Billy Wagner joins the show! He talks HOF, Phillies and more!

00:00:03
Speaker 1: All right, this is Billy Wagner and this is the Philly Show.

00:00:08
Speaker 2: Ruben Tomorrow, Junior, Jim Salisbury, Todd Z A lucky brought to you by the Foul Territory Network. How is everybody doing? I hope you are doing well. The holidays are almost here, just days away, and we have a special gift for all of you. Last week we spend some time with former Phillies closer Billy Wagner. Billy Wagner, who's going to find out next month January twenty first, to be specific, six pm Eastern on MLB Network if he has finally been inducted into the National Baseball Hall of Fame. Billy is in his tenth and final year of eligibility with the BBWAA. He fell five votes short last year or earlier this year, I should say, so, he has a great chance of getting in. Obviously, he hopes to get in. Jim Rubin and I all think he is worthy of getting in. Billy for the Phillies two thousand and four, two thousand and five, may the NL All Star Team in two thousand and five. Before we start this interview, I want to kind of just read to use some of the stats on Billy's career and why I think he's Hall of Fame worthy. Eighth in baseball history, four hundred and twenty two saves, finish his career with a two point three to one ERA. It's second best, second lowest in baseball history of any pitcher with seven hundred and fifty or more career innings. The only pitcher better Mariano Rivera. Billy Wagner first in baseball history in strikeouts per nine innings nine hundred more career innings eleven point nine strikeouts per nine innings, lowest opponents batting average against point one eight seven. Highest strikeout rate thirty three point two percent. And when you look at those strikeout numbers for Billy Wagner and you look at the guys just below them on the list, they're all current modern day pitchers Snell, Chris Sale, Robbie Ray, Jacob Degram, Max Suser. Billy was a unicorn in a day when guys did not blow one hundred mile heaters nasty sliders past everybody. Billy Wagner did it, and we wanted to have Billy on for quite a long time. Billy's a lot of fun to cover, obviously, he's dominating the back end of the bullpen, but also a very candid person, a good person in general. And one of my favorite stories in baseball history involves Billy Wagner and Jim Salisbury spring training of two thousand and five. Stay tuned, you're gonna love that one. Billy Wagner, everybody, Billy Wagner Man, thank you so much for joining the Philly Show. We're so excited to have you. It's the holiday season, which means a lot of family stuff, of course, and you must, I mean, what a great year for you and your family. Your son will makes his big league debut with the Blue Jays, your daughter's playing college hoops that Winthrop. You know what, what's this past you've been like for And of course you know down the road, hopefully next month you find out if you're going to make the Hall of Fame.

00:03:10
Speaker 1: Well, the most stressful thing is watching your kids.

00:03:12
Speaker 3: So I mean, you know, we have our months off that we get to actually relax and enjoy really life. But you know, when our kids are into the sports, I mean it's it's about twenty four to seven, you know, either hoping for a hit, hoping for a basket.

00:03:29
Speaker 1: Yeah, getting you know, just it's so you know, it's an up and.

00:03:33
Speaker 3: Down your parent time, I would say, And so you know, really, I mean as much as my kids probably keep up with the Hall of Fame more than I do, I ain't got time.

00:03:44
Speaker 1: I'm coaching. I'm following them. You know, when you become a coach, become you know, you're a shrink, You're you're a personal trainer, your your your know.

00:03:55
Speaker 3: You're maintenance guys. So literally it's a twenty four hour job at times.

00:04:01
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, we'll definitely talk about the Hall of Fame, but I did want to ask you about, you know, Will's Big league debut in August. You did you get to the game? It was in LA Did you get there in time? Did you not get there?

00:04:13
Speaker 1: No? We got there. It was great.

00:04:15
Speaker 3: I mean it was you know, we drove driven down from Buffalo on that Saturday, and we get a phone call later that night and saying, hey, I'm going to the big leagues and and you know, as luck would have it, it's in Anaheim, so you know, and so trying to coordinate that and get everybody.

00:04:33
Speaker 1: There was it was quite a job. But it all worked out. I mean, you know, we were all excited.

00:04:40
Speaker 3: I don't know who was more nervous, though, I think my wife or his fyance. You know, I'm a pitcher, so when I look at hitters, I'm like, dude, you got four shots of this thing, maybe five each night.

00:04:50
Speaker 1: I mean, come on, let's work in, let's let's go and so.

00:04:53
Speaker 3: But you know that first one, get that first and out out of the way, and then you know, just to have the debut ahead.

00:04:58
Speaker 1: I mean, that is pretty special.

00:05:00
Speaker 2: Not only did he get it out of the way, he swung at the first pitch and just ripped the double into the gap and right center field. And man, he was not messing around. That was pretty cool.

00:05:08
Speaker 3: Well, his mom didn't raise a fool's looking hard, look hard, baby, good Philly.

00:05:16
Speaker 4: I uh, you know, I can't imagine the thrill you must have felt and you must feel, uh to see your son play in the big leagues. How does it compare to the thrill when you got the call and made your debut.

00:05:35
Speaker 3: I think circumstances were completely different, But you know, for me, it was uh, you know, I every every step I took was new. I had no idea what I was doing, what I was getting into there, was no preparation for what I was about to get into. Uh.

00:05:52
Speaker 1: For Will, you know, it's probably more enjoyable.

00:05:56
Speaker 3: Because you know the path and you have he has a little bit more guidance of what to do and how to do it, what not to do them, and things like that, and so the guidances, you know, it's something that I think makes a big difference.

00:06:11
Speaker 1: So he's able to sit there.

00:06:12
Speaker 3: And understand things when you know, like when trades happen and you're like, hey, there's probably more to this trade than you know, so don't don't don't overthink this. You know, when when trade were going on, when I was playing, I had no idea what I was doing.

00:06:23
Speaker 1: When I got traded, I didn't know.

00:06:25
Speaker 3: I didn't understand that it was you know, it was a personal thing where I was. I'm able to sit there and tell Will, Hey, this is this is business. These are the good things. These are you know, anytime somebody's wanting you, that's a good thing. So I think, you know, being able to take this journey with Will, I mean really from the start to finish, when you look at him being on the field and taking ground balls.

00:06:46
Speaker 1: Uh uh, all the way up when when he was with when I was.

00:06:49
Speaker 3: With the Phillies, I mean shagging and really understanding that that locker room tend to where he's at today. I think it's you know, it's helped him to be able to handle his emotions a little bit better.

00:07:01
Speaker 1: Well, uh, Billy, I'm sorry.

00:07:03
Speaker 5: I'm great to have you with us, so so so good to see. Uh, you know, I had a lot of emotions when I called my father and made that phone call.

00:07:14
Speaker 6: Tell me exactly went through what threatened? You know, I've talked to my dad since then and now he's passed, but I keep that and hold that close to my heart. But tell me exactly what you were feeling when and what were the circumstances behind that phone call.

00:07:28
Speaker 3: Well, you know how emotional I am. I'm very emotional about my kids, and so when he was when you get that phone call, you know, and you see how much they've worked, and you know, just like your father watched, how hard you work to get to to fulfill your dream that one moment to be there. I mean, you know, to be able to share that, that's that's uh, you know, that's priceless. That's something that you hold on, like you said, for a long time just to be part of that. And so you know, and that that's the joy of this whole battle to get to the big leagues. Uh, you know, uh, to have that joy. And that's what I've pushed along with him. As I said, smile a lot more today. Every day you wake up, you o for four. You can still smile if you're in the big leagues.

00:08:08
Speaker 2: That's right. You know, Billy, Jim and I were talking a little earlier, and because we do have two generation baseball families here. You know, Ruben's dad, of course played in the big leagues. You played in the big leagues. I'm wondering and each of you can maybe answer this question. How much do you think just being blessed physically had to do with maybe Will's success, Ruben, with with your success versus just being around a dad who played in the big leagues and can say no, no, no, no, this is how you catch a ground ball, this is how you can hit the baseball, this is the best way to throw a ball. You know, just having that super expert expertise that can maybe kind of push them in the in the right direction.

00:08:53
Speaker 1: Go ahead, Rubin, you probably know more about those things.

00:08:57
Speaker 6: Well, I mean, for me, honest, it was less jeans. I think, even though my grandfather played in the big leagues and are not in the big leagues, but was an Hall of Fame type player, couldn't play in the big leagues because of the color of her skin. But I think more than anything else, it was about me being exposed to the game and sort of being taught, you know, how to manage your effort to get to the big leagues, and sort of just being around the game itself was and falling in love with it was more had a lot more to do with my overall talent. We were different types of players. I was a switch hitter, I ran pretty well, wasn't my dad it was a great infielder. I was not a great infielder, and so they tossed me into the outfield. So I think there was probably the ladder of those two things todd for me, like the love of the game and just being around the game and watching these you know, amazing players perform. You know, in the late seventies and early eighties in Philadelphia, I mean some of the best players in the history of our organization, you know, the Schmidt's and BoA's and Carlton's and those kind of guys and just being around it was more of ad more of an effect I think on me.

00:10:14
Speaker 1: You billy, Oh, I agree. I tell you.

00:10:16
Speaker 3: You know, when a young kid gets to walk into a locker room, you got Jimmy Rollins, uh, Chase Udley. You know, David Bell told me, guys that can give you a lasting impression, you know, along with the ride of your career, singing in a locker room with that caliber you know, Visio bag.

00:10:40
Speaker 1: Well, things like that. I mean, things like that rub off on you.

00:10:43
Speaker 3: Not maybe in physical but I mean how you see them handling you, you.

00:10:48
Speaker 1: Know, as a father.

00:10:49
Speaker 3: You know a lot of times I'm going, hey, that's that's who you want to emulate right there.

00:10:53
Speaker 1: Look at those guys. See how they handled their business.

00:10:56
Speaker 6: You know.

00:10:56
Speaker 3: Plus, you know, being in the big league clubhouse allows you guys to take out there. Jimmy Williams used to take will out to the field and take hitting ground balls. I mean, so it's who you know and what you're talking to and subjecting them to. And so you know, me being a picture, you know, I mean, thank god I didn't rub off on him.

00:11:16
Speaker 1: So that they can really enjoy what they're doing.

00:11:19
Speaker 3: So I think that was part of uh, you know, you know, the experience and the journey is just putting him in a situation where he's around people that you know that he that he looked, he sees his quality and you know, emulates and I think there's things that he does that.

00:11:35
Speaker 1: You know when I look back and I go, I might have played with a guy like that, So you know, I like that.

00:11:39
Speaker 3: I think, you know, he's a whole lot of you know, you know, I think one of my favorite players ever in teammates was Chase Sutley. I mean, I just we always hit it off when when we were there and just to watch and I think I look at Will and more of that fashion, Who's you know, not gonna be flash and he's gonna do what you gotta get done and you know he's going to do it the best he can and so and he never had no excuse. So I think, you know, you can only be happy if you find people that he looks up to that are his quality as a guy like Chase Billy.

00:12:15
Speaker 2: You know, it's funny because we've had a lot of like former players on the former Chase teammates and he gets mentioned maybe more than anybody on this show. Do you have a Chase utleast story that that immediately comes to mind when you think of Chase or somebody asks you about him.

00:12:29
Speaker 1: I don't know if there's a story.

00:12:31
Speaker 3: I think it's just the what he did every day, how he handled itself every day. I don't think there's a story or a particular thing that stands out. I know that when I when I joined the Phillies and got to be around Chase. You know, he didn't break with us right out of the gate, and I remember me and Bowen. I mean it was like, what are we doing? I mean, clearly, this dude's a dude, let's let's go. And I mean and it only took a matter of time for him to come up there and do it.

00:12:59
Speaker 1: You know, when he got there, it was never overwhelmed. H I just like how he went about his business.

00:13:05
Speaker 3: I mean, I think there's a lot to be said about going out there and not having to beat your chest to do things, you know, and I think there's a quality to that, But there's a there's a fierce.

00:13:15
Speaker 1: Competitor in that too.

00:13:16
Speaker 3: I mean, he was he was one not to mess with He he wanted to, he wanted to beat you, and he did what it took to. He really was a throwback. He was a you know that seventies eighties throwback. I mean how he played was Larry Boa, you know, in a prime.

00:13:33
Speaker 1: I mean he was he was, He was hard nosed.

00:13:36
Speaker 4: You were there when Jimmy Chase and Ryan Howard were really just coming of age. What was it like to watch them as young players on the threshold of greatness.

00:13:48
Speaker 3: Well, I think watching them, you knew it was just gonna be a matter of maturation of time until they caught up with how to handle what they got coming at him.

00:13:57
Speaker 1: I mean commitments on and off the.

00:14:00
Speaker 3: Field, plus production, plus expectations. You know, that's a lot to throw on some of these young kids. And you know it took some guys a long time. I mean when Ryan Howard came up, I mean he came up and told me and pretty much took a gym spot. And the kid goes and hits twenty two home runs and what a month and a half.

00:14:21
Speaker 1: And I mean you're like, holy God, what just happened there? And so you see a comnents, but you.

00:14:26
Speaker 3: Know there was an air there that when those kids came up, there was a way different mentality. They never seemed overwhelmed or are beat up by the situation. They knew how to handle it, and so that was that was fun to watch watch those guys. I mean I went to Jimmy's very first All Star game in Seattle. We were there, and I remember sitting with him trying to help him figure out how to get jerseys for his team. And I mean, there's you know, those are great journeys together that when you look back, you know, it's it's it's fun to see how far they've come along and how awesome they were to play against.

00:15:01
Speaker 6: Hey, Billy, I just wanted to sort of compare. You know, you've been around some great players and you mentioned before Bagwell b g O, I think you're around Caman Eddy. I'm not sure it was a Cammy as well. Tell me compare those guys with you know, the Chase Utleys and the Rollins's and and the Howards of the world.

00:15:20
Speaker 1: Because there's some great players there too. Man.

00:15:25
Speaker 3: I think I think if you're comparing those guys, there's I don't know if there's anybody that compares to Kaman Edti because he was just so. I mean he's an ultimate competitor, ultimate teammate, but I mean he could stare holes through your brain. He was He had the death stare, and I mean he was as intimidating a teammate as I've ever had. But I tell you he he definitely had your back. You know, when I think about guys.

00:15:49
Speaker 1: Like uh, you know, Chase reminds me a lot of like bagging.

00:15:54
Speaker 3: Hey, I just went around, did my job, Here's what I do, made the play, hit a home run, did these things, stole the base when I needed to.

00:16:01
Speaker 1: Where when you watch like.

00:16:04
Speaker 3: Visio, Vigio was a little bit more active, I mean you could see him. He he was chirpy at times, and he could get after you a little bit like Jimmy. I mean, not not as flashy, probably not as athletic by.

00:16:15
Speaker 1: Far as Jimmy.

00:16:17
Speaker 3: Uh you know, but I mean that that whole era had that talent. And I think what we've seen is the progression of baseball up to this point is just the amount of consistent talent that you're seeing day in and day out. You know, where you know, there's things that as an old player, and I'm sure older players look at as far as you know a little bit more flashy. Uh, the talent on a whole is completely different than it's ever been in my opinion, just watching the guys who come to the plate and hit the ball so hard, and the guys who throw hard, and the guys who run.

00:16:53
Speaker 1: I mean, I just think the talent is so so unbelievable.

00:16:55
Speaker 3: And you know, but it's you know, it's kind of like the discussion of the Michael Jordan and Lebron and uh, you know, of course I'm a Michael Jordan fan. So when you look at that or an Iverson fan, you know, when you look in that air, those guys were different, played different, and you know, you know, you have a Pete Rose who would take out a catcher in the All Star Game, where now today's games smitch different.

00:17:20
Speaker 1: But the quality of what you face daily is so impressive.

00:17:26
Speaker 6: Billy.

00:17:26
Speaker 2: I think I want to know if one of the biggest thrills of your Philly's career was catching Jim Salisbury catching in two thousand, do you remember this at all?

00:17:36
Speaker 1: I mean absolutely, I mean, I mean, you know what I told Jim all long. It wasn't going to be a big deal. I said, it's gonna be easy.

00:17:43
Speaker 3: You're gonna walk up from though Jesus Christy and he get lit up more often. But I mean, you know it really, I mean, you know, I remember catching flat grounds for guys like Kim Broll and Lidge and guys like that. But when guys can throw balls around you, you you're just like, okay, it's it's different. I mean, I wouldn't want to catch Eralda Chapmans for I mean, he's literally thrown from five feet from me. But I think, you know, once you get used to those guys. And I think jim Jim was so he was so excited, so excited, and I was like, don't The only thing that I think was gonna give him my hard time was a breaking ball in which is like, well wait a minute. But I mean, what do you expect? You know, I told Jimison, now you really know that it's not a big deal.

00:18:31
Speaker 2: I gotta tell you.

00:18:31
Speaker 1: I was there and witnessed the whole thing, and it was. It was quite the spectacle.

00:18:35
Speaker 6: We did it right there in the right next to the hot field where they do it. I think Jimmy handled himself extremely well.

00:18:42
Speaker 3: Man.

00:18:43
Speaker 2: I think he did a heck of a job.

00:18:45
Speaker 6: I mean, I was really impressed that little Barney rebel looking fella.

00:18:49
Speaker 1: He did a nice job.

00:18:51
Speaker 2: I mean you said that, well, he said, well, I mean so for people that don't know the whole story, Jim came with Jim in spring training where he comes up to me one day He's like, I think I'm going to go ask Billy if I could catch one of his bullpen sessions. And I'm like, okay, good luck. And he came back He's like, holy crap. He said yes. And then Jim, you could take it the rest of the way. You had to go through a process before you could actually catch him.

00:19:14
Speaker 4: Well, I actually I wanted to do it because Billy. You know, when you were young, people said, oh, Billy Wagner's just a power arm.

00:19:25
Speaker 2: He's a thrower.

00:19:26
Speaker 4: And I knew that used to rankle you and kind of tick you off because you really worked hard to be a pitcher and develop that great slider and your command and everything. You were a student of pitching and so all winter long and I'm thinking of I want to write this story. I want to catch it the bullpen and write a story about it and show people this more than to this guy than just a rear back and fire. And I rehearsed the entire sales pitch all winter long in my head. And then I go to Billy's locker and typical Billy down to earth, regular dude, most regular dude, you know, jeans and cowboy boots. I said, I laid out my entire pitch, and he goes, okay, when you want to do it, I'm like, so I had to sign a waiver form where like in the second sentence the word death was in there. And so you know, I had been a catcher as a kid, and I my biggest fear, Billy. I knew I could do it with the hands, because I'm not how to catch a ball, right. My fear was my eyes. And so I went to Todd and I said Todd, Billy said yes, And we had about ten days because you're going to pitch back to back days in the bullpen. That's when we picked it out, and it was gonna be a night game down in clear Water. So Todd and I borrowed a couple of balls, and I think I borrowed a glove from John Vukovich. And every night after work we'd go across the street to that field across the street in cliar Water, and Todd would stand forty feet in front of me. I'm like, throw it harder, throw it harder, throw it harder. And he was right on top of me because I really needed to get my eyes going. But the upshot of that billy is Todd's shoulder still hurts. I have an eight billy, I have an eight year old son.

00:21:11
Speaker 2: I'll play in the backyard catch with them, and my about ten throws in my shoulder starts certain and I go the freaking belly Wagner story man, that's still barking after like almost twenty years. You know, I'm still still fill in the pain from trying to get Jim so he could catch the baseball. But you know, I remember Mick bill Mury, Mick bill Meyer being there, was there.

00:21:34
Speaker 1: Everybody was thinking this was going to be a joke.

00:21:36
Speaker 3: I mean I remember, and I was like, you know this is I mean, it's you know, it's you're not catching a guy who just got to the you know, drafted, who's really not sure what's going on. I mean, all you're doing it and so you know the biggest thing is going to be a breaking ball.

00:21:52
Speaker 1: It'd be you'd be like me trying to catch.

00:21:54
Speaker 3: I remember when I went to Japan and was playing I wanted to go play catch with Pauffman and him filmy change up and flashed on me his breaking ball, and all of a sudden You're like, hey, okay, now don't tell me and just throwing then your coach shit, I mean, and it's all of a sudden, that's what That's what that all speed?

00:22:11
Speaker 1: Really, doesn't you know?

00:22:13
Speaker 3: And that really stands out to me is kind of like the feeling you had. There was no better feeling to sit there and see what everybody else sees.

00:22:21
Speaker 1: Uh. The problem was I think you were like, this is really hittable. I just don't. I don't. I'm not getting it. I'm not getting it.

00:22:28
Speaker 3: And uh, you know whether where I'm sitting there catching Hoffman and going, how in God's names anybody hit that?

00:22:33
Speaker 1: So, I mean, I appreciate you making me feel good.

00:22:37
Speaker 4: I'll tell you what though, So that day, you know, the day comes, I was I was very anxious obviously, and you know I go out there, Now, Billy's all business. I mean, because I remember telling Billy said, now, Billy, I want you to really, you know, give me it all right, And he goes, don't worry, I'm gonna cheat you. And so we go out there on the half field and he's he wants to warm up do his long toss on the flat ground. So I got no mask on, and his first throw on flat ground just to get loose from like only ninety feet, I could hear it, you know, and it was on my face like that, like, and I had no mask. It was on my face and I'm like, holy good god, what have I just gotten into?

00:23:22
Speaker 3: Well, you asked me by Nobody liked to play catch with me because I could get I could be loosing seven throws. That was I mean, my worst fear as a reliever was to have somebody go, oh, let's hold up and get the bases loaded.

00:23:35
Speaker 1: That was the worst fear for me.

00:23:37
Speaker 3: I would literally tell coaches before when they call down, I go, I'm ready, and they'd be like what I'm like, by the time you've walked out there, I'm ready and stuff. Because that was my big spirit. I hated coaching the well we'll give them one more hitter. I wanted to make that decision right away. I'm good, let's.

00:23:52
Speaker 4: Go that was a real thrill. And you know, my goal was to write a good story to tell the reader that, you know, show the reader the fan the work that you put into your craft on days you're not on in the game. And uh and and hopefully I succeeded. And you know, my dad actually clipped that story and had it mounted and hung in his in his basement for years, and when he passed away, I grabbed it and now it's on my podcasting wall. It's right over my shoulder. Billy, that's pretty cool.

00:24:27
Speaker 1: That's awesome. Hey, so, so.

00:24:29
Speaker 6: Billy, let me let me ask you this question. I mean, that was a great that was that was really wonderful. Tell me about what it was like to pitch in Philadelphia, people staring at that you know, radar gun. You'd hit ninety nine and people were like boo, and then you know, and then you'd hit one hundred and people like yeah, you know, tell us someone's going through your mind during that time.

00:24:52
Speaker 3: You know what I wish, I wish I could go back in that moment and been way more mature on how I handled that whole situation. But I tell you, what I did appreciate about those moments is when you stepped out on that field, you better have your a game, You better be ready to go.

00:25:10
Speaker 1: There was no uh, you had a tough game.

00:25:13
Speaker 3: There was just a moment, and you know, you don't realize what a hundred looks like. I mean, now you looked up and it's happening a little bit more often now. I mean when I was playing it, it wasn't as often. And so you know, for me being a player in that moment, I didn't realize how awesome that was because, in my opinion, I'm chasing lines and tigers, that's who I'm facing. I've got the bonds, I've got these guys, and I ain't got.

00:25:39
Speaker 1: Time to like pat myself on the back and do those things.

00:25:42
Speaker 3: And so, you know, looking back and sitting there thinking about, hey, you know, when I stepped up there, everybody knew what was coming. There was no secret, and you know, people were excited to see that. I think, you know, those were the moments I looked back and went, you know, I should have played that a little different.

00:25:59
Speaker 1: But you know, to know that you have that in your bag, that's that's pretty good. That's pretty fun.

00:26:04
Speaker 6: So I gotta have to say something about the hundred that you threw in the hundreds of being thrown now, I am, and I know this for certain that the hundred that's being thrown back then is not the same one hundred that's being thrown now. That's probably like one hundred and four to one hundred and six in this day and age. And because they are not taking that reading, they're taking the reading at at the plate back in the day, they're taking it out of the hand today, and so it's a totally different reading. And I wanted to point that out because I think it's something real.

00:26:37
Speaker 1: It's it's a real thing.

00:26:38
Speaker 6: Yes, more consistently guys are throwing harder, there's no question about it. But it's a different one hundred. I think that if you have been tracked today with stat cast and that kind of stuff, you be tracked at a much higher number.

00:26:53
Speaker 3: Well, you know, I've heard that often. I think, you know, you're just seeing guys I think hard hard. I think there's ninety six is that really play up and play hard?

00:27:04
Speaker 5: You know?

00:27:05
Speaker 3: And I think, you know, the numbers are always fascinating, but what really stands out is when you watch and a guy that comes to mind me, it just amazes me.

00:27:13
Speaker 1: Is uh Woody.

00:27:15
Speaker 3: Williams who would go out there and throw eighty eight, but he would always pitch in a triangle, and he would just sit here and to go eighty six, eighty eight, eighty six, eighty eight, eighty eight, eighty seven, and you and just be sitting there and all of a sudden you look up and you're in sixth seventh. But that played up so much, you know, and and the velocities today, and I mean, the good the good thing is being able to talk to my son about guys.

00:27:37
Speaker 1: And I think he faced the kid from wool was it Anaheim? Ben Joyce? Is that his name? And I mean, you know that's I mean, that's funny money.

00:27:49
Speaker 3: That's that's like you know, I mean starts winging when he steps on the mount kind of stuff.

00:27:53
Speaker 1: I think there's something to it. I just I think there's a.

00:27:56
Speaker 3: Defer difference in the commitment to what you're doing. Can you imagine facing a Waldis Chapman in the seventies and eighties who would throw at your neck? I mean that being like that where today's game, you know, they're they're hey, it's you're you're in a box and stuff. I think these kids today are the pitchers have to be a little different unfortunately, but you know when I when I.

00:28:23
Speaker 1: Talk to big league hitters, they still say hards hard.

00:28:27
Speaker 2: Well, Bill, I mean, like, I was just looking at your stats statement. Obviously you're throwing hard in the slider and being a great pitcher. You had tremendous successes. Look at your career numbers. Two point three one year in your career, four hunder, twenty two career saves. And this is the cool part. Your strikeout rate eleven point nine strikeouts per nine innings. It's the best in baseball history of any pitcher with nine hundred more innings pitched. One eighty seven. Opponent's batting average against, best in baseball history at any pitcher with over nine hundred more innings. Second lowest ERA ever nine hundred more innings. I think it's the lowest by by a lefty. Uh, second lowest lowest e RA A yeah, like yeah, like I said, by by a lefty. So, you know, just a tremendous, tremendous career. And you know you came so close to the Hall of Fame last year. I've read some things that you said after that last vote said, it's just such a wild roller coaster. Can you put into words what these weeks are like right now? Are you?

00:29:23
Speaker 1: Well? Is it?

00:29:25
Speaker 3: I try really hard not to pay attention that last year. I mean, as we went along through this ten year grind, you know, you know, it's easy to see the growth, and then all of a sudden you get over to sixty and then everybody's like, oh, hey, you know, that's nobody's ever not gotten in over sixty. And then you get to sixty four and you're and you don't get you know, you know it was it was. Last year was tough emotionally, not so much just watching the process as much as you know, trying to stay.

00:29:57
Speaker 1: Out of that mindset of what's going to happen.

00:30:01
Speaker 3: I mean, uh, you know, coaching is my life and I lean on that a lot, and especially in these days when there's the Hall of Fame talk and so, you know, last year, all of a sudden, NBC Nightly News shows up. I had no idea, and so I'm I'm dealing with that, and you know, they pulled me off side and go, hey, do you got meant to talk about why you didn't make it? You know, I'm on the I mean, and there's my team. It was very hard to sit there and go all right, oh yeah, you only missed about five votes. Huh nice, Okay, you know it was tough, but you know, you know, I was blessed to be in a situation where I could create a coachable situation and how to handle and deal with it. But I really inside it was the most miserable thing I'd ever had gone through as a for myself personally, and so you know, I you know, it's such a great honor to be on that ballot, and there's so many people that's been on that ballot that haven't gotten to the opportunity that I have and stuff.

00:31:08
Speaker 1: But you know, as an athlete who.

00:31:13
Speaker 3: Gets to this far or past athlete, you know, it's the ultimate.

00:31:18
Speaker 1: You've reached the top of the pyramid. Right now.

00:31:21
Speaker 3: If to be in the Hall of Fame, you're talking about the grades of the greats, You're not talking about anything else. And you know, to think about yourself being in any conversation where Hofs at the end of your name is humbling, and you know, is pretty sacred for me to look at.

00:31:45
Speaker 4: Billy, I mean, here you are, this exciting time, you keep going up on the ballot. I think you belong there. I hope you get there. I am a sucker for a good story. I just love a good story. I actually think they could make a movie about your life. I mean, here's this kid who breaks his dominant arm, his throwing arm as a little boy and says, Okay, screw it, I'll learn to I learned to throw with my other arm and become like this great left hander. You know, it's it's it's an amazing, amazing story. And it shows like like I've been around pro athletes like pretty much my whole life. They're special. They have this elite athleticism, but the really great ones have intangible character, competitiveness, drive, that's the word I'm looking for. And you have all that those physical tools, but you had that drive to overcome that injury as a little kid, learn to throw left handed and become the hardest throwing left hand on the planet and one of the best relievers in the history of the game.

00:32:57
Speaker 1: My god, you.

00:32:58
Speaker 4: Were blessed with unbelievable and tangibles. Where did all that come from?

00:33:02
Speaker 3: Well, I really think that you know, it's you know, it's very easy to sit there and go hey, you know, I was blessed by God. But it's obvious that I show it every time I went out on the mound that I was blessed. But I think it was also one of those situations where it allowed me to be on a platform and a lot of times that I, you know, was humbled and went through some things that I think it was God's way of giving me the opportunity to be a coach, to talk to kids, to really talk about ways to do things different and a little bit better, to have the experience, you know, and I had the blessing of playing with so many people that were you know, inspiring to me.

00:33:41
Speaker 1: That and meeting so many guys.

00:33:43
Speaker 3: I mean, you know, you think about the people that you get involved with on a daily basis in pro baseball that you get to see and you get to see.

00:33:53
Speaker 1: Walking Robin Roberts. I remember taking Robin Robins out to dinner. Holy Cow.

00:33:57
Speaker 3: I mean, one of the greatest things in my life was sitting there talking to Sandy Kofex. Those are the things, but I think that gave me an insight that also God gave me the ability to have this journey and get sixteen years in so that I could be a coach and sit there and tell kids and help them deal with today's anxieties in the day's game that has manifest into something at times that is unrecognizable.

00:34:24
Speaker 6: Billy, you and I have something in common, man, and we both had to teach ourselves to throw with our opposite hand. I was originally a left handed thrower, and I wanted to be like my brother, so I turned I taught myself how to throw right handed. I ended up just like my dad. I wanted to be an infielder and all the other stuff. Why didn't you teach me how to create some arm speed? Because I had the weakest arm on the planet in the outfield.

00:34:48
Speaker 1: You know.

00:34:49
Speaker 3: You know who else was a natural? Darryl Kyle was a natural left hander, and me and him would trade gloves and people play kitchen. If you could only have seen how good he threw a curveball. His curveball is really good anyway, then he could throw a left handed curveball. There are so many guys that have that weirdness to him. And you know, when it's it's amazing what athletes can do to survive and to get to where they want to go.

00:35:18
Speaker 6: Well, your stories are one of the best ones ever man, of all time, and I hope it culminates in the right spot because you definitely deserve. As far as I'm concerned. If I'm voting, man, you're You're a Hall of Famer to me, Man, no question.

00:35:31
Speaker 4: Billy, what does what does Hall of Fame night look for you?

00:35:34
Speaker 1: Look like?

00:35:34
Speaker 2: For you?

00:35:35
Speaker 4: In the family? Hall of Fame Day announcement day.

00:35:37
Speaker 1: Well, I'm not going to know. I'm not gonna know. I you know, that's too hard. I'm not very good at that. I mean, you know, I know my kids will be keeping up with it.

00:35:48
Speaker 3: I know I'll be very anxious because I know what this is, I know what what's on the line right here, and so you know it'll be it'll be difficult to find a way to get through to six o'clock.

00:36:02
Speaker 1: To be honest with you, you.

00:36:03
Speaker 3: Know, I know I've had conversations with the Hall of Fame going, hey, you know, it looks like this, we need to have time like nope, kiss of death.

00:36:09
Speaker 1: I'm not talking to nobody, and I'm not trying to be that guy.

00:36:13
Speaker 3: But I mean, you know, my lifestyle growing up has always been waiting on the other shoot of fall. And I'm not going to sit here and put myself in such a situation where it's so disappointing that you know, it's that I have to, you know, apologize for being upset.

00:36:31
Speaker 1: And so the less people around me the better.

00:36:36
Speaker 2: Well, I mean, we all wish you the best of luck. You know. Just a couple of weeks ago, we were doing a show and somebody asked us about like favorite people Jim and I covered, and you were one of the guys that immediately popped into our heads just because you were so much fun to talk to. And obviously you, Billy, you were a great quote.

00:36:58
Speaker 1: And we and we loved it in front office.

00:37:00
Speaker 6: We loved in the office.

00:37:02
Speaker 3: I say right now that that and see that right there when when I talked to Will, that's exactly like, I don't care how what's going on.

00:37:10
Speaker 1: You just said, yes, sir, No certain, yes, ma'am. No, ma'am. You do not say anything else. I said.

00:37:15
Speaker 3: I said, I've got a whole wall of things to not do. You know, but that you know, in that environment you go from Houston to Philly, I mean, you're you're talking about the opposite spectrum of everything, and then even if you had a bad game in Houston. I was never like, oh you you looked like you weren't very good tonight, or you you know, you didn't have those weird questions where in Philly you could go out and punch out three with my pitching and you know you've lost.

00:37:44
Speaker 1: It looked like very good.

00:37:49
Speaker 3: Those are things these kids, you know, from me, I had no idea. Everything was a poke at me. And so you know, from being from southwest Virginia to breezing al Pakist, you name it.

00:38:00
Speaker 1: And and that's.

00:38:01
Speaker 3: Where I didn't have very good guiding send how to handle these things.

00:38:06
Speaker 2: Well, Billy, if you hadn't spoke up the Phillies, Bullpen might still be on the top level.

00:38:10
Speaker 1: So that's right.

00:38:14
Speaker 2: Sometimes that mouth that really.

00:38:18
Speaker 1: It doesn't exactly I remember after that, yeah exactly.

00:38:23
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, that was so great. The first Ondex series. I think it was after the first game the Index series, you came down like that will not work, we need to move down.

00:38:33
Speaker 1: Already getting crushed. I was like, Bullcraft, I am not dealing with that. You have one bad game.

00:38:39
Speaker 3: I got so but it was funny because you know, you can just say I would much read the visitors.

00:38:45
Speaker 1: Now.

00:38:45
Speaker 3: Granted, you know, when I make that decision, I think I'm gonna be in Philadelphia for the next ten years and I'll be retired and I don't have to deal with.

00:38:51
Speaker 1: This, you know, and then next thing you know, you're dealing with it constantly.

00:38:54
Speaker 3: I remember when I came back, I just put a chair right out in the middle of the bullpen and I just said, have that four games.

00:39:03
Speaker 1: So, you know. But you know what's funny though, when I'm around Philly fans, they they are way more. You know, there's so much.

00:39:11
Speaker 3: I probably had two of the best seasons of my career in Philadelphia and they also you know, the fans are when I do stuff I've come through and I'm doing a sign, you know, there's always a positive to it.

00:39:24
Speaker 1: I mean, there's something.

00:39:25
Speaker 3: But you know, when you're playing and you're young and immature, you don't know that passion, what that really means. And so you know, when you start talking to guys after you retire, people are like, oh, we loved you, and You're like, what you know? And you don't realize that, but I think, you know that's what I think that is something you know for me that when as I went through this process maturing and you know, understanding that you know, these guys what they do on a daily basis, you know, to come watch me play, to do this.

00:39:57
Speaker 1: You know this is important and you know this is their way to vent.

00:40:00
Speaker 3: But at my stage and my immaturity and my where I was not used to that, that was that was a completely different I mean, that was a constant attack. And so you know, those are things that you know, you know, if I could talk to kids coming through you know, rougher cities like Philly and Boston and New York things like that, I would be like, hey, it's never personal.

00:40:24
Speaker 1: I would really.

00:40:25
Speaker 3: Make that a big differ because I mean there's a tendency to make that really personal when it really wasn't. And you know, sometimes you just need somebody to go, hey, just it's not a big thing.

00:40:34
Speaker 4: If I could ask you really quick, because I know we're taking up a lot of your time, but I'm so enjoying this. You mentioned having two good years in Philly. Oh five was just an unbelievable year. Seventy five appearentss a one and a half ur But you also had a great year in Atlanta.

00:40:50
Speaker 6: The year you are.

00:40:50
Speaker 3: I thought you were going to talk about my bad average great.

00:40:55
Speaker 1: Emanuel, Charlie. Manuel gave me.

00:40:56
Speaker 3: I went one for one and I came in and I looked at Charlie and I said, Charlie, how hard can it really be? And if you He got me in more games to hit. And at the end of the year we had an eight run lead, and he put me in the hit so I would strike out and be below three hundred.

00:41:11
Speaker 1: How about that. That's what friends, Virginia, friends do for you.

00:41:15
Speaker 4: Well, he wanted to be the best hitter from Southwest Virginia. Last year in Atlanta, you were great.

00:41:26
Speaker 1: Yeah, he was awesome. I've had enough.

00:41:28
Speaker 4: You could have probably pitched two more three more years, right.

00:41:31
Speaker 1: You know what, you know what I probably could have pitched a year or two more.

00:41:34
Speaker 3: But you know, there was a point where you know, you knew, you know, as a player, it's enough, And you know, I don't know what it had been like. I mean, you know, I think people always sit there and go, well, you know you pitch well, well, you know I could have pitched two more years and maybe I do do well?

00:41:51
Speaker 1: Or what if I go out there and pitch two more years and it's not well.

00:41:53
Speaker 3: So you know, honestly, I told Bobby Cox before the season started, I said, listen, I just want to let you know I'm not coming back.

00:42:01
Speaker 1: This is it. Please don't tell anybody.

00:42:03
Speaker 3: So by the time I got to my locker, he'd already told everybody that I was retiring and stepping away.

00:42:11
Speaker 1: So he didn't make it, you know.

00:42:12
Speaker 3: And I think it was easy because it was one of those things that it wasn't I wasn't going to change or do anything.

00:42:18
Speaker 1: But I will say that I really feel like I relaxed and really.

00:42:21
Speaker 3: Looked around a little bit more, really enjoyed things a little bit more, knowing that I was blessed to go out on my own terms. But I mean, there were so many nights I'm sitting there. I mean, the tortos shots that I was getting in my back, my hips, my ankles, I mean, you know, I we could sept it. I mean, it was just it was one of those things. I mean, I was wrapped up in tape from my ankles through my growing you know, and I was like, man, you know, the only thing that wasn't hurting was my shoulder and my elbow, and so it was just one of those things I said. You know, my kids are older, they're getting ready to go into that high school. It was important for me to be a dad first. And you know, uh, you know, I'd like to think that I could have played longer, but you know, you know, I'm happy with where I left.

00:43:07
Speaker 1: I don't regret what I've done.

00:43:10
Speaker 6: Well, you definitely have. You definitely left your You left your mark, man, you left your legacy, and and I have a great deal of respect for for you to step away from when you when you did, because that's a personal thing, and that's something that that I appreciate that you did and that you won't I agree.

00:43:29
Speaker 1: I agree with Gruen.

00:43:30
Speaker 4: You left your mark not only as a player and a pitcher, but as a man. Billy, I have great respect and appreciation for you.

00:43:38
Speaker 1: Thank you, Yeah, we bet.

00:43:40
Speaker 2: We wish you the best of luck. Hopefully it will be a nice celebration, uh next month and then we'll see in Cooperstown. We'll all be pulling for you.

00:43:47
Speaker 1: I appreciate that. Look forward to that.

00:43:49
Speaker 2: Thanks again to Billy Wagner for the time and good luck to Billy. January twenty first, six pm, Eastern MLB Network. Hopefully he gets the call to Cooperstown. We'll be back later, guys for more Phillies talk. Thanks everybody. The Philly Show is brought to you by the Foul Territory Network. Subscribe to The Phillies Show on YouTube and wherever you get your podcasts. If you like us, give us a review, Follow us on Instagram, TikTok x, Facebook, and threads. Find Rubens analysis before, during, and after Phillies games on NBC Sports Philadelphia, on the Sports Radio ninety four, WIP Morning Show, and MLB Network. Find Jim at all phl y dot com. Find me at MLB dot com, the Phillies Bet Newsletter, and MLB Network