Raiders of the Lost Ark - 100th Episode Spectacular!

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Speaker 1: On the Dog Cast, the questions asked if movies have women in them? Are all their discussions just boyfriends and husbands? Do they have individualism? The patriarchy? Zef invest start changing it with the Beck del Cast. Do do Do Do Do Do Do Do Do Do Do keep going do do Do Do do do do do? You know something horrible? But when I was watching this movie, every time, I was expecting the NFL team, you know, the one that's like, it's close enough, there's a lot of brass and it precedes men fighting. That's true. So you're like, but I was like, that's not his song. I was like, actually, in one of the most famous movies of all time, it turns out to do this a song. Hey, everyone, welcome to the Beck dol Caret. Hello, I'm Caitlin Dronte. I'm Jamie Loftus, and here we are for our one hundred episode. This is where you put in the crazy frog music. Cue ding ding ding ding. You know? Okay? Well, oh crazy frog heads, is that there will know? So this is our hundredth episode of the Betel Cast. If this is your first time listening, I'd recommend maybe make this not your first episode. Yeah, because this is our celebration. We're probably gonna be a little more casual. No guests today, guests, we're raw dogging it, baby, because I don't know. We uh, we've been doing We've been doing our hundred episodes almost two years. We've got a lot to reflect on. Yeah, and also I have ten pages of notes for this movie. I mean, what would be more fitting. It's the celebrations. You have to take twice as many notes as you normally would. Um, so before we get started, this will probably be a slightly looser episode that you're used to, and it'll just be the two of us, so hopefully you want to hang with us for a little bit. This is like kind of closer to what our bonus episodes are, like yeah so good or Matrion. Yeah, if you like more to chill gals, just kind of tune the ship there. Uh no, actually cut that out. But we do have a movie, like we have a task yes, okay, for the sake of consistency. The Bechdel test was the idea or podcast is built around. It is a media test, a test applied to media, usually to movies and television, that requires there be a scene that has two female characters with names that speak to each other about something other than a man for a total of at least two lines of dialogue. That's our standard. Does it happen frequently? No? Listen on there, you start the demo today. I always, I always initiate the demo. Okay, Hey, Jamie in our episodes, which when's your favorite doubt? Doubt? Uh? That passes? Yeah, that passes. What I could have said to make it not passes. John Patrick Shanley what a genius. Okay, I wish All for Melina had been in it, but fortunately Segue Alfred Molina's first major film credit is the movie we're discussing today. It's one of Caitlin's favorites. That's right, Raiders of the Lost Arc. Before we get into it, I'm just gonna get a little heartfelt here for a second, and I think this will continue to pass the Bechdel test because I just wanted to say, Jamie, first of all, I've had such a fun time recording. Really it's been. It's technically when you include our bonus Matreon episodes, it's been over a hundred. But of our regular released episodes that are available on you know iTunes, Spotify, wherever you get your podcasts. This is our hundred one. I have had so much fun talking and laughing with you. When you track our progress from episode one two now, it's there's so many different categories of progress. Oh my gosh. Yeah, there's I feel like there's like progress of like our understanding of talking about gender and blind spots that I think we definitely had two years ago that we're working on more now. And there's also the very heartwarming I think track of like we've gotten like mentions of this from listeners before, like you can sort of tell the point where we become like really good friends, and that warms my heart too. There's so many I love you, really, we're glad that we do this. Me too. Fun. I have so much fun with it, and I learned ship all the time. I genuinely think that like doing this show and having like the need to like I mean for us, especially like to watch media critically or we're not doing our job correctly has informed like everything else that I do, and just sort of a general way of perceiving the world in the past two years has has changed. And we didn't I mean, we were talking about this podcast pre election but the fact that our show came out pretty much I think, like maybe a week or two after the election to it's been a doozy of two years in terms of like, I think that there's stuff like at the beginning of the show that we just didn't even have language for or wasn't really discussed that much that now we do. So our conversations we have gotten so much more sophisticated as time goes on. But also we still regularly call into question the consistency of beetlejuice come. So have our conversation has gotten more sophisticated though, and to be fair, but okay for using that example, and you know, I love when we do. I'm already regretting bringing it up. Well, you could think about it in terms of discourse. It took us a whole year to even mentioned beetle juices come because we as a culture simply didn't have the language. It was just embedded so deeply that we assumed that we didn't know what he came and we and it was a taboo. We didn't think about it. It took us a whole year of the podcast, nearly eleven months till October of twenty seventeen to be so bold as to say, does he come dry scaps or wet scaps? And that's why people listen for this exact discourse specifically, and then also just because we are you know, we're bringing up these conversations, giving people the language that they need to discuss come of all genders. Well, most of that conversation, until we started talking about beetle juices come most of it past the becto tests. So yeah, let's talk about Raiders of the Lost Art. Dude, that's for football soccer. Sorry, that's a soccer. So what is this movie? It stars my least favorite character. I was going to say Alfred Molina, but he's not the star really, I mean in terms of men I respect. The spectrum is represented in the first scene of this movie. Before we get there, Caitlin, please tell me what is your history with Raiders of the Lost Art. I would love to tell you. I would say that I first saw this movie when I was probably nine or ten. All three of the original trilogy of Indiana Jones films were on VHS at my house, and as soon as I discover them, I never looked back. I have seen this movie, probably a good thirty times, I would say, yep, I would say I've seen Last Crusade even more than that, because that is I would still call it my favorite. But I'm beginning to appreciate more and more that Raiders is a better film. Um templea doom I've never been that fond of, and it is not aging well at all. That's also one that the female lead is by far the least strong, right, the least strong, the not to detract from the cause, but the most annoying and the least active. As I've said many times, part of feminism is being able to openly acknowledge when you do not like another one, right yeah, so yeah, definitely the weakest one and until Crystal Skull rears its ugly head in whatever year that was two thousand eight or something like that, which, by the way, was my first date ever boy where I brought like my date, but also my best friend Peter, because I was scared. I know, I know, so basically to some up, I I love this movie. I still love this movie. We will unpack all the reasons that there are to not love parts of this movie, but I'm gonna stand by this movie and say that it is great, even though I already have a good idea of what nipple rating I will give it, and it is not high. But even so, I love this franchise and it is definitely in my top five favorite franchises and movies of all times. So that's where I'm coming from. Cool my history with this movie. I feel like we should have our own Bingo card out for this episode to see it, to make sure we hit all the right notes. This movie saw last night, and then I wasn't going to watch it a second time, but then I was going to go to the d m V this learning, and then I sucked it up, so I just watched it again, watched it twice. Good, good, good, We're growing Yeah, yeah, I did not grow up with this franchise. I also didn't grow up with a Star Wars franchise. I don't know. I don't really know why that was. You would think that I would have encountered it, but I just didn't. We weren't we weren't a big movie household. We weren't a big but we were like a big Disney movie household. We were a big cartoon household, which I think influenced the direction of my life. But we were we were more of a TV household than a movie household. Um, so I just never really watched it. Mostly watched holes, which we should do it upside um, but I never watched it. And then as I grew older, I mean, as as you know about me, action movies just kind of weren't my thing. And then, as I've learned, actually directly via this podcast, Harrison Ford also is very much not my thing, and so I had little incentive to watch this movie until I mean, this movie feels important to do canonically. And I will say I was expecting to come in, you know, just swinging my labia around like loose PASTRAMI being like, I hate this movie, this movie sucks whatever, But I have I have more conflicting feelings about it than I thought. There were parts of this movie that I liked very much. I mean, and by that, I mean I loved the Alfred Molina scene and he's so handsome. Does it pass the Bechtel test if Harrison Ford grabs the front of Alfred Molina's pants? No, it passes the Bechtel test. When Alfred Molina steals from Harrison Ford and leaves him to die, it doesn't pass the Bectel test. But now from Molina dies obviously what a crazy I mean? And I didn't like that was his first movie ever and he's on screen with a huge movie star for a long time. I was like, he's just so gift and he didn't crack under pressure. He gave the performance of a lifetime. He never God, I would like, literally give a finger to see him as Tavia. But yeah, what are you gonna do? So writers of the Lost Arc? So I'll do the recap of the story of Writers of the Lost Arc, because like, not really that much happens. A ton happens. What are you talking about? There are some scenes that go on for a long time, but fun. Okay. So we're in the mid nineteen thirties. We meet Indiana Jones. He is an adventurer who mostly steals sacred artifacts from indigenous cultures. But we love him, love him. I think the greatest piece of acting here is us believing that Harrison Ford could be a teacher. Okay, I know you hate Ford. I not as an individual, I hate his characters. He seems he seems like a perfectly fun guy. So we meet Indiana Jones. We see him trying to take a golden idol from a tribe in South America. But who else is there? Well, Cepedo a k a. Alpha. It's his big day and he recovered in Tarantula's for part of the city. Jeeves is cool and he is you can tell he's like, I'm not sold on this franchise, but I'm a young buck who needs an opportunity. I can see what's going through his head. What if there is maybe there's a universe where he has those tarantulas on him. He gets bitten by one because one of them is radioactive, and that that's what makes him become Doc. I love that. Oh it's like the twenty three Years Sleeper. And then he wakes up one day and he's Doc Doc. Okay, that's Cannon. Now that's Cannon. It's as Cannona's dry scaps baby. Okay. So Alfred Molina is there. So is this character named Belloc who is Indiana Jones's rival, and he takes the idol from him because he's friends with the indigenous culture that Indiana Jones is trying to steal from. Then we cut to a classroom because Indiana Jones is also a professor of archaeology. The teacher who can read. Sure, Look, he's an academic, he has he has more degrees than I do. He's wearing glasses. I'm like, this is fucking lazy, but fine, Yeah, Harrison Ford can read and he has glasses. Sure, I only have a master's degree in screenwriting. I don't like to bring it up, but it is from Boston University. He's got a PhD from Chicago. A doctor. He's a doctor, Dr Jones. Doctor I know, and I love anytime someone says doctor Jones. It is the best doctor Jones songs. Mr Jones, what, oh my god? Have you never heard that song? No, it's like the Amy Weinhouse song Me and doctor Chill. Alright. Anyway, So he's at his university, he's teaching the kids about archaeology, and then he gets approached by a couple of army intelligence guys who have intercepted a communicate from the Nazis, and the Nazis are looking for the headpiece to the Staff of Raw, which is a thing that's going to help them find the Ark of the Covenant. It's another piece of indigenous art that Harrison Ford needs to steal so that more evil white guy doesn't get it right, but it's not suggested that perhaps this is something an indigenous adventurer could do. Only Harrison Ford could do it, and in this scene he's the best, and he says things as if he's read a book before. Sure, doctor, look he's got a PhD. And I believe it's Hitler PhD candidates. God damnit. Hitler is looking for the art because he wants to weaponize it, so Indiana Jones has to find it before he does so that that can't happen. So Indiana goes to Nepal to get the headpiece from Marion Ravenwood, which is her dad, her dad, and then yeah, he Indiana Jones learns that her quote he died it was like an old professor of his and he and Maryan have a history which we will talk about, but it was a child. Yeah. Well, there's there's too much to say now, so we'll get there. So then some Nazis coming to steal the headpiece. They're not successful, so then Marian partners up with Indie by the way, after he immediately comes back triggers her and then burns down her small business. And now they're working together. Okay, So then they go to Tannis, which is a city where the arc is thought to be. They meet up with Indiana's friend Salah, a white guy. Yeah, yep, we'll get there as well. And then they figure out what the markings on the headpiece mean, and then they make sure their staff is the right height because Bellock's staff is too long. They're digging in the wrong place. Oh no, They go to the map room to figure out the right spot to find the arc. So indeed, he starts digging and they find the Well of the Souls, So so they're they're in the Chamber of Secrets and then they find the arc. But Belloc shows up and he's like, that's nine nine nine. So Bellock takes it and he loads it onto a plane and then there's a big fight sequence and then they're like, no, let's put it on a truck. And then there's another big there, like we need to have a battle scene on every mode of transportation or the movie can't end. Have we yet passed the point where Marian is kidnapped? And then Indy shows up and he's like, actually just gonna leave you here. Yeah, I glossed over that part. There's a big fight sequence. It's in a market scene. Maryon gets kidnapped and then she thought to have died, and then he right after he figures out the spot where the arc is. He goes into a tent and Maryan is there. She's bound, she's gagged. She's like, get me out of here, and he's like, no, I have to go get an arc curse. Yeah. Then she is taken to the Well of the Souls and gets dumped in there with Indiana right and then they have to escape and that's when they go on this wild goose chase of going after the plane and then the trucks, and then they get on a boat. At one point there's some kissing. It's very cool. By the end of the movie that they all end up on this island where Belloc performs this ritual to make sure that the arc works. I guess he's doing a test run before he gives it to Hitler. Shares ghost comes out of it and all their heads exploit their faces melt off. Indiana is like, don't look at it, and then don't like a Shares go and then that is pretty much the movie. Yeah, I I liked it more than I was expecting. Well, I mean, if you like movies like you know, The Mummy or National Treasure, those movies don't exist without this movie. So that's true. And I love National Trushre I know you do. I love the I feel like I've said this a million times too. But the Daylight savings time, plot, plot contrivance, gorgeous, beautiful. Why wasn't there that? I think that's what this well, speaking of time, I think it's time to take a quick break. But then we'll come back and we'll talk more about raiders Do Do Do Anywhere? We're back now, So, um, there's a lot, there's a lot here. This is one of the movies that takes place in a world where women barely exist, says all of early George Lucas. Basically where up until like three years ago, you wouldn't know that George Lucas had really met a woman before, and then all of a sudden, you know, the less evolved he was, the more women would appear. But whatever, this is very much. I mean I think that this is and George Lucas has involved in both projects obviously, but like this is like comparable to Leia in some ways of like we're given one female character she does a lot of stuff. She's relatively active within bounds. I would argue that this movie would never empower Maryan to the point where she didn't need Indy, which I think that in that way, she's kind of a weaker character than La, because I think that, like, it's clear that she would be okay without the guys, but Marian, like, there are clear limitations to what the movie will allow her to do before she's taken captive basically, but there's no one for her to talk to, no one for her to talk to, and yeah, as you said, not that much for her to do more than I was expecting. It's interesting with Mary And there were some points where I'm like, I can't imagine that this was done super intentionally as like a meta text thing. But for the sake of argument, there are scenes where you know, this is so common in any action movie, where Harrison Ford is tossing her to the side, getting her out of harm's way, throwing her the piles of hay, but then Marian will get up and start fighting again and then help pick her up and toss her away again. And it was interesting because I don't think it was like super intentionally done of like Indiana Jones is very much a typical action hero of like my lady can't get harmed, You're not got to keep her safe. But unlike you know, like Mary Jane Watson caught in a web for the climax of another Alfred Molina classic. Uh, Marian keeps getting up and keeps trying to fight, and and like she has fighting that goes beyond like the standard woman one bunk, one panda the head. Wow, she did it. Like she doesn't have multiple battle victories, Yeah, which I wasn't expecting. Sure, and let's go through them. Let's talk about her sort of role in this story. So and well, before we do that, I just want to kind of give a quick overview of her character. Um. So, when she's introduced on screen, she is beating a man in a drinking contest, so we know she she's not like the other girls, right she We know she can hold her liquor, which is a skill that will pay off later in the movie. So at least that's set up for our specific purpose. We know that she's the daughter of a famous archaeologist and she has traveled the world with him, but she doesn't necessarily seem to have any specific career ambition of her own or interest in archaeology, which is fine, which is fine, but it's a small business owner. But also she doesn't really seem to like that because she says, I'm stuck in this dive. I can't you know, I want to get out of here. And we know that she's had a relationship with Indiana Jones in the past, which is a whole other conversation. I would say, even though she is sort of presented as like not like the other girl's kind of character, I do and I have always admired her for being tough and self sufficient, self sufficient she you know, doesn't take ship from anyone. Yeah, I know, it's it's pretty surface level. The thing there is like it's weird because again it's like eighties convention of like surface level empowerment. But even the way she's presented of like she is able to sustain a life on her own, but it's not anywhere close to the level of like satisfaction she could get out of life with Indiana je And so there's like a level of like when he arrives and sweeps her off into adventure. It's not that she was waiting for him to show up, but sort of, you know, like like he's definitely the catalyst that turns her world upside down exactly makes it exciting again, which yeah, is it's not great, but I would say overall, she's presented as a smart, capable character who advocates for herself. But the trouble is that the story rarely gives her an opportunity to do anything that has much of an impact on the narrative for the for the time it's coming out. It's not bad, but there's still a lot of shortsightedays around it. I would wonder, like how much of an influence the success of Leah's character had on the way this character was written, because Leiah predates her by a couple of years. Yeah, so the first Star Wars movie came out in ninete. This movie came out in one. Okay, So yeah, I mean that's good, and that's I mean, her character is more complicated to analyze than I was anticipating. Yeah, because as much as it not like the other girl tropes kind of bug me, there at least grounded in this story where it skills that she, like you're saying, needs later. I guess this is like the in between level of yes, we are acknowledging that a woman can sustain a life on her own, but she can't truly experience the joy of life without a man's And then if for taking it all the way back to the Mummy episode. In that movie, we see we see the Rachel wife's character having really important knowledge the greatly in fact, the direction of the story which Brendan Fraser needs to be able to carry on with his quest. Whereas in this movie, while she does some things and makes some active choices, there's nothing that she can sure beats that's crucial to the narrative because Indiana Jones has given all of the necessary information and knowledge and you know, problem solving skills to you know, make all the important moves of the story because he can read. Don't forget Indiana Jones character who canonically can read and has a doctorate. Anyways, So yeah, oh, I also just wanted to make a comment on the actress who plays Marian She Allen. Yes, she doesn't end up doing a whole lot of stuff by choice after this movie, I would just like to throw out there, no judgment, just wanted to put it out there. She does marry a man named Kale, a grown man named Kale. Karen and Kale, Karen and Kale. That's something people had to say seriously when making plans. So that's just all Kale. So yeah, do you think Cal and Karen are around if you knew Kale first? In any case, just a little bit of gristle for you to chew on for our hundredth episode. You bet you? Okay, back to talk about Yeah, let's talk about her role and major contributions in the story. So we see her for the first time in the bar in Nepal. Some bad guys come in and threaten her. They use violence as a way to turn her business down. In reality, she would have to stay and at least get the insurance money, not leave that day. Anyways, Indiana has to come in and save her. There is a fight. She does a couple of things, like she hits a guy with a log head. She drinks whiskey out of a barrel. This was That was the first thing where I was like, she's more active than I thought she was going to be. But she still wasn't that like she could. She couldn't have won the day on her own for sure, and then as opposed to Oklahoma, Oklahoma Smith my favorite actor movie hero. Personally, I'm partial to Utah, Pennsylvania, Johnson Pennsylvania, Johnson is great? Where's Johnny Utah? And all of this point break Okay, anyway, choose its crews favorite action hero. Okay. So by the end of this scene, Indiana Jones is doing most of the fighting, but Marian does shoot the last bad guy who was about to kill Indiana Jones. I'd argue this is a little trophy of the woman did something. Yeah, so she saves him, but it is like, oh, wow, look at it, look at look at what a woman. I guess that I could I think that, And I think that that is partially used as like a reasoning to the audience of like, oh, she is a realistic person for him to take on as a partner, which there's a pattern of the way she's treated in this movie. I feel like almost the movie never well, it does make a decision eventually, but it goes back and forth several times of like if we're thinking chessboard, is she a pawn or is she an actual player in the game, Because there's multiple times where she's used as a pond she treated like an object to move the plot forward. There's that moment where what's the name of that character, katanga u Katanga has her on the boat and it's like, I think that, you know, we could sell her as a prostitute once we get off the boat, and that moves the plot forward and gets what needs to happen in the scene to happen, but only because she's treated as an object. Same dale whenever she's randomly abducted. That just adds steaks by her being there. But then there's other moments where her skills and presence are necessary to the plot moving forward, and the movie just kind of goes back and forth, and never I think that it settles on the decision that she is a pawn, because by the end she is wearing like a wedding dress and it's to be rescued. But for for a while, it's back and forth. And then one more quick thing about the bar scene is that at the end of that she makes the choice to accompany him on She's like, like, you got more than you bargained for. I'm your goddamn partner, right, so so I'm not getting tired of it personally me either, and Prior to that, you know, we see her interacting with like the Nazi guy who's like, I don't know what kind of people are used to dealing with, but no one tells me what to do in my place, she blows smoke in his face, you know, So she's more headstrong considering the era, considering the genre, and also considering the fact that these movies were based on these sort of adventurer cereals from the nineteen thirties. I have not watched that media personally, but I would wager that those did not treat women very well, and if it was a woman in the story, this is probably progress built upon that. Yeah, I would imagine. So if you, if you are familiar, as as the audience listening to us, if you have seen those, you know, adventure cereals that Indiana Jones movies are kind of inspired by, let us know. But again, I would hazard to guess that the women in those stories were just kind of tossed around and not allowed to do anything or damsels in distress the whole time. So yeah, but you know, more progress could have been made than it was. I agree, Yeah, I would be shocked if this wasn't somehow an improvement on the source material, but you know it's still an idea one, right, right, right. So the next sequence is the one in the marketplace. They are now in Cairo, h Indiana Jones calls her stupid because there's a monkey that's their friend. Now, Indiana Jones is enough, right, but yeah, but he's like, oh, do we need the monkey? And she's like, it's got your looks and he's like, and your brains and she's like, I noticed that she's smart, so um, and then that fights scene breaks out. As soon as the fight breaks out, you see Mary and picking something up and like starting to hit a bunch of bad guys with it. It seems to be an aluminum pan that would not inflict much damage, but hey, it's what was right there. But it's more the same thing that we see in the first fight scene at the bar, where Indiana Jones is doing most of the fighting and she is not doing nearly as much. He says to her pretty early on to get out of there, and then he throws her aside. She falls on the ground. A little later on, picks up a frying pan and hits a guy over the head with it. But this is something that. I feel like we see a lot where if women in a movie are allowed to participate in a fight scene, they're usually not given actual weapons. No, no, the well, and then very often I think that they end up using domestic items to fight, which is like a weird subtext of like, oh, well, they would never have just have weapons, and so they you know, you know how to use this pot, They've they've cooked many things. Let's let's have her fight in her language. Like what yeah, totally absolutely agree with that. Or another example of what happens when women are fighting and fight scenes is she will wrap her legs around a guy's face and then pussy slam him on the floor. Yeah. Yeah, so those are usually the two options. Rarely do we see a woman wielding a gun and being skilled with a gun. Now is this something as a hater of guns, do I want to see women firing of guns all the time? Not necessarily, but because men get to do it so much right, and we see so little of women doing it in action movies. It's a very noticeable disparity. Uh. And then I honestly like I did lose track of the fight scenes because it's just not a language that I speak, I'm like, okay, there's he's gonna win, Like why are we He's going to win, but we have to see him struggle before he wins and fights. But you just love it. But he's gonna win and we don't know that. But intellectually we know, but emotionally we only twist in movies. Ever that's ever happened is in School of Rock when they lose the Battle of the Dance. That's the only Act three twist. You never see it coming. So the rest of the sequence plays out where she after she makes a few failed attempts at fighting, she hides in a basket, then gets captured, gets loaded onto a truck, and is thought to have been killed in a big truck explosion. And then she disappears from the movie for about fifteen minutes and doesn't appear on screen again until Oh no. But it's to build suspense, doy, so she appears on screen again whenever Indiana Jones finds her in a tent where she is tied up, she is bound and gagged and he's like, hey, there you are. I thought you were dead, and she's like, give me out of here, cut me loose, and he's like no, that would be too says that they'll be on me. That's gonna risk you dying. The only thing that's more frustrating than a woman needing to be constantly rescued as a woman almost being rescued, and then the guy being like, actually not, and then they still end up together. It's just not a cute thing to do. I don't care what this movie tells me to feel. I don't think it's cute or charming. I understand. God damn it. He just left her with Nazis, right, And then we cut to a scene where the Nazis are talking about torturing her to get information out of her, which I think it would have been an improvement on the story if she was given information about the medallion that she not that I wanted to see her tortured, but if if she had had Because they get the medallion and there's these markings on it that they need to have interpreted so they can figure out how high the staff of raw needs to be. It would stand to reason because she's been in possession of this thing for so long, because her father was a noted archaeologist who was an expert on this very ark of the Covenant, Tannis staff of raw stuff. You would think that maybe she would have along the way acquire heard some information about this, but because the movie God Forbid a woman knows anything, that doesn't become you know, world cannon. Until at least the early two thousand, women didn't know facts. But then we talked about this on the tomb Raider episode because we can very easily liken lot of craft tomb Raider to Raiders of the Lost Arc. And even in that movie, where we have a female protagonist who is driving the story, she is given most of the information she needs to propel the story forward, usually by men. So it's not even though that she knows the stuff or has a waited or like even it's not because it's like sometimes it's uh Mary Sue situation where it's like, how would she have known that? Radically? But it's like she could have sought out that information and found it, and we could have had her be actively looking for like that. But no, bret In staid, a bunch of you know, guys come up to her and they're like, hey, here's the information. You know. Anyways, See he's like, who is that and why is he? In Sagg now like that's insane. So after she realizes that Indiana Jones is not going to cut her loose and rescue her, she takes matters into her own hands, to her credit, so what she does is she tries to outsmart and out drink Bellock so that she can try to escape, because her whole plan is to get him so drunk that he can't chase after her whenever she tries to run away, and there's a knife that she threatens him with and it almost works until and he's mad. He's got a coat hanger. But she made that Nazi so mad with her knife and she's, oh shit, that not he pissed, and then she is made or maybe this already happens, but at some point in this scene, she is made to put on a sexy white dress basically like a virgin. We it's a wedding dress like it's just as she's putting this on, Belloc is spying on her, which means that the audience is spying on her while she's changing. And that's another sneaky moment where it's a moment of blatantly objectifying a woman, but the bad guys doing it, so you don't have to feel bad about participating, which is like not dog does not happen. It works, right, So that scene concludes with them taking her and then throwing her into the Well of Souls where Indiana Jones is already hanging out. This seems fun. At this point. We haven't seen Alfred Billina for well over an hour, and we're getting frost right there. You've had to pause and watch Shock a lot for a while. I had to. I had to keep pausing and watching a whole other movies. Yeah, um, watch all a feud in the middle of this. So then, um, she's in the tomb in that scene starts with an upshot of us looking up her dress while she's dangling from a statue, and then they now need to escape from this tomb, the snake tomb. The snake tomb. That's right, So she is less scared of snakes than Indiana Jones, but she's still shrieking at the top of her lungs throughout the entire scene. If we need to remove snake stigma as a future snake owner, let's normalize women with snakes. I guess I still don't support this snake things. Too late, I gotta Terry, Um, I need to fill it. So they're trying to escape, and of course Indiana Jones is doing most of the escape ing. She's mostly just squealing about snakes. Uh. This could have been an opportunity to because she has like because Indiana Jones has a crippling fear of snakes in the whole tomb is slithering with them. So this could have been an opportunity to make her more active and to have her be the one because she's not so petrified, being the one who is actively doing stuff to find an escape route. But of course that does not happen. So Indiana Jones he's doing he's whipping stuff, he's crashing through a wall. Um, he's doing all manners stuff. He's occasionally that that theme we all know and love starts to play in the crowd will go wild. And as my friends pointed out, because I watched this recently with Nolan, Alex and Jake and sorry everyone for hanging out with men, but that was the reality of the situation. So shouts out to my friends. But um, I think it was my friend Nolan who pointed out that he is an archaeologist and yet he is destroying an ancient historical site. Oh, he has no regard for the culture he's supposed to dearly love like and that's I mean, that is perhaps one of the more realistic elements of the nineteen thirties being presented, because like it's so well documented of like British it's it's like super fucking colonial ship of like if you're an archaeologist, it's basically sanctioned fievery because you're white. That maybe is the most historically accurate, just like he wants one thing and he'll burn down any other piece of ancient history, and archaeologist should probably be more comfortable around snakes. There's just a lot of like he's a very least an unethical archaeology. Yeah, there's there's no doubt about that. Also in this scene, because she's now in her in a wedding dress, he's where did you get this dress? From him? And she's like, I was trying to escape, no, thanks to you, And he's like how hard were you trying? Right, I'm like, dog, you had the opportunity to rescue me from a serious So she's like, well, where the hell were you? And then instead of answering, he rips off the bottom two feet of her dress for the torch. Yeah, and then they throw a bunch of skeletons at her. She's screaming, and then they get out of the tomb, so she is rendered I would say, more inactive in this scene than probably any of the other scenes she's in, which, as you pointed out, it's pretty inconsistent with like sometimes she's like doing stuff and it's in it's helping, and it's you know, further in the cause, and at the time she's completely damseled. So the next scene we come upon with her is the fight scene at the plane where she does some I would pretty cool stuff here. She hits the pilot with some wooden blocks who was trying to shoot indies, so she saves him there, and then she gets in the plane and shoots a bunch of bad guys with like the big gun. Um. But then she gets trapped in the plane and he has to save her, and then she is not on the screen again for a while because there's a big chunk of the movie where he's on a truck and he's punching Nazis. That scene certainly was long, but it's so good. God, I love it. The only thing that occurred to me during the truck scene was like, Wow, he must have really a high quality pants because anyone else's pants would have just, you know, totally deteriorated. He's dragging along at like seventy miles hour, so you know, good on his pants. Guy, they don't like pants. As far as I got into being engaged in that scene, hey, let's take a quick break. We'll put a pause on the conversation and we'll come back after the break. That's all breaks work. Yes, do do Do Do Do Do Do. It's hockey night in Canada, da Sweet saying on me, I can't believe you don't know that song. Oh my god. Okay, so we're back and this is the hundredth episode. Okay, so we're we're finishing up Marion's moments of activity. Yes, so the next scene we're gonna take a look at. Here is the scene on the boat. Well, first, before Marion even gets on the boat, she kisses Sala on the mouth to thank him, right, and he has a horny connection, which is her choice, but also as weird, like Indiana Jones doesn't kiss him on the mouth to thank him. So that part I mean it was stupid, but I don't know, Like Indiana Jones, he's so like, you know, all of his male friendships, he literally like kind of no homos his own friend when his friends like I'll miss you, and then Indiana Jones like that's clearly too much emotion for him. He's like you are a friend, like you are a good friend, and then you're like okay, so also only going to get so he would never say he missed someone, sure, But also in the very beginning with Alfred Molina, whenever he's like grabbing onto his pants and then pulls them to the other side of this like crevice. They've kind of like got their arms around each other, and then Indiana Jones pushes Alfred Molina away because do you know you're being embraced by a god? And second of all, I'll go on record to say I would get guarantee that we're talking Cannon. All of Harrison Ford's early characters are homophobic, not a question in my mind. I don't think Harrison Ford is really an ally to it or his character. Sorry, I don't know anything about him as a person, but all of his characters are part of like they're like rogue is charm is. They're not an ally to literally anyone. Uh. And I want to talk about him as like, you know, a man's man, but we'll get there. Oh yeah, there's some not the worst perpetrator of toxicity in the whole world, but you know it's certainly a purp, yeah for sure. So then they get on a boat. She puts on another sexy white dress, which she wears for the rest of the movie pretty much until the very last scene. And then she spends that whole scene trying to take care of Indiana Jones, for which he is not grateful. No, which is I think falls into the man's man's persona of like I don't need anyone to take care of me, independent man, blah blah blah. And this is kind of like a familiar scene too, of like the warriors wounded and now the woman must be his nurse. And it reminded me I was thinking immediately of that scene from Beauty and the Beast after the Beast has rescued Bell from the wolves and then she you know, heals him, and at first he's really mean to her, but then by the end it's like there's something here, kind of like the exact same road map for this scene because until this moment on screen, we have not seen them be Oh no, we have seen them be romantic. He kisses her, I think, whenever he finds her in the tent. Yeah, like there are moments, but it's just like, this is the first moment where he isn't totally nagging her, right, And it's also one of their first like private moments that they're not in grave danger. Right, it's like a quiet moment. So yeah, he's not quite as much like peacocking around. But even then still it's you can tell that this character is so steeped in his own masculinity that acknowledging that he needs help from another person pains him greatly. Also, his own physical fallibility is upsetting to him, which we find out in this scene as well, which I thought was like kind of an effective choice of like, Okay, at least Indiana Jones has an insecurity that we are now aware of. I didn't know that before, so that's something. Yeah, Oh, I forgot to mention that, you know, they kiss on a boat, not on like Hydros Titanic. They but but the spark simply isn't there. And then The next thing that happens is the Nazis invade this boat and then we you talked about this scene already where Indiana Jones hides but Marian gets captured, and then the ship captain Katanga is like, hey, let's keep her because she's got value where we're headed. And then the Nazis are like, no, she's our property. Yeah, like literally, she's property in this And then Indiana Jones gets on a submarine, but I don't think he goes inside, so I think we're meant to believe that he just like somehow hangs on the outside of a submarine for what seems like a journey of like several hundred miles. Sure, I'm like, I don't know. The rules of this world are very unclear. I mean probably a little bit on purpose. Where like there's one point where Indiana Jones gets literally shot, but it doesn't seem to slow and by that much. He gets shot and then punched in that bullet wound, right, and then he's like I'm fine, and he like later he's like, aoie, but give me a little kiss. It's like this, but whatever, it's an action movie, right. So then we arrive at the island where So this scene is interesting because in many action movies, the female lead is tied up at the end um usually so the male hero can save her. But an interesting thing happens in this movie where the male hero is also tied up and ends up being very passive during the climax of the movie. It's so weird how shares goes really steals. I thought that was interesting as well. I mean, and it ends up kind of, I guess, being a wash because no one really does anything. You kind of just trapped and they're like, well, just don't open your eyes and let's just power through the end of this movie. Yeah, it's kind of I don't know. I mean, I guess I don't feel one way or another. It's not as bad as like the normal Tolby mcguarth throwing Kurs and Duns out of the frame, or it's not as bad as specific Rim where the female protagonists launched out of the final scene via submersible, or like in Twilight whenever Bella's one's like I'm just going to pass out for the climax of my own story right, or the time she likes sleeps for three months because a breakup. I don't know, but I think ultimately it just ends up being just kind of an unusual choice to disable both of your protagonasts for the sure, I mean, I guess that. I mean, I'm grateful for the world that we have those face melting, head exploding shots. I'm glad that ghost looks like share. I guess that you don't really need anything outside of that. I don't know that was that was kind of I mean, yeah, because of the Nazis bring their own demise upon themselves, so it was interesting, not not a usual climax to an action movie. So I would say my overall thoughts on her participation in the story, what's her participation grade, Well, it's it's not very high. She she needs to be saved no less than probably five times throughout the story, if not more. She is I would say, more act of and kind of more headstrong than a lot of female characters in similar roles in similar movies. But that's not saying much because usually women don't get to do anything in these types of stories. And I think when it comes down to it, there's a lot of pluses to this character, but ultimately the writing of her is very inconsistent where the movie doesn't know how much they want or there and when she's there, the rules of how much she's allowed to participate it seemed to be very limited. I don't know that I could stay as sistinctly what she wants, Like what does this character want besides to not work at a dive bar? Like there? We don't really know, like where the goals for Indiana Jones couldn't be more clear, to the point where it's like I wish there was a little more but with Mary and it's like, well, what does she want? And I don't think that the movie really gives that a lot of consideration. Oh not at all. Yeah, I mean most kind of you know, romantic interests aren't given any sort of specific goal, especially you know, action movies like this. Some of them do and that's and that's great, and I think that should happen more often. But yeah, the movie doesn't give it a second thought. So speaking of their romantic relationship, here we here, we go there, I mean, I don't there's multiple ways to interpret it. Is the best I can say. Where sometimes when people say child, they mean a younger version of a person, because she says, I mean, it's also unclear how old her character is supposed to be. I think the actress is about thirty, but I don't know how old her character is supposed to be. But she references ten years since they first hooked. So let me break this down the scene where they first interact on screen together in the movie, which is when Indiana Jones walks into her bar in Nepal. She says, Indiana Jones, I always knew someday you'd come walking back through my door. What are you doing here in Nepal? And he says, I need one of the pieces your father collected, and then she punches him in the face, right, which is another That was the other thing I wanted to cite as like not like the other girl's move. Yeah, well, let me talk about that real quickly, because I would say in movies that it's like, oh, she's not like the other girls. There are other women too put her up against. And because there are no other women, I don't think the movie is actively doing that. I'll counter that with the type of character India's, which is, you know, I think it's made clearaters very early on, like he's the eternal bachelor type character. And why is he an eternal bachelor because he can't find a woman who can match him, you know, And so that's I think little things like that are meant to indicate, like here, like Indiana finally meets his match. I don't know. It sounds like that sort of tapers off as the series goes along, but as far as I can tell, because this is the only Indiana Jones movie besides The Child a Buff Bonus one that I've seen, and to me, it seems like the character was like, you know, he's like in his late thirties and is still single, unusual especially for the thirties, and it's like he's just he's a he's a professional, and he doesn't have time for relationships and unless it's some lady who can really keep up with him, so that I don't know, Yeah, I see that. Um okay, So back to back to this what's about to become a very upsetting conversation. So she punches him. She says, I learned to hate you in the last ten years. He says, I never meant to hurt you. She says, I was a child, I was in love. It was wrong and you knew it. He says, you knew what you were doing. It's not good. He says, look, I did what I did. You don't have to be happy about it, but maybe we can help each other out now. And then she's like visibly exasperated, and she says, do you know what you did to me? To my life? This is the scene that plays out on screen. Let's examine a conversation between the director Steven Spielberg, George Lucas, who is sort of the creative mastermind will say behind the movies, and Lawrence Kasden, the screenwriter of the film honestly rather than not. But we have we must. So this is a kind of spitballing meeting that they're having. They recorded it, and then this is from the transcript of the recording. So so I'll be kasidin, you'd be George Lucas, and I'll be Spielberg. Okay, I'm going to pretend Kasiden is British, so watch out everybody. So Kasdin says, I like it if they already had a relationship at one point, because then you don't have to build it. Org Lucas says, I was thinking that this old guy could have been his his mentor he could have known this little girl when she was just a kid, hadn't a fair there when she was eleven and he was fulty two. He hasn't seen her in twelve years. Now she's twenty two. It's a real strange relationship. Spielberg says, she'd better be older than twenty two. Lucas says he's thirty five, and he knew her ten years ago when he was twenty five and she was only twelve. Lucas is stuck on twelve. He says it would be amusing to make her slightly young at the time Spielberg and promiscuous she came on to him. Lucas says, fifteen is a right on the edge. I know it's an outrageous idea, but it is interesting. Once she's sixteen or seventeen, it's not interesting anymore. But if she was fifteen and he was twenty five, and they actually had an affair the last time they met, and she was madly in love with him, and he she has pictures of him, says Spielberg, and the conversation, My god, that is George Lucas. So Lucas wanted him. He negotiates, He's like, fine, I guess we can't do a of in but I'm not going above fifteen like Jesus Christ. So it is unclear what they settled on because they never articulate what actual age Marion rave Wentz character is. Karen Allen was thirty at the time of the movies, but I'm assuming the character is supposed to be playing younger, right, So because Harrison four is always supposed to be playing younger, and and because she says I was a child it was wrong and you knew it because she says that to Indiana Jones, I'm guessing they went with the fifteen narrative, but not over literally sets the parameter of like she cannot be of consenting age or it's not hot. That's literally what he says, right, it's it's horrifying. So my guess is she is a teenager. She's fifteen. Also, it is unclear what happened between them, but I think we can assume that they had sex and that he statutory raped her. Everything I could find in the original marketing and reviews of this movie referred to them as former lovers. I think it's safe to say that's insane. I was. I was so ready to give a little leeway. God, God, George Lucas, you fucking freak. So this is horrifying this once you realize this, because it recontextualizes their whole relationship, because we realize that Indiana Jones is a statutory rapist and that he had sex with a child, and she is the love interest for the rest of the movie. She agrees to keep hanging out with her rapist. And then this is a trauma. This is literally a trauma victim who he shows up after ten years and burns her building down. So, okay, recontextualize. This is a full on nightmare. Yeah, where you're your rapist shows up after ten years. Now he's a successful archaeologist, he's learned to read. He and then he refuses, like if someone you've raped is kidnapped by Nazis and you're the only one who can save them, save them her own rape, hast refused to save her from Nazis. Yeah, and and schoofy is Okay. She cares for him and kisses him and they are in love at the end. And the end in the fourth movie, The Fucking Piece of Ship that is a Kingdom in the Crystal Skull, they get married at the end. Okay, Yeah, this, uh who Okay, So the child line was red flag, but I I sort of instinctively gave it a pass of like she was she's clearly younger than him, but I didn't think it was a literal rape situation. I thought it was like she was. I. I mean, I guess I'm giving Georgia the costumes credit and like she's between the ages of like seventeen and twenty one where she's naive, but it's not a crime. She was a consenting party to this. But that is not well shit wells. And here's what is also extremely upsetting to me that as a kid who's watching this movie all the way up until I would say a few years ago, the implications of that conversation did not even register with me. So no, I didn't. I bet that with most people they did, it wouldn't. Yeah, I didn't notice them as being probably like that whole conversation. Didn't notice it as being problematic until probably like four years ago, and then I was like, oh my god, Indiana Jones, my hero is a statutory rapist. And I didn't think anything of it until recently. Sentence that, Yeah, that is very that is bone chilling, and it just goes to show how strongly ape culture is ingrained in just culture everything, and how movies like this reinforced and normalize rape culture, and and and and that conversation alone should be like studied because it's so it's such a weird enabling conversation where Lucas is clearly the one pushing the narrative of like, no younger, younger, younger, and then the other guys are like, well, maybe like older, and then he's like, nah, not legal though, and then by the end they've sort of become complicit of like, okay, not legal but not eleven. Like it's just such your duds enabling other dudes kind of conversation where yeah, there's one guy who's clearly the wrongest. Damn George Lucas, Holy shit. I mean, I knew you wouldn't allow more than one woman to appear in your movie is prior to two thousand and fifteen, but this is a this is a loop. I am deeply disturb by this. So all of my just for clarity, all of my notes on Marian were taken without this clear knowledge. Yes, right, but that's sort of how I experienced this movie. I think a lot of people experienced this movie where you're like, oh, you know, he's he's condescending. He might neg her every now and then, and we know that there's some history to their relationship, but overall he's punches Nazis, so he can't be a bad guy. And then you find out about this conversation and then you realize that she's intended to be probably fifteen at best, and the Indiana Jones is a statutory rapist. Can we talk a little bit about the Indiana Jones school of masculinity? Yes, Um, it's weird because I don't think that his character brings anything to the table of toxic masculinity that is necessarily new or even unfamiliar to most of a movie audience. Um, but it really does hit all the points where he has his no home a moment, a staple of toxic masculine characters. He has a moment where he outright refuses to be emotionally vulnerable in front of both a woman and a male friend, which I think is like a quality of toxic masculinity that isn't spoken frequently enough about. Of like he can't even be honest with his own male friend because he's just so whatever. There is countless moments where he's straight up the game, nagging, nagging, nagging, and it works. It happens even worse in the second movie and Temple of Doom. Well, and that the second movie is the one where his love interest tries to leave at the end and he whips her. It is like no, and she's like, I love you. One of the most most insane. I haven't seen that full movie. I've seen that scene a million times and it hurts my feelings. I feel personally attacked by that scene. Yeah, I mean it seems subtler in this but all the action, like nothing is subverted by Indiana Jones. In terms of masculinity. It sounds like maybe some action hero tropes are subverted by him at this time in history. I would say the main one is that he's also an academic, so like, you know, he's he's a he's a rugged. Well here's he like makes mistakes. That was something that I read was like that he doesn't do everything perfectly every time. It makes some more relatable. Yeah, like, for instance, he's a rapist and you know he's imperfect. But that's the thing though, like he is so many people's idea of what like an awesome male hero is in a story to the extent that I did kind of a little. I sourced it out to Facebook and I said, what are your thoughts on Indiana Jones as a character, especially earlier in your life? And I had to respond is from people saying I had the biggest crush on him. I wanted to be exactly like him. I studied archaeology or anthropology in college because of him. I went to the University of Chicago because he went there. I but he is such an iconic hero to so many people because he is sort of like the height of He's handsome, he's got a cool outfit. He punches people, and he whips his whip around. He rides horses, he drives trucks. You know, he's doing all this stuff. But he's also he cleans up real nice and he's a professor. He can self puzzles. He's pragmatic, you know, so it's like all these he has a sense of humor. He's very smooth with women. Think this exact same conversation with some small alterations apply to har and Solo, where it's the same like rugged, constantly nagging women hero and again I think that part of the reason these characters get away with being the way they are outside of clearly the time they were written in is because the villains are so egregiously bad that you don't notice, like you'll you'll give the hero a pass on literally anything if they defeat War two Nazis, like, yeah, of course we're going to root for someone to punch Nazis. However, because the bad guys are so bad, I think that it just conditions and audience to not examine the hero really at all, or like let him get away with far more than if you know. And these aren't my favorite movies either, but like the Nolan Batman movies, you think more about like is Batman actually that good of a guy because he and the villains he's up against are more frequently his equals and have more nuance, And when both sides are you know, presented with nuance, you will examine your hero. But that's not the approach this movie takes at all. This movie doesn't really want you to examine the hero too much. He looks nice and he punches Nazis and that's all they need you to know. So that realization really puts a damper on how much you can really like Indiana Jones as a character. So there's a lot to reconcile with this for me, and I would hope for other huge fans of this movie because on the surface, it, you know, just seems like a cool action movie where there's this like this rugged, handsome guy who's punching Nazis and and he's saving the world and all this stuff, and then is a red flag if he's in the movie in a leading role, it's a red flag. And especially we refer you to the pop culture detective video essay entitled Predatory Romance and Harrison Ford Movies, which examines how people specially young men watching primarily I believe Star Wars, Indiana Jones, and boy Bade Runner. But those are three huge fucking franchises that are to some extent all still around today, and Harrison Ford is still involved in all of them and no one cares. So that's fun and I love that. Shall we Shall we talk about the use of brown face in this I hear and I wonder if you can confirm this for me that this movie of the three is not the most egregious one correct, That would definitely go to Doom. We would need to do an entirely other episode on Temple of Doom just to unpack every horrible, problematic, racist thing that happens there. But this movie, which I also didn't quite fully realize until watching this on Amazon Prime, and it does that fun little thing where like the actor who's in the scene will pop up and it shows what character they're playing, and then you click on that that guy and then you see, oh wait, this person he's white and he's not playing a white person. The same for I believe he's credited in the movie as Arab swordsman. Yeah, that is also a white man in a very egregious instance of brown face. Let me just kind of quickly go through the different locations and the racist stuff that happens at each one. So characters who are not white in this movie are either usually played by white people or are just background extras. They're not given any significant screen time or characterization or anything like that. Um, And nearly every scene in this movie takes place in a country whose population is made up of mostly non white people. So keep that in mind. So first we open, We're in South America. What country in South America? He doesn't give enough to tell you it doesn't care. The presentation of and I'm pretty sure they are referred to as natives in this scene is ridiculous. It's like, it's just they go to such lengths to make the indigenous people of they don't care what country, seem like they don't have minds of their own. They will do whatever. The first white guy who comes along says, they're they're made to be dumb. They're made to stylistically look very primitive in a way that even forties is not at all. I mean, I guess we don't know where we are, so how could we know? It could be deep in the Amazon where you know, Western culture hasn't reached this tribe, but they're made to seem like there. It's it's it's glorified set dressing, which comes up again and again in all movies. But like, yeah, like the indigenous people of wherever we happen to be are largely treated as set dressing, as people to be killed by Indiana Jones. Boy does Indiana Jones kill a lot of brown people in this movie. Blankets stated, not even getting into brown face. It's awful, and also his whole objective is to take something from their culture and bring it back to Western white America. So then we are in Nepal and all of the native Nepalese characters are in the background. There are no major speaking roles for them. All of the major speaking roles are relegated to white people. There is a character who is credited as Ratty Nepalese. Awesome. He is played by a white man named Malcolm Weaver in Yellow Face Better. There's also a character called Mean Mongolian. He I didn't do enough research on that character, but the fact that there's a character called mean Mongole what else do you need to know other than it's It's just I mean. And then his best friend Sala is one of the most agreed to choices, playing a Welsh white man named John Reese Davies. Um. He later plays Gimli. That's true, literally gimlely playing a non white character. Awesome. Also, don't forget he made a bunch of anti Muslim remarks in two thousand four. He is also a Brexitter, so he and then we've got the Arab swordsman. Um, I'm sorry really quick for Salau. The John Yes, Darby Dave Davies. John Es Davies keep trying to not say that, and I said it. John Reith Davies was not the first choice for Salo. Do you know who the first choice for Salo was? Was it another wiker? Daniel de Vito was the first choice for Salo loss for the culture? Um? Yeah, And then there's some confusing ones. I think alf Molina exists in an uncanny valley of this world where he is of Spanish Italian descent, but you know he's playing a South American character, so you know he's still of exclusively European descent, and the character he's playing seems to be a native of South America, I think, without a question, and is also falling into sort of that trope of like the selfish, tricky native who he is presented as a guide, a subordinate of Indiana Jones. And then the first chance he gets, he's he's a liar and a cheat and he's going to sneak off and he'll be punished and killed. And that is exactly what happens, just for a moment of levity. For Millina was born in Paddington, London. I know he said it before. It's worth repeating, Wait, I didn't know that he really, he's frosts are past. It's part of why he's so pure. Oh my god, born in Paddington. But Alfred Molina loves marmalade sandwiches. I get along really well with geminis. This makes so much sense anyways, So I do feel a little better after saying that out loud. So if you yeah, the situation with Alfred Molina, it would appear that he is in brown face as well. I would. I would argue he is in brown face. And that seems to be almost a blanket rule of this movie, with possibly a few small exceptions of brown people of often unclear. We don't always know where we are when we do people that are actually from there, our sidelined and brown people was speaking roles are white people in brown face? Correct? Uh? And then in the scenes in Cairo especially, there's a whole fight that breaks out where a bunch of Arab people are attacking Indiana Jones for reasons that have never entirely been clear to me. Yeah, but it makes it seem like, oh, the people are just so violent that if they see a Westerner they're just going to freaking try to hit him right, which is another like common I think that even goes back to like a stereotype that's referenced in at and like the first line of Aladdin where it's like where they cut off your ear if they don't like your face. Just irrational violence, which is just fearmongering for Western white America is Indiana Jones is justified in stealing from these people and killing these people and ruining their history because they're bad and they are stupid and they don't know what they're doing. It's bad because then we cut to the scene where they're as a character who is credited as Arab Swordsman and he's, you know, slinging a sword around. We're saying the one who gets shot. He yeah, he gets shot because Harrison Ford had diary at that day and couldn't do the fight choreography movie Magic. I hate it. I hate it so but hey, you guessed it. That character of the Arab Swordsman is played by he's white white guy named Terry Richards. One of the only non white characters who speaks is Katanga, who, for Harry Potter fans also plays Kingsley shock Ball. Yes he dies. I didn't put that together. But totally um, well worth noting about that is that, yeah, so they're on the boat. We see several black Africans on this boat. They are the few people of color with speaking roles. But guess what they're pirates are They're still bad guys. I mean, I mean, yeah, pirates, you know, the ones known for raping and stealing. Uh. Not to be fair, Indiana Jones is known for those two things as well. Uh so really, perhaps they're just cut of the same cloth. But yeah, it's like, Okay, these are only these are the only non white characters that we were allowing to speak, and they're like, hey, let's sell the only female character into prostitution. Well, yeah, you know, I can't remember when I was like there's some nuance to this. I honestly no longer feel that way. Yeah, feel that way that I've got. Really there's a there's a storm brewing in my head about I mean, yeah, I I mean, and I have no attachment to these so it's yeah, yeah, um. A few lost things I wanted to bring up is that, as with many action movie franchises, the hero gets older, but the love interests stay the same age or in some case as they get younger. So talking strictly about the actors that play the female leads in these movies, so not the character's ages, but the actor's ages. At the time Raiders of the Last Arc comes out, Harrison Ford is thirty nine years old. Karen Allen is thirty not the worst, not not too big of an age difference, a nine year age difference, not not too bad. Now in Temple of Doom, Kate cap shot thirty one. Um, but Harrison Ford is forty two, so he's now eleven years older than her. Here's the real kicker, Alison Duty actor who she plays the female lead in The Last Crusade. Now she eleven or she's twelve? She is was never clear. Harrison Ford is forty seven hot, Alison Duty is twenty three. So oh I, I'm exhausted. The one exception is in Crystal Skull when Karen Allen reprises her role as Marion raven Wood and she and Indiana Jones get married, and that is that. But um, sure there's I mean, we don't have time to talk about all the problematic elements of the other Indiana Jones movies. Rest assured there are many, and I don't know, if we'll do episodes on them in the future, we'll see. But there's a lot to unpack there as well. Yeah, this so overall, I think, honestly, like the discussion of this movie has made me like it less. I started off on the fence, and now I'm off the fence on the side of I don't ever want to see this movie again. Well, that's what happens because when you just watch something at face value and you forget about all the problematic things that go into the development and the making of these movies because you're not aware of that because you're just watching the movie. You're having a good time. There's punching, and there's action scenes, and there's big step pieces, and it's a story that I would argue is fairly well crafted. There is, you know, the cinema thought was put into it. I mean it was like, how old was the character when Arison Ford first fucked? Or was she eleven? Or was she twelve? There's a lot of stuff to unpack. George Lucas is known for his world buildings, so this level of attention to perverted detail really admirable. I want to throw a brick at someone. I'm like, what the fuck, dude? Yes, so happy one episode we started in such high spirits. Okay, let's does it pass well real quick? Uh, A few last things. If anyone who's is paying attention to the anagrams of of my name, Caitlin Durante, I've got a few relevant ones for this movie to just to bring some levity back to the conversation. So for this one, you have to suspend your disbelief for the spelling of the plural of the word tarantula, and you have to assume that it's tarantula laid on me. If you recall the scene where Alfred Molina is covered in Tarantula's um, just consider that the name Caitlin Darante anagrams too nice tarantula D. So yeah, some tarantulas. We got some good dick out there, and they're they're so okay. So that trrent okay, So we're okay, Yeah, we should be acknowledging tarrant D. Yeah, tarrantual i D. And then even more relevant is the fact that Caitlin Darante anagrams to Indiana clutter. So there's a whole clutter of problematic ship that happens in Indiana Jones. Perhaps more pertinent than everything is that this movie does not pass the battle test. No, it comes closer than I thought too, because there is a quick scene where Salah's wife says to Mary, his wife, his wife, they're at Salah's house. There's a monkey there. Marian says, what an adorable creature. Sala's wife says, then it shall be welcome in our house. Marian says, no, you don't have to keep it here just because of me. The thing is, we do not learn Sala's wife's name, so that conversation does not pass. I checked. Yeah, yeah, that's a that's a miss. Honestly, I would be more upset if it did, by you know, the skin of its teeth. I think that it's it is for the best that it doesn't, right because there are so The only scene where you see a clutter of women, if you will, we move in clutters is the scene at the very beginning when he is in his classroom, and because he's such a man's man and a ladies man, the only people taking his class are a clutter of women, and one of them even has I Love you written across her eyelids. So um, it just it's like, Oh, look, how cool Indiana Jones is he? I wonder if he ever abuses that power dynamics. Oh wait, I guess. I guess. Also, there is a queer icon in this movie, and that is boy who gives Dr Jones and apple as he's dismissing class. So I think queer icon boy that he moved on doesn't doesn't pass. Honestly, I'm glad it doesn't pass. I wasn't tread. I'm not trying to give this movie any more points. Well, speaking of, let's write, all right, the hundred nipple bestow upon. Okay, I'm gonna give this one quarter nipple if you just isolate Marion's character. And we say this for a lot of action movies where if you isolate the one female character, she seems fairly smart and competent and capable, and if she was given her own movie that she was the hero of, she could probably do a pretty good job. However, because she is a grape victim and framed pretty much only as the romantic interest with no other real involvement in the story, Because she is put in situations where she has damseled several times, you know she's she's held captive and she has to be saved, and the few times we see her doing something active in the story, it doesn't really make that much of a dent because it's usually Indiana Jones pushing the story forward. And the fact that when the people who were developing this story thought that she should be eleven whenever Indiana Jones had sex with her and then completely ignored the fact that it's so obvious that men wrote this because yeah, they don't even consider that she is a rape victim who then, according to the story, later goes on adventures with him and then later marries him. I have an ulcer like I I can. I can no longer endure what this movie is foisting upon us. Yeah, it's real upsetting, and the fact that there's just so much brown face and yellow face and the way that indigenous cultures and the way that non white people are treated in this movie is just horrendous. And this, honestly, I love us. I love our show. I love the hundredth episode. I feel like kind of sick to my stomach right now. This makes me genuinely like it's it's just so frustrated how little so many cultures have to latch onto as media that they can stand by with a clear conscience. Uh, and that's sort of what our show maybe, I mean, I guess we're ending kind of on a somber note. I'm giving it, I'll give I'll give it a quarter nipple as well. Uh for letting a woman exist within very specific parameters that white female, hetero rape victim can exist in this world. But that aside, and I'm giving it to the tarantula. Uh, but that aside, I mean, or a hundredth episode. On a somber note, it really is like some some days it's it sucks just to think of I mean, and it is fun and at least interesting to navigate. Okay, this is for you. I mean, this is a piece of media that meant a lot to you and influenced you. I think I became as interested in anthropology as I am because of these movies. There you go, and so it's like, there are you can race positive effects that this piece of media has had in your life, and that is like worth exploring. And and so it's kind of impossible because media shapes who we are so much. It's it's it is impossible to completely divorce yourself from a piece of media, because it's already shaped who you are in some ways. And then like looking at in the face is super important and we need to do it. But sometimes it's just like I need a mice hard lemonade, which I didn't mean what if this was an ad? This is just a two hour way down That's what I grab. You know what a world too? Oh I do? I feel a little bit sick. It's just it's upsetic. Everyone has so little to feel good about, and the things that we turn to to feel good about are also bad. So cheers to a hundred. Maybe this is the burden we bear though. As the host of the Bechtel Cast, puke, We're we're going to get more golfs trivia. I'm going to cause plays, Luke. So I'm gonna I'm gonna go full Paris tonight. I'm gonna be just gonna be like on it. I'm gonna be a student. I love my homework. Let's get out of here, honestly, thank you for listen. We love our We love you guys. Oh, I guess let's send the episode as we normally would. Yeah, let's okay, let's take a deep breath everyone with us, And yes, there's a lot to be upset about, especially in regards to this film that I unfortunately still enjoy and we'll watch, but because it's like it's a part of you, it's a part of me. But I guess feel comforted in acknowledging and recognizing how problematic it is. And I hope it didn't shape me for the worst. It's kind of hard to tell sometimes the impact that media has on you. I did take four anthropology classes in college because I loved these movies so much. But I it's listen. I mean, Tanya Harding is my hero, used to be my hero, and she's like, alt right, we all have our crosses, she's not she's all lives matter, she's whatever. Whatever. Everyone has these things, and it's just we encourage you to just have conversations about it and don't feel guilty or like you have to bear the burden of something that shaped you when you were very young. It's understandable, it happens to us all. But also don't shy away from having the discussion. And uh, you know, if if you're not sober and you're you're you're willing to uh you know, crack open a Mike's hard when you have these discussions, we we hear the battle can't occur to that enough. This is a whole two hour episode has been an advertisement for my talk Lemonade. Thank you so much for listening to the backtel Thank you. You can follow us on Twitter, Instagram, and Facebook at betel Cast. You can rate and review us on iTunes or wherever you get your podcast. You can go to our website becktelcast dot com and we would highly recommend I. If you enjoyed this episode, if you enjoyed just the gals, the gals kicking it and unpacking some stuff, we encourage you to sign up for our Patreon ak Matreon that is Patreon dot com slash becktel Cast. For five bucks a month. You get too full sized bonus episodes with just Caitlin and myself in a more kind of like chill format. It's cash usually we're literally so it's also hot, so when you think about it, you're silly not to sign up. That's so true, Jamie. And also we are going to be doing a couple live shows on the East Coast coming up. We're gonna be doing a mini East Coast tour starting with Saturday, November three, We're going to be in Philadelphia at the Good Good Comedy Theater. Then on Sunday, November four, we're going to be in Washington, d C. More details to come with that show. And on Monday, November five, we are going to be in New York City as a part of the New York Comedy Festival. We're doing a show at Baby's All Right in Brooklyn, So we'll be posting updates and ticket links on our social media and on our website Backtelcast dot com. Go to the live appearances tab and we will have more details posted there. Also, we have another live show in Los Angeles at The Ruby on Saturday, November ten at nine pm, so keep abreast of the information via I did via our Twitter and Instagram. We will post the updates there. And I'm going to be in Boston doing stand up from October seventeenth through the two so check out my website Caitlin n dot com slash shows for more details on that. I'm also going to be teaching a screenwriting workshop on October at Improv Boston, so come on down to that if you want to learn from someone who does have a master's degree in screenwriting from Boston University. But again, I hate to bring it up. Check that out. Check out our live shows if we're coming to a city near you and we would love to see you there. Yeah. I think that about does it. Also, one last thing, go to our merch store t public dot com slash feedback doecast. You can buy and send us your picks. We love seeing your picks wearing the march. That makes us very happy. Yes, we love. We love posting it to our indeed, so yeah, grab your feminist icon, queer, i, et cetera, shirts, notebooks, phone cases, mugs, anything you want on TI Public and Jamie, thank you so much once again for being here with me. Thank you for being my friend, and thank you for helping the world navigate through this hellscape with your many pages of notes and your color coding. And I love you. I love you. Let's go to Gilmore Girls trivia. Do it right everyone, Bye,