Inside the Skaggs v. Angels wrongful death civil trial + Angels offseason to-do list, Trout to DH more?

00:00:03
Speaker 1: Hey, and we're back with Sam Blum joining us right now. We're going to first get into where he's been for the majority of his life. Over the last few months, Sam writes for The Athletic, of course, covering the Angels and many other topics, including this court case that involves the Angels in the wrong full death lawsuit that has been brought by the Tyler Skaggs family and parties. So Sam, let's first get an update on where we're at, as it appears that we are getting close to a verdict. Is that correct.

00:00:34
Speaker 2: Yeah, they started deliberating about twenty five hours ago. They had a night off. I should make that clear. But yeah, I mean, this is this is the very end. I mean, this is three months. This trial started September twenty second. I think the jury started actually hearing the case on October fourteenth, So it's been you know, over two months of listening to testimony, and so I don't know when they're going to have a verdict. It could be while we're sitting here talking. It could be you know, tomorrow, next week. But yeah, I mean it's it's it's just been a really intense heavy story, intense heavy case, and I don't know what's where it's gonna land, but I tend to think the longer this goes, you know, they have to there's a lot of questions on that. There's twenty six questions for the jury answer, and they have to go through a lot of different elements. Like if they do find that the Angels are somewhat responsible, they're gonna have to go through and find the portionment like the percentage of responsibility that Tyler had, that the Angels have that Eric Kay had. They have to determine, you know, is Eric k working in the course and scope of his job when he did all this. So you know, if they want to find for punitive damages, that changes everything. That could add a lot of money to whatever the payoff potentially could be. So uh and even if they do find for punitive damages, then they have to do a whole separate hearing to determine the actual value of the Los Angeles Angels. So there's still a lot to be done, but it's it's getting to the end and there's a lot of questions for that for that jury to work through.

00:01:51
Speaker 1: Right now, Sam, I know this is a loaded question. I've been following your articles in the athletic and we'll only get to one percent sliver of what you've read about, but can you point out some notables to get people caught up on what's happening there. I think the way to do it is to help fans relate to some names that they really know, Mike Trout, Matt Harvey, even Dan Duquette I know recently sitting up there and answering questions, and everyone had some uniqueness to it in terms of having to get really open about, you know, whether it's how Tyler was a teammate or getting into you know, painkiller medicine, stuff like that. And then for Dan most recently, he was actually from what I understand in your article, paid to speak and essentially talk down his value so that if the Skags family is entitled to money, wouldn't be as much money.

00:02:46
Speaker 2: Yeah, So that's I'll get into that first because I think it's interesting they had, you know, an ex major League baseball general manager as a paid expert witness. The Skag side had Jeff Fanell, who was a longtime union lawyer, come in and argue on their behalf earlier in the trial. This has been kind of the trial within the trial, because I think it is the most tangible thing that either side could argue, is what would Tyler Skaggs have earned. It's it's you know, it's it's a really dark arbitration case. Essentially, what would he have earned had he been had he finished his career at he had this not all happened, essentially, because that's you know, that's damages that the Skags side is trying to recoup, essentially. And so, you know, I was a little surprised by by Dan Neukt's testimony. I felt like a lot of the the stats he utilized were way out of context to my opinion. You know, they had all slide up there saying Tyler Skaggs was declining in his career, and if you look at his numbers from twenty eighteen and the first half of twenty nineteen before he died, I mean, he was having the two best seasons and healthiest seasons of his career. You know, they use numbers like curveball spin rate, stuff like that to show that they were declining, But in no way was Tyler Skaggs declining as an actual pitcher at that point in his career. You know, I think the Angels can make a case, well, if he had been found out, you know, that impacts his value and things like that, as you know, been found out as someone that was you know, involved in this in this drug kind of situation and using drugs and of helping to facilitate to other players, certainly that would have impacted his value.

00:04:06
Speaker 3: But in terms of actual pitching, he was.

00:04:08
Speaker 2: He was the best pitcher on a really bad pitching team and ultimately was kind of getting better as he went. So that that was an interesting thing to me, like why the Angels are trying to you know, really diminish his value as a pitcher and why a GM would go up there and you know make that case for them. But you know, it's what it is in terms of the actual like arguments, Mike Trout, I mean, you know, this this case ultimately comes down to the where the Angels negligent in their supervising of Eric k who's now in prison, who the person who provided the lethal fentanyl pill to Tyler Skaggs that killed him in twenty nineteen.

00:04:42
Speaker 3: And so that's that's the crux of this case.

00:04:44
Speaker 2: You know, Mike Trout came in as a witness for the Skag side and you know, I think ultimately more as a neutral third person essentially, but you know, he talked about knowing about Erica's drug addiction right, knowing that you know, he was dealing with this, and offering to actually one point pay for his rehabilitation if they needed it, if he needed it.

00:05:03
Speaker 3: So you know, that's why some of these witnesses have been coming in.

00:05:05
Speaker 2: I mean, I think you saw, like Trevor pluf tweet about this the other day, and you know, he's he was a witness on behalf of the Skag sid They didn't end up calling him, but that's there's been a lot of players that have come in. Mike Moriane, a former picture Matt Harvey testified, testified for you know, as part of the Angel's case about you know, being a source of drugs for Skags in the last month of his life and even you know, having pills with him that came from from Matt Harvey than the day that he died.

00:05:31
Speaker 3: So but they were not ultimately the lethal pills that the leath of pill that killed him.

00:05:36
Speaker 2: So you know, that's that's kind of been the crux of this case. There's so many things. It's so nuanced. There's so much context that goes with every single thing we talked about, so it's hard to get into all of it. But you know, I think that that's what ultimately the jury is deciding is were the Angels negligent and they're supervising of arricage? Did they follow their own policies? Did they you know, did they act reasonably in dealing with him? And and you know, was Tyler Skaggs, you know, from the Angel side of it, how complicit is Tyler Skagg's in his own death right, how you know, taking that pill? You know, what role does that have and kind of how the jury looks at this, you know, his own choice that he made to do that. So I think it's a really interesting, complicated set of questions that they face.

00:06:15
Speaker 3: And you know, there's no really easy answer to that.

00:06:18
Speaker 2: But you know, if they've for nine weeks of testimony so that they'll have enough information to work with, you.

00:06:23
Speaker 4: Have been there for thirty days, you have seen this. You've been day in and day out in the court. The big names we hear, obviously, Tyler Skaggs died, Mike Trout's on the stand, Harvey used drugs, Eric Kays in prison, the Angels are Is there any one group that's really kind of sliding by a person or maybe like a group of people, like say Major League Baseball who's accepting zero responsibility for this and kind of not really being the ones that are at the forefront because of all those big names and exactly what happened and Eric Kays in prison. Is there a group of people or a certain person that's like kind of sliding by and not getting not getting I don't even know what the right word is.

00:07:09
Speaker 2: But trouble, you know, I don't I don't look at this as MLB's fault here and and these and I say that is I mean, I know that the Skags, I would have probably included them, and they had other They had Tim Mead and Eric k listed as defendants initially in this lawsuit, and they and Tim Mead was, you know, a long time PR guy for the Angels, led the PR department and is kind of at the crux of, you know, someone that allegedly knew about the dynamic between Skags and and k. But I don't look at MLB as being complicit here because MLB's policies and that's really what One of the main arguments here is and they've come up a lot in this trial because at one point an Angels witness, their VP for HR, said that the Angels notified MLB about Erk's drug addiction and there's no evidence and I should they notified and said they worked with them, and there's no evidence of that it did. You know, MLB has come out and said that didn't happen. H So you know, they actually went out, they actually went on the record and you know, kind of refuted what was testified to by by that Angel's VP. So I don't look at MLB as super complicit in this. They have pretty set policies on what should have happened here. They have a drug Oversight committee that wasn't that that theory should have been involved in this. You know. I think the Angels, we are arguing that they that they followed at the very least, they followed the policy of you know, utilizing you know, a team doctor essentially to help treat Eric, and that would have been what MLB would have done. But I just I don't MLB wasn't a part of this, and I think if they had their way, they would have been you know, but you have to be notified.

00:08:42
Speaker 3: I mean they don't.

00:08:43
Speaker 2: They don't know what's going on on the ground every day in Anaheim. And I think that's that's the role of the team, and that's ultimately what is being argued here. You know, why why weren't their policies followed. Why wasn't MLB's policies followed. Why weren't people notified of this when when there were multiple episodes alleged about er K utilizing you know, drugs at work and things like that.

00:09:02
Speaker 1: How surprising was that part of the case. To me, that was incredibly surprising based on how the league is usually so lockstep with the teams and the owners. But almost sounds like an accusations made the league's like whoa, whoa, whoa hold up that is not true, and they push it back. It usually sounds like something that would be taken care of behind the scenes before it actually gets to court, and makes it look like the group overseeing another group and really in cahoots with a group is battling within this case.

00:09:33
Speaker 2: I think that that testimony surprised people, right. I think that's where this you know, MLB is. I think it, from my understanding, is kind of allowed the Angels to to do what they need to do here, right like it's it's there to I mean, it's there all ultimately already Moreno's business. He can decide if he wants to, you know, how he wants to approach you know, this case. Do you want to settle it? Do you want to where you want to go to trial?

00:09:54
Speaker 3: Like that?

00:09:55
Speaker 2: That's I think the League has kind of allowed them to be autonomous in that front at the very least. But you know, once that accusation comes up that they're were working together and that Erk was you know, tested under MLV policy and things like that, I think that's where MLB was kind of like, we we can't allow that to be at that narrative. I mean, I'm gonna don't want to speak for the league, so I probably shouldn't even say that. I just I think they put that statement out there because you're you're you know, there was a narrative and this is a legal case, and I don't think that UHMLBI wants to be part of that legal case. And you know, when you say that MLB was involved in his treatment and in any capacity, that that brings him into it.

00:10:29
Speaker 3: So I agree with you. It surprised me, and that was why I reached out.

00:10:32
Speaker 2: To the league, you know, right after that testimony happened, and asked them if they had any comments on it. And you know, like you said, you don't usually see that kind of dispute happening between teams, especially in an ongoing legal matter, So it surprised me certainly. And that statement ended up kind of being read in court. Another ex team president, Frank Kunley, former Pirates president, longtime MLB in you know, general Council, testified on behalf of the Angels and he ended up getting handed that statement by one of this GAG's lawyers and was read and because he was kind of implying some similar things about, you know, basically the league, basically the Angels working under league policy essentially to treat Eric K. I don't remember exactly what I want to speak out of line of what exactly said, but it was, you know, basically saying that the team's EAP, their employee assistance professional, was treating Eric K and that that would have been kind of adequate under the policy. So, you know, I think that MLB is a little frustrated, at least at that particular you know comment by Debora Johnson, the team, the Angel's VP. But I know we're going through a lot of different names here, so it's probably confusing some of the audience. But it's a complicated case, and I apologize if I'm going astray here.

00:11:39
Speaker 1: Yeah, But the point also is that if someone's checking this out for ten minutes, there's a world of information. You can know almost everything there is to know from a public standpoint if they read your work. So this is just a slivery. Like I said, you're doing great on it, and I want to spin it forward, kind of last topic on this. Then we'll get to the Angels. But we're going to get a verdict. So what could we be looking at right? Could we look at nothing and the Angels are you know, whatever, the terminology is innocent, They don't have to pay anything to the Skag's family. Could we see hundreds of millions of dollars go to the Skags family? Could we see that? Then get to the next level of whatever they call it. You know, I'm forgetting a lot of the legal terminology right now, or they challenge it and then it goes back to court again. So I know that's kind of a two parter. And then the last part here that you can all answer together, because I think it's all related, is if the Skag side does win something here, does it get looked at as something that could be you know, precedent going forward for this specifics thing. But when something happens within an organization and a player feels like he missed out on career earnings for it or his family that he left.

00:12:54
Speaker 2: Yeah, So to answer like the first question right like this this could be appealed, I imagine it would be assuming there's you know, any sort of judgment against the Angels and maybe even the Skags, I could appeal if there's a judgment, not judgment against them. But if they don't win, you know, I I don't know exactly what will happen and how we'll all play out. But yeah, I mean to answer your last question, like the precedent side of this, I mean there's now I don't as far as I'm aware, there's never been a professional sports team that's been found responsible for the death of a player, right, this is a wrongful death case. That's ultimately the question here, Like the responsibility, Now, there are different machinations of what that responsibility could look like they could say the Angels are ten percent responsible, and you know, then that dollar value is ten percent of it, and you could say Tyler Scaggs is ninety. I don't know what they'll come up with. I know that the skag side asked the jury essentially to find the Angels like eighty seventy to ninety percent responsible for this, and you know the rest either goes to er K or to Tyler Skaggs. So but that's how this works. I mean, they're gonna find a apportionment of responsibility. They're going to find a dollar value, and then that will basically be you know, or it could be zero. The Angels could just come out with, you know, winning this case outright for all we know. So I don't know what will happen. There's so many questions that will have to be answered, and it might go on for a little while. And I certainly expect an appeal regardless of kind of the results. I believe there were even some there might have been even a request for a mistrial that was not granted. So you know, there's there's still a lot to happen here, and I they re have to redo this trial. That would be another three months of my life. But we'll see not.

00:14:38
Speaker 1: Oh boy, oh boy, yep, may not in your control. And you're doing a great job covering it. What'd you say, No.

00:14:43
Speaker 3: I said, I don't think that'll happen, but we'll see.

00:14:46
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, I hope something like this just from the outside perspective gets resolved soon, because no matter how you slice it, it is ugly. It's it's awkward, it's uncomfortable. You're talking about someone who passed away tragedy and then bringing up the value of that person as a player and what he did off the field, like a lot of personal and private information on both sides. You know, it's not like the angels are having fun with this, but they're challenging it. So anyway, you're doing a great job. It's it's been cool to read everything just from an insider perspective, to see what's going on inside the courthouse, since, of course I appreciate both of us cannot be there, So thanks for that. And then I'm going to make life a little bit easier on you now because the second portion of our conversation is baseball moves off season to do list. Let's hit the Angels. They've done some things already. But Sam, what do you think's on the docket for them?

00:15:41
Speaker 3: Well, okay, I think I put together a little list.

00:15:43
Speaker 2: The top thing that I find interesting is how they're going to navigate Mike Trout and Hori Hilaire, because this, to me is, you know, it's not the most important question, but it's really interesting because both these guys. I mean, Trout, I know, is going into the season wanting to play at the outfield, but he also wanted the last season wanted to play outfield, and then by the end of April he didn't play another game defensively the whole season. And you're kind of also looking at a lot of injuries. You're looking at him being a year older. You know, you've already had issues keeping him on the field, so I think at the very least you're gonna expect a lot of dh I mean, that's just that's just.

00:16:11
Speaker 3: My read on this.

00:16:12
Speaker 2: And then you have Hori Solaire, who really you know, he got injured all that last year and he directly said it's because I'm playing the outfield a lot, like he doesn't really want to play the outfield. I don't think you know when he's out there, it's not He's just not a natural I mean maybe at earlier points in his career was a better defensive player, but just not a good defensive player at this point. So and it's hurting him physically. So I don't know how you handle that. I don't know if there's like a trade partner for Solaire or if there's, you know, some way to work through this. I mean in theory, you know, they traded Taylor Ward, so there's there's space in the outfield. I just don't know exactly how they're gonna feel that if they're going to want to go and add more players and you know what you do with Joe Adele, because then you're also working with the reality that Joe Adele, if you look at his numbers, was a really bad defensive center fielder, but a really good defensive right fielder. So is Trout going to go back to center? That was brought up and as a possibility at the winter meetings. So I just think that they kind of have to work through this problem. You know, is it a problem to have too good hitters? Know, but it is something you got to, you know, navigate when you're talking about players, then maybe just aren't capable of playing every day defensively.

00:17:15
Speaker 4: All right, well then let's go with let's go with your first Your first note there Solaire and Trout. Obviously you want to keep Mike Trout healthy, he's got more years left on his contract. Is Jorge Solaire's market completely diminished in the sense that it's really only a one year, fourteen million dollar deal. I'm not sure how much of it's backloaded, if there's more than that, but essentially that's what it comes out to, is his power if you're if a team is able to be found to have it at DH worth the fourteen million, because if not, why the heck did they trade for him last year? They put themselves in this situation knowing what's happened to Mike Trout the last few years.

00:17:59
Speaker 2: I think you had me on like the day after they traded for there, we had this exact conversation and I was like, yeah, I could see this definitely becoming a problem, and then that it definitely has been. And so I mean, listen, I think if you're trading Solaire, it's probably for another bad contract, right, because at this point, I don't think Solaia has looked at as like highly valuable.

00:18:18
Speaker 3: I mean, he had a bad year last year.

00:18:19
Speaker 2: He was hurt last year, so you know, I know Perry's talked about well, he tends to do well on contract years, but he's also I think, like thirty five now, so he's never been thirty five in those contract years before.

00:18:29
Speaker 3: So if you're in.

00:18:31
Speaker 2: A trade him, I think it would you know, you maybe could trade for a similar contract or something like that. I think that would be the the and they might they might decide to do that because I just I don't know how you're going to navigate this issue. I mean, it's it's just kind of like they're stuck on it. The best the best solution would be Mike Trap playing defense every day, but I mean I wouldn't rely on that at this point. I mean, you know, going into the season, that will be the plan, I'm sure, but it's not.

00:18:57
Speaker 3: You know, it's just not a reliable plan. Everything we know from the last five seasons.

00:19:01
Speaker 2: So yeah, I would I would think they should try to trade them if they can, maybe for a picture that's similar and or you know, a starting picture with a similar type of contract. If not necessarily reliable, but you hope that you can get something out of it.

00:19:14
Speaker 1: Hey, Sam, we're on a show every day, so we're wrong a lot, we're right sometimes. I'm glad you brought that up. Just dming with Kratz. I'm like, we smash that move last year, respectfully, Like this isn't against Torgues sol Layer and we know that the Angels needed power. I remember everything about it because I start to harp on certain things and it was like, Oh, Trout's going to take too many swings if he's at DH And I'm with you on this pushing forward part too. Really going to throw Mike Trout into the outfield regularly center field? Get out of here. You're gonna put Trout running around center field at the age and the injuries that he's gone through, some of which seem chronic at this point to me, I think Mike Trout still has value as a bat, and I think he can feel significant h time. I mean, he's certainly being paid to contribute as much as possible, so I would figure that out. That's why for me, the move baffled me so much last year. It's not against or Laier, it's not against the dh spot, but how they looked at it. For Mike Trout to get himself back on the field. I'm sure there's pushback from Mike, as you're a competitor and one of the best in the sport for a long period of time. You want to see that. But the organization is to push back, like, hey, dude, paying a ton of money, we want to take care of you and make sure that you get as many AB's as possible. That's your value at this point in your career.

00:20:30
Speaker 2: I mean, if you look at their lineup last year, I mean they had the second most strikeouts in the history of baseball last year. That team, I mean, this was a team that just was not putting the ball in play. So you're at this point, I mean, you know you got to be you know, having horses Hilaire in your lineup is they wanted puplic They needed like that type of power after last offseasons, So I think that was like kind of the idea behind it, but it didn't really.

00:20:52
Speaker 3: Pay off in any capacity.

00:20:53
Speaker 2: I mean, he hit some home runs, but it wasn't you know, he wasn't even available for much of the season.

00:20:57
Speaker 3: And you know.

00:20:58
Speaker 2: That even goes devtails into the other things, which which is, you know, what do you do at third base? I mean, you keep a Christian more out there, or you know, you got von Grissom, or you know, Oswald Peroza. But you're also dealing with a lot of players that continue to have strikeout these strikeout issues. So I don't you know, I don't know what they're going to do. They need to have a third basement. They just this has been this position since they signed Rendon. It's just been one after the other after the other after the other. It has been nothing but like disaster at that position. So I don't know if they're going to just try to run out one of the guys they already have, if they're going to try to make an acquisition of some kind. But I think the players that you're working with on your roster are huge strikeout prone players at this point. Now, you know, I don't know if that's a coaching thing. They've got a new coach, whole new coaching staff, new manager, everything like that, so maybe there's a different approach that's coming up. But I think my concern would be for this lineup is that it's still going to be really strikeout heavy.

00:21:45
Speaker 5: I want to hit on Rendon a little bit here for the off season topic number two. You talked about his replacement. Fine, okay, understandable. That's you know, if you're an Angels fan, that's frustrating here because ultimately you're looking for somebody to solidify that spot. Are they working on a buyout plan for Anthony? Or is are they talking about something about him?

00:22:05
Speaker 2: I think take a preliminary stage right now, if I had to kind of read between the lines of you know, I think that's what Perry would love, if I had to guess.

00:22:13
Speaker 3: I mean, you know, he's on the last year of his contract.

00:22:16
Speaker 2: So my question with Rindon is always, is it really even valuable to them to work on this buy out? I kind of waffle between that those two competing thoughts because I mean, the Angels really going to be competitive in twenty twenty six given what we saw last year, given the roster, I mean, is this really a team that you expect to like be a playoff team next year? And I mean I wouldn't personally, So doesn't make sense to just like pay this contract out, get it over, get it off your books, get it out of your life. Get it out of your headspace or do you want to because any sort of buyout would probably mean a deferral of some kind. So if then you're paying him more money next year of the year after, So that's that's really the question, you know, for me, And you know it's the we already know already hates these deferrals. We saw that with show A. Obviously this is not something he typically does. So I think that if the front office, I think everyone maybe below Ardy would love to see some sort of deferral plan. But I don't know exactly where it all stands, and I do think this will ultimately be an already conversation with Boris and with with Anthony, with everybody that's you know, directly involved in that process. I don't I just don't think through that.

00:23:17
Speaker 3: I don't.

00:23:17
Speaker 2: I don't want to report exactly. I don't know for sure, but I don't think it's like on the doorstep or anything. It could be wrong, but that's not the sense I've gotten. But again, I don't know if it's the smart thing for them to do. Part of me just says get get Let this contract be this contract, and we shouldn't, you know, worry about you know, is Perry gonna get his shot at a playoff team or at more money in free agency this season when I'm not sure the Angels have justified spending big this offseason, and you know, trying to really go for it next year, even though that's kind of what they do every year, is just you know, pretend to go for it.

00:23:50
Speaker 4: Your third point is find reliable starting pitching is almost a laughable comment when Ardi Moreno is still your owner of a team. I feel like for years he's hamstrung his GMS into finding that reliable starting pitching because I think the number that you sent over was sixty percent of their starting rotation hasn't made a start in a Big League since twenty twenty four.

00:24:19
Speaker 2: Yeah, I guess it depends on how you view men. Noah, is he look in the rotation to see a bullpen guy? Is he someone that has to earn it? But I mean, if you you know, you look at Rodriguez and you look at Reed Detmer's who was in the bullpenal last year, I mean that's kind of you know that those guys have more solidified spots at this point, so you know, and then I think your most reliable guy is probably Usiekikuchi. This guy's always made his starts, He's always been available. That's kind of his calling card, and I think it's what makes him very valuable in a lot of ways. But you know, Soriano is good. He's a really good pitterer. I think he's all Star caliber, if not better than that. But you know, he's also had the wildly inconsistent I think the one thing that the Angels have done really well the offseason they hired my maddis now that you know what difference that makes in this and this whole equation is to be seen, I think, but I would give them credit for that higher I think that is, you know, that's a that's a good addition, right this guy. The Texas Rangers have the best pitching staff in baseball last year, and I don't necessarily think that equates to the Angels will have the best pitching staff in baseball, But you know, it's good to have someone with with that pedigree at least overseeing some of these younger pitchers and overseeing some of these reclamation projects because ultimately, those who are who the Angels seem to do that, they're going to be relying on you know.

00:25:28
Speaker 3: They can make they can make more moves.

00:25:30
Speaker 2: I still think that that is very much on the table to add a starting pitching. But for right now, what they're what it looks like is is a lot of guys that you can't really count on and you just kind of hope work out.

00:25:45
Speaker 1: That's all we got. Sam's off the hot seat. Sam, that was great stuff.

00:25:48
Speaker 4: Man.

00:25:50
Speaker 1: Thanks for Evan, although I'm sure you probably have been doing a lot of listening in the courthouse.

00:25:55
Speaker 3: So a verdict though.

00:25:59
Speaker 1: Is that what that's where you are right now? Right you're sitting waiting for.

00:26:02
Speaker 3: Me on my car outside the courthouse. Yeah, I'm gonna do it from the courthouse.

00:26:06
Speaker 2: And then your producer said that there was a lot of talk back, and I was like, I gotta get at it.

00:26:09
Speaker 1: Yeah, probably better to be outside the courthouse.

00:26:11
Speaker 3: And there's a variety of reasons.

00:26:13
Speaker 1: Yeah, producer lady is tough.

00:26:16
Speaker 2: She's the best.

00:26:17
Speaker 1: Sam, you too, Man, great work on this. Really appreciate it. It's been fascinating to read all about what's going on here. And we'll catch it from where Angels talk at some.

00:26:25
Speaker 3: Point soon thany time. Thank you guys for having me I appreciate it,