Workplace Wellness: A Discussion

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Speaker 1: Hi. This is Laura Vandercamp. I'm a mother of five, an author, journalist, and speaker. And this is Sarah Hartunger. I'm a mother of three, a practicing physician and blogger. On the side, we are two working parents who love our careers and our families. Welcome to best of both worlds. Here we talk about how real women manage work, family, and time for fun, from figuring out childcare to mapping out long term career goals. We want you to get the most out of life. Welcome to best of both worlds. This is Laura. This is episode one hundred and eighty seven, which is first airing in early March of twenty twenty one. Today we are going to be talking about workplace wellness. We're going to be approaching this from a couple of different angles. First, talking about what wellness is, what we can do personally to improve our wellness at work, what managers can do to help employees with wellness at work, and then sort of generally, what makes something a great place to work Because we've all observed that you can have the exact same job title and the same substance of your job at one organization versus another and yet be much happier at one place versus another. So what is that magic secret sauce that makes someplace so great to work? And how can more of us, you know, either find those places or if we are in charge, create those places. So that is what this episode is about. But first, this was partly spark because Sarah is officially a wellness leader. You want to tell us about that. I don't know how if well. I guess it is official, but it's it's sort of a volunteer part of my job, I guess, I would say. So. I serve on the wellness committee for our healthcare system, or for the physician group of our healthcare system, and it is a topic I am very passionate about and think about a lot. I think I do have kind of a unique perspective because I have one eye on the p of like resident wellness and what that means as they're kind of becoming physicians. I have another on the pulse of like a half administrative career, which is my own and my secret weapon in understanding things. I think at a little bit of a deeper web level than many is my husband, because I also see what a very hectic clinical job with high demands and kind of a high value placed on what they do. Can how that intersects with the challenge of cultivating wellness, and so I do think I'm a good person to be delving into this. At the same time, it can be very hard to know what as an individual one can do to promote more wellness amongst physicians, and it is a huge challenge that is being faced at many different places, as you know, especially all kinds of healthcare obviously has faced unprecedented challenges this past year, but even before then, everyone was talking about physician burnout, and this committee existed even pre COVID. So yeah, it's really really interesting and learning and just a lot of things to think about in that role. Yeah. No, well, it's a great idea that they're doing it. I mean, since, as you said, physicians turn out to be human beings who have you know, bodies that fall apart, brains that need a break, and recognizing that among the people who deliver our health care, given it that it is such a big part of everyone else's health too, is probably important, though interestingly has not necessarily been an important narrative in the past. So we're glad that that is coming to the front right now. So you had written a blog post recently which was your answer to everything on wellness. So this was on the personal side. So if somebody's like, I, what are the things that you know make me feel better and reduce work struss, what did you come up with? Yeah, well, the first of all, the title was completely like tongue in cheek, like I do not have the answer to everything. This came from. It's just like a long time joke Josh and I have had because when I was in medical school, the first year, we had to do a motivational interviewing exercise. So I'm like this baby eighteen year old no nineteen, twenty two year old first year med student, and I'm trying to convince this like fake patient to stop smoking and by doing a motivational interview and at the end, I said, now, that's the secret to this whole thing. I came to it and I played it for Josh and he's like, you just told that guy that you knew the secret to this whole thing. And so that's that's become We use that phrase in our house when someone sort of acts like the answer to something, it's like so easy and they know everything, and it's like, obviously, you just stop smoking. I never thought of it that way before, twenty two year old, first year med school and I just I will bring you the secret to this whole thing. I'm sure he said it like very earnestly and cute. Thank goodness it was an actor. Yes, yes, thank goodness. You don't get to practice, for the most part on real patience. That's a first year meda student. That is so true, although you do get to spend some time with patients and more and more actually as time has gone by. Anyway, So I just as I wrote out this list, I recognize that I did not know the secret, and that's sort of why I sarcastically titled it if that kind of makes a sense, because for everybody it's different. But the things that I did come up for myself that might help other individuals. And again this is not on the institutional side, but like what can you do within yourself getting enough sleep? Number one, remembering why you're there each day, like maybe even taking a moment as you walk into work and be like I am here to take care of patients and to like work effectively as a team to make kids healthier, like remembering that spending some time outside each day and taking effective breaks like using that fifteen minutes you might have between sessions to take a little walk instead of just scroll. That helps me plan. Obviously, don't need to delve into that one, but I find it a secret to life for real, spend some time teaching and sometime learning. I think that this does invigorate many, at least healthcare workers. It's really really fun to see like students develop and impart your wisdom and teach them things to have at least one non work hobby that feels meaningful to you. I know this really really helps my husband to have something like guitar that is just completely separate from work that actually helps him enjoy his work paradoxically more. To take time to thank others and be generous, especially the people that you're working with, not spend excessive money. And we can delve into that in a little bit, but I do think that's actually important. Don't think that you are superhuman or special. That is a complex trap I've seen some physicians seem to get into. Like remember, even you know everybody you're working with, we're all people, and we all have jobs. And we're all trying to do our best. And finally, if you are a parent, don't skip on childcare. So that's the very best of both worlds tip for everyone. But I want to have you elaborate a little bit on this. I mean, because one of the things you did put is don't spend excessive money in here, So how is how is that benefiting your your wellness a lot of I mean, so what I've learned over the past few years is physicians especially are notorious for overspending what they're earning to the point where they become very, very dependent on not even their jobs like sustaining, but their jobs growing. And I think that that pressure, like if you were like, oh, if I don't earn this like extra bonus, I won't be able to afford my mortgage payments, like if you put yourself into that kind of a position. We certainly don't, but some people do. Then I think that it as a completely unnecessary layer of pressure to what is already a high stress job. And so I do feel like structuring your life so that there is not a lot of financial stress and you kind of know the future is well planned and you're on a path that you know. I guess you don't have to do heroics to increase your earnings in order to have a comfortable retirement or meet your goals. I think that adds to overall wellness. I know that once we got stuff in better order, that added to my own personal wellness and oddly helped me to feel a little bit more free at work, maybe because I didn't feel like I you just feel less desperate, like you feel more like you know, I could do something else if I needed to, or I could, I could find another job and it wouldn't even necessarily have to be like exactly the same paying job. It just gives you a lot more flexibility and freedom and one less thing to worry about. Yeah, now that's a great point, because yeah, I mean having a bonus be a bonus is probably wise for one psychological wellness in general, that if you live on what you know you will make even if it's not a great year, than if it is. It's all gravy, and you know, you don't have to push yourself to for something that is more variable and that you wouldn't know. So that's that's good advice for people, whether you're in medicine or not. Of course, the one place that you do want to spend is the childcare. And talk a little bit about this because when people are like skimping on childcare, I mean, what are the ways people do that that make, you know, adds to their stress. I mean I get tempted myself. I'm like, do we really need full time with the kids are? And then I really search myself and I'm like, well, it would make every morning very stressful, and then I'd be on a time clock every afternoon. Like I think, having a little bit more than you truly need so that you have a buffer and you know that if you have, you know, a meeting that has to happen at six pm, like I have tonight that I don't have to stress over. You know who's going to help me with that? It greatly adds to my It really takes away from career stress, because that does become a layer of career stress if you feel very, very constrained by your hours. And I recognize that as a luxury like that that is not something that everyone can do, but probably most physicians, depending on their other lifestyle choices, can afford a little bit of extra kind of buffer zone there and I that it does add to quality of life and probably increases just general job satisfaction because you feel like, Okay, I'm gonna have to work an extra hour here and there, but then I can get it all done without like that additional layer of stress of scrambling to figure out what to do with the kids. Yes, it's funny that we're talking about this right now because we have a giant snowstorm and that forces a change in our general childcare arrangements. But what we have the four older kids home with us right now doing virtual school, although Alex is not doing virtual school right now because I can't supervise it. I'm here doing something else. I will supervise it in the afternoon, but I can't in the morning. So he's just playing his Kindle, which we found. It was hidden in the house but has been found. So that's an exciting thing for anyone who is reading my blog and wondering about that. But this is how it is at the moment with this. But it is not some thing that I could say like, oh, hey, you know, since we're both working from home, we don't need childcare at all, right, Like that would just be ridiculous. And yet yet I know a lot of people the year had to make do with that with the pandemic over the past year, or have maybe thought like, oh, yeah, why don't we try that? Would I would suggest you not try that if there are other options. And yes, you know, good child care costs money, but one of our themes here on Best of both worlds is that that is actually worth putting money into that. Maybe there are other areas of life that we can cut back on in order to you know, have that quality of life aspect. Right, Well, why don't we take a short break and then we'll be back with more on what managers and what institutions can do. All right, Well, we are back talking about workplace wellness. Sarah is on the official wellness committee at her institution. She talked about what people can do individually to make themselves feel better to reduce workplace stress. But after she posted on her blog about this, of course other people chimed in with things that managers and organizations can do and that they've seen. So, Sarah, what what are some of those things that our readers and listeners came up with. Yeah, So, one thing was to make sure that counseling for stressors is easily available, and that could be you know, directly through some sort of online service, through HR, could be through help benefits. But also not only should the workplaces make sure that those services are available, but they should make sure that employees have goodly way to use those services when needed. Because somebody did point out that it's you know, it's great to have psychologists available, but if I need to use them during business hours and I'm not allowed to you know, take the time off to go to an appointment, then it's useless. So having those services available and having the ability to kind of take breaks when needed to use those services, that was somebody some brought up. A lot of people were passionate about fitness and having the workplace you know, either provide incentives for exercise or have like convenient on site fitness facilities. But then they also mentioned that it has to be part of the work culture, so it can't be seen as like, you know, weird or wrong to work out during your lunch break. You actually want to see like the leadership doing it and modeling it to make it a normal thing and kind of encourage that wellness culture within the institution. So having having the facilities available and having the behaviors modeled by those in leadership. I thought that was an interesting one. Yeah, No, that's a great one. Yeah. And then moving down the actual workplace wellness programs like one on sleep someone mentioned, Yeah, there was somebody who commented on my blog that has a role as like I think a corporate like what like. She consults with companies to help improve their wellness and she said one of their most successful campaigns was actually to do a huge education and I don't know if they also maybe like altered some things about schedules. She didn't really talk about specifics, but to improve the quality and amount of sleep that the people at the company got, and she said that ended up having trickle down effects into many other realms like exercise and like other kinds of kind of job satisfaction and engagement things. So I thought that was really really cool. Another company mentioned having like an on site massage therapist or optional fund social events. I do think the key is optional because I think if they become obligatory, you will get people complaining that they wanted that time for family and how dare the organization like force them to be doing events for wellness when you know they But at the same time, if they're optional, then they can just be you know, opportunities to hang out with colleagues in a more informal setting like a book club, unrelated to you know, the work topic that you have. We used to call it mandatory fun. Yeah, I don't think it's not a mandatory mandatory fun. Agree. Agree. I think I think suggested ways that people might want get involved if desired, because you're right, the desire to do that's going to vary based on people's life stages and time constraints and all things like that. And then one thing that was mentioned in the Medical Realm was making sure that workloads are reasonable and a management that doesn't just listen to problems but responds to them. So I think that is huge. I mean, it's great if the management takes a listening ear to you saying, like, you know, I really need someone to help me with notes, I need an assistant or ascribe. And if they listen and nod, that's not helpful. But if less yours exactly if they listen and to find out what you need and sort of partner with you to say, you know what, I would love that you would have more productivity, you would be happier. Is a way you could like sneak in one extra patient per day if I provided you described to help offset the costs, and then most positions would be like great, no problem. So a management that actually, you know, responds to these quote unquote pebbles in your shoes that you deal with every day is huge. And one person said that was sort of what made the difference with her between various jobs as to whether whether people work together and whether administration actually listened and responded to concerns. And I love like one more you had on the list, which was closure during holidays. I think this is this is something you could check very easily if you are thinking of taking a job looking at their schedule, because an office that you know, if you're not providing life and death services here obviously, you know, if you're in the police force, you're going to work over Christmas like, because that's just you know that people need to be operated on sometimes, you know, over Christmas, this is life. But most of us are not doing that right And so if the office is closed for major holidays, like they don't just say oh yeah, we come in on the Friday after Thanksgiving, Like now they actually are closed from like Wednesday to Monday, or you know, Tuesday to Monday. Whatever. That's a way to show that they aren't forcing people to take vacation days to sort of what is considered a normal holidays schedule, and that may indicate that they have a little bit more belief that it is appropriate to take time off for holidays that people might wish to spend with family. Well I find that a little funny because at least where I work, when the office is closed, those are vacation days that come out of your vacation banks. So I don't know that probably varies wherever you're going, But still I still think it can be helpful because it's like saying, you know what, things are going to be quiet. We don't need you to check your inbox, Like this is time that everyone's going to kind of step away from everything but the urgent. And of course one on call person can cover the urgent, but that can be a different person every year for any given holidays. So you do get that that time, whether or not it's you know, coming out of your your vacation bank or not. I think that wasn't even more Sorry, I was just going to say, I think this is you know, especially as a number of sort of the the cool and hip employers are experimenting with not actual vacation days, right, Like it's more flexible how many you take, Like there's not like you get ten exactly and you must account for all ten. The closures actually do help because they people know it is okay, right, and many people are like, oh, well, I don't want to take all ten because that shows I'm the kind of person who takes all ten. But like you need them to get the actual holidays up. So if the place is closed, it's a sign that everybody is taking it off. And so especially if it isn't counted against your bank of PTO, that can be helpful for that kind of place. That makes sense, and leaders need to model that. So I think that's kind of a key theme throughout. If the leadership is like offering all these things, but then they're sending emails at Sunday at ten am and like at you know, five am on a Thursday, and inviting you to a mandatory meeting at seven pm, then like they're they're not they're not really modeling all of these things. And I think especially with the vacation stuff. I mean, this doesn't apply necessarily to a medical place, but like if you work in some I don't know, Silicon Valley corporation and they're saying that the office is closed, then I think I think the boss should make a big show of being like, we're closed, and I'm also going to Tahiti or whatever. Maybe not now, but someday someday. Yeah, exactly. So, Sarah, if you were, you know, in charge of a big place and you were going to, you know, have the best in class wellness someplace, what would you do, Like, what would be the first thing you'd do? I would make sure I would. I would. I would respond to what that person said about management really really listening, and I would put in place some sort of regular forums for people to bring up concerns with kind of dedicated problem and troubleshooting measures with formalized follow up to see if these things like got taken care of. So I think I would, I would, and I am. I mean, we aren't doing some of the stuff. So it's not even just pretend like opening lines of communication to troubleshoot what is actually bothering people. I think that's one thing. I would mandate that people use their vacation. This is maybe a little bit you know, controvers but you know, physicians, there's all this discussion about burnout, and then if you actually drilled down, you will often find that many people who are extremely burned out have paid time off in their bank, sometimes weeks of it, and have not used it. So I would create a culture where it was very important to take time off and to actually be off during that time off. I mean, that's why we are in these groups that have coverage models set, and I think that we can because of you know, better communication and you know, I kind of think the electronic medical record does help with this. We can better hand off from patient to patient and feel like we can truly turn off when we're off. So I would encourage more of that. Yeah, there was that. For people who've read Cheryl Sandberg's lean In, she talks about her office manager when she was in the Washington DC office of McKenzie, talking about how people would leave all the time because they were burned out, but they always had weeks of unpaid, untaken vacation time. Said well, I can understand that, you know, people might not want to do this. Job forever. Like sure, you know, maybe people don't want to do this job forever, but you know the company is going to ask whatever they're going to ask of you. It's up to you to set your boundaries as well. And so if you're feeling burned out and you've got two weeks of vacation time that you haven't used, like try taking that first right and then and then come back and see how you feel. And you know, maybe you still want to quit, and that's fine, but it's not just that you haven't had a vacation in ten months and so you have to quit. It's like, well, well, there's actually a mechanism for you to take a vacation, Like it's there. You have to do it, though, Yeah, And I think I think it's I think it's really underrated. I think that the anticipating the vacation is good for us, spending that time apart with family, trying as best as you can not to pollute that vacation with you know, multiple work tests and projects, which I you know, if people show that that's the norm, then other people feel tempted to do it. And I think that's such a sad slip slope. So yeah, I think that. I think that's a priority as well as administration very much listening to people's everyday concerns and responding to them. So how's your wellness and how's how's Josh's right? Now? You know my I feel like my wellness is very good. But you're so proactive about it. I mean, you have so many good habits in place. They're like, well, I exercise every morning, and I journal and I meditate in my own I mean, this is you consciously doing this. I mean, so I am very proactive about it. Sometimes I feel like, well, does this mean like am I getting away with something? Like is my job just like easy? But then I look around and people who are theoretically doing my same job and they don't necessarily seem so stress free. So but like at the same time, it's like, well, what am I doing? Right? I don't know. I guess you're right, like I am in a polder. So maybe that helps me to put myself first sometimes, like I'm gonna go buy my routines. I'm also pretty proactive about work tasks because I find that being proactive and staying ahead of the game tends to save a lot of time. I've got to know you really well, and I follow people like cal Newport really well. So I think I've gotten really efficient at parts of my job. I'm not a perfectionist, and I'm also willing to hand off and let others cover me, and I think that's a I think that's an important skill. You have to learn to trust others. And I have no problem doing that if it means that I can unplug for a period of time. And I really like my job, like I both the residency part and the clinical part. When I go into work, like, yes, there can be like little things of course about anything that are just you know, annoying, but on a global picture, I just feel like, Wow, what I'm doing is important, and I'm connecting with families and I'm helping train residents, and since all of those things feel meaningful to me, it's pretty easy. But I but I also I'm not going to lie and say I work seventy hours a week. I totally don't. I work like forty or less probably, And I'm that's fine. Doing your job in forty hours. I mean that's like, I'm pretty sure watching you rise up the ranks in your organize that you have I think I'm doing my job. I see my patients, I see my volume, I get my notes in, I run my residency. I'm pretty active. I'm check off the boxes. So yeah, I mean it's it's hard to know, but it seems like it's a great balance. Now, Josh is an interesting case and I guess this is the way I think of Josh, the case study of Josh. I asked him the other day. I was like, do you feel like you have good wellness? And I think I asked him when he was doing notes at like five point thirty in the morning, and he was like He's like, no, yeah, oh really Okay. It's like, yeah, I don't know why, but I do. And I'm like, that is very interesting. And he says, well, I feel like I have some time I can spend with the family and somehow I can spend with my hobbies, and it doesn't really bother me that my work sometimes bleeds into certain other areas of life. Now, he definitely works more than forty hours a week, although he's been better, And I think I will take a tiny bit of credit for this about being more intentional about when he's going to work later, when he's going to get stuffed done. I actually showed him the case study that Obijui in that asked a question many episodes ago about like, well, when should I get my charts done? And so we worked out like certain nights that he's going to work on charts, which means there's certain nights that he's not going to work on charts and either do something for himself like he's been doing this guitar thing, or have a night with a family, or beat the kind of dad on call on a given night. And I also think he's gotten better about spending his call weekends really really really really catching up so that when he's not on call, he doesn't feel bound to do a ton of EMR catch up and that helps. And I think he does find a lot of meaning in what he does and enjoys that. I think he likes teaching. I think he likes the patient care. I think he really forms true relationships with his colleagues. And you know, many surgeons get kind of a god complex and he is the opposite of that. So I think all these things help. And I think his wellness is pretty good despite on paper what might look like you would be at risk for not being well, that's good. The younger family has good systems in place. Nobody surprise, We do not skim by job. That is for sure exactly well cool, and we just wanted to, you know, before we move on to our Q and A talk about broadly what makes an organization a great place to work, because this has actually been studied fairly well as one might imagine. You know, people are interested in becoming an employer of choice. Some places aren't, but some places certainly are. And it turns out that it's not just throwing money at people. Now, we are fully in favor of throwing money at people, but that is not the primary thing. It can't make up for other problems. People want autonomy, which is that you can mostly choose how you do your work. You may be held accountable for results, but you are mostly responsible for figuring out within a range of how you do your work. And that also includes flexibility over hours and location. So if it is a job that can occasionally be done remotely, that you are able to do that. We've found out that a lot more jobs fall in that category over the past year, but certainly, moving forward, hopefully more places will recognize that opportunities for growth, that there is a career trajectory and that there is interest in your development. That when somebody joins an organization, it is understood that you would like to see them learn and grow within that organization. That nobody is hired as a sort of dead end kind of thing. That there is always an opportunity for you to move up and get more responsibility, and if it requires more training for you to get to that place, that the organization is actively interested in making that happen for you. A collaborative, inclusive culture that people enjoy working with their colleagues, and that incentives don't pit everyone against each other. If you're on a sales team where it's like, okay, one guy goes to Hawaii and the rest of you get yelled at, like no, that doesn't work at all, you want to make sure that that's not going on. That there's a sense of purpose what Sarah talked about, that she shows up and thinks, Okay, I'm taking care of kids. I'm helping them get healthy. If you are organized around a sense of purpose, which obviously not all of us are in the business of helping kids get healthy. We can't all have that, but there's probably something that is cool about where you work, what you're doing. Maybe you have a product that really brings people joy, or you're helping other businesses run more efficiently and so that they can do the great things they're doing. There's all sorts of wonderful purpose. But if you are united around that, it makes it a great place to work. And of course, then throwing money at people great pay and benefits never a bad thing, though again it can't make up for the others, but it can't be missing either. So you want to be at least in the top half of your industry distribution. So, yeah, Sarah, anything to add to that. No, I think I've gotten pretty darn lucky. I just want to say that if I came across as like, oh, I have the best job and I'm really good at doing it, I think there is an element of luck. And I am very lucky to have trained in a place that was pretty good to work. And I certainly work in a place that I think is fantastic to work. And there are in better places to be, and I like that where I work is trying to be even better than they already are. But but I do feel like I lucked out in that realm. That's awesome. Well Vandercam Inc. Is a well, it's actually Vandercamp Media, I'll say. But anyway, we're okay on the wellness front. Tough Boss, Yes, definitely, little podcasting job has excellent wellness benefits as well. Yeah, exactly. All right, So our question did this come in from Instagram? Or where did this? I think so I went through my photos because a lot of times I will screenshot questions that come in and that's a little behind scenes at the fact that I still haven't totally organized it. But this one I think came from Instagram, which was suggestions on how to get out the door with a toddler. I thought that was a great question. It's a great question because there's no answer. It's like I love, I love the idea that people have these questions as if we have the answers. Sarah, do you have the answer? I don't think I have the answer. I mean, we've had a lot of years to work on the process. I think there are some things I can share which have helped. Okay, Well, one thing, and you mentioned this as well, is that I think if you have one person in charge of kid wrangling that is beneficial. I think sometimes it's actually worse when there are two because it's like not clear who's in charged. So today is a day that Josh drives the kids to school, but we've kind of established this nice division where like he's going to drive them and appear at seven thirty, and I'm going to help get them to that point. And it's very clear that they're answering to me in terms of like getting dressed and eating their breakfast and whatever. So I think getting rid of the ambiguity with who's in charge helps keeping the clothes downstairs and the toothbrushes downstairs, and the minimizing trips up and down the stairs to the extent possible, I think can be can be great. I have a cutoff time. This one's hard, but I try to enforce a cutoff time for eating breakfast because like three year olds in particular, you can like take two bites and then like get distracted and then want to take another bite. To the point where like they're eating takes forty five minutes and it really doesn't need to. So if it's like seven twenty, I'm like, well, you have two more minutes to finish eating. If you're not done, that's fine. We will put it in a bag and you can bring that to school and need it when you get there, because like they're not going to starve, they can eat it in thirty minutes. And then with older kids, I will like, just walk out the door, you like, meet me in the car. It doesn't work, doesn't really work with Genevieve, but the other two we'll get frantic and we'll actually usually get out pretty quickly. Yeah, I would say getting out the door with five children requires effort. We're usually not doing all five except on weekends, and I will admit that I am often running around like a crazy person and yelling. And this is partly a function of the nature of pandemic era family activities, is that you have timed tickets for stuff, and so like in a normal world it wouldn't matter if we got in the car ten minutes later to go to the zoo than we did, but now it does because you have a limited window in which you are allowed to show up at the gates. And so this has added slightly to the stress of getting us out. So what I have I have a leaving time and I have a getting in the car time, and the getting in the car time is about ten minutes prior to the leaving time, so that that is when I start saying shoes on, coats on, masks on, whatever else. We need, diaper bag which is you know, usually packed but whatever, and we have diapers and wipes in the car, so it's not even a deal. But kids are given warnings ahead of time, so it's not like I just announced, Okay, we're getting shoes on. Like we've talked through like this afternoon at one o'clock we will be doing this. We have everything the necessary equipment in the mudroom bins hockey equipment, not hockey equipment, you know what I'm saying, Like everything that is needed is in the bins. The masks. I still wind up grabbing ones for everybody. I you know, I there's no good they're not stored there because then they get all dirty. So we store them in a certain place in the kitchen. But then they like nobody, they get their shoes on and they're like, oh wait, I forgot my mask, and so they have to take their shoes off and walk back to the kitchen. It's just I wind up grabbing them and then they put them down and then wind up in the car without them. But that's another matter, the you know, the one. We only have one kid who is engaged in any active subterfuge of not getting in the car, and you know, our listeners can probably guess which child that is. And so I have occasionally had to run back in the car house or send Michael back in the house to find him, grab him, pull him out. So occasionally I'm just like yelling like a crazy person in the driveway as I realize he has run back in the house and like hidden somewhere. So I'm sure our neighbors have all kinds of opinions on us. And you know, so you can keep listening to best of both worlds for more pro parenting tips like that, well you're gonna get new neighbors, Okay, you'll start fresh. No, there's definitely yelling that happens out the door sometimes with masks. I don't have the kids. I just grab it and then I have them put it on in the car, because I agree if I were to give it to them in the house, like I don't know that it would make it to the car. And I'm sure people have gotten to the point where like in my weekend bag, I have like extra masks in a plastic bag because maybe them in the backpacks too. So I'm the like bringing kids to school, you know, I look and see are they wearing them? When I'm in the car because we've been stopped using the bus service because of you know, COVID for the morning runs and stuff. But it's uh yeah, just one more thing. We have a sign by the door like do you have mask charged computer, snack or lunch if needed, But it's become part of the wallpaper at this point. So I was just gonna say that would work until it didn't. Didn't. That doesn't, but it's a good try, good all right. Love of the week, Sarah, what's yours? Yeah, So, since this was a work themed episode, I would just like to announce that I've had the same Litman pediatric stethoscope since residency and it is still going strong. I did replace the eartips at one point because they got like disintegrated or something. But like I was just thinking, as I was creating the notes for this episode, I just looked over and I'm like, that thing looks great and it's old now, so I hope that that could be my only stethoscope of my career. Going to make it to retirement, well, maybe my love of the week will too. I bought a fifteen pound kettlebell, so I've been doing, you know, every day a little something in terms of strength and resistance training. I started on January first, and as of February, late February, as we're recording this, I have been doing it every single day. I started with the ten pound kettle bell because that's what I had, and then I decided, as I had done this for close to two months, that I was feeling a bit more motivated, so bought a fifteen pound kettlebell, which was available. I know, at the start of the pandemic there was a huge run on dumbbells and kettlebells and everything as people are trying to do home based fitness. But the beauty of the market is that this has been re established now, so if you are thinking all the fitness equipment is gone, it is back, so you too can buy yourself heavier weights if you are looking to do so. So my love of the week is my fifteen pound kettlebell. Hopefully I'll stick with that for a couple months and then maybe I'll move on to twenty pounds. Woo Shelsey, stay Tunedo. That's awesome. Congratulations. All right, well, this has been best of both worlds. We have been talking about workplace wellness and we will be back next week with more on making work and life fit together. Thanks for listening. You can find me Sarah at the shoebox dot com or at the Underscore Shoebox on Instagram, and you can find me Laura at Laura vandercam dot com. This has been the best of both worlds podcasts. Please join us next time for more on making work and life work together.