Layering Plants in the Garden and Landscape

Hello, my friends across the fruited and rooted plane, It's time for the
Gardening Simplified Show with Stacy Hervella, me Rick Weiss, Stanar engineer and producer
ad Rihanna Robinson. Hey, today we're going to talk about landscape layering.
Yes, layering now, from cakes to clothing, lasagna, to soil,
atmosphere to bed sheets. Many things in our lives come in layers. Stacy,
I think about seven layer salad, the go to salad that you bring
to potlucks or family holiday and dinners, and I think everybody eats those things
because they top them with cheese and bacon and they add a little sugar too.
Yeah. I like the seven layer bars where they got the chocolate chips
and sna all. That's that's my more more my style of layered foods.
I would. I mean the seven layer salads. They never measure the amount
of mayo and miracle whip. And by the way, miracle whip is great
to put on your house plays this time of the year to shine the leaves.
But that's for another show, okay, okay, So today we'll talk
about layering. Now. We seek depth and dimension in our landscape layers of
interest. What do the most interesting gardens all have in common. Well,
they've got a focal point, a path, and a border, great plant
variety. But layering without overcrowding is tricky, and there's far more to it
than simply putting the tall plants in the back and the short plants in the
front. And I want to start off stacy by saying that with landscape layers,
I think three components are critical. One. The first one is a
layer of structural plants. These plants are the bones, the foundation of the
design, a four season, year round presence, and that's why many times
evergreens are used for this layer. The second layer is seasonal plants, using
a wide variety of plants with peaks at different times of the year. This
ensures you know, waves of interest throughout the year. Perennials, flowering shrubs
are perfect for that. And then the functional layer, which is groundcover and
filler plants. That's the layer that's kind of a living mult or a carpet,
a continuous border. Groundcovers and annuals are perfect for this level. We
call it plants at the toll level. So taking an elementary initial approach,
I kind of look at it that way. That's a really good way to
look at it. I mean, it's much simpler, right if you try
to break the landscape into elements, then to just try to approach it as
one big hole. And that's what we do in our Gardening Simplified Landscape Guide
as well as we break it down into these different elements. And when you
combine the low hedge and the groundcovers and the specimens and all of that other
stuff, then you do with proper you know, sighting, end up with
a with a layered landscape. So I will put the link to a landscape
or Gardening Simplified Landscape Guide, not to be confused with our show Gardening Simplified
on air, so people can use that as a resource when they're checking out
our shutouts. I like that. That'll be very helpful. It's fun to
layer a landscape. Of course, you have to apply the design principles of
repetition, scale, flow, and depth. I love repetition along the front
border of a landscape because it kind of ties the whole thing together. On
our show notes and on our YouTube video, we'll post a picture of Queen
Elizabeth Park near Vancouver, a picture that I took that I think really points
that out. But repetition and balance, in other words, some continuity as
your eye moves from left to right, maybe a place where your eye can
rest. And then another thing that I like to do Stacey with a layering
is that again it's not just tall plants in the back to shorter plants in
the front. It's great to put a few taller plants in that center filler
area that we use as exclaimentation points. It really adds interest. Absolutely,
that is a pro move right there, to do that and not just be
like short, medium tall. And you know, I'm glad that you mentioned
this part because I think one of the best ways to you know, find
a way to layer your garden or compose in layers is to take inspiration from
another garden that you've seen, and instead of just looking at it and going,
oh, that's really pretty, but I couldn't do that, instead of
just sort of walking away, take the time to dig in and you know,
even sketch it out and make a plan on paper of how that was
composed, and then you really see that it's very simple. It all sounds
very complex, and it is very complex if you try to attack it from
the top down. But when you do break it up into these individual components,
you know, I think your point about repetition is a great one,
because what could be simpler than just repeating the same plants. You don't have
to reinvent, you know, your entire garden scheme all the time throughout the
garden. You can just repeat those same plants in new combinations. And so
when you really start to look at it, it does become simpler. And
that's what we're all about. Yeah, when I, for example, when
I went to gardens, took lots of pictures. Then you get back home,
you look at the pictures, you try to emulate some of those pictures
and what they do. Now. Of course, of course with the botchart,
there are all sorts of levels, and I think that for layering,
one of the things to look at is modulating elevations. So if you just
have a flat surface, it can get a little weary on the eye or
rather busy when you look across. But if you were to grade or use
hardscaping to elevate some areas lower some areas, change or modulate the elevations.
I think that that's another important principle in layering your landscape in a really simple
way to do that without investing a ton of money. You're still going to
invest some money, but would be a really large container. Yeah, there
you go. You know, it doesn't always have to be like a full
construction project. Just getting a really large container and putting that in your garden
or a fountain, that's work as well. So there's always these different ways
if we take the time to dig in and solve our problems, you know,
through the knowledge that we have, rather than just being completely overwhelmed,
which, believe me, I get it. It's easy to be completely overwhelmed
when it comes to cardin design. Yeah, it's a great points they see
it's tall. I like these tall, narrow containers. Again, that could
be an exclamation point within a drift or a landscape like that. Let me
give you a limerick on layers. I'm scratching my head thinking, well,
how am I going to do a limerick on layers? And then I thought,
well, here in West Michigan, it's snowing like crazy and it's super
cold. We have arctic temperatures, so I tend to layer my clothes.
Layers are a form of preparation a multi layer clothing peroration. When you're hot,
you're hot when you're not. First we freeze, then there's perspiration.
Three layers. I thought would suffer, no need for self sacrifice. There's
a reason they call it a sweater. I sweat and then I get wetter,
and in minutes it turns to ice. So in winter I'll dress in
layers apparel. It comes in pairs. Soon I'll be sweating and then I'll
be getting your sympathetic stairs. I have difficulty wearing sweaters. I get overheated.
I just do. Yeah. So you know you got to dress in
layers in the Midwest and here in Michigan, especially at this time of the
year. So three important elements in layering landscapes variation in foliage size and foliage
texture. I think the foliage size issue is important because if everything is a
small leaf or a similar leaf, it gets so busy it just doesn't look
right. A mix of shapes and sizes in the mid section. The middle
doesn't have to be filled only with modestly sized plants. We talked about the
exclamation points and then stacy under planting. Underplanting as it relates to less plants
but rather there are some plants that you can plant under the canopy, whether
it's a tree or a flowering shrub, that are suited and work quite well
to kind of fill in those areas. Again, a filler area of underplant,
you know. A classic choice for underplanting ugara. Oh, yes,
you know. There's so many hugra these days. You think, how am
I going to use these? Odd there's just so many. I don't even
know how to pick. Just get like three colors of hukara, or pick
one color and then pick sort of variations on that color because there's so many
different options. Now, that's a perfect one. Carex or sedge is another
great one. There's so many good options that aren't just useful in terms of
the aesthetic contribution, but also in terms of the environmental contribution, because a
lot of people these days are using those underplantings as like a living mulch.
Hucre is a great idea because there's many different colors, it has color all
season long, and I also like the size of the foliage on. Hucre
has a little gravitass just like hostas, also would work well as underplanting plants
except in winter, except in war exactly. So think about repetition, scale,
depth and balance when you layer your landscape, and make a note to
head out this summer and visit some gardens, take some pictures, study them
closely, look at these concepts where you can take those pictures and those ideas
and bring them home to your landscape. And you know you don't have to
wait till summer. There's so much great inspiration you can get online just by
searching different gardens or garden designers and looking at their work, both old and
new. I know two of my favorites for inspiration are Dan Pearson, who
is still practicing, and of course Christopher Lloyd from England's I mean just incredible,
incredible plantsmen and garden designers, as well as books. You know,
on an afternoon in your library looking at some nice glossy garden books, that
sounds like a good way to spend a cold, snowy afternoon. Sounds like
a fantastic way. So layer your landscape. Plants on trial coming up next
here on the Gardening Simplified Show, Proven Winners Colored Choice Shrubs cares about your
success in the garden. That's why we trial and test all of our shrubs
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Greetings, gardening friends, and welcome back to the Gardening Simplified Show. It's
the time of the show where we put a plant on trial, which is
to say that we're going to tell you all about it and then you get
to decide if it's going to earn a spot in your garden or not.
And today's plant on Trial, I'll just get right to it is Cheskey gold
dwarf birch chesskey cheskey gold birch dwarf birch dwarf. Ye, this is in
the tree. It's a shrup. We're going to get to all that in
a second, but first I always like to tell everyone, you know,
why we're talking about this particular plant in today's plant on Trial, and it's
for two reasons. Number one is because it is a great layering plant.
And you know one thing that we didn't really get to talk to too much
in the first segment, and we were talking about that middle layer. Now,
this plant reaches two to four feet tall and wide. So if you
live in a colder area. It's probably going to be more on the lower
end of that. If you live in a slightly warmer climate, it could
get more to the fore foot. So it is kind of that front middle
range for most borders. But we didn't really talk about the concept of a
sea through plant as a middle layer, and this is really important. And
if you have no idea what I'm talking about is you start to kind of
apply this lens to different plants you it will quickly become apparent. A sea
through plant is a plant that you can have in the garden, and it
can be it's usually on the taller side, but instead of just being like
a big blob in the landscape, it has space and air in it and
you can see through it to the plants behind it or to whatever is behind
it. And that's a really important part of layering because in a layered garden,
it's not just supposed to be again just those big blobs that you know
are. I love plants with space and light and air in them, and
this is a really great plant for that. So it's a really good plan
again for that sort of middle to back or medium layer and just has a
beautiful texture. Now, the other reason that we're talking about it today,
in particular as we are in the midst of a polar vortex of single digit
fahrenheit temperatures here in Michigan. Is it is also one of our hardiest trubs.
I saw that zone two all the way down to USDA Zone two.
WHOA, that's cool. That is very cold. I don't think that outside
it. There's very many people who live in areas outside of USDA Zone two
because it is so cold and inhospitable. But even if you are that cold,
then you can grow successfully and very happily. I might add cheskey goldbirch.
So those two things I thought would make this particular plant a great choice
for today's plan on trial. I think that's perfect. And your point about
see through that is really great for a layered garden three to four foot tall.
Ornamental grasses play that same role for me too. And there's movement,
yeah, movements. I think movement is also an important part of that.
Now the ultimate you know, I think when people think of a sea through
plant or this concept, they think of for being a bone ariensis and proven
Winners has an annual ver seedless for being a bone orienceis which isn't going to
self so, but it's real short meteor show, yeah, meteor showers.
Yeah, and I you know, like the old fashioned kind that is taller.
That's to me like the ultimate sea through plant where you're really going to
have that structure and color and presence, but again without it being a total
blockade. It's not a plant goalie blocking off everybody behind it. So now
I'm gonna guess as our listeners are listening and maybe not watching and seeing the
plant on YouTube, another good frigid ice reference. Very well done, I
guess I'm just you know, my brain's half frozen with this weather. So
most people when they hear birch, they're probably already thinking in their head of
you know, the snow white paper bark birch, right, that's what comes
to mind for most people when you say birch. Or if it's not our
paper bark birch, then they probably have a river birch which has sort of
come to take over. Paper bark birches, which are susceptible to some pests
and diseases, don't particularly love hot suburban areas where they are very often planted,
or at least where when I was a kid. Most of those are
not around anymore. Certainly, when you go up north, you see those
paper bark birches doing well. So river birch is kind of come in as
a substitute. It's not pure white. It has kind of an orange color
to it, which I think they're quite nice. I've seen some beautiful specimens
of them. Well, this is like neither of those. It is a
dwarf shrubby birch, and most people have never heard or seen a shrubby birch.
So instead of a tree with a single trunk and branching, it's a
nice almost like a dome shape. You know a lot of times I talk
about things being kind of like rounded, and I was looking at the pictures
of this and thinking, you know, it really does look like a dome,
but not a really dense dome like a mom does you know in fall
where that's not a sea through planet at all. So it has this really
elegant, nice domed shape, and the branches are a pretty kind of red
tan, and they're very thin and slender and elegant, so you know,
they just have this light texture. Now those branches then get be decked in
the season with this adorably tiny leaf and you really kind of have to see
it to know what I'm talking about, but they're they're really small, like
the size of maybe a pinky nail, and they have a serrated edge,
and they're bright yellow when they come out, So that's where the gold part
comes from. So this is a plant that you know, it's not the
showiest plant. And I think that's also a really important part of a layered
garden. Is not everything in your layered garden can be a star. You
need some supporting players here who are not going to come in and be that
diva and demand all the attention. You want a cast that supports each other.
And this is a really nice, quiet but not too quiet, supporting
character for your garden. Two things. One I'm contemplating on that word be
decked. I like that. Secondly, while you were talking, I pulled
up the pictures here. Foliage in almost looks like nine Bark to me,
of course, you know I can see that, yeah, style it has.
I would say the serration on the edge is very similar to nine Bark,
but it's much much smaller, okay, and it's in nine Bark.
Foliage is very often sort of trident shaped, has like kind of three points
and this is just like one little like I said, it would just like
fit on your little pinky nail. Okay, So very very interesting foliage.
Great texture means beautiful. Yeah, it is a and I just you know,
it's so important when we're in the garden center. It's very easy to
be distracted by those super showy things. Oh I gotta have that. But
your garden, you know, does need some again, just these softer things
that aren't boring at all. I mean, this planet is still contributing a
lot of color, still contributing a lot of character, but just not demanding
all the attention all the time. Now that that gold foliage is by far,
and that picture you're looking at their rick is in spring, so when
it leaves out in spring, then it's really really going to be showy.
Now it does flower, it has just kind of your regular birch catkin,
so not something that you would probably even notice, not really showy, but
that golden color does continue to emerge through the season as the new growth comes
out, and then it matures to a really pretty fresh green color. I
could see this in drifts in that middle ground of a layered landscape. I
could see why you picked this plant for a layered landscape, and day don't
forget that. And now this plant does come to us from a Michael or
Michael and Drusiev of the Czech Republic, and that is where the name Cheskey
gold comes from, to honor his homeland. Nice and again we call it
cheskey gold dwarf birch, so people don't get it confused with the tree like
birch. So that's where that funny name name comes from. It is cesky,
not c h or c z as the Czech Republic would be, as
we had to make it somewhat pronounceable, right. But so this is a
plant that, yes, it works great in landscape layers. It also works
really well on its own. It's a good front of water plants. It's
good for natural gardens. So really it's kind of when those super versatile.
However, you want to use it in your landscape or garden, it will
work if I layer it into my garden. Probably want to get it as
much sun as possible, so it depends if so. Certainly if you live
in the colder climates, it's going to be able to take full sun.
But you know, that color could be a lot stronger. It can take
part shade easily, and it can even grow in full shade. However,
in full shade, you're definitely not going to be getting that golden color.
You know. It's if it's too dark, it's just not going to have
those pigments and it's going to be more great Now, it will still look
beautiful and it will still grow fine, but you just again have to have
those expectations of what's actually going to happen if you put it in that kind
of environment. And it does need moist soil. So this is not a
plant that I have in my garden. As our listeners have probably heard me
talk about before. It's very dry, it's very sandy. So as much
as I really enjoy this plant, I don't have it because it will want
more water. So it's great for clay soil. Maybe our friend from England
last week's show, could I have an update from our friend in England in
our mailbags, so stay tuned to hear from Kurt. But yeah, this
is going to be a great plant for clay soil, good for shade.
Now. As I said before, a lot of plants that are very hardy
like cheske gold dwarf birch don't have similar heat tolerance, and that is certainly
the case here. This plant is not going to go much beyond uscas one
seven. So sorry to our warm climate friends, but enjoy where you're at
because it's not two degrees there for you, hopefully right now, two to
four feet tall and wide again full to parts on parts share. Our full
shade is fine. You're just not going to get as much color, not
significant flowers, but it's a disease resistant, easy care plant that adds just
the right amount of color and texture. Kind of a no brainer. Yeah
it is, It's perfect. I say this is a winner and scores here
in Plants on Try It shoots the scores and you can go to Gardeningsimplified on
air dot com to find all the information. We're going to take a little
bit of a break and when we come back, we've got the gardener mailbags,
so please stay tuned. At proven winner's color choice, we've got a
shrub for every taste and every space. Whether you're looking for an easycare rose
and unforgettable hydrangea or something new and unique, you can be confident that the
shrubs and the white containers have been trialed and tested for your success. Look
for them at your local garden center. Greeting's gardening friends, and welcome back
to the Gardening Simplified Show. One of the ways we simplify gardening for you
is by answering your garden questions, and even here in the midst of a
polar vortext or maybe I should say especially so, because we do have some
concerned listeners that we're going to be answering their questions today, or is my
plan going to be okay because it's going to be ex temperature this week or
whatever. So we will get to all of that. But if you have
a question for us, we'd love to from you. You can email us
at help HLP at Gardening Simplified on air dot com, or just go to
Gardening Simplified on air dot com and click on the contact form. You can
also leave a comment on YouTube. Adriana lets us know if there's any of
those that need answered. So there's lots and lots of ways to get a
hold of us. And I wanted to start off today with an update from
Kurt Oh Kurt Kurt So. Last week we talked about Kurt in England.
I someone did, and he was dealing with some horrendous flooding in his yard
there in England, standing water. I mean, it was kind of hard
to believe it was even a yard. It looked like it could be a
swamp or something. And you know a lot of people on YouTube luff comments.
So Kurt, I don't know if you check out our YouTube channel,
but if you want to see what other people have to say about your water
issue, you can read those there. But he writes and says the water
has drained and the shrubs appear to be okay, yay, So glad to
hear that. But he also shared a new problem. And Kurt's concern is
something that I've heard from multiple gardeners over the past couple days, so I
thought I would just kind of tie it all up into this timely concern.
So Kurt says that now they're calling for nine inshes of snow in England and
temperatures down to fourteen degrees fahrenheit. Now, he says that his garden is
usually considered USDA Zone eight, so that is definitely pushing the boundaries of what
would be USDA Zone eight, but not unusual as far as what we see
here in the States. For the US, it wouldn't be seeing down south
in January. Boy, we can whether it's Oklahoma, Texas, Alabama.
Yeah, I mean, I've been to New Orleans and needed a hat in
gloves in winter coats, So it can't happen. It probably happens less in
England. And he is worried about his fig tree with this weather, and
he sends a picture of his fig tree, and I thought, you know
what, I don't want to leave a taste in people's mouths about Kurt and
his flooded garden. So Adriana is going to put a very cheerful and lovely
picture of Kurt's garden and his fig tree that he's concerned about on the YouTube
version of the Shelf. Of course it will be in our show notes at
Gardeningsimplified on air dot com. So Kurt's worried about his fig tree in these
unusually cold temperatures. And I also heard from James in Texas where again they're
having unusually cold weather and he's worried about his perfected Mundo azaleas. So he
said, do I need protection at twenty degrees fahrenheit for the perfected Mundo double
blooming Azaleas. So I know there's lots of people out there wondering, and
you know, I'm gonna sort of take this back to this concept of USDA
hardiness zones. A couple weeks ago, a new hardiness zone map came out.
We did a whole show on the hardiness zones. So this is where
hardiness zones are useful. As I said in the show, there's a lot
of places where hardiness zones have a lot of shortcomings, but one useful place
is that they give you a sense of how much cold those plants can take.
So in the case of both the fig, now there are some exceptions
to figs. There are some fig varieties that are less hardy than others,
but for the most part, figs are considered hardy to USDA's one seven.
There is a couple that are even hardier, but I'm just going to go
with the middle ground of zone seven for the fig and perfective into Azilia's also
happen to be hardy to USDA zone seven or six B, but we're going
to say seven for the sake of argument here. Now, if you look
at the USDA key of what those temperature ranges for the hardiness zone USAA Zone
seven is actually zero degrees fahrenheit. Wow. So, as we talked about
on our hardiness zone map show we're looking at average minimum temperature, and so
if the temperature is going to dip to twenty, he's still well above that
minimum absolutely, So that's a really good sign that the plants are probably going
to be okay. But now we have to get back to sort of one
of the shortcomings of the hardiness zone system, which is that it does not
address how long it is going to be that cold. Now, you know,
for me to sit here and say, oh, well, you know
it's down to the zone seven is down to zero, well, we've had
temperatures around zero degrees fair night, not wind chill, this is air temperature.
So people might be thinking, well, shoot, then why aren't we
USDA Zone seven here in Michigan, Because we ra really get much colder than
we are right now. But the difference again is how long those temperatures last.
And of course our temperatures can get much lower, they don't typically,
but that's the issue here is how long are those temperatures, those extreme cold
temperatures going to be around and that's how you're going to determine whether or not
you should protect those plants. It's a good point in my mind. It's
similar to a hard frost in spring. Yeah, the duration of that frost
overnight. Yeah, it definitely makes a huge, huge difference. Now Here
in Michigan we're getting those single digit air temperatures. But I got two feet
snow on the ground, so all my stuff is like, hey, that's
cool. I can say there's a lot of insulation, but of course if
you're in Texas, you probably don't have that. So you know, I
would say keep use that heartiness and the zone range as your guide. If
it's a newer plant, then you're probably gonna want to protect it just because
it hasn't yet developed, you know, the root system that it needs to
fully withstand the challenges of winter. If you feel if you have the means
to protect it in the time, well then it's certainly not going to hurt
either. You know, just putting an old sheet or a blanket or you
know, a lot of garden centers will sell frost blanket or remay. There's
a lot of different things that you can buy to just sort of drape over
them. And get them through. Now, Kurt's fig is a tree,
so it's not a shrubby fig. But the good news, Kurt, as
lovely as your fig tree is, if it does it's much harder to protect
something like that. But if it does get very, very cold, you
will not lose your fig tree. It will just die back and you'll have
a shrub instead of a tree. Sure. So, and if you drape,
be careful. If the winds are high or you get ice, well,
you can do some damage to that'srue. That's a really good point.
Yeah, don't try to take it off until things are safe. So again,
that's where the heartiness own system can work for you. So if you're
concerned, don't worry so much about where you're at, but look at what
your plants can withstand, protect if you need to, and hope for the
best because this is where you learn and hopefully you're not losing anything too precious
and valuable to you. So, Stacy Marvel writes to us, I planted
two three gallon lemone lace elderberry shrubs in late spring twenty twenty two. I've
been doing some research on prining these shrubs, as this is the first time
I have ever grown elderberry, You're gonna love it, Marvel. I've found
somewhat conflicting information on my online search. And so Marvel then goes on to
list all of the different stuff that she found about how to prune a elderberry's
and she's kind of saying, so, which do I do? And the
answer to the question here is it really depends on why you are pruning in
the first place. And I think that whenever you're trying to research something and
you see a lot of conflicting advice like this, what that indicates is that
the pruning on this plant is going to be a highly subjective issue. Now,
if you read about rose pruning, you're going to find the same advice
pretty much everywhere, because the reason that you prune roses is essentially the same.
You want to take off the thin spindley growth that was put on at
the end of the previous season and make sure that the growth for the season
is coming from those thicker buds lower down on the plant, which are going
to be thicker, more vigorous, flower better, and also give you a
more uniform flowering rather than flowering forefoot off the ground with just a skinny little
sad flower at the top. So there in those cases we know why we
prune them, and therefore the pruning advice can be kind of generalized. But
in the case of the elderbray, I think the reason that you're seeing so
much different you know, perspective on how to prune and when to prune,
and how much to prune and all of this is because it does depend on
the why. So I would say to Marvel, why do you want to
prune this is it's not something that needs to be prune as a matter of
course or habit. You can absolutely never prune an elderberry. It might get
very large. I have an instant Karma variegated elderberry in my yard. It's
about ten feet tall and wide, and I do love it. I've never
prune it. But it's healthy and beautiful and it's you know, doesn't need
it. But so if you're trying to size control it, you know,
that's one that's a different consideration than if you're just trying to say, hey,
I love the foliage on this plant. I want to compass it.
So it's a plant that can be compass and then you can keep cutting it
back and just getting those fresh shoots every year. It would be a great
middle of the border see through kind of plant. In that regard, you
can prune it into a tree. And so this is why, you know,
we always say when it comes to pruning, never prune without a reason.
If you don't have a reason, you really don't know what to do.
Because there's a lot of different approaches in terms of timing, how much
you cut off, where you make your cuts. There's so much. So
you have to get your why straightened out before you get your house straightened out.
I endorse that answer one hundred percent. When I work in the garden
center and somebody approaches me with a question like Marvel gave us that those are
the first words out of my mouth. Why do you want to prune it?
You are one hundred percent correct about that. And then after that I
usually suggest, well, then prune it during the dormant season when you can
get a good look at the shape of the plant and really determine, well,
why am I pruning this? Am I pruning out weak branches, crossing
branches, whatever it may be? So why is a great question, yep.
And you know also understand that I if you print it in the dormant
season, it might lose its flowers. But if you are okay with that
are losing some of them, you just have to do your research, which
Marvel has done. So next step is to decide the why. So we're
going to take a little break. When we come back, we have a
special guest for the final segment, so please stay tuned. The Gardening Simplified
Show is brought to you by proven Winners Color Choice Shrubs. Our award winning
flowering shrubs and evergreens have been trialed and tested for your success so you enjoy
more beauty and less work. Look for proven Winners Color Choice Shrubs and the
distinctive White Container at your local garden center. Welcome back to the Gardening Simplified
Show. Today for branching news, we're going to talk about biofilia biophilia.
Now, maybe you've never heard that word before, but maybe it's something well
you experience and to help us sort it out, horticulturists, her herbalist and
author Deborah Kannapke, She's the Garden Sage, is going to join us here
on the Gardening Simplified Show. Deborah, always great to talk to you.
Oh same here, same here, Deborah. Here in Michigan and in the
Midwest, we're experiencing a significant cold snap in January, and we take it
to another level in West Michigan and in Buffalo, New York, where the
Great Lakes provide us something called lake effects snow, and that machine is turned
on right now and it's snowing like crazy. I look out the window and
I longingly look at my garden, and I realize how much I miss it
this time of the year, having my hands in the dirt and working with
the plants. Deborah, am I experiencing biophilia? You're actually you're experiencing being
away from biophelia, Okay, having sort of a less of a connection.
And just as just as an aside, I grew up in Lake County in
Ohio, which is northeast Ohio. We were in the snow belt, and
I know all about like effect snow. But being in central Ohio, we
right now I have maybe sixteenth of an inch. Oh wow. Although Lake
County they get a lot of snow, and there are a lot of plant
growers in Lake County, and so it must be that snow provides good insulation.
It does, and you know, it's interesting, And you asked about
biophilia, and I'm going to connect this back in because it's understanding what plants
need at different times of the year. That's part of biophilia connection, which
I'll define in a moment, but that being able to be under a snug
blanket. Now I'm anthropomorphizing here, but I sometimes think that when we treat
plants and animals and ecosystem them, when we treat them like they're an object
instead of an entity, I feel, you know, all this life,
then we start losing that connection of biofilia, which going to define biophilia.
It is our essential need, the humans essential need to be connected to all
other living things. So it was coined by EO. Wilson in nineteen eighty
four. It actually had been used in the early nineteen hundreds, but in
a different way. And EO. Wilson, you know, the ant van
is no longer with us, but he looked at society, ant societies and
other insects, et cetera. But he said, it is this connection with
the others. And you just mentioned that here's your garden underneath all this snow,
and you are suffering from a lack of connection. But yet, isn't
it nice to know that your garden's under this beautiful insulating blanket. That's true,
and maybe if you think about it that way, it might not be
that wrenching to be away from it. And so then get go get a
house plant, the practical side of biophilia, right right, right, yeah,
you know right now, I have my house plants. You know,
if I could give you some visuals, i'd take you around to my greenhouse,
a little fifteen by fifteen hobby house, or in the living room or
in my office. I have plants because they make me happy, and I
have this connection with them, you know. It's and I also have connection
with my cats, you know, pets. That's another biophilic thing if you
think about it. Now. Getting back to that deep snow and these cold
temperatures, but I'm not bitter about that, Deborah. One of the things
that I miss is my hands in the dirt. But you were teaching us
that, well, maybe it's not really dirt. It's not dirt. I
had this conversation this morning with a colleague, and she's working on a project
to get people's hands, as she said, in the dirt. And I
said, first of all, we're going to stop with using the term dirt
because that's an objectifying kind of nouns. Instead, think of it as soil.
Think of soil as filled with biotic communities in micro organisms, macro organisms,
fungi, bacteria, worms, beetles, you name it. But even
though soil is san silt and clay as its mineral portions, its living portion
is absolutely amazing. So when you think of soil, it's a positive word.
When you say dirt, it's that stuff underneath your fingernails that you want
to wash off and get rid of. So I also work on language when
I talk about biophilia and talk about that connection with others in the landscape and
in the world. Is what kind of language do we use? I like
that, you know, the plants that we're putting in the ground, we're
putting it into a living thing when it's when we look at it as soil
as opposed to dirt. I really like that. Yeah. And also if
given a choice, I don't know if it's a choice or not, but
plants grow so much better in soil that has an active living community because there's
this the symbioses, there's the micorrhizal fungi, there's a nitrogen fixing bacteria.
There are the little tiny microL organisms that make micropoores so that air and water
can get through the soil and keep it friable so that roots can go through.
It's this community, and I guess if you think about what biophilia is,
it is being part of a community, you know, Stacy. That's
probably why marketers put the words potting soil on the bag as opposed to potting
dirt, potting mix. Potting mix is what I use just saying, and
that's still you know, that's made up of living things that typically as compost
and peat moss, which it's not the same as soil, and it doesn't
have that incredible, you know, scale of geological time that we experience when
we are working in real soil. But I mean it's still a valuable,
you know, ecosystem that does get created as you plant and work with it.
And and all of the components of potting soil comes from something from the
earth. The the what is it, pearlite coming from pomus and oh gosh,
for mickeylite comes from Micah, I think expanded Michael, Yes, yeah,
yeah, and Pete Moss, et cetera. So they're all still part
of what was or is a living system. And even Rock, you know,
we talk about well is Rock alive? We could get into a real
interesting discussion there. But Rock also has michael organisms that live in it,
that work with plants and groups, et cetera. It's fascinating once you start
thinking about it, definitely. So what happens, Deborah, when people do
not understand biophilia? In other words, what happens when we do not connect?
We're missing out, aren't we? We are? And you know I've
I've done talks on bio celia, and I use four words. When we
do not connect. We have disease or disease. We have disconnect. We
have distress, you know, disk and stress. We have stress but negative
stress, and we have disintegration. It's we aren't a part of it.
We hold we often hold ourselves apart from nature or we think we can conquer
it. I mentioned before, I think last time I was on that I
have a bumper sticker on my car that says nature bat blast. You know,
so that's when you sort of forget that that you're a part of this
all, not not the controller, right, because every time you think you're
going to control what happens. Right. Yeah, that's that's where gardening comes
in handy. It puts up, It gives you a lot of humility and
really sets you in your place. I think it does. I think.
I think it is the garden where I actually where I finally grew up,
where I finally became a more mature person because I started seeing these interactions and
the gardens taught me patients. The garden taught me about interconnection. And I
think it's also when I started being able to read the landscape and read plants
and understand what was going on, and just being able to walk outside and
say, hmm, something's not right here. I need to figure this out.
Yeah. And if biophilia is about a connection, a feeling for all
that is around you, Deborah, give us our listeners and our viewers a
couple of tangible examples where bio ophelia is the practical side of it. I
guess, in other words, if you want to experience this, and you
want to be attuned to this, what is the practical side of biophilia?
Part of it is, well, one, how do you interact with your
gardens. You know, do you immediately pull out the chemicals when you see
a problem if you've defined the problem. Well, but again another discussion.
But you see something and you think, oh, the first thing I'm going
to do is spray, spray something. But then maybe if you sit back
and observe, you might notice that, Okay, there's aphids on this plant,
and whoa, look what just showed up to eat them? Either the
larvae or the adult form of the ladybird beetle or ladybugs, whichever you wish
to call it. But a fits are a big one, and you know,
disease organisms when they come into the garden, you know, people will
think, yeah, let's choose the juniper. The juniper and hawthorns russ.
It goes back and forth, and the first thing is, oh, gosh,
what can I spray? But really you should be looking at hmm,
I have these junipers planted really close to these hawthorns. One of these two
needs to go otherwise this is going to happen every single year. And then
if you notice your neighbors have them or have junipers, that might mean that
the hawthorns get to go or they will eventually because after repeated infections. Very
often they don't survive. But then maybe you go somewhere else and you realize
there's this one hawthorn tree over here that isn't getting it. This is a
hawthorn tree that figured out a way to deal with that infection. That's biophilia
being connected and understanding that this interaction is different. And you know, being
a gardener, I think, oh, I want the resistant hawthorn in my
garden. So that's a practical aspect of biophilia is through observation, maybe understanding
better how to have a garden and not being terribly reactive, you know,
right away grabbing for a chemical or freaking out or whatever. Most of the
time I sit back and take a look and think, hmm. You know,
boxwood blight's one of those like how can I beat this? And what
is our gardening community, our growers or horticultural community doing. We're looking for
those boxwoods that don't get it. You know. That's practical biophilia. Yeah,
Stacey, When I listened to Deborah talk, I'm thinking that biophilia to
an extent is natural common sense. It is, I mean it is,
but it takes time to develop that and I think, you know, I
think that you know, sort of what I'm hearing is that biophilia is an
essential element of human nature. But then culturally, societally, you know,
we start to take on these attitudes that say, if we see a leaf
spot, that something has to be done, that it's not tolerable, that
it reflects poorly on us as homeowners, as neighbors or whatever, when in
fact, you know, it's it's just it's just something that happens, and
you can just just be like, well, you can shrug it off.
I mean, it's okay, you don't need to have you know, this
perfect so called ideal landscape. You know, as you were giving the example
of the of the Hawthorne cedar, rust I was thinking, is it biophilia
if you leave them both because you like to freak people out with the gymnosporantiums
and to see it is because that's what I would be, right. I
was kind of proud when it showed up on mil and the pictures. The
pictures are great to post in social media. Yes, it freaks people out.
They are I think they're pretty. I don't know, call me crazy,
but that beautiful orange color. Now they do get kind of you know,
like charcoal burt looking at the end when all the spores a release,
so it's not as pretty. But oh, initially it's like somebody hung ornaments
in the juniper. And that's a to me, a biophilic response and that
I'm enjoying the life. And if you think about it, everything in this
world eats something else, you know, it's a it's it's I don't know
why we think that we need, as you said, Stacy, this pristine
idea of of of a garden, you know, and an apple that doesn't
have a blemish and all that. Shoot, I just make sure I don't
eat the caterpillars. When I harvest my kale and collars from the garden,
I like to get them off and put them back outside. It's so true,
and that I think really is where you know, gardening is a game
changer for people, because yeah, I mean I was totally before I started
vegetable gardening, and this is many years ago now, but you know,
I would never go to the store and buy like a tomato that had a
blemish. And then the first year that I grew tomatoes, you know,
I had this beautiful tomato that was on the ground and slugs had eaten a
bit of it on the bottom, and I was like, there is no
way that I am not eating this tomato. I'm just gonna cut that part
off. And then it just completely changes your understanding of what it takes to
grow food, and it changes your you know, tolerance for what is ultimately
a pretty natural thing to happen. Totally agree, Totally agree it's and gardening
does that. I think all so having relationships with animals, whether they're pets
inside or whether you have chickens or a goat or you know. I I
when I was younger, I thought how cool it would have been to live
on a farm. I you know, I just thought that would be so
cool. I'm not so sure now. It's a lot of work, hard
work. It's hard work. But I think that farmers and people who work
on the land as part of their life really have a different point of view.
And that biophilia. I know, if you we're talking about a term
and there someone out there sitting there and saying, well, shoot, everybody
knows about this, They're just not paying attention something like that. Okay,
so I will I'll let we'll play complete the phrase Debro. Okay, I'm
going to have you complete this phrase. Okay, biophilia is not curb appeal
or your best lawn competition with your neighbor, but rather, biophilia is and
I'll let you complete that phrase. Oh, biophilia is creating a garden that
makes you feel good and does not harm the earth or anything in it.
Yeah. That's good. That's true. That's good. Yeah, And this
is Deborah, this is a phrase you mentioned. The phrase was coined what
in the nineteen eighties? Is that what you said at nineteen eighty four by
EO. Wilson. In fact, I have his slim little volume that he
wrote about biophilia. It's fascinating. I have many friends in the garden center
industry and I have found and I mentioned to Stacey and Adriana that my garden
center friends on the West Coast and California and Seattle we're really attuned to this
and are right now and talk about it often. But it's really worked its
way across the country and now I think has become more and more mainstream from
coast to coast, and it has I agree with that. I was doing
research for creating my plant sciences course for Columbus State Community College, and I
stumbled on this very interesting organism called Mycobacterium vacae, which is in the soil
and a little bacteria. And when you work in the soil, you breathe
in this bacteria. And what it does is it sparks serotonin production. And
serotonin is the happiness hormone or chemical or sure whatever it's called. I'm not
exactly sure what serotonin, which group it's in, but you feel good when
you're working in the soil. And that was in about two thousand and eight,
two thousand and nine, and there were these studies about how people felt
good when they worked with soil, and they narrowed it down to this little
microbacterian vake. So it's it's kind of the mid ats two thousand oughts.
Even though this term was coined in eighty four, it really didn't get a
strong purchase in farming and gardening, et cetera, to my knowledge until after
two thousand. Interesting, So Debra can next fall, can Rick dig up
a box full of soil and bring it in and have this micobacterium to get
him through winter? Will will that work? To Kia's winter blues? Next
year. What a great idea. It would help. It would help if
he planted. Okay, it's a dirty job. Somebody's got to do it.
That it's a soily job. It's a soily job. There, I
think dirty might work better. You know, we can we can laugh about
it, but but I would admit that I love the look of soil.
I love the feel of soil. I love the smell of soil. Often
when people would come into the garden center with a houseplant that was struggling,
often I would pull it out of that plastic pot and stick my nose in
the soil and could quickly tell by the the the aroma of this, you
know, if it was underwatered, overwatered, whatever. I think that there.
I think it's a real thing. I really do. I love dirt.
Now. Of course, it's not fun to track into the house and
and have to do the laundry and that kind of stuff, But I'm sticking
with it. I love dirt. M Yeah, And I think gardeners,
do you know. I used to think, oh my gosh, maybe my
nails aren't perfectly clean. Now I don't care unless I'm going somewhere really hoity
toity. You know where I have to look really good, but I don't
do that much anymore. So I'll tell you what, Deborah, you've inspired
us. All you've inspired me. As a matter of fact, when I
leave the studio here today, I'm going to go to a garden center by
a bag of potting soil and stick my face in it. And I think,
all very jo I think that will just don't breathe into deeply because it's
all that. No, I understand, I understand. Her name is Deborah
Kannapke and she is the garden Sage. Always a pleasure to talk to you,
and Deborah, of course you're an author. Also share your your website
with our listeners and our viewers. It is Deborah the Gardenstage dot com and
it is undergoing revision right now. It's the old website, but pretty soon
I will have new information on it and a slightly different look, but not
much. I'm keeping most of the pictures and some more text. But once
yeah, the www dot Deborah the Gardenstage dot com. And that's ae b
r A. Yes, it's d e b r A correct, okay,
correct, all right, great, and it is always a pleasure to talk
to you, and Stacey like pleasure to talk to you. Thank you and
hang in there. Springs down the way, it is bye bye bye.
Well, speaking of spring almost being here, you know we're halfway to the
spring backdrop today. Oh yes, yes, thanks Spring. So only six
more weeks with this backdrop and so Spring is on the way. So thank
you so much to Deborah, Thanks to you Rick, and of course thanks
to Adriana, and thank you to all of you for listening and supporting the
show. We'll see you next week.