056 | EXAMPLE with Tony Wagner, State Champ Head Basketball Coach, Lubbock Estacado High School

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<|0.00|> Once I got to Lubbock, I started to understand because I had no one here.<|4.00|><|4.00|> It was me and my family, and I had no other family in Lubbock and West Texas for that matter.<|10.40|><|10.40|> And so I started playing a little bit of the rec leagues and stuff like that,<|14.00|><|14.00|> but it gave me more time to be at the school.<|16.72|><|16.72|> And the more I started hanging out around these kids in East Lubbock<|20.72|><|20.72|> and seeing that a lot of them grew up exactly how I did,<|23.92|><|23.92|> the more I wanted to become a coach and be an example for them that they can make it<|28.04|><|28.04|> out of here too.<|29.84|><|29.84|> My name is Tony Wagner and I am Undone.

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Hey friend, I am glad you are here.

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If this is your first episode of Becoming Undone, I hope you love it.

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I hope you stick around.

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I hope that you go back and binge these episodes and get inspired by high achievers who didn't let something like failure stand in the way of their eventual victory.

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And if you're a regular, let me just say thank you.

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I've learned a lot about achievement and resilience and grit in these past 10 months, and I couldn't have done it without you.

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So for real, thanks.

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That said, welcome to another episode of Becoming Undone, the podcast for those who dare bravely, risk mightily, and grow relentlessly.

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I'm Toby Brooks, a professor of Rehab Science at the Texas Tech University Health Sciences Center.

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And over the past two decades, I've grown more and more fascinated with what sets high achievers apart and how failures can frequently be necessary steps on our path to success.

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Each week on Becoming Undone, I invite new guests to examine how high achievers can transform from falling apart to falling into place.

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I'd like to emphasize that this show is entirely separate from my roles at Texas Tech, but it's my attempt to apply what I've learned and what I'm learning and to share with others about the mindsets of high achievers. For Lubbock Estacado High School head basketball coach Tony Wagner, it was early and somewhat tumultuous experiences that shaped him, but it's been his steady presence as a fixture on the sidelines of the legacy program he's built in East Lubbock that's defined him. A self-described late bloomer on the basketball court who was equally gifted in both track and hoops, his first stop at Navarro College was abruptly ended by academic difficulties.

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A father of two by 19, he found a fresh start at Cisco Junior College before transferring to four-year Wayland Baptist University to finish out his career and earn his degree. With opportunities to play overseas still present, he opted to stay stateside and begin his career.

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First as an assistant coach at Plainview High School in Plainview, Texas, then to Estacado, where he was promoted to head coach in 2006.

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He's been there ever since.

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Hear Coach Swaggs tell his inspiring story of not letting obstacles stop your progress.

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Why he wishes there would have been camera phones rolling on those championship bus rides and locker room celebrations.

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And why wedding invites mean more than victories in episode 56, Example, with coach Tony Wagner.

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This week we have the dean of high school basketball coaches in the 806. Tony Wagner has joined us. Coach, thanks for joining us.

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Thanks for having me.

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Really excited about this one. I've been in Lubbock for 14 years and I've certainly followed Estacado.

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We send students to the school and in terms of basketball powerhouses, they don't get any better than what you've built there.

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But this isn't about Estacado, this isn't about the program that you've built, this is about you.

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And so the question I always ask starting off is, start at the beginning, wherever that was for you.

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Well, from Wichita Falls, I graduated from Rider High School. One of the things right now that's going on in Wichita Falls is that they're closing down our high schools and they're building two high schools and so it's actually been a great week for me. I've got had the chance to go back home and meet with my parents and see my parents and then see some people that I hadn't seen in over 25 or 30 years because, you know, the Wichita Falls High and Rider rivalry football game was last weekend on Friday and it was the last one ever.

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And so a lot of our classmates and friends were there and so I mean, it was a good time to be a part of that.

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Yeah, well, I've been here 14 years and you've been a fixture in Lubbock, but certainly coming from Wichita Falls, I'm sure you grew up and basketball was a big part of your life.

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Tell me about athletics and when it entered the equation for you and maybe what sports you played and how those early experiences led to later things in college.

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My older cousins were all boxers. And so when I turned six years old, that's what I did as well.

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We started boxing for the Boys and Girls Club, but it wasn't Boys and Girls Club back then.

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It was just the Boys Club of Wichita Falls. And so at an early age, I was traveling and competing against other kids in the boxing ring, playing football, basketball, just being a normal kid up until I was probably about 12 years old.

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So I did those things.

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I boxed all year round and I played football, boys club football and boys club basketball.

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And then once I got to junior high, I just kind of got away from boxing and just did baseball, football and basketball. It's funny you say just did in this day and age. Estacado is probably the the larger end of that spectrum where athletes can be multi-sport athletes but certainly at the 5a at the 6a level being a multi-sport athlete is a really hard thing to do. The time commitment associated with each of those things. How do you think being a multi-sport athlete helped you as you grew not just as a baseball player as a basketball player but just generally as an athlete?

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Well, I think it's a sad case when parents decide to make their kids do only one sport.

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I don't have a single kid in our program that does one sport.

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You know, I feel like kids need to be able to compete at different levels, against different circumstances, against different people.

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And I feel like there needs to be at least one sport where only themselves are being held accountable, whether it's cross country, whether it's track, whether it's baseball, or something where you can't blame others for your mistakes.

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I think you get caught up and you start playing a team sport and only a team sport, I don't think you really learn the full capability of accountability when it comes to taking accountability for your mistakes and your teammates' mistakes or anything else. So, I love kids that play multiple sports, you know, and I make a way for them to succeed in our program. I work around what they got going on, like Bobby Ross is a two-sport kid, so obviously I'm not gonna let him get mad because he missed his practice to go on a visit to Alabama, you know. I mean, and vice versa, when Kevin was here and he played basketball, Coach Servan allowed him to go down and play in Elite 14 in Wichita Falls, which is where we played against the Randall kid that's in New York.

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You know, we played them that weekend.

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And so just every college coach in America was there.

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And he understood where Kevin was going to play college basketball, so he allowed him to go down and play that weekend, although they had a football game the night before.

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I think you have to have some grace with those kids in those instances so they can have the most fun of their life.

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In high school, I think a lot of times as coaches, we get so bogged up in our sport that we forget that these are kids.

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And so, to me, it's hard to enjoy the full high school experience doing one thing.

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Sure.

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So, you're a multi-sport athlete.

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You end up at Cisco College.

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Talk me through your high school career.

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What were the, maybe, the high point and the low point as a high school athlete for you and what it taught you?

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Well, I graduated in 1990, so only two teams went to the playoffs in every sport.

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And we were in a district with, at the time, it was just Sermon High School and Denton High School.

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You can imagine how good Denton is now with all those multiple schools now.

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Imagine them being one big school.

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You know, Louisville was only one high school.

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Flourmouth, Marcus, and all those different people were all in our district.

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So only two teams went to the playoffs, and we finished third every year.

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So I mean that was tough but I don't know if that was a good thing or a bad thing because the reward for the second place finishing our district back then was forward Dunbar who was a powerhouse and so I don't know I would have liked to go one and done at least experienced it but it was one of those deals where I never really made the playoffs in high school and so I made it to a play-in game, but we lost to Mario Bennett in then high, in which Mario went on to star at Arizona State and play for the Lakers.

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So it was just a different time back then.

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So I decided to run track because all of my friends ran track.

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I never really ran summer track or anything like that, but ended up going to State Track meet.

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I jumped in 16, I think it was 16, 16-11, something like that.

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As a senior, I only ran track that one year.

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And so I went to Cisco, played basketball there a couple of years, but my first stop actually was in Navarro College with Coach Orr, who, and that changed my life.

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My maturity level was really low back then.

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I was kind of a knucklehead, ended up flunking out of Navarro.

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I had to sit out because I was on academic probation.

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So I had to sit out somewhere, so I couldn't go anywhere.

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And so my mom being a pastor's wife and my dad being a preacher.

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And so they wouldn't hire me going back to Navarro.

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So that's how I ended up with Coach Gallien at Cisco Junior College.

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So in that moment, obviously nobody would have chosen to be academically ineligible or to have to transfer.

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What do you think that experience taught you that has helped you as a coach and that adversity that you encountered as an athlete, what did it create within you that allows you to maybe counsel or coach a young man differently?

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Well, all of my friends were still in college and so I was still home.

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I was working at the local grocery store.

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I was bagging groceries.

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Then my daughter was born and Kevin was born.

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And so here I am, you know, 19 years old with two kids, not married, and not knowing really where I wanted to end up in life.

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But I knew I didn't want to bag groceries forever. I knew I didn't want to work at PPG, at the glass company forever. I mean, it was hot in there. So I understood that if I ever wanted to be any kind of successful, I needed a job that required that there was going to have some air conditioning in it. So that was kind of my motivation.

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So, Coach Gallien was kind enough to take me on the second semester when I was eligible to get back into school at Sisko Junior College.

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And I took 20 hours that semester to become eligible to play in the fall.

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And so, he made sure I had all the resources that I needed.

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Taking 20 hours in a semester is tough.

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I felt like I was in class all day and all night.

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But we worked through it, and I ended up graduating from there and getting to Whalen and play for Coach Cleveland over there at Whalen Baptist.

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I think sometimes we don't realize what we're capable of and when we start and encounter adversity and we fold, it's really easy to walk away from that lesson feeling like we're a failure or we're less than or letting that kind of soak into our identity.

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And the fact that you were able to be successful with that kind of academic load.

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What do you think that taught you about yourself that semester of just being stretched to the absolute limits of what you're capable of?

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Well, at that moment, I learned that you don't know how strong you can be until you have to be strong.

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At that point, like I said, I had two kids, two small kids, and all of my friends were having a lot of success in college where they were attending, but one of my friends, Robert Brooks, his daughter just competed in the World Games in the decathlon, so he was a big motivation of mine.

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Then another one of my friends, he started running one of the local car dealers there.

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He's like 22, first general manager at one of the car dealers there in West South Falls.

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And so all those things motivated me, seeing them doing really well, and so I just stayed the course and worked and worked and worked and worked and made sure that I did everything I needed to do to stay in school and play basketball so that I can one day provide for the two kids that I have. Sure, so you know better than I do the fact that the likelihood of being a college athlete is pretty low for a high school athlete and I want to say depending on the sport it could be as low as one or two percent, maybe as high as eight or nine, but still for basketball players, playing at that next level is a big deal. So it doesn't matter if it's a junior college or D1 school, that's a fairly unique group. It's an elite group. You end up at Navarro. What were your dreams? Was that the choice for you or did you have grander aspirations when you were in high school? Well, I was a late bloomer. So like my freshman year, I was 5'2", my sophomore year I was 5'5", my junior year I was 5'7", and then between my junior and senior year I grew five inches. And so I went from being this small point guard to this big guard that can play three positions at that time. And so I wasn't being heavily recruited, so Duco was really the best option for me. And my Duco team was really, really good.

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I mean, we were really good.

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We had guys on our team that played at the Division I level when they left.

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Alex Wright ended up being like the D2 player of the year two years in a row, National Player of the Year.

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And I think the only reason he ended up at Central Oklahoma was because he didn't have the grades to get into a Division I school, which also motivated me.

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Because I'm thinking, jeez, this guy was just ranked number four in the country, and Juco behind Sam Purcell and Nick Van Exel and another kid, and he's going to Central Oklahoma.

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So I didn't want to put myself in that position, even though I didn't end up going to Division I.

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But it was motivation for me to start going to class after the fact.

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So that was one of the things that kept me through Cisco, is remembering how Alex finished up at UCO.

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And I've yet to play against a player that was better than him.

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And I was on that team with him that played against Nick Van Exel and John Barry and Sam Fishelle and all those guys.

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And he was every bit as good as those guys.

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All those guys went to the league.

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So you end up at Whelan.

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And a lot of my guests on here have had this.

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It's almost like a cheat.

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Like sport is so critical.

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It's such a part of our identity, and then we're not ready for that to be over.

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There's not an opportunity to play professionally, so then we go into coaching.

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For me, it was athletic training.

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When you saw your career at Weyland's winding down the last few games there, what would you say your role in your relationship with basketball was at that stage of your life?

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And what did the thought of not having that competitive outlet due to you psychologically?

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So when I finished at Whelan, I still had a year of eligibility left as far as another sport goes.

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And also, I played well enough to where I got some looks invited to some camps, CBA camps and stuff like that back then.

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So a friend of mine and I, we drove to Iowa and I ended up making the team.

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And so I had an opportunity to go over and play overseas, but it was only like $22,000 or $23,000.

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And at that time I was young and made and had a couple of kids.

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And so I was thinking to myself, I can make $22,000 here in the United States and not have to leave my family.

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This is now the second time my research has failed me, but cut me some slack.

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Coach Wags and I are of the same era, a pre-internet era.

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Google is questionable in finding out stuff about our generation.

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Not only did his college career start at Navarro, not Cisco, a fact that I hadn't found in my research, he also had a chance to play pro ball overseas.

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He did what he thought he had to at the time and passed on the opportunity, but his future lay not inside the court boundaries, but outside.

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His career as a coach was starting to fall into place.

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But at the same time, hindsight looking back, I feel like that was probably one of the worst decisions that I made because I never went to go see how good I could have been or if I could have actually made it playing over there.

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What could I have turned that $20,000 into?

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But instead, I took a job working at Plainview ISD.

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Yeah.

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So you've completed your playing career.

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What did that adversity teach you that success probably wouldn't have when you ended up day one at Plainview?

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Man, once I stopped playing and I realized that I wasn't going to play overseas and I still needed a year to graduate, I joined a track team at Wayland.

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Coach Bielby came out and he was like, man, I know you had jumps in high school, and I want you to come see if you can still do it here." So I was a grad assistant at Whelan at the time, and it was another way for me to go out and compete.

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And so I ended up going out there and finished second in nationals, indoor nationals, I think I came in fifth in the outdoor nationals that year, and I was All-American at Whelan and track.

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I think I jumped like over seven foot, something like that.

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But again, it was another lesson that I learned that I never really gave tracking my all.

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I always just did enough to get by.

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And so it wasn't until the bar was at like seven two, and then if you clear seven two, that's a qualifying height for a different trial that I understood that I should have taken it a little bit more seriously.

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And so then after that, I just coached and played pickup games with the guys at Whalum up until I started at Plainview High School.

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Yeah.

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So you weren't a Plainview long before you ended up at Estacado as an assistant.

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According to my research here, you were there 2000, 2006 as an assistant, and then you've been head ever since.

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What were your goals initially when you made that transition from athlete to coach?

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What, where did you see yourself in the future and where did you see coaching leading your life?

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I really didn't think that I would ever be a head coach.

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I was in Plainview, I was assistant at Plainview from 98 to 2000.

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Then I came here in 2000 and I was Coach Thomas' assistant here from 2000 to 2006.

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And while I was in Plainview, man, I mean, it was some guys over there that were just unbelievable athletes that were just stuck at home, that got in certain trouble.

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Guys like Pat Nash and Stephen Ridley.

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I think they just put him in the Athletic Hall of Fame in Plainview this past week.

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Marcus Williams, D.B. Ray, there was a lot of talent there, a lot of guys that were home, that were living there, that played at high level football and basketball, but they were just living.

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And so I was on all these city league teams with those guys, and we were winning all these leagues and stuff.

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But once I got to Lubbock, I started to understand because I had no one here with me and my family and I had no other family in Lubbock and West Texas for that matter. And so I started playing a little bit of the rec leagues and stuff like that but it gave me more time to be at the school and the more I started hanging out around these kids in East Lubbock and seeing that a lot of them grew up exactly how I did.

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The more I wanted to become a coach and be an example for them, that they can make it out of here too.

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A great day to be an Estacado Matador! It is a great day to be an Estacado Matador.

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They return home state champs for the first time in school history.

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And they return home heroes.

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First state title for the city of Lubbock in 59 years and doing so against Dallas Madison, the number one team in the state.

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When you win state, I don't think the guys matter who it's against.

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And I think we could have played anyone.

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We have the same feeling that we have right now.

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Put this in the paper, baby, number one.

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Feel good.

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It's all we talk about this year.

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And we make sure that we work hard so we can leave with a state championship.

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District! Chant! Area! Chant! Regional! Chant! I can't say enough about the city of Lubbock, how they came together in supporting us, our neighborhood. They get a chance to hold on, grab a hold of something that's positive and take pride in it. And I don't think it's just our community, I think it's Lubbock in general.

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It's important to our city, it's important to us, and my dad got a saying, a tradition never graduates. So it's real important to us to keep the tradition going.

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Well, your success at Estacado is nothing short of remarkable.

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I'm going to rattle off some accolades here.

00:20:36.000 --> 00:20:59.839
Since 2000, 15 district championships, 16 area championships, four regionals, four state tournament appearances, one state championship, 78-game district winning streak, ranked in the top 50 in the U.S. twice, and top 20 once. Teams finished ranked in the top five of the state eight times and you've been named coach of the year nine times. You've also been named to a number of awards.

00:20:59.839 --> 00:21:16.880
I gotta believe that Estacado is not the most heavily resourced school in the world. It's not the largest division. It's not college. I'm sure you've had those opportunities. What has kept you at Estacado when those opportunities came to call?

00:21:16.880 --> 00:21:30.440
I think that our kids on this side of town need to see more of guys like myself that are doing things the right way and invested in them so they can see they can do it too.

00:21:30.440 --> 00:21:32.839
I've had opportunities to go to a couple of Ducos.

00:21:32.839 --> 00:21:42.720
I've had an opportunity to go to some big time colleges, but at the same time, I always lean back on my mentors, Tim Thomas and Mark Adams.

00:21:42.720 --> 00:21:45.200
I'm off his coaching tree.

00:21:45.200 --> 00:21:47.200
And we all kind of have the same philosophy.

00:21:47.200 --> 00:21:48.519
And that's kind of what Tim did.

00:21:48.519 --> 00:21:51.599
Tim just went and explored those opportunities.

00:21:51.599 --> 00:21:56.039
He went to Cedar Hill, and then he went to Temple, then he went to Odessa Permian.

00:21:56.039 --> 00:22:27.000
But really, he's looking for another place like El Sacado, because, I mean, there's really no place to be like the E. And I talked to him about everything. I said, Coach, you know, these guys are coming to me, and Coach, I got a good setup here. I'm allowed to work with our kids at younger ages. You know, our kids, they're brought in over here. There's not a lot of restructuring and discipline things that we have to deal with because they just know what the standard is. And so, at this point in my career, that's just something I'm not willing to go try and rebuild and restart.

00:22:27.000 --> 00:22:41.000
Yeah. One thing I'm definitely impressed by is you have seen some incredible talent come and go through your program, but the success doesn't fall off just because another class steps across the graduation stage.

00:22:41.000 --> 00:22:46.000
And if I'm not mistaken, that's one of your cultural things is tradition never graduates.

00:22:46.000 --> 00:22:51.279
What has been the culture that you have worked to build at Estacado.

00:22:51.279 --> 00:22:56.039
How do you think that's parlayed over and influenced your long-term success?

00:22:56.039 --> 00:22:59.319
Well, most people don't believe this when I tell them.

00:22:59.319 --> 00:23:02.940
I mean, like the wins are good, they're fine, they're fun.

00:23:02.940 --> 00:24:04.759
It's fun to be a part of the successes, but the thing that gets me the most is when those kids come back five years later, or 10 years later, or their kids start coming to my basketball camp and they're walking around the gym, they're looking at the banners that their dad's on and they're glowing their faces and now they're successful men in our community. They're successful men, they're successful fathers, successful husbands, they're just doing everything the right way. Like right now I got nine kids that are currently enrolling in colleges, you know, I got five from last year and all of those kids were early college kids and so they're Creeland's going, Creeland's a senior right now, it's 19 year old senior at his college where he's playing basketball, Jaquan's a junior at his college and DT, DT, Dakari Thompson and DeLoran are both juniors at Tech this year, you know, they're all 19 years old and those are the things I take pride of was that they took care of their academics and got ahead and like so that they can be generational for their kids.

00:24:04.759 --> 00:24:11.119
You know, Keontae Williams and all the things that he went through, you know, he was put on the plane the other day to Platoon, took me in.

00:24:11.119 --> 00:24:14.759
So although we butted heads, I think they started listening to the message.

00:24:14.759 --> 00:24:15.960
I don't sugarcoat it.

00:24:15.960 --> 00:24:16.960
I don't hide it.

00:24:16.960 --> 00:24:20.559
I tell them the absolute truth about how it's going to work.

00:24:20.559 --> 00:24:25.119
And they don't understand it always at the beginning, but as they get older, they do.

00:24:25.119 --> 00:24:26.119
Yeah.

00:24:26.119 --> 00:24:54.000
You mentioned the early college program. I've got a lot of listeners who are kind of all over the country. They might not be familiar with that. Talk me up through that early college program and the role you played in helping get that established. Well it's through Texas Tech. So if you get accepted into that program you can graduate high school with up to 60 college hours and they're all transferable, they're all free, the kids don't have to pay a dime, they just have to pass the classes.

00:24:54.000 --> 00:25:06.000
And so for our kids, it means a lot to me because now those kids that are graduating high school, it's the same kids, but they're going to college and they're not finishing.

00:25:06.000 --> 00:25:16.000
But with this program, if you graduate with 50 hours, it's a lot more encouraging for you to go to college and finish when you know that you can be, you know, like Creeland wants to be an engineer.

00:25:16.000 --> 00:25:19.000
So, once he's done, he can already start whatever he's doing.

00:25:19.000 --> 00:25:21.000
And then I have a couple of them that want to be lawyers.

00:25:21.000 --> 00:25:32.000
And so, they can be 20 years old and get in law school because they're already done with college because they graduated with 55, 56, 58 hours of college credit when they graduated high school.

00:25:32.000 --> 00:25:37.839
And so, for me, I think it's generational for our kids that are involved in that program.

00:25:37.839 --> 00:25:47.440
So if they want to pursue careers that require additional programs, when they finish those careers, they're still the same age as their classmates that didn't go into the early college stuff.

00:25:47.440 --> 00:25:49.720
I think it's a phenomenal program.

00:25:49.720 --> 00:25:53.759
I think you're right. I think it incentivizes college.

00:25:53.759 --> 00:25:55.480
Like you realize, I'm halfway there already.

00:25:55.480 --> 00:25:58.039
Like why wouldn't I finish this degree?

00:25:58.039 --> 00:26:01.880
They've proven to themselves that they have the ability to get it done.

00:26:01.880 --> 00:26:08.559
And so I'm a first gen college student myself and it doesn't come naturally in some families.

00:26:08.559 --> 00:26:11.460
You know, some places it's assumed you're gonna go to college.

00:26:11.460 --> 00:26:15.839
Other times that takes a big investment, a big commitment from the entire family.

00:26:15.839 --> 00:26:19.319
And I think it really does change the mindset and it's fantastic.

00:26:19.319 --> 00:26:24.000
Like one example is Tyce Kenny, who was a phenomenal athlete, extremely smart.

00:26:24.000 --> 00:26:32.599
He had a couple of two co-officers play basketball, but he got the President's Award to go to Tech, and so he had 55 college hours.

00:26:32.599 --> 00:26:36.279
So he went to summer school, and so that put him as a junior.

00:26:36.279 --> 00:26:42.180
So when he started school, he's already doing the classes for his major.

00:26:42.180 --> 00:26:51.579
So now, he didn't understand the class load or the workload that was going to be involved with that because he was also trying to walk on at Texas Tech at the time.

00:26:51.579 --> 00:26:54.240
And Texas Tech basketball was so time consuming.

00:26:54.240 --> 00:26:57.160
And then with him being in that program was time consuming.

00:26:57.160 --> 00:27:00.920
He didn't understand the amount of work that it was gonna take to complete that.

00:27:00.920 --> 00:27:12.119
And so, afterwards, he comes in here and he says, you know, coach, I didn't understand how much it was gonna be like to be an athlete and a student at the Division I level.

00:27:12.119 --> 00:27:16.160
But after about a week of that, he understood exactly how hard it is for those kids.

00:27:16.160 --> 00:27:22.799
Well, I said I got here 14 years ago, so I was here to see the legendary K-Wag play for you.

00:27:22.799 --> 00:27:27.759
And talk me through what it was like coaching your own son in that championship run.

00:27:27.759 --> 00:27:40.000
Well, it was good. These guys are coming in here to get all my snacks now, Toby.

00:27:40.000 --> 00:27:42.000
You know, you just got to run and track.

00:27:42.000 --> 00:27:44.000
What did y'all do today?

00:27:44.000 --> 00:27:46.000
Well, we did a mile.

00:27:46.000 --> 00:27:48.000
We did 10 kills in 25 yards.

00:27:48.000 --> 00:27:50.000
Okay.

00:27:50.000 --> 00:27:58.000
Now, a more formal podcaster might get upset at the busy background, the distractions, and the constant stream of athletes in and out of their guest's office.

00:27:58.000 --> 00:28:06.000
And I'll admit it, part of me wishes I'd wrangled Coach Wagner into a quiet soundproof studio where we could do this interview.

00:28:06.000 --> 00:28:12.000
I almost edited out the chatter and the interactions going on while we interviewed, but I left it in.

00:28:12.000 --> 00:28:14.000
I need to point out two things here.

00:28:14.000 --> 00:28:18.000
It's 6 p.m. when we're doing this interview in the off-season.

00:28:18.000 --> 00:28:30.200
Coach Wagner is not only giving me his time for the interview, but he's at the school in his office being the leader and the man and the example of someone committed to the job.

00:28:30.200 --> 00:28:36.480
It's been said that champions do daily what the average do occasionally, and Coach Wagner is a champion.

00:28:36.480 --> 00:28:42.200
He's leading young athletes by example, and his impact goes far beyond the basketball court.

00:28:42.200 --> 00:28:51.000
They're coming in from outside from our off-season stripping condition and stuff, but actually today is Kevin's birthday, Kevin 31.

00:28:51.000 --> 00:28:53.039
I mean, it's run by pretty fast.

00:28:53.039 --> 00:28:57.680
And that's one of the things that I wish I would have videoed more of it.

00:28:57.680 --> 00:29:04.359
I was one of those dads that was like, man, I see those other dads videotaping everything that's going on.

00:29:04.359 --> 00:29:05.519
I'm like, why are you doing that?

00:29:05.519 --> 00:29:07.359
I mean, that's just kind of corny.

00:29:07.359 --> 00:29:57.880
But now, I wish I would have, especially not even the games, just the interaction on the bus after we won state I wish I had that stuff on camera the interaction in the locker room after we won state I wish I had that stuff on camera and just walking from the drum to the buses I wish I had all that stuff on your own I go back to look at the schedule of our games back then and we're playing Dallas Lincoln, video you know I mean just then you just we're playing Garland Lake, we're playing all kinds of teams that are really, really think that you'll see another kid like that or you'll have another kid like that good from Chicago, from Houston, and we're beating them.

00:29:55.640 --> 00:30:01.700
well I'm still waiting you know right Well, I remember it was my first couple of weeks here.

00:30:01.700 --> 00:30:02.880
I'm a basketball guy.

00:30:02.880 --> 00:30:05.880
Being a basketball guy in West Texas is not a real easy thing to do.

00:30:05.880 --> 00:30:07.539
This is football country.

00:30:07.539 --> 00:30:15.799
And one of my students who was assigned out at Estacado brought me, it might have been a laptop, it might have been before a lot of YouTube on the phone.

00:30:15.799 --> 00:30:19.079
And he showed me this video of K-Wag doing work on YouTube.

00:30:19.079 --> 00:30:21.000
He's like, you gotta see this kid.

00:30:21.000 --> 00:30:27.200
And I knew from hearing his conversations that you were the program to watch without a question.

00:30:27.200 --> 00:30:31.680
Winning a state championship is a mountaintop experience, no doubt about it.

00:30:31.680 --> 00:30:42.480
Would you say that's the mountaintop experience of your coaching career or is there maybe another moment that stands out in your mind as the pinnacle of what you've accomplished so far as a coach?

00:30:42.480 --> 00:30:49.000
Man, the thing is, again, I'm weird, man.

00:30:49.000 --> 00:30:55.559
I mean, the things that excite me about being a coach is being invited to my players' weddings.

00:30:55.559 --> 00:30:58.279
You know, when they're getting married, they want me there.

00:30:58.279 --> 00:31:04.200
Or their daughters or sons are getting Christian at church, and they want me there.

00:31:04.200 --> 00:31:07.720
Those are the things that excite me more than the winning.

00:31:07.720 --> 00:31:16.440
I just felt like if you do everything right, or as best you can, and you've got a few athletes, especially in West Texas, the win's going to take care of itself.

00:31:16.440 --> 00:31:22.440
But those guys want you to be a part of the special moments when they're 30, they're 35 years old.

00:31:22.440 --> 00:31:26.839
Those are the things that make me feel like that we're really reaching our kids.

00:31:26.839 --> 00:32:03.000
I told our guys after we won state, and that's why I said I wish we had video of this stuff, that winning the state championship is the biggest moment of their life that they hadn't lived. You know, that's a great moment for that point of time in their life, but if that's still the greatest, 20 years later, if that's still the best thing that you've ever did and you've really not lived. And so, and I mean that because I mean, I can't imagine, you know, Aiden being born, the state championship, winning the state championship, being bigger than my kids being born, you know. And so, and those are the kind of conversations that we have.

00:32:03.000 --> 00:32:15.160
Well, I follow you on social media and I see your gym pics and talk me through what you think the role of being an example, like living out what you're coaching to your student-athletes.

00:32:15.160 --> 00:32:17.240
You live it.

00:32:17.240 --> 00:32:19.079
You can't trick them.

00:32:19.079 --> 00:32:23.640
You know, they know if a coach cares, if they love their job, they want to be around.

00:32:23.640 --> 00:32:26.000
Even in the summers, I don't miss what our guys are doing.

00:32:26.000 --> 00:32:28.000
If they're playing, I'm at that.

00:32:28.000 --> 00:32:30.000
I'm at whatever, especially if it's in Lubbock.

00:32:30.000 --> 00:32:36.000
I mean, I'm at that facility because I feel like if they think it's important to me, it'll be more important to them.

00:32:36.000 --> 00:32:40.000
And so, even with the little kids, I can't stay away from it.

00:32:40.000 --> 00:32:46.000
I started coaching this little fifth through sixth grade team called One Way, and I have my staff up here.

00:32:46.000 --> 00:33:41.000
It's hard work for me because I'm expecting to pour into our community the same way as I do. So once they become head coaches they'll be used to it. So we coach them. Coach Perez coached the third and fourth grade team and Coach Thomas he was coaching the first and second grade team and I coached the fifth and sixth grade team. We have them up here every Monday and Wednesday working them out for an hour, even in the season. So we'll have practice out here, get our guys out the gym and then here comes our little one-way kids. We'll practice them for an hour. I feel like if the community see that you pointed to them that they'll have a little bit more support for you and those kids I grew up wanting to be Matadors sometimes and they see their cousins and their brothers and their uncles They had played here and they want to be a part of tradition and they get a chance to meet me and see how I am and understand my expectations because I coach my sixth grade team as hard as I coach my varsity team and Shoot those y'all for getting beat by 30 and 40 points in the beginning of the summer.

00:33:41.000 --> 00:33:45.000
But at the end of the summer, they won the last three terms they played in.

00:33:45.000 --> 00:33:49.000
And so I could see the progress in those kids, and they call me every day.

00:33:49.000 --> 00:33:56.000
I mean, it's worthsome, but, you know, when they don't have football on Saturdays, at 7.30 a.m.

00:33:56.000 --> 00:34:00.000
they're texting me, Coach, what time can we get in the gym?

00:34:00.000 --> 00:34:03.640
And I'm going to ask them, did they even go to sleep yet?

00:34:03.640 --> 00:34:06.960
But I'll come up here and let them in, let them shoot.

00:34:06.960 --> 00:34:13.719
The other night I was up here, I guess 9, 9.30 on a Sunday, and I just let them shoot.

00:34:13.719 --> 00:34:15.119
I'll come on in, y'all can shoot.

00:34:15.119 --> 00:34:16.679
And then they'll go home.

00:34:16.679 --> 00:34:24.920
But for me, it's an outlet for them, so I know that they're not in the streets getting in trouble, so I don't mind it.

00:34:24.920 --> 00:34:30.960
Well, I certainly appreciate the fact that you've overcome your share of adversity and getting to where you've gotten.

00:34:30.960 --> 00:34:39.320
And whether it be high school, undergrad, early coaching experiences, it wasn't all easy.

00:34:39.320 --> 00:34:40.539
Some of it was adversity.

00:34:40.539 --> 00:34:44.400
How would you say you're different as a result of the adversity that you face?

00:34:44.400 --> 00:34:47.000
And how do you think your journey shaped you the most?

00:34:47.000 --> 00:34:52.960
Well, I feel like that I can overcome anything that's thrown my way.

00:34:52.960 --> 00:34:56.960
I feel like if I lose it all, I can go get it all right back.

00:34:56.960 --> 00:35:02.960
To not get so down on myself when things are bad, and not to get so high on myself when things are good.

00:35:02.960 --> 00:35:05.960
Because at the blink of an eye, any of it can change.

00:35:05.960 --> 00:35:11.960
My dad was just diagnosed with ALS, I guess, about three weeks ago.

00:35:11.960 --> 00:35:16.960
Well, a month ago, he was driving a school bus for summer school kids.

00:35:16.960 --> 00:35:22.760
But in that instant, his whole life changed just based on him falling down one time.

00:35:22.760 --> 00:35:24.760
And so, I don't take anything for granted.

00:35:24.760 --> 00:35:35.599
I don't take anything for granted, and I try to live life to the fullest, to the best I can with no regrets, and I try to handle everything on an even keel.

00:35:35.599 --> 00:35:43.039
I love that you mentioned your roots are in boxing and you mentioned Mark Adams and obviously he's got connections to boxing.

00:35:43.039 --> 00:35:51.760
If you could speak a word of wisdom or some advice into the year of that little six year old boxer back in Wichita Falls, what would you tell yourself?

00:35:51.760 --> 00:36:00.480
I would say get a smaller headgear so every time I got punched I wouldn't have to turn it around so I could see.

00:36:00.480 --> 00:36:05.800
That's what I would tell myself, man.

00:36:05.800 --> 00:36:14.400
Get a smaller, because that one punch turned into three or four while I was trying to turn my headgear to the front so that I could see.

00:36:14.400 --> 00:36:24.480
In fact, when I get off the phone with you, I think I'm going to inbox my boxing coach and say, man, why do I have such a big headgear?

00:36:24.480 --> 00:36:32.519
Well in this day and age, with concussions being what they are, people would probably accuse you of child abuse, headgear or not, with a cigarette.

00:36:32.519 --> 00:36:33.519
Yeah.

00:36:33.519 --> 00:36:34.519
It's a different era for sure.

00:36:34.519 --> 00:36:35.519
It's definitely different.

00:36:35.519 --> 00:36:40.159
It's different, you know, but I, you know, it is what it is.

00:36:40.159 --> 00:36:41.960
You have to be able to change with the culture.

00:36:41.960 --> 00:36:45.440
I can't coach these kids the way I coached them 10 years ago.

00:36:45.440 --> 00:36:54.000
They just not built like that, especially with these COVID kids who didn't get yelled at or talked to for almost two years, you know, they don't respond very well to that.

00:36:54.000 --> 00:36:57.000
It almost shakes them into being still and thinkers.

00:36:57.000 --> 00:37:00.000
And then as basketball players, you don't want thinkers on the floor.

00:37:00.000 --> 00:37:02.000
You want kids that's going to react.

00:37:02.000 --> 00:37:05.000
So I had to learn that the hard way.

00:37:05.000 --> 00:37:07.000
It took me a season or so to figure it out.

00:37:07.000 --> 00:37:14.000
But it is what it is, and a lot of our people my age want to call them soft and this, that, and the other.

00:37:14.000 --> 00:37:24.880
It's just a time we live in. I had to tell this guy the other day, I said, did you play football? He said, yeah, I played football. Did you have a face mask? Yeah, I said, well, you soft. So when football was first started, they didn't have a face mask.

00:37:24.880 --> 00:37:38.559
So does that make you soft for wanting a face mask? And so, yeah, I put things in those perspectives for people nowadays when they start calling the younger generation soft because the technology has proven or data has proven things to be different than how it was when we grew up.

00:37:38.559 --> 00:38:04.860
Yeah, there's a coach on social media and he talks about how kids aren't different, adults are different. You know, what my coach and what your coach wouldn't stand for, we do. And I learned as an educator and as a coach, you're either coaching it or allowing it to happen. And if I want someone to respond to how I'm trying to shape them, I have to be consistent.

00:38:04.860 --> 00:38:07.139
I have to be clear in my communication.

00:38:07.139 --> 00:38:13.500
And I think we have to be a little bit more purposeful about that maybe than we did years past.

00:38:13.500 --> 00:38:18.500
But still I recognize that the coach sets the tone.

00:38:18.500 --> 00:38:27.000
And you can't just expect your athletes to know exactly what you expect of them on day one. You got to cultivate that.

00:38:27.000 --> 00:38:33.000
You got to cultivate it and then you also have to have kids that have been there to help you cultivate it.

00:38:33.000 --> 00:39:40.000
So if you're not around and they're in the locker room, they're doing something that they know they're not supposed to do, you got to have kids in that locker room explaining to them that, okay, you can choose to do this, just understand that Coach Walken here, this is what's happening, you're doing it, it's going to be a consequence. And so in fact, it's funny you say that because I thought for today was you promote what you allow. That was our thought for today before athletics. You promote what you allow. Then I asked them what do they think that means. And so they give me their version of it. Then I give them my version of it in drills, in the form of drills, or rather jumping rope. I said, you see your teammate over there and every time I turn my back and he stops jumping rope, well you promoting it. Because you're allowing him to stop jumping rope when he should be jumping rope the whole time. I shouldn't have to turn around and tell this kid to get his rope going and you're standing right next to him. Or if you're in a classroom and he's acting up in the classroom and you don't say anything, well you're promoting his behavior. I shouldn't have to come to that classroom to get on to him for him to act right if you sit right next to him.

00:39:40.000 --> 00:39:45.000
That's where your role at the school, obviously you're working with sixth graders, so they know your system.

00:39:45.000 --> 00:39:48.000
They are literally raised within the confines of your culture.

00:39:48.000 --> 00:39:50.000
And that's why tradition never graduates.

00:39:50.000 --> 00:39:55.000
By the time they're seniors, it's not your culture, it's their culture.

00:39:55.000 --> 00:40:10.079
Yeah, and I enjoy it, you know, because I can just walk in and if I'm late, like from a class or in my assistant coaches or in class, in a company class, I don't have to worry about if our kids are getting dressed and getting on the floor and getting where they're supposed to be.

00:40:10.079 --> 00:40:13.800
They just know that's what they're supposed to be doing.

00:40:13.800 --> 00:40:15.960
I don't have to worry about if they start to stretch it.

00:40:15.960 --> 00:40:20.239
I just know once I get in there, it's going to be where it needs to be.

00:40:20.239 --> 00:40:24.239
And so, again, that's part of the culture that we've built.

00:40:24.239 --> 00:40:25.679
For sure.

00:40:25.679 --> 00:40:35.119
Getting close here, I love music and the emotions that it can represent. If we were to piece together a montage of your life, what song would be playing in the background and why?

00:40:35.119 --> 00:40:50.320
Man, I'm such a R&B person. You know, it would probably be T-Sweat, Right and Wrong Way to love somebody.

00:40:50.320 --> 00:40:50.960
That's a good one.

00:40:50.960 --> 00:40:52.239
It will probably be that one.

00:40:52.239 --> 00:40:56.400
I just interviewed Garfield Bright, who was one of the founding members of Shy.

00:40:56.400 --> 00:40:59.760
So I'm a huge 90s R&B guy myself.

00:40:59.760 --> 00:41:03.280
So I loved hearing from those guys on how they blew up.

00:41:03.280 --> 00:41:07.840
And then he went on and got his PhD after he was done with the group and still singing today.

00:41:07.840 --> 00:41:16.780
So kind of a cool thing.

00:41:16.780 --> 00:41:17.820
That's awesome.

00:41:17.820 --> 00:41:18.659
Cool.

00:41:18.659 --> 00:41:21.780
Well, lots of gold balls on the shelf behind you.

00:41:21.780 --> 00:41:25.960
What for coach Tony Wagner remains undone?

00:41:25.960 --> 00:41:26.800
I don't know.

00:41:26.800 --> 00:41:28.400
I want to get back to the state tournament.

00:41:28.400 --> 00:41:32.679
I feel like we got a chance to in the next couple of years, this year and the next couple of years.

00:41:32.679 --> 00:41:40.440
But for me, when you say undone, I mean, I don't really consider it undone.

00:41:40.440 --> 00:41:44.000
I just want to make sure that we're maintaining our consistency with our kids.

00:41:44.000 --> 00:41:46.280
And when they leave, that's the kind of thing.

00:41:46.280 --> 00:41:48.280
They're prepared for the real world.

00:41:48.280 --> 00:41:50.440
They understand that nobody's going to enable them.

00:41:50.440 --> 00:41:52.239
They have to work for everything they get.

00:41:52.239 --> 00:41:58.679
They're going to have to really push through all the adversity in a positive way.

00:41:58.679 --> 00:42:00.360
And nothing comes free.

00:42:00.360 --> 00:42:11.760
And so those are the things that I want to continue to put on our kids to be the best person, the hardest worker, the most consistent person that they can be.

00:42:11.760 --> 00:42:15.159
And I think if they can do those things that they'll have a pretty good life.

00:42:15.159 --> 00:42:16.159
For sure.

00:42:16.159 --> 00:42:17.159
Great goals.

00:42:17.159 --> 00:42:19.679
How can listeners connect or follow what you're doing?

00:42:19.679 --> 00:42:21.800
What are your social handles?

00:42:21.800 --> 00:42:23.239
I'm still trying to figure it out.

00:42:23.239 --> 00:42:28.500
I didn't even know they changed the Twitter thing to X for like a week ago.

00:42:28.500 --> 00:42:37.039
And like all of my co, like not my co-workers, but like guys that I talk to, and text groups, CJ and all this stuff, they're big on Twitter, Jamie.

00:42:37.039 --> 00:42:38.239
He's a AD at Andrews.

00:42:38.239 --> 00:42:39.199
They're big on Twitter.

00:42:39.199 --> 00:42:41.679
And so I think my Twitter is Coach Wag.

00:42:41.679 --> 00:42:45.480
And then my Facebook is Tony Wagner.

00:42:45.480 --> 00:42:48.440
Instagram is also, I think it's the original Wag.

00:42:48.440 --> 00:43:10.659
Cause my son, his name is Wagner as well. I think I put like the original wag on Instagram My name is Tony Wagner and I am undone. It's awesome. Thanks coach I'm thankful to Coach Wagner for giving of his time and chatting with me about his accomplishments, his goals, and his journey, and I hope you found as much inspiration from this episode as I did.

00:43:10.659 --> 00:43:13.940
For more info on today's episode, be sure to check it out on the web.

00:43:13.940 --> 00:43:22.059
Simply go to undonepodcast.com backslash ep56 to see the notes, links, and images related to today's guest, Tony Wagner.

00:43:22.059 --> 00:43:39.119
I know there are great stories out there to be told, and I'm always on the lookout.

00:43:39.119 --> 00:43:43.800
So if you or someone you know has a story that we can all be inspired by, tell me about it.

00:43:43.800 --> 00:43:50.280
Surf on over to UndonePodcast.com, click the contact tab in the top menu and drop me a note.

00:43:50.280 --> 00:44:28.159
Coming up I've got fitness personality Gio Marine, former NCAA All-American and two-time national champion women's basketball player Emma Middleton Morris and Australian nonprofit founder Ian Westmoreland. So stay tuned. This and more coming up on Becoming Undone. Becoming Undone is a NitroHype creative production written and produced by me Toby Brooks. If you or someone you know has a story of resilience and victory to share for Becoming Undone, contact me at undonepodcast.com.

00:44:28.159 --> 00:44:32.880
Follow the show on Facebook, Instagram, and LinkedIn at becomingundonepod.

00:44:32.880 --> 00:44:37.400
And follow me at TobyJBrooks on X, Instagram, and TikTok.

00:44:37.400 --> 00:44:44.800
Listen, subscribe, and leave us a review at Apple Podcasts, Spotify, iHeartRadio, or wherever you get your podcasts.

00:44:44.800 --> 00:44:47.159
Till next time, everybody, keep getting better.

00:44:47.159 --> 00:45:08.579
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