The Continued Fight for Hunting w/ Dan Gates & Karen Gates | Big Hunt Guys Podcast, Ep. 122

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Crazy, it's, yeah, I think people, I don't know,

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I remember when I did the first podcast I ever did,

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I did with J. Scott, you guys know J?

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Yeah.

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Yeah, so I did a J. Scott podcast and it was up,

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I did it, it was remote, so I was upstairs in my loft

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and I remember being so nervous and I was like,

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oh, what's he gonna ask me?

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But I'm not gonna know the answers and, you know,

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at this point it's just like, hey,

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this is just a normal conversation that we have.

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Just like you talked out there.

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Yeah, yeah, no biggies.

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Except the dog's not here to throw the duck to.

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We can let it in.

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I'd love to sit right here in my lap.

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We have a German Shepherd that runs around the office

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and every once in a while it pops in

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and scratches at the door.

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Oh, that's cool.

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Yeah, Jared's dog. I love that.

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Harley.

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Very dog friendly here.

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Very dog friendly.

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When you get a dog?

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My girlfriend has a dog.

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Yeah, that's right.

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So.

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So you basically have a dog?

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You basically now have a dog.

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Yeah.

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Yeah, well thanks for coming in.

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Appreciate it.

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We appreciate it, we got Karen and Dan Gates

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and making the stop.

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You're here for a special engagement?

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Engagement?

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Yeah, we're celebrating our 36th wedding anniversary.

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36, 36.

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36, yeah.

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36 years.

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It seems like it's only been like 50, but.

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Yes.

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Uh.

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I can tell you another 30.

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Yeah.

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I'm thinking there's no way I can live that long.

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Not with this level of stress.

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I think that's the standard answer.

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Yeah, people ask me, how long you been married?

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I don't know, too long.

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It feels like 20 something, but yeah.

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Why Vegas?

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You like Vegas?

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I love Vegas.

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Do you?

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I like the lights, the atmosphere, the hustle and bustle

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because we're rural and so you don't have a lot of that.

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And then the food.

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Oh yeah.

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Yeah, most people come for the food for sure.

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She watches all the home cooking shows and stuff

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and the house is like everything

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that you could possibly imagine,

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especially around the holidays.

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And she wants to experience every single part of that here

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because she doesn't get it at home.

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Yes.

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What kind of food do you like?

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I love Mexican food.

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I love chicken wings.

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Yeah, yeah.

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About sushi, we have really good sushi in town.

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No, I'll have to pass on that.

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No, you're passing on the sushi?

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Really?

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Yeah.

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We did find a little gym of a place on Sunday night

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that we were told about and fantastic.

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I mean, we've been coming here for years.

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We never knew about it.

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I wonder how many food places we actually have in town.

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Like how long it would take you to do.

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I was gonna say, do you guys try to hit different spots

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every time you come?

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Yeah.

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Because there's so many.

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That's, I mean, what do you pick?

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What kind of food do you want that night?

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Yeah, it's hard, but we have never had a bad meal

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no matter if it's breakfast or late lunch

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or the dinners especially.

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There's a difference of atmosphere that you find

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in a place like Vegas where it's based on upon entertainment

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and satisfaction to get people to spend their money

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and get rid of it.

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And piss poor service doesn't bring people back.

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And I think that that's one of the things,

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we can go to in town or up in Colorado Springs or Denver

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and we can have bad service.

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We'd never have bad service in Vegas, ever.

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Yeah, the entire town is built on the service industry.

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Yeah, very much so.

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It's everything.

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They know that people tend to come back

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and they're a little bit more accommodating.

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Now it was different in COVID

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because there wasn't anybody working.

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Sure.

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But it's like, you might wait a little bit.

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So we might have to cook our own food and wash our hands

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and we might have to cook our own food

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and wash our own dishes too.

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But no, it's been pretty good since COVID.

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Yes.

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She gets all her fancy restaurants.

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You win any money?

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I do.

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You do?

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There you go.

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I saved my money for just coming out

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and doing slot machines and buying clothes.

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Yeah, we won a clothes shop and binge on,

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so what is it, Sunday?

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Yes.

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There you go.

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I haven't bought anything, I'll just tell you that.

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There's several movies that you see

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where the guy is always carrying like a bag

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of lots of stuff and I was that guy on Sunday.

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Did you bring like an extra suitcase?

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We do.

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Or we bought.

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We bought one.

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Or we buy luggage too.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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She was actually having pants on

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that she had not worn from two or three times ago

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because she couldn't find a shirt.

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Well, lo and behold, we had to go shirt shopping.

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Yeah, you got to, it's a necessity.

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Exactly.

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Well, in town where we're at,

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you're going to go to Big R or Walmart.

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Tractors of Park.

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Yeah.

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That's a highway feed maybe.

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Yeah, that's the extent of our shopping in Canyon City.

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Do people ask you about your bear claw

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when you're walking around?

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Yeah, actually they do.

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And the belt buckle.

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And the belt buckle.

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Yeah.

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I get recognized for the beard,

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the bear claw and the belt buckle.

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Just your trademarks now.

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Yeah, I was actually playing blackjack the other night

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and the pit boss there said,

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I remember you, you came over and spun the big wheel

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the last time over here.

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I said, yeah.

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And he said, I remember your beard

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and I remember that belt buckle.

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That's pretty cool.

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Yeah, so, but I did get the-

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Of all the people, like he probably sees

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and he remembers.

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Yeah, and that was like nine months ago or 10 months ago.

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And so it was, you feel like you get a little bit of status.

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If we're in town, everybody sees you and recognizes you

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and wants to ask you about pest control

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or what fur prices are going to be here.

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They really care about the person here.

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No fur prices questions here?

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No fur prices questions here, no.

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Shit.

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No, bear claw maybe, but that's about it.

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Well, I want to talk about the bear claw

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because I'm interested what the backstory on it is,

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but we better hit promo codes first before we jump in.

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I'll get too deep.

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I'll keep going.

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I keep looking at the clock over there.

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I'm like, I'm already 5.30 in.

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I'll take you to an hour before I even hit promo codes.

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But we better hit promo codes first.

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Brady, you want to hit promo code?

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It's been a while since I used it.

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Really?

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You want me to run with it?

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I don't even know what we have going on.

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I know we have a little giveaway one.

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Yeah, so we've got a couple.

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You can sign up for a Go Hunt Insider membership.

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You can use the promo code podcasts.

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You're going to get dollars back in the Go Hunt Gear Shop,

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so $50 back in the Go Hunt Gear Shop.

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And then now through the end of May,

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if you use the promo code podcast,

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if you sign up for an Insider membership,

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we're doing a random drawing for a $500 gift card

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to the Go Hunt Gear Shop so you can get geared up

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with some new gear.

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We're trying to beat everybody else.

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Any other affiliates out there that are pushing codes,

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we would like you to ignore their codes

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and use ours because you put in for a $500 gift card.

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So we got that running.

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We got the Memorial Day sale still running.

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Tons of opportunity to save some bucks in the Go Hunt Gear Shop.

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And then, of course, we want to thank SIG.

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SIG being a sponsor of the podcast.

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And you still can use CRWM when you're signing up too.

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You can still use that, which would

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be the only acceptable code.

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Beyond podcasts.

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Use that when we sign up as well.

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You use that one.

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That's the only other acceptable promo code.

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So if you hear any others out there floating around,

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use one of those too.

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Did I cover it?

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Is that pretty good?

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That's pretty good.

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We nailed it.

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That's a quick one, but yeah.

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Well, it's good.

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We got to get to the heart of the matter here.

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I know.

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We got special guests.

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Important guests, important topic.

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That's it.

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That's it.

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So I want to get to know you better just as a person.

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So I talked to you a little bit earlier, and I hope we don't.

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If you have any questions that you're like,

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I don't want to answer that, just let us know.

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But we had you on in Salt Lake at the Hawn Expo,

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which was an awesome podcast.

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I think all of us collectively walked out of that,

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and we were like, man, that was awesome.

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You walked away fired up.

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Yeah, everybody.

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You couldn't help but feel like.

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We got a lot of good feedback out of it.

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Good.

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But the one thing, I mean, the message was awesome,

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which we need to push it.

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We're going to get into it.

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But one of the things that resonated me with me the most

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is just the passion that I felt from you.

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And I think I walked away, and I told Brady,

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I'm like, this Dan Gates dude is the real deal.

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This guy is awesome.

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I just felt so much passion and drive.

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And I love, you wouldn't know it,

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I'm a little bit soft spoken.

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But to talk to people directly, I'm pretty direct, I feel like,

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and to the point, which is something

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I resonate with you.

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I feel like you're direct with your message, which

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I appreciate.

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Thanks.

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Because I think we sugarcoat things a lot too much.

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And I felt like you've been very bold and blunt

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and to the point on what you feel and what you're pushing for

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and how passionate you feel it.

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And I appreciate that.

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So I thought.

272
00:08:39,160 --> 00:08:39,640
Thanks.

273
00:08:39,640 --> 00:08:40,560
Yeah.

274
00:08:40,560 --> 00:08:41,880
Did you have something?

275
00:08:41,880 --> 00:08:42,400
Yes.

276
00:08:42,400 --> 00:08:43,840
I just wanted to get to it.

277
00:08:43,840 --> 00:08:44,800
I always do this.

278
00:08:44,800 --> 00:08:45,920
I feel like I'm Brady.

279
00:08:45,920 --> 00:08:47,480
Sometimes I give you a look too long,

280
00:08:47,480 --> 00:08:48,800
you're like, OK, I want to talk.

281
00:08:48,800 --> 00:08:50,440
Yeah, Brady has to give me side eye.

282
00:08:50,440 --> 00:08:52,880
You know, like your hound dogs, they give you that side eye.

283
00:08:52,880 --> 00:08:53,760
They got long ears.

284
00:08:53,760 --> 00:08:55,080
They're like, yeah, look at that.

285
00:08:55,080 --> 00:08:56,280
That's how I feel from Brady.

286
00:08:56,280 --> 00:08:59,000
He's like, yeah, I got something to say.

287
00:08:59,000 --> 00:09:00,200
Give us some background.

288
00:09:00,200 --> 00:09:01,320
I mean, where are you from?

289
00:09:01,320 --> 00:09:02,360
Where did you grow up?

290
00:09:02,360 --> 00:09:03,480
How did you get in?

291
00:09:03,480 --> 00:09:05,280
I just want to know more about you personally.

292
00:09:05,280 --> 00:09:07,320
And then we'll get into some of this other stuff.

293
00:09:07,320 --> 00:09:09,240
That's not that much of a fabulous story.

294
00:09:09,240 --> 00:09:13,360
I mean, I was born in Missouri, the Show Me state.

295
00:09:13,360 --> 00:09:17,960
Moved to Colorado when I was 12, which is a hell of a long time

296
00:09:17,960 --> 00:09:18,960
ago.

297
00:09:18,960 --> 00:09:22,120
And about the time we've been married, I think.

298
00:09:22,120 --> 00:09:23,120
Pretty much.

299
00:09:23,120 --> 00:09:26,520
But moved there when I was 12 and started working in the tax

300
00:09:26,520 --> 00:09:30,920
a derma shop when I was 12 and had the interest in the outdoors

301
00:09:30,920 --> 00:09:32,000
and hunting and fishing.

302
00:09:32,000 --> 00:09:35,080
And what better place to do it was around game wardens

303
00:09:35,080 --> 00:09:37,680
and hunting guides and taxidermists and trappers

304
00:09:37,680 --> 00:09:40,640
and fur buyers and Western artists.

305
00:09:40,640 --> 00:09:42,360
And that's what the shop was.

306
00:09:42,360 --> 00:09:49,200
And so I just became the shop gopher, so to speak.

307
00:09:49,200 --> 00:09:50,120
When you were 12?

308
00:09:50,120 --> 00:09:51,320
I was 12.

309
00:09:51,320 --> 00:09:55,640
And then actually ended up living in that shop

310
00:09:55,640 --> 00:09:56,920
when I was 15.

311
00:09:56,920 --> 00:09:59,600
And my mom and dad and I didn't get along that well.

312
00:09:59,600 --> 00:10:01,720
And I was bigger, better, meaner, faster, stronger,

313
00:10:01,720 --> 00:10:03,160
and thought I could do what I wanted to do.

314
00:10:03,160 --> 00:10:04,600
And they said, go ahead.

315
00:10:04,600 --> 00:10:05,480
You were a teenager.

316
00:10:05,480 --> 00:10:06,000
Yeah.

317
00:10:06,000 --> 00:10:08,840
And I wish you'd breed some of that into teenagers now.

318
00:10:08,840 --> 00:10:10,280
Yeah.

319
00:10:10,280 --> 00:10:11,960
And the way that I was brought up,

320
00:10:11,960 --> 00:10:13,520
you talk about boldness.

321
00:10:13,520 --> 00:10:15,960
It's not that I'm some big bad ass or anything.

322
00:10:15,960 --> 00:10:18,400
But I worked around some guys that were.

323
00:10:18,400 --> 00:10:21,240
And they treated me either as a punching bag

324
00:10:21,240 --> 00:10:24,440
or as a chew toy, one of the two.

325
00:10:24,440 --> 00:10:26,560
And so I grew up around some guys

326
00:10:26,560 --> 00:10:28,960
that were pretty tough, rough around the edges.

327
00:10:28,960 --> 00:10:31,640
And it kind of set the tone and narrative

328
00:10:31,640 --> 00:10:36,040
for my demeanor and my attitude toward life.

329
00:10:36,040 --> 00:10:38,400
And I think that that's where I got to the point

330
00:10:38,400 --> 00:10:40,480
to where when we've gotten together,

331
00:10:40,480 --> 00:10:44,040
we've always been pretty self-sufficient, self-sustaining,

332
00:10:44,040 --> 00:10:46,360
been self-employed all our lives.

333
00:10:46,360 --> 00:10:47,280
We've had jobs.

334
00:10:47,280 --> 00:10:49,640
But since we've been together, it's

335
00:10:49,640 --> 00:10:52,800
been running a trading post, running a wildlife control

336
00:10:52,800 --> 00:10:56,280
business, and the early stages of life

337
00:10:56,280 --> 00:10:57,840
got you to the point where I didn't

338
00:10:57,840 --> 00:11:01,520
want to depend on anybody else and didn't

339
00:11:01,520 --> 00:11:03,640
think that I needed to.

340
00:11:03,640 --> 00:11:10,760
And it proved very, I guess, in the long scheme of things,

341
00:11:10,760 --> 00:11:13,000
trying to figure out where a couple can get together

342
00:11:13,000 --> 00:11:16,560
and where they can actually work together and have

343
00:11:16,560 --> 00:11:21,840
like-minded ideologies politically and otherwise.

344
00:11:21,840 --> 00:11:23,320
You've got to put your foot down.

345
00:11:23,320 --> 00:11:25,400
And you have to stand up for what's right.

346
00:11:25,400 --> 00:11:27,440
And not that everybody has to agree with that,

347
00:11:27,440 --> 00:11:29,640
but we know the difference between right and wrong.

348
00:11:29,640 --> 00:11:32,560
And I think that that's what those guys in that taxidermy

349
00:11:32,560 --> 00:11:37,320
shop 45 damn near 50 years ago instilled into me.

350
00:11:37,320 --> 00:11:39,560
And I remember them chasing me around the table

351
00:11:39,560 --> 00:11:42,280
because I told them no, and I would holler expletives back

352
00:11:42,280 --> 00:11:43,040
at them.

353
00:11:43,040 --> 00:11:44,600
And one of them would grab a hold of me,

354
00:11:44,600 --> 00:11:46,800
and the no became a yes.

355
00:11:46,800 --> 00:11:48,680
But it was no again.

356
00:11:48,680 --> 00:11:52,280
And so it gives you a little bit of a chip on your shoulder,

357
00:11:52,280 --> 00:11:53,480
an intestinal fortitude.

358
00:11:53,480 --> 00:11:56,280
And I am a bigger, better manifester, stronger

359
00:11:56,280 --> 00:11:57,560
for it, I think.

360
00:11:57,560 --> 00:12:01,160
How did you get a job at a taxidermy shop at 12?

361
00:12:01,160 --> 00:12:04,680
There was a flea market at the dog track next to Bob's Liquor

362
00:12:04,680 --> 00:12:06,360
on North Prospect.

363
00:12:06,360 --> 00:12:08,720
This story's getting better and better.

364
00:12:08,720 --> 00:12:11,120
I knew you would have some of that.

365
00:12:11,120 --> 00:12:14,600
I'm like, man, this is the stuff I want to know.

366
00:12:14,600 --> 00:12:18,240
A dog track of liquor's from a taxidermy shop.

367
00:12:18,240 --> 00:12:19,240
At a flea market.

368
00:12:19,240 --> 00:12:21,040
And we went to the flea market one day,

369
00:12:21,040 --> 00:12:23,440
and I was enamored by taxidermy stuff.

370
00:12:23,440 --> 00:12:27,000
And my dad dropped me off there, and I started sweeping floors.

371
00:12:27,000 --> 00:12:32,480
And from then on out, it just became the second home

372
00:12:32,480 --> 00:12:33,960
to the first home.

373
00:12:33,960 --> 00:12:34,880
And all the-

374
00:12:34,880 --> 00:12:36,080
Just hanging around?

375
00:12:36,080 --> 00:12:37,320
Yeah, just started hanging around.

376
00:12:37,320 --> 00:12:38,720
And he was like, here's a broom.

377
00:12:38,720 --> 00:12:39,880
Do this.

378
00:12:39,880 --> 00:12:41,760
And pretty soon, you know how to scan.

379
00:12:41,760 --> 00:12:44,600
I didn't know what I was doing at that age

380
00:12:44,600 --> 00:12:47,000
because I'd never been around much of it.

381
00:12:47,000 --> 00:12:50,080
But I joke, and I was on, I think it was Bobby Marshall's

382
00:12:50,080 --> 00:12:52,200
podcast, the Mountainside podcast.

383
00:12:52,200 --> 00:12:56,800
And I mentioned that a book that I read in junior high high

384
00:12:56,800 --> 00:12:59,200
school was a book called Give Your Heart to the Hawks

385
00:12:59,200 --> 00:13:00,240
by Winford Blevins.

386
00:13:00,240 --> 00:13:02,200
And it was about the mountain men.

387
00:13:02,200 --> 00:13:03,960
And it just enamored the hell out of me

388
00:13:03,960 --> 00:13:06,480
to the point to where that's what I wanted to do when I grew

389
00:13:06,480 --> 00:13:07,120
up.

390
00:13:07,120 --> 00:13:09,400
And I'm probably as close as you can

391
00:13:09,400 --> 00:13:13,080
get in a contemporary lifestyle to be able to, at least

392
00:13:13,080 --> 00:13:14,840
in my mind, live that.

393
00:13:14,840 --> 00:13:16,760
You know that picture I showed you on the shirt?

394
00:13:16,760 --> 00:13:17,260
Yeah.

395
00:13:17,260 --> 00:13:19,840
I mean, that's a buckskin and regalia

396
00:13:19,840 --> 00:13:23,360
that I have now when I try to do some historical reenactments

397
00:13:23,360 --> 00:13:24,600
and stuff.

398
00:13:24,600 --> 00:13:26,840
But that's the ideology that I had when I was a kid,

399
00:13:26,840 --> 00:13:28,560
is this is what I wanted to do.

400
00:13:28,560 --> 00:13:31,880
Matter of fact, my shop teacher was her neighbor,

401
00:13:31,880 --> 00:13:34,120
which we didn't know each other at all.

402
00:13:34,120 --> 00:13:35,520
No.

403
00:13:35,520 --> 00:13:37,600
But he told me at one time, he says, Mr. Gates,

404
00:13:37,600 --> 00:13:39,920
you're not Jim Bridger, and this is not 1840.

405
00:13:39,920 --> 00:13:43,120
You know, you need to get a college education.

406
00:13:43,120 --> 00:13:46,480
But he let me build a cannon and a muzzleloader in shop class.

407
00:13:46,480 --> 00:13:50,120
I would skin raccoons in the welding booth at lunchtime.

408
00:13:50,120 --> 00:13:53,240
And I had a 68 Pontiac Catalina station wagon

409
00:13:53,240 --> 00:13:56,760
that I hauled dead crap around all the time, checking traps.

410
00:13:56,760 --> 00:14:00,760
And I kind of set my own path, but I

411
00:14:00,760 --> 00:14:03,400
did it on the coattails of a lot of other people

412
00:14:03,400 --> 00:14:06,240
that were influential in my life, that

413
00:14:06,240 --> 00:14:09,640
had morals, ethics, and values, and personal boots

414
00:14:09,640 --> 00:14:12,320
on the ground experience about a lot of different stuff.

415
00:14:12,320 --> 00:14:13,980
And one thing that's really interesting

416
00:14:13,980 --> 00:14:17,400
is one of the guys that kind of coddled me,

417
00:14:17,400 --> 00:14:22,360
that I worked for for years and years, his name is Dick Hain.

418
00:14:22,360 --> 00:14:25,080
I'll give him a shout out, because he's kind of essentially

419
00:14:25,080 --> 00:14:29,400
still the godfather of our son.

420
00:14:29,400 --> 00:14:32,080
And our son goes over and sees Dick and his wife, Dick

421
00:14:32,080 --> 00:14:32,580
and Joan.

422
00:14:32,580 --> 00:14:35,560
And Dick is mid-80s now.

423
00:14:35,560 --> 00:14:40,720
And so friends and stewards and mentors

424
00:14:40,720 --> 00:14:43,360
that you have in your life, if they're important,

425
00:14:43,360 --> 00:14:44,600
stay in your life.

426
00:14:44,600 --> 00:14:46,680
And people like that have.

427
00:14:46,680 --> 00:14:48,000
Not original family.

428
00:14:48,000 --> 00:14:51,080
He knew my mom and dad and knew all the people I grew up with

429
00:14:51,080 --> 00:14:53,200
and watched me get the crap kicked out of me

430
00:14:53,200 --> 00:14:55,240
and watched me kick the crap out of somebody else

431
00:14:55,240 --> 00:14:58,800
and try to instigate me kicking the crap out of other people

432
00:14:58,800 --> 00:15:01,320
and making sure I get the crap kicked out of me again.

433
00:15:01,320 --> 00:15:03,080
So.

434
00:15:03,080 --> 00:15:04,160
Yeah.

435
00:15:04,160 --> 00:15:05,920
Not funny, I think, as you're talking.

436
00:15:05,920 --> 00:15:07,760
I'm going to have Garth Roberts was a guy,

437
00:15:07,760 --> 00:15:08,960
and I'll give him a shout out.

438
00:15:08,960 --> 00:15:09,760
He's since passed.

439
00:15:09,760 --> 00:15:13,040
But his grandson, Riley Roberts, I went to high school with.

440
00:15:13,040 --> 00:15:14,840
But I remember going over to his house,

441
00:15:14,840 --> 00:15:18,200
and he lived in a log cabin that I'm pretty sure they must

442
00:15:18,200 --> 00:15:19,080
have built themselves.

443
00:15:19,080 --> 00:15:20,280
It was pieced together.

444
00:15:20,280 --> 00:15:24,680
But he had the world record mountain lion for a lot of years.

445
00:15:24,680 --> 00:15:26,840
And he had that, and he had several other mounts

446
00:15:26,840 --> 00:15:27,400
in his house.

447
00:15:27,400 --> 00:15:30,960
But I remember being probably six to 10 and going

448
00:15:30,960 --> 00:15:33,160
in a wood-burning stove and just going over there.

449
00:15:33,160 --> 00:15:35,000
And I remember looking at that lion skull

450
00:15:35,000 --> 00:15:37,440
and just thinking, man, that is the coolest thing I've ever

451
00:15:37,440 --> 00:15:39,640
seen, giant big mountain lion skull.

452
00:15:39,640 --> 00:15:41,480
But that kind of stuff stuck with me, too.

453
00:15:41,480 --> 00:15:43,720
I grew up around guys that were probably

454
00:15:43,720 --> 00:15:46,280
some of the biggest, baddest, meanest, toughest sons of bitches

455
00:15:46,280 --> 00:15:46,960
on the planet.

456
00:15:46,960 --> 00:15:49,640
And I don't say that because I was a kid at the time.

457
00:15:49,640 --> 00:15:50,840
They were.

458
00:15:50,840 --> 00:15:54,160
I mean, you remember the blazing saddle story with Alex Karras

459
00:15:54,160 --> 00:15:55,760
when he knocked that horse out.

460
00:15:55,760 --> 00:15:57,080
These guys could.

461
00:15:57,080 --> 00:16:01,920
And just great big giant hands of steel and rough tumble,

462
00:16:01,920 --> 00:16:04,800
but really thoughtfully minded and really respectful,

463
00:16:04,800 --> 00:16:06,040
old school.

464
00:16:06,040 --> 00:16:09,080
And I think that it's probably instilled a little bit.

465
00:16:09,080 --> 00:16:11,080
There was a lot of sarcasm.

466
00:16:11,080 --> 00:16:14,400
A lot of vulgarness and a lot of professionalism,

467
00:16:14,400 --> 00:16:16,720
but a lot of thoughtfulness at the same time.

468
00:16:16,720 --> 00:16:20,040
And a care for the landscape and a care for the wildlife

469
00:16:20,040 --> 00:16:21,640
and the natural resources.

470
00:16:21,640 --> 00:16:23,720
And I think that that's probably brought it into me

471
00:16:23,720 --> 00:16:27,240
to some point because I really do care about it.

472
00:16:27,240 --> 00:16:29,960
And I care about what we can do because what

473
00:16:29,960 --> 00:16:32,920
we've been able to establish in ourselves,

474
00:16:32,920 --> 00:16:34,720
we ran a trading post for 25 years,

475
00:16:34,720 --> 00:16:36,120
and it was an old time trading post.

476
00:16:36,120 --> 00:16:38,200
I mean, you could bring your hides in and trade them

477
00:16:38,200 --> 00:16:40,080
for Indian jewelry to take home or candles

478
00:16:40,080 --> 00:16:42,400
or taxidermy or whatever.

479
00:16:42,400 --> 00:16:43,920
And we've run the wildlife control business

480
00:16:43,920 --> 00:16:45,400
for going on 40 years.

481
00:16:45,400 --> 00:16:48,000
And we, wildlife control in this sense,

482
00:16:48,000 --> 00:16:50,040
is we solve human animal conflicts.

483
00:16:50,040 --> 00:16:52,400
We resolve problems in power plants

484
00:16:52,400 --> 00:16:53,600
and utility infrastructures

485
00:16:53,600 --> 00:16:56,040
and department of defense structures.

486
00:16:56,040 --> 00:16:59,400
We've had a blessed life to do what we do.

487
00:16:59,400 --> 00:17:04,400
We do it not in much uniformity to what other people do,

488
00:17:04,760 --> 00:17:07,280
but I think that we're losing a lot of that.

489
00:17:07,280 --> 00:17:08,760
And I think we're losing a lot of it

490
00:17:08,760 --> 00:17:11,040
when it comes to the natural resource management

491
00:17:11,040 --> 00:17:13,080
and the ideology of why we do what we do

492
00:17:13,080 --> 00:17:15,360
and how we need to continually be able to do it.

493
00:17:15,360 --> 00:17:17,960
And she's a major component of every single thing

494
00:17:17,960 --> 00:17:20,040
that we've been doing for the last 36 years

495
00:17:20,040 --> 00:17:21,400
that we've been together.

496
00:17:21,400 --> 00:17:25,440
Did, were you, I mean, taxidermy shop,

497
00:17:25,440 --> 00:17:26,600
did those guys kind of mentor you

498
00:17:26,600 --> 00:17:27,760
as far as hunting goes to you

499
00:17:27,760 --> 00:17:29,600
and kind of take you out hunting with them?

500
00:17:29,600 --> 00:17:30,520
Did your dad hunt?

501
00:17:31,800 --> 00:17:33,520
My dad hunted very, very minimally,

502
00:17:33,520 --> 00:17:35,200
and I went with him several times as a kid,

503
00:17:35,200 --> 00:17:39,640
but he was, it was more of a,

504
00:17:39,640 --> 00:17:41,560
the guys get together side of things.

505
00:17:41,560 --> 00:17:44,800
And so I was tagging along with the outfitters

506
00:17:44,800 --> 00:17:45,960
and the hunting guides and stuff.

507
00:17:45,960 --> 00:17:47,800
And I was the Wrangler, and like I said,

508
00:17:47,800 --> 00:17:48,920
I was the gopher.

509
00:17:48,920 --> 00:17:50,520
And I mean, there's a lot of stuff

510
00:17:50,520 --> 00:17:53,920
that I did that nobody else would do

511
00:17:53,920 --> 00:17:56,280
because I just wanted to turn around and be with the guys.

512
00:17:56,280 --> 00:17:57,400
You know, it was-

513
00:17:57,400 --> 00:17:58,240
You want a community.

514
00:17:58,240 --> 00:18:00,720
Yeah, you know, and it's funny

515
00:18:00,720 --> 00:18:04,520
because I've been around this side of things for so long

516
00:18:04,520 --> 00:18:09,520
that with as intimately involved or integrally involved

517
00:18:09,520 --> 00:18:11,720
as I am within like Colorado Parks and Wildlife,

518
00:18:11,720 --> 00:18:14,280
which used to be the Colorado Division of Wildlife,

519
00:18:14,280 --> 00:18:17,400
I'll mention names of people that I grew up around

520
00:18:17,400 --> 00:18:20,360
that were in their latter stages of their career.

521
00:18:20,360 --> 00:18:22,680
And people now that have been in 30 or 40 years

522
00:18:22,680 --> 00:18:23,520
will look and go,

523
00:18:23,520 --> 00:18:25,440
how the hell long you've been playing this game?

524
00:18:25,440 --> 00:18:27,240
Because they heard the names,

525
00:18:27,240 --> 00:18:28,880
but they didn't, you know,

526
00:18:28,880 --> 00:18:33,480
somebody's name or badge number might be on a wall.

527
00:18:33,480 --> 00:18:34,600
They didn't know them personally.

528
00:18:34,600 --> 00:18:35,720
Well, I did.

529
00:18:35,720 --> 00:18:38,240
And so I've been through the ups and downs

530
00:18:38,240 --> 00:18:40,000
and hoops and hurdles of wildlife management

531
00:18:40,000 --> 00:18:42,160
over the course of the last 50 years,

532
00:18:42,160 --> 00:18:43,880
not forever, but last 50 years.

533
00:18:43,880 --> 00:18:46,360
And that gives me a little bit of street cred.

534
00:18:46,360 --> 00:18:48,320
But I also think it gives,

535
00:18:48,320 --> 00:18:50,960
I personally, I believe that it gives our enemies

536
00:18:50,960 --> 00:18:53,840
a bigger target because they haven't run into somebody

537
00:18:53,840 --> 00:18:56,680
from the private side that is intimately involved

538
00:18:56,680 --> 00:18:58,640
as what I am or what we are.

539
00:18:58,640 --> 00:19:00,280
And so we're the bigger threat.

540
00:19:00,280 --> 00:19:02,320
And that's not putting us on a pedestal

541
00:19:02,320 --> 00:19:05,040
and it's not, you know, it's not,

542
00:19:05,040 --> 00:19:07,680
they are bastardizing us for what we do,

543
00:19:07,680 --> 00:19:09,320
but it's from a historical perspective,

544
00:19:09,320 --> 00:19:10,440
everything that we've done

545
00:19:10,440 --> 00:19:12,120
for our entire lives, essentially.

546
00:19:12,120 --> 00:19:12,960
Yeah.

547
00:19:12,960 --> 00:19:14,680
It's the difference of trying to read something

548
00:19:14,680 --> 00:19:16,520
and get a feel for it,

549
00:19:16,520 --> 00:19:17,800
and then actually living through it

550
00:19:17,800 --> 00:19:20,240
and experiencing it and seeing the change, the dynamics.

551
00:19:20,240 --> 00:19:22,440
There's a massive difference there

552
00:19:22,440 --> 00:19:26,360
in your breadth of understanding and how things work,

553
00:19:26,360 --> 00:19:28,640
how things used to work and kind of that transition

554
00:19:28,640 --> 00:19:30,160
and how you're seeing things work now.

555
00:19:30,160 --> 00:19:32,160
It's this scope of understanding

556
00:19:32,160 --> 00:19:34,360
that really only somebody like yourself could have.

557
00:19:34,360 --> 00:19:38,400
Well, and two, because we're in their businesses.

558
00:19:38,400 --> 00:19:40,080
We're in their houses.

559
00:19:40,080 --> 00:19:41,400
We're correcting problems.

560
00:19:41,400 --> 00:19:46,400
We see things evolve and adapt on the ecosystem side,

561
00:19:46,800 --> 00:19:48,800
but people themselves have to figure out a way

562
00:19:48,800 --> 00:19:50,040
to evolve and adapt.

563
00:19:50,040 --> 00:19:51,760
And the average person,

564
00:19:51,760 --> 00:19:54,400
that if they've been in a position for six years,

565
00:19:54,400 --> 00:19:55,560
well, they might have some knowledge,

566
00:19:55,560 --> 00:19:57,080
but they don't have institutional knowledge.

567
00:19:57,080 --> 00:19:59,160
They don't have historical precedent knowledge.

568
00:19:59,160 --> 00:20:01,640
I mean, I'm dealing with Bureau of Land Management

569
00:20:01,640 --> 00:20:03,840
and Forest Officers, Rangers or whatever.

570
00:20:03,840 --> 00:20:06,480
And the guy telling me or telling the rancher

571
00:20:06,480 --> 00:20:09,320
that I deal with is six generations of ranching

572
00:20:09,320 --> 00:20:11,120
on this particular property.

573
00:20:11,120 --> 00:20:13,520
And the guy's there six months with a college degree

574
00:20:13,520 --> 00:20:16,520
telling them what they need to do because the book says it.

575
00:20:16,520 --> 00:20:18,320
That's part of our problem when it comes

576
00:20:18,320 --> 00:20:21,000
to the ecological side of wildlife

577
00:20:21,000 --> 00:20:22,920
and natural resource management.

578
00:20:23,960 --> 00:20:27,200
You might know a little bit, but you don't know it all.

579
00:20:27,200 --> 00:20:29,760
And we don't know everything,

580
00:20:29,760 --> 00:20:32,880
but I got a pretty damn good shot of guessing

581
00:20:32,880 --> 00:20:34,560
just because of the historical experience

582
00:20:34,560 --> 00:20:35,640
and knowledge that we bring.

583
00:20:35,640 --> 00:20:37,520
And she's gotten to be,

584
00:20:37,520 --> 00:20:39,320
after as long as she's hung around

585
00:20:39,320 --> 00:20:40,800
and doing what we're doing,

586
00:20:40,800 --> 00:20:42,760
she can get on the phone and talk the talk

587
00:20:42,760 --> 00:20:45,760
and walk the walk too with people that don't know.

588
00:20:45,760 --> 00:20:49,240
The average customer that calls us and has a problem,

589
00:20:49,240 --> 00:20:51,080
she turns around and gives a good enough spiel out

590
00:20:51,080 --> 00:20:53,800
to where it's like, she's not feeding them a line.

591
00:20:53,800 --> 00:20:55,480
She's giving them the facts and the data

592
00:20:55,480 --> 00:20:57,200
and the truth and the statistics

593
00:20:57,200 --> 00:20:59,920
from what we've dealt with for the last 45 years.

594
00:20:59,920 --> 00:21:01,160
Sure.

595
00:21:01,160 --> 00:21:02,920
When did you guys meet?

596
00:21:02,920 --> 00:21:04,800
I wanna hear more about what it is

597
00:21:04,800 --> 00:21:07,440
that you do here together, but when did you guys meet?

598
00:21:09,280 --> 00:21:11,840
Actually, I kind of stalked him.

599
00:21:13,840 --> 00:21:17,480
I worked at the DA's office in the Springs for 12 years.

600
00:21:17,480 --> 00:21:19,480
I was a convicted felon, so I know.

601
00:21:19,480 --> 00:21:22,280
And he worked for the county and the maintenance then

602
00:21:22,280 --> 00:21:23,680
and I happened to spot him.

603
00:21:23,680 --> 00:21:26,280
And so for a few weeks and that,

604
00:21:26,280 --> 00:21:28,280
I would see where he would park and I would follow

605
00:21:28,280 --> 00:21:30,720
and park there, so we would run into each other.

606
00:21:30,720 --> 00:21:31,560
Yeah, naturally.

607
00:21:31,560 --> 00:21:36,560
We just kinda, finally he asked me out and we actually.

608
00:21:36,880 --> 00:21:38,440
Wasn't really out.

609
00:21:38,440 --> 00:21:41,400
It was more of a, you wanna go get a drink.

610
00:21:41,400 --> 00:21:44,120
We did do that, yes, yes.

611
00:21:44,120 --> 00:21:45,440
I was just trying to get lucky.

612
00:21:45,440 --> 00:21:46,840
That's all it was.

613
00:21:46,840 --> 00:21:50,720
And so we lived together for a couple years

614
00:21:50,720 --> 00:21:53,760
and he kinda introduced me to hunting.

615
00:21:53,760 --> 00:21:55,720
My dad and my uncles all hunted,

616
00:21:55,720 --> 00:21:58,360
but I didn't really do too much or pay attention.

617
00:21:58,360 --> 00:22:03,240
And so I figured, well, if I want to be with him,

618
00:22:03,240 --> 00:22:05,440
I would have to learn about it.

619
00:22:05,440 --> 00:22:07,640
So I surprised him and signed myself up

620
00:22:07,640 --> 00:22:11,880
for hunter education class down at a sporting goods store.

621
00:22:11,880 --> 00:22:13,920
I was very nervous, cause I'm dyslexic.

622
00:22:13,920 --> 00:22:16,360
So I wasn't sure if I could pass the test and everything,

623
00:22:16,360 --> 00:22:20,640
but did that for two days and got my hunter safety card

624
00:22:20,640 --> 00:22:25,640
and figured, and so that kinda impressed him.

625
00:22:25,840 --> 00:22:26,920
There you go.

626
00:22:28,920 --> 00:22:30,760
Do you guys hunt together still?

627
00:22:30,760 --> 00:22:33,920
I go hunting some with him.

628
00:22:33,920 --> 00:22:35,040
She killed a cow elk last year.

629
00:22:35,040 --> 00:22:36,640
I did on Thanksgiving morning.

630
00:22:36,640 --> 00:22:37,760
There you go. That was fun.

631
00:22:37,760 --> 00:22:38,760
That's a good Thanksgiving.

632
00:22:38,760 --> 00:22:41,840
Yes, and my first one after I got my hunter safety card,

633
00:22:41,840 --> 00:22:45,720
I got a doe and she's mounted and she's up on our wall

634
00:22:45,720 --> 00:22:46,560
with all of our other stuff.

635
00:22:46,560 --> 00:22:48,000
Yeah, you don't have any does in here at all.

636
00:22:48,000 --> 00:22:48,840
No, we don't have any.

637
00:22:48,840 --> 00:22:50,840
Did you mount it?

638
00:22:50,840 --> 00:22:52,280
Did you do the taxidermy with it?

639
00:22:52,280 --> 00:22:55,440
No, no, actually a friend of ours did that I was,

640
00:22:55,440 --> 00:23:00,000
cause we were so busy at the time doing the fur preparation

641
00:23:00,000 --> 00:23:01,400
and the trapping and stuff.

642
00:23:01,400 --> 00:23:03,600
I just gave it to a buddy of ours and he did it,

643
00:23:03,600 --> 00:23:04,920
but it's still hanging on the wall.

644
00:23:04,920 --> 00:23:05,760
It's a shoulder mount?

645
00:23:05,760 --> 00:23:06,920
It's a full shoulder mount.

646
00:23:06,920 --> 00:23:08,160
That's awesome.

647
00:23:08,160 --> 00:23:09,000
Brady, you should do one of those.

648
00:23:09,000 --> 00:23:10,320
I really should, that'd be kinda cool.

649
00:23:10,320 --> 00:23:11,360
You ever killed a doe?

650
00:23:13,240 --> 00:23:14,960
Maybe two or three.

651
00:23:14,960 --> 00:23:15,960
I've killed plenty of cow elk,

652
00:23:15,960 --> 00:23:17,000
but I don't think I've ever killed a doe.

653
00:23:17,000 --> 00:23:18,320
See, she's up on you there.

654
00:23:18,320 --> 00:23:19,160
Yeah, that's it.

655
00:23:19,160 --> 00:23:20,480
You've done some, I've never done.

656
00:23:20,480 --> 00:23:21,320
Yeah.

657
00:23:21,320 --> 00:23:22,160
Yeah, lots of.

658
00:23:22,160 --> 00:23:23,000
Get all the heads and go hunt,

659
00:23:23,000 --> 00:23:24,120
you don't have a doe for ground allowed.

660
00:23:24,120 --> 00:23:25,680
I think we ought to.

661
00:23:25,680 --> 00:23:26,800
I think we need a doe right here.

662
00:23:26,800 --> 00:23:27,640
We probably do.

663
00:23:27,640 --> 00:23:29,920
We better add that to the list.

664
00:23:29,920 --> 00:23:31,200
Taking a lot of whitetail does,

665
00:23:31,200 --> 00:23:32,960
but I haven't taken very many mule deer does.

666
00:23:32,960 --> 00:23:34,920
Yeah, I love that, that'd be cool actually.

667
00:23:34,920 --> 00:23:38,280
First time we ever went to meet my parents,

668
00:23:38,280 --> 00:23:41,280
she was riding along and I jumped out of the truck

669
00:23:41,280 --> 00:23:46,280
and shot a coyote and she thought I shot a German Shepherd.

670
00:23:46,360 --> 00:23:47,960
Oh, I was hysterical.

671
00:23:47,960 --> 00:23:51,040
She didn't understand why I killed somebody's dog.

672
00:23:51,040 --> 00:23:51,960
It was like it was a coyote.

673
00:23:51,960 --> 00:23:53,680
She said, I see those things all over the place.

674
00:23:53,680 --> 00:23:54,520
I'd be riding my horse.

675
00:23:54,520 --> 00:23:55,360
Those are coyotes.

676
00:23:55,360 --> 00:23:57,400
Yeah, in the Eastern part of Colorado Springs,

677
00:23:57,400 --> 00:23:58,240
I'd see them all the time,

678
00:23:58,240 --> 00:24:00,160
but I didn't realize that's what it was.

679
00:24:00,160 --> 00:24:01,000
Sure.

680
00:24:01,000 --> 00:24:01,840
You know?

681
00:24:01,840 --> 00:24:06,240
And then after I saw what it was and realized,

682
00:24:06,240 --> 00:24:07,320
then one day I came home

683
00:24:07,320 --> 00:24:10,320
and he's washing the coyote hides in my bathtub.

684
00:24:10,320 --> 00:24:13,240
And so that was an opening experience,

685
00:24:13,240 --> 00:24:16,920
but now that's what I look forward to every season

686
00:24:16,920 --> 00:24:19,920
that he goes out because now I wash all those hides.

687
00:24:19,920 --> 00:24:20,880
Okay.

688
00:24:20,880 --> 00:24:21,720
And I love it.

689
00:24:21,720 --> 00:24:24,280
We used to have a trapping supplies business

690
00:24:24,280 --> 00:24:27,080
in the basement of a house that we had.

691
00:24:27,080 --> 00:24:29,680
And she'd go home at lunch from the DA's office

692
00:24:29,680 --> 00:24:32,080
to sell trapping supplies to the people.

693
00:24:32,080 --> 00:24:32,920
And louvers.

694
00:24:32,920 --> 00:24:35,520
And she would skin muskrats at night

695
00:24:35,520 --> 00:24:38,080
and on her way to work, she would pick up,

696
00:24:38,080 --> 00:24:40,760
carcass stuff that was roadkill, spray it with Raid,

697
00:24:40,760 --> 00:24:42,080
put it in a bag and then turn around

698
00:24:42,080 --> 00:24:43,520
and take it in her car to work.

699
00:24:43,520 --> 00:24:44,360
Really?

700
00:24:44,360 --> 00:24:45,200
Yeah.

701
00:24:45,200 --> 00:24:46,840
Gosh, you guys have probably have some crazy stories.

702
00:24:46,840 --> 00:24:49,360
Or a truckload of coyotes that we get

703
00:24:49,360 --> 00:24:50,920
because they had a bounty.

704
00:24:50,920 --> 00:24:53,360
So I take them to the county assessor's office

705
00:24:53,360 --> 00:24:55,960
and I get my two bucks and then I park.

706
00:24:55,960 --> 00:24:56,800
Two bucks?

707
00:24:56,800 --> 00:24:57,620
Two bucks for an ear.

708
00:24:57,620 --> 00:24:58,460
Two dollars for a bounty.

709
00:24:58,460 --> 00:25:01,960
And she'd take 150 or 200.

710
00:25:01,960 --> 00:25:03,840
Cause all they did was just clip the ears then.

711
00:25:03,840 --> 00:25:04,680
Yeah, yeah.

712
00:25:04,680 --> 00:25:08,080
So she'd make 150 or 200 dollars a week off of coyotes.

713
00:25:08,080 --> 00:25:09,920
And they kept thinking,

714
00:25:09,920 --> 00:25:11,040
something's wrong with this girl.

715
00:25:11,040 --> 00:25:13,560
She's got high heels.

716
00:25:13,560 --> 00:25:15,560
And she goes,

717
00:25:15,560 --> 00:25:18,000
Go work at the DA's office.

718
00:25:18,000 --> 00:25:20,200
Mercury links full of coyote hides.

719
00:25:20,200 --> 00:25:22,120
You know, clip the ears in there.

720
00:25:22,120 --> 00:25:22,960
So.

721
00:25:22,960 --> 00:25:24,240
Yeah.

722
00:25:24,240 --> 00:25:26,680
So you owned a trading post?

723
00:25:26,680 --> 00:25:29,240
Yeah, we did for 25 years.

724
00:25:29,240 --> 00:25:31,880
We just recently closed it down just because of,

725
00:25:31,880 --> 00:25:34,520
well, her mom and dad used to work at Forest

726
00:25:34,520 --> 00:25:35,680
when we weren't available.

727
00:25:35,680 --> 00:25:38,320
But I mean, we did muzzle loading supplies

728
00:25:38,320 --> 00:25:40,600
and taxidermy and hides and furs and.

729
00:25:40,600 --> 00:25:42,480
You just kind of built that up from scratch?

730
00:25:42,480 --> 00:25:43,320
From scratch.

731
00:25:43,320 --> 00:25:44,160
Yeah.

732
00:25:44,160 --> 00:25:47,640
First time we ever actually started doing stuff like that,

733
00:25:47,640 --> 00:25:48,640
that she was part of it.

734
00:25:48,640 --> 00:25:50,240
I'd been doing it all my life.

735
00:25:50,240 --> 00:25:52,120
Was, I asked her if she wanted to go

736
00:25:52,120 --> 00:25:53,760
to Santa Fe, New Mexico.

737
00:25:53,760 --> 00:25:56,240
And so we set up at the Teseque Indian reservation

738
00:25:56,240 --> 00:26:00,040
down there and set up, you know, during the flea market.

739
00:26:00,040 --> 00:26:02,560
And I remember her sitting in the front seat of the truck

740
00:26:02,560 --> 00:26:05,000
in a, what was it, 87 Chevy pickup

741
00:26:05,000 --> 00:26:07,040
and no air conditioning with a border collie dog

742
00:26:07,040 --> 00:26:08,480
sitting in a halter top and shorts

743
00:26:08,480 --> 00:26:10,760
and counting a hundred dollar bills trying to.

744
00:26:10,760 --> 00:26:14,320
And she was making like $11,000 a year.

745
00:26:14,320 --> 00:26:17,040
And we made like $11,000 in two days selling skulls

746
00:26:17,040 --> 00:26:18,040
and parts and pieces.

747
00:26:18,040 --> 00:26:21,600
And she's like, hey, this guy might not be that half bad.

748
00:26:21,600 --> 00:26:23,560
Maybe this might work out pretty good.

749
00:26:23,560 --> 00:26:25,000
Did you do a lot of that traveling

750
00:26:25,000 --> 00:26:27,760
and hit a lot of flea markets and stuff?

751
00:26:27,760 --> 00:26:31,360
Cheyenne frontier days and friendship Indiana.

752
00:26:31,360 --> 00:26:33,840
Yeah, the national muzzle loading.

753
00:26:33,840 --> 00:26:36,000
There was times I was on the road for six or eight weeks

754
00:26:36,000 --> 00:26:38,600
at a time going around and selling parts and pieces.

755
00:26:38,600 --> 00:26:41,840
And I did the Kenton coon dog trials.

756
00:26:41,840 --> 00:26:42,680
Yeah.

757
00:26:42,680 --> 00:26:43,760
Yeah, if you haven't been there,

758
00:26:43,760 --> 00:26:46,680
that's that's that you talk about deliverance.

759
00:26:46,680 --> 00:26:49,120
I mean, that's about as close as you can get.

760
00:26:49,120 --> 00:26:52,320
You know, it's like, people said, where's your wife?

761
00:26:52,320 --> 00:26:53,160
I said, she didn't come.

762
00:26:53,160 --> 00:26:54,080
You came by yourself.

763
00:26:54,080 --> 00:26:54,920
Are you an idiot?

764
00:26:54,920 --> 00:26:56,600
What the hell's wrong with you?

765
00:26:56,600 --> 00:26:57,440
It's like,

766
00:26:59,040 --> 00:27:01,080
We would take a deer and elk hides in

767
00:27:01,080 --> 00:27:04,440
and I would finish cutting off the big pieces of meat

768
00:27:04,440 --> 00:27:05,720
and then salt them.

769
00:27:05,720 --> 00:27:07,160
So we'd go through that process

770
00:27:07,160 --> 00:27:09,480
and then we would have trailer loads.

771
00:27:09,480 --> 00:27:10,880
Like semi trailer loads.

772
00:27:10,880 --> 00:27:12,920
We didn't often either get tan for customers

773
00:27:12,920 --> 00:27:15,240
or we would buy them so we could sell the tan leather

774
00:27:15,240 --> 00:27:18,320
in our store or hair on because we sold hair on products.

775
00:27:18,320 --> 00:27:21,040
We used to have the tannery that we dealt with Fox Valley

776
00:27:21,040 --> 00:27:22,400
there in Salt Lake City.

777
00:27:22,400 --> 00:27:25,840
And we did semi loads of deer and elk hides for years

778
00:27:25,840 --> 00:27:27,000
until they went out of business.

779
00:27:27,000 --> 00:27:29,080
You sell hides just wherever.

780
00:27:29,080 --> 00:27:31,640
Yeah, I came home from hunting one time.

781
00:27:31,640 --> 00:27:34,840
My dad did go with me in the older stages

782
00:27:34,840 --> 00:27:37,880
and we came home and she was actually pregnant

783
00:27:37,880 --> 00:27:41,160
with our son, we just got the one son.

784
00:27:41,160 --> 00:27:43,400
And he's 33 today.

785
00:27:43,400 --> 00:27:44,320
Oh, happy birthday.

786
00:27:44,320 --> 00:27:45,400
Yeah, what's his name?

787
00:27:45,400 --> 00:27:46,600
His name's Ethan.

788
00:27:46,600 --> 00:27:47,440
Very good.

789
00:27:47,440 --> 00:27:50,800
We came home and she's out there in the driveway,

790
00:27:50,800 --> 00:27:52,120
pregnant, bent over,

791
00:27:53,160 --> 00:27:54,640
flushing hides and salt and hides.

792
00:27:54,640 --> 00:27:55,880
And my dad looks and he says,

793
00:27:55,880 --> 00:27:58,040
I don't know if you got a good one

794
00:27:58,040 --> 00:27:59,120
or something's wrong with her.

795
00:27:59,120 --> 00:28:02,080
I've been told that a lot.

796
00:28:02,080 --> 00:28:04,680
I think you got a good one.

797
00:28:04,680 --> 00:28:07,640
Yeah, she's been a good one, that's for sure.

798
00:28:07,640 --> 00:28:08,720
A lot of hard work.

799
00:28:08,720 --> 00:28:09,560
Oh yeah.

800
00:28:09,560 --> 00:28:10,480
They're heavy when they're wet.

801
00:28:10,480 --> 00:28:11,320
Oh my goodness.

802
00:28:11,320 --> 00:28:13,520
Oh yeah, I mean just flushing them is a ton of work.

803
00:28:13,520 --> 00:28:14,360
Yeah.

804
00:28:14,360 --> 00:28:15,200
Yeah.

805
00:28:15,200 --> 00:28:16,720
She's been a trooper.

806
00:28:16,720 --> 00:28:18,000
She just goes along with the flow.

807
00:28:18,000 --> 00:28:20,240
But you make a good life for yourself

808
00:28:20,240 --> 00:28:23,560
and you put a lot of value and effort

809
00:28:23,560 --> 00:28:24,800
into a lot of different things.

810
00:28:24,800 --> 00:28:29,800
And I think it goes into the natural utilization

811
00:28:29,800 --> 00:28:33,040
of resources and trying to utilize,

812
00:28:33,040 --> 00:28:35,120
and it gets into the part of our conversation here,

813
00:28:35,120 --> 00:28:37,360
but utilize every single thing

814
00:28:37,360 --> 00:28:38,600
that you could possibly utilize

815
00:28:38,600 --> 00:28:40,320
because there's a use for it.

816
00:28:40,320 --> 00:28:45,320
And from the bones and the claws and the teeth

817
00:28:46,040 --> 00:28:48,560
and the back straps and the sinew,

818
00:28:48,560 --> 00:28:50,480
and everything that goes into it

819
00:28:50,480 --> 00:28:52,480
is something that can be utilized.

820
00:28:52,480 --> 00:28:55,520
And so when we talk about it from an experience level,

821
00:28:55,520 --> 00:28:57,000
we do the wildlife control side,

822
00:28:57,000 --> 00:28:58,160
that's an experience level.

823
00:28:58,160 --> 00:29:00,520
We do the product utilization side,

824
00:29:00,520 --> 00:29:01,800
that's an experience level.

825
00:29:01,800 --> 00:29:04,200
I mean the things that we salvaged

826
00:29:04,200 --> 00:29:06,160
off of animal parts and pieces

827
00:29:06,160 --> 00:29:10,240
that were components that you didn't harvest for.

828
00:29:10,240 --> 00:29:12,920
We didn't harvest for toe bones.

829
00:29:12,920 --> 00:29:14,520
We didn't harvest for dew claws.

830
00:29:14,520 --> 00:29:17,480
We didn't harvest for antler burrs and stuff.

831
00:29:17,480 --> 00:29:19,080
But there's a market out there

832
00:29:19,080 --> 00:29:21,680
that is going to be utilized in some capacity

833
00:29:21,680 --> 00:29:23,080
while people hunt for meat

834
00:29:23,080 --> 00:29:25,320
or they hunt for something that uses a memory on the wall

835
00:29:25,320 --> 00:29:27,120
as a three dimensional picture.

836
00:29:27,120 --> 00:29:27,960
Sure.

837
00:29:27,960 --> 00:29:30,640
And that's why we're,

838
00:29:30,640 --> 00:29:33,040
I'm not saying that we're the chosen ones

839
00:29:33,040 --> 00:29:35,520
to make that statement, but we do it all.

840
00:29:35,520 --> 00:29:36,600
We have done it all.

841
00:29:36,600 --> 00:29:38,560
And I know the difference between right and wrong

842
00:29:38,560 --> 00:29:39,440
when it comes to that

843
00:29:39,440 --> 00:29:42,520
because other people don't necessarily understand

844
00:29:42,520 --> 00:29:44,160
the salvage ability of it.

845
00:29:44,160 --> 00:29:45,880
When we were dealing in hundreds and hundreds

846
00:29:45,880 --> 00:29:47,680
and thousands of deer and elk hides,

847
00:29:47,680 --> 00:29:49,040
we were dealing with all the meat packers

848
00:29:49,040 --> 00:29:50,400
around the state of Colorado.

849
00:29:50,400 --> 00:29:52,080
I mean they would save the product,

850
00:29:52,080 --> 00:29:53,560
we would go pick it up, we'd flush it,

851
00:29:53,560 --> 00:29:55,000
we'd salt it, we'd haul it.

852
00:29:55,000 --> 00:29:56,000
And what happened to it?

853
00:29:56,000 --> 00:29:57,520
You'd turn it into leather products.

854
00:29:57,520 --> 00:29:59,440
What do you think leather gloves are made out of?

855
00:29:59,440 --> 00:30:00,960
I mean I get customers all the time say,

856
00:30:00,960 --> 00:30:02,160
well I don't use any of this.

857
00:30:02,160 --> 00:30:04,520
You're wearing leather gloves, don't tell me you're not.

858
00:30:04,520 --> 00:30:06,320
But they don't, nobody showed them,

859
00:30:06,320 --> 00:30:08,040
nobody visualized it to them.

860
00:30:08,040 --> 00:30:10,160
And I think that that goes into the same thing.

861
00:30:10,160 --> 00:30:13,880
We had guys that, you know what coonpecker's look like.

862
00:30:13,880 --> 00:30:17,880
You know, we had guys buying coonpecker deals

863
00:30:17,880 --> 00:30:19,160
just to make earrings out of.

864
00:30:19,160 --> 00:30:22,040
And one guy called it hope on a rope for crying out loud.

865
00:30:22,040 --> 00:30:24,800
I mean, you know, making necklaces and stuff.

866
00:30:24,800 --> 00:30:25,640
Yeah.

867
00:30:25,640 --> 00:30:28,600
There's anything that you utilize

868
00:30:28,600 --> 00:30:30,400
off of any natural resource is something

869
00:30:30,400 --> 00:30:33,680
that should be coveted, it should be regulated.

870
00:30:33,680 --> 00:30:36,160
But for people to bastardize every single thing

871
00:30:36,160 --> 00:30:37,520
that we do on every single level,

872
00:30:37,520 --> 00:30:39,000
just because they think that there's a head

873
00:30:39,000 --> 00:30:42,400
hanging on the wall, that's the byproduct right there.

874
00:30:42,400 --> 00:30:44,480
There was all the parts and pieces inside of it

875
00:30:44,480 --> 00:30:45,680
that made that animal.

876
00:30:45,680 --> 00:30:47,960
It just is, this is not using any different

877
00:30:47,960 --> 00:30:49,640
than any of the other stuff.

878
00:30:49,640 --> 00:30:51,000
And she's been part of that whole deal

879
00:30:51,000 --> 00:30:52,000
to be able to tell that story

880
00:30:52,000 --> 00:30:55,840
and be able to explain it to people on a broad scale.

881
00:30:55,840 --> 00:31:00,040
Man, I'm so glad that you're so open and willing to talk

882
00:31:00,040 --> 00:31:02,800
and kind of tell the story because as I'm listening to you,

883
00:31:02,800 --> 00:31:05,560
it's building a much broader, bigger picture

884
00:31:05,560 --> 00:31:07,560
as to why I feel like you're so passionate

885
00:31:07,560 --> 00:31:09,880
about the thing that you're doing now.

886
00:31:09,880 --> 00:31:11,440
I hope that resonates with people

887
00:31:11,440 --> 00:31:13,720
that listen to the podcast.

888
00:31:13,720 --> 00:31:15,880
To me, it's really interesting and it's fascinating.

889
00:31:15,880 --> 00:31:18,680
And I'm so glad that you're willing to talk

890
00:31:18,680 --> 00:31:20,880
and tell your story, because it paints a better picture

891
00:31:20,880 --> 00:31:23,120
as to why you feel the way that you feel.

892
00:31:23,120 --> 00:31:25,840
And you're so passionate about it and you feel,

893
00:31:25,840 --> 00:31:28,640
you see it from a perspective that most don't.

894
00:31:28,640 --> 00:31:31,480
Even myself, I'm in my mid-40s at this time.

895
00:31:31,480 --> 00:31:33,760
I grew up in a small town, similar, hunting,

896
00:31:33,760 --> 00:31:38,560
but it's interesting dealing with all the parts and pieces

897
00:31:38,560 --> 00:31:40,400
and the hides and you made a living from it.

898
00:31:40,400 --> 00:31:43,020
You carved out this thing from a renewable resource

899
00:31:43,020 --> 00:31:47,040
that was based on this North American model of conservation

900
00:31:47,040 --> 00:31:49,880
and you can see how the whole thing works

901
00:31:49,880 --> 00:31:51,760
as it progresses and moves along

902
00:31:51,760 --> 00:31:54,440
and why you feel so protective of that.

903
00:31:54,440 --> 00:31:59,000
Well, and trying to explain it to the average person

904
00:31:59,000 --> 00:32:00,840
that wants to bitch about the North American model

905
00:32:00,840 --> 00:32:03,280
and that we are profitizing off of wildlife.

906
00:32:04,200 --> 00:32:05,960
The North American model components,

907
00:32:05,960 --> 00:32:08,960
the tenants were written on the game side of things

908
00:32:08,960 --> 00:32:11,600
for meat because the meat market

909
00:32:11,600 --> 00:32:14,200
and the people that don't know that need to understand

910
00:32:14,200 --> 00:32:15,800
and they need to listen to what Shane Mahoney

911
00:32:15,800 --> 00:32:18,600
and Valerius Geist actually wrote down in the book,

912
00:32:18,600 --> 00:32:21,120
the North American model of wildlife conservation,

913
00:32:21,120 --> 00:32:22,400
but they want to turn around and act like

914
00:32:22,400 --> 00:32:24,840
if I'm selling deer toes or if I'm selling a coyote hide

915
00:32:24,840 --> 00:32:25,960
that I'm profiting.

916
00:32:27,200 --> 00:32:29,760
The meat market is what was banned.

917
00:32:29,760 --> 00:32:31,520
The meat market was banned.

918
00:32:31,520 --> 00:32:34,680
The utilization of wildlife and product and resource

919
00:32:34,680 --> 00:32:37,280
is not part of that.

920
00:32:37,280 --> 00:32:40,760
It's not and you can read the dissertation

921
00:32:40,760 --> 00:32:42,960
of the peer reviewed information.

922
00:32:42,960 --> 00:32:45,200
I mean, it'd be great if you could get Shane Mahoney on here

923
00:32:45,200 --> 00:32:46,840
because I mean, she's a legend.

924
00:32:46,840 --> 00:32:51,240
Yeah, I know Shane personally and he and I've talked

925
00:32:51,240 --> 00:32:52,720
and we've actually been through a lot of trials

926
00:32:52,720 --> 00:32:54,680
and tribulations on some things together,

927
00:32:54,680 --> 00:32:57,280
but I can tell you the people that want to turn around

928
00:32:57,280 --> 00:33:00,400
and bastardize what we have is because they know

929
00:33:00,400 --> 00:33:02,240
that it works and they want to turn around

930
00:33:02,240 --> 00:33:03,720
and make it seem bad to the people

931
00:33:03,720 --> 00:33:05,520
that don't know what the hell it is.

932
00:33:05,520 --> 00:33:07,800
The product utilization out of animal parts

933
00:33:07,800 --> 00:33:10,320
and pieces is a byproduct.

934
00:33:10,320 --> 00:33:12,440
It's going to go in the dump.

935
00:33:12,440 --> 00:33:15,160
And when you look at what these,

936
00:33:15,160 --> 00:33:18,160
the proponents of these measures did on this go around

937
00:33:18,160 --> 00:33:19,280
through our legal process,

938
00:33:19,280 --> 00:33:21,240
you could tell what their intent was

939
00:33:21,240 --> 00:33:25,160
because when we forced them to go to a second initiative

940
00:33:25,160 --> 00:33:27,080
because we were winning on the first initiative

941
00:33:27,080 --> 00:33:29,320
as far as the legal challenges,

942
00:33:29,320 --> 00:33:30,840
you could tell where their intent was

943
00:33:30,840 --> 00:33:35,280
because they said that you can harvest everything,

944
00:33:35,280 --> 00:33:37,600
but then everything but the meat had to be surrendered

945
00:33:37,600 --> 00:33:39,160
to Colorado Parks and Wildlife.

946
00:33:40,360 --> 00:33:42,800
So you couldn't keep the hide, you couldn't keep the skull,

947
00:33:42,800 --> 00:33:44,080
you couldn't keep the claws.

948
00:33:44,080 --> 00:33:46,680
You could only keep the meat and everything else.

949
00:33:46,680 --> 00:33:49,160
Because they're acting like that we're doing it for that.

950
00:33:49,160 --> 00:33:50,360
We're not doing it for that.

951
00:33:50,360 --> 00:33:52,000
We're doing it for the entire circle.

952
00:33:52,000 --> 00:33:54,760
That just happens to be a product of that.

953
00:33:54,760 --> 00:33:56,080
Yeah, it's an entirety.

954
00:33:56,080 --> 00:34:01,080
Yeah, and so I see no problem like with

955
00:34:02,640 --> 00:34:05,840
the elk refuge, selling deer and elk handlers.

956
00:34:05,840 --> 00:34:07,400
See no problem with that whatsoever.

957
00:34:07,400 --> 00:34:08,720
The anti's think that that's wrong.

958
00:34:08,720 --> 00:34:09,560
Why?

959
00:34:09,560 --> 00:34:11,760
Because they think we go out and cut the fricking horns off.

960
00:34:11,760 --> 00:34:13,600
They don't know that they drop them.

961
00:34:13,600 --> 00:34:15,920
Now some people do, they know that,

962
00:34:15,920 --> 00:34:17,360
but they're still arguing the fact

963
00:34:17,360 --> 00:34:20,280
that we're trying to turn around and profit off of wildlife.

964
00:34:20,280 --> 00:34:21,120
Sure.

965
00:34:21,120 --> 00:34:23,560
And I think the passion and stuff that we drive,

966
00:34:23,560 --> 00:34:24,880
that's why our kid is so involved in it.

967
00:34:24,880 --> 00:34:26,440
He runs the business with us.

968
00:34:26,440 --> 00:34:28,720
I mean, it's everything that we do.

969
00:34:28,720 --> 00:34:31,520
We live it, breathe it, eat it, crap it, drink it,

970
00:34:31,520 --> 00:34:33,440
screw it, you know, sleep it.

971
00:34:33,440 --> 00:34:36,920
I mean, it's everything that we do revolves around this.

972
00:34:36,920 --> 00:34:40,520
Yeah, do you look back on those times fondly?

973
00:34:40,520 --> 00:34:41,360
Oh yes.

974
00:34:41,360 --> 00:34:42,200
They were a lot simpler.

975
00:34:42,200 --> 00:34:44,520
They were very simple.

976
00:34:44,520 --> 00:34:47,400
We ran our, our business was open seven days a week.

977
00:34:49,520 --> 00:34:50,440
Seven days a week.

978
00:34:50,440 --> 00:34:51,280
Seven days a week.

979
00:34:51,280 --> 00:34:52,480
You were there seven days a week doing something.

980
00:34:52,480 --> 00:34:55,120
My mom and dad helped on Sundays or,

981
00:34:55,120 --> 00:34:56,640
but primarily seven days a week.

982
00:34:56,640 --> 00:34:58,560
We ran one business for a while

983
00:34:58,560 --> 00:35:00,680
and then we ran two businesses at the same time.

984
00:35:00,680 --> 00:35:05,680
So it's, we're used to being busy all the time.

985
00:35:05,960 --> 00:35:09,400
But one point I want to make is we sold over the years,

986
00:35:09,400 --> 00:35:13,920
hundreds or not even thousands of skulls, teeth, claws,

987
00:35:13,920 --> 00:35:17,720
hides to teachers for education.

988
00:35:17,720 --> 00:35:20,000
They wanted to have a box in their room.

989
00:35:20,000 --> 00:35:22,880
That way the students could actually feel it.

990
00:35:22,880 --> 00:35:24,920
They can teach about it.

991
00:35:24,920 --> 00:35:28,480
So I feel that we actually served a great service

992
00:35:28,480 --> 00:35:32,120
to those individuals that maybe not

993
00:35:32,120 --> 00:35:34,160
wouldn't have been able to get ahold of something

994
00:35:34,160 --> 00:35:36,360
and at least be able to just show the kids

995
00:35:36,360 --> 00:35:38,440
that there's a purpose for this.

996
00:35:38,440 --> 00:35:39,960
Yeah, absolutely.

997
00:35:39,960 --> 00:35:42,080
It's hard to get people to understand

998
00:35:42,080 --> 00:35:43,640
the value of something when they don't know

999
00:35:43,640 --> 00:35:45,240
what the value of something is.

1000
00:35:46,120 --> 00:35:48,920
I mean, you know, get somebody to understand

1001
00:35:50,000 --> 00:35:52,160
what a bar of silver is worth.

1002
00:35:52,160 --> 00:35:53,400
Show them a quarter.

1003
00:35:53,400 --> 00:35:54,480
Okay, no big deal.

1004
00:35:54,480 --> 00:35:56,720
Show them a hundred ounce bar of silver.

1005
00:35:56,720 --> 00:35:58,280
How many quarters can you make out of that?

1006
00:35:58,280 --> 00:35:59,920
That shows the value of it.

1007
00:35:59,920 --> 00:36:02,800
You know, the value of wildlife and natural resources

1008
00:36:02,800 --> 00:36:05,640
is when you touch it, you feel it, you fondle it.

1009
00:36:05,640 --> 00:36:07,160
If you see it at a distance,

1010
00:36:07,160 --> 00:36:09,240
you have no direct connectivity to it.

1011
00:36:09,240 --> 00:36:11,160
But you have to be able to grasp it.

1012
00:36:11,160 --> 00:36:13,080
You have to be able to walk up to it.

1013
00:36:13,080 --> 00:36:15,720
You have to be able to realize that it was alive

1014
00:36:15,720 --> 00:36:16,560
and now it's not.

1015
00:36:16,560 --> 00:36:18,600
And I took it because I had the choice to.

1016
00:36:18,600 --> 00:36:19,760
But you know how many times I went out there

1017
00:36:19,760 --> 00:36:21,320
and I didn't pull the trigger?

1018
00:36:21,320 --> 00:36:23,120
I had the choice to do that too.

1019
00:36:23,120 --> 00:36:24,800
And so when you're looking at things

1020
00:36:24,800 --> 00:36:27,840
from a human animal conflict resolution side of things,

1021
00:36:27,840 --> 00:36:28,960
what we do with our business,

1022
00:36:28,960 --> 00:36:33,080
but you're also looking at a utilization side,

1023
00:36:33,080 --> 00:36:35,200
all of that goes into the management.

1024
00:36:35,200 --> 00:36:37,400
All of that goes into the North American model

1025
00:36:37,400 --> 00:36:39,000
of wildlife conservation.

1026
00:36:39,000 --> 00:36:41,640
It all goes into why we have what we have

1027
00:36:41,640 --> 00:36:44,080
and where it came from and where we need to go with it.

1028
00:36:44,080 --> 00:36:46,440
Because it's a lot easier to turn around and say,

1029
00:36:46,440 --> 00:36:49,240
I have this, I can touch it, feel it and fondle it.

1030
00:36:49,240 --> 00:36:50,080
Look at this claw.

1031
00:36:50,080 --> 00:36:51,240
You know how many times people walk up to me

1032
00:36:51,240 --> 00:36:52,080
and want to grab it?

1033
00:36:52,080 --> 00:36:52,920
You know, can I feel your claw?

1034
00:36:52,920 --> 00:36:55,880
It's like a pregnant woman, they rub the belly

1035
00:36:55,880 --> 00:36:56,720
and want to grab your bear claw.

1036
00:36:56,720 --> 00:36:58,560
Can I feel your bell bugling?

1037
00:36:58,560 --> 00:37:00,600
It's like, yeah, but just don't go any lower or anything.

1038
00:37:00,600 --> 00:37:01,920
I mean, there's a, you know.

1039
00:37:01,920 --> 00:37:03,080
You're like, you can.

1040
00:37:03,080 --> 00:37:07,760
Yeah, people are enamored by things of curiosity

1041
00:37:07,760 --> 00:37:09,760
and interest and uniqueness.

1042
00:37:09,760 --> 00:37:13,080
Wildlife, every single thing is unique about it.

1043
00:37:13,080 --> 00:37:14,540
They like to see what it is.

1044
00:37:14,540 --> 00:37:17,040
Why do you think wildlife museums are so popular?

1045
00:37:17,040 --> 00:37:18,080
Because people like to go see it.

1046
00:37:18,080 --> 00:37:19,280
Where do you think that comes from?

1047
00:37:19,280 --> 00:37:21,040
From sportsmen and women.

1048
00:37:21,040 --> 00:37:23,120
I mean, you don't go to a wildlife museum

1049
00:37:23,120 --> 00:37:24,440
unless somebody actually killed it.

1050
00:37:24,440 --> 00:37:25,340
Yep, yeah.

1051
00:37:25,340 --> 00:37:29,840
So the knowledge and education that you provide to society,

1052
00:37:29,840 --> 00:37:32,840
like Karen had mentioned, is something to where,

1053
00:37:32,840 --> 00:37:35,600
you know, she would sell five or six skulls to somebody

1054
00:37:35,600 --> 00:37:39,880
and the way that they felt them and the way that it's primal.

1055
00:37:39,880 --> 00:37:41,080
It's part of people.

1056
00:37:41,080 --> 00:37:44,800
It's part of humans on the planet.

1057
00:37:44,800 --> 00:37:47,240
And just because you don't want to do that

1058
00:37:47,240 --> 00:37:50,760
doesn't mean that everybody else doesn't want to do it.

1059
00:37:50,760 --> 00:37:52,600
Or that you've never experienced it.

1060
00:37:52,600 --> 00:37:53,440
Exactly.

1061
00:37:53,440 --> 00:37:54,480
I want to kind of know, like,

1062
00:37:54,480 --> 00:37:57,280
what sort of value do you place on, you know,

1063
00:37:57,280 --> 00:37:58,480
growing up in the outdoors,

1064
00:37:58,480 --> 00:38:00,640
growing up hunting, fishing, trapping?

1065
00:38:00,640 --> 00:38:02,920
It looks like right now we have a big changing landscape

1066
00:38:02,920 --> 00:38:04,640
because a lot of people are more disconnected

1067
00:38:04,640 --> 00:38:06,240
from the outdoors than ever.

1068
00:38:06,240 --> 00:38:08,040
But obviously it's shaped your guys' lives.

1069
00:38:08,040 --> 00:38:10,560
So what sort of value do you place on, you know,

1070
00:38:10,560 --> 00:38:12,440
growing up being able to go outdoors

1071
00:38:12,440 --> 00:38:14,800
and do all the things you have and like?

1072
00:38:14,800 --> 00:38:18,000
I think it's the only reason we exist anymore, personally.

1073
00:38:19,360 --> 00:38:22,560
And I think that when you listen to people like Mahoney

1074
00:38:22,560 --> 00:38:24,440
and when Valerius Guice was alive

1075
00:38:24,440 --> 00:38:29,440
and you hear the value that people provide, you know,

1076
00:38:32,960 --> 00:38:36,640
Shane said something that sticks with me very solidly

1077
00:38:36,640 --> 00:38:40,080
that everybody benefits off wildlife.

1078
00:38:40,080 --> 00:38:42,200
And when you're intimately involved with it,

1079
00:38:42,200 --> 00:38:46,040
you benefit more, but then you can educate others about it.

1080
00:38:46,040 --> 00:38:48,960
When somebody goes skiing, they see a moose,

1081
00:38:48,960 --> 00:38:51,040
first thing they do is tell people about the moose

1082
00:38:51,040 --> 00:38:52,440
on their ski trip.

1083
00:38:52,440 --> 00:38:54,640
When they turn around and fishing

1084
00:38:54,640 --> 00:38:57,040
and they saw a herd of elk cross the highway,

1085
00:38:57,040 --> 00:38:58,760
first thing they do, they forgot about the fish

1086
00:38:58,760 --> 00:39:00,360
that they caught, they tell them about the elk

1087
00:39:00,360 --> 00:39:01,320
that crossed the highway.

1088
00:39:01,320 --> 00:39:02,960
That's why people like to go to Yellowstone.

1089
00:39:02,960 --> 00:39:03,800
Yeah.

1090
00:39:03,800 --> 00:39:04,640
That's why they like to go to Glacier.

1091
00:39:04,640 --> 00:39:05,760
It's the only reason Yellowstone people go to Yellowstone.

1092
00:39:05,760 --> 00:39:06,600
Yeah.

1093
00:39:06,600 --> 00:39:07,440
You know, it's to see wildlife.

1094
00:39:07,440 --> 00:39:08,280
I mean, geisters are cool.

1095
00:39:08,280 --> 00:39:09,120
I mean, did you see that thing

1096
00:39:09,120 --> 00:39:10,840
that Sports and the Alliance put out?

1097
00:39:10,840 --> 00:39:14,240
You know, there was a complaint, did you see that online?

1098
00:39:14,240 --> 00:39:17,440
It was a complaint and it was just last week.

1099
00:39:17,440 --> 00:39:20,960
And one of the tenants, one of the guests,

1100
00:39:20,960 --> 00:39:25,120
one of their suggestion box letters, did you see this?

1101
00:39:25,120 --> 00:39:25,960
Yeah.

1102
00:39:25,960 --> 00:39:27,760
Where they said, well, you need to train your bears

1103
00:39:27,760 --> 00:39:29,840
to be able to go to places where we can see them.

1104
00:39:29,840 --> 00:39:33,080
And it's like, that's the people that we deal with.

1105
00:39:33,080 --> 00:39:35,000
They need to train the bears to go.

1106
00:39:35,000 --> 00:39:36,920
Well, and I've heard there's kind of an undercurrent

1107
00:39:36,920 --> 00:39:40,320
of people who are seeing wildlife and less wildlife.

1108
00:39:40,320 --> 00:39:41,640
Like I've heard that's been a complaint

1109
00:39:41,640 --> 00:39:42,760
of people that are visiting,

1110
00:39:42,760 --> 00:39:44,720
they expect to go to Yellowstone and see animals.

1111
00:39:44,720 --> 00:39:45,560
Yeah.

1112
00:39:45,560 --> 00:39:46,380
A lot of them.

1113
00:39:46,380 --> 00:39:48,400
And I've heard just, you know, kind of an undercurrent,

1114
00:39:48,400 --> 00:39:50,480
hey, we're not seeing the animals we thought we would see.

1115
00:39:50,480 --> 00:39:51,920
Well, and I'll say that.

1116
00:39:51,920 --> 00:39:52,920
And of course we'd get off track

1117
00:39:52,920 --> 00:39:54,680
and we could go down to a dozen different rabbit holes.

1118
00:39:54,680 --> 00:39:57,040
You might have to get lunch and then come back or whatever.

1119
00:39:57,040 --> 00:39:59,040
But you know, as much as we've traveled

1120
00:39:59,040 --> 00:40:02,320
and because we have a hunting background

1121
00:40:02,320 --> 00:40:05,040
and I'm not saying that hunters don't go to Yellowstone

1122
00:40:05,040 --> 00:40:07,080
or Rocky Mountain National Park or whatever,

1123
00:40:07,080 --> 00:40:09,680
but we would go at six o'clock in the morning

1124
00:40:09,680 --> 00:40:12,120
and we would go at four to seven o'clock at night.

1125
00:40:12,120 --> 00:40:13,600
You know when the animals are gonna be moving around.

1126
00:40:13,600 --> 00:40:16,480
Yeah, because, and so Lauren Stray with Good Bull Outdoors

1127
00:40:16,480 --> 00:40:18,440
who does our social media accounts for us,

1128
00:40:18,440 --> 00:40:20,560
and you know, he just got back from Yellowstone.

1129
00:40:20,560 --> 00:40:21,400
When is he out?

1130
00:40:21,400 --> 00:40:23,240
He's filming all the stuff at those times.

1131
00:40:23,240 --> 00:40:24,480
When is everybody else out?

1132
00:40:24,480 --> 00:40:26,680
Well, nine, 30, 10 after they got breakfast.

1133
00:40:26,680 --> 00:40:28,560
Yeah, the heat of the day, no animals are moving around.

1134
00:40:28,560 --> 00:40:29,400
That's why you're not seeing anything.

1135
00:40:29,400 --> 00:40:30,520
Exactly, and they're like, well.

1136
00:40:30,520 --> 00:40:31,360
They don't understand the biology.

1137
00:40:31,360 --> 00:40:32,360
They don't have a clue.

1138
00:40:32,360 --> 00:40:34,200
And they don't understand the concept

1139
00:40:34,200 --> 00:40:35,400
of what sportsmen and women do

1140
00:40:35,400 --> 00:40:37,520
to be able to turn around and go in the field

1141
00:40:37,520 --> 00:40:40,560
and pursue their quarry, their prey.

1142
00:40:40,560 --> 00:40:42,160
And it's a lot of time and effort

1143
00:40:42,160 --> 00:40:44,000
to be able to get what you wanna get,

1144
00:40:44,000 --> 00:40:45,680
whether it's just the enjoyment of it

1145
00:40:45,680 --> 00:40:47,840
or you're actually trying to, you know, fill a tag.

1146
00:40:47,840 --> 00:40:49,040
That could be a very negative thing too,

1147
00:40:49,040 --> 00:40:49,880
because then people are like,

1148
00:40:49,880 --> 00:40:51,200
yeah, there is no wildlife,

1149
00:40:51,200 --> 00:40:52,560
because 100 are taking too many,

1150
00:40:52,560 --> 00:40:54,240
but it's like, no, you're going at the wrong time to see them.

1151
00:40:54,240 --> 00:40:57,120
So it's like, even though they just don't know the basics,

1152
00:40:57,120 --> 00:40:59,560
that could then turn around and be a very negative thing,

1153
00:40:59,560 --> 00:41:00,400
legislation-wise.

1154
00:41:00,400 --> 00:41:01,560
It's like, oh yeah, people are taking too many animals.

1155
00:41:01,560 --> 00:41:02,800
Like, no, they're there.

1156
00:41:02,800 --> 00:41:04,120
You just gotta go at the times when the animals are there.

1157
00:41:04,120 --> 00:41:05,320
Well, and we see too.

1158
00:41:05,320 --> 00:41:08,080
I mean, Karen was talking to you

1159
00:41:08,080 --> 00:41:10,560
about the deer antelope on our property,

1160
00:41:10,560 --> 00:41:14,000
and there'll be 150 antelope and 45 deer

1161
00:41:14,000 --> 00:41:16,160
and 90 acres is what we got.

1162
00:41:16,160 --> 00:41:18,560
But there's, you know, vacant land

1163
00:41:18,560 --> 00:41:20,920
and there's little farmsteads and stuff.

1164
00:41:20,920 --> 00:41:22,240
But the people driving down the highway,

1165
00:41:22,240 --> 00:41:25,440
we border highway nine, they'll never see any of that game.

1166
00:41:25,440 --> 00:41:28,400
It's just, it's lines, eyes on a yellow line,

1167
00:41:28,400 --> 00:41:30,600
they won't see anything off the side of the road.

1168
00:41:30,600 --> 00:41:32,400
I mean, for what, 25 years,

1169
00:41:32,400 --> 00:41:33,760
people didn't know where the hell we lived.

1170
00:41:33,760 --> 00:41:35,160
And we got a house and a barn sitting there,

1171
00:41:35,160 --> 00:41:36,560
and it's like, well, I've never seen that before.

1172
00:41:36,560 --> 00:41:40,200
It's like, you have to, it's not in the trees, you know?

1173
00:41:40,200 --> 00:41:43,200
But people don't, they're not cognizant

1174
00:41:43,200 --> 00:41:46,000
of their surroundings, and they're not cognizant

1175
00:41:46,000 --> 00:41:48,720
and aware of the landscape as a whole.

1176
00:41:48,720 --> 00:41:49,920
I'm not saying everybody,

1177
00:41:49,920 --> 00:41:52,680
but the overwhelming majority of the public.

1178
00:41:52,680 --> 00:41:56,760
And we know that from a fact, just with our way of life,

1179
00:41:56,760 --> 00:41:58,960
what we've done, how we've lived,

1180
00:41:58,960 --> 00:42:01,640
that people had no idea.

1181
00:42:01,640 --> 00:42:03,320
And we've been around this,

1182
00:42:03,320 --> 00:42:06,280
we've been on both sides of the spectrum of this

1183
00:42:06,280 --> 00:42:11,280
for the service side of it, and for the retail side of it,

1184
00:42:11,320 --> 00:42:13,680
and for the consumptive use side of it.

1185
00:42:13,680 --> 00:42:17,200
And there's no difference between any one of those

1186
00:42:17,200 --> 00:42:18,800
with the people that don't hunt.

1187
00:42:18,800 --> 00:42:21,280
They all have an opinion about something,

1188
00:42:21,280 --> 00:42:23,480
but they don't have a factual-based opinion.

1189
00:42:24,640 --> 00:42:26,920
Have you, what's the, maybe talk a little bit,

1190
00:42:26,920 --> 00:42:30,680
I'm curious, in your lifespan,

1191
00:42:30,680 --> 00:42:33,760
in kind of the businesses that you've built,

1192
00:42:33,760 --> 00:42:35,560
you've chose, and where you grew up,

1193
00:42:36,840 --> 00:42:40,120
talk a little bit about the landscape of,

1194
00:42:40,120 --> 00:42:43,840
just as people, how are we changing?

1195
00:42:43,840 --> 00:42:44,840
Have you seen that change?

1196
00:42:44,840 --> 00:42:46,040
Like, have we changed from?

1197
00:42:46,040 --> 00:42:47,280
Oh, yes. Oh, yes.

1198
00:42:47,280 --> 00:42:49,600
You have? Yes, and I'll let her talk about it.

1199
00:42:49,600 --> 00:42:50,560
And how so?

1200
00:42:51,760 --> 00:42:56,320
I think over the years, to where we're at now,

1201
00:42:56,320 --> 00:43:01,320
people do not pay attention, maybe don't care,

1202
00:43:03,280 --> 00:43:07,080
and they don't listen to what you're telling them.

1203
00:43:07,080 --> 00:43:09,720
And sometimes we see that with our customers,

1204
00:43:09,720 --> 00:43:11,360
I'm speaking to on the phone,

1205
00:43:12,240 --> 00:43:15,200
I'll go through and tell them all the information

1206
00:43:15,200 --> 00:43:17,240
I need to for whatever the instance is,

1207
00:43:17,240 --> 00:43:19,520
but then the guys go out to their home,

1208
00:43:19,520 --> 00:43:23,280
and they never even listen to what I had to tell them.

1209
00:43:23,280 --> 00:43:24,440
And she's trying to educate them.

1210
00:43:24,440 --> 00:43:26,400
And you're trying to educate them.

1211
00:43:26,400 --> 00:43:28,200
We're to that point now, I think,

1212
00:43:28,200 --> 00:43:31,400
if you start back when we started the retail,

1213
00:43:31,400 --> 00:43:34,760
people were more eager to hear what you had to say,

1214
00:43:34,760 --> 00:43:37,240
and to actually stand there and be intrigued,

1215
00:43:37,240 --> 00:43:40,000
and want to maybe be more engaged.

1216
00:43:40,000 --> 00:43:42,440
And I don't know if that's because of electronics now,

1217
00:43:42,440 --> 00:43:46,080
to where we are so disengaged from conversation,

1218
00:43:46,080 --> 00:43:47,760
and being a part of something.

1219
00:43:49,960 --> 00:43:51,920
I think we've lost a lot.

1220
00:43:51,920 --> 00:43:56,120
I think it'd be much different having a retail store now

1221
00:43:56,120 --> 00:44:00,360
than what it was when we started and was engaged.

1222
00:44:00,360 --> 00:44:03,200
And we were in a tourist area, so we had lots of tourists.

1223
00:44:03,200 --> 00:44:08,200
But it was a tension span, their job significantly.

1224
00:44:08,200 --> 00:44:11,840
And I know this from a fact on the phone side of it.

1225
00:44:11,840 --> 00:44:14,360
You got like 0.7 seconds to grab somebody's attention,

1226
00:44:14,360 --> 00:44:17,400
and for them to see a message,

1227
00:44:17,400 --> 00:44:19,000
to be able to resonate and recall that message,

1228
00:44:19,000 --> 00:44:20,800
they have to see that message 11 times

1229
00:44:20,800 --> 00:44:23,360
over a seven second period or some crap.

1230
00:44:23,360 --> 00:44:26,760
You look at it and go, if that's the case,

1231
00:44:26,760 --> 00:44:28,480
no wonder they don't have a clue about

1232
00:44:28,480 --> 00:44:30,160
what we're talking about in natural resources

1233
00:44:30,160 --> 00:44:31,760
and wildlife management.

1234
00:44:31,760 --> 00:44:36,360
And I think that one of the biggest things that we see is

1235
00:44:39,080 --> 00:44:43,400
the lack of attention to detail

1236
00:44:43,400 --> 00:44:48,400
that people want to provide for something that matters.

1237
00:44:49,240 --> 00:44:53,080
I'm not talking about the five day season.

1238
00:44:53,080 --> 00:44:55,080
I'm not talking about the vacation.

1239
00:44:55,080 --> 00:44:57,400
What matters past that?

1240
00:44:57,400 --> 00:44:58,760
What matters next year?

1241
00:44:58,760 --> 00:45:00,440
What matters five years from now?

1242
00:45:00,440 --> 00:45:03,880
Now you've got an activist on both sides of the spectrum,

1243
00:45:03,880 --> 00:45:05,720
but the average general public,

1244
00:45:05,720 --> 00:45:08,320
that middle of the road group that we talk about,

1245
00:45:08,320 --> 00:45:10,400
their attention span is very, very limited.

1246
00:45:10,400 --> 00:45:13,720
And their opinions are built on a lot of things

1247
00:45:13,720 --> 00:45:15,160
that aren't factual.

1248
00:45:15,160 --> 00:45:18,240
And there's lots of misinformation on the computer.

1249
00:45:19,920 --> 00:45:24,920
Lots, and so you have to weed that out of the conversation

1250
00:45:25,120 --> 00:45:27,960
and get to what is actually the truth.

1251
00:45:27,960 --> 00:45:29,520
Because with what we deal with,

1252
00:45:29,520 --> 00:45:31,360
and that's with our retail store

1253
00:45:31,360 --> 00:45:34,000
or with our business for the wildlife,

1254
00:45:34,000 --> 00:45:36,080
we are heavily regulated.

1255
00:45:37,200 --> 00:45:39,920
And there is lots of federal and state laws

1256
00:45:39,920 --> 00:45:44,920
that pertain to animals and birds and everything.

1257
00:45:45,000 --> 00:45:48,040
And there's lots of misinformation on the computer

1258
00:45:48,040 --> 00:45:50,000
of how you can handle those.

1259
00:45:50,000 --> 00:45:51,560
They'll probably be like, oh, I read this on the internet.

1260
00:45:51,560 --> 00:45:53,480
Like, no, this is exactly not,

1261
00:45:53,480 --> 00:45:55,600
rather listen from the source, like you guys.

1262
00:45:55,600 --> 00:45:57,840
But like, oh, I read this, this must be true.

1263
00:45:57,840 --> 00:46:00,480
Well, and the thing too is,

1264
00:46:00,480 --> 00:46:02,040
and I joke about this often,

1265
00:46:02,040 --> 00:46:04,800
and we see it so frequently,

1266
00:46:04,800 --> 00:46:08,520
that people don't want you and I to do what we do

1267
00:46:10,520 --> 00:46:13,240
until it affects them.

1268
00:46:13,240 --> 00:46:15,960
And then when it affects them, burn it, kill it,

1269
00:46:15,960 --> 00:46:17,760
hang it, shoot it, stomp it.

1270
00:46:17,760 --> 00:46:18,720
I don't care what you do to it,

1271
00:46:18,720 --> 00:46:20,960
get it out of my house, get it out of my garden.

1272
00:46:20,960 --> 00:46:23,120
But before, when it was in the neighbor's garden,

1273
00:46:23,120 --> 00:46:24,680
you were criticizing me for turning around

1274
00:46:24,680 --> 00:46:25,920
and getting it out of there.

1275
00:46:25,920 --> 00:46:28,720
And I think that that's part of our issue that we've got

1276
00:46:28,720 --> 00:46:30,880
is nobody thinks it's going to affect them.

1277
00:46:30,880 --> 00:46:32,400
How many people turn around and call you about,

1278
00:46:32,400 --> 00:46:33,960
well, if it's in town?

1279
00:46:33,960 --> 00:46:37,240
Oh, they're surprised that there's a skunk

1280
00:46:37,240 --> 00:46:39,680
or there's a coon or a red fox.

1281
00:46:39,680 --> 00:46:41,920
I said, they are born there.

1282
00:46:41,920 --> 00:46:44,960
They don't know anything different, you know?

1283
00:46:44,960 --> 00:46:49,120
And the communities have grown into the mountain areas,

1284
00:46:49,120 --> 00:46:50,920
so that's just gonna be natural.

1285
00:46:50,920 --> 00:46:52,320
Or deer, they're so surprised

1286
00:46:52,320 --> 00:46:54,520
that we have deer in Canyon City.

1287
00:46:54,520 --> 00:46:58,000
Well, that's where we always have had an issue, you know?

1288
00:46:58,000 --> 00:47:01,560
And there's a lot of them, but they don't like it.

1289
00:47:01,560 --> 00:47:03,560
And so what can we do to get rid of it?

1290
00:47:03,560 --> 00:47:08,560
You know, well, and so it's always interesting to try

1291
00:47:09,280 --> 00:47:13,080
and have them listen to you and take your advice

1292
00:47:13,080 --> 00:47:15,120
or make, and I can try and refer research.

1293
00:47:15,120 --> 00:47:16,840
What really pisses them off

1294
00:47:16,840 --> 00:47:19,240
is when she tells them something,

1295
00:47:19,240 --> 00:47:20,920
they'll call me thinking they're gonna hold them

1296
00:47:20,920 --> 00:47:23,360
another business, but they just call the other number.

1297
00:47:23,360 --> 00:47:25,000
And then I'll tell them something.

1298
00:47:25,000 --> 00:47:27,320
And then they'll call three or four other places

1299
00:47:27,320 --> 00:47:29,200
that will send them back to us

1300
00:47:29,200 --> 00:47:31,920
because we specialize in specific things.

1301
00:47:31,920 --> 00:47:33,520
And you can see them coming back

1302
00:47:33,520 --> 00:47:35,400
with this sheepish grin on their face.

1303
00:47:35,400 --> 00:47:36,440
You know, it's like, oh crap,

1304
00:47:36,440 --> 00:47:38,000
now I gotta go talk to the asshole.

1305
00:47:38,000 --> 00:47:38,840
Yeah.

1306
00:47:39,800 --> 00:47:41,520
It's something to where,

1307
00:47:42,560 --> 00:47:44,040
I think that that's the most trying thing

1308
00:47:44,040 --> 00:47:46,880
that we have to figure out a way to deal with

1309
00:47:46,880 --> 00:47:48,360
when I'm dead and gone, you know,

1310
00:47:48,360 --> 00:47:50,520
five, 10, 15 years from now,

1311
00:47:50,520 --> 00:47:54,040
that if you don't set a precedent on proper protocols

1312
00:47:54,040 --> 00:47:56,160
and procedure, where are you gonna end up down the road?

1313
00:47:56,160 --> 00:47:57,800
We want to talk about, you know,

1314
00:47:57,800 --> 00:48:00,960
sustainable wildlife populations in perpetuity.

1315
00:48:00,960 --> 00:48:03,120
How are we gonna get to that if people don't fricking,

1316
00:48:03,120 --> 00:48:05,320
you know, have any facts or data or knowledge

1317
00:48:05,320 --> 00:48:07,120
to be able to turn around and do that?

1318
00:48:07,120 --> 00:48:09,800
The public perception of hunting and wildlife in general

1319
00:48:09,800 --> 00:48:12,000
over your lifespan, you've seen it change as well,

1320
00:48:12,000 --> 00:48:15,240
I would assume as far as like just hunting is a lifestyle,

1321
00:48:15,240 --> 00:48:17,360
hunting is something that people do.

1322
00:48:17,360 --> 00:48:19,320
Yeah. Yeah.

1323
00:48:19,320 --> 00:48:23,080
The dumber people get, the more dumb they get.

1324
00:48:23,080 --> 00:48:25,720
I mean, you know, and it sounds like I'm being critical,

1325
00:48:25,720 --> 00:48:29,840
but it's, you know, in 1900,

1326
00:48:30,920 --> 00:48:33,440
20% of the population lived in cities

1327
00:48:33,440 --> 00:48:37,360
and 80% lived on the rural side of things.

1328
00:48:37,360 --> 00:48:40,880
In 1950, it was 50-50 split.

1329
00:48:40,880 --> 00:48:45,560
And in 2000, there was 20% lived on the landscape

1330
00:48:45,560 --> 00:48:47,240
and 80% lived in the cities.

1331
00:48:47,240 --> 00:48:49,880
What are you gonna do, you know, 25 years from now?

1332
00:48:49,880 --> 00:48:53,280
It's gonna be less than 5% to this rule and 95%.

1333
00:48:53,280 --> 00:48:55,480
How do you govern, how do you manage

1334
00:48:55,480 --> 00:48:56,800
and how do you sustain something

1335
00:48:56,800 --> 00:48:58,720
that's so important to everybody

1336
00:48:58,720 --> 00:49:01,720
when only 5% really actually understand it?

1337
00:49:01,720 --> 00:49:04,160
And that 5%, I think, is gonna include a fair amount

1338
00:49:04,160 --> 00:49:06,880
of the individuals that actually go out and pursue game

1339
00:49:06,880 --> 00:49:11,480
because some of us don't live in condominiums

1340
00:49:11,480 --> 00:49:13,160
and trailer parks and stuff.

1341
00:49:13,160 --> 00:49:14,960
I mean, not knocking anybody that does,

1342
00:49:14,960 --> 00:49:19,280
but if you do, you are in tune with the landscape

1343
00:49:19,280 --> 00:49:22,360
as intimately as what people that live on the landscape are.

1344
00:49:22,360 --> 00:49:23,280
Yeah.

1345
00:49:23,280 --> 00:49:28,160
Was there a, maybe give me an idea of like when you,

1346
00:49:28,160 --> 00:49:30,920
how did this become Colorado's

1347
00:49:30,920 --> 00:49:33,720
for responsible wildlife management and your involvement?

1348
00:49:33,720 --> 00:49:35,400
And was there like a tipping point?

1349
00:49:35,400 --> 00:49:36,480
Was there a trigger for you?

1350
00:49:36,480 --> 00:49:38,360
Like what happened where you were like,

1351
00:49:38,360 --> 00:49:42,080
okay, it's time to do something, I gotta do something.

1352
00:49:42,080 --> 00:49:45,080
Back in, I've been playing the politics side for about

1353
00:49:45,080 --> 00:49:48,680
15 years, 16 years, I guess.

1354
00:49:48,680 --> 00:49:52,400
When Colorado Parks and Wildlife changed

1355
00:49:52,400 --> 00:49:55,280
from the Colorado Division of Wildlife,

1356
00:49:55,280 --> 00:49:57,640
the ideology under Governor Hickenlooper at the time

1357
00:49:57,640 --> 00:49:59,000
started to change significantly

1358
00:49:59,000 --> 00:50:01,720
because it was more park-centric.

1359
00:50:01,720 --> 00:50:05,120
And so while we were playing at the wildlife side of things,

1360
00:50:06,160 --> 00:50:08,800
I got involved with the Colorado Trappers

1361
00:50:08,800 --> 00:50:10,280
and Predator Hunters Association,

1362
00:50:10,280 --> 00:50:14,920
was elected to be, through some different citizens petitions

1363
00:50:14,920 --> 00:50:16,160
that we were successful on,

1364
00:50:16,160 --> 00:50:18,080
was elected to be vice president

1365
00:50:18,080 --> 00:50:21,360
and then ultimately was handed the baton to be president,

1366
00:50:21,360 --> 00:50:25,720
which is not like you get a Grammy or an Oscar or anything.

1367
00:50:25,720 --> 00:50:26,760
Didn't come with a giant paycheck?

1368
00:50:26,760 --> 00:50:29,720
No, it came with a hangman's deuce and a guillotine

1369
00:50:29,720 --> 00:50:31,480
and some cyanide capsules for last minute.

1370
00:50:31,480 --> 00:50:33,880
You're probably poor because of it, right?

1371
00:50:33,880 --> 00:50:37,200
And I'm still the damn president now, so I mean.

1372
00:50:37,200 --> 00:50:42,200
But trying to fight the enemy at that time was difficult

1373
00:50:43,760 --> 00:50:46,160
because when you segregate yourself as a trapper,

1374
00:50:46,160 --> 00:50:49,600
you become the ugly redheaded stepchild on a milk carton.

1375
00:50:49,600 --> 00:50:52,760
I mean, it's like, well, we know that trapping's good, Gates,

1376
00:50:52,760 --> 00:50:54,160
but we can't socialize.

1377
00:50:54,160 --> 00:50:57,520
We can't connect ourselves with trapping.

1378
00:50:57,520 --> 00:51:01,240
And so a buddy of mine, Chris Journey and I

1379
00:51:01,240 --> 00:51:04,200
started the Coloradans for Responsible Wildlife Management

1380
00:51:04,200 --> 00:51:06,880
back in 2016, knowing full well

1381
00:51:06,880 --> 00:51:08,840
that when Governor Hickenlooper was stepping out,

1382
00:51:08,840 --> 00:51:11,320
that we were likely gonna have some significant changes

1383
00:51:11,320 --> 00:51:14,760
on the gubernatorial side in 2018,

1384
00:51:14,760 --> 00:51:18,040
which has come to fruition and we still have.

1385
00:51:18,960 --> 00:51:22,080
It's like Hannibal Lecter being in office right now

1386
00:51:22,080 --> 00:51:25,560
and the first gentleman is not a hell of a lot better.

1387
00:51:25,560 --> 00:51:30,560
Both of them together are two demons that are, in my mind,

1388
00:51:30,920 --> 00:51:33,320
demon-like when it comes to wildlife management,

1389
00:51:33,320 --> 00:51:35,320
conservation and hunting and fishing.

1390
00:51:35,320 --> 00:51:39,920
And the things that we have tried to uphold

1391
00:51:39,920 --> 00:51:44,000
and that we've, you know, you learn from mistakes,

1392
00:51:44,000 --> 00:51:45,200
but you make things better.

1393
00:51:45,200 --> 00:51:47,360
You don't turn around and make things worse.

1394
00:51:47,360 --> 00:51:50,480
And the last six years have only gotten worse.

1395
00:51:50,480 --> 00:51:52,760
So when Chris and I started this organization,

1396
00:51:52,760 --> 00:51:55,920
which, and I'll just say it, but the mission of it

1397
00:51:55,920 --> 00:51:57,920
is to enhance, promote and defend

1398
00:51:57,920 --> 00:52:00,040
the North American model of wildlife conservation

1399
00:52:00,040 --> 00:52:01,920
and responsible wildlife management, period.

1400
00:52:01,920 --> 00:52:03,800
We're not a membership organization,

1401
00:52:03,800 --> 00:52:07,080
but we felt that we needed lobbying representation

1402
00:52:07,080 --> 00:52:10,640
at the Colorado Capitol, which we got the first year.

1403
00:52:10,640 --> 00:52:12,600
And now we've got three full-time lobbyists.

1404
00:52:12,600 --> 00:52:14,440
And we legitimately became,

1405
00:52:14,440 --> 00:52:16,040
and we've got partners that we work with,

1406
00:52:16,040 --> 00:52:18,600
and we've got a coalition that we work within

1407
00:52:18,600 --> 00:52:22,440
that we started with a buddy of ours.

1408
00:52:22,440 --> 00:52:27,440
And trying to get people to understand

1409
00:52:27,520 --> 00:52:29,080
that if you want representation,

1410
00:52:29,080 --> 00:52:30,520
you have to provide it for yourself.

1411
00:52:30,520 --> 00:52:32,440
And if anybody speaks on your behalf,

1412
00:52:32,440 --> 00:52:34,640
they have to be part of a collective mentality

1413
00:52:34,640 --> 00:52:36,600
to be able to get that message across.

1414
00:52:37,600 --> 00:52:40,600
So we did what we needed to do.

1415
00:52:40,600 --> 00:52:43,160
Lo and behold, we became the tip of the iceberg

1416
00:52:45,920 --> 00:52:50,560
in May of 2019, when there was a citizens petition

1417
00:52:50,560 --> 00:52:54,440
that came up, and we beat that citizens petition,

1418
00:52:54,440 --> 00:52:56,440
the ban on harvest of bobcats,

1419
00:52:56,440 --> 00:53:00,960
with this governor's new commissioners that were appointed.

1420
00:53:00,960 --> 00:53:05,960
And we put 350 people at the courtyard in Marriott

1421
00:53:06,120 --> 00:53:07,280
at a commission meeting.

1422
00:53:07,280 --> 00:53:08,400
It was the largest commission meeting

1423
00:53:08,400 --> 00:53:09,680
that had been had at that time.

1424
00:53:09,680 --> 00:53:13,200
We busted our ass to get that many people there.

1425
00:53:13,200 --> 00:53:15,800
With this commission that was appointed by this governor,

1426
00:53:15,800 --> 00:53:17,480
and we won 11 to zero.

1427
00:53:18,880 --> 00:53:23,400
The next year, HSUS, Humane Society of the United States,

1428
00:53:23,400 --> 00:53:27,760
came back and we beat them again, 11 to zero,

1429
00:53:27,760 --> 00:53:31,480
with new commissioners with this governor's appointment.

1430
00:53:31,480 --> 00:53:34,640
They decided to do the same thing in 2021,

1431
00:53:34,640 --> 00:53:36,560
but knowing full well that they'd probably lose,

1432
00:53:36,560 --> 00:53:38,560
because I think that they counted the votes ahead of time,

1433
00:53:38,560 --> 00:53:41,880
they withdrew the petition about a month ahead of time.

1434
00:53:41,880 --> 00:53:43,160
And then they decided to go,

1435
00:53:43,160 --> 00:53:45,520
hey, I think we're going back to a different route.

1436
00:53:45,520 --> 00:53:47,440
So they went to the legislature.

1437
00:53:47,440 --> 00:53:52,000
And in the February of 22, Senate Bill 31 was introduced,

1438
00:53:52,000 --> 00:53:54,320
and we beat them at the general assembly

1439
00:53:54,320 --> 00:53:56,880
on Mount Lyons and bobcats, four to one,

1440
00:53:56,880 --> 00:53:59,160
when we were told we were going to lose four to one.

1441
00:53:59,160 --> 00:54:00,000
And that was another deal.

1442
00:54:00,000 --> 00:54:03,080
We put 350, 375 people at the steps of the Capitol

1443
00:54:03,080 --> 00:54:05,600
and inside during the latter stages of COVID.

1444
00:54:06,560 --> 00:54:09,680
And sportsmen and women showed up and we beat them.

1445
00:54:09,680 --> 00:54:11,680
This was the next choice for them to turn around

1446
00:54:11,680 --> 00:54:13,720
and come at us at this direction.

1447
00:54:13,720 --> 00:54:15,760
But it's been a culmination of efforts,

1448
00:54:15,760 --> 00:54:19,920
because if you look back 30 some odd years ago,

1449
00:54:19,920 --> 00:54:23,320
a bear hunting campaign was initiated.

1450
00:54:23,320 --> 00:54:25,440
It was initiative 10,

1451
00:54:25,440 --> 00:54:27,680
and it took spring bear hunting away,

1452
00:54:27,680 --> 00:54:30,720
no hounds, no bait, fall only.

1453
00:54:30,720 --> 00:54:34,520
Four years later, Wild Earth Guardians or SNAPU at the time

1454
00:54:34,520 --> 00:54:36,640
took trapping away through a ballot initiative,

1455
00:54:36,640 --> 00:54:41,640
which was a constitutional amendment that passed by 52 to 48%.

1456
00:54:42,440 --> 00:54:44,560
But what I'll tell you is that while Colorado

1457
00:54:44,560 --> 00:54:47,720
has changed significantly demographics and population wise,

1458
00:54:49,440 --> 00:54:52,580
the organizational effort from the sporting side of things

1459
00:54:52,580 --> 00:54:56,040
is a hundred times different now than what it was then.

1460
00:54:56,040 --> 00:54:57,880
The sportsmen and women were not well organized

1461
00:54:57,880 --> 00:54:59,440
at that point in time.

1462
00:54:59,440 --> 00:55:02,960
They were not well structured.

1463
00:55:02,960 --> 00:55:05,420
And I don't think they had the intestinal fortitude.

1464
00:55:05,420 --> 00:55:07,160
And I won't say the brains,

1465
00:55:07,160 --> 00:55:10,480
but they didn't have the collective mindset

1466
00:55:10,480 --> 00:55:12,100
because you had trappers on one side,

1467
00:55:12,100 --> 00:55:13,760
you had bear hunters on the other side.

1468
00:55:13,760 --> 00:55:16,620
I don't give a rat's ass about either one, honestly.

1469
00:55:16,620 --> 00:55:17,960
I care about sportsmen

1470
00:55:17,960 --> 00:55:19,840
and where they fall underneath of that umbrella.

1471
00:55:19,840 --> 00:55:22,180
And I think that that's what we've been able to formulate

1472
00:55:22,180 --> 00:55:27,180
specifically since 2016 with the formulation of CRWM

1473
00:55:27,200 --> 00:55:29,000
is to make sure that we have the partners

1474
00:55:29,000 --> 00:55:30,160
and we have the resources

1475
00:55:30,160 --> 00:55:32,960
and we have the collective mindset to where,

1476
00:55:32,960 --> 00:55:35,200
I might not like what you do,

1477
00:55:35,200 --> 00:55:36,160
but I'm not gonna turn around

1478
00:55:36,160 --> 00:55:37,080
and try to take it away from you.

1479
00:55:37,080 --> 00:55:38,000
Yeah, exactly.

1480
00:55:38,000 --> 00:55:40,000
I might not care about that person over there,

1481
00:55:40,000 --> 00:55:43,080
but I can find the commonality

1482
00:55:43,080 --> 00:55:45,120
between the things that we agree on

1483
00:55:45,120 --> 00:55:47,200
and we can have our differences.

1484
00:55:47,200 --> 00:55:49,280
We can roll around the parking lot for all I care.

1485
00:55:49,280 --> 00:55:51,000
It doesn't really matter.

1486
00:55:51,000 --> 00:55:53,280
I mean, what are they gonna do, hurt me?

1487
00:55:53,280 --> 00:55:55,480
I've been hurt for the last 60 years in some capacity.

1488
00:55:55,480 --> 00:55:58,360
I'm sick and tired of us acting like

1489
00:55:58,360 --> 00:56:00,200
that we are each other's enemies.

1490
00:56:00,200 --> 00:56:01,920
Our enemies are the sons of bitches

1491
00:56:01,920 --> 00:56:04,920
trying to take it away from you and you and her and him

1492
00:56:04,920 --> 00:56:06,300
and me and everybody else.

1493
00:56:06,300 --> 00:56:07,240
We have to figure out a way

1494
00:56:07,240 --> 00:56:09,120
that we're gonna turn around and put the army together

1495
00:56:09,120 --> 00:56:10,720
and that's what we did with CRWM.

1496
00:56:10,720 --> 00:56:13,440
And that's why we become the number one target.

1497
00:56:13,440 --> 00:56:15,840
And that's why we've got the bandwidth

1498
00:56:15,840 --> 00:56:17,220
to do what we're doing.

1499
00:56:17,220 --> 00:56:19,140
And I think that that's why we're gonna be victorious

1500
00:56:19,140 --> 00:56:21,040
if this son of a bitch gets on the fricking ballot.

1501
00:56:21,040 --> 00:56:22,000
Yeah.

1502
00:56:22,000 --> 00:56:23,920
I wanna talk, I wanna like,

1503
00:56:24,820 --> 00:56:27,240
I wanna talk, dive into like kind of the latest,

1504
00:56:27,240 --> 00:56:28,320
you know, what's going on

1505
00:56:28,320 --> 00:56:30,200
and then kind of like how, you know,

1506
00:56:30,200 --> 00:56:31,800
people can get involved and they can help.

1507
00:56:31,800 --> 00:56:34,160
But I'm curious, before we dive into that,

1508
00:56:34,160 --> 00:56:36,560
I wanna ask, it sounds exhausting.

1509
00:56:36,560 --> 00:56:37,960
What you do sounds exhausting.

1510
00:56:37,960 --> 00:56:39,440
Yeah.

1511
00:56:39,440 --> 00:56:40,840
I'm just being honest.

1512
00:56:40,840 --> 00:56:43,080
You know, whenever I'm around and I've talked with Dan,

1513
00:56:43,080 --> 00:56:44,720
you know, we had you on the podcast before,

1514
00:56:44,720 --> 00:56:45,840
at the end of it, I remember thinking,

1515
00:56:45,840 --> 00:56:48,680
man, that guy has the energy of my 11 year old.

1516
00:56:48,680 --> 00:56:52,440
Like you just, it seems like it must be exhausting

1517
00:56:52,440 --> 00:56:55,240
and you're constantly involved, you're constantly out,

1518
00:56:55,240 --> 00:56:57,520
you're doing podcasts, you're doing different content,

1519
00:56:57,520 --> 00:56:59,800
you're, you know, you're lobbying at the Capitol,

1520
00:56:59,800 --> 00:57:01,240
you're doing all these things.

1521
00:57:02,600 --> 00:57:04,760
Why is it so important to you?

1522
00:57:04,760 --> 00:57:07,400
Like, what is it that, I mean,

1523
00:57:07,400 --> 00:57:09,380
why is this so important to you?

1524
00:57:10,760 --> 00:57:14,800
I think I've got a chip on my shoulder.

1525
00:57:14,800 --> 00:57:15,680
Okay.

1526
00:57:15,680 --> 00:57:17,640
And I don't think that,

1527
00:57:17,640 --> 00:57:19,200
I think we're getting more people

1528
00:57:19,200 --> 00:57:21,000
with chips on their shoulder.

1529
00:57:21,000 --> 00:57:24,840
I think that we've become at a breaking point,

1530
00:57:24,840 --> 00:57:28,760
specifically in Colorado, because of this election process

1531
00:57:28,760 --> 00:57:31,160
and the people in power that are coming

1532
00:57:31,160 --> 00:57:34,800
with ideologies to stop everything.

1533
00:57:34,800 --> 00:57:37,560
They wanna stop agriculture, they wanna stop oil and gas,

1534
00:57:37,560 --> 00:57:40,160
they wanna stop public land use and recreation,

1535
00:57:40,160 --> 00:57:41,520
they wanna stop hunting and fishing,

1536
00:57:41,520 --> 00:57:43,820
they wanna stop everything that has anything to do

1537
00:57:43,820 --> 00:57:47,840
with my background, my lifestyle, what we adhere to.

1538
00:57:47,840 --> 00:57:51,880
And I think that that chip on my shoulder

1539
00:57:51,880 --> 00:57:54,200
kind of bleeds over to people that are really close to us

1540
00:57:54,200 --> 00:57:55,640
and we've got a really good network

1541
00:57:55,640 --> 00:57:59,280
and a core group of individuals that see the passion.

1542
00:58:00,560 --> 00:58:03,880
Sometimes I'm at question, why the hell did I get in?

1543
00:58:03,880 --> 00:58:06,240
I mean, there's friends of ours that are on our board

1544
00:58:06,240 --> 00:58:08,680
and they'll comment and go,

1545
00:58:08,680 --> 00:58:10,560
yeah, well, I remember six years ago

1546
00:58:10,560 --> 00:58:12,360
in the game ward and said, go talk to that guy.

1547
00:58:12,360 --> 00:58:13,200
Yeah.

1548
00:58:13,200 --> 00:58:15,280
That was the stupidest thing I ever did.

1549
00:58:15,280 --> 00:58:19,000
Because now it's almost, it breeds,

1550
00:58:19,000 --> 00:58:22,760
and you become part of a living breathing organism

1551
00:58:22,760 --> 00:58:27,760
or mechanism of solution problem solving stuff.

1552
00:58:28,240 --> 00:58:33,240
And I just, people say all the time,

1553
00:58:34,080 --> 00:58:37,960
if it's not for the right things,

1554
00:58:37,960 --> 00:58:39,480
what are you willing to do for the wrong things?

1555
00:58:39,480 --> 00:58:40,920
And I don't think there is any wrong things

1556
00:58:40,920 --> 00:58:42,560
when it comes to this.

1557
00:58:42,560 --> 00:58:45,680
I joke about this, but it's not a joke.

1558
00:58:45,680 --> 00:58:48,200
We need to draw a line in the sand.

1559
00:58:48,200 --> 00:58:49,040
We need to turn around.

1560
00:58:49,040 --> 00:58:51,600
And if we spend as much time doing what we do

1561
00:58:51,600 --> 00:58:52,960
to get ready for the hunt,

1562
00:58:52,960 --> 00:58:56,400
we better freaking figure out a way to fight for the hunt.

1563
00:58:56,400 --> 00:59:01,400
And that's why when we came up with the save the hunt,

1564
00:59:03,600 --> 00:59:05,160
did you get crying?

1565
00:59:06,560 --> 00:59:08,280
I tickle, it makes my eyes water.

1566
00:59:08,280 --> 00:59:13,280
We came up with the save the hunt as the URL.

1567
00:59:13,480 --> 00:59:15,680
It's Colorado's for responsible wildlife management,

1568
00:59:15,680 --> 00:59:16,880
but that's a long freaking thing

1569
00:59:16,880 --> 00:59:19,280
to turn around and put out there, save the hunt.

1570
00:59:19,280 --> 00:59:20,840
That resonates.

1571
00:59:20,840 --> 00:59:23,480
And it resonates now and enough to where people go,

1572
00:59:23,480 --> 00:59:25,520
I wanna help save the hunt.

1573
00:59:25,520 --> 00:59:27,160
But they're not just talking about it in Colorado,

1574
00:59:27,160 --> 00:59:28,840
they're talking about it in Texas and in Hampshire

1575
00:59:28,840 --> 00:59:30,200
and in California to turn around

1576
00:59:30,200 --> 00:59:31,520
and try to reverse some things.

1577
00:59:31,520 --> 00:59:34,840
Montana and Utah and every state now.

1578
00:59:34,840 --> 00:59:36,600
And I think that that chip on my shoulder

1579
00:59:36,600 --> 00:59:41,600
has bred enthusiasm and optimism within the community.

1580
00:59:42,200 --> 00:59:43,240
And I hope that it,

1581
00:59:43,240 --> 00:59:45,960
I hope people understand that what we're talking about,

1582
00:59:45,960 --> 00:59:49,240
yeah, this is a Colorado centric issue right now,

1583
00:59:49,240 --> 00:59:51,960
but it's not about Colorado.

1584
00:59:51,960 --> 00:59:53,840
It's about hunting, it's about fishing.

1585
00:59:53,840 --> 00:59:56,200
It's about wildlife management, it's about conservation.

1586
00:59:56,200 --> 00:59:58,120
It's about the North American model.

1587
00:59:58,120 --> 00:59:59,760
And I think that if we're not willing to turn around

1588
00:59:59,760 --> 01:00:00,680
and fight for that stuff,

1589
01:00:00,680 --> 01:00:02,680
we might as well just turn around and hand it over.

1590
01:00:02,680 --> 01:00:03,520
If we're gonna hand it over,

1591
01:00:03,520 --> 01:00:05,240
then I can go do something else

1592
01:00:05,240 --> 01:00:06,680
and I don't know, become a poacher

1593
01:00:06,680 --> 01:00:07,920
or whatever the hell I'm gonna do.

1594
01:00:07,920 --> 01:00:10,520
But we're gonna get to a point

1595
01:00:10,520 --> 01:00:12,440
to where other people have to figure out a way

1596
01:00:12,440 --> 01:00:17,440
to stand up, prop up, buck up, belly up,

1597
01:00:17,440 --> 01:00:20,800
and money up because if we spend as much

1598
01:00:20,800 --> 01:00:21,920
as what we do to do it,

1599
01:00:21,920 --> 01:00:24,680
we better figure out a way to spend

1600
01:00:24,680 --> 01:00:26,440
as much as what we do to save it.

1601
01:00:28,120 --> 01:00:30,360
What do you say to people that think hunting and fishing

1602
01:00:30,360 --> 01:00:32,960
and that way of life is somewhat antiquated?

1603
01:00:32,960 --> 01:00:35,400
That it's not the future.

1604
01:00:37,080 --> 01:00:40,200
Well, there's a lot of stuff happening in this world today

1605
01:00:40,200 --> 01:00:41,320
I don't think is right.

1606
01:00:43,480 --> 01:00:45,520
I think there's a lot of things that she can agree on

1607
01:00:45,520 --> 01:00:47,800
that she doesn't think is right.

1608
01:00:47,800 --> 01:00:51,000
I think everybody that we deal with on every single level.

1609
01:00:54,600 --> 01:00:57,280
Sean Ender with Peak Decreet Productions

1610
01:00:57,280 --> 01:00:59,440
that does our cinematography for us,

1611
01:00:59,440 --> 01:01:01,320
he did a video that was called Speak.

1612
01:01:01,320 --> 01:01:06,320
And just a one minute, it's on our website.

1613
01:01:06,360 --> 01:01:08,320
It's on our Instagram stuff.

1614
01:01:08,320 --> 01:01:10,800
Speak for the animals that don't.

1615
01:01:10,800 --> 01:01:12,320
Speak for those that don't.

1616
01:01:12,320 --> 01:01:15,000
And I think that with all due respect,

1617
01:01:15,000 --> 01:01:17,400
the animal rights wackos that are out there,

1618
01:01:17,400 --> 01:01:18,880
they think they're doing the right thing,

1619
01:01:18,880 --> 01:01:20,280
but they don't have the proof and the data

1620
01:01:20,280 --> 01:01:22,080
and the statistics to back it up.

1621
01:01:22,080 --> 01:01:24,200
But they know less passionate about what they're doing

1622
01:01:24,200 --> 01:01:25,680
as what we are.

1623
01:01:25,680 --> 01:01:26,880
I mean, I'll give them credit.

1624
01:01:26,880 --> 01:01:28,280
I just think they're wrong.

1625
01:01:28,280 --> 01:01:29,800
And until they can belly up to the bar

1626
01:01:29,800 --> 01:01:31,440
with hundreds of millions of dollars

1627
01:01:31,440 --> 01:01:34,160
or billions of dollars of support in industry

1628
01:01:34,160 --> 01:01:36,480
for long term, then I don't think

1629
01:01:36,480 --> 01:01:38,400
that there's any way, shape or form

1630
01:01:38,400 --> 01:01:43,400
that we cannot deny what our forefathers

1631
01:01:43,960 --> 01:01:46,960
have laid out for us, whether it's Roosevelt

1632
01:01:46,960 --> 01:01:50,520
or Hornaday or Audubon or Leopold.

1633
01:01:50,520 --> 01:01:51,680
Go as far back as you want.

1634
01:01:51,680 --> 01:01:53,360
Yeah, I mean, that's where it started.

1635
01:01:53,360 --> 01:01:56,240
The history of mankind is built on hunting.

1636
01:01:56,240 --> 01:01:57,640
Exactly.

1637
01:01:57,640 --> 01:02:01,800
And I think that it's our due diligence

1638
01:02:01,800 --> 01:02:03,960
to do as much as what we possibly can.

1639
01:02:03,960 --> 01:02:05,520
And if we're not willing to do that,

1640
01:02:05,520 --> 01:02:08,480
then where are our morals and ethics and values?

1641
01:02:09,680 --> 01:02:10,560
Really believe that.

1642
01:02:10,560 --> 01:02:12,680
Yeah, I believe that you believe that.

1643
01:02:14,240 --> 01:02:16,760
Yeah, and I hope the question didn't come off as,

1644
01:02:16,760 --> 01:02:17,720
I'm not questioning.

1645
01:02:17,720 --> 01:02:18,560
Oh no.

1646
01:02:18,560 --> 01:02:23,080
Yeah, I'm curious more for just people out there in general.

1647
01:02:23,080 --> 01:02:24,320
I mean, I don't know how many people

1648
01:02:24,320 --> 01:02:27,160
that would listen to our podcast that don't hunt

1649
01:02:27,160 --> 01:02:29,280
or are in that middle ground, right?

1650
01:02:29,280 --> 01:02:30,120
Yeah.

1651
01:02:30,120 --> 01:02:31,200
I think they listen to our podcast

1652
01:02:31,200 --> 01:02:33,600
because we hunt, right?

1653
01:02:33,600 --> 01:02:34,440
Yeah.

1654
01:02:34,440 --> 01:02:35,440
And we're definitely, it's what we do.

1655
01:02:35,440 --> 01:02:37,640
I mean, it's everything that I live and breathe.

1656
01:02:37,640 --> 01:02:42,200
I mean, I guess, to try to put it in layman's terms

1657
01:02:42,200 --> 01:02:44,160
for the person that maybe doesn't fully understand

1658
01:02:44,160 --> 01:02:46,000
or doesn't think it's that big of a deal,

1659
01:02:46,000 --> 01:02:47,200
how about if I walked into your house

1660
01:02:47,200 --> 01:02:48,920
and tried to take all your shit away from you?

1661
01:02:48,920 --> 01:02:49,760
Yeah.

1662
01:02:49,760 --> 01:02:50,600
What are we gonna do?

1663
01:02:50,600 --> 01:02:51,440
You're gonna give it up?

1664
01:02:51,440 --> 01:02:52,800
Because that's what they're doing.

1665
01:02:52,800 --> 01:02:53,640
Sure.

1666
01:02:53,640 --> 01:02:55,560
They're walking into our house, period.

1667
01:02:55,560 --> 01:02:57,320
But my house is your house right now.

1668
01:02:57,320 --> 01:03:00,760
And not just stuff, but like a genuine way of life.

1669
01:03:00,760 --> 01:03:01,600
Yeah.

1670
01:03:01,600 --> 01:03:02,600
Exactly.

1671
01:03:02,600 --> 01:03:03,960
Not stuff, it's not stuff.

1672
01:03:03,960 --> 01:03:06,480
Like this is, you could say this is stuff, right?

1673
01:03:06,480 --> 01:03:08,920
Like it's antlers and hide and that stuff.

1674
01:03:08,920 --> 01:03:10,680
But it's not, the reason I hunt,

1675
01:03:10,680 --> 01:03:12,080
the reason that we all hunt, I guarantee you,

1676
01:03:12,080 --> 01:03:14,120
it's not for the stuff.

1677
01:03:14,120 --> 01:03:16,680
It's because of the way that it feels.

1678
01:03:16,680 --> 01:03:18,360
It's the experience.

1679
01:03:18,360 --> 01:03:19,200
It's all of it.

1680
01:03:19,200 --> 01:03:21,520
It's the meats, the hide, the antlers, the memories.

1681
01:03:21,520 --> 01:03:23,680
It's the connections, the bonds that you make with people.

1682
01:03:23,680 --> 01:03:25,200
It's testing yourself.

1683
01:03:25,200 --> 01:03:28,880
It's the sense of satisfaction from providing meat

1684
01:03:28,880 --> 01:03:30,960
for yourself and your family.

1685
01:03:30,960 --> 01:03:32,320
We had tacos last night.

1686
01:03:32,320 --> 01:03:35,720
It was at, I think, Deer Antelope, I can't remember.

1687
01:03:35,720 --> 01:03:38,560
But my wife made tacos and we ate it.

1688
01:03:38,560 --> 01:03:40,160
My kids eat it, they love it.

1689
01:03:41,160 --> 01:03:43,760
And as I sit down and I eat a taco, it's a basic taco.

1690
01:03:43,760 --> 01:03:45,840
But as I eat that, I think, yeah, I killed that.

1691
01:03:45,840 --> 01:03:49,800
Like that's something, I saw that through the entire process.

1692
01:03:49,800 --> 01:03:51,960
I killed it, I put the arrow through it.

1693
01:03:51,960 --> 01:03:54,760
I processed the entire thing, ground it, we cooked it,

1694
01:03:54,760 --> 01:03:56,240
we ate it.

1695
01:03:56,240 --> 01:03:57,640
So it's not stuff.

1696
01:03:57,640 --> 01:03:59,400
And I think that's the thing that a lot of people,

1697
01:03:59,400 --> 01:04:01,920
they look, if you're outside of this, you've never hunted,

1698
01:04:01,920 --> 01:04:04,400
you didn't grow up maybe, any familiarity

1699
01:04:04,400 --> 01:04:05,480
with that kind of lifestyle.

1700
01:04:05,480 --> 01:04:07,200
You look at it, it's like, this is the stuff.

1701
01:04:07,200 --> 01:04:08,240
This is the thing on the wall.

1702
01:04:08,240 --> 01:04:09,960
The thing that you value or I value,

1703
01:04:09,960 --> 01:04:11,840
they could point to it and say, it's that antler, right?

1704
01:04:11,840 --> 01:04:12,680
Those antlers.

1705
01:04:12,680 --> 01:04:13,720
And that's not it.

1706
01:04:13,720 --> 01:04:14,560
No.

1707
01:04:14,560 --> 01:04:15,600
That's just a piece.

1708
01:04:15,600 --> 01:04:17,600
It's something that I look at and I'm like, you know what?

1709
01:04:17,600 --> 01:04:18,800
That was an incredible experience.

1710
01:04:18,800 --> 01:04:20,960
I remember exactly the way I felt.

1711
01:04:20,960 --> 01:04:23,760
I remember the amount of work and effort and dedication

1712
01:04:23,760 --> 01:04:26,080
that it took me to find that success in a sense.

1713
01:04:27,800 --> 01:04:31,880
My sense of self-esteem, my sense of self, of who I am,

1714
01:04:31,880 --> 01:04:34,160
is wrapped up in these experiences.

1715
01:04:34,160 --> 01:04:36,560
So it's not stuff, and I understand what you're saying,

1716
01:04:36,560 --> 01:04:39,360
but it's everything that I am.

1717
01:04:39,360 --> 01:04:42,280
It's the only thing that I look forward to.

1718
01:04:42,280 --> 01:04:44,320
And I pardon that.

1719
01:04:44,320 --> 01:04:47,200
And they're trying to choose how you live,

1720
01:04:47,200 --> 01:04:49,880
how you breathe, how you eat, how you recreate.

1721
01:04:49,880 --> 01:04:53,600
I mean, that's a three-dimensional memory in my mind.

1722
01:04:53,600 --> 01:04:56,240
But why is that any different than a petroglyph

1723
01:04:56,240 --> 01:04:58,640
that's on the rock wall there at Moab, Utah?

1724
01:04:58,640 --> 01:05:02,080
Maybe that was his photo collection, for all I know.

1725
01:05:02,080 --> 01:05:04,640
I mean, he turned around and chipped a bunch of stuff in it.

1726
01:05:04,640 --> 01:05:05,840
That was a story.

1727
01:05:05,840 --> 01:05:10,680
But stop and think about, since the beginning of mankind,

1728
01:05:10,680 --> 01:05:14,400
what meant to those people for survival.

1729
01:05:14,400 --> 01:05:16,400
Okay, do we need this for survival?

1730
01:05:16,400 --> 01:05:17,400
To some degree.

1731
01:05:17,400 --> 01:05:19,640
I mean, if we're gonna continue to maintain what we have.

1732
01:05:19,640 --> 01:05:22,040
I mean, I would argue that I do at this point.

1733
01:05:22,040 --> 01:05:25,000
To be honest, and I'm not speaking specifically of food.

1734
01:05:25,000 --> 01:05:26,920
I'm talking about my mental well-being.

1735
01:05:26,920 --> 01:05:27,760
It's everything.

1736
01:05:27,760 --> 01:05:28,760
And physical well-being.

1737
01:05:28,760 --> 01:05:31,200
The thing that brings me some of the most pleasure

1738
01:05:31,200 --> 01:05:33,520
in my life is that pursuit.

1739
01:05:33,520 --> 01:05:36,480
It's at this stage in the world

1740
01:05:36,480 --> 01:05:39,880
where we're sitting in front of a computer all the time.

1741
01:05:39,880 --> 01:05:42,280
I have my phone in my pocket constantly.

1742
01:05:42,280 --> 01:05:44,200
I drive down the I-15 on my way home.

1743
01:05:44,200 --> 01:05:47,000
Nine out of 10 people will be looking at their phone.

1744
01:05:47,000 --> 01:05:49,360
That is the only time, those 10 days,

1745
01:05:49,360 --> 01:05:51,440
or whatever it is that I get in the woods,

1746
01:05:51,440 --> 01:05:54,480
where I feel well.

1747
01:05:54,480 --> 01:05:57,160
I feel disconnected from all that,

1748
01:05:57,160 --> 01:05:59,040
and I feel like this is it.

1749
01:06:00,000 --> 01:06:02,680
It's the only time that I feel it in today's world.

1750
01:06:02,680 --> 01:06:04,560
And to me, that's what I value.

1751
01:06:04,560 --> 01:06:08,320
And the kicker is you can do that with a tag in your pocket,

1752
01:06:08,320 --> 01:06:10,640
and other people do it without a tag in their pocket

1753
01:06:10,640 --> 01:06:11,840
if they wanna go mountain biking,

1754
01:06:11,840 --> 01:06:14,280
or if they wanna go rock climbing, or whatever.

1755
01:06:14,280 --> 01:06:18,320
But overwhelmingly, we probably are,

1756
01:06:18,320 --> 01:06:20,160
well, I know that I am anymore,

1757
01:06:20,160 --> 01:06:23,960
but the percentage rate, the success rate of what we have,

1758
01:06:23,960 --> 01:06:27,840
versus what people believe that we have,

1759
01:06:27,840 --> 01:06:30,920
it's a 10, or a 20, or a 30% success rate.

1760
01:06:30,920 --> 01:06:33,080
There's one of the commercials that we kicked out

1761
01:06:33,080 --> 01:06:37,880
where Sean said the elk harvest rate in Colorado was 9%.

1762
01:06:37,880 --> 01:06:39,760
That's straight across the board for everything.

1763
01:06:39,760 --> 01:06:44,760
Doze cows, bulls, private, public, guided, unguided,

1764
01:06:44,880 --> 01:06:46,240
any season, whatever.

1765
01:06:46,240 --> 01:06:49,040
But he said in the commercial,

1766
01:06:49,040 --> 01:06:50,560
can you imagine going to the grocery store

1767
01:06:50,560 --> 01:06:52,800
and only being successful 9% of the time?

1768
01:06:53,680 --> 01:06:56,080
And when you put it in a perspective, somebody like that,

1769
01:06:56,080 --> 01:06:59,120
and say, and then, what if you had to draw

1770
01:06:59,120 --> 01:07:01,400
for the opportunity to go to the grocery store?

1771
01:07:01,400 --> 01:07:02,600
And then you only turn around

1772
01:07:02,600 --> 01:07:04,480
and we're successful 9% of the time.

1773
01:07:04,480 --> 01:07:07,400
We do something different for the opportunity

1774
01:07:07,400 --> 01:07:08,920
to be able to provide that everybody

1775
01:07:08,920 --> 01:07:10,240
gets the benefit off of,

1776
01:07:10,240 --> 01:07:12,400
but we're the ones who decide to put the money out.

1777
01:07:12,400 --> 01:07:14,600
We decide to put the effort into it.

1778
01:07:14,600 --> 01:07:15,960
And if we decide to pull the trigger

1779
01:07:15,960 --> 01:07:19,880
and not pull the trigger or pull the string or whatever.

1780
01:07:19,880 --> 01:07:23,360
I had a conversation with an individual for HSUS

1781
01:07:23,360 --> 01:07:26,760
and she was enamored by the fact that when I said,

1782
01:07:26,760 --> 01:07:28,480
you know how unsuccessful I am

1783
01:07:28,480 --> 01:07:29,880
compared to the success that I have?

1784
01:07:29,880 --> 01:07:30,720
And she said, why?

1785
01:07:30,720 --> 01:07:32,840
And I said, because I have the choice.

1786
01:07:32,840 --> 01:07:35,040
Maybe I didn't want to pack it that far.

1787
01:07:35,040 --> 01:07:36,480
Maybe it wasn't the right size.

1788
01:07:36,480 --> 01:07:37,920
Maybe I was stalking,

1789
01:07:37,920 --> 01:07:40,320
I never got a chance to pull the trigger on it, whatever.

1790
01:07:40,320 --> 01:07:43,120
But I am unsuccessful more and I keep doing it

1791
01:07:43,120 --> 01:07:45,000
and keep doing it and keep doing it.

1792
01:07:45,000 --> 01:07:47,080
There's very few things that people do

1793
01:07:47,080 --> 01:07:49,680
in today's environment that are for the better good

1794
01:07:49,680 --> 01:07:52,920
of society and the landscape and the resources

1795
01:07:52,920 --> 01:07:55,240
that they would be unsuccessful

1796
01:07:55,240 --> 01:07:57,000
and continually go back and do it

1797
01:07:57,000 --> 01:07:58,560
and go back and do it and pay to do it.

1798
01:07:58,560 --> 01:08:00,560
Yeah, you want to create it.

1799
01:08:00,560 --> 01:08:02,200
That's the intestinal fortitude,

1800
01:08:02,200 --> 01:08:04,120
I think that comes into what we're trying to do.

1801
01:08:04,120 --> 01:08:05,760
And that's why we're trying to fight so damn hard

1802
01:08:05,760 --> 01:08:07,120
to do what we're doing.

1803
01:08:07,120 --> 01:08:09,360
And I think Colorado is,

1804
01:08:09,360 --> 01:08:10,760
Colorado has become the epicenter

1805
01:08:10,760 --> 01:08:11,880
on a lot of different fronts.

1806
01:08:11,880 --> 01:08:15,040
And I think that that chip on my shoulder

1807
01:08:15,040 --> 01:08:18,520
is expanding to where other people

1808
01:08:18,520 --> 01:08:20,440
have a big chip on their shoulder as well.

1809
01:08:20,440 --> 01:08:21,280
Yeah.

1810
01:08:23,040 --> 01:08:24,400
Do you care, I'm gonna take a break

1811
01:08:24,400 --> 01:08:25,560
to use the bathroom real quick.

1812
01:08:25,560 --> 01:08:26,400
Go for it. I gotta pee

1813
01:08:26,400 --> 01:08:27,560
or I'm gonna pee my pants.

1814
01:08:27,560 --> 01:08:28,400
I apologize.

1815
01:08:28,400 --> 01:08:30,520
You need to go.

1816
01:08:30,520 --> 01:08:31,640
I'm sorry about that.

1817
01:08:31,640 --> 01:08:35,200
Get that tickle and then my eye goes to just a drain.

1818
01:08:35,200 --> 01:08:36,400
We'll be right back.

1819
01:08:36,400 --> 01:08:37,240
I'm good.

1820
01:08:37,240 --> 01:08:38,440
I'm good for another hour anyway.

1821
01:08:38,440 --> 01:08:40,000
I've got a bladder of a 12 year old.

1822
01:08:40,000 --> 01:08:42,000
I'm gonna go get that.

1823
01:08:42,000 --> 01:08:43,960
Hey, might be time for checkup.

1824
01:08:44,840 --> 01:08:45,840
You might want to.

1825
01:08:47,160 --> 01:08:49,360
I gotta go man, I drink coffee on the way down,

1826
01:08:49,360 --> 01:08:50,560
drink water when I'm here.

1827
01:08:50,560 --> 01:08:51,840
You guys got me on this kick

1828
01:08:51,840 --> 01:08:52,920
of trying to stay hydrated.

1829
01:08:52,920 --> 01:08:53,760
You're not just dehydrated,

1830
01:08:53,760 --> 01:08:54,600
it's good for you.

1831
01:08:54,600 --> 01:08:55,440
I guess.

1832
01:08:55,440 --> 01:08:56,280
No, you gotta pee every five minutes.

1833
01:08:56,280 --> 01:08:57,400
That's it, yeah.

1834
01:08:57,400 --> 01:08:59,520
The joys, right?

1835
01:08:59,520 --> 01:09:01,960
How many times do you stop on the way home?

1836
01:09:01,960 --> 01:09:02,840
Between here and Vegas,

1837
01:09:02,840 --> 01:09:04,520
I'm like a two stopper usually.

1838
01:09:04,520 --> 01:09:05,360
Yeah.

1839
01:09:05,360 --> 01:09:06,840
Yeah, just like if I drink water on the way,

1840
01:09:06,840 --> 01:09:08,760
I'm like, I got them planned out.

1841
01:09:08,760 --> 01:09:09,960
I know all the ranch exits.

1842
01:09:09,960 --> 01:09:13,160
I know every spot along the way.

1843
01:09:13,160 --> 01:09:14,280
You don't have a pee bottle?

1844
01:09:14,280 --> 01:09:15,920
No, I ain't doing that.

1845
01:09:15,920 --> 01:09:18,000
I'm just gonna pull over.

1846
01:09:18,000 --> 01:09:19,600
We're not that far gone, are we?

1847
01:09:20,640 --> 01:09:23,000
Where a guy can't step out at a ranch exit

1848
01:09:23,000 --> 01:09:23,840
and take a leak.

1849
01:09:23,840 --> 01:09:25,160
Sometimes I'll use a bottle.

1850
01:09:27,280 --> 01:09:28,120
No.

1851
01:09:29,200 --> 01:09:30,040
Nope, nope.

1852
01:09:30,040 --> 01:09:32,440
He just shakes his head over there.

1853
01:09:32,440 --> 01:09:34,160
Cody, thanks for selling.

1854
01:09:36,840 --> 01:09:38,520
How do we go from chip on the shoulder to pee bottle?

1855
01:09:38,520 --> 01:09:39,800
No kidding, my bad.

1856
01:09:39,800 --> 01:09:41,320
Yeah, but we're back.

1857
01:09:43,280 --> 01:09:46,120
Yeah, I was just thinking as I was peeing, sorry.

1858
01:09:47,200 --> 01:09:48,360
It was what you do when you hang out.

1859
01:09:48,360 --> 01:09:49,360
It's true, it's true.

1860
01:09:50,480 --> 01:09:52,080
Yeah, you make the point,

1861
01:09:53,240 --> 01:09:54,880
I think people, they say,

1862
01:09:54,880 --> 01:09:56,280
oh, you could get that somewhere else.

1863
01:09:56,280 --> 01:09:57,720
You could get that through a mountain biking

1864
01:09:57,720 --> 01:09:59,920
or a trail run or whatever it might be.

1865
01:10:02,080 --> 01:10:04,000
In the same regard, we're not trying to take away

1866
01:10:04,000 --> 01:10:06,560
mountain biking or trail running from those folks.

1867
01:10:06,560 --> 01:10:11,560
To me, it's not even an apples to apples comparison.

1868
01:10:11,920 --> 01:10:14,080
It's not even the same thing.

1869
01:10:15,000 --> 01:10:17,880
Well, it is in a sense where if you went there,

1870
01:10:17,880 --> 01:10:19,960
and when I did the Ronella podcast,

1871
01:10:19,960 --> 01:10:21,800
and I thank Clay said,

1872
01:10:21,800 --> 01:10:24,120
how about if we do a ballot initiative, stop rock climbing?

1873
01:10:24,120 --> 01:10:25,440
Sure.

1874
01:10:25,440 --> 01:10:28,040
I mean, people would come out of the woodwork.

1875
01:10:28,040 --> 01:10:30,120
But if you did it in the name of conservation

1876
01:10:30,120 --> 01:10:31,880
because of birds of prey.

1877
01:10:31,880 --> 01:10:32,720
Falcons?

1878
01:10:32,720 --> 01:10:33,540
Yeah.

1879
01:10:33,540 --> 01:10:34,380
Bats?

1880
01:10:34,380 --> 01:10:36,440
Yeah, I mean, you'd start to open up some eyes

1881
01:10:36,440 --> 01:10:38,800
of, well, I don't want this to affect me.

1882
01:10:38,800 --> 01:10:40,760
Well, you didn't come to my defense over there

1883
01:10:40,760 --> 01:10:43,160
because you didn't think it was going to affect you then.

1884
01:10:43,160 --> 01:10:47,960
I think that the ideology of the general public is that,

1885
01:10:47,960 --> 01:10:51,440
even in our circle, that I'm bulletproof,

1886
01:10:51,440 --> 01:10:53,160
that they're coming after you.

1887
01:10:53,160 --> 01:10:56,880
And I think that if you look at the environmental movement,

1888
01:10:56,880 --> 01:11:00,080
it has a tendency to be overreaching

1889
01:11:00,960 --> 01:11:02,520
on a lot of different levels.

1890
01:11:02,520 --> 01:11:04,400
And I don't think that mountain bikes,

1891
01:11:04,400 --> 01:11:06,040
I don't think that hiking and backpacking

1892
01:11:06,040 --> 01:11:09,040
are off the table the more that you get into things.

1893
01:11:09,040 --> 01:11:11,320
You look at the closures that we have,

1894
01:11:11,320 --> 01:11:13,480
look at the lack of management that we have,

1895
01:11:13,480 --> 01:11:17,040
look at the lack of monetary enforcement that we have.

1896
01:11:18,400 --> 01:11:20,000
They're all part of this scheme too,

1897
01:11:20,000 --> 01:11:21,880
except for the difference is,

1898
01:11:21,880 --> 01:11:23,760
they're out there 365 days a year

1899
01:11:23,760 --> 01:11:25,760
and sportsmen for the most part aren't.

1900
01:11:26,720 --> 01:11:27,560
They aren't.

1901
01:11:27,560 --> 01:11:31,080
And then, I mean, if you look at Pitt and Robertson

1902
01:11:31,080 --> 01:11:34,240
and all the money that permits put back into,

1903
01:11:34,240 --> 01:11:36,640
I mean, the only reason that we have wildlife species

1904
01:11:36,640 --> 01:11:40,560
in North America that we could hunt is because of hunting.

1905
01:11:41,560 --> 01:11:43,320
You were talking earlier, I remember,

1906
01:11:43,320 --> 01:11:44,640
and I've probably said this before,

1907
01:11:44,640 --> 01:11:45,960
so I apologize if you listen,

1908
01:11:45,960 --> 01:11:48,960
but my dad, when I was a kid,

1909
01:11:48,960 --> 01:11:49,800
he would always tell me,

1910
01:11:49,800 --> 01:11:51,960
that hunting permit in your pocket,

1911
01:11:51,960 --> 01:11:54,560
it's not a one for one for the animal.

1912
01:11:54,560 --> 01:11:57,160
It's not that you buy the permit, you get the animal.

1913
01:11:57,160 --> 01:12:00,160
That hunting permit that you purchase is for the experience.

1914
01:12:00,160 --> 01:12:03,480
It's for your opportunity to be in the woods,

1915
01:12:03,480 --> 01:12:05,520
pursuing game.

1916
01:12:05,520 --> 01:12:08,320
It's like buying a movie ticket.

1917
01:12:08,320 --> 01:12:09,720
You're gonna sit through a movie

1918
01:12:09,720 --> 01:12:11,940
and observe this and experience it.

1919
01:12:12,840 --> 01:12:13,920
It's not a one to one.

1920
01:12:13,920 --> 01:12:16,400
It's not like I buy a hunting permit, I get an elk.

1921
01:12:16,400 --> 01:12:19,520
It's an experience that you get,

1922
01:12:19,520 --> 01:12:22,480
and then that feeds back in to promoting

1923
01:12:22,480 --> 01:12:24,720
and providing wildlife for everybody,

1924
01:12:24,720 --> 01:12:28,520
to view, to hunt, whatever it is that you,

1925
01:12:28,520 --> 01:12:30,720
the value that you place on wildlife.

1926
01:12:30,720 --> 01:12:33,720
And I've tried to pass that on to my kids,

1927
01:12:33,720 --> 01:12:35,880
because I think people, and people that don't hunt,

1928
01:12:35,880 --> 01:12:37,240
I think they look at hunting and they're like,

1929
01:12:37,240 --> 01:12:38,960
oh, you buy the permit, you get the animal,

1930
01:12:38,960 --> 01:12:40,600
you're out there just slaughtering animals.

1931
01:12:40,600 --> 01:12:43,000
It's not, it's an experience.

1932
01:12:43,000 --> 01:12:43,840
It's a lifestyle.

1933
01:12:46,240 --> 01:12:50,220
It's a lifestyle, and it's something that's hard.

1934
01:12:50,220 --> 01:12:52,160
When people say, why do you hunt?

1935
01:12:54,040 --> 01:12:55,160
That's different for everybody.

1936
01:12:55,160 --> 01:12:56,000
Sure.

1937
01:12:56,000 --> 01:13:00,400
Every single person, and maybe it's a method of take,

1938
01:13:00,400 --> 01:13:03,560
maybe it's a species, maybe it's time of the family,

1939
01:13:03,560 --> 01:13:07,440
maybe it's just being out in the field.

1940
01:13:07,440 --> 01:13:09,880
But you ask 100 people, why do you hunt?

1941
01:13:09,880 --> 01:13:12,920
And you're gonna get 145 different answers.

1942
01:13:13,840 --> 01:13:15,480
And I think that that's one of the things,

1943
01:13:15,480 --> 01:13:17,320
why do you mountain bike?

1944
01:13:17,320 --> 01:13:18,800
You're gonna get some different answers,

1945
01:13:18,800 --> 01:13:20,220
but it's not as broad as what it is

1946
01:13:20,220 --> 01:13:22,280
when you turn around and say, why do I hunt?

1947
01:13:22,280 --> 01:13:24,800
And hunting is even different than fishing.

1948
01:13:26,200 --> 01:13:28,000
There's a different component there.

1949
01:13:28,000 --> 01:13:30,360
I like to fish, but I'm not an avid fisherman

1950
01:13:30,360 --> 01:13:32,760
in a sense to where I am like an avid hunter.

1951
01:13:33,920 --> 01:13:36,400
But we have more connectivity between the hunting

1952
01:13:36,400 --> 01:13:38,840
and angling side of it than what, let's just say,

1953
01:13:38,840 --> 01:13:40,840
rock climbers and hang gliders do.

1954
01:13:40,840 --> 01:13:42,400
I mean, there's people that do some,

1955
01:13:42,400 --> 01:13:44,020
there's people that do both,

1956
01:13:44,020 --> 01:13:46,880
but they don't buy a license to be able to do it.

1957
01:13:46,880 --> 01:13:48,760
And they don't have to, on the hunting side,

1958
01:13:48,760 --> 01:13:50,960
they don't have to go through a class or a course

1959
01:13:50,960 --> 01:13:54,480
or a test to be certified to be able to do that.

1960
01:13:54,480 --> 01:13:55,560
Same on the mountain lion deal.

1961
01:13:55,560 --> 01:13:57,520
And people say, oh, it's just unregulated.

1962
01:13:57,520 --> 01:13:58,760
No, it's not.

1963
01:13:58,760 --> 01:13:59,880
You have to have a class.

1964
01:13:59,880 --> 01:14:00,840
You have to have a test.

1965
01:14:00,840 --> 01:14:02,560
You have to be able to pass the course.

1966
01:14:02,560 --> 01:14:05,520
And then there's regulations that you have to adhere to

1967
01:14:05,520 --> 01:14:07,920
and quotas and studies and guidelines and data

1968
01:14:07,920 --> 01:14:09,880
and all the stuff that go into that.

1969
01:14:09,880 --> 01:14:11,480
That doesn't go into mountain biking,

1970
01:14:11,480 --> 01:14:13,440
doesn't go into backpacking.

1971
01:14:13,440 --> 01:14:14,640
You don't need any of that.

1972
01:14:14,640 --> 01:14:17,360
You just buy a backpack out here in your showroom,

1973
01:14:17,360 --> 01:14:19,880
turn around and go on a hike.

1974
01:14:19,880 --> 01:14:21,880
I hope they're buying backpacks in our showroom.

1975
01:14:21,880 --> 01:14:24,240
That's right.

1976
01:14:24,240 --> 01:14:25,400
If you're a backpacker out there

1977
01:14:25,400 --> 01:14:27,840
and you just want a backpack, yeah.

1978
01:14:27,840 --> 01:14:31,320
Come get a backpack and then we'll talk you into hunting.

1979
01:14:31,320 --> 01:14:33,520
Let's, did you have any?

1980
01:14:33,520 --> 01:14:35,800
I was gonna, I wanted to dive into kind of

1981
01:14:35,800 --> 01:14:38,200
where we're at currently on some of the issues.

1982
01:14:38,200 --> 01:14:39,040
On the lion stuff.

1983
01:14:39,040 --> 01:14:39,920
Yeah, on the lion stuff.

1984
01:14:39,920 --> 01:14:43,480
Yeah, we're up against the wall like a redneck mother,

1985
01:14:43,480 --> 01:14:44,480
I think, right now.

1986
01:14:46,960 --> 01:14:49,080
I say that wholeheartedly.

1987
01:14:49,080 --> 01:14:49,920
Stop that.

1988
01:14:51,320 --> 01:14:53,080
I say that wholeheartedly because

1989
01:14:54,200 --> 01:14:57,120
they just started getting paid signatures.

1990
01:14:57,120 --> 01:14:57,960
How does that work?

1991
01:14:57,960 --> 01:15:00,040
So there's firms out there that turn around

1992
01:15:00,040 --> 01:15:02,000
and charge to go collect signatures

1993
01:15:02,000 --> 01:15:04,280
on behalf of whatever case you might want to make.

1994
01:15:04,280 --> 01:15:05,120
Is that legal?

1995
01:15:05,120 --> 01:15:05,960
Yeah.

1996
01:15:05,960 --> 01:15:06,800
How's that legal?

1997
01:15:06,800 --> 01:15:09,240
I can't pay you, but I can pay somebody to get yours.

1998
01:15:09,240 --> 01:15:12,480
And so they just started doing that, which ups the game.

1999
01:15:12,480 --> 01:15:15,800
They've got until July 5th to get the signatures

2000
01:15:15,800 --> 01:15:18,580
that we fought diligently to get to the process

2001
01:15:18,580 --> 01:15:20,040
that we need to get to.

2002
01:15:20,040 --> 01:15:21,560
So they pay a firm.

2003
01:15:21,560 --> 01:15:22,400
Yep.

2004
01:15:22,400 --> 01:15:23,920
Does the firm pay?

2005
01:15:23,920 --> 01:15:26,240
No, no, they can't pay the person.

2006
01:15:26,240 --> 01:15:28,720
They can't pay a person for the signature,

2007
01:15:28,720 --> 01:15:31,440
but can they pay an intern to go out and collect signatures?

2008
01:15:31,440 --> 01:15:32,560
Yep, that's exactly what they do.

2009
01:15:32,560 --> 01:15:34,080
Un-freaking- believable.

2010
01:15:34,080 --> 01:15:36,080
So now they'll have volunteer people in the field

2011
01:15:36,080 --> 01:15:38,880
and they'll have paid professional signature gatherers

2012
01:15:38,880 --> 01:15:40,520
or circulators in the field.

2013
01:15:40,520 --> 01:15:42,140
And the thing that where we kind of got

2014
01:15:42,140 --> 01:15:43,540
between a rock and a hard spot

2015
01:15:43,540 --> 01:15:47,160
is the signatures were costing about $20 a piece.

2016
01:15:47,160 --> 01:15:50,640
Now, because of some compromises and negotiations

2017
01:15:50,640 --> 01:15:52,680
that our governor in Colorado worked out

2018
01:15:52,680 --> 01:15:54,520
with the oil and gas industry

2019
01:15:54,520 --> 01:15:56,440
on two particular ballot initiatives

2020
01:15:56,440 --> 01:15:58,880
that we're gonna be on this year,

2021
01:15:58,880 --> 01:15:59,760
they worked those out.

2022
01:15:59,760 --> 01:16:01,780
So the signatures don't need to be gathered now.

2023
01:16:01,780 --> 01:16:03,840
So there's two firms that opened up

2024
01:16:03,840 --> 01:16:05,280
and the signatures dropped,

2025
01:16:05,280 --> 01:16:09,440
the signature per signature dropped from $20 to $3.

2026
01:16:09,440 --> 01:16:11,480
So now they went out and they're,

2027
01:16:11,480 --> 01:16:14,340
I think we don't know exactly what they need to collect,

2028
01:16:14,340 --> 01:16:16,400
but they need to collect a good amount

2029
01:16:16,400 --> 01:16:19,840
because they were still doing volunteer signature stuff.

2030
01:16:19,840 --> 01:16:21,520
We don't know how many they have to collect

2031
01:16:21,520 --> 01:16:22,680
to then that be-

2032
01:16:22,680 --> 01:16:24,060
We know how many they need to collect.

2033
01:16:24,060 --> 01:16:26,160
We just don't know where they're at in that process.

2034
01:16:26,160 --> 01:16:27,000
Like how far along they are.

2035
01:16:27,000 --> 01:16:28,880
Yeah, so we don't know whether they've got 12

2036
01:16:28,880 --> 01:16:31,840
or they got 12,000 or they have 120,000.

2037
01:16:31,840 --> 01:16:33,840
I'm anticipating that they probably have somewhere

2038
01:16:33,840 --> 01:16:36,840
between 50 and 70,000 and they need to get 124,238

2039
01:16:39,740 --> 01:16:44,740
by July 5th, but to be eligible and legible and so forth,

2040
01:16:45,520 --> 01:16:48,560
they probably need 170 or 180,000

2041
01:16:48,560 --> 01:16:50,800
to make the threshold of 124.

2042
01:16:50,800 --> 01:16:53,520
Have you ever run into somebody out collecting signatures?

2043
01:16:53,520 --> 01:16:54,960
I have not on this particular issue.

2044
01:16:54,960 --> 01:16:56,240
Heard their pitch?

2045
01:16:56,240 --> 01:16:58,240
I mean, how does that go?

2046
01:16:58,240 --> 01:16:59,280
I'm curious.

2047
01:16:59,280 --> 01:17:01,360
Well, from what I'm getting feedback from,

2048
01:17:01,360 --> 01:17:03,320
from people that are in the field that actually see them

2049
01:17:03,320 --> 01:17:05,600
in Whole Foods or in front of a shopping mall

2050
01:17:05,600 --> 01:17:06,440
or a farmer's market.

2051
01:17:06,440 --> 01:17:07,280
Universities probably.

2052
01:17:07,280 --> 01:17:08,360
Yeah, universities.

2053
01:17:08,360 --> 01:17:11,280
Yeah, and they're lying.

2054
01:17:11,280 --> 01:17:15,040
They're deceitful sales pitches,

2055
01:17:15,040 --> 01:17:17,160
talking about trophy hunting, talk about cruelty,

2056
01:17:17,160 --> 01:17:19,080
talk about orphanage of cubs,

2057
01:17:19,080 --> 01:17:20,640
talking about the lack of management,

2058
01:17:20,640 --> 01:17:24,360
talking about waste and want, want and waste laws.

2059
01:17:24,360 --> 01:17:25,800
I mean, they, it's.

2060
01:17:25,800 --> 01:17:27,560
They talk about hot button issues that sounds like,

2061
01:17:27,560 --> 01:17:28,840
oh yeah, sure, I'll sign my name.

2062
01:17:28,840 --> 01:17:30,200
It's like. Yeah.

2063
01:17:30,200 --> 01:17:32,960
Yeah, and then they even still are lying to the point

2064
01:17:32,960 --> 01:17:35,800
to where they say, well, we don't want people

2065
01:17:35,800 --> 01:17:40,520
to be able to just harvest things for the trophy,

2066
01:17:40,520 --> 01:17:42,440
but this is a total hunting ban.

2067
01:17:42,440 --> 01:17:44,160
It doesn't have anything to do with the meat anymore.

2068
01:17:44,160 --> 01:17:47,840
This is complete, everything's off the table.

2069
01:17:47,840 --> 01:17:48,680
Total ban.

2070
01:17:48,680 --> 01:17:49,600
Total ban, yeah.

2071
01:17:49,600 --> 01:17:52,360
And so when we fought diligently for the first four months

2072
01:17:52,360 --> 01:17:54,720
to the tune of a couple hundred thousand dollars

2073
01:17:54,720 --> 01:17:55,840
through the legal process,

2074
01:17:55,840 --> 01:17:57,600
then we talked about in February,

2075
01:17:58,720 --> 01:18:02,160
the, they started out, this was a trophy hunting ban,

2076
01:18:02,160 --> 01:18:04,080
but we got the language changed in the title.

2077
01:18:04,080 --> 01:18:05,280
So it's a hunting ban.

2078
01:18:05,280 --> 01:18:06,800
They still are trying to promote it

2079
01:18:06,800 --> 01:18:09,880
as a trophy hunting ban, but it is a hunting ban.

2080
01:18:09,880 --> 01:18:13,880
It, the language specifically says that trophy hunting

2081
01:18:13,880 --> 01:18:15,240
in the language, not the title,

2082
01:18:15,240 --> 01:18:17,240
but in the language that says trophy hunting

2083
01:18:17,240 --> 01:18:20,960
means intentionally killing, wounding, stalking, pursuing,

2084
01:18:20,960 --> 01:18:23,080
or entrapping a bobcat or a mountain lion.

2085
01:18:23,080 --> 01:18:24,280
That's hunting.

2086
01:18:24,280 --> 01:18:25,720
And the bad part about it is,

2087
01:18:25,720 --> 01:18:28,320
and I need to emphasize this on every podcast that I've done,

2088
01:18:28,320 --> 01:18:30,280
speaking of which, this is like the 64th one

2089
01:18:30,280 --> 01:18:31,600
that I've done now.

2090
01:18:31,600 --> 01:18:32,440
So I'm-

2091
01:18:32,440 --> 01:18:33,280
You're an old pro.

2092
01:18:33,280 --> 01:18:34,120
So I'm-

2093
01:18:34,120 --> 01:18:36,360
You know, and I've listened to a fair number of them,

2094
01:18:36,360 --> 01:18:38,080
and even then they're still good.

2095
01:18:38,080 --> 01:18:39,440
Thanks, well I appreciate it.

2096
01:18:39,440 --> 01:18:40,520
I'm still fascinated.

2097
01:18:40,520 --> 01:18:41,920
I appreciate it.

2098
01:18:41,920 --> 01:18:43,000
So it comes through.

2099
01:18:43,000 --> 01:18:45,760
Well, and I think that, I think you, when you,

2100
01:18:45,760 --> 01:18:47,960
going back to my original assessment that, you know,

2101
01:18:47,960 --> 01:18:50,240
you got 0.7 seconds to turn around and get somebody

2102
01:18:50,240 --> 01:18:52,280
to be able to recall something.

2103
01:18:52,280 --> 01:18:55,080
Over and over repetitiveness and redundancy

2104
01:18:55,080 --> 01:18:57,160
is what we're seeing a lot of.

2105
01:18:57,160 --> 01:19:00,240
We're finally, after 30 podcasts or 20,

2106
01:19:00,240 --> 01:19:02,000
27 different commercials or whatever,

2107
01:19:02,000 --> 01:19:03,840
somebody will send us a check for 50 bucks saying,

2108
01:19:03,840 --> 01:19:06,760
oh, I've been seeing this for the last five months.

2109
01:19:06,760 --> 01:19:08,280
We need to get involved.

2110
01:19:08,280 --> 01:19:12,520
Well, I think that where we are at

2111
01:19:12,520 --> 01:19:15,920
compared to where we were in the process,

2112
01:19:15,920 --> 01:19:18,680
we are light years ahead of where they thought we would be.

2113
01:19:18,680 --> 01:19:20,920
That's why we put their backs against the wall.

2114
01:19:20,920 --> 01:19:24,120
That we've created so many hurdles and obstacles

2115
01:19:24,120 --> 01:19:26,680
for them to be able to turn around and try to, you know,

2116
01:19:26,680 --> 01:19:28,280
circumvent.

2117
01:19:28,280 --> 01:19:29,760
That's why they're up in their game.

2118
01:19:29,760 --> 01:19:32,400
Now somebody, I think, kicks some additional money in

2119
01:19:32,400 --> 01:19:34,640
for the signature gathering process.

2120
01:19:34,640 --> 01:19:37,520
Because when you're dealing with a ballot initiative,

2121
01:19:37,520 --> 01:19:40,800
there's issues committees and there's rules and regulations

2122
01:19:40,800 --> 01:19:43,920
and audits and independent expenditure committees and stuff.

2123
01:19:43,920 --> 01:19:46,120
I mean, you've got to comply with a bunch of crap

2124
01:19:46,120 --> 01:19:48,440
because you're dealing with voter stuff.

2125
01:19:48,440 --> 01:19:51,200
And they are complying,

2126
01:19:51,200 --> 01:19:53,880
but there's some money sitting in the wings somewhere.

2127
01:19:53,880 --> 01:19:55,600
We just don't know where it's coming from yet.

2128
01:19:55,600 --> 01:19:57,240
And until it actually hits their account,

2129
01:19:57,240 --> 01:19:59,400
we won't know actually where it came from.

2130
01:20:00,520 --> 01:20:05,520
It's just wild that they can send out paid individuals

2131
01:20:05,920 --> 01:20:09,320
to collect signatures and essentially disseminate,

2132
01:20:09,320 --> 01:20:12,040
just put information out into the public

2133
01:20:12,040 --> 01:20:14,920
that's completely dishonest.

2134
01:20:14,920 --> 01:20:15,760
Yeah, and it's-

2135
01:20:15,760 --> 01:20:19,960
And misleading and just like, hey, you know,

2136
01:20:19,960 --> 01:20:22,080
I mean, just whatever they feel like they want to tell them.

2137
01:20:22,080 --> 01:20:25,040
You know, I said this on Renella and Steve said this

2138
01:20:25,040 --> 01:20:26,960
in one of our spots that he did.

2139
01:20:26,960 --> 01:20:31,960
And he goes, I believe that there could be a proposal

2140
01:20:32,040 --> 01:20:33,760
to ban deer and elk hunting

2141
01:20:33,760 --> 01:20:36,320
and not too long in the future.

2142
01:20:36,320 --> 01:20:38,200
I mean, don't you feel that if they get that,

2143
01:20:38,200 --> 01:20:40,000
like if they cleared the hurdle,

2144
01:20:40,000 --> 01:20:42,280
if they were able to get mountain lion hunting

2145
01:20:42,280 --> 01:20:45,520
and bobcat hunting, you know, cat hunting banned

2146
01:20:45,520 --> 01:20:48,840
and they had some success, I mean, why wouldn't they?

2147
01:20:48,840 --> 01:20:51,360
Well, and that's what I was gonna say too

2148
01:20:51,360 --> 01:20:52,720
before I had a brain fart.

2149
01:20:54,720 --> 01:20:58,480
This will be a statutory definition, not regulatory.

2150
01:20:58,480 --> 01:21:01,400
This will be the first time that essentially

2151
01:21:01,400 --> 01:21:03,600
that trophy hunting in language

2152
01:21:03,600 --> 01:21:07,360
would be determined in statute

2153
01:21:07,360 --> 01:21:08,960
in the United States.

2154
01:21:08,960 --> 01:21:12,060
So if you determine what the definition is,

2155
01:21:12,060 --> 01:21:13,760
you can turn around and take bobcats out

2156
01:21:13,760 --> 01:21:14,960
and put bighorn sheep in.

2157
01:21:14,960 --> 01:21:16,840
You could take mountain lions out and put moose in

2158
01:21:16,840 --> 01:21:17,760
if you really wanted to,

2159
01:21:17,760 --> 01:21:19,720
because it's a statutory definition

2160
01:21:19,720 --> 01:21:21,640
because it defines trophy hunting.

2161
01:21:22,560 --> 01:21:24,360
Trophy hunting means intentionally killing,

2162
01:21:24,360 --> 01:21:26,160
wounding, stalking, pursuing or entrapping.

2163
01:21:26,160 --> 01:21:27,000
Who's this hunting?

2164
01:21:27,000 --> 01:21:29,080
Yeah, I don't know anybody that intentionally wounds anything

2165
01:21:29,080 --> 01:21:31,760
which is a bunch of bullshit anyway.

2166
01:21:31,760 --> 01:21:35,920
But if it's defined, trophy hunting is defined as that.

2167
01:21:35,920 --> 01:21:38,240
Tell me where in Nevada or in Texas or anywhere else

2168
01:21:38,240 --> 01:21:40,080
that you couldn't turn around and take another species

2169
01:21:40,080 --> 01:21:42,840
and put it in because of the statutory precedent.

2170
01:21:42,840 --> 01:21:43,960
You look at the legal side

2171
01:21:43,960 --> 01:21:46,240
and she worked in the district attorney's office

2172
01:21:46,240 --> 01:21:48,040
and through the federal court judge

2173
01:21:48,040 --> 01:21:50,800
or state court judge for years.

2174
01:21:50,800 --> 01:21:51,640
14.

2175
01:21:52,840 --> 01:21:54,200
They go on precedent.

2176
01:21:55,760 --> 01:21:59,400
Look at this is, Keller versus Williams

2177
01:21:59,400 --> 01:22:01,360
or wherever it might be.

2178
01:22:02,360 --> 01:22:03,880
That's what they go off of.

2179
01:22:03,880 --> 01:22:06,240
Regulatory is what the Colorado Parks and Wildlife Commission

2180
01:22:06,240 --> 01:22:07,680
would deal with.

2181
01:22:07,680 --> 01:22:08,960
Those are things that could be changed

2182
01:22:08,960 --> 01:22:10,360
a little bit more easy.

2183
01:22:10,360 --> 01:22:13,480
Statutory, you start really getting into some.

2184
01:22:13,480 --> 01:22:14,520
You establish precedence.

2185
01:22:14,520 --> 01:22:15,360
Yeah.

2186
01:22:15,360 --> 01:22:18,400
And if you define the statutory definition

2187
01:22:18,400 --> 01:22:21,440
of trophy hunting in the state of Colorado,

2188
01:22:21,440 --> 01:22:24,160
that could be translated in the state of Colorado

2189
01:22:24,160 --> 01:22:25,800
or out of the state of Colorado.

2190
01:22:25,800 --> 01:22:28,240
Somebody wants to turn around and do alligator,

2191
01:22:28,240 --> 01:22:30,160
gars or turkeys for crying out loud.

2192
01:22:30,160 --> 01:22:31,240
Just put it in there.

2193
01:22:32,160 --> 01:22:33,040
Will it pass?

2194
01:22:33,040 --> 01:22:34,560
Maybe it won't.

2195
01:22:34,560 --> 01:22:36,440
But nobody thought it'd pass in Colorado either.

2196
01:22:36,440 --> 01:22:38,000
Yeah.

2197
01:22:38,000 --> 01:22:39,680
So if they collect the signatures,

2198
01:22:39,680 --> 01:22:41,080
it'll go to a vote.

2199
01:22:41,080 --> 01:22:44,440
Yeah, if they get the signatures by July 5th.

2200
01:22:44,440 --> 01:22:46,720
So that's why we're up against the deadline right now

2201
01:22:46,720 --> 01:22:50,640
for the monetary fundraising side of things

2202
01:22:50,640 --> 01:22:54,640
because we know that we have a specific timeline

2203
01:22:54,640 --> 01:22:57,760
on our level to be able to talk to our audience,

2204
01:22:57,760 --> 01:23:01,280
our stakeholder audience, not the target audience.

2205
01:23:01,280 --> 01:23:03,240
The stakeholder audience is still the hook and bullet,

2206
01:23:03,240 --> 01:23:04,920
the hunters and anglers that we've been talking to

2207
01:23:04,920 --> 01:23:07,560
the last nine months, educating them

2208
01:23:07,560 --> 01:23:09,760
about how important this is.

2209
01:23:09,760 --> 01:23:12,680
If we can't get our guys on board,

2210
01:23:12,680 --> 01:23:14,840
how the hell are we going to get the people

2211
01:23:14,840 --> 01:23:17,280
that aren't our guys on board?

2212
01:23:17,280 --> 01:23:18,760
And as soon as we get to a point

2213
01:23:18,760 --> 01:23:20,600
to where September comes around,

2214
01:23:20,600 --> 01:23:22,240
I mean, how many guys in this building

2215
01:23:22,240 --> 01:23:24,320
are going to be around September or gone?

2216
01:23:24,320 --> 01:23:26,280
All these rifle hunters, well, I'll be gone.

2217
01:23:26,280 --> 01:23:27,400
Yeah.

2218
01:23:27,400 --> 01:23:29,240
I mean, September 1st comes around

2219
01:23:29,240 --> 01:23:31,880
and we start to lose a lot of enthusiasm,

2220
01:23:31,880 --> 01:23:36,240
a lot of connectivity, a lot of that mechanism

2221
01:23:36,240 --> 01:23:38,680
with our groups because they're gone, they're in a field.

2222
01:23:38,680 --> 01:23:39,920
Yeah, big fights now through August.

2223
01:23:39,920 --> 01:23:40,880
Yeah.

2224
01:23:40,880 --> 01:23:44,800
So from now until July 5th,

2225
01:23:44,800 --> 01:23:47,720
then certification of the signatures, if they get enough,

2226
01:23:47,720 --> 01:23:49,240
will happen by August 5th.

2227
01:23:49,240 --> 01:23:51,880
And then from August 5th to November 5th is D-Day.

2228
01:23:52,840 --> 01:23:54,320
So what's the best way right now

2229
01:23:54,320 --> 01:23:56,680
people can help join the fight?

2230
01:23:56,680 --> 01:23:58,240
We got to get some funds.

2231
01:23:58,240 --> 01:24:00,080
We've been doing really, really remarkable

2232
01:24:00,080 --> 01:24:02,720
and to everybody that's contributed at every single level,

2233
01:24:02,720 --> 01:24:05,640
whether it's the industry, whether it's organizations,

2234
01:24:05,640 --> 01:24:07,720
whether it's individuals,

2235
01:24:07,720 --> 01:24:10,040
hound hunting associations in other states,

2236
01:24:10,040 --> 01:24:11,600
kids with lemonade stands,

2237
01:24:13,400 --> 01:24:17,280
old men giving us handwritten cursive notes

2238
01:24:17,280 --> 01:24:20,080
with a walker going up to the mailbox

2239
01:24:20,080 --> 01:24:21,440
and somebody taking a selfie of them

2240
01:24:21,440 --> 01:24:23,840
and saying, I'm putting my money order in.

2241
01:24:25,560 --> 01:24:27,960
We've gotten, excuse me,

2242
01:24:27,960 --> 01:24:31,320
we've gotten so much generosity from around the state

2243
01:24:31,320 --> 01:24:34,160
and around the country, but we got to have more.

2244
01:24:34,160 --> 01:24:37,200
We're dealing with a major giant juggernaut.

2245
01:24:37,200 --> 01:24:40,280
When you start talking about Wayne Pacelli,

2246
01:24:40,280 --> 01:24:45,280
the former HSUS CEO, raising funds,

2247
01:24:45,680 --> 01:24:47,800
Carole Baskins off of Tiger King.

2248
01:24:47,800 --> 01:24:49,120
Wild King, Wild Earth Road.

2249
01:24:49,120 --> 01:24:49,960
Carole Baskins?

2250
01:24:49,960 --> 01:24:53,200
Oh yeah, she's in on top of this wholeheartedly.

2251
01:24:53,200 --> 01:24:54,040
Yeah, there's 60.

2252
01:24:54,040 --> 01:24:54,880
I mean, that's all you need to know.

2253
01:24:54,880 --> 01:24:57,880
If you're listening to this and you're on the fence,

2254
01:24:57,880 --> 01:24:59,480
you know, Carole Baskins.

2255
01:24:59,480 --> 01:25:02,040
Go back and watch Tiger King.

2256
01:25:02,040 --> 01:25:02,880
Exactly.

2257
01:25:02,880 --> 01:25:04,760
And then tell me if you would like to put your money

2258
01:25:04,760 --> 01:25:06,080
and vote towards that.

2259
01:25:06,080 --> 01:25:06,920
Yeah.

2260
01:25:06,920 --> 01:25:07,760
Unbelievable.

2261
01:25:07,760 --> 01:25:10,320
Yeah, so you look at the following that they've got.

2262
01:25:10,320 --> 01:25:15,320
They realize that this is an opportunity for them,

2263
01:25:15,720 --> 01:25:18,400
the way Colorado's makeup is legislatively,

2264
01:25:18,400 --> 01:25:21,160
appointment wise, gubernatorial wise,

2265
01:25:21,160 --> 01:25:23,880
first gentleman wise, the animal extremist wise.

2266
01:25:23,880 --> 01:25:27,120
They realize that if they can capitalize off of this,

2267
01:25:27,120 --> 01:25:30,080
that it'll set a precedent on multiple levels

2268
01:25:30,080 --> 01:25:31,280
that they can be able to turn around

2269
01:25:31,280 --> 01:25:33,600
and broaden their message and broaden their reach

2270
01:25:33,600 --> 01:25:35,400
and be able to accomplish what they want.

2271
01:25:35,400 --> 01:25:37,920
But they also realize that if they don't

2272
01:25:37,920 --> 01:25:39,320
and that we're successful

2273
01:25:39,320 --> 01:25:41,520
and we can turn around and turn this around,

2274
01:25:42,600 --> 01:25:44,040
where do they go next?

2275
01:25:44,040 --> 01:25:45,040
And how do they go there?

2276
01:25:45,040 --> 01:25:47,440
Because we built a roadmap and a playbook.

2277
01:25:47,440 --> 01:25:50,480
We've helped create the mechanism, the conduit.

2278
01:25:50,480 --> 01:25:52,120
I didn't say we do it at all on our own.

2279
01:25:52,120 --> 01:25:54,560
We just help give the opportunity for that.

2280
01:25:54,560 --> 01:25:58,040
And I joke about the 64th podcast.

2281
01:25:58,040 --> 01:26:00,960
I mean, we can't buy that sort of stuff.

2282
01:26:00,960 --> 01:26:03,000
We've had articles in Field and Stream,

2283
01:26:04,480 --> 01:26:08,520
Fur Fish and Game, Full Cry, Sports of Field,

2284
01:26:08,520 --> 01:26:10,600
Rocky Mountain or the Bugle Magazine.

2285
01:26:12,360 --> 01:26:15,200
I mean, there's been like 12, 13 different publications.

2286
01:26:15,200 --> 01:26:16,480
See what the Eastmans did.

2287
01:26:16,480 --> 01:26:17,800
They turned around and did the belly band

2288
01:26:17,800 --> 01:26:19,560
on 40,000 different magazines.

2289
01:26:19,560 --> 01:26:21,320
Hunt and Fool turned around and did the same thing.

2290
01:26:21,320 --> 01:26:24,240
I mean, the reason I'm saying this is because

2291
01:26:24,240 --> 01:26:25,960
a lot of these groups and entities

2292
01:26:25,960 --> 01:26:28,560
are in competition with each other business-wise,

2293
01:26:28,560 --> 01:26:31,360
but they realize that this is the tipping point.

2294
01:26:31,360 --> 01:26:33,680
They see just what I was talking about.

2295
01:26:33,680 --> 01:26:36,560
I might not agree with you 100% on everything,

2296
01:26:36,560 --> 01:26:38,880
but I realize that the enemy is over there

2297
01:26:38,880 --> 01:26:39,720
and you're not the enemy.

2298
01:26:39,720 --> 01:26:41,600
And they're all starting to realize internally

2299
01:26:41,600 --> 01:26:45,360
that the enemy is not in our rank and file.

2300
01:26:45,360 --> 01:26:48,320
Our enemy is the opposition who wants you gone

2301
01:26:48,320 --> 01:26:49,920
and them gone and everybody else gone.

2302
01:26:49,920 --> 01:26:54,040
And that's the remarkable thing to see the enthusiasm

2303
01:26:54,040 --> 01:26:55,520
and the optimism coming out.

2304
01:26:55,520 --> 01:26:57,000
Outdoor Edge, for instance,

2305
01:26:57,000 --> 01:26:59,880
they're doing a commemorative knife that's to save the hunt

2306
01:26:59,880 --> 01:27:01,560
and they're trying to get all of their people,

2307
01:27:01,560 --> 01:27:03,600
whether it was Shockies or Lee and Tiffany

2308
01:27:03,600 --> 01:27:05,840
or everybody else to promote the knife.

2309
01:27:05,840 --> 01:27:07,120
All the money turns around and goes.

2310
01:27:07,120 --> 01:27:08,040
I showed you the t-shirt.

2311
01:27:08,040 --> 01:27:09,560
That guy came out of the woodwork

2312
01:27:09,560 --> 01:27:12,000
and they're selling things on our behalf

2313
01:27:12,000 --> 01:27:14,280
to generate money for this cause.

2314
01:27:14,280 --> 01:27:15,880
Nobody's making any money off of it

2315
01:27:15,880 --> 01:27:18,320
except for sending the money to what we're doing.

2316
01:27:18,320 --> 01:27:21,120
And I think that that sets the tone and the precedent

2317
01:27:21,120 --> 01:27:23,160
for what we can try to capitalize on

2318
01:27:23,160 --> 01:27:26,680
to make this event a victorious one for us.

2319
01:27:26,680 --> 01:27:28,000
But then everybody else can turn around

2320
01:27:28,000 --> 01:27:30,880
and capitalize off the successes that we've had.

2321
01:27:30,880 --> 01:27:32,520
And I will say going on the website,

2322
01:27:32,520 --> 01:27:34,680
making a donation is actually super easy.

2323
01:27:34,680 --> 01:27:36,080
It takes a couple of minutes.

2324
01:27:36,080 --> 01:27:36,920
Yeah, yeah.

2325
01:27:36,920 --> 01:27:38,800
Like I work in the hunting industry.

2326
01:27:38,800 --> 01:27:40,280
I don't make a ton of money.

2327
01:27:40,280 --> 01:27:42,280
I went on there and made a personal donation.

2328
01:27:42,280 --> 01:27:43,360
It's that easy.

2329
01:27:43,360 --> 01:27:45,200
Cause like on our last podcast we did with you,

2330
01:27:45,200 --> 01:27:48,440
what resonated with me is all the hunting apps we throw out,

2331
01:27:48,440 --> 01:27:50,360
all the hunting license we spend,

2332
01:27:50,360 --> 01:27:52,600
you mentioned, well, we just take that money

2333
01:27:52,600 --> 01:27:54,360
we would spend on hunting license and apps

2334
01:27:54,360 --> 01:27:55,520
and use that same sort of thing

2335
01:27:55,520 --> 01:27:57,440
and donate that same amount of money.

2336
01:27:57,440 --> 01:27:58,600
That's what I did.

2337
01:27:58,600 --> 01:27:59,440
It was super easy.

2338
01:27:59,440 --> 01:28:00,260
That resonated with me.

2339
01:28:00,260 --> 01:28:02,600
I spend a lot of money on hunting license and apps.

2340
01:28:02,600 --> 01:28:05,280
I can donate that same amount

2341
01:28:05,280 --> 01:28:07,280
to you guys to continue the fight.

2342
01:28:07,280 --> 01:28:08,280
It's easy.

2343
01:28:08,280 --> 01:28:09,600
And that should resonate with a lot of hunters.

2344
01:28:09,600 --> 01:28:13,200
Like we spend money on gear, licenses,

2345
01:28:13,200 --> 01:28:14,040
donate it as well.

2346
01:28:14,040 --> 01:28:18,080
We've had multiple fundraising opportunities.

2347
01:28:18,080 --> 01:28:21,520
One is the donate button on the savethehuntcolorado.com.

2348
01:28:21,520 --> 01:28:23,600
The other one that I wanted to mention

2349
01:28:23,600 --> 01:28:27,160
is the Colorado chapter of Safari Club International

2350
01:28:27,160 --> 01:28:28,800
has got the two raffles going for us.

2351
01:28:28,800 --> 01:28:31,280
If you go to savethehuntcolorado.com,

2352
01:28:31,280 --> 01:28:32,760
you can go right to it.

2353
01:28:32,760 --> 01:28:36,560
There's a hunt that you can register to win for on a raffle

2354
01:28:36,560 --> 01:28:38,040
and there's a Gunworks rifle.

2355
01:28:38,040 --> 01:28:41,000
Gunworks rifle and a scope donated by Gunworks

2356
01:28:41,000 --> 01:28:43,000
and Salida gun shop.

2357
01:28:43,000 --> 01:28:45,800
The lion hunt and the lion mount is donated

2358
01:28:45,800 --> 01:28:47,700
by Whitaker Brothers Outfitting

2359
01:28:47,700 --> 01:28:51,080
and Ovis Wildlife Taxidermy with Doug Barnes.

2360
01:28:51,080 --> 01:28:54,200
And all four great companies.

2361
01:28:54,200 --> 01:28:58,480
The opportunity for people that you don't wanna donate,

2362
01:28:58,480 --> 01:29:00,320
then you get a chance at two different raffles.

2363
01:29:00,320 --> 01:29:02,060
You don't wanna do that, then go to the shop page

2364
01:29:02,060 --> 01:29:04,760
and buy them a hat or a t-shirt or a...

2365
01:29:04,760 --> 01:29:07,200
Every single dollar that we're generating

2366
01:29:07,200 --> 01:29:09,160
goes to this fight and this effort.

2367
01:29:09,160 --> 01:29:10,640
And we need every single dollar

2368
01:29:10,640 --> 01:29:12,520
that we can possibly get at this point in time.

2369
01:29:12,520 --> 01:29:14,960
And that we've had a question, multiple questions.

2370
01:29:14,960 --> 01:29:17,200
People said, well, if they don't get the signatures,

2371
01:29:17,200 --> 01:29:18,040
what are you gonna do?

2372
01:29:18,040 --> 01:29:19,400
Then we go on the offense.

2373
01:29:19,400 --> 01:29:21,040
We don't know what that is yet,

2374
01:29:21,040 --> 01:29:23,160
depends on if it's legislative or otherwise.

2375
01:29:23,160 --> 01:29:25,460
We can't run a ballot initiative in Colorado next year

2376
01:29:25,460 --> 01:29:29,500
because it's 2025, so we can only run a tax measure

2377
01:29:29,500 --> 01:29:30,340
on the ballot.

2378
01:29:30,340 --> 01:29:32,920
So if we wanted to run a ballot measure,

2379
01:29:32,920 --> 01:29:34,920
I'm just throwing something out, the right to...

2380
01:29:34,920 --> 01:29:35,760
Right to hunt fish.

2381
01:29:35,760 --> 01:29:37,600
I was going there next.

2382
01:29:37,600 --> 01:29:40,840
So, but we can't do that until 26.

2383
01:29:40,840 --> 01:29:42,080
But it takes you two years

2384
01:29:42,080 --> 01:29:43,640
to be able to get to that process.

2385
01:29:43,640 --> 01:29:45,500
But that doesn't mean that we're not gonna have fights

2386
01:29:45,500 --> 01:29:46,340
before us in the next two years.

2387
01:29:46,340 --> 01:29:47,180
Exactly, everything changes.

2388
01:29:47,180 --> 01:29:48,440
Because this governor and the first gentleman

2389
01:29:48,440 --> 01:29:50,820
are still there for the next two years as well.

2390
01:29:50,820 --> 01:29:52,960
If they don't get the signatures,

2391
01:29:52,960 --> 01:29:54,640
we are going on the offense.

2392
01:29:54,640 --> 01:29:56,760
That means we still need additional funds.

2393
01:29:56,760 --> 01:29:58,680
But we need everybody to understand

2394
01:29:59,520 --> 01:30:04,280
that what GoHunters provided, what MeatEaters provided,

2395
01:30:04,280 --> 01:30:06,600
what Outdoor Edge has provided, what Eastmans have provided,

2396
01:30:06,600 --> 01:30:09,000
what every single other organization on the planet

2397
01:30:09,000 --> 01:30:11,720
that has contributed to this has provided,

2398
01:30:11,720 --> 01:30:14,780
plus the thousands of individuals that have contributed,

2399
01:30:14,780 --> 01:30:17,160
from $5 a week that are people putting stuff in

2400
01:30:17,160 --> 01:30:19,560
to $5,000 at a whack,

2401
01:30:19,560 --> 01:30:22,240
this is going to a mechanism

2402
01:30:22,240 --> 01:30:24,920
and a playbook building process to say,

2403
01:30:24,920 --> 01:30:27,280
this is what we did collectively as an industry

2404
01:30:27,280 --> 01:30:30,320
and as a country to support the North American model

2405
01:30:30,320 --> 01:30:31,320
of wildlife conservation

2406
01:30:31,320 --> 01:30:32,920
and responsible wildlife management.

2407
01:30:32,920 --> 01:30:34,720
We can't do it on our own.

2408
01:30:34,720 --> 01:30:35,720
But if we're not here,

2409
01:30:35,720 --> 01:30:38,200
we damn sure can't do it to help somebody else.

2410
01:30:38,200 --> 01:30:41,260
And I think that you could see the generosity

2411
01:30:41,260 --> 01:30:43,780
and the enthusiasm that is coming out of the community

2412
01:30:43,780 --> 01:30:47,280
that has not happened at the level that we've seen it

2413
01:30:47,280 --> 01:30:49,240
over the course of the last nine months.

2414
01:30:49,240 --> 01:30:51,120
They see there's an opportunity for a victory.

2415
01:30:51,120 --> 01:30:52,840
If we need to be at the tip of the spear, fine,

2416
01:30:52,840 --> 01:30:54,160
we'll be at the tip of the spear.

2417
01:30:54,160 --> 01:30:55,640
We need to have to put our head in the noose,

2418
01:30:55,640 --> 01:30:57,400
we'll put our head in the noose.

2419
01:30:57,400 --> 01:31:00,400
But we're going to continue to do it until we're victorious,

2420
01:31:01,520 --> 01:31:04,280
collectively and individually and organizationally

2421
01:31:04,280 --> 01:31:05,680
and industry-wide.

2422
01:31:05,680 --> 01:31:07,680
And if we can't do it at this level,

2423
01:31:07,680 --> 01:31:09,080
show me how the hell you're going to do it

2424
01:31:09,080 --> 01:31:10,720
in the next state or the next species

2425
01:31:10,720 --> 01:31:12,320
or the next method to take.

2426
01:31:14,000 --> 01:31:15,680
Yeah, and it's not going away.

2427
01:31:15,680 --> 01:31:16,600
It's never going away.

2428
01:31:16,600 --> 01:31:17,680
Yeah.

2429
01:31:17,680 --> 01:31:18,960
But we can damn sure kick them.

2430
01:31:18,960 --> 01:31:20,280
Sure.

2431
01:31:20,280 --> 01:31:21,120
Back.

2432
01:31:21,120 --> 01:31:21,960
Yep.

2433
01:31:21,960 --> 01:31:22,780
Yeah.

2434
01:31:22,780 --> 01:31:25,040
No, I mean, just in the same way,

2435
01:31:25,040 --> 01:31:26,400
if they're trying to set a precedence,

2436
01:31:26,400 --> 01:31:29,160
we can do the same thing on the opposite side.

2437
01:31:30,000 --> 01:31:30,840
So.

2438
01:31:32,680 --> 01:31:37,680
Their efforts that they've said on a hot mic

2439
01:31:38,420 --> 01:31:40,960
when they were asked, why did you go after this?

2440
01:31:40,960 --> 01:31:44,040
They said, we went after the low-hanging fruit.

2441
01:31:44,040 --> 01:31:46,040
I'm going to give a couple of statistics.

2442
01:31:46,040 --> 01:31:50,580
In Colorado, there was 2,500 and some odd

2443
01:31:50,580 --> 01:31:53,000
mountain lion hunters last year,

2444
01:31:53,000 --> 01:31:57,220
with a 486 lion harvest, 19% success.

2445
01:31:58,460 --> 01:32:01,060
I said this at the Rocky Mountain Big Horn Sheep Banquet

2446
01:32:01,060 --> 01:32:04,060
on the 2nd of May.

2447
01:32:04,060 --> 01:32:06,980
There's less mountain lion, there's less mountain goat,

2448
01:32:07,860 --> 01:32:10,980
big horn sheep and moose hunters combined

2449
01:32:10,980 --> 01:32:12,660
than there is mountain lion hunters.

2450
01:32:12,660 --> 01:32:15,060
And they said they wanted to go after

2451
01:32:15,060 --> 01:32:17,460
the low-hanging fruit, mountain lion hunters.

2452
01:32:17,460 --> 01:32:21,060
There's less big horn sheep, mountain goat and moose hunters.

2453
01:32:21,060 --> 01:32:23,260
If they said that they're going after the low-hanging fruit,

2454
01:32:23,260 --> 01:32:25,740
and then they also mentioned that once they go after

2455
01:32:25,740 --> 01:32:27,660
the low-hanging fruit, they want to cut the branch off,

2456
01:32:27,660 --> 01:32:29,780
cut the tree down and then go into the forest.

2457
01:32:29,780 --> 01:32:32,280
I'd like to know where the mountain goat,

2458
01:32:32,280 --> 01:32:33,700
the big horn sheep and the moose hunters

2459
01:32:33,700 --> 01:32:35,180
think that they're at next.

2460
01:32:35,180 --> 01:32:37,540
Trish Zornio with the Colorado Sun, last year,

2461
01:32:37,540 --> 01:32:39,620
late last year, turned around and put an article out

2462
01:32:39,620 --> 01:32:42,240
and she said point blank, why are big horn sheep

2463
01:32:42,240 --> 01:32:43,300
any different than mountain lions?

2464
01:32:43,300 --> 01:32:44,900
Why are we killing the state animal?

2465
01:32:44,900 --> 01:32:47,180
If you don't think that they've got a plan on a roadmap

2466
01:32:47,180 --> 01:32:48,660
to go somewhere else after they get rid

2467
01:32:48,660 --> 01:32:51,300
of the low-hanging fruit, then you're mistaken.

2468
01:32:51,300 --> 01:32:52,140
For sure.

2469
01:32:52,140 --> 01:32:54,740
And if we lose at this level and CRWM does not have

2470
01:32:54,740 --> 01:32:57,100
the ability to co-mingle our efforts

2471
01:32:57,100 --> 01:32:58,900
and get our strategies together

2472
01:32:58,900 --> 01:33:01,140
and get the finances in the road.

2473
01:33:01,140 --> 01:33:03,340
If we can't win with this when they said

2474
01:33:03,340 --> 01:33:04,680
that this is a low-hanging fruit,

2475
01:33:04,680 --> 01:33:07,500
but in reality it's not in total numbers,

2476
01:33:07,500 --> 01:33:08,580
who the hell is going to turn around

2477
01:33:08,580 --> 01:33:10,060
and help support the other ones?

2478
01:33:10,060 --> 01:33:12,420
We want to build the roadmap and the playbook

2479
01:33:12,420 --> 01:33:14,300
and the armament and pack the sandbags

2480
01:33:14,300 --> 01:33:17,380
and say, come and get it and you're not taking anymore.

2481
01:33:17,380 --> 01:33:19,180
And I think it's feasible.

2482
01:33:19,180 --> 01:33:20,740
And I think that they're scared to death.

2483
01:33:20,740 --> 01:33:22,380
That's why they're getting paid signatures now

2484
01:33:22,380 --> 01:33:24,460
because they thought they could do it volunteer wise.

2485
01:33:24,460 --> 01:33:28,260
But they know with this governor, this legislature

2486
01:33:28,260 --> 01:33:30,820
and these appointments that this is their one shot

2487
01:33:30,820 --> 01:33:32,540
to turn around and do this through the ballot

2488
01:33:32,540 --> 01:33:35,740
or they will not get a chance in the next two years, period.

2489
01:33:35,740 --> 01:33:39,680
We beat them for two years, I bet we beat them for four.

2490
01:33:39,680 --> 01:33:42,340
We beat them for four, I bet we beat them in New Mexico

2491
01:33:42,340 --> 01:33:44,220
and in Arizona on other shit.

2492
01:33:44,220 --> 01:33:45,100
In every other state.

2493
01:33:45,100 --> 01:33:45,940
In every other state.

2494
01:33:45,940 --> 01:33:49,580
Utah, I mean, look at the Wasatch Fronts where people live.

2495
01:33:49,580 --> 01:33:51,900
Exactly, it sounds like I'm trying to do a rally cry,

2496
01:33:51,900 --> 01:33:54,580
but it's more of a personal experience to say,

2497
01:33:54,580 --> 01:33:57,640
look, people keep saying we always lose, lose and lose.

2498
01:33:57,640 --> 01:33:59,500
And if you listen to Charles Whitman with Howell,

2499
01:33:59,500 --> 01:34:00,340
we don't always lose.

2500
01:34:00,340 --> 01:34:01,580
We lose a few here and there.

2501
01:34:01,580 --> 01:34:05,260
We've not lost in Colorado in the last 10 years.

2502
01:34:05,260 --> 01:34:07,260
Yeah, they brought wolves in.

2503
01:34:07,260 --> 01:34:12,260
That was a margin of error by 1.9%.

2504
01:34:12,260 --> 01:34:14,940
How much you want to bet that a significant amount

2505
01:34:14,940 --> 01:34:16,980
of those people that voted for wolves

2506
01:34:16,980 --> 01:34:19,940
are going to turn around and vote against this hunting ban.

2507
01:34:19,940 --> 01:34:21,500
And I think that that's the truth

2508
01:34:21,500 --> 01:34:23,660
because they realize that wolves were a mistake.

2509
01:34:23,660 --> 01:34:25,820
They had a grandiose idea in their head

2510
01:34:25,820 --> 01:34:26,960
of what wolves were going to do

2511
01:34:26,960 --> 01:34:28,420
and they haven't come to fruition.

2512
01:34:28,420 --> 01:34:29,820
Now they see it's in the news every day

2513
01:34:29,820 --> 01:34:31,380
in a negative fashion.

2514
01:34:31,380 --> 01:34:33,020
And I think that they're willing to recognize

2515
01:34:33,020 --> 01:34:34,580
that science-based wildlife management

2516
01:34:34,580 --> 01:34:36,340
should be left up to the experts,

2517
01:34:36,340 --> 01:34:39,540
to the 350 biologists and scientists

2518
01:34:39,540 --> 01:34:41,020
within Colorado Parks and Wildlife

2519
01:34:41,020 --> 01:34:43,660
and not up to the general public to decide

2520
01:34:43,660 --> 01:34:45,620
where our wildlife resources are going to be managed

2521
01:34:45,620 --> 01:34:47,540
and how they're going to be able to be maintained

2522
01:34:47,540 --> 01:34:48,620
in perpetuity.

2523
01:34:48,620 --> 01:34:51,600
Yeah, well said, well stated.

2524
01:34:52,980 --> 01:34:54,780
What's it like being married to Dan?

2525
01:34:54,780 --> 01:34:56,820
I'm curious.

2526
01:34:56,820 --> 01:35:00,540
It is always an adventure.

2527
01:35:01,500 --> 01:35:03,220
We're never sitting there

2528
01:35:03,220 --> 01:35:05,500
just trying to figure out something to do,

2529
01:35:05,500 --> 01:35:07,220
but I love being married to him.

2530
01:35:07,220 --> 01:35:12,220
He's very kindhearted, always thinks about other people,

2531
01:35:13,980 --> 01:35:17,980
and he is, as you can see, very passionate for what he does.

2532
01:35:17,980 --> 01:35:21,700
What you see, that's how he is 24-7.

2533
01:35:21,700 --> 01:35:23,900
It's not on-off switch at all.

2534
01:35:23,900 --> 01:35:26,340
This is our lifestyle.

2535
01:35:26,340 --> 01:35:27,940
I always joke every morning,

2536
01:35:27,940 --> 01:35:30,860
I'm a secretary treasurer of an association,

2537
01:35:30,860 --> 01:35:33,540
so I say, put that hat on, do whatever I need to,

2538
01:35:33,540 --> 01:35:36,340
then I put my CRWM hat on,

2539
01:35:36,340 --> 01:35:38,180
do what I need to for it,

2540
01:35:38,180 --> 01:35:40,260
and then I put on my Riddikritor hat.

2541
01:35:41,860 --> 01:35:44,460
And that's just our normal day.

2542
01:35:44,460 --> 01:35:47,220
We deal with our regular home stuff.

2543
01:35:50,220 --> 01:35:53,060
I love what we do, and it's our lifestyle.

2544
01:35:53,060 --> 01:35:54,940
I don't know what I would do otherwise.

2545
01:35:56,100 --> 01:35:57,980
And being able to see the animals,

2546
01:35:57,980 --> 01:36:02,980
and you kind of have a peace that comes over you.

2547
01:36:03,660 --> 01:36:05,260
When I look out my office window

2548
01:36:05,260 --> 01:36:07,180
and I could see the amulet in the pasture,

2549
01:36:07,180 --> 01:36:10,180
the deer in the pasture, along with our horses and donkeys,

2550
01:36:10,180 --> 01:36:12,660
it's just that kind of peace.

2551
01:36:14,420 --> 01:36:15,380
And I love that.

2552
01:36:16,940 --> 01:36:19,940
We do good together, we do good as a team.

2553
01:36:20,860 --> 01:36:22,740
Our son is part of all of this,

2554
01:36:22,740 --> 01:36:25,100
and he's just passionate,

2555
01:36:25,100 --> 01:36:28,580
but he does the business side to be able to maintain.

2556
01:36:28,580 --> 01:36:30,580
So we, I mean, literally,

2557
01:36:30,580 --> 01:36:32,700
we're doing 90 hours a week in this crap right now.

2558
01:36:32,700 --> 01:36:35,540
I can imagine.

2559
01:36:35,540 --> 01:36:37,540
Yeah, you said that earlier.

2560
01:36:37,540 --> 01:36:41,020
And I bet you know about 70 hour weeks sometimes.

2561
01:36:41,020 --> 01:36:42,260
I'm sure Porter will love to hear that.

2562
01:36:42,260 --> 01:36:45,700
But yeah, I'm like, man, gotta work a weekend.

2563
01:36:45,700 --> 01:36:47,340
But you said that to me earlier,

2564
01:36:47,340 --> 01:36:49,740
and it really, I mean, it resonated with me.

2565
01:36:49,740 --> 01:36:52,540
Like I really get the feeling you guys are living this

2566
01:36:52,540 --> 01:36:54,900
24 hours a day, seven days a week.

2567
01:36:54,900 --> 01:36:57,060
It's a chip on our shoulder, it's expensive.

2568
01:36:58,060 --> 01:37:00,020
It's taxing on your personal life.

2569
01:37:00,020 --> 01:37:05,020
And I get frustrated when people that were supporting

2570
01:37:06,940 --> 01:37:08,780
and doing what we do for,

2571
01:37:09,740 --> 01:37:12,180
bitch or complain about, I didn't get my tag,

2572
01:37:12,180 --> 01:37:14,700
or they're just talking to Chris in there about,

2573
01:37:14,700 --> 01:37:18,100
the licenses went up by $30 or whatever the hell.

2574
01:37:18,100 --> 01:37:22,300
And I'm thinking, if that's all you got to gripe about,

2575
01:37:22,300 --> 01:37:25,380
I care about making sure that you can continue

2576
01:37:25,380 --> 01:37:26,220
to do what you do,

2577
01:37:26,220 --> 01:37:28,820
and that our friends can continue to do what they do.

2578
01:37:28,820 --> 01:37:31,100
I strive to be able to turn around and do some of the stuff.

2579
01:37:31,100 --> 01:37:32,180
I mean, I've been fortunate enough,

2580
01:37:32,180 --> 01:37:34,300
I've traveled around the world at different levels.

2581
01:37:34,300 --> 01:37:36,180
I am going to Africa this summer

2582
01:37:36,180 --> 01:37:38,980
that I booked a hunt during COVID,

2583
01:37:38,980 --> 01:37:40,620
and I've contemplated on and off,

2584
01:37:40,620 --> 01:37:41,740
and on and off, and on and off,

2585
01:37:41,740 --> 01:37:43,420
that I wasn't gonna go, I wasn't gonna go.

2586
01:37:43,420 --> 01:37:48,420
So I cut the trip down, and my son and Karen both said,

2587
01:37:48,460 --> 01:37:51,100
just go, you gotta get away.

2588
01:37:51,100 --> 01:37:54,180
And so the straw that broke the camel's back

2589
01:37:54,180 --> 01:37:58,140
is the gal that I, the pH that I'm going with, the firm.

2590
01:37:58,140 --> 01:37:59,620
She said, we have internet service.

2591
01:37:59,620 --> 01:38:00,460
So you're still working.

2592
01:38:00,460 --> 01:38:02,580
So I get, so she said, you need to do a meeting,

2593
01:38:02,580 --> 01:38:03,620
we'll put you at the Boma,

2594
01:38:03,620 --> 01:38:05,500
and you'll turn around and do whatever you need to do it,

2595
01:38:05,500 --> 01:38:06,780
however you need to do it.

2596
01:38:06,780 --> 01:38:11,780
And so I'm going to 10th of July to the 20th of July,

2597
01:38:12,460 --> 01:38:14,140
but it's right after the 5th,

2598
01:38:14,140 --> 01:38:16,540
and I imagine I'm gonna be sitting in the Atlanta airport,

2599
01:38:16,540 --> 01:38:20,300
in the Johannesburg airport, and in Port Elizabeth.

2600
01:38:20,300 --> 01:38:21,700
Celebrating.

2601
01:38:21,700 --> 01:38:22,820
Hopefully celebrating.

2602
01:38:22,820 --> 01:38:23,660
Hopefully celebrating.

2603
01:38:23,660 --> 01:38:25,980
And if not, then we're gonna be strategizing,

2604
01:38:25,980 --> 01:38:28,940
and that gives us another opportunity

2605
01:38:28,940 --> 01:38:30,020
to figure out where we're gonna go,

2606
01:38:30,020 --> 01:38:31,420
and how we're gonna get there when we get back.

2607
01:38:31,420 --> 01:38:32,260
Yeah.

2608
01:38:32,260 --> 01:38:33,080
So.

2609
01:38:33,080 --> 01:38:33,920
I love the fact that you said,

2610
01:38:33,920 --> 01:38:35,180
if they don't get the signatures,

2611
01:38:35,180 --> 01:38:36,700
which would be best case scenario,

2612
01:38:36,700 --> 01:38:38,060
they don't get the signatures,

2613
01:38:38,060 --> 01:38:40,660
and then what's next?

2614
01:38:40,660 --> 01:38:42,060
State right to hunt and fish.

2615
01:38:42,060 --> 01:38:43,340
Yeah, we're gonna kick some ass.

2616
01:38:43,340 --> 01:38:45,340
I mean, I already been talking to Mahoney on this,

2617
01:38:45,340 --> 01:38:47,540
and we talked to a lot of the,

2618
01:38:48,700 --> 01:38:50,540
the partners in the American

2619
01:38:50,540 --> 01:38:53,140
Wildlife Conservation Partnership,

2620
01:38:53,140 --> 01:38:55,660
we've got a similar group that we did in Colorado

2621
01:38:55,660 --> 01:38:58,100
called the Colorado Wildlife Conservation Project.

2622
01:39:00,220 --> 01:39:02,380
We will go on the offense.

2623
01:39:02,380 --> 01:39:04,980
And what better way to do it is when you come off

2624
01:39:04,980 --> 01:39:06,660
of the coattails of a victory.

2625
01:39:06,660 --> 01:39:07,500
Yep.

2626
01:39:07,500 --> 01:39:10,080
And we might have to run something legislatively,

2627
01:39:10,080 --> 01:39:13,980
we might have to run something additional defense,

2628
01:39:13,980 --> 01:39:15,380
but we're not gonna sit on our laurels

2629
01:39:15,380 --> 01:39:16,940
and wait to see what happens.

2630
01:39:16,940 --> 01:39:19,020
You know, a meeting I had yesterday

2631
01:39:19,020 --> 01:39:21,020
with 35 different people on Zoom,

2632
01:39:21,020 --> 01:39:22,420
and a couple of them were like,

2633
01:39:22,420 --> 01:39:23,540
well, we're just sick and tired

2634
01:39:23,540 --> 01:39:24,820
of being on the defense of all.

2635
01:39:24,820 --> 01:39:26,140
Well, you know, then help us win

2636
01:39:26,140 --> 01:39:27,660
so we can go on the offense.

2637
01:39:27,660 --> 01:39:29,380
Because show me who's going on the offense

2638
01:39:29,380 --> 01:39:30,720
at any single level.

2639
01:39:30,720 --> 01:39:31,780
And it's not criticizing,

2640
01:39:31,780 --> 01:39:33,580
it's just that the reason we don't is

2641
01:39:33,580 --> 01:39:36,060
because we're typically defensive oriented,

2642
01:39:36,060 --> 01:39:37,140
you know, as a community.

2643
01:39:37,140 --> 01:39:37,980
Yep.

2644
01:39:37,980 --> 01:39:40,060
You know, we wait to see who's gonna kick us in the nuts,

2645
01:39:40,060 --> 01:39:41,060
and then we decide,

2646
01:39:41,060 --> 01:39:43,480
then we're gonna go buy a jockstrap and a cup.

2647
01:39:43,480 --> 01:39:46,460
You know, it's a little late at that point in time.

2648
01:39:46,460 --> 01:39:48,320
I mean, I'm to the point where I think

2649
01:39:48,320 --> 01:39:49,740
that we have the ability,

2650
01:39:50,700 --> 01:39:52,740
we have the tools, you know,

2651
01:39:52,740 --> 01:39:56,380
the electronic technology that's been available to us

2652
01:39:56,380 --> 01:39:59,660
that the industry has used to better the industry.

2653
01:39:59,660 --> 01:40:01,700
We haven't utilized as the fight

2654
01:40:01,700 --> 01:40:03,580
as much as what we possibly could.

2655
01:40:03,580 --> 01:40:05,900
And I'm finding out that that's actually

2656
01:40:05,900 --> 01:40:08,060
a pretty damn good tool to be able to arm

2657
01:40:08,060 --> 01:40:12,740
your defense and offense at the same time.

2658
01:40:12,740 --> 01:40:13,580
Yeah.

2659
01:40:13,580 --> 01:40:14,860
You know, and I think there's,

2660
01:40:14,860 --> 01:40:17,220
I give us not just a puncher's chance,

2661
01:40:17,220 --> 01:40:19,060
I can say that we've won the first four rounds

2662
01:40:19,060 --> 01:40:23,060
in a 15 round title bout through this initial stage,

2663
01:40:23,060 --> 01:40:24,340
but we still have to turn around and fight

2664
01:40:24,340 --> 01:40:26,060
the full 15 rounds or knock the hell out of them

2665
01:40:26,060 --> 01:40:27,780
before they get to that point.

2666
01:40:27,780 --> 01:40:28,740
Yep.

2667
01:40:28,740 --> 01:40:30,540
Well, you're a good man,

2668
01:40:30,540 --> 01:40:34,140
and you're a good woman for working as hard as you guys do.

2669
01:40:34,140 --> 01:40:34,980
Appreciate it.

2670
01:40:34,980 --> 01:40:39,100
I'm once again, just genuinely thankful

2671
01:40:39,100 --> 01:40:40,540
that there are people out,

2672
01:40:40,540 --> 01:40:42,380
I couldn't do what you do.

2673
01:40:42,380 --> 01:40:46,860
You're so well, I mean, you have the passion for it,

2674
01:40:46,860 --> 01:40:48,380
but you also are so, you know,

2675
01:40:48,380 --> 01:40:49,620
you're well-spoken, you're the right person

2676
01:40:49,620 --> 01:40:50,660
at the right time.

2677
01:40:50,660 --> 01:40:51,500
Thanks.

2678
01:40:51,500 --> 01:40:52,340
So I appreciate it.

2679
01:40:52,340 --> 01:40:54,060
A hearty thank you from myself,

2680
01:40:54,060 --> 01:40:56,420
and I'm sure everybody at GoHunt works here,

2681
01:40:56,420 --> 01:40:58,220
and anybody that would listen to our podcast,

2682
01:40:58,220 --> 01:40:59,740
I mean, a genuine and hearty thank you

2683
01:40:59,740 --> 01:41:01,060
for everything that you've done.

2684
01:41:01,060 --> 01:41:01,900
Well, we appreciate it.

2685
01:41:01,900 --> 01:41:03,900
We just need everybody's support and backing

2686
01:41:03,900 --> 01:41:05,500
as much as we possibly can.

2687
01:41:05,500 --> 01:41:09,180
And the team that we built within our rank and files,

2688
01:41:09,180 --> 01:41:14,180
I mean, the individuals that are volunteering their time

2689
01:41:15,740 --> 01:41:18,140
from our board members and others,

2690
01:41:18,140 --> 01:41:21,260
we got guys that are doing the social media side of things,

2691
01:41:21,260 --> 01:41:23,180
the website side of things, you know,

2692
01:41:23,180 --> 01:41:24,420
helping to run the organization,

2693
01:41:24,420 --> 01:41:28,620
taking the brunt of emails and phone calls and stuff

2694
01:41:28,620 --> 01:41:31,780
that people wanna talk to me, and I'm like, I can't.

2695
01:41:31,780 --> 01:41:32,620
Yeah.

2696
01:41:32,620 --> 01:41:33,460
It's not being rude.

2697
01:41:33,460 --> 01:41:35,100
It's just like, that's out of my wheelhouse.

2698
01:41:35,100 --> 01:41:36,940
I have to turn you over to somebody else.

2699
01:41:36,940 --> 01:41:38,540
We have a very good team established.

2700
01:41:38,540 --> 01:41:41,380
We've got a very good core bunch of individuals,

2701
01:41:41,380 --> 01:41:45,180
and the people around that are starting to come together

2702
01:41:45,180 --> 01:41:46,140
to where you're starting to see

2703
01:41:46,140 --> 01:41:47,780
they wanna help carry your message,

2704
01:41:47,780 --> 01:41:50,180
and they wanna extend the outreach,

2705
01:41:50,180 --> 01:41:54,140
and they wanna use your language and your tools.

2706
01:41:54,140 --> 01:41:55,700
They don't wanna do their tools.

2707
01:41:55,700 --> 01:41:57,900
Historically, when I've done this so frequently

2708
01:41:57,900 --> 01:41:59,340
over different small things,

2709
01:41:59,340 --> 01:42:01,140
everybody wanted to say their own piece

2710
01:42:01,140 --> 01:42:03,860
because they wanted to appease their membership.

2711
01:42:03,860 --> 01:42:05,380
Now they're like, what can we do

2712
01:42:05,380 --> 01:42:07,260
to get your message to our membership?

2713
01:42:07,260 --> 01:42:09,180
And I think that that's a valuable component

2714
01:42:09,180 --> 01:42:12,300
of where we need to be down the road for everybody.

2715
01:42:12,300 --> 01:42:14,380
Whether it's a sheep deal or a bow deal

2716
01:42:14,380 --> 01:42:16,660
or a mountain lion deal or a turkey deal or whatever,

2717
01:42:16,660 --> 01:42:18,900
we better figure out a way to talk the talk

2718
01:42:18,900 --> 01:42:21,500
and walk the walk as opposed to talk your talk

2719
01:42:21,500 --> 01:42:22,940
and then watch him walk his walk.

2720
01:42:22,940 --> 01:42:25,100
That's not a team effort.

2721
01:42:25,100 --> 01:42:25,940
Yeah, together.

2722
01:42:25,940 --> 01:42:27,140
Yeah, it's gotta be together.

2723
01:42:27,140 --> 01:42:32,140
And Go Hunt, all the other major organizations and entities

2724
01:42:32,140 --> 01:42:34,260
that have stepped up and bellied up,

2725
01:42:34,260 --> 01:42:36,820
you guys have saw us at different shows and things.

2726
01:42:36,820 --> 01:42:39,620
All that stuff was, the generosity was given to us

2727
01:42:40,820 --> 01:42:43,380
because everybody sees the need for it.

2728
01:42:43,380 --> 01:42:44,540
Yeah, rightly so.

2729
01:42:44,540 --> 01:42:46,420
So we just appreciate,

2730
01:42:46,420 --> 01:42:49,420
but people need to not let off the gas pedal.

2731
01:42:49,420 --> 01:42:51,300
They need to help and they need to turn around

2732
01:42:51,300 --> 01:42:53,980
and educate themselves, be informed about our issue,

2733
01:42:53,980 --> 01:42:55,900
their issues, make sure they pay attention

2734
01:42:55,900 --> 01:42:58,100
to their general assemblies and their commissions

2735
01:42:58,100 --> 01:43:01,260
and who's making the decisions on their behalf

2736
01:43:01,260 --> 01:43:03,140
that maybe they elected or didn't elect

2737
01:43:03,140 --> 01:43:05,060
or that maybe was appointed.

2738
01:43:05,060 --> 01:43:06,660
And they need to get engaged

2739
01:43:06,660 --> 01:43:08,660
and get involved in some capacity.

2740
01:43:08,660 --> 01:43:11,300
And on a final note, I would say,

2741
01:43:11,300 --> 01:43:15,380
people ask what can they do outside of sending money,

2742
01:43:15,380 --> 01:43:16,900
get engaged.

2743
01:43:16,900 --> 01:43:21,100
If you would donate five to 10 hours a year,

2744
01:43:22,060 --> 01:43:24,900
not to a banquet, not to a fundraiser,

2745
01:43:24,900 --> 01:43:26,980
but to write in letters to the General Assembly

2746
01:43:26,980 --> 01:43:30,180
or to the commission or go to testify or sign up virtually,

2747
01:43:30,180 --> 01:43:31,420
five to 10 hours a year.

2748
01:43:31,420 --> 01:43:33,740
And you did that times 14 million hunters and anglers

2749
01:43:33,740 --> 01:43:34,700
across the country.

2750
01:43:34,700 --> 01:43:37,660
We would be undeniably the most formidable

2751
01:43:37,660 --> 01:43:41,100
bunch of conservation minded individuals on the planet.

2752
01:43:41,100 --> 01:43:42,980
Five to 10 hours a year,

2753
01:43:42,980 --> 01:43:44,580
and we could turn around and turn this thing around

2754
01:43:44,580 --> 01:43:47,660
so easily that the antis would not have anything

2755
01:43:47,660 --> 01:43:50,100
to be able to turn around and stop it, period.

2756
01:43:51,620 --> 01:43:52,820
That's what we'll put.

2757
01:43:52,820 --> 01:43:53,640
Powerful.

2758
01:43:55,300 --> 01:43:57,460
Everyone has five to 10 hours a year.

2759
01:43:57,460 --> 01:43:58,940
Five to 10 hours a year.

2760
01:43:58,940 --> 01:43:59,780
That's all it is.

2761
01:44:01,620 --> 01:44:03,460
I think that's the thing that people generally

2762
01:44:03,460 --> 01:44:04,300
get hung up on.

2763
01:44:04,300 --> 01:44:05,140
Oh, what do I do?

2764
01:44:05,140 --> 01:44:08,660
You know, do I, but it's a different day and age

2765
01:44:08,660 --> 01:44:11,340
and that really letters, writing letters,

2766
01:44:11,340 --> 01:44:13,500
sending comments, showing up.

2767
01:44:13,500 --> 01:44:14,500
It's a big deal.

2768
01:44:14,500 --> 01:44:15,980
Those are the kinds of things that carry weight

2769
01:44:15,980 --> 01:44:18,060
and the things that when you ask, what can I do?

2770
01:44:18,060 --> 01:44:19,220
Those are the things that you can do.

2771
01:44:19,220 --> 01:44:20,900
Yeah, if they don't wanna do it themselves,

2772
01:44:20,900 --> 01:44:24,820
when guys like Howell for Wildlife kick something out

2773
01:44:24,820 --> 01:44:26,580
and they're doing a call to action in Florida

2774
01:44:26,580 --> 01:44:28,700
or in Colorado or in Washington,

2775
01:44:28,700 --> 01:44:32,020
hey, sign up because they have a program,

2776
01:44:32,020 --> 01:44:36,380
they have a format that is, oh, it's remarkable.

2777
01:44:36,380 --> 01:44:38,220
And the legislators are paying attention to it.

2778
01:44:38,220 --> 01:44:40,460
I see it firsthand because of what we're doing in Colorado.

2779
01:44:40,460 --> 01:44:43,920
I'm working with Charles and Mike and John with Howell

2780
01:44:43,920 --> 01:44:47,220
and they're great partners, but they have a tool

2781
01:44:47,220 --> 01:44:48,580
that we should be able to utilize,

2782
01:44:48,580 --> 01:44:51,340
but that doesn't mean that's what you should rely on.

2783
01:44:51,340 --> 01:44:55,100
If you own a business in Salt Lake City,

2784
01:44:55,100 --> 01:44:57,020
you should know who your legislator is

2785
01:44:57,020 --> 01:44:59,520
and you should let your legislator know who the hell you are

2786
01:44:59,520 --> 01:45:01,940
because they care about their constituents.

2787
01:45:01,940 --> 01:45:03,300
If they don't know that you hunt

2788
01:45:03,300 --> 01:45:05,100
and they don't know you own a gas station

2789
01:45:05,100 --> 01:45:07,340
or they don't know that you own a stucco company

2790
01:45:07,340 --> 01:45:09,260
or whatever, how the hell are they gonna turn around

2791
01:45:09,260 --> 01:45:10,720
and act when they don't know anything

2792
01:45:10,720 --> 01:45:12,340
about their constituents?

2793
01:45:12,340 --> 01:45:17,300
Most of our people don't necessarily pay attention

2794
01:45:17,300 --> 01:45:20,320
to the politics because that's not the fun part

2795
01:45:20,320 --> 01:45:22,060
of hunting and fishing.

2796
01:45:22,060 --> 01:45:23,780
They gotta pay attention to the politics five

2797
01:45:23,780 --> 01:45:24,940
or 10 hours a year to figure out

2798
01:45:24,940 --> 01:45:26,980
who the hell is making those decisions.

2799
01:45:26,980 --> 01:45:28,700
And so they can interact with those people.

2800
01:45:28,700 --> 01:45:31,460
And so those people that are making the decisions

2801
01:45:31,460 --> 01:45:33,680
act on your best behalf.

2802
01:45:33,680 --> 01:45:35,740
Yeah, so that you can continue to do the things

2803
01:45:35,740 --> 01:45:36,580
that you do love.

2804
01:45:36,580 --> 01:45:37,420
Yep.

2805
01:45:37,420 --> 01:45:38,380
Yeah.

2806
01:45:38,380 --> 01:45:39,660
Well, I appreciate you guys' time.

2807
01:45:39,660 --> 01:45:40,660
That was awesome.

2808
01:45:40,660 --> 01:45:41,500
Appreciate it. Thank you very much.

2809
01:45:41,500 --> 01:45:42,340
It was really good.

2810
01:45:42,340 --> 01:45:44,060
It's always good to talk to you.

2811
01:45:44,060 --> 01:45:45,260
And it was lovely to meet you.

2812
01:45:45,260 --> 01:45:46,100
Thank you very much.

2813
01:45:46,100 --> 01:45:46,940
I had a good time.

2814
01:45:46,940 --> 01:45:48,540
I can see why he's so successful.

2815
01:45:48,540 --> 01:45:50,500
Oh, thank you.

2816
01:45:50,500 --> 01:45:51,940
Now she's gonna fret when she goes out.

2817
01:45:51,940 --> 01:45:52,780
How did I look?

2818
01:45:52,780 --> 01:45:53,600
How did I talk?

2819
01:45:53,600 --> 01:45:54,440
You did great.

2820
01:45:54,440 --> 01:45:56,340
I'm sorry I lost my hair and had a tickle.

2821
01:45:56,340 --> 01:45:57,180
No, you did great.

2822
01:45:57,180 --> 01:45:58,020
You did awesome.

2823
01:45:58,020 --> 01:45:59,340
You are a lifesaver.

2824
01:45:59,340 --> 01:46:00,180
Thank you.

2825
01:46:00,180 --> 01:46:02,220
I hope you guys go out and enjoy the rest of your week

2826
01:46:02,220 --> 01:46:05,140
and enjoy your anniversary and congratulations on that.

2827
01:46:05,140 --> 01:46:05,980
Appreciate it.

2828
01:46:05,980 --> 01:46:06,800
Thank you.

2829
01:46:06,800 --> 01:46:07,640
Thank you.

2830
01:46:07,640 --> 01:46:12,640
Thank you.