Who Could The Braves Target For The Rotation?

00:00:21
Speaker 1: Hello everyone, and welcome back to the Hamber Territory Podcast. This is episode three, This zero three. My name is Brad Roland. I am joined today. I'm a good friend Scott Coleman. Scott. Is the first episode of December. We are into the holiday season in full force. How are you, my friend?

00:00:40
Speaker 2: Hello Brad, It is good as always to see you and I hope everybody out there had a happy and safe Thanksgiving. And you know we're making progress into the off season. As of recording this or when folks are listening, we are about a week away from the Winter Meetings, which gets started on December seventh, and maybe we'll get some more activity there. We have seen a little bit more activity across the league. Of course, the Braves made a couple moves early as well, so fingers crossed a busy couple weeks ahead before kind of everything goes silent around Christmas and New Year's. But we have about three and a half weeks to hopefully get some action in before things quiet down again.

00:01:15
Speaker 1: Yeah, we might do like a Winter Meetings preview letter this week if nothing else is going on, but we are week from away from that, like you said, and the draft lottery happens then, which the Braves are actually invested in this time around. That's an odd feeling that we'll talk about. But by the way, if anybody missed it, Scott did a great interview with our old friend Carlos Closma Baseball America that dropped on the feed during Thanksgiving week. Good prospect content, far system rankings, and all kinds of things that I am not equip to talk about as well as my old friend Carlos's. So that was good to listen to passively on the road, as I'm sure many of you did as well. Also, I'll say this, you and I a couple of weeks ago gathered to do kind of a relief pitcher market primer. Perhaps it was like, hey, here's all the guys that Brave might look atmarket, and we did that one first, and we kind of said that on the show even that night, like hey, this might move quickly, let's go ahead and do this now. And we were pressia in that one time. We're usually not prescient, Scott, we were at that point in time because the Braves then went out and sign russall Glaciers thoughts about it shortly after that. Today we're going to do the starting pitching version of that discussion as our first show in December. And I like to say that that was an original idea that we had, but also it was kind of prompted by what happened the last several days in the market. While most guys have not signed yet, still I know that's your favorite thing. It has happened, some stuff has happened, and most of it's been geared toward the pitching market. So basically, in response to two things that have happened, we're doing this one of them. I have to just throw your way because we've talked about Sunny Gray for years and I really kind of thought it might happen this time around, Scott.

00:02:51
Speaker 2: It didn't.

00:02:52
Speaker 1: It didn't happen this time around. Sunny Gray is not going to be a brave He's going to Boston instead.

00:02:57
Speaker 2: Your thoughts, you know, Red, We're going to keep the dream going. And if folks are new, it's a bit. I don't actually think Sonny Gray is like a top three pitcher.

00:03:07
Speaker 1: On a couple of people like, yes you do, Yes you do. That's fine.

00:03:10
Speaker 2: He is my Charlie Morton to you.

00:03:13
Speaker 1: That's that's exactly where I actually almost madly that joke on Twitter the night that had happened. So Greg got trades. If people didn't notice, great Greg got trades at Boston. A lot of money went back to Saint Louis to get him to go to Boston. It's not a bravest thing. So we won't talk about much more beyond that, but we did genuinely think it was interesting to talk about because Sonny Gray is very bravesy and I know you like him. He's been your white Will. But also like, it wasn't shocking that he didn't come to the Braves. What's a situation where we're like deciding he was definitely coming. But it does make for good podcasting. It's a good bit. To your point.

00:03:46
Speaker 2: The only thing I will say about the Sunny Gray trade and then we will move on, although you can bet if he becomes a free agent again in a year. Oh yeah, baby, subscribe follow hit the bell because we will talk about Sonny Gray in twenty twenty six. But until then, you know, I think the equivalent, the Braves equivalent in that trade was probably something like JR. Richie and Bryce Elder, maybe even like Hirston Waldrip and Bryce elder in terms of what Boston got or had to give up to Saint Louis in order to get Gray. That's a pretty steep ask for a picture in his late thirties and is still even with the money coming over, is still making twenty one million. So I wasn't like beside myself at the offer. If Boston would have given up a prospect in the twenties, you know, a seventeen year old who hasn't even stepped foot in America yet to play professionally, that then it would have been, like, man, that would have been nice to do Gray for basically just nothing but money. But I don't fault Alex for not giving up Waldrip or Richie or one of the pictures in the upper tier of the miners to get Sonny Gray.

00:04:48
Speaker 1: I agree, you know it would have been I thought it was reasonable what Boston did. There was a moment when you and I and Steve and Sean were all kind of texting back and forth, like, man, they got I'd be getting a lot of money, right and they and they did. It was twenty million going back to Saint Louis, which sorry, going to Boston from Saint Louis, which made it made it what kind of makes sense for all parties. It wasn't like a grand Slam to your point, to where we were all kicking ourselves. But that happened a guy across off the board that was a potential for the Braves, and then a few days later I thought it was funny as well. The only team that probably wasn't hibernating for Thanksgiving on Wednesday before Thanksgiving was the Toronto Blue Jays because they don't have the same Thanksgiving that we do, and that was a team that made the big splash on Wednesday night. I felt bad, momentarily felt bad for people that cover the Blue Jays. I'm like, man, Wednesday night before Thanksgiving, major major transaction. I would have been furious if the place made a move Wednesday night, but then I thought it was it was Toronto. But anyway, it's a big deal. Dylan Ceees another guy who we've talked about a lot on this podcast, maybe as much or more than Sunny Gray seven years, two hundred and ten million. Now there's some different in there, it seems like. But still that's a big old pile of money for him to go to Toronto and a guy that I think we said on the show was maybe the big ticket, big money guy we thought was at least like somewhat plausible for the Braves, like you felt like kind of a bravezy guy, even though it was such a big contract that it was maybe not likely for that price. I don't think Alex is ever going to go there, but hey, that's a lot of my fanilla and cs and maybe the number one guy off the board, like he was certainly in the top three for sure.

00:06:27
Speaker 2: I think C's will get the most guaranteed money of any pitcher. I don't think franber Valdez gets two hundred ten million. I don't think Ranger Swarez or Michael King or Zach Gallon, who we are all going to talk about here in a couple of minutes on the show, are going to get close to two hundred and ten million. And man, it's a lot of money. Good for Dylan sees One more time. I just want to hammer home one more thing. Front Offices do not give two poops about a pitcher's er. In terms of the evaluating we always hear era it's an older metric, get it. They've been doing it for one hundred and twenty years. That's at the end of the day, how many runs a pitcher gives up. That is his era. But Seeds was not. What do you have an Arran like the mid four's last.

00:07:09
Speaker 1: Year and four point five people were. People kept saying it over and over again when they in reaction to the move, for sure.

00:07:15
Speaker 2: So I wanted to make that note and then hey, good for Seas. He's a local Georgia product. He has been the pillar of health. He makes like thirty two starts every single year. If there was a pitcher and free agency, the Braves were gonna go out all out on I could see it being Seas because he's local and he's highly durable, which is something this team needs. But I do not blame Himthopolis for not beating seven years in two hundred and ten million dollars. Yeah, I do believe if he's not number one and starts made over the last five seasons, he's like in the top couple.

00:07:49
Speaker 1: Actually, no, he is number one. Check I just check. He's number one in all of baseball and starts made the last five years. So yeah, durable, But another deal that's like, while it's not our money, I would have been fine if the Raids give that contract because it's not our money in the At the end of the day, I do understand more than maybe Braves fans seem to the reticence to give out that kind of length more than the money itself. For me, it's not dollars, it's length on pictures. And I think Alex probably feels the same way. But hey, a lot of money for him also could be worth it. I think he's really good. And that kind of prompts us again to kind of do at some point we were going to do the show anyway, but because those two things happen, it's like, you know what, maybe this market starts to speed up a little bit, and before that happens, a little bit of a primer today one thing we should at least do, and I'm telling myself it's more than even you Scott quickly. We should talk about what the Braves have on their roster in the same way we did with the bullpen. It's both better than what they had in the bullpen and also still very uncertain. And we've made the point a million times, but I'm sure we have new listeners our general podcast stance and Scott correct me if you wants to is that you simply do not only need five starting pictures. Everyone loves to direct their top five starting pictures and say that's the rotation. Yes, on opening day you probably will use five. You need seven, eight, nine, ten plus starting pitchers. Yeah, so if you have your five, you like, that's cool, You still need more. That's me talking, and I have said, and I'll let you go on this as well. I've said, even with yes, if you give the rosiest possible interpretation of health for the Braves current roster, they have a rotation that's really good. But if you take one step away from that and realize it takes more than five six guys, they do need more. And my stance is that the Braves need a starting pitcher, a real one, at least one, if not more than one. Between now and April.

00:09:44
Speaker 2: They need to add a starting pitcher who you would feel at least somewhat comfortable giving the ball to in game two of a playoff series, in game three of a playoff series, a needle mover. And we're going to cover pretty wide spectrum of pitching targets tonight. Some of them absolutely fit that bill, some of them are maybe more questionable, but Alexanthoppolas said at his end of season media availability that he wants to add a starting pitcher and that it's a priority. I think he kind of reemphasized that again at the GM meetings a couple of weeks ago. And yeah, man, sure, like if the Braves hit the jackpot and get ninety combined starts from Sale, Schwalenbach and Strider next year, guess what, the team's probably winning ninety plus games and is going to just cruise to the playoffs. Maybe they get another twenty five plus from Waldrip And I mean, that's probably not going to happen, and if it does, then we'll be doing a lot of happy podcasts over the summer, Brad. But yes, they need to add someone and somebody of note if this team wants to be really serious about having depth to navigate not only six months, but then having two or three guys in a playoff series you can feel good about.

00:10:51
Speaker 1: Nineteen pitchers made a start for the Braves last year. Now, granted that was a freshise record. It won't always be nineteen. I'm not being silly, but you need a dozen or more guys like Eric Fetti, Carlos Carrasco, cal Quantrill Davis, Daniel Scott Blewett all made starts with the Braves last year. And I know it was a little up. I know it was a lost season. I understand, but even even in a normal year, I think it's going when things go further, well, you need twelve, you need thirteen like it was. So that's that's the preface to say they need Maybe they do need more quickly. They do have some names that you like. Of course, Chris Sale has been cy Young level since he arrived in Atlanta. He's the number one guy on the team. He's awesome, cool, specially woman Bach has been an ace when he's been pitching. He's coming off the fractured elbow that happened at the end of June. Seems to be on track, but somewhat of the question mark. I feel good about swamah blah, but he's he's come up an injury. Special Strider was not great last year. He did end the season better than he started it, but not a question huge. But like he's gonna he'll be. He's gonna pitch in the rotation if he's healthy.

00:11:57
Speaker 2: We know that.

00:11:58
Speaker 1: But he's not the guy who was three years ago. No, I don't think. And then herson walterp was awesome last year in ten appearances forty six intings. But that's all it was. It's ten appearances, and I think he'll be in a rotation. He looks great for a first round pick et cetera, but not a guy that I'm writing in like full blown permanent ink. So those are the four guys that you are comfortable with. If I would guess any thoughts on those guys quickly.

00:12:25
Speaker 2: I mean, yes, if healthy, I think you feel good. I do think with Waldrop, we've seen pitchers be effective and then and then not be as effective it right or But yes, I mean if healthy I feel good, I think especially the improvements that Waldrop made throughout the course of last year, throwing strikes, working off that splitter that's so nasty, establishing his fastball, which was a big question, and then the other three. If healthy I feel good about I think for Spencer Strider, I mean he is one of the true if he's good man this team. If Strider can get back to anything close to what he was a few years ago, the Brave Seal is so much higher. Without even adding anyone the ceiling is so much higher. But if he's more of just kind of inconsistent or just does not have the same bite to his pitches that he had before, where the God forbid the velocity continues to decline, then that that gets scary. I mean, the Braves full stop needs Strider to be good and healthy next year. Yeah.

00:13:19
Speaker 1: So that's four guys and you feel pretty good. Then you have the two guys who have been quality starters recently but have injury concerns. Grant Holmes coming off of the no surgery rehab on his elbow, could go well, could not, we don't know. Plus could be a bullpen option. Grant Holmes has been in the bullpen before, that'd be totally reasonable to have him there again. We'll see. We'renald A Lopez two years ago, was awesome as a starter before that, was a reliever coming off shoulder surgery basically all last season. We'll see, could be in the bullpen. Same thing. So those guys, I'm not saying you know nothing about Grant Holmes Ronaldo Lopez, but you know enough to say they're not written in income storrying. One piction that'd be where I would put it at this point. Obviously it's early in this process, but as of December one, that's where I would be in the incomplete on both those guys.

00:14:06
Speaker 2: Yeah, no real way to say what you're going to get from Holmes or Lopez if they're healthy, it would be terrific to put it lightly, but that's those are pretty big ifs at this point. And then you know, just to kind of round out the group, aj Smith Schav had Tommy John surgery in June. Everybody recovers from that differently, but I think at bare minimum you're talking about twelve months, so maybe i'll start break it best. Yeah, and if you get Smith Schavor and he's throwing the ball well in August in September, it'll be the chip carry like making a trade without having to make a trade.

00:14:40
Speaker 1: There.

00:14:41
Speaker 2: You could have Smith chaovor even in your bullpen if you want to bring him back slowly and have him work every couple of days instead of going and making a start every five days. And then there's the depth types. Joey Wentz got tender to contract, Bryce Elder is still around, jose Sworez got tender to contract, and and then you have some prospects who are in the upper levels of the minor leagues. JR. Ritchie is somebody who could make his Braves debut. In twenty twenty six we saw ditty Er Fuentes, although Didtier was not ready. He could also be in the mix in a couple of others in the upper levels of the miners. So there are some names there. Again, just to put a bowl on this, Brad and I firmly think the Braves need to add a starting pitcher of some kind, but there are there is some depth here. Of course, we're in December and it's amazing how fast pitching depth can vanish once the games get going.

00:15:32
Speaker 1: Yeah, I was encouraged to hear Alex pretty plainly say they want to add a starter. Well, he didn't even waffle. Usually Alex will do a little bit of a dance. He didn't really do that. He was kind of like, hey, we want we want to add a starter. I agree with you, Alex at a starter, whether it's a trade or a signing or whatever. And the rest of this podcast will be about who is available on the market. So from here on we'll talk about some guys who were not on the organization. That was kind of the primer to say, hey, this is the situation they need pitching, and we'll see what they add in the coming days. In a second, Scott, we'll dive into theate for agents first, big names first, then maybe some trade names. At the end of this conversation, we'll do all that and more after work for de partners.

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00:17:10
Speaker 1: Fam Okay Scott, the big name we thought was most likely is off the board with don't cease in free agency. But there are still three or four, maybe five guys who are projected to be potential, like one hundred million dollar pictures potential. They won't all get that, probably, but we'll see in this is kind of in projection order. But you got Fremervelt, fremerveltez Ranger Suarez, Michael King, a podcast favorite, uh, Zach Gallon, a dim local guy for you, Zach Gallen, Arizona. And then tatsuia Emi. Is that where I'm going with I have no idea how to say this man's name. My apologies to everybody involved, but the Brays do have a history. It's a long time ago now of going overseas. They it's you know, should even say should even say his name? People don't like it to human.

00:18:02
Speaker 2: Shout out Kenshin was that like late to like two thousand and seven, two thousand and eight, two thousand and nine.

00:18:09
Speaker 1: That was lifetimes ago. At this point, Pratt that that they they have done it. It was two thousand and nine. Uh, he was actually pretty good for a year and then that was the end of that. But those are the guys who are basically projected by either Fangrafts or ESPN and Trade Remembers to get in the seventy five to one hundred million dollar range. I guess we'll go one my ones. These are the bigger names. Framer Valdez is number one on all of these projections as far as money.

00:18:37
Speaker 2: Now.

00:18:37
Speaker 1: That seasons off the board. Right. He's almost thirty three years old. But he's been very good for a long time now and it is durable. HRDs one of one of us last four years. The only thing that people talk about him in a negative way is that he potentially crossed up with his own catcher last year. That got that made some national attention. And we talked about him last time, you and I a couple couple of weeks ago. That was like half the comments and you on YouTube was well, we can't sign him.

00:19:01
Speaker 2: He did. I get it.

00:19:02
Speaker 1: Guys, we understand he's he's good at pitching. So, but it seems like it's going to be a five six year deal in the twenty five to thirty plus million dollar range. That's a lot of money. If that's the price, I kind of don't think it's gonna happen. But hey, thoughts on Framber Valdez.

00:19:17
Speaker 2: I mean, my thoughts on fraanbra Valdez is that for a veteran lefty with a long track record of success, given the expected cost and years of commitment, I would imagine that Ranger Suarez is more likely than Framber Valdez. And hey, if the Braves want to go out and sign Framber Valdez, awesome, Like, well, we'll happily take this guy. He has been the model of consistency, especially from the left side. Three point two e array over one hundred and twenty one starts the last four years. That's that is about as good as it gets short of being one of the true aces of all aces in this league. That being said, I think like the big market teams are probably going to be in on Valdez pretty heavily. But if Ranger Swarez is available, it maybe ten million dollars less per season. We all know Alexanthopolis has kind of like this cap right now in the clubhouse of twenty three million dollars for Matt Olsen and Austin Reiley and Akoon. You'll be closer to that. I think that's what Chris Sale is making this upcoming year. Strider is gonna get up to twenty million if he wants to kind of maintain that level of payroll. In terms of individual salaries, I think Ranger Suarez is more likely than Valdez because I just don't see Valdez getting anything less than twenty eight to thirty million dollars a year.

00:20:33
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean some of the projections. You know, five for one point fifty six for one sixty eight is what ESPN had on Thedez. I'd be surprised. I wouldn't hate it, to be one hundred percent clear, I would not hate it. I'd rather go shorter, So five would be better than six on a guy who's already his thirties, like that's most of the guys on this list. But yeah, I'd be fine. Suarez, the projections are in a more reasonable range. You know, five for one fifteen is a number that's out there on end Trade Roumors five for one thirty at Fancrafts, four for ninety two at ESPN. That is much more in the traditional Alex zone. I will also just say this says I have to mention earlier Alex has still never given out a big money deal on a starting pitcher in free agency. The one guy he has paid long term with Strider, and that is an internal buy out some arbitration years move that's a different kind of thing. Also, that's still not at the level of this type of money on a per on annual basis. So the first time he does this will be the first time he's never done this before. With that said, I think, after you know, talking to you a little bit, this is a guy in Suarez. If these numbers are right, Scott, would you be interested in Rangers Juarez at the projection numbers?

00:21:53
Speaker 2: So I will say this, if let's say MLB trade rumors is correct on Ranger Suarez and gets five years and one hundred and fifteen million dollars, so that's five years at twenty three million dollars per year, I would be ecstatic about that deal. Now, maybe it's because Ranger Swarrez has just absolutely dog walked the Braves, for he hears at this point and you'd be stealing him from a division rival in Philadelphia. But Suarez is just he's so good, so consistent. He's thirty years old, so he's not too old where you start to worry about a real fall off. Over the last four years, Ranger Suarez has a three point three eight ERA, a three point five to four FIP. I think he would also benefit from an improved infield defense with the Braves compared to what he had with the Phillies. And I mean, he's just he has been so consistent. He's also a postseason performer. Suarez has performed very well in the playoffs his entire career, often against Atlanta, much to our chagrin. So yeah, I mean, of every player we're going to talk about tonight. I know it's a significant money investment. I know that you would lose a draft pick for signing Wars, But if we got the push alert tomorrow morning that the Brave signs swore as to five years and one hundred and ten hundred and fifteen million dollars, I would be ecstatic. I would be I sit down when I record this podcast, Brad, but I would be jumping up and down and blowing out our audio and making life hell for you.

00:23:18
Speaker 1: I do think I agree, I would like it. I do think he's also a little bit younger than somebody. He's only thirty and just turned thirty in August, So if you want to go a little longer, that's not as as concerning potentially not as durable as well as or as cis. His cap has been like one hundred and sixty innings in his career. I don't know if that's a firm cap, but like he's he's missed some time in each of the last four seasons. He's not pitched every single week, which is not no disaster seasons. Like he's pitch enough, but it's not like he's been a total work horse either.

00:23:52
Speaker 2: I was looking into this a little bit more like Swarez miss time last year he had a groin contusion because he got hit by a comeback fastball. Like it's more a christ cell zone of like weirdness than like actual he had. I think he picked up a mild forearm strain when pitching in the World Baseball Classic like three years ago, but that went away. There's nothing, at least without being able to see his medicals. There's there's not chronic shoulder problems here where it's like, dear God, we could be one pitch away and all of a sudden that contract is going up in flames. Yeah, and also I mean he's he's a lita getting soft contact, like he's not a huge shrikeout guy, but like it's effective, like all of the there's no smoking mirrors here, Like his era is three point three eight, like you said fit at three point five, Like there's no, it's not a blow up situation. Like I think it's really a relatively projectable skill set that should last for a while. And if it's twenty three million a year, twenty four million a year for five or less years, I would be I would be on that just because I think he's meaningfully. I never I never want to use the words on a picture pitching's not safe. No such projectible. That is what I will use instead of the words safe. So yeah, we're in on that, at least at the number that's been bandied about. We'll see if that's the actual number, because Sees came in above his number. For example, he's the only.

00:25:15
Speaker 1: Guy we have a number one so far, The next two guys are a little bit lower omni projections, but they're in the kind of a tier by themselves. Michael King Zach Gallon very different profiles. Zach Gallon is like a former Top five so young guy multiple times like really really, really good and last year was not particularly good. Michael King more of a late bloomer, was a reliever at one point, innings were down last year, but since he's become a starter, he's been basically awesome. So do you have like they're not exactly the same situation, but a lot of the projections are very similar, like a twenty ish million dollars a year profile for these guys, Do you have a preference between the two Michael King versus Zach Gallen?

00:25:58
Speaker 2: So both for King and Gallon, MLB trade rumors projected four years in eighty million dollars, so twenty million a year. That's a lower financial investment than a Ranger Suarez or fram Ra Valvez and much less than Dylanc's. But they're also have more questions than those guys. I actually sent out a poll, I said, did a survey on Twitter on Sunday, and I was a little surprised, So I said if they got their projected contracts, and that's a big if. But if Suarez, King and Gallon got their projected contracts four years eighty million for King and Gallon and five years and one hundred and fifteen million for Suarez, which pitcher would you have the Braves take? And to my surprise, the winner of that poll was Michael King at forty five percent of the vote. I wouldn't have guessed that. Maybe I'm maybe I I was off.

00:26:48
Speaker 1: But I wonder, I wonder, I'm wondering out loud. I wonder if there's a little bit of anti Phillies in your sample, considering Brave fans follow you on Twitter, or perhaps people are I think that maybe King has the highest upside of the three as well. Maybe, like if you look at just the numbers the last two years, for example, sistic mostically he became a starter. He has the best numbers of the three because the ra is two point nine or so in the last two and a half years. And if that's the big shye number you're aware of, I don't know if Brace fans did the research on this. Also, He's it's not one hundred million dollars, you know, what I mean that that extra digit on the number tends to swing things. So if they were looking for him versus Suarez, perhaps the one hundred plus number through them off as well. But hey, that's not it. That is interesting. I'm surprised that that too.

00:27:38
Speaker 2: And I really like Michael King. And if folks feel like, where have I seen Michael King pitch? He pitched Game one of the wild Card round. He hear go against the Braves, and I know that team was just dead and running on fumes, but I mean, that was about as bad as I've ever seen in Atlanta team perform offensively in a playoff game. But you know, the big problem in question with kan is can and he stay healthy because he's basically had one one healthy full season in the major leagues. That was twenty twenty four. He was one of legitimately one of the best pitchers in baseball, but this past season he only threw seventy three innings. He had a pinch nerve and then a knee problem. But when he's been on the mound, Michael King has been really good and really effective. So that is kind of the opposite of what we have talked about for the last month. And a half on this podcast of bringing somebody with a track record of durability, as much as that means in modern day baseball, King is not that. But you can also say, well, this guy doesn't have a thousand innings on his arm and elbow and shoulder. Maybe he's going to be more fresh than your typical thirty year old and if you could get him at twenty million dollars a year, I would also similarly be very happy if the Braves did that deal. Yeah, I would personally, it will spoil this. I would personally do either of the I think, did you use mbitrir rumors for your poll? What numbers were using?

00:29:01
Speaker 1: I would do either either Suarez or King right now, sign me up. I probably would not do Gallon personally, Now what I would I be offended if they did. No, I would not, because it would you know, it's again, it's not my money, It's not crazy. But Gallon is the interesting for me. They're all interesting in different ways. But Gallen over three year sample size, was literally taught to picture of baseball. Before last year from twenty twenty two to twenty twenty four, si On voats every season. I think he was like seven or eight in total fangrafts war over three years. He was awesome with the Dyamondbacks last year. To be very clear, it was not just an Era problem. We already made fun of Era as the only arbiter of success. It wasn't just Era. Like I saw the RA just to take it behind the curtain a little bit. We were doing the prep for this for this podcast. I saw the IRA and I was like, huh, started to do my little half, my little half half dig I'm like, oh, that's not good. Next next, Dick. Oh that's not good either. Like there's a lot of little things that were worrying to me about Gallon. He's only thirty, but his stuff plus, which is an advanced metric, crashed. Like if that tells you, like just the pure stuff he's throwing was not the same last year you pointed this out. His breaking his breaking ball stuff in stat cast was like literally one extreme to the other within one season. So I'll leave it to you, Like what do you make of Zach Gallen, Like he's I'm reading everything about Zach Allen after today, like all the projections that everyone's kind of doing the shrug emoji right now, Like no one was supposed to do with Zach Gallen. And that's the way I feel too, honestly, thoughts he is.

00:30:40
Speaker 2: An interesting by low. If you feel like you can get Zach Gallen back to what he was a couple of seasons ago, yep. I will say, and I'm out here in Arizona that if you walked around Chase Field and said, hello, Diamondbacks fan, would you like to sign Zach Gallen to a four year, eighty million dollar contract? I bet ninety percent would say absolutely not. In no world would I pay Gallon twenty million dollars a year for the next four years. And that might just be fan opinion, And I'd be fascinated to know if front offices feel like they could fix him. Maybe Jeremy Hefner sees something with Zach Gallon and goes, oh my gosh, we can we can move you know, we can get some more break on his breaking balls and get more vertical drop on his you know whatever. Whatever a pitching coach sees that people like you and I and those watching the show would never really have insight into. But to me, if that projection from trade rumors is correct, I would absolutely pass on Zach Gallen. I almost wonder if he might end up taking a one year pillow deal to try to get some some value back if it's a if it's a short.

00:31:44
Speaker 1: Well then I was gonna say, if there's ever a team, m I give a one year deal out Scott, we cover that team, I think.

00:31:49
Speaker 2: Yeah, that might be an interesting of course, again, though you're only doing one year, you might you're giving up a draft pick in order to do it. That's that's a consideration. But yeah, clearly for me, unless it's like the most favorable contract of all time, I'm probably out on Gallon and we'll let some other team take him and if he's awesome then then good for you. Yeah, I.

00:32:13
Speaker 1: Don't think it's crazy. I don't like there's there are people people that do these projections are smart full stop. Like they're not always right, but they're very smart, and they're probably hearing things too when they're doing the projections. So like, it should not surprise anyone if he gets this kind of contract, because there is a lot to like if you go if you ignore last year just results wise and look at the arm and the history. He's only thirty, he's not old. Like if there's something in there. And the Braves are actually known for this, Like if they see something in a profile that they like and it's like, hey, we could just kind of trim the corner here, trim the corner here and focus on this, they will do that and they have done that with success in the past, so that maybe that's that down. I don't know if it's going to happen, but my reaction would not be as negative as Diamondbacks fans because you know this, Scott, Like you cover a team, there's a guy or two on that team that the fan base is lower on, then they probably should be like compared to like the rest of the league. Of course, that's what happens. And Gallon was bad last year. He was I mean, that's that's the thing, full stop, like e ra a four point eight, fifth of four point five and not fake like that was that's the way he pitched. So if I'm if I'm a DBAX fan, it's like harder almost to have that guy come back at that number having just seen it and people like us who we see it, but we would we have we have to watch it every every fifth day, right, Yeah, we didn't have to see the see the whole meltdown there. So alas, there you have it. But uh, yeah, Gallon is interesting, but it sounds like you and I agree that we would prefer Swarrez or King at their number over over Gallon at his number.

00:33:46
Speaker 2: Yeah, definitely he will beleave it there.

00:33:48
Speaker 1: Oh, by the way, as for I believe it's I'm gonna go with em I and if I'm wrong, I apologize. Twenty seven year od Ray Hender. He was awesome in MPB last year. We've gotten zero buzz on the Braves being interested in these super high dollar Japanese players. Doesn't mean they won't do it, but until there's buzz, like, I'm inclined to just be like, maybe we'll have to wait and see. I do know we've talked about Kawakami earlier, but that's why we haven't talked about Emi more like, I just don't think it's gonna be what the Braves do. And there's I've tried to find any link anywhere and no one's spectioned in the Brison. So that's why we have fun about a lot.

00:34:19
Speaker 2: I think the early front runners, Giants, Mariners, maybe the Padre like there, it's historically and not every players the same, but historically it's been the West Coast teams California and Seattle, and then the New York teams have been where most players, most Asian players come over and play in. Not always there's exceptions, And I would love to get a pipeline open for the Braves, but it might be tough. I'm not holding my breath on that signing well.

00:34:47
Speaker 1: And the projections also, like for instance, trade rivers, which we've been using the most six for one point fifty plus posting fee, So that would be the biggest deals given out by a ton plus posting fee. And that's that's a different Maybe ay, he's a younger, interesting picture could be awesome, but similar with Yamamoto. Were like we talked about when when Yamamoto came over, like hey, they'd be great to sign Yamamoto, and then they got three hundred million dollars. It's like, well, that wasn't gonna happen. It seems like we'll move on, all right, Scott. More to come, names like Merrill, Kelly, Chris Bassett, Lucas Gilito not quite a sexy but certainly mid rotation names and more coming up in just a second after from our partners. All right, Scott, Let's continue with some less sexy names, but names that I think at least there's a few more on this list that I think are like very clearly like third starter types, which may not seem awesome, but those are valuable pictures, like guys who are projected to make seventeen eighteen million dollars a year, like not gonna blow you away, but certainly names that are interesting. And unsurprisingly, a couple of these names are older. Chris Bassett is one of these names. He'll be thirty seven before opening day. He's about as boring as possible, and I mean that in an endearing way. I appreciate this kind of picture. But he's been a two plus win as in wins a replacement pitcher every year since twenty nineteen. He just plugs along with an era of like three point nine every year. He's a good pitcher. But he also, like last year, for instance, in Toronto, wasn't starting games by the end like the granted Toronto was loaded and then made the World Series, but he's more of a three to four inter rotation. And that's all Almost most of all these guys that are remaining are basically that picture. So thoughts on Bassett, and then I'll bring up the guy that I actually kind of love for the Braves next. His name is Merril Kelly. But Chris Bassett. First thoughts.

00:36:43
Speaker 2: It would be boring. I think we would. We would come on the show and say, look, he's durable, he's reliable, He's better than some of the other options the Braves have internally as their number four starter. But yeah, I mean it goes back. Do I feel good about giving Chris Bassett the ball in game two or game three of a short series. Probably not.

00:37:03
Speaker 1: I think it'd be fine in a game through. This is more nitpicking. I think he is a three that you'd like to be here four, like on a great team. He's probably where you'd like to be your four. I do think he's pretty good. The upside is like non insistent, though, Like his upside is like three point sixty RA instead of four point one, you know what I mean. Not sexy, but kind of in the late career Morton zone. Not that everything is Charlie Morton, but like, I'm okay with giving this kind of picture. An eighteen million dollars a year contract for one year, and that sounds like a lot of money, but it's not like for one year in baseball. That is what this is what these guys get paid, that's what this kind of picture is worth on the market. That's just flat out what it is all of these guys. So we'll go through it that and.

00:37:50
Speaker 2: Interestingly enough, that's where you and I disagree. I yeah, and that's good because we agree on a lot of things. But correct if they sign Chris Bassett or Merrill Kelly or Lucas Giolito coming off an elbow injury or Tyler Mallley like these types. Okay, I'm not gonna lie to you. I'm never gonna be like super pissed that the Braves added, especially given the way the last two off seasons go, but it would be pretty like like if I get that push alert, I'm gonna be like, nah, I do.

00:38:19
Speaker 1: And the thing is, I think, let me clarify my position. I'm not saying that's like an exciting the only move you do thing with the start in rotation. I think I would like that more than you would and more than some would. But I also think that you're the Braves probably need to do a little bit more than that. As far as like, they don't have to sign Suarez or King, but I would rather, as we're gonna do later on, I would rather trade for Joe Ryan than sign Chris Bassett. You know what I mean, absolutely that kind of thing. What I'm not saying that Chris Bassett's awesome, He's not. But if it's free agency, for instance, here's my counter. If it's Zach Gallon at market price or Chris Bassett market price, Chris Bassett every time, for me, i'd rather if I'm gonna pay, if I'm gonna pay the market almost on that kind of picture, I'll take the shorter term guy. For it to be someone that I give four years to five years to they got to be. I gotta be convinced that they're a top you know, they're real, top location kind of level guy. No necessary an ace. But like I'm convinced of that with Rayder Suarez, I'm convinced of that with Michael King when he's healthy. Zach Dollan, I'm not convinced of that. Chris Malas Chris mass is not that either. And I actually like Mary Kelly more than Chris Bassett, which we'll get to in a second I guess, but you're right, Like I I would like that more. But I'm not saying that Braves need to just do that and then stop like I'm not. I'm not on that train. I just would like that more and more more so if the Braves did like two of those, I would be like more okay with it then not. But uh, if they if all they do, I will you know what mark this down December first if all they saw, If all the Braves do is signed Meryl Kelly or Chris Bassett, I won't hate it like some people will, but I won't love it either, even if it's kind of off brand for me, makes sense.

00:40:10
Speaker 2: The challenge is sure, if you could get Chris Bassett for eight million, ten million, twelve million, and then.

00:40:16
Speaker 1: Yeah, add an impact hitter and add that's just not the market though, like for these guys, like it tends to be like they they maybe maybe twelve, Like maybe one of these guys signs for twelve instead of seventeen. But the projections also, I mean Bassett two for thirty eight, one for seventeen, two for thirty four, Mary Kelly two for thirty six, one for twenty one, two for thirty five, like that, that's just the price of these Charlie could get twenty million a year. I'm not saying it was an awesome contract. That's that's what the market was going to pay out for this kind of picture. Even Tyler Mallley, who has like way less record of success, is projected to get fifteen million, not fifty million dollars a year. Like that's just what these guys cost. So but your your point is also valid, Like then don't do it, okay, I'm okay with that. I just my my entire I think I think I'm more of a contrarian sometimes to just say, yeah, these guys cost money, Like pictures like this cost money and you don't have to pay it. But that's it's not outrageous that he would get seventeen million dollars a year. That's what's one of my main stance is like it's okay, you're paying for the production and that, But the other side is there isn't a lot of upside And I would definitely agree with you on that, like there are there are more upside ways to spend seventeen million dollars with Chris Bassett.

00:41:29
Speaker 2: This middle tier is my breaking point of I would rather go make a trade because truthfully, yeah, there's only so many prospects in the system. I mean, after talking to Carlos at Baseball America and hearing his kind of objective take about the prospects in the system, there's like one or maybe two guys, right, I'd really feel the pain if the Raves traded them to get a Pablo Lopez or a Joe Ryan or any of you know me, my longtime stance is basically, trade anybody that's not ron on Acunya, like he's the only guy, like basically ever that I was like, Nope, can't trade him, even Dre and obviously Baldwin now you can't trade. But like even ball when a year ago I would have been wrong, But I would have trade a ball when a year ago I would if they got Garrett Crochet back.

00:42:13
Speaker 1: Yeah, for a top tier guy. I'm not saying you're trading for notes for whatever, but like, pick your favorite guy, whether it's Cam and Eddy or whoever number one person is. If it's a good enough player, I am you know, thank you, thank you for your service. Camp We'll shake hands and that'll be the end of it. You're You're not on the level of the guys we can't trade. I'm sorry, yeah you it would have to be somebody good. But yeah, so this group, this kind of middle tier veteran boring can make twenty five starts for your next year and won't kill you.

00:42:38
Speaker 2: But the upside is what it is. That's where I'm like, you know what, let's go, let's go trade. Let's go try to get a you know, one of the guys from the Twins, or try to get Mackenzie Gore from the Nationals, or see if you can kind of buy low on like San Dielo Contra from the Marlins or someone who we probably won't even think of. And that's this is going to go get.

00:42:57
Speaker 1: It is hard to do, is trade. It's easier on starters to do trades. Like we kind of just didn't even try to do trades on the Reliever show because it's like good luck trying to figure out who's available and whatever. We'll na have some guys in the second on the startering market that are like either we know we're available or like seem to be kind of available. That make a lot of sense. And yeah, a lot of these guys that we just talked about briefly, like you're Joe Ryan Types or whoever are better than Chris Bassett. They're better than Maryll Kelly, so that gives you the reason to do that. The last name I do want to mention just because I already tease it a little bit. I like Merrill Kelly, I think more than most people do. He's old to thirty seven on brand for me, but he is literally fourteenth in baseball and innings pitched over the last six seasons. Like he just pitches every freaking fifth day, like he's just gonna be out there and be and he's good. Like he doesn't walk anybody. Projections are like three point eight era FIP level. That's not great. But like I think Merrill Kelly is like I would like to have MARYL. Kelly in my rotation. Nobody's safe. Not he's the words safe, but I like him more than Bassett. He's my favorite of the mid tier and another guy I'd rather have than than Zach Allen at their price. If you want, we we do. We do agree that the trade guys are more interesting. But as far as like if you told me the Braves are gonna do a bravezy deal and for agency, which for me is a one or two year deal. He's the one for me unless someone's market falls apart, like obviously if someone is you know, if Michael King's market falls apart and he gets one year and twenty five million, like I would prefer to do that for sure, but sure of somebody like that. If it's if it's a Alex as an Alex deal, I would give it to Merrill Kelly. That's the guy.

00:44:43
Speaker 2: This is getting into the range as well, where it's like, Okay, maybe you sign Meryl Kelly for the rotation and it's awfully boring, but you save money. You go sign Hasan Kim to play short stuff every day, and you go trade for an outfield DH bat who makes decent money, and you go out and sign a reliever or to not an a list guy because they have a glaciers. But that's kind of how without knowing what kind of budget and thoughpless has to work with, where it's kind of that that shifting scale of Okay, we can add elsewhere, but it means we've got to be boring in the rotation as long as it's significant enough additions to round out the rest of the roster. Then I would not lose my mind over Merrill Kelly.

00:45:24
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I'm glad you said that because we might have new listeners that are not familiar with all of our takes, like almost all of these are like if you spend elsewhere, Like one of the people from Foul Territory, they clipped something that we talked about last time, you and I talked about basically the shortstop discussion with Mauricio Dubaan, and essentially like emphasizing that it's okay to have that player be your shortstop if Giant, if you spend the money somewhere else. Yeah, and that's my general take on sorry pitching too, if you were to do something like Meryl Kelly or Chris Bassett, if you use your resources somewhere else to improve the club, Like, we agree on that wholeheartedly. And I think there is an argument. I'm not gonna still gonna make it, but I've seen it on the internet and I think it's not crazy. I have poked fun at people that think the Braves are just like cool with a rotation because they have all these number of names or whatever. That's silly to me. But given that they do, you do us upside in your rotation with swallow Bach, Strider, Waldrip like, you could argue that a safer low ceiling option in the rotation in particular is not crazy to give you some more safety, even though I don't. I don't like that word because you do actually have a path to upside, whereas in other areas you may not have that same path to upside.

00:46:44
Speaker 2: Yeah, oh yes, no, we sit off the top. If the Braves get healthy seasons. I have a hard time seeing thirty starts from Chris Sale not being amazing. And similarly for yeah exactly and even Strider to it maybe a lesser extent, which is kind of because I also think he might if he just figured some things out this offseason, Streider might somehow have the highest upside of all three of those guys, given sales getting up there in age. But yes, I mean we south the top. Will say again if the biggest improvements the Braves can have year over year is they're stars performing like stars again, But we just we can't take that risk like they have to add this offseason and it seems like they're going to otherwise. I have major questions about giving Iglesias in Dubon twenty two million dollars guaranteed ten days into the off season. I probably would have swung a little higher on that end, but I don't know. Probably a discussion for another day and hopefully we never have to have it all right.

00:47:41
Speaker 1: In an effort to not make this a two hour podcast, I want to say some names that are free agents who the Braves could look at on the cheaper side to fill things out. Basically, Lucas Gilido, Tower, Mallley, Brad Keller is like this year's Ronal Lopez Is he a reliever? Is a starter? Interesting picture though when he's been right. Zach Lttel never walks anybody. Nick Martinez, who last year we laughed about because he took the he took a qualifying offer. It was a weird situation. He's a free agent this year. Interesting starter. Cody Ponce I kind of like coming back from the he was in the KBO last year. Like I'm kind of fascinated by heim. He throws hard, he was good KBO. Who knows. I won't even name the two super old guys because it's like it's just a meme. At this point, I'm gonna throw those guys out the window. For now, old friend Michael Soroka is a free agent. Our our our old Colliguert Cole would just weep at his desk and based on making Soroka back and then uh, he wasn't about boring. There's boring, and then there's Adrienne Hauser. Adrian Hauser is actually like even more boring than Chris Pass. So that's all my all my boring names. I know you hate all of those guys, so I'm not even gonna mention anymore to you.

00:48:51
Speaker 2: Yeah, I would say, if maybe one of these guys is floating around at the end of February and you can get up one, one more, yes, five million, assuming they have added somebody else to the rotation, Like I promise you you could do a six man rotation for a while. You could have Waldrip open up in the bullpen and then make him a starter later in the year if you need him to limit innings. Like there's there's always a way to work around things. And we always say, if there's a situation in July where we're doing a podcast and it's all right, Brad, we have seven guys throwing the ball, making starts so good. They're all healthy, they're all great. None of them need to rest, none of them need to fake injured. List. I promise you one we won't do that show because it will never happen. In two If by some miracle we did do that show, we have that that is the biggest non problem in the world.

00:49:38
Speaker 1: One hundred percent. Yeah, there's a great My favorite movie is Ocean's eleven and there's a scene in the kind of getting the band together where there's it's Brad Pitt and George Clooney and they go back and forth and says, and do you think we need one more? I think we need one more. Let's get one more. That's my general thing. I gonn start to pitching. Just sign another guy. If if you have a chance to get one more guy on it on a decent price, go ahead and do it. And if that's Cody Ponce, if that's Michael Soroka, sure my answer is yes, start sign more, starting pitching, acquire more.

00:50:11
Speaker 2: Starting pitching. We've done a lot of podcasts, Brad, I would firmly have Oceans eleven in my top five of all time. I wish we disagreed more, but that that is a class. That is a remote drop if you're flipping channels on Sunday afternoon and Ocean's eleven is on, you can bet absolutely watching it every single time.

00:50:31
Speaker 1: I'm embarrassed to say how many texts that I have with my friend Robbie kaland back and forth of it's just Oceans quotes with no other context. That's that's all we ever talk about. Moving on last thing, and we're not going to try to project the trade. We're just not going to try to do that. But there are some interesting trade names, a very useful I don't I'm not gonna actually I didn't. I didn't reference this, and we trade rumors what you're talking about a lot on this on the podcast already did this like top forty trade targets post and they acknowledge in it like they're just it's speculation and fourth speculation, et cetera. A lot of these guys are going to mention are on that list. But there are some interesting starting pitchers that could be gettable at a reasonable price. Any are good and by the way, full caveats supply here the Bratsky trade for somebody that's not on this list, what one thousand percent alex is usually good for a spring on something that no one ever sees very possible. But you've seen the list, guy, we'll go through it. But is there anybody that you want to talk about desperately as a trade target, if you have a favorite, a pet guy that you're like your non Sunny Gray division trade candidate. Now that study is off the.

00:51:35
Speaker 2: Board, great question, I would say, of all of the names listed on this trade list, and let's just breeze through them quickly and then we'll focus on a couple. So by all means, Mackenzie Gore from the Nationals, Joe Ryan and Pablo Lopez from the Twins, Sandy al Contra and Edward Cabrera from the Marlins, Brady Singer and Nick Lidolo from the Reds. You say, Kikuchi and Toriano from the Angels, Mitch Keller, Luis Castillo, who's been good for a long time with the Mariners.

00:52:07
Speaker 1: It seems to always be like on the trade list. I don't know, I don't know why he's awesome, but like it's like always like kind of out there as a potential guy they might trade.

00:52:14
Speaker 2: Jerry Depoto works in weird ways, that is why maybe that's a good point him and aj Preller, something about the initials. They just they just like to be weird. Freddy Peralta is like a borderline ace, like an actual ace with Milwaukee. I still don't see Milwaukee trading him. He has one year of contract control left. It would cost a lot.

00:52:34
Speaker 1: That reminds me I have to stop you. Did you see they just see the fake trade that made the REALNMS this week? Somebody wrote a fake trade that involved the Braves getting Freddy Peralta. Did you see this?

00:52:43
Speaker 2: I did see this.

00:52:44
Speaker 1: It was it was a real outlet. It wasn't like a fake blog. It was a real outlet.

00:52:49
Speaker 2: MLB dot com.

00:52:51
Speaker 1: And granted it was like supposed to be wild trades. It wasn't like it was being reported, but it was literally like four of the top five or something like that. Braves prospects for one year of Freddy Peralta, because that's what it is. He's under contract for one season. That as much as I am trade prospect guy, that would be quite a price for one year of Freddy Berlta. That's all I'm saying.

00:53:12
Speaker 2: Agreed, So that article is out there, and by of the roads, if you can get Freddy pralt for less than half of the farm system. Then great, But there's also on that Trade Rumors trade list Kyle Freeland, who is with the Rockies. And then an interesting name is Luis Severino. Sever Reno has been around. He was awful with the Oakland Sacramento As last year, although his career was kind of revitalized with Jeremy Hefner in twenty twenty four with the Mets, so maybe, although Severino's contract is pretty ugly. So my two favorite names are on our teammates on this list, I'll say the most obtainable players on this list because I think Minnesota, no matter what they're saying, is going to do a rebuild of some kind. They're in massive debt. They they just they're out of gas, like they just don't have talent to compete in that division. But Joe Ryan Pablo Lopez both are criminally underrated nationally. I know that we've seen Pablo Lopez up close with the Marlins, but I would be very happy if either of them come over. They also have two years of club control as well, so that's not a small thing.

00:54:19
Speaker 1: Yeah, No, I agree, I think there They have been a popular Braves Internet trade partner for a while and it makes sense. Both of those guys are not number ones, but like clearly top three rotation kind of pictures. They're really good and won't be crazy expensive, which definitely is up the rays alley. I I think Britty Singer is one for me with the Reds, It's like, h if they want to do that, I'd be very interested. Mitch Keller is not famous, but like it's quite good. It's the pirates, you know, people are is what it is. Sanrino is actually fascinating to me because he was just clearly did not want to be with the A's, and the A's signed him to get to like the salary floor. Basically that's what happened. He said, have this big contract. I wonder if the A's, like how much the A's would pay financially to get off the Averno's contract.

00:55:14
Speaker 2: Uh that quite a bit, and and sevar Reino spoke publicly about how bad the conditions were like clubhouses in left field, like behind the left field wall in Sacramento. I mean it was a it was a minor league operation and at and that's being kind. I mean it was amateur hour ine and they were quite.

00:55:31
Speaker 1: Literally playing in a minor league ballpark. So yeah, I always liked you, Sai Kakuci even I think was the last year he signed with the Angels. Like I we talked about it on the show. I wanted them to brace to sign as a free agent, and I still would do that now. He's more of the boring variety, but not like incredibly boring, like he has some strikeout stuff, has some upside. Has been a three way picture before. If the Angels are going to be the Angels and so relatively low one guy who's still good, I would try to fleece the Angels because the Angels are fleecible historically. I don't know Castillo is the best pitcher on this list, maybe not par Altive, but problems is kind of a different category. I would love to trade for Alice Castillo. I don't know how much it would cost. I don't know if he's available, but for I already alluded to it. But for whatever reason, he's just always on these lists, which means somebody somewhere thinks he might get traded, and I would love He's my favorite of all of these guys. If he's actually available, he's the name I want. I would be calling Seattle a repeat to see if that's available.

00:56:35
Speaker 2: The challenge is that Seattle is probably looking for major league ready talent in exchange, because I mean, Seattle was a game away from the World's Series. I mean, they were pitches away from the World Series last year. Certainly the Braves don't have a you know, a good version of von Grissom who's kind of blocked and they have to you know, unload him or they you know, they had like three young catchers instead of just like Baldwin. Maybe you know, well they cal rally, but you understand what I'm saying. Yeah, that may be tough the thread. Yeah, maybe that's the situation. You know what.

00:57:07
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna get into it. I was gonna say, you issue, and I slightly use Michael Harris.

00:57:14
Speaker 2: The one player here who I think has legitimate front end rotation upside, he's been good, not great. Is Mackenzie Gore with the Nationals. Yeah. The challenge with Gore, of course, is that he is in the division and he would not be cheap. I mean, and I would love to get my hands on McKenzie Gore, but I don't think Washington wants to give him within the division. Although I would say, at the end of the day, you want to get the best prospect return possible. And I mean, honestly, the Braves are just as much at risk in that deal because if you trade kim Kemminetti, which is probably what you'd have to give up to get McKenzie Gore at this point, if kim Kemminetti becomes a legitimate ace, guess what, You're gonna have to face that guy for six plus years and you might only have Gore. I think he has three more years of control. Yeah, I mean former top five pick in the draft. I think it's only twenty six, I mean twenty seven fourth season starts, So he's way younger than most of the guys that.

00:58:09
Speaker 1: We've talked about today. That would make it interesting. Yeah, this is nothing groundbreaking here, but certainly a bunch of interesting names. One more time, Alex tends to go off of the board of names who are not end lists. That's that's tends to be the modus operandi for this front office. But I to bring a full circle. You know, it's hard to talk more about trade stuff than free agents. I think, and we both have said this. I know Sewan and Stephen have as well, that trades are still undervalued, and how the Braves can add to the roster in multiple different ways. And I get why it's just hard to talk about trades. It just is. But same thing with shortstop, same thing with power backed that they're trying to add one for DH outfield or whatever and started pitching. It doesn't have to be a free agent, doesn't now shortstops harder obviously because those guys are just impossible to get most of the time, but particularly with the either outfield, DH spot and then started pitching. Trades should be part of the calculus. And I'm confident with Alex he's not just going in saying we have to sign free agents. Trades are very much on the board for this front office.

00:59:18
Speaker 2: They always oh, if I had to bet today, I would lean heavily towards the trade of some kind instead of assigning. You do have to give up prospects of some kind in a trade. First, signing a free agent you lose if you send one of the big free agents, you lose your Drake Baldwin PPI pick at the end of the first round. But that's all a trade. But again, you can also control salaries much easier in trade than in free agency. And that's all. That's all part of the calculation, and hopefully in the next two months it ends up being a good calculation, and we feel like the Braves squeeze the most out of however much money they have to spend.

00:59:57
Speaker 1: Two more things that I shouldly got off my chest because I will sploit up. I don't number one. As much as we talk about salaries and fitting in the structors and all those things, my mode is the Braves should be spending more than they spent last year, like by a lot. The Brave should be spending money. We know what we know. They're the one team in baseball where it's not even conjecture. We know their books. We can see their books. They should be spending at a top five pay roll level. They should be, and they were not last year. So that spending money is part. You don't just spend it to spend it, but using that money effectively is important. But spending should be happening, whether it be a trade or free agency. That's number one. Number two, I don't particularly care about the qualifying offer prospect. I mean draft pick stuff that they're gonna live. It matters a little, but I tend to think it's overstated. Maybe that's kind of my trade every prospect thought. But if they did, if that's the only hold up in signing someone, it shouldn't be a hold up. In my opinion. It's more of a small part of the.

01:00:58
Speaker 2: Tacklist for me.

01:01:00
Speaker 1: But I also say that to say, like, if that okay, one question to you, hear Scott, If it's the difference between signing Raiders Warez and not, do you care about the prospect the draftic they would lose because for me, I just don't.

01:01:15
Speaker 2: Sorry, I don't care. I am not actively just trying to boot that pick because that would be crazy. But if it means that you can sign Rangers, Swarez or Michael King to a you know, a deal that makes sense or I mean, hell, we don't think fran Bravaldez is real, but yeah, sure one of the hitters who have a qualifying offer that doesn't seem likely. But but yes, I mean, at the end of the day, it's a free pick, like this is a free square for the Braves.

01:01:39
Speaker 1: That's also the case. They got this pick because Drake won rookie the year, which they could not have projected even if that's it was very possible. They couldn't have said a year ago, Hey, Drake's definitely gonna win Rookie of the Year on a team with Sean Murphy on it, by the way, and that still happened. So that was a that was cool. It's free money to your point, and.

01:01:55
Speaker 2: The Braves are going to have a significant draft bonus pool no matter what. With the Baldwin pick, it'll be worth about three point five million. But if the Braves finish or land a top six pick in the draft, then we'll know that in a week. Even if they're the six pick. I believe the slot money is like nine million dollars this year, and if they were to move into the top three, that could be as much as like twelve million dollars eleven ten million. So that's also maybe part of this decision for the Braves is knowing how much money they'll have to spend. But to answer your question, if they can add a qualifying offer free agent to a reasonable deal that would make this team better, I will no problem. It was a free pick, give it away or give it back to the league, they will be just fine.

01:02:38
Speaker 1: Yeah, we are on the same page all right, Scott, I kept you long enough late into the evening, early in the morning on a December first Monday. That's all we have. This could literally be a two hour plus podcast like we have a lot more we didn't talk about. That's nature of the beast here. But if things as always, if you are a new listener or you've just forgotten, if we get a rumor, a real one, we'll talk about it. If we get a signing, we'll always talk about it a lot. If we get a trade, same thing. But this is kind of a meant to be an overarching primer. We can't touch on everybody in total depth. I'm sure I could give you ten more minutes on Ragasuirez right now. I'm not going to do it, but that's what we have today. I won't make comments about NFL teams because my team is terrible and your team has fallen apart. As you texted me today, my college team lost in relatively brutal fashion yesterday. It hasn't gone well outside of baseball, so maybe the Braves will help us out with some activity in the near future.

01:03:36
Speaker 2: There we go. I am sure Alex is listening to an hour plus podcast about Alex the open in BikeE come on the show. But as always, a big thank you to everybody for checking this out. It's not often that we do our plus shows in the middle of the off season when we had quite literally no news to talk about. But we try to create content. We try to give you guys something not only to listen to, but then have discussions with us on YouTube comments and tweet us and all that good stuff. And hopefully in the next days weeks, whenever it is, we'll get one of these pictures added, which would be a big time boost for this team. And I mean, if they add somebody good Brad, this could be on paper at the top three rotation in the game. I mean it could be. It could be really fun to watch this team throw the ball every night.

01:04:18
Speaker 1: Yeah, if they get Chris Bassett, look out, baby, I'm I'm just kidding. I'll try to just try to throw you. At the end of the podcast, please subscribe everybody to Hammer Territory, part of the Lad Territory Network. Check out the whole network too, Palatator, it is great shows. Pearl Territory with Ken Rosenthal, who I can't believe is a colleague of ours, But that's that's a real thing that happens. Sorry Ken for embarrassing you. Please subscribe to the podcast YouTube, especially if you're an audio listener. Just smash the sscribe button on YouTube. Takes two seconds, and vice versa. Helps support the show ratings, reviews, comments, follows on Twitter, Instagram, Facebook, all those fun things. We appreciate you listening to the podcast. As always, we'll have more to come later on this week, and we'll see you all next time.