Posting Anonymously to Protect Our Reputation

Scott Cooper: Welcome back to the next episode of Horse Show Bestie. I'm your co-host Scott Cooper.

Crysta Brown: And I'm your other co-host Krista Brown. Hey, Scott.

Scott Cooper: Hi Krista. It's been a hot second.

Crysta Brown: What's going on in the horsey world these days? I just feel like I've been in my own world. I don't know. I don't know what's happening

Scott Cooper: ⁓ my god. You and me both. ⁓ I'm exiled from the community. ⁓ Not for any reason other than my injury and just lack of getting to the barn. But ⁓ good news. I got good news today's guys. I saw my orthodontist, my orthopedist this morning. Although I could get some braces, need some dull braces.

Crysta Brown: Wait, pause quickly. have to tell you when you texted me my ortho appointment immediately, I was like, ⁓ that's interesting. He went to the orthodontist. Did not, did not register at all.

Scott Cooper: ⁓ yeah. See, guys, look at this is how much Krista cares about me. She's like, she forgot. She's like, you're fine. You're fine. You've been faking it this whole time.

Crysta Brown: I I know. It is easy to forget when you're so obsessed with your own self.

Scott Cooper: I totally get it. So many people have asked me recently like how are you and I'm like, I'm blah blah blah and I like totally forget that to ask how they are

Crysta Brown: ⁓ well, there's that.

Scott Cooper: That's a personality flaw. So if I do that to you, just know that I'm just expecting you to tell me and sometimes I just forget to ask.

Crysta Brown: Yeah, I think some of it though is like, I have a lot of friends that like, you don't have to prompt them, they just say, like if there's something interesting going on, they'll say it. So then like sometimes when I'm around new groups or communities, I'm like, ⁓ right, like I should ask questions. One time.

Scott Cooper: Anyway, I'm leaving you guys on a cliffhanger right now. My not-orthodontist, my orthopedist. Is that the right word?

Crysta Brown: Yeah, wait, yeah, orthopedics, so orthopedist, sure. There you go.

Scott Cooper: orthopedic, my bone doctor, the surgeon man will go with that. I got cleared to ride. Yes. I mean, with the caveat that like my horse is an angel and I'm not doing hunter jumper or three day venting. Still try to avoid high risk activity. But she's like, you can ride, you're clear. The bone is you can still see the fracture line but like the bone is like obviously

Crysta Brown: No way. Okay. Wow.

Scott Cooper: like almost healed all the way, which is exciting. But I got confirmation of like my worst nightmare. Arms a little deformed, just like a little. Yeah, I've been like the last two months, I've been like everyone I ask when I take my splint off, I was like, does this look weird to you? Does this look weird? Cause looks weird to me. And everyone's like, no, it's fine. And like, no one's had the balls to say like, mm, yeah, it's like just a touch off. Sure enough, my...

Crysta Brown: Hey guys, a quick word from our sponsors. ⁓ no

Scott Cooper: For years, Naomi Clayton of NAC Equine Services has helped paint and quarter owners, breeders, and trainers streamline the often overwhelming process of marketing and placing horses in the great new homes. She has a proven background as a paint and pinto breeder and amateur show exhibitor, as well as nearly a decade of experience as an equine sales agent. NAC Equine Services doesn't just post ads. For each listing, she also creates a detailed marketing plan, organizes photos, my ortho today was like, yeah, it's just like a little touch off and might fix like as muscles come in. They like they, I don't know if you can kind of even see it from that angle. But like, I feel like they put my hand back on wrong.

Crysta Brown: Wait, off how? We.

Scott Cooper: creates sale videos and manages communication so you don't get bogged down in the details. Her commitment to professionalism and finding the right home shows in the countless clients who rave about their friendly, efficient and smooth experience from first contact to the final sale or purchase. Whether you're looking to sell or find your next partner, trust a service with real industry knowledge and reviews that speak for themselves. NAC Equine Services has competitive and transparent pricing, $50 listing fee, Like they put it too much too far to the left. I know that's what I'm saying. It like looks weird for all you people that can't see the video. You're welcome. You don't want to see this. It actually like that's a very that's the worst thing to look at it by the way, Chrysta But ⁓ partly because like there's the bump from the plates like you can see the raised part from the plate. But also like they like put the hand on like this way a little bit.

Crysta Brown: It looks like a puppet hand. ooooh yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah

Scott Cooper: signed contract and 5 % commission. Find her on Facebook under the NAC Equine or check out her website at nac-equine-services.com. So like, don't think most people will notice it, but like I notice it.

Crysta Brown: Did you ever do this skit when you were at like summer camp where you like put your arms through some other like somebody's shirt and like it's just their head? You know what I'm talking about? Now back to the episode.

Scott Cooper: I wasn't

Crysta Brown: Come on, could've gone to church camps for poor kids too. Okay, well either way, it's like the person's hands can't see and then the person who can see doesn't have hands, that's like the fun of this kit, but your hand kinda looks like that.

Scott Cooper: VBS, baby. Thanks. You guys, if you can't see the video, but it's not that bad. Like I don't want anyone to listening to this being like, ⁓ my God, Scott's got a weird arm now. It's just not perfectly normal, but it'll be fine. Stop. I just, need to add some muscle. think, I think like once I eat muscle, come back in my forearm. It'll help a lot, but, but yeah.

Crysta Brown: It's not that bad. I think it adds character. Yeah, you won't be able to tell. Honestly, if you hadn't pointed it out, I probably wouldn't notice. But then once I really started looking, I was like, wait.

Scott Cooper: Okay, to self, never show you again. ⁓ Yeah, but I'm super excited to get back in the saddle, like actually.

Crysta Brown: Come on, come on, I like it. I was gonna say, so I have two questions. One, how are you feeling? Like, do you feel like yourself?

Scott Cooper: That is such a loaded question. ⁓ Mentally, physically, emotionally, is this what you're asking? Physically? Which road do we want to go down?

Crysta Brown: Okay. ⁓ yeah, I was just thinking okay first let's start with like physical like are do you feel?

Scott Cooper: Because I was at the bottom of a spiral all day yesterday, just halfway. But go on.

Crysta Brown: Aww. Okay, well I was just curious, like, because I know when I've had injuries, at least like my experience was, there was a time where I started to feel strong enough, like I felt okay, but I was very ⁓ aware that I was injured and like I didn't feel comfy. So I'm just curious, like what you're feeling physically.

Scott Cooper: Mm. Yes. ⁓ I kind of in those lines like a good, good like litmus test of that is I went to the real gym for the first time this week. ⁓ Because I just needed a break from the Peloton in the garage. But I said I go to the real gym, not my like, hit workout class type gym. It was just like go run on a treadmill because it's safer. So do it and do a little yog on the treadmill and then do some light strength work.

Crysta Brown: right.

Scott Cooper: And when I got to the strength work, it was obvious like, ⁓ this is still like, it's not ready yet. Like, there's there's some motions that are better than others. But definitely like, yeah, keep it in check. ⁓ Like I was trying to do this like cable fly thing. And I noticed like the torque it put on my right arm when I like put my arm straight out behind me. I was like, ⁓ no, no, no, no, we're not doing that yet. So

Crysta Brown: Mmm. Yeah, right.

Scott Cooper: It's like I feel good and I like feel ready to go physically and like I've been doing Peloton rides and crushing those and like again, but ⁓ also like ⁓ know there's definitely like a limit. Like I'm ⁓ not gonna get to play in the faculty staff versus senior basketball game at the end of the school year, which makes me sad, I know.

Crysta Brown: terrible

Scott Cooper: I know mostly because like I can't shoot a basketball because my hand doesn't turn that way. Like I'm still working on mobility. So yeah, yeah. And also like I shouldn't fall on it. So that's like the biggest scare. overall, like physically, yeah, I feel good. My back has been giving me no problems, which I was really worried that was going to be a huge issue. But it turns out, you know, growing your arm back is a little bit bigger. But yeah, I feel good.

Crysta Brown: Yeah, it'll come though. Yeah, give it time. It's amazing.

Scott Cooper: Mentally, I'm all over the place all the time, but that's just, that's on ADHD and a little bit of depression, anxiety. Yeah.

Crysta Brown: Right, right. Okay, so then my next question is how do you feel about riding? Like obviously you seem excited, but like is there a video that's like, ooh, like a little nervous or you just like get me back in the saddle?

Scott Cooper: and I think if I had a more of a loose cannon of a horse, I would be a little bit more nervous, but I'm not like I'm not nervous about flying or thing. The only thing I like kind of start to hesitate when I think about is like putting the saddle on. I'm like, okay, all the motions of like putting the saddle on and cinching and like currying and all that. Like, how's that going to work with my arm? ⁓ So that's the that's the only thing I'd like.

Crysta Brown: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Mm. That's interesting.

Scott Cooper: worry about it. Once I'm in the saddle, I'm not worried about it at all. As opposed to like skiing again where I'm like, ooh, I don't know if I can, I'm sad about that.

Crysta Brown: Yeah But it's crazy though cuz like I fully would have expected your Limitation coming into writing would have been like the back pressure like you know so it's interesting that you're feeling like no that feels really good, but like the twist

Scott Cooper: Yeah, same. I mean, there's a world in which I sit in the saddle and I'm like, ⁓ shit, that hurts. Nope. ⁓ Which I don't think will happen. Like if I've been on a bike saddle for two months now, like probably fine. So.

Crysta Brown: Yeah, yeah. Well, hopefully not. Yeah. Yeah, that's a good, that's a good thought. I mean, you won't know until you know, but at least you get to try now. That's exciting. Yeah.

Scott Cooper: Exactly, And without sneaking around it too. So, I mean y'all, I'm just gonna say it. If the ortho didn't give me clearance today, I would have probably been in the saddle in the next week or two anyway. Just like, F you, I'm doing this. Yeah, no, I'm done. So, I'm glad that I got the official. Okay. And I'm just gonna put this in the universe. Toying with going to zone two. Just, I'm toying with it. I would need to book my hotels like right now, but.

Crysta Brown: Yeah. You couldn't wait. Yeah.

Scott Cooper: Maybe, we'll see.

Crysta Brown: It's one of those things that for most teams would seem ridiculous, but it's like, it's you and Chip. You'll probably be fine. And he's in shape. It's not like he's been sitting. It's literally just a few feel good enough, so.

Scott Cooper: I know. He's in shame. Like if I wrote twice before, if I wrote once before then like honestly I could probably ride zero before then and like he would probably ⁓

Crysta Brown: You'll be fine. You know him. Yeah, like he will pack you and feel like Chip no matter what you do. So it's just if you feel good enough to do it.

Scott Cooper: Right. Right. Yeah. Yeah. That's not being consistent, y'all. That horse is worth a zillion dollars just for that alone. What a privilege.

Crysta Brown: I was going to say, what a privilege. Do know how many people I coach that need a chip? Like they think that they need the five-year-old like specialty bread horse. And I'm like, you need a chip. You need a hootie. Like you just need a sweet packer who's going to try their best and give you a chance to do all of the classes. And that's perfect.

Scott Cooper: Right? Everyone needs a chip. Yeah. Yeah. And while keeping you humble while doing it, just like just enough, not unsafe. No, but like the whole debacle last year in Vegas with the gate at trail, I could have. ⁓ my God, I could have took him out behind the barn and just like not safe. But that one.

Crysta Brown: He does have his moments, but not unsafe. Yeah. For what reason? It's hard because he does so much for you and is like such a perfect citizen and then he just picks his moment and he's like, that was enough. Right there, that was enough.

Scott Cooper: Right. Yeah, like this is a moment where we're just gonna ruin it all with style.

Crysta Brown: as if he's never done a gate before.

Scott Cooper: As if he's ever done a gate. ⁓ my god. ⁓ my god one day you guys just to like keep you humble in case you're you know, think I'm getting braggy one day at home. We had an epic meltdown at the gate Spencer and whoever else got to witness it can attest to it. I I've never seen a meltdown like that. He just like flipped out and did not want to go. So then we started fighting and then it wasn't pretty and then like I don't fight well. So it was just like, it was so ugly. I think I ended up just quitting like, this is a Karen problem for the week and I'm like, fix this before exactly that's 100 % why I pay you for fix this and I'll be back next week.

Crysta Brown: Hmm. You're like, guess what? I pay for training. That's a fantastic attitude because man, there are sometimes though where like I'll see a client get into a fight and I'm like, I don't think that's a you fight. I think that's a me fight. You don't have to go there. let me get some different tools out.

Scott Cooper: That's like There are like some things that are worth every single penny having a trainer that can fix a horse like I remember another time a few years ago I was fighting with him while Karen was at a show of our really changes and I eventually stopped because I was like This is a Karen problem when she gets back. I like or maybe just today. I don't know whatever this is It's it's not my problem for the rest of the thing

Crysta Brown: Yeah. But there are times I actually, that's kind of an interesting thought. I'm really, as I've gotten older, I'm not in the like, have to win the battle before you put them away, actually. Like, I used to feel really strongly about that, but the, I don't know, the more I've experienced more horses I've been around, I think there's some horses where it's like, no, I think this is just an unusual day for you, and I'm gonna get to the best point that we can. today and then I'm gonna leave it. You know, like, not that I'm gonna let one completely take advantage or like learn a new bad habit, but I just don't feel like every fight is worth picking that day. And I think it's good to just sometimes be like, you know what, today's not the day. We're not gonna go there. We're gonna go be successful on something else.

Scott Cooper: Great. Yeah. Right, like, I think there's a difference between having a bad day and it becoming a pattern. So like, if that would continually happen, then be like, ⁓ we have an issue. like, everyone can have a bad day, every horse can have a bad day, every human can have a bad day, like, don't think it's the end of the world. And I didn't, like, it wasn't the end of world. It was just a crappy day. One of us was in a bad mood. Maybe we were both in a bad mood, like, whatever. ⁓ But I agree, I'm with you on the like, you don't have to like,

Crysta Brown: rate. Yeah, for sure. Right.

Scott Cooper: win World War seven every single time that you get on your horse. I think with like the day he was having a meltdown in the gate, like I got him to the point where I just like made him stand by it. And like, it wasn't a huge win. Like we didn't go and redo it and plus three it just in practice. I was like, all right, we got to stand by it. Good enough. Like, take, yeah, just take the little bit. Like it doesn't have to be the full win. Just like enough.

Crysta Brown: Yes. Yes. But that's what I mean, yeah, it's like, yes. And not that he's a green mean, like that sounds like he just had a weird moment. But like, especially when you're bringing one along, it's like, there are times where it's like, well, I got whatever it was at, let's say, I don't know, ⁓ getting more lateral push, like in the lope, right? It's like, some days you come out and they really have it and they really try and crack over. And other days it's like, if I try to ask for that much, we're both going to fail. So I'm just going to like, try to set you up for success and ask for what's. I also try not to ask questions that I don't think I can win. But again, this is like 30 year old Krista, 20 year old Krista was pushing for everything and it didn't really serve me.

Scott Cooper: Mm. you live and learn. The other thing, a few other things I think are money well spent all the time. Banders and braiders. Banders and braiders baby. Like, I don't want to do that shit. I am terrible at it. Please like, please come and do it. I will gladly pay any amount of money. Also, big fan of the Roach y'all. If you don't know, Chips ,mane is Roached all the way the hell off. The only thing that left a band if we do the regular all-around classes is his forelock And still, I don't want to do that shit. I'm terrible at

Crysta Brown: Yeah. ⁓ yeah. ⁓ yeah. Aw man. Yeah. No, I am 100 % with you. I think more horses should be roached. Big fan of the roaching. Like, and yeah, like, banding, takes, like, the professional banders, it's gonna take them 20, maybe 30 minutes to do their entire mane and do it beautiful, perfect, exactly. You know how long it's gonna take me? Mm-mm, not worth it. Not worth it.

Scott Cooper: It'll take me two hours. No, you know, and can I just put in another plug for roaching? You guys when you're in Fort Worth in July at World Show and your horse is banded and now you got to put a slinky on and it's 100 degrees with 150 % humidity. It's miserable, miserable. Like, if you roach, you don't have to do any of that. They don't have to wear a slinky. They don't have to do anything. They're not itching their necks. It's awesome. I 100 % they get to be naked, which is super great.

Crysta Brown: Mm-hmm. They get to be nakey. Yeah, I like it. Mm-hmm.

Scott Cooper: And then you don't have worry about bands. Especially at a long show like that. The one year I least chanced and had to deal with bands for 10 days, I was like, ⁓ this is enough good reminder of never, ever let my horse's mane grow out ever. Like, no.

Crysta Brown: And people are so scared to do it, but honestly, I feel like half the time it makes their neck look so clean. And it just looks like the bands are on the other side. Nobody can tell. It's fine. Yeah.

Scott Cooper: Yeah, exactly. So many people have no idea that chips roach like I have to point it out and they're like, ⁓ I never realized that. it's like, that's been the whole time. It looks clean. It looks neat. The horses are happy. You're happy and go do whatever discipline you want. shave that shit, please. ⁓ Speaking of shows and money. ⁓ Chris, what are your thoughts on day fees for trainers and horse shows?

Crysta Brown: Exactly. The best. What do you mean by that?

Scott Cooper: I'm referencing maybe some things that I saw on a certain social media page and people complaining about maybe not complaining. I don't want to point that out. wasn't complaining. like, okay, here's the question. Should I pay day fees to my trainer? My horse is at a show. Should I pay day fees to the trainer on the days I'm not showing?

Crysta Brown: So like what ex- okay. Okay, I can totally see where someone is coming from, where they're feeling like, well, if I'm not really utilizing the services on that day, why should my fee be the same? And I will say, some trainers do structure it to where it's like, you maybe you pay 40 bucks on your non-showing days and you pay 100 on your showing days. that, you know, there's all of that. But for example, let's consider a trainer who flies a Krista Brown out to the horse show. whether that client is showing that day or not, they have to contract me for that entire time. You know, it's not like, and as, and your horse trainer as well, even for your trainer's time, it's not like if you show Monday, Tuesday and not Wednesday, they get to fly home and like make money on their training horses on Wednesday. No, they still have to be there the whole time. So, ⁓ I know different trainers structure it different ways, but. Personally, I think you're paying for my time like you're paying for me to be away from my other money-making opportunities so if that means that you don't show one of the days out of the time that we're at the horse show then So be it but your horse is still there your horse probably still got lunged your horse still probably got groomed by all the crap that I brought like I don't know. I think it's justifiable either way somebody wants to do it, but I Don't think anybody's gonna like my opinion on this. Sorry amies I don't think horse trainers charge enough in general. I really don't. And I think that's evidenced by the fact that most of them are barely making it. And that doesn't mean that I don't think this is really expensive. I think it is. But most of them are not charging what it actually costs. Like they're charging what they think people will pay so they can keep people. But if we were to really run this like businesses and not run this like horse trainers, this is a concierge service. It should.

Scott Cooper: Mm.

Crysta Brown: be expensive. don't think the average person should be able to afford it. And I think we should be charging enough that we get to pay our help living wages and we get to, you know, do things ethically in the right way. And I think if your trainer was making more, I think fewer trainers would make concessions on some of the ethic choices. I think a lot of them are in tight spots and have to make hard choices. So I'm a big fan of trainers making money. Sorry.

Scott Cooper: I don't disagree. ⁓ As soon as you said the word concierge, I was like, a light bulb clicked. And it was like, yeah, holy shit, like, the things we ask of our trainers and assistant trainers, like, there's amateurs that like literally show up ringside on the day of their class and jump on and go in and jump off and don't touch the horse again, like, talk about concierge. Like, they're not grooming their horse, whatever. And you know what, maybe those people are paying premiums for that.

Crysta Brown: Mm. Yeah, right.

Scott Cooper: But even like for the fact that I can show up at a show and my horse is there. He's already fed. I didn't haul him. I didn't have to unload. I didn't do anything like yeah, probably should pay a little bit more for that to have that experience. So I don't disagree and I also know like, you know, it's we're bleeding money all the time, but I saw that.

Crysta Brown: Right. And that's not me saying I want fewer people to be able to afford this. I actually think we just need to be more creative about small to medium offerings. But full-time training, that should be the top tier of services. And I think it should reflect that. think otherwise, people do get in tight spots. ⁓ Yeah, I don't think your trainer should be broke to try to help you live your dreams. That's what I think.

Scott Cooper: Oh, 100%. I totally agree with that. It's like back to the Davey saying, I could see I see that I see and hear the argument that like, you know, if they if my horse was at home right now, like I wouldn't be paying more. So if it's at the show, and it's not doing anything, why am I paying for that? I don't have a good argument against that. Other than just like, it's a different environment. It's more stressful. Like, I don't I don't know. Do you have

Crysta Brown: Yeah. Yeah, but okay, for the most part, okay, so like, let's, I'm trying to imagine the situation, like we're at the horse show, the horse isn't showing that day, right? That's what we're saying, okay?

Scott Cooper: Take me for example, my horse goes to world show, I'm not coming till the fifth day that Karen's there.

Crysta Brown: Okay. Right, but we're still going to get your horse out and ride it. Okay, like that is a great example. Okay, okay, I guess I see what you're saying, but I have to be at the horse show. That's the point. The point is that, so like, yes, like how am I at the show? That's what you're paying for. yeah, like I get.

Scott Cooper: But you would at home. But it would be at home and that's not extra. in which pay your hotels and lodging and food and all that. There you go, light bulb moment.

Crysta Brown: I totally can understand. This is so many of the amateur trainer debates. I really understand where the person is coming from with the question. Like that's a good question. There's nothing wrong with sitting there going, well, why does this cost more? But I think you need to hear the perspective of the person who's like there. It's like, yeah, well, you know, I had to get myself there. I have to stay in a hotel. I'm, you know, eating meals out so that I can be here for your horse. I'm still coming in at 6 a.m. like whatever. I'm there for longer hours because it's a horse show. All of those are the reasons that I think, yeah, it is what it is.

Scott Cooper: Yeah, and again, I think it's worth it. There has been so many, I don't even know if I'm, we're legally, and I put legally in air quotes, because I'm just making this up, legally, ⁓ like allowed to talk about the amateur group posts. ⁓ But there's, y'all, ⁓ Wednesdays are wild, wild, because it can, the anonymous thing, can post an honest thing on Wednesday.

Crysta Brown: What amateur group? No, I'm just kidding. the anonymous thing. Yeah.

Scott Cooper: It is a wild west. Like, should be crazy in there. Like, calling out people and there's nothing.

Crysta Brown: Okay. Do you feel like the anonymity can be positive though, because it like allows people to ask questions they would be nervous to put their name on, or do you see it mostly kind of enabling naughtiness?

Scott Cooper: It does a little bit of both. ⁓ And I have a love-hate with it because sometimes it's like, and like, Admin said, talked about this, where like, you don't need to ask anonymously, like, what brand of English saddle you should ride in. Like, no one needs to be anonymous in that situation, but...

Crysta Brown: Okay. Okay, but how sad that people do want that to be anonymous. Like they're so scared of people's reactions. They're like, I need to hide.

Scott Cooper: Well, I could see why because people draw a lot of dots that they may not know the little line in between stories.

Crysta Brown: Yes.

Scott Cooper: I get the anonymity thing in some cases like that because people connect the dots for instance ⁓ Let's I were to go on the page ⁓ as and be like, ⁓ hey ⁓ I'm curious what the best truck and trailer option is. I'm looking to buy my own rig Period people see Scott Kubrick post that the rumors that are gonna start why Scott buying a truck? is he trailer? Why ⁓ doesn't haul his horse? What is he doing? What's happening? So like

Crysta Brown: right. Right. Even with the English saddle thing, I could totally see if you've got a little bit of a toxic bar and somebody's like, well, why wouldn't you ask the trainer that? You know what I mean? Like, I can totally see where some of the negative things that do happen could make somebody want to, like, just protect themselves a little bit.

Scott Cooper: I can totally... Yeah. Right. Right. It's for me when it feels icky is when it's anonymous and it's like kind of talking or referencing about like interpersonal stuff that I'm like, this feels icky that you're hiding behind that. Like, you know, people getting up in arms about like trainers, wives being amateurs and stuff like that. And I'm just like, can we not like, can we not? And can I get on a soapbox for a second?

Crysta Brown: Hmm. Okay. Ooh. What even is amateur? Yeah, go ahead.

Scott Cooper: excuse my language, but fuck that shit. Who cares? Who cares if a trainer's wife is showing the amateurs with us? Hell, I wouldn't care if most of the trainers were showing an amateur with us. I'm sure I'm a better rider than most people. I am so sick of this. I am so sick of this in our industry about this whole like, you know, blurring the lines and the fact that I'm sorry, our rules are so archaic. The fact if you accept money, you're automatically a pro. I could

Crysta Brown: Yes. It makes no sense. That doesn't... Right.

Scott Cooper: I could hire a donkey to ride chip and it doesn't mean he's gonna do it a good job. But also that donkey is now a pro because I gave it money. I'm so sick of this argument. It should be like a merit based thing, a point based thing, something that should make you a pro besides accepting $1 to give little Susie a riding lesson for her four eight show like full stop. This is so archaic and so dumb.

Crysta Brown: Yes. Yes, I agree. Yep. I feel like you're, you are finally getting on my level, Scott. I am with you. Get rid, what does amateur even mean? Like what does amateur even mean? Like just that you don't do this professionally, does that really protect? Right, but then there's all of these amateurs that are literally like professional amateurs and like they spend all of their time getting better at horses. So like it's super hard to define, it's super hard to protect and there's always gonna be somebody who really wants to limit.

Scott Cooper: that you don't accept money. and police.

Crysta Brown: and jumps down, but that doesn't necessarily mean that they're not even appropriate to jump down. I think we all need to get rid of it. I think it all should go and I think it should be a leveled system, completely leveled, no amateur, just 18 and over leveled.

Scott Cooper: Get rid of it, start over. Amen. Yeah, I 100 % agree. I'm so sick of this. You should just ride who you like based on your Based on your ability. Like you should be riding in the same group as your ability. And there are some current professionals that will probably range from like ⁓ novice ⁓ all the way to L4 or ⁓ wait, what's the top in or L3? No, and maybe they're great coaches, but like

Crysta Brown: Yes. Yes. Yes. And that doesn't mean that they shouldn't be professionals, by the way, because there are some professionals, and maybe they're amazing cult starters. Like, you could have a million different skills and still be novice in the Western writing. For me, I feel like I've literally never shown a Western writing song. Never. Why shouldn't I get to show on the novice? You would. You would. Yeah, like, and...

Scott Cooper: Great. Great. Right. I will beat your ass, Krista. I will beat your ass probably and you're a pro.

Crysta Brown: But because I've taken money, I have to go play in the Western running against Karen and Shannon. Come on. I'm just saying we have this lack of professionals, and then we kind of put them in a hole. Yes. Yes. And it's like, well, I need to learn too. So because I took money when I was 18 trying to do some lessons so I could afford this, now I forever have to be professional level at everything.

Scott Cooper: So it's so stupid. Right. It makes no sense. vilify them. Right. Right. Right. And I can't like, I can't like coach up a friend's kid that wants to learn how to ride. Like, now I'm like, you know, a friend's kid comes to me and is like, ⁓ my gosh, I would love to learn how to ride horses. And I'm like, too bad I'm not a pro. I can't help you go away. Like, how is that inclusive? It's just like, I know, I'm trying not to be negative about the industry now. But like, this is one thing that is like, increasingly getting under my skin. And the more people talk about it and like,

Crysta Brown: I don't know, I mean... It makes no sense. can't. Yep. Who's it helping?

Scott Cooper: bitch about it. I'm like, I'm ready to blow my top because I hope all the amies are listening right now because this is it's so ridiculous. Stop complaining about trainers wives does not make them better riders. It does not make them any better than an amateur who married for money and can buy whatever horse they want and doesn't have to work and go spend eight hours in the barn every day. It's the same thing. You wouldn't complain about them. But you're complaining about the wives and like or husbands, whatever it is for inclusive here. Like

Crysta Brown: It's silly. You

Scott Cooper: It it doesn't matter. It just stopped, like full stop. I don't want to see another person complaining about it. I'm so over it.

Crysta Brown: Yeah, but like also, could you imagine if like I pull Chris out and I have him start showing? He absolutely does not belong in the professional category. That would be horrible. Right. Like God bless them. Like they listen to us all the time. And like, certainly I would coach him to the best of my ability to help him succeed. But I actually would do that with anyone. And like, if a client is like, Hey, like I.

Scott Cooper: Exactly, Craig, right. Right. Great.

Crysta Brown: want you to make sure you're on my horse as much as possible. I want to buy the best horse. Like I want every opportunity to help myself succeed. Are they not at the exact same advantage as the trainer's spouse? So I'm not sure. Yeah.

Scott Cooper: Right. And someone pointed out in this some hypothetical non-existent person in this non-existent group that I'm not referencing pointed out like what about working students in the English world and like they're not pros. So like how is that different? like pointing out that the English like especially the hundred jumper world just has a totally different set of rules like and I'm like, you know, that's like great point. So.

Crysta Brown: Right, right. Well, and that's the thing is like in other disciplines, there's not this professional amateur line. It's divided differently, you know, ⁓ like in the jumping, think for the most part, yeah, for the most part, I think it's divided by height of the fences. And that's really it. Sometimes there's separate youth classes. But from my understanding, which is limited, I think that's how it is. And I think it's the same for the dressage, like.

Scott Cooper: Exactly. Roping, barrel racing, yeah. Mm-hmm.

Crysta Brown: If I went to show dressage right now, I would come in at like one of the lowest levels because like there's no pro division. And I think as we we look at some of the problems, like I don't think you're just being negative about the industry because we're also trying to offer solutions. And I think there's a difference between sitting here and saying like, this sucks. I hate it. But like not trying to be a part of the solution. And like I would very much like to be a part of the solution. I think we have a problem. with there's not enough people teaching lessons, there's not enough horse trainers, period. And I think if you open it up, you might see some of those amateurs that get along really good with the horse. go, well, I could probably do my friend's horse too. And you might see more horse trainers develop. You might see more people have opportunities if, or even, you know, the people that DIY. If everybody wasn't terrified of having their amateur card turned in, they might be like, hey Scott, could I pay you 50 bucks when I'm gone this one day to get my horse out? And you might be like, yeah, that'd be great. And the whole world goes around. I don't know. I just don't see why getting paid to coach or ride is the problem. I don't know.

Scott Cooper: Yeah, just accepting money does not make you a better horseman. Like that's my final argument is just because you got a check does not increase your skill at all. It's so frustrating, but that group's wild.

Crysta Brown: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. I was gonna say, think it's good that there's a place for, like Facebook groups are a great place for people to discuss the things they see going on, like bring out their concerns. I think it's good that there is some community, but I do think it can get negative really quickly.

Scott Cooper: Mm. Yeah.

Crysta Brown: I've seen some posts just in general Facebook land recently that were very haterrific. I just, again, I think there's a difference between just being mean, nasty, and negative about our industry and going, hey, I see this problem and I'd really like to see us fix it in this way.

Scott Cooper: I think this is a great time to remind everyone, be on your best behavior, even on social media. I'm popping off on our platform right now, but in general, just be nice about it. You don't have to tear others down. You don't have to tear anything down. And actually, you don't have to have an opinion on anything. And even if you have an opinion, you don't have to share it. Just FYI. So it's like a good reminder of like,

Crysta Brown: Yeah. Yeah, for sure.

Scott Cooper: to have a little bit of etiquette when it comes to social media.

Crysta Brown: I think it's remembering that it's still real humans behind the screen as well. I think that gets lost a lot. You know, I mean, the comments that I see on my stuff all the time, I'm like, you realize like I'm a person, like I'm just a human who thought, I know how to do this thing, let me share like what I think is the way to do this thing. And it's like, that's not how I would do it. Congratulations.

Scott Cooper: Right. Right. Yeah. Right. Yeah, I can relate to that. What's interesting to me about the amateur group, I've really mixed feelings on this, I think when it was created, it was tailored to people who show, and literally in the title it says, breed show amateurs, breed show. I'm thinking you show on the paint circuit, you show on the quarter circuit. There's equalizer in there that like,

Crysta Brown: That's what I would have thought.

Scott Cooper: we're at this level and it has blown up and grown and which is good and bad but I think what's interesting now is that the clientele of the group it's not just those like paying quarter app people who have shown breed shows who have points it's those people that show on a local show level or haven't shown at all.

Crysta Brown: Mm. Okay.

Scott Cooper: And this is where I struggle of like, we want to be inclusive and we want to be good ambassadors and welcome people and bring people into the fold. And sometimes I feel like there's kind of two parts of the group are talking separate languages and it's just, doesn't always quite compute. It's a little bit, what's an analogy that's not gonna...

Crysta Brown: No, I understand exactly what you're saying.

Scott Cooper: I have an analogy, but I know it's going to offend people, so I'm not going to say it. like, they're just very different places. knowing that those of us that show world show level stuff, like we want to welcome, at least you should, you do want to welcome people into the fold, right? So like you want to take those people I've never shown or never showed at a breed show level and bring them in. But it's. ⁓ see tension, though, sometimes between. questions the newbies are asking and like what's going on kind of at the bigger show levels.

Crysta Brown: So I actually think that's a bigger industry problem. ⁓ And I don't know if we can fix it because, okay, it's kind of like when you first start riding horses, all you're obsessed with doing is like, what's cool, what's flashy, what makes for a cool pick on Facebook. Like I wanna jump, I wanna barrel race, like I wanna do fast big lead changes, like right. And then... That's kind of, think, your beginner horseman. Like they just, I want to ride a two-year-old. Like, you know, they want to do anything that they think is hard or cool. Then I think you start getting into this intermediate kind of advanced category. And all of a sudden, all you want to do is go back to the basics. Like you really want to nail like the easy stuff, the simple stuff. Like, okay, I walked, but like, what does it mean to walk with excellence? Like, how do I have collection as I walk off here? Like, I think when you begin to become advanced at something or you start to step into mastery of something, I think you end up understanding things at a different level. But you're right, like speaking a new language. Like it's like when you're kind of at this beginner phase, you're you're writing your letters, you know, you're just learning how to write your letters. And then, you know, you get to that intermediate and it's like, OK, I can start to put sentences together. But when you start to really understand the mastery of this sport, like it is paragraphs. And I think I see this in writers all the time where I think it's really hard to accurately assess yourself. And I think it gets a lot of people in bad situations. And I think it's easy to feel like, I've been at this a really long time, so I'm going to start my own cult. I'm going to do this. I'm going to do that. And I it's not that people shouldn't try some of these things, but I think it's if you don't come into it. with the humility of, I understand there are other people with more mastery of this. I think that's where it's a problem. Does that make sense? Am I speaking English?

Scott Cooper: Yes, because I was going to point that out. I'm glad you brought up the humility thing is like. Okay, this is totally gonna sound judgy, but there are times in that group where it is someone asking a question that is not at a world-should level. They're beginning their journey, but the lack of humility in either an answer or a question is actually so gross. I'm like, can we remember that maybe what you do at your...

Crysta Brown: They're just beginning their journey. They're beginning their journey. Yeah.

Scott Cooper: level of shows is different from what we do here. like, I don't know, there's just, I think one of the things that gets under my skin is people who talk with more authority than what they have. ⁓ And I mean, you guys, I'm a perfect example of this, ⁓ of what you should do is like, I'm a little self-deprecating. Like I... don't have a world show buckle, but I show at that level. And yet I still think I'm a frickin idiot half the time and I do idiot stuff. Like I think just a little humility in the horse community could go a long way and kind of avoid a lot of those like really spicy comment sections of just like

Crysta Brown: But also, look how far you've come as a writer. Look at how much you've learned, how much knowledge you've accumulated. Just to acknowledge your skill level for a moment, you are at a high skill level. But we can also both sit here and acknowledge there are trainers that have 50 times that knowledge and skill level.

Scott Cooper: And there's amateurs that have 50 times my knowledge and skill.

Crysta Brown: I have worked so hard to be good at this and like, I'm constantly meeting people that are just a wealth of knowledge and I get to add new tools to my tool belt. And again, I do think the more you explore, I guess anything, like I wanted to say sport, but like really anything in life that you start to get better at, you just start to understand how much you don't know. And I think maybe what we're trying to, like, yeah, we're not, I don't wanna like,

Scott Cooper: Right. And accept that and it's okay. It's okay not to know.

Crysta Brown: act like we're knocking on anybody because we're absolutely not. But I do think there's maybe like a self check of like, you know, am I coming at this sport with humility? Because once you think you know everything, like that is when the sport will humble you. It is really tempting.

Scott Cooper: Well, it's like the I think the like perfect example of this is like I think of the TikTok trainers we all talk about where it's like someone in the the back woods of Oklahoma that all of a decided one day I'm going to ⁓ Mallory Ray performance horses and slap performance horses on anything and all of a sudden is critiquing everyone while like it's just like be so real right now. Like just check yourself, humble of yourself. Don't have opinions like

Crysta Brown: ⁓ yeah.

Scott Cooper: I don't know. It's that's kind of the perfect example of that. I feel like.

Crysta Brown: But the loudest voices usually don't actually like post anything of themselves writing. do have to say it's a consistent thing. Another little, little spicy, this is going to be like hot take episode, but another little spicy meatball I'm going to throw in there is, ⁓ I have found consistently, not always, not always. There are people that do bad things, but consistently a lot of the trainers on the top of this sport.

Scott Cooper: Hmm.

Crysta Brown: ⁓ that are often accused of drugging or unethical means to get a horse shown. I meet them, I'm around them, and know they're literally just that good. And I really think a lot of those rumors often come from other people being in disbelief that you could achieve that without those means. You know what I mean? And again, I'm not saying that there isn't a side to this industry that can get

Scott Cooper: Agreed.

Crysta Brown: ugly and I want that to go away as much as anyone but I do think just because you can't get it done with a horse doesn't mean that somebody else isn't capable of getting it done.

Scott Cooper: Mm-hmm. Yeah, I agree. And in that vein, like, I think as a human population, we need to make sure like, you see it with your own eyes before you validate and start spreading it. Like, if you're seeing abuse, you better see it and you better report it. But just like thinking that maybe someone does it and then starting to remember about it is no bueno. Do not do that. That being said, like,

Crysta Brown: Report it.

Scott Cooper: Yeah, I agree. There are some really amazing trainers out there that are 100 % doing it the right way. And there are trainers who are winning big time that like, I've witnessed with my own eyes doing really, really shitty things. And yes, I have reported them. Because that that should have no place in our industry. So but I, I agree, like some of those rumors often start out of jealousy or just frustration.

Crysta Brown: Yep. Yep. I think it's like disbelief because like, you know, being around different disciplines, like there are people that literally think like I drug my horses to like, okay, I'm thinking of like when, this is like a horrible memory, but it's not a sad story. Okay. But like when Moon was dying, like Ricky was around, right? And I remember the vet assistant was like, did you sedate him? And I was like, no, he's just standing there quietly because he's.

Scott Cooper: Thank you. It's a cardboard.

Crysta Brown: He's just not insane. But like she genuinely was like in disbelief that he just was like hanging around us and not like biting or jumping over the top of us. He just stood there. But again, like there is somebody like assuming that extra mean, not that I would have been unethical for doing it, but like assuming extra means were taken because she hasn't seen the opposite. And so I do think like as social media kind of connects us to more disciplines and things like.

Scott Cooper: Right. .

Crysta Brown: things like that, it's like just because you don't know how to do it doesn't mean that it's because of abuse, I guess is what I'm trying to say. Yeah.

Scott Cooper: Yeah. Yeah. How is our little Ricky Bobby.

Crysta Brown: He's crazy. He's so feral. He is he's shedding out now, but like I need to I'm going to have a really satisfying video soon where I'm going to take that shed blade out there and you're just going to see it just because he is like fully shed right now.

Scott Cooper: He's wooly. I saw your video this morning that was like, who's Mangee Burmese Mountain Dog is that out in the pasture.

Crysta Brown: No, I know. He is like so cute, but like so disgusting. He's definitely like, I don't know. I totally get why some people like post baby photos and then just like hide them behind the back of the barn until they're two. Because like, I mean.

Scott Cooper: You Yeah, one and two year olds can be real ugly.

Crysta Brown: They're just they are never balanced looking like if you look at his individual pieces if you like shut your eye and like cover Like different parts. I'm like, ⁓ that one part's kind of nice, but like altogether. They're looking a little funny But he is I do have some news ⁓ He is a gray horse Yeah, so I I know I did his color genetics and he's like homozygous for everything which is weird So he's he's ⁓

Scott Cooper: Yeah. ⁓ he's gonna be alone.

Crysta Brown: I think homozygous for red gene and black gene and W20 and gray. And he has a done gene. Yeah. So like, that's why he made no sense because he was every color. Every color. Yeah. But no, he's like, just like the loveliest, sweetest boy. Like ⁓ when I got home from my last trip, I like went out to the pasture and just like checked on him and he just like wanders over and he like, you know, he's just very...

Scott Cooper: Okay. He is every color. He's like a calico. Yeah.

Crysta Brown: sweet natured the way he wants to hang around, which I very much enjoy. But I'm also like, I've given up on any thoughts of like yearling classes, not like I like played with him a little and like it seemed fine. And then I just was like, my heart's not in it. Like, I don't really want to like put them on a trailer or like try hard for this. Like I would rather just keep this year.

Scott Cooper: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah.

Crysta Brown: about like, you know, pull him down once every few weeks, do a little bit of work on his manners, make sure he's being safe to handle, pushes off your pressure, all of that. And then outside of that, like he can just grow. I just want him to grow. So.

Scott Cooper: Yeah. Do you think showing yearlings make some dull?

Crysta Brown: Okay. I have a few opinions, but these are my opinions. And that doesn't mean that there aren't other opinions. And that doesn't mean that there aren't exceptions to every rule. Okay. Doesn't mean I'm right. I think I'm right, but it's fine. ⁓ I think it can be overdone. I really think to me, handling babies comes down to quality not.

Scott Cooper: Mm-hmm. Mm. Mm. and doesn't mean you're right. Although, you're usually right about everything.

Crysta Brown: quantity and I Think a lot of it comes down to how you handle them Not if you are or aren't like to me It is equally as dangerous to turn one out and then pull it when it's two years old and try to get on its back Like absolutely not like I would rather he's prepped for his life a little bit and feels kind of confident ⁓ But I also think it's really dangerous and hard to be around one. That's like learn to shove all over you and like doesn't respect people's space and like doesn't move off of pressure. I mean, that's a big one for me. Like I don't want a horse that runs away from me, but I also don't want a horse that like I cannot get to move. Both of those things scare me. ⁓ And so I really think it's being thoughtful about all of the moments in their life. I think to me, every horse is a history of their positive and negative experiences. So to me with a baby, like I'm trying to build as many positive experiences as possible so that when he goes on to his future life, he's like, oh, I can't remember this. Like, oh yeah, that was fun. You know, like I want him to really not be shocked by the world, feel confident in his world, but I also want him to understand the rules which he has to operate by, which are don't run me over, don't bite me. If I step towards you, please move out of my way. You know. I'm big on my hula hoop of space. ⁓ But yeah, I think less is more, but that's just me. ⁓ And that's not to say there aren't horses that did all the yearling stuff and were super handled, can't go on to be good show horses. I just think as a general rule of thumb, I prefer a horse that's handled, experienced some life, knows how to be safely maneuvered around, and that's enough. Just turn it out.

Scott Cooper: Yeah, I agree. I, know, and if you're showing a yearling, this is not us coming at you. And I like that our industry thinks of more ways to get more participation and involvement. ⁓ I just I think it can be overdone. And I think of like those poor babies that are hauled around all year, they're, they're literal babies. And like, people have them acting like full grown horses, which

Crysta Brown: Yeah. Yeah. we are. I know. I know.

Scott Cooper: is good and bad. Like, they're getting rules and they're getting, you know, norms if they're going to be a show horse or learn that quick. But yeah, I don't know. I just feel like I look at him like you're just a little baby. need to go like run and play and be dirty and get gross too. So

Crysta Brown: But there's two sides to the coin. Yeah. I think that's what's hard is there's two sides to the coin because on the one hand, like how awesome for that baby that he's experiencing what his life is going to be. um, I also like very intent. Right. Right. Because like I intentionally made sure like Ricky would spend, you know, a of days in the stall just because I don't want him to have any stall issues or like be weird around being stalled because he's like a feral pastor horse all the time. You know? So like, I think it's balanced. And in the same way, like,

Scott Cooper: Right. And his two-year-old year shows aren't going to be scary.

Crysta Brown: for them to get on the trailer and not be scared and experience all of that. Like that's only gonna make that easier as they get older. ⁓ But again, I really think it's the quality of it. If someone is being really thoughtful and maybe they haul them to a show and they keep it really light, they keep it easy, then I don't think it's a negative. ⁓ But I think it's all about being fair and considering the horse that you want in 20 years. not the horse that you want tomorrow.

Scott Cooper: Well, and I think of like something, if I were to imagine myself with a yearling right now, like would I want to show it? Maybe. And I think there is like some, you know, at least gives you something to shoot for. Like, I think I would want to probably do like in a hand trail, because at least it's like stimulating for my mind to. ⁓ I just think there's a limit that we should hit with them that like to keep in mind they're 18 months old. and they can do everything perfect and to just give them a little bit more grace might just that's a general blanket statement for our whole industry. Can we all give our yearlings a little bit more grace?

Crysta Brown: If what you're saying is you, yeah, I was gonna say, if what you're trying to say is you're tired of watching babies get beat up in the yearling in hand trail pen, me too, to be honest. I don't enjoy that.

Scott Cooper: Yeah. Yeah. And I just period, even on a little unjined like guys, they're they're 18, 19, 20 months old. Like they're just babies. And I know they need manners and rules, but they're just babies. Like let them let them be babies a little bit.

Crysta Brown: Yeah, yeah, I just think it's I think we all have to question ourselves and then all the time like with written work as well. I have to question myself on like, am I asking a fair question? You know, like if I'm getting into it and I'm feeling some big resistance, I go like, well, did I ask something fair? And sometimes the answer is yes. And sometimes I go no. And then I go, OK, let's go back and ask a different question. ⁓ But I think I think my problem with the yearling classes isn't the yearling classes. My problem. is that there's always going to be someone that goes and takes it just too far. You know? Yes. And there are people that are doing it beautifully. Yeah.

Scott Cooper: Yeah, yeah, and how you get there. And I'm not saying don't, right, and I'm not saying don't give your baby rules and like draw a line in the sand. It's just like, let's keep in mind how much we're asking for perfection so that you can win a yearling class at a horse show. Like, just keep that in mind and have a little bit more grace.

Crysta Brown: Yeah. No. Yeah, I just think in general with young horses though, right? Like with your twos and threes as well. It's like, I personally, I think it really depends on the individual. Like I absolutely could tell you that there are some horses that just come out and want to do their job. Whether it's Lunge Line or like the Pleasure or the Hunter Under Saddle. Some of those things are just freaks of nature and they just get it and it's easy for them and they don't struggle. That's not who I'm ever concerned about. But that's just to justify that there are horses that absolutely belong in those classes and it's not hard for them and they didn't have to do much to get there. There are other situations though where you are trying to make a horse work for somebody or maybe this is the only horse you have so you have to make them work. There are lots of situations like that and I think that's when it starts to become. pushing on them and pounding on them and it starts to become too much. ⁓ You know, like I'm around, it's so interesting like being around a different culture, right? Like in Ireland, like the thought of sitting on your two year old, they're like, you know, like they're really horrified by anything like that. And I'm like, it's hard because like when you look at all of the joint spaces closing, like all of the different developmental things that happen, it's like truly they're not fully developed till seven.

Scott Cooper: Right.

Crysta Brown: I don't think a horse is fully developed until seven years old. So where do you draw the line? Like, well, I think it's different for everybody and it's different for every individual. But I don't know. I think there's lots of horses that have been started at two that go on to be aged geldings and or aged mares, whatever, aged horses and live a great life. But I think it's just not shoving them in a box that they don't belong in and letting them kind of be who they are.

Scott Cooper: Damn.

Crysta Brown: If they come out wanting to lope, sure, why can't you do some of the younger aged classes? But yeah.

Scott Cooper: Yeah. I hesitate to say this, but I'm to say it because we have a podcast on platform and like, what else are we going to do? I really don't like seeing people ride their yearlings. You know what I'm talking about? When people are starting their quote unquote, two year olds in the fall. I'm like, that is a 20 month old baby still. ⁓ You don't have to listen to me, but I'm going to tell you, I don't like it. I do not like seeing people getting on those long yearlings.

Crysta Brown: you ⁓ I don't either. Yeah. Yeah.

Scott Cooper: before New Year. just it it just rubs me the wrong way. I know they're probably prepping.

Crysta Brown: It doesn't seem necessary to me.

Scott Cooper: I mean, I'm sure the people that are pushing for the two-year-old events would tell you otherwise, but I wouldn't hate if we got rid of two-year-old riding events in our industry, Like, I... Right.

Crysta Brown: I wouldn't mind. I personally wouldn't mind, but that's also not what I do. ⁓ I think it's hard though. Okay, okay, but here's, I'm gonna add, gonna devil's advocate, I'm awake now, hello. ⁓ Okay, what becomes hard is it can feel like breeders are being punished if you don't incentivize people to buy the young horses. Okay, so part of the idea behind,

Scott Cooper: I them.

Crysta Brown: yearling classes and why a lot of people feel yearling classes are important is it incentivizes someone to buy the young horse because they have something to do with it, you know, pretty quickly. ⁓ It gives people a chance to like get that yearling out and show and maybe somebody wants to buy it at the horse show, right? Like that can be really good for the industry. And I think it's the same with two year olds. I think the concern becomes, well, how much more... If we were pricing horses based off of what it costs to get them to that point, Which isn't really what's happening, but if we were pricing horses ⁓ Based off of what it costs us to get them to that point if we're not starting them until Three years or not showing them until three years old well It's that much longer that horses are like waiting around to kind of get shown and sold So I think that becomes the concern but like me Personally, I mean I think I'm always big on incentivizing what we want to see, not punishing what we don't want to see. And I do kind of love that there's so much money added to the three-year-old events now and they get more money if they're made in. I think that's a really smart way around this issue because it keeps the option open for those freaks of nature that are just going to do it as twos and they should be shown. But I think it incentivized the rest of us where it's like, well, like I have a feeling. I have a feeling we'll see, you know, check back in in a year. But I have a feeling a year from now I'm going to be sitting there like, I don't know, like I could show Ricky as a two, but maybe I'll just wait. I have a feeling that's how it's going to go. I don't think he's going to be an abnormal freaking nature. I think he's going to be a very normal horse. So that's going to put me in a position to make choices.

Scott Cooper: Mm-hmm. No, I totally get that. And I was going to say, like, I love seeing all the emphasis on the maiden three-year-olds and like, I agree, keep incentivizing that. I think that's a great step. three-year-olds are so much more fun to watch. But I also get that, like, yeah, if you buy a baby and you're waiting around for two years, like you're going to ⁓ probably get bored and sell it like do something else with it. I 100 % get that. That is like.

Crysta Brown: Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Scott Cooper: part of why I have yet to buy a baby. So I'm like, what am I going to do with it? Just sit and watch it grow while I pay for it. So I understand that. And, you know, there is a market for every person in our industry. Some people need to buy the young ones to because that's all they can afford. So ⁓ get it going both ways. But I just as a general, just stop your yearlings. Like, just ⁓ wait at least after January 1st. ⁓ It's I don't know. ⁓

Crysta Brown: Right. Yeah. I that's fair. I think we're gonna get canceled after this episode. I think we've been too honest. I think this is like too... I think we're both a little tired. I think we're just like... I don't know. I got nothing but real thoughts right now.

Scott Cooper: I think so too, y'all. It's fine. I think we've been too honest. Am I too na- I have, yeah, and you know, I was at the bottom of a barrel of a spiral yesterday, so this is actually an improvement, but I know, like we always talk about wanting to bring positivity to the industry, so I'm very sensitive when I'm like critiquing something. But I like to think of it as like negativity towards bad things.

Crysta Brown: Mm. I think toxic positivity exists.

Scott Cooper: agreed in which I'm 100,000 % against I freaking hate toxic positivity get that away from me.

Crysta Brown: And maybe like we check ourselves. We're going to self-evaluate after this episode. We're going see how we feel about it. But like, I think it's okay to... Yeah, yeah.

Scott Cooper: Yeah. You guys, if we're so resonating, tell us if you were like you were a little spicy there, you guys just like need a little zoloft and like move on with your day. That's fair.

Crysta Brown: That's fair. That's fair. We're tired. I had a 24 hour travel day. That was a lot for me.

Scott Cooper: You've been on the road a lot, a lot, Crysta Y'all, it's Crysta's fault why you haven't had a new episode in two weeks. I'm just gonna say that. I mean, it's a little bit my fault, but.

Crysta Brown: Scott, I feel like I've been on the road a lot. ⁓ my gosh, yeah, I meant to say that at the top of the episode. No, I meant to say that at the top of the episode. Like, I just want everybody to know that like Scott is ready to record. It's me. I'm the problem. And my main problem is I'm not thinking ahead.

Scott Cooper: Yes and no, y'all. I am busy as hell too. Like, work's killing me in the spring, but that's a different story. We're the problem.

Crysta Brown: Yes, but I've really been on the road and then previously I think I was better at thinking ahead and being like I know I'm gonna be gone so we should record a few extra episodes and I just I've been pouring from an empty cup I don't that much room for thoughts at the moment ⁓ so Yeah, I've been all over but it's good like it's great like I hate to in the same way that we're talking about like talks positivity and all these things like in the same way ⁓ I hate to complain about like, like I have so much going on because there was a time where I didn't have a lot going on and it was really scary. Yeah. Yeah. So I am so grateful and like, I think it's cool. I'm like so excited that like I have so many opportunities that I get to say no to some. That's crazy. It wasn't like that for a long time. Yeah. But okay. Wait, circling back really quick. I do really think

Scott Cooper: and you're panicking, right? Totally.

Crysta Brown: We cannot be positive forces in this industry if we are not willing to speak to some of our concerns. I think you have to.

Scott Cooper: Agreed. like, I think we're just being human too. Like, am not, if y'all know me well, you'll know that like, I am not a ray of sunshine every minute of every day. That's just not me at all and not my personality. So you guys get to see the real me at this point. I do think that there's a lot of amazing things about this industry we really love and that's why we fight for it and sometimes point out the hypocrisy or negative things that we're seeing.

Crysta Brown: Yeah.

Scott Cooper: You can be both guys. can like spread your love and joy and also call out the BS.

Crysta Brown: Yeah. Should I, what should I title this episode? just feel like Scott and Krista are Debbie Downers. Scott and Krista ruin everything.

Scott Cooper: What can we name it? It'd like Scott and Chris' Spiral. Scott and Krista need antidepressants apparently. No, and remember when we started this podcast and we were like, we'll record when we want. And like, if you get an episode every few weeks, just be happy. Be grateful, be grateful. That's all we have to say if we miss a week. Just be grateful when we're back.

Crysta Brown: Look, maybe. Be grateful. I know.

Scott Cooper: Do you think we could start a call? Do we have that much influence yet? Okay guys, we are obviously at the end of our brain cells. And love you and we hope you still love us too. And Krista has to go coach a lesson on the interwebs.

Crysta Brown: my God. Yeah. ⁓ yeah, I do actually. Well, keep in mind you go forward in life that you can't be of good that the horse show world needs, but the horse show world needs all the good that you can do. And we will see you ⁓ next time. Bye. ⁓

Scott Cooper: Bye.