#319 The Best First .22 Rifle: Semi-Auto vs. Bolt-Action

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I can't think of the last time

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that I needed more than one shot,
and not that I

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was got the game every time,
but usually with a squirrel,

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if you take a shot and miss, well,
let's go find what are you going to do?

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Open up on along this limb
as he runs along the limb or something.

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What?

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Tell me about fun
is that plus, it's not safe.

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Hi there, and welcome to the Guns
Podcast, U.S..

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I'm your host, Brant Wheat.

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And I'd like to thank you

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for joining us here on one of the world's
biggest gun talk programs.

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As we chat with the interesting folks
who make up the world of shooting.

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And I'm joined today by my co-host,
Roy Huntington.

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Hello there. Roy.

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Howdy. Let's get to it.

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Let's get to it.

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Okay, today we're going to jump right in.

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And this is a topic Roy kind of suggested.

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And I thought, you know,
I get that question all the time.

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So we're going to address it today.

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And that that simple question is okay
I'm going to buy my first 22 for me

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my spouse, my, my child, whomever.

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You know, the kid down the block,
I don't know.

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But do I want a single shot
or do I want a bolt action?

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Do I want a semi-auto or a full auto?

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Okay then no, nobody asked that question.

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But we're going to give you some advice on
what is the best 22 out of the gate.

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And I would say
I'm going to throw it to you, Roy.

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But really, I think it depends
on the recipient of said rifle.

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More so than the person doing the buying.

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Wouldn't you agree?

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Oh, I agree,
I think people make a really bad mistake

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when they've got,

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you know, a ten year old boy or girl
and the first thing they do is buy them

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a Ruger. 1022 yeah.

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And, you know, it
just teaches them to make empty brass,

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you know, bang, bang, bang bang bang
bang bang bang bang bang bang bang bang.

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Nobody's learning sight picture no.

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Based on any trigger squeeze, you know.

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So so you're right.

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I think it is situationally dependent.

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And so, you know, my recommendation,
I'm sure yours is the same

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first 22 for somebody adolescent or below
should be a single shot,

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22 bolt action rifle or a single shot
break open 22 rifle if you can find one,

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because that just slows everything down,
you know,

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I mean, if you give them a box of 50, 20

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twos,
that's going to last them quite a while

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and, you know, it'll let them learn sight
picture, learn trigger squeeze.

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So and having said that, it's also
not a bad idea if you're an adult numbers.

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If this really is your first 22 rifle
then go get some savage bolt action 22

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single shot, you know, or maybe a bolt
action tube feed or magazine feed gun.

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But is it just everything slows down,
you know?

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Well, you know, the great analogy
and talking about my personal life,

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but this kind of relates,
I started Chi recently thought I'd try.

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It seemed interesting

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and I, I had my first class the other day,
and a lot of people ask, how did you do?

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And I said, I felt like a spastic baby
giraffe out there.

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You know, Tai Chi
is that very flowing thinking I'm like.

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Oh. And it wasn't that I'm I'm not.

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I think I'm semi intelligent
and it's not rocket

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surgery,
but it's a whole new learning curve

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that I'd never been part of
and trying to take everything.

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And it really struck me.

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I thought, okay,
I know I'm going to be a little behind

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the curve and try to follow,
but something that seemed so simple,

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like doing forms or maybe shooting a 22,

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it's not just doing it, it's
everything that goes with it.

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And then I gotta admit, I didn't think of
there be any self-consciousness

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because I really that's not kind of me,
but I was very self-conscious

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because it's like I felt like everybody in
the gym was watching me.

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And we tend to forget that new shooters
are the same way, even even adults.

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You know,
I don't care what people think we do.

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Most humans do care what people think,

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whether it's a group of onlookers
or it's the instructor.

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You know, if you're teaching somebody,

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so we've got to put our place

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in, in place
of the recipient, of the new shooter.

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And, I think that's why

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that single shot is such a great idea,
because it's slow, as you said.

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Right? Slows everything down.

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You know, if you start adding magazines
and you especially start

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adding a semi-auto,
there's a whole bunch of stuff happening.

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And that's how people kind of start
shutting down.

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We often called it, you know, an emergency
services, drinking from the fire hose.

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It's pretty hard to drink
from that fire hose.

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So if you cut it down to a garden hose,

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the person that's learning
tends to do better.

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Well, you don't go out and buy
a $50,000 set of snap on tools.

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If you think you want to change the air

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filter in your car, you know,
I mean, don't buy a fire.

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People do though. It's it's insane. Yeah.

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I mean, you buy a $5 socket
set from Harbor Freight, you know,

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and then while you learn
how to use a socket and so, you know,

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and there's some mechanical things to,
I think, like a single shot,

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22 rifle, if it's up, good
quality is usually extremely accurate.

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And so if you upgrade the fixed sights
and put an aperture on or eventually

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put a scope on it or something,

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you have a gun that will last you
the rest of your life.

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I still shoot my original ramming,
but Remington Model 514

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that I got when I was ten years
old, single shot, bolt catching 22.

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I shoot it pretty regularly,
so it's still, a lot of fun.

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So I found,
you know, the average, inexpensive,

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affordable 22 is not as accurate
as a bolt action 22.

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And so, you know, if you buy a savage
something, bolt action 22

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and then a run of the mill
semi-automatic 22,

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the bolt gun will more than likely
outshoot the semi-auto.

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And I think that can be an eye
opening experience for people.

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And so if you've

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if you've done the single shot

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rifle now you think, oh,
now I'm going to get a semi-automatic.

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You know, something from here
and you get it and you shoot that

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first group and it's like,
what's going on?

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You know?

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Well, I mean, unless you're going to spend
$1,000 and get, you know, like a

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you know, a custom kind of ten, 22

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or something like that, something
that was acquired since doing, you know,

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that gun's not going to shoot as well
as, your bolt action.

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And then as you grow,
I think you're going to want

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look at I have a couple of and shoots
22 rifle bolt guns in a CC.

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And all of that is based on the experience
you had from your early days.

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And if your early days was banging away
with a,

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you know, some semi-auto 22
or you never learned sight pick,

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you never learn trigger squeeze, you know,
you bought ammo bulk cheap, right?

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So you never learned how to gauge
different ammo and everything.

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So it won't be as fun.

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And I see people lose interest.
They just go, yeah, okay.

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Yeah. Big deal. Yeah.

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I think that's the big thing that,
if people start out

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with the best equipment
and, multiple shot capability,

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where do you go from there?

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But if you start single shot, and again,
start with good quality.

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Doesn't have to be the best,
but a decent quality single shot.

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Or, like you said, at least a 22,

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bolt gun that, you know,
they can't just dump ammo.

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Then, once they build competency faster
because there's less going on,

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and then they start thinking, well, boy,

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I'd really like one of those,
you know, semi-auto.

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So I want a 20 1022 or, you know, I want
a lever action or something like that.

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And it and it builds in steps.

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And that's one of those things
that I think that's a common thread

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that goes through
everything we talk about.

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Roy, is, I guess, to encapsulate my

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one of my favorite lines
is slow down Speed Racer.

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And we've all had buddies.

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I had a buddy that,

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if he got into a certain type of fishing,
he'd go out and buy $500 fishing rods.

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And there was one time
we were out fishing in my boat,

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and he got really frustrated
because anybody that fishes knows

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if there's two guys are boat, one's
going to catch all the fish and one's not.

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It just it seems to work out that way.

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So I was pulling him out left and right.

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We were pan fishing
and he got so mad he started beating his

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this very expensive rod
on the side of the boat and reared back.

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I said, if you throw that in,
I'm diving in to get it.

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Well, fine.

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And he put it,

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he literally, as you always say, Roy
threw down his sucker and just sit there.

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And then he saw me still catching fish.

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So it was that thing that he was,

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and firmly convinced that,

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better quality equipment
made up for his lack of skill.

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And I think that's kind of the big thing
that we fight against,

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almost all the time.

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Better
equipment, will make the expert better,

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but it's not really going to do anything,
for the beginner or the intermediate.

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And it actually might be
counterproductive.

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Well, you and I bait you said lever got.

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And that's a that's a category.

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I kind of forgot about a lever

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gun is an interesting
blend of all of these categories.

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Although you find the average lever action
22 should not be

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as accurate as a good quality bolt action,
but it'll be adequate, you know?

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Yeah.

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I mean, that's a good
Henry makes a really cool little mini

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lever action is great for kids.

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Same thing slows them down.

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You can look over the hammer's cocked.

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You know that the gun's cocked.
You know, it's easy.

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It's good for safety.

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But people say the thing I hear is like.

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Oh, well, you know, I wouldn't
want a single shot 22, because I go

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squirrel hunting, and I want the ability
to have follow up shots.

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It's like.

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I mean, I can't think of the last time

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that I needed more than one shot,
you know?

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And not that I was got the game
every time,

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but usually with a squirrel, if you take
a shot and miss, well, let's go find.

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Yeah. You know.

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And what are you going to do
to open up on along this limb

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as he runs along the limb or something?

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But tell me, what fun is that?

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Plus, it's not safe, you know.

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So yeah, go ahead
play with the semi-auto and stuff.

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And maybe if you're Chase
and jackrabbits in the high desert,

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it's kind of fun to chase him
with a semi-automatic 22.

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If you're doing some weekend competition,
there's a lot of times

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where they use semiautomatic 20 twos
for that kind of stuff.

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So don't I mean, don't hate me.

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I'm not saying
don't buy a semi-auto 22, but

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what this is about is what do you
what do you think you should buy.

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What's your first 22?

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So I mean, honestly,
if you're already a shooter,

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and you have guns and you understand it,

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I would recommend
if you really don't have a 22.

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Which would amaze me, though, right?

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But I would recommend
that you spend some money

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and get a good quality, either
a tuned volt parts and,

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you know, 1022 bass gun
if you want semi-auto or a CC

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or an an shoots or even a good Savage 22,
I would recommend you spend the money,

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get a good accurate 22 rifle, put a scope
on it that costs more than the rifle.

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You will be happy the rest of your life.

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You know.

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It'll be so satisfying. Yeah, so.

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Well,
you know, you talk about squirrel hunting.

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I'm a big squirrel hunter.

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And if it's one thing to miss.

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But if you hit a squirrel
and you don't hit it good and and,

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you know,
they invariably, like you said, they run

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or they immediately dive into a knothole
someplace and you've lost it.

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To me, that is such a failure.

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It it almost ruins my day. So, you know,

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especially really it should be that way
with any kind of hunting.

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And we've talked about this a lot is
it should be the one shot, one kill ethos.

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And there are times
where you have to take a follow up.

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But if you're doing it right,
whether you're talking elk or squirrel,

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you really need to be good enough.

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Be the loose nut behind the gun that
you're good enough that most of the time,

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the vast majority of the time, you're
putting the game down with a single shot.

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So the only time I would say a follow up
shot that is really important

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is if you're hunting cape
buffalo or elephant.

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Lion. Yeah. That's a
that's a different deal.

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Don't use your semi-auto or 22 for that.

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You know I sometimes I have people here

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and I'll break out my old single shot room
to tomorrow 514.

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And of course I have terrible
adjuster open sights, you know, a

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bead with the,
you know, shallow you thing on the rear.

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But once you learn how to hold those
sights, they're they're actually good.

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I scoped one of these guns,
I, I milled it to where I was able

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to install a scope on

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an old 514 Remington, and the darn thing
shoots like a laser beam.

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I mean, it'll shoot
through quarter of an inch at 50 yards.

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And so the gun's capable, right?

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But I have people say, oh, you know,
you can't hit anything with those guns

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because, you know,
they're just single shot, 20 twos,

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and they have terrible sights
and all that.

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Well, I have a spinner targeted, a hunt.

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Well, it's 85 yards here.

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That is for 22, you know, and I always
I always just go

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Let's see, you know, bang tink bang

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tink bang tink at 100 yards.

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It's not because I'm brilliant.

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Of course I've shot this gun 50,000 times.

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Yeah, but, it it teaches you to do that.

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In other words, if

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you have, if, you know,
this is what your limitations are,

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then you're going to learn
to shoot this gun up to its ability.

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And then once you do that,
now when you buy a really good gun,

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like you say, good equipment will help
somebody who's already proficient.

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You know, the game, that extra 5%
or whatever it is.

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And so I mean it's 20 twos are for fun.

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So don't, you know, don't agonize over it.

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But I just recommended the other day
somebody said he shot.

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The last time he shot, he was a kid.

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That was like 40 years ago.

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He said,
I was thinking of buying a 22 rifle,

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and he was going to buy a, you know,
kind of a high end semi-auto 22.

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00:14:58,800 --> 00:15:02,880
And I said, you know, Rick, you don't have
a lot of experience shooting these guns.

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I really recommend you get it.

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If Savage makes a really cool
single shot, 22 rifle

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with aperture sights and stuff,
and I said, just go buy one of those

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and go to the range,
learn to shoot it, relax, have some fun,

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and then move on to something else.

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And so I guess it was more than recently.

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It was a couple months ago.
And so he did just that.

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00:15:24,760 --> 00:15:28,080
And he told me it was he
said, this is so much

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fun, you know, and what fun?

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00:15:31,560 --> 00:15:33,000
Guns are supposed to be fun.

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00:15:33,000 --> 00:15:35,520
They're supposed to be tactical, he said.

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00:15:35,520 --> 00:15:38,840
An added advantage, though,
he says, is ammunition is cheap.

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And I don't, you know, well, I mean,
if if he said if I go to the range,

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00:15:43,240 --> 00:15:46,560
I shoot a 50 round box of ammunition,
that's like an hour.

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Yeah.

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You know, and so he said it's great fun.

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So there we go. It works.

295
00:15:51,760 --> 00:15:53,480
There you go. It does work.

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00:15:53,480 --> 00:15:56,680
And we'd like to hear your thoughts
or questions.

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00:15:57,480 --> 00:16:00,120
You can reach out to us
if you're watching on YouTube.

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00:16:00,120 --> 00:16:02,080
Of course, as I've said often, Roy

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00:16:02,080 --> 00:16:06,040
makes it his daily chore
to go through all those, comments.

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And I look through him, too.

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00:16:07,240 --> 00:16:11,120
But, you can also reach
us, email, editor at guns

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00:16:11,120 --> 00:16:16,440
podcast.us and, I can
I can answer those or triage them.

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00:16:16,440 --> 00:16:19,040
Send them over to Roy
if you want to hear what Roy's got to say.

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00:16:19,040 --> 00:16:23,640
But, anyway,
I think we're both in agreement for folks

305
00:16:23,640 --> 00:16:28,040
starting out the, low round count,
single shot, but decent quality.

306
00:16:28,040 --> 00:16:29,760
22 is the way to go.

307
00:16:29,760 --> 00:16:33,360
Save the semi-auto for when somebody
gets a little more proficient.

308
00:16:33,360 --> 00:16:36,360
So any, final tag on that, Roy?

309
00:16:36,800 --> 00:16:38,880
No, I think, you know, I mean,

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00:16:39,840 --> 00:16:42,840
just because it's single shot doesn't
mean it's not good.

311
00:16:42,920 --> 00:16:44,800
Exactly. You know, truly.

312
00:16:44,800 --> 00:16:46,680
And, or a bolt action.

313
00:16:46,680 --> 00:16:49,400
If, you know, a bolt action
with a magazine or something, that's fine.

314
00:16:49,400 --> 00:16:52,080
That'd be great.
Start a rifle. Even for a kid.

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00:16:52,080 --> 00:16:55,040
As a matter of fact, I had a test gun here
not too long ago.

316
00:16:55,040 --> 00:16:57,960
Was a 22 rifle.
It was. It was actually made for kids.

317
00:16:57,960 --> 00:17:00,960
It was a semi-automatic
22 rifle made for kids,

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00:17:00,960 --> 00:17:05,440
which came with a magazine
that only held one round.

319
00:17:05,640 --> 00:17:08,760
Oh, really? That's it? Yeah. And so you.

320
00:17:09,040 --> 00:17:11,760
So they got experience loading a magazine,

321
00:17:11,760 --> 00:17:15,360
experience learning how to run the action
and all that kind of stuff.

322
00:17:15,560 --> 00:17:18,200
And then they shot
and they only had one shot.

323
00:17:18,200 --> 00:17:21,000
So they didn't just go
bang, bang, make, make make make. Right.

324
00:17:21,000 --> 00:17:23,240
Yeah. And I thought,
you know what? That's clever.

325
00:17:23,240 --> 00:17:27,160
And and you could adapt that if I mean,
if you're really convinced you want your,

326
00:17:27,320 --> 00:17:30,320
your kid to have a ten, 22
for the first time, that's fine.

327
00:17:30,440 --> 00:17:33,560
But make them load one
round in the magazine

328
00:17:33,560 --> 00:17:35,240
while they learn to shoot the gun.

329
00:17:35,240 --> 00:17:36,960
It's so all right.

330
00:17:36,960 --> 00:17:39,680
Mostly. Have fun with it, though. Exactly.

331
00:17:40,720 --> 00:17:42,240
I say it a lot.

332
00:17:42,240 --> 00:17:44,360
Gun and fun are one letter apart,
and they should be.

333
00:17:44,360 --> 00:17:45,320
And we tend to.

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00:17:45,320 --> 00:17:47,280
We tend to lose that nowadays.

335
00:17:47,280 --> 00:17:51,360
So anyway, thanks for joining us here
on Guns Podcast U.S.

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00:17:51,360 --> 00:17:55,360
Of course we have to give a shout out
to our great sponsor, Tango Down.

337
00:17:56,120 --> 00:17:59,360
Visit
Tango down.com to explore the full lineup

338
00:17:59,440 --> 00:18:02,760
and sign up for email updates
so you don't miss what's next?

339
00:18:03,400 --> 00:18:06,400
Tango down combat gear without peer.

340
00:18:09,320 --> 00:18:11,160
So as I said, thanks for joining us.

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00:18:11,160 --> 00:18:14,680
And on behalf of my official co-host Roy
Huntington,

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00:18:15,000 --> 00:18:17,760
I'm Guns podcast, dot U.S.

343
00:18:17,760 --> 00:18:20,640
host Brant Wheat
stumbled over my words there.

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00:18:20,640 --> 00:18:24,800
But anyway, regardless if I can talk
or not, this is Guns Podcast U.S.

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00:18:25,040 --> 00:18:29,200
and as I always end the episode
now get out there and get shooting.