Cody Bellinger weighing multiple offers, Skubal & Boras open to negotiating w/Tigers? HOF Election Day

00:00:09
Speaker 1: Everyone's new favorite song, Where will Belly sign? Jim Bowden?

00:00:14
Speaker 2: With this tweet this morning, Cody Bellinger is mulling over multiple offers from multiple teams and is expected to make a decision shortly. That does usually mean decision in the next let's call it twenty four to seventy two hours, right where there's a soft timeline on the player and representation side. I don't want to say it always is the case, but it is often the case.

00:00:39
Speaker 3: Right.

00:00:39
Speaker 2: We started to hear the Kyle Tucker whispers last week, and then within about twenty four to thirty six hours the decision came. So I do think that we're going to learn about Cody Bellinger's ultimate destination for the twenty twenty six season in the next one to two days. Mulling multiple offers to me aj and I know we've talked about this a lot this week. This means I've got the long term thing from the Yankees. I probably have a short term offer from the Mets that is at a higher yearly rate, and then a team like the Blue Jays might fall in either category. My guess is that they're in the longer term category and maybe kind of a hybrid of both where they still give you an opt out somewhere within that deal as well, just naming three that I think they are likely in there.

00:01:30
Speaker 1: Do we really think that they're in there?

00:01:32
Speaker 3: No, I'm not saying that.

00:01:33
Speaker 4: I'm just saying just as Susan Slusser, she said they need a bat in the outfield that can play defense. Really well, hm, that sounds like Cody Bellinger. Why not do I said it kind of as a joke, but why not do what they've done with Chapman and they did it with Snell. I'll snow onto the Dodgers, But the Dodgers have also done these short they just didn't want to tucker right short term deal. The Mets did it with Boba Schett. Why can't Why can't the Giants go to Bellinger and be like, hey, we'll give you, you know, four years one hundred and fifty with an opt out after the first two years. I don't know, just throwing random numbers out there to get them there though, and get the fans excited.

00:02:08
Speaker 2: They're also not near the luxury tax number as far as I'm doing my math here, So I've got the latest number pulled up there at two twelve. The luxury tax number is I believe in the two forties. So they're still well behind that number. And the point is that's when you start to get taxed and some penalties start to hit you. They're not even close to some of the teams that are involved that end up paying essentially double.

00:02:31
Speaker 1: We go over this all the time, right.

00:02:32
Speaker 2: The teams don't look at it as, hey, I sign this player, I'm really putting double the money together against my payroll. They spread it out right, Hey, this is the responsibility of our whole payroll. But from a fan perspective, that is how the money is laid out.

00:02:46
Speaker 1: Right.

00:02:46
Speaker 2: If they go over that mark, right like the Mets, for example, if they spend thirty five a year on Bellinger, it's more like seventy five for this coming season.

00:02:56
Speaker 1: The Giants don't have to deal with that.

00:02:58
Speaker 3: Now.

00:02:58
Speaker 2: The resources different rencheal is clearly there. Steve Cohen is much more willing to spend. But it is a good call for the sake of this exercise. I don't think they're involved. So Kratz, what do you think if let's say those are the three finalists, where do you think Cody Goes? Does he go with the sexy new trend of more money at a shorter term and still the guarantee. Let's say it's three years, but he gets a lot more on the average annual value like a Boba Schett gets.

00:03:26
Speaker 1: Or does he go with.

00:03:28
Speaker 2: The Bronx safe I mean one spot, I don't have to worry about anything else. They'll probably give him a no trade clause if he wants, and he doesn't have to deal with these opt out contracts because he has been a part of them in the past. He's made good money off of them. So just curious where you think he lands here.

00:03:45
Speaker 5: I think it's I think it's the Yankees. I think it's a Bronx. And I think the worst thing for the Yankees would be if the Mets would be getting in a bidding war with them and they said. The Yankees have come out and said, we're not going to get into bidding war. Our offer is our offer, and it's a very good offer. So you can't lose. You can't lose Juan Soto and Cody Bellinger in two back to back years. I just think I don't think other teams are gonna be willing to go the guaranteed amount that he's getting from the Yankees. Now somebody steps in and does that'd be great for Cody if to beat it, you know, the blue Jays have to beat the Yankees. The blue Jays have to beat the Yankees offer, in my opinion, for him to go to a place where he hasn't been yet. And it seems like all indications seem like he really.

00:04:33
Speaker 3: Liked playing in New York.

00:04:36
Speaker 5: But the biggest thing for me is the fact that I don't think there is I don't know any players that are like, it's fine, I'll just continue to go year for year. There was one guy who said I'm going to go year to year forever, and he signed a three year deal too. But like you can say all you want, I just think Cody's been through it so much that it seems like completely outsider's view and I completely co completely wrong. I don't know Cody at all, But it's time to not always be the guy that has to prove it. There's there's some semblance of it's a it's a free agent year. I got to prove it as a guy who always had to prove it in a different way, like I had to prove it to stay on a roster. That part can get it can get tiring, it can it can get like, Okay, I got it.

00:05:24
Speaker 3: It's got to be the next thing.

00:05:25
Speaker 5: And it's like instead of getting like in a groove that I think the Yankees deal is going to end up being the best deal for him, and I think that's what he wants in his career and he'll end his career as a Yankee.

00:05:39
Speaker 3: That guy who wanted one year deals, he's out of baseball now too. Just definitely, people who don't know you have to figure you have to figure out who that person is. Huh.

00:05:46
Speaker 1: You could say the name Voldemort, right, Voldemort.

00:05:50
Speaker 3: That will not be named.

00:05:52
Speaker 4: But anyway, I don't want to get I don't want to get sued. I'm not saying it now you might. That's so I didn't say it.

00:05:59
Speaker 1: I don't care sue me.

00:06:00
Speaker 4: Okay, But maybe Bellinger the Yankees just is what it's like, it has to happen. It's like the one once when the Yankees traded for one Soda that offseason. It was it had to As soon as Ron Soda was put out there, everyone's like, he has to go to the Yankees, and it felt inevitable. Right, Well, that's what I feel like. This Bellinger to the Yankees feels like it feels inevitable because honestly, we've asked all the experts, Jim bow and Ken Rosenthal, every expert we have on and nobody can give us another team.

00:06:27
Speaker 1: Yes they can, well, I mean Mets in Blue Jays.

00:06:29
Speaker 4: But that we've actually heard as like the Yankees have said, here's our offer, this is what we're giving them, and the Blue Jays and the Mets. Yeah, but then the Mets go signed, but Shet the blue Jays do some other things.

00:06:43
Speaker 1: Well what though, see that's the X factor.

00:06:45
Speaker 3: I don't know. I just don't know.

00:06:47
Speaker 1: I don't know.

00:06:48
Speaker 3: Again, I'm not skull boards. I don't know.

00:06:50
Speaker 1: That's my question.

00:06:51
Speaker 2: So going back to another CBA thing, owners and the league want as signing deadline, why because it was help controls pricing and then baseb for two more months would be what would were talking about today?

00:07:04
Speaker 4: What did Eric just say on here, wait, but this is when he goes you know, but listen, when he goes.

00:07:08
Speaker 3: Year to year, they put pressure on me. So I knew I had to perform. Can you imagine if there was a signing deadline on January second.

00:07:14
Speaker 4: How much pressure would be on the players and then teams would just sit back and go, We're just gonna offer every we your buddy one year five million, and people are gonna have.

00:07:22
Speaker 3: To take it.

00:07:22
Speaker 4: Yeah, because you know what happened, because you know why, because they have to sign by a January second and they don't get to play this year.

00:07:29
Speaker 3: So guys, it would be be unbelievably stupid.

00:07:33
Speaker 2: Nobody likes a bloated cell phone bill. It can consume you, it can take over, it can be very annoying. So I know that twenty twenty five ended Crafts and that's when you have your end of your sales, but there actually is still one sale that is running until the end of the month.

00:07:49
Speaker 5: Mid Mobile, they still have their fifty percent off their unlimited premium wireless offer that you got to go and get and take advantage of it because it's not necessarily going to.

00:07:57
Speaker 3: Be around all the time.

00:07:59
Speaker 2: An all plan to come with high speed data and unlimited talk and text delivered on the nation's largest five G network. Quit overspending on wireless with fifty percent off. Unlimited Premium wireless plans start at fifteen bucks a month at mintmobile dot com slash territory. That's mintmobile dot com slash territory. Limited time offer upfront payment of forty five dollars for three months, ninety dollars for six months, or one hundred eighty dollars for twelve months. Plan required fifteen dollars per month equivalent taxes and fees extra initial plan term only. Over fifty gigabytes may slow a network is busy. Capable device required, availability, speed and coverage varies see mintmobile dot com. We could take a month off because nothing would happen. It would be born. But anyway, the point of me bringing this up is that, in addition to all of the reasons why why, players and even fans have listed that it would make sense. And I know there are some people that are like, oh, I just want to see the signings happen. Already they do happen. They just trickle in. Owners change their minds. The Mets can say whatever they want about Bobashet. They were not super seriously into Bobashet until five seconds after they realized they weren't getting Kyle Tucker. I could make the same case for the Blue Jays and Cody Bellinger did we hear them link to him, not much, all of a sudden, I do think they're seriously involved in someone like Cody Bellinger. Right, they are losing outfielders after this coming season, and Belly's bat fits there. You know, They've created a really nice, versatile lineup that they think depth wise, is going to get them through the season. But one more piece really puts them over the top. In my mind, they're already I think the front runner in the American League East, but this would really be the icing on the cake.

00:09:32
Speaker 1: They were going for Kyle Tucker.

00:09:34
Speaker 2: This is going to cost them less on a per season basis for sure than Kyle Tucker. This crats is why I think teams slash owners and front offices change their mind or get involved in things very late in an offseason. So if you take that away, then you don't have that activity. Right if Bo had to signed by whatever date, then the Mets aren't in on Bo. So same concept here for the Blue Jays. All of a sudden, he was more in like the here for them in terms of interest, and I think he jumps up and that's why it actually puts the Yankees in a tougher spot for most of the off season. I think the Yankees were like, we like you, we want you, we think we have the best offer slash kind of know we have the best offer, and then all of a sudden, other teams emerge late and go, this is the best guy available, and we didn't get someone in Kyle Tucker who we really thought we had.

00:10:21
Speaker 1: A good chance at.

00:10:22
Speaker 2: So anyway, that's why I think the market changes and we could get surprised.

00:10:27
Speaker 1: The Blue Jays can easily beat the Yankees.

00:10:29
Speaker 2: The one thing we've learned from these reports, unless they're totally off, and I don't think they are, is that the Yankees are sticking to their offer. They feel like they've offered him something nice, and I agree with them it is a nice offer. But that doesn't mean the Blue Jays can't swoop in and say, cool, your best offers five one sixty with some opt outs.

00:10:45
Speaker 1: We'll give you six one point eighty five with more opt outs.

00:10:50
Speaker 2: And then he goes up there and says, hey, you thought you were the only one dancing, but you're not.

00:10:57
Speaker 5: Yeah, man, anytime you can have because situations change. Is the biggest thing that you said, Scott, is the fact that maybe the Blue Jays were like, oh, we made a great offer to Kyle Tucker. No way he turns down ten years, three hundred and fifty million. Well that was less than a week ago. Now you got to change. If we had a deadline, that deadline, that offer would be made, he would sign, deadline would happen, and all of a sudden, the Blue Jays wouldn't have a team. So a deadline wouldn't help. Wouldn't help like you want to, wouldn't help the teams who want to win because they want to put the best players out there. And maybe that's why Cody's like, you know what, I won't need to make a decision. I'll just wait and see if the Blue Jays who just missed out on the guy who they thought was there one, I'll be there number two choice, and maybe that offer that they originally made goes up a little bit higher. It's a it's a great it's a great dance. It's a great like you know, back and forth.

00:11:58
Speaker 3: And I come in the Blue.

00:12:00
Speaker 5: Jays for being in on pretty much every top notch free agent this offseason, and I command the Yankees for not getting anything done this offseason but sticking to their guns. On what they think is Cody Belly Cody Bellinger is worth. Because there's a lot of teams that are like, well, we'll do this, we'll do that. I know the Phillies, they're like, hey, we're gonna give you market value. We're gonna give you what you are worth. That's all fine and dandy, as long as you're okay with not.

00:12:34
Speaker 3: Losing him, not losing that player.

00:12:39
Speaker 4: Here's my question, people that want to signing signing deadline. Okay, let's say the signing deadlines January first. Who got hurt yesterday or two days ago? Has on Kim? There's no sign you can't sign anybody.

00:12:52
Speaker 3: What do the Braves do? You have to make a trade.

00:12:56
Speaker 1: Yeah, but that's not easy. Teams are so annoying about what we're saying that.

00:13:00
Speaker 3: I wouldn't know what good does a signing deadline do.

00:13:02
Speaker 4: If you that's your free agent, you sign him to a free agent deal and he gets hurt after the free or after the free agent deadline, what happens to the guys who are after the free agent that I have take the year off, They have to sign a minor league deal, they have to sign what banana ball?

00:13:17
Speaker 3: I don't know.

00:13:17
Speaker 4: Do you see like this is one of the because okay, I'll say this, like, use I'll use Justin Verlander, Right, I said, I saw him the other day and when we talked to Ken, what he's waiting on somebody possibly to get hurt. He doesn't want anyone to get hurt. But let's say whoever, Like, I'll use Garrett Cole for example. He got hurt in spring training last year.

00:13:34
Speaker 3: Right.

00:13:36
Speaker 4: If someone like that gets hurt for the Yankees this year, gets who they're gonna call? Justin Verlander? Hey, Justin, could you be ready in three weeks to pitch in May for us? Absolutely? Guys, Okay, boom, here you go. Here's your one year whatever it is, ten, twelve, fifteen, whatever they come to terms with.

00:13:50
Speaker 3: Right.

00:13:50
Speaker 2: Yeah, Pitchers should wait. Sometimes it hurts them. It hurts many of them because they're not necessarily ready in spring training, but we have so many arm injuries that it does often benefit both sides to wait. Sometimes a team doesn't have an opening, all of a sudden, they have an opening. We oh my gosh, every time spring training starts up and we get the TJ's, the TJ rush in the first ten days this guy needs.

00:14:14
Speaker 3: Once game start. They ran pp start. Oh yeah, that was everybody.

00:14:19
Speaker 5: I have one comment if you want to if you want to suffice the fans who are saying, well, I want.

00:14:23
Speaker 3: To know where they're going to go. Yeah, we all want to know. But that's the exciting part of it.

00:14:28
Speaker 5: If you want to, if you want to have a deadline I would be in favor of a trade deadline in the offseason. Your trades don't get done, then you have to move on. You can't.

00:14:38
Speaker 3: You can't trade to Freddy Parolta.

00:14:40
Speaker 5: Now that could be a player's point of view, because I think the ability to have somebody like if Trek Scuba was out there, Freddy Peralta, who's a number one like out there on the market. It's hurting Framber Valdez's market may have even been hurting a little bit Rangers market. Well, now Rangers signed, and the fact that they're under contracts that are not negotiated in the free market like free agents, teams view them as more valuable because free agents are going to cost you more millions for more years. So I'd be up for a trade deadline ending January tenth, give a little bit of time after Christmas, no more trades after January tenth. Then every team's like, okay, well, we can't do any trades anymore.

00:15:29
Speaker 4: We got to go after the guys who are left. But when does the trade deadline en spring training starts? That that that doesn't make any sense either, because okayns January tenth, and then the first day of spring training, you're allowed to trade because guys have opt outs, guys that are out of options, guys have all so opening day, yeah, April first, okay, so then what about the guys that don't have options. They get traded at the end of spring training because they they're out of options and they're like, oh, we'll put We'll trade them to another team for an a ball kid or something right like, that doesn't make any Why do we want to put why do we want to put trade deadline? Because also, hass On Kim gets hurt. Yes, look at the list of free agent shortstops.

00:16:07
Speaker 1: I can't find it.

00:16:08
Speaker 4: I kf and Tim Anderson are on the MLB list. Okay, so then they're not allowed to trade because he got hurt.

00:16:13
Speaker 3: After that, it's dumb.

00:16:15
Speaker 4: I'm sorry, this is we don't need deadlines. You know what the deadline is when opening day hits most of the time.

00:16:23
Speaker 1: Right, because then you're rolling or about it.

00:16:25
Speaker 4: It's usually about a week before opening day because they want to get guys there before.

00:16:28
Speaker 3: But I remember the Braves.

00:16:30
Speaker 4: When I was on the Braves, we traded kick Craig Kimberle like the day before opening day and we got Camera Mayven and I forget who else we got from the podres, but they traded him literally like the day before the season started. We're breaking camp and also like kim well got traded. Wait what didn't the season start tomorrow? Something crazy like that, right, So I don't know how you can't have deadlines, No, especially in the off season. You can't have deadlines for baseball because it plays out too much.

00:16:53
Speaker 2: They want their winter meetings to be bigger. So I was like, maybe you do a trade deadline for a month, so I at least stop that for a little And you say, hey, last day of winter meetings is when you can make a trade for a little bit.

00:17:02
Speaker 1: I get what you're saying. It's it's complicated.

00:17:05
Speaker 2: Let's charge about Yeah, let's charge a mound and let's talk about tire schooble first, So Evan Petzold, who covers the Tigers on a daily basis, said Scott Boris says he remains open to negotiating Schoobl's salary with the Tigers before an arbitration hearing, using current comparable contracts, not outdated benchmarks like David Price's nineteen point seventy five million in twenty fifteen.

00:17:31
Speaker 1: Quote from Boris, we are open to negotiate. It's funny, Krat.

00:17:36
Speaker 2: You've probably seen this because you've got kids for this age, but the twenty sixteen thing has been a thing over the past week or two. No, you haven't seen this where people are posting like, oh, here's what I was doing in twenty sixteen.

00:17:51
Speaker 5: No, seen it.

00:17:52
Speaker 2: Oh wow, maybe it's maybe it's with my age group. But everyone's like, this is the common post.

00:17:57
Speaker 3: I'm doing it.

00:17:58
Speaker 1: You saw it, right, it's Oliver. But I love this.

00:18:01
Speaker 2: They go, well, since everyone's doing it, I have to. That's like when the influencers go, I know, you're all asking me about my skincare routine, and it's like, are they or.

00:18:12
Speaker 4: Do they care less about the twenty sixteen trend or the Beckham thing that's happening.

00:18:16
Speaker 3: Have you seen that that's we don't have time to get into all that.

00:18:19
Speaker 1: But wow, I mean, I don't know that I've seen that.

00:18:21
Speaker 4: David Beckham and his son and his wife. It's a whole trust me. I got the whole run down this morning on it.

00:18:26
Speaker 3: It's crazy.

00:18:27
Speaker 2: There is nothing more boring than a bad social media trend. So anyway, I don't care what you're doing in twenty sixteen, but in twenty fifteen, I do care that we're trying to use the comp from back then. So anyway, Boris took his little slight shot. Did you learn anything from this quote? Do you think that there will be some type of an agreement that goes down before we get to the arbitration hearing? Or does the league which is paired up with the Tigers on this one? Right, the Labor Relations Board is working with them, so they have a huge say. Do they feel like it's not worth giving in and saying to Boris, all right, we're gonna push this to twenty six, twenty seven to twenty eight plus when the previous number is nineteen point seventy five.

00:19:08
Speaker 5: It just depends on how far the Major League Baseball wants to dig their feet in this isn't a Tigers versus Scoobale thing. So any fans who are like, oh, he's gonna be pissed off at the Tiger, this is a Major League Baseball versus essentially the players Association or the future of every really good pitcher that reaches arbitration and has won. Cy Young's I mean, Terry scoubl Is sitting there going, Paul Skeens, I'm just kind of trying to help you out here. But it's a landmark arbitration case. They're sitting there going, Okay. Scott Boris has done nothing in his career more than growing the salaries for the next player. He has always has it. Has it looked Has it looked smooth to fans? No, it hasn't. Has he done the best for his clients and his future clients clients Enter Price still in high school right now that he doesn't even know he has yet the next superstar. Trek Scouble is the next superstar. So he's trying to push that level of where the arbitration process is behind. And if landmark players like Tarrek Scuble, like Juan Soto a few years ago, don't push this number, then major League Baseball wins in if we're looking at arbitration as a case of winning and losing, and Major League Baseball looks at it as if we don't win this, this is gonna be I'm not gonna say catastrophic, but this really moves the needle. Do you have to do incredible things? Yeah, you got to win back to back Cy Young's. You have to be the best pitcher in your respective league. Well, they don't have to look too far over to the National League and say.

00:20:53
Speaker 3: We don't do this. What could Paul Schemes get?

00:20:55
Speaker 5: So Major League Baseball is going to dig their feet in. And I don't think there's a number that Scott Boris says is fair that Major League Baseball also says is fair. I think Major League Baseball knows that nineteen million is definitely well short of where they should be, and I think Scott Boris thinks thirty two million is a little bit over where they should be. But I don't think I don't think that happy medium is going to be a happy medium. I think it truly is a landmark case that if Boris continues down the path that he's always been, I think they win this case. I think they win it because of the fact that it's so dated back to twenty fifteen, twenty sixteen of where that quote price should be for him for Scooble.

00:21:47
Speaker 4: Okay, well, there's a couple of things on this one. The fact that we're using twenty sixteen is crazy. Okay. Look at the way that salaries have gone up twenty fifteen. Sorry, the way salaries have gone up. Okay, But it was his twenty sixteen salary that they went, right, wasn't it. I think twenty salary just over ten years ago. Yeah, okay, so it's crazy. Also, Boris has a couple of things. One, they can because he's in his sixth year, they can use free agent contracts and that is a huge help to Trek's school. Well, especially when young guys like Verlander and Schuzer have signed like one year deals for thirty forty million, these short term deals. Guess what that helps the player in these negotiations. Now, MLB of course wants to go low. I don't think that they thought that that Boris was gonna go this big. I thought they were like, oh, we'll go nineteen, Boris will go twenty five, right, But he went thirty two. So now there was a monster gap in between here the middles twenty five and a half. So Boris is probably like, hey, you get to twenty eight, I will think about it. But that would be such a huge jump for the league to go from nineteen to twenty eight, because then as soon as if they say yes to twenty eight, then once Skens gets to this spot or someone else down the road, they're gonna be like, well, five years ago, Terrek School, we got twenty eight. I have a Rookie of the Year, maybe two or three Cy Youngs, this or that. I should be thirty five, right, depending on how you know. Everything goes with salaries. So that's why MLB's fighting so hard for this now. The other thing is there's also a third component in play here. The owners hate arbitration, okay, because they don't want arbitrary. They've had one arbitration since the player's got arbitration, Marvin Miller back how many ever years ago, right, So if they can prove that Trek School is not worth more than David Price was in twenty fifteen, that's another chip they can put on their negotiating table and say, look, guys, your best pitcher he got screwed in arbitration. We don't like arbitration, maybe you guys shouldn't like arbitration either, and they can try and get rid of it. They could use that in the CBA and say, one of your best players on the field, could you know you got what a guy fifteen, you know, almost twelve years ago less than what he got right, And they can and then the Players Association is going to go, well, you know, maybe we should look at changing this. So again, there's a third thing in play. And I know the overriding factor in all Major League Baseball right now. It's just damn CBA. And I'm already tired of talking about it. I got we got like twelve more months to talk about it.

00:24:07
Speaker 2: It's a factor in everything that happens right now. But also here's another factor. The arbitration panel, unless stuff has changed, is three humans, right, three humans, and they make their case to each other on where they're going to vote. Right, So even if you get one one side one the other, there's going to be someone that splits this up. Every once in a while there's a case where it seems obvious that one side's going to win and the other side wins. Why Because these people are not the most educated on baseball and they want it to be that way for some reason.

00:24:38
Speaker 3: Right, Well, they want it because.

00:24:39
Speaker 4: They're not supposed to be influenced whether they're like have a team or whether they have something going on, right, so they never they don't want that. And again, is someone that's been through this problem. I've been in this process. I've been in this room. I've been through this whole thing. They don't tell you why you won. They don't tell you why you won. They don't tell you what the number was they came to a conclusion on. They just give you a U win or you w. And there's no explanation. This isn't like a law case right where the law after the lawyer, the judge makes a decision, then they write like a thing explaining why they made this decision or why they're doing this, or like the Supreme Court will we voted this way because of this case back one hundred years ago, whatever it was. They just say, hey, Scooba one the tigers. There is no explanation. It's a you get one phone call from your age, they call the union, They call the owners, and the union calls you or your agent. They say you won, you lost, and there's that's it. It's over and that's what you get. But there's no explanation, there's nothing.

00:25:33
Speaker 2: The problem with that is these people want to keep their jobs, and this is the biggest case of all time. So I do think they're going to be weighing which side holds more influence in them keeping their jobs. They're human beings, that's a part of it.

00:25:47
Speaker 1: Right.

00:25:47
Speaker 2: They get compensated nicely to be able to handle this, So they get a nice.

00:25:51
Speaker 3: Vacation for two weeks in Arizona or Florida, depending on this year, it's in Arizona, so they get a nice little vacation.

00:25:57
Speaker 1: There are factors at play.

00:25:58
Speaker 2: It's like, you know one of those movies where both sides are trying to pick the jury and it gets all crazy.

00:26:03
Speaker 1: Remember that one movie.

00:26:04
Speaker 2: It was like you who is it, Gene Hackman, I don't know, you know what I'm talking about. It's like that where they're like figuring out is this person going to be for us or against us? And obviously these people have their jobs on the line if they get fired for it, right, I mean, I'm saying if they picked the wrong side, and then the other side's going to try and fire them. All right, let's talk Hall of Fame. Today's the day. The announcement is going to come around six. I think that's when the show starts. You'll probably get the announcement at like six forty five or something. That's TV for you. They keep you there, they give you the commercials. But anyway, eventually we'll find out.

00:26:46
Speaker 4: You go through all one hundred candidates on the list and explain why each one should be in the Hall of Fame.

00:26:50
Speaker 2: Yep, they do the whole song and dance, or you can just check Twitter later on. But anyway, yeah, it'll probably be close to seven people. No, it's a good show. It's worth while and you get to hear from some of the guys. But anyway, many people are going to be watching this our show and listening to our show, and we already have an answer. So what do you think of Beltron probably getting in and Andrew Jones.

00:27:12
Speaker 3: And Andrews last year. No, so he's got one more right.

00:27:16
Speaker 1: But what I've been doing.

00:27:17
Speaker 2: Is that if he doesn't get in this year, he's a lock next year, which is I think.

00:27:24
Speaker 4: Just because and this is not knocking to any of the guys on the ballot, because you can say, oh, you know, you didn't get any of that.

00:27:30
Speaker 3: I was on a ballot. I got two votes.

00:27:31
Speaker 5: Okay.

00:27:32
Speaker 4: So before there's just not a surefire first ballot Hall of Famer of the new guys that were added this year. So that's how when they say, oh, guys give big bumps and jumps and all this, it's because there's certain people that are taking off the ballot bonds Clemens. Those guys are now gone, and then the new group comes in and there is not a lot of sure fire Hall of Famer. I don't know if there's a there's definitely not a first ballot Hall of Famer on this new list. But I don't know there's a sure fire Hall of Famer on this new ballot of list of guys. So you'll see a bump for oddly Rawlins, Felix, Andrew Jones, these guys, right, hopefully Burley Tory Hunter will get some bumps. Right, it looked like Andrew Jones was a lock, but then they always say, well, if he's at seventy percent or whatever, eighty percent, then that falls because the people who don't release their ballots it's not always, not always the number that usually come in lower than what the people that release them. So I'm pretty sure Beltron's going to get in well deserved, and I'm pretty sure that Andrew Jones is going to get in US, if not this year then next year.

00:28:31
Speaker 3: So well deserved.

00:28:32
Speaker 4: Man, I mean, it's it's awesome, what an amazing achievement, especially for those guys. And listen, if Andrew Jones gets in from you know, Cirasol and down there, that's a big thing for that island down there.

00:28:43
Speaker 1: Oh.

00:28:44
Speaker 2: I've been on the Andrew Jones train for a while now because I think he's getting punished for the late stages of his career. But I think he had enough of a prime window, especially now with the way that boating's going down, and I'm fine with it. We just had this conversation on a different segment. The voting process has to change because you're not going to hit some of those milestone numbers and Andrew Jones actually put up, like some of the counting stats are looking for, say home runs.

00:29:09
Speaker 1: Ye, he's the.

00:29:12
Speaker 2: Best defensive center fielder, if not top three, of a long period of time right of an era. One of the best all time, the whole deal, like you had that, and he wasn't a nothing on offense. He was a very impactful offensive player for a good chunk of time, and then he went through something that's natural, it's called the aging process, but he still played for a bit and that hurt his rate stats. So I think that the crowd has been off on him for a while now, and it appears as if it'll finally fix itself, either this year or next year. I was also surprised to see Beltron, I forgot, has already been on the ballot for several years. I think this is his fourth run at this point. But anyway, overall thoughts from your crats.

00:29:53
Speaker 5: I mean, I think Beltron's the best switch hitter that I ever saw alive. I mean, I saw Chip Jones at the end of his career. I saw Beltro Beltron a little bit closer to you know, a little bit more closer to his prime because I think they played like three or four more years after after Chipper Jones. But those two guys, and I think, you know, I think it's a he was probably one of the more underrated players because he was in k C and nobody really knew about him until he burst on the scene in Houston. I think Andrew Jones, like obviously it's Hall of Fame voting time and everything. Some of the stats that are coming out there about his about his defense, and like different guys that you would respect what they said about the fact that I think Bobby Cox was the one that said he's the second best altfaer he's ever seen, behind Willie Mays. I just think it's I think it's something. I hope both of them get in and the whole like waiting the whole wait another year. I think that would suck for Andrew, So I hope he gets in this year. I hope he gets in the skin of his teeth.

00:31:03
Speaker 4: By the way, if Andrew does get in, which I hope he does, again, I fought this fight Tory Hunter and Jim Edmonds, he's not even on the ballot need to be looked down more closely. I mean, Jim only had eight gold gloves, but he's got you know, ops plus a one to thirty two.

00:31:17
Speaker 3: Andrew Jones ops plus is one eleven. I mean that's better, though. That's what do you think is hurting? Okay, what do you think is Torris.

00:31:25
Speaker 4: Okay, but Tory Hunter. I'm gonna just this is just Tory Hunter. We get Jim Vans, and obviously I have a special place in my heart for Tory. We've played together from the minor leagues all the way up. Gold Gloves nine Andrew Jones ten. So nine years in a row, Tory Hunter won the AO Gold Glove. Andrew Jones did it ten years in a row. Tory Hunter two Silver Sluggers. Andrew Jones won either won a World Series, five All Star Games. Andrew Jones in two thousand and five did win RBI total and a home run title. Okay, fine, more games for Tory bet thirty three point higher batting average for Tory. Now he's eighty home runs behind, so that's fine. But more RBI's five hundred more hits, almost one hundred more runs, almost over one hundred more doubles, more triples, less strikeouts.

00:32:12
Speaker 3: I got plugging for Center's.

00:32:13
Speaker 4: Almost closed on base, almost close ops plus one eleven to one, ten war sixty two point eight to fifty.

00:32:22
Speaker 1: That's the big one.

00:32:23
Speaker 4: That Okay, but if you look at the stats, play should but explain to me how Andrew Jones has sixty two point eight war and Tory Hunter has fifty war? So was there twelve point eight war in that one? Gold extra gold gloved Andrew one. That's what I don't understand, because if you if I line their numbers up next to each other, other than the home runs, okay, Tory has them in almost every other category. So why is Andrew like, oh that Andrew Jones asking I watched Tory Hunter for a long time. He was the best center fielder I ever saw on a daily basis, Jones, I didn't see Andrew Jones on a daily base I saw Tory Hunter play every day in centerfield.

00:32:57
Speaker 3: I was catching.

00:32:58
Speaker 4: I'm watching him play centerfield for year after year. This dude was making catches and I never saw anybody come close to.

00:33:04
Speaker 5: Making Why do you think he's being held back. I don't think that's being held back because he's They're both great dudes. They're very I don't know, they're very affeable. They've always been that guy. There's no controversy around him. To me, there has to be a reason. I don't think somebody just looks up and goes Tory Hunter. Yeah, I thought he was a good player, But what was his war? No sorry, never mind, Like you're talking about a dude that has over three hundred home runs and has nine gold gloves. Like to me, that takes that takes effort then to go, okay, I have to I have to rethink this.

00:33:43
Speaker 2: I think some guys are getting punished for playing for a long period of time from rat stats, so like you can't figure out it's like, okay, so you played too long or you didn't play long enough.

00:33:54
Speaker 1: I agree with you. I just I think they both should be in.

00:33:56
Speaker 2: Jason Stark, who we have on the show often and is looked at as one of the games history, and voted for Tory Hunter this year.

00:34:02
Speaker 4: Yeah, I don't know anyways, that's just my that's my soapbox. I'm on this year because I love Andrew. I played with Andrew, I played with Tory. I think I think it's kind of like if this guy gets in and this guy has for me, It's like Andy Pettitt and Mark Burley. If Andy Pettit gets in, the Mark Burley has to be in right behind him because if you look at their numbers and.

00:34:23
Speaker 3: What now Pettitt.

00:34:24
Speaker 4: The one thing Pettitt had, though, was he had the postseason because he was on the Yankee so he got the postseason, so everybody knew him a little bit more.

00:34:30
Speaker 3: Right, That's kind of what happened with Andrew Jones.

00:34:32
Speaker 4: And everyone goes, well, look at Andrew Jones, is like those ten years when he was winning gold gloves. Okay, Well, Tory Hunter had nine really unbelievable years too, and he won those gold gloves, right, so he play longer. And then we go like, we'll use Joe Maller an example. Everyone's like, well, the six years Joe Maher caught, he was so great, first ballot Hall of Famer, right, Well, I mean if you pick anybody's six best years, if they play long enough, you can make argument that a lot of guys are Hall of Famers.

00:34:57
Speaker 3: So I don't know it. It's this is why the Hall of Fame is still polarizing.

00:35:01
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's really tough to find center fielders that did it all right.

00:35:04
Speaker 1: We still have problems with that.

00:35:05
Speaker 4: I mean Jim Edmonds still look at Jim NaN's numbers and he won eight Gold Gloves, right, I mean he wants he won championship. I mean there's there's you know, Kenny Lofton is another one that's an interesting case. And if as the numbers in the in the perspective changes, it just opens it up to more arguments.

00:35:19
Speaker 5: Do you feel like it's because Do you feel like it's because Tory started his career a little bit later? I mean by the time Tory was an everyday guy cares then? I mean Andrew Jones was already in his what fifth season?

00:35:36
Speaker 3: Do you think it? Who cares when you start? Yeah, I'm just saying.

00:35:41
Speaker 4: Listen, Tory was a slower developer. He was gonna quit and go play football. I mean, listen, I was there for all that stuff. But toy, we've had him on many times. He's one of the best dudes in the world. And so for people to say, well, you can't do you want to what do you want to?

00:35:52
Speaker 3: Check?

00:35:52
Speaker 4: His personality? He was awesome, right, He played all the time. He never won, but he was on winners. Andrew Jones never won a World Series to him, but he never won him. He didn't win the one on the ninety five team. Really, Oh, he was later than that.

00:36:04
Speaker 3: He was he came up in ninety six, so he never won and he went on the ninety five team, right.

00:36:09
Speaker 4: I mean, there's a song ninety eight Braves, you know, got out done by that Padre magic Morgan Wallen, Right, yep, he was on that dam the Jones Boys. But I don't know, it's just I don't know. We could argue about this until we're blue in the face.

00:36:27
Speaker 2: Yeah, they're both great. I'm just going through stats and all that they both have my vote. That's all we have time for now. But we can do any aftermath. Yeah, we're gonna slap in a sec. We can do any aftermath on what we end up seeing with who gets in. But also I want us to do it today. Maybe we'll do tomorrow in case there are any other stray single vote getters.

00:36:50
Speaker 1: I want to talk about that.

00:36:52
Speaker 2: It's just a that's a fun show topic for a few minutes. But anyway, let's lap. We're looking at case case studies.

00:37:11
Speaker 4: With Yeah, I'm looking at another team, Burley versus pettit and I'm showing like it's tight. It's there's so much you can put this and that It's like, Okay, so Petti gets in because he had more postseason, but that's not Burley's fault that we weren't as good as the Yankees were for all, you know, So That's why I have a hard time when listen when Burley pitched in the postseason, he pitched well. He closed the game out drunk one time. So anyways, whatever I see drunk stats for each player. Yeah, I bet, I bet a birth won wins. I can name you some other guys that did some stuff too.

00:37:43
Speaker 1: Yeah, that would be a fun segment.

00:37:44
Speaker 2: Anyone want that last thing today besides Kratz hat, Let's do that and then I'll load this up.

00:37:51
Speaker 5: I really found my Minnesota Twins hat, and I'm not sure they found the off season yet. So I feel like if somebody needs a really good defensive outfielder that also for power, Twins could make a huge splash by trading someone who doesn't want to be traded in Byron Buxton.

00:38:10
Speaker 2: Except you will at the trade deadline when they're terrible. They signed Victor Caratini, which is nice. I didn't even know that was the fit they needed. Because they have Brian Jeffers, maybe they're going to trade him. I can't eat. I don't want to get mad. It's only Tuesday Rangers Fest, so they're not doing signings at the winter warm up appearances. I think they're going to do signings at the fan fest. But they're doing like their little stop by situation. It's a long tweet. So they're saying that the autograph memorabilia seekers that hagub all the time and they bring a billion things are causing lines to get longer and other fans to miss out on stuff. So there's back and forth discussion on what that is. Can you also just limit someone or if someone goes up there and be like, hey, dude, you get one signature?

00:38:59
Speaker 4: Yeah, you're supposed to do that, but then the problem with that is Kratz knows, is if someone comes up to you with five and then you're like, okay, I'm only supposed to sign one. Then the guy's like, oh but I waited in line for an hour, and then there's the security guard there that you know, and then it makes you feel bad.

00:39:13
Speaker 3: So you just are like, I just sign them real quick and get them the heck out of here.

00:39:15
Speaker 1: What about one signature per person?

00:39:19
Speaker 3: And you look yes, and then they say, but I have two kids.

00:39:22
Speaker 1: But they're saying I have two kids, no signatures, two kids? They can share it, okay, teach them sharing.

00:39:29
Speaker 5: I'm not again, I'm not about taking away from the fans, like I love the fan experience the autograph. These events get crushed by the autograph seekers. One autograph, these guys will do it, will well, they'll do it. They'll put on another jacket, they bring changes of clothes to get back through the same line again. So it's it really has gotten watered down for the people that the autographs would matter. And I promise you, coming from a player, we want to sign the autographs for the kids, for the people who they're like, oh my gosh, I don't even know who you are, our crats, but thank you for signing it. Like that means a lot to the players, not the dude that comes with the binder and is.

00:40:16
Speaker 3: Like I've just got six, can you just do six?

00:40:19
Speaker 5: And that's for me. Like the guys who are really who are actually good players, they get crushed by stuff, crushed.

00:40:27
Speaker 2: And then they pay the kids to get the rest of them. I mean, that's a real thing I've heard. Yeah, well I'll say this.

00:40:35
Speaker 4: We had a thing, we had our twentieth anniversary with the White Sox issue, right and they came and said, hey, we want to do autograph stations for all the players, and I said, well, do we get paid, because normally when I do sign autographs, I get paid. And they're like, no, this is just for the fans. I'm like, well, the fans have to pay to stay in line and they were like yeah. And I'm like, I'm not signing.

00:40:55
Speaker 1: That doesn't make any sense.

00:40:56
Speaker 4: And they said why not? And I said, well, where's the money going. They're like, well, really, give me an answer. And I was like, well, if the players aren't getting paid, how about we I go, how about this, We'll just do pictures.

00:41:05
Speaker 3: Yeah, we'll do pictures like this.

00:41:08
Speaker 4: And you know what, it's actually kind of cool because everyone comes up, they're happy to see you, and they're like.

00:41:13
Speaker 3: Hey, smile, they have a story for you. Right. Justin Blasco is in the chat all the time.

00:41:18
Speaker 4: He came up and man, I think it was Paul, me and Jermaine and we were signing, and people could go from one stage to the other and get their picture with whoever their favorite players, and you had time to make too write. It was cool because you actually get to talk to the people and shake their hand and meet them, as opposed to you're just looking down.

00:41:33
Speaker 1: You're like, right, I'm a picture over autographing because it's more of.

00:41:39
Speaker 4: A personal experience than just the autograph line. I'm sorry it is. And even for the players it's cool because then the guy, the man or woman who ever comes up to he says.

00:41:50
Speaker 3: Hey man, this is my favorite you're my favorite player.

00:41:53
Speaker 4: This is the memory I have or this is what I and you're like, this is ridiculous, this is awesome.

00:41:58
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm with you.

00:42:00
Speaker 3: It's like excepting when you.

00:42:00
Speaker 4: Get done, you're you're like, oh, I need hand sanitiz or I gotta wash my hands like five times, because you know, shaking everyone's hand and my hands get dirty.

00:42:08
Speaker 3: Their hands are dirty, gets tiring.

00:42:11
Speaker 2: But that's just so many no, I said, I'm saying it. That's not fun physically either.

00:42:17
Speaker 1: So this was fun. Thanks everyone.

00:42:20
Speaker 2: Oh tomorrow, JJ Cooper, big day for Baseball America.

00:42:25
Speaker 1: We'll talk about it tomorrow.

00:42:27
Speaker 2: Cedric Mullins need Tampa Bay Ray outfielder and Derek Johnson to talk pitching as well as anybody in the game. Good guest list tomorrow. We'll see you then. And remember Saturday, we have a show. Baseball Writers Association of America Awards will be streaming live