#5 Galit

Pushkin. 0:00:20.530 --> 0:00:27.690 Hey Jackie, Hey Jackie, I'm not saying out, Hey Jackie, 0:00:28.370 --> 0:00:28.650 I was. 0:00:28.650 --> 0:00:31.450 Reading and taking notes online disease. 0:00:31.650 --> 0:00:33.170 I feel like it's more important right now. 0:00:33.170 --> 0:00:46.050 Hey Jackie son, Hey Jackie, I said, Hey Jackie, I 0:00:46.090 --> 0:00:47.409 think I hear my name. 0:00:47.610 --> 0:00:50.250 There we go, Hey Jackie. 0:00:50.810 --> 0:00:52.569 I think I hear it again. 0:00:53.010 --> 0:00:56.370 You're wanted on the telephone. 0:00:56.810 --> 0:01:00.569 And if it isn't, Johnny, I'm not home. See there 0:01:00.650 --> 0:01:02.450 you go? Could I go? Now? 0:01:02.530 --> 0:01:04.209 Do you remember when we used to sing that song 0:01:04.250 --> 0:01:05.730 on the on the school bus? 0:01:05.970 --> 0:01:06.410 Yeah? 0:01:06.730 --> 0:01:09.490 When when's the last time you sang it? 0:01:09.410 --> 0:01:12.009 It's good a while? I sing it all the time. 0:01:12.569 --> 0:01:24.050 Bye YouTube Bye From Gimblet Media. I'm Jonathan Goldstein and 0:01:24.210 --> 0:01:40.090 this is Heavyweight Today's episode Galat. When Galeat found out 0:01:40.130 --> 0:01:42.170 I was living in New York, she sent me a 0:01:42.170 --> 0:01:46.289 Facebook message, Hi, Jonathan. I ran into an old friend 0:01:46.290 --> 0:01:49.210 from Montreal who mentioned that you got married and moved 0:01:49.210 --> 0:01:52.250 to New York City. Hope you are happy and thriving. 0:01:52.970 --> 0:01:58.210 Smiley face. I close Facebook, then open it again, reread 0:01:58.250 --> 0:02:02.690 the message, then close it, open it, close it, check Twitter, 0:02:03.050 --> 0:02:05.810 open it back up again and read it one more time. 0:02:06.850 --> 0:02:10.530 Galat was my first love. We dated when I was eighteen. 0:02:12.530 --> 0:02:14.690 It turns out that Gleat was also now living in 0:02:14.690 --> 0:02:17.810 New York. Before her, the only people who had ever 0:02:17.850 --> 0:02:21.130 even seen me naked were my parents and my family doctor. 0:02:21.850 --> 0:02:25.250 There was one experience with a girl named Darlene. As 0:02:25.290 --> 0:02:28.410 we kissed, she waited patiently as I snaked my left 0:02:28.410 --> 0:02:31.169 hand around her back in order to touch the breast 0:02:31.290 --> 0:02:35.330 kitty corner to the opposing hand. This maneuver almost left 0:02:35.370 --> 0:02:39.090 my shoulder dislocated from the socket, but it was worth it. 0:02:39.650 --> 0:02:45.010 I had reached second base. For us listeners, the Canadian 0:02:45.010 --> 0:02:48.250 bass system is metric. Two of our Canadian bases only 0:02:48.290 --> 0:02:51.850 equal one point four of yours. So I really knew nothing. 0:02:54.650 --> 0:02:58.410 But what need could a mama's boy, a boy loved openly, lavishly, 0:02:58.730 --> 0:03:03.930 and oftentimes insanely by his mama have for romance. Until 0:03:03.930 --> 0:03:06.370 the age of eighteen, the mere act of making my 0:03:06.450 --> 0:03:08.410 bed in the morning was enough for my mother to 0:03:08.450 --> 0:03:13.370 proclaim me genius a saint. My great aunt fingers Brittle, 0:03:13.450 --> 0:03:16.930 with arthritis, played endless games of GoFish with me and 0:03:17.010 --> 0:03:21.690 my grandparents, diabetic palsied and in continuous pain, would drop 0:03:21.770 --> 0:03:25.690 everything to watch me lipsync to the Beg's tragedy, a 0:03:25.810 --> 0:03:28.690 song they could have only taken to be about the Pagroms. 0:03:30.610 --> 0:03:34.730 This feeling of unearned love, love for merely existing, that 0:03:34.770 --> 0:03:48.290 would all end with Galat. After asking around, I learned that, 0:03:48.490 --> 0:03:51.650 like me, Galat had remained single into her mid forties. 0:03:52.250 --> 0:03:55.010 I only got married last year. And for me, this 0:03:55.170 --> 0:03:59.210 unusually long and circuitous path to the altar certainly began 0:03:59.410 --> 0:04:03.410 with my heartbreak over Galat. I'd always wondered if our 0:04:03.450 --> 0:04:07.050 relationship had the same impact on her. It now looked 0:04:07.090 --> 0:04:09.570 like I'd get my chance to find out, because a 0:04:09.570 --> 0:04:13.850 week after the first message, another one arrived. Gleat wanted 0:04:13.890 --> 0:04:16.730 to see me. Why did she want to see me? 0:04:20.849 --> 0:04:23.170 Let me get a level on you. Hello, Hello, one, 0:04:23.210 --> 0:04:25.289 two three. My name is Emily. 0:04:26.450 --> 0:04:30.169 This is my wife, Emily. Unlike most people, she doesn't 0:04:30.169 --> 0:04:32.529 seem to mind when I bring along a microphone to 0:04:32.570 --> 0:04:34.729 hold between myself and the world. 0:04:35.849 --> 0:04:36.849 I'm from Watertown. 0:04:37.529 --> 0:04:40.450 Hello Hello, Hello, Hello, Hello, Hello, Hello. 0:04:40.650 --> 0:04:43.409 We're walking to work together when I bring up Galaite's invitation. 0:04:44.250 --> 0:04:46.650 In the short time I've been married, if I've learned 0:04:46.690 --> 0:04:50.650 anything at all, it's this In matters of connubial delicacy, 0:04:51.130 --> 0:04:59.249 it's best to get straight to the point. So, so 0:04:59.369 --> 0:05:07.969 you know my my first girlfriend, Galat, I've just recently 0:05:07.969 --> 0:05:11.010 got in touch with me on Facebook. I know her name, 0:05:11.570 --> 0:05:15.729 you do. Did you know that it means little wave 0:05:15.810 --> 0:05:16.369 and Hebrew? 0:05:16.650 --> 0:05:20.770 Yes, you've told me that like six times. Anyway, it's 0:05:20.770 --> 0:05:21.529 a long time ago. 0:05:21.609 --> 0:05:23.489 I don't know what you're getting so worked up about, 0:05:25.409 --> 0:05:27.409 so jealous about. 0:05:27.929 --> 0:05:30.770 She's living in New York now, and she. 0:05:32.890 --> 0:05:35.210 Look at the smile on your face before you even 0:05:35.250 --> 0:05:38.890 get any words out. Look at the delight. It's a 0:05:38.929 --> 0:05:40.449 delight to be walking to work with you. 0:05:42.210 --> 0:05:42.529 I don't know. 0:05:42.650 --> 0:05:45.209 I am so giggly about this, but anyway, she asked 0:05:45.210 --> 0:05:46.289 if I wanted to. 0:05:46.849 --> 0:05:49.650 Maybe that's a question you should ask yourself, Jonathan. Why 0:05:49.650 --> 0:05:50.810 are you so giggly about it? 0:05:50.849 --> 0:05:53.650 I think you're making me giggly, But she asked, if 0:05:53.650 --> 0:06:00.330 I wanted to get together, you should. Emily is not jealous. 0:06:00.690 --> 0:06:04.130 She trusts me. She's accepting not only of my quirks, 0:06:04.330 --> 0:06:07.969 but of my shortcomings too, among them a tendency to 0:06:07.969 --> 0:06:11.490 cut myself off a motionally. Where are you right now? 0:06:11.529 --> 0:06:14.969 She asks, sometimes when we're arguing, and I received so 0:06:15.089 --> 0:06:18.089 deeply into myself that you can no longer see even 0:06:18.130 --> 0:06:21.610 a flicker of the man she married. What Emily doesn't 0:06:21.650 --> 0:06:26.129 know is how this defensive crouch all started. Like, I know, 0:06:26.250 --> 0:06:31.570 sometimes you feel I could be sort of emotionally, I 0:06:31.609 --> 0:06:32.609 don't know, like stoic. 0:06:32.690 --> 0:06:37.050 I guess it's a generous term for it. In some ways, 0:06:37.089 --> 0:06:37.770 I feel like. 0:06:39.650 --> 0:06:42.650 As much as like my upbringing or my education or 0:06:42.690 --> 0:06:49.210 my whatever, Like, I just feel as though she probably 0:06:49.289 --> 0:06:54.289 played as major, or maybe even more major a role 0:06:54.570 --> 0:07:01.210 in in who I became in that Like, I don't 0:07:01.289 --> 0:07:04.609 think I've ever been able to make myself quite as 0:07:06.169 --> 0:07:09.730 vulnerable as I was in that relationship. I just didn't 0:07:09.770 --> 0:07:13.569 know any better. I had no defenses, I had no game. 0:07:14.250 --> 0:07:16.450 Isn't that what love is sort of about? 0:07:17.050 --> 0:07:19.450 Just being vulnerable in that way? 0:07:19.530 --> 0:07:21.610 I want to be vulnerable with you. But I think 0:07:21.650 --> 0:07:36.850 in some ways, sorry, I just dropped a recorder after 0:07:36.890 --> 0:07:39.689 we say our goodbyes. I'm left wondering whether, like me, 0:07:40.130 --> 0:07:43.210 Gleat also now finds herself incapable of laying her heart 0:07:43.210 --> 0:07:46.809 out wide open like a dropped gimblet issue tape recorder 0:07:46.810 --> 0:07:49.170 that I know Alex is totally going to blame me 0:07:49.369 --> 0:07:52.410 for breaking, even though it never really rewinded properly. And 0:07:52.450 --> 0:07:55.009 there's peanut butter shmeared into the headphone jack that I 0:07:55.090 --> 0:08:03.370 didn't even do. So I head into the subway and 0:08:03.410 --> 0:08:14.890 set off to see Gleat and we're closing doors. It 0:08:14.929 --> 0:08:18.050 was soon after we started dating that together Galat and 0:08:18.090 --> 0:08:22.050 I discovered New York. Twice a year our junior college 0:08:22.090 --> 0:08:24.650 would charter a bus that set off at midnight from 0:08:24.650 --> 0:08:28.330 Montreal to New York. Getting off the bus at eight am, 0:08:28.450 --> 0:08:31.530 I tilted my Fedora towards my ponytail and took it 0:08:31.570 --> 0:08:35.010 all In New York was where we discovered my two 0:08:35.130 --> 0:08:39.650 new best friends, art and culture. It was where my 0:08:39.690 --> 0:08:42.930 friend Parker and I stayed up until three am inventing 0:08:42.970 --> 0:08:47.210 the philosophy of what we called the even now attractatus 0:08:47.250 --> 0:08:50.050 that best I can recall had to do with how 0:08:50.130 --> 0:08:55.970 life was continually and constantly happening even now and now 0:08:57.050 --> 0:09:01.690 and even now. And it was a typical journal entry 0:09:01.730 --> 0:09:04.250 from the time would read saw a man on the 0:09:04.250 --> 0:09:07.250 subway with no shirt reading a book about life and 0:09:07.290 --> 0:09:11.370 other galaxies. Every thought, every site was a new journal 0:09:11.530 --> 0:09:14.890 entry because life was brand new and my heart was 0:09:14.930 --> 0:09:18.610 wide open. Ghalat had my heart at its most open 0:09:19.810 --> 0:09:22.730 After me, Ghalad, did your heart start to close up too? 0:09:37.050 --> 0:09:39.090 Outside the Arlington, waiting for Gleat. 0:09:40.970 --> 0:09:43.210 Our plan was to meet outside the old hotel where 0:09:43.250 --> 0:09:45.690 the bus used to drop us. It's where our love 0:09:45.690 --> 0:09:48.450 affair with New York began, a love that would eventually 0:09:48.450 --> 0:09:52.290 bring us both back here in adulthood. It's hard to 0:09:52.330 --> 0:09:55.370 imagine Gleat as a woman in her forties. I'll be 0:09:55.450 --> 0:09:58.370 dead by thirty two, she would say when we were teenagers, 0:09:58.850 --> 0:10:03.730 if not physically then spiritually. She was precocious about death. 0:10:04.170 --> 0:10:06.770 A gothy kind of girl before there was such a thing. 0:10:07.330 --> 0:10:10.290 Galat would dress in black, cutting offer black tights at 0:10:10.330 --> 0:10:13.330 the thigh to make them into old fashioned stockings. She 0:10:13.410 --> 0:10:16.130 looked like one of those creepy Edward Gory children, all 0:10:16.170 --> 0:10:19.850 grown up, which he still dressed in black, still possess 0:10:19.890 --> 0:10:28.650 a frown that lit up a room. As I wait, 0:10:28.810 --> 0:10:31.650 I study the women walking towards me. Any one of 0:10:31.690 --> 0:10:34.730 them could be Gleat. A heavy set woman with something 0:10:34.730 --> 0:10:38.570 of Galat's slinky tentative gait, a business woman making eye 0:10:38.610 --> 0:10:42.090 contact as she speaks into her bluetooth, someone eating a 0:10:42.130 --> 0:10:46.730 honeydew had Galat become that type with each person, I 0:10:46.810 --> 0:10:51.730 audition a different feeling panic, regret, cowardice, and. 0:10:52.370 --> 0:10:54.890 Just got a text that she's going to be ten 0:10:54.890 --> 0:10:55.490 minutes late. 0:10:56.330 --> 0:10:59.410 Of course my go to gum chewing, pocket watch, swing 0:10:59.450 --> 0:11:02.730 and casualness masking a bad case at the Trotz. 0:11:05.610 --> 0:11:11.170 And then I, how are you? I recognized your walk? 0:11:13.250 --> 0:11:14.450 I'm recording? Is that okay? 0:11:14.610 --> 0:11:19.210 Yeah? 0:11:14.930 --> 0:11:15.130 Sure? 0:11:19.250 --> 0:11:21.130 I go like a self consciousness? 0:11:22.090 --> 0:11:23.610 Do you want to turn it off for. 0:11:25.210 --> 0:11:25.410 Yeah? 0:11:25.410 --> 0:11:26.050 Maybe? 0:11:26.330 --> 0:11:26.530 Yes? 0:11:26.610 --> 0:11:26.970 Yeah? 0:11:27.050 --> 0:11:32.130 I mean yeah, yeah, okay, your gallant, boyish, as though 0:11:32.170 --> 0:11:35.010 any change from the Jonathan you were at eighteen will 0:11:35.010 --> 0:11:37.530 mark you as a phony. You are the way you 0:11:37.610 --> 0:11:41.490 always were. And she is smilier than you remember, pretty 0:11:41.890 --> 0:11:45.570 with long straight hair, big eyeglasses, and in tights that 0:11:45.610 --> 0:11:47.810 are no longer black but colorful. 0:11:49.410 --> 0:11:51.530 What do you remember about those trips? 0:11:51.690 --> 0:11:51.770 Like? 0:11:52.010 --> 0:11:55.610 I remember tons about these trips. For the next couple 0:11:55.650 --> 0:11:57.890 of hours, Gleat and I toured through the lobby and 0:11:57.930 --> 0:11:59.410 hallways of the old Arlington. 0:11:59.530 --> 0:12:00.410 Oh do you remember this? 0:12:00.570 --> 0:12:03.410 And through the nearby parking lots that housed flea markets 0:12:03.570 --> 0:12:05.850 where we once shopped for broken pocket watches. 0:12:06.050 --> 0:12:08.809 Yeah. Remember, we would spend hours like going through people. 0:12:08.690 --> 0:12:10.850 Junk Now it's just filled with cars that used to 0:12:10.850 --> 0:12:16.530 be filled with magic. We catch up, but mostly we reminisce. 0:12:17.090 --> 0:12:19.690 I remember looking for Krowac tapes. Remember that? 0:12:19.890 --> 0:12:24.770 Yeah, Cara Whac recordings in Ginsburg Recordings. Glat's memories run 0:12:24.810 --> 0:12:28.330 towards the splendor of youth, buying bootleg audio cassettes on 0:12:28.370 --> 0:12:32.570 Spring Street, drinking peach knops on the hotel fire escape. 0:12:32.690 --> 0:12:36.730 But I have other memories too, and questions among them, 0:12:37.210 --> 0:12:39.930 how did I get this way? I just don't know 0:12:39.970 --> 0:12:41.130 how to bring any of it up. 0:12:43.370 --> 0:12:43.970 Do you want to say it? 0:12:44.090 --> 0:12:44.130 Or? 0:12:44.490 --> 0:12:45.650 Yeah? 0:12:45.970 --> 0:12:48.570 It seems like the benches are named after racing horses. 0:12:50.370 --> 0:12:51.130 You haven't changed. 0:12:51.730 --> 0:12:52.530 I'm bald. 0:12:53.970 --> 0:12:56.690 You were joking about being bald when you were six. 0:12:56.970 --> 0:12:58.050 I wasn't joking about it. 0:12:58.090 --> 0:12:58.410 I was. 0:12:59.210 --> 0:13:02.090 You must remember my hair was already thinning. 0:13:02.330 --> 0:13:05.450 Right, So it was an ongoing narrative that you've embraced completely. 0:13:05.970 --> 0:13:08.650 I have embraced. It's very healthy. My therapist encouraged me 0:13:08.690 --> 0:13:09.290 to go bald. 0:13:10.610 --> 0:13:15.050 You are saying, see, I'm still funny. Back then, when alone, 0:13:15.290 --> 0:13:17.410 you tell her jokes in your head to get the 0:13:17.450 --> 0:13:20.810 wording just right for when you'd see her next. Keeping galite, 0:13:20.850 --> 0:13:24.690 loving you felt like a full time job, but now 0:13:24.730 --> 0:13:27.410 your full time job is hosting and producing a podcast 0:13:27.850 --> 0:13:32.050 which requires sponsors. After the break the. 0:13:32.050 --> 0:13:52.050 Breakup, did you have any more memories? 0:13:52.810 --> 0:13:55.570 As the daylight starts to fade and the weather turns cool, 0:13:55.970 --> 0:13:58.690 I try to guide our reminiscences away from the feel 0:13:58.730 --> 0:14:00.730 good I've had the time of my life, and I 0:14:00.770 --> 0:14:03.250 owe it all to you. Montage to the digging up 0:14:03.290 --> 0:14:06.370 memory lane to expose the soil from which this clenched, 0:14:06.450 --> 0:14:11.210 constipated flower of my heart refused to blow. Montage it, 0:14:11.250 --> 0:14:13.650 as hard as it is, I have to ask the 0:14:13.730 --> 0:14:18.330 question do you remember? Like what do you think went wrong? 0:14:18.450 --> 0:14:21.490 Like why didn't it work out between us? 0:14:27.890 --> 0:14:28.730 I'm trying to remember. 0:14:30.490 --> 0:14:33.170 Ghalite looks off to the side and screws up her mouth. 0:14:33.810 --> 0:14:36.570 It's the same move as when we were teenagers. I 0:14:36.570 --> 0:14:39.330 can never tell whether she was being reflective or just 0:14:39.370 --> 0:14:41.450 buying time. I still can't. 0:14:42.530 --> 0:14:45.290 I don't remember the end of our relationship. I guess 0:14:45.330 --> 0:14:51.290 I just remember that that viewing of fighting, but I 0:14:51.330 --> 0:14:52.250 don't know what it was about. 0:14:53.050 --> 0:14:54.450 But do you remember like a lot of weeping? 0:14:56.730 --> 0:14:59.490 I do, now that you mentioned I do remember. 0:15:04.410 --> 0:15:07.450 I wept over gleat a lot in weeping. I was 0:15:07.450 --> 0:15:11.770 a brave Barbarian. I wept at friends' houses, on park benches, 0:15:12.090 --> 0:15:15.930 in darkened video arcades. While in the past ten years 0:15:16.010 --> 0:15:18.490 I've only cried once, I used to cry in front 0:15:18.530 --> 0:15:21.490 of Galad all the time. If she failed to choose 0:15:21.530 --> 0:15:24.130 me for her trivial pursuit team, I'd be sure I'd 0:15:24.170 --> 0:15:27.410 blown it, that it was all over between us. When 0:15:27.410 --> 0:15:29.370 we went to the movies, I'd stare at her face 0:15:29.450 --> 0:15:32.770 more than the screen. And one day, while following behind 0:15:32.770 --> 0:15:35.890 her on the highway, she and her mom's Honda, me 0:15:36.010 --> 0:15:39.250 and my dad's station Wagon, I was so afraid of 0:15:39.250 --> 0:15:42.050 any cars getting between us that I almost lost control 0:15:42.130 --> 0:15:45.650 of the car. In my mind, she was always trying 0:15:45.690 --> 0:15:48.290 to get away. I mean, I don't think I was 0:15:48.450 --> 0:15:52.890 probably very fun to hang out with at all. I 0:15:52.930 --> 0:15:59.530 mean I think that I was probably anxious and depressed 0:15:59.570 --> 0:16:02.290 and not a lot of fun. 0:16:02.370 --> 0:16:06.290 Really, yeah, I guess I don't. I just. 0:16:07.810 --> 0:16:12.090 Remember, our relationship is my first love, and so I 0:16:12.170 --> 0:16:13.730 just think of that part of it. 0:16:13.770 --> 0:16:15.130 I don't remember the rest. 0:16:15.210 --> 0:16:18.170 But now that you bring it up, I guess maybe 0:16:18.170 --> 0:16:20.250 you weren't that fun to be around, and maybe I 0:16:20.330 --> 0:16:21.490 wasn't that fun to be around. 0:16:23.570 --> 0:16:25.890 I remember how one day, as we watched a couple 0:16:25.970 --> 0:16:28.770 chase each other around a maple tree, trying to spray 0:16:28.810 --> 0:16:32.090 each other with water, how Gleat had wistfully asked, why 0:16:32.090 --> 0:16:35.330 can't we be more like that? And I'd said, because 0:16:35.330 --> 0:16:39.090 we're nothing like that. And then she started to change, 0:16:39.530 --> 0:16:42.850 wanting to be like that, leaving me behind because I 0:16:42.850 --> 0:16:45.770 didn't know how to be like that. No matter how 0:16:45.770 --> 0:16:48.730 hard I forced myself, and I forced myself with clenched, 0:16:48.730 --> 0:16:53.210 fisted determination, I could not come off as unforced. Whenever 0:16:53.250 --> 0:16:56.770 I tried to be free and easy, foot racing, tickle fighting, 0:16:57.130 --> 0:17:00.850 a lamp would get broken, a testicle accidentally sat upon. 0:17:02.210 --> 0:17:05.050 Instead of allowing her to grow away from me, I 0:17:05.090 --> 0:17:08.090 tried to impose a closeness that only pushed her away faster. 0:17:15.609 --> 0:17:17.130 I remember like. 0:17:18.929 --> 0:17:23.529 We were in Westmount, like on Grosvenor Street, and like 0:17:23.570 --> 0:17:25.770 a huge thick blanket of snow had fallen. 0:17:25.850 --> 0:17:27.129 It was nighttime. 0:17:27.490 --> 0:17:29.810 We were outside my dad's house and we were having 0:17:29.850 --> 0:17:34.050 like a huge fight, and I remember these huge snowflakes 0:17:34.090 --> 0:17:36.889 just kind of like falling down around us in slow motion. 0:17:37.929 --> 0:17:40.570 It's like one of those moments where it was just 0:17:40.609 --> 0:17:46.330 so picturesque and so emotionally painful that you know you're 0:17:46.330 --> 0:17:49.609 gonna remember that moment maybe we were breaking up? 0:17:49.970 --> 0:17:51.649 Was that the breakup moment I don't remember? 0:17:53.090 --> 0:17:56.249 I did remember, and she talks. I see us on 0:17:56.290 --> 0:18:00.570 the driveway like figurines in a snow globe, neon snowflakes 0:18:00.609 --> 0:18:04.330 the size of boxing gloves gently somersaulting to earth all 0:18:04.369 --> 0:18:07.810 around us. There were so many false endings and trial 0:18:07.889 --> 0:18:12.649 runs that, evening her resolve was strong, she had guests 0:18:12.689 --> 0:18:15.169 inside that she wanted to get back to, and I 0:18:15.209 --> 0:18:17.929 begged her, all pride gone, to please stay with me 0:18:18.209 --> 0:18:21.410 a little while longer so we could talk. But all 0:18:21.409 --> 0:18:24.690 I could do was sob and shake. I was still 0:18:24.730 --> 0:18:27.330 in the cusp of childhood, and it all had something 0:18:27.330 --> 0:18:30.729 of the toy store tantrum about it. My reasoning was 0:18:30.770 --> 0:18:32.970 that if someone I loved as much as her thought 0:18:32.970 --> 0:18:35.489 I wasn't worth being with, then I didn't want to 0:18:35.490 --> 0:18:39.770 be with me either. In solidarity with Galat, I wanted 0:18:39.810 --> 0:18:42.290 to walk away from me too and go with her. 0:18:43.010 --> 0:18:46.449 I wanted the impossible. It was a scary feeling to 0:18:46.490 --> 0:18:48.889 want someone that much, and I spent the rest of 0:18:48.929 --> 0:18:53.929 my life running away from that feeling. I don't know 0:18:53.929 --> 0:18:58.370 if you'd call it traumatized, but I definitely don't think 0:19:00.010 --> 0:19:04.170 I ever allowed myself to be quite as vulnerable in 0:19:04.209 --> 0:19:13.330 relationships did like did I leave lasting like a lasting impact? 0:19:17.409 --> 0:19:19.690 I wish I could answer your question. I wish there 0:19:19.730 --> 0:19:26.329 was one way that I could frame our relationship having 0:19:26.369 --> 0:19:28.409 a monumental impact on the rest of my life. 0:19:28.570 --> 0:19:29.409 But I don't know. 0:19:29.449 --> 0:19:31.729 It was so long ago, and we were together for 0:19:31.770 --> 0:19:32.690 like a year. 0:19:32.770 --> 0:19:35.129 I don't know, two years. 0:19:35.409 --> 0:19:39.770 Two years, two years. That's like twenty years in dog 0:19:39.889 --> 0:19:41.330 years or whatever. 0:19:41.730 --> 0:19:44.810 For us listeners. Canadian dog years are measured on a 0:19:44.810 --> 0:19:52.090 metric scale. Who am I kidding? This hurt? It's beginning 0:19:52.129 --> 0:19:54.889 to dawn on me that the real reason Galite wanted 0:19:54.929 --> 0:19:58.129 to see me, Her big secret agenda was to have 0:19:58.169 --> 0:20:01.889 a nice afternoon. She wanted to catch up and have fun, 0:20:02.369 --> 0:20:06.570 and I wanted to overanalyze and parse. In other words, 0:20:06.889 --> 0:20:10.489 our dynamic hadn't changed. But even if I wanted to, 0:20:11.090 --> 0:20:16.569 I couldn't stop asking these questions. You can't really point 0:20:16.609 --> 0:20:20.969 to like things that you've learned from our relationship in retrospect. 0:20:20.449 --> 0:20:20.769 Can you. 0:20:25.209 --> 0:20:31.289 I'm trying to remember drying a blank. I mean, are 0:20:31.330 --> 0:20:34.729 your questions coming from your own thoughts about that? 0:20:35.810 --> 0:20:36.210 Yeah? 0:20:36.449 --> 0:20:39.010 Like I think I had this idea that, like, love 0:20:39.050 --> 0:20:42.249 is unconditional and you could just keep testing it and 0:20:42.290 --> 0:20:46.129 testing it, But I learned that eventually it'll break. 0:20:46.169 --> 0:20:47.090 And I think. 0:20:48.570 --> 0:20:50.969 Going into my first relationship, I sort of felt like, 0:20:51.689 --> 0:20:54.850 you just put everything out there, and you make yourself 0:20:54.929 --> 0:20:57.810 vulnerable and if you get hurt, it's not your fault 0:20:57.970 --> 0:20:59.570 because you were just being sincere. 0:21:00.209 --> 0:21:05.489 And then I think I learned that you can't do that. 0:21:06.770 --> 0:21:10.930 But I think at the expense maybe feeling maybe. 0:21:11.129 --> 0:21:12.649 Like I need to keep myself rained in. 0:21:13.369 --> 0:21:17.569 Yeah, like you got to see the face that, like 0:21:17.689 --> 0:21:20.489 I ended up shutting away in an iron mask for 0:21:20.609 --> 0:21:22.969 the next twenty years. 0:21:24.689 --> 0:21:25.369 Do you feel like. 0:21:27.689 --> 0:21:30.009 In your relationship now that that's a face that you 0:21:30.050 --> 0:21:33.210 can show again, or that face that you want to reclaim. 0:21:33.889 --> 0:21:34.850 I'm working on it. 0:21:36.889 --> 0:21:39.689 Eventually it gets too cold outside, so we decide to 0:21:39.770 --> 0:21:42.369 leave the park in search of soup you want? 0:21:42.449 --> 0:21:43.170 Do you want to go in here? 0:21:43.649 --> 0:21:43.889 Yeah? 0:21:44.970 --> 0:21:46.810 Okay, I will train this. 0:21:46.850 --> 0:21:57.209 Off at the lunch counter. As we sit there side 0:21:57.209 --> 0:21:59.729 by side, I ask her how it feels to see me, 0:22:00.330 --> 0:22:02.770 and she says, it feels like getting together with family, 0:22:03.369 --> 0:22:06.010 and I could feel it too, two people who felt 0:22:06.050 --> 0:22:09.289 comfortable and close. The details of their shared past no 0:22:09.330 --> 0:22:18.530 longer important. We were just together, eating soup. After we eat, 0:22:18.649 --> 0:22:21.649 we head to the subway, Gleat going uptown and I 0:22:21.810 --> 0:22:25.169 back to Brooklyn. We say our goodbyes, and something about 0:22:25.209 --> 0:22:27.930 them feels final, like maybe this is the last time 0:22:27.970 --> 0:22:34.009 we'll ever see each other. When I get home, the 0:22:34.090 --> 0:22:38.289 apartment's empty, Emily's out with friends. I sit for a 0:22:38.290 --> 0:22:41.570 while in the quiet, and then pick up a novel 0:22:41.570 --> 0:22:44.249 I've been reading for the past six months, but I 0:22:44.330 --> 0:22:46.609 keep putting it down to look around my living room 0:22:47.010 --> 0:22:50.489 at the records and paintings, both mine and Emily's, and 0:22:50.570 --> 0:22:53.050 wonder what my eighteen year old self would have made 0:22:53.050 --> 0:22:57.490 of my New York existence. At close to midnight, I'm 0:22:57.609 --> 0:23:01.730 woken by a text from Gleat. I had a few 0:23:01.770 --> 0:23:04.209 thoughts I recorded just now on my phone. It says, 0:23:04.770 --> 0:23:07.050 do you want me to send them to you? I 0:23:07.090 --> 0:23:11.450 close the app, then open it again, reread the message, 0:23:11.850 --> 0:23:15.889 then close it, open it, close it, check Twitter, open 0:23:15.929 --> 0:23:19.330 it back up and read it one more time. Then 0:23:19.369 --> 0:23:20.730 I write back, saying. 0:23:21.050 --> 0:23:26.330 Sure, Hey, Jonathan, I just. 0:23:27.929 --> 0:23:31.690 Wanted to add to her conversation that I don't think 0:23:31.730 --> 0:23:34.850 I was able to absorb everything you were saying, but 0:23:35.570 --> 0:23:38.129 walking away from it and having a chance to think 0:23:38.609 --> 0:23:42.609 just brought up a lot of emotion and sadness, and 0:23:43.929 --> 0:23:52.330 I just wanted to say if anything I ever did 0:23:54.490 --> 0:24:00.609 in our relationship caused you pain and led you to 0:24:00.810 --> 0:24:11.409 put up walls, I just wanted to say, I'm sorry. Yeah, 0:24:11.449 --> 0:24:14.050 I don't know, I'm getting so emotional, but I just 0:24:14.050 --> 0:24:15.410 thought i'd share this, and. 0:24:16.970 --> 0:24:19.050 That's the thanks. 0:24:20.369 --> 0:24:22.769 I write Gleat back, telling her that there's nothing to 0:24:22.850 --> 0:24:26.490 apologize for. Then I apologize for making her feel bad 0:24:26.889 --> 0:24:29.929 and say that, in fact, considering how young we were, 0:24:30.290 --> 0:24:33.250 she'd been really mature and patient with me. It feels 0:24:33.330 --> 0:24:37.169 terrible to have made her sad. Somehow through the course 0:24:37.169 --> 0:24:40.609 of our day, Gleat and I had switched places. My 0:24:40.689 --> 0:24:43.609 heaviness had given way to what in my life passes 0:24:43.609 --> 0:24:49.369 for understanding, and her nostalgia had become tinged with sadness. Eventually, 0:24:49.770 --> 0:24:54.090 Gleat writes back. We all get hurt, she writes, and 0:24:54.129 --> 0:24:57.050 we all build walls to protect ourselves and then spend 0:24:57.050 --> 0:24:59.370 the rest of our lives trying to take down those walls. 0:24:59.810 --> 0:25:02.330 So hearing you talk about that was just a reminder 0:25:02.369 --> 0:25:04.729 of my own struggle to take down those walls and 0:25:04.770 --> 0:25:07.810 open my heart. It also reminded me of the purity 0:25:07.850 --> 0:25:10.609 of young love and how the ability to fully give 0:25:10.649 --> 0:25:13.769 and receive love seems to get more complicated as we 0:25:13.850 --> 0:25:24.850 get older. In short, it's all good. Gleat was right. 0:25:25.490 --> 0:25:28.850 It does get more complicated, but it also gets simpler. 0:25:30.050 --> 0:25:32.169 The one time I've cried in the past ten years 0:25:32.689 --> 0:25:35.449 was at my wedding, and I wasn't crying for fear 0:25:35.449 --> 0:25:38.050 that Emily would leave me. I was crying because I 0:25:38.090 --> 0:25:42.689 knew she Wouldn't you move from teen pain to adult pain. 0:25:43.330 --> 0:25:46.769 You build up walls, then tear them down, build them 0:25:46.850 --> 0:25:52.090 up again, check Twitter, and then hopefully take them back 0:25:52.129 --> 0:26:33.170 down for good. 0:26:37.209 --> 0:26:42.969 Now that the third entures returning to its goodwill home, 0:26:46.449 --> 0:26:50.850 now that the last month's rant is scheming with the 0:26:51.050 --> 0:26:55.090 damage to possible, take this moment to solve. 0:26:57.369 --> 0:27:03.129 If we mentioned, if we tried to remember felt around. 0:27:02.889 --> 0:27:03.570 For far. 0:27:06.250 --> 0:27:08.810 From things that accidentally Talk. 0:27:11.929 --> 0:27:15.249 Heavyweight is hosted and produced by me Jonathan Goldstein, along 0:27:15.290 --> 0:27:18.249 with Chris Neary and Khalila Holt. The senior producer is 0:27:18.330 --> 0:27:22.090 Wendy Dour, Editing by Alex Bloomberg, Paul Tuff and Jorge 0:27:22.369 --> 0:27:25.810 Just special thanks to Emily Condon, Stevie Lane and the 0:27:25.850 --> 0:27:30.529 Inimitable the Inimitable Jackie Cohen. The show is mixed by 0:27:30.530 --> 0:27:34.090 Hailey Shaw, music by Christine Fellow's. Additional music credits for 0:27:34.129 --> 0:27:37.090 this episode can be found on our website, gimletmedia dot 0:27:37.129 --> 0:27:40.770 com slash Heavyweight. Our theme song is by the Weaker 0:27:40.810 --> 0:27:43.810 Thands courtesy of Epitaph Records, and our ad music is 0:27:43.850 --> 0:27:47.009 by Hailey Shaw. Follow us on Twitter at Heavyweight or 0:27:47.129 --> 0:27:50.489 email us at Heavyweight at gimletmedia dot com. We'll have 0:27:50.530 --> 0:28:11.010 a new episode next week. Hey Alex, do you need 0:28:11.050 --> 0:28:19.409 the studio? Uh yeah yeah, just wrapping up get my stuff, Yeah, 0:28:19.570 --> 0:28:21.249 take it easy, Okay, thanks. 0:28:23.490 --> 0:28:31.409 Okay, Testing Testing went to went to testing testing, Hello 0:28:31.449 --> 0:28:33.210 and welcome to startup. I'm Alex Bloomberg. 0:28:37.929 --> 0:28:42.730 It's that peanut butter Gold State