116. Is it love, or are you just attached?

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Speaker 1: Hello everybody, and welcome back to the Psychology of Your Twenties, the podcast where we talk through some of the big life changes and transitions of our twenties and what they mean for our psychology. Hello everybody, Welcome back to the show. Welcome back to the podcast, New listeners, old listeners. Wherever you are in the world, it is great to have you here. Back for another episode. Today we're tackling I would say, a very important question in our twenties and beyond, am I actually in love or am I just attached? I think we often find ourselves entangled in relationships and sometimes unable to distinguish between the intoxication of infatuation, the closeness of emotional attachment, and of course identifying whether this is a love that lasts. Particularly in our twenties, I think a lot of our relationships take on this very sensational passion, this fire, this need to rush into things head first without pausing to consider do I actually even like this person? Do I see them in my future? Or do I just like the companionship? Do I just like how they make me feel? Knowing that distinction is so important so you can actually make good decisions, actually choose the right people rather than whoever is there at the time, especially if you're someone like me who occasionally has to deliberately hold back, which I've gotten a lot better at in a lot of my relationships to prevent falling head over heels after only a handful of dates. I know it's such a common experience, but importantly, attachment and love very very different. We develop our first attachments very young, almost immediately after birth, with our parents or our caregivers, because we instinctually need to be able to rely on others for protection. For we have even the cognitive or the emotional capacity to love, we can form attachments. They're very foundational, and the conditions for their creation is quite simple. Proximity to the person in question, a sense of closeness and dependency. Love, on the other hand, is a lot more complex. It involves a deeper level of trust, a vulnerability, of compatibility, and selflessness. It's not just about what we need from someone else, what security they can provide for us, but what we need in unison, what we need as a pair. They feel alarmingly similar. I know that, especially if you've come to realize you've perhaps never been in love before. And attachment or emotional closeness is all you kind of have to base that feeling on. But today I really want to break down the difference. We are going to look at what love and attachment do to us at a very biological rudimentary level, what function they each uniquely serve, and those callways to distinguish between the two feelings. We're also going to break down why some of us, myself included, get attached way too quickly, looking at things like anxious attachment styles, emotional validation and variable reward, even models of addiction, as well as why it's important to try and stay single or prevent getting attached to people romantically during some of those big life changes that we go through in our twenties. And finally, how do we keep that emotional distance when we know we are people who attach very quickly or both to others very quickly. How do we make it so that we let love develop slowly rather than confusing our attachment for something deeper. How can we decenter our love interests from our lives until they prove they deserve to be there. Well, I have a few answers for you, along with a lot of fascinating research and psychology behind this distinction. So I'm really excited for this episode. There is so much to cover. I know it is such a common conundrum, and I think it's really important that we set the record straight on the difference between these two experiences. Is it love or am I just attached? So without further ado, let us dive in. I know I mentioned it before, and I don't know about you, but I have a massive tendency to I think attach very quickly to the people that come into my life, not just romantic but also with friends or even people like work colleagues. I'm very much like an all or nothing kind of person. But often what that leaves me wondering, particularly in relationships, is whether I am truly in love with that person, or I've just become accustomed to their companionship, or I'm being driven by something more shallow like obsession or lust or the basic principles of attachment. And I think discerning those two feelings is a really important part of our emotional toolkit. They may feel the same, but they have very different implications for the quality of our relationships. I also think knowing the difference saves us from a lot of pain. I always use the example of situationships to explain this. Situationships, of course, are these relationships that feel legitimate and intimate and romantic or exclusive, but they're not, and typically one person is invested and the other person is quite distanced. Now, because I am a hopeless romantic, I think I've always been that person who has wanted more, and sometimes in those situations, what I've realized in hindsight is that what I thought was love, what I thought was this deep bond I had to this person, was really just a very natural psychological and physical reaction to the emotional environment that that relationship had created. When you spend time with someone doing things that create a sense of connection and release, primarily hormones and neurotransmitters like oxytocin, things like going on dates and cuddles and sleeping next to each other and shared memories. All of these things create the neurological premise for bonding, which in turn causes an attachment to develop, and from that perhaps love, but perhaps not, because it doesn't always get to that stage. So I want to explain the key differences between those two experiences. Let's start with love, particularly of the romantic sort. In the sequence of how a relationship develops. Often it follows the pattern of lust, attraction, and then love. That's kind of the final stage, when you've passed basic physical appeal and those urges and you've really met someone beyond the surface level. I think maybe past that is perhaps a sense of comfortability. Now, the psychology behind love is really fascinating because it's perhaps one of the most intense emotions we can feel as humans, probably only second or even probably first compared to grief and things like anger. So for a long time people have really wanted to know how it works. Why on Earth does this feeling drive us to do wild things, to create masterpieces and music, to kill, to start wars. And they've approached it from a ways, from a biological perspective, this idea that love is no more than a bunch of neurotransmitters serotonin, dopamine, oxytocin that is doing things to our brain. They've also offered a social perspective that love serves an evolutionary purpose because it's needed to build community and social cohesion. But my favorite theory is called the triangular theory of love, and it's this integrated idea and what love is and what it isn't. This was developed a little while ago, and the premise is that love, romantic love, true love is made up of three components intimacy, passion, and commitment. Each point on this triangle needs to be fulfilled to say that love exists. If you lack one of these things, and we're specifically talking about romantic relationships here, you have something that isn't quite love without the commitment. You have a situationship without the passion. You have something that might be very sexual or lustful without the intimacy, and without the intimacy, you have a friendship. Now, intimacy encompasses feelings of attachment, but beyond that, it's also you know, including things like trust, like security, vulnerability, you know, sensations that they go way beyond a simple closeness or biological bond. Love also follows what some have proposed as a fairly typical pattern. So a group of researchers have proposed almost a four stage model to love. You start off in the euphoric stage, which is around six months to two years, then early attachment one to five years, followed by the crisis stage where perhaps we begin to drift apart or wonder whether this is really what we want? Is this really working out at around five to seven years, and finally the deep attachment, the deep knowing around seven years and beyond. I actually think from an observational standpoint, this makes a lot of sense in my own experience seeing a lot of those people I've known who have been together around that five year point, really observing how their relationships shift to another level or they fall apart entirely. You know, there is no consensus on what love is because there are more spiritual conceptions that might call it fate, or they might say it's something deeply entwined with the universe and our soul. There is so much, I think, very deep human sentiment attached to this feeling. But I think really what it is is a deeply powerful connection that is built on the back of a lot of seemingly minuscule things, things that we overlook. Communication, memory, shed values, deep intimacy, passion, but also no compassion. Seeing the world through the eyes of another, knowing that they are just as much a part of your life as you are a part of your life. Being in love and desiring the love of others can be one of the strongest motivators in our life if we approach it correctly and if we are able to discern when perhaps it's something maybe less significant. So let's talk about attachment. I think intuitively we know it's probably a rung or two below that all consuming sensation that we were just describing. It's really interesting because if you ask people if they've ever been in love, especially in our twenties, I hear this response all the time. I think I thought I was at the time, and now I'm not sure. I thought I was in love, and what they're probably speaking to was actually attachment. So attachment is to find as a love lasting psychological connectedness between human beings, and most of what we know comes from the work of John Bulby. He is a very well known psychiatrist. If you study psychology, you definitely would have heard about him, and he was particularly interested in working with what he called at the time emotionally disturbed children. Our first attachment is to our parents or our caregivers, and it basically occurs from birth. We are biologically, genetically evolutionarily pre programmed to form attachments, particularly with the people who care for us or give us attention, and those who are around us. Frequently, and we can form these attachments well before we have any of the necessary cognitive or emotional functions to feel love. Attachment is based on who is fulfilling our needs, who is consistent in our lives, and who can create that very much needed sense of secure. This is really necessary for our survival because you know, we needed to be able to identify who is going to protect us back when I think things are a lot more perilous. And I think that it's also quite a basic foundational relationship, the one we have with our parents is going to greatly influence how we approach that broader idea of love, and I think we need to briefly talk about attachment theory here. Attachment theory has definitely been doing the rounds. It's one of those psychological theories that has mass appeal in mainstream media because it really claims to predict how you love and proposes an explanation for all of your perhaps you know, love conundrums. So a brief synopsis, this model proposes that there are four attachment styles that humans can have, and these attachment styles are derived primarily from the relationship that we had with our parents and the care and the love they showed us, and how that relationship and attachment to them has developed will then serve as our first image of how we should connect with people later on in our lives, especially in adulthoods So the four styles are secure. These are people who are confident, resilient, non reactive, reciprocal, especially in their relationships, and they don't really display anxiety when approaching things like romance or commitment or even harder feelings like rejection. Next, we have anxious preoccupied. This is characterized by a deep fear of abandonment, high levels of insecurity, perhaps really what we would say is clinging behavior, and also a level of fantasy bonding. And this attachment style is really important when we talk about this distinction between love and attachment, so remember it because we will come back to it later. Sadly, we have dismissive avoidant. These individuals will often stay quite emotionally distant. They isolate themselves, maybe reject attempts from others at deep emotional connection. And I think it's often because they've been taught from very very early childhood that they can't trust people who promise to care for them, so they push them away because they've associated deep connection with being hurt. And then finally we have fearful avoidant, dismissive avoidant, and fearful avoidant as somehow or some sometimes just kind of rolled into one as just an avoidant a blanket avoidant attachment, but the fearful avoidant can come off as both very ambivalent but also very unpredictable. And whilst the dismissive avoidant may just completely switch off, the fearful avoidant may create conflict in their relationships to try and push people away and see if they'll leave as others have done because they really can't fully trust them. They're constantly testing this relationship for weak spots. Now, these unique attachment styles will influence how we approach love and dating, but they are the basis also for seeking out intimacy. I think the easiest way to distinguish love versus attachment is that you can be attached to someone and not love them, but in order to love someone, you have to be attached. I want to talk about some of the other ways that we can distinguish between these two things, because, like I said before, and if you have had past experience, you'll know, they feel very very similar. I also think that when we confuse them, we can use what we think is love as reasoning to do things that might not be in our best interests, like moving in with someone after only a few months, or ignoring other possible people or options or red flags. So I think both of them, I feel like a sense of security. Both make us feel close to another person. But whilst love is selfless, attachment is somewhat selfish. Whilst love is very mutual. Importantly, attachment can be one sided and quite transient. So when I say attachment is selfish, I don't mean that that makes you a selfish person, because we all have some basic level of attachment, just that the function of attachment is self serving. For example, when we consider the early stages of dating, when we are forming this bond with someone, what we're really looking at is what is this person doing for me? Is this person making me happy? What feelings are they creating for me? How do I feel? Rather than what can I do to make them happy? How can we grow together? How can I love them better? Attachment is really driven by how you feel about yourself, how if you feel secure, and the safety and attention someone gives you. Based on all of these different models. A big part of attachment is that it's highly subjective, and it can be really easily influenced by our own visions or interpretations of what this person is offering. And it can also feel incredibly intense because biologically, our brains want us to attach to others, so it makes us fairly susceptible to ignoring things like red flags for the momentary, physical, emotional, mental comfort that someone may offer us. Also, getting incredibly attached to someone isn't always based on what they're actually showing you or their actions, but sometimes the fantasy that we've created of them in our own heads. It's this concept called fantasy bonding, and it occurs when you bond and attach to someone based on who you believe they can be or will be, or what you believe they can and will be able to give you in the future, not who they actually are. When you have a fantasy bond with someone, you often are in a very dysfunctional i would say situation or relationship where you have created a false image of them in your head, or you've looked to the future to justify why you feel so close to them and to psychologically protect yourself. You're not always in love with someone. You're in love with the idea of love or the idea of them. And I think, in contrast to that, love is very honest, it's sometimes brutally honest. I truly believe that you can't love someone until you've seen something about them that you don't like, or you've had some disagreement, or you've seen them anger, you've seen them vulnerable, and you have still chosen to be there. You don't have unrealistic expectations about who they are or what they could be. You just kind of take them as they are, whereas in attachment you're very willing to overlook those things for what they can give you. Additionally, I think love is mutual. Attachment can be one sided, wherein one person has really developed a bond and a connection, perhaps based on false cues, and the other person can realistically remain very distant. You know, everyone has their own timelines for how long it takes to connect with others. But also, in some instances, not all, but some people like being chased, and they can bread crumb us with tiny moments that invariably reinforce our connection to them. It's this notion in psychology of invariable reward. It's the same way that casinos get people to gamble more. Sometimes this person will be super affectionate and kind and loving, and that's where we feel like we have won the so called jackpot. And other times they'll be really distant or dismissive, and in those moments we want to keep pushing, We want to keep betting or gambling more because we are looking for the satisfaction of when they are once again giving us those warm feelings. We just don't know when that's going to happen. So whilst we may be attached, we may also be very much addicted to their inconsistent behavior and interpret that anxiety as excitement or even a deeper feeling of passion. I never knew what people meant when they say that love should be easy and consistent and feel safe, because I always thought that what I wanted was intensity and passion, and that sinking feeling in my stomach that was for me, true emotion, That was true feeling. That was love. But I think maturing is realizing that it's not. It's a very natural alarm system and natural reaction to someone's inconsistency and lack of stability. And it creates almost an a chronic stress response. It's very similar to infatuation, the all consuming feeling that very quickly and intensely flourishes at the beginning of a new relationship. It's the anxiety and the euphoria and the nervousness, And if that carries on for many, many months, it might be worth examining whether that is actually love, whether that is actually a good foundation for love, whether there is actually genuine friendship and care there, or whether someone is actually just using you to fulfill their own emotional hunger and emotional cravings. One final debate or differentiation that I think we should discuss is that I really believe that you can be attached to multiple people at once, but I don't think that you can be in love with them all. Definitely not in the same way. Our minds and social brains have adapted to allow for us to have multiple deep attachments with people like friends, like family. That's really the basis for community. But I think love is a lot more exclusive. Obviously, you can love multiple people, but in a different sense to that deep romantic, intimate love we're talking about. It takes so much from us emotionally. I think, but it also requires your deep attention to another person. That's hard to cultivate with multiple people at the same time, and it's a lot harder, I think, to fall out of love compared to falling out of attachment. That's a really good thing about attachment, depending on how you look at it, but especially for those of us who are maybe emotionally attached to someone in their lives right now who is maybe not the best for us. But attachment is founded on proximity and frequency of interaction. When you take away that source, when you take that fuel away, when you apply distance, our attachment fades. And I think it it's a really great way to distinguish that because love will last a lot longer. Think about it in terms of people who sadly have lost a spouse or a partner that takes years to heal from, and in some ways I think we never healed or forget that love. So hopefully that has given you a good preliminary idea of the distinction. But what I want to talk about next is why some of us get attached a lot quicker than others, myself included, And also some questions to ask yourself when you're thinking do I actually love this person or do I love the idea of them? Or do I love their companionship? And then, finally, how do we actually detach ourselves when we realize we're in that situation, when we realize that this may be a temporary connection, how do we slow things down and let it develop over time? So all of that and more, after this shortbreak, It goes without saying that there are some of us out there who have a tendency to fall hard and fast, to believe we are in love when really what might be happening is a very visceral, biological and emotional reaction to what you want someone else to be, your idea of them in your mind. If you find yourself utterly obsessed with someone after a couple of dates, already fantasizing about the wedding, telling all your friends, moving way too fast, or even finding that you can jump from relationship to relationship incredibly easily and be met with that same level of infatuation every single time, or if you know that deep down that you have this destructive pattern and you ignore red flags, this might be describing a subconscious and habitual tendency to emotionally attach to others, and there are a few psychological reasons why that may occur. Firstly, if you remember that anxious attachment style we discussed earlier, well, that is a massive contributor. The development of an anxious sometimes it's called preoccupied attachment style is often associated with an inconsistent parenting pattern. Sometimes people have parents who will be supportive and responsive to a child's emotional needs, and then at other times they'll really neglect them and ignore them. And this inconsistency makes it really difficult for us as children to understand what we can expect from our parents and what their behavior actually means, and so we end up confused about the relationship we have with these caregivers. And what happens is this expression called emotional hunger, where we crave the love of our parents. We are really anxious around them and when we can expect emotional fulfillment because it's never consistent, it's like never being fed on schedule. We're never given love on a schedule. In adulthood, this man offence in a very intense fear of abandonment and a propensity to attach very quickly to those who show us even the most basic of human empathy. And care and connection. Like a new romantic interest, we become very, very obsessed with their presence and worried that they'll leave us, and this once again might reinforce that we don't deserve love. So instead we go all in. We go as hard as possible, because we want to seemingly protect ourselves from this outcome by giving this misconception, by creating this false narrative that if we commit quicker, if we attach quicker, it will be harder for them to leave us. And I think that can often backfire when we either overwhelm this person or we get to the point in relationship which all relationships face, where we have to have hard conversations. We will have fights, we will have disagreements or sometimes be let down. And when that happens, because our attachment to them has been based on this very fantasy like image, this intensity, we will feel threatened because we have created and incredibly emotionally intense and at times fragile bond. It's not just childhood abandonment, though, but also our early romantic experiences, things like that, you know, a particularly devastating breakup or the end of a relationship. This can also teach us that we need to bond very quickly to hold on to people. This can also be created by repeated situationships or flings where we feel like things have really never reached that next level. So we are constantly seeking out people who might do this for us, who might fulfill this need. And then in creating that internal delusion that we are in love, because SubCom anxiously that is what we would like to believe, and so we make that a reality for ourselves in our imagination. This comes down to two other factors that I think are very interlinked. Firstly, you believe that a relationship or love or someone else will make you happy, and that belief has emerged from a deeply rooted insecurity that maybe you're not good enough or you don't deserve the love that you're after. Other people are a huge source of emotional validation, especially if we are highly self critical and haven't learned to trust our own opinions of ourselves. In those instances, we really need others to confirm that we are good, that we are attractive, that we are intelligent, that we are desirable, And when people offer that to us, even in small doses, this can cause us to attach much quicker because they've now become a really valuable source for our self confidence, which is a very crucial psychological need. There's been studies on this, and what they found is that people who rate their self esteem as lower or poorly, they respond with greater emotional intensity to compliments, particularly from people they admire. So it's important to examine if this is the conditions of your current relationship or the current early stages of a relationship, whether this person is actually someone you're compatible with, if they are a good person who you trust, or if they're just giving you the validation or perhaps even companionship to counter your loneliness, because loneliness is also something that can drive us to attach very quickly partners, boyfriends, girlfriends. Love in general is a pretty powerful protective factor against loneliness. But if we use relationships as a band aid solution or to feel some emotional void, it's unlikely that we will be as rational and discern about the people that we are seeking out. All they need to do is satisfy that baseline need of filling up our time and making us feel less alone for us to become bonded to them because we see them as providing something that we can't provide for ourselves. It's why I always say to people that you need to not date when you're feeling lonely or during major life transitions that might exacerbate loneliness, like right after a breakup or when you move to a new city. It will be difficult to determine whilst you're in that state whether you are pursuing this person for the right reasons, or whether our innate need for attachment is driving you to confuse what that relationship really is. Is it a bond simply formed on the back of a perceived emotional deprivation. There's one more factor, I guess, tendency. I want to mention that can create a lot of ambiguity between attachment and love, and it's one that comes up a bit, but I definitely think we need more research into it. Maybe it's a little bit controversial. Some people have theorized that being physically intimate with someone or having sex really early on can disrupt our ability to make logical decisions about the longevity or the nature of a relationship. Sex is a bonding activity. It releases a high amount of oxytocin and that produces feelings of connection and intimacy even if it's not really there. You know, if you've only known each other for a few dates, that intimacy may cause a very biological attachment before a cognitive or a mental one, before you've actually gotten to know them. And I'm not saying this in like a Puritan fashion or advocating for, you know, no sex before marriage, but I think if you've noticed a habit of getting attached very quickly, maybe change up your approach to intimacy and sex before exclusivity. One of my friends has a three date minimum, which I think works really well, or whatever standard you want to set for yourself so that all those hormones rushing through your body don't disrupt your decision making. There's a few other tactics we can enlist to protect ourselves and our heart in these situations, to take our time and you know, not just dive straight into a really intense attachment with someone. Firstly, you need to control your obsessive thoughts, as hard as that is, by decentering this person from your life until they prove they deserve to be there. When we frequently and obsessively think about a person, when we wonder whether they'll text us find reasons to talk speak about them continuously to our friends. What we're doing neurologically is strengthening the pathways associated with the image of this person and their presence in our lives. It's this idea called long term potentiation, which is basically the opposite of if you don't use it, you lose it. If you use it to much. If you focus on something excessively, you train your brain to use those neural pathways more often, and basically why your brain in the short term but also the long term towards that person. In this way, your thought pattern becomes quite procedural procedural meaning automatic, and you find that you can no longer control how often you're thinking of this person. You're exaggerating your level of attachment and your infatuation. To deprogram yourself, you need to give your brain new experiences and interest to focus on. You need to enrich your life beyond this person's presence, and that means making sure you prioritize your friends, taking on new hobbies or even just small activities that give you joy but also are a cause for reflection beyond your attachment to this person. Outdoor adventures weeknight dinners with friends, a sporting class, or a group. These are all great alternative to spending every single night with them in those early stages of dating. I always have a two day rule. We can't see each other more than twice a week because I know now that I really need and I want that time away from them to keep my independence and actually have some thinking time. And you know, if you end up marrying this person, you know, seeing each other less at the beginning of your relationship isn't going to matter. It's actually just going to mean that you have that slow burn. Secondly, if you're quick to jump right in and perhaps create an unhealthy bond, force yourself to take things slow, particularly by managing your expectations. Try not to talk about the future with them unless they've given you a reason to and crucially set emotional boundaries. I think when we crave closeness, especially during intense periods of loneliness. Maybe you know, maybe after a break or something traumatic and someone provides you with that opportunity. We know that over sharing and giving them very deep, a very deep idea of who we are is a great way to make them feel closer to you, and that can create what we know as a hyper dependency bond, the more you share, the more vulnerable you become, the quicker you're going to come to depend on this person and see them as someone you might love, not because of what they are, but because of what they offer you, which is a safe space to be validated. So I would say, make sure you take your time and be clear about what you want and be discerning. I know that I would have saved myself a lot of pain and heartbreak if I'd been clearer with myself and others about what I actually wanted. And I'm thinking about someone in particular, who I bonded to very quickly during a period of very intense stress and because of situations in my house and just general environment. So I began to rely on them really intensely, and I got very attached very quickly. Even when he told me that he wasn't looking for anything serious. You know, he was saying one thing and then acting another way, and I really chose to ignore what he was saying for the comfort of that closeness. Huge mistake, big mistake in those early stages before love develops, whilst we're getting close, you really got to check on the reality of your situation every now and again, because attachment will form outside of your conscious control and it's a natural precursor to something bigger. But that doesn't necessarily mean that you should be with this person. If you've found yourself in this position right now wondering do I really love for this person? Are they really my future? Or have I just you know, become attached to them. There's also a series of questions that I think are important to ask yourself. I've found these to be so incredibly discerning and truth revealing in my own dating life to ensure that I'm not just rushing into things because of an emotional urge or human nature. Firstly, when you think about how they make you feel, do you think about physical elements of the relationship or the quality of your emotional bond. Would you be just as happy being in bed with them as you would be having a long, deep conversation. Secondly, do you genuinely care about this person's happiness and well being, even if it means making sacrifices or compromises. Could someone else be in their place right now and would you feel the same way. This is really important because it highlights the distinction between wanting basic companionship and actually feeling a genuine, deep connection based on their individual qualities. Have you imagined a future with this person? Do you have shared goals, dreams? Do you have plans for the future. Are you willing to work through conflicts and communicate openly rather than just avoiding difficult conversations? And what do you feel when you're around them? Also, what do you feel when you're not around them? Is it calm? Do you know that you'll see them again soon? Is it peace or are you anxious? Are you fretful? Are you unsure of what you want? You know what that sounds a lot like. It sounds a lot like they are activating an abandonment wound or an anxious attachment. And I think it's important to be honest with yourself about whether beginning this way is going to actually lead to a good foundation for a future together. You know, remember, love is calm, Love is peaceful. You can still be excited and passionate, but you don't have to worry about how they feel. You know. Attachment is a lot more nuanced, and I guess fickle. It comes quicker, it burns brighter, it feels nice. But these two things are not the same, and confusing them can create a lot of havoc, but also regret later on when you realize you were perhaps mistaken it and you can't trust yourself anymore. So I hope that this has given you a good guide, a good ability to discern between these two feelings. Also, I would say, if you are listening to this podcast with a particular person in mind, I think that just that fact that you're having those questions about am I in love or am I just attached? Might be indicating that you are just attached, because I think love sometimes comes without question, like you kind of you kind of know, and that's something that I haven't really I didn't really realize until recently. But when they're making you feel uncomfortable, they're inconsistent, that's not love. That's they don't love you. If they're doing that to you, they don't love you. I know. It's a very hard truth. I feel kind of guilty for saying it so harshly, but I also think it's important to note. So I hope this episode has been enlightening. I hope it has helped you. It was very very interesting to record and to talk about it kind of just spilled out of me. This has been on my mind for so long. As always, if there is someone in your life who needs to hear this, please feel free to send it to them. You never know who it's going to help out. And also, if you feel cool to do so, please feel free to leave a five star review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify wherever you're listening right now and follow us along at that Psychology podcast to see behind the scenes stuff video content to keep up to date with what's going on. We would love to see you over there. As always, thank you for listening to today's episode. I hope you are in love and if you're attached, I hope that this has helped you figure out why that might be. And as always, we will see you back next week for another episode