Rebecca Hart: new solo mother, small business owner and also Sarah's sister!

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Speaker 1: Hi. This is Laura Vandercamp. I'm a mother of five, an author, journalist, and speaker. And this is Sarah Hart Hunger. I'm a mother of three, a practicing physician and blogger. On the side, we are two working parents who love our careers and our families. Welcome to best of both worlds. Here we talk about how real women manage work, family, and time for fun, from figuring out childcare to mapping out long term career goals. We want you to get the most out of life. All right, Welcome to best of both worlds. This is Laura. This is episode one hundred and sixty five. We will be interviewing a very special guest by the name of Rebecca Hart, who, if people might guess from the name Sarah Hart Hunger, is of some relation to my co host here. So yeah, we're excited to have Sarah's sister talking about all things new parenthood. She had a baby around the same time that I had Henry. She is running a small business in the midst of a pandemic, and so she's going to be talking about single parenthood, small business ownership, and life in general. So I can't wait to hear that. Sarah how so now we got to get the part about you and your sister growing up before we had to her. So we are two years and four months apart, and so you know, two girls, and we didn't have any other siblings, so definitely grew up quite close. I would say we are very different personalities, both as children and as adults, but we've also always like to do things together, or at least I always was dragging her into my CHANTI because she had no choice. Well, honestly, she's more introverted and probably would have been like fine if I didn't bother her so much, but like I always wanted her in my play, if that makes sense. So we I bossed her around a lot. We played a lot of school, We did a lot of crafts. Then she quickly got way better than me at doing craft as a learned as you hear about her actual business. Yes, yes, we both played piano and sang, so we had a lot of music stuff in common, and you know, as any siblings do. Of course, we fought sometimes, and there have been periods where things weren't as smooth, but generally we've remained very close. Like she's somebody that I feel like i've always been able to be completely honest with and I think that is mutual, and so that's just been such a lovely thing to have. I love having a sibling, and I'm so glad that I do, and so I you know, I hope my own kids developed that kind of relationship. Yeah. I mean, so I have two brothers, but they are one is significantly older and one is significantly younger. So we have about a six year gap on each side. So we really had more of parallel childhoods I guess you could say than actually that sort of two year apart sibling experience. I mean, the difference Bet and my older brother Jeff and me in age is like the difference between Jasper and Alex. So there's like two more children in there in my in my family. Clearly, we have a different experience in my house now than that was. Even though I grew up as one of three kids, so it wasn't exactly a small, you know, family, but it was what it's been more that we've gotten to know each other as adults, and that's been pretty cool because you know, my brother, I went to college pretty near where he lives, and so I was able to be part of my niece and nephew's life kind of early on when they were born. That was really fun to see them grow up as babies. And then my little brother moved to New York a few years ago, and so we had some overlap with him, not much, but he's he's come to see us. We've come to see him, and we enjoy hanging out with him anytime we're in New York, and he and my husband will like drink Scotch together, So it's a you know, it's it's been fun to have them as adults, and I definitely hope my kids can can stay close in their adult life. I don't know's it's gonna be fun to see. I'm not sure. We'll see how this all like, what the different alliances will be in different times. The other thing I'm really excited about is for Genevieve in particular, to get to know Miriam, because they're actually closer in age than Genevieve is to either of my bigger kids. Yeah, so it's going to be so wonderful when we all get to finally hang out and we can have like, you know, the two littles and the two bigs and no, I'm like, very very excited for this new phase of our relationship. And Miriam is the cutest as I'm sure I will post picture of her on Instagram. Cousins are awesome, and that's great that you have cousin and you have a cousin now for your kids on that clone, they have cousins on the other side, but yes, this is their first on this side. Yes, totally. So we're excited to have Rebecca Heart here. So Sarah and I are excited to welcome Rebecca Heart to the episode. Rebecca is a great many things though, also sarah sister. So Rebecca, can you introduce yourself to our listeners? Yeah, I'm hi, Sarah's sister. I don't know where I should start because I don't know where you're heading with us. Well, why don't you tell us a little bit about your business and your family set up right now? Absolutely? So. I own a yarnge store in Cary, North Carolina, where so I used to live. I've owned the store for a little over eight years now, and I have a seven month old girl, Miriam, who is now sleeping in the store in the little makeshift bedroom for her. Yeah, how does that work? So you just bring her in with you, and you do have pretty normal store hours now or how does that work? Not quite and we're playing around with the hours right now, but obviously because of COVID, we're doing appointment only. We're about to shift that. But typically I'm here five or six days a week, at least like ten till three. Sometimes I do work that sometimes before. It really depends on kind of what's going on in the store and her schedule. Sometimes she wakes up earlier later, so I do have a little bit of flexibility due to COVID. I don't know if it's good or bet, but yeah, it's been interesting. So she just comes and naps there or hangs out with you while you're wah. So I try to get here early enough so she can be down for her first nap, which is anywhere between nine and ten Yusually she goes down, and then that's where I usually am able to get a good chunk of work done for a couple of hours, whether I have customers in or I'm doing work on my computer. So yeah, she's fantastic at taking that early nap and I really take advantage of that. Afterwards, it's really hit or miss whether she's able to play in her little playyard independently, which is not for log Or I throw her on my back, which is a new thing I've been doing, and wear her. Or I have her in my lap and I try to type with her on my lap. Yeah, so tell us about mom and fuzzy yarn, Like, why where did the idea for this business come to be? And I assumed that you must have been the crafty sister growing up. If this is maybe maybe take take our listeners through the journey of like how you made the choice with your career to make a take a really big and kind of risky stuff, and like kind of what that thought process was like, and just kind of the bravery well, I mean, it's hard to toot your own horn, but it was a very brave step. So to tell a little bit about that. Yeah, so I had been working at a corporate job before for eight years and now it's hard to believe that I've actually been at the store now longer than that job, which sometimes is amazing. But I was doing business analytics. I was doing so a lot of spreadsheet works, staring at a computer all day long. Part of me liked what I was doing. In another part like hated just the corporate aspect of it, and I was just I felt like I hit a wall and I just was brainstorming things to do, and I kept coming back to yarn because that was always something like after work. I remember driving to a yarn store and picking up It was the highlight of my day. And I don't know exactly when it came into my head. I took a couple of business trips down to Arlington, and nearby in Alexandria is a wonderful yarn store named Fiberspace, and they had just tons and tons of hand eyed yarn, and each time I went, I spent like a couple hundred dollars on yard, which is pretty easy to do. And I remember just feeling that that that type of yarn really was not available in the area or very very limited. So I thought about that, and at some point I just I wondered about how feasible it would be. So I took a business class at night after work, and I had an amazing advisor who helped me write a business plan and feasibility studies and talked to a lot of my friends were knitters and crocheers. Actually I was more of a crecheer when I started, and then I got obsessed into knitting, which is more popular now. Most of my customers are knitters, and little by little it somehow didn't seem impossible, like I needed to get my LC license, I needed to get the find the space and have a fire, you know, check. And it was just one thing after another, and about a year after I started researching, I was opening my doors. And so you sell tell us. I mean, for those of us who are not yarn connoisseurs, the hand dyed yarn is like the high end of the market, right for people who are very particular about their sort of knitting. Yeah, I mean there's hand dyed and there's also just a small scale production. So pretty much all of my suppliers they're either one or two person show or it's one of my brands that I love. Everything is sourced in the US from you know, the actual wool the sheep, and then it's died and it's spun. Everything is done in the US, so just a lot of very very small scale partners and it just makes it special. That's kind of exciting that the sheep are Americans. Dozens too, when you have some sorry, I say, you do have some brands that come from like international destinations. So yeah, absolutely, Actually we have a lot, and that's been just a worry now. Thankfully supply has been okay during this but a lot comes from Ireland, Germany, England, We've had all over. But still the production that the dying is by usually just a handful of people. It's not a large scale production. That's her store is beautiful. By the way, I was going to say, I assume that a big part of this pre COVID of course, is also that you are a destination then for people to come in. And did you have like knitting circles going on quite a bit? We have three groups a week and just that knitting couch iconic. Yeah, it was just it was a really it had become a really nice place, and a lot of my friends would come and they would they just they would gather and make new friends and then you know those friendships. So it was still they would meet outside of the store as well, So I feel like I brought people together. It was like good way. So I missed the inergery very much. Yeah. Interesting, Yeah, how did you wind up then pivoting with the pandemic to I mean because you're still open, yeah, which is exciting. You have not gone out of business, so yeah, how did you pivot with that? So I feel rather lucky in the fact that my store was already set up for online. I had been getting orders before, not a large amount, but at percentage. I had already set up, probably a little bit because of my analytic background, just all of my yarns in the system, so that I had pictures of every single yarn in the store, so I didn't have to rush to create that as a lot of other stores were doing so that their business could be accessible online. So that was really nice. And so in the beginning, I just I did a lot of incentives, a lot of social media. I'm still doing that, but I've lessened it just a little bit because it was becoming a lot of work. I would send on email every morning. I was doing a daily deal and and just giving people in order of the day. I even liked looking at the day yeah and deal of the day. Yeah. I was doing a lot of that, but thankfully I was already set up to sell online and that helped immensely. Well, that sounds great, So we're going to take a short break here to have our ads and then we'll be right back to hear more from Rebecca. It's too bad we don't have like a yarn sponsor for this episode, but maybe in the future. In the future. So well, that's kind of the birth of your store. And now, as you were saying, it is opened by appointment, but it is soon to be open without restrictions, is that correct? Not without restrictions, But I am going to be changing. Actually well by the time this airs, I'm assuming my customers will know. But yeah, I'm starting to have in the afternoons, so I'm still gonna have appointments in the morning. I actually sent out a survey to my customers asking what they preferred, and some do prefer appointments so they think they can be the only one shopping in the store and feel safe. Of course, mass required. And then in the afternoons, I'm going to do appointments. I'm sorry, I'm going to do walk ins, limiting to five customers in the store, so it's still going to be a very small amount of people in the store at once. Oh that sounds like a nice balance though, and in time for the fall and winter knitting season, which I'm sure gets busy. Yeah, I hope. So, I hope it's like other years, but we'll see. Yeah. So, Rebecca, you're also you know, you've gone through this pandemic small business ownership with a newborn as well. So and you had a slightly different journey to motherhood. You want to whatever you'd like to share about that would be great. Sure. So I was just talking to Sarah about this, so she didn't realize is I went and visited Sarah and her family, and I believe, I want to say it was February twenty eighteen. I could be wrong with it, but I remember how odoud Viva have been then? Three months or two months? That sounds about right. And I remember I've known for a long time that I wanted to have at least one child, and I at that point, I guess I was thirty six. Yes, Rebocca is a younger sister. By the way, I'm two years older. So at that point I remember I always know I wanted to have at least a child, and I visited her and I just remember looking at Viva and thinking, oh, I want this so badly, and it just seemed like almost a ridiculous idea, like here I was. I probably unattached at that point. You know, I've been dating off and on, but at that point I don't think I was seeing anyone, or at least not seriously, and it just it seemed like something I just really, really really wanted. And Sarah said to me, did you ever think about having a child on your own? I don't know if you remember that or not, but you absolutely planted that idea in my head. And I think I had, but not in a realistic not in a almost like yeah, logistically. I just didn't really think it was something I would do. But once she planted that seed, I kind of ran with it. And so after that trip, I decided to go see a reproductive undercronologists and talk about options. I was not at all ready to go for it, but I just wanted to hear about the process, kind of what her thoughts were given my situation, my age. She suggested doing some tests, so we did that. Thankfully, numbers were pretty good, but she said, you know, you're thirty seven, thirty six, I guess at that point, and she said, you know you you're not. You don't have to do it right now, but I wouldn't wait too a lot, so I carried that with me for a while. I throughout that year I dated a little bit, but I don't enjoy dating very much and beginning and maybe no one does. I think some people though, I think some people do. And so about a year later I had been dating someone who I knew was not going to be but by the time we had dated for a couple months, it was kind of it was a little bit off and on I realized that was not going to be the man that helped me bring a child into the world. And I decided to go back to the same doctor, and I said, let's do it. How do we get book? Do you want to do you remember that wheat? I was like, well, you know, doing it versus like freezing. Do you want to talk about how you made that choice because you did a lot of analysis there. Yeah. So she told me about three different options. Basically, you go ahead and try to have a baby, you freeze your eggs, or you could do a combination of both, and you could go for in vitro at a later date. At that point, I think part of it was, given my age, freezing was not a guarantee that that would produce a child. So I could decide to try at forty two and end up not having a child. Also, the cost of freezing and vitro is much more, and the first try with just trying with the donor and not using fertility men. So I said, let's go for it. She said, let's try a few times and see what happens. And it worked. I was pregnant fairly soon after that, and yeah, gave birth January. So you want to talk about can you can you tell anything about like the donor selection process? Very curious, you don't have to go into it. Yeah, I need to tell you. Don't feel comfortable with anything about it. Yeah, I'm actually pretty open about it because people ask. But yeah, I didn't know anything about it. The fertility clinic that I worked with here in North Carolina, I loved them, and they only work with a few sperm banks, so they want the ones that are really you know, looking into the country and the genetics quality all control. You want to make sure that you're risk. I was low and for any kind of disease. So there is a very comprehensive genetic screening, which is nice. I feel like I actually knew in some ways medically more about this donor than I would about a partner. So it just it was interesting. And then you hear you find out all sorts of family information from heights and weights and occupations of the parents and grandparents and sisters and cousins and on and on and on. And so I chose someone who seemed healthy and seemed smart, who was in school. Yeah, just a number of things. And I got to see some of the profiles, which was really fun. Like I didn't put give real input, but it was just fun to be like part of that. If you're going to choose one pictures. There was even an audio interview. Yeah, so it was fun. Did you choose then, like you Yeah, I don't know. I looked at I looked at a whole bunch. The one I chose I liked. He was in grad school for neurodegenerative diseases. He had okay, had perfect vision without any correction, which is key. Very Yeah, healthy in general, not a lot of cancer in the family. Yeah, and a very cute baby picture. So the cute baby picture is everything because you assume that that's probably is going to look like maybe most babies are pretty cute, but okay, Yeah, and by the way Miriam is like so cute, Yes, exactly. So it has been a relatively you got pregnant fairly quickly then once you get start it's very lucky. This process, well, that's wonderful. And pregnancy, how I mean, how did you feel going through that not with a partner, since that is sort of the norm? I imagine people were like asking you all the time or you know, just mostly it felt fine because I mean I didn't have anything to compare it to. Sometimes I feel like the doctors are maybe not as sensitive as they could have been. Maybe not the doctors you a couple and think about it. Yeah, I mean question it's like, oh is your partner in the waiting room? Do they want to come in? Things like that, But mostly it was fine. I don't know, I've been very independent, I've lived alone. I just it felt fine to me. I didn't feel like going into an appointment that I needed someone else there. Yeah. And in terms of then caring for the baby, because that's been mostly just you then yeah the whole time. And I am just so how do you ever manage to get yourself a break at all? Or a little bit? So coming into this, I also kind of felt like I wasn't going to rely on other people, but that I had a tribe around me because my baby shower that Sarah helped organize, I don't know how many people were there. It was it was like a wild party. It was always did that customers. Yeah, I would say at least sixty people probably came flowered meet with presents. They all were you know, they all told me they would be happy to help out with a baby and come to the store and watch her and anything I needed. Well, unfortunately that's an exactly pan out because of COVID. I guess it did for two months. Yeah, yeah, so a little bit of help when my parents came down to help for the first month, But after that, I guess I kind of learned. And maybe it's a good thing in a way that I was able to do it on my own, and thankfully I've had I think Miriam is a very overall easy child. She sleeps beautifully. She did not for the first few months, but and that's obviously very difficult, but now she is a really wonderful sleeper. Again, she's sleeping right now. I don't expect her to wake up during this And yeah, overall, she's a pretty happy baby, so I think that has really been in my favor. So I'm sure if I had a really caligy baby, one that was really upset a lot, it would be a very different story. But because of that, I feel like manageable. Every once in a while, it's like I have a dog and you know, he'll throw up and trill of a poohee diaper and you know I'm starving, and all the things seem to collide at once, but overall it seems just doable. Well that's cool, I mean, because you have any advice for any of our listeners who are maybe looking at the same situation, they're say it's mid thirties, you know, debating if they want to go it by themselves or not. Goodness, I mean, I am just so glad I did this and I can't imagine life any other way right now. So if that helps it all, And I think even if it were harder, I'd somehow make it work as well. I mean, i'd have to, but I just am thankful every day with her. She is just a joy. Yeah, So it seems like it was this crazy idea in the beginning, and now it just I can't imagine it any other way. So, which is we discuss is a theme in your life. I mean it's like, really, you did the same thing. You've had two babies. You had the store baby and then the baby baby. Yeah, and both times were like kind of like not risky, but kind of like things that other people might have been hesitant because it just there's no like a clear path, but you made your path, and I think it's awesome. Yeah, I feel like it was sort of impulsive but also sort of thought out and then I get you know, I ruminate on something and then I really want it. So I guess that finally clicking the trigger is you just have to make that leap of faith at some point that it's going to be okay, because I don't think there's anything in the world, like I don't think there's any way that I could have known, like everything would just pan out. You know, it is a risk, financially, it's a risk in so many ways, but I don't think there's anything that would have just told me for sure that it was the right time. Well, there we go. I love it. This was great. I think I'm so excited for our listeners to to hear your story in this episode, and I was joking. I was like, you know, she'd be an amazing guest even if she wasn't also my sister. Do you have any Sarah stories you want to tell us that what she was like growing up? We got to hear about her planning list that you discovered in your parents' home, of her goals when she was nineteen eighty six. Goals list was featured previously. But yes, embarrassing Sarah story. I have one, the little maternal story that I think of because we you know, it was we were pretty close in age, so we played together a lot. And a very common game we played was Sarah was teacher. I was a student, and then I was an orphan and Sarah would adopt me over and over again. And sometimes I feel like you were like I don't want to do this. I'm like no, no, no no, no, no, like we have to do it again. Yep. I have very vivid memories of that as well. So I hope the Genevieve and Miriam can can like reenact that someday. I think it would be amazing. Yeah, because we're about there's almost the same art. Yeah. Yes, I mentioned in the intro that you know, Genevieve and Miriam are closer in age than Genevieve is to her older siblings. So I imagine someday down the road we're going to have some great cousin kind of gang time altogether, and I think those two hopefully can be close. Well, do you have a love of the week for it? Did I warn you about love of the week? Or did I forget? Did you did for me? And I have I believe I have a great love of the week. So this is just it was an odd heaven stance. I went to the grocery store for the first time. I went to Trader Joe's. They were actually very very organized, by the way, and a woman was loading up gooseberries into her cart. I had seen them before, and I was intrigued, but I'd never bought them. And she said, oh, yeah, I love them. I love them just pop in my mouth raw, And so I bought a container, took him home, ate one did not like it. Decided then to look up recipes, found a recipe for a gooseberry compote, and now it is my favorite thing. So on yogurt, probably on ice cream, probably over waffles, anything you want, but gooseberries cooked are wonderful. Wow, sounds good. I love that. I love the level of the week. Mine is super super superficial. It is the today, and I'm also like having amnesia today. Whether I've mentioned this before, but who cares if I did all mention it again. It's that good. It's the pharmacy, sleep tight firming night Bomb is very thick. It'd be good for winter if we had winter, but I just sort of craved that anyway. Like you know, some creams you put them on and your face is kind of cold because maybe they have some alcohol in it. This is not that. This is very almost petroleum jelly in texture, but smells a million times better and you wake up and your skin is nice and soft. It's they advertise themselves as like a retinol alternative, and I don't really see it that way, like I'll put retinol on and then put this on top. But I really like it. That's exciting. Mine this week is Green Drop, which is a company or organization that will come pick up your things that you would donate to various charities that then usually sell them. I think what they do is they sell them then in thrift stores and or to scrap dealers or whatever. And I just recently read a book called a second Hand Planet, or it was called Secondhand. It was about what actually happens to all your stuff when you donate it to places like this. So let's just say it goes somewhere and the money then goes to these charities that will use it. But anyway, it makes it very convenient to clean out stuff. I've been trying to get rid of a lot of stuff in my house to save boxes and put old books and clothes and all that stuff in there. But you just schedule a pick up, put it on your front porch, they come get it. That's all you have to do. So it's much easier than trying to drag it somewhere. So it just takes one extra little step out of the pill love that I may look that up. Yeah, yeah, I think they're all around everywhere. I know they're here, but they probably are or there's something similar I'm sure around the country. So yeah, look into it. Tell our listeners who might want to order yarn from you or check out your store where they can find you in the social media world and ordering information. Yeah, So it's warm and Fuzzy is the name of the store and the website. It's warm the Lettern Fuzzy dot com. We're on Instagram at warm and Fuzzy and Facebook as well. We have a weekly live video Tuesdays at ten thirty Eastern on Facebook. Wonderful. So go see Rebecca for all your yarn needs. And hopefully we've got a few listeners who are like you when it comes to yarn stores, they just go and buy tons of it whenever they wind up somewhere. So and let us know if they have great orders. We'd love to hear about it. All right, Welcome Rebecca, thanks for joining us for the tipsode so fun. Thank you, thank you, thank you for having me. Well, that was awesome. We've here from Rebecca. And so this few weeks question comes from a listener who has a toddler, and she says that the podcast has been helping her rethink her routines and her work life balance, and so that's awesome. And she says, yesterday, my family of three attempted a short trip to a nearby city to run some errands and just get out of the stroller ruts in our small town. To cut to the chase the trip ended up being her mostly fussing or crying in the car, although generally being okay when we were out. However, the stress from the combined three hours in the car like that put my husband and I at each other's throats. We criticized and fought until now we are stewing in silence the next day. Toddlers can't control their emotions, but adults should. So I have a two part question. One any tips for entertaining are toddler in the car so we don't get to this breaking point and be one and two? Or I don't any ideas on how to diffuse a difficult situation like that when we are in the car and can't physically take a break. So, Sarah, what do you have? I love this question. I mean I felt for her. I mean we've been there kind of. But then I would say, I mean, I'll skip to my last part, which is like, well, now you maybe learn something and maybe next time, if you really know that your baby is not going to tolerate the car, maybe don't take them on that long of a car trip. But it doesn't mean that that will still be the same in six months. Because the wonderful thing about toddler's is they're constantly changing, and so they're not going to stay toddlers forever unless you have another baby and have a new toddler. This this, you know, you might need this advice for a brief period which might seem like forever right now, but I promise you it's not. So that's my number four. But my other thoughts were, if there's any way you can get in more time outside to try to kind of tire them out before they get back in the car. That's been helpful for us. We have noted that the iPad with Mickey Mouse on it can be a solve for a child as young as you know, six eight months, just the colors and you know, of course that's not really like something that we do regularly in our family put babies in front of Mickey Mouse, but in the car when they're crying, like that is the time to do that. At least that's how we see it. So we have definitely stooped to that level. And then number three just the diffusing. I think that's when you just got to like look at your partner and just be like, well, this is kind of we have to like see the humor in this, like we have to see the fact that, like, we are stuck in a car with no other choice, and our intent was to have fun, and here we are, and like, what can we do to just see the sort of irony in it. You're in the trenches with your band of brothers, right exactly, bonding, binding the bombs are going off, you know, that's kind of what it is. No, this question made me laugh too, because I mean, I'm sure our listener is wonderful and sophisticated and just amazing parent and all this stuff, but they are relatively new to parenthood, right, and like if they have one toddler, and so I'm sure there was this idea of a lovely family trip, and of course the toddler didn't read the plan, and so there's this mismatch between expectations and reality. And of course the Buddha says that this is the cause of all suffering, is the mismatch between expectations and reality. But I think the way you have to view this is that a day can have unpleasant moments and not be all unpleasant. Right, you have to be very very careful with your narrative, because if you are looking for three points of evidence that this day was atrocious, Like you got them right, Like you can find your three points of evidence, like the toddler scream my husband and I hate each other, like whatever, Like you've got three points that like I should never do this again. And I've seen posts from people being like, you know, when I have children, will never travel because it looks so hard for the parents and the kids, and some people will just have to come to us. And I'm like, well great, So then if you have cousins, for instance, like you'll never see each other, Like if that's your attitude, like it's so miserable to travel that we just can't do it with young kids, then like you will never see your extended family, you'll never see your cousins, you'll never see other friends. Like it just like okay, if that's how you want to live your life. But you know, I think you have to just decide that there can be miserable moments and yet the overall whole can be okay. I mean, I wrote, have some of our listeners read I know how she does it. I discussed in There a beach trip back in what I believe was the summer of twenty fourteen, where you know, if I wanted to say that this was a miserable trip, like there there were plenty of that. Like we got caught in like a two hour traffic jam, you know, the seagulls slore are dessert that. There was a lot of baby screaming or two year old screaming. I guess. There was Sam vomited all over the place like multiple times. So it was just really everything that you know could possibly go wrong with a family car trip. But on the other hand, there were some really cool moments too. I mean there's you know, pretty beach like good lobster dinner we had, Like there were moments that didn't involve screaming and vomiting. So like, I'm which moments am I seeing the screaming and vomiting ones? Are they not screaming and vomiting ones? And so I think we just have to focus on, in this case, the lovely parts of walking around a new place, of being out and about and seeing you know, new stuff, spending some time together, and the rest is just transaction costs and you know, part of the package with parenthoods. So man up, woman up, you know, coming up, woman up. All right, Well, this has been best of Both worlds. We've been interviewing Rebecca Heart and we will be back next week with more on making work and life fit together. Thanks for listening. You can find me Sarah at the shoebox dot com or at the Underscore Shoebox on Instagram, and you can find me Laura at Laura vandercam dot com. This has been the Best of Both Worlds podcasts. Please join us next time for more on making work and life work together.