32 Takeaways from AFC Coaches Breakfast and Dave Canales Steals the Show

00:00:05
Speaker 1: Welcome to NFL Daily, where we were not invited to Jay Glazier's annual day drinking event with all the NFL coaches. I'm Greg Rosenthal, I'm in Los Angeles. I'm talking to my friend Nick Shook in Cleveland, and we are gonna be talking coaches breakfast takeaways.

00:00:23
Speaker 2: Are you ready?

00:00:24
Speaker 3: I'm so ready. Although I'm a little disappointed that I didn't get a few really embarrassing earlier morning photos from Phoenixes, like sweaty Mike Tomlin. We didn't get sweaty Mike Tomalin this year.

00:00:33
Speaker 1: No, and that Jay Glazer get together, which apparently is an annual event going on almost twenty years apparently, and this is not surprising at all if you know Mike Tomlin kickstarted with Glazer day drinking with Mike Tomlin at one of these owners meetings, and then apparently it turned into a thing where he invites every coach just hang out relax. As Glazer said, sometimes the leaders need to be taken care of who's thinking about them and just you know, let their proverbial hair down. He got twenty eight of the thirty two head coach ow to just hang out around the pool and have some beers and whatnot.

00:01:12
Speaker 3: Who are the squares, the four squares that didn't go?

00:01:14
Speaker 2: I want to find out.

00:01:16
Speaker 3: I could guess, yeah.

00:01:18
Speaker 1: But I don't know. We also were going to talk about Dave Canals. He's a candidate maybe for one of those that wouldn't be there, but I don't know. He seems like a regular dude who's going to talk. What I thought was a fascinating insight into the coach's photo, which we talked about on Monday Show. But let's get to the news and who really is always a reliable quote this time of year, anytime of year, it's Sean Peyton, the Denver Broncos coach. First of all, he just this is as an aside. I thought it was very interesting that his experience with the flag football, which took place in Los Angeles, playing against Team USA, he said, was very humbling and he would be very surprised if there's even one single goal NFL player on the Olympics flag football team. So in twenty twenty eight, I think that's in astute observation. So Joe Burrow, you might get disappointed, but let's get to the NFL of it all. I liked this back and forth. I'm gonna get your your thoughts on it right after. But it's Sean Payton and a reporter kind of talking about some of the articles that were in Denver about how come the Broncos aren't doing anything. This was, of course, before the Jalen Wattle trade.

00:02:27
Speaker 4: Let's yeah, I hear. I saw the stories right, all right, and I don't I don't believe them. And so it's not let's run it back. I hate that term. All right, it's not let's run it back. Let's understand one thing. It's anything but that when you win eleven to thirteen one score games like you saw the flip in just one season between Kansas City, it's how do you improve your team? And the better you get, the harder it is.

00:02:59
Speaker 2: To improve your team.

00:03:01
Speaker 4: And so you just weren't patient enough for us to trade for Wattle. Your stories had been written.

00:03:10
Speaker 3: I see.

00:03:12
Speaker 4: Oh come on, you had ten other suggestions too, And listen, you can come get one of these jobs. Apply for one. Well, I never feel good. I never feel good.

00:03:28
Speaker 2: I love that. What are your thoughts, chick?

00:03:30
Speaker 3: Come get one of these jobs, the job that you're totally unqualified for. And I'm just gonna expose you for it by saying this right now, because I'm feeling a little angry today because i didn't like how you wrote your stories. But I'm going to defend them real quick, because it's not like they didn't do anything. They retained some of their own They were able to keep their pair of linebackers Alex Singleton and justineter Nod and and yeah, I mean this is a team that finished with the number one seed in the AFC. Maybe they like a lot of what they had, and maybe their priorities were to keep a lot of what they had and then add a playmaker and Jalen. It is funny if there's any coach at mint a Pick that's going to go after a reporter who wants that reporter asked that question about the content that they produced to all the Broncos were perceived as sitting on their hands. It's Sean Payton. It is Sean Payton to a t. Nobody holds a vendetta like Sean Payton. And this is kind of, I guess, the perfect place. It's casual enough for him to just go after the guy and set the record straight, at least in his mind.

00:04:22
Speaker 1: Here's the thing though, that's his love language. I think he's only doing it with someone. I don't think he's mad. I think he's having fun. I think this is how he interacts with the world, and I guess I feel like I share that with John Pain. I don't know if it's working that going after people as my love language.

00:04:37
Speaker 2: I don't have that many people.

00:04:38
Speaker 3: No, I actually think that's one of my favorite attributes of you. Greg. You know, not to turn this into a shower Greg with compliments session here, but I mean on once you figure out that when Greg comes at you, he's actually expressing love, it's it's the best thing in the world. You're no longer on the defensive. You're like, oh, we were bringing that in closer here, let's hug.

00:04:54
Speaker 1: It gets tricky when you have kids, though you know, not every kid can be ty. You create dry, yeah, parented the same way. I have my son here, Walker, who's playing the Wii in silence. I said, as long as he stayed quiet in the grindge. He doesn't really respond to that, so you know I've changed. I've changed course. There Sean Payton, though, loves it, and I do take a few things away from that. First of all, you hate the idea of running it back, and I agree that never works, and I've been worried about that when it comes to the Broncos that you bring back the same team, it usually just doesn't work. You know, George Peyton that the GM talked about, how look we got rid of Drake Greenlow because we really like those other two linebackers that you said. And they might use Jonah Ellis by the way, at linebacker as well, and I get it. Jalen Watta will add something. They might change their number two quarterback. Sean Payton said that job could be Sam Elleners or Jared Stidham and maybe Jarretts Didham could still be traded. But the most telling thing was at the end when he just said, well, I'm never happy.

00:05:54
Speaker 3: Yeah. Well, because coaches know, I mean, they'll say this time and time again, but they especially know how hard it is to repeat success from year to year because so many things have to go right. You got to stay healthy, you got to have the schedule kind of play to your advantage, you got to catch a hot streak at the right time. Broncos did all of that. They also won a lot of close games by just waking up in the fourth quarter and he understands how thinnet margin is between victory and loss and how hard it is to repeat that. But I give them some credit. The only thing that I really worry about roster wise right now is that their running back room didn't get a lot better. Like, yeah, you have the idea of Dobbin's back and everything else, but I would have really liked for them to make an addition there. And the draft is still ahead, so they still have time to make additions. But yeah, I agree with you that it's running it back. As much as you like a team, I think there are some challenges that you can kind of project and some that you can't see coming, and it leads to some occasional disappointment. Not saying Broncos fans that I believe you're going to be disappointed. Okay, don't come as me. We're already on bad terms because of Bonix. I get that, but you know this is just part of you know, what they may be dealing with in twenty twenty six.

00:06:52
Speaker 1: But you were a little lucky last year, and you don't have to take my life for your head coach is saying it. I love a head coach kind of acknowledge that that we weren't quite as good as the record or a lot of things went our way. But also, you know, Sean Payton's getting up there in years. He's got a great team, he has turned around a disastrous situation, and he said he's never happy, and so you know, life is sure. I think he is finding happiness and he expresses it in different ways, but I hope he can find some happiness also finding happiness as a first time head coach. Jesse Mintor, I've been talking about the Nomdae Matabek situation all off season, thinking that is the most important news for the Ravens. Either they get one of the best defensive tackles in the league back or they have a big hole in their defensive line. Mintor did not say if Matta Week is coming back, but there was a report by ESPN last week that said signs are trending that way, and Mintor did say that mattab Weeke is in a great place mentally, and so that that just indicates to me it was about I think the mentality of Matt if Madabike wanted to play again or not, And so that sounds great. He also mentioned when asked about fourth downs whether it'd be aggressive, he said, well, Lamar Jackson's one of the best fourth down players in the NFL, so I love to hear hear that.

00:08:06
Speaker 3: Both good news for the Raven So I missed in a little scouting of the roster he's about to coach, so good on. Jesse mentioned for that he's Dennis research. You're right though, Matta Buka is a huge part of this defense. They couldn't stop the run. They couln't stop anything up front when they went on their losing streak in the middle of the season last year, and of course Lamar Jackson's injury coincided with that. Getting him back will be huge. Also, the nature of the injury that he dealt with, the neck injury for an interior lineman is always, you know, frightening. It's for anybody, but especially for interior lineman whose heads are just more involved on a per play basis. So you hope that he's able to come back and I think upgrade from in a good place mentally to also a good place physically. We have months to determine whether that's the case.

00:08:43
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I'm watching that. I think it's it's really big for their team. I was surprised to see the Ravens have the highest projected so early over under win total.

00:08:53
Speaker 2: We might take a look at that in.

00:08:54
Speaker 1: An upcoming episode, but that getting a little over our skis. I think one team that does not have a higher win total than really any AFT team is your Cleveland Browns. Todd Mounkin spoke, and I thought it was interesting. He said the reps in the quarterback battle won't be even. He said how last season ended matters a lot, and so he's going to favor some quarterbacks over others. On Deshaun Watson, he said he hasn't gone back and watch a lot of film, and that he knows he's going to be on the roster. He knows he'll evaluate him set o give him a shot. But what are your takeaways from hearing this from Monkin?

00:09:31
Speaker 2: Early?

00:09:31
Speaker 3: So, I collected an assortment of Todd Munkin responses, and what we got was I don't know if it was a masterclass, but it was definitely a veteran example of how to give a bunch of non answers and leave everybody guessing when it comes to the quarterback. Okay, so first quote, what I've seen over the years, I'm hoping to tap into that. That's in relation to Deshaun Watson. Second quote, I know he's going to be on the roster. I know we're going to evaluate him. Third quote, We're excited to see what we have. He's part of our roster. These are all Watson related quotes. Dan It shifts too, who's getting reps, Who's he starts out getting the roads. Most reps will be decided on quote what I've seen in the past, and where last year ended, Like you just said, right, well, where was Deshaun Watson last year? Not on the field? Door Sanders was on the field. And then he's asked about Shador and he talks about how last year, you know, mattered, but also that these reps are not going to be even so what he's essentially saying, and he ends it here with the number of reps a player doesn't gets doesn't eliminate competition, and it's not in set in stone. In the last quote, we certainly want to allocate our reps to the players that gives us the best chance to win, which means this is all a work in progress and that they're not going to reveal anything, because he even admitted that he hasn't really gone back and studied Watson's tape, but he also understands who Watson was at his peak. The Browns are leaving everything open. Jimmy Haslam has even tried to pivot from the whole swing and Amiss to potential home run. He's pointed to Sam Darnold and Daniel Jones's examples of what Watson could be. I don't buy it, but what I do buy is that the Browns are just like, well, last year we had five options. This year we have two, and we're just gonna figure it out as it goes.

00:11:00
Speaker 5: This.

00:11:00
Speaker 1: For Dylan Gabriel, you know he's not in this mix. I think the most telling part was he hasn't gone back and watched a lot of Watson. Yes, I think the bromance is real with should Hear? I think they're going to try to give should Hear as many reps.

00:11:13
Speaker 3: What else I think is a real romance though what Ty Simpson Oo keep an eye on it. I think you're buying romance. I don't want to buy it, but I'm buying it. Yeah, it's started to pick up an Indian and it's only gained a little bit of momentum with each week that's passed since then. And I just the longer we go on, the more I'm like, I think they really like him, and I think there's going to be another player in that competition that is not on the roster right now.

00:11:37
Speaker 1: Where where are there extra picks? I'm thinking out loud right now?

00:11:41
Speaker 3: Before in the top seventy they have two in the.

00:11:43
Speaker 1: First Okay, so they have twenty four and thirty nine are the extra one. The extra one is twenty four and thirty nine is their second round.

00:11:49
Speaker 3: That's the range though that you would expect them to draft him, specifically twenty four too high, thirty nine, sure, twenty four too high.

00:11:57
Speaker 1: It is interesting because the GM the head coach, Like, I know, it's a new head coach, but I just feel like they don't have the longest timeline in the world. I think you would like to show his work and in terms of what he could do with quarterbacks, that's really interesting.

00:12:08
Speaker 2: I like that thought.

00:12:09
Speaker 1: This is why Nick Schuck makes the Big Bucks. Who else makes big Bucks? It's Matt Laflir, not Mike Leffler. Already confusing our producer who has to go look for Lafleur sign Downd and things getting mixed up.

00:12:21
Speaker 2: Well, we didn't get mixed up. Here.

00:12:23
Speaker 1: We have some quotes that were actually from Monday, but I thought these were noteworthy and they were new to me.

00:12:30
Speaker 2: Tuesday morning.

00:12:31
Speaker 1: It was Matt Lafleur talking about maybe what went wrong with the Packers a season ago.

00:12:37
Speaker 6: If I'm being honest about it, I think there were some guys that were upset about roles last year, and I think that took a toll on our football team. So you need guys that bring great energy every day. I think from a coaching standpoint, role clarity is key. So we got to obviously do a better job communicating with our players, Hey, here's your role, and if you're unhappy about your it's on you to do something about that to carve out a bigger role on this football team. But yeah, we the buy in is absolutely critical. Getting guys in there that are juice, that are ready to go to work each and every day is going to be critical for us.

00:13:17
Speaker 1: I heard some whispers about this that just like, yeah, the vibes weren't great, and you look at like, who's not on the roster anymore, and who knows. I'm not, there's no point in guessing who that was. I also thought it was interesting he said they were going to strip down the offensive installation to studs, basically start all over. They have a bunch of new coaches, including on the offensive line throughout, you know, offensive coordinator, and almost act like it's the first year for Matt Lafleur and start from scratch.

00:13:45
Speaker 2: I like, just some interesting thoughts about it.

00:13:47
Speaker 1: Teams trying to take the next step from being the seventh seed every year.

00:13:50
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that that was a little bit of usual coach speak with well, if you don't like your role, go out and earn it and change it, that sort of thing. But I also, you know this is you could see this as cherry picking and that it's fine. But I felt in those games that they lost to the Bears, you could see the lack of continuity, just culture wise, like vibes wise, when things were falling apart around them, they were not able to get up off the mat and fight back. And I believe that in hindsight Lafleur has seen that, understood that, and probably experienced that every day and is out to make sure that doesn't happen again, which is why you start from square one. And I mean, look, this is a guy who's been there and had a lot of success for a while now, so it's not like you're questioning his ability to get the job done. It's just a matter of bringing everybody together. This happens from time to time, even with established coaches. Sometimes the vibes are just bad one year and you need that offseason reset. So Packers fans are going to hope that they're able to reset and start off on a better foot. Obviously, winning cures a lot of that.

00:14:41
Speaker 1: They have drafted really well at receiver, but it is tricky to build a receiver room where you're trying to get four or five guys fed. Look, the first round pick Matthew Golden didn't have a lot of time last year when Watson came back. Maybe that Christian Watson came back, maybe that cut into what Romeo Dobbs would do. And so it's just it's tricky to keep everyone happy. One guy who's probably happy is Kirk Cousins because everyone seems to want him as their backup quarterback and includes the Packers. Why why are you pumping in your fist, because that's.

00:15:08
Speaker 3: One of my notes that I just run on the side was in all caps, everybody wants Kirk Cousins.

00:15:14
Speaker 1: Well you you mentioned it in context with a guy who did speak Tuesday, Clint Kubiak, So why why don't you talk about the Raiders are another team potentially in the mix, And Matt Lafleur like volunteered Kirk Cousins his name, like he would love.

00:15:27
Speaker 3: Yeah, and he's not the only coach. Sean mcvaigh did it yesterday as well. He was just like, oh, yeah, by the way, for our backup job, it's Jimmy g or maybe it's Kirk Cousins, which I thought, you know, was a little bit eyebrow raising. It just shows how much he's in demand. But Kubiak said that, you know, the Raiders, he wants to add a veteran quarterback to the room, obvious, especially when you're anticipating they'll select Fernando Mendoza number one. And you know, Kirk seems to be a good fit there, although he didn't say that outright, unlike the other two coaches, but we've projected them as a good fit as well. And he's also talked about how the ideal situation in twenty twenty six would be a rookie watching quote a mature adult go and run an offense and run the team end quote. So I think he's a fan of sitting the young guy and letting a veteran get the job done. And they just need to go find that veteran now, right.

00:16:13
Speaker 1: And he went a little far saying like, you don't know if he's going to start week one of twenty twenty six or week one of twenty twenty seven. And I'm thinking, well, there's no way he's waiting untill week one at twenty twenty seven. But if you have Kirk Cousins start the beginning of the year, you think there's some benefit of that.

00:16:28
Speaker 2: Or whoever the veteran quarterback would be, We'll see.

00:16:31
Speaker 1: I think that depends more on how Fernando Mendoza adapts and what his summer is like.

00:16:36
Speaker 2: But it's good to have a fallback plan.

00:16:37
Speaker 1: Speaking of you planning ahead in terms of contracts, just a couple of little notes. Ian Conningham the Falcons GM said that a Drake London contract extension is quote top of mind. Remember he's in the same class as Garrett Wilson, who got paid a year ago as christ Lave who's trying to get paid now. I think that deal will happen. The Vikings exercise the fifth year option of Jordan Addison. Not a total lock there because of his off field stuff and you just didn't know. There were some trade rumors about him this offseason. The Jaguars will also exercise the fifth year option of Anton Harrison, just some fifth year option talk, and you know, I think this is a big year for Addison in terms of getting paid and whether he'll have a future in Minnesota or not, I don't know, but he's under contract there for two more years.

00:17:24
Speaker 3: I think when things are good. He's proven how special he could be as a receiver, whether he was at pitt USC or with the Vikings. Right, but last season it was kind of the whole the whole evaluation just felt a little off. It felt a little polluted by the fact that they struggled offensively, that they had these issues at quarterback. You know, when we talked to Justin Jefferson on Radio Row, he even admitted that, you know, there was a lot of frustration and that alone would be fine, and I think they would still understand the potential and what Adison has done. When things are good and feel confident in, you know, signing at least getting the fifth year option done. It's not considering a long term deal. But you're right the off field issues. It's three encounters with law Enforce, it's missing the walk through prior to the game against the Browns overseas, which is back in week five. These are signs that just make you think twice about giving that sort of guy a long term extension. When it comes to on field performance, though, I mean, I think he's done enough, even though they struggled last year to deserve it. It's just the total pictures so and and they're also operating with an interim GM right now, so things are just a little you know, they're not as settled as you would like them to be with decisions like that. So picking up the fifth year at least gives you the extra year to kind of explore whether you want to keep him long term.

00:18:29
Speaker 1: That that was very subtle quality pro podcast reflex.

00:18:33
Speaker 2: Just referring back to our conversation.

00:18:37
Speaker 3: I mean, it was a highlight of the year for both of us, so I had.

00:18:40
Speaker 2: It was back. It was great Justin Jefferson is the man.

00:18:45
Speaker 1: He appreciated, He appreciated the shoutout that we gave him two on social which I appreciated. And look, I should have remembered. Yeah, that game in Dublin was it all blends together weeks. You know, he he gets bench through, you know, he's out late and then he has the game winning catch and he pretty much dominated on that drive.

00:19:07
Speaker 2: That was.

00:19:07
Speaker 1: That was the one against the Brown So there, that was in London and he got them to win in that game. Because I fully believe in his talent. I think he's one of the best number two wide receivers in the league very much. You know, not quite at the level of DeVante Smith in Jalen Waddle, but in terms of the contract that he would get, I see them in the same kind of bucket of players that maybe you're not a top twenty receiver those two guys might be, but you're pretty close to that. And man, that is worth a lot as long as he can stay on tack. And I mentioned Anton Harrison that was you know, I wasn't sure that they would. He's had a very I wouldn't say up and down career, but there's some years where he's looked great as a tackle. You also noticed that Liam Cohen said, Travis Hunter very well ahead in recovery. This is that time of year where everyone's ahead and recovery.

00:19:56
Speaker 2: But good to hear.

00:19:56
Speaker 3: This was a fifth year option too, that I think is the product of all the vibes are good right now because we finished strong last year and we believe in our Yeah and yeah with Harrison, Yeah, because like, let's think about their offense now explosively became as a passing offense. Of course you're gonna at least, you know, pick up the fifth year guy or the fifth year option on a guy who is important to protecting your quarterback and continuing that explosive offense. So, I mean, his grades have kind of gone up and down. At least scored in a PFF last year he had his career best performance. Some of that I believe is related to the offense's success. And it's less than twenty million for the fifth year option on a former first rounder, so it makes sense. But it's not necessarily a sign that they're going to retain him long term. He's still going to have to earn that.

00:20:33
Speaker 1: I thought he was great two years ago. So that was what the twenty twenty three season. And then yeah, and then maybe it was a little bit of a dip, but good context. Sad for everyone that that lost their jobs at PFF. By the way you're mentioning, it just seems like they've completely given up on content, which sucks. To see a lot of great people like Trevor Sikkima over there, and so I know a lot of them will will bounce back, but yeah, I might have to cancel that PFF subscription.

00:21:01
Speaker 2: Let's go to the Jets too.

00:21:02
Speaker 1: It's just cracking me up how much Aaron Glenn is just talking about, like the Gino Smith is the answer to our prayers, everything that we want to be, all this stuff they're using AI more in the building, which has me a little concerned. I don't know what you're talking about there. And then he was like, we're gonna be a little more multiple. We're gonna do more three four, you know, four to three. We're not going to be as static. I just think that's one of the things to watch this season. Aaron Glenn has not really adjusted his defense for a while. He is now in charge of the defense. He has to make this thing work or else he's going to be gone and he's got to make it work. Early in the season, Let's go to the Dolphins where John Eric Sullivan is the new Dolphins GM. I thought it was interesting. He's had some interesting quotes in general, but he mentioned that the three pillars of their roster are Devin h Chan not going to trade him, Jordan Brooks the linebacker, and Aaron Brewer the center. Those are the three pillars that they're building around. Not exactly the way bearing walls that the Rams talked about years ago, where it was like Aaron Donald and yeah Stafford of course, and think who the other the waite bearing walls were, but yeah, maybe Cooper Cup at the time was but then that wall fell apart. Yeah, but but really good players, and I think just interesting that he mentioned those three. He also mentioned on the offensive line how they have two spots that they feel great about Patrick Paul at left tackle and Aaron Brewer at center. And I'm thinking, oh, well, if I'm right tackle Austin Jackson, who they invested a lot of money and in the old regime, M'd be like, huh, well, oh am, I not long for this team. So not the interesting how the new regime views like the roster they inherited.

00:22:40
Speaker 3: Not their guy. It's funny because you look at this roster and how they've had to tear it down in this rebuild, and then you compare it to the stance that the new regime is taking, which is, you know, very optimistic and kind of trying to oversell a little bit. I believe Jeff Hafley was talking about how, you know, he still feels good about the roster and they have playmakers and everything else, but it's a work in progress, and I'm like, Okay, first year honeymoon phase is going on right now, and you're trying to tell everybody and sell your plan that you have, you know, a long term vision for what this team should be. But it's interesting that they're kind of doing a baseball team approach and building through the middle, like pitcher and middle infielder. They're going a Chan as an explosive running back, Brewer as one of the best centers in the NFL, you know, as a finalist to win the Protector of the Year. And then Jordan Brooks, who I have always really appreciated, I feel like has been a little underrated in his career yeah, it makes some sense, but I just know that they are so far away that when I'm doing working on my first mock draft, right which will I believe will be up tomorrow, And I got to the Dolphins and I'm thinking, like, well, you could go in a number of different directions because they have needs all over the place. But me being trenches guy, I'm like, I'm looking back at offensive line, not telling you who, but I'm telling you that Aaron Brewer might have a new buddy lined up on one side of him as they continue this rebuild.

00:23:51
Speaker 2: They could use a guard. I think I can guess who it is, but we don't want to.

00:23:55
Speaker 1: We don't want to reveal anything too quickly. Let's go to Mike McCarthy. Keep clocking this story to me that he can't believe how lucky he is to be the Steelers coach. I don't think it's the greatest sign in the world. He was like, it is just so surreal to him. I don't think he expected to get hired a third time, much less with the Steelers. I don't know if I'd like that vibe. I did think it was funny that he noted in his first ever coach's breakfast in I think two thousand and six, he was being asked a question about whether his quarterback, then Brett Favre, was gonna come back or not. And now here he is, twenty years later, being asked about Aaron Rodgers, who he says he feels good about in texts multiple times a week. This is it's obvious that this thing is happening, and it's just annoying that it's it's not official, but to me it's official, but also maybe not like the best sign for your organization that your coach is revealed, like you're just revisiting like what the Packers were going through twenty years ago with the same guy.

00:24:53
Speaker 2: I don't know, there's something strange about it. Well, it was.

00:24:56
Speaker 3: It was a break from convention when they hired him, because usually they went with young and upcoming coaches, and instead they with a guy with a ton of experience that he can then lean on in situations like this, which I kind of think that maybe they needed in one way or another. And a lot of that has to do with the quarterback situation. Now. Obviously, when he was hired, the immediate connection was made Aaron Rodgers and well, maybe this will convince Rogers to come back. I don't know if it was really that deep, but it does help them at this point. But it is like funny that this is a guy who has coached at big time you know, franchises. You know, he's coached the Packers, he's coached the Cowboys, he's been to a Super Bowl, he's won a Super Bowl, he's been in big time games, and now he's just like walking around like, gee, whiz, isn't this just the best? I'm the coach of my hometown team.

00:25:36
Speaker 1: It's very endearing and likable in general. I just and also, yeah, I think as you get older and he is that we are all that. I think you appreciate things maybe a little more. I think he's appreciating the hell out of this moment. Let's actually listen to McCarthy. I didn't realize we had sound. We got sound from McCarthy Roberts in the you know, in the mills. Finding all the great sound on Tuesday.

00:26:00
Speaker 2: Was my first.

00:26:03
Speaker 4: First time doing this, and the first question was about a veteran quarterback whether he's gonna come back or not.

00:26:09
Speaker 1: So it's a big days of voo.

00:26:11
Speaker 3: But no, it's HiT's so good.

00:26:13
Speaker 2: It's been very positive, and we'll just continue to talk. So we talked regularly, all right.

00:26:19
Speaker 1: He talks regularly with with Aaron Rodgers also talking regularly. Mike Vrabel thought it was interesting. He really stressed how inefficient he believed they were running the football last year, said the explosive plays they had hid how they really weren't that good running something that we were hitting on a lot on this show. That's interesting, and that their offseason moves were directed to try to fix that. I wonder if moving Will Campbell inside could potentially be.

00:26:45
Speaker 2: Part of that.

00:26:46
Speaker 1: But they signed Julian Hill, who's a good tight end. They signed Reggie Gilliam who's a fullback from the Bills, and so they've made some moves with with thinking about the running game, Mike Rabel saying he wants all the tight ends quote unquote, and that is going to be geared. So something we were talking about was like people were saying that they had a good running game, but it was really boom or bust. Also asked about his old friend AJ Brown. It's our daily Aj Brown update. Let's listen to what Mike Brabil.

00:27:13
Speaker 2: Had to say.

00:27:15
Speaker 7: We we've talked about this since last January. We're gonna try to do everything we can to strengthen our roster through the draft, through free agency, multiple ways of player acquisition. So anything that we can continue to do to strengthen the roster, we're going to try to do.

00:27:33
Speaker 1: M okay as everyone at this time of the year, I know, but not shutting it down.

00:27:39
Speaker 2: Not shutting down. He's sick of answering that question.

00:27:42
Speaker 1: Also, apparently he just absolutely destroyed a orange juice on while he was sitting there. So we've been saying, we've been noticed there's less breakfast being consumed during the coach's breakfast, but Rabel's down in that. OJ didn't do it in one gulf, but you know, puts it down pretty quickly, you know, hits it again, you know, the mamle O day drink.

00:28:09
Speaker 3: See see this. First off, shout out to Eric, I my goodness, the collection of clips of him sipping this orange juice and it's not sipping, it's gulping. Fantastic work on your part, super producer, Eric Roberts. But also this makes me think and yet another reason for why I would love to play for Mike Vrabel and run through a brick wall for him because that's how I consume my beverage as well. So no shade on taking healthy.

00:28:33
Speaker 1: Gulps potentially dehydrated from the night before.

00:28:36
Speaker 3: But vitamin C gets back to life.

00:28:39
Speaker 2: Let's talk about the Lions.

00:28:40
Speaker 1: I just wanted to note there was a story about how they made Frank rag Now who once played through like a punctured lung and all sorts of other presture problems pay you know, payback is signing bonus, which has happened for many of these lines over the years. It was a day after a Taylor Decker story where the left tackle didn't feel like the Lions really dealt with them, dealt with him on a fair level after he decided to return. I think they wanted them to take a pay cut, and there was some misunderstanding between the two and Dan Campbell's done a great job, Brad Holmes has done a great job. But you know, the ownership structure hasn't changed. It was just a reminder like that maybe Dan Campbell and Brad Holmes are still, you know, having to deal with some organizational issues that have led to the Lions being who the Lions have been over the last thirty forty years.

00:29:34
Speaker 3: And that's the thing is, as you turn the corner toward being a successful franchise, sometimes it's hard to shake those old habits. You might be able to paper over them with victories, but small things like this still point toward, you know, some organizational deficiencies, weaknesses, whatever you might want to see them as it. That's kind of crazy. I'm not gonna lie, that's kind of crazy. But we are also in an nfay with old guard ownership and then new, much wealthier ownership, and we haven't quite cleared that gap yet.

00:30:02
Speaker 2: The last name is Ford.

00:30:03
Speaker 3: I mean, I know that, but I still look I know the die hard.

00:30:09
Speaker 1: I get it, but and that's how they've always operated. Just it's disappointing, and I know lyon I know it's going to be on Lions fans radars because they they have a long history of you know, loving their players, but not loving the ownership. And seeing this how they're treating some of their best players over the last handful of years is really disappointing. Speaking of ownership, Jed York, the forty nine ers owner, on Sunday revealed that when asked about Christian Kirk, that he didn't know Christian Kirk was on the roster. He also mentioned he hoped Brian Brandon Ayuk could play for the team this year, which I honestly just think it's a little bit of a red flag that he is so disconnected from knowing what was happening, because there's no way Brandon Ayuk is playing for.

00:30:52
Speaker 2: The team this year.

00:30:53
Speaker 1: And like, it's not great that that the average casual maybe not casual and fan, casual forty nine ers fan would know that, and like a lot of a lot of people, I would say that follow the NFL would have already known that Kristen Kirk is on the forty nine ers and the.

00:31:09
Speaker 3: Yes, there's there's two ways to look at this though, because you can either see it as oh no, the owner's unplugged. This is a bad sign, but it's also a strong sign and how good your your regime group is at doing their job at John Lynch and Kyle Shanahan managing everything so that Jed York doesn't have to get involved, because conversely, you would have an owner that's meddling and messing up the operation. But I did think it was funny when our insiders did a hit on Good Morning Football this morning and they started talking about Brandon. I you can there's still that Niners logo next to him because they haven't resolved it yet, but everybody knows that he's not going to be on that team. Or I was like, hmm, interesting that that that's still he's still associated with the forty nine ers. And maybe that's just the world that Jed's living in right now.

00:31:47
Speaker 1: Yeah, maybe maybe he watches GMFB with the sound off and just sees the name.

00:31:53
Speaker 3: There and yeah, that's our guy.

00:31:55
Speaker 2: I thinks this is great.

00:31:56
Speaker 1: The NFL announced that the Seahawks are going to be the hard Knocks team this year and the Patriots are going to be the hard Knocked team next year. They've never announced it a year ahead. Very interesting that it's going to be the two Super Bowl teams from this year and that they get a year ahead on the Patriots. But pretty cool that the Seahawks did it. My theory is that this was a I'm not gonna say, dining property for NFL films, but it's lost interest struggle from the struggling. I think it gets okay ratings within HBO and everything, but in terms of conversation, like I'll just admit I've kind of ducked out of watching Hard Knocks lately, and it's almost like we're gonna make you do this, or or the Seahawks, We're willing to do it.

00:32:42
Speaker 2: And yeah, a defending champ on Hard Knocks pretty cool.

00:32:45
Speaker 3: Yeah. So I think that there's a couple of avenues with this that are kind of interesting. One, you have to acknowledge the fact that we live in a different world than we did when Hard Knocks first debuted, you know, with the Ravens going on to win the Super Bowl and everything else right and all the captivating moments that came from that, we have more access now than we did then. I mean exponentially more access now than we did then. We also are dealing with players who are now properly trained in media to say all of the right things, so that you don't get as many of those genuine, candid moments that you would ten, fifteen, twenty years ago. So of course the allure is going to decline a little bit. But I wonder, and I worry a little bit about scheduling two teams in advance, the two Super Bowl teams, one this year and one next year. If that's going to be end up being a mistake the year after, or if it's really not going to.

00:33:27
Speaker 1: Matter at all, Mike Rabo will be there whether they're coming off a bad season or a good season. That's a compelling organization to hit because we've never really seen behind the scenes, and so I think that part of it is fine. And look, I think that's a great point. Everyone's grown up now with reality TV.

00:33:45
Speaker 2: I just think.

00:33:45
Speaker 1: There's so much football behind the scenes. There's so many documentaries, there's so many self produced team NFL that it just the market is flood.

00:33:55
Speaker 3: We all operate as if there's a camera president at all times. Like the authenticity of like the true authentic moment of twenty five years ago is no longer there.

00:34:04
Speaker 1: No, You're you're getting raw. You're getting raw sixty percent g all the time. This is who I am. I'm not playing for the cameras at all. So let's finish with a guy who does play for the cameras.

00:34:16
Speaker 2: He admitted it.

00:34:16
Speaker 1: A fascinating moment from Dave Canalis on Good Morning Football, reacting to Kyle Brandt, who did his annual look at the coach's photo and commenting just how nice Canalis, his shirt looked in terms of the thread count, how you know, in shape, he looked, his hair looked great, like he was fresh from barber. Here is Canalis's response to that.

00:34:43
Speaker 8: I do know there was some strategy to where you stand in the staff photo. So you know, you got to position yourself next to people that may or may not make you look a little better, and certainly a strategically on the opposite side of you know, who's like the guy, so you can see Matt and I have at least twelve feet of distance. You know, there's so there's some framing in there. You know, I'm not gonna say any names, but there's a little strategy behind me.

00:35:10
Speaker 1: Wow, I love it. Jordan and I talked after getting Canalis on the show. He's a really compelling guy on camera, very likable, but I always feel like there's like a real Canalist behind it all that I want to get to know, like a little better. He presents publicly very well, and I thought that was really telling because he positioned himself, Like he said, there's some strategy of where you want to be. He is right next to between Mike McCarthy and Kellen Moore.

00:35:45
Speaker 3: That's so unfair.

00:35:47
Speaker 2: He's the one that said it though. That's why this is amazing.

00:35:51
Speaker 1: This you want to talk about, you know, bulletin board material, coaches, never talking any trash. If I'm McCarthy or the guy in his division, Kellen Moore, and he's saying he's strategic, and then I was like, well, it'd be really interesting to find out the two he's next to, and then those were the two.

00:36:09
Speaker 2: I'm just I think there was some intent behind it. I love it. I love this sho.

00:36:14
Speaker 3: Also, he did a great job of putting Kellen Morbis when him and Dimico ryans so that like, right, here's the crew of the guys, here's the guys that stayed in shape. Here's the guys that drank too much and let themselves get you know, let their physical state get away from them. Good on him, But you know what that response, I'm gonna go all the way back to the front of the show here. That response tells me that I think it was a little unfair that you thought Dave Canalis might not have been at Jay Glazer's party. Because that guy who answers like that and is thinking that head, he's down to hang, he's down to hang.

00:36:44
Speaker 1: He has like he wrote a book, he has talked about recovery. Recovery right, doesn't have the drinks, but hanging out. Yeah, yeah, that that's fair, just fascinating. I wish that we had the AFC coaches back so someone could ask McCarthy, Uh, you know what you think of canals as comments like keep this going as a news cycle and yeah, as a man who is in great shape, check I mean it. I hate to think that in a similar situation like the NFL, you know, team photos they used to take talent team photos, that you were thinking about that in such a way. Oh I got a position myself next to Rosenthal.

00:37:25
Speaker 3: No, no, god, I am.

00:37:28
Speaker 2: You're not.

00:37:28
Speaker 5: No.

00:37:28
Speaker 3: The height would would just not be good for the lineup. And plus they never bought people with that different good for you to each other of course, Yeah, but I don't need to do that. Okay. That's like when it comes to heights, punching down, that's punching down. It is punching down a little bit. But I will say literally, I would make sure if I was in the coaches photo, to put somebody between me and Robert Salad because I would probably be wearing the same thing he was wearing. That man's got a better build than I did.

00:37:52
Speaker 1: Okay, that's fair, but this this is absolutely a story I am going to track for the rest of the season or if nothing else, just bring it up all the time, especially.

00:38:01
Speaker 2: When the Panthers in Saint's play.

00:38:03
Speaker 1: Let's take a break on the other side. Should have mentioned at the top of the show we got a special guest. Yeah, it's one of our main hosts. It's Jordan Rodrieke. She's boots on the ground at the owner's meetings. We'll talk about rule changes everything else you've been hearing back on NFL Daily for one of my favorite annual segments, Jordan rodrig buy a pool in a hotel or at a hotel that she could not afford to stay at, but the NFL owners can welcome.

00:38:41
Speaker 2: Jordan.

00:38:41
Speaker 5: How are you doing, Hi, I'm great. I love the Phoenix builtmore.

00:38:47
Speaker 9: It's fantastic.

00:38:48
Speaker 5: There are it's a prime lurking area if you do my job and you need to listen to other people talk to each other and then have meetings, you know, on various pop gets by pools around the Circle bar.

00:39:02
Speaker 9: Everybody watched the Duke.

00:39:04
Speaker 5: Game earlier this week, that caused quite the stir down at the Circle bar when a lot of people miss their privileged sessions because of that camp.

00:39:12
Speaker 9: Oh wow, yeah it was. It was a vibe.

00:39:15
Speaker 5: So yeah, it's I'm happy to see you guys, but I am not unhappy to be sitting where I am currently.

00:39:21
Speaker 1: That's amazing. I don't I don't envy you, and yet I'm happy. I'm happy for you. Wait, what's the like lurking strategy?

00:39:29
Speaker 2: What are you getting out of this?

00:39:30
Speaker 9: Yeah?

00:39:30
Speaker 2: Are you meeting with some people? What? What? What is the Jordan rod Rieg strategy here?

00:39:35
Speaker 9: Yes, it's to never stay still for too long? First of all.

00:39:39
Speaker 5: So there are a couple of areas. I'll keep my favorite one private. But there are a couple of areas where you know you're always going to see people and where you're always going to run into people. A that you need to talk to, or be that you need to get some face time with, or see that you maybe talk to you on the phone a lot or text a lot, but don't get a lot of times to get FaceTime with.

00:39:58
Speaker 9: So I like to be out. This is my favorite one.

00:40:01
Speaker 5: This is better than the Orlando or Jacksonville or Breakers or any Palm Beach ones because the layout is really simple. There's the pool, where I'd never go because it's all the coaches partying and I just feel like I don't belong there.

00:40:14
Speaker 9: And then and then there's.

00:40:16
Speaker 5: The circle bar area, and there's a lot of patio chairs and tables and everything, and that's a great place to lurk. Then there's the lobby where people have no choice but to walk past you back and forth between their meetings. And then there's the walkway between the meeting session rooms and the lobby, whereas another again a good place, and my last place is my favorite, which I will not share, but let me just tell you, Oh, nobody would survive this event if not for this one particular spot on site, and that is where I park outside.

00:40:49
Speaker 9: So that's got to see everyone. They must go there.

00:40:52
Speaker 2: I can guess.

00:40:53
Speaker 5: Yeah, I guess.

00:40:57
Speaker 1: It's not like a lot of sizzle. Sorry you jump in next.

00:41:01
Speaker 2: But like the.

00:41:03
Speaker 1: Rules that they passed on Tuesday as we're taping, not exciting, like you can now do an on site kick anytime of the game.

00:41:12
Speaker 2: Like they're changing the team's incentive to.

00:41:15
Speaker 1: When they kick off from the fifty yard line where they were just kicking out about it. It's just like little small things they did expand you know, replay in terms of obvious officiating mistake, so that that could have a big impact.

00:41:28
Speaker 2: But like, what's the buzz.

00:41:30
Speaker 1: In terms, it just doesn't feel like there's a in terms of changing the league. It's it's not a season like that.

00:41:36
Speaker 5: No, it's been very calm, and that's been kind of awesome.

00:41:40
Speaker 9: I would say too.

00:41:41
Speaker 5: It was not a really buzzy coaching cycle either, not a buzzy hiring cycle. I was talking to a couple of people who thought the two kind of went hand in hand where there wasn't some like person or catalytic figure causing buzz or some disruptor or anything like that.

00:42:00
Speaker 9: You know, it's kind of a very calm.

00:42:02
Speaker 5: Coaching cycle, a lot of retread coach of a couple very unknown, kind of unproven guys.

00:42:07
Speaker 9: And then also it's been a quiet rule cycle.

00:42:09
Speaker 5: The tush push basically has not been mentioned other than people saying, hey, I remember last year when all we talked about was the tush push and what I've both disliked and liked one. It's been calmer, so the buzzier stuff, you know, didn't even get a chance to hit the floor before I was rescinded this is the draft picks proposal. But then it's also like been just a lot of football talk, which is more my vibe. I don't really care as much about the rule stuff. The football talk has been cool because it's also a lot of guys that know each other. It's a very incestuous coaching landscape right now. A lot of siblings, like literal siblings, and then a lot of like coaching siblings too, from the same trees, interconnecting coaching trees, so everybody really knows each other for the most part, and everybody it's one of those calm events where everybody's just actually talking a lot of football, which I have personally quite enjoyed, but it's also not super exciting for the news cycles.

00:43:03
Speaker 3: One of those coaches that you know came from one of those trees that has now spawned his own tree. And somebody that you know very well, obviously Sean McVay. Is it me or did he seem like he was a little chattier this year than usual or maybe more just landed on my radar?

00:43:18
Speaker 9: Okay, here's the lore.

00:43:19
Speaker 5: This is my favorite thing about these meetings the lore and yes, you're correct, a lot chattier.

00:43:26
Speaker 9: Awake and in good health in the morning. I'll just say.

00:43:29
Speaker 5: Because it used to be that it used to be that the NFC coaches would go and do their table sessions in the morning at it's always been early as hell, and they would always do the sessions first thing in the morning, and NFC would always go the day after the big party that the league hosts where they absolutely blow out the budget and they it's an open bar for hours.

00:43:52
Speaker 9: It's a band and entertainment and it's.

00:43:54
Speaker 5: You know, there was a petting zoo and all this stuff, and like there's all this stuff that happens, and that's an open bar. That is a night that people kind of go a little bit harder. And then usually they'd make the NFC coaches for year over year, over ye over year, they'd make the NFC coaches go the next morning.

00:44:10
Speaker 9: The theory was that it was like a.

00:44:11
Speaker 5: Tomlin thing that he was trolling some of the like this can't be proven, but that was the theory that there was like a Tomlin thing. He's trolling the other coaches, especially the Shanahan guys who he's friends with and was kind of like trolling all of these NFC bros because he would make them go when they were at their most in pain. Basically, you'd see the Kyle Shanahan photos and the and the Sean McVay looking a little green around mc gill photos and videos and all those things.

00:44:37
Speaker 9: This year.

00:44:37
Speaker 5: I don't think it's a coincidence me personally that Mike Tomlin is taking a break from coaching all of a sudden, the NFC West is in full power. And hey, by the way, the days flipped where AFC went Tuesday morning and NFC got to go Monday morning. So no, Nick, I don't think it's a coincidence that Sean McVay was feeling particularly chatty. Now, the quality of some of the thing he said is up for debate, but I think that, you know, it's it was definitely a healthier option up there.

00:45:08
Speaker 2: She goes, we have lost Jordan.

00:45:11
Speaker 1: We were we were warned that her phone was overheating, and so we say goodbye. He's doing great work out there for the athletic and giving us UH some reporting. Who knows, maybe she just was trying to go join that Jay Glazer Uh I mean no, She says she hasn't uncomfortable by no, for real, her her phone overheated. I'm looking forward, by the way, next week we're going to have a Jordan Nick Shook show, So this was a preview of that pairing while I go see my parents and take the early part of next week off. She did have some interesting takes from from Sean McVay which she kind of alluded to earlier, and she can expound on this when she's on the show, but you know, kind of the shorter version was that, you know, she she thought Sean McVay could have been a little stronger publicly responding to to what's going on in terms of Poka Nakua and everything that's been surrounding him and the civil allegations. But that look, it would not be a surprise to her who knows this organization. Well, if you know, the concerns with everything going off the field with Puka is a conversation that does come up in the coming weeks months when it comes to you know, contract negotiations and Puka's future, and you know, look, this is an organization that is quickly pivoted and everything. So it just something that is is a big deal. It's not the media quote unquote, you know, making a big deal. It's just something that's going to come up between the player and the team. But but heck, Jordan is the RAMS expert. She she can talk about that next week. I'm looking forward to uh to that show, Shooky Time to shine for Shook.

00:47:00
Speaker 3: Kids are gonna be back in charge. Mom and dad are out on date night. We rule a house.

00:47:05
Speaker 1: That's right seeing my literal Mom and Dad. Let's hit the music, Let's get out of here. Thank you Shuk for going over.

00:47:13
Speaker 2: All the coaches, all the news, and of course Jordan's calling in there from Phoenix. We are not done here this week on Deep the next time you're hear from me, wee myself.

00:47:24
Speaker 1: Daniel Jeremiah forties and free agents were also going through a lot of the defensive prospects later in the week with Holly Connolly.

00:47:31
Speaker 2: We will see that