Young Guns (1988) vs. Young Guns II (1990) vs. Tombstone (1993): Part 2

<v Speaker 1>This is a podcast from Minute Media.
<v Speaker 2>Hello everybody, Welcome back to the Shirley You Can't Be
<v Speaker 2>Serious podcast. We are here for our second part of
<v Speaker 2>our competition between a gunfight, if you will, between Tombstone
<v Speaker 2>and Young Guns one and Young Guns two.
<v Speaker 1>Dog did you see the side of that chick in?
<v Speaker 1>We are going to get on our spirit horse and
<v Speaker 1>see where a lee It says, okay casting on Young Guns. Okay.
<v Speaker 3>So we talked earlier Christopher Caine, the director of Young Guns,
<v Speaker 3>directed Emelia.
<v Speaker 1>Estevez in That was then.
<v Speaker 3>This is now Estevez name sometimes throws people off. He
<v Speaker 3>is the son of Martin Sheen and the brother of
<v Speaker 3>Charlie Sheen. Sheen is their professional name. Yes, I heard
<v Speaker 3>Amelio talking about this. They're like, did you ever think
<v Speaker 3>about taking the Sheen name.
<v Speaker 1>He's like, well, yeah I did.
<v Speaker 3>He said, I had a lot of agents coming to
<v Speaker 3>me and saying, look, kid with a name like Sheen,
<v Speaker 3>you know your dad can propel you a lot if
<v Speaker 3>you'll just use it. And so he's like, okay, okay,
<v Speaker 3>And so he took some headshots and it said Emilio
<v Speaker 3>Sheen and he's like he laughed. He's like that just
<v Speaker 3>looks so stupid to have such a strong Latin first
<v Speaker 3>name and then such a regular last name. He's like,
<v Speaker 3>it's too I can't do it right, I can't do it.
<v Speaker 3>Change it back to sts Carlos Stevs.
<v Speaker 1>But he goes by Arlie. She's not really an americanized
<v Speaker 1>version of Emilio. There's no Charlie to go to on
<v Speaker 1>that one. We'd just call him Andrew. I would expect
<v Speaker 1>more from a varsity athlete Andrew. All right.
<v Speaker 3>So you've got Emilia Steves, who's hot off of the
<v Speaker 3>Breakfast Club. One movie that he was in that I
<v Speaker 3>forgot to mention that is a personal favorite of mine
<v Speaker 3>is an s he Hinton story that they made called
<v Speaker 3>Texts Isn't. Yeah, he's in that one, Matt Dyllan. Yeah,
<v Speaker 3>and it took place and shot all around to also
<v Speaker 3>Oklahoma when I was growing up. So definitely fond memories
<v Speaker 3>of that movie.
<v Speaker 1>Cool. Then you've got Kiefer Sutherland.
<v Speaker 3>Yep, you wrote fifteen year old boy straight into his
<v Speaker 3>grave and the rest of us straight to hell. Okay,
<v Speaker 3>backing up to Emilia, rest of as real quick he was.
<v Speaker 3>He turned twenty six when Young Guns was shot in
<v Speaker 3>nineteen eighty.
<v Speaker 1>Eight, right, and there be hanged by the neck till
<v Speaker 1>he be dead, dead dead. How do you have anything
<v Speaker 1>to say, young man, Yes.
<v Speaker 4>Your honor, I do.
<v Speaker 1>You can go to hell, hell, hell, okay, all right.
<v Speaker 3>Keefer Sutherland had just been the Lost Boys. Yeah, flash
<v Speaker 3>back to our Lost Boys episode. Yes, he had just
<v Speaker 3>turned twenty one. He turned twenty two at the in
<v Speaker 3>the end.
<v Speaker 1>Of eighty eight. He's just it's crazy, twenty one years old.
<v Speaker 1>He looks like the older, wiser guy of the group,
<v Speaker 1>but he was the youngest customer. Fascinating.
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, he would have been in stand By Me at
<v Speaker 3>twenty he was the bad guy and stand By Me
<v Speaker 3>with member of his gang, Casey Casey Chamisko. Yep, yep,
<v Speaker 3>all right and Casey Chamisco.
<v Speaker 5>No, no, no, no, oh it's you nine.
<v Speaker 6>Is that right, John, He went on, Yes, yes, it.
<v Speaker 3>Is turned twenty seven. In nineteen eighty eight, he had
<v Speaker 3>been in Back to the Future. He'd been in a
<v Speaker 3>movie called Three o'clock High.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.
<v Speaker 3>I think we've mentioned this a few times. If you
<v Speaker 3>have not seen Three o'clock High and you like eighties movies, awesome,
<v Speaker 3>awesome movie.
<v Speaker 1>So I told you that my brother got certified scuba
<v Speaker 1>diving with case He's a mesco right, let's hear it.
<v Speaker 1>I don't have it. He didn't do it. He was
<v Speaker 1>at like a Formula one race and he was too
<v Speaker 1>loud and I was like, I need the Casey never mind. Okay,
<v Speaker 1>So your brothers took scuba Lezzes, Well, yeah, he got
<v Speaker 1>his certification, like the last dive that you do when
<v Speaker 1>you're becoming certified scuba diver. And his opinion at the time,
<v Speaker 1>back in the eighties was that it came. He was
<v Speaker 1>an able, but my brother was a teenager wreck then,
<v Speaker 1>so what does he know. I'm I'm not saying that.
<v Speaker 1>I was just maybe Casey was having a bad day
<v Speaker 1>that day. Casey, he plays Charlie Bounder. Yeah, okay. Then
<v Speaker 1>you have Lou Diamond Phillips.
<v Speaker 7>Many nights, my friend, many nights, I'd put a blade
<v Speaker 7>to your throat while he was sleeping.
<v Speaker 2>Glad I never killed you.
<v Speaker 1>Steve Yes, he was actually one of the oldest guys.
<v Speaker 1>He was twenty five when they shot. Yeah, right now.
<v Speaker 1>He had just come off of Stand and Deliver and.
<v Speaker 8>Lobamba, Which it's interesting those, I mean, those are obviously
<v Speaker 8>well known movies.
<v Speaker 1>We know them very well, but I mean Standard Deliver
<v Speaker 1>was like a micro budget independent movie. Oabamba was a
<v Speaker 1>negative pickup project, small budget movie that just half they
<v Speaker 1>both happened to hit. But he hadn't gotten any work
<v Speaker 1>for like six months. And he's like, Okay, Oh, I
<v Speaker 1>got this part. That's a cowboy movie. I'll go audition
<v Speaker 1>for it. Okay, great, And they send him the script,
<v Speaker 1>but they don't tell him what the audition pieces are,
<v Speaker 1>and so he's like, I'm just gonna go pick out
<v Speaker 1>my favorite scenes and I'll just know those scenes so
<v Speaker 1>I can use that. Right, He's meeting with the producers
<v Speaker 1>with Christopher Kane and he's like okay, and they're talking
<v Speaker 1>and he's like, I'm really excited about this. I hope
<v Speaker 1>I can be a part of this project. I don't
<v Speaker 1>know what the audition parts are, but I've memorized some
<v Speaker 1>of these other parts. And they're looking at him like, yeah,
<v Speaker 1>you got the part already, buddy, you don't have to
<v Speaker 1>and he's like oh. And it was like that moment
<v Speaker 1>that he knew that he had made it, Like he
<v Speaker 1>didn't realize that despite the fact that he had had
<v Speaker 1>two really successful movies under his belt, he was still
<v Speaker 1>new and he wasn't getting work. He wasn't getting work,
<v Speaker 1>and it's like, oh I have it all right, yeah yeah, yeah, yeah,
<v Speaker 1>oh what it? Yes? Okay, quick, a funny story on
<v Speaker 1>Lou Diamond Films. That's a great story.
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, that every night after shooting they would go to
<v Speaker 3>the bar.
<v Speaker 1>This is in New.
<v Speaker 3>Mexico and this is like I think they stayed in
<v Speaker 3>Santa Fe, right, but Cinta Fe is not exactly New
<v Speaker 3>York City or Hollywood or anything.
<v Speaker 1>So, but they do have karaoke bars. Apparently they do.
<v Speaker 3>So there was this, uh, you know, a local band playing,
<v Speaker 3>and we got all these young guys at the bar
<v Speaker 3>drink and have fun, young whatever. And so every night,
<v Speaker 3>every night they'd be like, all right, Lou, let's go
<v Speaker 3>up here.
<v Speaker 1>LaBamba hit it.
<v Speaker 3>So he said that every night they would they would
<v Speaker 3>make him sing LaBamba and they would always sing knocking
<v Speaker 3>on Heaven's door.
<v Speaker 1>Oh nice. Splash back to our usual Lesion too episode.
<v Speaker 1>By the way, just in case anybody doesn't know, he
<v Speaker 1>didn't actually sing LaBamba in the movie. Yeah, okay, that's hysterical, man,
<v Speaker 1>This guy sucks, all right.
<v Speaker 3>Charlie Sheen, who is Amelio's younger brother.
<v Speaker 1>He plays Dick Brewer. Yes, go in there and cut
<v Speaker 1>the son of a bitch in a half.
<v Speaker 6>I'm daring you.
<v Speaker 3>Billy who was actually supposed to be played by Patrick
<v Speaker 3>Swayze Patrick Swayze, but Patrick Swayzey said, I've done too
<v Speaker 3>many of these ensemble pieces.
<v Speaker 1>I was in the Outsiders, I was in Red Dawn.
<v Speaker 1>I don't want to be that guy that's in these
<v Speaker 1>group pieces every time. So now, thank you.
<v Speaker 3>Patrick Swayzey would have been awesome as a cowboy. Perfect, Yeah,
<v Speaker 3>it's perfect. But Charlie Sheen does a fantastic job. He
<v Speaker 3>does great, Okay, and then Dermott Maroney plays dirty Steve Stevens.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, you're red ass Mexican Greece. You do it with
<v Speaker 1>your horse.
<v Speaker 6>Mexican Greasa.
<v Speaker 3>They said that the prop guys came to him like,
<v Speaker 3>all right, dude, you gotta have your face dirty the
<v Speaker 3>whole time. You're always chewing tobacco, And so he would
<v Speaker 3>chew actual tobacco. Oh and he like crams that chaw
<v Speaker 3>in there like and they asked him that he was like,
<v Speaker 3>he can't even close his lips right, So they said,
<v Speaker 3>you know, we can make fake tobacco where it's like
<v Speaker 3>tutsie rolls and he's like, no, no, man.
<v Speaker 1>Real tobacco. So he just he did the real deal.
<v Speaker 1>So that is funny because the real person's name was
<v Speaker 1>dirty Steve Yes. And they pointed out on Dan the
<v Speaker 1>based on a True Story Young Guns episode, They're like,
<v Speaker 1>the common practice was to take a bath once a week.
<v Speaker 1>That's what everybody did. How dirty did you have to
<v Speaker 1>be to be called dirty Steve? Back then everybody else
<v Speaker 1>took a bath once a week.
<v Speaker 3>It's yeah, I watched I listened to the commentary of
<v Speaker 3>Young Guns, which I thought this was hilarious. So they
<v Speaker 3>were lou Diamond Phillips and Casus Schmeska were saying to Dermottroney.
<v Speaker 1>They were like, dude, you were dirty. You were dirty
<v Speaker 1>all the time.
<v Speaker 3>I took a shower every day because because.
<v Speaker 1>I just didn't. He goes when I washed my hair,
<v Speaker 1>I did never use shampoo. It's like not washing, that's
<v Speaker 1>getting wet.
<v Speaker 3>So he said that was that was kind of my contribution.
<v Speaker 1>I didn't use shampoo. You congratulations, you got your hair wet.
<v Speaker 1>The dirt wet. So we got Terrence stamp As John.
<v Speaker 3>Mister Murphy is going to continue coming to you claiming
<v Speaker 3>I've taken his property until I pronounced the thief and
<v Speaker 3>shaken out of Lincoln.
<v Speaker 1>Who General Zodd, General Zod, which it was neat to
<v Speaker 1>see him as a good guy.
<v Speaker 3>He was, I mean, he was genteel, smart, yeah, and
<v Speaker 3>well meaning.
<v Speaker 1>Ye. And then you've got Jack Palance with this horrible
<v Speaker 1>Irish accent.
<v Speaker 6>Well, the beltader has spoken, but he was.
<v Speaker 3>Still a great back guy. Yeah, he's always over the top.
<v Speaker 3>He is well Englishman. And then you have Terry O'Quinn
<v Speaker 3>as Alex McSween.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, who was also in Tombstone as the mayor. That's right, Yeah,
<v Speaker 1>we'll cross over there. That is right. There is a
<v Speaker 1>connection right there. Okay, so let's talk about young guns
<v Speaker 1>two real quick.
<v Speaker 5>All right, so.
<v Speaker 1>Let's talk about young guns too, real quick. Well, obviously
<v Speaker 1>a lot of the same folks are involved, but it's
<v Speaker 1>actually not a lot. It's three. It's only three. It's
<v Speaker 1>only three. It's Billy the Kid, It's Chavez Chavez, and
<v Speaker 1>it is Doc Carlott, which is interesting because some of
<v Speaker 1>the guys that were killed, Dirtie, Steve and Charlie, they
<v Speaker 1>didn't they didn't get guilled. No, they didn't die, which
<v Speaker 1>is a shame because it had been great to see
<v Speaker 1>them in Part two, and they had started writing Part
<v Speaker 1>two while filming of Part one was still going on.
<v Speaker 1>They thought, there's going to be some unanswered questions, there's
<v Speaker 1>more to the story. We want to develop this thing,
<v Speaker 1>and so John Fusco got a whole lot of Billy's
<v Speaker 1>dialogue from actual newspaper interviews and reports that had been
<v Speaker 1>done between eighteen seventy nine and eighteen eighty one. By
<v Speaker 1>the way, Fusco also appears as the branded man in
<v Speaker 1>that pit scene and Young Gun too bon Jovi in it. Yes, right,
<v Speaker 1>he's got the JC for John Chisholm branded on it branded.
<v Speaker 3>Okay, Yeah, should we talk about cameos now or wait,
<v Speaker 3>let's talk about him now.
<v Speaker 1>Let's talk about it. I just mentioned it, so we
<v Speaker 1>might as well. Right, So Young Guns two, Let's let's
<v Speaker 1>talk about Young Guns one. Okay, let's talk about Young
<v Speaker 1>Guns one. The cameos from Young Guns one? Okay, So
<v Speaker 1>who shows up Tom Cruise? Tom Cruise, who's buddies with
<v Speaker 1>Amelia Estevez because they were both in The Outsiders together.
<v Speaker 1>That's right. Shot in Tulsa Oklahoma, Oklahoma. Little text connection there,
<v Speaker 1>all right, Yeah, and so he had never been shot
<v Speaker 1>in a movie before, and he's like, man, I'd love
<v Speaker 1>it if I could get shot, Like, dude, let's do it.
<v Speaker 3>Of course, get this guy a mustache and a trench
<v Speaker 3>code and cowboy hat.
<v Speaker 1>Okay, you have to look really quickly when after you
<v Speaker 1>can use the freeze frame like every player has these days.
<v Speaker 1>But are you sure.
<v Speaker 3>There's a scene where they are burning down Alex's house
<v Speaker 3>and the regulators are trapped inside and they decide to
<v Speaker 3>make a run for it.
<v Speaker 1>Right yep.
<v Speaker 3>They throw Billy out the top window spoilers in a box,
<v Speaker 3>right okay, and he jumps up.
<v Speaker 1>Right yeah, okay.
<v Speaker 3>Then Charlie comes out the side door. The next bad
<v Speaker 3>guy who gets shot is Tom Cruise.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. When you look, you're like, yep, that's Tom Cruise.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah yeah, but I never knew it until I was
<v Speaker 1>tell this little secret was revealed when we were looking.
<v Speaker 1>It's fascinating.
<v Speaker 3>When he came to town, he said that, you know,
<v Speaker 3>of course they're young or whatever, and they're like he's like, hey, guys,
<v Speaker 3>what are you guys doing. They're like, well, I'm just
<v Speaker 3>shooting this Guyboy movie. He's like, how about tomorrow we
<v Speaker 3>go skiing. They're like, let's go.
<v Speaker 1>We're in New Mexico. So they all win skiing except
<v Speaker 1>for Lou Diamond Phillips, who didn't know ski. He's also
<v Speaker 1>scared of heights. He is scared of fight, which makes
<v Speaker 1>that scene the Spirit worlds.
<v Speaker 5>You see, Sugar, You see the son.
<v Speaker 1>He's standing up on that rock, like thirty feet off
<v Speaker 1>the ground. Yeah. And if you look at his face
<v Speaker 1>you see fear in his you do. Yeah.
<v Speaker 3>Also cameo is Randy Travis. What Randy Travis.
<v Speaker 1>Randy freaking Travis Your country?
<v Speaker 3>No way, that's that's well, it's George. There is a
<v Speaker 3>pure Country connection.
<v Speaker 1>Okay, go ahead. Christopher Kine, Yes directed Pure Country. Yeah,
<v Speaker 1>that's right.
<v Speaker 6>Okay.
<v Speaker 3>Randy Travis is one of the guys operating in the
<v Speaker 3>Gatling Gun What. Yes, Wow, Randy Travis. He takes out
<v Speaker 3>Alex McSween.
<v Speaker 1>Wow. Okay, that's good.
<v Speaker 3>You want another cameo, Sure, another cameo bad guy who
<v Speaker 3>gets killed? Yeah, Meliss, Oh yeah, he's sitting around on
<v Speaker 3>one day, bored out of his mind. He's like, crap
<v Speaker 3>and put me in let me get shot.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, there's short and extras. He didn't have anything to
<v Speaker 1>shoot that day. It's like, make me one of the
<v Speaker 1>bad guys. All right. So we're coming into Young Guns
<v Speaker 1>too here where obviously a major character is Pat Garrett. Yes,
<v Speaker 1>not played by the same actor. That's right. Do you
<v Speaker 1>know who the actor was in the first one, Yes,
<v Speaker 1>I do. His name is Patrick way Wayne, son of
<v Speaker 1>Bruce Wayne John. Wayne John Wayne's son, freaking Wayne's son
<v Speaker 1>was Pat Garrett.
<v Speaker 3>He was awesome and they had that scene in Young Guns.
<v Speaker 3>It's it's kind of interesting. He comes to tell Billy
<v Speaker 3>that he's in trouble, he needs to skin out and
<v Speaker 3>go roll in Mexico. Yeah, right, and Billy actually turns
<v Speaker 3>his back on him and says, Patt, are you my friend?
<v Speaker 3>And if you look really carefully in the backgrounds out
<v Speaker 3>of focus, his hand goes to his gun and then
<v Speaker 3>he's like, yeah, Billy, I'm your friend, puts his hand down.
<v Speaker 3>It's like, do I take this guy out? Nope, I'm
<v Speaker 3>going to now And then of course yes in part two,
<v Speaker 3>William Peterson from CSI Fame and he was in to
<v Speaker 3>Live and Die.
<v Speaker 1>In las Manhunter. That's with Stephen Lang who was like Clinton.
<v Speaker 1>They were both in Manhunter. Really yes, connections everywhere. Yeah,
<v Speaker 1>Stephen Lang was the reporter that they set on fire.
<v Speaker 1>I can remember that from that from watching it one
<v Speaker 1>time back in the nineties. Yeah, I mean I remember
<v Speaker 1>that scene I did. That was Stephen Lane. Yeah, okay.
<v Speaker 1>He has this crazy, like very curly hairdoo. Interesting. He also,
<v Speaker 1>by the way, was in the first movie we saw together,
<v Speaker 1>which was Avatar. He's the general who's he's fantastic, bad
<v Speaker 1>guy bad a. Yeah. I saw an interview with him
<v Speaker 1>and they're like, so, did you get a percentage of
<v Speaker 1>this movie? He's like, that's interesting. My son asked me
<v Speaker 1>that question. But I got a percentage of this movie. Yes,
<v Speaker 1>I did. I got zero percent of this movie.
<v Speaker 3>One percent of Avatar would have been a bazillion dollars.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, right, okay.
<v Speaker 3>So we talked about William Peterson right, super famous now
<v Speaker 3>because he was in CSI Forever.
<v Speaker 1>Yep, Okay.
<v Speaker 3>You also had Christian Slater who plays Arkansas Dave rudebah, Ye.
<v Speaker 5>Tell me something, Chavez was it the sad was just
<v Speaker 5>putting it to a Mexican war.
<v Speaker 3>Was an Indian horror putting it to the whole goddamn Mexicans.
<v Speaker 3>He was actually twenty years old wow when he shot Yeah,
<v Speaker 3>because he's playing a twenty five year old.
<v Speaker 1>He was just like the kid in robin Hood Prince
<v Speaker 1>of Thieves, right, that's right, Yeah, that's right. One year later.
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, so you have Christian Slater. You also have Alan
<v Speaker 3>Ruck who played Cameron from Ferris Bueler's Day.
<v Speaker 1>Off when Cameron was in Egypt. Sorry, don't do that.
<v Speaker 1>Take out that I was terrible. No, that's fine.
<v Speaker 3>He was thirty four when he shot this, which he's
<v Speaker 3>not really a young gun. He was a farmer or whatever. Yeah,
<v Speaker 3>but the amazing thing is that he was thirty years
<v Speaker 3>old when he played Cameron.
<v Speaker 1>Nuts. Yes, but that character is not an actual historical figure.
<v Speaker 1>That was William Henry French was not a true figure, right,
<v Speaker 1>but Arkansas Dave Rudabah was and he had been with
<v Speaker 1>the Regulator for quite a while, like he would he
<v Speaker 1>had been with him. That was the other thing. There
<v Speaker 1>were about twenty regulators, not six, right, so that was
<v Speaker 1>a little Hollywood license that was done there. But he
<v Speaker 1>was one of the original regulators.
<v Speaker 3>You also have a bout the Czar Getty. Yes, he
<v Speaker 3>plays tom O Filliard.
<v Speaker 1>He was the kid that was in Lord of the Flies, right.
<v Speaker 3>That's right, that's right. Yeah, he turned fifteen during the
<v Speaker 3>shooting of Young Guns two. Right, he actually he's the
<v Speaker 3>fourteen and a half and half is important. That half
<v Speaker 3>has a lot of experience in there. He The interesting
<v Speaker 3>thing about that character that he plays Toma Folliard. Tomo Filliard,
<v Speaker 3>I think I'm saying that right. Historically that was one
<v Speaker 3>of the best friends of Billy the Kid.
<v Speaker 1>Oh really, so when he was.
<v Speaker 3>Shot and killed as a regulator. Yeah, it wasn't this
<v Speaker 3>you kill a kid, Patsy, No, it's just a He
<v Speaker 3>was just a regular, same age guy as the.
<v Speaker 1>Rest of them. Right, Okay, So a couple of names
<v Speaker 1>worth mentioning. We got Vigo Mortenson, oh gosh, yes, as
<v Speaker 1>John W. Poe pre Lord of the Rings where he
<v Speaker 1>was became mega famous. Got to have a movement me too.
<v Speaker 3>You also have Jenny Wright, who played Rob Lowe's wife
<v Speaker 3>in sant Emo's Fire that also had Emeliu Stws. Yeah,
<v Speaker 3>that's right, she plays Jane Goodall.
<v Speaker 5>Yeah.
<v Speaker 1>And I don't know how we didn't mention the fact
<v Speaker 1>that Dana Wheeler Nicholson was Mattie Blaylock and Tombstone, but
<v Speaker 1>she was the love interest in Fletch. She was Missus Stanwick.
<v Speaker 1>Missus Stanwick.
<v Speaker 3>Yes, that's right, we've never we haven't covered flod yet,
<v Speaker 3>but we.
<v Speaker 1>Need to, Okay, So talking about those characters and historical
<v Speaker 1>accuracy and that sort of thing. So the original screenplay
<v Speaker 1>actually had Doc Skurlock living. At the end, Kiefer Sutherland
<v Speaker 1>was going to live just like happened in real life,
<v Speaker 1>going to Texas with his wife, right, right, And so
<v Speaker 1>why did it and the way that it did well,
<v Speaker 1>Apparently Keifer Sutherland said, Hey, I got scheduling conflicts and
<v Speaker 1>I'm not going to come back to the Young Guns
<v Speaker 1>franchise unless you have my character die in the Stinking
<v Speaker 1>Springs shootout. And John Fusco was like, no, that's no, no, no, no,
<v Speaker 1>Doc has to live. But ultimately he went ahead and
<v Speaker 1>did what Keifer said, and that's why he dies. So
<v Speaker 1>it was Keifer Keefer's doing.
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, the real Doug Scurloca lived until nineteen twenty nine,
<v Speaker 3>I believe yeap nineteen twenty nine.
<v Speaker 1>He died at age eighty. Which here's a funny story
<v Speaker 1>about this.
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, he got in a gunfight one time Doc Skurloc okay,
<v Speaker 3>before he became a regulator.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, of our card game. He got shot in the face.
<v Speaker 1>Good thing. He went to medical school.
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I mean he got let's talk about that. He
<v Speaker 3>got the name doc because he studied medicine at Tulane.
<v Speaker 1>That was from New Orleans. He just left early. Yeah,
<v Speaker 1>got shot in the face. Okay. The bullet took out
<v Speaker 1>his front teeth.
<v Speaker 3>Okay, and exited his neck and it didn't even knock
<v Speaker 3>him down. And so after the dude had fired his bullet,
<v Speaker 3>he just raised his gun and blew the guy away.
<v Speaker 1>Wow.
<v Speaker 3>Took one in the face and then returned fire killed
<v Speaker 3>the guy.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it's fair fight. Sure, Okay. Were we talking about
<v Speaker 1>Young Guns too? Yeah, we're talking about Young Guns too.
<v Speaker 1>And you know, it's interesting. I saw the interviews on this,
<v Speaker 1>like every single one of the returning characters obviously said
<v Speaker 1>they liked Young Guns two better than Young Guns One. Now,
<v Speaker 1>of course they're promoting the movie as well, so of
<v Speaker 1>course they would say that. But I, like I said,
<v Speaker 1>I remember liking it better when I was a kid too.
<v Speaker 1>But one of the other things that Amelia Staves said
<v Speaker 1>was he talked about the other Billy the Kid movies
<v Speaker 1>that he had seen that might have had some influence
<v Speaker 1>on it. He said, probably the biggest influence on this
<v Speaker 1>movie was Sam Pick and Pause, Pat Garrett and Billy
<v Speaker 1>the Kid, which was nineteen seventy three. I've never seen
<v Speaker 1>that movie. Okay, so you know, do you know who
<v Speaker 1>played Pat Garrett in that movie? Tell me James Coburn,
<v Speaker 1>who played John Chisholm Mischism in Young Guns. You took
<v Speaker 1>a lot of people's Now that's interesting. Yeah, there's another
<v Speaker 1>Billy the Kid movie that came out in nineteen eighty nine.
<v Speaker 1>What it was, I made for TV movie. Yeah, do
<v Speaker 1>you know who played the part of Billy the Kid?
<v Speaker 3>No?
<v Speaker 1>Val Kilmer? What yes? No way? Is your mind blown?
<v Speaker 1>I actually saw that movie like he had the old
<v Speaker 1>top at that like Billy the Kid has in the
<v Speaker 1>old pictures, and it was I I can remember seeing
<v Speaker 1>that movie and going, this is nowhere near as good
<v Speaker 1>as Young Guns. I don't even know that I watched
<v Speaker 1>it all the way through. But Val Kilmer nineteen eighty nine,
<v Speaker 1>I mean, he's made top secret, he's made real genius.
<v Speaker 1>But somehow nineteen eighty nine he's in a TV movie
<v Speaker 1>as Billy the kids.
<v Speaker 3>Wow, that's a good one that you're blowing my mind
<v Speaker 3>with that. I didn't know that. Okay, young guns too.
<v Speaker 3>I want to talk about a couple things.
<v Speaker 1>Okay, Okay.
<v Speaker 3>Lou Diamond Phillips, yeah, almost died on set.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I sent you this video. Yeah I seen, I
<v Speaker 1>had seen it. I actually asked you. I asked you
<v Speaker 1>because like, this is such a fantastic story. If you
<v Speaker 1>don't know it, I'm going to be excited to tell it.
<v Speaker 1>So you already know it, you go ahead. Wow, Okay,
<v Speaker 1>So here's the deal. So I jump in. I can't help,
<v Speaker 1>but I'm want to jump in. Ok go tell it. Okay.
<v Speaker 3>So they had already shot most of the dramatic scenes,
<v Speaker 3>so now they're doing everything on horseback, and Lou Diamond
<v Speaker 3>Phillips horse arrow with a pain in his butt from
<v Speaker 3>day one.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah he is. He was from Texas, so he's like, oh,
<v Speaker 1>I've ridden a horse before, and they're like, all right,
<v Speaker 1>we'll give you the one that's part. By the way,
<v Speaker 1>Lou Diamond Phillips is not Latino. He's Filipino. Yeah, he's
<v Speaker 1>got a little cherokey in him, I believe. But yes,
<v Speaker 1>mixed an Indians anyway.
<v Speaker 3>So I just found that interesting that he is not
<v Speaker 3>Latino at all.
<v Speaker 1>Anyway.
<v Speaker 3>So there's a scene where he's got chains on handcuffs
<v Speaker 3>and they put a squib in between so that he
<v Speaker 3>was going to come running one way, you know, Emilio
<v Speaker 3>Estevez is coming the other way. Billy's gonna shoot boom,
<v Speaker 3>break the pancuffs in half.
<v Speaker 1>Right, This was a scene that they had not planned, right,
<v Speaker 1>and this was the last minute. Hey, we decided to
<v Speaker 1>do this right.
<v Speaker 3>Well, he had just escaped from jail. He's supposed to
<v Speaker 3>be hung, right, so he still had a noose around
<v Speaker 3>his neck. Yeah, okay, Well the prop man hadn't had
<v Speaker 3>a chance to score the noose, right, And so what
<v Speaker 3>generally happens is if you're ever in any kind of
<v Speaker 3>dangerous situation, there's always a way out, So they score
<v Speaker 3>the noos in case something happens, and that way it'll
<v Speaker 3>tear away if you get it hooked on something. Well,
<v Speaker 3>here comes Millio and his gun, and here comes Lou
<v Speaker 3>Diamond Phillips and his gun. They fire, that squib goes
<v Speaker 3>off and Lou Diamond Phillips horse rears back high in
<v Speaker 3>the air straight up. Yeah, tosses Lou off the horse. Well,
<v Speaker 3>the noos gets hung in the saddle, so he's got
<v Speaker 3>a real noose around his neck that's hooked to the
<v Speaker 3>saddle and there goes arrow boom down the street. There
<v Speaker 3>was like one thing and it was Mexico.
<v Speaker 1>Right, it was the desert. It was the desert. The
<v Speaker 1>horse was dragging him to the barren desert.
<v Speaker 3>So he's being pulled right, choking to death. People are
<v Speaker 3>chasing after him. The horse kicks Hi breaks his elbow, right.
<v Speaker 1>It broke his arm in two places, four places. Well, yeah,
<v Speaker 1>and the two of them were compound. It came through
<v Speaker 1>the skin. Oh gosh.
<v Speaker 3>So then they it continues to pull and it tears
<v Speaker 3>through you know. He takes out this prop thing and
<v Speaker 3>this woodpile and that thing, and then he finally hits
<v Speaker 3>a thing of railroad ties, crashes and breaks his patilla.
<v Speaker 1>He was being dragged for like it was going on
<v Speaker 1>and on. These horse hooves are like inches away from
<v Speaker 1>his face. He actually gets kicked in the head at
<v Speaker 1>one point. Oh my gosh, and he thought he was
<v Speaker 1>usually he was like, this is it, this is it.
<v Speaker 1>I'm having that moment that people have before they die.
<v Speaker 1>I'm about to die.
<v Speaker 3>So he finally when he it hits that pile of
<v Speaker 3>railroad ties. Yeah, it breaks the rope, Yeah, breaks the
<v Speaker 3>rope crazy that's around his neck.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, breaks his potella, breaks his potella on the railroad ties.
<v Speaker 3>So they have to airlift him because there's no ambulances
<v Speaker 3>in the middle of nowhere.
<v Speaker 1>And it's going to be an hour before the helicopter
<v Speaker 1>can get there, right, So they call the medic over
<v Speaker 1>and it's Emelio Estevez on one side, the medic on
<v Speaker 1>the other side, and everything that had been numb, and
<v Speaker 1>then he starts lou Diamond Phillips, starts to feel the
<v Speaker 1>pain everywhere, and he starts screaming. You know in the
<v Speaker 1>movie when when Chavez is screaming, like, you're like, wow,
<v Speaker 1>he's really that's the screaming that he's doing. And so
<v Speaker 1>Ameliustevez is freaking out and he's like, give it morphne,
<v Speaker 1>give it morphine. Yeah, and the medic's like no, no, no, no,
<v Speaker 1>we don't know what kind of internal injuries. He says,
<v Speaker 1>you know, the morphine could do something really bad to him.
<v Speaker 1>He's like he grabs him by the shirt lapels. He's
<v Speaker 1>like he is in pain, give him morphine, and so
<v Speaker 1>I don't know the story whether he get the morphine
<v Speaker 1>or not. I'm guessing so, but there's an hour wait.
<v Speaker 1>Amelia Estevez lays down next to Lou Diamond Phillips and
<v Speaker 1>just sits there and just holds him, comforts him, talks
<v Speaker 1>to him the entire time until the helicopter gets there.
<v Speaker 1>He was in the hospital for like six weeks or something.
<v Speaker 1>Made me tear up when I heard that story. That's
<v Speaker 1>a good friend. Their pals and easy being pals now.
<v Speaker 3>And there was no report whether or not Lou Diamond
<v Speaker 3>Phillips was going.
<v Speaker 1>I'd say, i'se sweet Mary's ask how the hell did
<v Speaker 1>you get him to do that? What's that mean?
<v Speaker 6>Anyway, I'd say, I'd say it's an ancient Neva whole word,
<v Speaker 6>I mean stop.
<v Speaker 1>So practical jokes abounded on the set as well on
<v Speaker 1>the set of the original movie when they the young
<v Speaker 1>Guns won, when they came in, they all got a
<v Speaker 1>package that was purportedly from the studio saying, you know,
<v Speaker 1>this is what we think of your chances for success.
<v Speaker 1>We're really rooting for.
<v Speaker 5>You, guys.
<v Speaker 1>And then you open up the package and it was
<v Speaker 1>cout Chips. I think that was that was actually Amilia
<v Speaker 1>Estevez and he had done that and he sent it off.
<v Speaker 1>But he actually had been in a big breakup right
<v Speaker 1>before this and was kind of sad and brooding for
<v Speaker 1>the entire shoot for Young Guns one right, and so
<v Speaker 1>to lighten the mood, lou Diamond Phillips puts makeup on
<v Speaker 1>a sheep and then throws it into Amelia Estevez's trailer.
<v Speaker 1>That's so nice of him. Yeah, his pals and snacking
<v Speaker 1>on you. That's awesome. Okay, let's talk about some of
<v Speaker 1>the things that they got right historically in Tombstone. Okay, yeah, okay,
<v Speaker 1>So the shootout at the OK Corral. Yes, so the
<v Speaker 1>line quoted by Doc at the end of the fight
<v Speaker 1>at the OK Corral is historically true and was reported
<v Speaker 1>in the Tombstone Papers reporting on the fight. When confronted
<v Speaker 1>by one of the cowboys at point blank range, the
<v Speaker 1>cowboy reportedly said I got you now, Doc, you son
<v Speaker 1>of a bitch, which Doc gleefully retorted, here a daisy
<v Speaker 1>if you do so, cool man, that's so cool.
<v Speaker 3>On that subject, listen to what Wyatt Or actually said
<v Speaker 3>about Doc Holliday. Okay, I love this, it says. Some
<v Speaker 3>years after the death of Doc Holliday, Wyatt was quoted
<v Speaker 3>in an interview saying, quote, Doc was a dentist, not
<v Speaker 3>a lawman or an assassin, whom necessity had made, a gambler.
<v Speaker 1>A gentleman whom disease.
<v Speaker 3>Had made, a frontier vagabond, a philosopher whom life had made,
<v Speaker 3>a caustic wit, a long, lean, ash blonde fellow nearly
<v Speaker 3>dead with consumption, and at the same time was the
<v Speaker 3>most skillful gambler and the nervoust speediest, deadliest man with
<v Speaker 3>a six gun that I ever knew. Nice, incredible.
<v Speaker 1>Did you know that?
<v Speaker 3>There's some talk about whether or not Doc Holliday actually
<v Speaker 3>did end Johnny ringdow say that again, so Johnny Ringo.
<v Speaker 3>It's been reported the Doc Holliday killed Johnny Ringo. He
<v Speaker 3>kills him in the movie right over the temple, and
<v Speaker 3>that's kind of generally accepted as what happened. However, there
<v Speaker 3>was a bullet hole in the right temple and an
<v Speaker 3>exit wound in the back of Johnny Ringo's head. Okay,
<v Speaker 3>his revolver had one round expended and he was found
<v Speaker 3>with his gun in his hand finger on the trigger,
<v Speaker 3>and his boots were tied to his saddle. Okay, Okay,
<v Speaker 3>so some people reported it as a suicide. Okay, My
<v Speaker 3>question is when you commit suicide, how many people put
<v Speaker 3>the gun to their temple?
<v Speaker 1>I don't know.
<v Speaker 3>So they tied your boots to your saddles, so the
<v Speaker 3>scorpions and snakes can't get in your boots?
<v Speaker 1>Right, Are you're gonna commit suicide?
<v Speaker 6>Why bother?
<v Speaker 5>Right?
<v Speaker 1>Yeah? I don't buy it. I don't even I think
<v Speaker 1>Doc Holliday killed him. I think so do Okay, So
<v Speaker 1>we know Curly Bill in the movie shoots Fred White, right, ye, Marshall, Yes,
<v Speaker 1>Apparently that's actually historically accurate as well. Apparently White Irp
<v Speaker 1>had heard the scuffle going on between the two men.
<v Speaker 1>He rushes out there to try to help out, and
<v Speaker 1>he's whenever white Erp is padding down Curly Bill, Fred
<v Speaker 1>White tries to take the gun out of Curly Bill's hand.
<v Speaker 1>The gun goes off and kills Fred White. So that's
<v Speaker 1>it was a little bit different than how it was portrayed,
<v Speaker 1>but it's still kind of this accident like Curly Bill's
<v Speaker 1>you know, he's like get up, you know, come on, Fred,
<v Speaker 1>Like it was an accident, and so that was true,
<v Speaker 1>Like they didn't know if it was really a murder
<v Speaker 1>or it was just an accidental shooting, you know, as
<v Speaker 1>he's trying to grab the gun out right. And so
<v Speaker 1>that's why Curly Bill in real life didn't go to
<v Speaker 1>prison for this. It was deemed not enough to convict
<v Speaker 1>him of murder.
<v Speaker 3>I also know the true story, like Virgil got shot
<v Speaker 3>in the arm and like destroyed his arm, he had
<v Speaker 3>nerve damaged.
<v Speaker 1>Morgan got shot in the back. Had Morgan's actually went
<v Speaker 1>through his right shoulder and out his left shoulder, like
<v Speaker 1>it went through his whoa, Like it was worse than
<v Speaker 1>they portrayed it in the movie. Wow, Yeah, that's incredible.
<v Speaker 1>You know why er never ever got hit by a
<v Speaker 1>bullet that is insane, Like never, like he at the
<v Speaker 1>shootout at the River where Curly Bill gets killed. Yeah,
<v Speaker 1>and they're like, that's true, that really happened, and it's
<v Speaker 1>this crazy. You know, he's out there in the middle
<v Speaker 1>of the fight. Yeah. I don't know if it was
<v Speaker 1>that crazy, but it was still pretty crazy. And they
<v Speaker 1>said afterwards his coat was full of bullet holes, but
<v Speaker 1>none of them had actually touched on unbelievable. Unbelievable. You're saying, God,
<v Speaker 1>reach down from heaven and stop those bullets from it.
<v Speaker 3>That's fascinating, a miracle. All right, let's talk about the
<v Speaker 3>line I'm your huckleberry.
<v Speaker 2>Okay, whoa, I didn't think you had it in you.
<v Speaker 3>I'm your huckleberry.
<v Speaker 1>Why, Johnny Ringo?
<v Speaker 5>It looked like somebody had just walked over your grave.
<v Speaker 3>Great line. Yeah, it's punctuated so well in the movie.
<v Speaker 1>What does it mean? I didn't know until I started
<v Speaker 1>doing some research. Tell me what you found out.
<v Speaker 3>All right, So here's here's the take. Right that the
<v Speaker 3>handles on a coffin are called huckles. Okay, So essentially
<v Speaker 3>it was I'm your huckle bearer, right, Okay, So a
<v Speaker 3>hucklebearer is somebody who is your pall bearer. So essentially
<v Speaker 3>saying I'm going to carry your body at your funeral.
<v Speaker 1>Interesting, But what's an actual huckleberry? Isn't that like a
<v Speaker 1>little like spur, like a little cart dog from the seventies.
<v Speaker 1>I don't know.
<v Speaker 3>All I know is that is supposedly where that came from.
<v Speaker 1>I'm your huckle bearer. So there you go. Okay, guys,
<v Speaker 1>we're going to take a brief intermission and go to
<v Speaker 1>our surely showcase. Yeah, that's right.
<v Speaker 3>This week we've got Jeff Mazuka from the thirty something
<v Speaker 3>Movie Podcast, just a good friend of ours, along with John,
<v Speaker 3>Patton Bow and Dennis. Those guys over there are great.
<v Speaker 1>He's a better friend of mine than you. Yeah, he
<v Speaker 1>likes me better. Well, I swear I when I don't
<v Speaker 1>give it away, don't give it away? All right?
<v Speaker 7>Right, Hey guys, it's Jeff Mazuka, co host of the
<v Speaker 7>thirty something Movie Podcast. I'm calling in with my final
<v Speaker 7>judgment on one of your pairings because Jason had reached
<v Speaker 7>out to me, Well, he'd actually reached out to Pat,
<v Speaker 7>but had accidentally sent Pat's message to me, but assured
<v Speaker 7>me that he had meant to reach out to me
<v Speaker 7>as well, so I might actually be responding to a
<v Speaker 7>pity invite.
<v Speaker 6>Regardless. The episode that I'm calling in.
<v Speaker 7>About is Jaws versus Jurassic Park. And where do I
<v Speaker 7>even begin. I've shared with you how the pairing of
<v Speaker 7>these movies blew my mind when I first heard you
<v Speaker 7>talk about it, and I can't tell you how many
<v Speaker 7>times the question of Jaws versus Jurassic Park will pop
<v Speaker 7>into my head completely out of the blue.
<v Speaker 6>So on what merit does one make this decision.
<v Speaker 7>I love both of these movies equally and really dig
<v Speaker 7>the similarities between them, despite being almost twenty years apart.
<v Speaker 7>The mere fact that Spielberg had the forethought to do
<v Speaker 7>as much as he did with so very little when
<v Speaker 7>making Jaws so early in his career is quite remarkable.
<v Speaker 7>The minimal approach to the movie monster goes a long
<v Speaker 7>way in selling the threat to moviegoing audiences, and John
<v Speaker 7>Williams's music also works on a minimal level.
<v Speaker 6>I believe it was d.
<v Speaker 7>Who had pointed out in your episodes that it was
<v Speaker 7>essentially two notes that drove the whole musical narrative forward,
<v Speaker 7>and the manipulation of those two notes and the tempos
<v Speaker 7>and the pitch and tone that helps perceive the threat
<v Speaker 7>as being.
<v Speaker 6>More real or less of a threat.
<v Speaker 7>I could go on and on about Jaws, because I
<v Speaker 7>love that movie, But then there's Jurassic Park Again.
<v Speaker 6>You get Spielberg taking a stab.
<v Speaker 7>At making a monster movie, but you get the sense
<v Speaker 7>that he had learned so much from his time making
<v Speaker 7>Jaws and he was not going to make the same
<v Speaker 7>mistakes he took a chance on utilizing CGI to showcase
<v Speaker 7>his dinosaurs, which was a huge risk, and with a
<v Speaker 7>great risk comes a great reward because his dinosaurs are magnificent.
<v Speaker 7>But he still knew when to do more with less,
<v Speaker 7>like the tremor vibrations in the puddle to help indicate
<v Speaker 7>the threat of the t rex.
<v Speaker 6>He's showing us that he's a much.
<v Speaker 7>More disciplined director at this point in his career, and
<v Speaker 7>John Williams score seems more full and rich and dynamic,
<v Speaker 7>also showcasing a more matured artist. With the themes that
<v Speaker 7>both fly and terrify, thrill and chill, Drastic Park landed
<v Speaker 7>at a pivotal time for me in terms of grasping
<v Speaker 7>my intrigue.
<v Speaker 6>One of those.
<v Speaker 7>Formative type movies for anyone who considers himself a movie
<v Speaker 7>ban It was the same sense of awe and wonder
<v Speaker 7>I had after I first saw Who Framed Roger Rabbit.
<v Speaker 7>It's a film that just lands at the right time
<v Speaker 7>to pique enough interest and again create such a sense
<v Speaker 7>of awe and wonder. Plus I had just finished reading
<v Speaker 7>the novel in a joint educational effort between my freshman
<v Speaker 7>year English and biology classes, so.
<v Speaker 6>I was all in on this movie.
<v Speaker 7>But would there even be a movie of Jurassic Park
<v Speaker 7>without there having been Jaws? And if there was, would
<v Speaker 7>Spielberg still have directed it, And if so, would he
<v Speaker 7>have been able to deliver on the same level as
<v Speaker 7>what he gave us? Or was Jaws a necessary part
<v Speaker 7>of the Jurassic Park equation?
<v Speaker 6>So does that earn it.
<v Speaker 7>The title of better movie because of its foundational principles?
<v Speaker 7>When I look around at the movie posters on display
<v Speaker 7>and my man cave, there was only one of the
<v Speaker 7>two on display. Because this movie came out at just
<v Speaker 7>the right time for me, and because I had such
<v Speaker 7>a strong connection to it, and because it had done
<v Speaker 7>just a little bit more to help shape my interest
<v Speaker 7>in movies, I'm going to act a side with Jason
<v Speaker 7>and say that Jurassic Park narrowly beats out.
<v Speaker 6>Jaws as being the better movie for me.
<v Speaker 7>Thank you, guys for giving me such a great question
<v Speaker 7>to ponder and forgiving me the opportunity to share my thoughts.
<v Speaker 6>Keep up the great work.
<v Speaker 1>Uh, Jeff, what?
<v Speaker 7>No?
<v Speaker 1>Okay, I don't blame you. I don't blame you because
<v Speaker 1>it was an influential time. Siding with Jason, I can't
<v Speaker 1>believe he doesn't have a Jaws poster. How do you
<v Speaker 1>not have a Jaws poster? And your man game? I know, right,
<v Speaker 1>you need to get on that.
<v Speaker 3>I'm giving us a pat on the back too, because
<v Speaker 3>that's a great matchup.
<v Speaker 1>Heck ya it is if you miss those.
<v Speaker 3>That's a three parter back in the summer of twenty twenty.
<v Speaker 1>And every second is goal.
<v Speaker 3>That was back in the middle of COVID when we
<v Speaker 3>had nothing better to do than just talk about Jaws
<v Speaker 3>addressing part Yeah, And for the record, Jeff, I swear
<v Speaker 3>I did text Pat right before you, and I copied
<v Speaker 3>and pasted, but I didn't change the wording from Pat
<v Speaker 3>to Jeff.
<v Speaker 1>I swear it's not a pition. But thanks Jeff, appreciate you. You
<v Speaker 1>guys over there at thirty something. Keep up the great work.
<v Speaker 1>You guys are awesome. All right, Now back to the show.
<v Speaker 1>Let's talk about that Tom Mixed web we talked about.
<v Speaker 1>He said that at the very end of the movie.
<v Speaker 1>That's the last line of the movie, and Tom Mix
<v Speaker 1>wept and you said, who the heck is Tom X?
<v Speaker 1>To me? Right? So Tom Mix was one of the
<v Speaker 1>very first movie Cowboys and one of the most famous
<v Speaker 1>movie Cowboys and the Old Knock. When you the knock
<v Speaker 1>that everybody does you know? Shave and hair cut two bits.
<v Speaker 1>The second line of that song is who knows the
<v Speaker 1>barber Tom mix That's where the song came from. Wow,
<v Speaker 1>that's how famous he is. So it's a big deal
<v Speaker 1>that he wept at Wiater funeral and was a huckle
<v Speaker 1>bearer for him.
<v Speaker 3>That is that's that's a great story. Somewhere Roger Rabbit
<v Speaker 3>is going crazy.
<v Speaker 1>Waiting for that, waiting for that.
<v Speaker 3>You know who almost directed Tombstone? This was in an
<v Speaker 3>interview in the late nineties. John Carpenter almost directed Tombstone.
<v Speaker 3>I can't figure that out, John Carpenter and Kurt Russell.
<v Speaker 1>Were you mean, like maybe they were gonna call John
<v Speaker 1>Carpenter instead of George Costomos, Costamos whatever. Think about it.
<v Speaker 3>When Kurt Russell looks around and there's nobody directing except
<v Speaker 3>for him, Yeah, I guess, Hey, I know a guy
<v Speaker 3>does a good job. John Clark, Escape from New York
<v Speaker 3>the thing.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, right, that would have been an interesting take.
<v Speaker 3>All right, let's I got a couple of stories for
<v Speaker 3>you on young guns. So let's flip back over to
<v Speaker 3>Young Guns.
<v Speaker 1>Okay, yeah, sounds good.
<v Speaker 4>All right.
<v Speaker 3>So Christopher Kane, the director of Leon Guns. Yeah, he
<v Speaker 3>is Dean Kin's father. Yeah, of Loews and Clark, Right,
<v Speaker 3>Dean Kane. Yeah, so Dean Kane was a football player.
<v Speaker 3>He was at Princeton. I think he had been in
<v Speaker 3>a few movies while he was in high school on college. Anyway,
<v Speaker 3>he came to visit the set. Uh huh, and he
<v Speaker 3>brought his girlfriend, Brook Shields. What Brooke Shields?
<v Speaker 1>So wait, wait, wait, wait.
<v Speaker 3>Dean Kine and Brooke Shields went to princetone at the
<v Speaker 3>same time.
<v Speaker 1>They're the same age, I guess, So I guess she
<v Speaker 1>was pretty young whenever she was super young.
<v Speaker 3>And so they show up. It's funny because even if
<v Speaker 3>you're a member of the brat pack, which lou Diamond
<v Speaker 3>Phillips said being in this movie automatically made me a
<v Speaker 3>member of the brat pack, you can still be starstruck.
<v Speaker 3>So when Brookshields show up, apparently all the guys were like, what's.
<v Speaker 1>Up, was like, hey man, that's right.
<v Speaker 3>Okay, just a couple of things. There was a scene
<v Speaker 3>cut where Charlie goes to a whorehouse. Right, okay, you
<v Speaker 3>actually see him visit a prostitute and she they're making
<v Speaker 3>their transaction or whatever, and he says, ma'am, I just.
<v Speaker 1>Want to hold you. Okay, I remember that.
<v Speaker 3>Okay, there's a scene that with another additional scene that
<v Speaker 3>was cut that sort of further explained that that's Charlie's mother.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I'm glad they cut that scene.
<v Speaker 3>Well in case of Schimsko was like, I wish they
<v Speaker 3>had to let that in. That was kind of didn't
<v Speaker 3>really fully exp playing what was happening.
<v Speaker 1>Uh huh, No, thank you. I'm happy that they just
<v Speaker 1>moved on quickly. Yeah, okay.
<v Speaker 3>Now then I listened to the commentary. All Right, if
<v Speaker 3>you grew up in the nineties, you know the song
<v Speaker 3>Regulate by Warren g Yeah, play it right here.
<v Speaker 5>Regulators, you regulate any stealing of his property.
<v Speaker 1>We're damn good too.
<v Speaker 6>But you can't be.
<v Speaker 1>Any geek off the street.
<v Speaker 6>You gotta be handy with the steel, if you know what.
<v Speaker 1>I mean, or you keep regular. No, it was a
<v Speaker 1>clear black knight, a clear white man woman.
<v Speaker 3>He was on the streets trying to consume some searchful thing.
<v Speaker 3>You have that whole monologue at the beginning that's directly
<v Speaker 3>lifted from Young Guns, and it's Casey Chimesko and Charlie
<v Speaker 3>beowdre is saying, you gotta be handy with the steel.
<v Speaker 3>It can't be any geek off the street, right, that
<v Speaker 3>whole thing. So in the commentary, they're like, hey, Casey,
<v Speaker 3>how much you get paid for that song?
<v Speaker 8>Man?
<v Speaker 1>That song was everywhere? And he's like, what you talk
<v Speaker 1>about it? What's like that song? That rab sign?
<v Speaker 3>It's like, I don't know what you guys, And I
<v Speaker 3>believed him that he legitimately did not know anything about
<v Speaker 3>that song.
<v Speaker 1>Oh my gosh, that's that's hilarious. How about that breaking
<v Speaker 1>my set? I can't believe they they took my rings,
<v Speaker 1>they took my rope.
<v Speaker 4>I look set.
<v Speaker 1>Damn one another thing.
<v Speaker 3>They talked about how cold it was the day that
<v Speaker 3>they shot John Tunstall's murder, right, so so called is
<v Speaker 3>like the coldest day on the set, and of course
<v Speaker 3>they're out in the middle of New Mexico in the
<v Speaker 3>winter time. That said that the stuntman who his job
<v Speaker 3>was to stand up, get shot, fall off the stage right,
<v Speaker 3>or fall off the cart or whatever. Okay, so when
<v Speaker 3>he hit the ground it was like hitting concrete.
<v Speaker 1>Had to go to the hospital. Oh no.
<v Speaker 3>And the last story I have for you the soundtrack
<v Speaker 3>for Young Guns two. Okay, I tried to entice you,
<v Speaker 3>going track by track.
<v Speaker 1>You did, but I couldn't know.
<v Speaker 5>You couldn't.
<v Speaker 1>This album meant so much to me the summer night.
<v Speaker 1>I'm sorry to dance on your engrave, your carede. That's okay,
<v Speaker 1>that's terrible.
<v Speaker 3>So everybody hit us up on Facebook told me that
<v Speaker 3>he should listen to the Young Gun's too centric.
<v Speaker 1>But here's the deal. Does this mean we can't be friends?
<v Speaker 1>If I thought we couldn't be friends, I couldn't, all right.
<v Speaker 1>So Amelia Estevez is good buddies with John bon Jovi, Okay,
<v Speaker 1>all right, yeah?
<v Speaker 3>And I think it's because Richie Sambora at the time
<v Speaker 3>had been dating Ali Shei.
<v Speaker 1>So you got too complicated. It's got you got.
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, you got breakfast clubs linked to bon Jovi, and
<v Speaker 3>that's how it works, right, right. So Joan bon Jovi
<v Speaker 3>visited the set and he was hanging around and Emelio said,
<v Speaker 3>I want you to provide a song for the movie.
<v Speaker 1>He goes, I want you to let us choose wanted
<v Speaker 1>dead or alive?
<v Speaker 3>Right, And John's like, well, okay, but those lyrics don't
<v Speaker 3>really fit the story.
<v Speaker 1>Of the movie. True. He's like, so let me we
<v Speaker 1>just write something.
<v Speaker 3>So they all go out for cheeseburgers one day, right,
<v Speaker 3>So they're all sitting around a table and Keeper Solan
<v Speaker 3>said that John actually just started to get quiet and
<v Speaker 3>he started to write on a napkin and they're all
<v Speaker 3>just munching, just hanging out and munching.
<v Speaker 1>Drinking beers and just hanging out.
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, And he said, after about ten minutes, John laid
<v Speaker 3>the napkins in front of Amelia and said, here's the song,
<v Speaker 3>and it's gonna be a hit. That song, Blaze of
<v Speaker 3>Glory's got to number three.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.
<v Speaker 3>Amelio still has those cocktail napkins framed.
<v Speaker 1>And he's like, oh, that's awesome. I wish I could
<v Speaker 1>get a picture of those. Yeah, so good. Yeah, that's awesome.
<v Speaker 1>The soundtracks score wise on these are not automated. I
<v Speaker 1>liked the soundtrack on Young Guns two better than the
<v Speaker 1>one on Young Guns one, although the one on Young
<v Speaker 1>Guns one did a nice job of being kind of
<v Speaker 1>edgy and more eighties sounding. But they brought Allan Sevestri
<v Speaker 1>in to do the soundtrack for part two we don't remember.
<v Speaker 1>We remember Alan Savestri from Back to the Future of course,
<v Speaker 1>Romancing the Stone, and then of course he went on
<v Speaker 1>to do you know, the Marvel movies, which is not
<v Speaker 1>an insignificant thing at all. For Tombstone, our composer was
<v Speaker 1>a guy named Bruce Brought. He had done mostly TV
<v Speaker 1>series and the one that, like the last TV series
<v Speaker 1>that he did, that he composed for before he hit
<v Speaker 1>the big movie scene. Everybody knows his song.
<v Speaker 4>It's the theme from Dallas Whoa.
<v Speaker 1>And so right after that he composed the theme for
<v Speaker 1>He composed the score for Silverado Kevin Costner, all that
<v Speaker 1>good stuff, right, and so then that, you know, that
<v Speaker 1>leads him down a path with more movies, most of
<v Speaker 1>which you probably don't know. He did The Monster Squad though,
<v Speaker 1>that's one. He also did Lost in Space, which came
<v Speaker 1>out in ninety eight. But this one I thought he
<v Speaker 1>did a fantastic job of putting music that led the
<v Speaker 1>story without being overwhelming.
<v Speaker 3>All right, So the composer for Young Guns one is
<v Speaker 3>this guy named Anthony Marinelli. Okay, Now the interesting thing
<v Speaker 3>about Anthony Marinelli he worked.
<v Speaker 1>For Quincy Jones.
<v Speaker 3>Okay, Marinelli and his former partner Brian Banks are credited
<v Speaker 3>with performance and synthesizer programming on Thriller.
<v Speaker 1>Oh my god.
<v Speaker 3>The same guy, Yes, the same guy who wrote the
<v Speaker 3>score for Young Guns performed on Thriller.
<v Speaker 5>Yeah.
<v Speaker 1>He also was involved with the soundtrack for War Games
<v Speaker 1>and Over the Top just to throw a couple, and
<v Speaker 1>Demolition Man if you have to sit through that, John
<v Speaker 1>Reed loves Demolition Man. He didn't even know what the
<v Speaker 1>shelves are for.
<v Speaker 3>Okay, So before we get to final judgment, Yes, there's
<v Speaker 3>one piece of the pie that I want to talk
<v Speaker 3>about from Young Guns Too.
<v Speaker 1>Okay, okay, and I.
<v Speaker 3>Think we talked about it briefly, but Young Guns Too
<v Speaker 3>takes the legend of Brushy Bill Roberts.
<v Speaker 1>Oh yes, right, oh yeah, this is huge. Yeah, we
<v Speaker 1>got to talk about this.
<v Speaker 5>Yeah.
<v Speaker 3>So there's a guy who said I am Billy the Kid.
<v Speaker 1>I mean, the movie begins with Brushy Bill in the
<v Speaker 1>desert saying I want my pardon from Governor Wallace, like
<v Speaker 1>I was promised before I die. Yes, yes, true, that
<v Speaker 1>is true. This is literally this guy existed and claimed
<v Speaker 1>to be Billy the Kid.
<v Speaker 3>Like.
<v Speaker 1>They had court cases about it.
<v Speaker 3>I know, right, They wanted to exhum Billy the Kid's
<v Speaker 3>mother to take her DNA to compare it with Brushy Bill.
<v Speaker 1>Because they couldn't take Billy the Kid because his grave
<v Speaker 1>had gotten washed away in a flood and they didn't
<v Speaker 1>know where he was.
<v Speaker 3>We don't know where his body is, right, It's incredible that,
<v Speaker 3>like researchers have, they've done facial recognition, they didn't.
<v Speaker 1>Unsolved mysteries on this guy. I mean, this is not
<v Speaker 1>this is a real deal. But they did the ninety
<v Speaker 1>three percent match. That's pretty solid. That seems like a
<v Speaker 1>big deal with me. I mean because you just got
<v Speaker 1>to think about it. Not only did this guy claim
<v Speaker 1>to be Billy the Kid, yes, which I mean, let's
<v Speaker 1>just think about it. Just to make that claim, you
<v Speaker 1>got to be if you were crazy, right, you go,
<v Speaker 1>you're gonna be like, okay, but you don't look anything
<v Speaker 1>like him, right, No, this guy looks like him ninety
<v Speaker 1>three percent, And apparently he knew stories that only Billy
<v Speaker 1>or somebody who had ridden closely with Billy would have known.
<v Speaker 1>Listen to this. Yeah.
<v Speaker 3>Former Jesse Evans gang member Jim McMichaels, along with Severo
<v Speaker 3>Diego's Martil Abo and Jose Montoya, all of whom had
<v Speaker 3>known Billy the Kid, signed affidavits verifying their belief that
<v Speaker 3>Brushy Bill Roberts was, in fact Billy the Kid.
<v Speaker 1>Pat Garrett had quickly buried the body after the death. Yep, quickly, yes,
<v Speaker 1>And somebody that was there with him was like, Nope,
<v Speaker 1>that wasn't Billy the Kid. That was some other guy
<v Speaker 1>that he buried. Right.
<v Speaker 3>So the witnesses, right were Poe Yep the guy that
<v Speaker 3>Vigo Mortensen. He had never seen Billy the Kid to
<v Speaker 3>recognize him, right, Yeah, Pad Garrett, of course he had Billy.
<v Speaker 1>The Kid in the room and it was dark. Yeah.
<v Speaker 3>One of the people there said, that's not kidd.
<v Speaker 1>Right, Okay. Are we about to go to final judgment? Yes? Okay,
<v Speaker 1>So there's one more thing that we've overlooked and I
<v Speaker 1>cannot bear to overlook it.
<v Speaker 6>Okay.
<v Speaker 1>We didn't bring him up in casting, we didn't bring
<v Speaker 1>him up in lines. But other than wider up and
<v Speaker 1>doc Holiday, he probably has the most memorable lines in
<v Speaker 1>the home movie Mister Billy Bob Thornton as Johnny Tyler,
<v Speaker 1>Johnny Tyler man cap Nice. So all of those lines,
<v Speaker 1>this is Billy Bob's breakout performance. Right, Like he went
<v Speaker 1>on to become a megastar after this movie, like sling
<v Speaker 1>Blade made him something special. We had simple planned. I mean,
<v Speaker 1>he did a lot of great stuff, but this was
<v Speaker 1>really the first movie that you saw him and he
<v Speaker 1>was a tub and it rises it out of a
<v Speaker 1>tub like you. So he's got all these lines that
<v Speaker 1>he's spitting out. I can't tell you how many times
<v Speaker 1>I've said, it's like I'm playing cards with my brother's
<v Speaker 1>kids or something. Right, So none of those lines were scripted.
<v Speaker 1>All they said to Billy Bob Thornton was go be
<v Speaker 1>a bully, pressed all money.
<v Speaker 2>It's like I'm sitting here playing cards with my brother's
<v Speaker 2>kids or something.
<v Speaker 1>And he threw all of those gold nugget genius quotable
<v Speaker 1>lines out on his own. That's awesome. You back that
<v Speaker 1>queen one more time. I'm going to plow you up. Sorry,
<v Speaker 1>I can't say the rest of that line Wildcats as Sorry?
<v Speaker 1>Is that affect this? In fact? That is a fact?
<v Speaker 1>All right?
<v Speaker 3>Are we ready for final judgment between these three awesome movies?
<v Speaker 1>Yeah? This is really hard. This is really hard. But
<v Speaker 1>play your final judgment music here, it comes. Okay, you're
<v Speaker 1>good person.
<v Speaker 3>All right, all right, I really think I'm gonna be
<v Speaker 3>in the minority.
<v Speaker 1>Okay, okay, all right, here is my final judgment.
<v Speaker 3>Before I give that to you, let me just throw
<v Speaker 3>this out.
<v Speaker 5>Okay.
<v Speaker 3>I was born in nineteen seventy three, which meant I
<v Speaker 3>was about fifteen sixteen, fifteen.
<v Speaker 1>When Young Guns one came out.
<v Speaker 3>I was seventeen when The Guns two came out. I
<v Speaker 3>was a young gun.
<v Speaker 1>Okay.
<v Speaker 3>So when I saw those two movies first, they blew
<v Speaker 3>me away. You know, the idea of MTV cowboys really
<v Speaker 3>appealed to me. These guys are a little bit older
<v Speaker 3>than me, not a lot older than me, but they're
<v Speaker 3>gun slingers, they're law men, they're wild, they're rebels, they're
<v Speaker 3>having fun. They're shooting up the old West.
<v Speaker 1>Who wouldn't want to do that?
<v Speaker 5>Right?
<v Speaker 3>And then you take Tombstone, which I saw in college,
<v Speaker 3>which I loved, and it's totally horrible.
<v Speaker 1>Okay.
<v Speaker 3>I loved all the white stuff, but that's those guys
<v Speaker 3>were older men right now, had tons of fun. Doc
<v Speaker 3>Holliday is awesome, Kurt Russell is kicking bit as well.
<v Speaker 1>White Herb.
<v Speaker 3>But the love story is like an anchor around the
<v Speaker 3>neck of someone trying to swim. It just totally fell
<v Speaker 3>flat for me. Okay, so I am going to rank
<v Speaker 3>Young Guns one as number one, right behind it Young
<v Speaker 3>Guns two at number two, and then in last place,
<v Speaker 3>but just by millimeters is Tombstone. Oh my word, They're
<v Speaker 3>all interchangeable. I can throw any in at any time.
<v Speaker 3>I watched the whole thing.
<v Speaker 1>No no, no, no, no no, no, all right, what
<v Speaker 1>do you got what do you got to I got
<v Speaker 1>a loss of respect for you, my friend. Okay, So
<v Speaker 1>I watched Young Guns one and Young Guns two with
<v Speaker 1>my boy, Yes, right, Caleb. I wanted to watch Tombstone
<v Speaker 1>with him, but basically I couldn't get it in and
<v Speaker 1>the time that we had he actually got in a
<v Speaker 1>fight at school split it from school. I'm a little
<v Speaker 1>worried it was had something to do with the movies
<v Speaker 1>we watched anyway, and he say, I'm your hunk, right,
<v Speaker 1>I know that's the way it went. Yes, So, going
<v Speaker 1>into this like my preconceived notion, I was like, Okay,
<v Speaker 1>I know, I'm picking Tombstone as the winner. But then
<v Speaker 1>I started thinking about it. I was like, man, I
<v Speaker 1>really did like Young Guns too. It was really really good.
<v Speaker 1>And it was better than Young Guns one, and so
<v Speaker 1>I got it. It may be it may push out Tombstone.
<v Speaker 1>Tombstone may go to number two. Young Guns Too may
<v Speaker 1>go to number one. Okay, once I watched the movies,
<v Speaker 1>I completely threw all of that out, completely threw it out.
<v Speaker 1>So I remembered Young Guns one as being kind of
<v Speaker 1>it seemed like it was grainy and old fashion, and
<v Speaker 1>it was which didn't appeal to me when I was
<v Speaker 1>in my teenage years. But now looking back at it,
<v Speaker 1>it's a better made movie. It's a better made movie
<v Speaker 1>than Young Guns two. And my eleven year old agreed
<v Speaker 1>with me when we got when we're three quarters into
<v Speaker 1>Young Guns two, he's like, dad's a great movie, but
<v Speaker 1>it's not as good as Young Guns one. I was like, wow,
<v Speaker 1>boy wow. And he was really upset that they killed Dick.
<v Speaker 1>I was. I was talking to my wife in the
<v Speaker 1>car We're taking him to practice, and I'm talking about
<v Speaker 1>Young Guns one, and he's like, I can't believe they
<v Speaker 1>killed Dick. She's like, well, I haven't seen it, so
<v Speaker 1>thanks for giving that up. So I flipped on those.
<v Speaker 1>I don't think Young Guns Too better. It's good. It's
<v Speaker 1>a great movie, but it's not better than one. One
<v Speaker 1>is better. But when we come in for the number
<v Speaker 1>one spot, I have to say Tombstone. Yes, the love
<v Speaker 1>story is terrible, and yes, you could cut it out
<v Speaker 1>and you would have a perfect movie. It is imperfect
<v Speaker 1>because of the love story. Yes, but when you're comparing
<v Speaker 1>the good parts of Tombstone versus anything in Young Guns
<v Speaker 1>one or two, Tombstone wins the day hands down. Young
<v Speaker 1>Guns one comes in second place, Young Guns two and third.
<v Speaker 1>That's my final judgment on it.
<v Speaker 3>Okay, yeah, all right, everybody out there, we want to
<v Speaker 3>hear from you. Let us know these are three great movies.
<v Speaker 1>How do we do? Yeah, and you've stuck with this
<v Speaker 1>this long. Hit that subscribe button right, hit the follow button.
<v Speaker 1>Make sure that you get our next episode, which will
<v Speaker 1>be out next Tuesday, and we are going to cover
<v Speaker 1>two awesome albums and bands eighteen eighty six Run DMC,
<v Speaker 1>can the Beast, the Boys.
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, hie, you're right ex treatment.
<v Speaker 1>All right, thank you very much. We'll see you next week.