Erin Brockovich with Alfred Molina

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Speaker 1: On the Bechdel Cast, the questions asked if movies have women in um, are all their discussions just boyfriends and husbands, or do they have individualism the patriarchy zef in best start changing it with the Bechdel Cast. Hello, and welcome to the Bechtel Cast. My name is Jamie Loftus, my name is Caitlin Drunte, and this is a podcast where we discussed the role of women in movies you know and possibly love. That's right, and we use the Bechtel Test as a jumping off point to initiate a larger conversation about the representation and portrayal of women in cinema. And if you're the Moss, if you're not familiar, the Bechdel Test is a media test that was created by cartoonist Alison Bechtel, and it requires that the story has two female identifying characters who have names. They must speak to each other, and their conversation cannot be about a man. You think it would be easy, and yeah, almost every movie can't do it. A lot of movies fail the test, or some of our faiths, there's or like a barely pass where it's like you should kill yourself Hey, that's mean, and then it passes upsetting that was that she's all that pass So whoop see for that movie. Today is a very special day. It's a very special day in backtel cast history. I don't know if our guest is aware what a big deal this is for us. I don't know. We we'll have to find out. I I mean, there's a lot of lore, there's a lot of back story. It's it's all been coming down to this at this very moment. Yes, So, in the interest of not burying the lead any further, let us introduce our guests. Yes, he really needs no introduction on this all the time. He is, of course, Actor Alfred Molina, Hello, Hello, getting slightly worried. Okay, so we were afraid this might happen. I don't know how adequately briefed you were on our podcast. Everyone's getting very Also, right before we came in, you were like, Oh, that's crazy, We're going into a soundproof room nervously, and then we're like, oh, we're about to really spring something on him, and then the soundproof will seem even worse. We're just huge fans. Do we mention you on every episode? Yes? Literally every episode? What why on earth would you want to do that? It's on our feminist podcast. We mentioned you in over a hundred episodes in a podcast about how women should talk about men. Don't flatted, but slightly slightly worried for you. We are also worried for ourselves, and yet we're huge fans. We regularly at the end of every show say, felt for Molina. Wasn't an this movie? What's the part that we think he should have taken from someone else? Uh? So we have a lot of that conversation with myself. We should swap notes. We'll let you know where you belonged in movies you weren't in all right, called my agent let her know as well. We'll do. We're just so psyched to head. Well, thank you, I'm delighted you. Thank you. That's very sweet with you. Yeah, so now you've picked the movie that we're talking about today. Yes, Aaron Brockovich, Um, is there any specific reason you picked this one? And what's your sort of relationship in history with this movie? Well, apart from just being a bit of a fan of Julia Roberts, but also on a personal level, Albert Finney and I are chums, and I sort of always, you know, whenever, you know, whenever Albert is in a movie, I was kind of go and watch it, because, you know, he's one of I think, one of the actors that certainly my generation of actors. He's a little bit he's like about ten years or so ahead of me, maybe a bit more. But when I was growing up and studying, he was one of those actors that you sort of kind of revere. I certainly revered him. I looked up to him a little bit, and he was he was the sort of actor that I kind of wanted to be when I was very young, and he's always been, you know, the kind of character actor that you know, the whole generation of us sort of aspired to. But also it was such a really really interesting story. I mean, the the and and I mean films that have a female lead character are traditionally and the general kind of the general sort of intelligence seems to be that those movies are harder to market, they're harder to sell, they're harder to find, it's harder to find an audience for them. Totally crazy. So you need star power, you need you know, or you need a story that's kind of really compelling and all the and it's true of that movie, there's a kind of I think it's because it's not overtly political. It's not a movie, it's not a movie with a cause in a sense, it's it's it's it doesn't it's not kind of proselytizing about anything in particular. It's really I find it very very much character based, and what Julia Roberts did with the role was so audacious and wonderfully free of of really caring about what anyone thinks. I mean, it starts off. I mean the first time you see her in the movie, she's kind of in a mood. She's like, you know, she's breaking out of something. She she's she's got an opinion, she has a point of view. And that I always think is the best thing about any kind of story on film is that you're not you know, she's not trying to please everybody. The writing isn't trying to say, you know, this is the kind of woman all women should aspire to. You know, this is just a very specific woman who is going through a very specific thing. And that that always I always found that attractive and very entertaining, and you know, but it's a story that has such heart and passion and and her journey. You know, she starts off unemployed, almost homeless, with children, a ne'er do weel partner who's not kind of you know, pulling his weight, and and and so straight away the movie starts with her absolutely with the odds against her in every possible way. And still there's this sort of you know, the guts of it and the the rage, I think is what fuels her as well, not just being honorable or being decent or being noble. There's nothing in a way, there's nothing really noble about Aaron Brockovich. She's she knows exactly what she needs to do. She knows exactly what has to has to happen in order for her to create some kind of decent life for herself. She's very single minded. She's not carrying, you know, the message of a movement or the aspirations of other people. And that makes a to me kind of one of the great sort of heroines of modern cinema. That was beautiful. She's a yeah, I'll give it to monologue. That's my audition monologue. They're just explaining why you like Karen Braca. It breaks the ice. Then it's the great equalizer. I like, this is one of those movies that it's very hard to find someone who has seen this movie and doesn't at least appreciate it, if not is like a fan of it. Definitely. I've seen this movie, as with many in bits and pieces on TNT over a course of years, and I'd seen it all the way through once in high school. Um, but I hadn't revisited it in a long time and rewatching it for this, I mean, any movie released in the year two thousand. We just released What Women Want episode. You're just like, this could go a lot of ways. Uh, just like a span of years where things were going on over the place. But I mean I thought held up, I mean pretty spectacularly well. And probably part of the reason is because it's rooted in a true story, so it's harder to let a lot of the insidious tropes that we talked about all the time into a true story, although some of them sneak in there anyways. But I really I thought it was great. I enjoyed watching it. Yeah, Julie Roberts kills it, Albert Finney kills it. All the good performances. Aaron I Card has a braid. You're just like I forgot about that. I had flo like, Okay, I saw this movie. I don't think I saw it in theaters, but it was one of those ones where I saw it within a year of it coming out on you know, DVD or whatever, and I think that was the only time I had seen it before rewatching it to prep for the show, and I was reminded that I really enjoy it. I love a good you know, like investigatory. That's not a word I like to get to keep it. Um. Yeah, I just I really I enjoyed the movie. I think it is entertaining and performances are great, and I like the story that unfolds. Cute baby in the movie, A cute baby. Well, you can never lose with a cute It's a cute cute baby and cute dogs. Yes, it's a It's an absolute kind of winner. I was one over very easily. The baby, I don't know is it was an active baby. Julia Roberts is having fun with the baby. Great chemistry with the baby. Where's that baby? Now, there's a couple of things. I think there's a scene, isn't that where she's holding the baby and she kind of shouts at someone, and clearly the baby is absolutely kind of like shocked by it, starts to cry, and then she's carrying on the scene and kind of taking care of the bay, taking care of the crying baby, and you kind of go. And my first thought when I first saw that, my first thought was, is that her baby? Because it felt so her connection to the way she was just handling the child while while she was doing something. And you know, you see mothers, you know, you see mom's doing that all the time. But it was so seamless. Somehow she she ceased to feel like an actor coping in a scene, but you know, and she was still committed to the scene, taking care of the chose. I thought it was absolutely brilliant. I always talk about like on screen chemistry, but it's usually like romantic relation. I mean, the chemistry between Julia Roberts and baby. It was two babies. It was twins, which usually is what happens classic baby when there's a baby that has to be in a movie. But I had to do that on a movie once. I had a baby a little month months old and we had twins, but sadly one of them had a sort of. It was a temporary thing. Apparently happens a lot when babies are born. One of them had a kind of lump on miss shapen heads, slightly misshapen head which was going it was going down. It was something to do with the once and now getting squeezed when during the delivery or something. And so it's not it's not a problem. But because it was quite prominent, quite pronounced, when they swapped the babies over, they realize, oh, we've got an issue here because one baby's shaped it. So what they do is they put both babies in these terrible hats. And I kept and I kept saying to the I said, at one point in the drag, said, you know, I don't know about you, mate, but you know, when I brought my baby home, I never I would take the hat off. We can't take the hat off because of when we swapped the babies over, the other one's got great big lump on its head, you know. But yeah, but that twin thing is interesting because you know they can they're not necessarily the same, very different temperaments. You know, I love a lumpy head based continuity era. I think that would be a first How would be to be the person who goes into the continuity, be like one of the babies seemed lumpy and some se but smooth in others. That's just cruel. So yeah, so I saw the movie and I liked it, and that is my history with it. Um. This is one of my mom's favorite because I was too young to see this movie when it came out. But my mom and one of her many VHS hills she'd die on, Aaron Brockovich was one of them. And my my mom's VHS hills to die on, as you know, our hit or miss. I would say she loves Aaron Brockovich just as much as she loves what weapon want. But you know she's we're all, we're all works in progress out But yes, so she she loves this movie as well. Shall I do the recap of the story. Let's recap all right, and feel free to comment to any time. Yes, we grant your profission. Yes, okay. So Aaron Brockovich is a single mother, UM, and she is unemployed. She is financially broke. We see her get into a car accident that is clearly not her fault within the first few minutes of the film, and she does not get a settlement from this accident, and she's calling her lawyer and masbrid that, of course is Albert Finney's character, right, And then part of the reason that she doesn't get the settlement, in the way the movie makes clear, is because the jury is biased against her because she's a single mom, because she doesn't have a job right now, And so they frame it like, while, you've got into an accent twice and right, he's like everything about her to explain why she did it on purpose and why it wasn't an accident even though it was. Right. So a little bit later, she goes into her attorney's office and demands a job, and he hadn't know what to do. He's just like, okay, he's reluctant, but Steve rolls him. It's fun to watch. You can't resist that Crimson tide. This is irresistible. Um. Meanwhile, she's her neighbor George. He's a biker dude played by Aaron Eckhart. Aaron Eckhart with a rat tail. It's wild. You don't see it coming, and then all of a sudden it's there and you're like, all right, I'm in this. Aaron Eckart with a rat tail. I've already seen him as I Frankenstein. I'm down for this too. I love I Frankenstein in You're the Only Person in the World too. That's true A million times. Loved it. So she's at work and she is doing a lot of filing at this law office, and she's going over a real estate file and there's a case that has a bunch of medical records in it, um, which doesn't make sense to be in a real estate case. So she starts to investigate it. She goes to the town of Hinckley, California, to a woman's home Donna Jensen, she's the person who like filed the case, and she's like don yes, yes, and um. She says that the Pacific Gas and Electric Company are trying to buy her home, but she and her husband don't want to sell it, and they are also both sick and p Jennie covered their medical bills, and Aaron's like, wait a minute, that's perhaps these two things are related. Yeah, and then Donna is like, well, it's because of the chromium and we're like what what what what does chromium? It sounds like it sounds bad. Yeah, it sounds like it's like it's like movie science. Movie science is not really science. You just got to find a word that sounds either bad or dangerous or mysterious. You know. It's like when we did Spider Man too, Trium, what is that? You know? I mean it could it could, you know, you could you could take a word off the you know, the the ingredients in washing powder, and you can make it sound like some mysterious science. It doesn't sound good. You don't know. But in the movie. I think the reason why we but we buy chromium in the movie is because of that. There's that little thing that the director decided to do that when when she mentions the word for the first time, there's a little bit of air around it. Yeah, and it's like she goes it was the chromeum and then it's like there's just like then it cuts away to Aaron kind of going She's thinking, what the hell is that giving us to? You know, the audiences think it doesn't sound good, you know, it's kind of clever. It's good good stories hunting. It could be. It could also be in a superhero movie. I mean I could say so I could say something to you like, yeah, my my kids are really sick. It's some it's the flooride. And then someone goes floride yeah, and suddenly everyone's kind of panicking about floride. They're like, they told us it was healthy, but yeah, we're all sick. They said it was in our toothpaste on it's in your toothpaste or all decaying from the inside up. There's no hope, and it seems like the chromium can very easily becomes sort of like this. I don't know. I liked how the chromium was handed. At least it made sense in story because I feel like often when a mysterious substance is introduced into a movie and all of a sudden is just like, well, we've got to get rid of this substance. What do we do? Or is either we have to get it or we have to destroy it, right, But the chromium is just sort of consistent. It's more like we just have to avoid it. They're still bathing in the chromium for most of the movie. There's kids in pools full of chromium. So she, so Aaron Brockovich, starts to research what this is, and she finds out that chromium six is the bad kind. It's toxic, what's It's a chromium hex hexas tape something I don't know. It sounded dangerous. It sounds like, what is the red die that sucks you up? What does that redde number? I don't remember which there's a red dye that is not good And any time I hear about a red die, it's bad. Love potion number nine that's pretty bad too, And that's the worst. Red Die forty, what's what's where's that from? It just does it's bad for you. They put it in a lot of color food artificial. You were talking about like a movie where they where they said, this is my life. Isn't a movie that I'm currently writing where red Die forty is the main antagonist. It kills everyone. It's in like gummy worms and kool aid and stuff. Yeah, our children are anyways. Now I'm gonna just put on a good tin foil hat and go full chromium six everyone. So she learns how toxic it is and how it probably caused all of the medical problems that Donna Jensen and her husband have, and she also finds out that the utility plants that p G and E are operating put this chromium six in their water because it prevents rust and corrosion of their engines and then that seeps into the groundwater. Um, so she starts to poke around. She goes to the local water board for records that might tell her something, and she discovers that there was like this order for a clean up that happened, and that all of this area around Hinckley, California was contaminated with chromium six. Right, and then we find out this was one of the story points that I'm like, I wonder how based in the actual story of aer Brockovich this was because this threw me a little bit where apparently this whole time that she's been she's been investigating the story for about a week, but she didn't tell her boss or something like Albert Finney didn't understand why she wasn't at work. Well, he seems to never check his messages. That's true. She would off researching and she was away. Because she comes back, he said, he says to in the scene, you've you've been away. You know we fight. You got fired because you've been away a week and she am I remembering right that she told someone in the office that she was going, but the message wasn't relayed to him, so he just assumed that she wasn't turning. But that's another thing about the movie that I thought was really interesting is that in the beginnings, in the early scenes when she's working, because she dresses in a kind of slightly more provocative way, in a more kind of you know, she's not all buttoned up like all the other women in the office, there's not a lot of support for her, particularly from the women in the office. She she's liking. She she's at loggerheads with them almost immediately, and which I thought was which I always thought was like a really interesting dimension in the story that you know, she doesn't get a lot of support in terms of, you know, what she's fighting for or what she's dealing with in her own life. Yeah, that's that's like one of the elements of this character that that was sing and at times a little bit confusing, where women seemed to in the world of this movie relate to each other based on class versus anything else. And a lot of movies take a lot of different stances on like how are the people interacting, but there seems to be a lot of especially once they start to get into the weeds of this case, like when I wrote down in my nose is like Aaron Brockovich is the poor people whisperer, because no one else knows how to talk to normal people in this movie except for her, and so like when she encounters not wealthy people, like middle class people who work office jobs versus service jobs, they just don't know what to do with her at all. And then she goes full Aaron Brockovich and it's like fuck you, you know, fuck you. My kits are out, and you're like, all right, cool, that's fine too. But she she's able to communicate. I was, I was worried when it's so early all the women in the office don't like her. I was like, oh, hope, it's not that kind of movie where just the women are constantly at odds and there's not a lot of explanation as to why, and there's no nuance. But then when you see her interact with all the women who are chromium affected, she is very empathetic towards them and gets along with them and generally gets along with the women in her neighborhood and she's a good mom. But it's it seems like the friction between I mean, not just women like characters in general are mostly class based. Yeah, and we can talk more about that, um a little bit later, but yeah, that's definitely something that like went off in my had a little backtel alert if you will. Um. So, she she gets fired, and meanwhile she she kisses her neighbor George, and they're starting to you know, winds her over and the babysitting pretty sick. He turns into he turns into almost like the perfect partner for a while there. I mean, you know, he does all the babysitting, he does all the cooking, he's kind of look at he's dacare. He's like daycare's daycare guy. And but then, but then the thing that really disappointed me is the way I don't know why the writers felt this was necessary. Why. I mean, I can understand that a relationship not working out, but why that's the first thing he throws back in her face, especially because he offered when they have that's the first thing, well, you know, oh yeah, well I've been I've been doing this. I can't remember the exact words, but he's basically kind of saying, well, I've been doing all this and you haven't appreciated it. And every time that bit comes up. I'm always disappointed in in that because it could have been so much more interesting just to see the fact that this relationship just doesn't work for all kinds of reasons, right, But but he has to throw that in her face, which I always I always feel it's kind of unfair. Yeah, like he's punished because he did. I mean, like you're thinking, and he does offer. He offered it, like insists, He's like, I like your kids, and then he has this weird I don't know was his job again, because he's like, I work when I need to construction. Okay, So he's like, I don't need to work right now, and I like your kids and they like me, so I can do this. So it's never like she doesn't. She goes to other babysitters kind of at the end of her rope, but never him. He's always fine to do it. But then, yeah, he just throws it in her face, holds her career against her. And that's another thing we can definitely George George so fabulous now even with the rat tile. God damn it, turn it. Did I burst a bubble there? I'm sorry? Okay, So she she's she's kissed and George, and then the lawyer at Masuri comes back and he's like, Hey, any chance you might have been onto something with this PG nithing And she's like, well, funny that you should ask, because yes, I was onto something. Negotiate. She negotiates and she's like, give me a raise while hanging out with the baby. Baby. Yeah, the baby gives her a stray with which to so nonchalant in that series, and she does that more than once, doesn't she She uses that negotiating employ more than once. And I think it's I think it's a great piece of storytelling because what it does it it keeps us as the audience, connected to the fact that she's she's a working woman, she's a single mother, you know, she's she's not all kind of it's not all about, you know, the nobility of the cause. There's a very practical there's a very real reason why she's doing this, you know. And I that's what I love about it. I love I love that she's she never stops being, you know, a woman who's like really working hard for herself and for her family. I love that that was something that I thought was interesting and it made the character a little more nuance, because it would be very easy to write this character of like she's a crusader for what is right, and she's and she does do what's right, which also happens to be advantageous to her in the know to the two point five million dollars. But I thought it was interesting. She is really onto something with this chromium six thing, but then when she gets fired, she drops it and she's like, if it were sort of a more like truth crusade or kind of role, I feel like she would have been like, well, I don't care, I'm gonna but she's like, no, I have three kids to raise. If you're not gonna pay me, I'm not going to do it. And then once he compensates her fairly, she resumes. So I don't know, I thought that was cool. Yeah. I was like, yeah, you shouldn't do things when you're not paid. I forgot that. Yeah, we as artists are often told to the contrary. So so she negotiates for her to get her job back, and meanwhile Pgnie is like, all right, fine, we'll pay two dollars for the Jensen home and yeah, no thanks. So then Aaron is approached by another couple who used to live by the Gensens and their chickens were born all deform, some snarly chicken imagery, some brutal, some brutal chicken and uh. And the woman has had several miscarriages and they're wondering if the chromium might have affected them as well. Chromium you rascal, damnit chromium, God damnit chromium. So then Aaron and Mazori start to build a case. First they have like a handful of clients. Then they've got like a dozen, and then it's hundreds. Basically like what started out as a small real estate dispute ends up in this huge lawsuit against PG and over six people by the end. Yeah. And so meanwhile, her job is making her so busy that she's not dedicating enough time to her children and her neighbor slash boyfriend George. I think eventually when they once they flash forward nine months, I'm like, I guess they're official. It seems like they're But that's one of the things I want to talk about is their romantic relationship. But we'll get there in a moment um. So she's kind of, you know, she's missing out on some core moments and like she misses her baby daughter's first word. Her maybe's first word savagely is ball, but says ball, and I thought was ball? I can't remember. I think I was watching it with a a subtitle? Was the subtitle? Says ball? Dan? I thought I was like, you watched it with subtitles. I watched everything I watched you do. Yeah, I can, I ask my ask why. I just find that I understand what's being said. What do you find? Do you find though, that you're spending all your time reading rather than watching the image? I've gotten pretty good switching back and forth between the two, between my eating and I'm curious because my partner does the same thing. And I thought at first it was because we were watching a couple of movies where there was like a very strong there was very strong Scottish accents, and I thought me, maybe she's just having trouble with the accent, but actually she does it with everything I do and everything. Yeah, it's and I'm always when we're watching something together, I'm in if you like this distracting, But I don't find it distracting. If I'm watching a foreign film in a language I don't understand. If I'm watching a Japanese movie or you know, a Polish film that the subtitles don't bother me then, but when it's in English or language I speak, I find it distracting. It's weird. I think the first movie I did it for was The Full Monty and then because those actually and then I was like, wait a minute, I understand what people are saying so much better when the subtitles run. So I just started doing it for every movie I watched. I think I pay closer attention if the subtitles are on, Like, if I'm watching something that I know I need to really pay attention to what's being said, I'll do it. But if I'm just watching something for fun, sure, but I'm so easily. Does they have something to do with the fact that you're a writer? I think so, yeah, because I seeing the words, wanting to write the Christmas most polished dialogue. But I'm like, what are they what are they saying? These people doing? Yeah, I just want to see chromium spelled out as many times as possible. Um, we need to take a quick break, but then we'll come right back and talk more so, UM to finish up the story. Aaron, you know her career is taking off. Her personal relationships are not going so well. George is fed up with her and he's like, either leave your job or I'm leaving, and she refuses to leave her job, so he's got addles. And then ed Maysuri brings in a partner um without checking with her, and Manny has to get her a car. Right, this case has just become so big that they need more help and more finances to cover the expenses and things like that. And then Aaron gets off on the wrong foot with the new lawyer. His name is Kurt Potter Um, his colleague Teresa. There's a whole thing the air um. There's class issues radiating from every interaction they have UM. And then they also need proof that shows that PGNI headquarters in San Francisco knew about the polluted water in Hinckley. So they're like looking for that piece of evidence. Here's the that part. Okay, are we getting up to the part where the guy has that the bar has the documents pretty close so a little bit before that part is very well. Aaron's going around. She has to get all the clients to agree to a binding arbitration, which basically means that the case will only be tried in front of a judge, there's a jury, but if they win, they'll get the money a lot quicker. So everyone thinks that that's the best idea, except for most of the clients because they're just like, what did I don't even know, Like I thought we were going to trial with a jury and everything. So she has to go and convince everyone that this is the best course of action because otherwise I'll get sicker faster, right exactly, A trial could last like decades basically. But then this this guy who it's creepy as hell. This is okay, this is nuts to me because I had to watch this seed twice just to make sure I was getting it, because we've seen this guy, I think twice by the time he shows up in the bar, and both times he's like staring at her in a way I definitely interpreted as like leering it. Yeah, yeah, Like it was like, this is a creepy guy with the hat. I don't know who plays this part. He plays it very well, because I was like, this guy is freaky. And then he shows up in the bar and it literally for for me, he was like he's going all the way up to him like he's about to put something in her drink, He's going to do something creepy. And then he all of a sudden becomes this like god in the machine of like, no, I'm not a pervert. I have the documents that are going to make you a millionaire. You're like what? It was just such a weird choice. My first instinct was that he was he was like a plumpt from from the company that he was going to. He was like, you know, but but it's the way he behaves that that this what's so weird. But I wondered if I kept thinking, maybe that's the actor's choice, you know, and maybe on the day, you know, sort of he kind of he was convincing, but it seems it does seem like it's an odd beat in a film that doesn't have any other element like that. But the whole film is rooted in a kind of realism and a sort of you know, a logic that that kind of you know, you can follow, and then suddenly there's this weird thing. Yeah, I mean, you thinks is he creepy? Is he? Is he a perv? Is he? And then also when he when he finally reveals the fact that he's got this information, even that's done in a kind of way. I thought, any minute now he's going to say, so what do I get out of it? I thought it's going to be one of those scenes, you know, sort of but luckily it wasn't. But it was. It's it's an odd beat. You're strange because because every other situation where a man gives or really anyone gives arian brack of which you know, guff about anything, she hands it right back to them and it's resolved pretty quickly most of the time. But this guy, she she's like, yeah, sure, can I get you a beer? And then I don't know, he went from like creepy as hell to my cousin is dead and I have the documents you need in less than a minute. You're just like sure. That was like the one beat of this movie that I could not make heads or tails is And I skipped over this part in the recap. But she receives an ominous phone call at some point whenever someone is basically making threats towards her, like don't snoop around the water records, or because you've got three young children, we wouldn't want anything to happen to them, now, would we Um, And it does not deter her in any way. Um, But I thought maybe the movie was making us the audience think that, oh, this is that guy who called her and threatened her, but turned out it's not. It's not, they're not the same guy. It's it's weird that character. It just threw me entirely. I mean, and he once she gets the documents, you know, the movie resolves sort of in the way that is consistent with the rest of the movie. It just weird, weird beat. Yeah, because that that's pretty much towards the end. They've they've gotten all the signatures they need so that they can go to the arbitration. They get the proof, they win, the clients are awarded a total of three three million dollars to be split among them. That before or after, I would guess that's before so little old ed Masriy made out like abandoned and Aaron gets a bonus of like two or two and a half million dollars or something like that, And that is essentially the end of the movie. So I wish I'd seen it. Sounds goods in turns, So where do we want to start with? Our discussion. I don't know, there's a lot of stuff to to pick apart here, would you. Well, the first thing I kind of wanted to bring up is, so this is I don't know if you could call it a biopic really, but it's a it's a movie based on a true story about a real woman everyone who is still championing environmental issues to this day, so environmental icon Aaron Brockovich. But and I think we've talked about this a little bit on one of our Matreon Bonus episodes, that there are countless biopics or movies based on true stories that are about men, and so much fewer ones that are about women. You can kind of count on two hands the famous ones that are kind of in everyone's wheelhouse that are about women, and then there's You're inne of the Best, But there's Yeah, I mean, statistically it's way way, way, way low. Yeah, And so I think it's impressively especially for the time it came out. I mean, I have to imagine and when I was reading up on the history of this movie, even with Julia Roberts star power, this movie was still sort of viewed as a risk um and I guess during While it was being tested, there was some audience feedback that was like, we love Aaron Brockovich, she's the best, And there were other people They're like, why is she swearing so much? I wish she wasn't saying these bad words that girls don't say those words, man and so. But but I mean it seems like I'll at least a lot of it stayed. And so I mean that alone seems like a pretty big accomplishment, especially for two thousand, because who knows what's going on in two thout the great don't know. I was fourteen and what Women Want was coming out and disappointing us all the head of the century. But um, yeah, I am going to be inclined to just appreciate any sort of like true story based on a woman because there are so few of them even today still. I mean, we've got our you know, Ruth Bader Ginsburg pick coming out, but there's just so few. Can you ever forgives me? And there is love that one, And but there's always going to be the argument, well, you know, women haven't contributed as much to society, so that's why we don't make movies about them. And it's like, do people still say that, Yeah, men's rights activists and you know, men's rights activists. Is that such a thing men's rights? Yeah, there are people who hate women and crap is totally agree. Yeah that thing. Seriously, I'm not being I'm not being disingenious. Is that men's rights there's like an organization movement. Yeah, it's still I mean, it's like most prevalent on the cowardly as corners of the Internet, but it leaks into the real world as well. M R is I mean we we sometimes get spammed like online by m R is just absolutely dumping on. I mean the thing with m R is they have a lot of free time. So if I say something like most men are stupid, they would not be happy with you. Okay, most man of stupid. You're not wrong. No, but here's something I'm I'm interested in, see your your perspective on it. Very often with films where you have a female protagonist who is pushing the story, you know, it's it's often as in Aaron Brockoviet woman with with a cause, with a with a reason to pursue this something an injustice of some kind, or it could be like in the Sally Field film, you know, when when she becomes a trade unionist norma, and those are very the stakes in the story are always very very clear. But I've noticed very often that the woman in question has to be peculiar in some way or different, or has to stand out in some way from other women in order to make it valid. So with with normal Ray, she's aggressive, she's she's kind of feisty, she doesn't she upsets people and doesn't care. And the same thing with Aaron Brockovich, to a certain extent, she dresses in a more revealing way. She's she's she's kind of much more kind of you know. And I think that scene the sort of that that the zenith of that in Aaron Brockovich is that scene when they meet the partners from the from the fancy white shoe Layers. And I think it's Vianne Cox who plays the the the young female attorney who's all done up in this the business suit. She's all kind of very sort of stiff and and and they had that in that scene when you know, when she just like lets her have it. I mean, but they there always has to be something that's very rare that they're just they're just women, you know, right, yeah, you know they have that there has to be something extraordinary about them. It can get a little cartoony at times. I was taking some notes to this, and I don't even know exactly how to articulate it, because I don't think it's necessarily a bad thing that there is an outspoken female protagonist that is like really getting into the workplace aggressively. She's unapologetic, and she's really going for it and balls to the wall. Pent of the time. I think it's weird that there isn't more diversity and storytelling of like how a realistic workplace would work. I don't know how much of Aaron Rockovich is directly how the real Aaron Brockovich acted and behaved. I have to imagine it's a little heightened because so often to even remain employed, women have to work, you know, normally work subtly and play the game to an extent and get work done behind the scenes. But you don't really see that in movies very often. I mean, the first thing that jumps to my mind of something that even begins to reflect that would be hidden figures of like women who are doing doing the real work but are not appreciated, which seems like more of a reflection of real life. But I guess, I mean, even with Aaron she doesn't get I mean, you have to imagine that like Masar made way more money than than she did. It seems like they were pretty much doing the same job. She was probably actually doing more work than she was in a bog a frog. My new podcasts coming out on what happens. But also she's also throughout the movie, whenever she's trying to get something, either information or you know, trying to get something to to enhance her case, she's dealing with different kinds of men, and she has to find a way to ingratiate herself with all those men in a way that they will respond to. So when she goes when she goes to meet the clerk, who's a bit kind of you know, a bit slow and a bit kind of you know, deer in the headlights, and she kind of like you know, just leans over and gives him, you know, gives him a perfect view of her cleavage all that going on. And it's whereas when the role is a male role, that's never a concern, right, You're just you're just a guy coming in saying I need this, I need that. You know, there's never a question that you'll get what you need. Society respects men more than they do women. That's I mean. The way Aaron's sexuality is handled is interesting to me. I mean, we were talking about this a little bit earlier today, where this movie like sort of straddles second and third wave feminism. For me, we're a second wave is focused on women in the workplace, and then third wave is more about racing sexuality and being opened about it. So this is like somewhere in the middle of that, and which makes sense for the time it takes place in, but there are moments with I don't know, there were ways to interpret Aaron using her sexuality to get something accomplished that I understand could be viewed as almost like a regressive fem fatale kind of thing, like lean forward and get the information. I don't know. It's tricky in the context that I would understand if someone had that criticism as a negative. For me, the reason it works is because you see, she's capable in so many other ways where she's with any given person, she seems very smart at reading a person and then doing whatever she has to to get what she needs from them in a few and like one one or two cases, that's the lean forward. And it does get like a little cheesy where I think at one point she tells Albert Fineling it's called booms and you're like, okay, fine, But but there's other times where she's, you know, frog in the bog. There's other times where she's like busting her ass going door to door, and you see her be capable in all these different ways that it does seem like, I don't know, like what you're saying earlier, like she's going to get the job done and get paid. One of my favorites is when she's talking to I forget exactly what who exactly it is, but it's someone who represents the Gas Electric company and she's saying something like, oh, well, how much is your spine worth to you? And whatever number you're thinking multiplied by a hundred and then come back to it like she's she's using like I mean, it's kind of aggressive and wild, but it's also like she's she's really kicking ass with like getting her point across. That's such a brilliant moment that when I remember when I saw the movie that got a huge chair. That's definitely like a big applause break moment and theater um what you were touching on earlier, Alfred, when you were saying about how, you know, movies with a female protagonist, you know, she's got to be something outstanding or just like something kind of extraordinary or unusual about her. And I feel like that's kind of exemplary of the attitude, at least of this time that this movie came out, and still to probably a pretty big extent today, people in society at large, because of the patriarchy, think that women aren't capable, and you know, every women are just kind of there and we're not doing much. But you know, we've got an exception to the rule with someone like Aaron Brockovich. So it's almost I feel like that might be part of the reason that those characters are portrayed that way, where it's like, you know, yeah, women are generally pretty average or you know whatever, but every s while one comes along, and I feel like that might be an example of that attitude as at that point. Yeah, And I think it's it's a it's an interesting contrast to see what's happened in the last twenty five years since that movie was released. How in the realm of cultural politics, sexual politics, feminism, whichever wave we're on now, I think we're maybe like the fourth, fourth, or fifth wave. You know. It's it's a you know, things have changed so quickly and so exponentially that I think if a movie like Erin Brockovitch was now being pitched, I think that it would be a very different film. And I think there'd be I think some of the dynamics that make the film so extraordinary to us now might not even exist, like, for instance, the relationship between her and her boss, you know, in the in the twenty five years since the film was made, actually laws have actually changed, but you know, to protect women in the workplace and so on. So I think there's a in a way, it's a it's a period piece in a way, but but it's a period piece that kind of shines a light on you know, what was to come, you know, and that I think that's what made that also for me, makes it a kind of really quite a quite a valuable film in that regard. Yeah, yeah, and and fully a product of its time as well. I think this movie would also be much less yellowy orange if it were, but hard to say a dusty look. I think something that would definitely be different if he were made now was and we were sort of touching on this earlier, was how she interacts with the women in her workplace, because that was like one of the only moments where I was like, she's being pretty mean, Like she she like fashions one of her coworkers. She's I mean, and I but doesn't she do that as a kind of retaliation for something else? Yeah, yeah, the way the women that doesn't justify it, but you know, but it isn't I mean, and Aaron's character is so she retaliates immediately to protect herself, and that's like whatever part of who she is, but it's it's I think hopefully if it was made now, we would at least understand where those women, or even if they don't like each other, we would understand those women are coming from more because it's sort of flattened in the movie where we get to know Masury so well and and grow to love him, and that's great, and I mean, you there's a professional respect between the two of them, but you don't other than kind of a pretty reductive like she dresses provocatively and we think that's gross, like that is sort of the only reason we're given, and that she's not good at her job at first, which kind of makes sense. It's like there's that scene where she goes up to her co worker I think her name is Anna, and Aaron's like, how do I do my job again? And AND's like Cia, and so see, I don't I read that differently where Aaron is asking a legitimate question where she's like, hey, you know, she probably I feel like she probably knows how to do her job well at this point, but she wouldn't understand why there would be medical files in with this real estate case. So she's like, hey, can I get clarification on this? And I feel like this movie does something that a lot of movies do, where if there are women working together or interacting in some way, they've got to be pitted against each other because of society or whatever reasons we've decided that. But like, so yeah, she's like, well, I'm not if she would just like if Anna had just listened to Aaron and be like, oh wait, that is weird that file would be in with the real estate case. But instead she's just like very dismissive of her she's incompetent. So yeah, I feel like between that and between the various cases where there's another person in the office. Her name is Brenda, That's who Aaron fat shames on a few different occasions, it just, yeah, I couldn't help but notice that she has what it feels like, largely antagonistic relationships with all the women in her office. And then later with the character's name is Teresa, she's like the you know, upscale attorney lady who gets brought onto the case later on that that's it was like a combo of class and gender issues because there are two lawyers in the room and she goes after the woman in the room she's supposed to be working with, which kind of is one of the more problematic elements of Aaron's character. She doesn't work well with women. She just doesn't seem to. That scene was really interesting to be because in one way, like we know Aaron at this point, we understand where she's coming from. She's very like defensive about people assume she's incompetent all the time, and she's like, no, I know this case inside out. But you also see where Teresa is coming from where you know, and and and and Masary kind of breaks this down. I wish that it was more of a conversation between the female characters and that they were able to talk to each other. But Masary is the character who explains, like, well, she went to like she you know, grinded through law school and and has been taking ship and lesser jobs and she deserves for years. So this is why she's frustrated. And you you can sort of see it from from both perspectives, but it's not really resolved ever between the characters. And I thought that would have been an interesting if they Yeah, because for if it was men involved, there'd be a scene where the two the two men who have butted heads end up in a bar and over a couple of drinks or a couple of beers, they kind of work things out and you know what, I really respect and they end up becoming allies in some way. But yeah, it doesn't happen, and you know, it's a but that's why I mean, now, if we were making the movie now that seem might happen. I hope. So, I hope so because that was an interesting dynamic that kind of was left because the only other time you see Teresa is they sort of start to imply that she's incompetent, which also doesn't quite match up there, like, well, she can't walk around a farm, so she think the idea is she doesn't connect well with people. She's not a people person, poor people whisper. That's like yeah, And but also doesn't Teresa get a little bit sort of patronized by her boss Peter Coyote's character. There's a little dynamic in there which happens in front of Aaron, and and and I think it creates a little moment of she's like embarrassed, you know, which kind of creates a sort of tension. There's there's lots of beautiful, little interactive moments like that. For sure. Yeah, we've got to take another quick break, but then we will come her back, kind of going back to just sort of her general behavior and background and different things like that. Um, we touched on this a little bit already, but um, Aaron does dress in ways that could be considered provocative or perhaps you know, inappropriate for a law office. There's leather, sleeveless leather. When you see her, we see her cleavelange a lot. And I don't want to sound like I'm shaming her for dressing this way by any means, because I'm certainly not. Um, they're good fits, but yeah, she's rocking the look, but it's often used as an excuse by various other characters to not take her seriously to the extent where well, first of all, the ad major character says something like, UM, you know, now that you work here, you might want to reconsider what you're wearing. It makes the other women uncomfortable, and I feel like that might have been true. But I also think that he's he's projecting and he makes him uncomfortable, and he keeps stop making me horny at work. I'm confused. Then she she's got that wonderful rejoinder about his ties. Yeah, I love. And then later on the reason he admits that the reason that he fires her is because she left and didn't check in enough according to the people who work at the law office. Uh. And then he's like, well, you know, I thought you were just off having fun. You look like someone who just has fun. But then, as Aaron Brockovich often does, she comes right back with some the retort of like Oh, well, if we're making assumptions based on how you look, then you must never get laid so swish. I like that she's always challenging these comments about her appearance and the way she dresses. Yeah, I really love that. And then if we're if we're getting into the way that that translates to her relationship with Aaron and cartwo a braid is. I believe that the character's name and referred to in the movie. This was one of those movies. It was tricky if like, did this movie need a romantic subplot? I think technically it didn't, but it did in some ways help flesh out Aaron's character more. I don't I don't know what did you what did? What did everyone make of that relationship? Well, if I might, I think if it wasn't the relationship with George, then it would have been it would have to have been a relationship with someone or something else in order to balance her life at work, her life you know, on the case, as it were, because otherwise then she really would have been just very one dimensional. And I think the choice that she has this kind of biker kind of you know, semi employed guy living next door that she gets involved with was I'm assuming must have felt like a as a suitable contrast to what she was dealing with professionally, you know. And it and it also it gives her a kind of there's a I don't know, I know it sounds weird, but there's a kind of there's a slight whiff of adventure about that relationship because it's all about being able to just take off. You know. The houses are restored trailers, he's got a bike and a truck. You know, there's a there's a sense, there's a sense that he embodies the possibility of just taking off, and that's very deeply ingrained in the kind of American psyche. So that kind of gives her a sort of unit, a specialness in comparison to the people who she works with, all the women at work with himself, who all seems so kind of anchored to their lives. And you know, because I mean, I think more than once it says justifies the fact that he's married, because I'm married, I got a fan, I got you know, he like as if somehow almost with an air of like resentment, almost you know, I can't have fun like you do. I'm married, and I think that's so. I think it was a convenient way of balancing her as a character in the world. Yeah, I agree with that. My main takeaway from it was that, and I think I might have touched on this briefly in the recap. But as we see her excelling in her professional life, her like romantic and personal life are deteriorating at the same exact time. So it's almost common theme for female protection, right. And it's great that she stands up for herself because she's bit He's basically like, leave this job or I'm gonna leave you, and she stands around and she says, nope, I'm not leaving this job. So it's great that she's standing up for herself. And it is I would say, fairly realistic that a man isn't okay when a when a woman is working hard and maybe resenting the fact that she has a job and is putting a lot of effort into it. But it just it does suck that we have to see her personal life fall apart just as her professional life is taking off. Yeah. That that breakup scene with them, I thought was really My two favorite scenes between them were when they met and when they broke up kind of take or leave the rest, because there was an element of his character somewhere in the middle room, like he's a little bit too perfect, Like he's like, I'll do whatever, I love you, go to work whatever. Like there's not a lot of friction until they're very much is. But in their breakup scene, I thought that that, as frustrating as it is, it felt probably realistic of that time to happen, and it did seem like the movie commented on it enough where Aaron is pushing back and you know, he has the benefit unlike her of like if he's not happy taking care of children all the time, he can leave, which is what's already happened to her twice and sort of what she's conditioned to expect from men who express interest in being with her, as they can eventually leave because they feel like they're able to and it's societally okay to do so. And the fact that he does that was interesting and like, you, I don't know, I didn't see it coming, but when it happened, it made sense where he's just not you know, he's kind of presented as like this gentle but like macho biker guy who starts to feel like he's being too domestic and he doesn't feel appreciated for the work he does at home, which is not usually a complaint coming from the male partner, And it's interesting to hear that, but you never hear a female partner say I don't feel appreciated at home. I'm doing all this work and I feel like you're, you know, taking a dump on me all the time. That is like, uh, could be anyone. But his benefit is like, so I'm leaving because I can. And when when she says like like, he's like, what can I do to prove to you that I'm not like those other men? And she's like, don't leave you stay. That was great and he leaves anyway because men are cowards. That was great and I really enjoyed. I wanted to talk about the scene where they meet, too, because that's that's first of all, he was so pushy, like he I mean talking about not taking no for an answer. Yeah, I mean, she she kept kinding on busy, I've got kids, something this, I've got that, and he just keeps walking up towards uh. You know. I think that is one perfect example of how in the intervening years since that movie was made that that would not fly. Now, yeah, I mean it barely flies with Aaron, right, He's very very pushy and does sort of achieve the like wearing her down vibe. That is how those movie interactions tend to end. It is like, yeah, he was a little pushy, but it's just enthusiastic. It's not, you know, disrespectful, because he even says, well, why don't you give me your number? You though I've already got your address. You can't get away. It's a joke, but it's real there. I don't know, but at the moment I liked in that scene that I thought was like really telling about Aaron's character is she's still very direct and aggressive, but she basically lists all the reasons of why she thinks no one would want to be a partner with her when like she just lists off you know, she's got kids, she's been divorced twice, she's broke, she's unemployed. She lists off all the reasons that are you know, eating her up inside and then flings it into someone else's face of like, well I'm unlovable, so get off my stoop. Uh. And I thought that was like a great moment for that character, and then he goes from being creepy to being perfect to being a burnout and then he kind of comes back at the young stack, which I actually appreciated how the movie handles this, because the narrative hardly makes any sort of deal of him showing up again, Like I feel like in a lot of movies, especially when with a female lead, where romantic storylines are such a huge part of so many movies with a female protagonist, that there's often some sort of huge reconciliation scene where they're like, oh, yes, we've had our problems, but now this is it and we're making it work and we're back together. There's no such scene like that, and it just comes back. I don't even think they get back together. I think she just like called in a favor from him and he's like, yeah, i'll watch your kids for a few days. Like I don't even know if they it's ambiguous how it happens, but I would he's probably gonna try and chill now that she's a millionaire. I don't know, but um yeah, I liked how the movie doesn't make some sort of it's like, I know, I seemed unwilling to commit before you were a millionaire but not transparent at all. UM. A couple other just like quick scenes that you know, made my Bechtel alert go off, is um. This one of them is the scene where Aaron Brockovich is talking to the young girl who has cancer UM and she's gone through radiation and she's lost all of her hair, and Aaron spends like a minute saying like, oh you're you're so beautiful and you must drive all the boys wild and like. And I understand what her intention is. She's trying to comfort this girl who you know is sick. Um. But of course the thing that she uses to comfort her is you're still physically attractive. It's a comment on her appearance. It's a comment on how she would be valued by her male peers. And is an example of you know what has been historically done a lot where we place so much emphasis on girls appearance and how they how much they appeal to men. And I mean there's not that. There is an element of Aaron's character that sort of subscribes to that as well, because we learned that she was like a former beauty queen, and which I did think was an interesting characterization choice where you know, it's like, oh, she earlier in her life, she it seemed like she was on a conventional track to somewhere and it didn't work out, and now that she's found a different track, she's going to really apply herself to make it happen. But yeah, that that exchange that that you're talking about did seem well intentioned but dated. Yes, yes, I don't think that. I think it's far less common now, or at least a lot of especially a woman to a young girl, thinks twice before they say, well you're pretty a lead. Yeah, definitely. And then the other quick thing that set off my alert was whenever Ed Masury towards the end of the movie, he's brought in like the fancy lawyers, and Aaron feels like she's being kind of pushed out of participating in the whole case, and you know, she reacts appropriately and she says like, you're like, you're pushing me out. You didn't tell me anything about this, And then Ed responds by saying, you're emotional, you're erratic, you're seeing everything that comes your mind. You're making this personal and it isn't. And it's just like such a common reaction to a woman expressing anger that is completely justified, and of course it's It's often the first thing I get said is, oh, you're a woman who's reacting, You're being emotional, you're erratic, you're crazy, and that doesn't I mean, she challenges it, but you know, it's just it's you know, you can't help but notice these things. I don't know how much there is to say about it besides that, but I was just like, Oh, I'm a man, a woman, crazy and erratic and emotional. That's example number eight bazillion. So anyway, I just wanted to touch on that very quickly as well. Yeah, I agree. Yeah, was that? Is there anything any other topics that you wanted to touch on? No? I think I've enjoyed this. It's it's I want to go see it again. Now we're gonna watch it again. I mean, there's so I love the way that films, particularly films that somehow seemed to capture a particular moment in time of particular you know that they're infused with whatever the discussion appens to be at that given moment. I think Aaron Brockovich is a kind of it's a throwback to a movie that might have been made ten years earlier, but it's doubtful whether it would be treated in quite the same way now, you know. I did a movie recently called Saint Judy, which is a similar story about a single mother who is a lawyer and who you know, fights for a very specific cause and kind of makes a lot of sacrifices along the way. But there's no there's no romantic element. There's there's no George in the story. There's an ex husband, that's it, but there's no there's no kind of romantic thing going on, and and and that's an interesting it's interesting how things evolved that way, you know. But you know, which is why I think is why I said earlier. I mean, I think Aaron Brockovich is really is a period movie, you know, because it's it's kind of capturing something that you know, a moment's twenty five years and that's quite a long time in movies in movie terms. I mean, it takes place in the year which is the year that Jurassic Park comes out. You see the poster in the bedroom. I'm always on the lookout for Jurassic Park reference, and we get it in this movie. So that makes it a terrific masterpiece in my mind, does if you pass the BACKDL test. I believe it does. Yeah, it does quite a bit. Yeah. Aaron talks to various combinations of women who names we know and um, sometimes about men but not always, a lot of times about chromium, which is generally but also the scene where she's the very first scene with Margemark Helgenberger's character when they talk about the effects of this stuff, she mentions her husband, but only as an example of something that happened to someone, because the scene is not really about him. They're not really discussing him. The context is chum. So it does. Yeah. And she talks to Brenda in the law office, she talks to Anna, she talks to her dad, she talks to the other lawyer, Teresa. Yeah, there's there's a number of scenes that passed by our standards, and Cheryl Crowe is at the end every day as a whining road. I'd forgotten that. When that came up, I was like jumping up. Yeah, yeah, I forgotten that song Bob's It's so good it um so Yes, that's a definite. Yes, I'm passing the back total test. Let's write the movie. We have a zero to five nipple scale, so we rate it based on its portrayal and representation of women. Five nipples being the best. I love that so sacred scale. Yes, I would say I would say three. M okay, three nipples. You can also give the nipples to characters in the movie, or really anyone you want. Oh, I definitely give four nipples to Erin Okay, great? Yeah, what what say you? I'm gonna go I think I'm gonna go four. Yeah, I think I'm gonna go for it. There's little things that we have already discussed that are sort of I think largely product of its time issues, but largely, I mean, this movie is held up really really well. You rarely have a leading female character at all, much less a biopic, much less someone who is constantly calling out everyone on the ways that they're marginalizing her in very colorful language. I think the baby's cute. Albert Finney is great. Aaron at Cart, it must be said, does have a braid and a lettherst. So there's a lot going on. I'm I'm here for it. I think it's great. I'll give two nips to Aaron. I'll give one nip to Donna Jensen, and I'll toss one to Teresa. There was some unexplored Teresa stuff. Yeah, I'm gonna go three and a half nipples. Um, because oh yes you can, you can revise your answer. No, No, I'm not. I'm just thinking. I'm just thinking. Unfortunately you have to picture it. We bisect nipples quite often. Um, yeah, three and a half. No bulls because while it is a woman who's driving the narrative, and she is, you know, a strongheaded, brassy woman who does not apologize for her behavior or her her status in life and any she's got done. She's a single mom who you know, says funk around her kids often and doesn't give a funk about it. And um, she's even though she doesn't have a formal education, which is something that gets brought up as an excuse, another excuse not to take her seriously, you know, she doesn't. She's incredibly smart and hard working and she doesn't apologize for anything. And and it's it's also tricky to talk about a movie about a real person because it's it is hard to tell if certain events or aspects of their character are true depictions or if they're sort of embellishments. To heighten the tension or the conflict, or you know, make for like a tighter cinematic narrative. But but Aaron Brockovit as depicted by Julie Roberts in this movie, is a character that I really enjoy watching. And um, the real Aaron Brockovich love that she's still doing a bunch of environment don't work. Um yeah, there's a there's a lot to like about this movie. There's a few things that I think it could be handled, definitely, and like you said, it's a kind of a product of its time. But um yeah, I'm going to go three and a half nipples and they're all going to the dead frog. Good for the Froghian anything. I'm real dumb. I would like to take the nipple away from Teresa and give it to Cheryl Crowe. Sorry, for sure, I understandry. I just forgot that she was involved in the project. Well, Alfred Molina, thank you. This has been my pleasure, absolute pleasure. Did freak you out at the beginning, No, it's very flat to that, but I must admit I had no idea what you were talking about. But I'm very flat to thank merge with your face on it. It's a cartoon version of you, and it says feminist icon Alfred Mallina. Well, I'm very pleased to be a feminist iconog someone out in the wild with a feminist icon Alfred Mollina. It is our fault. We can we can order you a shirt. Yeah, Jamie designed it. Do the full, we'll do the we'll do the work. There's pillows. That's weird. You see, I can't wear what i'd love to wear. I'd love to. I wish I was someone else now because I wouldn't. I wouldn't be able to wear that. Can you imagine walking around like that? It's like it's like walking around with you. I start walking around with your agents phone number on the back of your jacket. It's sort of and trust me, I've tried that. It just doesn't doesn't go down. Well, but I'm very that's very flattering. Thank you very much, Thank you. This has been such an honor and treat for us. Well then invite me again. Oh well the second time, spoil it. Let's go back tomorrow. It doesn't matter where year. So do you guys, do you guys do this every week with a different movie. Yes, Yeah, that's cool. Yeah, and how long have you been doing How long have you been doing the podcast? Over two years? Yeah, quite sometime. We've covered a lot. We did do an episode on spider Man two, We did Cool by Knights, we did's Raiders of the Last Time. Yeah. Yeah, we've covered a few of your Yeah, I've stopped been talking a lot about that lately. That movie I think I'm getting I'm getting so old now, it's like it's sort of it's like nearly forty years old. So it's that kind of you know, people saying things like, so, what was it like making movies in those days? It wasn't exactly the silent here. But once again, we've been so honored and thrilled to have you here. Is there anything that you would like to plug? Angela Vine, which is the podcast that we've been Oliver and I have been working on. Oliver is the writer and I I'm just I just playing my part in it. Um and it's it's it's a great one for film buffs as well, because it's it's a it's a sort of noir story. It's kind of loosely, loosely based on the whole kind of you know, um, is it the Blue or the Black Black Dahlia story. And it's one of those great things. It's basically like a movie inside your head, you know, and every every listener will have their own their own movie going on. And it's so that's that's what we've been, you know, slipping our talk uses around town talking about and that once again is the Angel of Vine Angel. Check out that podcast. Thank you again so much for being absolutely my pleasure. Thank you so much for inviting me. We can do our plugs. But yeah, thank you so much, and we'll be here next week. Yeah, see you next week. Bye bye. All right, it's just me and Jamie. Now Alfred has left. We just wanted to sort of regroup and decompress from what just happened. Yeah, fred Freddie, he's our friend. I think we held it together very well. The dogs are then the second the second Alfred left, my dog picked up on my vibes and piste and ship on the floor. Um. But I think we all, you know, while Freddie was in our kingdom, we held we held it together very well. I think we did, especially you, Jamie, I mean, thank you you did an incredible job. Thank you. I was saying, your composure that was a matrix episode level of fronting in terms of oh I felt like dying. I'm so glad that you brought up the merch because I was terrified too. Oh. Yes, I also do think that our friend Freddie yes as we like to call him as our friend, has just a calming presence and it truly possible to be stressed around him. I just wanted to shout out Brett Boham from Forever Dog Podcast Network, um for helping us to set this up. I mean, I hope it was worth it for everyone. It certainly was for me. I want to I can't cry or I would sure I Um, I am very proud of all of us. I that was so much fun and really a monumental episode. I think we have to end this show just kidding we have Yeah, there's still Haley Jewels, so um, I'm sure there's a celebrity that I like that we would. Oh yeah, we've all got to This is why people start podcasts to me people they like, and then to gradually stop doing the podcast too real But anyway, so no, there's many more episodes of ours to come, um, but this unfortunately was our best one there. This is the peak, so after this we understand. But anyway, that was great. Alfred is such a class act. I'm like freaking out and and listen to the Angel of vine Yes indeed, um and speaking of plugging things, you can follow us on social media on the platforms at Bechtel Cast. Please rate and review us. On iTunes, please subscribe to our Patreon aka Matreon. It's five dollars for two bonus episodes a month, which is a great deal. This month we are doing Pagentiuary pageant movies, so we're doing Dumplin with a special guest to be announced, and we're also doing Drop Dead Gorgeous. A special guest is alphad Molina. Again, one of these we actually would like to announce we have a third chair. You heard it. He did offer to come back and I will, you know, just send that audio clip to him every once in a while. Well, um, do you think it's like news breaking that Alfred Billina learned when an m R A is. I'm just I'm glad we taught him something, so why Yeah, I feel like this was a very educational I think he got more out of this than we did, which is crazy because I'm not the same person I was when I enter. I'm also very much kidding, but my dog is picking up on my vibes and that he is piste and shipped and humped since he arrived. He's just I take full responsibility for the dog today because I'm sending out vibes that are just sending him into into horny terror. Anyway, we've got merch I mean, now more than ever, you have to buy our feminist icon Alfred Molina merchandise. He won't wear it, but you you have to just so in case you know, you ever, if you're in l A or you come to visit, you got to wear it in the off chance that you'll encounter him, and then he can be like, hey, I know that I was on that podcast, So make sure you get that merch at t public dot com slash the Bechtel Cast. God, what a day. What a day? We can't where do we go? Find exhausted? I don't know. I think I need to sleep for like twenty two hours. Uh No, I genuinely think I'm gonna listen to the Angel of Mine this uh this afternoon. You gotta yeah, so yes. Unfortunately, every episode after this will be disappointing because Alfred Million now will probably not be our guest the Tribe. But he did say he'd come back, so maybe he could. What is a movie he could do that I wanted to do? Something funked up? If we talk about a movie that no women are in, we would just be forced to have to talk about something else, like if we did like The Shockshank Redemption, or like what just tell us your life story? Yeah, just how do you get started? And you know, to tell us everything. It's a good trick. It's a good heck you. I mean, hopefully if you're a long time listener, you know what this meant to us. And if this is your first time listening, hopefully it wasn't too confusing, right, and we cherish you. Thanks for listening, thanks for your support. Well, we'll be here next week. Bye,