The Best of The Dan Patrick Show

00:00:00
Speaker 1: You are listening to the Dan Patrick Show on Fox Sports Radio. Let me bring in Ben Pickman.

00:00:06
Speaker 2: He is covering the situation WNBA reporter for The Athletic. Before I get to you, Ben, I want to play Nofisia Callier had. Now, this is just a portion of what she had to say about the WNBA commissioner, Kathy Engelbert at.

00:00:23
Speaker 3: Unrivaled this past February. I sat a across from Kathy and asked how she planned to address the officiating issues in our league. Her response was, will only the losers complain about the refs? I also asked how she planned to fix the fact that players like Caitlin Angel and Page, who are clearly driving massive revenue for the league, are making so little for their first four years. Her response was, Caitlyn should be grateful she makes sixty million off the court, because without the platform that the WBA gives her, she wouldn't make anything. And in that same conversation, she told me players should be on their knees thanking their lucky stars for the media.

00:00:57
Speaker 4: Righte steal that I got them?

00:00:59
Speaker 5: Well, well, well, Ben pick it up from there.

00:01:03
Speaker 6: Yeah, you could have picked any number of sound bites I mean, think about any other player in any other sport doing what Nefisa Collier did. I mean, this is a potentially seminal moment in WNBA history. I just want to know how your production crew Dan decided on those clips and not the clip of you know, Nafisa Collier's saying that right now, the WNBA has the worst leadership in the world. I mean, this was four minutes of just going scorched earth and frankly telling a lot of things that seemingly a lot of players, a lot of executives, a lot of people around the league team wise.

00:01:34
Speaker 5: Tend to agree with. Do you agree with her?

00:01:37
Speaker 6: I mean, I think there's certainly a lot of valid criticism in what she said. I'm not going to go so far to say that Kathy Engelbert is part of the worst leadership in the world, but I think a lot of what she said is a lot of what you know, someone like me here is in private. I mean, my phone was blowing up Tuesday from you know, the moment that Nafisa Collier's comments finished, with a lot of people really commending her for saying the quiet part out loud, and I Fisakllier did say this in her own comments that you know, I'm not going to keep things private anymore. She's calling for accountability, transparency, not just on officiating but on broader league wide matters too.

00:02:13
Speaker 2: But they have added five teams. I mean, you know that let's look at both sides here, because the commissioner has done some good things, but this is negotiations and that's where it's a war, and this is one of the most This might be the most important moment in WNBA history as we move forward.

00:02:31
Speaker 6: Yeah, it's important to call that out because since Kathy Engelbert has been the commissioner, it's around six years now. At this point, a lot has changed in the WNBA. I mean, Kathy Engelbert used to say that the WNBA was in an existential moment.

00:02:44
Speaker 5: That was the word that she used.

00:02:46
Speaker 6: In twenty twenty there was a potential that if they didn't play a bubble season, would the league even exist? And so a lot has changed since then. Just look at recent years. A fifty million dollar expansion fee for the Golden State Valkyries in Septembumber twenty twenty three, that was two fifty million this summer. I mean, that is crazy growth. The New York Liberty a four hundred and fifty million dollar valuation this summer. That is all under Kathy Engelbert's watch. But what Nafisa Kalier is also saying is the players are really driving that. I mean, that is what we heard or what you can hear when she retells that story involving Caitlyn Clark, Like that is a clear story of hitting the players against management. And yes, this is a really intense negotiation. And you know these comments are not going to do anything to put less fuel on the fire of anything. It's going to explode from here on out.

00:03:34
Speaker 2: Caitlin Clark's WNBA salary was seventy eight thousand. Yeah, so it's slotted that she's going to make seventy eight thousand. Yes, she makes all that money off the court. But should Caitlin Clark be grateful that she makes sixteen million dollars off the court? According to the commissioner through Nafisia Collier, Yeah.

00:03:56
Speaker 6: I mean we should say. The commissioner said she was disheartened by the characterization of those comments, and this was an a Fisa Collier relaying them. But I mean, think about that kind of tactical move or that decision to include Caitlin Clark in this conversation, and we should say Nefisa Callier and Kitlin Clark they shared the same agent, right, So I don't think it's a coincidence that both of those players, or that Caitlin Clark's name rather was mentioned in this four and a half minute statement by Nafisa Kalier, like there is a knowledge know how going on there. Caitlin Clark obviously super super important to the league. And one of the questions that you know, I was fielding yesterday was yes, Kathy Engelbert is you know, has been the commissioner over this period of growth. But if you look at the next fifteen years of the league, Dan, who is more important to the health the growth of the league? Kathy Engelbert if she's around that long, or Kitlyn Clark. I think the answer there is is pretty clear.

00:04:47
Speaker 2: Well, does Caitlin Clark need the WNBA more than the WNBA needs Caitlyn Clark.

00:04:52
Speaker 6: I mean that is another big question. I feel like you could write books and articles and fund articles. Certainly Caitlin Clark is worth you know, millions, if not. You know, I did a story earlier this season, she could be worked up to a billion dollars. Some people told me two women's sports more generally, and so yeah, I mean, Caitlin Clark's certainly a big driver in the broader WNBA revenue conversation, the change of the business right.

00:05:16
Speaker 2: And the commissioner responded, I'm not going to read the whole statement, but she was complimentary to Nofisia Collier, who's a very bright woman. You know, started the unrivaled league. It's a side league, not a competing league. But where does this go from here?

00:05:32
Speaker 5: Where does it go? That is a great question.

00:05:34
Speaker 6: I mean, as you mentioned, the league and the players are in this contentious CBA negotiation. The deal currently expires October thirty. First, we'll see if they reach an extension or if you know, there is a work stoppage, whether it is just in the off season or down the line. May twenty twenty six is when the twenty twenty sixth season would begin, So we will see where things go. I think the tensions have only heightened from here on that. How could they not knowing that a FISA klier said what she said, knowing that so many players have supported her, knowing that now there's so many more eyeballs on the WNBA and what is going on because of her comments like that is what is so fascinating about this really remarkable, remarkable for a minute statement than a FISA Collier gave on Tuesday.

00:06:17
Speaker 2: There's only a certain piece of the pie available here, Ben that I know. We look at leagues and we go they should be paid more. Well, this it comes down to math. It's just it's that amount of money that's available. We split it up and that's what everybody is going to share it. Now you're adding five new franchises, so now that piece of the pie gets carved up a little bit more. And they did sign what eleven year, two billion dollar, two point two billion dollar TV deal. There's a lot of progress here. I'm just I worry. I thought that they tripped themselves up with the Caitlin Clark situation. Nobody knew how to deal with her. Officials didn't be, you know, the opposite position other players.

00:07:01
Speaker 5: They weren't all in on her.

00:07:02
Speaker 2: Hey, we've got Diana Tarazzi and all the people who started the league. I still don't know if they know how to handle Caitlin Clark moving forward, because she is different than anybody else in the sport.

00:07:17
Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean, she definitely is. But I want to go back to your point on splitting the pie because I think it's really important here because what makes the WNBA so unique in this context is that also it is owned by the NBA that Kathy Engelbert reports up to Adam Silver, Right, So there are other stakeholders here other than just WNBA owners who are important in this conversation.

00:07:40
Speaker 1: Right.

00:07:40
Speaker 6: So it's not just what do the owners of the WNBA think, because even that phrase owners of the WNBA is a really muddled phrase.

00:07:49
Speaker 7: Right.

00:07:49
Speaker 6: You have a number of franchises that are owned by the same people that also own NBA teams. Forty two percent of the league is owned by the NBA, for instance, forty two percent is owned by WNBA owners. But in that forty two percent, well, there's some people who are in both pots here, right, and then there is another pot of sixteen that also includes some people who are in both of those other pots. That is what makes the WNBA's situation about how to proceed, whether it relates to Kathy Engelbert and her job status, whether it relates to the CBA. That's part of what makes it so tricky, so unique is there are so many stakeholders in this conversation that the league is in a really tough spot, and that's why we're in this very complicated mess that we are in.

00:08:32
Speaker 2: ESPN reported over the weekend that WNBA data doesn't show a correlation between recent playoff injuries and missed calls by officials. Nafisia Collier, one of the great players in the game, called the claim quote an insult to my intelligence, honestly. Caller also asked the commissioner about how the league planned to address officiating, and according to Collier, the commissioner said, only the losers complain about the reps.

00:09:02
Speaker 7: Also strong, Yeah, that's wrong.

00:09:05
Speaker 2: Yes, but not correct because some of the biggest complainers in the history of the NBA, or Michael Jordan and Larry Bird and great players complain about officiating as well, not losers.

00:09:17
Speaker 5: Yeah, exactly.

00:09:18
Speaker 6: And I think one of the things that is so interesting or that everyone is tracking is these claims or these calls about officiating.

00:09:25
Speaker 5: They're not new, right.

00:09:26
Speaker 6: I wrote a story two years ago at the start of the WNBA Finals all about coaches and executives and players talking about inconsistent officiating, and going back to that point that I was just making on NBA and WNBA ownership, Several people around the league, coaches, executives, they point to high yearly turnover that multiple WNB officials move out of the league and into the NBA literally from twenty eighteen to twenty twenty two. In NBA official press releases, they would use the word promotes as it relates to people moving from the WNBA, that is officials, to the NBA. Right, and so there are questions again systemic questions about how much are officials paid, how are they trained, how are they reviewed?

00:10:07
Speaker 2: But is it slanted ben they are they calling different? Are they seeing something different for certain players and not others? Are they just not great at their jobs?

00:10:18
Speaker 6: I mean it's hard for me, the layperson to say, you know, how correct or incorrect is an official's assessment of it.

00:10:26
Speaker 2: But they do grade them. They get graded, just like NBA officials. I don't know if they're not calling enough for Kaitlyn Clark or they're calling too much for it, does she get preferential? I mean it feels like everything circles back to Caitlin Clark.

00:10:38
Speaker 6: I mean I think actually on this officiating conversation though, Dan, like, this is a conversation that has been going on for a number of years. I think Caitlyn Clark, like so many other topics, her presence in the league has brought more eyeballs to the topic of officiating. But you talk to people like, these frustrations are frustrations that have been held for a number of years the league. As you're saying and you're asking, they're saying that, you know, our officials are excellent, that they gray out incredibly well, that we don't have the same kind of problem that so many people say. But what Nafisa Collier and what others have said is, you know, the first step in what fixing a problem is acknowledging you have a problem in the first place. Like that was another, you know, clear sentiment that she tried to voice throughout her opening statement at her exit interview.

00:11:22
Speaker 5: Great stuff, Ben, thanks for joining us, we'll be reading.

00:11:25
Speaker 6: Thanks at for having me.

00:11:26
Speaker 5: That's Ben Pickman, wmba reporter for The Athletic.

00:11:30
Speaker 1: Be sure to catch the live edition of The Dan Patrick Show weekdays at nine am Eastern six am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and the iHeartRadio app.

00:11:40
Speaker 8: Hey, this is Jason McIntyre. Join me every weekday morning on my podcast, Straight Fire with Jason McIntyre. This isn't your typical sports pod pushing the same tired narratives down your throat every day. Straight Fire gives you honest opinions on all the biggest sports headlines, accurate stats to help you win big at the sportsbook, and all the best guests. Do yourself a favor and listen to Straight Fire with Jason McIntyre on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

00:12:12
Speaker 2: Mark Schlereth, NFL and Fox analyst. He won three Super Bowls with the Broncos and he called the Patriots Panthers game in Week four and guess what as a reward he gets the Dolphins in the Panthers coming up this weekend at one o'clock Sunday on Fox.

00:12:30
Speaker 5: Mark joins us on the program.

00:12:32
Speaker 2: You know you've gotten to that grumpy old man age where you can say what you want to. So here's your platform. What's the topic today that is really bothering you.

00:12:44
Speaker 7: Overtime? Like listen to fans. You guys did it?

00:12:48
Speaker 9: You guys asked for this, right forty to forty game, we don't get a winner, we don't get a victory.

00:12:53
Speaker 7: We don't get victory. What was wrong with sudden death? There was nothing wrong with sudden debts, sudden depth. It's it's sudden and it's death. You're over.

00:13:02
Speaker 9: Like that makes sense to me. Playing to a forty to forty tie makes zero sense to me. And by the way, I've sat in a bunch of meetings twelve years I played this league.

00:13:11
Speaker 7: I sat in meetings, I heard it every week. Hey, it's three things of the game.

00:13:14
Speaker 9: It's special teams, it's offense, and it's defense. Your defense had an opportunity to stop the opponent's quarterback. But no, you know what happened. Josh Allen didn't get the ball. And that's not fair and we want to be fair. And it's not fair. Like did your parenting your parents? Did they ever parent you? Did they ever say to you, hey, man, life ain't fair. Did you not get parented?

00:13:39
Speaker 7: And now this is what we have to live with ties. I hate it, Dan, and I hate it.

00:13:44
Speaker 2: Okay, if you're in a game and you get to overtime and you lose in sudden death, like would you are you better at accepting a loss in sudden death overtime than a tie in overtime.

00:13:59
Speaker 9: I'm good with whatever, because we had sixty minutes to win this football game, and we didn't get it done in sixty minutes. And I'll deal with the consequences of that. I just I hate playing an extra ten minutes and then nothing is sold, nothing is satisfied to me, and then so I just it just bothers me. The whole thing bothers me. And the thing that bothers me is the way the NFL operates. Right, we listen to a bunch of people whine about things right and so and then, and most of the people that whind don't even like the game, Like why do we as a league, why do we basically cowtow to people who.

00:14:39
Speaker 7: Don't even like our game? Screw them.

00:14:41
Speaker 9: It's the greatest game in the world. If you don't like it, tough, I don't care. So that part of that part, to me, I don't understand. I mean, I guess I understand it. You're trying to get more and more people involved in the game, and I get that part of it, but I just I don't like to make excuses for it. And I don't like people who don't like our game, who complained about it that we try to satisfy.

00:15:04
Speaker 7: I like, screw those people.

00:15:06
Speaker 2: Are you more bothered by overtime or the Broncos uniforms that they trotted out on Monday Night?

00:15:13
Speaker 9: I like, hey, man, I'm old school, Like I liked Pat Patriot, Like did you see the Patriots in the game against Pittsburgh, you know, with the old pat Patriot on the helmet and that I think.

00:15:23
Speaker 7: I love that.

00:15:24
Speaker 9: I love the old school. I wish they'd go back to that Bronco uniform would.

00:15:28
Speaker 7: Be you know, the horse breathing fire out of snows, Like.

00:15:31
Speaker 9: I wish they would go back to all that stuff because I think those uniforms are just absolutely classic.

00:15:37
Speaker 7: They're awesome. And yeah, they all blues.

00:15:40
Speaker 9: I could do without the all blues, but I hate it mostly because when we went to all blues when I played for the Broncos. One, the pants for whatever reason, the pants were super tight, Like I didn't like that. And two two you look like a upa lumpa like you just look like a big, giantly blueberry, and.

00:16:01
Speaker 7: Uh, I was concientious. Hey, I looked at my other offensive liga. Does this uniform make me look sad?

00:16:07
Speaker 9: You know.

00:16:10
Speaker 2: We're talking to Mark Schlareth. You will find him an NFL Fox analyst. Panthers Patriots Week four and now you've got the Dolphins and the Panthers.

00:16:21
Speaker 5: Wow.

00:16:21
Speaker 9: Turns it turns out that I am the official broadcaster of the NFC South. I don't know who's cheery as I pissed in to get the Panthers every weekend.

00:16:30
Speaker 5: They are, Uh they are.

00:16:31
Speaker 9: Don't tell anybody I said that they are a bad football team.

00:16:34
Speaker 2: Okay, I saw this headline and I knew you were going to call the game. H Bryce Young is not a bust? The Panthers are?

00:16:44
Speaker 5: Is that? Is that a fair headline?

00:16:48
Speaker 7: Well? I think so. You know we put up in the broadcast end of the day.

00:16:50
Speaker 9: I mean they had both Baker Mayfield and Sam Darnold in their organization and said see you and you know what, you get some good coaching. Sam Donald actually turns down this is Sam Donald's a great story, because Sam, they're both great stories. Sam Donald turns down other opportunities to potentially go in and be a starter, and he decides, I'm going to go to San Francisco and get coached by Kyle Shanahan and.

00:17:17
Speaker 7: Learn how to play NFL football. That's what happened.

00:17:19
Speaker 9: And then he goes to Minnesota and Kyle Shannan told me he goes. Listen, he gets to the Jets, right, bad organization gets to the Jets and they try to put him in the Peyton Manning offense. He goes, there's one guy they can run the Peyton Manning offense. That's Peyton Manning, right, So he fails there. Then he goes to Matt Rule in the Carolina Panthers and they're running some college So the first time that this guy has ever gotten into a true progression offense in reality is in San Francisco, and so he learned basically NFL football. He's year four in the league and at one point, Baker Mayfield, we put a picture of a couple of a different broadcasts at Tampa broadcast I did last year where he is actually a scout team defensive end for the Carolina Panthers and they didn't like they cut him. And then he signs on in with the Rams and plays there for a few weeks as that. I think it was a Christmas Day game against the Broncos where he hangs fifty on them after being in the facility for three days, and and you know he goes on to play great football.

00:18:19
Speaker 7: So I don't know what Bryce Young is yet.

00:18:22
Speaker 9: I think he's I mean, he's small, he's diminutive, but you know he gonna operate an offense. And I've seen growth because I'm because i'm the official broadcast of the Carolina Panthers, I've seen some growth.

00:18:34
Speaker 7: But but Dan, like I think.

00:18:37
Speaker 9: The wide receivers, I think wide receivers are a completely dependent position.

00:18:41
Speaker 7: They're they're like children.

00:18:42
Speaker 9: One they're dependent, right, ten other guys had to do their job for them to sniff a football, and then you know they're they're like toddlers. They whine and they cry and they bitch a lot if they don't get fed.

00:18:53
Speaker 7: Like that's who wide receivers are. They're just like toddlers.

00:18:56
Speaker 9: And so ultimately, ultimately, there is not very much talent on this football team. And so if you're a great quarterback, you take you know, fair to midland wide receivers and you can create a great offense around that.

00:19:13
Speaker 7: If you're a.

00:19:14
Speaker 9: Quarterback trying to figure it out, you've got to surround that guy with some opportunity, some people who can actually excel get opening one on one and going into last week, Tedoro McMillan had two hundred and sixteen yards receiving. All the other wide receivers combined had a one hundred and forty one through three games. It's just they just don't I mean, they're just not very good that way, that talent wise. So again, I just don't know. Do I think he's a franchise quarterback. No, But do I think you can win with Bryce Young if you put enough people around him, in pieces around him, I think you probably could help me understand the Eagles situation.

00:19:48
Speaker 2: It feels like every week there's something. Every week there's something. You know, we started out with spitgate with Jalen Carter to start the year. Now you know, you got aj Brown with a cryptic tweet that he puts out and then I mean, they don't throw the ball a lot, but if they when they do throw it, I think he's targeted a little over thirty percent of the time. So they're good numbers. You're winning, you're undefeated, you won the Super Bowl. Help me understand the Philadelphia Eagles.

00:20:20
Speaker 7: I can't. I don't understand. I don't come from that world.

00:20:25
Speaker 9: I don't come from that world where I'm not getting enough shine.

00:20:28
Speaker 7: So I'm upset.

00:20:30
Speaker 9: I come from the offensive line world, the world of offensive line, and that's a you know, we're a secret mushroom society.

00:20:36
Speaker 7: Nobody knows what the hell we're doing. And if we have a great game, we're just to throw away tagline.

00:20:42
Speaker 9: You know, I mean, a guy who rushes for two hundred yards, you got to think the big fellow's up front. Now let's talk about me. It was awesome, you know. I mean, that's that's the way it works, right. You give up, man, I can whip your ass sixty five plays in a row. Dan, I give up one sack. I'm a piece of garbage and you go to the Pro Bowl. That's the world I come from. And so I don't underst and this world of we're winning, but I'm not getting to touch the ball enough. So I'm going to pout or send cryptic tweets or be upset that world. I don't understand that world. And I mean, ultimately, it is about winning. And I know that you want to compete, and I know that you want you know, you want to win but you know, it's amazing what you can do as an organization, whether it's football or any organization, it's amazing what you can accomplish when no one cares who gets the credit. And that's the world I come from. So it's probably why I hate wide receivers with the white hot intensity of a thousand suns.

00:21:38
Speaker 7: So it's you.

00:21:40
Speaker 9: I'm probably not the right guy to ask because I just think. I just think it's selfish and it bothers me, and you know, and I'm.

00:21:48
Speaker 7: Grumpy and I've got on black sox. So that's where I live right now.

00:21:53
Speaker 2: How frustrating was it or is it for an offensive lineman to do your job for a couple of seconds and then all of a sudden you turn around and your quarterbacks trying to make something happen, and then you guys are going to get blamed for a sack?

00:22:08
Speaker 7: Yeah, well I will.

00:22:10
Speaker 9: I will tell you that sacks are more of a quarterback driven and a coaching driven statistic than they are on offensive line static in today's NFL with all the I mean, we didn't even have a bubble screen when I was playing that that didn't even exist. And you know, and you throw it behind line of scrimmage and out to the sidelines so much, and there's so much quick game. You really if you boil it down, Dan, you say, hey man, we throw it thirty five times. You boil it down thirty five times, you've got five. Let's call it. I'm just gonna make the math easy because I'm not that smart. We're gonna go five quick balls, like five three step drops, right, So now you're down to thirty. Right, We're gonna do five kind of bubble screens. So now I'm down to twenty five. We're gonna do five, you know, swing passes out to the running backs, all right, So now I'm down to to twenty. Now we're going to do a five to five step drop, but five step drop with no hitch. So it's the ball is out right now. Now I'm down to fifteen, you know, and so I look at that. How about the boot keep play action game. We're gonna do five of those, right, So now I'm down.

00:23:15
Speaker 7: To let's let's call it. I'll whittle it down, you know, give or take a few.

00:23:19
Speaker 9: I'll whittle it down to twelve plays where you actually have to protect twelve plays, and so ultimately you got to get the ball out of your hand. That's the way the game is designed. And I was talking to Byron left which when Tom Brady was playing for the Dam Bay Buccaneers, and I said, what has been the most amazing thing about Tom? He said, Hey, listen, if I call curl flat, which is the first day, like first day operation curl flat, everybody name league runs curl flat. And your first read is the flat like it's just you know, a backron tight end that's in the flat, right, whatever it is, and that flat is open, and that's the first read in the progression. Tom will take it one hundred out of one hundred times, never get taking the profit, and it'll put us in second down and six minus and then the entirety of the offense is open. We're on schedule. You hear people say that all the time. On schedule, there are some quarterbacks that don't want to throw it. Let me see what I can get at hey, let me see if I can get something better. Let me see if I can get something better. You got to fall in love with Bory. And that's why guys who scramble around. Most guys who scramble around don't win. Championships because you gotta be you can't like ultimately, Like I look at Kyler Murray and do you want to win football games? Or do you want to make Sports Center highlights? Like that was? That was what I would ask, like, because I want to I want to win football games.

00:24:41
Speaker 7: And the way you win is staying out a third down and long.

00:24:44
Speaker 9: And the way you stay at a third down long is you have success on first and second down.

00:24:48
Speaker 7: And so if somebody is going to give me a gift, somebody's going to give me.

00:24:53
Speaker 9: A five yard quick out and I pass it by because I want something.

00:24:58
Speaker 7: Better, or I want to make a highlight play. What's selfish football? Because it's second down and five, I can do anything. Everything is open to me. Second down and ten. I'm predictable. Nothing is open to you. I have aired down my playbook by you know, eighty percent. Whatever it is.

00:25:18
Speaker 5: Stay grumpy, Okay.

00:25:24
Speaker 7: I'm gonna get a T shirt.

00:25:25
Speaker 5: Stay grumpy, stay grumpy. Good to talk to you, buddy, Thank you.

00:25:28
Speaker 7: Likewise, be good, buddy.

00:25:30
Speaker 5: Mark Slera.

00:25:31
Speaker 1: Fox Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in the nation. Catch all of our shows at foxsports radio dot com and within the iHeartRadio app search FSR to listen live.

00:25:42
Speaker 2: We bring in Sean CASEYMLB Network analyst. You can see him throughout the postseason on MLB Network the studio shows also MLB Tonight and his Mayor's Office podcast, Great to See You Again. How much of the game comes down to a gut feeling as a post to the analytics, because it feels like you can lean on analytics and blame analytics, but when it's a gut feeling, it's on you.

00:26:09
Speaker 10: Yeah, what's up, Danny? Yeah, I think there's definitely something to that, you know. I think we go back to, you know a few years ago when when Snell was cruising along for the Rays and then Cash comes and gets them because that's what the analytics saying.

00:26:24
Speaker 4: I think that was the first time we were all like, oh man, where's the gut feel here?

00:26:29
Speaker 10: Of kind of watching what you're seeing and going with that. I think the managers that are that are in these games, you know, are allowed to go on gut fields. And you heard Aaron Boone say, I think that was a gut feel for him. He felt like there was some traffic on the bases with Freed in four five and six, and he felt like, you know that that was the right time he was going to go to the pen there anyhow, So I feel like that was kind of a gut feel from Boone as opposed to the analytics. But you know, Danny being in these meetings, you know, being back in the clubhouse in twenty twenty three with the Yankees and seeing these meetings of how hey, if this matchup comes up, the analytics say here, uh, you know those are on the table. But I do think as a manager in the postseason, the gut feel is part of it, and you know it has.

00:27:12
Speaker 4: To come and play.

00:27:14
Speaker 2: Managing differently in the postseason, do you do you manage differently or is that let's fight the urge to manage differently.

00:27:23
Speaker 10: Well, I think I think there's a little bit of managing differently in the postseason on a few fronts because you know there is no tomorrow sometimes, you know, especially some in these wildcard series too, like what is it ninety percent of the teams that have won Game one have gone on to.

00:27:38
Speaker 4: Win the Wildcard series.

00:27:40
Speaker 10: So I think that you know, if a pitcher's in trouble early, you can't do what you might have done in the in the regular season to save the bullpen. You gotta you gotta get them out. You got to get to the pen sooner. I think you're going to see more bunts and strategies in the postseason of get the you know, getting the bunt down, putting pressure on getting the guy over. Uh So, I think I think you do have to manage a little differently in the postseason because the stakes are a lot higher.

00:28:06
Speaker 2: Of the four teams that lost yesterday, which one has the best chance to win their series?

00:28:12
Speaker 4: I still think the Yankees have a great shot to win that series.

00:28:14
Speaker 10: I really, I really believe that, you know, I think they you know, when you run into Crochet and Chapman, you know, for seven and two thirds and then one and a third, I mean, that is a that's a tall order. They hadn't they had Chapman on the ropes too in the ninth couldn't figure it out with basis loaded, no outs. But you know, that's a taller in Game one. I really feel like the Yankees have a really good team. I think they still have a chance to win that series.

00:28:37
Speaker 5: What do you remember about your first playoff game?

00:28:40
Speaker 10: Wow, you know what's a good This is a great, This is a great point. I was just I was just saying this last week on on MLB Network. My first real kind of playoff game was Game one sixty three with the Reds and the and the and the Mets. When we had the playing game the playoff atmosphere. Was the first time I ever felt that, and I rememberer Danny like it was an adrenaline and energy I'd never felt. I'm twenty five year old kid, and I remember thinking, I'm gonna go win this game tonight. I'm gonna go I'm gonna really go go take this game. Right, I'm I'm you know, it's the kind of that football mentality which doesn't work in baseball. I end up going zero for four, two punchouts, one of the worst games.

00:29:19
Speaker 4: Of my life.

00:29:19
Speaker 10: Right, And I remember thinking to myself, you know, and as in the game of baseball and in life, failures, feedback, failures, information, I was like, man, how do I take the failure I got here?

00:29:30
Speaker 4: Get me back to the postseason to experience it.

00:29:32
Speaker 10: And when I finally went back to the postseason in six when I was with the Tigers and I you know, led the post, led all hitters and hitting and I hit five hundred in the World Series.

00:29:42
Speaker 4: The only reason I say that is because.

00:29:44
Speaker 10: What I learned when I was twenty five years old about you know, trying my hardest and really being somebody different to you know, go get this game with the adrenaline of the postseason being on another level. It doesn't work. You got to be able to slow down. You got to be able to let the game come to you. And I think that's why you do. Sees maybe a guy like Hunter Green last night, maybe the adrenaline was a little too high.

00:30:06
Speaker 4: Maybe that cost his pitches to.

00:30:07
Speaker 10: Be up out over the plate more than they would be during the regular season.

00:30:10
Speaker 4: But you can't teach experience.

00:30:13
Speaker 5: How do you pitch to o'tani.

00:30:17
Speaker 3: Man?

00:30:17
Speaker 4: I'll tell you what.

00:30:18
Speaker 10: When he's locked in like this, he's very very dangerous. I mean, you know, for me, you got to be very careful. I mean, i'd like to say, you know, I'd like to say, you go upper rail, but he's proven he can hit that better than anybody in the game. Now too, you got to really mix and match with him. I think you got to get him off the plate a little bit. You got to, you know, get him in, move his feet and then you try and uh just try and hit him with the kitchen sink.

00:30:42
Speaker 2: Uh Kershaw is I think Otani's pitching maybe Game three, but we saw, you know, Kershaw the second half of the season. Pitch unbelievable. What's it like or was it like to face a Clayton Kershaw?

00:30:58
Speaker 10: Well, you know, funny looking back at me, you know in my career because that was my last spring training in two thousand and eight, was with the Red Sox. Scott's time Flies met seventeen years ago, and it was my third bat at the game. We're in Vero Beach. Joe toy is the manager with Larry Bowa the bench coach. Tito's my manager with the Red Sox, and it's like my third bat.

00:31:20
Speaker 4: I'm coming after that out of the game.

00:31:21
Speaker 10: So on the on the mound pops a guy I believe he was number ninety eight or eighty nine, and I remember going to Dave Magnant and my hitting coach, going hey, hey, you got anything on this guy. He's like, nah, I got me. He goes through his notes, got nothing. So I go to Tito, Hey you got anything on this guy? He's like just some rookie off the backfield. They're trying to get some work, and I'm like, all right, it should be easy. Let me you know, you know, so I'm daddy. I'm like, all right, let me take it. Let me take a look at the first pitch. See what he's got, you know, maybe set out my eyes. So I get in there, say how to the catch here? Look over, Tory gives me a nod.

00:31:50
Speaker 4: I get in there.

00:31:51
Speaker 10: You know this big left he's on the mound, number ninety eight. So I set up, take a nice I'm gonna take one.

00:31:56
Speaker 4: Wam hits me with like ninety eight outside black. I'm like, I am. I'm like, that's this kid from the backfield's pretty good. This guy's got some pretty good stuff.

00:32:05
Speaker 10: So I look over Joe Tory and Joe Tory and Larry Bow and now laughing because I obviously they know they know this kid better than than we know him on the Red Sox side. So next pitch, Danny, he hits me with it. This guy hits me with a curveball. I swear to guy who was behind me, I total buck Tony's buckle. I just Tony's pizza up whaa and bam he hits me with strike two and I'm like wow, I'm like, that's this kid's this kid from the backfield, something special, so believable. Like so next pitch he hits me with like about ninety eight outside black.

00:32:35
Speaker 4: It's no doubt strike three.

00:32:36
Speaker 10: Like I just got used and abused by this young eighteen year old kid ninety eight from the backfield.

00:32:41
Speaker 4: They call it ball. They called a ball just because I.

00:32:43
Speaker 10: Think Gump was like, hey, we can't, we can't ring up shaw Casey on three pitches from this guy number ninety eight on the backfields and Danny hits me. Next pitch, he hits me with that curveball again. I almost I literally almost blew out my acl. I was like, what Bamy hits me? And I look over everyone's laugh and I come back to the dugout and I go to.

00:33:01
Speaker 4: Tito, go, man, you don't know who that guy is. He goes, no, I'm just glad I'm.

00:33:04
Speaker 9: Not you right now, but yeah, I go, yeah.

00:33:06
Speaker 7: Me too.

00:33:07
Speaker 4: It turns out that was Clayton Kershaw. I think that was his first big lead year ever. Faced he maybe looked like a four year old kid.

00:33:13
Speaker 2: So Sean Casey MLB network analysts, you can see him on MLB's postseason coverage, and also check out his Mayor's Office podcast. I opened the show talking about it used to be I had to have a hammer or two in the postseason. And you know, we've seen teams that have had those two great starters in a best of five, best of seven, you're going to see them four times. Scooba is one of those guys. Croche we saw that performance there. Schemes isn't going to be in a playoff anytime soon. Verlander didn't make the playoffs, you know, so you're starting to look around and go, how many of these hammers are out there, and just the importance of them, certainly in a three game series.

00:33:57
Speaker 4: Oh my gosh.

00:33:57
Speaker 10: Well, I look at the Dodgers and I go, okay, you got game one with Snell, you're gonna get Yamamoto coming back, game two, and you got Otani game three.

00:34:05
Speaker 4: You know that that wasn't that rotation setting up all year.

00:34:08
Speaker 10: Snell was banged up, Yamamoto did well, Otani came back late. But they they they couldn't have timed Otawni's uh, you know, his ascending into that starter with his last couple of starts. I now think that's a that's a real three headed monster right there. You talk about hammers. These are guys that can absolutely control the game. Now, the big thing with the Dodgers is can that you know, can they can they go pretty long because the bullpen's you know, been a little banged up. But you're right when you watch Scoobale pitch yesterday and you watched Crochet even Freed you.

00:34:39
Speaker 4: Know, kept him in the game with the Yankees.

00:34:40
Speaker 10: But these are guys that are, like, you really gotta be on your A game.

00:34:45
Speaker 4: You gotta find a way to.

00:34:46
Speaker 10: Manufacture against these guys because if they're on, it's it's a tough go.

00:34:50
Speaker 2: How much should it factor in that cal Rawly was the catcher on a on a Pennant winning team as far as the MVP go with Aaron.

00:35:00
Speaker 4: Judge, it should definitely factor in.

00:35:02
Speaker 10: I mean, I think the biggest reason we're talking about cal Rawley obviously, other than the sixty home runs, which is incredible, is that he's a catcher. You know, because at the end of the day, you know, to be able to catch that many games, to handle the staff, the preparation, pregame of what goes into that We've never seen a catcher do it, because you know, the legs that are under you start to go in the second half. The fact that he beat Mantles and he's also a switch hitter. He beat Manos fifty four home runs as a switch hitter. Really historic stuff. I mean historic stuff. So you know, I really think that that cal Rawly. That's why he's in this conversation for MVP. That's why he might he might win. It is because he's a catcher.

00:35:41
Speaker 5: Sounds like you're leaning towards Aaron Judge.

00:35:46
Speaker 4: You know what.

00:35:46
Speaker 10: I this is the one thing I think about the MVP race in this generation. Back when I was playing, guys would have incredible, incredible years, historic seasons. But Barry Bonds was in the league, and then you know, years ago guys would have historic seasons and look how amazing this is. Yeah, but sho heyo, Tawny's in that league, in the American League. I feel that way with Aaron Judge. I mean, Aaron Judge won a batting title, hit hit over fifty home runs. Only Jimmy Fox and Mickey Manle have ever done that historic stuff. He's one of four players that ever have four seasons of fifty homers. Historic stuff. He's hitting three thirty in an age where no one's hitting three hundred. Is that like three seventy years ago? Historic stuff? So like I look at Aaron Judge's numbers. His ops is over, you know, two hundred, greater than cal Raley's.

00:36:33
Speaker 4: There's just so many things. Is on base percentage what he does every day?

00:36:36
Speaker 10: And for me, Danny, I don't buy the whole average doesn't matter. You know what batting average shows me. It shows me you're showing up every day. It shows me I can trust you. It shows me you're hitting good pitching. It shows me you're hitting the closers and the number one starters. It shows me that you're winning ball games for my team.

00:36:51
Speaker 4: So I don't know.

00:36:52
Speaker 10: I just look at Aaron Judge. I just feel like cal Rawly had a historic year. But Aaron Judge exists in twenty twenty five, and he's a generational player that we've never seen, one that we've really never seen before.

00:37:03
Speaker 4: And for me, he's the MVP.

00:37:05
Speaker 5: What's the coolest thing in your office?

00:37:08
Speaker 4: Coolest thing in my office?

00:37:10
Speaker 10: I got a lot of cool things here in the office. I have a picture over there of Marilyn Monroe and Joe DiMaggio getting off a plane, and there's two signed checks. One of the Maggio he signed us to a school in nineteen ninety eight and the Marilyn Monroe check signed in like nineteen fifty three for a dollar fifty to a friend of hers.

00:37:33
Speaker 2: Are those Sports Emmys? The years that MLB Tonight beat my show? Did you put those out? Those weren't out there? Probably twenty minutes ago. They weren't out there.

00:37:45
Speaker 10: Dude, I knew I was coming on. I was like, I want to be sure Danny knows the Emmys.

00:37:50
Speaker 5: Damn you. That's like a bat flip there. Damn Oh.

00:37:56
Speaker 4: You know.

00:37:56
Speaker 5: One more thing.

00:37:57
Speaker 2: We were talking about great swings, pretty swings. Why is it a right handed hitters? Never we don't single out and go, boy, that guy's got one of the prettiest swings in the game. It's always gonna be Junior Rafael Paul Merrow. I mean, there's it's always the left handed hitter.

00:38:12
Speaker 4: Why is that always the lefties? I don't know.

00:38:14
Speaker 10: It just looks a lot sweeter left handed the right he's look like they're always grinding, Like, oh man, that looks weird, but boy, it's a good swing hundred pens like, oh what hell, man, he's a really good player, you know what I mean.

00:38:27
Speaker 2: Once again, this guy got thrown out from left field on a base hit.

00:38:31
Speaker 4: That's right, that's right.

00:38:32
Speaker 10: And don't forget there's two new members in that Dylan Moore and uh and uh Tommy Fam.

00:38:36
Speaker 4: Thank you guys for being in that club.

00:38:38
Speaker 2: How many guys have gotten thrown out from left field?

00:38:40
Speaker 5: At first? That's it three us now in the history of the game.

00:38:43
Speaker 4: It was me forever, that history of the game. And then Tommy Fam this year and Dylan Moore. I'm keeping tabs.

00:38:49
Speaker 10: I'm keeping receipts on who's getting thrown off and left because I was.

00:38:52
Speaker 4: I was in the exclusive club.

00:38:54
Speaker 2: Dandy, damn them. Keep the energy. Great to talk to you, buddy.

00:38:58
Speaker 4: Great scene, man, I'll talk to you.

00:39:00
Speaker 2: Sean Casey, MLB Network analysts. You can see him throughout the postseason on MLB Network studio shows and his podcast, The Mayor's Office.