Ron Perlman

How you doing out there? It's me Tigger Duc Wayne Duck. It's me
Bunker's Deep Bobcat. All right, y'all, did it great? Your favorite
firefly you desire hold old knock goud. My name is Jim Cummings and welcome
to tuned In. Ladies and gentlemen, we are here today. Welcome to
tuned In with Jim Cummings. Today we have a very special treat and old
buddy of mine and a bodacious actor. You know him, you love him,
you can't live without him. And the crowd went wild for Rodber.
Thank you, thank you so very much for being here. That's my pleasure.
Bro. We go way back, We go a little way back,
and uh, I remember it like it was yesterday, and it was okay.
Actually I don't remember much, but I do remember yesterday and you weren't
there. However, Uh it was great because I walk in and there's this
incredible actor that everybody loves, including me, and I'm getting to hang out
with him because we're doing a TV show called Bunkers, and it was you
and then Rita Moreno was sitting across the room and I'm going, are you
kidding me? Wait? And I'm pinching myself, you know. And and
I've I've dug you from in the name of the Rose and then the Father
and of the Son and the spare amen. But I used to be in
my stage name Spiritue sang to just call me spirit human spear. And why
did they? No? No, but I joke, Yeah, you joke
professionally. Well no, not really, as you'll you'll you'll find that as
we as we go on here, no one would pay me for this ship.
Well I'll have what he's having. But but no, it was incredible
and uh and and of course I think one of your big boost would have
been the Beast. M Yeah, this was a post beast, Yeah,
roast beast. Yes, this is like doctor Seuss. Yeah. You know,
it's funny when you talk about, you know, everybody's reaction to somebody
walking into the room and you you know whatever, whatever, you know,
the moment of recognition, and it's always the absolute shoe on the other foot
for me, Like I walked into that room feeling like I'm a tin horn.
I've never done a voice and a cartoon before walking into a world I'm
unfamiliar with. Nobody knows who the fuck I am, and and I'm looking
around and you know the obvious, you know, like big Shanny object.
Of course it is Ridam Arena. Everybody knows who she is. So I'm
like going, oh my god, I'm not the only one that like,
you know, like you know, has has figured out like, Okay,
maybe cartoons is going to be the way I go for the rest of my
career. But I told I just told the story with you, Jim a
second ago as we were getting ready to roll here. Andrea Romano was the
director of that thing, and you were playing Bonkers and another role, so
you were a couple. You played you played two of the lead roles,
but anybody who was anybody in Voiceover World Cartoon World was in that room and
we're doing pretty good. And it was one of those beautiful experiences where you
record it, you know, in real time, with the entire cast present,
rather than coming in individually, which is how sometimes you do it.
So I got a chance to sit there and be part of an ensemble and
listen to what everybody else was doing. And at the very end of the
session I went up, everybody had kind of dispersed and left, and I
was kind of like so blown away that I just I couldn't really move.
And I was the last one out of the room, and I walked up
to Andrea Romano, the director, and I said, who do I pay?
She said, what do you mean? I said, well, this
was the most entertained I've ever been in my life. This was my mind
blowing. Like the talent that I just watched just throws it away. There's
got to be a cover charge. And she she thought that was kind of
amusing. Yeah, but she still took you fifty bucks and she said,
and also, no, we don't validate, so you can pay the parking
attendant. I'll validate here. Let me validate you. You're a hell of
a nice guy. Get out of here. Yeah, there's a second opinion.
You're ugly too. But anyway, Oh Jesus, that was our first
day of meeting each other, and I was, I was, you know,
a fanboy for real inexplicable talent. You guys who do that? All
I could think of was you have to be the most unsung hero of creating
entertainment that there are, because you know, you're most most of the time
exclusive to that world. You know you don't and so you're you're just a
voice. You're faceless most of the time. Yes, and yet your the
creativity, the inventiveness, the genius way of approaching a role. And for
me, my favorite kind of acting is city of your Pants and going for
the performance on takee one, which is what you are charged to do when
you're when you're doing voices, especially in a cartoon. You go as big
as you can. You go as you go for the result, you go
for the performance, you go for And I'm in the room with the people
who do that as good as any anybody I'd ever seen. So, I
mean, I was like floored and odd and every time I see you and
all those guys Maurice LaMarsh and you know, Rob and you know all those
guys that I go back all that way with, I just my heart goes
all the flutter because that's you. Guys are just amazing actors. It's wonderful
and so in touch with your all these you know, inner and outer child.
Yeah, but you know, I mean, you know, being an
actor, you have to access parts of yourself that most people don't ever have
a chance to even explore them or know that they know it is. We're
always digging down but I really feel what you're saying there. You know.
It's it's interesting because I remember you just reminded me of it. We'd always
do a read through and they would, you know, and Andrea or whoever
it would be, would perfect voice, well, yeah, yeah, this
guy's not from Brooklyn. I think he's from Montgomery, Alabama or you know
what what are And then you're okay, okay, okay, So we do
this and that, and and you you bade me one of the coolest compliments.
I don't want to be sounded self aggrandizing here, but but we did
the read through and you said to me something to the tune of, do
you go this hard when it's not rolling? You know? And I said
I couldn't. And it never occurred to me that I was going, you
know, overdoing it or not overdoing it, but you know, giving it.
And I said I don't. I don't think I know any other way,
you know. And you said, so everyone's the super Bowl, and
I go, yeah, yeah, I think it is. I said that
yeah something very yeah, very sick. You're confusing me with Tony Roberts.
No, no, no, but I was so about that. But that's
kind of like I don't know how to go halfway, which is why I'm
one of these guys. Yeah, what's really I you know, even when
I'm when I'm shooting in front of the camera, Let's shoot the rehearsal.
Oh yeah, yeah, let's let's start shooting immediately, because the first thing
that comes out is going to be the most unjudged per going to give.
It's going to be it's going to be instincts of instincts are the best thinks.
Yes, that's so true. I wish I had said that, and
I will on my next podcast, coming to you Live from Higher Top.
Anyway, Uh no, I'm off to the floor. I like I like.
I like taking that very very first reaction that I have to what I'm
what I'm what I'm reading on the page, and now I'm having to embody
it, channel it or whatever and see what happens. And very often it's
wrong, but sometimes it's really really like, it's not going to get any
better than that, which is why I like to shoot the rehearsal, which
is why I was. I was the minute I got introduced to the cartoon
world and giving these pure voice performances where you don't have to worry about anything.
There's no vanity involved, that's for sure. There's just performance, and
there's a kind of an invitation to be entertaining, you know we are.
Yeah, we're not playing Louis Pasteur. Yeah that's right. We are not
curing anything here. We're not looking for you know, a Humanitius Award or
anything. We're just Saturday Morning. Yeah, we're just trying to fuck up
the mind on our part of the next generation. Yeah that's right. God,
I'm going to carve that into stone. That's so true. And we
succeed so much of the time sucking up these little kids. I'll never be
the same after that. Yeah, that ould hold the little bastards. Yeah
yeah, okay. Now Super Sales, Oh my god, it wasn't that
him who said that. No, Actually there was a movie that pre dated
Super Sales, but Super Sales was kind of like the new incarnation of what
I'm about to share with you, okay, And they made a movie of
this thing was called Facing the Crowd with Andy Griffith. Was actually a movie
that was directed by Elia Kazan, the guy who did like streetcar name on
the Waterfront, Facing the Crowd, and he played this kind of country boy
who was always getting in trouble and he was in jail and he just starts,
you know, playing guitar and talking and giving all this local knowledge and
he's as charming as charming could be. And somebody walks through the jail and
hears him and decides to give him a morning radio show, and he instantaneously
becomes the hottest thing in America and he becomes a star, which turns him
into He was always kind of like nefarious, but success takes nefarious and pumps
it up to a volume where it's not just harmless, it's megala maniacal.
And that's what this movie is. It's the study of this guy. He
his character in the movie is Lonesome Roads, and he's based on a real
guy, lon some Roads that name. He was based on a real guy
who had been on the chain gang and he went from jail to jail to
jail. But he was as funny as fuck was charming and the women loved
him, and he used to get on early, you know, daytime stuff.
And then he got so successful that he became he had so much weight
to throw around at the network that he became a monster, complete monster,
and he said, after he had done this this real homespun kind of show
where he's just given recipes and talking about what's going to happen at the next
church social and everything like that. And he gets done with the broadcast and
he says that out of hold the little bastards, and they and his engineer
kept the mic open because he wanted to. He wanted to show the world
what a fucking monster this was, and he spun he went down the drain.
From that moment on when everybody realized this guy is completely full of ship.
Wow. So it was one of the you know, go see it.
It's it's a phenomenal and it made Andy griff of the star. It's
called Facing the Crowd Ilia Kazan. It's as underrated a movie as you're ever
going to find. Patricia Neil was the girl who discovers him and then and
then Patricia Neil and then becomes you know, she rused the day that she
made him a star because she watches him become this, you know, monster,
the most the most objectionable human you could be. I will check that
out though, Yeah, as you you have your assignment. Yeah, oh,
I didn't realize we were filming this. Oh yeah, I should have
given you my good side, but then I don't have one, So here
we go. Just take a good side. Is when I'm out of the
room and the cameras are going, Yeah, you said something that made me
think of a question for both to you, how do you think you've changed
becoming famous? Like how do you think fame has changed you? Or has
it? As a person? I swear to God I'm not being COI or
saying this for effect or being disingenuous in any in any way, shape or
form. I am incapable of thinking of myself as famous. If anything,
it's the opposite, if anything, is like this guy who nobody knows,
who's obscure, who never you know, who never got to that level that
one dreams of when one dreams about fame and money and success and all that
stuff. In this business, I've always felt like I'm an outsider looking in,
and I always give all the credit to everyone else, Like you know,
I know what a genius Jim Cumming is. I have zero sense about
that about myself, and I never have. And I'm conscious of the fact
that I've done very well in the business, and I'm conscious of the fact
that I have standards that make me not behave like some newbie on the set.
I know what I'm doing. But that's different than celebrity or fame,
which is with the question you're asking me. So yes, have I developed
a lot of confidence as somebody who feels like I know what I'm doing in
the business and when I'm on the set or whatever it is I'm doing,
you know, I'm having to give a performance. Absolutely, much more so
than back in even ten years ago, way more so than when it all
started, where I have zero self esteem and zero confidence whatsoever. But I
don't consider myself. You know, George Clooney's famous. You know, I'm
a schlepper. I get what you're saying, and in my mind and you
know, and I know it's a kind of dysmorphia of certain because you know,
people keep the fuck out of here. Man. Yeah, of course
you're famous. I mean we're just in the lobby and like, you know,
two out of the four people in there, yeah, half of them
and the other two we're going you know who that is. So that's kind
of cool, But that's that's just part of my fucked up you know,
wiring same question for you, Jim, how do you feel Do you feel
as if you've changed when you started getting notoriety and you started getting fame and
people are coming up taking pictures, people are crying when they hear your voices.
Yeah, well that's different. Yeah yeah, I don't even know what
to think about that, because it's impossible for me to think of. The
first thing I think of is well, you flunked math in eighth grade and
then in ninth grade, and then you know, and I ended up taking
business math my sophomore year in high school twice because you had to have that
math, and and lord knows, we all use that high school diploma.
I mean, without that high school diploma, I would have never have been
here. It's bring up a hole in the wall that I punched one day.
Yeah, yeah, so you know, it's a dubious worth. I
mean I always say that the best lessons I learned were in the hall,
you know, when I got kicked out of class for doing those weird voices
and everything, and I still remember. I don't know if this is within
the realm of the answer, but having a guy who remained nameless is jim
on on M A U. G. H. A n he's manning nameless
and he slammed me up against the wall and he goes, look, you
think you're mister cute and mister this and that, and you say all these
voices, all these kids, but let me tell you something. You're gonna
end up just like your cousins. He knew he used to date my cousin.
You're gonna end up working at the Youngstown Sheeting Tube until you're sixty five.
Then you're gonna retire. Then you're gonna drink Budweiser and lose money on
the Browns or maybe the Pirates. I don't know, but you're gonna lose
money, and you're gonna be sitting there and you're and then you're going to
die. I said, oh, I guess I can go home now.
I mean, just killed myself. And I remember thinking that I'm going to
live long enough to make you eat those words and that, you know,
I've always been a negative encouragement guy, me too, you know. You
know that's that's the one thing where like, oh yeah, well, you
know, I mean, I can remember some of the early earliest meetings I
went to. It took me so many years of going to regular school because
I wanted to kill time, because I was terrified of actually saying, Okay,
I'm a professional actor. I'm going to start trying to do this.
When I finally did it, I got nothing but disrespect and negative reinforcement,
and like one casting director actually said, what makes you think you deserve to
be here? She actually like asked me that kind of question, Like,
you know, it's almost like, don't you realize you're wasting everybody's time.
If you're somebody who's never been validated professionally and that's the only feedback you get,
that's suicidal, man. I mean that's devastating because that becomes, oh,
is that what they're seeing? They're seeing a guy who really just shouldn't
even bother. But at the same time, there was that, you know,
like luckily there was that part of me. They went really really well,
I guess I'm going to have to show you. Yeah, yeah,
because we all got the bug performing bug early, because we did it and
we were successful at it. In other words, even if it was like
a junior high school play or a high school player high school. When I
did my very first play, and when I did that first play, the
feedback was through the roof positive. So even though that casting director didn't see
it, I knew there's something I'm holding in reserve here. Maybe it's not
coming out in a commercial setting. Maybe, you know, like when you're
trying to cast one life to fucking live, because that's you know, look
what you're doing, bitch. Yeah, you know, sure, go ahead,
sit up on your ivory tower and piss down on me because you know
you can, but you really like you have to use that that indignation and
that like, no, no, I know there's something in there that's worth
sharing. I've seen it, I've felt it, I've seen it happen,
and I don't know how long it's going to take, or what it's going
to take, or whether I have what it takes to stick it out.
So much of that coming up in New York, so much time with no
validation or whatsoever. You know that you got to reach back and find some
reserves that are going to get you through those times. I'm just really,
really lucky that nothing was devastating enough to make me give up. Yeah exactly
was there? Hello? Hello? Yes, And that's right. Yeah,
I've heard I've heard show business described as a battle of attrition. You know,
just the older you get, the more you kind of miss out on
things that your peers are doing, and you know they're starting families and you
know, whatever they're doing, you know, and when you're in this industry,
would you guys agree that, like you kind of the longer you hold
on to that and the more you work at it, do you think it
really does increase your chance of success. I feel like there are so many
other factors, and I have to say luck has a lot to do with
it, because one of the most heartbreaking things for me was watching some of
the people I started out with that did fold up their tent and get out
of it, and watching them make that decision like I'm not doing this anymore.
This is like banging my head against so well, I'm not doing it.
Yeah, And they all ended up taking civilian jobs. It was heartbreaking
because I saw their talent, and it's just they didn't get the breaks,
you know, things, and break their way enough so that they could be
just encouraged enough to give it another day, another week, and another month,
et cetera. And I'm really really lucky I had just those enough crumbs
to sustain me through the really really rough times men say, Okay, here's
a little bit of encouragement. Maybe I can parlay that into something. Would
you agree though, that with the statement that luck is being prepared for the
moment? Well, was it Leo Derosi opportunity or something like that? Yeah?
Who was it? I couldn't have been a baseball manager, But I
think they credit this quote to I think maybe Leo de Rosia, the manager
of the Dodgers, who said luck is the residue of design, and the
harder you work, the luckier you're going to get. Right. The more
you insist on not succumbing to being dispensed, the luckier you're going to Yet,
because you're you're kind of putting yourself in a position to get lucky by
just being there. And it may take fifty times to get lucky once,
but if you get lucky once, and you know, that could be the
key to everything. You know, It's like the other old expression. You
know, it took me twenty years to become an overnight success, you know,
Yeah, yeah, yeah, why were you doing this again? It's
too late now we're stuck exactly. Yeah, We're too late. And I'm
at this point now and I'm just looking here at Jim. You know,
I'm almost When I see my friends who are able to look back and have
all these things to be proud of, makes me very emotional because I know
what they've been through, I know what they had to I know how many
of those moments they had to go through where it was they were getting nothing
back that was encouraging and they had a supply it on their own, and
so and then I see that they are Now I'm seventy three years old,
you know, I know what a body of work feels like. You know,
like, Okay, there's a body of work. There's something you can
actually look at. If I never work again, I just you know,
yeah, there's something you can point to. And I see that with guys
like Jim and some of the other guys that hung in there and have a
tremendously prideful body of work that they can look to, and it's really moving
to me. It's really like because I understand what it took, what it
cost to get there. Yeah, yeah, it's true, well said.
It's not for the faint of heart, no, but it's like an addiction.
I'm never going to get the kind of high that I get from when
I'm on that set or in that sound booth creating bonkers, just a cartoon
character, but I'm creating you know, right right, and I'm and it's
getting it gets a response. Yeah, it plays on television or plays in
the movies and people go, yeah, I just saw that thing you did.
Man, that was fucking awesome. You know. So it's like not
just an exercise, it's not just a wank. It's like it's cause effect,
you know, it has the world. Yeah, and and that that's
another thrill of it all too. It's like to just see, like you
know, it's like a mathematical equation without the actual product getting out there and
and and get and and generating a response. It's not a full equation.
Yeah, but when it when, when it reaches that final you know that
which is the end zone. Yeah, that's true. That's a great way
of looking at it. You're welcome to use that. I'm going to write
it soon. I hope you do, because I'm never going to remember anything.
I'm saying, right, well, I'll have what he's having whatever.
Anyway, I'm with you, I'm with you, man. Yeah, that's
that's really inspiring because really, yeah, you know, Chris is an actor,
so he knows it's it's I'm reticent to say this because it's not the
first time I've said it publicly, but we all start out acting for a
set of reasons, and I think the longer you do it, the more
those reasons transform and shift into other reasons. Oh that's for sure. Yeah,
Like that's a great observation. Actually, the reason why I say that
is because when I first discovered acting, it was the antidote to being me.
Like being me I was disastrous. I was like a schmuck. I
was a putts. I didn't fit anywhere. I you know, I you
know, I had tremendously low esteem. But I played a character and I
had a shot at getting the character right, even though everything else in my
life was wrong. So it was pure therapy. It was like walking into
somebody else's shoes, which was kind of like a relief from the drudgery of
being me. And it was all so like a high. It's like,
this is as close as I'm going to get to a human that's sort of
bordering on perfect. Even though it's an illusion, it's like a character.
I'm playing it and then I go home at night and it's over. You
know, So what started out as a tremendously therapeutic endeavor was transforming myself into
something that wasn't me. Over the course of time, as you get more
and more comfortable with yourself, but you still find like, I'm still getting
a thrill out of acting, then you have to start exploring, like why
do I still dig it? And I'm at this point now where I feel
as though the amount of admiration that we all receive as part of the storytelling
community from people who really do have shitty lives but who get to watch something
beautifully well performed and they see humanity there, and they see suffering there that's
enacted in a beautiful way. But they get to see that they're not the
first people to feel lonely. They're not the first people to feel like losers.
They're not the first people to feel like they're in an insurmountable situation.
They don't know how they're going to get out of it, but they watch
the hero journey in a movie or something like that, and it gives them
hope. So what we're doing is we're providing humanity with as noble an expression
of the beauty of what it is to be human as there is. And
if that sounds corny, I'm sorry. I'm not going to apologize, but
that's truly like. That's what sustains me now is that I realize like I'm
in a very very exclusive, wonderful club where I get to work in some
kind of an incredible world that some amazing writer has invented with amazing humanity all
over the place, and I get to be one of the colors on the
painting by playing this one character. And if we do it successfully, and
we do it well and it gets lucky enough to get marketed properly and enough
people see it and it affects them, then I'm performing as useful a service
as one can. Because the collective consciousness is our only hope at rising to
the prayer of all men are created equal and endowed by their creator with life,
liberty in the pursuit of happiness. That's what we're doing in our endeavor
to tell stories and show humanity in all of its many, many different highs
and lows. We are participating in an exercise of the collective consciousness, which
is as valuable to somebody in Kenya as it is to somebody in Alabama because
it resonates on the same human level. And I didn't really sorry, I
didn't expect to go there, but that was pretty pretty great. That's wonderful.
That's sentiment. Yeah, so it really is. I want to sing
Kumbayan now, go ahead, okay, by I don't even know what that
means, but I know I meant that somebody said anything that was really really
touching and really heartfelt and really well thought, well considered. Thank you.
That's pretty awesome pleasure. Yeah, that good stuff. I'm very very lucky,
dude. Yeah, well, I think that's one of the keys keys
to happiness is gratitude. You know, if you ever there's no way to
run into somebody going well, I should have got that job. I mean
cheese now now I'm working for the asshole or took my job and blah blah
blah. Well, you're not going to be very happy because you're not grate.
You should be grateful for having that job and then be good enough that
when this guy gets promoted, you'll get his job. You know, it's
it's all perspective. Perspective is our friend, yeah, or in a can
be our enemy. There's a million cliches that come to mind, but it's
it's true. Now we're being invaded. Yeah, there's the Hollywood biker gang.
Yes, is this friends of yours? Yeah? Yeah, that's my
ride right off. Good night everybody. Obviously they're a little early lily.
Those are the Sons of Sunset. Yeah the sun Where was that film?
Now? And now I'm my new club is the Sons of Arthritis. I
think I'm joining that guy I saw somebody with with the leather the leather cut,
you know, the motorcycle clubs. Guys were said Sons of Arthritis.
So it wasn't original, guys, throwing myself under the bus, but yes,
Sons of Anarchy was supposed to take place up in northern Cali, up
around the Bay Area, but we shot it all here. Oh that's the
miracle of of television. Yes it is. And it looked like Canada,
which was which was really amazingly shy. Wrap your mind around that one.
Yeah, man, we managed to pull that off. Well that's beautiful.
No, but yeah it was a great experience and I got to sleep in
my own beds, so yeah, when that counts, it sure does that
really counts? Did you guys have any idea going into it, how big
of a show that was going to be. No. No, In fact,
I on the other side of the coin from all that Kumbai eye and
I was just doing them a second ago. Is that I'm also completely wired
for failure because you too, huh yeah, no, because of security and
good at failing. By the way, I can no, no, no,
you have no idea. If you look at if you look at MIAMGB,
this like over two hundred entries, and only three or four of them
were successful. But those three or four of them were what people remember,
so but they didn't see the other two hundred and thirty two that really stunk
out the joint. And it wasn't as if you went into any of those
thinking you were going to stink out the joint. It just that's the way
it went. Because there's just so many ways amazing things have to happen in
order for something to be really really good and perfect and break through and be
regarded as as as a classic or there's a lot of moving parts successful.
And the longer you do this, the more you realize how rare that is.
And so what I do now is I just expect everything to fail.
One of the great realizations I made in order to protect my thin skin is
like, no expectations, no disappointments, and if you expect nothing, you're
never going to be disappointed because if something good does happen, then it's a
complete pleasant surprise. So to answer your question, no, I mean I
went into Sons of Anarchy thinking this is this is going to be one and
done. You know, we're gonna we're We're lucky. We're lucky they got
that far. This is too special, it's too weird, it's too unlike
anything anybody's ever seen before. And you know, Hollywood is not known for
breakthrough you know, original content, especially these days. So uh yeah,
that's and then there was so much violence and so much bloodshed towards the middle
of season one that people wanted more. And that's when I realized that people
wanted more. Yeah, that's when I realized, Okay, that's just that's
that's the function we serve. Yeah, there you go, not not a
normal men of mayhem. Well, you know, you hope for the best,
you expect the worst, and you take what comes exactly. And you
know, when you when you really really do have no expectations or you or
you think this is never going to fly when it doesn't. You know,
you're you're just you're good. Yeah, you were there, Yeah, you
were you beating you know, and we're all doing the best we can.
But you know, there's just too many other factors that, yeah, need
to go right in order for things to resonate. Now, this is a
funky question because I've had and I remember it because I've been asked any number
of times. But was there something you really, really really wanted and then
they gave it away somebody else? Yeah, I'm pretty sure that there were.
Yeah. I blocked all that out though, you too, Yeah,
Wow, Okay, that's my answer. Yeah, because you got to suggest
there has to be Yes, I was doing. Did we mentioned this earlier?
We talked about this prior to when we came on the air. The
last show I did on stage was I came in and replaced Stephen Lang in
a Few Good Men on Broadway, And while I was performing it, that
show was such a huge success that Hollywood started coming to call. So while
I was on stage, Rob Reiner came one night to see it, and
then a couple of nights later Rob came with Tom Cruise to see it Wow.
And then the rumor started flying Hollywood is going to make the movie.
Rob Briner is going to direct it. Tom Cruise is going to star in
it. And I wrote Rob Ryner a letter saying, well, I know
you saw me play Colonel Jessup and you know, and this thing and you
know this, this, this piece of material means so much to me,
and you know, blah blah blah, and I know my odds are crazy,
you know, but I'm just I just want to put it out there,
you know, if there's any way you could consider me for this role.
And it went to Jack Nicholson and I wrote another note to Rob and
I said, I get it, man, he needs the work so much
more than I do. But that was I mean, you know, I
finally remembered one that you know, I kind of want and yeah, yeah,
yeah yeah and fell by the wayside. Yeah. And also anything that
anything in the world that you see Josh Brolin in should have gone to me.
Okay, he's my he's my nemesis these days. But I'm losing to
to better people than I ever thought I would. Like, you know,
I'm losing the better people than I ever thought I would did you audition for
Thanoms. Well, there was a thing that went on, you know,
like on social media for what's the character in Deadpool that got introduced in the
second dead I know who you're talking about. Yeah, justin I can't remember.
It went to Josh, but yeah, he wasn't even in the fucking
survey. Yeah really, you know, me and and about five other people
in the survey. And you know, I got one hundred and fifty times
more votes than anybody else because the cable. It was a roll of cable.
Cable, that's cable. Yeah, with the bionic Josh Broland. Are
you kidding me? Yeah? Enough when you imagine my cable. I mean,
no disrespect, Josh. If you're listening to this podcast, which I
know you are, that's right. You're fulling no one. You're fooling no
one. Yeah, and that's good stuff. Whatever it is. I said
it, I said it, God damn it. I'm sticking to it.
That's right. Are you on the on the circuit nowadays? Are you you
got a lot lined up right? Well? As we as we speak,
we're still on strike. Yes, but but I'm always I produce a lot,
and I always have little projects that I'm trying to push up the mountain,
whether we're striking or not. So yeah, I stay very, very
busy promoting some of my own ideas and some of the things that i'd love
to see get made. And I've been really really lucky over the last few
years, you know, just a lot of work coming my way. Even
during the strike, some of these independent films of which I do a lot,
have been green lit because they've signed this interim agreement which allows for you,
you're if SAG approves, you're allowed to make a picture on this independent
This interim agreement kind of a reality. So I made a couple of those
during the strike. So you know, I'm doing fine, keeping my head
above water and waiting for better days ahead, which I think are right around
the corner. I have a question for you about how boy, how many
hours of makeup was that process? So it was four hours of makeup every
day except for the days where I was shirtless, and then that was six
hours, jeez. And it was one hour to get cleaned up, only
one hour to get cleaned up. Yeah, that's because I had a lot
of drinking to do, so I made them. Sometimes I just left the
gig with the makeup on. Yeah, I went to h the bar as
Hellboy the runner. Oh hi, run, I got really good service.
Yeah, I bet you did really good service. Oh God, you wouldn't
like me when I'm mad. You don't. You don't want to ignore brought
the gun and everything. Jesus. Yeah, that was a real That was
a high watermark for you, I would think. Because I saw it,
I was like, oh, hell yes, I mean that's that's every now
and then they get it right. And that's was perfect casting, perfect timing,
perfect care I mean perfect that. You were amazing. Thank you.
I thought it was the damn thing. So lucky to have been in the
very first film of this young Mexican director named Giamo del Toro. He's been
struggling through a little, yeah, tiny, little vampire movie that he made
when he was twenty six years old in Mexico City, and they called Kronos.
Some years later, he said, I want to do this comic a
character called Hellboy, and you're like, you're the one I want. And
it took him seven years to get the movie financed with me in it,
because I wasn't bankable or I wasn't considered you know, name of the title,
especially the star of a comic book franchise. And he just spent seven
years saying, sorry, I won't make it with him. I won't make
it with him. I won't make it with him. This is what I
want. And so I was the recipient of something that I've never seen before.
And I don't think an said anything I'll ever see again. It's like
one guy's so dogged determination to make it his way. He had a kind
of a vision of what the kind of tone of the character needed to be.
He was conceiving a superhero who was a complete under retiever of slob schmuck
who liked to watch Marx Brothers movies and play with cats and eat pizza.
And let's face it, when you narrow it down to that, there is
nobody better than me. There you have it. And he knew it got
you, he got he fought for it, but he got it done after
seven years. Yeah. Wow, that that. I didn't have no idea,
and it wasn't background. It was a game changer, just you know
it, Like I would think. Yeah, as hard as it was to
get the guys who write the checks to wrap their brain around me playing that
role, that's his dramatic reaction as one guy. You know, when it
came out and the public got to see it, So it was phenomenal opportunity.
Would you say that that's like among your biggest or the biggest success commercial
success or yeah, commercial. I mean that that and Sons were there were
the two biggest commercial successes and the ones that were most mainstream. A lot
of wonderfully peripheral uh artsy fartsy successes along the way, but nothing that hasn'tated
enough to be game changes. Whereas hell Boy was on a huge stage.
You know, it was a comic book franchise, and Giamo had already established
himself as that by that point, as being a force of nature. So
I got all of the toys that came Yeah, yeah, boy, that's
not bad. Yeah luck Yeah, I mean have a friend like that.
Well, I remember Quest for Fire right and uh in the Name of the
Name of the Rose, Name of the Rose. He had a lot of
interesting characters. That's so cool. I mean your your your resume is like,
oh that was so cool. Oh I remember that. Oh that one
was really Oh he was really good in this That's what it feels like when
you look down to your you know, it's that's good stuff. Thank you
man. Yeah, what would you say, is your your favorite project that
you've ever worked on? And again, not not wanting to sound disingenuous,
but what Jim was saying, like, for an actor to have played so
many characters that were like really like mind blowingly interesting and cool, it's impossible
to pick one. I would say. There was a period there from twenty
thirteen to twenty eighteen where I had my own production company and I was producing
my own projects, and the very first project that came across our desk was
called Asher. It was a story of an Israeli assassin living in New York
just killing people you don't even know why or who. And that was really
hard to get made, and I crawled on our bellies to get it made
and finally lost a lot of money. You know, she was supposed to
start shooting it, how to get canceled. So finally made that And that
was the biggest sense of accomplishment I've ever had, because that was, against
all odds, a tiny movie. To this day, no one has seen
it. So I'm not telling you it's my favorite because it was a success.
Because it wasn't. No one has seen it. No one has seen
it, like it hasn't been I've seen it released or I've seen and I
know what went into getting it finally fucking done. But it was released,
right, you mean you're like exaggerating then nobody. Yeah, you know,
it was sort of released, but it really wasn't. These little distribution companies
they give you no money, not even close to what you spent on the
picture, and they don't do any advertising, so no one knew it it
even existed, right, and they take their cut and that's it. Yeah,
it's the nature of the beast show business. Yeah, well it's one
of those learning experiences. Yeah, like the School of Hard Knocks. Yeah,
where you do all of your really important learning death. Do you mind
telling that story of how you came to be on a role on Archer again?
Can you tell that for the audience? So? Yeah, I was
on a show, The Sons of Anarchy, was on FX and FX like
all the networks. There's a thing in Hollywood called Critics Week where the rics
come out and they take every network and they have all the stars of all
the networks and they have press conferences and stuff, and then you know,
network throws a big party. So FX through this party at the Ritz Carlton
and Pasadena, and there were thousands of people, their critics and directors and
producers and stars and you know. And at the end of the night,
I was at the last table. Everybody had got home. It was like
quarter to two in the morning, and I'm sitting at this table. I
don't even know who I'm sitting with. I'm drunk out of my mind.
And I said to this one guy said, so, what do you do?
He says, well, I got this new show on FX. It's
an animated series. And I go animated series on FX. He goes,
yeah, yeah, it's kind of it's kind of cool. It's kind of
like an adult animated series. It's the first one that's ever going to be
on the network. And I said, well, I don't know if you
realize this, but I'm the premiere voice actor in America, obviously hoping they'd
never heard of Jim Cummings. Yeah, And the guy said, oh,
really you are. I said, yep, number one. He goes,
wow, that's really good to know. And two weeks later I got a
call for my voice OVERGIN. She said, well, you at a party
with a guy from Archer because he just he's offering you this role he wrote,
playing a gay Cuban spy, and I knew that. He was like,
let's find out exactly how premiere you are, because you're going to now
play a gay Cuban spy. And I go, yeah, I don't have
that in me. That's not part of my my you know, my my
repertoire. For the right amount of money, he tested me and we ended
up having a great time, and then they invited the character back a couple
of times after that, so it was I fooled them. I fooled them
again. That's wonderful. Gosh, I knew I should have never turned that
role down, damn it. Apparently it was well received. Well that's amazing.
Yeah, that's great. So what do you think now? Man?
What's do we have anything on the books that we can see you in?
I think I've asked a variation of this. A couple of things that I
was really looking forward to have come out during the strike, one of which
I was like, the title character. But I am not allowed to promote
anything, right, right, Okay, So the movie came and went.
I wasn't able to even share with anybody that I was in it, you
know publicly. Yeah, but what do I have coming up? I have
another movie, big movie with Matt Damon and Casey Affleck coming up, which
I'm also not allowed to promote. So what was it like working with me?
I can't tell the name of it was omenal guy. Yeah, terrific
guy, as nice as the day is long, man and fun and smart.
Yeah, and really cool to do. He seems really dedicated to his
craft, like a he loves being an actor, he loves other actors,
and he loves like shooting the ship like we're doing here. I mean,
he could just do that with you, you know, hours and hours and
hours on it. Yeah. Oh man, I thank you enough for coming
here and doing this. Hey. Thanks, this has been a thrill bro,
hanging with you and reminiscing and and we're still here and we're still here.
Yeah, this has been great. Thank you so much for Let me
give me let me ask one more question before we before we wrap things up.
I guess I guess we're not saying goodbye. Well, I know there's
always one guy I'm calling it off. That's right, one guy. I
just want to know what Charlie. Charlie Huntum is like as a co star,
a good guy. Yeah, yeah, I absolutely love the guys from
that show. Yeah, and Charlie and I were born four days and thirty
years apart. As much as I believe in that astrology bullshit, you know,
when I met him, I saw my younger self, you know,
a guy who was full of idealism and righteous indignation about things and stuff,
and so I kind of always took him on as my kid brother. Rightful,
beautiful guy, beautiful guy. God bless you, buddy, Thank you
so much. I'll bless you. Jim