Kayvon Thibodeaux returns; Monday Mailbag

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Speaker 1: Be Around the NFL podcast has traded Greg for a conditional third from the Chris west Link podcast studio. It's Around the NFL. I'm Dan Jansas, just one hero with me. It's Mark Sessler. Listen, in our league, you need to make moves in a non sentimental manner, and we thought at this time moving away from Gregg was the right I think the listeners will ask, did we get value because a conditional third for it? Really? Uh? You know died in the World Journal who has done a lot of great work on our show. I mean, what what does a conditional third franchise star? Uh? And we're just giving them up for a conditional third. Maybe will be fired. Yes, we're in the dead of June quiet period of the NFL, so we're gonna just Mark and I were gonna take you through everything that's going on. Uh in the league, the scant amount of news. Will open up the mailbag and just have fun. That's all. That's what we do, and it's it comes naturally to us. What's this? What do is? That? Is? That? Is that cave Thibodeau's music there is get to see it again? Whoa here he comes cave On tivod Oh the hat Trick on Around the NFL podcast joined US Draft Night the next week, and now here we are with Warren g featuring the late great Nate Doug Regulate. This is your walk up music on the show. How are you? I'm doing well, man, it's gonna while. I'm happy to be back, happy to be in the NFL. I have to ask you a question. Do you remember us? I have to ask your name before I walked up, But I do remember. I do remember. Um, isn't it? It's Mark? All right? The next level won me over. Like in baseball, the players get the walk up music and that's cool. I feel like a pass rusher, especially after a sack there should be a stop down and extended play clock. I know you get, you get a celebration, but you were Warren Gy like pumps out of the speakers that met Life Stadium. You know, you know, we do get like walk up music. Like third downs you never hear. You probably don't pay attention, but like when third downs come to music, play that's the music is really loud. That's the whole you know, especially if it's a home game. Come on, how much? And I don't know if and we're gonna get into some of this as you begin your rookie journey in the NFL. Like how different the college game coming from Oregon is now they're in our league as it's called like in college? Was that like a big conversation point amongst the defensive players, like what's the song we choose? Was there a vote that they come from upstairs? And guys, it's not really a song. I think it's more of like what the tradition is at the team, right, you know, because Oregon we had like it was the same song every week, but you knew it was it was the third down song and when it came on, you were high. Is it hard to pay attention when like music's blasting and you're attempting to like, you know, formulate a play call as a group or something. Well, you gotta ask offensive players because on defense most of the time when its third down, you know the mission? Yeah that so where are we at? Came on? So we just got through the spring O t A s I do? I should ask you as a dog and journal and I should check in on your physical status. You were limited or pract you were in a red shirt, red jersey working with a trainer on the side. I saw a report out there that it was a hip issue of where we had health wise, anything to be concerned. Fine, now, I think you know I did tweak my hip at a point at my hip flex or you know, during um O t AS. But after a couple of weeks rest, you know, I'm back, I'm training full and I'm ready to get back for training camp. I like it. That's good. So you gotta here first. And if you write your little blurbs wherever you write your blurbs site around the NFL, there will be sharp to court. Well, that's um. So I was thinking, came on, we were thinking about like, as you begin this journey, we're much older than you grossly, so you were born in the two thousands, I imagine. Yeah exactly. I mean I'm twice your age plus a few years. That's concerning. Right, You guys are on the way out. It's no longer our world. But we have seen a thing or two, so I thought it'd be good to have a conversation. We call this segment with Cavon Thibodeau the third time on the Around the NFL podcast. No your league, Okay, we know the NFL. We've covered it. This podcast has been going on since two thousand thirteen. Cavan hadn't he even had his bar mits. But yet at that point he was a young thirteen year old boy. Um, but now I still haven't had one, still waiting. So let's go over a couple of things. Just curious if you know about it, if this is something you've already come across. Let's start with the idea of now, hazing is a bit of a dirty word, now, Uh. In the NFL, we had, of course, that Richie Incognito scandal with Jonathan Martin years ago, but it still goes on. And one thing that really stands out, Kabin, I wanted to ask you about this, there was there's a podcast. Fellow New York first round pick Garrett Wilson, wide receiver of the Jets, was on another podcast, probably inferior to this one, but I'm sure good if they got Garrett um and they talked about rookies having to pay for dinners. Fred Taylor, former great running back of the Jaguars and other teams, Uh, said to Garrett Wilson, you know they're gonna run that bill up to like seventy five dollars that rookies had to pay for meals rookie year, and Wilson said he didn't buy it. Ryan Clark, another great former player, said, you're the tenth pick of the draft. They know you've got they got the money. Channing Crowder then said he thinks it's his decision. Are you concerned that you're gonna be hit with that? No, I'm not concerned. You know, I'm a guy who I'll definitely take care of my guys and de line room. But as far as doing things that I don't want to do, I've never done it. I've all he's been a leader, not a follower. So we set new standards, all right. So let me let me give you a hypothetical from that same interview. Fred Taylor, later his career, played with the Patriots briefly, and he said Tom tom Brady would come in there and buy three or four or five thousand dollar bottle of line whine, take a sip and say good night. What if it's now? We know there's no Tom Brady figure involved with the Giants right now, at least not yet. I mean, even if there was, I don't think i'd stand up Tom Brady wouldn't take a ship and walk out on me. He'd be there. He'd be there a whole night. Uh. If he did walk out, I'll finish that bottle the wine. What do you think about this? Uh? Years ago, Ryan Leaf, Chargers quarterback, he was the second round pick the year Peyton Man and came into the league. He had to pick up a tab. He told management about it, and then Junior say how wiped him out following an interception in practice? Like, is there this code behind the scenes that you would then have to worry about if you were to turn down such a demand from your teammates? Um? I mean, I guess it just depends on who you are. UM. I feel like I've gained a lot of respect from the guys around me, and I showed respect to a lot of guys around me. So I don't think I'd ever have to worry about my physical health. But then again, I also wouldn't do anything now I wouldn't want to do so pure pressure is not a thing for me. I've got one for you. Uh. You know you remember Tim Tebow obviously back when he was a rookie with the Broncos. And for our audio listeners, We're going to show a picture here. We can get that up on this video. Yeah, so this was this is if you this was the haircut they gave Tim Tebow, and I guess I would describe it as, um, they shaved around, uh you know, the shade the top of his head, so he looks sort of like a friar from the Middle Ages. Would you accept that haircut? If? If I think I know the answer based on the first question, well, how would you if a veteran said this is this is part of your rite of passage? How would you deal with that demand? I would come through a different door. I wouldn't need to go to that. Yeah, you know, there's there's things for me. I show a lot of respect to doing extra work. So if they say you're a rookie, you gotta run five more, your ricky, gotta show up earlier, you're a rookie, gotta you know, carry some paths or something like that, that's respect. But as far as like, yeah, I think he might look good with that haircut, though, I'm just saying you get it first and I'll just follow. You'll go together, all right, Let's go over some fan bases again. This is no your league. We've been around the block. It's forties, so we you know there are negatives, but there are some positives. We know about these fan bases on a deep level. So we'll start with these and tell me if you were aware of this or how plugged in you are as a new as a new face of the New York Giants. Some heads up, the Patriots fans, they're very sensitive about the New York Giants because forty two and forty seven, the two Super Bowls or um. Just something if you didn't know to be aware of, if you wanted to ever drop that in Pepper that in next time you guys have a match them for sure. He's factored it in. How Eagles fans. You know about the Eagles fans. They're fans of the Eagles, red eyes, small hands, known to bite, very moody, very moody fan base. You guys listen to the fans, do we? We are? I mean we are in some level. You guys are the fans? Get now you got to the liaison. Now it's making sense. I'm like, yeah, you know I could care less? Right like, they hate the Eagles fans hate when you bring up the fact that they once pelt at Santa Claus with snowballs. You know, you know how much you could really set a fan base off. You just whoop them, you just beat them. I see it, you win the game. There's none. There's really none. I like to go into stadiums and I like them to be quiet. I like graveyards. You know, we got to graveyards. You get a piece of mind. So we're leaving midway through the fourth quarter. That's the good stuff me. I tell him to come back. It's not over. Come back, come back, leave it, take more punishment. The show is just go. Do you know that Bills fans when you play the I don't know the Bills on the schedule, the Giants this year, I don't know, But eventually there will be Bills fans will want you to know that they're the only team technically that plays in New York. They're going to try to give that to you. Is like a singer. Does that bother you at all? I hope you didn't come up with that one. No, No, listen, it's their Jets fans like they try to bring that at me. I gotta get some old school fans that say more hurtful stuff. Or something that's that's like, oh man, you said, you said something came on the first time we ever spoke. You said one of your goals when you have conversations with people, you know, something like this. You want that you want to leave having made an impression and make people feel like they know you know what you're about. I'd like you to if you could try to know what Marks about by the end of this brief conversation we're having and if you're okay, Mark had just a couple of questions for you that I haven't seen yet. I don't know anything about. Sure. I would ask you this because you know the New York giants. UM from an earth angle, historical angle going way back, do you believe that actual giants roam the earth? Um, that's a good question, that's a great question. Um. I mean factor fiction. I mean that's you know, it's possible. Nothing's nothing's impossible. Physical job help's all we're talking. I think probably a story. There's actually a story in the Bible that talks about that. So I couldn't. I couldn't say that it's not they're mentioned, they're mentioned. I'm talking like sixteen seventeen feet tall, but very just a different you know, species. So there's this there's this crazy thing I watched just like the mountains. They're like mountain ranges and different like crazy things that are like these, like you say, these giants were too big to be buried, so they've basically what encrusted into the mountain ranges. So like you could if there's a video, you could look up where it's like mountains are shaped like humans or shaped like some type of figure. So it's possible. I think it is. The earth is very weird. How about this um? You know, you us gotten to know Brian Table, your your new coach. Would you just instinctly do you think he's more of a front spoon or a backspoon when he is spooning someone. I don't answer those type of questions. That's a tough one. I think that was all right. Forget that want to bail next? All right, let's see how about this um, Dan and Mark before you before you go, let's not ask any more personal questions about any other man. Ask a question about the two of us. No, No, It's like let's say Dan and I were to appear in front of you in wrestling tights and attempt to wrestle you could you So, what's the newest thing's kind of going on in NFL? Anything? All right? Good? You know what The answer is nothing. It's June seven right now. Um, but you know that's all good. So we're gonna hear. Let's wrap it up. This is where we're at. You ready, any other questions you have? I think I'm going to ask some of my other questions at this point. It's yeah, this is so we're gonna be I've heard you guys up for extensions. How's that going? Has been negotiating? Look at that, we're negotiations. We got the deal done. You signed your rookie deal as well, right, yeah, I mean, but I'm worried about yours. I heard you guys. Are you guys getting some big money coming up? You guys have been doing doing numbers in around the NFL. I'm beginning to be worried too. We're doing Yeah, we did, we did. I think we got a deal. I don't think it's in the territory of a top ten pick in the NFL. But but there's gossips that they can only keep one of you. So my question is, where's like, you know, are you guys both going to leave or somebody's just gonna We typically have a third and we've kicked him off. He's processes of elimination. By the end of today's episode, we're gonna have some shadowy league figure from upstairs come and make a decision. Yeah. I don't think you will actually see him. I think he's just you know, it will be phantom. It's like that Joe Pesci and good Fellas. When you get back to your office, I think you'll just have You won't see your name tag anymore. They'll just it'll be blanking. You'll know more than we do. Thank you, buddy for coming on. We appreciate it. What you got going on the rest of this summer during your breakcre just training, you know, I meaning a lot of different people, you know, making sure that I'm ready to go back being in you know, full health and full shape. Um. But yeah, enjoying the Calli's son until I get back and got to enjoy that that real New York key, you know. Yeah, I've it's the humidity that gets you. As a native New Yorker, I could say that Cavan. Thank you buddy, and uh, good luck. Can't wait to watch the ball. Yeah, but you know those are you You're very insightful. I just think, you know, personal information shouldn't be here, you know, Yeah, the the spoons stuff with his head coach, that's I point taking. It's just a question hardboard box out for you after that time. I was just simply curious about that on my own. But I but I understand why you would not want to answer that, you know. Yeah, I think that's fair. You know, I think you only got like two more shaky's and you might be on a different podcast. Two more shaky's for Mark sel all right, came on, Thank you buddy, appreciate you guys. Alright, Mark, we were making the quest towards friendship with Cavon Thibodeaux. Where do you think we stand after that conversation. I think we got friend zoned to some degree and not in the way that we were angling for. Um, you know we are our show has a certain flavor to it, and uh, I thought we pursued that flavor to some degree. Um. I don't think I would not call at a home run out of the park. In terms of his enjoyment of the of the event, it was. It was fine. I thought overall I did. I knew we were in for an interesting fifteen minutes when before we started, Cavan, you know, he's curious what we were gonna be talking about. And then he looked at your computer screen and I was like, oh, my goodness, if he sees the madness of a Mark Sessler question before we start, And sure enough, you know he wasn't into all the questions. I would say that came out of the mind of Mark Sesler. Is it so wrong that I actually, when I think of certain individuals like a Brian day Ball, there are moments I'm sure with his significant other or whoever, it's it's fine with anyone that he has spooned, And I'm curious as to which position, uh he would prefer. Not every man is a is a back. I would just I would just I would say, maybe there is a teachable moment in there. I imagine there is in an going quest to be a great interviewer at allah a Barbara Walters with the soft focused and eight that type of situation that maybe a lot of these guys don't want to talk about, like spooning and the head coach, especially rookies coming into the league, that you know it makes perfect sense here. I was out of place potentially, and I think the follow up asking about you and I and Tights taking him on in a grappling match probably was not the direction to go. And I how do you how do you think that went? One out of ten? Three? Excuse me, grape digger. Three. Well we got some good stuff about about paying for dinner or whatever. Sure, yeah, real nugget, all right, but we survived. I think so far, so far, it put us ill at ease. I think you and I had a couple of shared a couple of looks during the whole process. You know, it's like, can someone come out of the wilderness and shoot me? Now? Yeah, we're not. We're gonna be all right. And we still I'm not giving up on the quest to be friends with Cabon. I think we took a step back. I would say, you know, friendship has those ebb and flow moments, and so you know we have to be resilient um and seek his friendship and potentially a different way. All right, let's hit uh, let's hit a break and then do the news. But you do want a beer from don't? All right, let's get into it. Let's hey, Mark Seler, let's spin Okay, I don't like that approach. That's that's but yes we shall that's not a bad podcast idea spin forward with Kotler. I don't like that. I don't like the get like sixty eight tweets about that. Over the next seventy two hours. Let's start, as we must in this year, Deshaun Watson. Let's check in on his situation. We'll start with the reporting that came out over the weekend the Wall Street Journals Andrew Beaton reports that the NFL will push for a indefinite suspension that would last no shorter than one year for Watson, um who has been taking part in the Browns offseason program. I think Cleveland brass which in general is laying low with this mark and hoping you can imagine and assume that they're gonna have Watson in some form on the field this season. But according to this reporting, the NFL is making a hard push to keep him off the field for at least one year, and indefinite suspension would uh potentially take him off the field for more than the season. And of course, he missed all one when everything was unfurling around him the legal situation, and then we also got an update UM about the lawsuit and the ongoing litigation involving the Watson. Involving Watson, the Houston Texans were formally named as defendants on Monday and the ongoing civil litigation involving their former quarterback. UH. This from UH Tony Busby, the Houston attorney who at one time represented twenty five different women with lawsuits against Watson. Many of them have been settled now, but there are still ongoing lawsuits. Today we filed the first case of what will likely be many against the Houston Texans related to Deshaun Watson's behavior. Buzby said, right, and that you know there are details inside the lawsuit against the Texans, UM that I that particularly someone I find disturbing. UH. The Cleveland Browns kept saying over and over, we were competent with the homework that we did before we engaged with the Shawn Watson and made him the richest player in the entire league. But there's a quote inside this lawsuit that says, despite claims that it did extensive due diligence, not one question was asked by Watson's new employer. The Browns of the victims about Watson's alleged behavior. No effort was made to obtain the police file or speak to the investigating offers. It's a terrible look for the Cleveland Browns because everything they've told us not a surprise, sounds like an utter lie at this point, and they're in a disastrous situation. If Watson is suspended for a year plus, he's gonna his hearing will take place in front of Sue L. Robinson. It's gonna be a little bit different than some of these UH hearings in the past, where would be a Goodell's decision alone. And I mean, it's notable that the NFL p A is going to defend Watson to some degree from a any suspension deems inappropriate or excessive, so he's there is another side to this, But I it just feels to me like the NFL and all the reportings suggests are pushing to get him out of the mix for this entire season and completely reset the board for next year. And it could be longer than that too, And I think that's all we know about this case. It should be a year long suspension in my opinion, and the process has obviously kind of drawn dragged out over the course of You remember there was report last month that the NFL wanted to have UH this situation figured out in terms of potential suspension in June, and here we are now in very late June. So we'll see what comes out of this UM meeting, UH, with this hearing with Sue L. Robinson, So the Watson situation ongoing, We'll see what happens next. In other news, God, the Browns got themselves in a whole what a mess. I mean, it's like, you know, if if you think where they were last offseason, where they had come off a playoff victory over the Pittsburgh's Dealers, you thought that you were getting the better version of Baker Mayfield. You're the coach of the year, and I think that coach of the Year Kevin Stefanski quietly has to be beyond beyond, absolutely incensed with what's gone down here because he's been put up in a terrible position. Jacoby Brissette potentially could be starting seventeen games for a team that looks like they'll be the worst team in the a f C North that that's the case. UH. In other news, Pro Football Talks, Mike Florio reports that Saints running back Alan Kamara is bracing for a suspension of at least six games. You will remember that Kamara um is facing felony battery charges for allegedly throwing punches Um at an incident in Las Vegas. Uh. We'll see what this means for the Saints. But I think this is something that UM caught me a little bit by surprise. I remember when the news came out and there was some video, uh tape evidence of what had happened Um. And now here we are in a situation where you can miss a substantial part of the season for a Saints team that depending how you look at the you could see them as a real NFC player, losing your best player for that amount of time potential, even if it got appealed down to four games, that's substantial. Yeah. And I think what's part of it is the timing of it, because Florio noted that, you know, the the NFL may wait until the legal process on this one plays out, but maybe it could be later in the season. But I think you know, in that offense, which has obviously improved its wide receiver group, but Jamis Winston, you know it depends what version of Jamis Winston you get. But losing Kamara is not unlike losing a Christian McCaffrey in Caroline. I mean, it's that important to me. And And I think it's probably also taking fantasy heads and having their heads explode because I don't know what's gonna happen with them. Yeah, no, that's a good call. Hey, look at you with the fantasy analysis there, Mark, that's a great pim zoned in on when they're agitated about things. Yeah, he it makes him either somebody that you you're gonna drop, take off your board entirely. Yeah, it's all over the map. But we need to see where that you stash him. Well, it depends what kind of draft people were scared off him. You grab him at a at a value zone and then he's only out for four games or to six games. Well that's a great, Mark, Thank you. Alright, time for news and Notes presented by up work, where you can build the team that will build your business. Learn more at upwork dot com. This is just kind of moving the timeline of the story along, so I'll just pass it along here, Mark, and interested in your thoughts. Quarterback Jimmy Garoppolo. His timetable for throwing remains on schedule after offseason's shoulder surgery. That from ESPN's Jeremy Fowler, the expectation has been that Garoppolo had the right shoulder surgery in March, will throw over the next few weeks after he's been cleared, and that plan remains in place. So it's kind of a story, non story, update, non update. But I imagine there are certain people Jimmy Garoppolo and his agent for starters, the Niners are probably cool at this getting this information out here. Hey, he's okay, everything on schedule, he's he's ready to start throwing. He'll be your quarterback if you want him in September. And yet there's zero whisper at all about their being a market for Jimmy Garoppolo. I think it's a problematic scenario. I mean, you'd have to look at like, in theory, the Panthers could be interested, but there's a Baker Mayfield situation, and you're not trading them to the Seattle Seahawks. And so what team out there wants to sign Jimmy Garoppolo for twenty six or twenty four plus million? But then you have them come in maybe five or six weeks before you're before you're playing actual regular season games and acclimating him as a starting quarterback. It feels like a tough set, would you so you rule out any chance that they would deal within the division. I don't rule it out depending on what they could get in return, because I feel like that would take precedence if they could get the best deal from Seattle. Not to say that this is something it probably isn't really reality. They don't want to put trade him within the division. But also I don't get the feeling that Kyle Shanahan and is necessarily thinking that Garoppolo is a difference maker, hence why they're looking to trade him in the in the first place. So maybe that would almost be the best place to trade him when you want to look at depending on your perspective on this. I mean, Shanahan seems so loyal to Jimmy G two and like he's hung around much longer than people thought, and you know, started the entire season last year, and in reverse, I don't sense immense confidence in Trey Lance. It just seems like a little bit of a strange situation. But this is the thing like the whole market changes for Baker Mayfield, for Jimmy g When we get to camp and in two starting quarterbacks have their knees wrecked or something, that that's when the trade market goes crazy and you'd have a situation like when Sam Bradford got moved for like a first rounder, because the need suddenly changes that there's no need for Jimmy Garoppolo right now. Trey Lance has worked with the forty niners um first team offense during the off season, while Garoppolo has spent his offseason rehabbing here in Southern California. So Niners look like a team ready to move on, but they first need to be able to move there from your current quarterback or starting quarterback. So we'll see where that goes. All right, finally in the news, all right, Mark, here we are a little uh the boxing, the the NFL players boxing. Where did you come down on the NFL players boxing, I mean boxing, whatever it is. I've never made the effort to go watch one of these fights. I think that's indicative of my interests. Fair enough, I'm gonna just gonna pass this one along as well. Then, But that there's a matchup in the works between two of the great running backs of the past, you know, twenty years or at least it's at certain points in their career, Adrian Peterson and Levan Bell squaring off. Who do you got? I'll tell you I got Adrian Peterson. You ever shake hands with that man? His his hands NFL Honors. It was the year you stepped on Ryan Tannehill's wife's purse, Lauren Tannehill's white like white leather. Purson heard something crack and specially heard something crack, and we just kind of shuffled away quietly. Sorry, grave digger. Uh, he was on the Donalds at the time. If it makes you feel better. Um, I shook his hand and he nearly broke every bone I have in my right hand. So I imagine he's a freight train when he put the gloves on and Levy on Bell. You know, I don't have much feelings positive um on his athletic ability, whether whatever the sport at this point. Yeah, I put my my least car in our rental home. Um up forbid on the fact that Adrian Peterson takes this. I mean, who do you trust that Levian Bell is even training adequately? Based on just the experience in the last couple of years. I don't know what he's you know, Adrian Peterson's ready. That guy would love to get back in the league. But he did not. Did he play last season? I'm sorry, I apologize. Had a few he had a couple of weeks. He he scored a touchdown against the Rams at Sofi Stadium, a moment and there was a whole news story about Adrian's handshake when the Titans signed him. So I think that it was like a thing that he had you with us, that he would take this this bat. And that was News and Notes presented by up work, the world's work marketplace. Learn more at up work dot com. Um, that's what's happening in the news. We'll be right back, all right, buddy, UH mail back when in doubt, just go break glass and get the listeners Uh involved with the program, and I'll just be completely honest. Mark, Sometimes I send out the bat signal for the mail bag. I don't get what I'm looking for. This time, the listeners stepped up some good questions and I'm going to share them right now here on around the other. Good job by them, I do agree. There's been times when the mailbag had very little offer. I hope this is different. All right, let's hit it. You've got mail. Wasn't it so great when you would for you know, people came of age in the nineties, when you heard that you got mail. I was like, oh, yes, someone wants to connect with me. It would it would um speed up your pulse. It's not unlike when you're you know, writing people online today and you can see that they're like typing and you know that something's coming, and it's just like this is this is exciting for me. Grave Digger too, I can see the look in the I don't know if he was around for the A O L. I'm talking about today's technically the internet dot dot dot yeah, oh yeah, especially if it's you know, a certain individual. Well who what who would that be? For you? Well, I'm talking about Graver? Oh? I see, yes, absolutely. Do you guys communicate online often? Grave Digger? Oh? Are we text like normal people? Okay? Did she ever leave you hanging on red? Never? Now we both have read receipts turned off, so I actually wouldn't even know if she did. I like that strategy. Do you have your tart off? Yes? You have your red receipt turned off? Does everybody do that? I'd like to keep it transparent. Yeah, it's it's interesting. I know Erica talked about this on Split Ends, but she does it to like psychologically manipulate the people she's texting. Shocker, oh, ricky Hollywood. I wonder how she's doing. I actually did text with her little bit yesterday. She seemed to be in good spirits already her and then she asked me a question that I never responded to. So I'm turning the tables there to speak psychological how you do it? All? Right? Here we go, let's get into it. Mail bag time. Let's start right here. Let's see. Oh, this is kind of to both of us from Kevin Rodgers. Would it be depressing or intriguing for YouTube to watch Sam Donald and Baker Mayfield battle for the Panthers QB job, given that your Browns and Jets wants picked them to lead those teams. Sam Donald, I would say, it's ironic if that's what ends up happening. Yeah, I kind of find it, and it would be intriguing actually, And it's the journey of those two has already been so depressing that um, it just comes full circle to where they're battling each other. I think that would be one of the more intriguing August plotlines. Sure, and I you know a couple of things. And I posted it a few months back before the draft. The shot of us at the Cozy Inn in Culver City toasting to a new era of Jets and Brown's football on Draft night in two thousand and eighteen. Um kind of sad in retrospect, we were so overconfident to such fool and clowns, such fools. And then there is the other take, which is a deeply unpopular take, both on this podcast and elsewhere. I still believe on some level that Sam Donald could thrive or at least be Baker let Mayfield good. Baker Mayfield with the Browns proficient in the right set up. And I think Baker could look as bad as Donald did if he was with the Jets and Panthers. I still think Donald could win that debate, as sad as that debate has now become. I appreciate your faith, but I until proven otherwise, I think that of Donald Morris at bottom five quarterback, well, I apologize it's not my quarterback anymore. Uh, this is a tough one from Mike Atkins mark, what's one NFL storyline this summer no one is talking about but should be headline news. My feeling on this is that that's really not how the NFL works anymore. Uh, that everything gets I sected, And if there was a story that was a big enough story, it probably has been discussed. But I don't know if anybody has anything. Is there a starting quarterback coming off shoulder surgery outside of Garoppolo or some type of serious rehab that's kind of going under the radar. I don't I'm with you. I feel like the news cycle is so exhaustive and and we even on this show. I think occasionally hitting news topics if we're light that really maybe wouldn't make it in a in a busier time. Today could be an example of that. So I I don't think that there's mystery storylines out there that that that fascinate me. Anything Gray jumps to mind for you. I think we got it covered basically. Maybe it's just a kind of a humble bragg in a way got it. Like everything that I'm trying to think of, we've at least covered on this show specifically, So I can't even you know, like maybe the Bill's offensive coordinator situation is a bigger deal than we thought. Like I just know for personal experience, the Titans change offensive. Cordy art Smith went and got the Falcons head coaching job, and everyone in Tennessee was like, Oh, we're going to run the same offense. We're promoting from within, so it's gonna be fine. And then the offense was a disaster for most of the year. I worry about that for the Bills, but we talked about that, like with Kyle Brant, we talked about that, so well, you know, that's a That's a good point though, because that it has been covered because The Athletic just did a huge feature on that. It was it was last week. But in it Kevin Gilbride who talked about the first year that he called plays for the the Oilers back then that you know, behind the scenes, he was panicking on a week two week basis because he had never called plays at that moment. And he talked about, like years later, like your toolbox or your acumen and your ability in a panic situation, and it's this type two minute drill to use more of your playbook came naturally, but in that first season it was a huge mess. And Ken Dorsey has never done this, and Brian Table had years and years of experience. So I think that's a fair one. All right, let's move on. Steve Olvera asks if you could change one play in NFL history and create a butterfly effect that would alter the current NFL landscape for all eternity. What play would you change? You know what? This one? It kind of popped into my head pretty quickly. UM, I would go back to I believe it was January nine, three, maybe January two, and the Bo Jackson hip injury he suffered in the playoffs UH that year with the Oakland Raiders. Um Bo Jackson to this January thirteenth against the Bengals, UH in the divisional playoffs suffered a he was tackled, He kind of was the tackler grabbed his leg. Uh. Bo Jackson lunged and it led to a terrible hip injury that eventually fractured and dislocated hip. He had to have the hip replace. It instantly ended his NFL career. He came back eventually. UH. In baseball, the first you know, a huge two sports star bow was but was never close to the same guy. Uh And I to this, to this point in my life, I still don't think there was a more exciting you're paying athlete then Peak Bo Jackson and what he was able to do in two sports as an All Star. Uh So that injury as cruel as it was, I think he was seven years old. That would be my pick. Remember watching that game. That's a great call. I mean, that's that completely changed the NFL because he was one of the most electrifying, jaw dropping athletes of our time. I'd have to go. I'd be disingenuous if I didn't, and I won't spend a ton of time on this. Ernest Biner's fumble on January sev in the second a f C Championship against the Denver Broncos, where they lost that game thirty eight to thirty three. They were down twenty one three at half um in Mile High. They had played their worst half of football the entire season, and then came storming back to make it one of the best games of all time. And they wouldn't have gotten there to begin with without Ernest Biner, who was the kind of running back who was such a weapon out of the backfield as a past receiver as well, that he fits so well into that office and did everything for them. Kevin Mack was sick in that game, so it was all on Ernest Biner to basically handle the comeback from the backfield position, and he was glorious and he had a couple of plays that I think would have changed the way that we think about him entirely, because I'm not saying he's a Hall of Famer, but Ernest Biner's fumble is the only thing most people know about him and he and he went on to win a Super Bowl title with Washington where he was an incredible He had an incredible serion had that moment. I'm so glad he did, and like you know, I met him in person. He is a genuinely wonderful guy who I think learned and taught other people about failure through that fumble and everything that happened. But I do think had they won that game, um, you know, they went on to the Denver went on to lose to Washington in a wipe out a couple of weeks later. I think Cleveland could have given them a much better fight. And I was in seventh grade and it destroyed my world. I was walking around middle school like a ghost for like the next two months. Sports. I've had moments like that myself. And you know exactly where you were when the heartbreak get you. Uh the old Barcels quote that he had to walk away when the losing hurt more than the winning felt good. It's kind of like the sports fan experience, like even when the great things have happened, um, those crushing losses, they just kind of hang with you a little bit more, Alright. This one from Alex Everson, when is Mark's next solo holiday or vacation into a Ceed motel. It feels like it has been sometime since he has had a non stay cation trip, yet he's still been on the pod. Uh So this offseason, I've taken a different tack. Um, this is the idea that I'm staying in Ceed motels. We already clarified that there are three and four star even hotels. They are and they're typically you know, dotted around town. I've learned that Los Angeles is about as good of a place on a staycation as I'll go anywhere else. And I you know, when you have kids and the whole thing going on I'm not gonna be going to India for two weeks, although Gregg is in Japan, but he's you know, I'm not. I'm not going to mean there's none of those type of adventures. So I like to do the little tours three day staycations that are dotted in between our shows. And I can't talk about much that occurs on the on these staycations. Just yeah, he can't say everything. But just understand what you're hearing right now is the soundtrack of a Mark stay or action like blasting this one out of the hotel window. What else you got one? You got one that you grabbed from the old mail bag. Yes, if you could pick any guest to join for a podcast and after party, who would you pick? And why? And I'm gonna say, I'm gonna add um and I don't Actually I should research shoo. I just copy the question, So I'm sorry if you were the one that that sent this out, I didn't do that research. But it could be a person of history of the past two I'm including anyone. They don't have to currently be alive. Okay, that's an easy one. Napoleon does he speak English? Uh? No, not so that's that would go about as well as to days uh guest appearance went um. I was thinking about this um, this song which was performed by the Weather Girls. Do we have this graver? I think we do. What's happening here the Weather Girls who performed this song. I think it's an underrated song. I think we could happen to come on. I'd like to have musicians on the show at times, time to time, still with us. The song came out many many days, right, but I already said it doesn't like that they would come back. They come You've said Napoleon on the show. I mean you remember the night when I was not able to join you at the Cozy for New Year's where from my house I had the app where you could play because he's jukebox, and I played this song nineteen times in a row. I don't know if it actually went through. I think that technology wise, they got you and they kept the money too. But a great idea. Yeah, it seems unfair. I would you know, I would like maybe a little Debby, you know, I would get I'd like to maybe get little Debbie back on the show. I don't know if that's in the spirit of the question went too because I was telling someone the other week that that was a time that you know, I did a lot of the leg work to get her on the show, and then she came in and I was essentially sort of star struck and not in my personality for like the first who is a accomplished Bay Area I believe um rapper, and she came on the show a couple of times, uh about five years ago or so now, Big Raiders fan Mark went alone and I think you were like in the front row for a little Debbie concert. Well there were no seats, but I covered around the m Yes, and then she came in. And when she came in, she had her and her associates had before the show had hot boxed in their box their car and then came in and shared some goods with us, and then we we had that conversation. I think it'd be cool to check check in with her, especially in light of the Davante Ad acquisition by the Raiders, and you know she's tracking that very very closely. Uh. This from Corbin du Bois. See some people might say the boys and maybe it is, but I'm gonna go with Corbin du Bois, Well, you got the Quebec thing right, so I'm gonna try back. Yeah. Do you know that the Athletic NFL podcast declared there is now a car continuum which feels a lot like it infringes on the Dalton scale. I p you may have to declare vengeance until you can have Nate Tye and Robert May's on for some peacemaking listen where not the Police of NFL podcasts? And I I like both these gentlemen a lot. We've had Nate on the show several times. In fact, um, I don't know the details of the car continuum if it's the same of what the Dalton scale uh is about? If it is, so be it. It wasn't our idea anyway, it was Chris Westling's idea. So for us to uh police it that, I don't even think that passes the sniff test. So how fun with your football talk, especially in the offseason. Yeah, I don't have a huge amount of energy right now to add like new grudges to the lineup. Some of them that I'm involved in don't even aren't even aware. Well I'm not even like enjoying them, they're not That's not necessarily fun. So yeah, keep on keeping on athletic. Alright. A couple of more from Susannah h This question a better fit here versus uh, what does a quarterback I have to accomplish to pass Tom Brady is the goat? You can't just be super Bowl rings, right, say you get three or four rings, but are better in other metrics? What is a hypothetical resume that can compete with Brady? Good question, Let's start here. I think you need that team success. You have to have at least I know Brady has seven. So we're talking. The conversation to me starts at five or so, right, and then on top of it, now, Brady has been a monster statistical producer. Um, that's gonna own every record. So I don't not to be so obvious about it, but yeah, somebody's had to come along, come along, play for twenty plus years and combine what the greatest statistical build up ever with you know, a handful of rings and then some I don't know if it's going to happen though, I don't see it. I think it's longevity with no drop off. Um, and how about this winning super Bowls with multiple teams? Because part of what Brady did. Had he gone to Tampa Bay and they were a ten win team in the last couple of years. Fine, But like the idea that he transformed what was a loser franchise into what they are now in one season kind of in a lot of people's mind ended the chicken or egg like Belichick Brady debate to some degree. And I don't understand. Number one quarterbacks cannot control their longevity most of the most in the way that Brady has, whether they want to or not. Their bodies start to give up at some point, and Brady is such an outlier on that front that you'd have to play for twenty years. Who's going to do that? Yeah? I would The only thing I'd pushed back a little bit there, and what you said was that the Bucks were kind of a team losers before he got there. He was very smart and he went to a team that was really well set up except for they were like hanging onto this Jamis Winston dream, this dying dream that Winston was a true franchise leader and a quarterback. And now now it gets me mad because I wish I would have said it when we did the Dalton Scale conversation and Greg was pushing Winston up the list, as he always seems to do. And isn't it interesting that the Bucks went from Jamis Winston Mr. Thirty thirty season with that really strong roster around him and they didn't go anywhere to the next year Brady comes in and they win the whole thing. Um, it speaks to both Winston and Brady and their careers and what they've been able to accomplish or not accomplished. So yeah, I think that that team was a very good team that he made great. Um, the defense was really good already, I mean, and they were really good that year, and they were really good in the Super Bowl getting all the pressure on the home So Brady obviously is a huge factor, and like is the kind of guy that motivates the rest of the team to play to their best level because they know they're super confident in the quarterback. But it was a really good teach well at that time, it was. It was a good It was a good set up from I sort of more mean the Bucks franchise historically, outside of the John Gruden Super Bowl year, It's not if I had to picture a post Patriots jersey that Tom Brady was wearing the Bucks were not the first team that I thought of it. It was a strange I thought match, but it was the right time and he maximized it. Speaking of jerseys, I got one more here, Mark, This from M Bouche. Some people will say butcher, but now I'm just you know, this is your new thing. Like I like that. You're you're getting playful with the pronunciation. This is a heat check. Bo U C h e R. Hit me up, M Bouche and tell me if I'm right. What teams need jersey updates the most. Um, Speaking of Tom Brady, I think the Patriots. The two teams that kind of spring to mind for me are the Patriots and the Broncos, who both had nineteen nineties reboots, radical reboots of their classic logos. And if you were a sports fan or came in the age, came of age in the nineties like I did. Mark, you came of age in the eighties, but uh just eighteen eighties. Um. A lot of the nineties sports jerseys aged terribly immediately and eventually we're replaced. I think the flying Elvis for the Patriots is obviously tricky because of Tom Brady. They won six Super Bowls with Pat with the flying Elvis jersey, So it would be really weird to abandon that at this point and go back to Pat Patriot and the Red, although they're gonna have a throwback jersey uh in a game this season. So but I just think that's a superior look for them. The Broncos have never been all totally on board with their reboot, but now that I think about it, they've won three Super Bowls uh since and that came immediately after they rebooted out of their original classic Orange Crush, So they have a similar issue with that. So one man's opinion. I'm not a big fan of those jerseys, but it's complicated by their success. I would I would add the Carolina Panthers. I am tired of the way they look and I think they need a reboot. You're saying more pounding in terms of the think tank. I would pound that issue. You would keep pounding until someone listens. Additional pounding, additional pounding. All right, do you have anything else? But how about this a player that performed underperformed last year that you are like money in the bank. You have them rounding back into shape and becoming what we think they can become. Here's where I'm going with this. Lamar Jackson, coming off an injury plagued messy again, did not track the name. I mean this is you know, I think how cool it would be if you're your favorite show? How about what you answer? I will look for this and kind of presumptuous of me to say that whoever said that this is their favorite show? But obviously it's a podcast they like enough that they sent in the question, And what a thrill it would be for you to say their name. I think you've made the point. I am looking. I'm looking right now for I've been bloviating for so long that I don't even remember what the question was, Mark, What was it? A player that had underperformed a lot year ago, a rebound season, a big bounce back. Yes, I like that one. Let's see looking at the old and you've got Lamar Jackson. Yeah, you got a really wax poetic Because I'm cycling through these tweets here, all right, I'll throw it out there. Allen Robinson that completely disappeared in his final season in Chicago. Now that you could, depending how you look at it, you can see that as that might have quit on that team a little bit, but hey, that was a rough team to be in with the final year with Matt Nage and all the struggles they had, and a rookie Justin Fields who was feeling his way through things. You know, you had late period Andy Dalton involved. It was just a tough time to be on that offense. But I think fresh start with the Rams, the defending champions. You have in Cooper Cup, a big time number one receiver who's going to attract a lot of attention. It's possible that O'Dell Beckham returns to the fold. They're still you have a great quarterback in Matt Stafford obviously, and a great play caller in Sean McVeigh. So Allen Robinson with the season that you know, puts him back in Pro Bowl consideration. How about that? And I have an update. Okay that tweet he or anything I just said, be honest, Okay, that's fine, go ahead, competent. I mean from a distance, the tweet came from Alex Smith. One seven, so either now seven the number could have an incredible amount of meeting to Alex Smith. I think it me perhaps born in December, potentially a Russian bot because I don't know too many people to do that with at the end of their tagline numbers. All right, what, thank you Alex for the question. What a thrill it must have been to hear your name and so you say, Lamar Jackson, I got Allen Robinson. Oh you did. I didn't even notice that. I didn't. I wasn't even listening to that part. That's a good answer, thanks buddy. All right, good, let's let's close it up. Let's sign off, perhaps for the last time. I'm just picked up the phone and you heard you know, when somebody picks up the phone when you're online and the old dial up days. Oh I can I tell you one little quick thing that happened to me that caused massive anxiety. So remember like total phone, which was like three way calling essentially. Uh. This was like seventh grade and my parents had a bunch of people over and I was in my room. Um that was like a dinner party with a bunch of drinking from well I I had not that I saw, but I wouldn't put it past them. But like, um, I had a friend call up this girl that I liked named Robin Herman, and so my friend like without her knowing that I was on the line was doing some some you know, groundwork on like this this Mark Sessler. Do you think that maybe he's someone you would like to like? In the middle of the this call in the kitchen, one of the ladies that had come over picked up to you know, to call home to find on what's going on with the citner something like that, and all I could hear is, Hey, Barb Sessler, Barb Sessler, what's going on here? Is it seems like someone's on the phone. I'm like, WHOA? So I basically like did I? Everyone hung up, as I think, as quick as possible, But it was a totally unmasked and but I did end up going on a few I went to a dance with her, so it worked out on the end. And you have two kids together, So that's where my daughter came from. No, it's not so much people were curious. This is actually for my submission from the mailbag. A lot of people reaching out and saying, um, it was mentioned that Mark had a twenty four year old daughter on our last episode. Uh, and that was kind of glossed over. Do you want to get into any specifics there? I don't think that's wise. I think we've said, we've said enough. Like Cavon Thibodeau, sometimes you just gotta say, next question, smart. Thank you to Cavon Thibodeaux, who we'll be back on the field and ready for training camp. You heard it here first, Please site us properly in the news. We'll be back on Thursday, maybe um with another episode UM and maybe a guest. I don't know. We'll see Greg Is in Japan safe journey while he's there, so you uh, next week, buddy, But we got one more show to do, but one at least need that call. Welcome to this guy gets it with Mark Sessler. Today's episode the National Football League's Great Debate Artificial Turf or Natural Grass, featuring special guest Cavan Thibodeaux and now your host, My Cessler. Thank you for joining us this week. You know, for decades pro football has been dogged by one burning question that refuses to go away. To nobody's surprise, it is a question of plane surface. Sixteen NFL teams operate on real grass, the other sixteen wage battle on artificial turf. This, of course, raises an ethical question. Is it proper to ask players to perform on artificial surfaces when they could perform their duties on Bermuda grass, Kentucky blue grass, or even swaths of Desso Grassmaster Cavon, where do you come down on this pivotal issue we must confront. I'm a grass guy. I think I'll always be a grass guy. We are from nature, we come you know, we are natural beings, So I think performing everything on grass was just the smartest, safest way to go. Join us next week when we dive deep into the topic of referee outerwear. Is it time for us to rethink how these hard working officials are dressed in two