Buck Showalter unfiltered: Yankees spending, Philly drama, Injury communication questions

00:00:03
Speaker 1: Let me ask you a question, So, how are you surprised by these injuries in the spring? Like we used to have everybody, we'd take about ten or fifteen people and you got you got these five guys. You got these five guys. You got these five guys, and you would call them once a week or every ten days, go, hey, how do you feeling what's going on? You know, our ability to detect stuff is almost too good. You take enough MRIs and enough pictures, you're gonna find something wrong with everybody.

00:00:30
Speaker 2: I think.

00:00:30
Speaker 1: I'm not saying it's right or wrong, or guys were tougher, but guys used to throw through a lot of things. But I'm shocked with how many people get surprised by someone being hurt in the spring when when they get there, what were you doing in the off season?

00:00:44
Speaker 3: You know, you tell me too much.

00:00:46
Speaker 1: But the Mets traded their backup short stop before they knew Lindor was gonna miss time. I mean, it's important with the decision, the things you do in all season, knowing the health of your people. I've talked to Keith Meister about this. Hey, we take enough pictures, we're gonna find something wrong with everybody, Okay, I'm done, So.

00:01:05
Speaker 4: I mean we're gonna stay on that.

00:01:07
Speaker 3: Fuck.

00:01:08
Speaker 4: You need to be the one that changes this because this is a billion dollar question.

00:01:15
Speaker 3: This.

00:01:15
Speaker 4: If teams can figure this out, who cares about draft picks and qualifying offers and contracts?

00:01:20
Speaker 3: You figure this out.

00:01:22
Speaker 4: Should players come into spring training throwing one hundred miles an hour in their first bullpen?

00:01:27
Speaker 2: No, there's the progression. You know, you're trying to get to the end game.

00:01:31
Speaker 1: You know, I used to not watch guys throw, and I wouldn't let a bunch of people stand around down in the bullpen when they're throwing or batting practice. There's fifty people with evaluation tools or whatever around the cage watching them throw. Hey, you're not trying to make the team. Well, then why are twenty people watching me throw? Get away from them. Let let them have the progression to get to the end game of the start of the season. And you know, now these people are bringing thirty and forty pitchers into camp.

00:02:00
Speaker 2: How can you evaluate them?

00:02:01
Speaker 1: And how can you I used to if you had over sixty people in camp, you're going to have a tough time evaluating players properly. You don't need more than six catchers. You don't need more than twenty eight to thirty pitchers. But now I look at the size of these spring training rosters, there's no way you can evaluate these people properly. Or Okay, you guys got me going, I'll.

00:02:24
Speaker 5: Stop, no buck, I love this because here's my thing. You asked what they're doing in the offseason. They're doing too much. These kids. Most of these kids, since they're ten years old, I'll say ten years old to twelve years old, especially, pictures have been pictures only and all they do is throw and throw and throw and try to get their VL up so they get recruited or so they get drafted, right, and then eventually you got to pay the price for that.

00:02:47
Speaker 3: And they never take time off. We just had, I forget.

00:02:50
Speaker 5: We had on last week a picture and I said, hey, you don't take any time off, and they're like, no, I just keep going. I just keep throwing. I take about a week off and keep throwing and keep throwing and keep throwing. And then in the off season they all go to drive line and they go to tread and they go to all these places and they say, gosh, I want to improve my stuff. Well, The only way I can improve is if I throw one hundred miles an hour every day in the in December, so they never get their body of time to relax and recover, and then all of a sudden they're like, oh wait, on first day of camp, here's one hundred. I mean you remember dude, Mark Burley would come in his first bullpen would be about forty miles an hour, right, Brad Raky. Literally we get out there and go, oh, I'm just gonna feel it, right he They've been throwing, but they were just like, you know, it's a different adrenaline, it's different everything. I'm just gonna feel it and get and then slowly build up. Now it's like first day we have the iPad. Oh, let's see my vert and my horizontal, all my this and that.

00:03:47
Speaker 1: No iPads should be allowed around them throwing for the first three or four balance.

00:03:51
Speaker 2: You know, it's funny. I'm a big bio guy.

00:03:52
Speaker 1: When I look at pictures, you know, young pictures that we signed or whatever that are in camp. I love when a guy has play three sports or two sports and he hasn't pitched or played year round. You know, the arm and the shoulder and the elbow. The time off is precious. I pill guys get away from it, don't pick up a baseball until whatever. And pitching coaches, you know, the time off is so precious. But guys that played baseball only year round, it was a big red flag because we knew they were gonna.

00:04:20
Speaker 2: Have some along the line. Now. I remember one.

00:04:23
Speaker 1: Guy said, hey, what positions you played when you didn't pitch? He goes, well, I didn't play another position. I go, wait a minute, you didn't hit or play when you didn't pitch in high school? Well no, really, that guy lasted about two weeks.

00:04:38
Speaker 2: All right.

00:04:38
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00:04:47
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00:05:02
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00:05:25
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00:05:26
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00:05:38
Speaker 5: He tried to find something on me and he couldn't, So that's a lie. When he told you you'll find everything, he couldn't find anything on me, So you know him.

00:05:46
Speaker 3: He was great.

00:05:47
Speaker 1: Nobody knew what you want. Keith's great. If I had to send some my thumb it go. But you know the drill. They do the check swing drill, and you've seen that one where they start the bad as fast as they can. Then they slam the handle back into the amate bomb area and you know they've got They've taken so many reps. Now you know Eric, you know this it's like you got a machine, you got a short toss, you got teamwork, you got ten guys at throw battye practice, and I don't know, it's just like we're always trying to run everything down to empty. You know, let's make sure your dad ever tried to see how low he could get his that gas tank before he put gas in it.

00:06:25
Speaker 3: You know, Yeah, I still do that. Trick works. It works.

00:06:28
Speaker 2: Sometimes your wife's crazy. That's your wife crazy.

00:06:32
Speaker 4: Now, don't yeah, don't do that. My question is, fuck, is baseball too much? Like well, everyone else is doing it, so we have to do it? And do you think you'll see in your lifetime an organization that says no, that's fine, because I remember I remember back in I forget maybe fifteen years ago. I'm not sure who it was. If it was the rangers of somebody that Knowlan Ryan was working with, and they were saying, Hey, we're gonna have these guys actually throw longer in games. We're going to have them do different things. Is that the rest of the industry is not doing or are we all just sheep and just doing the exact same thing and afraid of looking outside of the box to create a healthier, better product for one organization.

00:07:16
Speaker 1: Well, they copy each other. They think someone's getting ahead. And you know, I looked at a staff the other day. I just out of curiosity, I said, see if I know about this coaches that they had fourteen people on the coaching staff. That's like an NFL team that plays sixteen or seventeen games. Fourteen Trish, you think Indiana has fourteen coaches on their football team. Maybe, but I just yeah, You've got so many people tripping over themselves to matter. We're all chasing titles. Hey, I'm a director of left handed sliders in the dirt.

00:07:47
Speaker 2: You know. Hey, I'm the director. I'm the I don't know a coordinator.

00:07:51
Speaker 1: It's like I was talking to an ex manager the other day, you know, the field coordinator for the team, Well, the field coordinator. Someone asked me about helping a spring train and run spring train. I said, hey, if your manager can't run spring training, you might have the wrong manager.

00:08:06
Speaker 2: And I don't know.

00:08:07
Speaker 1: We've we've got so many people trying to build a niche that and there's a lot of copycat that goes on, Wait a minute, they're doing that, let's let's go. It's like a charm Bracelet let me get my charm You know, I remember when Itchiro and Montsouey came out and I had been over Japan. I said, hey, these two guys stick out like short thumbs. The drop off from them to the next offensive player is huge. But everybody tried to go get their charm brace. But hey, I've got a player from Japan. Well wait a minute, you don't have Montsoue, you don't have Itchi row You know that each person's different, and it's like charm brace's, Hey I've got my this. Hey I've got my this. That team has this, and we got to get one of these and get one of this. I just wondered at some point if an owner is going to go, what are we getting for this? You know, we're just in the last place again, what are we What advantage are we gaining by having this? Because you know, you can you can really confuse players with too many voices, and I think you're careful about that.

00:09:05
Speaker 3: I agree Buck.

00:09:05
Speaker 5: By the way, since Indiana has the National Football Trophy, they apparently can't afford good Wi Fi. So Tricia, we lost Tricia for a second. You know, Mark Cuban and her Big or Big Tricia and Sydney podcast where they had Mark Cuban. Maybe she could ask Mark for a little loan to get better Wi Fi.

00:09:23
Speaker 8: I'll send this to filhim afterwards from AJ how about that. I'll tell me Mark Cuban buy me a better WiFi. I'm sure he will. Well, you know, not to bring up AU football again. I lost you guys for like a whole minute there, but you were talking about how a time off is really necessary and taking a break is necessary. You want to know what IU football head coach is Kurt Signetti. His theory and his philosophy on practice is high efficiency, short duration practices, ninety minutes on the field, and he doesn't like long grueling sessions because he wants to keep players fresh and healthy.

00:09:59
Speaker 3: That's his approach.

00:10:00
Speaker 5: That's because they're all thirty years old, Tricia. They got they need to get in there to go see their grand they are.

00:10:06
Speaker 8: You don't need to do your research, sir, they are not thirty years good.

00:10:12
Speaker 1: It's the same way with spring training. You know, you got thirty year old guys that you have to entertain. We never did a drill more than ten to twelve minutes. Their attention span. And you know I used to tell we're not going to do things till we get them right. We're going to do them till we can't do them wrong. And we would get on and off the field and do things. And efficiency is what you're looking for and purpose of what you're doing, and you know every everything you do, it's like rehearsing a Broadway play down in spring training, because when the curtain goes up in the spring, it always kills me. How a rundown happens in game one and nobody knows how to run it, or a relay is messed up. I go, what were you doing in spring training? You know that's what that was for, rehearsing your lines for this Broadway play? And what do we do if it gets off the tracks?

00:10:58
Speaker 2: How do we handle it?

00:11:02
Speaker 8: I would all I would like to clarify something a j SID the IU football team. Let me tell you the average age. Yes, they are older. The average age is around twenty three years old. Forty seven guys aged twenty two to twenty five.

00:11:18
Speaker 5: I had all forty seven of them started. They were older I think than the Tennessee Titans who were in the NFL. So or there was within a year, So I mean, I don't know, Tricia.

00:11:27
Speaker 3: He's so good about that.

00:11:29
Speaker 8: I take when I show you.

00:11:31
Speaker 5: Guys have that national championship though, that you paid for and all that.

00:11:34
Speaker 3: Fine.

00:11:37
Speaker 1: Jealousy is a horrible emotion, so don't don't feel bad about it.

00:11:40
Speaker 2: They're just jealous.

00:11:41
Speaker 3: Okay, basketball school book, Florida's a basket, Dia.

00:11:45
Speaker 2: Hey did you guys? Did you guys ever play on a team that had a captain?

00:11:50
Speaker 3: That's what I was going to ask you about. We were just going to ask you about that. I did.

00:11:54
Speaker 5: Paul can Erica. His name happened so we could resign him in two thousand and six. After we won in two thousand and five, Ozzie's like, he's our captain, but he never wore a C, and I used to make fun of him. I'm like, you're the captain, how come you don't wear a sea Because he got the C that I could get the A for asshole, right.

00:12:08
Speaker 3: You know in hockey they have the C in the A, so I could have gone.

00:12:12
Speaker 2: Instead of assistant captain. It just shortened to.

00:12:14
Speaker 5: Ask right, yes, exactly exactly, So that's yes, I did play on one. But the fact that Stevie Cohen came out and said, Oh, the Mets, don't we I don't believe in this.

00:12:23
Speaker 3: You think Lindor's hurt by that?

00:12:27
Speaker 2: Probably down deep, I know that he would, you know, wanting to.

00:12:30
Speaker 1: Take on that that and all that entails is uh, there's a lot to ask of players nowadays. You know the dynamics of a locker room. You know, the people in it realize how it works, and it takes a special person to take on that responsibility of being that And you know, I've had I had Maddingly there and Jeter after him. Matt Williams was kind of our captain out in Arizona. But if you've got to put a C on somebody's jersey, I think you might. You know, everybody knows who that guy is. You have any doubt the two people over in Philadelphia who's running that ship?

00:13:06
Speaker 2: You know?

00:13:07
Speaker 1: And that's I think one of the best signings of the all season was the catcher in Philadelphia and of course Schwarber there. And you know, when you think about people that you can trust to do things because their voice once you do that and make that commitment. But I'm not sure a lot of owners really understand the dynamics of how locker room works in baseball where you play one hundred almost two hundred games counting screen train.

00:13:32
Speaker 3: Fuck.

00:13:35
Speaker 5: Yeah, they don't take the coin toss. They don't go out there in midfield and take the coin toss. I mean, I get it. It's a symbolic thing, right, I get it. But like other than just being like, hey, you're the captain because you've been here a long time, Like, what is the captain really do in baseball?

00:13:52
Speaker 1: Well, if we play a double header and I get thrown out of the first game, the captain takes a lineup party out the second game.

00:14:00
Speaker 3: Okay, not your bench.

00:14:04
Speaker 1: He's mad too, he went with me. If he's a bench coach, he probably left the building too.

00:14:10
Speaker 8: Wait, but you were talking about a voice. Their voice matters in the clubhouse when they're the captain. What can you kind of explain maybe the benefit of having that voice.

00:14:19
Speaker 6: To people who might not understand, you know, I.

00:14:23
Speaker 1: Think I think it's somebody that players so comfortable bouncing something off of and trusting them, and the coaches in the front office trust that guy to say the right thing and not be a sympathetic year. One of the things you have to do when you go into the new situation and struggle is you got to eliminate the sympathetic years to bs. If you get to the point where people go to this guy, hey, uh, you know there's they're screwing me here. Oh wait a minute, he don't want to hear. All right, let me go over here. Oh wait a minute, he don't want to hear what wait? Maybe I just got to play better. I used to erase all those signs that said, you know, some patent line or Churchill line, all these things written on the wall. They never made a player better. I just put one thing up there said play better, Play better. You know, nobody wants to hear it. People working nine to five, five days a week and staying up late at night when you're on the West Coast and watching team. They don't want to hear how your chartered plane was late or your five star hotel made too much noise. Just play better, shut up and post up. Okay, I'm done again. I had too much coffee.

00:15:20
Speaker 2: I love it buck though.

00:15:22
Speaker 8: I remember I used to listen to some things like that when players would say things like, yeah, you know, the car ride to spring training really messed up my legs, and it's just like, I get it, but do you think the nine to five worker wants to hear that. I'm not saying some of the complaints aren't legitimate, But sometimes when I hear players be like, oh those hotel beds at this five star hotel really messed up my neck, I'm like, you have a massage therapist at the field, you have a trainer, you have all of these things at your disposal, and that's why you say you're not hitting. It's confusing to me.

00:15:51
Speaker 2: I don't know, you know, I love this question.

00:15:55
Speaker 1: Communication is communication saying what you want to hear or what you need to hear.

00:16:00
Speaker 2: Big difference.

00:16:01
Speaker 1: Max Schurzer used to come in and PLoP down and we talk about life and everything. Max like bluntness. I love Max's bluntless with me and me back at it, and he loved it. He didn't want anything sugarcoated. And you're looking for those type of players. I just hope we don't have a lockout at the end of this thing.

00:16:20
Speaker 2: I don't like what I'm hearing.

00:16:22
Speaker 4: Two situations a team. He brought up about having possibly two captains in the Phillies' locker room. They've had the Castiano's situation and now they have the most recent information about Bryce Harper saying, you know, we thought it was kind of wild. How is a manager, when you're general manager or president of baseball operations, makes comments like that about one of your superstars on the team. What's your view and what's your next step?

00:16:53
Speaker 1: For both those situations, Well, you do talk to the player and just say, hey, what do you feeling?

00:16:59
Speaker 2: What are you thinking?

00:17:00
Speaker 1: And sometimes both parties are right, you know, whether you air it publicly or it's out there. You know, I would think that Dave had a purpose to everything he does. I knew in the whole Castalanas thing that there was going to be support of the manager there in between Matt, Donnie Maddingly, he's president Mattingly and and Dave. They're not going to put up with stuff like that, and they're going to support their player. And there's two sides to every story, there really is. You know, there's no expression. One of the worst things for a managers you never let a star fall on you. There's nothing worse than managing a guy that did great things for you, but he's I'm not saying Castlana's skills are going down. I'm just saying there's some things that you know, playing defense for a superstar late and again or a star player, and it's uncomfortable, but you've got to do what's best for the team.

00:17:47
Speaker 2: And uh, that's uncomfortable for a locker room.

00:17:51
Speaker 1: And no one will say it publicly, but you know, I think they're glad that the not the problem, but just the issue is not there anymore. Now he's a good player and they're going to have to replace him with some things. But you know, I know Robbie well, and uh, he's not looking for a problem. All he's looking for is given the Phillies the best chance to win a game.

00:18:11
Speaker 3: Fuck, has a player ever had a beer under your tutelage? After had?

00:18:16
Speaker 2: I just went there were a few games I wish I could have a sip of it.

00:18:19
Speaker 3: I can tell you that that's fair.

00:18:24
Speaker 1: Hey, my first game is the manager against the Boston Red Sox opening day Cleate Warrior. You ever seen a picky youwn cigarette? It's a really strong cigarette. It's not marijuana, but it's And he could tell I was a little nervous in ninth inning trying to close out the game, not that I remember. Steve Fark Jody Reid was a hitter, and Cleek asked me, if I want to take a drag off his cigarette and then tell you what, I don't even remember the last inning. I don't.

00:18:53
Speaker 5: Well, that's good. There's a lot of games I don't wish I didn't remember. Buck So you're one up on a lot of guys.

00:18:59
Speaker 2: You did you, Hey, let me tell you.

00:19:01
Speaker 1: You go in the locker rooms and there's some empty beer cans in there, and you go, now, years ago when guys would try to get that edge, so to speak, and.

00:19:12
Speaker 5: They took greenies. They took greenies, and beer kicked him back. And we've talked about a bucket's fine, you can say it. Everyone does, got a big deal.

00:19:19
Speaker 1: That's when I first knew. I went, wow, there's empty beer cans in here, are half empty.

00:19:25
Speaker 3: Mm hmm. All right.

00:19:26
Speaker 5: So now you hit the Yankees, and so let me ask you the question. When you were playing for George George Steinbrenner, would he have ever after not winning a World Series, brought back essentially the same team as the Yankees are doing this year. Now I know they get Garrett Cole at some point this year. But would he have ever done that, or would if he have said I need to change something, we need to miss mix this up and get a better team.

00:19:52
Speaker 1: Of course he would have, you know he you know, you knew the job description as a manager. You know, That's why I never complained about it. I knew, you know, I was there nineteen years. I've seen a lot of people come and go. But it doesn't mean make him right, and it doesn't mean Cashman's wrong. I mean the healthier if one. You know, if you ask every manager, what's the one thing you'd like to have when the season started, is the healthier players, you know, staying healthy? And you're what ips, that's what all seasons are for. Okay, what if you know Derek Jeter couldn't play, or what if Lindor got hurt? You know, that's your job as a GM and a manager is to attack the what ifs. And because it's not a normal thing to do your body to play seven days a week for seven or eight months. The last time you were one hundred percent was the day you got out of the car in spring training. And evidently some of them were one hundred percent this room. That's for sure, Peace, I can't believe the teams that are surprised by injuries that, you know, just all of a sudden appear in spring training. You know, I need to prepare for that, George,