Episode 44 - Eldar pt 1 - the Eldar Pantheon, Craftworlds, and Webway

[SPEAKER_01]: Welcome to the Forty-K-Lorecast.
[SPEAKER_01]: Welcome to Forty-K-Lorecast with me, John Barcelona and Brad Jester.
[SPEAKER_01]: And today's cast we're going to do a dangerous experiment.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, we're going to let Brad speak into the microphone about it.
[SPEAKER_01]: Not only his favorite faction, Forty Kay, his favorite thing and all of sci-fi.
[SPEAKER_01]: The elder.
[SPEAKER_01]: So this is going to go long.
[SPEAKER_01]: Very long.
[SPEAKER_01]: Spacesales.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yep.
[SPEAKER_01]: We're going to do three episodes.
[SPEAKER_01]: I've told Brad we're only doing three episodes right now.
[SPEAKER_01]: We'll do more later.
[SPEAKER_01]: So whatever we don't get to and what's probably going to be close to six hours of content, we'll have to push down the road.
[SPEAKER_04]: I have a couple of people that have said they appreciate really how we stand focused and I want to point on again that has nothing to do with me.
[SPEAKER_01]: That is totally me.
[SPEAKER_01]: We have deep notes.
[SPEAKER_01]: I have to keep Brad.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know if bumper bowling exists outside of the U.S.
[SPEAKER_01]: that's effectively how we have to do this in this cast where like you have to put the ball just convening off off the sides that at least were kind of going down a lane.
[SPEAKER_01]: Anyway, today what we're going to do is really kind of set up Eldar bit better.
[SPEAKER_01]: So we're going to cover a couple of key pieces.
[SPEAKER_01]: One is the Eldar Pantheon, which is, I think one of the more confusing elements of the Forty Kay universe.
[SPEAKER_04]: Super confusing because it's been semi-retcon and very confusing because they made a lot of just
[SPEAKER_04]: Alludes to it right as opposed to what actually is happening and then a lot of the short stories that we know were completely different.
[SPEAKER_04]: So we're going to talk about kind of all of those and then how it's seen right now, but it's also a big deal because some of it's still cough coffee shit.
[SPEAKER_04]: Things are still happening.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, they're still being used here.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is now we say retcon some stuff like Zotes were correctly written out of the game.
[SPEAKER_01]: The elder
[SPEAKER_01]: Pantheon is more, in my opinion, I think it's one of the most confusing pieces for new players.
[SPEAKER_01]: And we're going to get to it in the second guys, but we'll dive into that.
[SPEAKER_01]: And after that, we're going to talk about the creation of the craft worlds where they actually come from.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then finally, with the elder, the elder web way.
[SPEAKER_01]: And we think once we've done that, it makes the next few casts a little bit easier because those are the big things we're referring to.
[SPEAKER_01]: We're going to reference this a while.
[SPEAKER_04]: Exactly.
[SPEAKER_04]: If you're going back from a future cast and you're coming back, told you so in this game.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, exactly.
[SPEAKER_01]: All right, before we begin, please follow and comment on the podcast.
[SPEAKER_01]: It really does help our metrics.
[SPEAKER_01]: We're doing very, very well within Spotify, even with an iTunes kind of everywhere.
[SPEAKER_01]: So thank you for all of you who left comments.
[SPEAKER_01]: We can read them by the way.
[SPEAKER_01]: So some of the ones you guys would love to have in quite funny.
[SPEAKER_01]: I do appreciate that.
[SPEAKER_01]: Another one is join a discord.
[SPEAKER_01]: The link is in the notes as we're getting deeper and deeper into this lore.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, we're at episode forty three right now.
[SPEAKER_01]: We don't really plan on stopping anytime soon.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a great place to go in and ask questions.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I hope not on that because we do have the only reason we would stop as bread one was dies and so with the most rooted but not to happen.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I travel for work.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like mine would be a car accident year would be a like yeah, yeah, the doctors agree.
[SPEAKER_01]: But anyway.
[SPEAKER_01]: But that's what we're going to be going.
[SPEAKER_01]: The discord's a great place, especially if you're discovering us for the first time, and maybe you're listening to an episode, it's a few months old.
[SPEAKER_01]: Ask, we're all in there.
[SPEAKER_01]: And all the people are in there.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's great for the jump on and give you tons of different lower aspects.
[SPEAKER_04]: And we've got gameplay on there too.
[SPEAKER_01]: We also do, yeah, the goal of the discord really is to turn it into kind of the almost kind of controlled version of Reddit around this lower where people can come in, they can have commerce, they can ask questions, get stuff answered.
[SPEAKER_01]: and that we're like a voter down voted.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, that's my opinion.
[SPEAKER_01]: Although I do use Reddit, but it's awesome.
[SPEAKER_01]: I just don't think it's, I don't think it's very, again, inviting the new boys.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: That's the biggest thing.
[SPEAKER_04]: Don't be afraid to ask the craziest newbie thing ever.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: Seriously, though, I really think that.
[SPEAKER_01]: We wrote that this cast exists honestly for newbies primarily.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's for veterans and newbies, but today we're going to get into the Elder Pantheon.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is something that I remember confused the hell out of me for a long time.
[SPEAKER_01]: Do it about again.
[SPEAKER_01]: But anyway, next thing I want to bring out is the Patreon.
[SPEAKER_01]: There's another link in the notes.
[SPEAKER_01]: But you've already given me the Patreon and I can't thank you enough.
[SPEAKER_01]: We are now on new microphones.
[SPEAKER_01]: We've actually got new audio set up.
[SPEAKER_01]: There's some other changes coming down the pipe for the podcast that are effectively being funded by these Patreon members.
[SPEAKER_01]: So thank you so much for that.
[SPEAKER_01]: It really does help.
[SPEAKER_04]: Totally going to be adults soon.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, maybe not in twenty- twenty-four.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, we're not going to actually do a truly organized cast, but we'll do this, but we're not leaving the basement.
[SPEAKER_01]: The last one, though, is of course Brad.
[SPEAKER_01]: Brad is available for coaching in forty-k for both competitive and casual players.
[SPEAKER_01]: If you're new to the game, when you had a play, if you're a veteran of the game, you want to play better.
[SPEAKER_01]: Brad's great for that, and you can get him by emailing a mat.
[SPEAKER_04]: Old man Brad, Forty-K, a Gmail.com.
[SPEAKER_01]: Or go to our website, the Forty-K-Lorecast.com and click his link.
[SPEAKER_01]: Anyway, under the cast.
[SPEAKER_01]: So as we've been alluding to us, dive right into it.
[SPEAKER_01]: We want to focus on the Elder Gods.
[SPEAKER_01]: And this is because every player whose new to the game goes, wait, the Elder Have Gods?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: So the Chaos Gods.
[SPEAKER_01]: No.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, we'll sort of not really sub-law, blah, blah.
[SPEAKER_01]: And we're getting to some of our own personal theories in this in a minute.
[SPEAKER_03]: All right.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so I think the Noah I wrote here is we'll address the flaming elephant in the room.
[SPEAKER_01]: What's an elder god?
[SPEAKER_01]: I thought all the gods were chaos.
[SPEAKER_01]: Is there a specific like chapter in one of the GW books that explains this really well?
[SPEAKER_03]: No, but the new elder gods are who the real but also what were they?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's a key, but they're not mythology.
[SPEAKER_01]: They are real.
[SPEAKER_01]: The Elder Gods will really, it's all fake.
[SPEAKER_01]: But it's real fake.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's real fake.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's real fake.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's real fake.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's just not an actual thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: Let's just kind of go into what they were.
[SPEAKER_01]: Were they actual gods or just really powerful beings?
[SPEAKER_01]: Because Elder Gods are insanely power.
[SPEAKER_04]: What are the big things I want to go into?
[SPEAKER_04]: kind of right away because we have to go into what are we talking about because whatever you decide and this is kind of on a you basically honest with you because they GW does not make a clear and defined because again the elder were around for
[SPEAKER_04]: sixty five million years that we know of right and that was once they got raised up by the old ones what are the big things is they became certain members of the other race just became wildly powerful because they were effectively immortal yeah
[SPEAKER_04]: You have a lot of time to be juiced up by the war, which you had.
[SPEAKER_04]: So you have to ask yourself, are the elder gods, you know, people that were an elder that was juiced up for four million years and is now the pinnacle.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like a clerk for an orc type thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, let's let's just set some stages.
[SPEAKER_01]: We love saying, under them better.
[SPEAKER_01]: So the elder gods were exceptionally powerful.
[SPEAKER_01]: So there is not, this is not mythology.
[SPEAKER_01]: We're talking about these are very much so yeah, real.
[SPEAKER_01]: They did speak with the elder.
[SPEAKER_01]: They communicated with them, actually, pretty routinely.
[SPEAKER_01]: Isha, for example, was really active within them.
[SPEAKER_01]: So we know that the elder gods were beings.
[SPEAKER_01]: They did exist, but they also were not fully omnipotent or all powerful.
[SPEAKER_01]: They
[SPEAKER_04]: when they were never on that.
[SPEAKER_04]: They were just how we're a fold.
[SPEAKER_04]: And they were very no knowledgeable, but a knowledgeable on a, I have more access to stuff than anything else.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: And the example I use here is that when Slenex was born, it was not hard for a Slenex to rip to shreds the old Argots.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like instant kill with one fought for a minute or two.
[SPEAKER_02]: A couple of them, are they got?
[SPEAKER_01]: No, only one, only one thought.
[SPEAKER_01]: The rest of them stayed.
[SPEAKER_04]: Well, they, some of them thought.
[SPEAKER_04]: You just don't know that they fought because they had beats so quickly.
[SPEAKER_01]: I guess that's true.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: You're right.
[SPEAKER_01]: I guess it does still count as a fight.
[SPEAKER_04]: When you had a fight that you watched on paper view and it was a bad fight.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: And the other ones, you just heard on the internet.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: You also beat that guy.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, and they also did, I think, think about them as they fought amongst themselves quite a bit too.
[SPEAKER_01]: There's a lot of
[SPEAKER_01]: There's a lot of parallels here to Greek with the opposite.
[SPEAKER_04]: That's just a hundred percent.
[SPEAKER_04]: They did a lot of Greek mythology on the fact that the gods were oftentimes petty.
[SPEAKER_04]: The gods fought amongst themselves.
[SPEAKER_04]: The gods wanted their people to fight again, right, to fight against other their followers kind of thing.
[SPEAKER_04]: And a lot of times it wasn't an open fight as in we're fighting.
[SPEAKER_01]: It was just kind of like it was screw their shit.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, childish fights.
[SPEAKER_01]: Here's where I'm a new John theory.
[SPEAKER_01]: What I think these things are Brad willing to disagree.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think they were all an early version of a demon prince.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's what I that's they line up really well with that.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like I basically like a bellicoar.
[SPEAKER_01]: We don't know when Bellacor was birthed.
[SPEAKER_01]: We just know Bellacor what existed at some point.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think that might be like in the older gods fall into this because they're more powerful than a regular demon prince don't give me wrong, but I sort of was not saying they're wildly.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's not, I can see that your other power from the same place is everybody's drawn their power from the warp even turn.
[SPEAKER_01]: Right, but this is why I compared to Bellacom.
[SPEAKER_01]: And Bellacom has been powered up obviously by the chaos gods over the years, but I compare it to Bellacom and that Bellacom would slap a bloodthirsty around.
[SPEAKER_04]: But also the cascads don't hold their power to any other power.
[SPEAKER_01]: True.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so what I'm thinking is before that my thought process is that before the chaos gods fully formed the warp, the warp energy was kind of available.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's the same way that my view points that, uh, what are the dark angels things?
[SPEAKER_01]: The watchers of the dark are good nerdlings and spoiler alert.
[SPEAKER_01]: All my opinion is all of the the sister's gods or this is the sister's saints.
[SPEAKER_01]: Those are also the even.
[SPEAKER_04]: Those are the same.
[SPEAKER_04]: And I get it, but the thing is, is that everything that gets power from the upside down, the war, whatever you want to actually refer to it as, it isn't just that's the bad place.
[SPEAKER_04]: Again, the old ones used only the warp.
[SPEAKER_04]: That's true power, and they did no bad things.
[SPEAKER_04]: They weren't spotting chaos.
[SPEAKER_04]: They were doing anything.
[SPEAKER_04]: Eldar God's got their powers from here also doesn't really make him a demon prince.
[SPEAKER_04]: It just means that that's that a source of power is there.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I'm just comparing them to them.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not saying they are demon prince.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm just saying that that's what their entity would most closely be is a warp entity.
[SPEAKER_04]: I give you that.
[SPEAKER_04]: But anything that if you just went, hey, here's a farce here and then you would
[SPEAKER_04]: Hey, instead of thousands of years, how about you give the student millions of years to power up?
[SPEAKER_01]: You power up.
[SPEAKER_01]: Is it that?
[SPEAKER_04]: Is it a note that God or is it just a super juiced up guy?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that that's a fair point.
[SPEAKER_04]: Never stopped grinding in the more P.C.s playing.
[SPEAKER_01]: So they just like, I mean, I'm expiing up.
[SPEAKER_01]: Just don't know the forest and killing boys.
[SPEAKER_02]: There's no level cap here.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's kind of the stage for what we think the Elder Gods are.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, let's dive into the actual story of the Elder Gods, which again.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, sorry, guys.
[SPEAKER_04]: If you, I can only imagine right now that there's someone that's doing their thesis on Greek or Roman method.
[SPEAKER_01]: And they're about to get so mad.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's interesting.
[SPEAKER_01]: Just like what are going on?
[SPEAKER_01]: The level of plagiarism in your idea.
[SPEAKER_01]: Some of it is not all the way direct plagiarism, but it's definitely scurting the edge of IP violation.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, and by scurting the edge, I don't mean scurting the edge at all.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it's there.
[SPEAKER_01]: So let's let list listing off kind of the gods and then we'll dive into them.
[SPEAKER_01]: The first one is Ossar Yan.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, no, no.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, no.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, no.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, no.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, no.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's not.
[SPEAKER_04]: is he was the oldest and wisest and probably most powerful.
[SPEAKER_04]: Like sometimes a lot of these got spike in weird power.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: But as a whole, he's the most powerful.
[SPEAKER_01]: He has to look out because numerous stories he will intervene and all the gods just capitulate.
[SPEAKER_04]: He's also the coach, the ref, the hey guys.
[SPEAKER_04]: He's the one that comes down and says we shouldn't do this.
[SPEAKER_04]: And I think that it's important that he exists because when you have a bunch of
[SPEAKER_04]: possibly just straight, super powerful, regular people that ascended to this, which, again, is the theory.
[SPEAKER_04]: One of the theories of this, you need someone that was willing to, and he was the first and the oldest of them, to be able to just step in and go, hey, you can't do this.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's gonna wreck things for our race, kind of thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and they're going to, I mean, he's also the one that everyone appeals to.
[SPEAKER_01]: So when the gods are fighting, they go to him.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is why he's kind of dad, also known as Zeus.
[SPEAKER_01]: He is Zeus without a lot of the, we'll call it baggage.
[SPEAKER_04]: That comes with with three times with you decide that you're going to go hang out as an animal and do things.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, of course, just like Greek mythology.
[SPEAKER_01]: Also, Jan has a brother.
[SPEAKER_01]: Actually, there's a bunch of siblings.
[SPEAKER_01]: The first one is Kane, who later gets the moniker, Kelmenza for the bloodhanders.
[SPEAKER_04]: He becomes the bloody hand of God.
[SPEAKER_01]: The bloody hand of God.
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's Kane is the God of War, but also murder violence and destruction.
[SPEAKER_04]: This is it's more leaned into later on, though, because game was just the God of War, but they got a battle.
[SPEAKER_04]: Like, because they held our head a lot of structure to their feet.
[SPEAKER_01]: He did, but Kane has a temper.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's the thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: He was not like that when we look at some of the mythologies, the God of War is a God of like strategy.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a God of temperament, like Napoleon type style.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like you're omitted to say that, Kane has a temper.
[SPEAKER_04]: The thing is, is that because Eldar and to go into Eldar just a little bit, some of the things, and we talked about this in some of the previous guests, Eldar feel things a thousand times more strongly, like actual emotions than humans do, and I feel that they always had this because when they went to war in the most dire times, you had to unleash your cane hair grows, because you had to unleash your wrath.
[SPEAKER_04]: because you couldn't, no one elder just can't lean in any one thing because they get to, to into anything they do.
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.
[SPEAKER_01]: Brad's a big elder Homer, and I am too, but I'm gonna point out, Keynes also the god of torture.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, most people don't need a god of torture.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not something you need to worship into.
[SPEAKER_04]: I feel it's the dark elder game, some of the stuff a bad rap, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: Just not there.
[SPEAKER_01]: Also the god of torture.
[SPEAKER_01]: And violence really all forms of violence.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's King.
[SPEAKER_01]: King's gonna come up a lot as we're discussing the history of the Elder.
[SPEAKER_01]: Next one is Gaya, who's really kind of a fun one because she's, that the term they use in the book is Concert, which I had to Google, which I'd look up a couple times, that's pretty sure Concert meant wife, and it does.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I couldn't, because she's actually the Concert of both Osirion and Kane.
[SPEAKER_01]: So she was married to both brothers.
[SPEAKER_04]: But she was supposed to be the matriarch, basically, of that.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah, and I get that, but there's just a little bit of edipist going on in here.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not going edipist.
[SPEAKER_01]: It just, this gets a little weird.
[SPEAKER_01]: Anyway, quickly moving on before we get in trouble, Isha, Isha is the another one of the most important gods in the history.
[SPEAKER_04]: Isha's awesome, that she becomes way more awesome in modern forty.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, Isha's, to me, Isha and Kane are actually probably the two most critical in modern forty.
[SPEAKER_01]: No, the wife and God.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, cigarette.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's like the most critical, but anyway, issues that got a goddess of harvest life and fertility.
[SPEAKER_04]: She also guided the elder in so many ways and led them down to good.
[SPEAKER_04]: She is always positive in what she did.
[SPEAKER_04]: They always didn't, it didn't always work out.
[SPEAKER_04]: The issue has that issue left for the elder let us to things like the exudites and things of that nature because she wanted them to be what happened before the old ones raised them up which is poets and philosophers and the greatest of the creators of beauty and
[SPEAKER_04]: I love it basically in the galaxy and that is not always the case.
[SPEAKER_01]: It didn't always work out and the issue is going to be one of the ones that's going to make some confusion for players because the issue is also the one who created the elder.
[SPEAKER_01]: So we'll get to that in a little bit.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is where the, the elder pent-outs are going to get a little bit loopy.
[SPEAKER_01]: We're going, we can't keep it together.
[SPEAKER_01]: Wall, who is the forge?
[SPEAKER_01]: This is one hundred percent have faced this.
[SPEAKER_01]: Where is, whereas issue is, I kind of, I, like, a, like, I deem to meet our hybrid.
[SPEAKER_01]: Wall just is have faced this.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, he, he runs the forge for the gods.
[SPEAKER_01]: He makes swords for gods.
[SPEAKER_01]: I have no idea what his purpose is.
[SPEAKER_04]: I think that these are all just fables because he's a god that made swords.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yes, but he's also, I think a lot of these things are.
[SPEAKER_01]: There's more he does.
[SPEAKER_01]: There actually are.
[SPEAKER_04]: I'm not saying like a lot of these stories aren't actually that like he's creating these guys are technologically superior in every other way.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think he's what gives that to them.
[SPEAKER_01]: We'll get there in a minute.
[SPEAKER_04]: I mean, it's just he's, you know, is he creating a sword for you or was he really creating a warp drive?
[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, it's or it would be for them a webinar.
[SPEAKER_01]: Another one who doesn't answer some of these guys, I would point I get mentioned by like six or seven lines in a codex.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then one of them is Hoek, Hock, H O E C. Hook, hook.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, but he doesn't do anything.
[SPEAKER_01]: So he yes and no.
[SPEAKER_01]: So he's the god of the web way.
[SPEAKER_04]: I know he's mentioned, but like, as the guy of the webway, what does he do?
[SPEAKER_04]: And then you look at his resume and he goes, oh, apparently I've never done anything.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, he visits.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a weird thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: So all it says in the code X is that he's visited all the webways.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's the one that's walked the entire webway.
[SPEAKER_01]: So did he like help?
[SPEAKER_01]: Has the webway always been there?
[SPEAKER_01]: And he's the one that opened it up who knows.
[SPEAKER_04]: He's not even like out of the webway.
[SPEAKER_04]: He's the dude that traveled.
[SPEAKER_04]: He got a stamp from every place in the webway.
[SPEAKER_01]: He comes like in the most fucking much better way of putting it.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, he did.
[SPEAKER_04]: He literally would.
[SPEAKER_04]: I have.
[SPEAKER_04]: Being.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, good news.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's dead.
[SPEAKER_01]: So cool.
[SPEAKER_04]: He got.
[SPEAKER_04]: He literally got the steam achievement of being everywhere in the webway.
[SPEAKER_04]: God.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yep.
[SPEAKER_01]: Next one.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to shoot in this in a second is Kernos, who's the god of the hunt.
[SPEAKER_01]: GW gender flipped Artemis.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's what it is.
[SPEAKER_01]: I do have an issue with this.
[SPEAKER_01]: Kronos is always depicted with dogs and hawks.
[SPEAKER_01]: There are no dogs.
[SPEAKER_01]: Why are there dogs and hawks on elder planets?
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, why did the elder have a hawk?
[SPEAKER_01]: By the way, it's not like a weird looking hawk.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's just a hawk.
[SPEAKER_01]: So apparently, the elder gods, when they were formed before, well, just technically you had birds, sixty five million years ago, it was a dinosaur that was, that was, that was evolved.
[SPEAKER_04]: I worked out for the elder.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm just anyway, that's Kernos is also the opposite.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's just dollars because it's like, there's just things like you don't have to do it this way and they do it and I'm just like, why do you have dogs and birds?
[SPEAKER_01]: Kernos's key thing is that he is the husband of Isha.
[SPEAKER_01]: That is basically explained to me.
[SPEAKER_01]: That is his claim to fame.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, Andy has a daughter named Lilith, who is, what should he have?
[SPEAKER_01]: Isha and Kernos is daughter, who is one of the
[SPEAKER_01]: She might be one of the more important shots for L.A.
[SPEAKER_01]: because because she is, she's the god of foresight.
[SPEAKER_01]: So she's the whole reason L.A.
[SPEAKER_01]: can see into the future.
[SPEAKER_04]: Our series exists because she exists.
[SPEAKER_01]: Because she existed.
[SPEAKER_01]: Although they are kind of bad at it sometimes.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yes, but L.A.
[SPEAKER_04]: It depends the book.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's what I say.
[SPEAKER_01]: I know you love Eldar, but in a love Eldar, and I'm with you on Eldar, but Eldar seems to miss some predictions quite often.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like when you're standing in front of somebody who's corrupted by chaos.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, no, you could.
[SPEAKER_04]: He looks at the future, tries to adjust the future, but the way he tries to adjust it is terrible.
[SPEAKER_01]: He was standing in front of all, like, with all the folks from, yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: And yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: He definitely did not prepare his speech on the mirror.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, we've done that one hard.
[SPEAKER_01]: From there, we'll move on to Morai Hague, who much like Gaya was also the consort wife of the also Yonan Kane.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's really weird.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I think she's a side consort.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, she's, uh, she's important though.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, but she's the fates, but not quite the fates.
[SPEAKER_01]: She's a little bit different.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, so she's the goddess of feet and souls.
[SPEAKER_01]: She was the goth of the gods.
[SPEAKER_01]: Basically, she was really duller, but what she was doing was, was effectively more talking about more like Marvel universe type fates where you're not necessarily tied to a strand.
[SPEAKER_01]: She says strands can change and you have that you have these.
[SPEAKER_04]: It was also kind of encouraged on her.
[SPEAKER_04]: Like what I got a lot from the things on that is that that was the guy that said, your fate is, your fate, but you can change your fate, kind of encouraging people to be the best they could be, kind of thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: But she was also, but also your fate will come true, because that's where she gets you really confusing, because it's like, no, you don't have to do this.
[SPEAKER_01]: The fate's on a predetermined, but this thing is totally what I don't think gonna happen no matter what you do.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's like, it's kind of weird on that.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, because she's kind of the fate, like I said, she's kind of the fate's kind of not.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so in my mind, like the he has made figure at some point, I kind of like Greek history and Greek writing, also old Roman history and old Roman writing.
[SPEAKER_01]: So there's a lot of soft, but please stop in this.
[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, the Romans also really like Greek history and Greek writing.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's the deep word that the stuff for themselves.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's cool.
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, we'll rename it, but this this is if you if you read the edifice stories, that's got a lot of little more on high where you edifice did have some level of control over his life, but it was always going to end the way it was it's basically you can change the stream, but this deliver always.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, and up at the same place or the thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I'm in again.
[SPEAKER_01]: is what is.
[SPEAKER_01]: So the only thing about Mara Kai, she's also is the Cron, which is why Eldar, the lost worlds of the Eldar are called the Cron worlds.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's in reference to her.
[SPEAKER_01]: So that's where we get this from.
[SPEAKER_04]: Kind of awesome.
[SPEAKER_04]: If they spend not enough time on her.
[SPEAKER_01]: They reference her a lot.
[SPEAKER_01]: There's just not a lot of like deep writing on it.
[SPEAKER_01]: But now we'll get to the last two who are kind of the big ones on my mind.
[SPEAKER_01]: Sticker.
[SPEAKER_04]: Well, only one of the gods got to pull the caper.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yes, Lanesh.
[SPEAKER_04]: And that would be the latter guy.
[SPEAKER_01]: So he is also the god of the harlicons worship for obvious reasons, which is why he's so important.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's the trickster.
[SPEAKER_01]: There's actually a lot of great stories on cigarette throughout both co-dexes, but also a lot of the black library writing about what he was.
[SPEAKER_01]: If he actually drive his enemies mad,
[SPEAKER_04]: But with the way he did it with Louder than man, he isn't.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's funny because he's petty.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: But in a, you know, wildly crazy way, because he'll just mess with you in the smallest of there's great stories that written about how he would just kind of screw up the command people's every little bit about everything they did.
[SPEAKER_04]: Nothing was big deal.
[SPEAKER_04]: But like, you're always out of your drink.
[SPEAKER_04]: You always trip to the morning.
[SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_04]: People work always jacked up your messages always kind of get sent or lost or whatever.
[SPEAKER_01]: Or cuts off must like last half second is cut off just that then just to annoy just constantly a little bit.
[SPEAKER_04]: And then he was told that's when you attack eventually and you put your opponent on edge, then lightning strike leave.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, one of my favorite, I think he may not know it, but Aramon's greatest foe in the entire universe is.
[SPEAKER_01]: Because all those stories of Aramon trying to pierce the web way, the way that it would always fall apart, it's obviously with Segerac, just massive.
[SPEAKER_01]: It wasn't as easy to do.
[SPEAKER_04]: Was that him into the black library or around?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, but they almost the fake room in the black library.
[SPEAKER_01]: They might have like, sake, they got pulled on him.
[SPEAKER_01]: We're going to do a lot of time on mostly because Brad and I both really like Harley Quinn's a lot so it's going to be a down plane.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, the table.
[SPEAKER_01]: What's the truth is I mean just split of the future one solitaire.
[SPEAKER_01]: I beat you two doesn't point.
[SPEAKER_01]: because he just runs across the board killing.
[SPEAKER_04]: And this is a big thing that we're going to point out, when everything went down, when the fall came, the laughing god, effectively, taunted sling ash and did a couple backflips and just do that.
[SPEAKER_01]: And he was into the web way, which is the one place that she cannot get into.
[SPEAKER_04]: And that was a big deal on this because the laughing guy just went, oh, shit's going down.
[SPEAKER_04]: I'll fight another day in a thing.
[SPEAKER_04]: And that even just a straight, I mean, it sounds like running away, and I'm not really saying it now, but like, they ran away.
[SPEAKER_04]: He's just, the laughing guy went, I can't do anything about this.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, right now.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, he didn't run away.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, well, I mean, he ran away.
[SPEAKER_01]: There's no, there's no positive on he ran away other than he was going to instant die if he didn't run away.
[SPEAKER_01]: So you run away.
[SPEAKER_04]: Also, a lot of parliaments exist because of them.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's a good move.
[SPEAKER_01]: He actually may have saved the elder from being completely honest, but speaking of saving the elder, what if they just all died?
[SPEAKER_01]: So there is a new God.
[SPEAKER_01]: You need.
[SPEAKER_01]: So you need is not part of the original elder pantheon.
[SPEAKER_01]: You need lesbian, lesbian, birthed, since then.
[SPEAKER_04]: And it's so weird of how, because it's not just the death, it's the continued deaths of the same people, basically, because the infinity circuit.
[SPEAKER_04]: So, right now, if you die and your L.R., your soul is instantly and irrefucably tied to the Sunash.
[SPEAKER_04]: Sunash is the inner soul's will get you.
[SPEAKER_04]: The elder set up, it's called the Infinity Circuit, which is effectively where they host souls of their fallen comrades in the spirit, James.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, and you wear it on you.
[SPEAKER_01]: So every elder, if you guys, if you paint models, that's what's on the end.
[SPEAKER_01]: Right there, that gem in the middle that most of us don't paint because it's work.
[SPEAKER_01]: But anyway, that's what that gem is.
[SPEAKER_01]: When you die, that gem grabs your soul.
[SPEAKER_01]: Then the elder collect the souls after, we're just talking about the space and reigns with the gene seed.
[SPEAKER_01]: But this is a bit more complex.
[SPEAKER_01]: They bring it back to the craft world and it's loaded into the infinity circuit there.
[SPEAKER_01]: From that infinity circuit, we can actually take that and load you into a wraith host, which we're going to cover in the next episode.
[SPEAKER_01]: Don't worry.
[SPEAKER_01]: But it's a really key piece.
[SPEAKER_01]: All this cycle, though, of death and pain,
[SPEAKER_01]: You then take all those dead souls.
[SPEAKER_01]: You'll load them into any face circuit.
[SPEAKER_01]: So there's now millions, billions of souls together.
[SPEAKER_01]: That birth to God.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's the best way to explain it.
[SPEAKER_01]: That birth to God.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's a God of death.
[SPEAKER_01]: And we're going to spend a lot of time on the good thing about you, Nari's.
[SPEAKER_01]: We're going to spend a bunch of time on it.
[SPEAKER_01]: Then have a cliffhanger ending because you just decided.
[SPEAKER_04]: They're going to mic drop it and nothing's going to happen.
[SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.
[SPEAKER_04]: So Bobby G got buffed up and you have rain and Bobby G walked into the night and only Bobby G apparently.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, which is so.
[SPEAKER_00]: There we are.
[SPEAKER_00]: We'll be right back after a quick break.
[SPEAKER_01]: There are actually three other gods that we're not going to cover here because it's the gods of the exudites and I'll just let Brad scream into our room and that's awesome.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's they're not.
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, I think I grossly disagree on exudites, but that's me.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, it's because you don't like dinosaurs.
[SPEAKER_01]: Then I even does it.
[SPEAKER_01]: They're supposed to be dragons.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's the don't it.
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's just like, do it or don't do it.
[SPEAKER_01]: She W's where I'm at.
[SPEAKER_01]: So elder gods.
[SPEAKER_01]: So did they create the L.R.?
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, let's do the story.
[SPEAKER_01]: We'll do the story and we can just crap all over it and rewrite it.
[SPEAKER_04]: And this is, I'm going to get this up for you.
[SPEAKER_04]: I'm going to practice this with, this is wildly just my opinion.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: Would you like to say?
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: Like a hundred percent.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so the story of the elder gods starts with the elder being a race of perfection.
[SPEAKER_01]: So they were meant to be intelligent, powerful, compassionate, joyous, creative.
[SPEAKER_01]: These were not the way they were formed originally.
[SPEAKER_01]: These were given to them.
[SPEAKER_01]: And you're all immediately thinking the same thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, that's what the old ones did.
[SPEAKER_01]: So they're with the old ones.
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's like, no.
[SPEAKER_04]: Technically, no, elder were raised up by the old ones.
[SPEAKER_04]: They weren't created by the old ones.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's where this all gets confusing.
[SPEAKER_01]: Really confusing, really quick.
[SPEAKER_01]: Some people may be thinking, well, the elder gods are just old ones.
[SPEAKER_01]: No, the old ones weren't this powerful.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's the elder gods are much more.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, maybe some of them survived, but so they never explained like how I this was done, but we do know that at some point there were two brothers named Elden Eschen Ulfanesh, Lady Godjw Union naming.
[SPEAKER_01]: And from those two, all the Eldar were created.
[SPEAKER_01]: Don't worry, this is going to get really close.
[SPEAKER_02]: I know, it's just funny because we're doing that.
[SPEAKER_02]: The robberless.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's, it gets, it's rather than remiss.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's going to be, yeah, there's no wolf here yet.
[SPEAKER_01]: And don't worry, this is about to get really confusing.
[SPEAKER_01]: So you might end.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's going to require a lot of really crisp pronunciation on the part of Brad and I. Yes, to keep track.
[SPEAKER_01]: So my bad.
[SPEAKER_01]: Anyway.
[SPEAKER_01]: So the elder are created and the elder gods decide to uplift them in.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, but we don't know who.
[SPEAKER_04]: created the ally they never say it that no in the writing of if somebody can find some obscure piece where they say this
[SPEAKER_01]: It's just, oh, yeah, I'd love to see, you haven't discovered.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'd love to see it.
[SPEAKER_01]: I went through all the codexes.
[SPEAKER_01]: I didn't see anything codex.
[SPEAKER_01]: I haven't read all the black library obviously, but very good amount of it.
[SPEAKER_01]: Effectively, the elder just do exist.
[SPEAKER_01]: This would, in some ways, line up the rest of the writing that the old ones did uplift them from whatever they were into a larger being.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think a lot of this is the, the elder gods, like, I'm going to give you my opinion.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think when ends up happening or but discuss, is what happened to the elder after the old ones disappeared.
[SPEAKER_01]: because they would have been, they would have had leadership and then leadership disappeared and then be their demon princes, be them, Eldar long lived, Eldar who powered up, the following begins to happen.
[SPEAKER_01]: So the first piece is Asar-Yan gives the Eldar the gift of wisdom.
[SPEAKER_01]: So this is, and they call it so that they would know themselves and their purpose.
[SPEAKER_04]: Is she gives them love?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, of course.
[SPEAKER_01]: You need to have love.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is so they would know each other and stand together as a race.
[SPEAKER_01]: That was the idea.
[SPEAKER_01]: Is this way they're a knowledgeable race who have a purpose, sometimes a little bit too OCD even the purpose, but that purpose is also
[SPEAKER_01]: But what Esha then does is she comes in gives them the purpose of taking care of themselves and others and then Lilayeth actually gives them joy so that they would be happy or would pursue have that's right
[SPEAKER_04]: She gives them the pursuit of joy, but the way the elder are made, the pursuit of joy becomes OCD times a million in anything that they do.
[SPEAKER_04]: And some of these things become
[SPEAKER_01]: And we're probably going to get into some of the other little issues that pop in.
[SPEAKER_01]: So the next one that they get is vault.
[SPEAKER_01]: So vault gives them what's called the Artifice.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is the way that Eldar can manifest physical things from the war.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like we're going to talk about.
[SPEAKER_01]: And this is Raythbone.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, this is he's given the recently giving the MHG.
[SPEAKER_04]: Volgives in the RFS.
[SPEAKER_04]: Is this technology because they use technology with their magic, their psychics to create things?
[SPEAKER_04]: Is he giving them that tech?
[SPEAKER_04]: Is he giving them that ability?
[SPEAKER_04]: Psychically teaching them?
[SPEAKER_04]: Is he teaching them a spa?
[SPEAKER_04]: This is work.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's kind of weird because you don't know, is, are they have this right away?
[SPEAKER_04]: Because eventually, they're racing.
[SPEAKER_04]: They do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do, they do,
[SPEAKER_04]: They could think things into being because they, but they also use technology to do it.
[SPEAKER_04]: It wasn't the just.
[SPEAKER_01]: We had, but this gave them the ability to advance the race massively because the whole, like, race bonus is, yes, it's great.
[SPEAKER_04]: This is the one that was really confusing for me because I didn't know where it was like, because eventually this is what they do.
[SPEAKER_04]: Is this what he gave them right away?
[SPEAKER_04]: Or is this something that they just discovered later on?
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, I see a point.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: I have no idea.
[SPEAKER_04]: That's why it's confusing on this.
[SPEAKER_04]: Because you're like, if they didn't have the technology right away, is he giving him in that?
[SPEAKER_04]: And that's my issue with that.
[SPEAKER_04]: And I don't want to get super.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's fine.
[SPEAKER_01]: We're going to have a lot of die tribes.
[SPEAKER_01]: This one, a lot of side stuff that we're doing here.
[SPEAKER_01]: Corrinos gave the Eldar desire.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is, this way they would strive to prosper and succeed.
[SPEAKER_01]: So basically, Corrinos with Eleth, that's what's gritty Eldar.
[SPEAKER_04]: I mean, they kind of made them.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that was one too.
[SPEAKER_04]: The elder are again hyper hyper focused when they get something.
[SPEAKER_04]: Also, they don't take L's very well.
[SPEAKER_04]: No, no, because they feel everything so hard.
[SPEAKER_04]: They are real big on wins and they really dwell on their losses.
[SPEAKER_04]: Also, hey, if you live for
[SPEAKER_04]: Thousands upon thousands of years got a lot of time to dwell on that.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: And you have a memory forever.
[SPEAKER_01]: You can remember every bad thing you've ever done.
[SPEAKER_01]: You have all this.
[SPEAKER_01]: More I hate gave them foresight.
[SPEAKER_01]: Could have been like clear foresight.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, hey, this is exactly what's going to happen if you do something, but didn't do that.
[SPEAKER_04]: I think that she gave them the ability to use their warp touch to try to do this.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's true.
[SPEAKER_04]: So it's up to them to hone their senses.
[SPEAKER_01]: My favorite one of them all, and this is from the writing, is Cain.
[SPEAKER_01]: Cain gave the Eldar anger.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's what his gift was.
[SPEAKER_01]: That was his gift.
[SPEAKER_01]: His gift was he gave them anger.
[SPEAKER_01]: They wrote it well.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not just to be mean.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's actually to make it to give them even greater levels of success.
[SPEAKER_01]: Cain's whole idea was to grads things.
[SPEAKER_01]: We're going to give them the desire for joy.
[SPEAKER_01]: We're going to give them the desire for knowledge.
[SPEAKER_01]: We're going to and then we're going to take all of that in the desire for perfection and then we're going to give you anger and hate for every time it doesn't work out even a little bit anytime it's not perfect.
[SPEAKER_04]: You were going to feel overwhelming.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so that was, that was his real helpful gift anger.
[SPEAKER_01]: Now, I will say, this one's really held through at modern day LDR are really embracing the cane elements of some stuff when things come up.
[SPEAKER_01]: Anyway, back to those two brothers we mentioned earlier.
[SPEAKER_01]: As the Elder grew, the gods were actually with them.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like not grow them with them, walking around with them.
[SPEAKER_01]: The Elder actually went to war with their gods.
[SPEAKER_01]: Disha stood next to the Elder and showed them how to build worlds.
[SPEAKER_04]: Which is again why my view of this isn't there.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's just super powered up.
[SPEAKER_01]: Hey, you're probably right.
[SPEAKER_04]: I just like, I was like, I know what they were like, they were again.
[SPEAKER_04]: When you can go, hey, let me talk to my God, you're like, are you going to commune with them?
[SPEAKER_04]: I'm like, I'm going to walk over them right there and ask him because he's making toast right now.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it was a weird moment for the Eldar at this time because they just began conquering the galaxy.
[SPEAKER_01]: Nothing can stand in their way.
[SPEAKER_01]: Because over the Necrons are gone.
[SPEAKER_01]: Nothing else, Slonesh, we have sixty four million years between, you know, this all beginning and Slonesh being born.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, and there's nothing really written about the time, just that the Eldar went to war.
[SPEAKER_01]: There were some random races that the Eldar did go to war with.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's mentioned in about one sentence in a codex here.
[SPEAKER_04]: And every single thing that they met since the Necrons, they smoked.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and they fought together.
[SPEAKER_01]: What happened was the Eldar and the Eldar god pantheon were really hand in hand.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oster Yon was helping them out.
[SPEAKER_01]: Kane was going to battle with them.
[SPEAKER_01]: Issue was teaching them healing.
[SPEAKER_01]: All this stuff was going on until Lilith
[SPEAKER_01]: So the daughter, again, of Isher and Coronos who has foresight had a bad dream.
[SPEAKER_01]: And her dream, she saw the Eldar destroying King.
[SPEAKER_01]: And she told King this, King doesn't take it really well.
[SPEAKER_01]: He came realize that Elif has the gift of foresight.
[SPEAKER_01]: So he's going to solve this problem by killing every single Eldar that exists.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is the level of Greek mythology, and this is incredible.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, as he's just ripping through them, Isha, and Karanos just go to Osterian and say, you have to stop this.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's going to kill every single one of them, to which Kane is going, yeah, yeah, it's exactly what I'm going to do.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is not, I'm not angry and lashing out.
[SPEAKER_01]: I am on a purpose right now.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oscar-Yon steps in.
[SPEAKER_01]: And what Oscar-Yon says is, well, the Eldar can't kill us if they can't access us.
[SPEAKER_01]: So we're going to separate the Eldar.
[SPEAKER_04]: I feel you put the gods in the war.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and that's one way of looking at it.
[SPEAKER_04]: I have to mean that's just what it looks like.
[SPEAKER_04]: For me, he put the gods into the war as the cascads are.
[SPEAKER_04]: The cascads can access things.
[SPEAKER_04]: They can see and they can access when they're asked, basically.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then I'll John theory this.
[SPEAKER_01]: I bet you this is probably at the point where the chaos gods are starting to actually form.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so that because I think that they're work entities, they then got pulled into the immaterial away from the material.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's on that.
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's, you know, his, sorry, you know, King killing all these things.
[SPEAKER_01]: So what this does is this against this leads to what's called the splitting of the pantheon.
[SPEAKER_01]: So
[SPEAKER_01]: The elder and the elder gods are separated.
[SPEAKER_01]: The elder continue on their normal ways of doing their normal stuff.
[SPEAKER_01]: They're growing, they're expanding, they're baking, whatever they're doing, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: The chaos gods are just sitting in the pantheon now well protected from the elder, except Isha and Karanos just couldn't handle this.
[SPEAKER_04]: Well, our whole purpose in life is to be part of the elder society, to be to guide, to nurture, to love, but also they're not getting anything unless they're there.
[SPEAKER_04]: So they aren't just ideas.
[SPEAKER_04]: They want to be part of this.
[SPEAKER_04]: So this is one of my favorites because they go to them and they say, hey, we can't do this.
[SPEAKER_04]: and falls like I can't possibly do it.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, I was told not to, and then they give the super easy speech of, come on.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, what if we say, please, at which point ball goes, okay, all right, and ball creates the spirit stones, which come up a lot more later, obviously.
[SPEAKER_01]: And now, through the spirit stones, Esha and colonos are able to, are able to converse back with the Eldar again.
[SPEAKER_01]: Now, problem with that is big angry cane is wandering around and walks in on, this is a safe, it's Osarion, or you sure are both talking to the elder, but yeah, it's pretty pissed.
[SPEAKER_04]: This part of the story is just weird.
[SPEAKER_01]: Fuck, yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: because he bitches Dasiron.
[SPEAKER_04]: And in the world's weirdest story flip, he's like, hey, I said I wouldn't smoke all of them if no one can talk to him.
[SPEAKER_04]: But this is the petty issue of all time.
[SPEAKER_04]: He's like, if they can talk to him, you know, I'm going to go smoke him.
[SPEAKER_04]: And then for somehow the this argument gets settled by how about if you just own the two goddesses, you know, like, God and God.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I'm going to, I'm going to hand you us or yon just hands over.
[SPEAKER_01]: Isha and coronavirus two came to do with him what he wants and what he wants is
[SPEAKER_01]: torture them.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's like, I don't level that the that the Drew car is.
[SPEAKER_04]: Oh, right.
[SPEAKER_04]: And it's still just no sense.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so he spends an unknown amount of time, just very loudly torturing these two.
[SPEAKER_01]: At the point where the other gods are kind of like, hey, this is weird.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is awkward, can someone make it stop?
[SPEAKER_01]: And so don't worry, sorry, think it weirder.
[SPEAKER_01]: So vul decides that it's still technically a little bit his fault.
[SPEAKER_01]: This whole thing went down.
[SPEAKER_01]: So he goes to Cain and says, look, you got to let them.
[SPEAKER_01]: You got to stop doing this.
[SPEAKER_01]: And Cain says, no, this is I'm the god of vengeance and torture.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is my purpose.
[SPEAKER_01]: No, vol offers to make Cain a hundred swords.
[SPEAKER_01]: The level here of this being just dumb mythology is bothering me.
[SPEAKER_01]: But this is the story.
[SPEAKER_01]: So we're doing it.
[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, these end up being the most powerful weapons on the galaxy, but continue.
[SPEAKER_01]: Fine.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, he's right, exactly.
[SPEAKER_01]: He doesn't make it later.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, he does, I mean, they cut their spaces.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: But the rest of the story is just annoying.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, Wall offers to make a hundred of his special swords.
[SPEAKER_01]: And Wall's swords are, as Brad has said, the most powerful things in the galaxy.
[SPEAKER_01]: So Kane says, yes, but then gives him a time table of one year.
[SPEAKER_01]: because apparently the pantheon of the elder gods revolves around the sun, so it's only yet, it's just a random measurement of time for no reason.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, the year goes by, and the clock is ticking down, and Val has only made ninety-nine of his special swords.
[SPEAKER_01]: So he then grabs one of his Rando extras and throws it in with a hundred.
[SPEAKER_04]: I've been waiting for us to get past this, because I love the other, but this part of it makes right sense.
[SPEAKER_01]: So anyway, King sees takes under swords releases, Esha, and colonos, they go back.
[SPEAKER_01]: Anyway, obviously, King later discovers that one of his hundred swords is BS and freaks the hell out, like real freaks out.
[SPEAKER_01]: And this goes on.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so this leads to what's ends up being called the war in heaven.
[SPEAKER_01]: Now, it's only, it's not called Warren heaven part two, which is what I'm calling it.
[SPEAKER_01]: So we had the Warren heaven before, which was obviously the old ones, Necrons, C-Tanzara.
[SPEAKER_01]: This one is just all of the gods in heaven fighting each other.
[SPEAKER_01]: Wall on one side came on the other.
[SPEAKER_04]: Super short.
[SPEAKER_04]: Maybe.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, it's true.
[SPEAKER_04]: We don't have a timeline, but it's, how about this?
[SPEAKER_04]: The stories really show.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, the story's a paragraph.
[SPEAKER_01]: All the gods in heaven begin fighting, eventually the war culminates with Cain involved meeting in combat.
[SPEAKER_01]: Vol walks into the battle carrying his greatest sword ever, which is a narrist.
[SPEAKER_01]: Problem is, vol's a forge master, Cain's the God of War.
[SPEAKER_01]: Cain beats Vol to a pulp.
[SPEAKER_04]: Like bad man.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, but wall wall is lying there.
[SPEAKER_04]: Well, big thing.
[SPEAKER_04]: He does cripple wall.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, yeah, I forgot about that.
[SPEAKER_01]: I totally forgot that he cripples wall.
[SPEAKER_01]: Anyway, while he's doing, he then bends down to pick up the sword and a bird.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yep, a bird because of a narris flies in grabs the sort of a God and takes it down to one of those two brothers who mentioned earlier named Eldenish who are still around.
[SPEAKER_04]: who also why yeah so need to have dick move bird has a mortal gets handed a sort of the gods not real sure why and the god of war shows up and he's like
[SPEAKER_04]: I don't even know what's happening.
[SPEAKER_01]: And also, that got to work really once that sore.
[SPEAKER_04]: Which you have no idea about.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, you're just holding it.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's like, yeah, it's standing there going.
[SPEAKER_04]: What?
[SPEAKER_04]: Like, like, this was just, I don't know what Eldenesh did to that bird, but that bird did not like him.
[SPEAKER_01]: Go, yes.
[SPEAKER_01]: Hey, man, hold this.
[SPEAKER_01]: He holds this for a minute.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so King just rips Eldenesh to pieces.
[SPEAKER_01]: The positive here, this moment, Oscar Jan goes, all right.
[SPEAKER_04]: Well, no, he hardcore comes down.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, because he's like, it's his, his like, chosen of the elder.
[SPEAKER_04]: He, the just gets smoked.
[SPEAKER_04]: And he's like, apparently, I was super cool with you, torture.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, you can torture my relatives.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: Oh, whoa, whoa, whoa, I like that particular personal portal.
[SPEAKER_04]: It comes down and just goes, no, just hit some of the squirt mom.
[SPEAKER_01]: and came, takes his new, his latest sword and just leaves.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, because he got sprayed with the spray bottle and he wasn't allowed to be on the counter.
[SPEAKER_01]: So after this, the elder, that's the end of the story of the Pantheon.
[SPEAKER_04]: This is why we sort of wait too much time in this one, because it's a paragraph.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a paragraph, but it's two pairs.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's that's how everybody keeps coming up later.
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's why I wanted to cover into it, because it does matter later, because now we're going to fast forward anywhere.
[SPEAKER_04]: But I think that they spoiled the point of this story, I have to bring it back.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, I lied on it.
[SPEAKER_04]: So I will give the story it's due, because
[SPEAKER_04]: this in my mind poisoned the elder.
[SPEAKER_04]: This conflict is what set the stage for the
[SPEAKER_04]: downfall the fall.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, you know, exactly because I think what this story talks about is the elder gods were not unified even into protecting each other.
[SPEAKER_01]: And the what that would create a downfall of the elder is this like, I think if the elder had been like the necrontier, where they just went, they were happy to just slaughter the entire galaxy advancing themselves.
[SPEAKER_01]: No slenesh.
[SPEAKER_04]: Or maybe little slenish it was the elders will you turn on on each other is what created was trying to turn on each other to think that each others are nothing if it wasn't you it's nothing to you.
[SPEAKER_05]: Hmm.
[SPEAKER_04]: This is what made it so that they got the pleasure.
[SPEAKER_04]: Cool.
[SPEAKER_04]: So the ability to just be okay with.
[SPEAKER_04]: for trying each other, for shifts and giggles, do horrible things, but also another reason they had to turn in because there was no war.
[SPEAKER_04]: I don't think the other actually fall if they have rivals, but they don't.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, they'll they'll they'll they'll they'll do to board them.
[SPEAKER_01]: So
[SPEAKER_01]: And to that point, that's what happens.
[SPEAKER_01]: The Eldar entered a time of peace sort of.
[SPEAKER_01]: And since there were no external threats.
[SPEAKER_01]: And internally, there were no threats.
[SPEAKER_01]: They just got weird.
[SPEAKER_01]: So until they get weird enough, that slenash is born.
[SPEAKER_04]: And this is millions of.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_01]: We don't know.
[SPEAKER_01]: We don't know.
[SPEAKER_01]: We don't know.
[SPEAKER_04]: We don't know.
[SPEAKER_04]: We don't know what the time period.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's sixty four million years from Neckron Awards.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: Till the virus.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's the first homosepience about a million years old.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so sixty times that amount of time and they started well ahead of them.
[SPEAKER_04]: They were flying around in space.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah, this is way better than Lucy.
[SPEAKER_04]: But the biggest thing is we don't know how long it's going on because Eldar effectively conquered the galaxy.
[SPEAKER_04]: Actually, they don't even do the whole galaxy.
[SPEAKER_01]: They just get they bored.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, they get to a certain point.
[SPEAKER_04]: We get to a certain point.
[SPEAKER_04]: Go we are the we are the kings of the universe.
[SPEAKER_04]: Mm-hmm.
[SPEAKER_04]: Nothing can touch us.
[SPEAKER_04]: And to that point in that claim, they're not wrong.
[SPEAKER_04]: Nope.
[SPEAKER_04]: And nothing that they still they make something that can.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: Well, this is the thing is they also this goes into, if anybody knows the Eric stories, we're there on the island of Melbourne, where they basically don't even realize that they're not the rulers of everything anymore.
[SPEAKER_04]: This is kind of what the other did because
[SPEAKER_01]: leading up to this humanity is conquering the galaxy and the elder kind of know about it kind of don't but they're so I don't care because the thing was as humanity is conquering the galaxy they're not doing it away that's a threat to the elder the elder can sense that technology and this is again not great crusade we're talking age of technology when the kind of we're actually more advanced
[SPEAKER_01]: And the elder went, yeah, it's not a threat.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't.
[SPEAKER_01]: They just didn't care.
[SPEAKER_01]: They just didn't care.
[SPEAKER_01]: If they are close enough, we'll just flip.
[SPEAKER_01]: We'll flick them in the front.
[SPEAKER_01]: They did.
[SPEAKER_04]: And they're so only care about their immediate wants needs.
[SPEAKER_04]: And there are lots of needs of torture and craziness for most of the civilization.
[SPEAKER_01]: While this is going on, though, and the elder argument is, the elder pantheon does exist.
[SPEAKER_01]: And there is some limited interaction between the elder pantheon and the elder.
[SPEAKER_01]: until Slonesh's birth.
[SPEAKER_01]: And this is a really important thing, in an instant, Slonesh's born.
[SPEAKER_01]: Slonesh was not born piece by piece with a concrete force in the galaxy.
[SPEAKER_01]: That birth, Slonesh goes in Slonesh as Slash probably had sentience before her birth, but at her birth, she knew where to go first.
[SPEAKER_04]: Instantly lashes.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, she kills also on Lilith Mori-Hage.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like that.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, like a, oh, I can get a guy.
[SPEAKER_04]: I assume also that he exploded the sky.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: The eye of tear is the center of the other civilization.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: There's up to she kills all of them.
[SPEAKER_01]: She absorbs anything in the realm nearby is now in the immaterial.
[SPEAKER_01]: The only two gods that actually are the hold-up are, as we said, Segarak, who just looks at us and goes, no.
[SPEAKER_01]: And runs away in the mean.
[SPEAKER_04]: Into the web web.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, Cain actually does stand up and fights Slonash for an instant or two.
[SPEAKER_04]: And then gets shattered.
[SPEAKER_01]: But this is important.
[SPEAKER_01]: He does it whereas, also on Lilith, they just, they don't exist.
[SPEAKER_04]: No.
[SPEAKER_04]: Came gets, yeah, actually, will not.
[SPEAKER_04]: He's like, down, place of a table.
[SPEAKER_04]: He's told it.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's full of rage.
[SPEAKER_01]: And this is really critical because there's a model called the Avatar of Kane.
[SPEAKER_01]: And we're going to explain how it exists right now.
[SPEAKER_01]: Slonesh consumed the soul of us or young.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's gone, Loth.
[SPEAKER_01]: King wouldn't let that happen.
[SPEAKER_01]: Stood and fun.
[SPEAKER_01]: So when Slonesh reached out and struck and came to kill him, King split up into these little crystals, all of them.
[SPEAKER_01]: They're just almost infinite among crystals throughout the galaxy.
[SPEAKER_01]: So to this day, when an autarck is the need is most dire, they can't actually take one of these shards they're carrying and they will turn into an avatar of King.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's what they're saying.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's basically a something.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a something ceremony where you say something, what is not a demon, but totally a demon.
[SPEAKER_01]: That is king.
[SPEAKER_01]: There are a couple other who did survive.
[SPEAKER_01]: We said sacred.
[SPEAKER_01]: Isha was about to get consumed as we covered in our cast on Nurgle.
[SPEAKER_01]: Nurgle goes, yeah, no, that that one's mine.
[SPEAKER_01]: And Nurgle grabs Isha.
[SPEAKER_01]: So Isha is also alive and sitting within Nurgle's compound.
[SPEAKER_02]: Super bummed by the way.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: And you need has been birthed since.
[SPEAKER_01]: The note I left here did that all make sense.
[SPEAKER_01]: Hopefully it did.
[SPEAKER_01]: If it didn't, I really, we spent a lot of luck on writing these notes.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know how to make that cleat clear then it was.
[SPEAKER_01]: So there you go.
[SPEAKER_01]: So let's shift a little bit to this will help us set more of the stage.
[SPEAKER_01]: What Eldar was like leading up to the fall because it wasn't all creepy murder and torture ghosts.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, they had mastered the warp, and I actually would argue I think they were, they may have been better at the warp, as we actually expected.
[SPEAKER_04]: I think the old ones made the web way.
[SPEAKER_01]: But the, I'm talking about, I think the elder.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, master, sorry, master, master.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, the most important.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: If the pinnacles are society, because this is a big thing that people don't realize about the elder, and even in the game and the lowering, the elder won't use the maximum of the powers.
[SPEAKER_01]: No, because they know Sloanash just appears.
[SPEAKER_04]: They used to be able to make things exist by thought through their mastery of the war, but their mastery of the war with their tech.
[SPEAKER_04]: Their tech basically worked.
[SPEAKER_04]: All of our tech is basically an elephant tech.
[SPEAKER_04]: You know what I mean?
[SPEAKER_04]: Like you do in the fantasy where the elves sing to the trees in nature and make things happen.
[SPEAKER_04]: Elder do that with technology.
[SPEAKER_04]: and their rate phone technology and their tech, they could just make the warp make things.
[SPEAKER_04]: They don't do that anymore.
[SPEAKER_04]: They sing to the Ray Phones stuff, but they don't just, they used to just force things into existence.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, now there's a bit more of a somewhat manufacturing process.
[SPEAKER_01]: They're still using it, but it's different.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, but they were just just straight up making.
[SPEAKER_01]: And let's talk about Ray Phones for a minute, because Ray Phones is the material that's in everything that Eldar use.
[SPEAKER_01]: And it is effectively warp energy that's weaved into being a physical
[SPEAKER_04]: But it's, it's effectively almost a living day, tissue because it generates.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, not in the game.
[SPEAKER_04]: Well, no, it used to kind of, they've had some rules.
[SPEAKER_01]: Some of them have, I guess you're going to say, because Rayth Lord's can, yeah, it can self repair a little bit.
[SPEAKER_01]: But the Rayth bone is the key thing to the LDR, and it is maybe the strongest element in the universe in the lore.
[SPEAKER_01]: Again, they all are also this point kind of master they become almost immortal, but they were already long lived, but they thanks to soulstone and some other technology, they become, well, before they were psychos, elder, we just, they had full on reincarnation.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, you would just go back into
[SPEAKER_04]: The elder.
[SPEAKER_04]: The whole experience.
[SPEAKER_01]: I tried to write something in here about the life cycle of the elder and after like losing my mind trying to read it, I just gave up on it because because they used to have like they have a close circle now, which is the infinity.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, but it used to just be how they live.
[SPEAKER_01]: eventually once an elder reached like two thousand years old, they would eventually die of old age.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then they would, and then they would get recycled back there.
[SPEAKER_01]: They didn't even need the infinity circle.
[SPEAKER_01]: They would just get recycled back into another elder that is born.
[SPEAKER_01]: But at the same time, they also were.
[SPEAKER_04]: There was also a lot of, there's a lot of thing, elder.
[SPEAKER_04]: Who's also a lot of talk of whether or not you kept all of their knowledge or not.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's all over the place in that.
[SPEAKER_04]: But the biggest thing on this is once they got into the crazy pressure quotes and stuff, elder just didn't want to die.
[SPEAKER_01]: Period.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, the problem is, this is where I think led to the, the pleasure cult is the fact that the pleasure cults could exist because they actually weren't killing.
[SPEAKER_01]: That was like, and a pleasure cult would kill an elder.
[SPEAKER_01]: They were just, there's recycle.
[SPEAKER_01]: So there was, you had that excuse where, like, yeah, I just murdered that person.
[SPEAKER_04]: Meaninglessly.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I murdered this person, right, but then they just got reborn like four minutes later.
[SPEAKER_04]: I kind of already didn't care, but also
[SPEAKER_04]: It really didn't matter.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and so that's, which is also how this project gets to be even more excessive in their psychosis.
[SPEAKER_01]: The other one to it this time is the elder, and I keep it in the word sort of mastered for far-sight.
[SPEAKER_01]: They had the ability, this is where the real birth of the far-seers comes up.
[SPEAKER_01]: It was all this years.
[SPEAKER_04]: They were wildly great at this when they were determining what things are going to happen, celestial events that are going to happen, planets that they could go.
[SPEAKER_04]: But they predicted when and where things would be ready for them as an elder to settle things of that nature.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's true.
[SPEAKER_01]: Because one thing, and we're going to get to it a little bit, the elder never actually, they do use a little bit of work travel now, but they didn't really use work for these faster and light drives.
[SPEAKER_01]: So the problem is that when you had to go somewhere, they had to know where they were going was worth getting to.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so that's where the far site was used a lot.
[SPEAKER_01]: Also when they would go to war,
[SPEAKER_01]: this power was incredible because they could, they knew they would effectively fire artillery at where the enemy was about to be.
[SPEAKER_01]: The enemy would just, you know, to be doing, you'd be doing some sneaky move like, oh, we're gonna sneak around this mountain, then attack, and as you come around the mountain behind all the old artillery hits you.
[SPEAKER_04]: And they do this face and stuff like that.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, people coming out of the ward, we'll just go.
[SPEAKER_04]: Oh, yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, you wouldn't come out of the, out of the work.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then they were shoot at you.
[SPEAKER_01]: You'd come out of the work to the shots that have already been fired.
[SPEAKER_01]: And it just was like, Oh, well, I guess we're done here.
[SPEAKER_04]: But they were wildly accurate as far as.
[SPEAKER_04]: These are the worlds we want.
[SPEAKER_04]: These are the times where things are going to work out.
[SPEAKER_04]: Celestial events.
[SPEAKER_04]: Things are like, effectively, if they wanted to colonize a word, they would have far seers looking to the future and go, how is this world going to be there if we leave now tomorrow or whatever?
[SPEAKER_04]: Where do we go?
[SPEAKER_04]: And they would just go there.
[SPEAKER_04]: And they would went way up.
[SPEAKER_01]: So at the end of this, the elder, this is as we're getting towards the fall, they cannot really die.
[SPEAKER_01]: They reincarnate.
[SPEAKER_01]: they cannot want for anything they want, they just create.
[SPEAKER_01]: And there's no enemies worth fighting because they fight, they ought to win.
[SPEAKER_01]: And that last one I want to put some out.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, dark didn't fight with Eldar.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's the last piece there, where it's like humanity has revolutions.
[SPEAKER_01]: Even the Tao actually have revolutions, orks, constantly fight with themselves, tyrannids don't.
[SPEAKER_01]: But whatever, but for the most part, all the other races that exist within the galaxy.
[SPEAKER_01]: Just straight each other.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, had some, there's a Eldar didn't.
[SPEAKER_01]: Until we get, so then things begin to get weird.
[SPEAKER_01]: And effectively,
[SPEAKER_01]: and we've probably the pleasure calls before.
[SPEAKER_01]: They go nuts here and they just start killing each other and we're interacting each other and doing worse.
[SPEAKER_01]: We're got a very fun cast on Drew Carrey in the future about where they came from and yeah, they kept on.
[SPEAKER_04]: But all of this doesn't happen like instantaneously.
[SPEAKER_01]: So all of this is millennia.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's going over there.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's more than millions.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: So these pop out.
[SPEAKER_04]: They're starting to happen and they are looking for the first years are looking for their sensing of the future that's reporting.
[SPEAKER_04]: They're saying what?
[SPEAKER_04]: Their portends are things are going to be in the future.
[SPEAKER_04]: We should do something about this.
[SPEAKER_04]: And the four
[SPEAKER_04]: Again, hundreds of thousands of years, they start to plan this.
[SPEAKER_01]: They do.
[SPEAKER_01]: And one of the key problems is that everybody's people may not remember that, absolutely, before on this.
[SPEAKER_01]: The pleasure cult started just kind of like anything, just it was, it was a small subset of the populace.
[SPEAKER_01]: At some point that the pleasure cults infected the nobility of the Eldar.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then it became, at this point, now the entire civilization is shifting this way.
[SPEAKER_01]: So what you get is,
[SPEAKER_01]: a movement away.
[SPEAKER_01]: So some people, it's a kind of three groups, three groups come in.
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.
[SPEAKER_01]: First group is one.
[SPEAKER_04]: You have to do that.
[SPEAKER_04]: Why?
[SPEAKER_04]: Because GW had, have you fisted it in a good way?
[SPEAKER_04]: The thing is they gave the whole ultimate power corrupts ultimately.
[SPEAKER_04]: And they did because when you are effectively immortal, you have no one who can do anything to you.
[SPEAKER_04]: And also there's no ramifications for their actions on this point.
[SPEAKER_01]: None.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, they're, yeah, none that they're.
[SPEAKER_04]: They know.
[SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, the, the, the forestier's new of it.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's the way.
[SPEAKER_01]: But the ones who are living day to day don't care.
[SPEAKER_01]: So three groups emerge.
[SPEAKER_01]: First, the ones who run off immediately, the X lights, which we're in cover in a second.
[SPEAKER_01]: The next one is the ones who take big ships and kind of try to save.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm, I'm understanding big.
[SPEAKER_01]: And the last one are actually the ones who choose, who try to convince everyone the errors of their ways.
[SPEAKER_01]: And we're going to cover the last ones actually all died.
[SPEAKER_01]: So anyway.
[SPEAKER_04]: Well, they're gone.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: So two of the three.
[SPEAKER_01]: So the first one we'll talk about is what I consider one of the more controversial aspects of the Eldar lore, which in the sense, which is the exidites.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's controversial in that much like they did with the Unary.
[SPEAKER_01]: The Eldar wrote about the exides for a while and then one day just stopped.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm pretty sure this is because at some point in the early nineties, they had to bring your kid to work day and that could get all hopped up of Mountain Dew and caught some exhibit in Natural History Museum because during the fall of the Eldar, these exidites
[SPEAKER_01]: found dinosaurs slash dragons depending on which model.
[SPEAKER_01]: The ex-dites are modeled as Eldar, carrying blight bright lenses, and either riding on dragons or just straight up dinosaurs.
[SPEAKER_04]: They literally strapped bright lenses to the heads of flying dinosaurs.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: And it was awesome.
[SPEAKER_01]: It was awesome.
[SPEAKER_01]: It makes no sense.
[SPEAKER_04]: Step away from the dinosaur with a bright landscape.
[SPEAKER_04]: Step away from it.
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_01]: If you want to see some very, very fun, three deep printed models, people have had a good time with this over the years.
[SPEAKER_01]: And there's some amazing stuff out there.
[SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely amazing stuff about that out there, but yeah, the exudites just disappeared effectively from Eldar, Lord though, and more modern code exes.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yes, but they're still.
[SPEAKER_04]: They still write about Cronorals the next night worlds.
[SPEAKER_04]: They just don't talk about them as much as they used.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, because of the dinosaur thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's because every time and we there, this is actually because of people who play Warhammer or funny, and any time GW ever mentions an accident, they get bombarded with nothing but questions of, are we getting models?
[SPEAKER_01]: Are we getting models?
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, when are we getting models?
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, I will buy the entire army.
[SPEAKER_01]: Can I pre-buy the army?
[SPEAKER_01]: feel like you didn't hear me with flying dinosaurs and I'll be right Lance is strapped to their hands is they brought the extra dites back into the game and they were like oh we're doing a starter box I would camp out I would say you were talking shit about this I would a hundred percent get this I'd get like I would buy eat I would actually they would assume I was a scalper at the amount of boxes I'd be buying and they all wait for personal consumption we'll be right back after a quick break
[SPEAKER_01]: Anyway, the excited to leave first and what they do is they just kind of shoot off all throughout the galaxy in kind of smaller groups.
[SPEAKER_01]: The longer the pilgrims.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, which is it's funny because when we say they're going in smaller groups, these are still gigantic groups.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's we're talking about a huge civilization, but it's just it's small groups that aren't huge like we're going to see in craft for stuff like that.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, but what we're going into these groups, small groups, which end up being full planets worth of people.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that means billions of souls.
[SPEAKER_01]: The ex-dates kind of went off.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I view it almost like some like a road trader and that there's some where small ships, some are bigger ships.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, they just grabbed the ship and left like a life boat.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, actually, it's where everything between a thousand to a hundred and fifty thousand to a million millions.
[SPEAKER_04]: No one knows every exit I world was X amount of people that went, you guys are crazy.
[SPEAKER_04]: We're the hell out here.
[SPEAKER_04]: And they left wildly before.
[SPEAKER_01]: And they also had wildly far.
[SPEAKER_01]: The thing was is that most of, like, they were trying to get beyond the scope of the other.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's why the elder craft worlds are still in what's considered elder space.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's obviously not the space that the slenash had took over, but you'll hit exudites on like the
[SPEAKER_01]: far northern southern east of it, like all the way on the fringe room, which is actually what's kind of funny when, yeah, if you think about just to go back to a road trader episode, here a road trader exploring, you could hit tau, you could hit orc, you could hit tyrannid, or you could hit exidite, which actually might be one of the worst of those, because you won't know you hit them, just get blown out of the sky instantly, because the exidates are not, like we talking about like Brad likes to tease the omniscient of the, of the elder.
[SPEAKER_01]: But they're not omnisch like the omnisch and those you aren't in the US.
[SPEAKER_01]: Google the omnisch, it's too hard to explain in the cast.
[SPEAKER_01]: But anyway, they're not against technology.
[SPEAKER_01]: They've got bright lenses.
[SPEAKER_01]: All of the bright lenses.
[SPEAKER_01]: They will blast you out of the sky in a second.
[SPEAKER_04]: Also, they're kind of big on, leave me the hell alone, because some of them aren't a hundred percent sure on what's going on in the rest of the galaxy.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and they just, and they're very entuned with corruption is something that I'm not going to let anywhere near me.
[SPEAKER_01]: And if you're not me, you could be corruption.
[SPEAKER_04]: Therefore, and the other have been kind of real dicks about, well, there's elder, and then there's just not elder.
[SPEAKER_01]: So the next group is, of course, the ones who, and we're going to, we're going to craft worlds.
[SPEAKER_01]: And the next one we're going to come after this is craft worlds, but we're going to craft worlds, how they try to save the Eldar.
[SPEAKER_01]: Then there were the ones who stayed behind to try and sit there and say, Hey, everybody stop doing this.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is wrong.
[SPEAKER_04]: And you had ups and downs of this because they had a couple.
[SPEAKER_04]: We had stories about random, elder people, no one got a foothold.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, they all died.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'll grab directions one more.
[SPEAKER_01]: The Jew Curry.
[SPEAKER_01]: They do survive this.
[SPEAKER_04]: Well, they were basically the old emperor.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, the jukari are the old elder.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's what this is.
[SPEAKER_01]: But they did survive because of, and we'll get to a common common run in a minute.
[SPEAKER_01]: But anyway, let's, at this point, to kind of set this stage for modern, for decay, get into into the craft world.
[SPEAKER_01]: Because these are in the history, the lore of the Eldari is maybe the most important.
[SPEAKER_01]: So first off, craft roads were not built for the fall.
[SPEAKER_01]: They predated the fall.
[SPEAKER_01]: They've always had craft.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yes, and yes.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yes, they, they've always had what they, they tuned them up.
[SPEAKER_04]: They tuned them up.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_04]: I mean, if this happened, because craft roads weren't, hey, everybody get on a craft world, shit's about to get down.
[SPEAKER_04]: Go down.
[SPEAKER_04]: Craft roads are were super unhappy with elder society.
[SPEAKER_04]: And we're going to take billions of elder and again, when you said the ships were large.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: Sorry, big.
[SPEAKER_01]: Let's go back to the original.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's what they did with them.
[SPEAKER_01]: the original craft worlds were actually effectively trading and colonization vessels.
[SPEAKER_01]: Because as we said, the Eldar have the web way, which allows them to move within Eldar worlds.
[SPEAKER_04]: Well, it has to be anything that the web way is built exactly.
[SPEAKER_01]: So you can't just go somewhere and then attach it to the web.
[SPEAKER_04]: Exactly what they did.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, but they had to do that.
[SPEAKER_01]: And the Eldar didn't have warp travel at that stage.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's actually unclear if they did it or did not, but just says that they really didn't use it.
[SPEAKER_01]: So these ships were all faster than life ships.
[SPEAKER_01]: The reason that matters is that an Eldar craft world would go in these trading and colonization missions.
[SPEAKER_01]: And they would come back to Eldar space once every two hundred years.
[SPEAKER_04]: These were craft worlds are world.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, they're world.
[SPEAKER_01]: These we're not talking about a trading vessel.
[SPEAKER_01]: We're talking about a million people potentially more on a ship with their own.
[SPEAKER_04]: They're effectively flying earths with their own fleet.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so what end of happening is these vessels are coming and going actually really we're trying to describe them.
[SPEAKER_01]: Just play mass effect.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's the Koreans that is that's the fact that it's what these things they are.
[SPEAKER_01]: Because not even a craft world also, it's usually got one main ship, but it's actually also a collection.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's a free craft for the craftsmen, but there's a fleet or coffee.
[SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.
[SPEAKER_01]: It is the Koreans from Mass Effect.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, because the every other ship that's around the craft world, there's a bunch of, yes, fighting ships, but there's also a bunch of
[SPEAKER_04]: Refueling ships, everything.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, we've got you have your freighters, you've got your battleships, you've got you have everything you would be.
[SPEAKER_04]: You had everything, you had your mining ships stuff like that.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, just, because I mean, they took this, it's, obviously, mass effect took this from before.
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_01]: And Forty K probably took this from early English colonial.
[SPEAKER_01]: is a where you would send tens of thousands of people to, well, Australia, all listeners there, you guys, you know where you guys came from?
[SPEAKER_01]: Anyway, but that's what it was.
[SPEAKER_01]: So the crowd for it because they spent so much time away, a key thing that, and it was funny, I didn't occur to me till I was doing the research for this.
[SPEAKER_01]: They noticed the Eldar descent and decadence, which it realized, of course, if you were living in one of the true Eldar home worlds, it's the old phrase, how do you boil a frog?
[SPEAKER_01]: You do it slowly.
[SPEAKER_01]: You put the frog in the water and you add the heat and then eventually the frog never notices that it's boiling around them.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's what was happening on the Eldar home worlds.
[SPEAKER_01]: As these cults of pleasure got more and more decadent, it wasn't over night, it was over a million years.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, but for the craft roads.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, the craft roads come back after a thousand years like what are you all?
[SPEAKER_04]: It is a thousand percent the Danny Glover me.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah, what did they get on me?
[SPEAKER_04]: Like when I just want to see what the piece doesn't go.
[SPEAKER_04]: What?
[UNKNOWN]: What?
[SPEAKER_01]: How is wrong with your people?
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, if you don't know if it is Google it.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's one of it's what you have to know that meme is the guy holding pizza and the room's on fire.
[SPEAKER_01]: You have to see that meme.
[SPEAKER_01]: Anyway, the elder crop roads realize at a certain point in their back and forth, they have to do something because the elder seers are going nuts and they're just saying, well, every single one of them, I mean, some of them are just dying because they're looking into a future where the elder civilization is
[SPEAKER_04]: effectively snuffed out because it is at the core of it and they're telling their non-stop well the craft world's the ones that we now know as the craft world's got but for these craft world's they start specifically getting a plan to we need to get the hell out of here you guys are too.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, the Eldar Sears are able to see the future that not only is their civilization at collapse, but it's going to be a cataclysmic event where anyone anywhere near the Eldar home worlds will get killed.
[SPEAKER_04]: They don't know this as far as.
[SPEAKER_04]: They don't know it's slimy fair.
[SPEAKER_04]: They don't know that it's going to rip apart space and time.
[SPEAKER_01]: But they think that they can't be here.
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.
[SPEAKER_04]: We are currently going to happen.
[SPEAKER_04]: We're going to fight amongst ourselves and we're going to invite this or they don't know what it is.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's just going to be a civilization ending event is going to happen.
[SPEAKER_04]: And we need to just get the hell out of here.
[SPEAKER_04]: But also we want to continue our specific old our way of life.
[SPEAKER_04]: And this is different for each of the craftsmen.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so the craft world assemble get more into them when the next cast that deep dive into each individual craft group where the craft world's do is they decide to kind of know as arc this situation where they're going to all the part just traveling to all the elder homes.
[SPEAKER_04]: I mean, I know we're going to do it in the next but it is important to tell everybody.
[SPEAKER_04]: that they're not just grabbing people that are not cool with all their society.
[SPEAKER_04]: They're grabbing their focus.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, because there's a web ways and nice thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: So if you park a craft world in a position, anyone who agrees with that craft world, now can use the web way to get to that craft world.
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's what they were effectively doing there.
[SPEAKER_01]: They're filling their ships to the brim.
[SPEAKER_01]: with anyone who was not corrupted into the pleasure called, and agreed with their style of, and they also have a pretty easy way to determine this.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, being psychic helps.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's the cool thing is that when we think about, I was thinking of the story and it's like, normally you'd have that moment of like, hey, there's a bunch of like corrupted people here, but we have to save the ones who aren't corrupted.
[SPEAKER_01]: And any movie that ever seen, that's an impossible task.
[SPEAKER_01]: But the Eldar are so, so he could get to-
[SPEAKER_01]: There's like, yeah, uh, Eric's a yes, Sean's a hard no.
[SPEAKER_01]: Susan, not taking the risk.
[SPEAKER_01]: Nope.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, it's like, they can just go through them one by one by one.
[SPEAKER_04]: They're getting the people that they were this mindset on because it's a big deal because the craft world, as you find out, are very hardcore rigid in ways that they think.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so they begin this process.
[SPEAKER_01]: And this, by the way, doesn't happen slow.
[SPEAKER_01]: This craft world thing is actually pretty quick.
[SPEAKER_01]: It depends on me.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think it's third edition.
[SPEAKER_01]: It refers to as the last weeks.
[SPEAKER_01]: It was a final weeks before.
[SPEAKER_04]: But some of them happen.
[SPEAKER_04]: If this is either hundreds or days.
[SPEAKER_04]: Or, yeah, it's, they're saying like, because some of these are just gone and they just decided it beforehand.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah, some platforms were just already there, but there was there was the last at the very end of the fall.
[SPEAKER_01]: There was that scene of like the fall of Saigon where people are being, you know, I mean, they're not running.
[SPEAKER_04]: It doesn't switch when the crafts are talking about because some of these crafts were just left.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: Hey, we were supposed to turn around, and we're just not.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, but others were literally parked next to it.
[SPEAKER_04]: And had to, and had to put up them, don't survive.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and that's what I'm saying.
[SPEAKER_01]: They had to boogie out as Slonash's born and did Brad's point.
[SPEAKER_01]: We don't know, like, let me say, we are not, I've seen something like my historian.
[SPEAKER_01]: GW has never stated how many craft worlds existed, or even how many exist currently, but we know in the fall quite a few of them didn't make it, because they were still way too close.
[SPEAKER_04]: In way too close as a big deal, I mean, wow, a lot of stuff got blown up.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: And so I have Terry's huge.
[SPEAKER_01]: It is.
[SPEAKER_01]: One part of the story that I do like is to Brad's point with the craft roads.
[SPEAKER_01]: The craft roads weren't anywhere near the size at this stage that they are today.
[SPEAKER_01]: Some of them like the stories are there.
[SPEAKER_01]: tend to a hundred times larger.
[SPEAKER_01]: They just grabbed every single person who was going to, like, kind of fit their check marks.
[SPEAKER_01]: These ships were shoulder to shoulder as they fled out the birth of slenash, which must have been really fun, visual, and feeling as everyone you've ever known, who's not on the ship, but you've gets consumed and screens as your soul.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: Remember a whole bunch of people died.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, on terror and everywhere else when we have because it was it was such a psychic yeah explosion and I'll say these those aren't people that were born into the work.
[SPEAKER_01]: See, I'm like a crap on towel.
[SPEAKER_01]: They're not.
[SPEAKER_01]: So he clicked it.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, they had no idea it was going on.
[SPEAKER_01]: Anyway, so that will say the birth of slenesh does have a little caveat.
[SPEAKER_01]: We talked about it destroying ninety percent of the elder were consumed.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, but then there's also the Harley Quinn's exercise in jukari who it's hard to cover.
[SPEAKER_01]: Are they part of that number?
[SPEAKER_01]: They're not part of that number.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like we're going to have fun with jukari cast to like, how many jukari are there?
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, how many of your career are there also?
[SPEAKER_04]: Because they're super not into one, but yeah, but it doesn't point to it.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's weird.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's there with me.
[SPEAKER_01]: Harlow wins are there.
[SPEAKER_04]: Absolutely no idea.
[SPEAKER_04]: They're supposed to be a small mountain.
[SPEAKER_04]: But yeah, but how many is that amount?
[SPEAKER_04]: And the thing is also the other are listed as a dying race, but also there's just building something.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, it is kind of fun with the LDR, like they opened a portal to hell, you know, and a bunch of them got consumed in the process.
[SPEAKER_01]: But I will give the LDR credit after the fall.
[SPEAKER_01]: They have the little like moment of like of your brain burning as everyone you ever known or carried about dies.
[SPEAKER_01]: And they instantly set off to fix it.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's a big deal because they now make it their life's work to fix all of these things.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: Also, when they find out that necrons are coming back, they start fixing that.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: They're still trying to stop chaos, they're trying to stop necrons.
[SPEAKER_04]: Didn't think tournaments were a big deal until, well, some shit happened.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, more like high got eaten by one of them.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know what I'm talking about?
[SPEAKER_01]: Like the moment I, I'm all in tight, I'm all in tight happened.
[SPEAKER_01]: The towel shot at him a couple times.
[SPEAKER_01]: Now they're going to deal with them, too.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, they'll do the, they go, the other effectively due to themselves with the old ones did to them, sixty five million years ago, where they say,
[SPEAKER_01]: Forget everything we were doing that wasn't war.
[SPEAKER_01]: We are now only war conquest and victory, but also still knowledge, but the knowledge to defeat our foes.
[SPEAKER_01]: There is no all the poets are gone.
[SPEAKER_01]: Let's put it that way.
[SPEAKER_04]: Because now that our society is still, they're forcing it to happen.
[SPEAKER_01]: They are, but the Eldar are, they're not growing anymore, because we think about Eldar's aside, there were Eldar worlds that were devoted to music.
[SPEAKER_01]: They were devoted, that's gone.
[SPEAKER_01]: If you're on a craft world, every member of a craft world is a warrior.
[SPEAKER_01]: They're a guardian or more powerful.
[SPEAKER_01]: You fleed our at guardian.
[SPEAKER_04]: And that's the thing is that you're a full-time job.
[SPEAKER_04]: is to fight, but then you have the the bakers, the poets, whatever, but that's your side hustle.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, your number one thing is fight.
[SPEAKER_01]: And this is why when you know what Brad's love of the elder, I know what he's going to, but I have a big like love of the elder for this, too, because they
[SPEAKER_01]: They're dicks about it, don't get me wrong, they're dicks about it, but they are setting off to fix the galaxy and tell the galaxy what they're also doing wrong.
[SPEAKER_01]: Anyway.
[SPEAKER_04]: They're pretty snooty about that.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, they're not cool, but tens of millions of years of elder culture, just, I think it wiped out, and now it's more, more, more, more, more.
[SPEAKER_02]: and preventing more more.
[SPEAKER_01]: The last little bit though to take a little one last check mark we have to cover before getting the next cast is the web way, which we haven't really spent I think enough time on in our cast and even if we had we'd have to dive back into it for an Eldar cast anyway.
[SPEAKER_01]: So let's let's get this going.
[SPEAKER_01]: So
[SPEAKER_01]: The majority of the L-DAR that survived the fall to slash on giant fleets.
[SPEAKER_01]: The L-DAR have effectively two methods of transportation.
[SPEAKER_01]: They have their big ships, which as we said, are faster than light drives.
[SPEAKER_01]: They interestingly don't have navigators.
[SPEAKER_01]: So when an L-DAR wants to transit, that's why we talked about warp travel, the L-DAR don't really use the warp to travel, because they can't see into it.
[SPEAKER_01]: They can do little short jobs here and there.
[SPEAKER_01]: So their primary modes of transportation are
[SPEAKER_04]: faster than light drives, or which are wildly better than our fasty algebra.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, but still not, you know, it's just meant in a race, mankind can get their first because they can go to the web unless there's a web way.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so the old ones began this process of building web ways and the L-DAR took this technology and they put it everywhere.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, they they standard the shit out of the web way.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it's they never explained how the web way works.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's effectively from a rule standpoint.
[SPEAKER_01]: I view it as a third dimension because we've got the material, the immaterial and the web way.
[SPEAKER_01]: They're three separate things.
[SPEAKER_04]: And it's also whether you can exist physically in the web way.
[SPEAKER_04]: or are you just instantaneously travel between?
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, in the arm on books, they do refer the webways as being somewhat alive, too, because the webway would attack chaos.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's inside the webway, not the beings of the way, but the webway itself.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's why you would as a third dimension, much like the way that you can exist there, but also you can't.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's very, you could do this, but you might get killed for existing.
[SPEAKER_04]: So versus the thing is, it's like you can take the webway and you would almost, in some of the stories, you're just there.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's true.
[SPEAKER_01]: Where I think the webway falls into this weird one is like so, for example, a demon can't exist in the material without having a host and my dad.
[SPEAKER_01]: A demon also can't exist in the in the in the webway, but maybe it can, but if it does, the webway will kill it.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's where the webway collapsed on us.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it gets a little bit weird.
[SPEAKER_01]: But anyway.
[SPEAKER_01]: The webway is a interconnected series of tubes and tunnels.
[SPEAKER_01]: The second edition codex, I think, actually did all the things I write on it.
[SPEAKER_01]: The second edition codex is the best way of explaining it.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's this impossible maze of tunnels of varying sizes.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like so some of the webways are meant for like barely a person to fit through.
[SPEAKER_01]: And others, you can put a craft world through.
[SPEAKER_01]: And the network is also not
[SPEAKER_01]: like interconnected, like the, well, well, throughout our English users, like the British underground, which actually you can get into the kind of, kind of get anywhere.
[SPEAKER_01]: The web way kind of, a lot of times you'd have to enter the web way at one point.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, you're the hubs.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, go to the other spot, get out of the web way, go up above grounds in some ways, it's like the British tube system and then go down, down, there's somewhere else.
[SPEAKER_04]: The web web has hubs because, depending on where you want to go and what you want to move.
[SPEAKER_04]: If it comes, that's why I said it's confusing on that because they never
[SPEAKER_04]: Sometimes in the stories, they just go into the web way and they just appear almost instantaneously.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and you can do that if you're on A to B web way.
[SPEAKER_01]: But a lot of times you get on A, get off on B, have to fly for a little bit, then get on the C to go to D. It's just the way it's set up.
[SPEAKER_01]: This getting is made a lot worse with the fall of slenish.
[SPEAKER_01]: because of the fall of slenash, a lot of the webwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebwebweb
[SPEAKER_01]: One other piece about the webway travel is we're never really sure how long it does take to what Brad was just saying, sometimes it's interesting.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, sometimes it's longer, but it is still faster than warp travel.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, it's never years, months, whatever, you know, distance, it's semi instantaneous.
[SPEAKER_04]: Again, the stories are wildly different.
[SPEAKER_01]: One of the key things though in the webway that's just going to come up a lot is the webway is not, it's not like this, let's say, Stargate, we've all seen.
[SPEAKER_01]: And if you haven't seen Stargate SG-One as I've, I've crap talked it earlier in our cast.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's pretty cool.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not a great show, but whatever.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's the way.
[SPEAKER_01]: The webways, not I enter in a portal and appear at the other portal.
[SPEAKER_01]: There is a travel in between.
[SPEAKER_01]: And as such, the Eldar actually built structures within the webway.
[SPEAKER_01]: Two are the, there's two very key ones that that were built in the webway.
[SPEAKER_01]: The first one, which is I think the more important, maybe, is the Black Library.
[SPEAKER_01]: You don't think that's very important.
[SPEAKER_01]: More comma.
[SPEAKER_01]: As I'm saying, it's pretty big.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I love the black library.
[SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, the black library is the ultimate level of the elder having foresight because they decided that they wanted to collect all of the information in the galaxy and all the history of the galaxy.
[SPEAKER_01]: And this includes like how a chaos God is born.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like we're not talking like, you know, you have a repository of
[SPEAKER_04]: Every single piece of information we've collected in the last sixty-five million years.
[SPEAKER_01]: And this information is mildly critical information, and sometimes if they use it very often, apparently not, but whatever.
[SPEAKER_04]: Well, a lot of it's again looked at it as if we use this week and again, we'll break this guy again.
[SPEAKER_04]: We'll follow the slenash.
[SPEAKER_04]: We can't take that chance, even though it probably could solve all of our problems right now.
[SPEAKER_01]: So in order to protect this information, they built the Black Library within a pocket of the webway that you can't even get to unless you know the very specific series of doors of the webway, you have to walk through to get to it.
[SPEAKER_01]: It is the hardest place to access.
[SPEAKER_04]: There's a chance that it also shifts.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: You can arguably, the black library is harder to access than the thrones of the chaos gods.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's that well protected.
[SPEAKER_01]: And they've even gotten to who's protecting it.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's just that hard to access it.
[SPEAKER_01]: So the black library is one of the two main structures within the web way.
[SPEAKER_01]: The other one though is an impossibly large city.
[SPEAKER_04]: Be helping?
[SPEAKER_04]: No.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know, but it's where all of the jukari live.
[SPEAKER_01]: So at some point before the fall of slenash, effectively, some of the elder pleasure calls who are too extreme for the other pleasure calls had to build their own place to go hang out.
[SPEAKER_01]: And they built this thing in the web way.
[SPEAKER_01]: You is the best way to explain Kamara.
[SPEAKER_04]: And the cover-up also has still the most advanced web way technology, even above the other right now.
[SPEAKER_04]: Oh, yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: Because they're using all of the old technology, all of the old technology, all of the old are now having to kind of, the differences they, the, we'll cover a lot more into car later, but the advanced comma has is
[SPEAKER_01]: the denzians of the war can't access it.
[SPEAKER_01]: So the craft world has to be careful about how they utilize the war, because using too much of it and we'll talk later about how they can overpower them, they can become possessed or consumed by slenash for using too much.
[SPEAKER_01]: that you card and how do whatever they want because they're within the web way.
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, they also kind of have to because they did get wrecked by.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, they did, but they can do whatever that page they have is the powered by pain is is not a title.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's a reality.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a reality, but it keeps the demons at bay.
[SPEAKER_01]: So they still have old-held our technology as a result.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is why the raiders are so fast.
[SPEAKER_01]: You card yes, I mean, it should be a lot of fun.
[SPEAKER_01]: We'll cover more on Comar and we do it your carry cast, but we just do want to point that out, not say, hey, isn't there something else in the web way?
[SPEAKER_01]: So the web way does have structures within it.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's just hard.
[SPEAKER_02]: And one of those structures is, you know, infinite.
[SPEAKER_01]: So where does this take us?
[SPEAKER_01]: It takes us to the the state of the elder before we dive into deeper cast on them.
[SPEAKER_01]: Basically, the elder are holding on by a threat.
[SPEAKER_01]: The ninety plus percent of the civilization was consumed.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's still, I mean, a ninety percent loss is still a lot.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's significant loss.
[SPEAKER_01]: They went from ruling the galaxy.
[SPEAKER_01]: with no threats to having nothing but threats around them at all times.
[SPEAKER_04]: They're also a deal.
[SPEAKER_04]: One of the things that's a big deal about this is their while they have a decent amount of numbers.
[SPEAKER_04]: They're considered a dying race, but they're still a huge amount of them.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, but these are very spread out, but they're also kind of interconnected, but not really.
[SPEAKER_04]: There's these nomadic craftworlds who all have their version of what they should do to fix things.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: That's it.
[SPEAKER_04]: So each one is kind of their own.
[SPEAKER_04]: Oh, no, these are all separate.
[SPEAKER_04]: Elder entities.
[SPEAKER_04]: They're not coming together and fighting.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's true.
[SPEAKER_01]: Because they are all convinced that the other ones plan is not going to be successful.
[SPEAKER_01]: Right?
[SPEAKER_01]: That's the one.
[SPEAKER_04]: And again, when you have a catastrophically bad plan, which is a blend of the fall, you're kind of like, well, oh, I'm going to go ahead and do it this way.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, I'm going to let's not break the sky again.
[SPEAKER_01]: The elder elephant on the elder have is they're not really great at making allies.
[SPEAKER_04]: But they're also innately pretty disdainful of anybody that's not yelled at.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, they're not going to negotiate their way through the tyrannids or the orcs.
[SPEAKER_01]: The necrons both end to shoot each other on site.
[SPEAKER_01]: So they're left with mankind and tal and tal aren't psychically gifted.
[SPEAKER_01]: So they're not real things as far as the elder are concerned.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I mean, honestly, just like the elder would view you as if you were a non-psychograise as being.
[SPEAKER_01]: All right.
[SPEAKER_01]: So why are you here?
[SPEAKER_01]: So you're a rock.
[SPEAKER_04]: I mean, effective way to be fair.
[SPEAKER_04]: Elder could fix shit.
[SPEAKER_04]: They have access to the Black Library.
[SPEAKER_04]: They could actually do all these things.
[SPEAKER_04]: No one can agree how and why.
[SPEAKER_04]: And they can't convince others.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, let's spend them in on it.
[SPEAKER_01]: The problem they have is the black library is guarded by the hardliquins.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, and the hardliquins also think that there's this civilization.
[SPEAKER_04]: F stop pretty good.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so you can ask the hardliquins to read some of the black library and the hardliquins are going to say no.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's the other problem is like, it's not just that the elder of fractured, but their greatest repository of information now are letting in there.
[SPEAKER_01]: So the elder are kind of their backs are against it.
[SPEAKER_01]: Again, to their credit, their system is currently fine.
[SPEAKER_01]: fight them, which this leads to one other thing we should cover, which is a lot of people who play Forty Kay don't like Eldar.
[SPEAKER_01]: And there's two reasons they don't like them.
[SPEAKER_01]: One is from a lower standpoint.
[SPEAKER_01]: They think they're all dicks.
[SPEAKER_01]: Which is wrong or two from a competitive standpoint.
[SPEAKER_01]: The Eldar have had the most broken codex and almost every addition.
[SPEAKER_04]: There are several of the times they might have been a little overpiled.
[SPEAKER_01]: I do not believe and someone correct me was playing him longer than I have.
[SPEAKER_01]: Was there ever in addition, in which point at one moment in the addition, Eldar were not a huge problem at the table top?
[SPEAKER_04]: Fifth edition, I think they were bad.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_01]: You got one.
[SPEAKER_01]: Tenth edition, they broke it without even having it.
[SPEAKER_01]: As you can't and eighth, they were able to be broken without even having code.
[SPEAKER_01]: Thanks.
[SPEAKER_04]: There's minus four.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, seven edition, six edition, second.
[SPEAKER_01]: Anyway, so you'll, you will hear a lot of people who hate Eldar.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's one or the two.
[SPEAKER_01]: The other thing that they're, that they're dick from a lower standpoint, or they play competitively, and if that just horrible games, you guys don't know.
[SPEAKER_04]: And when we get into the craft rooms next, the next cast.
[SPEAKER_04]: We're going to deep dive into this and this the craft for us are the reason that all of the other because of the fact that they have some huge heroes and they have a way of life that is hardcore and a sci-fi setting give it fantasy or sci-fi so we'll go into a lot of that and it because right now you're like man, what is brand like the hell that seems terrible.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, they're cool.
[SPEAKER_04]: Well, a bunch of we go into the conference.
[SPEAKER_04]: We'll talk a lot about a lot of the things in our life are like crazy and inspiring about stuff because they they always because of all these things that have happened.
[SPEAKER_04]: everything they do is inspiring to be the best and even the most of the trivial things.
[SPEAKER_01]: But they also know are, like, it's, I'm in, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: That's the, the, the rates, the right constructs.
[SPEAKER_01]: I love that.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's this idea of we're going to sacrifice ourselves twice to make sure usually because I am in mostly coming against chaos.
[SPEAKER_01]: That seems to be one of one of their key areas is like,
[SPEAKER_04]: chaos is they're trying to fix the prime they know it's a big problem man raise your hand if you created a dark god yep yeah that we know we made some some shit at the same with all the way my I love all the art it's they're trying to it's different stuff that they've done which helps but
[SPEAKER_01]: But the old way, again, they're trying to fix it.
[SPEAKER_01]: That is their thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: They're trying to bring knowledge.
[SPEAKER_01]: Could they maybe explain things a little bit better?
[SPEAKER_01]: Take a few extra words when you're talking to a phlegrum, and maybe Horace doesn't get stabbed with a poison blade, or you just say, hey, that guy over there, the tattoo's on his head, shoot him.
[SPEAKER_04]: One of the things is the other, so ridiculously connected.
[SPEAKER_04]: I don't think they understand when they, this is what I've always gotten from them.
[SPEAKER_04]: Is one of the problems is,
[SPEAKER_04]: They, you don't get it immediately at psychic imprint and everything else because they, you feel, yeah, what an elderly person feels when they're telling you something.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's, I do think that's actually probably a really fair way to put it.
[SPEAKER_01]: The elderly just don't understand how mankind or others think, because they just, what are my favorites and sci-fi?
[SPEAKER_04]: We did it.
[SPEAKER_04]: Mass Effect.
[SPEAKER_04]: I think that needs where they had.
[SPEAKER_04]: when you get into races that spoke, but also they put out sense or colors or lights.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: And if you're only getting the spoken word, you're like, you're missing the two thirds of what they're actually saying.
[SPEAKER_01]: And we're going to dive more to kind of what it's like meeting an L.D.
[SPEAKER_01]: or like just the the inquisition has some interesting view points on L.D.
[SPEAKER_01]: or if like how creepy they are and we'll play with this for a little bit.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's the end of the first of three casts, as I've said, we're only doing three right now, so we're going to end up probably leaving quite a bit on the table at the end of the third one, and we'll be coming right back around in a little bit to get to them, so I just can't do ten casts on Eldar.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's where you're wrong.
[SPEAKER_01]: Why don't we can do it?
[SPEAKER_01]: It's just people aren't going to want to listen at a certain point.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's where you're probably right.
[SPEAKER_01]: So with that, this has been John Barsati and Brad Chester.
[SPEAKER_01]: See you guys next week.
[UNKNOWN]: Thank you.