279 | Client "Fit" in CCPT Isn't About the Child—It's About Expectations, Policies, and Processes

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You're listening to the Play Therapy Podcast with Dr. Brenna Hicks,

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your source for centered and focused play therapy coaching.

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Hi,

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I'm Dr. Brenna Hicks,

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The Kid Counselor.

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This is the Play Therapy Podcast where you get

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a master class in child-centered play therapy

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and practical support and application for your

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work with children and their families.

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In today's episode,

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I am answering a question from Chloe in Georgia.

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And her question is about.

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Clients and families being a good fit.

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And what that looks like,

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how to assess that,

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what

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tips and tricks and strategies we implement,

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and so I'm happy to dive into this.

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We'll read a little bit of the email together and then

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we'll get going.

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My questions are pertaining to a client being a good fit.

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In a recent episode,

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you briefly mentioned this and I'm wondering

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if you could elaborate on what is helpful

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in determining if a client is not a good fit for CCPT or the therapist client match.

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Does your center have a screening process

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for incoming referrals to determine this?

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How far into the process is it appropriate to determine goodness of fit,

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determining resistance or appropriateness,

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and how do you address this and what does your process for referring out look like?

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All right,

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Chloe,

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thank you for the questions,

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and I think this is actually really helpful for us to talk about.

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I,

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I talked a little bit about this in Virginia last weekend as well.

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So,

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I think first and foremost,

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let me be really clear,

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because your first part of your first question is

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what is helpful in determining if a client is not a good fit for CCPT?

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CCPT is a fit for every client.

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And I'm not saying that because I love it.

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I'm not saying that because I'm so sold on the model.

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I'm saying it because we have evidence-based support and empirical validation

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that CCPT works with every kid,

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with every scenario,

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with every,

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everything,

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every consideration you can think of

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CCPT has been proven effective.

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Obviously the process looks different for certain children.

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Neurodivergent kids,

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it takes longer,

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anxious kids,

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the early stages take a longer time.

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There are things that change based on

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the child and the scenario,

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but CCPT is a good fit for every single kid.

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As far as the therapist client match goes.

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That is also not

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something that we would need to consider

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because if the therapist

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is fully adherent to the model,

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And the therapist

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is

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fully trusting of the process.

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Every therapist-client relationship can be formed.

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And

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We will have the success that we're hoping for.

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So even the client therapist match is not necessarily a consideration either.

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But all of these other questions,

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I think are absolutely worth diving into.

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So do we have a screening process for incoming referrals?

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Well,

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Sort of.

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So,

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when

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the calls come in,

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Mya answers the phone,

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and she has scripts that she uses to

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get information from them.

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And then help them understand what to expect and what the next steps are.

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So typically what happens is the client calls and Mya's first question.

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Actually,

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it's a statement because we don't ask questions as a general rule,

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but the statement is,

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I wonder if you can tell me more about what's going on.

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And at that point,

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the parent is able to fill us in on.

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Age,

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presenting issues,

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concerns,

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history,

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whatever.

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And the only thing that we would,

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what you mentioned as vet

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over that phone call would be if the parent starts asking questions or

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Wondering if we're able to provide services that we are not able to provide,

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do things we're not able to do,

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or

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in some way have a different theoretical model.

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So,

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for example,

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if a

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parent says,

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do you accept insurance?

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That might not be a good fit because we're self-pay.

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If a parent says,

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how long is this going to take,

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we only have 9 weeks before school starts.

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If they expect this to miraculously solve every problem that they have in 9 weeks,

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it's probably not a good fit.

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If they

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tell us that they want us to talk to their children about what's going on,

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or they want us to do worksheets or activities with their children,

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it's not a good fit.

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If they hint that.

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They want us to testify in court,

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and the reason why they're having us start with their child is so

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that we can serve as an expert witness at an upcoming trial,

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not a good fit.

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So

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anything like that that comes up on the initial phone call,

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Maya is likely to address that.

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So she's probably going to say something like

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at our center

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and then give them the policies and what we will and will not do.

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I'm wondering if you're willing to set up an initial

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consultation where you can find out more about our center

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or we could provide you with referrals if you want someone

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that might be more along the lines of what you're seeking.

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So,

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for example,

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if they really want a therapist to go in and testify,

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there are therapists that happily work with the courts.

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If they want someone who is going to

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provide directive activities,

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although I don't think that that's helpful.

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We know of play therapists that

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are

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more directive than we are,

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so

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the vetting process in that initial phone

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call is typically what the client presents

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and if it does not align at all with our center's policies and or we're not

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able to do what they're asking for another scenario is if they ask us to diagnose,

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we,

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they want us to evaluate and diagnose

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we won't do that.

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So those are scenarios where we would immediately say,

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I'm not sure that this is

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the most helpful fit,

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but we can refer you to some other people.

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Now,

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in the initial parent consultation,

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there's an extra layer of vetting.

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So we ask parents to watch a video before they come,

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and that's one of the ways that we do a little bit

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of a check in to find out investment and commitment and buy-in

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because if the expectation is that you watch a 20

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minute video before you come and meet with us.

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And they show up and they haven't watched the video,

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that's a huge red flag.

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Because we're asking you to commit to 30 to 40 weeks

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of therapy because that's the national average

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and

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if you're not

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invested and committed enough to watch a 20 minute video,

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I'm not sure that you're going to be committed

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and invested enough to go 30 to 40 weeks.

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So that's a discussion that we have.

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And so really,

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it's about

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making sure that expectations are really clear.

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I think often

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once expectations are clearly spelled out on both sides,

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what are the parent expectations?

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What are our expectations as clinicians and as a center

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if we can find common ground

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and we can agree that we're all on the same page,

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then it's an appropriate fit.

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If there's a hang up somewhere,

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you know,

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I will not diagnose,

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I will not evaluate,

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I will not do a directive activity.

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I will not talk to your child about their problems at school.

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If we can't get over whatever that issue is,

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then we will refer.

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It's clearly not the fit that they want or need.

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Not that CCPT wouldn't help,

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and not that I don't desperately want to be able to help that child.

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But if we can't agree

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with the process moving forward.

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Then clearly it's not going to be the right fit.

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And if we were to move forward,

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one of two things is going to happen.

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We're going to be conceding or the parent is going to be conceding.

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And that ends up causing resentment and frustration.

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So that's option number 1.

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Option number 2 is

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there's going to be attrition

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because eventually the client's going to bail

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because needs aren't being met or tension gets too high

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or expectations haven't been delivered

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and then you end up not being able to help

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that client after you've already built a relationship with them.

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We would never want to establish a therapeutic relationship with a child

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and set that child up to be yanked from therapy 8,

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10 sessions in.

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Because

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it wasn't a fit.

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And it's not that it's not a fit with the child,

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it's,

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it's not a fit with all of the other considerations.

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So we work really hard to protect that therapeutic

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relationship because if we start with a child,

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we want to finish with a child.

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And it's about setting clear expectations.

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It's about having open communication.

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It's about making sure everyone is on the same page,

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everyone is in agreement about what's about to take place.

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And that preserves the relationship first,

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but it also preserves the experience for everyone involved.

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So your final question.

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How do you address

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any kind of resistance

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a little bit further into the process?

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Well,

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it all comes back to what was established

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when you had that first initial parent consult.

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That's why we,

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that's why I spent so much time in

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the coaching program talking about how to have those

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initial parent consult because

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when

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you set boundaries,

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when you set expectations,

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when there's a system,

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when there's a process,

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when you tell appropriate stories,

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when you give appropriate analogies,

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when you draw pictures for them to get the process,

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when things like resistance pop up and all of a sudden the parent like,

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I just don't know if this is actually helping and I just,

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I don't know that we're gonna keep coming.

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You remind them of what's already been discussed.

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You remind them of the commitment that they made.

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You bring them back to the things that you already said were likely going to happen.

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Remember I said it usually gets worse before it gets better?

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We're right in that it's worse before it gets better scenario.

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And

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there,

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but there has to be the early conversation for you to fall back on.

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So often that's that

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necessary

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confrontation,

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communication.

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You know,

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you,

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you knew that this was not going to be a quick fix.

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You knew that things were going to get worse before they got better.

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You knew we were going to hit resistance phase.

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You knew that

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that there was likely going to be a 30 to 40 week scenario here.

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This is what we all agreed on,

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and then you bring them back to the triangle of trust.

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So,

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I think

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Chloe,

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to kind of wrap up my answers to all of this,

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it really does go back to having scripts and templates and frameworks

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when you first communicate with parents.

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Because

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every client and every family has to

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be told the exact same thing

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in the exact same way

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at the exact same time

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and you have to have it all planned out ahead of time for consistency's sake,

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for setting expectations sake

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and for making sure that you're setting everyone up

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to have the most success.

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You don't want to have

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a client that you end up saying,

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oh,

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this isn't a good fit,

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the parent doesn't want that,

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the child doesn't want that.

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So we have to make sure

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that everything is very clearly expressed and communicated from the get go

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to prevent any kind of frustration or tension later on in the process.

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So Chloe and Georgia,

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thank you so much for the question.

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I really appreciate that.

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I hope that was helpful to all of you.

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Don't forget that we have the 3 week

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Core Wellness CEU program coming up.

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Core Wellness reached out to me and said that their website is Corewell,

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but they are officially Core Wellness,

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and I know some of you have reached out and been.

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Confused because I typically say Corwell and officially it

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is Core Wellness so I'm sorry for that.

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Please make sure that you know it's Core Wellness

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is the full name of the company even though their website is Corwell.

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It's shortened for the URL,

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but just be mindful that I have that 3 week series

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coming up at the end of March on the four pillars,

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Deep Dive advanced.

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Core 4 pillars.

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So if you're interested in that,

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check that out.

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You can go to playtherapypodcast.com/4pillars,

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and I would love to have you there.

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I know a lot of you have already registered,

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so I'm really looking forward to hanging out with you for 3 Fridays in a row.

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That's fun.

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We'll have the Collective call at noon Eastern and then we'll do

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a whole bunch of training for 3 Fridays in a row.

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So

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looking forward to hanging out with my people.

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I love you all.

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We'll talk again soon.

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Bye.

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Thank you for listening to the Play Therapy Podcast with Dr.

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Brenna Hicks.

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For more episodes and resources,

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please go to www.playtherapypodcast.com.