#24: Control vs. Trust: The Leap That Changes Everything

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dawn:  Port. Here we go. We're recording.

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Instead of building stronger teams, we unintentionally create dependency and distrust. We breed fear. Control doesn't build resilient teams, it drains them, and eventually it drains us  as leaders as well. I've seen this dynamic play out so many times. We don't drift toward control because we're bad leaders.

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dawn: That's right. And you know, Eric, what strikes me is that most leaders, they're not controlling  because they want to shut people down. They're not trying to shut their teams out, they just really care about their outcomes. Right? Their name is on the line, or their product is on the line. But even with the best intentions.

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To remember that as human beings, if we wanna accomplish anything great in life, we're going to have to partner with other people. Yeah. And that sounds great. So we join teams, we start companies, we build teams  because we, I think, instinctively, intuitively understand that we can do greater things in teams than we can by ourselves.

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eric: They hurt us. They burned us. We felt our toes stepped on. We felt cheated. We felt abandoned. We felt misunderstood. And because human partnership is such a delicate pursuit. Because we have so many past experiences of injury, I think what happens is we step into any team  dynamic, and this goes for our personal life and marriages or friendships or extended family relationships also into the workplace.

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Yeah. The other option is we don't work in teams and we just try to do everything by ourselves. But like I've already said, we know from  human history, from sociology that for us to accomplish creative things, we wanna go to the next level. We want to build a a, a bigger business. We want our family to be better and bigger.

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There should be greater output. Now there's four of us, instead of just my wife and I. That's right. But that's a mentality of a shift away from, Hey, I've just gotta go do my work. I've just gotta accomplish whatever I need to accomplish. Like this kind of individualized mindset. More toward a sense, a recognition that as a family unit, together we can accomplish greater things  than any one of us individually can.

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The reality is to be increasingly more successful is not to move toward isolation, but instead to learn the the journey of creating a  culture or an environment in which these partnerships that lead to collaboration can grow. But to do that, we have to create an environment where we. The fabric of that environment.

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And we start to lose out on what I  think we as human beings are hardwired for, which is how do we operate within social groups that allow us to accomplish something greater together than we could by ourself. That's right. So that, that's what I think is the Highline picture. I'd love to hear kind of what do you connect with and what do you think about that?

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Yeah. When that trust erodes, it, it comes down. Well, I, I can't, I can no longer rely on the potency that you, that we're gonna bring  together. So now I just have to control the situation by doing it. The way that I know how to do it. That's right. You know, and we double down on what feels comfortable to us, the way we've always done it, all those things.

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Because you don't have to see the Kraft mac and cheese made exactly how you has made it your whole life. Right? Yeah. The outcome is gonna be the same and we see that when we are able to risk. Partnership because it is a significant risk and it's a, it's a more significant risk because we have all been  burned and broken and bruised in the past.

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eric: That's right. That's right. So we think we're protecting  outcomes when really we're protecting ourselves from discomfort.

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Right. They're gonna bring their creative thoughts and, and processes too, that mix. And we, we miss out on what I call the collaborative or the harnessing of the collective genius, that together we are almost always guaranteed to produce something greater than we could by a.  Ourself, nothing great in the world that we look around at.

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We all know what it feels like to work for somebody who you feel like if I can't do it the way they want, they do it, then I, it's not worth doing it. Right, and I remember, I remember as a. In a former coaching business,  you know, I, I stepped into the role of doing all of the, the kind of key teaching at all of our training sessions.

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But I remember distinctly these, these tensions that I could see in them was, well, Eric, you, you do it good. You're good at it, you enjoy it, so why wouldn't you just keep doing it? Mm-hmm. And that's the thing for most of us as leaders, we're good at doing something. We know how it's done. We at least. Maybe  enjoy a little bit of doing it and therefore what, why wouldn't I just keep doing this?

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Spreads out into all areas, right? It might have started around one task or one project, but that erosion of trust starts to  affect all sorts of other areas. So our conversations get shorter. The risks that our team takes get smaller and everybody starts moving more cautiously because they don't wanna get it wrong.

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eric: Yeah. I love that. Now our listeners are gonna hear us refer to one of our. Toolkit tools called the Trust Code. And we're not gonna dive deep in this session into that tool. We've already done that in the season one. Mm-hmm.  And so I would strongly recommend to our listeners to go back and listen to that episode on the trust code, because in that episode we unpack what, what are the core ingredients of building reciprocal trust that drives partnership and collaboration and all that stuff that we're talking about.

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We didn't build teams because we thought  that would cut our efficiency in half, right? It's because we believe intuitively as human beings, it's in our DNA, that if we learn to partner with other people, actually that's going to expand our influence and impact. That's right. So what we want, our teams who lean in, bring their best ideas and move the mission forward without us having to force it.

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When trust is high, people take initiative. When trust is high, they communicate more openly. When trust is high, they collaborate with more creativity. But when trust is low, people shrink back. They do the minimum. They protect themselves instead of  pursuing the bigger picture. And that's why at Empower, like I mentioned earlier, we often emphasize this tool called the trust code because trust grows when people consistently feel seen, heard, and valued.

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Right. I need a  guard. Right. But that shift as leaders learning how to. Start instilling and building a culture where people feel seen, heard and valued is what is gonna make the difference. Because control might get us through the day, right? Holding the reigns really tightly. Might get the job done in the short run, but partnership.

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Then how do I create those types of partnerships, right? And we're not talking about a, a flat hierarchy in a company. We're not talking about everybody being on equal footing. We're talking about within any  structure. Whether it's, it's with people on our teams, whether it's peers in, in our workspace, whether it's the people that lead us, it is that reciprocal trust that actually drives the quality of partnerships, that allow all of us to bring more of who we are to the table to accomplish greater things.

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dawn: Yeah, man, I, um. Actually living this out in real time. And you and I have had a lot of conversations processing through this, but just like I'm sure any of our listeners that are, that are here with us right now, I have experienced a significant level of broken trust, of betrayal of relationships, whether those are personal or professional  that have left me wounded and, and specifically professionally.

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So I'm gonna start my own business where all I have to rely on is me, myself, and I. Mm-hmm. And you know what? I kicked ass. Mm-hmm. I did really good. I I, for all intents and purposes, succeeded until,  guess what? I got to the end of myself because there is a practical reality that I alone and am only able to accomplish so much.

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An idiotic risk to take again, but I'm willing to risk partnering professionally with somebody else because it feels like I'm going to be able to accomplish more than I can do by myself. Hmm. And that risk at this moment feels worth it.  Right. And, and I've told you, Eric, I'm like, it is a miracle that I'm even willing to take that risk again.

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Where you were the boss of this other company that you started. So you're not even the boss. So you, you don't, you, you don't get to call the shots. I mean, you know, you've got me to deal with and contend with. Right. And then we've got other team members. So it's like, oh my gosh.  Now I'm again in this community, this social group of people who.

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eric: That allows  that bridge to grow even stronger so that we can then endure the next wave of challenges, difficulties, pressures that we're all under. That's right. So let me, let me, let me, um, let me turn the table.

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eric: Who were friends, who we did live together. And there was this beautiful partnership and we each brought very different strengths to the table. And in those early years it was like, I think that's in many ways what made Empower Coaching so powerful and why it wa it grew so rapidly because clients were seen how we operated.

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And I remember feeling like, oh, that, that's not okay. We can disagree. We can fight over things. We can,  you know, we can wrestle through a lot. But when I started to hear language that communicated distrust toward me that I had their best interest in mind, that that I was willing to lay my life on the line for, for their wellbeing, that everything I was doing was for something bigger, not just for myself.

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To, for us to feel secure and continuing in this partnership. And I remember thinking, this is crazy. This is what I do for a living. I coach leaders and organizations and teams through this process because we, you and I both know Don,  that businesses do not succeed and fail on the basis of their product or their service or their financial outlooks.

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Yeah. And they, and, and I'm left holding nothing in my hands except myself. Right. So it's like, and I don't want that, but at the  same time. And, you know, and obviously I, I was in, I went through therapy and I, my amazing wife was an incredible partner through that process. And I'm just sitting there, spent a year thinking like, okay, all the ways I screwed up and failed and didn't lead well and beating the snot outta myself.

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Right, right. If I, if I isolate and do things on my own. And when you first came onto the team and when Ora first came onto the team, and I mean, I remember I may outwardly been like, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm so, I'm so glad for your team, your, your, your, your team help and your partnership. But I remember emotionally feeling like, mm-hmm  I can't do this again.

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That's right. And, and, and it wasn't easy and we've had to have a lot of hard conversations, but because I am so convinced that this is. The way we're designed to operate and flourish that I remember when another, I was talking to an individual who has  been talking about, you know, jumping into some form of partnership with our coaching business and he knows a little bit about, he heard a little bit about my story.

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eric: that I feel compelled to keep fighting for it, and I feel compelled to keep partnering with clients who say,  we believe in this.

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We brought up like that, that the bridge of trust, right? And, and how you found yourself on that bridge with your partners and it was starting to erode like that Indiana Jones sensation where the planks are disappearing in real time. And I wanna say this,  you, we have to take the steps to build the bridge that will support.

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Mm-hmm. That's me  entrusting the brand, the reputation, and all the while knowing that you could at any moment decide I don't wanna work with Empower Coaching anymore. And now the world thinks Empower Coaching is about Dawn as well, and it's actually bigger than both of us. But the point is like entrusting you here in entrusting you to work with some of our core clients, like entrusting you to start and build parts of our business that I don't have the time and energy to build.

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Not only has taken our business to another level over the last, you know, year or so, but it also has been far more enjoyable. To partner together than to do things on my own, and it also communicates to the world.  It's a constant signal to the world and to our clients to say, yeah, it's, it's hard to, to build this kinda stuff.

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dawn: That's right.  So give us some baby steps then. How As, how do we as leaders. Start to build those bridges of trust with our people that we are longing to partner with. What are some practical things that we can do, right?

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Let's go back, let's just utilize this bridge imagery. Mm-hmm. Right? You have two people standing on either side of a chasm. That chasm represents risk. The risk of partnership we could fall in, get hurt, and so we need this bridge. So the first order of business, I think for us in any partnership of our life, in any relationship, is to first ask the question,  what kind of risk are we taking?

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Because we have really kind of what I would call light partnerships. And then we have really heavy partnerships, which, you know, partnership of marriage, partnership and business, you know, and, and there's everything in between. So number one, I think is, is for our listeners is to. Just as a, as a, for a fun exercise to just consider what's one partnership in your life that  you think is important, and to ask the question, what is, what is the risk of that partnership?

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is the way that we communicate to other people the priority of human connection in all engagements.  Mm-hmm. The priority of human connection. What I mean by that is if we're not careful, we get into the game of what I call, we become users of one another. Yeah. Right. It's, it's, it's so contractual that it's like, I, I'm, I want what I want from you.

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Yeah. We are prioritizing a win-win mentality. We win together, we lose together. In other words, I am willing to tie my best interest into what's in your best interest. Yeah. Which moves us away from that user mentality. And in the workplace, because relationships are difficult. I think many of the organizations we operate in within or  work with them have defaulted to what they call the corporate culture, which then leads everybody just to feel like they're a cog in the machine.

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I'm gonna prioritize that human connection, that you're more than just somebody checking  me out for my groceries. You're more than just somebody handing me a Starbucks. You're more than just somebody you know who I might do a deal with. Mm-hmm. But I'm gonna prioritize the human element that I want to engage with you at that level.

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We win together, we lose together. Our best interest  is tied to each other, and that, that, that goes for marriage all the way down to checking out groceries at the, at the grocery store. Because whenever we're engaging with another human being, we're either going to communicate trustworthiness. I'm safe.

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Yes. Like when you think of your marriage or you think of your friendships, you think of your work relationships. When we are operating at that level of partnership, right? We're, we're, we're fighting for the mutual benefit. We're fighting for something greater than ourselves.  There is that scent, there is a reality that we might not be able to fully put language to that says.

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It's one and one. One doing that. Julian? One over here, one over there, one over here. One over there. Rather than when there is, you know, we start to create this culture of partnership  and collaboration. It's one plus one equals 10, one plus one plus one equals 50. The math doesn't make sense, but that's what you're saying.

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Again, go back to the first season and listen to that episode on the trust code. Dive deeper and learn how to build a culture of trust within those relationships that matter  most. Make sure you've subscribed, because next week we're talking about. Pace. Ooh. Pace. How to lead ourselves and our teams with sustainable rhythms so that we don't burn out chasing greater productivity.