Pirates "aggressively" pursuing Framber, D'backs sign Carlos Santana, Tigers v. Skubal battle today

00:00:03
Speaker 1: I'd be honest thing everybody, and Welcome to a brand new episode of Foul Territory. I am pin hitting for Scott bron.

00:00:09
Speaker 2: My name is Lana Rizzo, along with the guys that you know very well, AJ Pierzinski and Eric Kratz.

00:00:14
Speaker 1: Happy to be with you guys today a big show.

00:00:16
Speaker 2: Miguil Rojas will be joining us, Isaac Collins, the newest member of the Kansas City Royals, and Scott Okasaki, the president of Team Travel for the Dodgers, joining us as well. Don't forget to get involved hashtag ft live by merchant Foul Territory shop dot com. Lots to get into, gentlemen, let's charge the mound.

00:00:38
Speaker 3: Charge about.

00:00:41
Speaker 1: All right, guys.

00:00:42
Speaker 2: From Ravel Does He's still out there, Ken Rosenthal reporting that the Pirates are trying again in free agency and their latest target is a doozy. I did not have rombervel Does going to the Pirates AJ on my bingo car. Perhaps he does it, but it seems like the Buckos are interested in the Hurler.

00:01:02
Speaker 1: What say you.

00:01:04
Speaker 4: Prove it, prove it, prove it you're interested.

00:01:08
Speaker 5: I'm interested in from Bervaldez coming and pitching for my son's college team. He still has eligibility the way the college basketball is going, right, so I.

00:01:16
Speaker 4: Don't know, prove it. Go out and sign him. You want him.

00:01:19
Speaker 5: You're saying you want this guy and you want that guy, and listen, you get you got Ryan O'Hearn to a nice deal. But then you said you wanted Schwarber and you wanted Suarez, you wanted him.

00:01:28
Speaker 4: Prove it, Go get him, Go put him with.

00:01:31
Speaker 5: Schemes in Jones and Keller and Bubba Chandler and throw from Bervaldez in there as the fifth.

00:01:39
Speaker 4: That's pretty good rotation. So prove it. Prove it, Pittsburgh Pirates. I hope the fan for the fans sake, they do prove it, because it would be a huge upgrade for him and Eric.

00:01:48
Speaker 2: The rotation, as AJ was just mentioning, would look pretty good. I mean, if you want to take a look at the projected starting rotation, if Fromber was in the mix, I mean I would take that right obviously. Paul Schemes, the cream of the krop, Mitch Keller, Braxton Ashcroft, Bubba Chandler, which I just like saying that Bubba, And then how do you say this last name? Guys, Carmen Ledinski, I mean, Aj, you should know that sounds poolish. I like this again, though, Eric, to AJ's point, you think this is a legitimate landing spot.

00:02:21
Speaker 1: For from Bert.

00:02:24
Speaker 3: No, I'm fine saying that I was wrong, Like when the Pirates sign him, come back at me, come back at me. The reason I say no is past history, not even other years, because the Pirates front office ownership, whoever's heading this is definitely making a push. But how badly did they did they need third base offense? Henneo Suarez was out there, couldn't quite push it past the line. How badly did they want first base? They wanted Kyle Schwarber, couldn't quite push it past the line. The one area of strength where they're like or not not going to overpay in our rotation.

00:03:03
Speaker 6: Is Framber Valdez's position.

00:03:06
Speaker 3: Like they're gonna have to overpay Framber Valdez for him to go somewhere like Pittsburgh. I don't see them giving them fifty million, I mean one hundred and fifty million for five years or you know, somewhere in the even ranger Suarez type, because he's gonna have to get more if it's a one year, proven deal. He's not just gonna say yeah, I'll take twenty two million just to go to the Pirates. Like now, there's gonna be other teams that will be suiting if that's where they're at.

00:03:34
Speaker 6: So no, I don't think it's gonna happen.

00:03:36
Speaker 2: Apparently, the Pirates new pitching coach worked with Valdez guys for the vast majority of the pitcher's professional career career as both a minor and major league coach with the Houston Astros. So there's a guy that knows him well. Perhaps that would lend from Er got to get paid, of course, but perhaps that would lend Fromer to want to go to the Pirates where I mean, let's be honest, probably not going to win the division, probably not going to make the postseason. I may be wrong, but I mean, how much do you think that plays into this aj? Is it all about money for him? Does he have to get overpaid to go there? Or does familiarity with that guy help a little bit? Or is the calendar starting to work against him?

00:04:17
Speaker 4: Well?

00:04:17
Speaker 5: I think it's a couple of things. I think the calendar is obviously the owner's best friend, right because they feel like they can get guys. That's why a signing deadline would be the worst thing in the world for players. And also familiarity, yes with the pitching coach. Yes, but there's one thing I know from Briveldez wants to go to a place where he can get paid. Okay, and every free agent wants to go to a place where he can get paid. If he gets the longest term and the most money from the Pittsburgh Pirates, I think from rival does goes there, this is the perfect guy for the Pirates to go get. Okay, to shut crats up, to shut me up, to get to shut all the pundits out there of the Pittsburgh Pirates, go get a top ten free agent. Yes, it might be position of strength, but fram Ravaldes, if you sign him to a nice deal, he goes out and performs well, and then you have some of the other guys coming up, do you think are gonna be great? You can always move him for something at some point if he's signed to a nice deal and he has a nice showing. So I love this move. If they get it done, I don't think they will. I think this will be the same as schore Ber and Suarez and all these other guys. You know, listen, they're aggressively after him. But you know who loves this the most, Frambravaldes in his Asian Why because everyone's saying he's going to the Orioles. He's going to the Orioles. Now we hear blue jays are in on him, pirates are in on him. Guess what that means. There's a markets and now he can go back to the Orioles and say, hey, Orioles, guess what you're Your offer of five one hundred random numbers, not real numbers, is not good enough. We have five one twenty or six one twenty on the on the books here. It's a great spot to be in if you're fram Ravaldez at this point.

00:05:53
Speaker 3: What if he does sign there? Where does this rotation sit? But where does this rotation sit? Because as Alana said, well, probably not going to win the division. To me, I think from Bervaldez, unlike Kyle Schwarmer, unlike Ajohineo Suarez, from bert Valdez might push them to win the divis, push them too close to winning the division. But that's really the debate is is a move like this a guy who has perect for the last four years. I think four years made every one of his starts. The fact that, yeah, since twenty twenty two, the fact that he has finished in the top ten in cy Young three of the last four years. Yes, I get the fact that he threw at his catcher because he was pissed, because and he might have other you know, emotional like he's an emotional player. Him added to this rotation with Paul Skeins, hopefully Jared Jones will stay, will be healthy, Mitch Keller, Bubba Chandler. Do they become a top three rotation in the game, are they a top seven rotation? And does it push them to where they need to be because I don't think there's enough bats available anymore for them to push them to be a playoff team.

00:07:13
Speaker 1: Why is this taking so long? A jay? I mean, is this fromber and his agents holding things up? Is it mind?

00:07:20
Speaker 5: I don't think so. I don't think it's his agent. I think they want to get a deal done. I think Fromber one definitely wants to get a deal done. I think this is just teams saying, oh, we can wait this one out. Where's Zach Allen? We haven't heard a peep about Zach Gallen this entire offseason. I know Sky Borris keeps things very very tight to his chest, very close to his the best chest vest, whatever it is, whatever the saying is, Neil Dewin. But we haven't heard, yeah, close to the best. We haven't heard much about like the chess better better for better when the girls look at you because you know, but but where's Zach Allen's market? But we you know, obviously Yill and Cetern signed super early. But Bassett, I mean some of these guys verlind are yes, he's looking for the right deal shures or I get there up in Yil. But your guy Walker, Bueller, Alana, we haven't heard and heard Jose Cantana had a pretty good year, decent year for last year for the Brewers. We haven't heard much about a lot of these guys on the starting pitching market. And guess what, guys we're about. It's February fourth, We're about a week away from a lot of teams reporting for spring training. So it's a weird It's been a weird market for you guys not on the top, top top.

00:08:31
Speaker 3: I just talked to my buddy who's a pitcher and he's leaving Monday. Usually right around the Super Bowl, some you know guys start packing up and leaving. So yeah, you definitely want a spot. But to answer your question, Alana, this is a player who went to I think the Winter meetings or the GM meetings in person. Franbur Voudez and his agent were there in person talking to teams. So, yes, they wanted to get this done. Yes, they wanted to make sure they were ahead of any kind of negative.

00:09:01
Speaker 6: Well, here we are, February fourth.

00:09:05
Speaker 3: It's not his it's not his play on the field that is holding this up. He just does not fit into that how we don't want to give a give up a qualifying offer or the draft pick associated with qualifying offer. To me, if it's not the questions about we haven't heard, we haven't heard money being discussed. If it's not the questions about that one instance and then other instances that are alluded to, then I don't know what it would be that's holding this market up.

00:09:38
Speaker 5: Zach Allen doesn't have those things, does.

00:09:42
Speaker 4: Of those different?

00:09:43
Speaker 6: Story? Totally different?

00:09:45
Speaker 4: Okay, Well, what's holding his market up?

00:09:47
Speaker 3: What's holding He's that guy, He's that guy that's connected to the qualifying offer that major and we'll get into it at some point, like I talked to I talked to a previous a former GM the other day and him telling me about how they do arbitration things. Anyway, we'll talk about it later with the whole scooball stuff. But it shows me there is every year there's a guy, there's somebody that that qualifying offer, the compensatory pick that is associated with signing him really really hurts him. And I didn't think it was gonna be Zach Gallen this year. I thought Zach Allen was a nine figure pitcher and guess he had a down year. So you're gonna get a little bit better price for him, but nobody wants it.

00:10:31
Speaker 6: You know.

00:10:32
Speaker 3: I bet he goes back to the Diamondbacks because and they don't lose a pick. Whoever signs him doesn't lose a pick, and he regains his value.

00:10:38
Speaker 2: What about fromber in Toronto? The rumors are still swirling aj that he could possibly be a member of the Toronto Blueje's. I mean, this is a team that, to give them some credit, they went for it this offseason and they spent a lot of money. They obviously were this close to winning the World Series. Took that money from the World Series, put it right back in their team for the product on the field Fromber, does it make for him to go there?

00:11:05
Speaker 5: I mean their rotation is pretty loaded. I mean especially, let's not forget they got ceased, right Ponts. Gosman's still there, you savage, A full year, you savage. I mean they're there, their rotation, Barrios is still there. They got a pretty Bieber Biaber. We'll see how healthy Bieber is. But yeah, you know, they're their rotations loaded, and they still have the lefty just blanked in the lefty's name.

00:11:29
Speaker 6: That was good, so good.

00:11:31
Speaker 5: Lours still there, right, so they have a loaded rotation?

00:11:35
Speaker 4: It does?

00:11:35
Speaker 5: Does it make sense from just I'm greedy and I want everybody's standpoint like Alana's Dodgers? Yes, but doesn't make sense for any other reason. I mean, I guess Gosman could be a free agent. Some of these other guys might be free agents. They might trade a Barrios. Is Biaber healthy?

00:11:49
Speaker 6: I don't know.

00:11:49
Speaker 5: No, it makes sense, yes, because you can never have enough starting pitching. But no, it doesn't make sense because you would think they already are loaded for bear and their starting rotation. We'll see, but I think he makes way more sense to the Orioles and or the Pirates.

00:12:03
Speaker 1: All Right, you just brought up the Oriols. I was just about to ask you that. So k let's look at this.

00:12:07
Speaker 2: The Orioles projected starting rotation right now, Lefty, Trevor Rodgers, Kyle Barradis, Shane Baz, Dean Kramer, and Zach Efflick.

00:12:14
Speaker 1: You throw fromber in there?

00:12:16
Speaker 6: Do you like that? Or?

00:12:17
Speaker 1: I mean, who's who's the slam dunk?

00:12:19
Speaker 3: Okay, there's no odd man We're we're in We're in a central six man rotation territory. Like I don't I don't think they can. Trevor Rodgers had an unbelievable breakout fourteen starts. Are you gonna get thirty one of those starts? Thirty two of those starts? I mean you look at you look at the successful teams and they're really going six deep? Are you gonna Are you gonna sit any of these guys?

00:12:44
Speaker 6: No? Absolutely not.

00:12:45
Speaker 3: Kyle Braddis did not throw an entire year.

00:12:48
Speaker 6: Last year.

00:12:48
Speaker 3: He came back and was legit. But you're talking about a lot of time, So Framber to Baltimore is the slam dunk. I feel like I felt like it was gonna be Ranger. I felt like that price tag was going to be Orioles, Orioles all the way. It didn't happen. Boston came in and got the job done. So good for Boston. But to me, I think Framber to the Orioles finishes off their off season like Brandon Donovan did yesterday to the Marriagers Bob.

00:13:21
Speaker 2: Nightingale, saying the Oriols remain the heavy favorite guys to sign Valdez and saying, remember they were aggressive in the bidding, as Ek just said for Ranger Suarez before he signed a five year, one hundred and thirty million dollars deal with the Boston Red Solas.

00:13:35
Speaker 1: I want to ask you this, ag.

00:13:36
Speaker 2: I don't think you were on the show yet when Eric and I were talking about this with our producer, not producer Lady, but our producer Jeremy, our director. Today, there is a narrative surrounding from ber Valdez that Zach Gallen does not have following him like a dark cloud. I said, it depends. I guess on the clubhouse and you guys would know more than I playing. But does the fifteen win season erase that narrative for a team? Are there certain teams that will take that on versus others? What would it take for you to have a guy that does have some negative connotation associated with him, right, wrong or indifferent? I know that they took a video of him and said, look at this is my good guy video. We're going to show you now about from rivel Does. What does it take for you to want that in your clubhouse? If in fact he's not a good teammate. I don't know if he is. I've not played with the guy.

00:14:27
Speaker 4: I hate that. I hate that, I hate that.

00:14:28
Speaker 5: How do we know unless I'm because I've talked to guys on the Astros they all seem to like from rivela Does. Every time we've talked to Chandler Rome about the Astros, Jeff Blum, who I played with, they all say, yeah, I hate that bad He's just got a bad rap.

00:14:42
Speaker 6: You know.

00:14:42
Speaker 4: It's how do we know that?

00:14:44
Speaker 6: Now?

00:14:44
Speaker 5: I know his agency went around in the winter meetings and had Fromber there and they showed a video of how he.

00:14:50
Speaker 4: Is a good teammate.

00:14:51
Speaker 5: So yeah, they're trying to combat this. But listen, I'm never going to label somebody a bad team unless I actually played with him and I'm in that room with him for seven eight months.

00:15:00
Speaker 4: You don't know. You really don't know.

00:15:02
Speaker 5: There's no way to know unless you sit in that room, sit on the buses, sit on the planes, sit in there. Because there's people that I played with that were labeled as good teammates, and I played with them and I thought they were terrible. And then there was guys that were labeled bad teammates and I played with them and they.

00:15:16
Speaker 4: Were fucking awesome.

00:15:17
Speaker 5: So it's just everyone has a different view on everybody, and sometimes the media can spin it. Trust me, take it from someone who knows very well, TA can spin it however they want to spin it. And listen, one incident, if he can explain it and he says it and the team is fine with that incident that we always talk about with the catcher, then it shouldn't affect him that much. But that owners are also smart and the gms are smart. We're like, hey, we can use this against them to get them to take less money. Let's try it for sure.

00:15:45
Speaker 3: And the only thing I had to say, is what AJ is trying to say is every clubhouse is built differently. Some clubhouses problem guys come in and all they really wanted was to win. And the last place where they were trying to hold people accountable and you know what, it wasn't handled very well. Then there's other clubhouses where you never really knew if the guy was a good guy or not because he wasn't connected Like each each spot, not everybody can necessarily meld into the culture of what you're doing. When you're paying somebody one hundred and fifty million dollars like fran Bravaldez, are you paying for him to be a clubhouse leader, a club a rotation leader, that guy that everybody goes to. Maybe some organizations say we don't want to spend that money. It's all dependent on the player, and it's really all dependent on what they know about him. And what did we say at the beginning. If this is the pirates, that's the whole reason we're talking about this. The pirates are aggressive. Guess who knows him really well, Bill Murphy, who has been his pitching coach or in some capacity.

00:16:50
Speaker 6: Been around him.

00:16:51
Speaker 3: And you know what, maybe the pirates said Hey, if Murphy, who we haven't had here as a coach until this year, says yes, he would fit into what we're doing here, and maybe it's a lot easier for them to say, check he will fit in this clubhouse because he's really good.

00:17:14
Speaker 2: Bob Nightingale reporting guys that the Arizona Diamondbacks are signing first baseman Carlos Santana to a one year, two million dollar deal contract U pending a physical. Uh so we'll see that. I mean, this is a guy that just keeps going and going and going. He's like the energizer bunny.

00:17:33
Speaker 1: Do you like this?

00:17:33
Speaker 6: E K?

00:17:35
Speaker 1: I mean, for Santana, you go as long as you can, right until they take the jersey.

00:17:38
Speaker 6: Off of you.

00:17:40
Speaker 3: Why sense not necessarily? I mean I don't know that you do. I don't know Carlo. I don't know Carlos's decisions, so I'm not going to speak for him. For me, it wasn't as long as they take the jersey off of me, it was it was time to go. Like, but he's he's still a productive player, Like he's giving he's giving them productive at bats. He's going to give them. You know what does he in a in a successful Diamondbacks lineup. Does he hit as high as seventh in this lineup?

00:18:10
Speaker 6: No?

00:18:10
Speaker 3: But what other upgrade? It was kind of like what I was saying with the Pirates earlier. What other offensive upgrades are there left on the market? And Dinmonbacks wanted a first baseman. Good for them for going to get somebody who actually plays first and not doing what some of the teams are saying and going, well, we'll just make this guy a first baseman. Well, anybody can play first because they can't, So good for them. I think he had like a I don't know, like a one something war last year, so he's a productive player. His ops plus wasn't there, but his defense maybe picked it up some.

00:18:46
Speaker 6: But it's not a splash. It's a decent move.

00:18:49
Speaker 2: I mean, Paul goldschmianth Aj he's a first baseman, a true first baseman. That could have kind of come full circle for him, right, Maybe finish your career in Arizona where most people know Paul gold Schmidt, that mean, and that's his team, right at least it ends a reunion for now.

00:19:04
Speaker 5: Yeah, But Paul golsh was probably looking for ten million dollars and Carlos Santana took two million dollars, so they're like they needed a right handed first baseman. Carlos Santana switch hits. So yeah, it's a move. I like it for the Diamondbacks. Let's see what he has left, because let's not forget he. I mean, he was he good last year. Yeah, he was okay last year, he wasn't great. So he'll take a walk, he'll hit you at Homer every once in a while, and he'll played good defense. But yeah, it's a it's a it's a move that. Yeah, let's get behind it. But yeah, it's not the great, it's not. It's not a division changing move.

00:19:38
Speaker 2: Are they a playoff team as they are currently constructed? Again, we don't know Eric where Zach Gallen is going to end up. Whether it's back with Arizona someplace else, I don't know. Last year, the d Backs finished in fourth place in the division in eighty and eighty two records, so they were below five hundred. Is this a playoff team in twenty twenty six right now?

00:19:58
Speaker 6: No? Nope?

00:20:00
Speaker 3: Could could they be if they get Zack Gllen? I don't know if that's enough yet. Their bullpen's a little short, but man, I'm gonna take a lot of overs with this team because when you have three dudes in the top of your lineup that are MVP top three MVP candidates in Corbyn Carroll, Heraldo Perdomo and Katel Marte, I love it. But when you have a team also that says Gabriel Moreno is hitting fourth, Peven Smith is hitting fifth, like the projected lineup like you're You're definitely very top heavy. But they they figured out how to score some runs last year. They're gonna run the bases like their hair's on fire, and so they're gonna score a lot of runs. It's gonna be an issue keeping the other team off the base pass though.

00:20:48
Speaker 2: AJ does Nolan Ronado the acquisition of Nolan from the Cardinals. Does that move the needle at all for you in terms of making a playoff team.

00:20:58
Speaker 5: I don't know if it makes them a playoff team, but Nolan and I think he'll be a great leader for some of the guys in that clubhouse. He plays, still plays a good defense, he'll I think we talked to him not that long ago. He's talking about making some adjustments in the swing. So I think, yes, I think he'll he'll help them, but does he make him a playoff team? The National League's really hard.

00:21:19
Speaker 6: That is really hard.

00:21:21
Speaker 5: Yeah, But I mean Mett's, Phillies, Braves, Cubs, Brewers, Dodgers. There's seven I just named for six right, and you haven't even got to the Padres, Giants, Diamonds. I don't think they're better than the Reds. I mean there's there's ten or eleven teams you just named. The National League is hard. The National League is a better league right now than the American League. And I'm an American League guy.

00:21:46
Speaker 3: I don't bet against I don't bet against Tory Leavello, but I don't know if you can make chicken salad out of chicken, you know what? So I think there's I think I think the team has the potential to be really good. When does Corbyn Burns come back? Are they still in it? When they get a Corbyn Burns back into this rotation?

00:22:10
Speaker 6: Is he?

00:22:11
Speaker 3: Is he Corbyn Burns level Corbyn Burns like it's there's too many ifs in that pitching and they weren't able to They weren't able to address those things. So it'll be fun to watch man. I love watching them play because they run the bases the way you're supposed to.

00:22:26
Speaker 2: That's what we said, all right, So Chandler Rome, who covers the Astros, make sure you check out Crush City territory. Do you think it's likely that both Lach Parades and Christian Walker are on your roster when you get to camp. This is what Dana Brown, the GM said. Right now, both of them are still part of our roster, and we have plans for both of them to play.

00:22:49
Speaker 1: Right now.

00:22:49
Speaker 2: Our plan is for both of them to be here. That's basically not saying much. AJ will start with you.

00:22:56
Speaker 1: Yeah, you can say that on February fourth, because as of right now, they're both. Do you think one or both of these guys get moved, No.

00:23:07
Speaker 6: One.

00:23:07
Speaker 5: He's gonna say Parades, but I don't think they will, not not until maybe later in spring training or maybe in the season. I just think they're gonna roll with what they have right now and see how it plays out and then make make an adjustment, because you know, this stuff always works itself out, and I just think it's too close to spring training. I think they'll wait and then they'll see how spring training plays out and then make a decision.

00:23:30
Speaker 3: I say, I do say parades, and I say a great landing spot is.

00:23:36
Speaker 6: The Red Sox.

00:23:37
Speaker 3: There's one is one year left, he would wait, I don't say that's confidently now. I'm pretty sure this is his last year. I think he's a free agent after this year. But I could be wrong. Somebody looked that up for me, and I'll retract it if I'm wrong. But that right handed bat, like, do they think Marcella Meyer needs to go to or needs to be at third and then they need a second basement? Okay, well then that doesn't fit. Like I guess it depends on what the Red Sox are doing, but it's not a long term deal. I just don't see how you can find enough at bats. And I know every spring training they say this, And I think this could be like an end of spring training type of move when you see how well Marcella Meyer does it third, when you see how well certain teams' third basements are working out. Because if everybody ends spring training healthy, I get it. Al Tuove the other year broke his hand, broke his finger in the WBC. But and they need to stay healthy, but they're not moving to the outfield they're not moving Jose al Tuove consistently to the outfield, so he'll play second. DH is taken up because they need one hundred and sixty two games out of your don Carlos Correa, like, I get it. They'll figure it out. They picked them up last year and they said they'll figure it out when they need to. Well, now is when they need to. And they wanted to make a run at it last year and they came up short. But Carlos Correa is playing third, and Christian Walker do that bad last year. If you have somebody hitting thirty homers at first base, it wasn't up to his standard. I don't think he's as easily movable, and so I think it's paradeous And it's not anything against him. I mean, the dude was an All Star last year. But everybody's always expendable until they're not.

00:25:22
Speaker 2: According to Baseball Reference, Guys Parades has a little over four years of service time. He was arbitration eligible after the twenty twenty five season. He won't be a free agent until twenty twenty eight. Hey, j if I am a Tigers fan, all I care about is that you give Erk Skuble whatever the hell it is that he's asking for. I believe his arbitration has already started, or it's about to start.

00:25:45
Speaker 4: His arbitration run over, it's about over.

00:25:48
Speaker 1: Okay, all right? I mean, don't you do You guys were talking about it. I think on.

00:25:53
Speaker 2: Foul earlier that he should bring his cy Young Awards to the damn table and put him on the table and be like, are we are you kidds me with this right now? Like the gap in terms of what he thinks he deserves and what the team thinks he deserves. I mean, what's the right move here?

00:26:07
Speaker 5: Aj sign him, but it will already happened, that the time has already passed. Sign him, give him what he wants. I don't know what's the right move at this point. Well, they've they've painted themselves in a corner now, and the right move is they didn't settle because they went to the trial already, So there is no right move. The right move now is see what happens and then go from there. And he's gonna walk at the end of the year, and they're gonna give him a qualifying offer and get a draft pick out of him unless they're out of it and they trade him, which they don't think they will be.

00:26:40
Speaker 4: So the right move was.

00:26:43
Speaker 5: What aj Hinch said to me at the Baseball Writers' Association dinner the other night, which I said to him and he couldn't believe I said it, but people that know me know me. We were in Seattle for the Division Series before game it was the day before Game one. It was the workout day and I'm talking to Schooball and I'm talking to Hinch and it's me and Adam Wayne right, and Scott Harris walks over, their president of Baseball ops and says hello, and we start talking.

00:27:07
Speaker 4: We all kind of start talking.

00:27:08
Speaker 5: I just look at Scott Harris and I say, hey, what's gonna take to sign Schooble. Let's get this done right here. I'll negotiate the deal. And Scott Harris turned white as a ghost, and aj Hinch was trying to hide his laughter, and Schooble just looked at me, smiled and kind of walked away laughing. And that about sums it up. There is no right thing to do, so let's just make it completely awkward and see what happens, because that's what it's at right now.

00:27:29
Speaker 3: This isn't the Tiger's fault, Tigers fans, Tiger territory that everybody needs to know. This is not the Tiger's fault. This is not a team versus schooble thing. This is Major League Baseball versus the players. Major League Baseball would not allow the Tigers to agree and negotiate with somebody that's going to go down as one of the best Tigers pitchers of all time, like why because of the president it would send for or it would set for the rest of major League history, the rest of guys. We're still looking at David Price's nineteen point seven million dollars eleven years ago as the highest paid pitcher and arbitration and Juan Soto made over thirty million dollars. This is a chance to change the timeline, change the amount of money that pitchers get because Terrek Scouble could not have had two better years to come into this last arbitration chance. And Major League Baseball would not allow the Tigers to agree to this. They'll never admit to it, but there is no way that they would ever allow them to pay him twenty eight million dollars twenty nine million dollars. Well, if they don't win here. If Major League Baseball doesn't win, they're going to pay him thirty two. And it was a big backfire. And this is not a Tigers versus a Schooble thing. So fans, you have not alienated Tarrek Schouble in my opinion.

00:29:01
Speaker 1: So.

00:29:04
Speaker 4: Yes, yes they have.

00:29:05
Speaker 5: No I totally I agree with some of the things Eric said, But the Tigers can also make a decision and say, hey, we need to raise our offer above what David Price got in twenty fifteen. So yes, do I think that it's necessarily all the all MLB's fault or all the Tigers know, But I also believe that the Tigers should have tried after maybe his first say in the lock you ve and I know Scott Boris doesn't have a history of that, but they also it is you can't just say it's not the Tiger's fault. The Tigers have something to do with this. They put their number. Why didn't they put their number at twenty five million?

00:29:42
Speaker 6: Am to majorly?

00:29:44
Speaker 5: They have people that do it Major Legue Baseball, So okay, So then why did Scout Boris go to thirty two? Major League Baseball didn't tell him to do that. The Alumni Player Association didn't tell him to do that. He came up with his own number. The Tigers think on their own and if they wanted to get this done, the Tigers could have gone to MLB. He said, hey, guys, we're gonna settle at the midpoint twenty five and a half and let's move on. But they didn't want to. That's their philosophy, and that's fine, that's their right. But they could lose or they could win. And it's one of the most intriguing cases, I'm sorry in arbitration history, because if Trek Scoople can't win, then I don't know who else can win for players?

00:30:18
Speaker 2: Is this an ownership philosophy change? I have to believe the former owner would have been like, we're gonna give this kid you want to. I don't know, maybe I'm wrong. I feel like hal Steinbrenner of the Yankees is a little bit more conservative than George was. I feel like Mike Ilitch is a little bit more would have what I would have gone forward a little bit more. I don't know, you guys, tell me, I mean, is this an ownership philosophy change?

00:30:45
Speaker 4: Is this?

00:30:45
Speaker 1: What is this? I mean, why can't they sit at the table right now if whoever with the front office of the Tigers is there and say, hey, you know what, we're gonna forget this arbitration hearing? Can they can they extend him now?

00:30:59
Speaker 4: Cut off?

00:30:59
Speaker 3: But it's too Hey, they've heard of it on the here. But how many how many times has has Scott Boris accepted an extension before a guy hits free agency?

00:31:12
Speaker 6: Never?

00:31:14
Speaker 3: I mean, I don't know, but I don't want to say never. I know there was, but it would have to be massive. I mean, you're talking about a record setting picture contract to the you know, to the extent of four hundred thousand dollars four hundred million like that.

00:31:33
Speaker 5: I guarantee you this, And I don't know if it's true or not, but I can guarantee you one thing. Trek scooblel is well liked around the league. He got a lot of texts today and yesterday, in this morning and probably during this trial from players saying go get every dollar you can because they understand how important this is. I guarantee the players that have his number that know about this all texts Trek school day and said, hey man, we really want you to win this because this is big not only for you and your family, but for everyone that's coming behind you.

00:31:59
Speaker 4: Like Scott A.

00:32:00
Speaker 5: Kasaki said, you know, you try to make it better for the players behind you. School is a landmark case. It can make it better for a lot of people. AJ said it yesterday. It's historical.

00:32:09
Speaker 3: It's historical to the point where the reason I said, major League Baseball doesn't you know this is a major League Baseball thing.

00:32:17
Speaker 6: I get it.

00:32:17
Speaker 3: The Tigers have a little bit of culpability in this, but at the GM meetings they go over their arbitration cases and then Major League Baseball comes back to them and says, eh, maybe this is how far you should go.

00:32:31
Speaker 6: I'm not saying it's right.

00:32:33
Speaker 3: I'm saying that's how they go over it, and that's how they come up with these numbers, and that's why these numbers are stay pretty linear, pretty along the same lines for everybody. It's a way to keep keep salaries down, and no way Major League Baseball is just gonna say, Tigers, whatever you guys want to do with this historical, groundbreaking financial salary increase, will trust you. I just I have a hard time believing it, and I think and I think Boris knows that too. Boris Boris is like he's always been so good at getting the contract for the schoobl for the later Paul schemes for the next you know, Bubba Chandler could be the next Terrek School. We don't know who the next Ark school is going to be. But Boris has always done a good job of pushing that, pushing that stake forward for player salaries.

00:33:28
Speaker 1: A J did you ever go to arbitration for anything?

00:33:31
Speaker 5: I went, I went, I went me, I went through it, I sat through it, I won, I won a lot, I went through it the whole thing.

00:33:39
Speaker 2: I'm proud of you and you've never cramped in your life and you're the greatest ever. But let me ask you this when you're in when you're in an arbitration hearing, right, and we talked about this on the show on Monday, that you can manipulate numbers to service any narrative.

00:33:52
Speaker 1: That you want to put out there.

00:33:53
Speaker 2: So you're in an arbitration hearing with your team, the team that you know you're playing for is at the table.

00:33:59
Speaker 1: With their team.

00:34:00
Speaker 2: What are the numbers that are being looked at and how are those numbers being manipulated to service either side like this, this supposed you know, neutral arbiter.

00:34:11
Speaker 1: What are they looking at? Take take me through arbitration.

00:34:14
Speaker 5: Well, there's three arbiters, so it's not just one, there's three, and you present your number, they and the MLB presents their number. Now, normally you're allowed to look one year ahead, so like if it depends on what year you are in arbitration, so if you're a three, you can look at fours and you can look back and forward one year. Usually usually always look forward because guys salaries keep going up. But in Derek Schoubel's case, this is where it's special. He can actually look at free agent deals and go off free agent deals because he's one year away from free agency. So that's where his number gets really interesting with what he filed at because he's going into a sixth year. But he can also use Max Schurz or Justin Erlin or all these guys who have gotten these huge contracts as pictures. He can use that as a one year deal and say, look this guy got two years ago, three years ago, got forty million or whatever ver Lander and Sureza got from the Mets a few years ago, and say well they have Yes, they might have one more song, but they also have more time in the league and YadA YadA. Yeah, so we think he's not worth that much, but he's definitely worth more than the nineteen million that David Price made back in twenty fifteen. So that's where it gets. And the arbiters don't most of them, they don't know anything about baseball. They're just That's why I was.

00:35:26
Speaker 1: Just going to ask you, that's exactly what my next point.

00:35:28
Speaker 2: So these these neutral arbiters, there's three of them, as you mentioned, they don't know the game. They don't know Trek's impact of Like would they know who Trek Skouble is if he wasn't in that bordero? Would they know who like a Juan Soto was, or a Show Hey, or a Paul skeins Is Hey. They were going based off just the numbers. How do you how do you make that decision?

00:35:48
Speaker 4: Then it's it's not only numbers.

00:35:49
Speaker 5: I remember my case, I got to speak, which they not a lot of players speak, but they asked me and I was like, yeah, I want to talk. And then they asked me to explain what a catcher does compared to a normal position player. On a daily basis, and I walked them through and Ek knows what what we do. Deocratsy knows what we do, and that's you know, we have so much more responsibility than just being a hitter or just being a catcher. You have to kind of do both, and you have to worry about pictures and you have to do this, You have to study more film, you have to look at all this, and so they let me explain what my daily life was like. And I remember looking at the arbitrags and one of a couple were like, Wow, we didn't realize that you had to do all that compared to a normal hitter, right, So they really don't. It's supposed to be neutral, and I get it. It's just one of those things that the process stinks, but it's good for the players. So the owners want to hold it down, the players want to pump it up. Obviously, it's a bad situation that you have to go in front of three people that really don't know what they're doing and argue pros and cons and listen to your team. For scoobl who's been with the Tigers his entire life, and they're going to say things about him and he's going to be like, that's insanity. But and then he has to go back in a week and show up to Lakeland and be like, hey, guys, Scott Harris Greenberg, everything's fine, guys. Don't worry what you said about me in that room when you're sitting across from me.

00:37:03
Speaker 4: It's fine. I'm good. I'm happy to be here. Yeah, it's tough.

00:37:08
Speaker 2: I would I would think that sometimes feelings get hurt or relationships change because of this.

00:37:15
Speaker 5: Ask Corvin Burns. Yeah, ask Corbyn Burns, corn Burns. They lost you, guys, it's come out.

00:37:21
Speaker 3: They didn't make the playoffs because of Corvin Burns had like two bad starts in August.

00:37:26
Speaker 4: Like he's like.

00:37:28
Speaker 2: Me for real, AJ, this one should be better for you because I know you don't like bets right now in the eighties. But the regular season wins for the Nationals. Woof's looking bleak for the Nats for twenty twenty six over under on sixty five and a half regular season wins, AJ.

00:37:53
Speaker 1: What do you say?

00:37:56
Speaker 5: Easy? This one's easy under. You can't see me and I'm going thumbs down like gladiator thumbs. Don't they just traded away? I mean, listen, they trade away Mackenzie Gord was their best picture. They weren't good last year. The division got better. The Braves should be better, the Marlin should be better. The Phillies are gonna be good again. The Mets should be better. I don't see him not losing one hundred games. I'm sorry, I just don't know how they don't lose a hundred games.

00:38:25
Speaker 3: I mean, I'm locking this one in. I'm sorry. You can't give me. You can't give me sixty five, sixty five and a half. I was joking yesterday, I mean not joking, but this is a confident one. So I'm locking it in for everybody here, sixty five and a half. I'm taking the under for sure, at me if you think otherwise, because where's it gonna happen. James Wood is gonna carry this team.

00:38:49
Speaker 6: C J.

00:38:50
Speaker 3: Abrams gonna take the next step. I like some of their position player corps, but they just got rid of their best picture, their closer for the last few years, Kyle Finnegan.

00:39:00
Speaker 6: He's not back.

00:39:01
Speaker 3: He was there for two thirds of the season. This is an under and I'm locking it in.

00:39:09
Speaker 2: Okay, that's fair. Now, AJ thinks they could lose one hundred games.

00:39:12
Speaker 1: Are you going that low?

00:39:16
Speaker 6: Yes?

00:39:17
Speaker 1: Okay, all right out and again and two others.

00:39:21
Speaker 5: They have a lot a lot of overs in the Nationals because they're theirs. Pitching is not very good, so I'm sorry they traded Ferrer the lefty too for we love Harry Ford, but he was.

00:39:33
Speaker 4: Like one of their great bullpen pieces too, let's not forget.

00:39:36
Speaker 3: And they have and they have an entirely new coaching staff, like I've coached at the big league level, right, And I'm not even gonna like it's it's there's too many things that just have to hit this like perfect thin line for them to win sixty six games.

00:39:58
Speaker 1: Mhm.

00:40:00
Speaker 2: See career nine to five to one in our chat, says he's taken the under. He also wouldn't be surprised if Abrams goes in the next two weeks. All right, The biggest game of the year calls for a boost pack.

00:40:11
Speaker 1: That's just as big bet.

00:40:12
Speaker 2: MGM is rolling out the Big Game boost Pack, and it gives you three different ways to boost the odds on your next big game bet.

00:40:19
Speaker 1: Here's how it works.

00:40:20
Speaker 2: First, log in and your Big Game Boost Pack will be waiting for you. Next add any Big Game bet to your bet slip and activate the boost token you want to use. And finally, if that bet hits with the token activated, you get extra winnings on top of your payout. So if you want to add a little more excitement to your big Game action, make sure you grab the Big Game Boost pack from bet MGM. Make it legendary. Gambling problem or concern call one eight hundred Gambler. Time now to Slaphands. Journalism is a tough gig, guys, and we just wanted to take a moment to note the closing of the Washington Post Sports department. Terrific national beat writers like Andrew Golden, Spencer, nosbamb Chelsea Janes, and longtime reporter Arries. I can never say his name right, and I know I should be able to Solvlerga among the people who are affected. Someone tell me how to say that, because I always say it wrong and he doesn't deserve that. We're thinking about you, We're thinking about the Washington Post. We're thinking about I mean, it's hundreds of people, guys, thousands of layoff, not just in the sports department but in the international department at the Washington Post. It's funny or not funny ironic. NBA had a big trade today and there's nobody in the Washington Post that's covering it because the actually traded the Washington and that's a bummer.

00:41:47
Speaker 1: That's a bummer.

00:41:47
Speaker 2: So we just want to let you know that we're thinking of our colleagues. All right, let's talk a little bit about the play Makers Classic.

00:41:59
Speaker 1: We are going to to be there.

00:42:00
Speaker 2: In fact, it's the fourth Playmakers Classic, presented by Fanatics. It's a fundraising and recognition event in support of the Major League Baseball Players Trust, the nonprofit arm of.

00:42:11
Speaker 1: The Players Association.

00:42:13
Speaker 2: Support generated at this event supports communities and causes inspired by Major League players across the US, Latin America, and the broader Caribbean. Some of the activities at the Classic DJ sets a silent auction featuring some amazing sport experience package.

00:42:27
Speaker 1: Maybe AJ puts up his toilet.

00:42:29
Speaker 2: I don't know, super Bowl tickets for Super Bowl sixty one, Lionel Messi autographed jersey, NASCAR Cup Series, VIP experience, and more.

00:42:37
Speaker 1: Don't miss it.

00:42:38
Speaker 2: This is an event that has anticipated to sell out quickly. Visit players Trust dot org. That is Players Trust dot Org. We're gonna be there. It's going to be fun looking forward to that. I'm assuming you guys have participated in this event before.

00:42:52
Speaker 6: Yeah, one in Vegas. Oh okay, that was Vegas. That's right. It was good, it was great. I won't be there.

00:43:02
Speaker 4: And Mark. We got Mark to buy us a meal.

00:43:06
Speaker 1: Hey, I love that. That's that's our boss.

00:43:08
Speaker 6: By the way, all right, guys, and you showed up. He buys.

00:43:12
Speaker 3: He buys plenty of meals, but you normally don't show up.

00:43:15
Speaker 6: You're so sleepy.

00:43:16
Speaker 3: I've got to meet with somebody that's a private jet, so I won't be able to make up.

00:43:20
Speaker 6: I won't not me I see.

00:43:23
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I don't know anybody that has a private jet. I'm not gonna lie.

00:43:27
Speaker 6: Eric.

00:43:27
Speaker 1: Let's get to krats hats.

00:43:30
Speaker 3: Sure, And I gotta give I gotta give a shout out to the fact that I'm one. I'm wearing a Dodgers hat. I gotta give a shout out to Scott Akasaki's son, Timothy, who listens to us almost every day in the show.

00:43:44
Speaker 6: So appreciate you, Timothy.

00:43:45
Speaker 1: All right, Timothy, Yes, since Scott Akasaki.

00:43:48
Speaker 2: And also, and I'm not just saying this, guys, because he's a Dodger. But the Miguel Rojas interview today and some of the answers that he presented was one of the better interviews I've actually ever heard a player that is that honest and candid and the passion shows through.

00:44:04
Speaker 1: So Miguel Rojas, Migio, thank you so much.

00:44:06
Speaker 2: All Right, guys, great to be with you as always, appreciate you very much. Scott bron is back tomorrow, so enjoy the rest of your Wednesday.

00:44:15
Speaker 1: Our territory resume tomorrow and we'll see you then.