International Year of Quantum Science and Technology: our celebrations begin with a look at quantum networks and sensors

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Hello, and welcome to the 1st Physics World

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weekly podcast of 2025.

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I'm Hamish Johnston.

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The United Nations has proclaimed

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that 2025

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is the international year of Quantum Science and

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Technology,

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or IYQ

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for short.

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This year was chosen because it marks the

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centenary

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of the initial development

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of quantum mechanics

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by Werner Heisenberg.

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In the early days, the quantum world perplexed

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the physics community

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with its numerous

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paradoxes.

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A century later, and physicists are much more

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comfortable

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in the quantum world.

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And it's not just physicists.

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Over the past decade or so, a burgeoning

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quantum technology

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business sector has emerged,

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and engineers,

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financiers,

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and others

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are entering the quantum realm.

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To kick off IYQ,

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this podcast features the Turkish physicist

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Mete

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Atatore,

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who is at the UK's

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University of Cambridge.

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In a wide ranging conversation

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with Physics World's Katherine Skipper,

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Atatore talks about Quantour,

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I y q's

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equivalent to the Olympic torch,

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and he also talks about his research

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into quantum sensors

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and quantum networks.

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Hello. Welcome to the Physics World Podcast. I'm

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Katherine Schipper.

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So last summer was the Paris Olympics, which

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was

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marked by the ceremonial relay of the Olympic

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torch. Now we have to wait another 4

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years for the next Olympics, but 2025

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is the international year of quantum. And that

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too will be marked by

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the relay of,

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of a of a light source. But because

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it's the International Year of Quantum, it's going

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to be a very, very, very small

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light source. It's going to be a single

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photon,

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emitter.

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It's called, Contour,

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and it is

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touring 12 quantum labs around Europe over the

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course of 12 months.

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And I am in Cambridge today,

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visiting Contour, the quantum light source, on its

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stopover in England.

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And I'm joined today in Cambridge by, Mette

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Asasier,

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who is,

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responsible for the light source while it's in

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England. He's the head of the Cavendish Laboratory

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in Cambridge

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and also the head of the

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quantum optical materials and systems group. He's also

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the one of the founders of the quantum

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networking startup, NuQuantum.

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So, Messi, thank you so much for joining

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me today. Thank you very much for hitting

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me.

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So first question, can you

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explain

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what Contour is about and why it's something

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you wanted to be involved with here in

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Cambridge?

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I like to start with the,

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the the Paris Olympics and the the Olympic

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torch. It is in a sense the quantum

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torch that's going around, Europe. We wanted to

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be part of it because,

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we are part of the European,

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endeavor

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to achieve,

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useful operational quantum technologies.

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And one way or another light,

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appears in most of these,

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strands of research that we're pursuing.

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So it was important that that that we

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bring that forward. They,

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we did have a year of light a

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few years back. We're going into a year

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of quantum. So it is natural that we

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have this this essential part, the optics, the

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photonics, but in the quantum realm, to be

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showcased across the Europe,

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for two reasons. 1, to bring forward, of

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course, its importance, but also to show that

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we do interact.

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We do form a scientific network,

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around the concept of quantum light,

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and how it can impact the various technologies

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that might come in the future. Yeah. So

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talking about the technologies, I think the International

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Year of Quantum

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and Quantar, I guess, is quite a nice

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opportunity

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to

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showcase

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to people who don't have, you know, a

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specialism in physics what quantum science and quantum

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technology is about. Do you think that, I

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guess, the general public and

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politicians who are making decisions about, you know,

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quantum technologies and quantum policy

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know enough about what quantum is and how

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it could impact them?

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It's very difficult to know enough of quantum

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given how

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counterintuitive

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it is.

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And I think partly we are also to

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blame as we start most of our descriptions

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of our work, quantum related work with spooky

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action at a distance or mind boggling or

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hard to grasp, hard to understand,

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completely outside our,

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conceptions of what world is and reality is.

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That doesn't particularly help in the direction of,

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making people aware of what it can do

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for you as a technology as opposed to

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very interesting science that you might want to,

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to study or understand.

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So I think what we need to do,

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especially in the year of quantum, is to

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have a a change of word, a change

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of style so that we focus less on

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the weirdness of quantum, but focus on what

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it can actually bring us. And this is

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how you can grab the attention of public,

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policy makers,

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and, and more most importantly, the young minds

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who, might go into this field with an

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intention to actually do something useful

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to tackling,

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challenges that, we might be facing going forward.

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Okay. So can you talk a bit about

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how that relates to your research? What are

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the

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quantum

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technologies that you're looking at? Mhmm. So within

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my research group,

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we have a very vibrant team,

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tackling multiple directions at the same time, that

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keeps me entertained. Of course, there's not just

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a one topic that I'm working with. I

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get to work with, small groups of of,

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brilliant scientists,

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on different directions. One of them is quantum

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sensing and the other one is quantum networks.

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So sensing and networks are 22 strands, let's

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say that,

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that our work tends to focus on.

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On the sensing side, we're trying to see

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if quantum properties

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of light matter interfaces,

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objects, small net of nanoscale objects,

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a single electron in some cases or a

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single nuclear spin buried inside a material in

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other cases. Could that and its interaction with

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light

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be useful

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to understand,

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how materials behave or how different phenomena in

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physics and sciences in general can emerge?

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And having that view at the, at the

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nanoscale, at the at the ultimate limits or

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ranges, operational ranges that we don't have access

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to at the moment. So that's one direction

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they're pursuing. As very interestingly, as science takes

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you,

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to unexpected places, we are also working with

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quantum sensors

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in life sciences. So we have we're looking

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into how we can incorporate quantum sensors, diamond

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based quantum sensors in particular,

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into,

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into cells, live cells to understand their operations

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or in larger

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living organisms like c elegans, for example,

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to see if we can learn more about

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their physical properties as they go through a

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life cycle. So

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as long as there's it's it's about the

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development of a technology

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with very, very well grounded,

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physics and quantum physics aspect of it is

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is what highlights the,

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the quantum sensing aspect of our work. The

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second strand of our research is on quantum

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networks.

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We're exploring

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all the way from basic science part of

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it, the understanding materials, novel materials that could

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be quite relevant for quantum networks going forward.

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They may not, the future technologies may not

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necessarily rely on silicon. So we're looking at

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other,

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platforms to see if there's any advantage if

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we look at the,

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these materials from their,

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devices that leverage their quantum properties.

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And we actually push this towards technology a

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bit more, and we're actually building

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a small scale networks, very primitive,

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2 node, maybe if possible 3 node networks

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where we like to distribute not just information,

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but quantum information

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between these nodes. And we have the ability

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to actually store it at different nodes

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and use it when we need to use

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it. So in a way, you can think

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of it as quantum networks is there is

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a communication,

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concept,

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but it feeds very closely with, with quantum

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computing in a in a distributed quantum computing

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sense. So is the idea with quantum networks

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that it could one day replace,

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like, the fiber optic networks that we have

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now? It would actually not replace it. It

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would leverage the fiber optic networks. And that's

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the there's again the spirit of Contour.

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Ultimately, whether you work with,

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with intense lasers or light pulses or you

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operate at a single photon level, the medium

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that you'll transport your light, your, your information

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is going to be the same. It's going

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to be the fiber optic network. So that's

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why we think that it is actually feasible

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to implement quantum networks because we don't have

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to replace

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existing,

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infrastructure that we can almost leverage the existing

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infrastructure.

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Okay. So you're you're sending it across, again,

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across the fiber optic network, but

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you're looking at single photons. Right? So what's

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the challenge

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of taking,

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you know, taking the existing technology and

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adapting it so that we're looking at single

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coding information in single photons?

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The advantage that we have today on classical,

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communication is that,

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as photons are lost in an otherwise intense

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pulse, that carries some information, a bit 0

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or 1,

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is is the the the light intensity is

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diminished,

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throughout the propagation down a optical fiber,

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you can,

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at a different let's say, periodically, you can

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amplify that that signal and continue. The ones,

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the message, the information one stays 1, 0

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stays 0, and you proceed. And you go

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through a little amplification process,

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optical amplification.

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Now when it come down to a single

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photon, the photon is either there or it's

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00:10:17,495 --> 00:10:19,414
lost. And then when it's lost, the old

280
00:10:19,414 --> 00:10:21,889
information is gone. So there's no there's no

281
00:10:22,190 --> 00:10:24,190
gradual decline of the, of the quality of

282
00:10:24,190 --> 00:10:26,509
the past that carries information. It's a discrete

283
00:10:26,509 --> 00:10:29,389
yes, no. We have the information travelling or

284
00:10:29,389 --> 00:10:31,710
we don't have it anymore. So, so then

285
00:10:31,710 --> 00:10:32,590
you might want to do,

286
00:10:33,710 --> 00:10:35,410
you you might want to do an amplification,

287
00:10:37,024 --> 00:10:39,584
that looks at takes care of this. And

288
00:10:39,584 --> 00:10:41,904
it turns out that quantum mechanically, we cannot

289
00:10:41,904 --> 00:10:43,924
do amplification of information. So

290
00:10:44,464 --> 00:10:46,784
what what we're able to do classically, we're

291
00:10:46,784 --> 00:10:49,504
actually unable to do quantum mechanically. And that

292
00:10:49,504 --> 00:10:52,070
is exactly the reason why single photon level

293
00:10:52,070 --> 00:10:55,190
quantum communication is fundamentally secure, that you cannot

294
00:10:55,190 --> 00:10:57,750
simply amplify and then tap into it by

295
00:10:57,750 --> 00:10:59,290
some, by another means.

296
00:10:59,750 --> 00:11:01,910
That that photon is the only thing that

297
00:11:01,910 --> 00:11:03,050
could carry that information.

298
00:11:03,535 --> 00:11:04,035
So,

299
00:11:04,575 --> 00:11:06,335
so this puts a limit to how far

300
00:11:06,335 --> 00:11:08,735
these networks can be distributed. So that's why

301
00:11:08,735 --> 00:11:10,254
you need to bring a node instead of

302
00:11:10,254 --> 00:11:11,475
an amplifier unit.

303
00:11:12,014 --> 00:11:14,254
You need to bring a quantum node, that

304
00:11:14,254 --> 00:11:15,695
is shortened or let's say,

305
00:11:16,735 --> 00:11:20,169
approximate enough that without significant photon loss, you

306
00:11:20,169 --> 00:11:20,909
can trust,

307
00:11:21,370 --> 00:11:23,769
transmit information from a to b. And then

308
00:11:23,769 --> 00:11:26,409
in the node, you store that information in

309
00:11:26,409 --> 00:11:28,490
something else. Something else that is not prone

310
00:11:28,490 --> 00:11:31,049
to loss like photons, but maybe the internal

311
00:11:31,049 --> 00:11:33,524
degrees of freedom of an ion, a trapped

312
00:11:33,524 --> 00:11:36,085
ion, or or a single atom, or, some

313
00:11:36,085 --> 00:11:38,565
defect in a material, for example, hexagon boron

314
00:11:38,565 --> 00:11:39,705
nitride or diamond.

315
00:11:40,165 --> 00:11:41,764
Okay. So that's something else you're looking at

316
00:11:41,764 --> 00:11:43,384
as well, isn't it? How to store

317
00:11:43,924 --> 00:11:45,945
information in in different materials.

318
00:11:46,440 --> 00:11:46,940
What

319
00:11:47,399 --> 00:11:48,299
are the requirements

320
00:11:48,759 --> 00:11:51,080
on a material or a system that makes

321
00:11:51,080 --> 00:11:54,139
it good at storing quantum information for,

322
00:11:55,080 --> 00:11:57,399
reasonable periods of time? That's a great question.

323
00:11:57,399 --> 00:11:58,919
I think this is the question we've been

324
00:11:58,919 --> 00:11:59,804
banging our heads,

325
00:12:00,524 --> 00:12:01,245
on for a long time now.

326
00:12:03,325 --> 00:12:04,764
There it it comes with the,

327
00:12:05,725 --> 00:12:08,445
dichotomy, actually. It should be isolated enough that

328
00:12:08,445 --> 00:12:10,125
it does not interact with the rest of

329
00:12:10,125 --> 00:12:10,705
the universe

330
00:12:11,245 --> 00:12:13,424
on its own, but it should be integrated

331
00:12:13,565 --> 00:12:14,065
enough

332
00:12:14,389 --> 00:12:16,070
to our universe so that I can have

333
00:12:16,070 --> 00:12:18,730
direct access to it readily and availability. Right?

334
00:12:18,950 --> 00:12:21,350
And and that's that's a contradiction almost. Right?

335
00:12:21,350 --> 00:12:24,070
Either something is well isolated from everything or

336
00:12:24,070 --> 00:12:24,730
it isn't.

337
00:12:25,110 --> 00:12:27,370
If it is not well isolated, it decoheres

338
00:12:27,509 --> 00:12:28,725
very quickly because

339
00:12:29,204 --> 00:12:31,125
as as much as I get to talk

340
00:12:31,125 --> 00:12:33,065
to this quantum defect, the qubit,

341
00:12:33,605 --> 00:12:35,605
the rest of the universe also continues to

342
00:12:35,605 --> 00:12:37,304
talk to, the qubit.

343
00:12:38,164 --> 00:12:39,625
So creating an environment

344
00:12:40,084 --> 00:12:42,584
where the the the qubit is isolated

345
00:12:43,190 --> 00:12:45,690
for most parts, except when we are actually

346
00:12:46,070 --> 00:12:47,990
interacting with this with this cubit. I think

347
00:12:47,990 --> 00:12:48,889
that will be the,

348
00:12:49,350 --> 00:12:50,089
the the

349
00:12:51,190 --> 00:12:53,350
the material of choice, the actual physical system

350
00:12:53,350 --> 00:12:55,209
of choice. And we do have this available

351
00:12:55,269 --> 00:12:56,950
actually. So hence, there is no,

352
00:12:58,095 --> 00:13:00,995
winning materials yet. There's no winning material platform.

353
00:13:01,294 --> 00:13:03,554
That's why we need to pursue multiple platforms.

354
00:13:04,334 --> 00:13:06,514
But the nice thing is that the community,

355
00:13:07,855 --> 00:13:10,334
being diverse in terms of which material platform

356
00:13:10,334 --> 00:13:12,115
they're they're studying or investigating,

357
00:13:12,970 --> 00:13:14,490
we do have a common language. So we

358
00:13:14,490 --> 00:13:17,129
do address a a variety of materials and

359
00:13:17,129 --> 00:13:18,350
devices and systems

360
00:13:18,809 --> 00:13:21,850
with common similar language, which helps build coherence

361
00:13:21,850 --> 00:13:22,910
across the community.

362
00:13:23,370 --> 00:13:25,529
Okay. So, actually, what's the the quantum quantum

363
00:13:25,529 --> 00:13:27,529
light source? What's that what's that made of?

364
00:13:27,529 --> 00:13:28,924
Sure. It's, semiconductor

365
00:13:29,225 --> 00:13:31,465
quantum dots. So these are small islands of

366
00:13:31,465 --> 00:13:31,965
semiconductors

367
00:13:32,424 --> 00:13:35,304
buried inside another semiconductor. Their band gap is

368
00:13:35,304 --> 00:13:36,764
different of the 2 materials,

369
00:13:37,144 --> 00:13:39,485
types. So it's a material based confinement

370
00:13:39,785 --> 00:13:43,225
of, these pairs of, excitons and electron and

371
00:13:43,225 --> 00:13:45,360
a whole pair, that we can store inside

372
00:13:45,360 --> 00:13:46,339
these little islands.

373
00:13:47,039 --> 00:13:49,200
And then the electron and hole, they act

374
00:13:49,200 --> 00:13:51,039
like almost like a little atom on their

375
00:13:51,039 --> 00:13:53,299
own. Like the hydrogen atom is a nucleus,

376
00:13:53,559 --> 00:13:56,159
a proton and electron around it. You can

377
00:13:56,159 --> 00:13:58,159
think, it's it's kind of the same. You

378
00:13:58,159 --> 00:14:01,355
have an electron and a positively charged hole,

379
00:14:01,355 --> 00:14:03,455
and the 2 basically go around each other.

380
00:14:03,514 --> 00:14:06,235
That's one exciton is our quasi particle, and

381
00:14:06,235 --> 00:14:07,855
this has certain finite lifetime,

382
00:14:08,394 --> 00:14:10,095
usually on a 4 nanosecond

383
00:14:10,394 --> 00:14:12,960
or something, so extremely fast. But when they,

384
00:14:13,360 --> 00:14:15,840
recombine the electron and the hole combine, the

385
00:14:15,840 --> 00:14:18,320
total charge is 0. Something happens. The total

386
00:14:18,320 --> 00:14:21,200
energy goes somewhere and that somewhere is into

387
00:14:21,200 --> 00:14:23,679
light. So a single photon is generated per

388
00:14:23,679 --> 00:14:26,384
exciton that was stored inside a quantum dot.

389
00:14:26,384 --> 00:14:28,625
So what we do is periodically we create

390
00:14:28,625 --> 00:14:31,105
an exciton, 1 and only one exciton inside

391
00:14:31,105 --> 00:14:32,485
one of these quantum dots.

392
00:14:32,865 --> 00:14:35,985
And then they combine, recombine, and then emit

393
00:14:35,985 --> 00:14:38,190
a photon, but one and only one photon.

394
00:14:38,350 --> 00:14:40,429
And that's why it's a high purity single

395
00:14:40,429 --> 00:14:41,330
photon source.

396
00:14:41,789 --> 00:14:44,029
And the photon then instead of being emitted

397
00:14:44,029 --> 00:14:46,909
in all random directions, it is funnelled by

398
00:14:46,909 --> 00:14:47,409
a

399
00:14:47,789 --> 00:14:49,250
a a nanophotonic structure,

400
00:14:49,789 --> 00:14:51,764
called the bull's eye structures we call it.

401
00:14:51,924 --> 00:14:54,565
It funnels it into efficiently into a a

402
00:14:54,565 --> 00:14:56,884
a a basically a fiber optic channel, and

403
00:14:56,884 --> 00:14:58,985
then we use the single photon stream,

404
00:14:59,524 --> 00:15:01,845
to do communication by encoding information off to

405
00:15:01,845 --> 00:15:03,625
the photons. Okay. And so

406
00:15:04,884 --> 00:15:06,644
you you spoke about, you know, re you're

407
00:15:06,644 --> 00:15:07,144
reusing

408
00:15:07,649 --> 00:15:08,389
fiber optic,

409
00:15:09,089 --> 00:15:11,490
like, infrastructure that we already have, and then

410
00:15:11,490 --> 00:15:14,789
you're using materials that have very well defined

411
00:15:15,490 --> 00:15:15,990
band

412
00:15:16,370 --> 00:15:16,949
band caps.

413
00:15:17,490 --> 00:15:21,225
And so and and emit photons at very

414
00:15:21,304 --> 00:15:23,384
well defined wavelengths. And I know that in

415
00:15:23,384 --> 00:15:24,924
fiber optics, there are

416
00:15:25,384 --> 00:15:25,884
certain

417
00:15:26,424 --> 00:15:28,985
frequencies that are that are used. So it's

418
00:15:28,985 --> 00:15:29,485
15

419
00:15:30,504 --> 00:15:33,544
1500 and 1550 nanometers, right, is the, like,

420
00:15:33,544 --> 00:15:35,084
the the standard wavelength

421
00:15:35,409 --> 00:15:36,149
of those optics.

422
00:15:36,610 --> 00:15:38,789
And so how do you go about

423
00:15:39,490 --> 00:15:40,549
bridging that

424
00:15:41,330 --> 00:15:42,470
that, I guess,

425
00:15:43,649 --> 00:15:45,570
divide between the materials that you have to

426
00:15:45,570 --> 00:15:47,409
use because they have great quantum properties and

427
00:15:47,409 --> 00:15:49,490
the wavelengths that you want to use to

428
00:15:49,490 --> 00:15:50,894
reuse fiber optic networks?

429
00:15:51,295 --> 00:15:52,654
Fantastic question. This is,

430
00:15:53,615 --> 00:15:56,014
it's it's always a challenge because that's why

431
00:15:56,014 --> 00:15:58,495
there is no winning materials platform yet. If

432
00:15:58,495 --> 00:16:00,575
you're focusing on 1550, there are a couple

433
00:16:00,575 --> 00:16:00,894
of,

434
00:16:01,535 --> 00:16:02,995
platforms we could use,

435
00:16:03,570 --> 00:16:05,970
but they bring their own challenges as to

436
00:16:05,970 --> 00:16:08,389
why they're not necessarily the obvious,

437
00:16:09,170 --> 00:16:09,670
winners.

438
00:16:10,210 --> 00:16:12,290
And then we work with other systems like

439
00:16:12,290 --> 00:16:15,730
these, semiconductor quantum dots. They're more mature technology.

440
00:16:15,730 --> 00:16:17,504
They've been around for a few decades now.

441
00:16:17,585 --> 00:16:19,264
So we've really learned how to make them

442
00:16:19,264 --> 00:16:21,585
pristine and good quality. We learn how to

443
00:16:21,585 --> 00:16:23,664
mold the light that comes out of them.

444
00:16:23,985 --> 00:16:26,705
So they are very advantageous on the performance

445
00:16:26,705 --> 00:16:28,465
of the photon side, but you're right. They

446
00:16:28,465 --> 00:16:31,190
don't match the exactly the wavelength of, 1550

447
00:16:31,490 --> 00:16:33,410
of the preferred, emission. So there are 2

448
00:16:33,410 --> 00:16:35,889
ways you can cheat. Right? 1, you, look

449
00:16:35,889 --> 00:16:37,730
for the next material and that's part of,

450
00:16:38,049 --> 00:16:40,850
scientific research that we do. We, we we

451
00:16:40,850 --> 00:16:43,250
don't limit ourselves to a very particular class

452
00:16:43,250 --> 00:16:44,389
of material platforms.

453
00:16:44,834 --> 00:16:46,754
We go bold. We go, out there and

454
00:16:46,754 --> 00:16:47,814
look for the craziest,

455
00:16:48,194 --> 00:16:50,694
materials you can think of, including diamond, including

456
00:16:50,914 --> 00:16:54,375
let single monolayer of of, some, semiconductor,

457
00:16:55,475 --> 00:16:56,375
2 d material.

458
00:16:57,250 --> 00:16:59,649
And we're we're finding these. Right? So that's,

459
00:16:59,889 --> 00:17:00,870
that's one direction,

460
00:17:01,250 --> 00:17:01,830
to pursue.

461
00:17:02,210 --> 00:17:03,110
That's the exploratory,

462
00:17:04,130 --> 00:17:05,509
part. The second,

463
00:17:05,970 --> 00:17:07,730
cheating, of course, is I call this cheating,

464
00:17:07,730 --> 00:17:09,910
but these are scientific progress, let's call it,

465
00:17:10,384 --> 00:17:12,865
is, is frequency conversion. So we have this

466
00:17:12,865 --> 00:17:15,365
fantastic tool in our hands called nonlinear optics.

467
00:17:15,585 --> 00:17:17,105
That is where if you have the right

468
00:17:17,105 --> 00:17:19,765
medium, a particular, again, material platform

469
00:17:20,065 --> 00:17:23,345
that brings not linear optics, but opportunity for

470
00:17:23,345 --> 00:17:25,700
nonlinear optics, opportunities for nonlinearities

471
00:17:26,640 --> 00:17:28,640
between photons so they can interact and exchange

472
00:17:28,640 --> 00:17:31,059
their frequency. Then you can take a 900

473
00:17:31,200 --> 00:17:31,700
nanometer,

474
00:17:32,640 --> 00:17:35,059
wavelength light and convert that to 1550

475
00:17:35,359 --> 00:17:36,900
with the help of another,

476
00:17:37,359 --> 00:17:39,505
light source. So that appear for what we

477
00:17:39,505 --> 00:17:41,105
call a three way mixing or a four

478
00:17:41,105 --> 00:17:41,845
way mixing,

479
00:17:42,305 --> 00:17:44,625
geometry. So you can almost, you can cook

480
00:17:44,625 --> 00:17:47,265
up the wavelength you want provided you get

481
00:17:47,265 --> 00:17:47,924
the photons

482
00:17:48,305 --> 00:17:50,884
that normally don't interact with anything to actually

483
00:17:50,945 --> 00:17:53,940
directly and strongly interact inside a very special

484
00:17:53,940 --> 00:17:56,660
material called chi 3 or chi 2 materials

485
00:17:56,660 --> 00:17:58,440
or nonlinear materials. So,

486
00:17:58,900 --> 00:18:00,819
this has been demonstrated. So in in a

487
00:18:00,819 --> 00:18:03,000
sense, while we lose a bit the efficiency,

488
00:18:03,059 --> 00:18:05,240
because not necessarily a 100% efficient,

489
00:18:05,744 --> 00:18:07,345
you do have a chance to take anything

490
00:18:07,345 --> 00:18:09,025
you want out there that works really well

491
00:18:09,025 --> 00:18:11,365
and convert that to the common frequency

492
00:18:11,664 --> 00:18:13,365
of a metropolitan network.

493
00:18:14,065 --> 00:18:16,384
Okay. And when when you're actually thinking about

494
00:18:16,384 --> 00:18:16,884
building

495
00:18:18,170 --> 00:18:20,490
these these systems so you spoke about diamond,

496
00:18:20,490 --> 00:18:22,829
and you spoke about hexagonal boron nitride,

497
00:18:23,609 --> 00:18:26,329
where you're actually you're using cubits that like,

498
00:18:26,329 --> 00:18:28,970
lattice defects. So, like, almost like like, holes

499
00:18:28,970 --> 00:18:31,505
almost or defects in these crystals.

500
00:18:32,765 --> 00:18:35,005
And then you also can use, as you

501
00:18:35,005 --> 00:18:36,945
spoke about, semiconductor quantum dots.

502
00:18:38,045 --> 00:18:38,545
How

503
00:18:39,964 --> 00:18:42,285
much control how how much control do you

504
00:18:42,285 --> 00:18:44,865
have when you're actually fabricating these systems over

505
00:18:45,565 --> 00:18:48,669
where the cubits are? Mhmm. It's,

506
00:18:49,150 --> 00:18:50,829
if if you're down to a single atom

507
00:18:50,829 --> 00:18:53,069
level, you have to have that precision to

508
00:18:53,069 --> 00:18:53,970
actually say,

509
00:18:54,349 --> 00:18:56,910
you, atom, move away and then you, atom,

510
00:18:56,910 --> 00:18:59,144
go back in there. So that's very difficult.

511
00:18:59,144 --> 00:19:01,224
And we don't have that technology except in

512
00:19:01,224 --> 00:19:02,765
a very rare case of,

513
00:19:03,705 --> 00:19:05,805
of of scanning tunneling microscope,

514
00:19:06,585 --> 00:19:07,085
approaches

515
00:19:07,545 --> 00:19:08,365
to constructing

516
00:19:08,904 --> 00:19:11,085
a particular device at the atomic level.

517
00:19:13,190 --> 00:19:15,910
Professor Simmons in Australia is doing fantastic work

518
00:19:15,910 --> 00:19:16,490
on this.

519
00:19:16,950 --> 00:19:19,130
She's literally putting atom by atom,

520
00:19:19,670 --> 00:19:22,009
construction or engineering of a quantum device,

521
00:19:22,470 --> 00:19:24,230
that is that small. It's only a few

522
00:19:24,230 --> 00:19:24,674
atoms,

523
00:19:25,235 --> 00:19:26,855
wide. But of course,

524
00:19:27,235 --> 00:19:29,235
from one side is a big achievement. From

525
00:19:29,235 --> 00:19:31,475
another side, this would be quite challenging to

526
00:19:31,475 --> 00:19:34,035
scale up, to make larger devices or bigger

527
00:19:34,035 --> 00:19:34,535
devices.

528
00:19:36,035 --> 00:19:38,035
What we are doing with the defect based

529
00:19:38,035 --> 00:19:39,150
systems is,

530
00:19:40,029 --> 00:19:42,049
that we rely on the fact that optically

531
00:19:42,109 --> 00:19:43,009
active defects,

532
00:19:43,630 --> 00:19:46,029
they'll relevant footprint is actually not the size

533
00:19:46,029 --> 00:19:47,789
of a single atom, but the size of

534
00:19:47,789 --> 00:19:48,450
your wavelength.

535
00:19:48,830 --> 00:19:50,830
Because the the atoms have 2 different length

536
00:19:50,830 --> 00:19:53,309
scales. 1 is their physical length scale within

537
00:19:53,309 --> 00:19:54,690
a crystal, within a lattice.

538
00:19:55,054 --> 00:19:55,714
That's like

539
00:19:56,174 --> 00:19:57,875
of the order of 1 lattice site.

540
00:19:58,335 --> 00:19:59,875
But if they're optically active,

541
00:20:00,255 --> 00:20:02,974
then their optical cross section is what we

542
00:20:02,974 --> 00:20:05,054
call is their physical size that really matters.

543
00:20:05,054 --> 00:20:06,974
And that's off order micron or half a

544
00:20:06,974 --> 00:20:08,549
micron. So that means

545
00:20:09,110 --> 00:20:10,789
it gives us a chance to not be

546
00:20:10,789 --> 00:20:13,590
precise exactly which of the lattice sites our

547
00:20:13,590 --> 00:20:16,710
defects sits that optically engages with, with the

548
00:20:16,710 --> 00:20:18,230
rest of the world. So that gives us

549
00:20:18,230 --> 00:20:20,150
a chance to realize everything we want without

550
00:20:20,150 --> 00:20:22,585
having to worry at that length scale of

551
00:20:22,585 --> 00:20:24,845
of, a nanometer or or sub nanometer.

552
00:20:25,545 --> 00:20:28,105
That's one thing. The advantage for coming back

553
00:20:28,105 --> 00:20:28,765
to Contour,

554
00:20:29,384 --> 00:20:32,525
it's our this, it's quant quantum torch.

555
00:20:33,460 --> 00:20:35,860
The advantage there is that it's actually bulky.

556
00:20:35,860 --> 00:20:37,400
It's not a single atomic,

557
00:20:37,779 --> 00:20:39,960
system. It's not a single defect based system.

558
00:20:40,100 --> 00:20:42,519
It actually is each of these quantum dots,

559
00:20:42,740 --> 00:20:44,119
despite the name dot,

560
00:20:44,980 --> 00:20:48,039
is actually about 50 to a 100000 atoms

561
00:20:48,500 --> 00:20:49,000
cluster.

562
00:20:49,355 --> 00:20:51,434
So if you go back, 2 years, the

563
00:20:51,434 --> 00:20:53,775
Nobel Prize in chemistry was for colloidal

564
00:20:54,234 --> 00:20:56,315
quantum dots. And these were small,

565
00:20:56,714 --> 00:20:58,654
balls of atoms combined into,

566
00:20:59,355 --> 00:21:01,914
to form a particular material with discrete energy

567
00:21:01,914 --> 00:21:04,049
levels, hence the same concept of,

568
00:21:04,529 --> 00:21:07,250
clear single photons. In the same spirit, these

569
00:21:07,250 --> 00:21:09,990
are only they're they're embedded inside another semiconductor,

570
00:21:10,210 --> 00:21:12,690
but otherwise, they are large bulky systems, and

571
00:21:12,690 --> 00:21:14,289
we know where to put them. So we

572
00:21:14,289 --> 00:21:15,345
can actually say,

573
00:21:16,065 --> 00:21:18,944
by by pre processing of the of the,

574
00:21:19,184 --> 00:21:21,345
surface that we're going to grow the quantum

575
00:21:21,345 --> 00:21:23,184
dots, we can actually tell them where to

576
00:21:23,184 --> 00:21:25,505
be with very high precision of of order

577
00:21:25,505 --> 00:21:25,904
nanometer,

578
00:21:26,384 --> 00:21:27,125
few nanometer

579
00:21:27,599 --> 00:21:28,880
precision for these rather,

580
00:21:29,279 --> 00:21:31,359
large systems. So it does give us this

581
00:21:31,359 --> 00:21:32,259
chance to say,

582
00:21:32,640 --> 00:21:34,259
to distribute a large scale,

583
00:21:35,519 --> 00:21:37,599
let's say, architecture of where these,

584
00:21:38,079 --> 00:21:41,045
special, systems will sit. Okay. And now I

585
00:21:41,045 --> 00:21:42,964
wanna talk a little bit about quantum as

586
00:21:42,964 --> 00:21:43,464
a

587
00:21:43,765 --> 00:21:45,865
technology and as a a commercial,

588
00:21:46,644 --> 00:21:47,704
you know, opportunity.

589
00:21:48,325 --> 00:21:49,224
I think that's

590
00:21:50,404 --> 00:21:52,484
I mean, it the if the International Year

591
00:21:52,484 --> 00:21:53,545
of Quantum in 2025,

592
00:21:54,940 --> 00:21:56,880
because it's a 100 years since

593
00:21:57,340 --> 00:21:58,080
when Heisenberg

594
00:21:58,460 --> 00:22:01,200
went to Helgeland to cure his hay fever

595
00:22:01,660 --> 00:22:03,820
and wrote down the matrix formalism of of

596
00:22:03,820 --> 00:22:05,360
quantum mechanics. But

597
00:22:06,335 --> 00:22:08,515
I think it's also been been chosen

598
00:22:09,055 --> 00:22:11,535
because quantum has kind of gone mainstream over

599
00:22:11,535 --> 00:22:13,775
the last couple of years. And I'm interested

600
00:22:13,775 --> 00:22:15,454
to know from your perspective, how long has

601
00:22:15,454 --> 00:22:16,994
it felt like this is a

602
00:22:19,390 --> 00:22:21,390
a part of physics that people are really

603
00:22:21,390 --> 00:22:23,250
seriously trying to turn into

604
00:22:23,549 --> 00:22:24,930
technology and commercialize?

605
00:22:26,430 --> 00:22:28,910
I think the the change of language is

606
00:22:28,910 --> 00:22:30,750
a good indicator for this as as,

607
00:22:31,070 --> 00:22:32,289
we discussed before.

608
00:22:32,684 --> 00:22:34,784
We were focusing on how weird it is.

609
00:22:35,724 --> 00:22:37,585
And we're we we thought experiments,

610
00:22:38,365 --> 00:22:40,304
real experiments in the lab were

611
00:22:40,605 --> 00:22:43,164
mainly to see if quantum mechanics concepts, the

612
00:22:43,164 --> 00:22:45,884
philosophy of quantum mechanics, the foundations of quantum

613
00:22:45,884 --> 00:22:47,329
mechanics is in in

614
00:22:47,630 --> 00:22:49,789
fact, is it valid or not. Right? So

615
00:22:49,789 --> 00:22:51,470
that was the starting point for all these.

616
00:22:51,470 --> 00:22:53,710
Now if you go back even further, the

617
00:22:53,710 --> 00:22:56,190
starting point for quantum physics was, of course,

618
00:22:56,190 --> 00:22:58,509
we'll never measure a single electron. Of course,

619
00:22:58,509 --> 00:23:00,429
we'll never be able to see this effect.

620
00:23:00,429 --> 00:23:02,554
But if we did, how would the experimental

621
00:23:02,615 --> 00:23:04,134
result look like? So it was all like

622
00:23:04,134 --> 00:23:07,095
get Duncan experiment, thought experiment. So if so

623
00:23:07,095 --> 00:23:09,014
they were in a stage 3 now. The

624
00:23:09,014 --> 00:23:11,494
get Duncan experiment has moved into real lab

625
00:23:11,494 --> 00:23:12,875
experiments of demonstrating

626
00:23:13,494 --> 00:23:15,990
foundations of quantum physics. And now we're in

627
00:23:15,990 --> 00:23:18,390
the era of actually turn them into real

628
00:23:18,390 --> 00:23:21,830
life feasible operations. Now there's as with most

629
00:23:21,830 --> 00:23:25,509
exciting emerging, technologies or potentially emerging technologies, there

630
00:23:25,509 --> 00:23:27,589
will always be hype around. And you'll see

631
00:23:27,589 --> 00:23:30,330
you'll see, news pieces where they'll say,

632
00:23:30,805 --> 00:23:33,365
headline will say something like quantum of quantum

633
00:23:33,365 --> 00:23:34,664
computing will cure cancer.

634
00:23:35,125 --> 00:23:37,205
And maybe one day it will, but, but

635
00:23:37,205 --> 00:23:38,644
we're not at this stage yet, and that's

636
00:23:38,644 --> 00:23:40,244
not the main reason why we put it

637
00:23:40,244 --> 00:23:42,805
all together. I think the what sets quantum

638
00:23:42,805 --> 00:23:45,490
technologies unique is that our one leg is

639
00:23:45,490 --> 00:23:48,630
still parked firmly at basic sciences and development

640
00:23:48,690 --> 00:23:52,549
of that interface of new concepts, new phenomenon,

641
00:23:53,170 --> 00:23:54,710
and new material systems

642
00:23:55,089 --> 00:23:56,950
that brings together computer scientists,

643
00:23:57,855 --> 00:24:00,755
physicists, and material scientists, chemist in some cases,

644
00:24:01,214 --> 00:24:02,894
so that we can all inter this in

645
00:24:02,894 --> 00:24:05,795
an interdisciplinary way, look at what beneficial

646
00:24:06,174 --> 00:24:08,355
directions we can push when it comes to,

647
00:24:08,734 --> 00:24:09,875
technology transfer.

648
00:24:10,255 --> 00:24:11,875
Okay. Thinking about quantum

649
00:24:12,414 --> 00:24:12,914
network

650
00:24:13,309 --> 00:24:15,069
speakers, I know that's one of that's the

651
00:24:15,069 --> 00:24:16,450
thing that new quantum

652
00:24:17,150 --> 00:24:19,309
is about right about quantum networking. What are

653
00:24:19,309 --> 00:24:20,289
the big challenges,

654
00:24:21,710 --> 00:24:22,210
outstanding

655
00:24:23,309 --> 00:24:25,569
experimental and theoretical challenges to actually

656
00:24:25,904 --> 00:24:27,125
bringing that technology

657
00:24:27,505 --> 00:24:28,005
to

658
00:24:28,545 --> 00:24:30,085
scaling it up and

659
00:24:31,184 --> 00:24:32,965
rolling it out on a large scale.

660
00:24:33,984 --> 00:24:35,924
Given that the the whole field,

661
00:24:37,025 --> 00:24:38,945
emerged, the experimental side of it, the practical

662
00:24:38,945 --> 00:24:40,005
side of it emerged

663
00:24:40,349 --> 00:24:40,589
in,

664
00:24:41,230 --> 00:24:42,849
physics based research labs

665
00:24:43,150 --> 00:24:45,809
with focus on the the the singular unit,

666
00:24:45,950 --> 00:24:46,690
the isolated

667
00:24:46,990 --> 00:24:47,970
quantum bit.

668
00:24:48,910 --> 00:24:51,390
We have a we know our quantum bits

669
00:24:51,390 --> 00:24:53,230
really well. We know how to control it.

670
00:24:53,230 --> 00:24:54,690
We've improved our techniques,

671
00:24:55,325 --> 00:24:56,865
including our material quality.

672
00:24:57,644 --> 00:25:00,204
What hasn't been developing so far? What is

673
00:25:00,204 --> 00:25:02,045
what is the what what's the what's the

674
00:25:02,045 --> 00:25:04,125
challenge that we're facing right now is the

675
00:25:04,125 --> 00:25:04,625
interconnects.

676
00:25:05,085 --> 00:25:07,345
It's connecting them together. And that's the scalability

677
00:25:07,404 --> 00:25:09,005
that you refer to as well. How to

678
00:25:09,005 --> 00:25:11,180
make 1,000 of these? Actually, it is fairly

679
00:25:11,180 --> 00:25:12,940
easy to make 1,000 of the same good

680
00:25:12,940 --> 00:25:13,440
qubit.

681
00:25:13,820 --> 00:25:15,740
It's not the number that stops us. It

682
00:25:15,740 --> 00:25:17,740
is linking them so that you benefit. You

683
00:25:17,740 --> 00:25:20,059
don't end up with 1,000 independent qubits, but

684
00:25:20,059 --> 00:25:22,640
rather a 1,000 qubit system.

685
00:25:22,994 --> 00:25:23,654
And that

686
00:25:24,115 --> 00:25:27,234
system, requires their their interaction exchange of,

687
00:25:27,795 --> 00:25:29,095
interaction and information,

688
00:25:29,875 --> 00:25:31,394
some sort of a network you need to

689
00:25:31,394 --> 00:25:33,875
put together regardless of whether it's a quantum

690
00:25:33,875 --> 00:25:36,889
computing, monolithic quantum computing you're after, or a

691
00:25:36,889 --> 00:25:37,429
a distributed

692
00:25:38,049 --> 00:25:41,089
metropolitan size quantum network that you're after, or

693
00:25:41,089 --> 00:25:43,409
quantum sensors where we need to make sure

694
00:25:43,409 --> 00:25:45,649
that we have direct links to them. Ultimately,

695
00:25:45,649 --> 00:25:46,149
the

696
00:25:46,450 --> 00:25:48,450
interconnect is going to be the name of

697
00:25:48,450 --> 00:25:50,230
the game. So you're talking about entangling?

698
00:25:50,690 --> 00:25:53,105
That's right. So how to sustain quantumness

699
00:25:54,045 --> 00:25:57,664
distributed over multiple cubits, multiple nodes,

700
00:25:58,605 --> 00:26:00,845
and and ensuring that that is operational, that

701
00:26:00,845 --> 00:26:02,765
we can do something with it. And that's

702
00:26:02,765 --> 00:26:04,650
that's going to be the challenge. The biggest,

703
00:26:05,450 --> 00:26:07,930
challenge in front of us across different platforms,

704
00:26:07,930 --> 00:26:10,410
across different approaches, and even technologies that we're

705
00:26:10,410 --> 00:26:12,750
aiming for is how to get that,

706
00:26:13,289 --> 00:26:13,789
link

707
00:26:14,410 --> 00:26:16,890
preferably with light, how to get get that

708
00:26:16,890 --> 00:26:19,505
link to be efficient and quantum preserving, let's

709
00:26:19,505 --> 00:26:20,005
say.

710
00:26:20,704 --> 00:26:22,464
Okay. And what sort of avenues are you

711
00:26:22,464 --> 00:26:24,065
looking at to try and to try and

712
00:26:24,065 --> 00:26:26,224
get there? It's very interesting. We're looking at

713
00:26:26,224 --> 00:26:28,625
classical avenues. We're looking at ways to make

714
00:26:28,625 --> 00:26:31,720
sure that we are not overlooking anything that

715
00:26:31,720 --> 00:26:34,119
has been developed on the classical conventional side

716
00:26:34,119 --> 00:26:35,900
of photonics and materials,

717
00:26:36,440 --> 00:26:39,179
and engineering and systems packaging. All of those

718
00:26:39,240 --> 00:26:40,059
which physicists

719
00:26:40,440 --> 00:26:43,444
arguably are not necessarily most accustomed to. All

720
00:26:43,444 --> 00:26:45,444
of that is now coming together to say,

721
00:26:45,444 --> 00:26:47,285
is there a better way that we could

722
00:26:47,285 --> 00:26:48,025
do this

723
00:26:48,404 --> 00:26:50,565
rather than a physicist hat, but rather an

724
00:26:50,565 --> 00:26:52,964
engineer hat or or a systems hat? Yeah.

725
00:26:52,964 --> 00:26:54,085
I think I've been I was sort of

726
00:26:54,085 --> 00:26:55,065
surprised to

727
00:26:55,605 --> 00:26:57,204
learn more about us and find that there's

728
00:26:57,204 --> 00:26:57,865
a big

729
00:26:58,349 --> 00:26:59,009
need for

730
00:27:00,430 --> 00:27:02,829
radio frequency engineers because it's still, you know

731
00:27:03,470 --> 00:27:05,069
even though we're using the the quantum physics,

732
00:27:05,069 --> 00:27:07,230
you're still using, you know, that that radio

733
00:27:07,230 --> 00:27:10,509
frequency technology to interface with the quantum system.

734
00:27:10,509 --> 00:27:12,509
Absolutely. It's it's a fantastic field to be

735
00:27:12,509 --> 00:27:14,565
in because you can be operating,

736
00:27:15,184 --> 00:27:17,445
at the far end of the technology delivery

737
00:27:17,505 --> 00:27:20,085
where you're building some architecture of quantum computers

738
00:27:20,144 --> 00:27:22,644
with multi qubit systems. You're doing some operations,

739
00:27:22,705 --> 00:27:23,445
and you identify

740
00:27:24,065 --> 00:27:26,065
what limits you. And you you realize that

741
00:27:26,065 --> 00:27:26,648
what limits you is a material property, and

742
00:27:26,648 --> 00:27:26,681
it goes all the way back to the,

743
00:27:26,684 --> 00:27:27,455
blackboard, the the drawing board. And then

744
00:27:27,809 --> 00:27:29,919
and it goes all the way back to

745
00:27:29,919 --> 00:27:32,293
the, blackboard, the the drawing board. And then

746
00:27:32,293 --> 00:27:34,666
you start, changing the material that you're using

747
00:27:34,666 --> 00:27:36,776
in your devices to build up that whole

748
00:27:36,776 --> 00:27:38,886
architecture, and you find out things have improved.

749
00:27:38,886 --> 00:27:40,996
So if you don't have that link, if

750
00:27:40,996 --> 00:27:42,974
you don't have that conversation, the,

751
00:27:43,434 --> 00:27:45,835
you know, bumping shoulders in the hallway with

752
00:27:45,835 --> 00:27:47,674
a material scientist and a physicist and a

753
00:27:47,674 --> 00:27:49,534
computer scientist, that communication,

754
00:27:50,154 --> 00:27:51,595
you're not going to be able to create

755
00:27:51,595 --> 00:27:54,394
this, the cycling loop of improvement. So let's

756
00:27:54,394 --> 00:27:56,301
think of it as a it's not really

757
00:27:56,301 --> 00:27:58,919
a cycle loop. It's more like a spiral

758
00:27:58,919 --> 00:28:01,537
upwards that as we tap different aspects, we

759
00:28:01,537 --> 00:28:04,482
solve a challenge that's relevant, to certain expertise,

760
00:28:04,809 --> 00:28:07,427
and then we go forward with it. Okay.

761
00:28:07,427 --> 00:28:07,755
And

762
00:28:08,714 --> 00:28:10,075
I was interested to hear the way you

763
00:28:10,075 --> 00:28:12,714
spoke about the the quantum weirdness and how

764
00:28:12,714 --> 00:28:14,494
that has shifted. Because

765
00:28:15,275 --> 00:28:15,855
I think

766
00:28:16,795 --> 00:28:18,555
if we are thinking about it being the

767
00:28:18,555 --> 00:28:21,194
international quantum and looking back a 100 years

768
00:28:21,194 --> 00:28:22,974
to the early days of quantum mechanics,

769
00:28:23,570 --> 00:28:24,549
I think it is

770
00:28:25,170 --> 00:28:27,570
easy to, if you're not an expert, look

771
00:28:27,570 --> 00:28:29,089
at all the stuff that's been done or

772
00:28:29,089 --> 00:28:31,730
been that is being done with quantum technologies

773
00:28:31,730 --> 00:28:34,210
and think that those fundamental questions that were

774
00:28:34,210 --> 00:28:35,570
being asked a 100 years ago have been

775
00:28:35,570 --> 00:28:37,329
resolved, and we're just trying to work at

776
00:28:37,329 --> 00:28:38,070
how to,

777
00:28:38,434 --> 00:28:39,734
you know, commercialize,

778
00:28:40,194 --> 00:28:42,674
you know, the the theory, basically. But, actually,

779
00:28:42,674 --> 00:28:45,575
all of the questions about, you know, what

780
00:28:45,634 --> 00:28:47,794
quantum mechanics means and how it should interpret

781
00:28:47,794 --> 00:28:49,954
it and what it means for understanding of

782
00:28:49,954 --> 00:28:51,315
reality, a lot of that is I mean,

783
00:28:51,315 --> 00:28:53,440
all of that really is still up in

784
00:28:53,440 --> 00:28:55,140
the air, and it's still being debated.

785
00:28:56,080 --> 00:28:58,259
You know, the the fact that or the

786
00:28:58,960 --> 00:29:01,619
the mainstream interpretation of quantum mechanics that,

787
00:29:02,799 --> 00:29:04,180
you know, the state of

788
00:29:05,615 --> 00:29:07,455
an object is is not in a definite

789
00:29:07,455 --> 00:29:09,634
state until you measure it. Is that

790
00:29:10,015 --> 00:29:11,875
something that you that sort of

791
00:29:12,975 --> 00:29:15,455
uncomfortable weirdness? Because because it is. It sort

792
00:29:15,455 --> 00:29:18,015
of defies it defies human comprehension, I think,

793
00:29:18,015 --> 00:29:19,134
in a way, when you really think about

794
00:29:19,134 --> 00:29:20,909
it. Is that something that you think about

795
00:29:20,909 --> 00:29:22,769
in your work and see yourself as

796
00:29:23,549 --> 00:29:24,369
looking into?

797
00:29:24,990 --> 00:29:27,629
Absolutely. It it it is again what sets,

798
00:29:27,950 --> 00:29:28,690
this area,

799
00:29:29,869 --> 00:29:32,190
is is a bit unique. We're more used

800
00:29:32,190 --> 00:29:34,355
to the production line concept. Right? They you

801
00:29:34,355 --> 00:29:36,195
start from the very beginning, the concept, and

802
00:29:36,195 --> 00:29:38,535
then you you make a prototype, you you

803
00:29:38,755 --> 00:29:40,674
you develop it and it continues. So it's

804
00:29:40,674 --> 00:29:42,914
almost like, if if I talk in TRL

805
00:29:42,914 --> 00:29:44,755
language, you start from TRL 1 and go

806
00:29:44,755 --> 00:29:46,275
on to the the final product and you

807
00:29:46,355 --> 00:29:48,215
and and it's it's now in the system.

808
00:29:49,029 --> 00:29:51,509
Quantum mechanics is not like that. Quantum mechanics

809
00:29:51,509 --> 00:29:52,009
delivers

810
00:29:52,869 --> 00:29:54,950
advantages in certain areas, and we're pushing that

811
00:29:54,950 --> 00:29:56,710
forward as a technology. And at the same

812
00:29:56,710 --> 00:29:58,970
time, it doesn't include as a theory, gravity.

813
00:29:59,109 --> 00:30:00,710
So I don't know what to do. Right?

814
00:30:00,710 --> 00:30:02,089
At the same time, I'm fundamentally

815
00:30:02,390 --> 00:30:04,255
limited with what I have, and I know

816
00:30:04,255 --> 00:30:05,234
that it's not complete.

817
00:30:06,095 --> 00:30:06,595
But

818
00:30:07,055 --> 00:30:08,815
in in in in the phase space that

819
00:30:08,815 --> 00:30:11,695
quantum physics covers, there are safe areas that

820
00:30:11,695 --> 00:30:13,375
we can tap into to convert them into

821
00:30:13,375 --> 00:30:17,019
technology without necessarily understanding its full scope and

822
00:30:17,019 --> 00:30:18,859
how it will have to be transformed in

823
00:30:18,859 --> 00:30:22,140
the future to be an overarching theory beyond

824
00:30:22,140 --> 00:30:24,940
everything else that that, harbors all phenomena that

825
00:30:24,940 --> 00:30:26,640
we see today. But, yeah, it's,

826
00:30:27,180 --> 00:30:28,720
even today, the technological

827
00:30:29,099 --> 00:30:31,595
push, say for example, space. Right? Space is

828
00:30:31,595 --> 00:30:33,054
the next frontier for us.

829
00:30:33,434 --> 00:30:35,934
We're talking about secure communications in space.

830
00:30:37,034 --> 00:30:38,875
One reason, of course, you could say is

831
00:30:38,875 --> 00:30:41,835
purely technological and applications. But another reason is

832
00:30:41,835 --> 00:30:42,414
to say,

833
00:30:42,829 --> 00:30:45,009
does the the concept of entanglement,

834
00:30:45,470 --> 00:30:47,869
long distance entanglement, and the the scoop spooky

835
00:30:47,869 --> 00:30:48,930
action in the distance,

836
00:30:49,549 --> 00:30:49,950
idea of,

837
00:30:50,670 --> 00:30:52,210
mention of, Einstein,

838
00:30:52,589 --> 00:30:54,829
does that hold over long distances? That's a

839
00:30:54,829 --> 00:30:57,204
question to ask because on short distance is

840
00:30:57,204 --> 00:30:59,684
fine, but long enough distances where relativity kicks

841
00:30:59,684 --> 00:31:02,484
in, special or general relativity kicks in, do

842
00:31:02,484 --> 00:31:04,484
we actually see an effect of this? Does

843
00:31:04,484 --> 00:31:07,525
gravity actually take part in determining what happens

844
00:31:07,525 --> 00:31:09,224
to the entanglement that was distributed?

845
00:31:09,880 --> 00:31:10,859
Quantum theory

846
00:31:11,319 --> 00:31:13,559
says that there's no mention of the distance

847
00:31:13,559 --> 00:31:15,099
d between 2 objects.

848
00:31:15,400 --> 00:31:15,900
Reality

849
00:31:16,359 --> 00:31:17,900
needs to be checked. So,

850
00:31:18,279 --> 00:31:21,179
some people are designing this very technologically advanced

851
00:31:21,240 --> 00:31:21,740
experiments

852
00:31:22,555 --> 00:31:25,855
to actually test entanglement over very long distances,

853
00:31:26,315 --> 00:31:27,775
you know, space,

854
00:31:28,075 --> 00:31:30,555
space like distance. So, again, it goes both

855
00:31:30,555 --> 00:31:31,055
ways.

856
00:31:31,595 --> 00:31:33,615
We will develop the theory more, hopefully,

857
00:31:34,394 --> 00:31:36,859
and it it there is room to go,

858
00:31:36,859 --> 00:31:39,339
but it shouldn't necessarily stop us using the

859
00:31:39,339 --> 00:31:41,899
parts we know are working well. Okay. Yeah.

860
00:31:41,899 --> 00:31:43,339
It is pretty amazing that a lot of

861
00:31:43,339 --> 00:31:43,839
the

862
00:31:44,380 --> 00:31:46,720
a lot of this quantum technology is based

863
00:31:47,740 --> 00:31:49,419
on theory that when it was first sort

864
00:31:49,419 --> 00:31:50,079
of conceived,

865
00:31:51,019 --> 00:31:53,075
the the the the understanding was, well, this

866
00:31:53,075 --> 00:31:54,275
is this is cool, but we'll never ever

867
00:31:54,275 --> 00:31:55,975
be able to measure it or test it.

868
00:31:56,355 --> 00:31:57,955
You know, we can't we can't get enough

869
00:31:57,955 --> 00:31:58,855
control over,

870
00:31:59,315 --> 00:32:01,315
you know, over quantum objects. And now we

871
00:32:01,315 --> 00:32:02,515
kind of we can just do it. I

872
00:32:02,515 --> 00:32:04,195
mean, I've, you know, been downstairs, and I've

873
00:32:04,195 --> 00:32:06,160
seen the lab where, you know, you're just

874
00:32:06,160 --> 00:32:07,600
you're just doing that as your everyday job.

875
00:32:07,600 --> 00:32:08,500
It's really cool.

876
00:32:10,000 --> 00:32:11,779
So just to sort of round off,

877
00:32:12,480 --> 00:32:14,480
we've talked about sort of the the present

878
00:32:14,480 --> 00:32:15,380
of of quantum

879
00:32:16,000 --> 00:32:18,160
technologies and the past of quantum theory. What

880
00:32:18,160 --> 00:32:20,515
are your hopes for the next couple of

881
00:32:20,515 --> 00:32:23,414
years of quantum and quantum technologies?

882
00:32:24,275 --> 00:32:26,275
I think next couple of years 2 years

883
00:32:26,275 --> 00:32:28,275
is is is a short time time frame,

884
00:32:28,275 --> 00:32:28,914
of course.

885
00:32:29,554 --> 00:32:31,654
The the 2 years is within a PhD.

886
00:32:31,714 --> 00:32:33,894
So this would be difficult to

887
00:32:34,200 --> 00:32:36,519
to expect big leaps within 2 years. But,

888
00:32:36,519 --> 00:32:39,419
of course, leaps come in effectively instantaneously,

889
00:32:39,799 --> 00:32:42,119
having leveraged the years years decades in some

890
00:32:42,119 --> 00:32:43,880
cases of research. And then you get the

891
00:32:43,880 --> 00:32:45,419
big leap. So I expect,

892
00:32:46,119 --> 00:32:47,500
clear progress in

893
00:32:47,804 --> 00:32:50,944
scaling, when it comes to, quantum computing activities.

894
00:32:51,565 --> 00:32:52,605
I expect the first,

895
00:32:53,085 --> 00:32:54,684
well, we do have a a 3 node

896
00:32:54,684 --> 00:32:57,244
quantum network in Europe, and it's diamond based,

897
00:32:57,565 --> 00:32:58,065
interestingly.

898
00:32:58,365 --> 00:33:01,160
It's located in the Netherlands. I do expect,

899
00:33:02,740 --> 00:33:05,779
similar quantum networks to actually be commissioned and

900
00:33:05,779 --> 00:33:06,279
operational,

901
00:33:06,740 --> 00:33:08,580
in many other places. So this is around

902
00:33:08,580 --> 00:33:10,259
this this time. And it seems like in

903
00:33:10,259 --> 00:33:12,674
almost all of these attempts at the moment,

904
00:33:13,475 --> 00:33:15,075
diamond seems to be a material of choice,

905
00:33:15,075 --> 00:33:16,295
which we wouldn't have guessed,

906
00:33:17,075 --> 00:33:18,615
20 years ago, for example.

907
00:33:19,154 --> 00:33:21,315
So I can see again, we'll be more

908
00:33:21,315 --> 00:33:24,355
in the in line of translation towards bit

909
00:33:24,355 --> 00:33:25,174
more operationally

910
00:33:26,559 --> 00:33:28,019
sensible, operationally interesting,

911
00:33:28,640 --> 00:33:30,880
modes of what we have, already. But of

912
00:33:30,880 --> 00:33:32,880
course breakthroughs happen because,

913
00:33:33,840 --> 00:33:36,340
an idea comes when you're at the unexpected

914
00:33:36,720 --> 00:33:38,900
talk at the, you know,

915
00:33:39,595 --> 00:33:41,914
annual conference, for example. And,

916
00:33:42,394 --> 00:33:44,955
the the progress is so fast now, as

917
00:33:44,955 --> 00:33:47,934
opposed to many, many decades ago, that translation

918
00:33:47,995 --> 00:33:49,755
of an idea, a new concept that comes

919
00:33:49,755 --> 00:33:52,495
in to realizing it as proof of principle

920
00:33:52,634 --> 00:33:55,115
is actually can be quite fast given all

921
00:33:55,115 --> 00:33:57,009
the all the experience that we managed to

922
00:33:57,009 --> 00:33:58,390
put together in this interdisciplinary,

923
00:33:59,250 --> 00:34:01,330
community that we built over the years. Okay.

924
00:34:01,330 --> 00:34:03,170
So it sounds like you're open to surprises

925
00:34:03,170 --> 00:34:05,670
in the next couple of weeks. Okay. Well,

926
00:34:05,970 --> 00:34:08,210
thank you so much for for joining me

927
00:34:08,210 --> 00:34:09,670
today. That was Messe Assessure.

928
00:34:11,105 --> 00:34:12,704
And, yeah, thank you very much for for

929
00:34:12,704 --> 00:34:14,065
speaking with me. It was great to talk.

930
00:34:14,065 --> 00:34:15,424
It was a great pleasure. Thank you for,

931
00:34:15,585 --> 00:34:16,324
having me.

932
00:34:23,500 --> 00:34:25,519
That was the University of Cambridge's

933
00:34:25,980 --> 00:34:26,480
Mettetatore

934
00:34:27,900 --> 00:34:28,640
in conversation

935
00:34:28,940 --> 00:34:31,200
with Physics World's Katherine Schipper.

936
00:34:31,980 --> 00:34:34,400
Stay tuned to the Physics World website

937
00:34:34,700 --> 00:34:37,760
for lots more quantum science and technology

938
00:34:38,219 --> 00:34:39,315
coverage this year.

939
00:34:40,114 --> 00:34:42,454
A good place to start is Bob Kreese's

940
00:34:42,914 --> 00:34:45,954
feature article that looks back on the summer

941
00:34:45,954 --> 00:34:47,094
of 1925,

942
00:34:48,755 --> 00:34:50,295
when the allergy prone

943
00:34:50,675 --> 00:34:51,815
Werner Heisenberg

944
00:34:52,559 --> 00:34:53,780
traveled to the tiny

945
00:34:54,239 --> 00:34:56,660
North Sea island of Helgoland

946
00:34:57,280 --> 00:34:59,300
for a pollen free holiday.

947
00:35:00,320 --> 00:35:03,300
It was there that the 23 year old

948
00:35:03,360 --> 00:35:03,860
formulated

949
00:35:04,400 --> 00:35:05,460
matrix mechanics,

950
00:35:06,184 --> 00:35:07,965
which was the first consistent

951
00:35:08,824 --> 00:35:09,324
mathematical

952
00:35:09,704 --> 00:35:10,204
formulation

953
00:35:10,744 --> 00:35:12,125
of quantum physics.

954
00:35:12,905 --> 00:35:15,565
The article sets the scene on the windswept

955
00:35:15,864 --> 00:35:16,364
island

956
00:35:16,905 --> 00:35:19,804
and ponders what was going through Heisinsberg's

957
00:35:20,184 --> 00:35:23,610
mind as he had his quantum revelation.

958
00:35:24,630 --> 00:35:27,590
And it also explains how his ideas have

959
00:35:27,590 --> 00:35:28,090
changed

960
00:35:28,390 --> 00:35:29,449
physics forever.

961
00:35:30,309 --> 00:35:30,809
Helgoland

962
00:35:31,110 --> 00:35:32,809
will be hosting a workshop

963
00:35:33,110 --> 00:35:35,894
in June of this year to celebrate the

964
00:35:35,894 --> 00:35:37,835
birth of quantum physics.

965
00:35:38,535 --> 00:35:40,155
And Kries also profiles

966
00:35:40,614 --> 00:35:42,074
some of the high profile

967
00:35:42,454 --> 00:35:42,954
scientists

968
00:35:43,414 --> 00:35:44,555
who will be there.

969
00:35:45,335 --> 00:35:47,735
You can find that article on the Physics

970
00:35:47,735 --> 00:35:48,635
World website.

971
00:35:49,289 --> 00:35:50,590
Just look for the headline

972
00:35:51,050 --> 00:35:52,349
return to Helgoland

973
00:35:53,369 --> 00:35:53,869
celebrating

974
00:35:54,730 --> 00:35:56,989
100 years of quantum mechanics.

975
00:35:58,250 --> 00:36:00,090
I'm afraid that's all the time we have

976
00:36:00,090 --> 00:36:01,390
for this week's podcast.

977
00:36:01,844 --> 00:36:03,704
Thanks to Mette Atatore

978
00:36:04,244 --> 00:36:06,824
and Katherine Skipper for a fascinating

979
00:36:07,204 --> 00:36:07,704
conversation.

980
00:36:08,324 --> 00:36:10,984
And thanks to our producer Fred Iles.

981
00:36:11,684 --> 00:36:14,969
This podcast returns next week, but until then,

982
00:36:14,969 --> 00:36:16,829
we wish you a happy

983
00:36:17,369 --> 00:36:20,670
international year of quantum science and technology.