Rachel Winder: Weaving the Bonds of Neurodiversity - A Mother and Son's Enlightening Odyssey through Autism and ADHD

Welcome to Why Not Me the World?
Podcast, hosted by Tony Mantor, broadcasting from Music City, USA, Nashville, Tennessee.
Join us as our guests tell us their stories. Some
will make you laugh, some will make you cry. Real
life people who will inspire and show that you are
not alone in this world. Hopefully you gain more awareness, acceptance,
and a better understanding for autism around the world. Hi,
I'm Tony Mantor. Welcome to Why Not Me the World.
Today's guest is Rachel Wynder. She's autistic and has a
son that's autistic. Her story is fascinating. Thanks for coming on.
No, thank you for allowing me this space. Basically, I'm sorry.
Sometimes if I'm a bit nervous, I talk very quickly,
and then sometimes I can't find our words, and then
sometimes I'm like, oh my god, I sounded really boring.
No need to be nervous here. You're definitely not boring,
and you've got a great story. I understand you have
an artistic child, is that correct?
Yeah? Yeah, so I'm autistic, ADHD, dyslectic, etc. I have
the full shebang, and my son, who's ten, he's basically
like a carbon copy of me. But obviously not me.
He is his own character. He and I discovered our
identities he was four, I was thirty nine, but when
we actually received our official medical model diagnosis, I was
forty and he was five and a half. So having
spent forty plus years of my life because I'm now
fortune five not knowing who I am, why I'm different,
thinking that I was broken, Well, it's just amazing to have,
like giving birth to an autistic adhder like me who
can share the same not same, got similar experiences and
share that insight and had that connection that I felt
I didn't have growing up.
What led you to get diagnosed at a later age?
I didn't think I was autistic or ADHD. I had
the kind of the sort of societal idea of what
autism was, what wasn't as it turns out to be,
And so thought, well, I can't be autistic, Okay, I
went to he has be twenty five. I went to
the GP because a friend of mine suggested that I
might be autistic. So I went to the GP. The
GP looked me up and down, said, oh, I'll refer you,
because at that time there wasn't a waiting list like
there is now. So like, within a week, I was
seeing an inverted Commas specialist. I wasn't in his office
for any more than five minutes, and he was, you know,
basically saying, because you've got friends and because you can
make eye contact, therefore you can't be autistic. But you know,
when you just sort of like, well, if they don't
actually know what autism looks like without trauma, then obviously
the people who are autistic can have masked their autistic
characteristics because they were like perceived as being undesirable to
the non autistic community. And so we then hit those characteristics.
But how are they ever going to put anybody, you know,
how are they ever going to know when everyone all
the autistic people are like, oh wow, I must be
more like the predominant neurotype and less my autistic self
because not acceptable way to be and sort of gets
me unwanted attention. So so I sort of like decided, well,
obviously the doctor must be right and I can't be autistic.
And then I just went along with, well, I must
be broken. There must be something wrong with me, because
I feel like, you know, I've got the pedal to
the metal all the time, right, people keep telling me
that you know, you need to be more like this,
you need to be more like that. I don't know
how many fans I've been told turn over a new leaf.
I'm not sure how many leaves I've turned over, but
rights probably like you know, Nottingham Forest, woodland. So it
wasn't until ten years after that, when I was thirty five,
I gave birth to Harry, and when he was sort
of too, I've sort of thought he's just like it's
got lots of things that are like me. Okay, when
he went to school, they picked up on things, but
they didn't want to talk to me about anything. That's
one of the things I had to raise it with them,
and they said, well, we thought this for a while,
and I was like, all right, well we didn't want
to tell you because sometimes parents become very hostile, very
unhappy when we say that their child is having difficulties.
And I was like, oh, I'd rather have known, you know,
I'd rather you said, you know, this is what's happening.
But apparently that's not always what all parents want. So
that was kind of the beginning. But to cut a
long story short, he was seen by a health visitor
who I don't think had a good command of what
autism is or autism isn't because she decided that Mason
can't be autistic because he's too intelligent. And I sort
of said, well, I don't think intelligence is a measurement
of whether you're autistic or not, right, So I had
to push for that. She told me that she'd referred
him to what hear in the UK is called Single
point of Access and that's like the first point of
call I guess to sort of say, you know, refer
for diagnosis, for a for assessment. It was probably about
two months later, I thought. In fact, I think it
was probably more than two months, because I kept chasing
people lot but not really getting anyone, kept getting told,
you know, it's we're doing all we can. And then
I actually contacted Single point of Access myself. And it
is just before the summer holidays, when everything's going to
shut down and I'm not going to be able to
communicate with anyone. I was like, I need to talk
to somebody. So I communicated with them and they are
told my son's name and details, and he said, no,
I've never heard of your son. He's never been mentioned,
never been registered with us for the health visits. I
had told me a lie, and I had to prove that.
So I got the PCT involved, which is the Primary
Care Trust, okay, and had to get them involved. So
they came to my house with me and my husband present,
and I had to fight to get my son the
assessment through, proving that the health visitor had delayed his
assessment by six months. And in the meeting there was
the sort of like you could tell they were wanting
to get up and go, and I just sort of said,
you know, with all due respect, if you leave now,
I want you to know that I'm not going to
drop this. I'm not going to give it up. So
they sat down again and I showed them a few
more documents that i'd sort of collected as evidence of
the paper trail that i'd been keeping. They just sort
of looked at it and went, Okay, we can't deny this.
I was like, what do you mean, Well, this, you know,
this show is that, Yeah, there's been a delay and
it's been caused by this particular help visitor. So I said, well,
can you write to my son's pediatrician to say that
this is what you've found, because I've written to them
to tell them, but obviously they're not going to listen
to just me, because I'm sure they get lots of
you know, parents asking them to move and move them
up the waiting list. And basically they said, oh, I
don't think we can do that because you know, they're
in a different look like they're not connected with bills.
And I was like, I don't think royal mail I'll
have a problem with that, right, meaning obviously you can
post communicate with them and post to post letters to them. Absolutely,
I said, before you send a letter, I want to
see you. I want to see it before it goes.
So they let me see the letter before it went
lots of untruths and I highlighted them and corrected them
and sent it back. And then they then sent that
letter to the pediatrician, and probably not just over a
week went by and I got a phone call from
the secretary of the pediatrician to say, we can see
your son in two weeks. So I did manage to
scrape that the six months that we'd lost and they'd
obviously seen the letter and decided that yeah, he can
be moved up the list.
That's great.
So I was assessed and I got my diagnosis as
it where I was what I call discovery of my identity,
my autistic identity. And then my son got his eleven
days later.
So how old is your son now?
He's ten?
Now how old was he when he got diagnosed?
He was five and a half when he got his diagnosis?
So how is he doing now?
And what are you doing for schooling forum now that
he's been diagnosed as artistic?
Okay? So this was like the next you know, you're
just like I thought? That was it? Like, No, you've
got more hurdles to climb over, okay, applying for an
e HGP, going to mainstream school, telling the mainstream school
that you think your son's are autistic you know, or
all that stuff, and then sort of looking at him
and then looking at me and going no, I don't
think so. So I was like that, I'll give you
two weeks and that not even two weeks went by
and they were like calling us in wanting to talk. Yes,
we think there is something you know that needs to
be investigated. Blobber. And this is the point where I
was still trying to get the diagnosis. But it kind
of connects with the starting school and leaving play school
and going to sort of reception and what they call
it here in the UK, which is first year at
mainstream school. Yes, so it was again it was another
kind of you've got to collect evidence, you've got to
prove why he's struggling, why he needs an EHCP. And
when I asked and I applied for an EHCP, I
was told that his needs weren't complex enough, to which
my response was, are you qualified to make that statement?
That was a great question. What was the response?
Their response was no, I'm not. So I said, with
all due respect, I'm going to apply if you're happy
to support me, and they said, yeah, they'll support me.
So I basically applied for the EHCP, I did all
the collecting of evidence, I paid for private assessments to
be done, and then COVID hit and then my son
had just got his EHGP just before they did lockdown.
And because soon lockdown, they was in a mainstream school
which were only allowing children who had parents who were
frontline staff or they had an EHDP were allowed to
go in. So they were like twelve fifteen children in
a day. They were staying in one area of the
school where they had like pe in the sports school
and it is like an old traditional Victorian school. Just
to kind of set the scene. Okay, it was at
that point that school was saying, your son's doing much better.
He's catching up with lots of things. He's able to
show us what he's capable of doing. Because before then,
which I think he was in year two when they
had lockdown, so we'd been at school, the school for
three years, that's when we realized that it was all
about the actual environment that was causing the problems. That
it was too busy, too many transitions from one classroom
moving to another part of the school, and all of that.
Well that makes sense, So.
That kind of helped move the EHDP along, but it
went to appeal for the first time, and then I
was missed informed. But see, the problem is because I'm
autistic KDHD, dyslexing, and because i have chronic post traumatic
stress disordered because of having so many distressing experiences growing
up not knowing I'm autistic ADHD, and also being dyslexic,
meaning that I'm relying on other people who understand what's
written in a letter, what said in a meeting, and
you know, all of this and just sort of taking
on what they're saying and letting them lead, right, And
then I was misinformed during that so I agreed to
something which I wasn't really fully informed about and I thought,
you know, this was this was a good thing, and
it turned out it wasn't. So I had to wait
another year for another tribunal.
That must have been really frustrating.
And again that was like, it's just just I don't
know what the word would be, but it is it
changes you, right, sure, Right the way the person I
was before all of this, having to fight for like
basic rights in getting a diagnosis of each that then
you can access the right support have just been very stressful.
And I would say traumatic, would say that, you know
the process of trying to get a diagnosis and trying
to get needs met is traumatic.
Sure, So after all that, how did it all turn out?
Now? After all that fighting, of four years of biting,
lots of money spent, he is now at a specialist
school which they don't have any more than five students
in the class. The class that is in at the
minute only has three, including my son.
That's great.
He's supported one to one all the time. Reaching language therapy,
occupation of therapy all on site and he has access
to those daily. The school also support us at home,
so they bee in a mainstream setting me asking that
the reasonable adjustments might not be welcomed with this school.
They actually recognize that, you know, being neurodivergent is genetic
and therefore parents are likely to need support as well,
so that they then can you know, like the dynamic works,
you know that you can sort of work as a team, right, right,
So it's all, it's all very it's all very different
in the school that he's at. When he was at
mainstream school, he was sort of like two years behind.
Okay.
He spent a year at this specialist school, like a
full academic year, and he was working a year ahead
of himself after just twelve after just you know, one
academic year. So it just goes to show that autism
plus environment equals outcome, which it's doctor look beard and
golden equation.
Sure, so houses daily life. Now, does school affect his
home life or home life affected school? How's he doing overall?
Okay, So when we were at mainstream school, the home
life was very difficult, incredibly stressful, very difficult because I've
got two children, you know, we're all eurodivergent. My youngest
who's six, he's an ADHDER, And obviously I've said about
my oldest who's ten, he is autistic, ADHD, dyslexic, dyspraxic,
this calcusia and all of that. Like me, they both
have different needs as any child would, their needs are
polar opposite. So I find that really hard to navigate
because so I'm autistic and ADHD, So I have my
own internalized thing and my ADHD wants spontaneity, my autism
wants a routine, and they're like kind of clashing. Okay,
it's the ADHD that winds and drags the autism along regardless.
Then and then obviously I'm dealing with the external environment,
which is being a parent to two of lee children sure,
who are just a constant like no no day is
ever dull. And because they have polar opposite it needs right.
And because I'm monotropic I don't know if you know
about being monotropics, and my focus is just one thing
I can't do like lots of things at the same time.
If I try to push myself to do that, I
end up melting down. Okay, so I have to like
work really hard. You know, now my children are older
and I can communicate with them and we've got more
flexibility in the communication, and it does help. But I
do have to sort of put down boundaries for myself
and help them create their own boundaries to help this
family life run as smoothly as possible. But there are
days where Harry might come home he's a bit overwhelmed
about something. Maybe he didn't win at something he struggles.
He struggles to lose at things that he's innately good at.
And I suspect that that's probably a lasting effect of
being in a mainstream school and him only having been
in a specialty school for a year and a half now,
where he would see his mainstream peers being able to
do all these things that he struggled with, and so
he started to, you know, when he got sort of
like into year three, he was comparing himself with his peers,
sort of realizing that he wasn't able to do the
things that they were able to do. But it wasn't
because he wasn't competent, which he obviously didn't see it
as that. It was because the criteria sh mainstream does
not accommodate autistic brains, often not saying all autistic people,
but many autistic people.
Right.
So, Harry is very much an outdoors child. He excelled
with anything when he's outdoors, and anything to do with computers,
computer games he's really good at. So if he loses
at a computer game, because he he connects with the
computer game and computer games being his thing, you know,
his sort of thing that he's really good at. Then
if he loses, he takes that as a massive personal loss,
like like it reflects on him as a person. Okay,
So yeah, so if that happens, then sometimes when he
comes home, that can make life a little bit more challenging.
Sure, now you brought up something very interesting.
You said that your ADHD tends to pull your autism. Yeah, now,
as you was growing up, you didn't have any of
these diagnosed. No, so as you was growing up, you
had one side pulling at you and the other side
pulling at you. You weren't yet diagnosed. So how did
you cope with that?
I think? I think I think that's probably where a
lot of my dark humor comes from. Okay, because if
I ever deliver any training, I get people saying that
it's like being at stand up. It's like it's like
I'm a stand like I'm a stand up comedian, which
I don't intend. That's not why. That's not what I did. Like,
so what I do, it's not my I think because
the way that I talk about my life. I think
I realized that when I talked very honestly and direct
about how I was feeling, that other people who maybe
didn't share those same experiences, it frightened them, okay, And
I think I realized that it frightened them. So I
think I developed strategy where I could talk about my experiences,
but if you deliver them in a particular way, it
actually makes it comical, okay, so other people don't feel uncomfortable,
which I guess is that you know, it's a type
of masking, right right, definitely masking heavily because I was
the youngest of three and I do think this is
a fact of it. Depending on where you are in
the order you arrived on this planet does have an
impact on you know, who you are as a person
and the way that you perceive the world in yourself,
you know, and the way that you the way you
come across you know. So I was the youngest of
three girls, and I think I'm the only autistic adhder. Okay,
I suspect one of them's an adhder and the other
one probably not so because I'm autistic adhd. And I
think because I was the youngest, I would look at
them and copy them. So I think then I probably
started to create math sooner than when I started soul
and would have you know, started doing that. But even
sort of within the family, any of my autistic characteristics
were not always welcome, and I would be told by
my siblings to behave in a particular way, and I
would try really really hard to do that. You know.
I would be like, I'll work really hard at trying
not to do the thing that you told me not
to do because you think it's weird. Or remember being
out and commenting on somebody you've got like a broach
in their hair, and I really liked it. And I'm
one of those some people that if I see something
I really like, like a broach or something, you know
that I'm just like, I need to look at it
for ages to like absorb all of the data that
I'm taking in and enjoying, right, And so I stared,
So then I realized what I'm staring at them, So
I'm just saying, I'm sorry that I'm staring. I'm staring
your hair clip because I really like it. And then
it was like, oh, that's really nice, thank you. It's
my grandma gave it me. And I remember my sister
coming in and going, what you're doing? Why are you
doing that? And I, honestly to hear that was really
odd that I was doing that. But to me, that's
something that I didn't think twice about doing. I didn't
think it was too bad anyway. Sort of just an example,
but yeah, I suppose growing up not knowing who I was,
why I was different, why I kept being told either
directly or indirectly, meaning that you sort of start to
learn the patterns of utterances and breathe, changes in breathing,
changes in facial expression, in body of language. The abilities
that I have now as a consequence of this pattern spotting,
which obviously is quite common amongst artistic people and neurodivergent people,
I've developed a really sort of acute sensitivity to changes
in facial expression, intonation, breathing, So I can tell what
somebody is feeling just by a change in their breathing,
and I don't know, it's not like I conscious me
think of it. My brain just tells me, like that
person's not being feeling comfortable right now, they don't like
what you've said. Okay, So then then I end up going,
oh god, I need to like try and clean up
after myself. You know, how can I? How can I
what's the word, like like digging a hole and getting
myself out just take the spade off me. But it's like, yeah,
there's that, And there's like lots of things that still
happen today. I mean, even though I'm aware of them.
I'm aware that I struggle with my cognitive empathy. Right
The only way I can sort of explain that is
I'm aware that I struggle with it, but when it's
actually happening, I'm not aware of it until after. If
that does that make sense?
Yeah? Yeah, sure.
So if if somebody whether this, like if there were
two non autistic people communicating, I don't know what the
social cues are, but I miss non autistic social cues
because they're not on my radar. I have great autistic
social skills. My non autistic social skills are likely better
than non autistic people's autistic social skills do you get me.
Okay, yeah, so so.
Quite often because a lot of non autistic people don't
realize or appreciate the privileges that they have with their
non autistic social skills. And how I don't see some
of those social skills though. A parent could fall out
with me and then have a right go at me,
and I've got no idea what it is that I've
done wrong, and not telling me what I've done wrong,
they're just having a go at me, and they're obviously
not happy with me about something. So my brain then goes, right,
let's go and see if be combined past events where
things might have gone wrong, right, And my brain doesn't stop.
This isn't a choice, sure, just what my brain does
very good, Like I'm very good at solving things. I
was often told I should be a detective. I'm not
sure i'd survived that sort of job, but hey ho, yes,
because my brain just keeps going and going and going
until it found out what it could be. Right, Well,
it could be this, this here's the evidence, and then
like on the board with like the strings attached to
it now to me like connecting things. Yeah yeah right right,
so so yeah, okay, I still can't figure it out,
and I have to just go. Look, you can't ask them, right,
They'll not want to explain. They're obviously upset you with
you about something you know that you didn't intend to
upset them. They've taken it as being offensive. That's not
my problem. I can't control how other people take what
I say, and I can't control how they react to it.
These are these are the new things that I've been
teaching myself since finding out about being autistic adhually. But
before that it would have been an absolute show of
the not pleasant and lots of ruminating, lots of perseveration
and trying to figure out, you know, keep my brain
would just keep going round and round and round and round.
But it would always be it must be something about me,
it must be my fault. Sure, And then now I
don't do that now. So like, prediscovery and post discovery
are two very different lives, you know. So that does
that help at all?
Absolutely so.
As you was growing up, let's say the ages between
ten and sixteen, that's when females are growing up, trying
to fit in, going through all their hormonal changes, just
trying to figure out life in general. Yes, that's when
a lot of females will try and fit in and
they'll start masking. More So, how were those years for
you and how did you work through it?
Yes? So it's yeah, looking back, I think sort of
towards the end of junior school. I don't know what
you call it in America. Okay, so high school is
secondary school here, right, okay, and junior school what you
call before high school?
That's middle school here, okay?
Right, okay, So the end of middle school and the
start of high school. Yeah, got that, right of an?
I yeah, yeah, you got it. And I think I
started to realize that it's almost like sort of visualizing
the sort of distance between friends, because right the non
autistic people their social skills developing a way at that
age that's more complicated, more complex. Trying to navigate that
as an autistic person, sorry, is difficult because if you
don't know that you're different, it's a real shock. And
especially the time between the last day of middle school
and the first day of high school. So you've had
that here, we have a six week holiday, and after
that holiday you go for this other school. Now, bearing
your mind, when I was in this is nineteen ninety
when I started at high school secondary school. Okay, I
actually created a TikTok where I just watched a film
that had triggered all of the trauma from that and
basically it all came out and I was like, I
need to video this and you know, record this. Basically,
the difference between middle school and high school, so junior
and secondary was just profound, an absolute, I mean you
could say, like a culture shock. It was just like
I had no friends. All of the friends that I
had at junior school, I wasn't with. They did this
thing where they mixed the classes up. I think they
thought they were trying to be helpful that they actually
made it really difficult for people like me right where
I ended up. I just ended up in a class
with I think. I think a lot of the girls
were like non autistic. It was quite a competitive year
that I was in. I didn't I didn't see this,
but peer pressure to be in a particular you know,
to be smoking in the toilets, and to have short
skirts and to have long hair and blah blah blah blah,
all of these things. And I was very much like, well, no,
I'll wear what makes me feel comfortable. I'm not I
wasn't bothered about fashion. I was. I was bothered about
the sensory aspect of my clothing. Sure, the differences that
I had just became very obvious. And I think also
because in the junior school, so in the middle school
compared secondary school, you've got lots of schools coming together
all in one school, whereas middle school, junior school was
a small junior school with not many people in and
then going to this secondary school to high school and
it being lots and lots of middle schools in one
You know, it is not the same as is it
in America?
Yet it can be depends upon where you are.
Oh yeah, So I was just like, oh my gosh,
I had absolutely no idea how to navigate it. Playtime
wasn't the same. It wasn't like when we were at
junior school where you just go outside and play games
and play with your friends and and do the sort
of playing that you do when you're at junior school
middle school, and I go into secondary school. It was
almost like some sort of unwritten rule had been announced
that this is not how you did things anymore. But
I was just like, oh my gosh, I didn't get
that message. I just arrived here going, oh, this just
seems like when I look back on those memories, they're
very dark, very gray, right. I don't remember ever being
happy at secondary.
School, you know, high school, that's too bad.
And I remember always being on my own. I remember
lots of bullying, physical and emotional. Wow, every day I
was bullied the whole time. I never thought tell anybody.
I never thought that moving to another school would be
an option. Not that saying moving to another school would
have solved it, because you don't know, it might have
been worse, right, because obviously they didn't understand what they
do now about being autistic ADHD. So it's not like
going to another school would have been like, oh, we
know that your autistic ADHD.
Sure you know.
It would have been the same kind of like expectations
placed on me to have non autistic social skills, and
I'm like, oh my gosh, I'm absolutely busting a good
Try and fit in, try and focus on the work
that I'm expected to do. To me is like some
sort of you basically thrown me out into the social
motorway right and gone right, try and dodge the cars,
you know, try, Like oh my, it was it was
just an absolute nightmare from start to finish. But the
bizarre thing is whether I don't know whether this is
because of being autistic ADHD, but it's almost like you
get into a routine of going to school and you
never think to question anything. Sure, that's all I look
back on and think, I never questioned anything. Whereas now
because of the experiences I've had with my own children
in realizing quite a lot of corruption behind the scenes,
and that if any parent who has to apply for
a backstage pass, which is usually a great thing, well
we've got backstage patters. Well you don't want a backstage
pass to the local education authority unless you, what the
shock of your life and your whole belief in the
system to be completely you know, chopped down and obliterate
and thrown in all directions. The basis of it is
the amount of lying that goes on, and that the
lying between an adult to protect other adult, and so
because of that then the protection of the child is lost.
And I'm just like, how is this even allowed? How
is this even legal? Just the whole thing generally, But anyway,
I've digressed on something else. So but yeah, secondary school
for me was horrific and I've had lots of therapy.
I recently have had em DR. I can't remember what
it stands for now, but because I'm I think in
pictures all the time, EMDR worked for me, whereas before
I had CBT cognitive behavioral therapy, which didn't work for
me at all, and I just kept going around in
circles with that, and the therapist I had just couldn't
understand why I kept going round in circles, like ruminating
and perseverating and repeating the same thing over. You could
see that they got really fed up of me, like
repeating the same thing. Okay, not being able to move forwards,
but that's just how my brain processes things.
So sure.
Yeah, So with everything that you've been through and your
son kind of being a mini me, how are things
going today for both of you?
I realized that basically I spent my life dealing with
the past traumas while also trying to deal with the
stuff that's thrown at you day to day, of trying
to navigate the world as a disabled person, trying to
allow myself to grow into the identities and my autistic
add identity that nature intends me to have, you know,
to have access to that. I was denied because of
the way the world was when I arrived on the planet,
and because of the ignorance I guess and misunderstandings surrounding
neurodivergent that are better today than they were obviously in
nineteen seventy eight when I was born. Right, also because
my childrehon have differences that require additional support that you
have to then you know, go through all that, like
I've said earlier, you know about having to go through
all the rig bar all of that and the stresses
of that, and then taking them into school and me
having my own school related traumas and those events triggering
my path traumas, and you know, trying to be a parent,
a good parent, trying to do the best for your children,
while also trying to navigate your own mental health that
has issues based in the past, and also with the
day to day stuff cause obviitly, like any emotional state,
it's not forever is, it's just forever changing. So yeah,
I find that really difficult, and just being a parent.
So for example, you know, like this weekend, I want
to take the boys out. Okay, obviously want to take
them both out together, but I need somebody to help me.
I can't do it on my own. I can't take
them both that on their own because of being monotropic, right,
and because both have very different needs polar up as
it need. Sure, it's really hard to kind of meeting
the needs of one that doesn't meet the needs of
the other, you know, it's like contradictory, right, And then
it means that I feel like a rubbish parent because
I can't take them out places, you know, get them outside,
and because of that, but also because I struggled with
transitions because of being autistic, and also because I have
to take medications. I take citrallin and I take ADHD
meds as well, so they help. But obviously I just
have to live in the moment. Basically, I try not
to plan because it doesn't always go to plan.
Okay, have you accepted yourself now? Have you found a
comfort zone where you realize I am who I am,
the world is what it is, I've got kids, I've
got a family. So have you reached a comfort zone
and inner piece, yes, so that you realize that you
still have to move forward and that you can conquer this.
Yes. I think really from the moment that I discovered
I was autistic. I went through a grieving process. My
brain just would be like, oh, here's that event from
then and that the detail of being autistic ADHD and
again and again. That took me like two years process
all of those forty plus years. And then after that
it's almost like I went through a slightly rebellious stage
trying to establish my boundaries, my new boundaries. Okay, it's
almost like being a teenager again, but in a forty
year old body, I'll do all the things that I
wasn't able to do as a teenager because I didn't
feel able, I didn't feel confident enough, I didn't feel
safe enough to do these things. But now I understand myself.
I'm like, oh, okay, I'll ever go at this. I'll
ever go at that. You know, did it do it? Whatever? Okay, Well,
then if you've got children, as I don't know if
you've seen the clip of Michael mcinty, the comedian of
like trying to leave the house with children, so like
just trying to leave the house without Chldren was like
that that Michael McIntyre speaks about because of being autistic
not knowing it right. And then now I've got children.
It's like I could really do with some sort of
time machine where I can rewind the time a bit.
It doesn't take us three days to leave the house
so that we can go out and have a good
time and I not have a meltdown before we even
set off, sort of growing into the shape that I
was supposed to be, as opposed to the shape that
I was kind of subjected and terrified into. Allowing myself
to create a set of boundaries that would mean that
I could be my authentic self and that if anybody
was offended by anything that I did, as long as
i'd follow these rules, I haven't done anything wrong to
offend them. Because being autistic ADHD is an exelation, not
an excuse. That if I do upset somebody, I do
apologize and I say sorry. If I upset you, that
wasn't my intention, right, and that person can decide to
forgive or not, not saying that I do anything terrible.
But these are like social faux pats you do because
I don't have non autistic social skills. I have autistic
social skills, So you know, it can make it tricky,
But I think I'm a lot more confident. I'm a
lot more vigilion. The small stuff doesn't completely obliterate me.
Okay, good.
I still have those days when I get knocked down
and it takes me ages to kind of climb back
out of the dark hole again, as it were. But
I think on the whole it saved me. So. Like
I always say to people like who go on about oh,
labeling this and labeling that, I'm like, correct labels save lives.
Wrong labels destroy them absolutely, And the label is useful
for me and it's to nobody else's benefit but me
because it then gives me an understanding of myself that
I can Then you venture out, Does that answer your question?
I tend to digress.
Sorry, No, that's all right. I think this is great.
This has been a tremendous conversation. Your story is just
so good and so unique. It's just been awesome.
I would think I'm boring. I'm boring.
I am not at all.
The great thing is that you've got such a good
story with a different perspective, and that's what this is
all about. Anyone can talk with an artistic person and
they've talked with one artistic person.
Yes, absolutely.
So, your story has been just tremendous.
Oh, thank you very much.
So now what would you like to leave us with?
Just anything that you could tell someone that just might
hopefully make a difference.
I guess flexibility in understanding that the way you experience
the world is not fixed. You know that other people's
experiences are different, and that different is not bad, that
it's okay to be different, and nobody has to be
wrong or right, you know, as long as you're safe obviously,
because you know there are differences that you should you
should be like, oh, there's a lion in the garden.
You know that's something that you might want to go okay,
but but you know, obviously, like it might not be
so obvious, but to me as an autistic person going
into a setting, which as soon as I basically leave
the house and go out into society, I can pretty
much say that I feel like I'm in a hostile environment.
So if, even if you don't know that they're autistic,
if somebody is asking for reasonable adjustments, try to remember
that those reasonable adjustments could be the making or breaking
of that person's day, and that you know, I don't
really know how to put it into words. Boys, it's
just more about realizing that the sort of non autistic
way is not the only way, and that the autistic
way is just as much valid as it is not autistic.
Does that make sense absolutely? I think it makes perfect sense.
So once again, this has been great and I really
appreciate you taking the time and coming on on my podcast.
Well, thank you very much for your time, Toning. I
really appreciate it.
It's been my place pleasure.
Thanks for taking the time out of your busy schedule
to listen to our show today. We hope that you
enjoyed it as much as we enjoyed bringing it to you.
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