E316- A Complete Walk Through- How To Stop Severe Leash Reactivity

[SPEAKER_00]: Hello, no bad dog army.
[SPEAKER_00]: Welcome back to the podcast.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is an excellent podcast if you're dealing with leash reactivity.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is a breed that I don't ever get, which is a good thing, which is why I tell people maybe they should start looking to this breed.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's an air delterior with pretty bad leash reactivity.
[SPEAKER_00]: Again, as you guys know, I would never put out anything that I didn't think was helpful for you guys or to repetitive.
[SPEAKER_00]: So this is all really good information.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I hope you enjoy it.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you guys don't know, I'm going to be an England next month in September.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to be in Australia and New Zealand in November.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm going to do a seminar at my facility.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm also doing a e-caller seminar at the Upstate Canyon Academy, all the information from my seminars.
[SPEAKER_00]: and workshops are listed in the description below.
[SPEAKER_00]: Enjoy the podcast and thanks for listening.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's the seven year old air deal.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I always tell people get airdales because I don't hear, I don't hear any problems with them.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I've worked with them briefly, but I don't see them a lot, which is good.
[SPEAKER_03]: What's good for many reasons, and it doesn't mean that they're not over bread.
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, this is my
[SPEAKER_03]: One, two, three, four, fifth, male airdale.
[SPEAKER_03]: He is my first that has been reactive.
[SPEAKER_03]: All the others have been sweetheart.
[SPEAKER_03]: Ripley, I got him as a puppy, the breeder that I've had forever.
[SPEAKER_03]: And he was a showdog.
[SPEAKER_03]: I had him show.
[SPEAKER_03]: find myself somewhat responsible because rather than trying to socialize him before he was shown, I kind of sheltered him a bit and it was also just before COVID hit.
[SPEAKER_03]: And so he was a little shy around people.
[SPEAKER_03]: He was fine in the ring with two thousand other dogs around with the handler
[SPEAKER_03]: But as soon as I picked him up, he was very protective.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's gotten to the, well, it's definitely gotten to the point.
[SPEAKER_03]: He's not put with people and he's not good, obviously with other dogs.
[SPEAKER_03]: So it's very difficult to walk him.
[SPEAKER_03]: In fact, I very rarely walk him.
[SPEAKER_03]: He stays in our backyard.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I exercise him that way.
[SPEAKER_03]: He's a sweet dog around the family.
[SPEAKER_03]: My husband and me.
[SPEAKER_03]: He's very cautious to the point of, I don't trust him around my grandkids.
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_03]: And the other point is, and God forbid anything happens, but if something were to happen to me, and I'm alone, nobody could come in to help.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's how, yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: So as I said, I need, in fact, I had not signed up, but I guess you're a assistant, Alicia, Alicia.
[SPEAKER_00]: Alyssa, Alyssa.
[SPEAKER_03]: Alyssa sent me the two dates in one in July, one in August, and unfortunately, both of them did not work for us.
[SPEAKER_03]: Because we live up in Lake George.
[SPEAKER_03]: They have a house there.
[SPEAKER_03]: So for me, it would have been easy to go down each day.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: How is it?
[SPEAKER_03]: We had a house full of family and I couldn't take Ripley up.
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_03]: Tell it.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: So I just, and in the other part with him, the poor guy, she is trying to think the word I would use, frightened of thunderstorms, certain smells.
[SPEAKER_03]: If we use the grill outside, he won't go outside, because Mel has a loud noise.
[SPEAKER_03]: He gets very anxious.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, that's normal dog's getting anxious from the, you know, the thunderstorms and the fireworks and that's a normal
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, and typically George, you know, we always have a lot of work.
[SPEAKER_03]: And yeah, and interestingly enough, our nine-year-old Eradale female just recently this past year has started to get angry about fireworks and she was never that way.
[SPEAKER_03]: So I don't out that with him that I can control.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's just the whole idea of not being able to take him for a walk.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so what's going on explained to me?
[SPEAKER_00]: What type of reaction is it?
[SPEAKER_00]: Is it consistent?
[SPEAKER_00]: Is it with dogs?
[SPEAKER_00]: Is it with people?
[SPEAKER_00]: What are you doing right now?
[SPEAKER_00]: What equipment are you using?
[SPEAKER_00]: Go over that.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_03]: He initially, when I tried to do this a couple of years ago, actually, after he finished, well, he finished way back.
[SPEAKER_03]: So I shouldn't use that in the excuse.
[SPEAKER_03]: He now is food driven.
[SPEAKER_03]: I do take my treats out with me.
[SPEAKER_03]: If we're walking, if he sees a dog coming, he gets very tense one day.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, yeah, I'm always just, I can't imagine you even sleep.
[SPEAKER_03]: I've sensed from my handler, I have shown, I have one of those slip collars for him.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yep.
[SPEAKER_03]: had the slip going sideways so that I pull it this way.
[SPEAKER_00]: Is it a slip collar or is it a slip leash?
[SPEAKER_03]: Sorry.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm sorry.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_03]: And so I can control him that way and I talked to him and depending if it's a person that's coming on the other side of the street, I will sit him down and talk to him, feed him
[SPEAKER_03]: and let him watch this person go by.
[SPEAKER_03]: With a dog, it really just depends.
[SPEAKER_03]: If the dog does not respond to Ripley, he may be okay.
[SPEAKER_03]: But the minute that other dog makes any sound, then he pulls.
[SPEAKER_00]: Is he bark?
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_03]: And it's a nasty bark.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_00]: Is he intact?
[SPEAKER_03]: No, not anymore.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_03]: Once he finished his championship, we took care of that.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_00]: So if another dog is neutral and doesn't engage with him, then he is.
[SPEAKER_00]: He might be okay.
[SPEAKER_03]: In fact, one, and, and, and I'm sure you've dealt with it where the other side
[SPEAKER_03]: may think this is fun and it's usually laboratories that do this almost and understandably they want to play or whatever and that just triggers him automatically you know he just wants to chew that dog up so I do I find myself and I'm he probably feels my anxiety I will if I see the dog coming I start tensing myself and I will
[SPEAKER_03]: talk to him, but he probably feels my body language as well.
[SPEAKER_03]: So he's aware.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, and if you're, yeah, and if you're, the big thing with that is, is we tend to condition our dogs to react.
[SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, they feel your tense, but they feel a difference.
[SPEAKER_00]: So you're walking, enjoying your walk, you see a dog, and then all of a sudden you're tied in the leash and you're talking.
[SPEAKER_00]: So then the dogs looking at you and feeling this, I want the text to deal.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then they see the dog.
[SPEAKER_00]: And so sometimes we can compound the reactivity and make it worse because they're saying, so yeah, they can feel that your tense because you tell them, like it's not like a
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, they're detecting heart rates.
[SPEAKER_00]: They're just, you're telling them, you're cranking up on the leash and now you're, it's okay.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, so you have your slip leash on.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, I have, you know, been working now with leash reactivity for quite a bit time and I have a reactive dog myself.
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's given me a lot more insight because now, you know, I specialize in leash reactivity and it's my bread and butter and now I have a hundred and fifty pound leash reactive dog that I get the sharper my tools with every day.
[SPEAKER_00]: And so, and here's the thing is, and I wanted to share this with you because I think it's helpful and insightful, in my opinion, is
[SPEAKER_00]: So I got him.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's an intact marble.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a it's a type of a mast.
[SPEAKER_00]: They're very protective breed.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's why I got him.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's a hundred fifty pounds.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's all muscle.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's low to the ground.
[SPEAKER_00]: Just like his built for pulling cars basically this dog.
[SPEAKER_00]: So the thing is is his lineage is protective his they are I don't know you and I'm gonna protect you the day I brought him home at eight weeks when he was just a little loaf of bread.
[SPEAKER_00]: He backed my Dutch shepherd up.
[SPEAKER_00]: So that's his base that's his genetics.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's never bitten another dog my other shepherd now will
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, correct them and hammer into him and he cries and runs away.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's a big baby, really.
[SPEAKER_00]: But but he's reactive and he's strong.
[SPEAKER_00]: And so I deal with it inconsistently with him.
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's the thing is it depends on the dog.
[SPEAKER_00]: So if here here's my I just want to walk you through like what I do with him.
[SPEAKER_00]: And the reason why I'm telling you this mainly is because sometimes you can't
[SPEAKER_00]: Once you get a dog and you, and the airdels aren't historically reactive dogs by any stretch, but, you know, poor bulls are, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: And these big protective loud, powerful dogs.
[SPEAKER_00]: And so I don't fight with that, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: And so my point is, I think with Ripley, is he probably had developed this, you know, through time, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: Like genetics and other parts.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's nothing you may be have done wrong or
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, some dogs who have been attacked, they've had this trauma.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think that sometimes dogs just develop this.
[SPEAKER_00]: And so your job is to really have realistic expectations and to manage the situation.
[SPEAKER_00]: So that means, could you modify it to it never happen to again, likely not because the success of the reactivity would be, let's just define that.
[SPEAKER_00]: I never want my dog to react again.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, the problem is, is your dog's reaction is predicated of off of other dogs.
[SPEAKER_00]: So same thing with my dog, if if another dog ignores him, he's neutral.
[SPEAKER_00]: He doesn't really care.
[SPEAKER_00]: and but if another dog kind of he's like he's got a really short few so if he's kind of make mess with the boy you get to horn so if they just look at him wrong he's like let's go like that's just his personality you know so so as you're working through this rippling my suggestion would be having a having a handful of exercises and techniques and methods and routines that you can do to
[SPEAKER_00]: Manage the situation so it's not so stressful for everybody involved Because some people reach out and their their hope is is like I just I want to stop the reactivity part of dealing with the leash reactive dog is going to be to stop the reactivity Once they start to build and react I want you to
[SPEAKER_00]: shorten the duration of the reaction.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I don't think it's realistic for you to say, I don't want them to ever react again.
[SPEAKER_00]: It should just be, you know, the shortened distance of the reaction.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now with dogs who are the caveat to that is dogs who are fearful and insecure and just nervous, you actually have more likelihood of getting that behavior to be modified, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: Where they're just like, I don't know what to do.
[SPEAKER_00]: and then you correct them, you show them the right way, act like this, and you get paid, and then they're just like, I know Biggie, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: I worked with the dog today, a couple of drove in from, not couple, father and daughter drove in from Michigan, and they have a dog that just is kind of nervous and secure and doesn't really know what to do, and she's never been corrected, and she's looking around, she's barking at everything, and her stress levels to the roof, I corrected her once or twice, and it was pretty much it.
[SPEAKER_00]: But when you have a dog like Ripley or like my dog Burley, which I'm talking about, it's their genetic makeup to kind of give people the business.
[SPEAKER_00]: They won't back down.
[SPEAKER_00]: They almost look for it, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm sure there's times or Ripley's mind in his business and then somebody kind of barks out of him and he just, yep, it's on party on.
[SPEAKER_00]: And just by judging by what you've told me, I just want to give you a clear road map.
[SPEAKER_00]: So you're more successful.
[SPEAKER_00]: And part of that success is having realistic expectations because that's what kind of screws everything up.
[SPEAKER_00]: So here's what I would do.
[SPEAKER_00]: Having good foundation is huge.
[SPEAKER_00]: So to give you an example, if we want a dog to stop pulling in the leash, we need to teach him heel.
[SPEAKER_00]: So if we want a dog to stop reacting, we have to have a good leave it.
[SPEAKER_00]: So leave it is something that you can work on with food, toys, anything that the dog is interested in.
[SPEAKER_00]: Just having a disengagement command, you can't have that.
[SPEAKER_00]: is really helpful.
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's really easy to start to integrate and work on.
[SPEAKER_00]: All you do is you get their favorite food, put it in a bowl, treats, ball, toy.
[SPEAKER_00]: They put them on a leash, and you start, and you basically do impulse control thresholds.
[SPEAKER_00]: They go, hey, I want that.
[SPEAKER_00]: You leave it, leave it.
[SPEAKER_00]: And eventually, they learn that when you say leave it, they can't have that.
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's just a really
[SPEAKER_00]: an easy way to get into the leave it work.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's a lot of nuances of, well, do you ever let the dog go get it?
[SPEAKER_00]: Is it okay if they get it?
[SPEAKER_00]: Are they never supposed to have it?
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's really discretionary.
[SPEAKER_00]: For me, if I tell a dog to leave it, it's because they have something, I don't want them to have it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Sometimes that's the phrase being the house.
[SPEAKER_00]: But when I go outside, they can have it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Sometimes it's one of my son's toys.
[SPEAKER_00]: Sometimes it's a dog.
[SPEAKER_00]: Sometimes it's a peanut bird jelly sandwich that my kid dropped on the ground.
[SPEAKER_00]: So leave it to me is really just what you're doing.
[SPEAKER_00]: You've got to come off of that.
[SPEAKER_00]: Stop doing that.
[SPEAKER_00]: You can't have that.
[SPEAKER_00]: So it'd be like almost a moving stay.
[SPEAKER_00]: So they see something they go and you say you can't have it and they stop.
[SPEAKER_00]: So leave it is something to start working on.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now the
[SPEAKER_00]: when you have a dog that is strong willed and is determined they tend to sometimes fight through certain corrections and equally I mean we see that you know in humans every day right it's like roll a stop sign nobody you know it's like oh you get pulled over I don't even realize it did it because there's just nobody it's just not a thing right so
[SPEAKER_00]: I guess my point is, is sometimes the juice is worth the squeeze to the dog.
[SPEAKER_00]: So they see the food and they get a correction from a slip, they push right through it.
[SPEAKER_00]: These are the realities that I've learned over the years.
[SPEAKER_00]: And it always comes up in almost every conversation I have with people, because I mainly do behavior modification.
[SPEAKER_00]: And the majority of people who have problems with behavior modification, like the people who drove from Michigan today, the dogs have never been told no.
[SPEAKER_03]: Now Ripley's been told, no.
[SPEAKER_00]: Right, good.
[SPEAKER_00]: But they'd never been told, no, in a way that they care about.
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
[SPEAKER_00]: So the info, so I should rephrase that.
[SPEAKER_00]: They've never been told, no, in a way that they care about.
[SPEAKER_00]: So the enforcement, so let's just just break it down for you.
[SPEAKER_00]: When a dog lunges to get something that they, so put it, and when a dog lunges to get something, rather it's food or react to a dog.
[SPEAKER_00]: their instinct and in their mind and their needs and their wants and their desires is I want this.
[SPEAKER_00]: Rather it's I'm hungry or it's I want to go fight this dog or you know whatever.
[SPEAKER_00]: So that's what they want to do and so when you correct them, punish them and hold them accountable.
[SPEAKER_00]: They have to care about the punishment, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: And if it's just a tap on a shoulder or whatever, and here's the thing is every single dog is different, just like every person is different.
[SPEAKER_00]: Every person's genetic makeup is entirely different.
[SPEAKER_00]: What they eat, what their skin, I mean, everything is different.
[SPEAKER_00]: Every single thing is different.
[SPEAKER_00]: And with dogs, it's really no different than that.
[SPEAKER_00]: So the step before that is a step I'll talk about briefly, but it's just ineffective and not useful in reality, which is why don't we just tell the dog no and then they just stop doing it and then we pay him after.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like, okay, that, that is an option.
[SPEAKER_00]: But, you know, if you told your dog to, here's the reality, you told your dog to leave it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Ripley leave it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Ripley said, nah, I gotta go.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, I'm, I really don't like to start getting close.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's my yard.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's you.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's all the things.
[SPEAKER_00]: So then you said, well, I told the dog leave it and they didn't.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like, do they know it?
[SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.
[SPEAKER_00]: So are they just giving you the bird and saying, I don't care I'm going?
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: So then that's where your discipline comes in, your correction comes in, your accountability comes in.
[SPEAKER_00]: You say, leave it, they push through it, and then you correct them.
[SPEAKER_00]: And so sometimes you kind of go up this ladder.
[SPEAKER_00]: And this is just reality.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I've heard, I've heard different people talk in different camps that that really like to use positive reinforcement only and I've heard them talk about things and
[SPEAKER_00]: It takes them six months to do something that takes somebody else six minutes.
[SPEAKER_00]: And even then, if the dog does push past that threshold of they've been conditioned for so long, I'm just not going to go because I want the food so much.
[SPEAKER_00]: But when you're dealing with different prey drives and different react like a horrible, you're never going to get
[SPEAKER_00]: They're too strong and too powerful and too strong-willed.
[SPEAKER_00]: Once they go, I mean, you need a prong collar, you need something to control that animal because they're so powerful unless you're going to go for a ride.
[SPEAKER_00]: So just think about that with Ripley when you're going through this, this is just one state.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to go through the whole process.
[SPEAKER_00]: But the first thing I like to talk about is
[SPEAKER_00]: telling the dog what you want them to do alternatively so not necessarily saying hey what you stop reacting that's kind of low hanging fruit but it's like okay what do you want them to do well you got to teach them a command you can't just tell them stop no you work on leave it
[SPEAKER_00]: But you have to practice it, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: So it's like somebody who plays on sports, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: They practice the kick, they practice the throw, they practice the hitting, whatever it is.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then in the game, they use it.
[SPEAKER_00]: And you can hear parents and coaches hit it, hit it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, I know what that is, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: That's what I'm applying.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is the skill set that I'm applying here.
[SPEAKER_00]: So when you go out with your dog and you say leave it, they're like, what the hell is that?
[SPEAKER_00]: And oh, by the way, I'm lunging now.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, when you say leave it, the dog needs to register.
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, I'm not supposed to have this.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm supposed to be doing this.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then that way, when you correct them, they know it gives them the power.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's up to you.
[SPEAKER_00]: You either stop or you don't.
[SPEAKER_00]: Right?
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, you're going to make this uncomfortable for yourself unless you stop.
[SPEAKER_03]: Now, just a quick question.
[SPEAKER_03]: When I'm taking, say I take him out into our backyard with Edon.
[SPEAKER_03]: Both sides of our property, there are dogs that are not reaction dogs, one who care less, where Ripley is.
[SPEAKER_03]: The other one will respond only because Ripley has yelled at him, you know, barked at him.
[SPEAKER_03]: If I took him out on a lead and had him sit when say rock would comes out.
[SPEAKER_03]: Is that and then just say leave it with treats is up.
[SPEAKER_03]: Even.
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, that's part of the other thing is just wanting them to be out the backyard and not have him constantly after those two dogs, so I know he can't get to them, but he parks back and forth back and forth.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, well, so that is something you could absolutely do.
[SPEAKER_00]: Here's the thing that I tell my clients every day is you a lot of people don't have the skill sets to achieve what you just said.
[SPEAKER_00]: So that would mean you want your dog to do a behavior, whether it's down or stay or leave it or recall.
[SPEAKER_00]: off leash so it's like that's a big deal right so you're dog's out there and they're just sniffing around Ripley down okay
[SPEAKER_00]: Come, okay.
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
[SPEAKER_00]: So that's a big deal.
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's something, again, most people when they bring up this formula of, well, I got, and it happens, I got this dog, this dog, and it's really the same kind of the same formula is, okay, you want your dog to not respond to these, or, you know, these things, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: So you're going against the dogs, what the dog wants to do.
[SPEAKER_00]: So the dog says, because dogs, you know, when you're dealing with property lines, they don't know that you've bought Matt and that's yours and that's your fence and that's, they just think, where, somebody's in our yard, Mom, what are they doing here?
[SPEAKER_00]: Get them out of here.
[SPEAKER_00]: They don't know, like, you know, when you go out and you flip burgers in your backyard and your neighbors out there, you're not like, what are you doing on my yard?
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like, no, that's theirs.
[SPEAKER_00]: Dogs don't know that.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, so my answer is, is absolutely, you can manually kind of program.
[SPEAKER_00]: what you want your dog to do.
[SPEAKER_00]: But the caveat to that is, is you also have to have the skill sets to accomplish those things in reality.
[SPEAKER_00]: So that's like a level three.
[SPEAKER_00]: So again, I go out with Burley.
[SPEAKER_00]: He sees the Amazon.
[SPEAKER_00]: He sees the garbage trucks.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's so he's doing a dog.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's doing a Ripley.
[SPEAKER_00]: Hey, I'm intrigued.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're not supposed to meet my yard.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're not supposed to become up my driveway.
[SPEAKER_00]: The kids are out.
[SPEAKER_00]: Would he posture it up?
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not going to say, what are you doing?
[SPEAKER_00]: Burley, I'm going to say Burley down.
[SPEAKER_00]: Stay.
[SPEAKER_00]: Amazon guy just walks right by him.
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, so you have to, you know what I mean?
[SPEAKER_00]: So you have to have the, so a lot of people I've been talking about this recently is the stop at syndrome.
[SPEAKER_00]: A lot of dog owners just, you know, like your car's making noise, your computer's not turning on, you just want to fix it.
[SPEAKER_00]: and with dog behavior because it's like kids, it's like, how do I stop this?
[SPEAKER_00]: You gotta work with it and you gotta have alternatives, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: So when my kid screams, I said, you know, we gotta teach, don't just tell them not the scream, I mean, that's an option, but it's not gonna be sustainable.
[SPEAKER_00]: You might holler at him and they stop real quick, but we say, hey, what are you frustrated about?
[SPEAKER_00]: So with Ripley, you can go out Ripley, on leash, Ripley, sit, good.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's a dog.
[SPEAKER_00]: He starts to bark, leave it.
[SPEAKER_00]: You have that application.
[SPEAKER_00]: So the same thing I told you right from the beginning, their conversation is I think it's just having realistic expectations.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think I'm going to train Ripley with anybody.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's no matter who it is.
[SPEAKER_00]: Excuse me, I'm going to train with Ripley and he's not going to bark at dogs anymore.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's more about managing the situation.
[SPEAKER_00]: So the more skill sets you have,
[SPEAKER_00]: And the more that they know it, which would be advanced, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: They can do it in any professional way.
[SPEAKER_00]: So again, ideally, you let Ripley out back.
[SPEAKER_00]: He goes romp on around.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're feeding the flowers or whatever.
[SPEAKER_00]: And boom, there's the next dog.
[SPEAKER_00]: And you, ah, so Ripley goes over there.
[SPEAKER_00]: And he starts running up.
[SPEAKER_00]: You say Ripley come.
[SPEAKER_00]: And he's like, oh, I got to show.
[SPEAKER_00]: He comes back Ripley down.
[SPEAKER_00]: And you're thinking, wow, that would be a dream.
[SPEAKER_00]: The reality is, is all of that is obtainable, but the reason why people fail at that is because they try to do that in that situation.
[SPEAKER_00]: So they try to teach a behavior, the dog isn't that familiar with or knows that well in the most chaotic and hardest situation to learn in.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, alternatively, you would teach the recall outside of the other dog.
[SPEAKER_00]: And a lot of times we just teach it, long line inside, super easy.
[SPEAKER_00]: You say, come, you pay him, come, you pay him, come, you pay him.
[SPEAKER_00]: Then what you do is you put a bowl of food down and inside.
[SPEAKER_00]: You give him a break.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's on his long line.
[SPEAKER_00]: Your long line is the secret sauce here because it's your ability to hold him accountable, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: So he's over here.
[SPEAKER_00]: So he goes towards the bowl of food.
[SPEAKER_00]: You say, Ripley, come here.
[SPEAKER_00]: Go to your chopped liver, buddy.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's the pile of kibble right here.
[SPEAKER_00]: You correct.
[SPEAKER_00]: Pop, pop the leash.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's he zips around.
[SPEAKER_00]: He comes back.
[SPEAKER_00]: You pay him.
[SPEAKER_00]: So then he goes two things.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're gonna correct me if I don't listen.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yep, that's the thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: You can just blow me off.
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's a big thing with recall because recall is, you know, it could be life threatening, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: I tell that people all the time like your dog's off.
[SPEAKER_00]: You let your dog off leash at a park and you think every, and then all of a sudden a deer comes out of the trail and starts running towards the road and you're freaking out.
[SPEAKER_00]: All right.
[SPEAKER_00]: I just saw a video yesterday of a German shepherd chasing a wolf down in Yellowstone.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm like, okay, there's a death sentence, but
[SPEAKER_00]: So you take the recall and you do this in the house and the dog knows that you're going to correct him if he doesn't listen.
[SPEAKER_00]: So there's consequences for this.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's it's it's psychology, one-on-one.
[SPEAKER_00]: You say, hey, come, oh, I know what that is.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I'm not going to listen because there's alternative motive over here.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's this food here.
[SPEAKER_00]: Correction.
[SPEAKER_00]: Uncomfortable, jarring.
[SPEAKER_00]: Disruptive.
[SPEAKER_00]: Whoa.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not supposed to be comfortable.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's the point of correction.
[SPEAKER_00]: If I was falling asleep, and I went over to the thing, it was like a melody.
[SPEAKER_00]: It wouldn't work, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: It's supposed to wake up.
[SPEAKER_00]: So when you correct the dog, they come zip and back.
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, sorry.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, let's try this again.
[SPEAKER_00]: Break.
[SPEAKER_00]: Give the dog a break.
[SPEAKER_00]: They go food.
[SPEAKER_00]: Ripley come, they turn around, no corrections.
[SPEAKER_00]: They go, I'm just going to come because you told me to and I don't want to get correction.
[SPEAKER_00]: Bang, they get all that food that was in their bowl and your pocket, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh my gosh.
[SPEAKER_00]: So then you kind of have this, what, you know what, I'm considered, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like a balanced dog trainer, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: Now we have balance.
[SPEAKER_00]: When you listen, you get all the love and affection and the good stuff in the world.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you don't listen, there's consequences.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's simple.
[SPEAKER_00]: So you start off with we have to know the behaviors you want to apply.
[SPEAKER_00]: So we're going to go over the reactivity exercises in a moment when you're out in the walk because there are some exercises that you can do outside of trying to get skill sets down.
[SPEAKER_00]: But just to give you context on your dog thing, neighbors.
[SPEAKER_00]: So again, you go outside and you're mining your business and then all of a sudden the dogs come out.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's where you would apply your obedience.
[SPEAKER_00]: Ripley come, Ripley leave it, Ripley down.
[SPEAKER_00]: But you have to start off.
[SPEAKER_00]: They have to master the behavior and then you build them up and then apply it to reality and the in reality for dog owners would be what I call level three dog or I call a Yoda dog.
[SPEAKER_00]: would be asking your dog to do something off leash and heavily distracted environment and they know I have to do this because I don't want to get in trouble and at the end of the day I get paid to do so there's like hyper awareness and clarity the dog wants to do something you know like the garbage man and you know any day I go outside my dogs like checking everyone's ideas scary as hell is a big dog
[SPEAKER_00]: So I'm constantly like, I put him in.
[SPEAKER_00]: I pull that lever a lot down.
[SPEAKER_00]: Stay there.
[SPEAKER_00]: Don't scare the garbage man.
[SPEAKER_00]: Don't scare the yard man.
[SPEAKER_00]: Don't scare, you know, because he's peace sounds big.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, he sounds scary and he is scary and he's big.
[SPEAKER_00]: So my point is, I don't, I don't walk around my neighborhood, scratch him, I had to go, no, I wonder where my dog's reactive.
[SPEAKER_00]: No, I have an intact, massive protective dog, period.
[SPEAKER_00]: So what I have to do is I have to manage it, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: And so Ripley could just be
[SPEAKER_00]: He started getting older, started maturing.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you kept him in tact, his testosterone, who knows?
[SPEAKER_00]: I tend not to really focus on the why because he can't change it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Why?
[SPEAKER_00]: Unless you're playing and giving the dog back and getting a different puppy, but that's not realistic.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now we go, okay, Ripley doesn't like other dogs.
[SPEAKER_00]: And if they bark at him and they react to him, he's gonna snap, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: So leave it's the first one.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then here's the exercises that I do.
[SPEAKER_00]: So if you want, I can walk you through the best case scenario.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, so you're out for a walk with Ripley.
[SPEAKER_00]: And what I like to do is work on engagement.
[SPEAKER_00]: So again,
[SPEAKER_00]: somebody says, hey, I got a dog who's reactive.
[SPEAKER_00]: I say, okay, let me see you work your dog.
[SPEAKER_00]: And when I'm looking for his engagement, how much does your dog look at you?
[SPEAKER_00]: How much do they care that you're on the end of the leash?
[SPEAKER_00]: Will they stop when you stop?
[SPEAKER_00]: Will they, are they in tunnel vision?
[SPEAKER_00]: Are they searching?
[SPEAKER_00]: Are they hunting?
[SPEAKER_00]: and most of the time it's like all the above right the dog's just like you might as well just like oh they're just nose down and just pulling in just just just completely disengaged you might if you swap the leash with a dinosaur your dog wouldn't know to get back home
[SPEAKER_00]: you know so so so what I like to do and this is you know this is good for every dog but this is really important and and almost in my in my training is is is mandatory as you just you just start with engagement so you go outside
[SPEAKER_00]: And you do what I call a two-not per calibration.
[SPEAKER_00]: So what this means is, your dog right now when you go out is going to be in front of you, nose to the ground, disengaged.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is just their normal, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: This is just what they do.
[SPEAKER_00]: And not paying attention, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: So if think about it,
[SPEAKER_00]: Ripley's out.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's just constantly.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to do it.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm doing what I want.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm doing what I want.
[SPEAKER_00]: Just to literally just ultimate freedom, which is totally okay under the right circumstances.
[SPEAKER_00]: I give dogs that freedom when I have the balance of when I say heal that I go to.
[SPEAKER_00]: down, come, focus, look, left leg, right leg.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like when I have that, I let my dogs do whatever they want.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like my, my shepherd who's nine, she's off leash.
[SPEAKER_00]: The only time I tell her to do anything when we're on walks is when there's a car.
[SPEAKER_00]: I just tell her to stay.
[SPEAKER_00]: She sits there and she watches me, stay.
[SPEAKER_00]: Car passes, break, boom, she's gone.
[SPEAKER_00]: Other than that, she doesn't, she wants because she deserves, she's earned it.
[SPEAKER_00]: She's earned that freedom.
[SPEAKER_00]: If I tell her to do anything, she'll just, she'll do it.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I never have to pull that lever.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, this is a car, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: Because she's just to, you know, I got lucky with her.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, so as you go out, start your walk with some engagement.
[SPEAKER_00]: So that means go out for your walk outside.
[SPEAKER_00]: Let the bathroom, you know, the potty's the peas and the poops like that all that happened.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then you start to go for a walk and you stop and you go the other way.
[SPEAKER_00]: Your dog's gonna go, huh?
[SPEAKER_00]: The hell?
[SPEAKER_00]: Where are we going?
[SPEAKER_00]: We're not going back home.
[SPEAKER_00]: Is it raining?
[SPEAKER_00]: What's going on?
[SPEAKER_00]: And you just kind of do this, this back and forth, like a ping pong.
[SPEAKER_00]: And what I like to do, which is very successful, I just did it today.
[SPEAKER_00]: is I walk out, I say Ripley come and I turn and I go the other way and I go I'm just what I'm going I'm this my walk I'm like looking for squirrels and chipmunks and much of tearier stuff so you turn you go the other way the dog continues to do they kind of say yeah okay correction pop and they hurry up to you and what the hell and you start walking
[SPEAKER_00]: and they're starting to look at you and then you turn you go the other way you're just do it and it's you know twenty foot it's not you know it's not like your dance and you're just going back and forth they follow and what you're doing is pay attention pay attention pay attention pay attention eventually
[SPEAKER_00]: What will happen is, after you do typically it's about four pops, three to four pops, depending on the sensitivity of the dog.
[SPEAKER_00]: And listen, I've done this with the cutest, most loving, most happiest, eight-month-old golden retrievers that aren't just, they're just the best, but they don't have any engagement.
[SPEAKER_00]: So once you kind of say, hey, pay attention to me, they're just sitting there wiggling like, well, okay, what else are we doing?
[SPEAKER_00]: But once you get that engagement, you're demanding attention.
[SPEAKER_00]: So what it does is it takes all that focus.
[SPEAKER_00]: So you go out with any dog, especially if you have a terrier or a rot while, or something is shepherds.
[SPEAKER_00]: These dogs who are just working, these border collies, and these healers, these Aussies, like they're just out, and they're just like busy, busy, busy, busy, busy, busy, busy.
[SPEAKER_00]: And if you don't kind of stick a fork in the spokes there and go, wait a minute, can you take all that and put it on me?
[SPEAKER_00]: I'll put you to work.
[SPEAKER_00]: Let me put you to work.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, dogs, as you know, if you let them, they will put themselves to work, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: They'll chase neighborhood cats and chase squirrels and that's just what they do.
[SPEAKER_00]: So what I like to do is that calibration, or I call it both, tune up calibration.
[SPEAKER_00]: And all I do is I bounce back and forth.
[SPEAKER_00]: And the key is, you turn, Ripley come.
[SPEAKER_00]: He goes, nope, correction.
[SPEAKER_00]: Go the other way.
[SPEAKER_00]: Ripley come, correction.
[SPEAKER_00]: By the third or fourth time, you can almost promise you, you say, come, no correction.
[SPEAKER_00]: Who?
[SPEAKER_00]: He's right with you.
[SPEAKER_00]: Gotcha.
[SPEAKER_00]: Where we going?
[SPEAKER_00]: And then you start bouncing.
[SPEAKER_03]: Tree.
[SPEAKER_00]: Sure.
[SPEAKER_00]: You can.
[SPEAKER_00]: Treats are just another tool in the beginning.
[SPEAKER_03]: That tune up.
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, should I try with the treats or just go without them initially and say,
[SPEAKER_00]: I would go without them in the beginning, because I really want the dog to pay attention to you.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, because here's what that will go wrong.
[SPEAKER_00]: I use positive reinforcement.
[SPEAKER_00]: Sometimes I just, I call them external rewards.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, use your internal rewards.
[SPEAKER_00]: Good.
[SPEAKER_00]: Good, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: Just good.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, you say, Ripley, come, good, come.
[SPEAKER_00]: Right?
[SPEAKER_00]: You get like the, the treats are
[SPEAKER_00]: Awesome.
[SPEAKER_00]: I use them every day with every dog.
[SPEAKER_00]: However, they're so powerful that sometimes they create a facade.
[SPEAKER_00]: right you go hey your dog's not listening to me crack open a bag of treats and now they're like your best friend and it's if you separate you know if you kind of itemize is it you or is it the food and I'd like to be me first then the food oh and by the way good job whoa sugar on top cherry on top this is great
[SPEAKER_00]: Not only did you look at me and tell me I was a good boy and padded me on the side and I got a piece of food.
[SPEAKER_00]: So treats are great.
[SPEAKER_00]: I want you to use them.
[SPEAKER_00]: Don't be afraid to use them.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's just in the beginning.
[SPEAKER_00]: Do this little, hey, it's like checking a horse, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: All you're doing is you're just pay attention to me, pay attention to me.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going this way, boom, boom, boom.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then all of a sudden, about the third or fourth time, the dog will start looking.
[SPEAKER_00]: You'll start to see the dog looking at you like what the hell?
[SPEAKER_00]: Because what happens is, as they go, if I don't look at you, I'm gonna get corrected.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I don't know where you're gonna go.
[SPEAKER_00]: So then it demands that attention.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then you start looking at the dog.
[SPEAKER_00]: Good.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_00]: And they go, well, this is this is great.
[SPEAKER_00]: You turn then.
[SPEAKER_00]: So once you start getting hyper focus, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: So really good folk like focused healing like the dog starts looking at you and then you can go it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now you can really start to put that food in good heel.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now you're thinking.
[SPEAKER_00]: So instead of coming out and just being disengaged and
[SPEAKER_00]: it knows down the whole time right because that's what happens is the dog comes out they disengage the whole time they see a dog you you start to here we go and they go here we go so so that's the first thing getting engagement do you have a release or a break command release or break
[SPEAKER_03]: What do you mean?
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, when you tell your dog to break, do they know what, like, if you say, okay, the answer's now.
[SPEAKER_00]: But here's what I do with all my clients and it's very simple.
[SPEAKER_00]: When I tell my dog to heal, for an example, to sit, for an example, to down, to place.
[SPEAKER_00]: At the end of that, I'll use a break or a release command to say, okay, you're done with this command, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: So if I say sit, okay, break, and then they can go off and do what they want.
[SPEAKER_00]: Kind of like a terminal marker, but what you're doing here is at the end of your sequence of behaviors.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you say break in a release, that means you're free.
[SPEAKER_00]: You could do what you want.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, to most people to be honest, unless you see it in person, the break command is pretty confusing.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're like, I don't understand.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I use it every day with my dogs.
[SPEAKER_00]: I use it a lot with my clients to just create clarity.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I'm out with a dog and I say, Ripley heel.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's walking next to me.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's in a heel.
[SPEAKER_00]: We're walking nice.
[SPEAKER_00]: I stop.
[SPEAKER_00]: He gave me every, he gave me all the engagement attention.
[SPEAKER_00]: I paid him with his favorite food.
[SPEAKER_00]: I say, break.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now he can be on the left of me and the right of me and the front of me.
[SPEAKER_00]: He can go over here and he can sniff.
[SPEAKER_00]: He can pee.
[SPEAKER_00]: He can disengage.
[SPEAKER_00]: kind of like that recess, do what you want.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's discretionary though.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're not going to bark, you're not going to react, you're not going to drag me, but you don't have to be right next to me paying attention at attention.
[SPEAKER_00]: So the great command is really nice to have.
[SPEAKER_00]: So the great command is very simple.
[SPEAKER_00]: Don't overthink it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Don't overwhelm yourself just at the end of whatever behavior you do with your dog.
[SPEAKER_00]: You got it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like some people use free.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, they say okay, so I just use break because it's just makes more sense to me so So once you start getting engagement The dogs looking at you stop then you start working on your heel
[SPEAKER_00]: So your heel is gonna be the dog at your heels.
[SPEAKER_00]: The heel come in for every dog trainer is gonna be different.
[SPEAKER_00]: For me, it's the dog on a loose leash at my heels in motion.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm just out.
[SPEAKER_00]: I just want you to pull on this leash.
[SPEAKER_00]: I want you to stay right up my heels.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I say heel.
[SPEAKER_00]: I go one, two, three, four.
[SPEAKER_00]: I stop the dog's looking at me.
[SPEAKER_00]: Food.
[SPEAKER_00]: Break.
[SPEAKER_00]: pay brick kind of make a sandwich to this and at the end you can get a break.
[SPEAKER_00]: So what this does is it creates clarity on the leash.
[SPEAKER_00]: It creates expectation.
[SPEAKER_00]: So again, I don't try to stop my
[SPEAKER_00]: Borable from being a borebone being protective and bark people come in even if it's my in-laws, which he loves and he's known as a life He's he's ripping around the corner.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's chest puffed up and his hackles are and I go down and he's still looking around the corner growl on his hackles are up He's down and then you know and then when he smells on me he's like you know his little nub goes and so so my point is is
[SPEAKER_00]: If I didn't have those skill sets this dog, I'd have to give them back.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'd have to return it.
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's why I see so many powerful dogs end up in the shelters.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you don't have the skill sets to handle a big dog like that,
[SPEAKER_00]: You're screwed really.
[SPEAKER_00]: So my point is is with Ripley.
[SPEAKER_00]: Once you start to develop the heel for an example, you're out for a walk, you say heel.
[SPEAKER_00]: So that means the moment he pulls past your heels, he gets a correction backwards.
[SPEAKER_00]: I usually do like a perfect correct him.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now here's here is an important piece.
[SPEAKER_00]: you have to really pay attention.
[SPEAKER_00]: When you say, and you correct them, does he go, oh crap, and get back into place?
[SPEAKER_00]: Or does he kind of just go, eh, and shrug it off?
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's not a question to you.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's just something to watch.
[SPEAKER_00]: If he, if you feel like, and the common, here's the common thing is if there's nothing else going on, the correction, the, hey, you better not,
[SPEAKER_00]: works.
[SPEAKER_00]: If there's nothing else going on.
[SPEAKER_00]: Kind of like when people go, I got my treats out, but he's still reacted.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's because the other dog was more valuable for him to bark at the dog.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're trying to trump all that with something else to really disrupt what he's doing.
[SPEAKER_00]: He hasn't care about it.
[SPEAKER_00]: It just doesn't care.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, audit that in your own time and figure that out.
[SPEAKER_00]: But when you're out for a walk and you go, and you say, hey, here's your punishment for pulling past my leg.
[SPEAKER_00]: And he goes out care about this.
[SPEAKER_00]: Then you ladder up to different equipment.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's extraordinarily common for that to happen.
[SPEAKER_00]: And again, I just worked with a dog today and I went through three different collars until I figured out
[SPEAKER_00]: And I went up and down the ladder trying to figure out what's going to be best.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then we landed on the slip, the slip collar is slip leash like you have.
[SPEAKER_00]: But every dog is going to be different, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: So just keep that in mind because that's really important because you may say, Tom, to the T, I followed your course and I followed this and I did that and I heard everything you said and you told me to correct the dog and I did.
[SPEAKER_00]: But the caveat to this is if the dog doesn't care about the correction, all the steps that come after that that you've been paying close attention to and you're very detail oriented aren't going to matter.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like baking a cake without eggs or sugar or flour.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like you missed an important piece.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's why it
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, during Christmas, I make spaghetti homemade pasta, and I remember this one time I kept making it, and it would not come out, because I was doing two eggs instead of three.
[SPEAKER_00]: Just little things, because it makes a huge difference.
[SPEAKER_00]: I can't do anything with this dough.
[SPEAKER_00]: So when you're training, it's very, very similar that the equipment is important.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'll say this.
[SPEAKER_00]: In the beginning, the equipment is very important because you're trying to build a foundation.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, as a dog owner, I don't want you to think that the equipment is forever.
[SPEAKER_00]: But in the beginning, when your dog goes, I'm going to test these waters.
[SPEAKER_00]: You told me to heal.
[SPEAKER_00]: We've been working on that.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know what it is, but there's a dog around the corner.
[SPEAKER_00]: They pull and you correct them.
[SPEAKER_00]: They go, that's all you got.
[SPEAKER_00]: Easy.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to take the pull.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to take the correction, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: So the sustainable and the overall macro or bigger picture objective is for when you go at the Douglas, you don't have to touch them on the leash, you don't have to touch them on the collar.
[SPEAKER_00]: And in fact, I want you to get to, and I know that you can get to a point where you just at and the dog comes right back without even any equipment, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: Again, you're barking.
[SPEAKER_00]: If the dog knows, you know, like, when I was a kid, my mom just had to look at me a certain way.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I was like, oh, okay, I'm in trouble.
[SPEAKER_00]: I was it.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I saw I needed, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: So so you want, you want your dog to, because there's going to be so many times where you're going to tell them to do something, they don't want to do it.
[SPEAKER_00]: I would much rather fence fight with the neighbor's dog.
[SPEAKER_00]: I would much rather react to this doodle reacting to me.
[SPEAKER_00]: They don't want to listen to, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: If you have to step in to do something that's going to disrupt an intervening with something that they care about, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: So it's like the very, very beginning of positive reinforcement training.
[SPEAKER_00]: To go, hey, if you come back to me, you get paid.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's great for development.
[SPEAKER_00]: Everybody needs to do it.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you come to me, you get paid.
[SPEAKER_00]: But the reality is, is once you apply, hey, if you come to me, you get paid.
[SPEAKER_00]: They're like, yeah, but if I bark, I get the dog.
[SPEAKER_00]: boom now you're now you're you're playing this game of it's it's a system of economics right because now they're like well here's the value here's the ROI on if I come to you I get a beef liver if I react to the dog I get all this adrenaline dopamine and
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, so heel break, okay?
[SPEAKER_00]: Sorry, back up.
[SPEAKER_00]: Tune up heel break.
[SPEAKER_00]: So pay attention to me.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, now I have your attention.
[SPEAKER_00]: Walk nicely next to me.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, break.
[SPEAKER_00]: My suggestion is to do these, you know, it takes a couple of weeks to get this down.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I want you to have the ability to apply skill sets and the dog grippy is going to, I want to do this to go, but you got a heel.
[SPEAKER_00]: because that's the thing is if your heels really good like I do that excuse me with my dog I'll go out he'll lock in on a dog that I've never seen before in the neighborhood maybe they're a dog walker from I don't even know there's this people coming in my name I don't know where they come from and he'll lock in and I'll say leave it
[SPEAKER_00]: Doesn't care I'll say I'll say look focus I got food right so I'm saying focus because he knows if he focuses he gets paid But he sees this new dog and he's locked and I could I could take that prom collar and as hard as I can Whang and he just doesn't care He's locked he's like no intruder alert new dog alert so what I do
[SPEAKER_00]: is what I was going to tell you next is an inside turn, huge.
[SPEAKER_00]: I can, I can, I can attest to it.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't give anybody information that I haven't tried myself that it doesn't work.
[SPEAKER_00]: I can tell you that because it's a waste of time.
[SPEAKER_00]: So the inside turn, so let's say your dog is on your left side.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're in a heel.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're walking.
[SPEAKER_00]: They start to build.
[SPEAKER_00]: You feel like a the dog came on fast out of nowhere and you don't have time to start deactivating things.
[SPEAKER_00]: So doing inside turn you're doing take your left leg you're basically gonna cut his head off right so his eyes are looking right at the dog and he starts to build you take your left leg you turn right inside to him and you're just you all you do is you walk back the other way five to ten feet and you do it again kind of like you're tuned up
[SPEAKER_00]: except you're not letting him hit the end of the leash.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're manipulating where his body goes, where his head goes, where his eyes go, with your leg.
[SPEAKER_00]: So you're just kind of doing this tune up inside.
[SPEAKER_00]: Does that make sense?
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, no, make, hold down.
[SPEAKER_03]: Sure.
[SPEAKER_00]: Ripley shown himself.
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, somebody is out there.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, my only concern with doing that would be that he,
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, they're strong animals and he would question my turning that way or he would manipulate around me.
[SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, he had any good?
[SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.
[SPEAKER_00]: Here's here's how to help with that.
[SPEAKER_00]: So a lot of times what ends up happening is you try to play this ketchup game, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: Where your hands, you keep stacked, stacked, stacked and you just play this game.
[SPEAKER_00]: So you go forward, they go forward, you go forward and don't do that.
[SPEAKER_00]: So
[SPEAKER_00]: I slow everything down because the heel, like again, you're going to work on the tune up, you're going to work on the heel, all these things.
[SPEAKER_00]: But the heel is, when I slow down, you slow down, when I speed up, you speed up.
[SPEAKER_00]: When I stop, you've got to stay at my heels regardless of if I'm going fast or not.
[SPEAKER_00]: So when you turn inside, what I a lot of times do will do a back pressure.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I'll just give the dog pressure to the back like I'll just pull back on the leash like a horse.
[SPEAKER_00]: They go backwards right so if I see a dog and I and they like if Burley my dog sees a dog and all of a sudden he pops up and I can just tell this isn't going to be a leave it.
[SPEAKER_00]: This isn't going to be a focus.
[SPEAKER_00]: He is and it's one out of ten I would say I would say I walk them two to three times a day and I would say
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe once a week he just gets his stray hair and he's just that dog and I'm like, okay.
[SPEAKER_00]: So one of the things that's super helpful from a massive, large dog just turning right inside to him and just walk.
[SPEAKER_00]: Every now and then he'll look back and you're not going home.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're not going the other way.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're just going ten feet out and you go back and then you do it again.
[SPEAKER_00]: You start to go up.
[SPEAKER_00]: He starts to load inside turn.
[SPEAKER_00]: And so what you're doing is you're de-escalating his focus on the other dog, because his eyes are the things that are going to really build him up, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: So that's super helpful.
[SPEAKER_00]: Work with that.
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's something you can do tonight.
[SPEAKER_00]: You don't need a heel for that.
[SPEAKER_00]: You don't need a tune up.
[SPEAKER_00]: If he starts to build and you feel like you're losing leverage, turn inside to him and cut him off.
[SPEAKER_00]: The other thing that I like to do is, especially for bigger dogs, if you feel like you're losing the power strength here, which with a lot of big dogs you do, is a down.
[SPEAKER_00]: So if you have a really good down, I pull that lever a lot with Burley when I'm on the walk.
[SPEAKER_00]: If he does, when he does do that walk in on that one dog, there's nothing like I could
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I can't even explain to you how just numb this dog is to anything.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, there's nothing I can do to break him.
[SPEAKER_00]: But if I can get, like, I have this cheat code where I can say down and he'll fold into a down and I'll just stare at this dog.
[SPEAKER_00]: And as long as the dog is far enough away, he's not going to lunger anything.
[SPEAKER_00]: He just downs, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: So the down is helpful.
[SPEAKER_00]: I like to I like to use down because it allows you to control the situation safer especially if there's another person who's like, oh, we just friendly and they want
[SPEAKER_00]: You're just like down and then you get right in front of your dog.
[SPEAKER_00]: You body block and you wait for them in the past.
[SPEAKER_00]: So those are some really effective things that have been helpful for me today.
[SPEAKER_00]: Tonight, after I get the phone, I'm walking on this the same thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: I pull those levers.
[SPEAKER_00]: And here's the thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: My dog is very trained.
[SPEAKER_00]: He listens to different languages.
[SPEAKER_00]: He knows what he needs to do.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's always going to be reactive.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's not going to change.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's what he is.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I don't go around going, oh, we had a reaction.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm like, oh, what could I have done better?
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, blah, blah, blah.
[SPEAKER_00]: But when I go out, I have a toolbox of things.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I got to tell you, like I said before, and I'm not trying to tut my horn.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm just putting things into perspective.
[SPEAKER_00]: I specialize in behavior modification and lease reactivity.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like that is my pride and butter.
[SPEAKER_00]: Been doing it for a decade.
[SPEAKER_00]: This dog gives me a run for my money all the time.
[SPEAKER_00]: I have a
[SPEAKER_00]: When I travel, I have a rule with my dog walkers and people who stay with my dog.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you see dog, turn around and go the other way.
[SPEAKER_00]: Because this dog takes a full-time professional to keep out of trouble.
[SPEAKER_00]: thing is he's when he was a puppy he would he would kind of do the same thing and I'd let him go up to dogs because everyone thought he was cute and he was small and he doesn't do anything he just sits here and he posture and he's like okay and then he like he has dog friends he plays he's never
[SPEAKER_00]: He's never like a bit in a dog or gone out like try to hurt a dog.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's just I want to let you know how big and bad I am and it's just like this it's it's classical leash reactivity So there there's there's a difference leash reactivity is when a dog is held back and gets really frustrated that they can't go check that person's idea or that dog.
[SPEAKER_00]: I've had the nicest dogs that go to my daycare have really bad leash reactivity because they're just like
[SPEAKER_00]: I need to get to you.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then the other side of that is just like, at least aggression, right, which is more of, I'm trying to hurt you.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm trying to get to you.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't like you.
[SPEAKER_00]: If I do get to you, I am going to hurt you.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I've had those dogs personally myself as well.
[SPEAKER_00]: But when you have a large dog, it's stressful, you know, because when you go out, well, I guess with any reactive dog, but when you go out, you're like, I hope I don't run into a dog.
[SPEAKER_00]: And for me, I get really excited, because I guess I get to work on this.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I want you to, but I can understand if you don't have a game plan.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, you're going to shoot in the dark.
[SPEAKER_03]: The sad thing is, and actually how I first heard about you, we live on a peninsula in Lake George Cleverdale.
[SPEAKER_03]: and this one couple had their dog and I ran it to them and maybe two years ago and they told me about you, ran into them again, this summer and the difference in the dog and they two did your horn and you know, I wonder for it all, I couldn't believe the difference in that dog.
[SPEAKER_03]: From, yeah, last time I saw, and this little peninsula is wall to wall dogs and my whole
[SPEAKER_03]: Of some point is not to put him in the in the.
[SPEAKER_03]: Cannell when we go up to the lake, which is what we do our female can go she's fine, but Ripley until I get this under somewhat control.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's not going to be worth it for me to take him up there.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it is.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's sad for everybody, you know, because it stresses you out.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I want to go up to the lake house.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like, oh, it's got all this stress.
[SPEAKER_00]: We're going to put Ripley is going to go.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's going to go.
[SPEAKER_00]: So my suggestion is is your homework is work on the things I, I told you.
[SPEAKER_00]: I have a, yeah, good.
[SPEAKER_00]: I have a leash reactivity course that not only goes over all this,
[SPEAKER_00]: But it shows you it with a real dog.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I put it into course form.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's called a reactive to neutral course.
[SPEAKER_00]: And all you have to do is go ahead.
[SPEAKER_03]: Is it online?
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, Tom Davis courses.com.
[SPEAKER_00]: Pretty simple.
[SPEAKER_00]: Tom Davis courses.com.
[SPEAKER_00]: And it goes, it's a whole process and at least reactivity.
[SPEAKER_00]: So it's like, what I just told you, but you can listen to it and watch it at your own, you know, pleasure and you don't have to sit down and do the whole thing at once, but it really just gives you, like, when I tell you about the inside turn, the equipment, because I think you should probably
[SPEAKER_00]: You probably have to go up in equipment.
[SPEAKER_00]: I would assume because right now he's just kind of like, I don't care what you say.
[SPEAKER_00]: So it goes over how to go up, when to go up, what to go up to what size.
[SPEAKER_00]: The inside turns shows you how to do all that stuff.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then yeah, and it's really just.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, my job is to just teach people the why and then show them how to do it and then do the homework.
[SPEAKER_00]: So really, you just gotta put in the work.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's where you're gonna see the real results.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not dogs by Tom.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's humans by Tom.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, I just...
[SPEAKER_00]: the dogs are the easiest part of my job like they're you know within.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah because I mean you've done all the things you know you're in your own habits and I tell my clients all the time I go you're gonna keep doing this I'm gonna keep telling you put your arm down look up stop talking all about you know so your homework is you could take that course which will give you but I I think
[SPEAKER_00]: you probably should move up to like a plastic pinch collar or a prom collar because if you get into a tug of war let's say you go out and he pulls and he lunges and now you're just hanging on instead of correcting so here's what I tell people give you perspective when you go out for a walk in your dog reacts
[SPEAKER_00]: In that moment, you're trying to figure out how to handle the situation and fix it and modify it and manage it and make it better.
[SPEAKER_00]: But the reality is, that's your only, but time you dog locks loads and then reacts.
[SPEAKER_00]: You have anywhere from twenty to five seconds depending on the dog.
[SPEAKER_00]: And a lot of times, people are just so nervous that they just don't get to the dog.
[SPEAKER_00]: Don't get to the dog.
[SPEAKER_00]: They forget about the inside turn.
[SPEAKER_00]: The drawback recalls the Levits.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, they forget all that stuff.
[SPEAKER_00]: So what happens is, is if you have a piece of equipment that enables your dog, if you say, hey, heal, the dog will screw you bang.
[SPEAKER_00]: you never really have an opportunity to work on these reactivity because you're so focused on don't pull me down don't get to the other dog don't slip the you know don't I at the least doesn't can't come out of my hands and then by the time you're over you're so stressed and like frustrated and upset and the thing is is you're never going to get better because you didn't work what you just did was hang on so yeah
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so you just have to remember that like when you go out and you say hey Ripley leave it and he goes and he's blowing this he so you're basically saying if you don't stop pulling this is gonna happen because I don't give a crap about that.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's a problem, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like given given somebody a test test when they robbed the pink everybody be robbing the bank, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like no, you're gonna go to the jail for life or might be get shot.
[SPEAKER_00]: So anyway
[SPEAKER_00]: I would just say that that is a big problem with people who have reactive dogs is when they give the dog the consequence of reaction.
[SPEAKER_00]: Reactor or else and the or else is nothing to them because a lot of times they know what they're doing is wrong like Burley.
[SPEAKER_00]: he knows he knows he's looking at me like I'm going to do it and I'm like well I'm going to correct you sometimes he's like well I don't care and then it then it is you know the whole thing happens it happens you know so that's what that's it knows that even the professionals have
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm telling you it's it's a challenge and it's not it's just sometimes the dog that you it's like kids like you get one one kid that's like shy and reclusive and you have to like come on talk and then you get the next kid that's doesn't shut up you know and it's like it's genetics it's yes
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah, you get it.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, so my point is is with Burley and I tell him that's the reason why I told you as I don't what you don't understand.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like I can relate to you.
[SPEAKER_00]: Before I got him, I wasn't expert in Lashriac, Tibi at the highest level.
[SPEAKER_00]: And now I'm even, I even know more about it, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: Because of him.
[SPEAKER_00]: And so always joke around about part of the reason I got them is because I wanted protection to my family but the other part and truthfully and I've said this publicly many times that I wanted the most challenging dog I've ever worked with.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I've had clients who have had boreboles before and I said this is the most rewarding dog I've ever worked with because once you break through
[SPEAKER_00]: They're your best friend, and now you have like a giant buddy, and it's like, and it was so hard to get in, and they're so hard to read.
[SPEAKER_00]: They whale eye, and they stiffen up, and it's just a really difficult dog.
[SPEAKER_00]: And so, yeah, so I just tell people when I, when I brought him home at eight weeks, he just went, I have it on my YouTube.
[SPEAKER_00]: You can see it.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's just this little back and up my shepherd, and she's looking at me like, what the hell is this?
[SPEAKER_00]: And just as genetics, and so he's trained, he listens, he knows better, but I'm not gonna tell that fish, not the swim.
[SPEAKER_00]: When he goes, he's like, I'm going, I'm not scratching my head going, what the hell are you doing this?
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm like, I know why you're doing this, I'm like, I know why you're doing this.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like a shepherd that barks.
[SPEAKER_00]: So why is a shepherd barking?
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm like, is this what they do?
[SPEAKER_00]: This is they bark, they're vocal, you know?
[SPEAKER_03]: For the air deals, time one less than no time here.
[SPEAKER_03]: The leash, the reactive leash course.
[SPEAKER_03]: I get on your website.
[SPEAKER_03]: It'll show that course.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, if you go to Tom DavisCourses.com.
[SPEAKER_00]: You will.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, there's only like we have the master the master the walk, which is the, which should be going to be nice for you to because we have them in bundles too.
[SPEAKER_00]: So if you're like, I need the the leash pressure and then that, but it's the master the walk, leash reactivity, e-collar and the kickstarter.
[SPEAKER_00]: And you'll see on there, there's a lot of bundles too if you wanted to save money and get them together, but yes, it's on Tom Davis courses.
[SPEAKER_03]: To be good.
[SPEAKER_00]: Say it again.
[SPEAKER_03]: From what you're just saying, maybe those two courses, two courses would be good.
[SPEAKER_00]: I agree.
[SPEAKER_00]: teaching the heal, master the walk, the master the walk teaches you the heal and then the leash reactivity goes over all the leash reactivity stuff.
[SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, I would agree.
[SPEAKER_00]: And there is a package there.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you buy him in a package, you save money.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_03]: We're ready.
[SPEAKER_03]: Thank you very much.
[SPEAKER_03]: Appreciate your time.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're welcome.