Air Bud with Lindy West and Meagan Hatcher-Mays

00:00:00
Speaker 1: On the Bechdelcast, the questions ask if movies have women in them, are all their discussions just boyfriends and husbands, or do they have individualism? It's the patriarchy, zephynvest start changing with the Bechdelcast.

00:00:16
Speaker 2: Hello listeners, just jumping into the top of this episode for a reminder about our upcoming Midwest tour. We are so excited about this. We are coming to Indianapolis, Chicago, Madison, and Minneapolis. We have never done live shows in any of these cities, so you simply must come. Starting with our Indianapolis show on August thirtieth, that's a Saturday matinee, and then later that night Jamie is doing a solo show this is all for Let's Fest. Then the following night, we have a show in Chicago on Sunday, August thirty. First following that is a show in Madison on September fourth, and then finally our Minneapolis show on September seventh. We are very close to announcing the movies we're going to be covering on this tour, so be on the lookout for that. Check our Instagram. The ticket links for the shows will also be updated shortly with the movie choices. And speaking of those ticket links, you can access them at link tree slash Bechdel Cast. Grab those tickets before they sell out. We're gonna pull out all the stops for this first ever Midwest tour that we're doing. You don't want to miss it. We will see you there and in the meantime, enjoy the episode the cast. Woof, woof. I'm a dog who wants to host a podcast. Check the rule book. It doesn't say a dog can't host a podcast.

00:01:44
Speaker 3: That's woof. So maybe just cover the podcast in all of oil and we'll be able to host it, no problem. Yeah, the podcast will slip right out of our mouth, corene into the air else and slam dunk into a fully exported at MP three file.

00:02:00
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, beautiful.

00:02:02
Speaker 3: Yeah, thank you so much. It's dogs can do anything? But should they? A question that will come up much today. Welcome to the Bechdel Cast Our. My name is Shamie Loftus woof.

00:02:15
Speaker 2: My name is Caitlin Deronte. This is our show where we examine movies through an intersectional feminist lens, using the Bechdel test as a jumping off point.

00:02:26
Speaker 3: It feels silly, but you're you're going to be shocked at the things that come up today. I'm still recovering. I watched this movie three days ago and I've been thinking about it so much.

00:02:37
Speaker 2: There's a lot to say it took us.

00:02:39
Speaker 3: So if you've been a longtime listener of the show, I feel like through this conversation you'll understand why it took us nine full years to cover this movie. We really had to know ourselves better. We needed to know the medium fully. Yes, we needed to have hard discussions. We needed to develop our skills as critics and grow as people before we could have the episode discussion that we're going to have today. It's our Airbud episode.

00:03:06
Speaker 2: Yeah, I would say that our Flubber episode walked so that our Airbud episode could run.

00:03:14
Speaker 3: Yeah, because Flubber. There's a lot going on in Flubber, and you can listen to that episode. But I wouldn't have been emotionally prepared to have the Weinstein brothers introduced in the opening moments of the film five years ago when we covered Flubber. I think I needed the time personally. I needed to go through my Saturn return before I could have this conversation.

00:03:36
Speaker 2: Wow, yes, yes, exactly so we're covering Airbud and we're so excited about our guests today. They are two real life best friends and hosts of the podcast. Text me back, it's Megan Hatcher May's and Lindy West.

00:03:52
Speaker 4: Welcome.

00:03:53
Speaker 5: Yay, it's true. It's us to real life best friends.

00:03:56
Speaker 6: We are so excited to be here.

00:04:00
Speaker 2: I have you.

00:04:01
Speaker 5: We're so excited. Everything you've said about Araic Bud is like exactly what I have written down in my four to five pages of notes that I took while watching this film.

00:04:13
Speaker 3: There's so much going on. I well, first, okay, before we get into it, tell us a little bit about your podcast, because I know the conversation is going to get quite serious very soon. Oh yes, yes, of course.

00:04:24
Speaker 6: Our podcast is a very silly podcast about two best friends who live on opposite sides of the country, and we Megan works in politics and is very depressed, and so on the podcast we try to have a little bit of fun.

00:04:39
Speaker 3: Yeah, love it.

00:04:40
Speaker 4: And I am not a serious person, and so a lot of the podcast is me coming to Megan with a news story. I heard parentheses a TikTok I saw about how there's an ice wall around Did you know that that the is flat and Antarctica is actually an ice wall around the rim of the Earth.

00:05:04
Speaker 6: Yeah, a lot of people don't know that.

00:05:05
Speaker 5: I didn't know that there previously had been a race of human dog hybrids, which somehow proves the existence of the flat earth ice wall.

00:05:13
Speaker 2: Anyway, Well, can they play basketball? Though?

00:05:16
Speaker 5: And the dog human hybrid's play basketball. We're about to find out.

00:05:21
Speaker 4: Well they can. The question of whether they can play basketball and whether they may play basketball, right, that's two different questions.

00:05:29
Speaker 5: Okay, yes, but yeah, we've been best friends since high school and which was twenty five years ago, twenty five beautiful years ago. And our show is just like stuff we think is really funny. It's really hard to describe, but it's like when you call your best friend and you don't really have anything on the agenda, and then you talk for two hours and then your tummy hurts from laughing. That's a text me back podcast guarantee. That's right now.

00:05:51
Speaker 2: Incredible, That sounds lovely and well. Unfortunately, though, if you're looking for fun and silliness on this episode on Airbud, you won't find it.

00:06:01
Speaker 5: Think again.

00:06:02
Speaker 3: Nope, the fund ends now because Meggan and Lindy what are your personal histories with Airbud, the movie, the franchise, et cetera.

00:06:13
Speaker 5: None. I have no history. I mean, I am clearly I'm aware of the existence of Airbud. I'm aware of a very poorly drafted middle school basketball handbook that, by virtue of its silence, allows dogs to play middle school basketball.

00:06:28
Speaker 4: Like I'm aware.

00:06:29
Speaker 5: I'm aware of the impact Arabud has had on our culture, but I've never saw I mean, we were fifteen, fourteen fifteen when this came out, so we're a little too cool and old to be watching Airbud, you know what I mean. And I figured it was just a silly children's movie, slash franchise, slash ip, you know, because now there's like a bunch of offshoots in the sequel he plays football.

00:06:51
Speaker 2: Apparently, one of many sequels.

00:06:53
Speaker 5: Yes, something to think about. So I didn't know what to expect going into this. I will say I was knocked flat on my when it was revealed that it was executively produced by Harvey Weinstein and I did not That was a major curveball for me.

00:07:08
Speaker 3: Really unpleasant.

00:07:09
Speaker 5: Yeah, these things happen in Hollywood, baby, you know.

00:07:14
Speaker 2: Uh, Lindy, how about you.

00:07:16
Speaker 4: It did not. We were not children anymore when it came out. I did not watch it. It was one of those things that you're just very aware of because it's an outlandish premise, you know, definitely a piece of pop culture that I was. That was in my vocabulary, but I don't think i'd ever actually seen it until yesterday. And it really, I mean, I know, we'll get into all this, but really contained a lot more evil clown and a lot less basketball than I had anticipated. You know. Also, I did not realize that this is a Pacific Northwest classic, and it is.

00:07:50
Speaker 5: I didn't know that either. Yes, and I consider myself an encyclopedia of Pacific Northwest media. Yeah, because well we grew up in Seattle, for the record, and so were like ten things I hate about you.

00:08:01
Speaker 4: Obviously that was more our era.

00:08:03
Speaker 5: I had no idea that air Bud was a great Seattle company. I did not know that.

00:08:08
Speaker 2: So jealous, I'm so excited to talk about this movie with you. Having kind of no background with it. I sort of assumed that the reason you chose this movie is because you have a deep connection to it.

00:08:20
Speaker 5: No, we just thought it would be funny.

00:08:23
Speaker 3: No, you're true, and that's so valid.

00:08:26
Speaker 2: Yeah, Jamie, what's your history with the movie.

00:08:30
Speaker 3: So I thought I could have sworn I had seen this movie, but it turns out it was a case of cultural osmosis. I was four when this movie came out, so I was in fact the target demographic. So I guess I just assumed because these movies were so ubiquitous in the late nineties into the early two thousands, I knew all of the like spinoff titles off the top of my head. Now I don't wait, I got I have to pull up There's they're all so funny. Golden Receiver, Golden Receiver. There's one that says Airbud spikes back. That's the volleyball one. He's basically using the basketball skills. Again, not to criticize him, but whoa, let's be let's be serious. Also, not the original Airbud because he died.

00:09:14
Speaker 2: He died after the first one. Yeah, his final film.

00:09:17
Speaker 4: Yeah, oh yeah, there.

00:09:18
Speaker 3: I have a lot of thoughts about this, all right, Airbud World Pop, Airbud Seventh Inning, Fetch No, it turns out the movie that I did see that is somehow involved in the Airbud Expanded universe. Because it stars the same kid Slash eventually man Kevin Zeeker's Josh frim Is. I was thinking, I definitely saw and owned MVP Most Valuable Primate, which is about the chimpanzee that plays hockey. My dad as a hockey reporter, so that was the one that we owned. I assumed I'd seen Airbud and I and I could have sworn this is a movie about a dog that joins a basketball team. That is not what happens in the movie. It is more a serious family drama where a dog plays basketball a few times. I was so shocked at how willing to go there the movie Airbud. It starts there's it's like it's so it's really special because it's like it's directed like the characters, especially the adults, they are basically like Disney Channel adults where they're they're very cartoonisht they're very over the top, but they have very real world problems where it's like the goofy villain is struggling with alcoholism and it's obvious there is a goofy coach who turns out to be an abuser of children. Yeah, he's just whipping basketballs at this kid. It's just I just don't know, I have I have so many thoughts about what's going on. There is no real plot to the movie, except it seems like Josh is just trying to get through this year of his life and a dog becomes his father. Basically is what happens.

00:10:58
Speaker 2: Because his father died in exploded plane crash literally exploded.

00:11:03
Speaker 4: By the way.

00:11:04
Speaker 5: We find that out because Josh keeps a framed copy of an article about how his dad died. Like, oh, and it's not even just a picture of your dad, it's the open joshsh Josh is unpacking his room.

00:11:18
Speaker 4: They've moved to a new town. Yeah, he's unpacking his room and he pulls out a framed newspaper article that's like man.

00:11:26
Speaker 3: Explodes and it's his dad, but not his obituary.

00:11:32
Speaker 5: No, it's an article reporting the death.

00:11:36
Speaker 3: Yes, Josh, like this poor kid and also one of my favorite tropes of kids movies, disappearing toddler younger sibling who actually becomes very important later in the franchise. She later becomes the leading character Andrea. Well anyways, she's.

00:11:53
Speaker 4: Also very important to this podcast because I believe she might be she might be involved in the only incidents test passing the Bechdel test.

00:12:02
Speaker 5: It's true, I have I have one other I have one other possibility, but we can get into that.

00:12:07
Speaker 3: Okay, I don't.

00:12:08
Speaker 4: I didn't. I didn't mean to jump ahead, but I don't want to know.

00:12:10
Speaker 3: You're fine this movie, Yeah, this is ultimately, this is a great example of ultimately all movies are somehow about fathers and sons, no matter what the premise is, and air Bud is not an exception to that role. So anyways, it turns out I did. I had not seen this movie, and I was really I was a gog.

00:12:29
Speaker 4: Yeah, it goes way harder than you expect, and it's also, I think, way better than like this kind of movie made. Now. I feel like it's better written, it's better acted, it's better directed, and it would be true slop just filled with like product placement and like like the worst pop culture references, you know what I mean.

00:12:50
Speaker 3: I agree.

00:12:51
Speaker 5: There are moments of like real comedy in this movie where I was.

00:12:54
Speaker 2: Like, there's some slapstick happening.

00:12:59
Speaker 3: The thing off and it looks good like the cinema. It's colorful, it's beautiful, Like I was very I don't know my fiance came in while I was watching it. He's like, why does Airbud look better than like most movies that come out now, Like, I don't.

00:13:15
Speaker 2: Know, it's shot on film or something shot on.

00:13:17
Speaker 3: Film, three million dollar budget, no excuses everyone, Your movie should look at least as good as Airbud.

00:13:25
Speaker 4: Practical effects. By the way, at the very end, it's like no special effects were used. Oh yes, dog basketball sequences.

00:13:32
Speaker 5: Airbud did all his own stunts, and that is so important.

00:13:35
Speaker 3: He's legend.

00:13:36
Speaker 5: You gotta put that down in the history books.

00:13:37
Speaker 3: He's a legend. I was really and we'll talk about Buddy. I was concerned when I was on the Wikipedia page and Buddy had his own Wikipedia page. You're like, this is either really good or really bad when an animal actor has their own Wikipedia page. I was thinking about the last animal actor we really talked about in any detail. Caitlin was Jimmy the Raven Oh from Ember him from from It It's a Wonderful Life and The Wizard of Our I was like.

00:14:01
Speaker 2: That Christmas movie you can't remember the name of.

00:14:03
Speaker 3: It, Christmas Week, But yeah, Buddy, Buddy's life is complicated. I feel for Buddy. We'll talk about it, Caitlyn, what's your history with Airbud?

00:14:13
Speaker 2: I am the only one who had seen this movie before brag. I definitely watched it a couple times as a kid. Although the dog movies that were a bigger part of my childhood were Beethoven and Homeward Bound, Airbud wasn't quite a staple in my house. I probably saw it once or twice as an eleven year old, which is how old I was when it came out. Never saw any of the sequels, And yeah, I haven't seen this movie in twenty five or more years, so I'm I Also, I was remembering it, you know, not correctly. I was like, Yeah, he joins the team way earlier, he plays a lot more bad football with them. Yeah, and that doesn't happen, and it's really just doing that climactic sequence.

00:15:06
Speaker 3: He's basically not on the team. I was so disappointed. He's the mascot for us, He's a side show.

00:15:12
Speaker 5: It takes a full like thirty minutes for Josh and Airbud to even meet. Yeah, you know, he has to like lure him out of the abandoned church with tapioca, and then it's like it takes another hour for Airbud to join the team, which, by the way, I'm not complaining. It's a great movie.

00:15:29
Speaker 4: It is really Okay, I want to say, I want to push back a little bit because I think it's actually like gorgeous restraint and artistry to not have Airbud beyond the team. I love that. Like, this movie is not camp. This movie is telling a serious story, and it's not realistic for a dog to join the basketball team. Yea, yeah, it's much more grounded to have the dog. Well, not to spoil it, but show up at the eleventh hour when the half the team has fouled out or been injured. Yea, and just step in and save the day.

00:16:05
Speaker 5: Right, and or moved to Spokane, right, Like the thing, I mean, it really subverts your expectations.

00:16:12
Speaker 4: Who you are thinking, is this going to be a series of like high.

00:16:15
Speaker 5: Adrenaline dog dunks, but it's not not at all the work for it.

00:16:19
Speaker 4: Yeah yeah, and he plays real basketball, you know.

00:16:23
Speaker 2: Yeah with his face yep.

00:16:25
Speaker 3: I was so impressed. Buddy. Uh he's he truly was a good boy. Alrip, buddy.

00:16:31
Speaker 2: Yeah, Well, let's take a quick break and we'll come back and do the recap ur we're back, and here's the recap of the movie. So we meet a man who works as a clown whose act is called Clown and a Hound because his partner is a golden retriever. But this clown is a piece of shit who is cruel and abusive to his dog. They arrive at a kid's birthday party, but this clown is a flop when he's doing his solo act, but then the kids love it when the dog gets involved and does a bunch of tricks with balls, and we're like, okay, check off's ball handling skills.

00:17:26
Speaker 4: That's right.

00:17:27
Speaker 2: But the clown is such a flop that he ruins the whole thing and gets kicked out of the party, and he blames his inadequacies on his dog.

00:17:38
Speaker 3: He's projecting really truly shame.

00:17:41
Speaker 2: And he goes to take the dog to the pound, but then the like crate slash dog carrier thing falls off the clown's truck and a family happens upon the dog crate and hits it with like hits it with their car.

00:17:58
Speaker 3: We're like, off to the race already. We know that Airbud is in an abusive situation with a clown, which is fascinating, and then he's almost hit by the protagonist of the movie.

00:18:10
Speaker 5: Yeah, right away, I'm so stressed out, and I'm so sad. You know, I hate to see a dog in a stressful situation. And here we have, you know, the so far unnamed Golden Retriever, you know, working as like an indentured servant to an incompetent clown. Although he's wearing the cuticle outfit you ever saw in your life, is like the pathos radiating off of this retriever.

00:18:31
Speaker 4: I was like, I don't know if I can watch this.

00:18:35
Speaker 5: What's gonna happen?

00:18:36
Speaker 4: And by the way, the evil clown when he's like he's not just taking the dog to the pound, he's on the phone with the pound being like, yeah, I'm bringing you a vicious, bad dog. Yeah, implying that he's gonna have that dog executed.

00:18:50
Speaker 5: Yeah.

00:18:51
Speaker 3: Yes, Oh, he's trying to get Airbud put down.

00:18:53
Speaker 5: He's trying to build up some receipts for the inevitable rip ing of Airbud.

00:18:59
Speaker 4: That's when it gets to.

00:18:59
Speaker 5: The pound, that's right, evil.

00:19:01
Speaker 4: And then yeah, the crate falls off the clown truck and then is hit by the protagonist and then this is the weirdest scene in the movie to me. Right off the bat, Josh, our main boy, looks out the window of the car sees a clown dog sitting on the side of the road, like two feet from the car.

00:19:22
Speaker 5: Josh says, nothing, nothing, no reaction, Lindy, his dad just exploded.

00:19:26
Speaker 3: His dad just exploded. He's in it.

00:19:29
Speaker 4: He's too depressed.

00:19:31
Speaker 5: I'd be like, oh my god, a dog and a clown cossume. He's like, I guess we'll just roll on.

00:19:36
Speaker 3: There's a very David Lynchy quality to that sequence.

00:19:39
Speaker 5: I was gonna say, like, because because the opening, I have a provocative question. The opening scene is a canary sitting on a tree branch. It's very reminiscent of the opening credits of Twin Peaks, where the red breasted Robin is sitting on a on a tree branch as well. And I was and then you find out that this is in fact taking place somewhere in the Pacific northwestutside of Seattle somewhere, And I was like, question, is Airbud happening in the same universe as Twin Peaks? Is this like eight years or excuse me, like six years after the death of Laura Palmer and here comes Airbud.

00:20:13
Speaker 3: We can only hope also is.

00:20:14
Speaker 4: The canary the Dad's ghost, because they they show the canary again at the end of the movie, and I was like, what the fuck is the significance of this bird?

00:20:26
Speaker 3: I did not notice that.

00:20:28
Speaker 4: It just occurred to me when you were saying that megs for sure. It's implying. The way they use the canary at the beginning sort of implies that this bird is like bringing the Airbud magic to the boy.

00:20:39
Speaker 5: You know what I mean, Yeah, a cosmic gift from Dad. Yeah.

00:20:43
Speaker 4: I was expecting the bird to like swoop down and give air Bud a whittle kiss on his head or something to like any but then you find out he was just trained by a clown to do ball stuff. But anyway, I think the bird is the exploded Dad's spirit.

00:20:57
Speaker 3: I believe it because Airbud takes on so many like al like qualities throughout the movie. He can smell a child in trouble like it's great, and I didn't know. I didn't recognize this actor, but I was like, who is committing fully to the role of Norm Snivey. And it turns out queer icon Michael Jeter is committing fully rest.

00:21:22
Speaker 4: In Power Power.

00:21:23
Speaker 3: Yes, he passed in two thousand and three, but he was like he's a character actor who was like known as like the sweetest guy in the world. He was in hair. He's a successful Broadway actor and he was out for UH for much of his life. He has and we love him for that and relevant to my interests. At the time, he was on Sesame Street as mister Noodle's brother Mister Noodle and those who know, no.

00:21:55
Speaker 4: He also was in Sister Act too, along with the mom.

00:22:00
Speaker 3: Yes, this is from.

00:22:02
Speaker 5: Who I always think is Illianna Douglas, but then it isn't.

00:22:06
Speaker 2: Instead it's Wendy McKenna aka Iliana Douglas was not available and guess correct, Yes, she plays Josh's mom. Josh again has no reaction to seeing this dog in a clown costume, and then they just drive away, and then the family arrives at the new house they're moving into. We've established already the Josh's dad had died the previous year. He was a test pilot. He exploded, and Josh used to play basketball with his dad, but he's lost interest in that ever since. His dad's passing, and then he starts at a new school. His mom tries to get him into some extracurricular activities like playing the trombone.

00:22:56
Speaker 3: A lot of band kids slander, and I just I want to say as a podcast, don't stand by that. You know, that's more of a sure Josh's dad exploited, but it's more of a hymn problem, I would say.

00:23:13
Speaker 2: And then one day after school, Josh walks by an abandoned church which has a crusty old basketball.

00:23:21
Speaker 3: Court and one of the many religious qualities to air Bud, there's a lot of religious imagery associated.

00:23:29
Speaker 5: I have a question. I was not raised in the church. Is it common for churches to have a basketball court or I don't know, this is unique to this particular church.

00:23:43
Speaker 3: My church had a playground, but not a not a basketball court.

00:23:46
Speaker 5: I was like, who was out of her balling when the church was still in business.

00:23:52
Speaker 3: There's one of those cool youth pastors. It's like, I know, I'll get the kid just here.

00:23:56
Speaker 5: Doing some crossover and stuff. Yeah, he's like bigee you know it.

00:24:01
Speaker 4: Yeah. To me, it's like it's you can imagine a church having a basketball court, but this church seems to only have a basketball court, Like there's not there's not like a graveyard or a play structure or anything. There's no parking lot.

00:24:17
Speaker 2: No, it's just a haunted ass church with a basketball court.

00:24:21
Speaker 4: Very normal.

00:24:22
Speaker 2: And Josh starts shooting hoops and not to bully this child, but he sucks at it really bad and the ball goes flying into the bushes and then there's some like rustling and dog sounds, but all he can find is a scrap from the dog's clown costume.

00:24:41
Speaker 3: Eventually, what they do meet, did it remind anyone else of et like? Their meeting felt very et coded to be.

00:24:48
Speaker 2: Yeah, because he's luring the creature with sweets.

00:24:51
Speaker 5: Yeah, with little puddings, yeah, out of the bushes.

00:24:54
Speaker 3: But then it's like just a golden retriever, no offensive buddy, can.

00:24:58
Speaker 5: We quickly address? So, lind I'm so curious Lindy your emotional state watching Airbud because Lindy herself owns a Golden Retriever. His name is Barry Reveal or air Berry.

00:25:10
Speaker 3: Yeah.

00:25:11
Speaker 5: Yes, Now Barry is more of a copper toned prince, and I would say air Bud is a little bit more blonde. But so there's so much Berry air Bud personality crossover.

00:25:22
Speaker 4: Yeah.

00:25:23
Speaker 5: But the whole time I was watching this movie, I was like, I feel as though Lindy is going to be emotionally devastated just at the mere sight of Airbud because he's so Berry like. And I am just curious would Barry successfully be lured by tapioca pudding or like, how exactly would you get him to come out onto the basketball court.

00:25:39
Speaker 4: Yeah, watching this movie was rough, and I will say that it it's extremely accurate to my you know, it matches up with my experience, the vibe and the energy of Airbud visibility. Yeah, representation, Barry would eat an unlimited number of pudding cups. He would come out of the bushes for any amount of pudding cups, spaghettios the other thing. Yeah, by the way, Josh not doing a great job of taking care of this dog. No, really bad. It's too much pudding for a dog, for sure.

00:26:17
Speaker 3: I was thinking that where I was like, God, you know that there's a bunch of kids that really took that to heart.

00:26:25
Speaker 4: I mean, but the thing about Barry, it's hard to say because Barry has lived a soft life of pure leisure. Not one bad thing has ever happened to him. He's been coddled since birth. He's never been abused by an evil clown. So the idea that Barry would ever even hide from a human and not immediately attack them and knock them over so that they will pet him. Barry would never be in the bushes waiting to be lurd with pudding. Like if Barry saw a boy with pudding, the boy is toast. There's no hope. So I don't know, but all the chaos that Airbud causes is very familiar to me. Okay, which we we'll get to.

00:27:08
Speaker 2: Yes, it's coming soon.

00:27:10
Speaker 4: But we have seen We've seen him cause one scene of chaos at the birthday party, but that was more the clown doing all the chaos.

00:27:17
Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean the clown was not talented. Well, fair Bud was exceptionally talented at catching those little balls in his mouth, you know.

00:27:24
Speaker 4: Okay, I'm sorry, Perhaps we've watched different movies. What I recall is that Airbud is doing his little ball tricks. Then the clown throws a bigger ball at Airbun. Airbud boops the ball back straight at the clown's nuts and he deserves, which he deserves, injures the clown in his privates, and then the clown starts flailing and screaming, and then Airbud is not helping. He's racing around, he's hiding under tables. The clown is chasing him. He's I'm just saying, obviously the clown is to blame.

00:27:58
Speaker 5: As they say in the law, can tributory negligence, So.

00:28:02
Speaker 4: There was some contributory negligence. I'm just saying, sure. But yeah, that's what my dog is like as well.

00:28:10
Speaker 3: And also, I mean the reason Airbud does all that is because, to quote Josh screaming, which he does a lot towards the end of the movie.

00:28:17
Speaker 4: He yeah, but hates that clowns ass so much.

00:28:25
Speaker 3: Josh, Oh my god, he's doing so he's a child. Shout out Kevin Ziegler because he's seekers because he's doing so much, he's really selling. My dad just exploded, honestly, Like, I'm surprised we haven't seen more of him.

00:28:40
Speaker 4: Where'd he go?

00:28:41
Speaker 5: We was on Gossip Girl.

00:28:42
Speaker 4: Ye oh good, good, good good, because like there's a part later, sorry spoiler, but like spoiler, there's a part later where he like talks to this girl at school and I'm so sorry to her. But you can really see the difference between a real actor and a Canadian child that they hired to yeah, to deliver one line.

00:29:03
Speaker 3: I think that's true.

00:29:04
Speaker 4: Yeah, Josh is a freaking pro.

00:29:06
Speaker 2: He's a good child actor.

00:29:08
Speaker 3: He went full method for this. He blew his dad up.

00:29:13
Speaker 2: He's also in most of the sequels, oh, if not all of them.

00:29:18
Speaker 3: He's in Okay. I I hate that he's in the first four, and then he's the protagonist. I think of the first three and then the fourth, there's a grand passing of the baton between Josh and Andrea. Josh goes to college and so he's in the movie, but he's not the protagonist. And then that's when Andrea takes over. She's missus Baseball at this point, gotcha right, right? I The extra homework I did for this was learning about the expanded air Bud universe, which encompasses twelve movies.

00:29:48
Speaker 2: Well, because there's all the air Buds and then air Buddy, then there's a spin off of air Buddies, and then which becomes snow Buddies, Space Buddies, Super Buddy, Fanta Buddy, Treasure Buddies, Pookie Budies, and Santa Buddies, the legend of Santa Pause, which then spins off into Santa Pause and Santa Paus to the Santa Pups.

00:30:08
Speaker 3: Okay, you can't tell by this small you know this, this very intimate family drama that we're talking about, The eventual airbud universe will will have global implications across literally time and space.

00:30:22
Speaker 5: Yeah.

00:30:23
Speaker 3: And then in real life it resulted in Disney killing over a dozen puppies, which I will get to the most famously evil thing you can do be responsible for the death of puppies.

00:30:37
Speaker 4: Which I think we all learned from a Disney movie, yes, called one hundred and one Dollmatians.

00:30:42
Speaker 3: Yeah, but that's not till two thousand and eight, during the production of Snow Buddies. Oh boy, oh sidebar later.

00:30:48
Speaker 4: Oh brother, it's you know, since we have this golden retriever. As soon as the movie started, my partner Roya started was like, I can't watch it. I can't watch it. Something's gonna happen to the dog, something can happen to the dog. I was like, nothing happens to the dog. I can tell you because there's nine hundred sequels, including we know that Airbud is extremely virile and has like one hundred children puppies who go on to play every sport on Earth. So she's like she couldn't calm down. She's very stressed, almost in tears, even when like all the dog's doing is playing one on one with a boy. Meanwhile she's reading out loud the most horrific facts from Buddy's Wikipedia page.

00:31:30
Speaker 3: Yes, like dead puppy.

00:31:31
Speaker 4: Oh this is his last film. He dies of cancer at age nine. I was like, sorry, oo, are making me depressed about things that really happened to a real dog. Meanwhile you're freaking out about things that aren't even gonna happen to a fictional dog.

00:31:48
Speaker 3: Anyway, It's really sad, it's really and and they go on and like Buddy Buddy is the only Buddy has two stunt doubles. I think in this because he did not want to walk on the roof of the house, and that's fair he did.

00:32:02
Speaker 5: That was the cutest part though. It was so funny.

00:32:04
Speaker 3: But I in future air Buds, Buddy would be played by four, five or six dogs, which feels more ethical. But this is this is Buddy's only This is Buddy's only film.

00:32:16
Speaker 5: It's like when they hire twins to play kids, a single kid on a sitcom.

00:32:22
Speaker 3: Buddy's fascinating because I feel like he's this part of this like star system that doesn't exist anymore, where he kind of becomes famous the way that some comedians become famous, where he was like on Letterman a lot in the early nineties. He's not on like Pee Wee Herman and that he was on Letterman a lot, and then he got his own starring vehicle.

00:32:41
Speaker 4: Nice shout out to him.

00:32:43
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, okay. So then Josh tries out for the basketball team at school. He doesn't make it.

00:32:52
Speaker 4: But okay, he doesn't. He just sits on the bleachers like a weirdo. He doesn't even do the tryouts, right.

00:32:58
Speaker 5: I was like, did we see that off screen or just like you know, he just sort of is just like sitting there at first, although like in between there's a janitor who you can tell has sort of a mystical air about him. Uh, and the janitor likes sees something in Josh. He's like, why isn't Josh throwing out meanwhile, Josh. So then Josh becomes the first, he becomes the manager of the team right wherein he is.

00:33:20
Speaker 4: Bullied by Larry.

00:33:21
Speaker 3: Honestly, if I was told that I was a manager of the basketball team, I'd be like, I'd just rather not do it any of this.

00:33:27
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, this coach makes him do like basketball child labor. I know at night in the basement.

00:33:35
Speaker 3: I'll go play the trump on.

00:33:36
Speaker 4: You need to stay after school until ten pm and you need to wash your bullies dirty underwear that he threw on your face, Like that's I don't think that's allowed.

00:33:47
Speaker 5: I don't think that's a real job.

00:33:49
Speaker 3: Also, the way that this coach is written we'll get into is so severe turned. But he has this wildline during I think his first scene where he says, if you can win on the court, you can win it life, which is just a really intense thing to say.

00:34:06
Speaker 2: No, that's true, Jamie, that's true.

00:34:09
Speaker 3: Not for him.

00:34:12
Speaker 4: I also like the there's when Josh first comes into the gym for the for the tryouts. I think the reason he doesn't try out is because he's immediately bullied, which also just is weird because he just is another boy who looks the same as all that. It's like, why are these people picking on him, but he has this red, white and blue basketball and then Larry the Bully goes, you look like you stole that from the Harlem Globe Trotters or something like that, and it's like nice, Yeah, that's a famous basketball teams, Like, Larry, what's your damage? Larry?

00:34:42
Speaker 3: What the hell? Larry?

00:34:43
Speaker 4: You would you would never make it onto the Harlem Globetrotters, Larry.

00:34:47
Speaker 3: Larry's just bad because his father is an actual cartoon character, Larry's father, Big the Guy. The guy's having a blast. He's like, my, I just gotta get on the court. Like his face so elastic, it's very distracting.

00:35:02
Speaker 4: Also, the coach is like, hey, I need a manager. I noticed that you just sat on the bleachers and you didn't try out. That's fine, you're clearly a loser who wouldn't make it. I do need a manager. It's a ton of work. You got to get here before the team and leave after the team. Anyway, you're hired. First of all, you're not selling it. That sounds horrible. And Josh doesn't even agree. But then the coach is just like, he just conscripts him to be his servant.

00:35:27
Speaker 3: Yeah, and Josh and Josh's mom is just like I need childcare. Yeah, this is this is what's gonna happen. Yeah that works Josh's mom. I have such a complicated, such complicated feelings around Josh's mom because sometimes I'm like she's doing her best, she's her husband exploded. But then other times she's so harsh with Josh in ways that and Airbud like I was like, she acts like Airbud blew her husband up, like the way that she treats him sometimes.

00:35:56
Speaker 5: Yeah she does. I mean there's a scene where like like meanwhile, while this is all happening, Josh is like becoming the basketball coach, manager whatever. Airbud is still hiding out at the condemned.

00:36:08
Speaker 3: Church basketball court.

00:36:11
Speaker 5: And then eventually he wins him over with the tapioca and he brings Airbud in for like a makeover montage, you know, and then Airbud escapes.

00:36:22
Speaker 4: It turns out Airbud is hot.

00:36:26
Speaker 5: He takes uf Airbuds glasses, they take off Airbuds glasses, and he's a hot hottie under there. He's not a nerd. So anyway, he escapes from the bathroom after his makeover and then runs into the living room and knocks over the ladder that has all the paint and wallpapering supplies on it, and paint and glue go everywhere. Now here's a questions, Mom, why did you leave paint cans with no lids on out like that all day? Because she's just come home from work and I was like, what is wrong with this? Is not on Airbud at all. No, this is on you, fake Ileana Douglas.

00:36:58
Speaker 3: She does not take accountability for this. She blames it on air Bud entirely outrageous. And then the thing that really stuck with me, I guess we are just sort of continuing the recapha. This is where the movie's go Like Josh obviously is like I want this dog, and I'm just like, I'm sorry, this kid just lost his dad. You have to give him anything he wants, Like that is the fucking dog. My friend Grace friend of the pod, Grace freyd I just saw her one person show about like she lost her dad when she was ten or eleven, and she like she there's a great joke about how she was like I knew I was going to get a PS two and that was really powerful and it's like, because you have to give the grieving child the thing they want.

00:37:40
Speaker 5: Just got a shower with gifts for a little while, I think.

00:37:43
Speaker 3: Yeah, And Josh's mom is like absolutely not. And then even when when Josh gives him a little cardboard box, she's like tear it up, like.

00:37:53
Speaker 5: Yeah, she's such an asshole about it. I know you're trying to make a home for air Bud, and I won't stand for.

00:38:00
Speaker 4: Josh is like, can the dog just live in this wet box in the yard, And she's like absolutely not.

00:38:08
Speaker 5: But like, I want to say a couple of things because I feel like this is important for later. Despite this adversity, Josh really does do his due diligence. He puts up the found Dog posters all over the town, which, by the way, this is the first instance of me genuinely laughing. Josh is putting up the found Dog and it's like a picture of air Bud and air Buzz is running up snatching those things right off the telephone fall and I was like comedy was watching it, just going aha, but that is so funny, and he's just putting him up all over the town, So he really, I mean, even though he really really wants this dog. He is like doing what is necessary to like find his home if such home exists, even though he deserves that damn dog, he does.

00:38:52
Speaker 3: Lord, let the kid have the dog. I was so frustrated with her, I know.

00:38:56
Speaker 2: Yeah. Absolutely. Also, if we haven't made this clear yet, Josh discovers that the dog can kind of play basketball.

00:39:06
Speaker 5: Yeah, he discovers Airbud can ball immediately at the abandoned church.

00:39:11
Speaker 4: Immediately because actually the thing that wins the dog over is not the pudding. The pudding lures him out of the bushes, but then Josh notices that the dog is fixated on his Harlem Globetrotter's basketball, and so that he's like, do you like this ball? Boy? Like, like I like that.

00:39:31
Speaker 3: Airbud has to be convinced of Josh, not the reverse, because he's like, oh you ball, okay.

00:39:38
Speaker 5: Okay, player, let's play.

00:39:41
Speaker 4: Oh, by the way, can I really quickly? Like There's also this part where Josh cleans up the landscaping on the basketball court and for some reason decides to kick over this fence and then on the immediately on the other side of the fence is a beautiful.

00:39:55
Speaker 5: Lake with like a Mountain glacial Yeah.

00:39:59
Speaker 4: And it was shot in Vancouber, which which makes sense because that is kind of what it looks like up here where I live outside Seattle. But I'm sorry, not a good thing to have next to your basketball court.

00:40:10
Speaker 2: A gaping hole where the ball can go through the ball.

00:40:13
Speaker 4: Is immediately gonna go into the lake, especially if a dog is playing.

00:40:17
Speaker 5: Yeah, play basketball, Like well, this dog is so good.

00:40:19
Speaker 3: It's almost like the church knew what they were doing when they put that fence up. That was it Also like.

00:40:25
Speaker 5: I love that the church is like could someone cover up that view? Do I want to look at God's wonders while I preach? No, I don't.

00:40:33
Speaker 4: This church is not about God's wonders. This church is about one thing and that's best. That's that's basketball church.

00:40:40
Speaker 5: Baby.

00:40:42
Speaker 3: I Also, I mean it's like and it's also presented as if like Josh is not aware of where he lives. He's like, oh, there's water here. It was like, well you know that, you know that?

00:40:52
Speaker 4: Oh my god?

00:40:52
Speaker 2: He gets in a boat later to an island, the water taxi.

00:40:56
Speaker 5: Yeah, he gets a little Yeah, he gets on a little tugboat or a little water tax.

00:41:00
Speaker 3: I'm kind of obsessed with the water taxi guy later because he looks like he is from another century. Then the Money takes place in and never speaks. It just takes this kid back and forth. I was like, what is his story?

00:41:11
Speaker 5: He didn't realize he was even in a movie. He just like, you want to ride?

00:41:14
Speaker 4: Okay, He's up on a grizzled teenage Mariner.

00:41:19
Speaker 3: He's wearing a Newsy cap. I was like, what movie are you in the trench coat?

00:41:24
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's frightening.

00:41:26
Speaker 5: But I think you know, with like the gentle coaching of air Bud, Josh learns how to ball, like he gets a lot better, and it really is, because you know, Airbud is out here boopin' and crossing over yeah, and assisting. And Josh was like, wow, I get it now, I get the fundamentals of basketball. Thank you Airbud. So it's pretty sweet.

00:41:45
Speaker 3: It's really nice.

00:41:46
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah.

00:41:47
Speaker 3: So now Josh has Airbud and his mom is like, you can't have this dog, And then she says if no one claims the dog by Christmas, which is about two weeks away, she'll take him to the pound. One of the many false conflicts of the movie because then boom, it's Christmas with another weirdly, like the Christmas montage is so weird to me, where it's like a montage where the mom is speaking in voiceover about like Santa Is. She's talking about Santa like he's Jesus. Yeah, yes, sorry, is.

00:42:19
Speaker 4: That is she reading from like a miracle on thirty fourth Street or something. She's like reading from a book. But it is weirdly, it's weird.

00:42:26
Speaker 3: Yeah, it is very Chris Christian coded.

00:42:30
Speaker 4: Okay, but before we get to Christmas, there's the moment when a moment when I genuinely left so loud, which was when they're making the deal. The mom is like, Okay, he can stay in the yard for two weeks, but he's not allowed in the house. And if you ever sneak that dog in the house, this is over. Do you understand you you are not allowed to sneak the dog in the house of Josh is like, I totally understand. And then they're in the foreground in the background teeny tiny at the top of the stairs you can just see Airbud's little face peeking through the last Airbud has already sneaked into the house. He's on it I was, he's been living in this house. Josh doesn't even know.

00:43:15
Speaker 5: Josh doesn't even know. I was weeping at this. It was so funny, just like the visual of like the mom being mad at the concept of Airbud being in the house at Airbud, just being like, ha, it's so funny. And so I took a picture of my TV and I was like, once Lindy watches it, I'm gonna send this to her. And then in Unison we were like this part killed me, and we sent each other the same picture of Airbud in the background, like mugging the mom. I was like, this movie freaking rocks.

00:43:40
Speaker 4: I love it.

00:43:42
Speaker 2: It is great.

00:43:42
Speaker 4: It's so great, a great visual gag. I mean good, so good. Good Anya. Creators of Airbud Heart Harvey Weinstein.

00:43:54
Speaker 2: Oh god, I hope he was never on set. This movie was directed by Charles Martin Smith.

00:44:01
Speaker 3: Yeah, who, Okay, you're you're being a hater because he's a TV in films Charles Martin Smith. Of course, of course he's a he's I don't know, he's what. His biggest role was in American Graffiti, which I still haven't seen. But he has an actor turned director who I think is fine. I always enjoy this career. Note where he directed Airbud is very successful. But then I think he had that moment where he's like, wait a second, I'm an artist. I can't just direct Airbud movies. And so he does not return for Airbud movies and then ends up directing a bunch of movies very much like Airbud anyways, tough business. He ends up directing Dolphin Tale and Dolphin Tale Too.

00:44:45
Speaker 5: Oh interesting.

00:44:46
Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm sure he's rich as hell from Airbud, I hope. So so good good for him, I hope.

00:44:51
Speaker 3: So he deserves it because he made.

00:44:52
Speaker 4: Something really special. He gave something special to the world.

00:44:57
Speaker 2: Okay. So then one evening, as Josh is in the school basement doing you know, basketball laundry, he sees an old Knicks jersey and a photo of a basketball player from back in the day, and he realizes these things belong to the janitor at the school, Arthur Cheney played by Bill Cobbs, and that he was a former basketball star. So Josh asks Arthur to sign his like collector card that he has of Arthur, but he's like, no, that isn't me. That guy died a long time ago. But then later Josh sees him shooting hoops and Josh is like, wait a minute, that is Arthur Cheney. So that's that beat.

00:45:44
Speaker 5: Just a couple of things about Arthur Cheney. First, Bill Cobbs, you will recognize him if you see it. This man was in everything from like nineteen ninety two to probably two thousand and three. He was in everything. There's nothing funnier to me than a Knick's legend keeping his nineteen fifty nixt jersey in his locker at school.

00:46:04
Speaker 3: That's where we keep just so he can deny it when confronted.

00:46:07
Speaker 5: It just be like, no, I never played for the Knicks. I just keep this here like that is so funny to do.

00:46:13
Speaker 4: I keep my jersey in a cupboard in a dirty basement of the middle school where I work as a janitor.

00:46:20
Speaker 5: In the boiler room of the middle school.

00:46:22
Speaker 4: I guess, by the way, not to not to make things too dark, but how bad of a gambling problem did Arthur Cheney have? Why did he go from NBA star to working As I know, the salaries are probably not as high in the fifties, but I mean he was a real star as we find out later not to spoil anything.

00:46:39
Speaker 3: He's like recognized on such like he's a legend.

00:46:42
Speaker 5: Yeah.

00:46:42
Speaker 3: Yeah, there's so many conflicting tropes with Arthur Cheney that it's like hard to really know where to begin because it's like there's a lot of tropes around I fel black actors that are put in there where he has this mystical quality that is completely unnecessary.

00:46:57
Speaker 5: Yes, I was gonna say, like not to get too serious about a children's movie where a dog plays basketball, but they really don't play what they call the magical Negro trope. And like as soon as this man appears on you screen, you know that's the role he's gonna play, because like the first scene you see him and he's kind of in shadow, but they're using a recognizable actress, so you know he's gonna have a bigger role in the movie, right. And of course, and like this trope is basically like a black character who will do anything to further the goals of the white protagonist and it was some sort of magical flavor. And in this case, his magical skill is that he used to play for the Knicks. But of course he's kind of hiding that from Josh and all this other stuff. It's not as like pronounced as it is in other movies. Were like the legend of Bagger Vance. But usually this character is like a janitor or a caddie, or in the.

00:47:47
Speaker 3: Case of Ghost, a psychic driving Miss Daisy as another like really famous example.

00:47:52
Speaker 5: Green Mile exactly, or or an inmate.

00:47:55
Speaker 3: Yeah, what was that shitty movie that came out recently, Marshall Ellie won an oscar for it.

00:48:00
Speaker 5: But it's h oh Green Book, Yeah, where he's like Viggo Mortons's driver. Yeah, and he's like that too, and where they'll sacrifice themselves for the greater good of the white protagonists or protagonists. And it's not that serious an Airbud, I mean in this case, it just deploys as he helps Airbud at the end. But like here you have this man who was like a Nix legend and now he's a janitor. He has all these incredible skills as like a coach and as a leader and as a person, and he uses it to like reunite a.

00:48:28
Speaker 4: Dog with a young boy.

00:48:32
Speaker 5: I mean, it's kind of like the classic magical Negro trope being deployed in this like children's movie, and it like it's like, man, ten year olds are just eight to twelve year olds are being immediately introduced to this like ridiculous stereotype that we see in like lots of different movies, But the fact that you see it in a kid's movie is kind of disappointing. Although I do love that guy.

00:48:52
Speaker 3: He's great, He's great. This is not the only I mean, we've talked about this troupe many times in the show over the years, but this is not the only children's basketball movie in which we have discussed this trope. And we also discussed it years ago in our episode on Full Court Miracle right that d com the Disney Channel original movie about the I think also a middle school basketball team that has I mean, I don't remember that many details about it because it's just a movie that leaves you at the moment it's over. But yeah, like this trope is like in all over kids media, it's wild.

00:49:27
Speaker 4: Yeah. There's also this angle with in this movie where when they first go into his boiler room secret office, they pan across all his stuff and it's like, oh, you thought he was just a janitor, Well, I bet you didn't think he would have a chess set and a book about engineering, and it's like, oh, he's a janitor, but he's also a genius and then whoa, and you know in that moment when they're like, he's a janitor, but something else, something more. He also reads books, Like I wrote down in my notes, you know, this man is the one who's going to deliver the line there's nothing in the rule book that says a dog can't play basketball because you know, he's read the rule book because he likes to play chess.

00:50:15
Speaker 5: Yeah, and he and it just and he, like I was saying before, I mean, he's like the only one who can sort of magically mystically see Josh's potential and like, you know, it's just the way it's deployed to. He can use his powers to help Josh, but he himself remains.

00:50:34
Speaker 3: But he's not able to change his own life.

00:50:36
Speaker 4: Like yeah, right, And in case I'm not being clear, Yeah, janitors can play chess and know how to read. Yeah, rights allowed. I don't know what brought Arthur Cheney from the NBA to the basement of Greenfield Middle School or whatever. The school is called.

00:50:53
Speaker 5: Fernfield, where anything can happen, but real.

00:50:58
Speaker 4: People do all kinds of jobs and it's normal.

00:51:02
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:51:02
Speaker 3: Yeah, So we get this like very common, hackneyed blend of a racist trope with a classist trope by this great actor. And it's weird because I think, ultimately Arthur and Airbud and this is this can't be good end up filling a similar role in Josh's life where they help him realize his potential and they believe in him and care about him when it seems like no one else does. Arthur's a fascinating character to because I feel like there's so many there's so many opportunities to try at least try things with this character, but he just disappears for long stretches.

00:51:39
Speaker 4: Also, you're telling me that an American public school has a former NBA player working as the janitor, and they choose to hire a random man to be the basketball.

00:51:50
Speaker 5: Coach who ends up being physically abusive. I mean, that's why Arthur ends up becoming He does end up becoming the coach of the boys middle school basketball team in fern Field, a suburb of Seattle. I guess because he does have a Sonics basketball mug rip to my Seattle super Sonics and also that kids Stewart has a piece of or he has Scottie Pippens orange peel, so they are close enough to Seattle to go to Sonics games.

00:52:17
Speaker 3: And Dennis Rodman's gum.

00:52:19
Speaker 5: Yeah, he does eventually coach because Shawn Camp's garbage sorry and Shawn Camps Apple Corp. He does eventually get get hired as the coach because the previous coach gets caught physically abusing Stuart. He's like chucking basketball's at Stuart's head. And then even then the principal is like, well, we're thinking about letting Larry's dad do it because he volunteered, and Josh has to be like, I have a suggestion, how about former Nick's legend Arthur Cheney.

00:52:48
Speaker 4: Maybe he could do it. I just think in no universe would Arthur not have already been the coach. I mean, this is absurd.

00:52:56
Speaker 3: Yes, it's true. I mean, so let's let's get let's get up there. Where do we leave off Kitlan?

00:53:01
Speaker 5: Oh?

00:53:01
Speaker 4: Bye bye?

00:53:02
Speaker 5: Right?

00:53:02
Speaker 2: Okay, so I think we're at like it's Christmas morning and his mom lets Josh have buddy. So that conflict of he will never live in this house is.

00:53:14
Speaker 5: False conflict because Airbud won her over with the power of ball and because Airbud. Every night, Airbud sneaks into the house by jumping up up a lattice into across the roof and into Josh's bedroom. And one night he goes to do it and nobody's home and Airbud's like, what the fuck? So Airbud finds the middle school. He escapes and finds the middle school, and he goes to the basketball game disrupts the whole thing.

00:53:37
Speaker 4: It's hilarious, by the way.

00:53:38
Speaker 3: I know this needs to happen for the for the plot to work, but Airbud is just like loose, like he's just this dog has never seen a leash in his life.

00:53:48
Speaker 5: I'm worried about Airbud.

00:53:50
Speaker 4: You don't know. I'm so worried.

00:53:51
Speaker 3: Why is she like, Okay, you could keep him and we don't really need to take care of him the way you'd expect.

00:53:57
Speaker 4: Yeah, I have a genuine question. There are several scenes, multiple scenes after the Christmas scene when Airbud has supposedly been brought into the family, where Airbud is like is locked out of the house and he's still climbing up the trellis and sneaking through the window. Two questions. First of all, I'm sorry, it's Christmas time in the Pacific Northwest and the window is open.

00:54:16
Speaker 5: And yeah, we would never do that. Yeah, and there's.

00:54:20
Speaker 4: Like people having a picnic outside on the ground but whatever.

00:54:23
Speaker 5: Yeah.

00:54:23
Speaker 4: But question number two is Airbu still not allowed to live inside the house.

00:54:27
Speaker 5: I think he's not allowed to go in the house. I think she's still like, yeah, we can keep the dog, but he because at one point they do build him a doghouse and paint body on the doghouse, So I think he's still technically supposed to live outside permanently.

00:54:38
Speaker 4: That is deranged.

00:54:40
Speaker 5: It's evil, not nice. But he like breaks He breaks up the middle school basketball game, causes a kerfuffle. It's hilarious, by the way, and I'm not I don't mean that ironically. I was laughing genuine real laughs.

00:54:53
Speaker 2: Again Jortle's slapstick comedy. It's great.

00:54:56
Speaker 5: And then that's when they realize he can ball. I think that Josh does the thing where he's making Airbud follow the ball and then they do like an alley oop. They hear the ball swish and the whole crowd goes, oh, why this dog and ball?

00:55:13
Speaker 2: And before that, Josh he gets invited to try out for the basketball team again. But this makes him sad and he's like, I don't want to play, Buddy, you can play, and then he like kind of nonchalantly tosses the ball to the side, and then Buddy shoots and scores a basket. So Josh rediscovers that he can play basketball, or at least like shoot hoops. And so, with this renewed enthusiasm for basketball, Josh tries out for the team. He's suddenly very good at basketball, and he makes it.

00:55:45
Speaker 3: On the team.

00:55:46
Speaker 2: And then this is like the first game where Buddy comes crashing in because he's just like, woof, woof, why not my best friend Josh home? And so he comes to the school and he sees Josh playing, so he runs out on the court, you know, reeks havoc. Everyone's falling down, everything is falling over, everything's getting knocked around, and everyone's like, whoa, he should be the mascot and he should do that trick during the halftime show.

00:56:12
Speaker 5: It's a huge honor, you know, to get invited to be the halftime entertainment of the middle school basketball game. Because we find out later that they televised these things and they report the outcome on the front page of the newspaper. So this is a big deal for Airbud Man.

00:56:26
Speaker 3: And also and also because I oh what this is like so kids movie and the best way the middle school basketball team is on the front page of the newspaper every single day. The moolves there's nothing going on in this town. I love it.

00:56:40
Speaker 4: Not that Missus from would know, because there's a subplot that, oh, yeah, that Buddy has been stealing and hiding her newspaper every day for a month because he's traumatized. He has PTSD from the evil clown bapping them with a newspaper.

00:56:57
Speaker 3: I know.

00:56:58
Speaker 5: But that's why the mom is like, oh, he can stay because he's so oh my god, you guys love each other due to basketball, just like you and your dad. And also that was a sweet trick, I think his mom thinks. And so then Josh gets to keep Buddy at Christmas and it's really genuinely very heartwarming. And then Josh makes air Bud a pair of sneakers, so a pair two pairs.

00:57:21
Speaker 2: True.

00:57:22
Speaker 3: I was thinking about things that because it is true that Missus frem is just completely severed from the world. She has no idea what's going on. She makes it sound like the newspaper is the only way she could learn news, even though I think they have a television. But no, I like to think that she like after the events of Airbud, like learns that Heaven's Gate happened, and she's like, oh my god, I had no idea my golden retriever Airbud has been taking all my newspapers. She learns about Princess die like, it's just a lot happened in nineteen ninety seven.

00:57:54
Speaker 4: Do you think that there is there are feminist implications to the fact that she works at a napkin.

00:58:02
Speaker 3: Okay I missed that.

00:58:03
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, she works in napkins. What she's like a napkin silk person. She runs a napkin factory, and that's why they moved to fern Field.

00:58:14
Speaker 3: She's a napkin girl.

00:58:16
Speaker 4: Yeah.

00:58:17
Speaker 2: Not only that, she apparently has a second job, because she's on the phone with her mom and she's like, no, Mom, it's not called moonlighting. You're allowed to have two jobs. So I'm like, what is her second job?

00:58:29
Speaker 3: To me?

00:58:29
Speaker 5: That was the only evidence I could find of a Bechdel Test passing moment where she says to her mom, I have two jobs, and I was like, nailed it.

00:58:38
Speaker 2: And we never well, we never hear her mom speak. I don't think so.

00:58:42
Speaker 3: Oh, she could be like your father is righted.

00:58:46
Speaker 2: But I'm just guessing that they needed to give her a lot of jobs because they need a reason for her to never be home so that she doesn't notice her son is always playing basketball at a haunted church, Like I don't know what's going on there, but she has a three year old toddler at home. That's like, who is taking care of that child?

00:59:06
Speaker 4: Yeah?

00:59:07
Speaker 5: And no childcare that we see.

00:59:10
Speaker 3: And it's like, again, this could be in a movie that's not afraid to get serious. This could be an element that comes up. Is like, you know, Josh is kind of like a latchkey kid. He because his mom works so much. Where is his sister? Why bother giving him a sister if we're just gonna drop her halfway through?

00:59:28
Speaker 5: But because she doesn't even go to the games, No she's too young.

00:59:32
Speaker 3: No, No, that was when I noticed Andrea was gone. I was like, where the hell is this kid there? But but to his mom's credit. I mean, she doesn't miss a game. She is thereue usually with some like pretty great outfits too. She's coming straight from the napkin factory looking hot.

00:59:49
Speaker 5: Yeah, very very big business, you know, very sister's doing it for themselves. You know she looks great.

00:59:55
Speaker 3: Last statement hats napkin factory.

00:59:58
Speaker 2: Huh Yeah. Anyway, So to answer your question, Lindy, I think that is feminism. She works at an her napkin factory. Okay, this is one where we see coach Joe hurling basketballs at one of the players, this kid Stuart, who will eventually become Josh's best friend in the later sequels. So then Coach Joe gets fired off screen because the next thing we know, the school is looking for a new coach.

01:00:24
Speaker 3: Okay, wait, so I know this is I know we keep it in tro but like the acting job that actress Nicola Cavendish is asked to do here as Principal Pepper Is, I stopped it and showed it to Grant because I was just I was blown away at how because she's doing again like the Disney Channel Adult character where she's like, oh my gosh, you have a dog and he's gotta come to the game, and then the next line out of her mouth, she's witnessing the coach, you know, doing this sort of like coded abusive behavior, but he's also whipping basketballs at a kid. And then her voice lowers an octave and she goes, that's enough, Joe, that's quite enough.

01:01:07
Speaker 4: And that's like, oh, like.

01:01:09
Speaker 5: She's seen him do it before, almost like or she's like, it's not necessarily surprising to her to see this coach behaving poorly.

01:01:18
Speaker 4: It was a very weird scene.

01:01:19
Speaker 3: I was surprised. I was happy at least that they do fire the coach, but it's like, yeah, they should have gone farther. Yeah, they should go to the weird court that we learned later is in this town. I love the court scene, my favorite.

01:01:32
Speaker 2: Scene from basketball court to judicial court.

01:01:36
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's so amazing because it's like at that point, you're like the movies should have just ended, but it's still happened.

01:01:44
Speaker 2: There's a whole other sequence. Anyways, Okay, I'm gonna try to speed through the rest of this. We so eventful, So much happens. Okay, So Arthur Cheney gets hired as the new coach, and he does a great job getting them to work together as a team. Then there's the next game where Buddy does his trick at the halftime show, and it's partly because Josh is so nice. He's not like that abuse of evil clown. He encourages Buddy because initially he has performance anxiety. Buddy does and he's like, no, no, no, you're such a good boy, you can do this, and he does the trick and everyone cheers.

01:02:22
Speaker 4: I loved that.

01:02:22
Speaker 3: I loved that Airbud was like they added that little beat for him because it's so and it's like it is all very ironic that like part of the part of the lesson in the movie is like, oh, we maybe shouldn't force this doctor perform, when in fact that is like why the movie exists, is forced to get doctor performed. But I like that Josh was like, of course Airbud would get nervous. Then when he's been in performance settings before, it had been like right before, he's going to be abused, traumatizing.

01:02:49
Speaker 4: Yeah, this guy that.

01:02:51
Speaker 2: Makes sense, but now he's a star truly. So then there's another game. There's a couple of seconds left, I think the team is one point down. Josh has ball. He tries to make a three pointer. He biffs it and they lose, So Josh is kind of beating himself up about it, but coach Arthur gives Josh a pep talk to play from the heart, and so the team starts playing really well. They qualify for finals against the opposing team that that bully kid Larry is now on because his like bully dad pulls him off the team and moves him to.

01:03:25
Speaker 5: Moves their whole family to Spokane, Washington. Yeah, which is in eastern Washington. You know this is taking place in western Washington because of the lush greenery. Eastern Washington's on the other side of the mountains. Entirely moves their whole family to Spokane so that Larry can play middle school basketball for the Warriors. That's wild Larry's dad. Yeah, that's really something.

01:03:47
Speaker 3: Level of pettiness here too. Four end seed.

01:03:50
Speaker 4: Spokane is really far away. It's far. It's not like they move to a different suburb of Seattle now, they moved to the far corner of the state. It's like at least a six hour drive.

01:04:02
Speaker 5: A mountain range to get away from air and Bud and Arthur Cheney and Josh Okay, it's like reverse Oregon trail to the opposite.

01:04:11
Speaker 4: Side of the state. It's almost Idaho like it is. You can go to your grocery shoping in Idaho if you live in SPOKEMP.

01:04:18
Speaker 5: It's true.

01:04:19
Speaker 3: It's like, I mean, not that this movie is has any interest in doing this with the bully character, but you're like, that's gotta be tough on Larry with a dad who's whose self worth is so tied up in your youth basketball career.

01:04:32
Speaker 5: Frankly explains everything you need to know about Larry and his behavior. I feel bad for the guys. Poor Larry, poor kid. Yeah.

01:04:41
Speaker 2: So then the clown whose name we finally learn is Norm's snively pretty good villain name. He gets wind of the fact that the team mascot of this middle school basketball team who can shoot hoops because there's like this whole news story about it.

01:05:01
Speaker 5: Yes, he finds out about it because the middle school basketball game is on is on TP.

01:05:08
Speaker 2: And he's like, wait a minute, that's my dog. So Norm goes to Josh's house and talks to his mom, Jackie, to be like, you have my dog. See here are his papers.

01:05:20
Speaker 4: And Jackie's in a vulnerable moment, she's feeling a little bit resentful of the dog because she has just found all of her buried newspapers in the yard.

01:05:26
Speaker 5: Yes that's right, Yes, which Airbud had buried due to newspaper based PTSD. Can I say a couple of things about the scene. First of all, norm is so menacing and he walks into her backyard, so he's like fully on her property. Scares her a little bit because she's like discovering the newspaper situation and doing some gardening and then holds up like a flyer of him and Airbud could be any golden retriever. This is not proof of anything, by the way. And then it's like, that's my dog. I have the papers to prove it. First of all, fake Eleana Douglas. You start with get the fuck off my property. I don't know who you are. I'm calling the police instead. She handswered the dog over. Is pretty wild to me immediately, no resistance whatsoever. And you know I know that as women were all taught to be compliant, but not me when it comes to Airbud. I'd be fighting back. And I also would like to say something else. I conferred with a lost dog expert, my husband who works at the Animal Shelterer here in the DC area, And I was like, this would never happen like this. The person would not just show up and be like, this is my dog. I have a single picture of it, and then when I try to get it to come to me, it growls and goes it bananas when.

01:06:39
Speaker 4: It sees me.

01:06:40
Speaker 5: And he was like, no, you'd be asking, this is what my expert said.

01:06:45
Speaker 4: He said, you'd have to. I mean, there's like no due.

01:06:47
Speaker 5: Process going on here. Hello, Okay, so you'd be asking like, Norm, what have you done? Can you show me lost reports? Did you report the dog loss to local animal shelters? Is the dog microchip? I don't know what the coorschip situation was in nineteen ninety seven, so we can let that one go. But do you have photos of you and this dog? And he does won and it's Airbud in a clown costume. Again, that could be any golden retriever. Okay, you'd really need to show some evidence that not only is it your dog, with that you had gone through some sort of process to find your lost dog, which Norm has not done until he thinks he can make a buck off of it. Meanwhile, again, I would refer the court to earlier in the movie when Josh is doing his due diligence. He's hanging up the found dog posters. Okay, now, sure, did Airbud tear him down? Yes, but that's not on Josh.

01:07:39
Speaker 4: He did his part.

01:07:40
Speaker 5: He tried to find this dog's owner. If anything, now it's been months.

01:07:44
Speaker 4: If anything, Airbud tearing the flyers down is more evidence that he does that. He should not go with the clown. Yeah, and he should stay with Josh.

01:07:52
Speaker 5: I mean he doesn't even he doesn't have any witnesses like Norm doesn't have any witnesses that saw him with this dog. Like he just doesn't do anything except show up menaces woman and wave a piece of paper in her face and then take the dog. It never would happen this way. I just want the audience to understand.

01:08:08
Speaker 3: Another very very disappointing thing from Miss Jackie fram letting down the family yet again. She's mad that she doesn't know about Heaven's Gate. Well, guess what, like borrow a paper at the napkin factory, turn on the.

01:08:21
Speaker 4: News, go to the library.

01:08:23
Speaker 5: Jackie, Come on, man, literally.

01:08:25
Speaker 3: This dog is raising your child for you. Could you find an ounce of effort to fight for him?

01:08:31
Speaker 5: Can I say something else, like, what is the plan here? Norm? As if Airbud is gonna do basketball for you, you're such an asshole to him. Airbud has autonomy. We've seen it, Okay, So the whole thing's driving me nuts. I'm like, there's no way that not only is Airbud gonna willingly go with Norm, but that he's gonna do basketball for this man in commercial antics game.

01:08:58
Speaker 4: Please give me a break.

01:08:59
Speaker 2: Next time we see him. Because what happens is Norm takes Buddy, yeah, and Josh is devastated. So Josh goes to Norm Sniveley's house where he's keeping Buddy chained up in the mud next to a stack of Budweiser cam Very Wizard of Oz five's here, and Norm is on the phone being like, we can't shoot that commercial on April. We're going on tour, and it's like, how.

01:09:22
Speaker 5: Did you How did you book a tour already? Did you get a dog agent all of a sudden?

01:09:27
Speaker 3: Well, and also just I mean whatever, like these movies are always contradictory, but like again, just having Norm Snivey do essentially what Buddy's trainer is doing, you know, be like, oh, let's get this dog to work in the entertainment industry, which is presented as the act of a sicico in this movie, when again, we wouldn't be watching the movie if someone had not done that. And we'll talk about his trader too, because there's a lot of lore that going on there as well.

01:09:53
Speaker 4: Yeah, there's there's actually this part where what Josh misses his three pointer and then he gets a pep talk from the coach where the co which is like, look at Buddy, he doesn't care about his point average, which by the way, is one hundred percent from the field.

01:10:07
Speaker 5: Buddy does not miss one single shot. I'm sorry, but you don't know that about him. You don't know that about him.

01:10:14
Speaker 4: But he's like, this dog doesn't care about being MVP. He's doing it for the love of the game. Like, no, he is not. He's doing it because you guys are making him do it.

01:10:24
Speaker 3: It's the only way that he receives love from people. Right, Yeah, it's sad, it's so complicated.

01:10:33
Speaker 2: Yeah. Anyway, so Josh rescues Buddy from Norm. They run off. Norm is chasing them in his clown truck which is actively falling apart. The breaks, the steering wheel, all this stuff are falling off back.

01:10:48
Speaker 3: When we were a proper country and we invested in a proper car chase in the middle of a movie that does not require it. Yes, beautiful, loved it.

01:10:55
Speaker 2: Yes, And then Norm drives his truck into a lake because the steering wheel and brakes are gone.

01:11:01
Speaker 3: Fly off one third of the movie's budget, right there, no reason.

01:11:05
Speaker 5: Yeah.

01:11:07
Speaker 2: Josh realizes that if he brings Buddy home, Norm will just come back and take him again, so he has to like set him free. He does the whole like, go.

01:11:19
Speaker 4: On, get it. I don't watch anymore.

01:11:21
Speaker 5: Doesn't you understand?

01:11:22
Speaker 3: What's that movie with the Sasquatch.

01:11:24
Speaker 4: Harry and the Henderson's Okay, hey, Harry and the Henderson's buddy, so much harder than you need to. I this was actually unbearable to watch.

01:11:32
Speaker 5: I couldn't.

01:11:33
Speaker 4: With my own baby boy curled up like a doughnut in his bed next to me, I was like, I can't, and I was screaming at Josh talk to one adult, because please, the evil clown has just committed attempted vehicular.

01:11:49
Speaker 5: Manslaughter, dogslaughter, daughter slaughter, yes, if not first degree homicide.

01:11:56
Speaker 4: And this man is not getting the dog back. It's just so Harriet.

01:12:02
Speaker 5: It's the most Harry and the Henderson's I've ever seen. It's so terrible, and the greatest devastation of all is that Josh violates airbuds trust. He uses the basketball for evil. He's like trying to get air butt. He like hires the water taxi to take him to some random islands where he leaves Buddy on an island. Yeah, and he's like, go away. Don't you understand I don't want you anymore. He's like trying to get him to like, somehow, you roughing it in the woods for the rest of your life is better than just us figuring out between human beings where the dogs should live.

01:12:35
Speaker 4: Controversial opinion. The dogs better off living with the clown that he himself on an island.

01:12:42
Speaker 5: And western there are bears. Okay, dude, what the hell? So anyway, so then Josh cannot get Buddy to leave him alone because they're best friends. Josh, so he chucks the basketball into the woods to get Buddy to go chase it. And I was like, oh, hell, oh, that is unforgivable. You demon child.

01:12:58
Speaker 3: This is like, if this dog gets the water and starts paddling, I'm gonna fucking lose it. And sure he gets in the water. And I was sobbing.

01:13:07
Speaker 5: I was so annoyed just watching this because I was like, you think, getting the water, Taxi's gonna stop a Golden Retriever from swimming after you.

01:13:14
Speaker 4: And of course the air Bud jumps into the water and is like, Josh, come back. The dog playing basketball. I could believe the Golden Retriever not swimming all the way across whatever, uh, channel Ford this to chase the boil. No chance that dog believable. The dog would not, like Buddy gives up swimming after one point five seconds and it's like, no, not not the Golden Retrievers that I know.

01:13:43
Speaker 5: I don't think so, honey, I don't think so.

01:13:45
Speaker 4: I don't think so. He would. That dog would swim all the way back to Josh's house.

01:13:49
Speaker 5: I'm just saying, Fernfield, where everything is possible.

01:13:52
Speaker 3: No one treats Buddy, right, Everyone like Buddy, he's just been through it. Everyone leaves everyone leaves him.

01:13:59
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's so sad, it's so unnecessary. Yeah, and I hate that thing. Where a child in a movie will just go rogue and think that he knows best. Talk to a lawyer before you abandon your dog on an island.

01:14:16
Speaker 3: I would say, in Josh's defense, look at whose behavior is being modeled at home. The clown could print out on a laser jet, I'm allowed to hit this dog with a car, And she'd be like, sorry, Josh, there's nothing I can do. I guess there's nothing that can be done.

01:14:30
Speaker 5: The laws a lot, Josh, I know, sir.

01:14:33
Speaker 2: Yeah, we'll talk more about his mom. But after Josh abandons Buddy on an island, we cut to the finals basketball game. It's Josh's team versus the other team that that little shit Larry's Warriors.

01:14:48
Speaker 4: Warriors, yeah yeah.

01:14:50
Speaker 2: And Josh's team is losing pretty bad. Two players on Josh's team are injured, another one gets a foul and has to sit out, and then the rest of the team is out with chicken pox that we learn in throwaway line.

01:15:01
Speaker 3: Of dialogue ax chicken pocks.

01:15:03
Speaker 2: Yes, of course, so now they only have four players. But just then Buddy shows up. Does anyone see where this is going? They put Buddy in uniform to play in the game and the refs and the opposing team are like, what the heck dogs can't play basketball, And then coach Arthur is like, check the rule book. You won't find anything that says a dog can't play And then the ref is like, he's right, there's nothing in the rule book that says a dog can't play basketball. So Buddy starts playing in the game, and he's just what the team needed, because they make a huge comeback, and Buddy nearly ties the game with a couple of foul shots, and then Josh has the ball with a few seconds left in the game. It's sort of like a mirror from what we saw earlier, and he takes the shot and this time he makes the three pointer and they win the game. But that it's not the end of the movie.

01:16:01
Speaker 5: So it's not just really quickly. The whole that final basketball game is so funny. The other team is so despondent that this they're just getting. This dog is running wild on their asses like Airbud is everywhere. He's a real threat in the paint. He's a threat from outside like he has. He's been playing for two minutes and already has three assists. He's a he's a menace on the court, okay, and the other coach is just yelling, will someone guard that dog? Guard that dog? So funny, and my husband was just like, dee up, Larry, deep up, and then fucking Larry fouls Airbud and what might be like the saddest thing saddest fouel I ever.

01:16:44
Speaker 3: I was shocked that they were willing to have a child foul Airport.

01:16:49
Speaker 4: So it was so nuts.

01:16:50
Speaker 5: And then yeah, but then they win, and it's very funny at the end because Larry walks off like sort of comically hunched over, like a like if you were just taking improv and learn that that's what you should look like when you're sad like sort of like Michael Sarah and walking home and rest of the development when they play Christmas Time is here, my husband and I call that when people are sad like that, we call it Christmas Time because that's the song they play. What George Michael is like walking home. So Larry's just like despondently haunched over leaving the court. But that's what you get from moving your whole family to Spokane.

01:17:23
Speaker 3: I guess you know.

01:17:24
Speaker 4: I'd like to say that Airbud not only has basketball skills, he also has basketball IQ. He uses his mind and he uses his dog wiles to help win the game. Like there's a part in the game when Airbud has to do a jump ball and Airbud is standing at two foot six. A jump ball is where there's a contested ball, and so the ref throws the ball in the air and two players. If you're not a basketball head, there's no way Airbud's winning this jump ball. But then the moment of truth, Airbud goes and then the opposed player is like what, he's so startled. He's startled.

01:18:07
Speaker 3: He played five D chess. He's a great player. I love that sequence so much. They like they directed the hell out of it. Airbud is a star. It's funny he's playing. He Larry fouling him really took me out.

01:18:24
Speaker 5: I was not.

01:18:26
Speaker 3: I was like this this and then he still lost the love and respect of his father. Anyways, Like Airbud's out there and his little sneakers like each it.

01:18:35
Speaker 4: Larry and.

01:18:38
Speaker 3: You assaulted and then got dunked on by a dog, Like Larry is never going to recover from this.

01:18:44
Speaker 4: Well, and the dog also gets rams Larry right in his nuts too.

01:18:48
Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, true, in what should have been a foul, but Airbud does not get fouled at all.

01:18:53
Speaker 3: There's no rule that says a dog can't ram into a fellow players private.

01:18:59
Speaker 5: Yeah, you should have been a flagrant. Should have been a technical.

01:19:02
Speaker 4: Also, when the when they were first checking the rule book and they decided that that the dog could play, that Buddy could play, my husband goes, well, there's probably a rule that you're not allowed to have your dick out. You have to wear bottoms. But it's not wearing bottom.

01:19:21
Speaker 3: No, he's loose.

01:19:22
Speaker 2: Yeah, he's Donald ducking in just tops.

01:19:25
Speaker 3: What a great film. So this is this is the ex So the movie is not quite over. It seems like the movie's about to be over. But yeah, the movies like buckle it because there's ten unpredictable minutes coming up.

01:19:38
Speaker 2: Yeah, because Norm the clown has shown up to the game demanding Buddy back. But his papers claiming Buddy is his property are all soggy from when he fell in the mud and the lake.

01:19:53
Speaker 4: By the way, whichever one of you it was that said that that car chase serve no purpose. That's may I direct your attention true the ziplock of soggy dog papers.

01:20:04
Speaker 3: Yeah, planting pad which before, of course before they were soggy, would have definitely solved it.

01:20:09
Speaker 5: It's not a DNA tesk.

01:20:11
Speaker 2: Come on, man, I don't know what papers he's talking about.

01:20:14
Speaker 3: I mean, dogs do have pay. I had to turn in papers for my dog recently and it was this really but like I had to prove that he was I didn't prove that he his mine. And then I had to prove that he had been fixed. And I knew he'd been fixed, but I couldn't find like a record of him being fixed in twenty nineteen. So I did go to the vet and literally, it's the funniest piece of paper. It's hanging on my fridge. It says, wait, I'm gonna go get it.

01:20:43
Speaker 4: Okay.

01:20:46
Speaker 5: Also what did the papers say? Because it becomes clear that Norm never named He never gave air Bud a name, right, because when he confronts the mom in the backyard, he's like, that's my dog. Uh, and then ate and it's like, oh it's blue because he sees it on the paint can. It's like, what does what do the papers say? You never named the dog?

01:21:07
Speaker 4: Norm?

01:21:07
Speaker 3: Great point maybe the papers might sound something like this, Dear Sirs, I examined Sonny on March twenty six five. Sonny has no testicles, which is which is, which is consistent with having been neutered in the past, and then just the doctor's signature. I pay thee forty dollars to give you that piece of paper. It is the funniest thing that I've ever paid for.

01:21:36
Speaker 5: I hope that that's what norm.

01:21:38
Speaker 3: Dear Sirs, air Bud has no test.

01:21:43
Speaker 5: This unnamed dog has no testicles.

01:21:48
Speaker 4: Okay.

01:21:48
Speaker 2: So Norm is like, I'll see you in court, and then we cut to court and it's a hearing that is goofy as hell. But basically Norm is like, this dog is legally mine, and Josh is like, well, buddy doesn't even like Norm because he was abusive. And then Coach Arthur shows up to be like, let the dog decide. So everyone goes outside.

01:22:11
Speaker 4: Okay, can I just say hold on? The coach Arthur walks into the courtroom. He was not there for most of the hearing. He comes in at a pivotal moment and he's like, I have something to say. The coach is like, are you Arthur Cheney?

01:22:28
Speaker 5: The judge from the next Yeah. The judge is like, I remember you.

01:22:33
Speaker 4: I was at the game against the Celtics when you hit that turnaround jump shot. And then Arthur Chaney is like, yeah, that's right, that's me. I think that you should let the dog decide. The judge has no context for why he's there. It's like if Sean Kemp walked into a random court hearing.

01:22:56
Speaker 5: Like divorce proceedings and was like, let the teenager choose where he wants to live.

01:23:04
Speaker 2: I didn't think of that.

01:23:05
Speaker 4: So funny, it's so funny, so funny.

01:23:07
Speaker 5: Well, the whole court, the whole court situation is well, it's I eventually realized why so many people were there. But there's never anyone just sitting in the gallery of a courtroom. And I was like, there's truly nothing going on in this town. If the whole town is showing up to a dog custody bad Like, what is this so awesome?

01:23:26
Speaker 4: There?

01:23:27
Speaker 3: This whole like courtroom is run on vibes and they don't they don't really make any if it's like the judge, what is the thing he says where he's like, normally I wouldn't do this, but this is hilarious.

01:23:40
Speaker 5: And so people come in my courtroom all the time with terrible ideas about how I should rule, and this time I like it, like.

01:23:48
Speaker 3: It, so let's take He's just like, let's do a silly one, yeah, court case.

01:23:53
Speaker 2: Let's keep it wacky, let's keep it light.

01:23:55
Speaker 4: It'll be fun.

01:23:56
Speaker 1: Yeah.

01:23:57
Speaker 2: So because he agrees to this, everyone goes outside. They gather around Buddy. We're not sure who he's gonna choose it first, because Buddy's like kind of going over to Norm the clown, because he has rolled up newspaper, but it's only so that Buddy can rip the newspaper to shreds. And then he goes over to Josh. So the judge awards custody to Josh of Buddy the dog, and that's the end of the movie.

01:24:27
Speaker 3: Finally, it's what a film.

01:24:30
Speaker 4: And the judge is like, bailiffs remove this clown, and then like three cops like bank the clown up and carry him away, even though.

01:24:39
Speaker 5: At this point they're outside on the front lawn.

01:24:41
Speaker 4: Where are you removing him to?

01:24:42
Speaker 5: He's outside, leave him, let's let him go.

01:24:45
Speaker 4: I think he has to go to clown prison.

01:24:47
Speaker 5: Oh, clown jail. Sure that makes a lot of sense, true, I just I loved it. And as the credits for role as you know, as Lindy mentioned earlier, they go out of their way to tell you the basketball scenes were not CGI air bu I really did do all that stuff. They did not use any sort of like trickery CGI trickery.

01:25:06
Speaker 4: It's really impressive in all sincerity. I found the basketball scenes believable. I felt like the dog, he's good. Yes, I felt like he was really playing basketball. And like I've seen other similar you know, cinema done with puppets and trickery, and it's not as satisfying and it's not as believable. Really, I really felt these practical effects. I loved it. Not even practical effects.

01:25:31
Speaker 5: Just a dog playing basketball, a dog playing basketball, just a dog shooting the jah.

01:25:36
Speaker 2: You love to see it. Let's take another quick break and then we will come back to discuss further.

01:25:52
Speaker 3: And we're back. I mean, okay, wait, can we talk okay? I uh if we talk about the real Buddy for a second, because it is a very complicated story. But there is a lot of history, a lot of lore attached to the dog. Buddy born approximately nineteen eighty eight, past February tenth, nineteen ninety eight. He was I don't quite know how to say this last name. He was found by Kevin Decico.

01:26:22
Speaker 2: Desico to Chico Chic yet check.

01:26:25
Speaker 3: I don't want to call him Dasco, so I'm gonna say Decico, Kevin Decico, I'll guess. He was found in the Sierra Nevada in the summer of nineteen eighty nine. Pulling from scholarly journal Wikipedia here, Desico adopted the Golden retriever and brought him to San Diego, where he quickly per Kevin. Because Kevin does write a memoir about this in twenty twelve called Go Buddy, and he says that he learned that like basically what Buddy does with the basketball is like it's covered in olive oil and he nips at it and it flies, and he learns how to do this, and pretty quickly there are to me some like circus vibes where like Kevin Desico knows he has an opportunity with this dog and he starts. I did some like background research into sort of how this came to be, and it was like Kevin was very trying to make this happen. He appeared at local events, then it was state events. Eventually Buddy gets onto David Letterman and people are loving Buddy. Buddy in the early nineties was on It is so wild because I just did an episode of Your Wrong About about Paul Rubins, and their arcs are just so similar. So he works and works and works, and he gets on Letterman. People love him on Letterman. They're like, let's let's give this dog a movie. And that's how this comes to pass. So there is like show animal vibes to this. But Kevin himself is a complicated figure because he gets basically cut out of the air Bud franchise in spite of the fact that he did create it in a way. He didn't write the movie, but you know, he was Buddy's handler. It's because Buddy was so popular on TV that this movie was written. But then Buddy passes away and Kevin sort of has no involvement from what I can tell with the franchise moving forward. It seems like he's had a very difficult life moving forward from there. There were a few articles about him last year about him having health struggles. He was unhoused for a time, like he's had a challenging life post Buddy. But then there's also very complicated stuff that we've talked about before. I think we talked about it a lot during our Babe episode. I think of just I think so that we don't need to fully unpack here because there's so much to talk about, but just the idea of like using real life animals in movies, it's always gonna be a hard sell for me. But like airbud is such an effective sound because because Buddy is incredible.

01:29:09
Speaker 5: He's so good at basketball and he seems like he's having a great time. But in a way, it's like this conversation we're having about should we use child actors for anything at all? Ever too, probably not, because there's just I mean that's a little bit different. It's very ripe for exploitation and abuse. That is the exploitation piece and the abuse piece also very true for animals, not equating children with animals.

01:29:33
Speaker 3: I guess it's like vulnerable perform Yeah, yeah, And there's not really a lot that's like been said about this with regards to Buddies specifically. I feel like probably because of the time it came out, but just reading like I don't know the directors did a lot of like fun you know, twentieth anaversary, twenty fifth anniversary retrospectives about Airbud, and they're mostly fun. It seems like it was a fun set. Everyone had a nice time. But then you just like, I don't know. I've read an anecdote where he was like talking about Airbud getting the hoop at the end of the basketball game at the climax of the movie, and that it took like thirty takes to get it and everyone was getting frustrated, and you're like, oh, he's a.

01:30:12
Speaker 5: Little guy, you know, air bottle loone.

01:30:17
Speaker 3: Yeah.

01:30:18
Speaker 2: I also read that Kevin Desicco claimed that he was not paid anything for the first film and then yeah, was basically cut out of the franchise after that, so.

01:30:30
Speaker 5: He doesn't have like an ownership stake and the ip of Airbud in any way, even though like he was the one who originally trained this dog to do all the.

01:30:39
Speaker 3: Right Definitely tragic, and there was an animal, a professional animal trainer on the set luckily, who was also helping with Airbuds like doubles. But yeah, I also saw that Kevin Desico wasn't paid, which I'm like, I don't understand how that could have happened when he was literally Buddy s handler. I'm like, did Buddy make money like I'm a doing he did airbud LLC Airbudlosi. But I'm also like, Buddy making money is basically Kevid Tosicica making money. I don't know. He's a very confusing character to me. I know Buddy had to have been paid. There's no world where Airbud was not compensated.

01:31:14
Speaker 5: Yeah. Yeah, it just feels so different now, you know, in the social media era. Sorry to sound like my own grandmother, but like you know, animals go super viral online and then there are in fact animal agents that will help you monetize your pet. And then like the worst thing is when you follow them on Instagram and they start to get old, and then you start to get sad because you know, eventually, like.

01:31:36
Speaker 3: I mean, Grumpy Cat died ten years ago.

01:31:39
Speaker 5: Yeah, but these days, I don't know, maybe in nineteen ninety seven it just was different. It's like, if you think about it, if Airbud were on Letterman during the Instagram era, like think of all the brand deals that Airbud would have had with Farmer's dog or whatever. But it's like, I guess dog agents didn't exists. It should dog agents exist probably.

01:32:03
Speaker 3: Now it's like and now I think it's all AI slop dogs anyways, Like I don't even know if dogs aren't even working anymore. And how do you feel, Like, how do I don't know?

01:32:15
Speaker 4: I feel bad though now that I because I was the one who went really hard for how good it was to watch the real dog play basketball, and I just want to say it was those fun ones. But like, maybe we don't have to do it again. Maybe we don't have to do a live action remake of yeah, of air Bunds.

01:32:31
Speaker 5: Definitely, there's a lot of art from the past that we don't need to revisit, like remake or revisit or redo, you know, where we can still appreciate for what it was.

01:32:39
Speaker 4: I feel like there's other things like that where it's like I don't know. They're like in the fifties they used a radioactive waste as blush and look how beautiful, Look how beautiful all the movie stars looked, and you could be like, yes, they looked beautiful, and we don't have to do that.

01:32:57
Speaker 3: And they died moments after wrapped and may they rest in power.

01:33:01
Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean we can appreciate the beauty and then we can say what we're gonna not probably not.

01:33:06
Speaker 2: Do that, but let's not keep doing that.

01:33:08
Speaker 5: We're gonna cee Gi the.

01:33:09
Speaker 3: Dog, which we don't need to and there is. We will put the link of the description if you want, if you if you wish to know more about the horrific production circumstances of the two thousand and eight directed DVD film Snow Buddies, you could read that in the description.

01:33:26
Speaker 5: But this was Paul Walker involved in that one.

01:33:28
Speaker 2: No, he is a different that's a different snow dog movie. I think that one might just be called snow Dogs.

01:33:33
Speaker 3: That's that's the Kouba getting Junior one. Oh wait, what's Tyro the Paul Walker snow Dogs movie is?

01:33:40
Speaker 5: I thought he was involved in the one where the dogs died. But I must have made that up because, oh god, I hope there's.

01:33:46
Speaker 3: Not two of them.

01:33:47
Speaker 2: Oh he Okay, Paul Walker's in the movie called eight Below.

01:33:50
Speaker 4: Okay, Oh that's right. I assume all the dogs.

01:33:54
Speaker 3: Survived, let's hope.

01:33:57
Speaker 4: Yeah.

01:33:58
Speaker 3: The last thing to say about Buddy, so he does pass away of cancer. It does not seem that his illness is related to performance at very least. But it's sad he dies a year later.

01:34:09
Speaker 5: Yeah, he only got to enjoy his fame for like a year, it sounds like.

01:34:13
Speaker 3: And to add insult to injury, he was nominated for one award, and only one award. It was a Kid's Choice Award for Best Animal, and he lost to Salem the Cat. Oh that's not even a real cat, who's a puppet. He lost to a puppet, insulting, an unbelievable snub.

01:34:31
Speaker 4: Horrific.

01:34:32
Speaker 5: Oh my god, that's like Chadwick Boseman losing to Anthony Hopkins after.

01:34:37
Speaker 3: He died the Oscar. It's bad. Yeah, Oh I hate that. Yeah, So that's buddy, now we know.

01:34:44
Speaker 4: You know, I think Kevin has a case, by the way, to get some kind of retroactive like life, they should have to buy Kevin's life rights or something to use for the entire franchise. Yeah, and I think the key is Kevin should take the Disney operation to court and all he needs is Arthur Cheney as his attorney.

01:35:07
Speaker 5: Yeah, speak on it, speak on this.

01:35:09
Speaker 4: To show up and tell the judge what's up.

01:35:11
Speaker 5: He says to the judge. Let the royalties choose where they want to flow. That's right to Kevin or to Bob Iger. I think I think we know where the royalties are going.

01:35:23
Speaker 3: Yeah, I hope, I hope, Yeah, I hope Kevin's well, it seems like he's having a hard time.

01:35:28
Speaker 5: Yeah, poor guy.

01:35:29
Speaker 4: I hate that, I really hate that.

01:35:31
Speaker 5: Yeah. I just want to say, Kevin, I know we're very we're feeling very fraught about the animal entertainment piece of this. But he did a real good job training that dog. Yeah, and he brought me a lot of happiness when I was watching air. But I just want you to know, if you're listening, which I'm sure you are, Thank you, Thanks keV, Thank you, Kevin.

01:35:47
Speaker 3: Yeah.

01:35:50
Speaker 2: Can we talk about I guess Jackie Josh's mom? Sure?

01:35:55
Speaker 5: What?

01:35:56
Speaker 4: Yeah? What else?

01:35:56
Speaker 3: What else is there to say about? I've had Jackie?

01:36:00
Speaker 2: Well, Okay, this is a Disney movie. Within a live mom, there is a parent who has passed away, and it's the dad this time, which is pretty unusual for a Disney movie.

01:36:10
Speaker 5: There's always at least one dead parrot in a Disney.

01:36:12
Speaker 2: Movie, right, almost always? Yes, canon, Now this happened recently, where this where Jackie's husband passed away very tragically and violently.

01:36:23
Speaker 3: He didn't need to be that bad.

01:36:25
Speaker 2: I don't know. I don't think so. But this does not seem to be affecting her, or if it is, the movie doesn't care to explore that in any meaningful way. She's busy with her napkin job and then her second job, whatever that might be. Her whole storyline in the movie is like where are my newspapers again? This movie could have easily explored something a little And I get it. It's a kid's movie. You don't want to go too heavy and deep on too many things, but it's right there, Like why wouldn't there be some sort of like moment in which she and Josh bonded over the loss of Yeah, over like grieving for Josh's father, Like it just is so goofy.

01:37:09
Speaker 5: Yeah, they don't show her struggling or grieving, and maybe that's just that is her coping mechanism to be could be relentlessly positive and happy. But really, the only time she brings up the dad, she's just talking, saying to the principle like, oh, he hasn't spoken since his dad died, which Jackie hello and then she's like, but maybe he just needs a hobby, like the tuba job or something, and that's really And she doesn't even have that conversation with Josh. She's like talking to the principle.

01:37:34
Speaker 2: I think she just signs him up for band without him knowing.

01:37:37
Speaker 3: And again it's like she's in a very difficult circumstance. I want to show Jackie race where I can, but she's just like her her bedside manner is not good. Like she there's that scene where she goes up to Josh and he's upset because he's also like, I don't know, I know this for her job, but like moving after a loss that's severe and like being away from your family and friends to be really hard. But she says, quote, your dad wouldn't want you being all MOPI unquote.

01:38:06
Speaker 4: So manipulative, who so evil?

01:38:09
Speaker 3: And then and then make the dogs sleep outside. I was like, she's a bit evil at times, like I, yeah, her.

01:38:16
Speaker 5: Emotional regulation is definitely questionable. I understand why, but it is very it's almost like kind of evil stepmother. I mean she I know, she says actual mother, not stepmother, to be like, I don't think your dad would like that very much witty.

01:38:30
Speaker 4: You know, it's weird.

01:38:31
Speaker 2: I think it's a case of the movies, which is what so many movies do, caring more about the male characters, the little boy's relationship with his father, than it does about any women or girls in the movies. They're just like, well, he has to have a mom. She's gonna be at work all the time at Napkin Factory, and she's gonna be in a few scenes here and there, but mostly it's just gonna be an unso provides child walking around and shooting hoops with a dog like Josh, it spends so much time unsupervised by an adult. He's always just loose in the world. The dog is similarly loose, just going all over the place.

01:39:15
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's also never explained how Airbud makes it back from that remote island in time for the basketball.

01:39:23
Speaker 3: This is where mister water Taxi comes in. It's his story.

01:39:27
Speaker 5: Or maybe he really did just swim the whole expanse of that body of water.

01:39:30
Speaker 4: I don't know.

01:39:31
Speaker 5: But yeah, they're both just kind of out there doing whatever, you know.

01:39:37
Speaker 2: And then we've already touched on this. But like the little sister, even to a lesser extent gets characterized.

01:39:43
Speaker 3: And just she is ignored.

01:39:46
Speaker 2: I don't even know her name, oh on Fred, but it's only because I read stuff about the sequels that she's in.

01:39:53
Speaker 3: She's not based on the Airbud fan YouTube videos I was watching. She is not a fan for a favorite. She's pretty despose. They're not fans of Andrea. They're like, she's a flop. She is bad at but like her brother, she is bad at every sport she tries, which is an interesting creative choice.

01:40:12
Speaker 5: Yeah, good for her.

01:40:14
Speaker 3: This family is just like full of losers. Anyways.

01:40:19
Speaker 2: The other big thing I want to talk about with this movie is its depiction of class, especially in regards to Norm the Clown, because we have maybe the most cartoonish villain of all time in a live action movie, to the point where he's literally a clown. He is abusive to animals, he hates children. There's all this stuff that makes him completely unlikable and unsympathetic to the audience. And on top of that, he is poor, and that's supposed to be another thing that we don't like about him, I think, which is a very common trope I feel like, especially in children's media, but across all media thinks you have like Sid and Toy story he lives on the wrong side of town kind of thing. Yeah, and therefore he's bad. And I feel like the idea here is that, like the character is poor and it's his fault rather than any systemic issue. And I feel like movies like this imply that the character being poor is part of what makes them a bad person.

01:41:25
Speaker 4: Yeah, Okay, I don't. Can I just okay, look not to be spicy, I agree with all of that. I think that that's a real trope. I think that this movie is certainly engaging in that trope. On the other hand, can I just say to Norm the clown get a real.

01:41:41
Speaker 5: Job or be a better clown? Right, he's not even committed to his craft, you know.

01:41:47
Speaker 4: But it's not like he's like I'm you know, I can't work. He's going out and working birthday parties. He just doesn't like it. So he's doing a bad job. Like it's like, I don't know, man, maybe go work at the napkin factory. I'm not saying that any of this is your fault.

01:42:06
Speaker 3: Yeah, I guess I've kind of followed the middle there, because it is interesting that, like the reason he is poor is ostensibly really because he is an artist quote unquote, like he's in the arts, which many such cases, and also that like he I don't know, there's there's he's just like a pile of tropes and I don't know what to make of him, and the performance is so campy, Like I agree that, like, yeah, the the class tropes are very present, as are that. Like again, it's just adding something that just feels like unnecessarily complicated for the kind of movie. This is making him an alcoholic as well, and like just throwing that in there. I you know, I don't know what to make of him. I do agree that it's like the fact that it's I guess I am like glad that he isn't being given like a working class job to imply that he's a bad person. And we also do have I mean, in Arthur's character, we have another working class character who's subject to many other tropes. I don't know. Yeah, it's like so campy, it over the top that I don't really know what to make of it.

01:43:18
Speaker 4: How did he get into clowning? Did he used to have a passion for it but he lost it?

01:43:24
Speaker 5: I mean, he's into clowning enough that he has a custom truck that has a giant, professionally made clown head on the top.

01:43:30
Speaker 3: So well, yeah, he's invested.

01:43:32
Speaker 2: He had one, well until he drove it into that length.

01:43:36
Speaker 3: Was it the family business?

01:43:38
Speaker 5: Like, yeah, maybe it's speaking of fathers. Maybe his father was moved the whole family to Spokane to force him to go to clown college. Oh, something to think about.

01:43:46
Speaker 2: Yeah, we don't know. It's just yeah, just one trope on top of the next. And it's all very cartoonish. And again like a character who's struggling with addiction. The movie so so like, and that's also why he's a bad person. And I know that this is a complicated matter where people who are dealing with addiction do behave sometimes in ways that is harmful to themselves and others, But movies like this never approach it with any nuance. Yeah, and it's just like, well, he's an alcoholic and he's poor, therefore bad.

01:44:20
Speaker 3: Yeah, therefore villain.

01:44:21
Speaker 4: Also, I'm sorry I said that Arthur might have a gambling problem. I was just trying to I thought that was in the movie. Are you just made that up? I've made that up. I was trying to hypothesize how you lose all of your NBA money, And I.

01:44:35
Speaker 2: Mean that's what Michael Jordan dealt with in real life, right, so maybe I mean exactly.

01:44:41
Speaker 5: He says that it's not a gambling problem if you don't run out of money, and he has never run out of money, therefore he doesn't have a problem.

01:44:48
Speaker 3: That's what he says.

01:44:49
Speaker 4: And I'm paraphrasing, but that's basically what he said.

01:44:52
Speaker 3: Addiction is an otherfucker.

01:44:54
Speaker 5: It's wild out there, folks.

01:44:56
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's like and I would be so shocked if the writers of this movie were even remotely doing anything but just like pulling well worn tropes out of their ass in that way.

01:45:09
Speaker 4: But I'd like to say that Arthur could have been swindled by an unscrupulous agent. True, there are many things, many things could have happened to Arthur.

01:45:17
Speaker 5: I mean, I can't imagine it was a picnic to be a black player and the NBA in nineteen fifty six.

01:45:23
Speaker 3: Absolutely yeah.

01:45:24
Speaker 5: And also like shoe deals, endorsement deals, that stuff where athletes actually make most of their money, Like none of that stuff interested until like the seventies and eighties. So that's right, poor Arthur and then but also that he felt like he had to hide his accomplishments from people just it just makes you sad. And then he kind of applies his great wealth of knowledge to help some random I mean, I don't know. Yeah, obviously Josh is going through a lot too, But it's like Arthur heal thyself, sir, you.

01:45:52
Speaker 3: Know it really is. Yeah, like Arthur could be there's a whole separate, very overly serious family drama about Arthur her but it's just sort of left on the table there not so much about norm I don't know. I don't know if there's if there's enough runway for a full movie there maybe though I don't know, there's maybe a bobcat gold White movie in there.

01:46:13
Speaker 4: I don't Yeah, absolutely, yeah.

01:46:16
Speaker 2: I mean, isn't that kind of what Baskets is about?

01:46:18
Speaker 3: There you go, there you go, Yeah, there's it's like it's frustrating, but it's like I love, I love being shown a trophy character when they're when they're doing something with it. But that's not the kind of movie where we're really watching. No, except with regards to Golden Retrievers, in which case we.

01:46:33
Speaker 5: Got a real nuanced look at what dogs are capable of. I think so true in this film.

01:46:38
Speaker 3: It's true.

01:46:39
Speaker 2: Another another trophy character I felt was the judge. At the end, it felt like a lot of ageist tropes were happening there where, Like, yes, he can't see, he can't hear, he doesn't seem to understand what's going on around him. He's horrible at his job.

01:46:55
Speaker 5: However, speaking of having controversial takes about judges, specifically, if you have been appointed for life to a judge ship and you don't know where you are or what's going on, please retire, and please retire when Barack Obama is president.

01:47:12
Speaker 3: A judge of any stature at any time, Yes.

01:47:15
Speaker 5: If you could just go ahead and not wait until Donald Trump is president to retire, slash Die, that would help us all out a great deal.

01:47:23
Speaker 4: Thank you, just throwing that.

01:47:25
Speaker 5: It does not about age, it's about ability.

01:47:27
Speaker 3: We'll just put it that way, the ability to judge.

01:47:30
Speaker 5: Just throwing that out there, this judge.

01:47:32
Speaker 3: It's so funny because it's like you don't even need those tropes because the character.

01:47:36
Speaker 2: Like the situation is goofy enough, and I just love that the.

01:47:40
Speaker 3: Characters like I don't give a fuck, I'm gonna do it feel as good, Like that's that's fun enough on its own, like him just being like whatever today is, I'm today doesn't count. Today's a silly one, Like that's fun today.

01:47:53
Speaker 5: We're making a TikTok on the front lawn of the.

01:48:00
Speaker 2: We talked a little bit about the sequels, But the thing I was curious about them is that because I knew nothing about I don't know if it was the same cast, even the same dog. You know, I knew nothing, and I was curious about is it ever girls playing sports? Yes, And the answer is kind of so. Air Bud Golden Receiver, the sequel that immediately follows this one, is about American football and it seems to be all boys. Air Bud World Pup is the soccer slash real football movie where it is a co ed team, but it does seem to be mostly boys. There is I think at least one girl on the team. Maybe she is the only one. I didn't watch the movie, hard to say.

01:48:41
Speaker 3: And then when the focus comes to Andrea, then we.

01:48:45
Speaker 2: Got to say. In the next one, Seventh Inning Fetch, which is the baseball movie, again seems to be a co ed team. But I was scrubbing through the movie on Disney Plus and it is seems to be mostly boys again, and then then the next one is Airbud Spikes Back. The Volleyball movie also a co ed team, although it almost doesn't seem like an official like like a school sports team. I think they're just sort of like casually playing beach volleyball, and Airbud gets involved. I can't really tell. But this one also centers Andrea, Josh's sister, so girls do get more meaningfully involved in the franchise as it goes.

01:49:30
Speaker 3: On the Hairbud universe, but it is.

01:49:32
Speaker 2: Still mostly centering boys playing sports and dogs playing sports.

01:49:37
Speaker 4: Is the dog ever a girl?

01:49:39
Speaker 3: So no, Airbud gets a girl friend and they literally missus Airbud hert. As far as I know, missus Arabud does not play sports. She's a stay at home missus Airbud. I'm not totally sure. I do know that in the third or fourth one he gets a girl friend, and then.

01:49:57
Speaker 2: I think that's world puffs pro pup okay, believe you.

01:50:01
Speaker 3: And then he I don't like how they talk about dogs having babies. He sires puppies sires, that's nasty. But he does he does have puppies who become the stars of air Buddies.

01:50:14
Speaker 5: I see, I see, well, the legacy of title nine is in tatters in the Airbud universe.

01:50:21
Speaker 3: It's true. It's true.

01:50:22
Speaker 2: Title nine more like K nine?

01:50:25
Speaker 5: What is?

01:50:27
Speaker 3: And there it is?

01:50:28
Speaker 2: I don't have anything else to say about the movie.

01:50:32
Speaker 5: I just want to say that this was a gift. I know we have a lot of fraught feelings about the ethics of Airbud, but boy, I haven't laughed like that in months. I think Airbud cured my very severe depression. Glad to him, I say, I salute to Airbud and his progeny.

01:50:52
Speaker 4: I salute you.

01:50:53
Speaker 5: Oh so a very funny movie. I laughed a lot.

01:50:56
Speaker 2: Does anyone have anything else they want to talk about?

01:50:58
Speaker 4: Well? Are we going to talk about the Bechdel Test? Because I have something to say about that.

01:51:04
Speaker 5: Did anyone? Did anyone pass?

01:51:06
Speaker 3: Honestly, I wasn't really paying attention.

01:51:07
Speaker 2: I don't know.

01:51:08
Speaker 4: I don't know if this counts, but because I actually didn't clock the the mom on the phone, so I guess it could have been.

01:51:14
Speaker 5: I don't think that counts because she wasn't.

01:51:16
Speaker 2: We don't see we don't hear the grandmother speaking.

01:51:18
Speaker 4: Okay, so to me, the only one I noticed is when they first get to the new house and the mom says to both kids, so what do you think? What do you think?

01:51:32
Speaker 5: So?

01:51:32
Speaker 4: What do you what do you think of the house?

01:51:33
Speaker 3: Does that count?

01:51:35
Speaker 2: Does little baby Andrea respond?

01:51:38
Speaker 4: She kind of goes, ah, I think it counts. I can't.

01:51:44
Speaker 5: I can't.

01:51:44
Speaker 3: I don't think. Usually then we'll kick it to like does it spiritually pass? And I just feel like, no, way doesn't spiritually pass.

01:51:52
Speaker 4: Like there's a part when the mom talks to the principal, except they're talking about Josh and his dad and his dad Yeah.

01:52:01
Speaker 3: Exploded father.

01:52:02
Speaker 2: So yeah, I think that's a no on the Bechdel test.

01:52:05
Speaker 4: But I kind of I'm standing by mind where the mom asks the baby if she likes the apartment?

01:52:12
Speaker 2: Okay, fair for fair.

01:52:13
Speaker 4: I think that was pretty good.

01:52:14
Speaker 3: I just wanted to throw in here really quick, because we sometimes, I don't know, sometimes enemy sometimes. Friend of the show Roger Ebert gave this movie three stars, which.

01:52:23
Speaker 5: I just thought was very out of three out of four out of.

01:52:27
Speaker 3: Four, pretty high spore and his whole I do like his reviews that are like this. He's like, look, I went in expected to have a bad time, and I was moved yep, and so and so I have no choice but to give it three stars. I was like, good for you, Good for you for recognizing.

01:52:44
Speaker 4: That's how I feel. I agree he's right on.

01:52:47
Speaker 5: My only disagreement is that I would give it four.

01:52:50
Speaker 2: Well, speaking of giving the movie a number of things on a scale, so it's our nipple scale. We rate the movie zero to five nipples based on examining the movie through an intersectional feminist lens. And while this is a romp and while this has some great dog acting and basketball abilities, I would say on the nipple scale it gets one nipple because there a mom is there. But based on all the things we've talked about regarding tropes surrounding poor characters and black characters and everything that we've discussed, Yeah, I think only one nipple, and I will give it to Buddy the Dog.

01:53:38
Speaker 4: Yeah, I think I would give it. I would give it two, although I'm not super familiar with the scale, so I could be off. But I just feel like thinking about the era and like the time that we grew up in, and like there's so much media that is that doesn't just use tropes but is like overtly offensive truth and like degrading and derogatory and what. It doesn't have any of that. It's just sort of like ideologically insensitive and clumsy.

01:54:07
Speaker 5: I think, I guess maybe the Bars on the Ground for media that came out in the nineties. But it's like a lot of stuff you can't go back and watch because there's like the use of slurs and just like wild comments about people's weight or whatever, like really out of pocket jokes that are just like completely racially based or just outright racist or whatever. And so like a lot of the issues that I if you even want to call them issues, I cannot emphasize enough.

01:54:37
Speaker 4: I love this movie so much.

01:54:38
Speaker 2: I really loved it.

01:54:40
Speaker 5: It's like stuff that you learn about later, like when you go to college, and then when you rewatch something, you're like, oh, that's that trope I learned about in my film studies class, which I took, by the way, you know, So like, yeah, is there this like sort of ridiculous and often harmful magical negro trope?

01:55:00
Speaker 4: Yes?

01:55:00
Speaker 5: Is it the worst one I've ever seen?

01:55:02
Speaker 2: Not by far?

01:55:03
Speaker 5: You know what I mean? So it's like I'm on a human scale, I'm given it four stars. On the feminist intersectional scale, I will also I will give it too as well, because to Lindy's point, there was nothing happening in it where that was like active pointed, like stuff where you couldn't show it to a kid today, which a lot of stuff from that era fits into that category, like you can't show it to a child because they're.

01:55:32
Speaker 3: Like, oh god, you watched this.

01:55:35
Speaker 2: Yeah totally.

01:55:36
Speaker 5: There's nothing really like that that happens in air. But it's just sort of like an absentee mother.

01:55:41
Speaker 2: Really, I'm just too busy at the napkin factory.

01:55:43
Speaker 4: Yeah yeah, And like I really and.

01:55:45
Speaker 5: They could have done a much better job giving coach Arthur Cheney a full, nuanced and inner rich life and they don't do that, which is too bad.

01:55:55
Speaker 4: I thought maybe the mom and Arthur were gonna get together.

01:55:58
Speaker 5: Hello.

01:55:58
Speaker 4: That was one of the things.

01:55:59
Speaker 3: I just get it, like it's giving the movie credit for what it doesn't do versus what it does. But I was surprised that they did toss in a boyfriend I guess would be pretty insensitive due to her husband just exploded. But a lot a lot of movies would, A lot of movies would, and that eventually does have. That happens literally in the next movie is she meets a new guy right away and she's like, I'm over it. I'm over it, Enter Patrick, I'm gonna be a coward and split the difference at one and a half. Okay, and that's going to be my choice. I want to say one more thing that I think that the true villains of this franchise, if we're talking about people that are like profiting off of animal performers with animal standards, to get worse and worse as time goes on. Two brothers produced this movie, which I always find to be a little bit evil show business brothers. I just don't like it. The Vince brothers, Robert Vince and William Vince. They have William Vince has produced like real movies quote unquote no offense, but like uh like he produced movies we've covered on the show. He produced Saved, he produced Capoti, whereas Robert Vince especially seems to have made a fortune exploiting animals for movies. He produced MVP Most Valuable Primate, He did all the air buds, including the one where five puppies died and more recently has been doing stuff called like monkey up pop Star. Like It's like, this is someone who probably like owns a house in Beverly Hills based on exploiting animals.

01:57:39
Speaker 5: So I know he hated to watch Chimp Crazy, that documentary.

01:57:45
Speaker 4: Ringing.

01:57:48
Speaker 3: So that's the last. Yeah, I just would saying those guys freak me out. Also, just in general, brothers freaked me out.

01:57:55
Speaker 4: Conceptually, I think boo to brothers.

01:57:58
Speaker 5: Yeah, I give z Rowe nipples to brothers.

01:58:02
Speaker 3: I don't like movies about brothers. I don't like I don't know my fiance has a brother. I'm like, don't hang out with them. Like, yeah, it's a scary bond break up. Some human bonds should not be preserved totally.

01:58:15
Speaker 2: Yeah. Oh well, thanks, thank you to the both of you for being here. What would you like to plug? Where can people follow you?

01:58:24
Speaker 3: Where can they follow the show?

01:58:26
Speaker 5: Please follow our show? If you thought this was fun, you'll love text me back podcast.

01:58:31
Speaker 4: We're on all of the social media's I.

01:58:33
Speaker 5: Think, although our speaking of abandoned haunted churches, that's what our TikTok is basically, But we do have a TikTok but we're on Instagram and all the places that at text Me Backpod. We are an independent podcasts. We make it ourselves. It's very hard, but we love doing it. So if you listen to the show and you like it, you can support us at patreon dot com slash text me Backpod.

01:58:55
Speaker 4: So check it out. Yeah, just come give us a listen.

01:58:58
Speaker 5: Yeah, we're so fun.

01:59:00
Speaker 4: So we have lots of lore. We have a thriving discord. There's all kinds of things to dig your little teeth into.

01:59:07
Speaker 5: And if you want to learn more about Barry, if you're into Golden Retrievers, yeah, babye, we got Barry. Okay, so come check this out.

01:59:14
Speaker 4: Come check us out. Yeah, and Megan has a special little friend I do well.

01:59:18
Speaker 5: I have one dog behind me right now as I'm recording. Her name is Margie. She's so sleepy and I assume the editor will cut this out, but you may have heard my dog, Kevin barking in the background of this while we were recording. He's a Pomeranian from Apish Country and he is diseased in the mind.

01:59:43
Speaker 3: You carefully chose your worst there.

01:59:46
Speaker 5: He came from hell and I love him so much, but he does not believe in quiet time for podcast recording.

01:59:54
Speaker 4: He does not believe in that.

01:59:56
Speaker 2: And that's his prerogative.

01:59:57
Speaker 5: Yep, I don't. I'm not here to exploit Kevin and make him do stuff he doesn't want to do, you know what I mean?

02:00:02
Speaker 2: Sorry, like and good for you, Oh goodness, well, thank you again so much, come back anytime.

02:00:09
Speaker 3: Thank you.

02:00:09
Speaker 4: This was a joy.

02:00:10
Speaker 3: It was the delight so much, Oh my gosh.

02:00:13
Speaker 2: You can follow us on mostly Instagram at Bechdelcast. You can subscribe to our Patreon aka Matreon, where we cover two bonus episodes every single month, always centering a genius theme. And that's all for five dollars a month and.

02:00:31
Speaker 3: You can check out soon. We're going on tour at the end of the summer in the Midwest, so if you live in Chicago, Minneapolis, Madison, Wisconsin, or Indianapolis, Indiana, you can come and see us. And if you live close by, get in your car, get in your clown car and get to the show and don't drive in a lake. And with that, let's get on this water taxi with this mysterious stranger and leave our dog behind and abandon our dog on an islands.

02:00:59
Speaker 5: So sad Hey Bye Bye.

02:01:04
Speaker 2: The Bechdel Cast is a production of iHeartMedia, hosted by Caitlin Drante and Jamie Loftis, produced by Sophie Lichtermann, edited by mo La Boord. Our theme song was composed by Mike Kaplan with vocals by Katherine Voskresenski. Our logo in merch is designed by Jamie Loftis and a special thanks to Aristotle Assevedo. For more information about the podcast, please visit linktree slash Bechdel Cast