Ep:170 Bigfoot and Filipino Vampires

<v Speaker 1>I was like in a creek bed, and I was.
<v Speaker 2>You know, dirty and scratched up and cut up and bruised.
<v Speaker 2>I had kind of pressed myself back into the creek
<v Speaker 2>bed against the bank in case it came over to me.
<v Speaker 2>I was thinking, maybe, you know, the water and the
<v Speaker 2>mud and everything might mask my scent and keep me
<v Speaker 2>hidden from its view. I'm sure though, it could have
<v Speaker 2>found me and got me if it wanted to. But
<v Speaker 2>I just sat there, and you know, when the sun
<v Speaker 2>was coming up, That's when I kind of cautiously and
<v Speaker 2>slowly made my way back to my campsite and my
<v Speaker 2>lean to to grab my rifle and pack up what
<v Speaker 2>I could.
<v Speaker 3>This is Bigfoot Crossroads. My name is Matt, and joining
<v Speaker 3>me is Justin McNeil, the author of The Bigfoot Paradox.
<v Speaker 3>Everything is a lie and everything is true. Okay, man,
<v Speaker 3>you got me on the title just like that. Welcome
<v Speaker 3>to the show man. Hey, thank you Matt for having me.
<v Speaker 3>It's an honor and privilege, so I appreciate it. The title, man, Uh,
<v Speaker 3>how did you come up with the title. Let's just
<v Speaker 3>start there.
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean, so the title is you know exactly
<v Speaker 2>what it says. It's depending on your perspective, your experiences,
<v Speaker 2>your degree of skepticism. You know, the same set of
<v Speaker 2>facts can be truth or they can be lies. So
<v Speaker 2>I'm kind of giving people kind of a warning and
<v Speaker 2>an invitation. You know, I think it will alter some
<v Speaker 2>people's perceptions of reality. Skeptics will like some of the
<v Speaker 2>stuff I say, they will hate some of the stuff
<v Speaker 2>I say.
<v Speaker 1>And the same thing for believers or knowers. They will
<v Speaker 1>like some of it, they will hate other parts of it.
<v Speaker 2>And I wanted the book to be a little controversial.
<v Speaker 2>I want people to think. I don't want to tell
<v Speaker 2>them what to think. I want to just present, you know,
<v Speaker 2>my field research, some of my interviews with.
<v Speaker 1>People, and you know, I don't put a lot of
<v Speaker 1>my own.
<v Speaker 2>Personal experiences in there, because again, I'm not trying to persuade.
<v Speaker 1>Anyone with this book. I mean, people are going to
<v Speaker 1>believe what they want to believe.
<v Speaker 2>But you know, I kind of wanted to set that
<v Speaker 2>those ground rules and that framework right from the start.
<v Speaker 3>Well, what's your own personal background in the subject. I mean,
<v Speaker 3>there must be something most people don't just like, wake
<v Speaker 3>up one day, I'm going to a book about bigfoot.
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so I had when I was younger, I had
<v Speaker 2>a kind of a crazy uncle and he used to
<v Speaker 2>always tell me all these stories. And he was a
<v Speaker 2>veteran and you know, airborne guy and kind of an
<v Speaker 2>adventure a.
<v Speaker 1>Treasure hunter, you know, you name it.
<v Speaker 2>He did that, and so I would always listen to
<v Speaker 2>his stories and be.
<v Speaker 1>Respectful and everything. And then I was a.
<v Speaker 2>Hunter and a fisherman growing up, you know, and we
<v Speaker 2>were very poor. So we did it not because it
<v Speaker 2>was necessarily fun, but we needed to supplement our table,
<v Speaker 2>you know, for food, and so I had, you know,
<v Speaker 2>a really kind of poor experience growing up. My dad
<v Speaker 2>was also kind of a believer, but he never really
<v Speaker 2>told me any personal stories. So I mean, I was
<v Speaker 2>definitely interested. And then all these you know, shows started
<v Speaker 2>coming out. I think Leonard Nimoy's Bigfoot Show came out
<v Speaker 2>in this late seventies, and.
<v Speaker 1>I was just hooked.
<v Speaker 2>I started watching all that stuff, but I didn't really
<v Speaker 2>have my own experience until two thousand and one, and
<v Speaker 2>that's when I started my research.
<v Speaker 1>You know, in earnest, I'm kind of a.
<v Speaker 2>Researcher by trade, and by training, I'm actually a double
<v Speaker 2>which is kind of weird. So you know, I understand
<v Speaker 2>about science and technology and.
<v Speaker 1>And things like that, but.
<v Speaker 2>I haven't run this Survivor Reviews YouTube channel. And so
<v Speaker 2>I'm out in the woods and I enjoy primitive camping
<v Speaker 2>and backpacking and hiking and hunting, and so, yeah, my
<v Speaker 2>first real experience. And I was definitely a skeptic, super
<v Speaker 2>sk optical, very familiar with all the wildlife and game,
<v Speaker 2>at least in North America, and so you know, and
<v Speaker 2>I'd always have a firearm or two and knife and
<v Speaker 2>everything with me.
<v Speaker 1>And I wasn't ever really afraid in the woods.
<v Speaker 2>You know, I'd fallen asleep and deer blinds and tree stands,
<v Speaker 2>you know, I've done all that stuff and.
<v Speaker 1>Slept in the dirt.
<v Speaker 2>So my first real experience that was two thousand and one.
<v Speaker 2>I had gone to Arkansas, the Washingtaw Washingtaw National Forests
<v Speaker 2>there and I was a couple of days into a
<v Speaker 2>solo boar hunt, which you know, I like to do.
<v Speaker 1>I don't like to have.
<v Speaker 2>I've taken other people hunting, and I've taken other people,
<v Speaker 2>you know, in the woods with me, and they're always
<v Speaker 2>noisy and more careless, and I like and I'll get
<v Speaker 2>to more of that later.
<v Speaker 1>So I was by myself solo boar hunt and I
<v Speaker 1>had seen a bore, but.
<v Speaker 2>The backstop for anything I would send down range at
<v Speaker 2>the boar was this farmer's field, and so I didn't
<v Speaker 2>take a shot.
<v Speaker 1>And I am, you know, deep deep in the.
<v Speaker 2>Washington National Forest, and I kind of set up a
<v Speaker 2>lean to using cordage and pine boughs and a tarp,
<v Speaker 2>you know, just kind of enough to keep the dow
<v Speaker 2>off me, bugs out in my face or if it rained.
<v Speaker 2>I was doing primitive camping, so I didn't have a tent,
<v Speaker 2>no backup, just me the wild in the forest. And
<v Speaker 2>I had my sig P two two nine on my
<v Speaker 2>hip and I had loaded that with forty It's a
<v Speaker 2>forty Smiths and Western Copper solid copper lee high defense rounds.
<v Speaker 2>And the reason why I carry a pistol when I'm
<v Speaker 2>on boar hunts is I've never experienced this, but I've
<v Speaker 2>you know, I've heard and seen videos. They're very aggressive
<v Speaker 2>and if the rifle shot doesn't take them down, they
<v Speaker 2>can charge and things like that. So I'm always ready
<v Speaker 2>when I go boar hunting to scurry up a tree
<v Speaker 2>and to you know, shoot at it with my side
<v Speaker 2>arm if I have to, So I put in solid
<v Speaker 2>copper defense rounds because they have good penetration against you know,
<v Speaker 2>a bore that might have a tough hide and a
<v Speaker 2>lot of fat. I wanted to get through that and penetrate.
<v Speaker 2>And that's so that's thirteen rounds, twelve in the mag
<v Speaker 2>and one in the pipe, and then in the shelter.
<v Speaker 1>Right next to my little bedroll.
<v Speaker 2>I had a PTR ninety one, which is my three
<v Speaker 2>oh eight Winchester rifle.
<v Speaker 1>So that's what I intended to shoot any bar with.
<v Speaker 2>Is obviously the rifle, but if it got close or
<v Speaker 2>snuck up on me or whatever surprised me, I would
<v Speaker 2>have the pistol as well.
<v Speaker 1>And it's like one seven am.
<v Speaker 2>And I remember the time because I looked at my
<v Speaker 2>watch when all this happened, and I was, you know,
<v Speaker 2>half asleep, kind of dozing, and my campfire had burned down.
<v Speaker 2>It was low, just kind of some embers. It's a
<v Speaker 2>little little flame, but not much, and everything was real quiet.
<v Speaker 2>I didn't really hear a lot of bug or insect noises.
<v Speaker 2>And what kind of stirred me out of being half asleep.
<v Speaker 2>I heard a kind of wet, low huff kind of
<v Speaker 2>beyond the tree line, and I knew, you know, I
<v Speaker 2>knew it wasn't a black bear.
<v Speaker 1>I knew it wasn't a war I knew it wasn't.
<v Speaker 2>Like a buck, a deer, and it seemed deliberate and
<v Speaker 2>it was loud enough, you know. I set up, and
<v Speaker 2>I put my boots on, and I grabbed my flashlight,
<v Speaker 2>and I, you know, instinctively kind of reached on my
<v Speaker 2>hip because again, I'm in the deep woods, right, I'm
<v Speaker 2>not off I'm not on any trails or any camp site.
<v Speaker 1>I don't even know with primitive camping like that is legal.
<v Speaker 1>I can't remember if.
<v Speaker 2>I had checked that, but anyway, so I stepped downside
<v Speaker 2>of my tent and I remember the air was kind
<v Speaker 2>of heavy, and it wasn't really any wind and no bugs.
<v Speaker 2>I didn't hear any sounds, but kind of the back
<v Speaker 2>of my neck started, you know, tingling. I started getting
<v Speaker 2>the hair raising on the back of my neck. If
<v Speaker 2>you've ever had some thing, you know, watching you, looking
<v Speaker 2>at you, I mean I had this similar type of
<v Speaker 2>experience when I was I was in the Philippines and
<v Speaker 2>they were you know, feeding lions there at the zoo,
<v Speaker 2>and and kind of that feeling when something's looking at
<v Speaker 2>you and it's dangerous and it might have bad intentions
<v Speaker 2>at you. It's it's looking hard at you. I started
<v Speaker 2>feeling that, and then the the way I explain it,
<v Speaker 2>it was like the brush just exploded.
<v Speaker 1>Right.
<v Speaker 2>So this I'm just going to call it a creature.
<v Speaker 2>It didn't ease its way out. It didn't creep out,
<v Speaker 2>it didn't. It kind of tore out of the forest,
<v Speaker 2>you know, like it was coiled up and waiting for
<v Speaker 2>me to move. And I think, in hindsight, I think
<v Speaker 2>it was kind of a bluff type charge, but.
<v Speaker 1>You know, I remember it was.
<v Speaker 2>It tore through there and the branches were cracking, and.
<v Speaker 1>It came right up to my camp. And it was huge.
<v Speaker 1>I tell people it was probably eight feet tall if
<v Speaker 1>it was an inch, and it was wide.
<v Speaker 2>Shoulders, thick and large and muscled with arms you know
<v Speaker 2>that hung almost to its knees, and its hair wasn't
<v Speaker 2>necessarily smooth like a bear's, was kind of matted and
<v Speaker 2>thick and wet in places and clumped with dirt and
<v Speaker 2>I don't know what else.
<v Speaker 3>So you got a really good look at this thing.
<v Speaker 2>Unfortunately, Yeah, I did, Yeah, And it's face, and you know,
<v Speaker 2>before I go on with the story, I mean, I was.
<v Speaker 1>So just so your listeners know.
<v Speaker 2>You know, I'm six feet tall, barefoot, I'm two hundred
<v Speaker 2>and seventy five pounds. I've studied martial arts my whole life.
<v Speaker 2>I used to power lift, you know, so I'm not
<v Speaker 2>a small guy. I'm not easily spooked. Excuse me.
<v Speaker 1>And I grew up, you know, in the woods and
<v Speaker 1>out in the woods.
<v Speaker 2>I used to do survival camps when I was even
<v Speaker 2>in my teenage years and with no one else, So
<v Speaker 2>I mean, I kind of froze up for a split second.
<v Speaker 1>And I remember looking at its face.
<v Speaker 2>And again this is where people have asked me, were
<v Speaker 2>its eyes red?
<v Speaker 1>And no, I didn't. I didn't notice that.
<v Speaker 2>But I just noticed that its face wasn't it wasn't
<v Speaker 2>like an ape face, and it wasn't man.
<v Speaker 1>It was something something else, you know, and.
<v Speaker 2>Had a flat, broad nose and a heavy brow that
<v Speaker 2>kind of you know, had shadows over its e. And
<v Speaker 2>I'm not I don't have a lot of light, but
<v Speaker 2>I have enough and I'm close enough, and I just
<v Speaker 2>I froze. I remember, my it was just it was
<v Speaker 2>so bizarre and strange and scary.
<v Speaker 1>That.
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I froze and then my my body just reacted
<v Speaker 2>and I dove into the brush, scrambling to kind of,
<v Speaker 2>you know, get away from it, and I dropped flat
<v Speaker 2>face in the dirt and belly down in the weeds,
<v Speaker 2>and I just I just laid there and I and
<v Speaker 2>I watched it for a short time.
<v Speaker 3>And how did it react to that.
<v Speaker 1>It didn't seem to react at all.
<v Speaker 2>It was more like it was looking at my camp site.
<v Speaker 2>It was it had stepped in my camp a little
<v Speaker 2>closer now to the fire pit, and it was like breathing,
<v Speaker 2>I want to say, like a bull, like kind of
<v Speaker 2>an angry bull. So I could see, you know, its
<v Speaker 2>chest going in and out as it was breathing.
<v Speaker 1>And then it kind of sniffed the air, and it.
<v Speaker 2>Was like it was searching or sensing.
<v Speaker 1>I don't know. I believe that it definitely knew I
<v Speaker 1>was there.
<v Speaker 2>It knew I was there before I knew it was
<v Speaker 2>there before it came out of the woods, because that's
<v Speaker 2>when it turned its head and looked right at me
<v Speaker 2>with its eyes.
<v Speaker 1>And again they weren't they weren't glowing red.
<v Speaker 2>I know a lot of witnesses have said that red
<v Speaker 2>or yellow, they weren't glowing, and they weren't completely wild.
<v Speaker 2>They were like, from what I could see, cold and
<v Speaker 2>focused and intelligent.
<v Speaker 1>It was like it was thinking.
<v Speaker 2>And then it looked directly at me, and that's when
<v Speaker 2>I ran. I ran, and you know, I'm thinking all
<v Speaker 2>this time, I'm like, well, if that thing comes over
<v Speaker 2>to me, it's clearly faster than me. If it comes
<v Speaker 2>over to me, I'm gonna shoot it. But I don't
<v Speaker 2>know if what I had in my pistol is going
<v Speaker 2>to stop.
<v Speaker 1>It or just make it angry.
<v Speaker 2>I mean, maybe it would die later, but I'm sure
<v Speaker 2>I would die first, and I couldn't.
<v Speaker 1>You know. There's no way I thought I could.
<v Speaker 2>Scramble back to my little lean to and grab my rifle.
<v Speaker 2>So my option was to run, And when it looked
<v Speaker 2>at me, that's what I did.
<v Speaker 1>I ran with pure erupting fear. And then it.
<v Speaker 2>It screamed, But it wasn't really a scream.
<v Speaker 1>It wasn't aroar either, but it it was like a low, throaty, violent.
<v Speaker 2>Sound that it made, and it kind of hit me
<v Speaker 2>in the chest, like a brick of noise vibrated through
<v Speaker 2>my body, and then later on in my research, when
<v Speaker 2>I really started my research to try to figure out
<v Speaker 2>what the hell these things were, I would learn about infrasounds.
<v Speaker 2>So I don't know if that's what it was doing.
<v Speaker 2>I suspect that's what it did, because I was absolutely
<v Speaker 2>terrified and my blood ran cold, and I just kept running.
<v Speaker 2>It was like terror upted from my core, you know,
<v Speaker 2>like my fear had been bottled up and it just
<v Speaker 2>exploded through every nerve in my body. And I've had
<v Speaker 2>adrenaline rush as before. This was more than that. It
<v Speaker 2>was like, I don't know if you've ever had a
<v Speaker 2>real adrenaline surge and you're kind of shaky after it.
<v Speaker 2>It was it was like that and more. I mean
<v Speaker 2>definitely time slowed down. I was running and you know,
<v Speaker 2>panting and getting hit by the brush and everything bleeding
<v Speaker 2>and tripping. I just kept moving away from it, and
<v Speaker 2>not because I thought it was chasing me, but I
<v Speaker 2>knew if it wanted to chase me.
<v Speaker 1>It could have.
<v Speaker 2>I just I just had to escape from it. I
<v Speaker 2>was extremely scared, you know where you're have you ever
<v Speaker 2>had something like that happen where the adrenaline hits you,
<v Speaker 2>and then even after it, you don't really remember everything
<v Speaker 2>that that happened.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, it was like it was like that. And then.
<v Speaker 2>By this time, I don't know how really how far
<v Speaker 2>I ran. I just kept running, or even if I
<v Speaker 2>was going in a straight line, but I was like
<v Speaker 2>in a creek bed, and I was you know, dirty
<v Speaker 2>and scratched up and cut up and bruised, and I
<v Speaker 2>had kind of pressed myself back into the creek bed
<v Speaker 2>against the bank in case it came over to me.
<v Speaker 2>I was thinking, maybe, you know, the water and the
<v Speaker 2>mud and everything might mask my scent and keep me
<v Speaker 2>hidden from its view. I'm sure though it could have
<v Speaker 2>found me and got me if it wanted to.
<v Speaker 1>But I just sat there, and you know, when the
<v Speaker 1>sun was.
<v Speaker 2>Coming up, that's when I kind of cautiously and slowly
<v Speaker 2>made my way back to my campsite and my lean
<v Speaker 2>to to grab my rifle and pack up what I could.
<v Speaker 3>And everything was as it had been when you left.
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, it didn't destroy anything, or I don't know.
<v Speaker 1>I don't know if it was telling me I was
<v Speaker 1>too close.
<v Speaker 2>To where it lived, if it was just you know,
<v Speaker 2>telling me that it was that was its property. I
<v Speaker 2>don't know, but I packed up everything that I you know,
<v Speaker 2>that I brought with me and that I I needed,
<v Speaker 2>and I left and I but there was definitely a
<v Speaker 2>smell there in my in the campsite. And it's hard
<v Speaker 2>to describe, you know, I've been unfortunate enough to see
<v Speaker 2>dead bodies and things like that before. And it was like.
<v Speaker 1>Rotten, wet fur and stale urine. It was a.
<v Speaker 2>I know, some people describe it as like a sulfury smell,
<v Speaker 2>but it was it was worse than that.
<v Speaker 1>And it was heavy in the air, clinging to the
<v Speaker 1>trees and on my backpack.
<v Speaker 2>And yeah, it was still there, the smell. And I
<v Speaker 2>never went back to those woods that area, and I won't,
<v Speaker 2>I won't for sure.
<v Speaker 3>Whenever it first, he erupped it out of the woods
<v Speaker 3>like that, and you saw it about how close was
<v Speaker 3>it to you?
<v Speaker 2>Maybe twenty feet away, twenty five feet away?
<v Speaker 1>Man, close enough.
<v Speaker 2>That I knew, like I said, I had a pistol.
<v Speaker 2>I had a rifle that was in my little lean too,
<v Speaker 2>and I knew that it could kill me if it
<v Speaker 2>wanted to.
<v Speaker 1>It could kill me for sure.
<v Speaker 3>How long had you been out there whenever that happened?
<v Speaker 1>Two days?
<v Speaker 3>And do you recall any possible signs of it being
<v Speaker 3>around before that that you just overlooked.
<v Speaker 2>No, I mean I always see stuff in the woods,
<v Speaker 2>you know that A lot of bigfoot hunters and cryptos
<v Speaker 2>who I would just say, oh, look that's sign, and
<v Speaker 2>oh look at these trees there been at this angle,
<v Speaker 2>and you know, there's that stuff.
<v Speaker 1>But I don't pay much attention to that.
<v Speaker 2>I mean, I've seen things fall in the woods and
<v Speaker 2>wind uproot trees, and you know, I mean, I'm from Missouri.
<v Speaker 1>We have tornadoes all the time.
<v Speaker 2>I've seen all kinds of crazy things with trees and
<v Speaker 2>rocks and everything. So no, not that, I not that
<v Speaker 2>I remember. I didn't see anything like that. I didn't
<v Speaker 2>feel anything. I saw animals and saw the one bore,
<v Speaker 2>but that was it.
<v Speaker 3>Nothing to the extent of yourself.
<v Speaker 1>You know.
<v Speaker 3>I don't want to compare apples and oranges here. But
<v Speaker 3>I was actually raised by my great grandparents, and my
<v Speaker 3>great grandfather came from a large family in Arkansas that
<v Speaker 3>was extremely poor. Both of my great grandparents were raised
<v Speaker 3>extremely and my great grandfather especially was raised in a
<v Speaker 3>family where they hunted and fished for food, you know,
<v Speaker 3>providing for the family and he had like eight brothers
<v Speaker 3>and sisters to provide for. Yeah, so those skills were
<v Speaker 3>passed on to me at a very early age.
<v Speaker 1>And it's.
<v Speaker 3>A very different school of thought than what your typical
<v Speaker 3>you know, hobby fishermen and hunters use today.
<v Speaker 1>But it is different, you know.
<v Speaker 2>I mean I tell people, I don't know if they
<v Speaker 2>believe me because I'm college educated, I have a professional
<v Speaker 2>job and and all that stuff, but you know, I
<v Speaker 2>tell them there I have family members and even an aunt.
<v Speaker 2>I mean she has chewed tobacco the whole time that
<v Speaker 2>I have known her my whole life and gone bare.
<v Speaker 1>Food and they make moonshine and you.
<v Speaker 2>Know, so yeah, it's definitely different. I mean, I won't
<v Speaker 2>personally kill an animal unless I am doing it to
<v Speaker 2>defend myself or I'm going to eat it, right.
<v Speaker 1>I'm not one of those people that you know, just
<v Speaker 1>goes down there for sport. And it is different, you know.
<v Speaker 2>I remember walking the train tracks when I was little
<v Speaker 2>and going in parks and collecting cans and bottles. I
<v Speaker 2>mean it's yeah, we were we were very poor. We
<v Speaker 2>were we were fine. I mean I had a great childhood.
<v Speaker 2>But yeah, it's different when you have to get meat, yeah,
<v Speaker 2>versus you're just doing it as a hobby for sure.
<v Speaker 3>So, I mean I'm fairly confident, even though you know
<v Speaker 3>we just started talking not too long ago, I'm fairly
<v Speaker 3>confident with the way that you were brought up and everything,
<v Speaker 3>if you had encountered something in the woods previous to
<v Speaker 3>that night that wasn't supposed to be there, you would
<v Speaker 3>have noticed it.
<v Speaker 1>Right, Yeah, it's true, It's true.
<v Speaker 2>I mean I started hunting, I want to say six
<v Speaker 2>or seven. I was hunting and camping and doing all that.
<v Speaker 1>My uncle and my dad. I mean, they both taught
<v Speaker 1>me how to move and walk.
<v Speaker 2>You know, quietly in the in the woods, and how
<v Speaker 2>to tell which way the wind is blowing so that
<v Speaker 2>I can stay upwind of.
<v Speaker 1>Game and all that.
<v Speaker 2>I'm very observant in the woods, and I have excellent
<v Speaker 2>hearing too.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah I would. I would have noticed, for sure.
<v Speaker 2>I mean I can see game trails, and I know
<v Speaker 2>how to identify, you know, prints from an animal. And
<v Speaker 2>I've tracked deer after I've shot them not so cleanly
<v Speaker 2>and had to track their their blood through the woods. Yeah,
<v Speaker 2>I would have. Well, I tell you one thing I
<v Speaker 2>would have been on higher alert than just you know,
<v Speaker 2>starting to doze off and chilling out in my lean to.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, for the night, for sure.
<v Speaker 3>I Mean that initial huff that you heard, you know,
<v Speaker 3>says a lot whenever you're talking about it's you know,
<v Speaker 3>it's not a board, it's not a bear. Yeah, you're
<v Speaker 3>hearing a sound that's not supposed to be there, that
<v Speaker 3>you've never heard before, right, and isn't matching any of
<v Speaker 3>the animals that are there. Yeah, I know what that's
<v Speaker 3>like for sure.
<v Speaker 2>So that's I mean, that's why I said I set
<v Speaker 2>up because again, you know, I mean I grew up
<v Speaker 2>in Missouri. I mean I've been in a deer stand
<v Speaker 2>before and had you know, five or six coyotes pass
<v Speaker 2>under me, not even though I was there, you know,
<v Speaker 2>and all that. And I've even had bucks walk up
<v Speaker 2>on me and get spooked when I was turkey hunting
<v Speaker 2>or something like that. So yeah, I mean that's that's
<v Speaker 2>what kind of like snapped me out of it because
<v Speaker 2>the sound didn't register in my head.
<v Speaker 3>You know, a long time ago, whenever I was doing
<v Speaker 3>filled investigations with a group of people, one of them said,
<v Speaker 3>my good friend Vicky, She said, you got to think
<v Speaker 3>like a booger. They called them boogers in the South.
<v Speaker 3>And yeah, this is a situation. Yeah, this is a
<v Speaker 3>situation where I'm thinking about your scenario where you're out
<v Speaker 3>there by yourself, primitive camping, hunting for boar, and this thing.
<v Speaker 3>I mean, it's nighttime. We both know at this point
<v Speaker 3>what they're capable of doing, and your first clue that
<v Speaker 3>anything was there was that vocalization that it chose to make.
<v Speaker 1>Yes.
<v Speaker 3>So this is a very unique situation. This isn't a
<v Speaker 3>road crossing or just you know, it happened by chance incident.
<v Speaker 3>This is a very intentional I'm coming here. I'm letting
<v Speaker 3>you know I'm here. I want to see you. I'm
<v Speaker 3>going to get in your face.
<v Speaker 1>Yes.
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, that's a really unique encounter for sure.
<v Speaker 2>And you're not going to do anything about it. And
<v Speaker 2>if you do, then you know I'll handle it, right Yeah, right, So.
<v Speaker 3>Did you tell anybody about this encounter afterwards?
<v Speaker 2>Didn't tell anybody for years and years and years, because
<v Speaker 2>you know, I mean, I'm a skeptic, like you know,
<v Speaker 2>like I said, I mean, I grew up, I was
<v Speaker 2>building forts and you know, spending most of.
<v Speaker 1>My time in the woods.
<v Speaker 2>I'm gen X and kind of you know, the last
<v Speaker 2>key type kid go out in the morning, go play
<v Speaker 2>and don't come back, you know, until it's nighttime, or
<v Speaker 2>I shout out the door that dinner's ready. And so yeah,
<v Speaker 2>I mean I everybody before when they would tell me
<v Speaker 2>this stuff, you know, I would be respectful, but inside
<v Speaker 2>of my head, I would be thinking, come on, now,
<v Speaker 2>you're just getting spooked.
<v Speaker 1>You know, you're scared of the dark. If you haven't
<v Speaker 1>spent much time in the woods.
<v Speaker 2>You know, the woods can make strange noises, and it's
<v Speaker 2>not familiar. It's not what civilized society is used to,
<v Speaker 2>you know, and I was extremely scary.
<v Speaker 1>I'm still skeptic, and maybe it's.
<v Speaker 2>My science background, you know, but I always want to
<v Speaker 2>I want to test things, I want to verify things.
<v Speaker 1>But I'm not skeptic anymore about that for sure.
<v Speaker 3>So was it this encounter that pushed you to write
<v Speaker 3>this book?
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, but I mean that was in two thousand and one.
<v Speaker 2>I didn't write this book until this year. But it
<v Speaker 2>drove me to try to rationalize and find out everything
<v Speaker 2>I could about this creature and about other people was
<v Speaker 2>encounters with it, you know.
<v Speaker 1>More is like a proving point in my mind, or
<v Speaker 1>to see if I could.
<v Speaker 2>Corroborate you know, what happened to me with other people
<v Speaker 2>and really got my research going. And I've I've researched
<v Speaker 2>it for years now.
<v Speaker 1>I mean it.
<v Speaker 2>Just to give you a little bit more background. I mean,
<v Speaker 2>that's so my professional job. I do one thing, but
<v Speaker 2>I also research anything I'm passionate about, and I've I've
<v Speaker 2>written a number of books and that's what I do.
<v Speaker 2>So if I learn about something or become an expert
<v Speaker 2>in something.
<v Speaker 1>Not that I'm an expert in bigfoot. I want to
<v Speaker 1>make that clear. I'm not whoa but the word. Yes
<v Speaker 1>I am not. I am not.
<v Speaker 2>But you know, if I'm passionate about it, I I
<v Speaker 2>enjoy writing, and so I research it and write it
<v Speaker 2>and I think that, you know, so that drove me
<v Speaker 2>really to research it and start to collect field notes
<v Speaker 2>and start to interview people and go you know on
<v Speaker 2>other tracks. Always more cautious and careful though since that time, about.
<v Speaker 1>Where I stay and what I look for, you know.
<v Speaker 2>So I've been mark Twain National Forests as Missouri and
<v Speaker 2>Shawnee National Forest, Wayne National Forests out in Ohio and
<v Speaker 2>Cherokee you know. So I've been several places in the US,
<v Speaker 2>and because of my job, I won't say the name,
<v Speaker 2>but I work for a very large international logistics company
<v Speaker 2>and transportation company, and so one of my things I
<v Speaker 2>did with them is I would train people in software
<v Speaker 2>and things like that. And I've been lucky enough to
<v Speaker 2>be able to travel quite a bit with that. So
<v Speaker 2>whenever I was near a place that had reported sightings
<v Speaker 2>and things like that, I would, you know, I would
<v Speaker 2>take a day or two. Often I would I would
<v Speaker 2>either go look myself for interview people, and I would
<v Speaker 2>just collect those field notes.
<v Speaker 3>When did you start doing that? When did you start,
<v Speaker 3>you know, doing actual like research into the topic after
<v Speaker 3>your encounter.
<v Speaker 2>I'd I'd say it was immediately after my first encounter.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, And I'd always, like I.
<v Speaker 2>Said, been interested in those shows and watch the different
<v Speaker 2>shows and documentaries and you know, all that other stuff.
<v Speaker 1>So it was definitely interesting to me.
<v Speaker 2>But I was always skeptical before and always trying to
<v Speaker 2>figure out, is this, you know, is this paradolia?
<v Speaker 1>Is this.
<v Speaker 2>Kind of our hidden you know, primitive years that we've
<v Speaker 2>inherited from our ancestors. What are people seeing? What are
<v Speaker 2>they experiencing because I hadn't seen her experience anything like that.
<v Speaker 2>So it was pretty much immediately afterwards.
<v Speaker 1>I mean I was. I was definitely shaken up about it.
<v Speaker 2>I had told my co workers because my face was
<v Speaker 2>scratched up a little bit.
<v Speaker 1>I had told them that I.
<v Speaker 2>Had fallen off from four wheeler, you know, because I
<v Speaker 2>didn't really want to talk about it. I didn't think
<v Speaker 2>I didn't think people would believe me. I thought they
<v Speaker 2>would think that I was, you know, a kookie bigfoot guy.
<v Speaker 2>So but it was immediately after that.
<v Speaker 3>For sure, you fit into a very rare category. And
<v Speaker 3>I say that from personal experience as a skeptic who
<v Speaker 3>had an encounter, had a signing yourself, So you know
<v Speaker 3>these things are out there. How do you take that,
<v Speaker 3>combine that with skepticism because clearly not everybody that says
<v Speaker 3>they've seen one has actually seen one. There are people
<v Speaker 3>that lie, there are people that are mistaken. You know,
<v Speaker 3>things happen. So how do you take that background and
<v Speaker 3>your skepticism and approach that to eyewitnesses? Whenever you're talking
<v Speaker 3>to people about their encounters, how do you handle that?
<v Speaker 2>I mean, I just approach them with a curious mindset,
<v Speaker 2>and I'm respectful of them. I asked them, you know,
<v Speaker 2>if they believe or if they've had any encounters or
<v Speaker 2>personal experience.
<v Speaker 1>And one of the.
<v Speaker 2>Things that I've been trained to do, because like I said,
<v Speaker 2>I do training of people, I do facilitation, I do
<v Speaker 2>coaching for large businesses, and so I've been trained to
<v Speaker 2>read people's body language, to look at their eyes when
<v Speaker 2>they're talking to me too, to pick up and be
<v Speaker 2>perceptive of lying and things like that. I've attended classes
<v Speaker 2>on that, and so I just kind of pay attention
<v Speaker 2>to all those cues that they're given me, and you know,
<v Speaker 2>try to build a little rapport with them and then
<v Speaker 2>start asking them about it. And if they ask me
<v Speaker 2>if I've had an experience, I say, you know, yes,
<v Speaker 2>but I'd rather not talk about it, and I just
<v Speaker 2>just like that. I just go on from there, but
<v Speaker 2>always with that, you know, scrutiny of is this person
<v Speaker 2>telling me the truth?
<v Speaker 1>And usually I can tell, you know, because I've.
<v Speaker 2>Looked into their eyes and I've seen maybe a little
<v Speaker 2>bit of the emotional baggage that they might have from it.
<v Speaker 1>I can pick up on those things. And so.
<v Speaker 2>That's that's really where I take it and I take
<v Speaker 2>it from there to you know, ask them about it
<v Speaker 2>if they'd be willing to talk to me about it,
<v Speaker 2>about their experiences.
<v Speaker 3>Are there some stories that stand out in your mind
<v Speaker 3>that people have told you.
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean I've I've heard stories before about you know,
<v Speaker 2>people being harassed by one of these creatures, and obviously
<v Speaker 2>all the rock throwing and.
<v Speaker 1>Things like that.
<v Speaker 2>I don't I haven't met an eyewitness yet that had
<v Speaker 2>a an encounter quite as close as mine. I've had
<v Speaker 2>people tell me that, you know, they've seen them on
<v Speaker 2>the banks of a river, They've walked up and they've
<v Speaker 2>seen it, you know, doing something and they thought it
<v Speaker 2>was a bear, and they've gotten closer and seen it
<v Speaker 2>stand up. And then you know a lot of the
<v Speaker 2>other reported things about it crossed the road in front
<v Speaker 2>of me, or it I saw it in the tree line,
<v Speaker 2>or it was too big to be a human, things
<v Speaker 2>like that. Really nothing that stands out, but I will
<v Speaker 2>tell you, I mean, even though I'm skeptical, I am
<v Speaker 2>a Christian as well, right, and so there's there's an
<v Speaker 2>element of a very strong element of faith in my background,
<v Speaker 2>and I had experienced and this was in high school,
<v Speaker 2>kind of a supernatural thing before. So I mean I
<v Speaker 2>was I wasn't one hundred percent closed off.
<v Speaker 1>To this, but I was so skeptical because I had
<v Speaker 1>never experienced anything like it myself, you know.
<v Speaker 2>I mean I was born in the show me state, right,
<v Speaker 2>So that's our that's our motto.
<v Speaker 1>Show me.
<v Speaker 3>So did you approach your research solo or did you
<v Speaker 3>join any groups? Do you work with people?
<v Speaker 1>No, I do it, so.
<v Speaker 2>I mean in the past, I had, you know, trying
<v Speaker 2>to take friends and things like that, but it really
<v Speaker 2>never worked out. I mean it, you know, people are noisy,
<v Speaker 2>and they have their own comfort thresholds and their own fears,
<v Speaker 2>and they disturb the environment. You know, We're trying to
<v Speaker 2>study and and be quiet, be quiet in you know,
<v Speaker 2>and I've seen evidence ruined by misplaced footprints before, and
<v Speaker 2>so yeah, I like to do it alone because I
<v Speaker 2>kind of have to.
<v Speaker 1>You know, I move quietly through the woods. I stop
<v Speaker 1>and I listen.
<v Speaker 2>And most people, I mean they you know, they don't
<v Speaker 2>want the bugs or oh there's too many gnats, there's mosquitoes.
<v Speaker 2>I mean, it's just it's more of a pain than
<v Speaker 2>it's worth. I mean, I definitely monitor and look at
<v Speaker 2>Bigfoot Research online, you know, the b BFRO and and
<v Speaker 2>things like that. I mean, I've been on their site
<v Speaker 2>and looked at their stuff for.
<v Speaker 1>A long time.
<v Speaker 4>I'm a member of a lot of cryptid groups on Facebook,
<v Speaker 4>and I listened to people's stories and I've you know,
<v Speaker 4>reached out there to get in contact with them with
<v Speaker 4>private messages, especially if.
<v Speaker 2>I know I'm going to be around their area if
<v Speaker 2>I can find that out. So like that, I haven't
<v Speaker 2>formally joined any groups though. I mean, I want the
<v Speaker 2>people that listen to this to know. I mean, I'm
<v Speaker 2>not a bigfoot guy. I'm a researcher and a writer,
<v Speaker 2>and I had a very bad bigfoot experience, which is.
<v Speaker 1>Why I wrote the book.
<v Speaker 2>But I'm not you know, you're never going to see
<v Speaker 2>me at a conference selling T shirts and mugs or.
<v Speaker 1>Any thing like that.
<v Speaker 2>I mean, I don't look at I don't look at
<v Speaker 2>this thing like a mascot, you know, I don't. I mean,
<v Speaker 2>it's serious and I and I think it's potentially dangerous.
<v Speaker 2>And I think that they're I think that they're intelligent enough.
<v Speaker 1>To be just like people.
<v Speaker 2>You know, you meet people in life that are kind
<v Speaker 2>and nice and polite and you meet people.
<v Speaker 1>That are not so kind and nice and.
<v Speaker 2>Polite, and so I mean, I maybe they have the
<v Speaker 2>same breadth of characters in their groups, you know.
<v Speaker 3>So what types of topics do you cover in this book?
<v Speaker 2>I cover a little bit of everything. I tried to
<v Speaker 2>cover every theory and add my own theory to it,
<v Speaker 2>so I cover you know, is is Bigfoot a spirit?
<v Speaker 2>Is it, you know, a creature of energy? Is it
<v Speaker 2>multi dimensional? Is it related to the you fold phenomenon?
<v Speaker 2>Because there's a high percentage of of eyewitness accounts out
<v Speaker 2>there that you know, they're seen around the same time
<v Speaker 2>that people see unidentified aerial phenomenon in UFOs. So I
<v Speaker 2>really cover a lot in this book. Do they live
<v Speaker 2>in caves?
<v Speaker 1>Do they? You know?
<v Speaker 2>Why haven't we found bigfoot skeletons and remains? And there's
<v Speaker 2>an interesting story in the book about a man that
<v Speaker 2>I had met on one of my travels that was
<v Speaker 2>a shaman, and he actually gave me the impression that
<v Speaker 2>his people knew about this creature, they had had interactions
<v Speaker 2>with it in the past, and that they have to
<v Speaker 2>eat constantly because of their size. And he gave me
<v Speaker 2>the impression, the compression that Bigfoot will eat their dead.
<v Speaker 3>Huh.
<v Speaker 1>I don't know if that's.
<v Speaker 2>True, obviously, but I did document that in the book.
<v Speaker 2>One thing I think is strange that I never see
<v Speaker 2>and I never hear of other people doing. You have
<v Speaker 2>all these bigfoot researchers, right, that are full time researchers,
<v Speaker 2>or at least they they give that impression that they're
<v Speaker 2>full time researchers.
<v Speaker 1>I mean, none of these people ever look up in
<v Speaker 1>the trees, right. Don't you think that's odd?
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, there's several reports of them falling out of trees.
<v Speaker 2>So yeah, if it's a bipedal primeate, primates climb trees.
<v Speaker 2>Humans are primeates, right, We climb, We can climb trees.
<v Speaker 2>I don't know why they don't do that. That's one
<v Speaker 2>of the things that puzzles me for sure.
<v Speaker 3>Well, I mean from the the track castings and stuff
<v Speaker 3>like that. Obviously, we have doctor Jeff melderm at our
<v Speaker 3>Disposal who has confirmed that in his own investigations of
<v Speaker 3>tracks and castings and everything, that they do in fact
<v Speaker 3>have some sort of mid tarsal or meta tarsal break
<v Speaker 3>or whatever the correct vernacular is, but a hinged foot,
<v Speaker 3>and that would be an adaptation for climbing trees. That's
<v Speaker 3>that's where absolutely so at least at some point in time,
<v Speaker 3>even though I get it they're huge, you know, eight
<v Speaker 3>four feet wide, but at some point in time they
<v Speaker 3>were tree dwellers, whether we like it or not. And
<v Speaker 3>I mean, orangutans get pretty big and they climb trees.
<v Speaker 3>They live in trees. So it's not you know, unheard
<v Speaker 3>of or impossible. And you're right. I have actually had
<v Speaker 3>someone on the show tell me about an encounter where
<v Speaker 3>the thing was up in a tree. And there's a
<v Speaker 3>few reports out there of like hikers and campers and
<v Speaker 3>people experience them dropping out of trees all of a
<v Speaker 3>sudden and you know, running off through the woods or whatever.
<v Speaker 3>So the reports are out there, they're just not very common.
<v Speaker 3>But yeah, I agree people should be looking in the
<v Speaker 3>trees more, and they should also be looking down at
<v Speaker 3>the ground more too, because we also have a lot
<v Speaker 3>of situations where they like you know, go prone and
<v Speaker 3>they flat on the ground and people usually just look
<v Speaker 3>right over them.
<v Speaker 2>But yeah, and they spider crawl and yeah, yeah, yeah
<v Speaker 2>for sure. So that's so I cover all those different
<v Speaker 2>topics and even you know, there's and I think it's
<v Speaker 2>a lesser known theory, you know that maybe these things
<v Speaker 2>are somehow related to extraterrestrials. Again, I've never seen an
<v Speaker 2>extraterrestrial I've never seen a a UFO and that or
<v Speaker 2>that they're guardians, you know, from an advanced to previously
<v Speaker 2>previous society, you know, advanced civilization. I mean I cover
<v Speaker 2>all that. I also cover, which is not going to
<v Speaker 2>be a is not going to be something that people like.
<v Speaker 2>But I have a chapter that I say tree knocks
<v Speaker 2>are bullshit. Wow, excuse my language, because if you think
<v Speaker 2>about it, I mean, we're this is an intelligent creature, right,
<v Speaker 2>I mean most everyone agrees on that it's intelligent. Why
<v Speaker 2>would something that is, you know, better than the best
<v Speaker 2>Native American ever at hiding and obscuring itself.
<v Speaker 1>Why in the world would it.
<v Speaker 2>Knock, especially when it's able to do vocalizations. Why would
<v Speaker 2>it beat on trees with sticks and alert people to
<v Speaker 2>its presence. There is no old primate that is known
<v Speaker 2>on Earth that does that outside of an aggressive or
<v Speaker 2>a bluff type of look at my power, look at
<v Speaker 2>my strength type of movement. So silver backed guerrillas do
<v Speaker 2>not do that. They may topple trees that may shake trees,
<v Speaker 2>they do not take sticks and smack a tree. Chimpanzees
<v Speaker 2>will use twigs to pull ants and termites on of
<v Speaker 2>trees as a tool to eat them.
<v Speaker 1>But there is no primate.
<v Speaker 2>That has documented evidence anywhere on Earth that beats on
<v Speaker 2>trees as communication, or as a signal or as anything.
<v Speaker 3>Well, we kind of we talked a little, not about
<v Speaker 3>tree knocks specifically, but the overall thought. And I'm not
<v Speaker 3>trying to you know, gang up on anybody's thoughts or
<v Speaker 3>opinions or things or anything. Sure, sure, no, And I'm
<v Speaker 3>not trying to the bigfoot world. Yeah, of course, it
<v Speaker 3>doesn't matter what you say. There's going to be people
<v Speaker 3>that disagree, sure, that's for sure. But it's a matter
<v Speaker 3>of fact that if you're out in the woods looking
<v Speaker 3>for Bigfoot and you hear a tree dock, oh it
<v Speaker 3>was a Bigfoot. If you're out there looking for ghosts,
<v Speaker 3>it's a ghost. If you're out there looking for aliens,
<v Speaker 3>it's an alien.
<v Speaker 1>Correct.
<v Speaker 3>We get caught up in a lot of that. And
<v Speaker 3>most of the stuff that is attributed directly to Bigfoot,
<v Speaker 3>whether it be tree knocks, rock clacking, limb formations and structures,
<v Speaker 3>all those things. There's no proof that Bigfoot's doing any
<v Speaker 3>of it. We don't have any of that documented. It's
<v Speaker 3>just oh, well, we're out here looking for bigfoot, and
<v Speaker 3>so this looks like something that you know, could be
<v Speaker 3>done by a bigfoot if it's here, So that makes
<v Speaker 3>this trip successful. Yeah, this the Bigfoot made this, and
<v Speaker 3>it's just kind of stuck over the years.
<v Speaker 2>Right, and that I mean, that's so that's what I
<v Speaker 2>go into is, you know, hard evidence is hard evidence.
<v Speaker 2>I mean, I saw with my own eyes one, so
<v Speaker 2>I know. But yeah, tree knocks, you know, I think
<v Speaker 2>there's vocalizations that I've heard the Sierra sounds for example.
<v Speaker 2>I think that that's legitimate, absolutely because I heard similar
<v Speaker 2>noises that night with my experience. But yeah, I mean
<v Speaker 2>I want I want hard data. I've seen the foot
<v Speaker 2>cast I've seen those in person.
<v Speaker 1>I've seen the footprints, so.
<v Speaker 2>I believe that, Yes, it definitely has feet, it definitely
<v Speaker 2>crushes things. It has a lot of body mass and weight,
<v Speaker 2>you know, so I can I can touch that, I
<v Speaker 2>can experience that, and so yeah, I believe that.
<v Speaker 1>But yeah, some of this stuff is a little out there.
<v Speaker 3>With all the theories and you being a Christian. Yeah,
<v Speaker 3>what are your thoughts on the theory that Bigfoot is
<v Speaker 3>like Nephelin more demonic.
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so I've I've written a Christian book, and I
<v Speaker 2>study the Bible.
<v Speaker 1>I mean, I don't believe that it's a Nephelim.
<v Speaker 2>Because I believe that number one majority of those died
<v Speaker 2>out with the flood.
<v Speaker 1>There have been anecdotal reports.
<v Speaker 2>There was a recent report recent being last ten to
<v Speaker 2>fifteen courses unit in Afghanistan. So, you know, I definitely
<v Speaker 2>believe that those things existed at one point, but.
<v Speaker 1>I don't believe that now.
<v Speaker 2>Whether this creature is completely definable from the scientific truth
<v Speaker 2>that it you know, it's an involved gigantapithecus. I mean,
<v Speaker 2>I've seen the artist depictions of gigantapithecus, and I've seen those.
<v Speaker 1>This was not. It was not that I can tell
<v Speaker 1>you that it was not.
<v Speaker 2>So, whether it's like all flesh and blood, whether it
<v Speaker 2>has cloaking abilities to stay hidden, I don't know.
<v Speaker 1>I don't know. But the thing I.
<v Speaker 2>Saw was very much real and horrifying. Yeah, So, I
<v Speaker 2>honestly I don't know. And the book, you know, doesn't
<v Speaker 2>have those answers. I don't think anyone has those answers.
<v Speaker 2>We will not have those answers until we, you know,
<v Speaker 2>figure out it's its biome, where does it live, where
<v Speaker 2>does it thrive? If we look at it, we can
<v Speaker 2>dissect it, we can draw blood from it. I even
<v Speaker 2>go into that, we already have that the military, you know,
<v Speaker 2>in the government, may be involved with some of this
<v Speaker 2>because around Washington, I'm sure you know this, there were
<v Speaker 2>reports during the Mount Saint Helen's eruption, there were reports
<v Speaker 2>that some of these creatures were evacuated from the area
<v Speaker 2>by military helicopters.
<v Speaker 1>I don't know if you've ever read that, so you know,
<v Speaker 1>I mean, I don't know what it is. I definitely
<v Speaker 1>don't know, but I know that I know that it's real.
<v Speaker 3>That's a question that gets asked a lot, So I'm
<v Speaker 3>going to ask you that question. Why would the government
<v Speaker 3>cover this up? Why would they want to keep it
<v Speaker 3>a secret?
<v Speaker 1>I think for a lot of reasons.
<v Speaker 2>I think anything that the government can can try to
<v Speaker 2>use for its own purposes to promote, you know, power structure,
<v Speaker 2>increase its wealth and influence in the world world, do
<v Speaker 2>genetic testing on this. I think there's a lot of reasons.
<v Speaker 2>I think you know when I in nineteen when was
<v Speaker 2>that nineteen ninety eight I worked for I worked for IBM,
<v Speaker 2>and I my the campus that I was in charge
<v Speaker 2>of as far as computer repair, networking, all that stuff,
<v Speaker 2>the equipment stuff. They had a contract with McDonald Douglas
<v Speaker 2>and I was on that campus. That's what I was
<v Speaker 2>responsible for, all the buildings of McDonald Douglas in Saint Louis.
<v Speaker 2>And I had a top secret security clearance and I
<v Speaker 2>but I was, you know, the guy going around fixing
<v Speaker 2>computers and things like that. And I will tell you
<v Speaker 2>that there was a plane, a jet in the one
<v Speaker 2>of the hangars there that now I understand as a
<v Speaker 2>stealth fighter. I didn't understand that at the time. I
<v Speaker 2>hadn't seen anything like that. I remember touching the wing
<v Speaker 2>and it was very smooth. It was a black plane.
<v Speaker 2>There were Air Force test pilots and things there. And
<v Speaker 2>you know, we're talking about a facility that builds, you know,
<v Speaker 2>jay dam rockets and all that stuff. A facility where
<v Speaker 2>I would go in rooms with engineers and I would
<v Speaker 2>actually be walking in a vault with four and five
<v Speaker 2>foot thick steel doors. When I would walk in the room,
<v Speaker 2>they would flip a little red light that would rotate
<v Speaker 2>on the wall, and all the engineers, everybody in that
<v Speaker 2>room there would be an arm guard with me. Everybody
<v Speaker 2>in that room would clear everything off their desk, they'd
<v Speaker 2>put it into their desk, lock their desk, and they
<v Speaker 2>would wait and stand there while I took the computer apart,
<v Speaker 2>placed whatever. And I even had a gun drawn on
<v Speaker 2>me one time because we were supposed to return all
<v Speaker 2>the they're called fru's Field replaceable units, were supposed to
<v Speaker 2>return those IBM because they had the contract with McDonald douglas.
<v Speaker 2>We swap out the hard drive. We returned the old
<v Speaker 2>hard drive.
<v Speaker 1>The guard.
<v Speaker 2>Pointed his gun at me and said, no, you're going
<v Speaker 2>to leave that hard drive here. So I was like, yes, sir,
<v Speaker 2>I will leave it here. And I you know, so,
<v Speaker 2>I mean, I've what I'm what I'm getting at, and
<v Speaker 2>I'm a little verbose.
<v Speaker 1>I apologize. Is I saw.
<v Speaker 2>That now that I recognize it as a stealth. But
<v Speaker 2>the government, I believe, and my whole family is military
<v Speaker 2>and law enforcement. I was the only civvy in the family.
<v Speaker 2>I'm civilian. So what I believe is that these you know,
<v Speaker 2>they're always looking for that edge, that edge, and superiority
<v Speaker 2>that edge, and you know, we're going to beat out
<v Speaker 2>our enemies, our competitors, and.
<v Speaker 1>So why wouldn't they Why wouldn't.
<v Speaker 2>They study this thing and try to extract secrets from it.
<v Speaker 2>If it can stay hidden, if it can move silently
<v Speaker 2>in the woods, if it's faster than humans, if it's
<v Speaker 2>stronger than humans, why wouldn't they.
<v Speaker 3>You know, if we look back at things like remote
<v Speaker 3>viewing and the government studying that and trying to use
<v Speaker 3>it and develop it, and psychic abilities and everything that
<v Speaker 3>was kind of prompted by the Russians looking into it,
<v Speaker 3>if I remember correctly, And we do know that for
<v Speaker 3>a while at least the Russians were also trying to
<v Speaker 3>develop super soldiers using primate hybrids and stuff. So it
<v Speaker 3>all kind of makes sense that if the Russians were
<v Speaker 3>doing that sort of thing, we would have been doing
<v Speaker 3>that sort of thing too. And if we had access
<v Speaker 3>to something like a sasquatch at our disposal, yeah, of
<v Speaker 3>course they would try to use it and weaponize it
<v Speaker 3>and see what they could make from it.
<v Speaker 1>Definitely.
<v Speaker 3>Yes, I've been waiting to ask you about this. I
<v Speaker 3>don't know how to pronounce it is it the ass Wang.
<v Speaker 3>It's the Aswang. I mean, come on, man, you gotta
<v Speaker 3>tell me what's going on with that.
<v Speaker 1>So there's a personal experience of mind that I've I've
<v Speaker 1>never told.
<v Speaker 2>Anyone before this this book that I documented in the book.
<v Speaker 2>It's in chapter seven. It's called Demons in the Jungle.
<v Speaker 2>And so this was in twenty twenty two. Now, Matt,
<v Speaker 2>I don't know if you've I don't know if you've
<v Speaker 2>seen my book or anything. But I have pictures of
<v Speaker 2>the aftermath of the attack. But let me just I'll
<v Speaker 2>go into the story. Since I've told her a few times,
<v Speaker 2>I'll tell it again. I mean, it's out there. If
<v Speaker 2>people think I'm a looney tune, they can think.
<v Speaker 1>That I don't care me.
<v Speaker 2>So in twenty twenty two, I you know, I went
<v Speaker 2>to the Philippines to meet my girlfriend and just his
<v Speaker 2>background for your audience there, you know, I speak to Galog.
<v Speaker 1>My first wife was from the Philippines.
<v Speaker 2>My son is a Philippine citizen and a citizen of
<v Speaker 2>the US.
<v Speaker 1>So I speak to Galog.
<v Speaker 2>And I had gone to the Philippines in twenty twenty
<v Speaker 2>two with a couple goals. I wanted to meet my
<v Speaker 2>new girlfriend, and I wanted to hunt the almamongo, which
<v Speaker 2>is a cryptid there that is very comparable to our
<v Speaker 2>bigfoot or our sasquatch. And they say that it's in
<v Speaker 2>the mountains of Negro sucks dental.
<v Speaker 1>It's a large, hairy beast. In fact, I put a fact.
<v Speaker 2>Sheet in the book about you know what what this
<v Speaker 2>creature's called in different cultures in different countries, and information
<v Speaker 2>about it there. And so I thought, well, I'm going
<v Speaker 2>to be in the Philippines for about seven eight weeks,
<v Speaker 2>and so I'll just take a little side trip because
<v Speaker 2>I knew that I was going to be going to
<v Speaker 2>Elo Elo and Negro SEXI Dentel is fairly close by.
<v Speaker 1>My girlfriend at the time.
<v Speaker 2>You know, I had already met up with her and
<v Speaker 2>met her family and been with her a couple of weeks,
<v Speaker 2>and I said, you know, I'm just going to go
<v Speaker 2>for one week.
<v Speaker 1>And she obviously thought I was crazy.
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I was gonna say, how did they like that?
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, she did not like that at all, and she
<v Speaker 2>definitely did not want to go with me, you know,
<v Speaker 2>but I shureder, I said.
<v Speaker 1>One week, I promise I'll come back. I won't be
<v Speaker 1>gone longer than a week.
<v Speaker 2>And you know, at the time, little did I know,
<v Speaker 2>but it would become one of the most dangerous things
<v Speaker 2>that I've ever done.
<v Speaker 1>So I had done a little research.
<v Speaker 2>I found a local Auti tribesman who was kind of
<v Speaker 2>a guide, and he spoke enough English to act as my.
<v Speaker 1>Guide, named Rinaldo, and he had told me that he
<v Speaker 1>knew the forest.
<v Speaker 2>Well, and he knew where the Amamongo lived and that
<v Speaker 2>they were basically they hung around and were in the
<v Speaker 2>the shadows of Mount Cono on con La. It depends
<v Speaker 2>on who you talk to. But which was like two
<v Speaker 2>hours ride and then I checked into a hotel there
<v Speaker 2>and met up with Rinaldo at a local bar called
<v Speaker 2>Tippy's Bistro. And people can check this stuff. I mean,
<v Speaker 2>I think Tippies may even have they may be on
<v Speaker 2>the web right now. But you know, I told him
<v Speaker 2>I would pay him three thousand pesos, which at the
<v Speaker 2>time was about sixty US dollars, and we set off.
<v Speaker 1>Into the jungle. He was going to guide me.
<v Speaker 2>So yeah, our first couple of days weren't were uneventful.
<v Speaker 1>You know, we would we would hear noises at night.
<v Speaker 1>But again I'm not that.
<v Speaker 2>Familiar with the jungles of the Philippines, and so I
<v Speaker 2>didn't think much about it. It seemed to unsettle Rinaldo
<v Speaker 2>a little bit. The fire and he would drink tendu
<v Speaker 2>i and which is a local rum there. I would
<v Speaker 2>drink a little bit, but I'm not really a drinker,
<v Speaker 2>you know, and just that they and then go to sleep.
<v Speaker 2>But on the morning of the third day, I woke
<v Speaker 2>up and Ronaldo was gone, and all of my gear
<v Speaker 2>was gone, and he had written a note. I don't
<v Speaker 2>know if you have any Filipino listeners, but you know,
<v Speaker 2>he said, patawad Hindiko, na kaya, Alam, nang magann La Lang, Nangutan,
<v Speaker 2>kung ba nandito Nasila. So it basically meant, you know, sorry,
<v Speaker 2>I can't take it anymore. The creatures of the forest
<v Speaker 2>know why we're here. They're angry.
<v Speaker 1>I've left you. It's up to you now, yeah, exactly.
<v Speaker 1>And you know, people all we can get into that.
<v Speaker 1>But I have some theories about Ronaldo and that stuff.
<v Speaker 2>So so at that point, I'm up a creek proverbial creek,
<v Speaker 2>down a paddle, right.
<v Speaker 1>I don't have my stuff. I didn't bring my phone.
<v Speaker 2>I had left that in the hotel because I'm I
<v Speaker 2>don't have signal or SIM card anyway in the Philippines,
<v Speaker 2>and so and I didn't have any idea where thema
<v Speaker 2>Mango was. So I'm like, okay, you know that's going
<v Speaker 2>to have to wait. I need to get out of
<v Speaker 2>here at this point. Sometimes there's there can be rebels,
<v Speaker 2>and there can be you know, abusaf and Muslim extremist
<v Speaker 2>folks that live in the jungle. So I was worried
<v Speaker 2>about that.
<v Speaker 1>I was worried about am I going to be able
<v Speaker 1>to find my way out? Or am I gonna, you know,
<v Speaker 1>die here? So I was completely alone in the heart
<v Speaker 1>of the jungle.
<v Speaker 2>Followed a stream on the mountain that it would it
<v Speaker 2>would have her in the water, would lead in a village,
<v Speaker 2>would mean safety.
<v Speaker 1>And so that's what I did.
<v Speaker 2>I started going through that, and I remember I hiked
<v Speaker 2>for I don't know, nine or ten hours probably and.
<v Speaker 1>Question probably mid forties.
<v Speaker 2>He invited me into his shanty, which you know, when
<v Speaker 2>this is the third world country, you know, I love
<v Speaker 2>the Philippines, but it is what it is. So the
<v Speaker 2>house or the hut was like bamboo and rusted metal.
<v Speaker 2>But I was exhausted, and so I accepted his hospitality.
<v Speaker 2>And inside of his hut it was him and his
<v Speaker 2>wife and their gaunt child is probably no older than twelve.
<v Speaker 1>And I say it was gone. I mean he was thin,
<v Speaker 1>you know, super thin.
<v Speaker 2>And I sat down quietly on the floor and I
<v Speaker 2>sipped on a small glass of tuba. There wasn't a
<v Speaker 2>concern because again, I was hungry. I was thirsty. The
<v Speaker 2>man had gone out back to bretty kitchen area. It
<v Speaker 2>was just just a fire and a pot and everything,
<v Speaker 2>so he had gone out there. And then I remember
<v Speaker 2>I started to feel strange, you know, my my vision
<v Speaker 2>started getting a little blurry, and I felt dizzy. And
<v Speaker 2>that's when I figured out that I think they had
<v Speaker 2>put something in my drink. And I tried, I tried
<v Speaker 2>to stand up and to kind of shake off the dizziness,
<v Speaker 2>and and the room started to spin.
<v Speaker 1>And that's that's when I noticed the child's eyes, the
<v Speaker 1>kid's eyes, and they were they were red, they were
<v Speaker 1>glowing red.
<v Speaker 2>And he was staring at me, you know, staring at
<v Speaker 2>staring at me with like a hunger, like you know
<v Speaker 2>a predator looks at it's it's prey. And he pulled
<v Speaker 2>his you know, teeth back and made us or his
<v Speaker 2>lips back and made a snarl, and he had jagged teeth.
<v Speaker 2>And that's when I when I said, you know, what
<v Speaker 2>the hell's happening? And I just knew I had to leave.
<v Speaker 2>I wanted to get out of that hut, out of
<v Speaker 2>that environment, and I knew I was in danger. I
<v Speaker 2>knew that they had put something in the drink. And
<v Speaker 2>when I started the head for the door, the the
<v Speaker 2>kid growled.
<v Speaker 1>And he lunged at me, jumped on top of my back.
<v Speaker 2>Like like a wild animal, and his teeth, you know,
<v Speaker 2>he was tearing at my face and my arms and
<v Speaker 2>biting me and clawing at me.
<v Speaker 1>Back.
<v Speaker 2>I grabbed him to try to throw him off, and
<v Speaker 2>his teeth sink deep into my forearm. And again I've
<v Speaker 2>got pictures of the aftermath in the book. But but
<v Speaker 2>I did, you know, I think when he bit my arm,
<v Speaker 2>because it hurt so badly that it kind of snapped
<v Speaker 2>me out of whatever mental state I was in, whatever
<v Speaker 2>kind of drugged up, doped up state I was in,
<v Speaker 2>because I.
<v Speaker 1>Threw him, you know, off of me.
<v Speaker 2>I threw him against the the wall of the hut,
<v Speaker 2>and he kind of you know, thuds and lay and
<v Speaker 2>you know, laid on the floor, fell on the floor,
<v Speaker 2>and my arm is bleeding down, my hand dripping blood,
<v Speaker 2>and my eye because he had tried to claw out
<v Speaker 2>my eye. I had deep puncture wounds and lacerations under.
<v Speaker 1>My eye, bleeding out of my face. And the mother
<v Speaker 1>screamed and it was like a you know, you.
<v Speaker 2>See those movies sometimes where somebody says something like with
<v Speaker 2>a demonic sounding voice.
<v Speaker 1>It's not just a.
<v Speaker 2>Normal human voice anymore. And she screamed basically for her husband,
<v Speaker 2>and she said, I'm not gonna worry you with the
<v Speaker 2>to dialogue again, but she said, Tayan, hurry, our food
<v Speaker 2>is escaping.
<v Speaker 1>Don't let him get away.
<v Speaker 2>And again her voice was like half beast, half human.
<v Speaker 2>And you know, the kid started crawling towards me again,
<v Speaker 2>this time on all fours. And I knew that I
<v Speaker 2>was in a great deal of trouble at this point.
<v Speaker 2>I knew that I would I would be dead if
<v Speaker 2>I stayed there. And she had kind of blocked my
<v Speaker 2>path to the door. When I say door, I mean
<v Speaker 2>it wasn't a door as much as it was like
<v Speaker 2>a blanket over the opening of their hut.
<v Speaker 1>But she blocked my path and I had come to.
<v Speaker 2>A little bit because the pain of the bite on
<v Speaker 2>my forearm, and I just I just kicked her as.
<v Speaker 1>Hard as I could, with everything I had in me.
<v Speaker 1>I kicked her.
<v Speaker 2>I kicked her right under the chin, and she crumpled
<v Speaker 2>to the floor. And that was when I saw that
<v Speaker 2>the guy was coming to the back and he had
<v Speaker 2>a machete in his hand. His eyes were glowing red
<v Speaker 2>as well. The mother's eyes were glowing red.
<v Speaker 1>And I just ran.
<v Speaker 2>I ran out the door, and I ran until I
<v Speaker 2>couldn't run anymore, and eventually I got to a barung
<v Speaker 2>guy hall, which is I don't know if you know
<v Speaker 2>much about the Philippines, but they have like locally elected
<v Speaker 2>peacekeepers and people that you know, settle disputes and everything.
<v Speaker 1>They have like a barung guy captain.
<v Speaker 2>They have little barung guys, yeah, and usually they're elected
<v Speaker 2>or maybe an elder for that area that everybody trusts,
<v Speaker 2>they trust, trust their judgment or whatever. And so I
<v Speaker 2>saw a little barung guy hall and it still had
<v Speaker 2>a light on inside, and I beat on the door
<v Speaker 2>and kind of collapsed by the door, and this man
<v Speaker 2>in his mid sixties told me he was the barun guy.
<v Speaker 2>Captain helped me inside, and I remember basically said, and
<v Speaker 2>you know, shaking his head, he said, you're very lucky, Joe.
<v Speaker 1>He repeated, You're lucky and was shaking his head.
<v Speaker 2>And then he'd called his a friend and he said,
<v Speaker 2>my friend will drive you back to your hotel. And so,
<v Speaker 2>you know, I'm riding back to my hotel and I'm
<v Speaker 2>in shock, and I just keep replaying the events and
<v Speaker 2>just kind of in a state of shock and trauma
<v Speaker 2>over what had happened and how closely I came to.
<v Speaker 1>Being killed. But yeah, when I got back.
<v Speaker 2>To the hotel, my arm and my face, my body
<v Speaker 2>was had bites and lacerations, and I took photos back
<v Speaker 2>into the hotel of the aftermath, you know, and it
<v Speaker 2>it really, it was one of the most and I've
<v Speaker 2>you know, I've been in fights and things. I mean,
<v Speaker 2>it was the most violent type of encounter that I've
<v Speaker 2>ever had in my life, and probably one of the
<v Speaker 2>closest that I've come to in as far as dying.
<v Speaker 2>So the next day I checked out of the hotel
<v Speaker 2>and I left. I went back to Elo Elo. Oh,
<v Speaker 2>I remember that the bite mark on my arm, it
<v Speaker 2>took you know, a few weeks to heal, and people
<v Speaker 2>ask me, well, why didn't you call the authorities and
<v Speaker 2>why didn't you do this and that?
<v Speaker 1>And I mean, I'm a foreigner, right yea one, I
<v Speaker 1>don't know.
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I don't even know if the police would come there, right,
<v Speaker 2>I don't I don't even know if they would come there.
<v Speaker 2>If they did come there, would they try to get
<v Speaker 2>money out of the Americano?
<v Speaker 1>Would they? You know, I didn't have any rest of
<v Speaker 1>the world.
<v Speaker 3>There are definitely places that don't work like it does here.
<v Speaker 3>Even though we people you know, definitely have issues with
<v Speaker 3>law enforcement and laws and government and how things are
<v Speaker 3>in you really need to spend some time learning about
<v Speaker 3>how life works in other countries, especially if you're traveling
<v Speaker 3>as an American.
<v Speaker 1>Oh yeah, definitely.
<v Speaker 2>And so my main concern was just you know, getting
<v Speaker 2>back to familiar territory, getting back to Elo Elo and
<v Speaker 2>the safety and know that I had rented with my
<v Speaker 2>girlfriend at the time.
<v Speaker 1>So that's that's what I did. Now, you know, was
<v Speaker 1>it a setup? Was there really?
<v Speaker 5>Was Renaldo really going to take me to see the
<v Speaker 5>a'man ango or was he just you know, trying to
<v Speaker 5>get a foreigner lost in the woods after he took
<v Speaker 5>money and then steal his stuff from him.
<v Speaker 1>I don't know, I don't know.
<v Speaker 3>Maybe So is there anything you know, we would know
<v Speaker 3>in the United States that is similar in comparison to
<v Speaker 3>the Oschwong.
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean, if you look at the mythology and
<v Speaker 2>the folk or around the aswang, they're they're probably most
<v Speaker 2>similar to our vampires. But you know, obviously they can
<v Speaker 2>go out in the daylight. They're not supposed to be immortal.
<v Speaker 2>Some people in the Philippines believe that they can shape shift.
<v Speaker 2>They you know, they drink blood, but they also are
<v Speaker 2>you know, cannibalistic. They some of the folklore, especially around
<v Speaker 2>the mendon Now area, which is the northern most or,
<v Speaker 2>which is an island in the Philippines, they they will
<v Speaker 2>say that, you know, as wang will go up on
<v Speaker 2>the roof and it will stick its tongue through the
<v Speaker 2>window and latch on to pregnant women and their bellies
<v Speaker 2>and drink the fluid from the woman's belly. So there's
<v Speaker 2>a lot of things like that. And then even my
<v Speaker 2>girlfriend was telling me at the time that they believed
<v Speaker 2>that they even had aschwangs that lived in their town,
<v Speaker 2>which is Antik, which is like an hour and a
<v Speaker 2>half drive from Elo Elo.
<v Speaker 1>So they have Ashwang.
<v Speaker 2>Everybody knows they're Oschwangs, but they have you know, strict
<v Speaker 2>instructions to not hurt anyone.
<v Speaker 1>If they hurt anyone, or someone with the barung gai
<v Speaker 1>would go to Yeah. So I don't know.
<v Speaker 2>There's a lot of different mythology, but I would say
<v Speaker 2>the closest is probably the vampire.
<v Speaker 3>So which one was scarier for you?
<v Speaker 1>I think the bigfoot was more scary.
<v Speaker 2>I think I was in more real danger though from
<v Speaker 2>the Ashwang attack because it was deliberate.
<v Speaker 1>They were me down. I don't know if they were
<v Speaker 1>going to chop me up and eat me. I don't know.
<v Speaker 1>I don't know what they were going to do. But
<v Speaker 1>I know that.
<v Speaker 2>I was in more real danger that night. And I
<v Speaker 2>don't know again if maybe what they gave me in
<v Speaker 2>the tuba it wasn't it wasn't as as scary as
<v Speaker 2>it was more dangerous, But the bigfoot thing was definitely
<v Speaker 2>dangerous because you have to remember I was.
<v Speaker 1>You know, I was completely at peace. I was half asleep.
<v Speaker 2>When that happened, and it was something that I did
<v Speaker 2>not that I never fathomed really existed.
<v Speaker 1>To see that, to see a legend.
<v Speaker 2>You know, like that appear in front of me, To
<v Speaker 2>have that size and that that presence. You know, these
<v Speaker 2>even though they attacked me, I mean they were you know,
<v Speaker 2>they were shaped like people. They were smaller than me.
<v Speaker 2>You know, it wasn't as imposing as as terrifying as
<v Speaker 2>like now you're safe and you're in the forest and
<v Speaker 2>everything is fine, and then all of a sudden, now
<v Speaker 2>you've got something that you feel like could tear you
<v Speaker 2>apart if it wanted to.
<v Speaker 3>It's an amazing story. Man, is Bigfoot subject that you're
<v Speaker 3>going to approach again with future works? Or do you
<v Speaker 3>got anything else on the horizon?
<v Speaker 1>I am right now. I'm writing a book on to
<v Speaker 1>Galog and.
<v Speaker 2>War I war I Whichari is the main language spoken
<v Speaker 2>in Lity. It's the local language, which is an area
<v Speaker 2>in the Philippines. So it's a just a language reference
<v Speaker 2>guide to help people, you know, understand English to Galog
<v Speaker 2>and Warai. And then after that, I've got another book
<v Speaker 2>about a disease that I suffer from and I've suffered
<v Speaker 2>for a long time with this idiopathic Hypersalma still going
<v Speaker 2>to be personally investigating and looking and researching Bigfoot. Absolutely,
<v Speaker 2>I will always do that. But am I going to
<v Speaker 2>write another book about it?
<v Speaker 1>I don't know.
<v Speaker 2>I definitely don't have anything right now in mind. The
<v Speaker 2>Bigfoot Paradox. It's not your typical cryptid book. So, you know,
<v Speaker 2>I try to be provocative. I try to make people think.
<v Speaker 2>I try to make people evaluate these things, both from
<v Speaker 2>a scientific perspective, eyewitness account, the folklore. I have all
<v Speaker 2>that in the book, research on that. It's it's an
<v Speaker 2>unsettling book, and it's it's supposed to be. I'm trying
<v Speaker 2>to walk the line between fact and fiction and truth
<v Speaker 2>and mythology. You know, I will tell you something that
<v Speaker 2>always piqued my interest about Bigfoot is, how do you
<v Speaker 2>have a creature?
<v Speaker 1>If it is all legend ar all myth, how.
<v Speaker 2>Do you have a creature that transcends cultural boundaries, country boundrease, governments,
<v Speaker 2>is depicted in cave diagrams from thousands of years ago?
<v Speaker 1>How do you have that?
<v Speaker 2>How do you have especially when it's alongside real and
<v Speaker 2>known a animals, how do you have that? And it'd
<v Speaker 2>be purely a legend. So I want people to read
<v Speaker 2>the book obviously, but I want you to think.
<v Speaker 1>So.
<v Speaker 2>If you're looking for a book that is entertaining and
<v Speaker 2>that challenges you and what you believe, and you know,
<v Speaker 2>maybe keeps you up at night, this is.
<v Speaker 1>A good book for that.
<v Speaker 3>And if you've had your own encounter with Bigfoot or
<v Speaker 3>Oshwong or something else you can't explain, send me an
<v Speaker 3>email a Bigfoot Crossroads at gmail dot com. Check out
<v Speaker 3>the website Bigfootcrossroads dot com. You can find links to
<v Speaker 3>social media, past episodes, merchandise, everything you need all in
<v Speaker 3>one place. And until next time, remember there's something in
<v Speaker 3>the woods.