Stranger Things Soundtrack: Season 1 Episode 4: The Tragic Story of Joy Division

<v Speaker 1>Hello, Shirley fans. For the last three years, Jason and
<v Speaker 1>I have been bringing you the stories behind all of
<v Speaker 1>your favorite movies from the eighties. But today we begin
<v Speaker 1>a new series.
<v Speaker 2>In twenty sixteen, the Duffer Brothers introduced the world to
<v Speaker 2>Stranger Things. This show not only changed the way we
<v Speaker 2>all watch television, but surprisingly also truly impacted the music
<v Speaker 2>we listened to, from Africa to running up that Hill.
<v Speaker 2>Stranger Things has brought back songs of our past and
<v Speaker 2>introduced them to a whole new generation.
<v Speaker 1>So The Shirley You Can't Be Serious Podcasts begins a
<v Speaker 1>new series bringing you the stories behind the songs of
<v Speaker 1>Stranger Things.
<v Speaker 2>Hey, everybody, welcome back to the Shirley Can't Be Serious podcast. Today,
<v Speaker 2>d we are diving into episode four of season one
<v Speaker 2>of Stranger Things and the music involved in this episode.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, we can't fail to mention our executive producer for
<v Speaker 1>this episode. That is your friend who pointed you out
<v Speaker 1>to the Chick fil A worker on our last episode,
<v Speaker 1>mister Blaine Peterson. Mister Blaine Peterson.
<v Speaker 2>As I was standing in Chick fil A, the manager
<v Speaker 2>came out to me and said, are you the celebrity
<v Speaker 2>Jason Colvin and I was so confused and he had
<v Speaker 2>just gone through the drive throughs well.
<v Speaker 1>And now he is our Patreon subscriber, he will be
<v Speaker 1>able to listen to all of our super secret episodes
<v Speaker 1>where we go through the one hit wonders of the
<v Speaker 1>eighties and beyond. So if you, dear listener, are interested
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<v Speaker 2>hit wonders that we've done the seventies, we've done the eighties,
<v Speaker 2>we've done the nineties, and they're.
<v Speaker 1>A lot of fun. They're a little bit shorter and
<v Speaker 1>they're kind.
<v Speaker 2>Of bite sized little snackies if you.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, but still the in depth stuff that you expect
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<v Speaker 2>The last episode, we talked about David Bowie and how
<v Speaker 2>he became friends with John Lennon.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, those two guys wrote a song together called Fame,
<v Speaker 1>which I mentioned was the number one song the day
<v Speaker 1>that I was born in nineteen seventy five.
<v Speaker 2>That's exactly right, David Bowie's first number one hit, by
<v Speaker 2>the way, Well, I came across an image on the
<v Speaker 2>internet I was going to tell you about. So it's
<v Speaker 2>John Lennon and Yoko Ono. Yeah, and let me tell
<v Speaker 2>you something. They needed to use the serious twenty code.
<v Speaker 1>Because they we're out of control. D. The mid seventies
<v Speaker 1>was a time for a lot of hair and not
<v Speaker 1>a lot of groom. Man, My gosh, now is not
<v Speaker 1>the seventies, ladies and gentlemen. Now is the time where
<v Speaker 1>you need to look good. I saw the picture that
<v Speaker 1>you're talking about, and it was a throwback to our
<v Speaker 1>Appetite for Destruction episode because I thought, welcome to the jungle, guys.
<v Speaker 1>You don't want to jungle down there. You don't want
<v Speaker 1>to be John Lennon, Harry or Yoko Oh no Harry
<v Speaker 1>for that matter. Sure, you want to be nice and
<v Speaker 1>trim looking for your lady.
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<v Speaker 1>need is love. But Manscape doesn't hurt.
<v Speaker 2>Wack it all?
<v Speaker 1>Right? Are we ready to jump into the songs of
<v Speaker 1>season one, episode four of Stranger Things. We're ready, We're ready.
<v Speaker 1>Let's go. So only two songs in this episode, yeah two.
<v Speaker 1>The first song that you hear is so monumental. It
<v Speaker 1>is by such an influential band, and I have to say,
<v Speaker 1>I'm so glad that we are doing this because had
<v Speaker 1>we not done this, Joy Division would just have been
<v Speaker 1>this band that I've heard of and that's all. But wow,
<v Speaker 1>what an incredible story, what an legacy, an influence that
<v Speaker 1>they've had over countless bands. Our friend James Buckley said,
<v Speaker 1>there weren't a whole lot of people that listened to
<v Speaker 1>Joy Division or bought that first album, but the ones
<v Speaker 1>that did all started a band. I know.
<v Speaker 2>That's a great quote, right, Yeah. I thought it was
<v Speaker 2>funny how you called James Buckley, And unbeknownst to me,
<v Speaker 2>I called James Buckley and I was like asking him.
<v Speaker 2>I was hitting him up on Joy Division because I
<v Speaker 2>didn't know who they were, right, And I'm like, so
<v Speaker 2>and so, how did.
<v Speaker 1>You find them?
<v Speaker 2>And you know, if it's they're not on MTV, I
<v Speaker 2>don't know how anybody finds anything. But so he's like, well,
<v Speaker 2>when I was talking to D I told him about this,
<v Speaker 2>I'm like, wait, D calls you already.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, we're both tapping the James Buckley Well is the truth.
<v Speaker 2>Here's the way he got involved with him, or how
<v Speaker 2>you found them. I thought this was interesting. He had
<v Speaker 2>read a rock magazine where the guys from Faith No
<v Speaker 2>More credited Joy Divisions being an influence on them. So
<v Speaker 2>if you've ever heard or like Faith No More, Joy
<v Speaker 2>Division's kind of their musical family.
<v Speaker 1>It was incredible because I didn't beat around the bush.
<v Speaker 1>I didn't do small talk. I'm like, hey, I'm listening
<v Speaker 1>to Joy Division and I need to know where the
<v Speaker 1>love is. I need you to help me understand the
<v Speaker 1>love because I liked the music. But the Ian Curtis's
<v Speaker 1>voice is not my taste, right weird, It's a little
<v Speaker 1>bit strange. But I asked him that question. I mean,
<v Speaker 1>he didn't hesitate. It was boom, Well, here's what happened,
<v Speaker 1>and went right into it. And then afterwards he texted
<v Speaker 1>me he said, I just laughingly told my wife you
<v Speaker 1>called to ask me about Joy Division, and she said,
<v Speaker 1>you've been preparing your whole life at this moment. It
<v Speaker 1>was seamless. He was ready. He was ready for oral
<v Speaker 1>arguments right then. Right there.
<v Speaker 2>I like, how when you said I didn't beat around
<v Speaker 2>the bush, I was ready to jump right into another
<v Speaker 2>Manscape ad. But we'll hang on for that for next time.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so let's talk about Manchester circa nineteen seventy four.
<v Speaker 1>So okay, So Manchester now has some soccer teams, a
<v Speaker 1>couple of Manchester United, Manchester City. My kid's a man
<v Speaker 1>City fan, and it's a place that people know. Back
<v Speaker 1>in the seventies it was like Detroit without Motown. Just
<v Speaker 1>not good at all, not a good music scene. They
<v Speaker 1>talked about how the only interesting act around was Gary Glitter,
<v Speaker 1>and if you know the Gary Glitter story, that's a
<v Speaker 1>word that's almost not safe to say. Yes, you know
<v Speaker 1>you've heard his music at the football game, but you
<v Speaker 1>haven't heard that story. And someday we will come back
<v Speaker 1>that story. We will come back with the Gary Glitter story,
<v Speaker 1>but not today. All right.
<v Speaker 2>When you started talking about Manchester United, I thought it
<v Speaker 2>was going to turn into a soccer podcast. I was
<v Speaker 2>going to tag in David Wright and check out because
<v Speaker 2>I know nothing about soccer and less about Manchester.
<v Speaker 1>So keep going, all right. So Manchester in the seventies
<v Speaker 1>has no good music, has a lot of poor, blue
<v Speaker 1>collar son of a gun guys out on their luck.
<v Speaker 1>Until June fourth, nineteen seventy six. Yes, on June fourth,
<v Speaker 1>nineteen seventy six, there is a double concert in the
<v Speaker 1>Free Trade Hall in Manchester by none other than The
<v Speaker 1>sex Pistols, the punk band of all punk bands of
<v Speaker 1>the seventies, I mean, the trendsetters, the torch Carriers, whatever
<v Speaker 1>you want to call them. These guys were there and
<v Speaker 1>it's kind of like the Joy Division album, Like, not
<v Speaker 1>a whole lot of people were there, but everybody that
<v Speaker 1>was there started a band. Yeah.
<v Speaker 2>We talked on our ninety days in the nineties about
<v Speaker 2>concerts that we'd like to time travel and go see. Yeah,
<v Speaker 2>this apparently was such a huge people who saw it
<v Speaker 2>created a band that started change the world.
<v Speaker 1>Well, here's kind of the impression that I got is that,
<v Speaker 1>you know, if you're listening to Deep Purple or led
<v Speaker 1>Zeppelin back in that day, you're like, those guys are incredible.
<v Speaker 1>I can't do that. But if you go watch the
<v Speaker 1>sex Pistols and you're a seventeen year old kid, you're like,
<v Speaker 1>I could do that, and these guys are I mean,
<v Speaker 1>they're a huge bill. The crowd is going crazy for
<v Speaker 1>these guys, and so there were a ton of guys
<v Speaker 1>in the audience that thought, I can do this, we
<v Speaker 1>can form a band. I can find people and we
<v Speaker 1>can form a band. And also in the audience was
<v Speaker 1>this reporter named Tony Wilson, and Tony was from Manchester.
<v Speaker 1>He had gone and gone to Cambridge and was an
<v Speaker 1>educated guy, but he was into sex, drugs and rock
<v Speaker 1>and roll. But he was kind of the yuppie guy
<v Speaker 1>for that scene. And so he was on He had
<v Speaker 1>these little news bits that he's on those kind of
<v Speaker 1>like Kamakazi articles like it would show him hang lighting
<v Speaker 1>throwback to our first episode him hang lighting. And fortunately
<v Speaker 1>he wasn't on a tall cliff, but he was in
<v Speaker 1>front of aire fence and so he immediately went to
<v Speaker 1>the Barbara fence, did an interview on like some karate people,
<v Speaker 1>and immediately was taken down to the mat, you know,
<v Speaker 1>like Hi, I'm oh, and there it is. He's down
<v Speaker 1>like that.
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.
<v Speaker 1>He was a lot of fun. But he was one
<v Speaker 1>of the guys who was at that Sex Pistols concert
<v Speaker 1>in seventy six. So some of the other guys that
<v Speaker 1>were there Ian Curtis, Bernard Sumner and Peter.
<v Speaker 2>Hook by the way, yeah, before you go any further, yeah,
<v Speaker 2>Peter Hook. Immediately I'm like if Peter Pan and Captain
<v Speaker 2>Hook had a child, they would name it Peter Hook.
<v Speaker 1>Yes, thank you, thank you for being here for all
<v Speaker 1>of our preschool listeners. We can keep on spiking the football, Peter.
<v Speaker 1>That is a great name. This is a very memorable name,
<v Speaker 1>Peter Hook. Keep going. So Tony Wilson decides he's going
<v Speaker 1>to form a record label. He enlists some help from
<v Speaker 1>some other people and they put together this record label
<v Speaker 1>called the Factory. Right, by this time, these guys who
<v Speaker 1>have seen the Sex Pistols play have put together their
<v Speaker 1>own bands, and by now we're going to have this
<v Speaker 1>big contest in Manchester to figure out who's the best
<v Speaker 1>of these bands. And it's like seventeen different bands, and
<v Speaker 1>the last band to be slated in this contest was
<v Speaker 1>the Negatives, and the guys from Joy Division were upset.
<v Speaker 1>They were like, we were supposed to be the last act,
<v Speaker 1>not these guys, because the last act is really kind
<v Speaker 1>of a key spot in a competition. You want to
<v Speaker 1>be the finale, right, And so they start arguing with
<v Speaker 1>the guys from the Negatives, they're arguing with the staff.
<v Speaker 1>They're saying, we're supposed to be last, not these guys.
<v Speaker 1>And at some point finally, like Ian Curtis is this
<v Speaker 1>very mild mannered, artsy kind of guy. But he's not
<v Speaker 1>small like you look at him. He's definitely a head
<v Speaker 1>taller than the rest of the guys in the band.
<v Speaker 1>Apparently he kicked down the door to the Negatives dressing
<v Speaker 1>room and said we're playing last, or I'm going to
<v Speaker 1>cut your effing head off, and they said, okay, you
<v Speaker 1>go last, and that led to them getting signed with
<v Speaker 1>Tony Wilson's new record label, and they were the driving
<v Speaker 1>force behind that record label. That's interesting. Their original name
<v Speaker 1>was Warsaw.
<v Speaker 2>It's a throwback to David Bowie's song Warzawa. Throwback to
<v Speaker 2>David Bowie that we covered are.
<v Speaker 1>In the last episode. He's going to come up again.
<v Speaker 1>He's going to come up again and it's not in
<v Speaker 1>a good way, but just put a pin in that
<v Speaker 1>put a pin in David Bowie. But yes, they were
<v Speaker 1>highly influenced by David Bowie and they were not what
<v Speaker 1>you would call punk. They were inspired by the punk
<v Speaker 1>but these guys had moved into an area of music
<v Speaker 1>that later on we would dub it post punk.
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, you know, you talked about how these three guys
<v Speaker 2>who formed Joy Division were at that concert.
<v Speaker 1>I thought it was interesting.
<v Speaker 2>The next day, like after that concert, they're like, we
<v Speaker 2>got to do this, Like we're doing this. One guy
<v Speaker 2>borrowed thirty five pounds from his mother to buy a guitar.
<v Speaker 2>The other guy's like, well, you know, he's been mollen
<v Speaker 2>lawns or whatever, and he went and bought a guitar.
<v Speaker 2>Like they just spark something in them that like this
<v Speaker 2>is happening. So they placed an ad in the Virgin
<v Speaker 2>record shop that they all go in and out of.
<v Speaker 2>Ian curaged response to that, and they're like, hey, yeah,
<v Speaker 2>we've seen you round. We know you don't audition him
<v Speaker 2>doesn't know if he can sing. They're like, yeah you okay,
<v Speaker 2>come on, it doesn't matter if you can sing.
<v Speaker 1>We're playing punk. Let's do it. Yeah, can you breathe?
<v Speaker 1>He said that as long as we go along with people,
<v Speaker 1>then it was cool. Right. So they went through a
<v Speaker 1>few drummers. This is the great story. I was gonna say.
<v Speaker 1>I think it was their third drummer, but you tell
<v Speaker 1>me the story, okay. So here's the deal.
<v Speaker 2>Joy Division has a band debuts May twenty ninth, nineteen
<v Speaker 2>seventy seven. In June of nineteen seventy seven. They decide
<v Speaker 2>we're going to replace our drummer. Okay, so they bring
<v Speaker 2>in this guy named Steve Brotherdale. Well, after a few gigs,
<v Speaker 2>they decide that they don't like him. This guy is
<v Speaker 2>not fitting. He's just a pain in the butt and
<v Speaker 2>we don't like him. What's his name, Steve Brotherdale, not
<v Speaker 2>David Covered. That's where that's where my head went.
<v Speaker 1>Steve Brotherdale.
<v Speaker 2>So while they're driving, they're all in a car and
<v Speaker 2>they decide we're going to fire this guy.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.
<v Speaker 2>So they they pull over and one guy's like, hey, Steve,
<v Speaker 2>I think we got a flat tire. Will you step
<v Speaker 2>out and check on it? So Steve gets out of
<v Speaker 2>the car and when he gets out of the car
<v Speaker 2>they drive off.
<v Speaker 1>They're like, re readier, that's fantastic. That is fantastic.
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, you know, sometimes you got to take the problem
<v Speaker 2>from the side, you know.
<v Speaker 1>So finally they end up with their third drummer who sticks,
<v Speaker 1>and that's Steven Morris. And by that time they call
<v Speaker 1>him sticks or because that's a great nickname for drummer.
<v Speaker 1>It's perfect, perfect really anyway, Steven Morris sticks, but the
<v Speaker 1>band name doesn't. They got to get rid of warsaw right,
<v Speaker 1>and so they go with a different name, Joy Division,
<v Speaker 1>very happy sounding name. It's happy sounding. Yeah. Yeah.
<v Speaker 2>So they get this from a nineteen fifty five novel
<v Speaker 2>called House of Dolls, and Joy Division refers to this
<v Speaker 2>special section of prostitutes or prisoners from the Auschwitz war
<v Speaker 2>camp in Nazi Germany, where the Nazi soldiers would go
<v Speaker 2>to have a good time. So they would keep woman
<v Speaker 2>prisoners on the side as the quote unquote Joy Division,
<v Speaker 2>so not so happy, no, not so happy. Basically sex
<v Speaker 2>slaves for the soldiers, and they would also use these
<v Speaker 2>women for favored prisoners.
<v Speaker 1>Wow. Horrible, Yeah, Joy Division. Okay, so that's less happy. Yeah,
<v Speaker 1>it's a good punk name, right, Yeah, it's it's Nirvana, right,
<v Speaker 1>but it's not but whole surfers, it's not Nirvana. That's
<v Speaker 1>buzz I mean, it's it's something that you hear and
<v Speaker 1>it sounds nice, but then when you find out the history,
<v Speaker 1>you're like, ooh, this is unpleasant.
<v Speaker 2>So January twenty fifth, nineteen seventy eight, Joy Division plays
<v Speaker 2>its first gig and they sort of, you know, work
<v Speaker 2>their way around, they begin their climb.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.
<v Speaker 2>When nineteen seventy nine rolls around they record their very
<v Speaker 2>first album.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so this is this is huge because this is
<v Speaker 1>Tony Wilson's concept, the Factory, And I say concept because
<v Speaker 1>it started out as actually a club and then ultimately
<v Speaker 1>that transitioned into a record label. And it was kind
<v Speaker 1>of neat how he did stuff like the contract that
<v Speaker 1>he signed with the Joy Division guys he signed in
<v Speaker 1>his own blood, like let you no kidding, because it
<v Speaker 1>was like on a napkin, And basically the idea was,
<v Speaker 1>I'm as the record label guy, I'm not going to
<v Speaker 1>own your music. I'm not going to influence your music.
<v Speaker 1>That is your call. Wow, you are the one who
<v Speaker 1>was in charge of that. I'm not going to own it.
<v Speaker 1>I'm just going to be the one that's in charge
<v Speaker 1>of the business side of things, and what's on the
<v Speaker 1>business side of things, I'm in charge of, not you.
<v Speaker 1>And so listen to some of the bands that he
<v Speaker 1>was the manager of, they're like, yeah, this sounds really
<v Speaker 1>open minded. But a lot of the times that meant
<v Speaker 1>when it got to something that we weren't happy about,
<v Speaker 1>he said, well, you know what you can do. That
<v Speaker 1>was a nice way to say it's going to be
<v Speaker 1>this way or you can go off because you aren't
<v Speaker 1>connected to me. You don't have to you don't have
<v Speaker 1>to stay here. You can go you can go somewhere
<v Speaker 1>else and do something else if you want to. Now,
<v Speaker 1>Joy Division was a different I mean, they still had
<v Speaker 1>the same contract, but they were the bread and butter
<v Speaker 1>of the Factory record label. So now that they've decided
<v Speaker 1>to record the album, they have to have a producer.
<v Speaker 1>And so the guy that they get to come be
<v Speaker 1>their producer is a guy named Martin Hannett. Okay, he
<v Speaker 1>had gone by the name Martin Zero before, and he
<v Speaker 1>was he had produced one record. But you know why
<v Speaker 1>he was important to these guys, No, because he was
<v Speaker 1>in Manchester. He was like the only record producer in Manchester.
<v Speaker 1>But he had produced the buzzcocks first EP called Spiral Scratch.
<v Speaker 1>And so they're like, Okay, Martin, you're going to be
<v Speaker 1>our producer. We've got Joy Division over here because they
<v Speaker 1>are the most talented band that we have. Let's put
<v Speaker 1>this record together. Okay, now here's here's where a bit
<v Speaker 1>of magic happens. Okay, Division didn't really sound like Joy
<v Speaker 1>Division until Martin Hannett put his fingers into their pie right,
<v Speaker 1>and people would talk about how difficult it was to
<v Speaker 1>work with Martin Hannett. Like he said, I saw one
<v Speaker 1>guy who was like, it didn't matter how long a
<v Speaker 1>bean been together, four weeks, forty years. Within three days
<v Speaker 1>of working with Martin Hannett, he had everybody at each
<v Speaker 1>other's throat. That was what he thought was the way
<v Speaker 1>to produce record was to get everybody. Matt and the
<v Speaker 1>guy he wanted to make the maddest was the drummer,
<v Speaker 1>because the matter he is, the harder he hits the drums. Okay,
<v Speaker 1>I can see that. There's a movie that's come out
<v Speaker 1>that details the rise and fall of Factory Records called
<v Speaker 1>I think it's like twenty four Hour Party Machine or
<v Speaker 1>something like that. But Andy Sarkis plays the part of
<v Speaker 1>Martin Hannett, and he's awesome. He's so good as just
<v Speaker 1>this total jerk face guy, but he's a guy who
<v Speaker 1>knows what he is doing, and so he takes these guys.
<v Speaker 1>He takes Joy Division, who has this standard rock beat,
<v Speaker 1>the two and four rock beat, and he's like, we're
<v Speaker 1>not doing that. We're doing a disco beat. And they're
<v Speaker 1>like what. He's like, Wow, No, we're doing a disco
<v Speaker 1>beat on this one, and he used loops that we've
<v Speaker 1>talked about before, which was rare in the seventies. He
<v Speaker 1>was doing all kinds of these innovative things with echoes
<v Speaker 1>and ambient sound, and he is the one that made
<v Speaker 1>them sound and they hated it. They hated the way
<v Speaker 1>they sounded for that first LP, but it made them
<v Speaker 1>who they are and it made them relevant. They became
<v Speaker 1>like the definitive post punk band in the late seventies.
<v Speaker 1>It's incredible. It's incredible. So he treated it like he
<v Speaker 1>owned the factory and the band members were the drones. Right.
<v Speaker 1>But he was inspired by a few things that we've
<v Speaker 1>talked about before, right, Yeah, Okay. Number one crowdrock. Yes,
<v Speaker 1>we keep talking about crowdrock. Yeah, so we mentioned it
<v Speaker 1>and dearly list. If you're not familiar with us talking
<v Speaker 1>about it, it was on one of our Patreon episodes.
<v Speaker 1>But Keith Forcey, the guy who wrote Don't You Forget
<v Speaker 1>About Me, was a prominent kroud rock guy who worked
<v Speaker 1>with Giorgio Moroder. After that, worked with Donna Summer, which
<v Speaker 1>we'll talk a little bit about New Order after this,
<v Speaker 1>and Donna Summer was a big factor in that right,
<v Speaker 1>So he's inspired by Kroud Rock, He's inspired by Brian Eno,
<v Speaker 1>who of course is working with David Bowie at that
<v Speaker 1>point and they're making Low and he rose with that
<v Speaker 1>ambient sound and then Key his idol that we talked
<v Speaker 1>about on our Dirty Dancing episode, Mister Phil Spector. Oh yeah,
<v Speaker 1>that all makes sense. He totally wanted to be the
<v Speaker 1>Phil Spector of the post punk scene and he I
<v Speaker 1>think achieved it. Can you know what?
<v Speaker 2>We keep coming in contact with Phil Spector and Georgio
<v Speaker 2>Moroder is all over the place, right, this is the
<v Speaker 2>guy that gave us the top Gun soundtrack.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, the Never Ending Store sort I mean, yes, yeah,
<v Speaker 1>it's all over the place, all over the place.
<v Speaker 2>So Joy Division starts to tour Europe in early nineteen eighty.
<v Speaker 1>Well, here's the problem.
<v Speaker 2>They start to realize Ian Curtis has got epilepsy.
<v Speaker 1>And this was kind of a big big deal anyway,
<v Speaker 1>but it was a bigger deal for him because in
<v Speaker 1>his past he'd actually worked in a hospital with epileptic patients.
<v Speaker 1>Like Joy Division has a song called She's out of Control,
<v Speaker 1>and people thought, well, he's talking about his condition. No,
<v Speaker 1>he was actually talking about a female patient. At the
<v Speaker 1>place that he worked, who he had seen go into
<v Speaker 1>these epileptic fits, and now he's getting the news, Hey,
<v Speaker 1>you have this, and you can't be around loud music,
<v Speaker 1>you can't do drugs, you can't stay up late, you
<v Speaker 1>can't drink. The doctor's like, oh, by the way, what
<v Speaker 1>do you do And he's like, oh, I'm a librarian.
<v Speaker 1>Oh wow, because you can't.
<v Speaker 2>You know, what do you say to that, Right, I'm
<v Speaker 2>a rock musician who you know, we crank it up
<v Speaker 2>and have lights everywhere.
<v Speaker 1>Right.
<v Speaker 2>In fact, he had special conditions, like they couldn't shoot
<v Speaker 2>the lights at him, yeah, or he'd have a seizure.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. No, they literally like, guys, the background crew turned
<v Speaker 1>on the strobes at one point during one of their
<v Speaker 1>concerts and I mean he flat out fell backwards into
<v Speaker 1>the drums. Yeah he did. He did.
<v Speaker 2>He had two grandma seizures in early nineteen eighty. Yeah,
<v Speaker 2>and we actually talked about the grandma seizure that Tina
<v Speaker 2>Marie experienced during the top Gun episode. And a grandma
<v Speaker 2>seizure if you don't know, that's like laying on the
<v Speaker 2>ground shaking, you have no sort of awareness, can't do anything.
<v Speaker 1>You know, right, And if you've seen any videos of
<v Speaker 1>Ian Curtis performing, he has this very unique dancing style
<v Speaker 1>which looks like an epileptic seizure. I mean, his eyes
<v Speaker 1>are big, his face is kind of like dumbfounded, and
<v Speaker 1>he's throwing his arms around like a fit. And so
<v Speaker 1>I could see how somebody was like, oh, it's just
<v Speaker 1>his way of dancing when he's having these seizures.
<v Speaker 2>He would have seizures on stage and people think, oh,
<v Speaker 2>look at it, man, he's really passionate.
<v Speaker 1>He's really into it right now. It's crazy. Yeah. So anyway, he.
<v Speaker 2>You know, the lack of sleep, the long hours, you know,
<v Speaker 2>the seizures on stage. It was embarrass Yeah, he was
<v Speaker 2>embarrassed and ashamed.
<v Speaker 1>And he had also at this point fallen in love
<v Speaker 1>with this Belgian journalist named Anika Nore and she actually
<v Speaker 1>later on went and formed the Belgian arm of the factory.
<v Speaker 1>So that's kind of a weird coincidence, okay, but he
<v Speaker 1>had developed deep feelings for her. She would later on
<v Speaker 1>say it was all platonic. I guess we should say
<v Speaker 1>he was married at the time. Yeah, he's a different woman.
<v Speaker 1>His wife did not believe it was platonic.
<v Speaker 2>Let's back up just a second. He got married at
<v Speaker 2>nineteen and worked for the government, had a boring life. Yeah,
<v Speaker 2>he and his wife, you know, struggled to make it.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.
<v Speaker 2>And then on the side, he's a punk rocker, right,
<v Speaker 2>you know, he aspired to be a musician, and then
<v Speaker 2>when he finally achieves it, falls in love with another woman.
<v Speaker 2>But he doesn't want to give up his wife and
<v Speaker 2>feels guilty. And I don't want to give up my girlfriend.
<v Speaker 2>I don't want to give up my wife. I kind
<v Speaker 2>of want to have both.
<v Speaker 1>And yeah, and she gives I mean, she files for divorce,
<v Speaker 1>and she gives him an ultimatum and says, you cannot
<v Speaker 1>have any more contact with her. If you have more
<v Speaker 1>contact with her, we're done. And that's it. I'm just
<v Speaker 1>there's no other way about this. You have to sever
<v Speaker 1>all contact with her. Then, on top of all of
<v Speaker 1>those other stressors, the epilepsy, the unrequited love or love affair,
<v Speaker 1>whatever it might have been. Sure, they also find out
<v Speaker 1>they're about to go to North America for a tour
<v Speaker 1>of the United States, Right, big deal. Yeah, and the
<v Speaker 1>rest of the band is elated. It's two big problems.
<v Speaker 1>Number One, he's worried about how the crowds are going
<v Speaker 1>to treat him if he's going to have an epileptic
<v Speaker 1>seizure on stage, because Americans are not the nicest people
<v Speaker 1>in concerts, right, I mean we've talked about Prince and
<v Speaker 1>what people did when he appeared. Yeah, and he's worried
<v Speaker 1>about that. And he's also deathly afraid of flying, like
<v Speaker 1>he had literally talked about how do I get there
<v Speaker 1>by boat? Can I just take a boat over to America? Wow?
<v Speaker 1>But anyway, all of those things are coming down hard
<v Speaker 1>upon his head.
<v Speaker 2>So he had attempted suicide when he was sixteen years
<v Speaker 2>old by overdosing on medication that he guy's hands, they.
<v Speaker 1>Actually pumped his stomach.
<v Speaker 2>Well, all these stressors start to kind of rear their
<v Speaker 2>ugly head, and people around him think, yeah, he's stressed out,
<v Speaker 2>but he's not really in danger, right, right.
<v Speaker 1>I mean you listen to people talk about him, they're
<v Speaker 1>like everybody thinks, you know, who doesn't know him and
<v Speaker 1>knows what happened, thinks he's this kind of dark, moody guy,
<v Speaker 1>and he wasn't. He's a guy who cut up and
<v Speaker 1>joked and playpool and drank with the boys. He's just
<v Speaker 1>a regular bloke, is the thing you hear most often.
<v Speaker 1>But like so many regular blokes, people didn't know the
<v Speaker 1>demons that he was truly dealing with. Yeah.
<v Speaker 2>So he was talking to his wife and he said,
<v Speaker 2>please stay with me tonight, and she felt like she
<v Speaker 2>had to stay with him or else. Who knows what
<v Speaker 2>would have happened, right, Well, she stayed with him, and
<v Speaker 2>then he told her to go away, don't come back. Yeah,
<v Speaker 2>And then while she was gone, on April seventh, nineteen eighty,
<v Speaker 2>he hanged himself.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, early morning hours. So according to Tony Wilson, before
<v Speaker 1>he did this, he did two things. He watched a
<v Speaker 1>movie and he listened to an album. The movie he
<v Speaker 1>watched is a movie called strosek Okay. It's by Vernon
<v Speaker 1>harzok Okay, famous director, but one of his earlier seventies movies.
<v Speaker 1>I took a look at this movie. So here's the
<v Speaker 1>plot line of the movie. Musician gets out of jail,
<v Speaker 1>starts dating a prostitute, gets beaten severely. The prostitute leaves
<v Speaker 1>in a car and never comes back, and then he
<v Speaker 1>goes and kills himself. Does that sound familiar at all?
<v Speaker 1>Sounds like the Reagan You story. It sounds like the
<v Speaker 1>Reagan you story, except that the Reagan You thing didn't happen,
<v Speaker 1>wouldn't happen for another decade. Yeah, like another yeah, yeah.
<v Speaker 1>So I was like, oh my gosh, wow, and I
<v Speaker 1>was just like, whoa, this is nuts. Then the album
<v Speaker 1>that he listened to we talked about in our last episode.
<v Speaker 1>It was the one that David Bowie produced for Iggy
<v Speaker 1>Pop call The Idiot, which you think, okay, so weird coincidence? Sure?
<v Speaker 1>The album The Idiot got its title from a Russian novel.
<v Speaker 1>It's about an epileptic prince and there's an attempted suicide.
<v Speaker 2>What in the book get out of Town?
<v Speaker 1>Where are you going to get that information? I don't
<v Speaker 1>know what the deal is with the songs that they're
<v Speaker 1>picking for the Stranger Things, But why is it that
<v Speaker 1>suicide seems to run a thread through all of them.
<v Speaker 1>That's just it's weird. It's crazy. It is very, very weird.
<v Speaker 2>This season alone, just on this series, we've talked about murder,
<v Speaker 2>We've talked about suicide, We've talked about kidnapping, hangt hang
<v Speaker 2>two of them, I know, right? And Christmas songs?
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and Christmas songs.
<v Speaker 2>Right, Hey, we got blocked on Facebook because we were
<v Speaker 2>talking about these. They were like, hey, we're going to
<v Speaker 2>talk about suicide and murder, drugs LSD and they're like, nope.
<v Speaker 1>The zecond bery shut us down. Yeah they did hard.
<v Speaker 1>We look to Facebook jail over this stranger things. It's
<v Speaker 1>not us, all right, Blame Nora Felder exactly, exactly. Okay,
<v Speaker 1>So he commits suicide, right, I mean literally, they're supposed
<v Speaker 1>to fly out the next next day, the next day,
<v Speaker 1>and so their world is coming to a crashing halt.
<v Speaker 1>Their lead singer is dead. They have to go to
<v Speaker 1>North America to tour. How are they going to do it?
<v Speaker 1>Are you really going to start a new band? Yes
<v Speaker 1>you are, Yes you are. Boys and girls, ladies and gentlemen.
<v Speaker 1>We're going to talk about it in just a second.
<v Speaker 1>But I hate to say it. We've gone this far
<v Speaker 1>and we have not yet said what the song I
<v Speaker 1>know or where it appears in the episode. So the
<v Speaker 1>Joy Division song that we're going to talk about is Atmosphere.
<v Speaker 1>The Atmosphere was not on one of their two albums
<v Speaker 1>that the band released. It came out as a single
<v Speaker 1>after Unknown Pleasures, but before closer, and it came out
<v Speaker 1>exactly two months before Ian Curtis hanged himself interesting March eighteenth. Now,
<v Speaker 1>obviously record stores get it earlier than that, Okay. I
<v Speaker 1>mentioned in one of our episodes recently that James Buckley
<v Speaker 1>pointed out that it would not be the last mention
<v Speaker 1>of suicide or John Peel. John Peele played this song
<v Speaker 1>for the first time on his show on March eleventh,
<v Speaker 1>a week before its release nineteen eighty. The next day
<v Speaker 1>he played the B side, which is Dead Souls, which
<v Speaker 1>is also a fantastic song and one that I will
<v Speaker 1>talk about in our next episode a little bit. If
<v Speaker 1>you don't know Dead Souls from Joy Division, if you've
<v Speaker 1>seen the movie The Crow Nine inch Nails covers that song,
<v Speaker 1>it's the scene where Eric Draven is running from rooftop
<v Speaker 1>to rooftop and it is it's intense, and it's awesome,
<v Speaker 1>and it's a great cover of that song. It's entrancing,
<v Speaker 1>it's beautiful. And I will say now for our listeners
<v Speaker 1>the same thing that I say. It said to James
<v Speaker 1>when I called them to ask him what the appeal
<v Speaker 1>of Joy Division was. I don't really like this guy's voice.
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, you and I talked about this, and he's been
<v Speaker 2>dead and buried for forty two years now, so yeah,
<v Speaker 2>we can kind.
<v Speaker 1>Of discuss it now soon. Right.
<v Speaker 2>It's interesting, it's deep, it's kind of nasally, but it
<v Speaker 2>sounds it's not it's not my taste.
<v Speaker 1>Even though it's not my taste, I find myself singing
<v Speaker 1>the song in that voice, like I'm wandering around throughout
<v Speaker 1>my day and I'll just be I'll just start singing
<v Speaker 1>the lyrics to that song. It's just it's not a
<v Speaker 1>pretty voice to listen to, but it does something that hooks.
<v Speaker 1>It hooks you in and the music is awesome. I
<v Speaker 1>love it very It sets the tone. Yeah, so I
<v Speaker 1>don't think we mentioned it, but this song comes in
<v Speaker 1>at three minutes and fifty two seconds into the episode.
<v Speaker 1>As you recall, the end of the last episode is
<v Speaker 1>when they discovered what appeared to be the body of
<v Speaker 1>Will Byers, and this one, the name of this episode
<v Speaker 1>is the Body, because it's all this question of is
<v Speaker 1>this really the body? Right? But the beginning of the
<v Speaker 1>episode is obvious, this kind of you know, like you've
<v Speaker 1>been hitting the head muted in shock, ambient noise going
<v Speaker 1>on for the first nearly four minutes, as Jim is
<v Speaker 1>trying to tell Joyce that they've found Will's body and
<v Speaker 1>that she's got to understand that he's really dead, and
<v Speaker 1>he understands why she's acting the way she is and
<v Speaker 1>believes he's still alive. And he went through the same
<v Speaker 1>thing with his daughter. And then he leaves, and that's
<v Speaker 1>when this song thumps in and what a crazy like.
<v Speaker 1>I don't even understand the meaning of the scene. But
<v Speaker 1>she's going out to the shed and she's getting in
<v Speaker 1>an axe, right, and what's going to happen we don't know,
<v Speaker 1>but this music playing in the background of that scene,
<v Speaker 1>it intensifies it. It's magnificent, perfect, perfect song for that moment.
<v Speaker 1>It's great.
<v Speaker 2>It's great, And is the body Will is not Will?
<v Speaker 1>We're not sure spoiler alert, it's not. Well. Well, the
<v Speaker 1>actor has been in all of the following seasons. I
<v Speaker 1>think everybody can guess that one, right. Yes, So we
<v Speaker 1>both like the song. Yeah, not real high on his voice,
<v Speaker 1>but still the music. I'll listen to this. Here's the thing.
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and we're gonna just briefly touch on this. Once
<v Speaker 2>Ian Curtis dies, the rest of the group pulls themselves
<v Speaker 2>together and says, I guess we need a new singer.
<v Speaker 2>Let's change the name and move on to something else,
<v Speaker 2>and they become New Order.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and we will be talking about them on our
<v Speaker 1>next episode, right, so hold that thought till next time.
<v Speaker 1>Stick a pin and we got some fun stuff for
<v Speaker 1>you for New Order. I will just tell you they
<v Speaker 1>did after his death, which, like I said, it was
<v Speaker 1>only two months later, they re released this song and
<v Speaker 1>they changed the B side from Dead Souls understandable sure
<v Speaker 1>to She's Lost Control, which is still I mean, that's
<v Speaker 1>the song that everybody's like, did he write this about himself?
<v Speaker 1>Because Sezure song? Right, yeah, it's the Seizure song. So
<v Speaker 1>I can understand why you don't want Dead Souls as
<v Speaker 1>your B side on the two month old single that
<v Speaker 1>the guy just killed himself. But why'd they pick other
<v Speaker 1>than it's it's also probably a single worthy song, right yeah?
<v Speaker 1>I don't know.
<v Speaker 2>Interesting short lived joy Division makes a big impact, starts
<v Speaker 2>a lot of bands, yeah, impacts the eighties really yeah, okay.
<v Speaker 1>Real quick. There is actually a music video for this song,
<v Speaker 1>as you know that. No, I haven't seen it. Yeah,
<v Speaker 1>it's weird. It's very weird. It didn't get released. They
<v Speaker 1>filmed it early on, but it didn't get released until
<v Speaker 1>this song was re released back in nineteen eighty eight.
<v Speaker 1>And it's like bizar, it's black and white. It's got
<v Speaker 1>these hooded cloaked very strange video, but it fits the
<v Speaker 1>tone of the song for sure. Okay, So this song
<v Speaker 1>reached the top of the UK Indie chart in October
<v Speaker 1>of nineteen eighty hit the number two spot on that
<v Speaker 1>same chart when they re released it in nineteen eighty eight. Okay,
<v Speaker 1>So you mentioned John Peel's BBC radio program Listen to
<v Speaker 1>This Little Nugget. In two thousand, the song Atmosphere was
<v Speaker 1>voted greatest song of the millennium by his listeners. It's
<v Speaker 1>good they use this song. I talked about the movie
<v Speaker 1>that they had made about Tony Wilson, the record label journalist,
<v Speaker 1>a guy called twenty four Hour Party. People use this
<v Speaker 1>song right after the scene where Ian Curtis commits suicide.
<v Speaker 1>They use this song at the end of his biopic,
<v Speaker 1>which was called Control. And then when Tony Wilson, the
<v Speaker 1>real person, actually died, they played it at aneral. So
<v Speaker 1>this I think for Joy Division fans, this is it
<v Speaker 1>this is the one top of the list song for sure.
<v Speaker 1>Cool awesome, all right, that does it for the song
<v Speaker 1>that's at the very beginning. There's only one other song
<v Speaker 1>in this episode for us to talk about, and that
<v Speaker 1>is Color Dreams by The Deep. Have you heard of
<v Speaker 1>The Deep? Never? No? And there's a reason for that.
<v Speaker 1>This is the only album they made and they only
<v Speaker 1>got together to make the album. They didn't tour as
<v Speaker 1>a group. And this song comes in in the episode.
<v Speaker 1>What was our time signature on them? Time signature thirty
<v Speaker 1>four minutes and three seconds. Right, So it's the scene
<v Speaker 1>where Popper is talking to the state trooper who found
<v Speaker 1>Will's supposed body. So they're in a bar having a drink.
<v Speaker 1>He's questioning the guy, acting like a good guy until
<v Speaker 1>he calls him out on the line and the guy's like,
<v Speaker 1>you know, thanks for running the game, dick. And then
<v Speaker 1>the next scene, Hopper has beaten the crap out of
<v Speaker 1>the guy in the alley to get information from him,
<v Speaker 1>and that's when we find out it was this app right,
<v Speaker 1>the song that's playing, Color Dreams. You can't hear it,
<v Speaker 1>I mean you can hear a little twinkling of it,
<v Speaker 1>but not only are both of the guys talking throughout
<v Speaker 1>the scene, but you've got the game playing throughout the scene.
<v Speaker 1>So you've got announcing going on, two guys talking, and
<v Speaker 1>in the very limited background you can hear the jukebox
<v Speaker 1>playing this song. Now, this song was by the Deep
<v Speaker 1>You got who are founder of the Deepest Rusty Evans,
<v Speaker 1>Rusty Evans, world.
<v Speaker 2>Famous, Rusty Evans rock star extraordinary.
<v Speaker 1>The only guy who really had a career before they
<v Speaker 1>made this album, right, And basically what happened was he
<v Speaker 1>was just kind of of a folk music guy, like
<v Speaker 1>almost rockabilly stuff. Yes, and he says to his buddy
<v Speaker 1>Marcus Barkin, yes, hey, let's go record a psychedelic album.
<v Speaker 1>And the guy's like, what right, And so for twelve
<v Speaker 1>hundred bucks, they get some other musicians around and they
<v Speaker 1>go to this place to record this album. But it's
<v Speaker 1>important in musical history because it is the first album
<v Speaker 1>that has the word psychedelic in the title.
<v Speaker 2>Okay, so this is a series of bad decisions in
<v Speaker 2>my opinion. Okay, So one guy who can play guitar
<v Speaker 2>and can sing goes to his buddies says, hey, let's
<v Speaker 2>produce this psychedelic album.
<v Speaker 1>Nobody knows what that means yet.
<v Speaker 2>It's literally the first album with the word psychedelic in
<v Speaker 2>the title, and he's like, yeah, it's gonna be great
<v Speaker 2>psychedelic moods. Psychedelic moods, that's right. Yeah, So we're gonna
<v Speaker 2>drive from New York to Philadelphia. We'll write music on
<v Speaker 2>the way, we'll figure it out as we go. They
<v Speaker 2>go twelve hundred bucks, which that's cheap, even for cheap
<v Speaker 2>albums back then. Yeah, they spend four days on it.
<v Speaker 2>One of the session guys they bring in to play
<v Speaker 2>the he quits midstream and it's supposed to be kind
<v Speaker 2>of like an LSD trip. Is the idea of the psychogetry,
<v Speaker 2>So I wonder what they used for inspiration for that.
<v Speaker 2>Just imagine that you're like, Okay, we're gonna we're getting
<v Speaker 2>hired for like a three day gig. Okay, oh we
<v Speaker 2>got to drop acid and then we play this sounds
<v Speaker 2>like a great idea, Yeah, sure, Well it worked for
<v Speaker 2>people who were doing stuff later on, it did. It's
<v Speaker 2>not as though that wasn't unsuccessful, right, But in this
<v Speaker 2>particular instance, it was not successful. They would later go on.
<v Speaker 2>I think maybe a couple of the guys played together again.
<v Speaker 1>They changed their name. The next album was called Psychedelic
<v Speaker 1>Soul with ps ou L. How funny is that? And
<v Speaker 1>it's clever. Yeah, And so they were, you know, again,
<v Speaker 1>an unsuccessful album. They they were doing stuff that nobody
<v Speaker 1>was interested in. And that's probably how this song ended
<v Speaker 1>up in the background of a Stranger Things episode. It
<v Speaker 1>was cheap, nobody cared, so you can get it cheap.
<v Speaker 2>That's very true, and that's why it's it's in there.
<v Speaker 2>But the producer, Mark Burkin, when they got done with it,
<v Speaker 2>he sent it to the publisher for the Beatles.
<v Speaker 1>Oh okay, named Dick James.
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and Dick James is like, yeah, you know, uh,
<v Speaker 2>I'll pay you guys to distribute this, and they're like,
<v Speaker 2>no way, man, this is.
<v Speaker 1>Going to be a hit. We don't need your help.
<v Speaker 2>I mean, I know you're with the Beatles and everything,
<v Speaker 2>but we got this right.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah what that's great.
<v Speaker 2>This goes along with the decisions to write songs and
<v Speaker 2>sleep in the studio and all that stuff.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, right, could have been much bigger. Okay, So I
<v Speaker 1>told you I had a special little nugget on this one. Yes,
<v Speaker 1>I'm ready, You're ready, Yes, Okay, so Marcus Sparkin, the producer,
<v Speaker 1>the guy who Rusty Evans talked into doing this right.
<v Speaker 1>He would go on to be the music supervisor in
<v Speaker 1>a show that you know and love that The first
<v Speaker 1>season was directed by Richard Donner, which we talked about
<v Speaker 1>in our Lethal Weapon episode Stopping was the musical director
<v Speaker 1>for the Banana Splits Adventure hour. That is mind blowing.
<v Speaker 1>There you go. I'd like to have at least one
<v Speaker 1>interesting thing to say about the song. But anyway, so
<v Speaker 1>boys and girls, ladies and gentlemen, go ahead.
<v Speaker 2>I was just gonna say one banana, two banana, three,
<v Speaker 2>banana four. Yeah, I love the Banana Splits.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, this is a little before my time. You're older
<v Speaker 1>than me.
<v Speaker 2>I mean I watched this in my underrews at my
<v Speaker 2>grandma's house.
<v Speaker 1>So there's a metal picture. I don't need incredible unders everyone. Okay, guys,
<v Speaker 1>that does it for this episode. We are taking a
<v Speaker 1>bit of a break. We got some catching up to
<v Speaker 1>do and we want to do a re release. This
<v Speaker 1>month is the month two years ago that we lost
<v Speaker 1>dear Eddie van Halen, so we are bringing you a
<v Speaker 1>return of our three original episodes on Van Halen and
<v Speaker 1>Van Hagar. That will be over the next three weeks,
<v Speaker 1>and then we'll be back with you for more exciting stuff.
<v Speaker 2>You know, we haven't done a great job of explaining
<v Speaker 2>ourselves because I've had more than I've had four or
<v Speaker 2>five or six. People say, are you guys gonna do
<v Speaker 2>like the entire run of Stranger Things. No, we're just
<v Speaker 2>going through season one. So this is episode four.
<v Speaker 1>Put a cap on this.
<v Speaker 2>We'll do five, six, seven, and eight, and then we'll
<v Speaker 2>be back into our regular rotation per season four.
<v Speaker 1>There you go. How about that season four of us?
<v Speaker 1>Four of us not a strange not Strange Things. That's right,
<v Speaker 1>because why would we skip two and three. We've been
<v Speaker 1>doing this for three years. It's crazy. It's awesome. Yeap,
<v Speaker 1>love you guys. Thank you so much for the support.
<v Speaker 1>We will see you next week, Tay. Guys,