Instant Reaction: Meta's Outlook Spooks Investors

Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio News. 0:00:07.000 --> 0:00:10.160 We're watching shares of matap platforms down ten percent after 0:00:10.200 --> 0:00:14.600 the company reported revenue that came in above estimates thirty 0:00:14.640 --> 0:00:16.960 six point four to six billion versus estimates of thirty 0:00:17.000 --> 0:00:20.400 six point one two billion. The concern, it looks like Carol, 0:00:20.400 --> 0:00:22.840 that investors have is all about that guidance. Second quarter 0:00:22.920 --> 0:00:25.680 revenue expected to come between thirty six point five and 0:00:25.720 --> 0:00:28.640 thirty nine billion, whereas estimates were for thirty eight point 0:00:28.680 --> 0:00:32.160 two four billion dollars. This is essentially the second quarter 0:00:32.240 --> 0:00:34.680 sales forecast lagging at least at the midpoint. But we're 0:00:34.680 --> 0:00:36.960 seeing a kind of an outsize reaction in the after hours. 0:00:37.000 --> 0:00:38.800 Yeah, it's kind of interesting. We're going to need some 0:00:38.880 --> 0:00:40.760 you know, kind of color around these numbers and also 0:00:40.800 --> 0:00:44.440 this you know, increase in expenses potentially and spending. Let's 0:00:44.440 --> 0:00:47.240 get to it with our Bloomberg News contributor John Erlickman, 0:00:47.280 --> 0:00:50.200 who follows the tech sector and has for a long time. 0:00:50.280 --> 0:00:56.120 John joining us from Toronto. John, the stock is sinking 0:00:56.560 --> 0:00:58.800 in the aftermarket. I mean, it's had quite a run 0:00:58.840 --> 0:01:01.520 here in twenty twenty four. But again, shares of Meta 0:01:01.560 --> 0:01:03.520 down about ten percent, what jumps out for you and 0:01:03.800 --> 0:01:06.000 why do you think maybe investors are so disappointed? Is 0:01:06.040 --> 0:01:07.080 it all about that outlook? 0:01:07.360 --> 0:01:09.480 I think Carol, at the end of the day, you 0:01:09.480 --> 0:01:12.520 and Tim have outlined all the considerations that are playing 0:01:12.520 --> 0:01:16.360 into the stock decline. Let's certainly wait for some details 0:01:16.400 --> 0:01:18.959 on the conference call later on how the AI roadmap 0:01:19.040 --> 0:01:21.440 is playing out. But I think the context here is 0:01:21.560 --> 0:01:24.040 very important. So you were talking about the run up 0:01:24.040 --> 0:01:27.479 in the stock last year and the continued rally this year. 0:01:27.520 --> 0:01:31.640 It's easily outpacing all the digital ad players because not 0:01:31.720 --> 0:01:34.120 only did they prove to Wall Street that they can 0:01:34.200 --> 0:01:37.720 deliver we saw that in the previous quarter, but also 0:01:37.800 --> 0:01:39.720 that they have been seen as one of the earliest 0:01:39.840 --> 0:01:42.920 big winners in big tech around AI. You could argue 0:01:42.959 --> 0:01:46.959 it's Microsoft and Meta that have shown the strongest ability 0:01:47.040 --> 0:01:51.680 to implement implement generative AI, work it into the system. 0:01:51.960 --> 0:01:54.600 So Tim was first to talk about the revenue number 0:01:54.600 --> 0:01:58.080 for the current quarter possibly ending up being a little 0:01:58.160 --> 0:02:01.560 light versus expectations, although in theory, based on the guidance 0:02:01.560 --> 0:02:03.680 they're giving us, it could be a little bit stronger. 0:02:04.120 --> 0:02:07.680 You highlighted the expenses. I think the fact that they 0:02:07.720 --> 0:02:12.200 are communicating around those expenses being impacted by their AI push. 0:02:12.639 --> 0:02:15.239 That's going to have to be a decision that investors make, 0:02:15.400 --> 0:02:19.400 because when this stock lost basically two thirds of its 0:02:19.440 --> 0:02:23.280 value in twenty twenty two, people were concerned about spending 0:02:23.320 --> 0:02:27.640 on the metaverse with an unclear roadmap. Most of Wall 0:02:27.680 --> 0:02:30.840 Street these days thinks that it is worthwhile to spend 0:02:30.840 --> 0:02:33.200 on AI, and heck, they know how much those Nvidia 0:02:33.280 --> 0:02:37.240 GPUs cost, so there seems to be a willingness to 0:02:37.320 --> 0:02:40.960 spend if it will mean bigger returns. You did see 0:02:41.000 --> 0:02:43.840 the revenue number for the current quarter pretty strong. This 0:02:43.919 --> 0:02:46.000 is the strongest growth we've seen from them in three 0:02:46.080 --> 0:02:48.239 years time. So I think we're going to have to 0:02:48.320 --> 0:02:51.400 let the math fall. The simplest part of this story 0:02:51.560 --> 0:02:54.839 is that expectations were high. The stock had rallied a lot, 0:02:54.919 --> 0:02:59.800 completely different story than Tesla yesterday. And let's see if 0:02:59.800 --> 0:03:01.560 they give us more details on the AI. 0:03:01.800 --> 0:03:01.960 Yeah. 0:03:02.000 --> 0:03:03.520 I think you bring up a really good point about 0:03:03.520 --> 0:03:05.320 the stock being up close to forty percent so far 0:03:05.360 --> 0:03:07.560 this year, expectations being high, just with the run up 0:03:07.600 --> 0:03:09.160 that we had last year too. I do want to 0:03:09.160 --> 0:03:12.240 bring in also, Man Deep saying Bloomberg Intelligence senior tech 0:03:12.280 --> 0:03:15.079 industry analysts whose just now looking at the numbers as well. 0:03:15.120 --> 0:03:17.440 Man deep the stock down about nine point six percent 0:03:17.560 --> 0:03:20.800 right now. You set up the call in the print 0:03:20.800 --> 0:03:22.639 in a great way for us earlier on the program. 0:03:22.760 --> 0:03:24.360 Your reaction to the numbers. 0:03:24.360 --> 0:03:27.520 The focus is more on the spending and the guide 0:03:27.520 --> 0:03:30.120 and the fact that they raised the capex guide by 0:03:30.160 --> 0:03:33.799 more than ten percent. I mean, investors are very fearful. 0:03:33.840 --> 0:03:37.360 Whenever this company talks about spending more, I think the 0:03:37.400 --> 0:03:38.600 alarm bells started ringing. 0:03:38.640 --> 0:03:40.040 I heard that somewhere you got to spend money to 0:03:40.080 --> 0:03:40.600 make money. 0:03:40.840 --> 0:03:43.880 Well, so I think in their case, the fact that 0:03:43.920 --> 0:03:47.240 they go so big and you know, in the past 0:03:47.280 --> 0:03:51.240 they haven't cared about what investors think, and it can 0:03:51.280 --> 0:03:55.160 be kind of a difficult scenario for people to imagine 0:03:55.200 --> 0:03:57.840 if the growth were to slow down and they're talking 0:03:57.840 --> 0:04:01.040 about raising capex, raising op x. Is it twenty twenty 0:04:01.080 --> 0:04:03.720 two all over again? And that seems to be the react. 0:04:03.880 --> 0:04:06.000 AD impressions up twenty percent in the quarter compared with 0:04:06.040 --> 0:04:08.080 the same period last year. The average price the platform 0:04:08.120 --> 0:04:09.880 is able to charge per AD is also up six 0:04:09.920 --> 0:04:12.280 percent or Alex Barinka weighing in on this, you know 0:04:12.400 --> 0:04:14.440 this gets to the point with what we talked about earlier, 0:04:14.480 --> 0:04:17.480 Like I get it. Everybody is excited about AI. You 0:04:17.560 --> 0:04:19.760 seem to say that in terms of ad targeting, it 0:04:19.880 --> 0:04:22.440 makes sense in terms of what they're doing. So for 0:04:22.600 --> 0:04:25.680 you who understands this company like no other, like the 0:04:25.760 --> 0:04:29.360 spend makes sense or again it's mandeep a little bit 0:04:29.360 --> 0:04:30.159 of a balance here. 0:04:30.240 --> 0:04:32.240 If they had said, Okay, if we are raising our 0:04:32.360 --> 0:04:36.640 capex and we expect to monetize Lama three, our latest model, 0:04:36.680 --> 0:04:38.520 in this way, then I think it would have been 0:04:38.520 --> 0:04:41.440 a lot more palatable. Right now, the guidance is more 0:04:41.480 --> 0:04:44.400 about we are raising our capex, we are raising our opics, 0:04:44.800 --> 0:04:47.760 and there isn't anything. Maybe we learned that on the call. 0:04:48.000 --> 0:04:49.560 What's the question you would ask. 0:04:49.800 --> 0:04:53.599 How do you plan to monetize generative AI beyond the 0:04:53.680 --> 0:04:56.320 ad targeting? Everyone can see the proof in the ad 0:04:56.360 --> 0:04:59.280 pricing numbers and this quarter was great, but how do 0:04:59.440 --> 0:05:03.480 you go beyond monetizing Jenny I separately, because Meta does 0:05:03.560 --> 0:05:06.080 have an engagement problem. As I was alluding to before, 0:05:06.400 --> 0:05:09.520 The blue app is losing engagement, so you somehow need 0:05:09.560 --> 0:05:12.760 to offset that somewhere else beyond the TikTok band hope 0:05:12.920 --> 0:05:14.720 that everyone thinks he is going to benefit that. 0:05:15.160 --> 0:05:17.040 John Relick, when I see you nodding here when Mandeep 0:05:17.120 --> 0:05:20.920 is talking about Meta's engagement problem, I mean, I don't 0:05:20.920 --> 0:05:22.680 know about you, but at least when it comes to 0:05:23.120 --> 0:05:27.560 the reels function, the TikTok clone in Instagram, I mean, 0:05:27.680 --> 0:05:29.320 sometimes I sit down with that thing and you know, 0:05:29.360 --> 0:05:31.160 suddenly I look up in twenty minutes have passed and 0:05:31.240 --> 0:05:33.240 I'm like, how did I just waste twenty minutes of 0:05:33.240 --> 0:05:33.719 my life with this? 0:05:33.800 --> 0:05:37.680 That happens to pull yourself out. Pull yourself out, Tim 0:05:37.680 --> 0:05:41.479 if you can't look. Mandeep has done some of the 0:05:41.520 --> 0:05:45.800 best work on implementing AI so far, and I think, 0:05:45.920 --> 0:05:51.200 actually we'll have a better conversation once Alphabet reports its results, 0:05:51.240 --> 0:05:53.880 because it was Mandy who said to me, if they 0:05:53.920 --> 0:05:56.880 can prove that their search business is not being impacted 0:05:56.920 --> 0:05:59.520 by all this talk about, you know, chat bots that 0:06:00.000 --> 0:06:03.000 courage people to spend more time on the Facebook platforms, 0:06:03.080 --> 0:06:06.680 on the Meta platforms, well, then maybe Meta will feel 0:06:06.720 --> 0:06:09.479 that they have to appease Wall Street in a bigger way. 0:06:09.520 --> 0:06:11.760 You were talking earlier about Mark Zuckerberg and the T 0:06:11.839 --> 0:06:14.159 shirt in the necklace. I was just thinking back to 0:06:14.480 --> 0:06:17.640 Mark Zuckerberg, you know, giving the suit and tie approach 0:06:17.720 --> 0:06:20.040 to Wall Street when the last quarter it was all 0:06:20.080 --> 0:06:23.839 about cost controls, issuing a dividend, focusing on stock buybacks. 0:06:24.200 --> 0:06:26.760 Historically that has not been the Mark Zuckerberg. We know 0:06:26.920 --> 0:06:29.120 this is. I mean, it's remarkable that these are even 0:06:29.120 --> 0:06:32.680 public companies sometimes when you think about how hungry all 0:06:32.720 --> 0:06:36.200 these tech entrepreneurs are to get the right the next 0:06:36.240 --> 0:06:39.440 story right. So I think that yes, I would agree 0:06:39.440 --> 0:06:42.920 with man Deep, let us know more on the profit 0:06:42.960 --> 0:06:46.240 and lost story around your AI initiatives. But I think 0:06:46.240 --> 0:06:49.240 for Mark Zuckerberg, when the table stakes seems so high 0:06:49.400 --> 0:06:52.520 to all these players in Silicon Valley right now, he's 0:06:52.520 --> 0:06:55.800 probably made a new chess move to say we won 0:06:55.920 --> 0:06:58.960 over Wall Street. Now we got to win the battle 0:06:58.960 --> 0:06:59.880 on the AI front. 0:07:00.080 --> 0:07:02.480 And I would just have one more thing. If they 0:07:02.560 --> 0:07:05.640 really wanted to fund the GENI initiatives, they could have 0:07:05.680 --> 0:07:09.440 said we are curtailing a reality lab spend. In the print, 0:07:09.600 --> 0:07:12.880 it's very obvious he wants to keep spending on reality labs. 0:07:12.920 --> 0:07:15.080 There is no pullback on that front. 0:07:15.120 --> 0:07:19.360 So the CFO, Susan, why is it I forget right? Susan, 0:07:19.360 --> 0:07:21.560 whne am I saying it correctly in the statement talking 0:07:21.560 --> 0:07:24.160 about the metaverse business reality labs. For reality labs, we 0:07:24.200 --> 0:07:27.960 continue to expect operating losses to increase meaningfully year over 0:07:28.040 --> 0:07:30.520 year due to our ongoing product development efforts and our 0:07:30.520 --> 0:07:33.480 investments to further scale our ecosystem. So Mandy, they're not 0:07:33.560 --> 0:07:34.240 scaling back. 0:07:34.360 --> 0:07:37.880 They're not and they want to increase spending on AI, 0:07:38.000 --> 0:07:41.920 which I think investors wouldn't mind given the state of 0:07:41.960 --> 0:07:45.480 generative AI. But you have to see that discipline that 0:07:45.520 --> 0:07:48.720 they have shown in the last eighteen months continue Why 0:07:48.800 --> 0:07:52.200 go back to that twenty twenty two phase where you know, everyone. 0:07:52.040 --> 0:07:53.320 Question we learned how well that worked? 0:07:53.400 --> 0:07:53.880 Right? Well? 0:07:53.960 --> 0:07:57.520 John, I mean there's a difference between investing in AI 0:07:57.680 --> 0:08:01.000 for ad tech and investing in AI for engagement on 0:08:01.160 --> 0:08:04.480 the traditional family of platforms, that family of apps. And 0:08:04.520 --> 0:08:07.200 there's a difference in spending billions of dollars. And I 0:08:07.200 --> 0:08:09.400 think many investors over the last couple of years would 0:08:09.440 --> 0:08:13.120 argue blowing billions of dollars on headsets and trying to 0:08:13.120 --> 0:08:16.120 create a new type of computing platform. 0:08:16.800 --> 0:08:20.239 Very true, very true. But I would say that if 0:08:20.520 --> 0:08:26.480 Mark Zuckerberg has already been very willing to make comments 0:08:26.520 --> 0:08:32.320 on Apple's VR and AR initiatives, and Apple is now 0:08:32.320 --> 0:08:34.960 a story where we're looking for more details on their 0:08:35.040 --> 0:08:39.040 AI strategy. We just don't know where we're going. We 0:08:39.120 --> 0:08:42.280 don't know what form factor will be the dominant one 0:08:42.400 --> 0:08:46.079 in a decade. We don't know exactly what AI strategy 0:08:46.160 --> 0:08:49.560 will be the most successful one. And I think to 0:08:50.679 --> 0:08:57.120 the Reality Labs reality it's that if you don't know, 0:08:57.280 --> 0:08:59.320 and you have the capital that you can commit to 0:08:59.360 --> 0:09:02.920 these things, and you're willing to take, you know, a 0:09:02.960 --> 0:09:05.920 slap on the wrist from from Wall Street so that 0:09:06.000 --> 0:09:09.720 you can keep going down both of these paths, because 0:09:09.840 --> 0:09:13.959 arguably Apple is as well making fresh hardware bets and 0:09:14.040 --> 0:09:16.800 AI bets. I think it just speaks to the fact 0:09:16.880 --> 0:09:20.120 this is a very exciting time after a lot of 0:09:20.160 --> 0:09:23.199 predictability in Silicon Valley for the last decade. 0:09:24.120 --> 0:09:27.400 What's interesting is and we're continuing to see Meta down 0:09:27.440 --> 0:09:29.880 about ten percent eleven percent in the after hours. Pinterest 0:09:29.920 --> 0:09:32.320 is also down about six percent in the after hours. 0:09:32.320 --> 0:09:36.320 We're watching some a two undred fifty billion dollar dollar 0:09:36.559 --> 0:09:39.080 exchange traded funny TAF tracking. The NAIs doc got hit 0:09:39.080 --> 0:09:41.520 in late hours following Meta too so we're seeing it 0:09:41.679 --> 0:09:45.000 kind of dragged down the sector MENTEP. If Meta was 0:09:45.000 --> 0:09:48.160 not up almost forty percent this year, would would maybe 0:09:48.360 --> 0:09:49.720 Wall Street be a little bit more patient. 0:09:50.400 --> 0:09:53.959 I think so, And to an extent, you know, it 0:09:54.120 --> 0:09:57.280 is tied to the fact that stock had done really well. 0:09:57.360 --> 0:09:59.400 But at the same time, I think if they are 0:09:59.480 --> 0:10:03.160 not in raised the capex and the opics view and 0:10:03.400 --> 0:10:06.360 probably not said that they will keep spending on reality laps, 0:10:06.720 --> 0:10:09.120 you wouldn't have seen such a reaction that this is 0:10:09.200 --> 0:10:13.600 more about investors really panicking around Meta, going back to 0:10:13.800 --> 0:10:14.520 you know, they're. 0:10:14.320 --> 0:10:16.840 Always MINDI is the panic warranted. 0:10:18.280 --> 0:10:21.760 Look, I think with the kind of churn you have 0:10:21.840 --> 0:10:25.040 seen with Meta shareholder base. I mean, remember when they 0:10:25.080 --> 0:10:27.240 had the eighty percent draw down, a lot of the 0:10:27.320 --> 0:10:30.839 lot people shareholders just left, They gave up. 0:10:30.800 --> 0:10:33.400 And I thought this was a twenty year turnaround story. 0:10:33.640 --> 0:10:37.120 And now they have new shareholders, which who may not 0:10:37.280 --> 0:10:39.280 have that kind of patience, you know, in terms of 0:10:39.320 --> 0:10:41.480 that long term strategy. So you want to be very 0:10:41.480 --> 0:10:44.680 careful in terms of setting expectations. I think last quarter 0:10:44.800 --> 0:10:47.240 they did the right thing by announcing a buyback, by 0:10:47.360 --> 0:10:50.600 announcing a dividend. Yeah, and they haven't really talked about 0:10:50.600 --> 0:10:54.160 capital allocation much in this release, which is what investors 0:10:54.200 --> 0:10:54.679 wanted to say. 0:10:54.920 --> 0:10:56.520 That's a really good point. The other thing I want 0:10:56.520 --> 0:10:58.160 to say, and John, let's bring you back into this. 0:10:58.880 --> 0:11:01.400 Looking at our live blog, Alex Barinka noting that the 0:11:01.400 --> 0:11:06.120 total number of people using Meta's apps, so we're talking Facebook, Instagram, Whatsappen, threads, 0:11:06.280 --> 0:11:08.800 rising seven percent year overy year to three point twenty 0:11:08.840 --> 0:11:12.000 four billion. I mean, again, when we think about social media, 0:11:12.200 --> 0:11:15.160 these guys really kind of just. 0:11:15.240 --> 0:11:17.239 There's Meta and there's everyone else exactly. 0:11:17.440 --> 0:11:20.000 And so as you know, men Deep was talking earlier like, 0:11:20.040 --> 0:11:21.360 if you're going to do an ad spend, this is 0:11:21.440 --> 0:11:23.280 kind of probably where you're going to go because this 0:11:23.320 --> 0:11:25.360 is where you get the payoff. But I mean there's 0:11:25.559 --> 0:11:28.320 value in that. I mean just putting aside the AD 0:11:28.320 --> 0:11:30.920 spend and stuff that the AdSpend, the marketing spend, the 0:11:30.920 --> 0:11:34.920 CAPEC spend, if you will, I mean that is incredible. 0:11:36.280 --> 0:11:39.199 Yeah, and I think we have had to relearn how 0:11:39.200 --> 0:11:43.320 to evaluate these companies. Meta doesn't get as specific with 0:11:43.559 --> 0:11:47.439 individual platform numbers as they used to. Apple doesn't tell 0:11:47.520 --> 0:11:50.520 us about the number of iPhones they're selling quarter to quarter. 0:11:50.840 --> 0:11:53.000 Netflix just told us they're not going to tell us 0:11:53.000 --> 0:11:55.560 how many subscribers they have in the future, right, which 0:11:55.600 --> 0:11:58.920 means we're talking now about the power of the platform, 0:11:59.200 --> 0:12:03.480 and you are appssolutely right, Carol. The advertising ecosystem around 0:12:03.559 --> 0:12:07.360 the meta properties is extremely robust, and they have proven 0:12:07.400 --> 0:12:09.760 to us that that is hard to break. I do 0:12:09.840 --> 0:12:12.120 have to go back to what Tim said, though, I'm 0:12:12.160 --> 0:12:15.360 still always curious about where the trends are taking us. 0:12:15.360 --> 0:12:17.880 It's been a busy day on the TikTok front as well. 0:12:18.480 --> 0:12:22.520 Without a doubt, if you're Mark Zuckerberg, you are concerned 0:12:22.679 --> 0:12:26.559 about the levels of engagement just in the pure traditional 0:12:26.600 --> 0:12:30.120 social media way of having the hot hand and Instagram 0:12:30.520 --> 0:12:34.480 is getting a bit older. Facebook certainly is already there, 0:12:34.960 --> 0:12:40.280 but breaking that model that they've built is hard to do. 0:12:40.800 --> 0:12:44.880 And maybe that's, you know, if you've got some competition 0:12:45.320 --> 0:12:49.679 on other social media platforms. Maybe that explains to what 0:12:49.720 --> 0:12:53.680 Mandy was talking about earlier, why you need to continue 0:12:53.679 --> 0:12:57.600 to put all that money into the metaverse in reality 0:12:57.679 --> 0:13:00.320 labs part while you're also spending on AI to make 0:13:00.360 --> 0:13:03.240 a more robust platform for your traditional social media channels. 0:13:03.280 --> 0:13:05.000 Aman Deef, I want to give you the last word 0:13:05.040 --> 0:13:07.680 here as you go and get ready to write your reports. 0:13:07.760 --> 0:13:09.320 The headline on that report. 0:13:09.040 --> 0:13:12.280 Reports reports plural later today. I know it's going to 0:13:12.320 --> 0:13:14.479 be a late night for you. What are you thinking. 0:13:14.559 --> 0:13:19.040 Cost discipline going away from meta question mark because you know, 0:13:19.160 --> 0:13:22.080 to me, there's no doubt this company has a scale 0:13:22.480 --> 0:13:24.880 and it's a juggernaut when it comes to digital ads. 0:13:25.160 --> 0:13:28.679 It's just kind of setting the right expectations and sticking 0:13:28.679 --> 0:13:31.960 to that. And we know Mark Zuckerberg can change and 0:13:32.160 --> 0:13:34.240 he can execute like no one else. It's a very 0:13:34.320 --> 0:13:38.199 nimble product team. But when it comes to managing investory expectations, 0:13:38.200 --> 0:13:41.480 it's a different ballgame. And they've shown they can be 0:13:41.520 --> 0:13:44.000 loosed when it comes to the capital allocation side. 0:13:44.120 --> 0:13:47.239 Gosh, I'm just telling you. You're on the live blog. 0:13:47.040 --> 0:13:49.600 Right, Yeah? Did you do that? 0:13:50.200 --> 0:13:54.840 That's amazing. It sounds like they're taken from our conversation 0:13:54.920 --> 0:13:56.720 for the live blog. Everyone check out the live blog. 0:13:56.800 --> 0:13:58.559 Sounds like Zuckerberg needs to put a suit back on 0:13:58.640 --> 0:13:59.840 and take off the rancher coat and silver. 0:14:00.360 --> 0:14:03.160 I mean it's maybe well. Shares down now, Shares down 0:14:03.200 --> 0:14:06.800 now twelve points seventy percent and up in going into 0:14:06.800 --> 0:14:07.920 the print close to forty percent. 0:14:08.000 --> 0:14:10.120 Yeah, so pretty much at its lows. Guys, thank you 0:14:10.160 --> 0:14:12.240 so much, Ben Deep saying we always appreciate it, senior 0:14:12.240 --> 0:14:15.080 tech industrial analysts at Bloomberg Intelligence, and our thanks to 0:14:15.559 --> 0:14:18.240 John Erlichman as well. Always great in terms of his 0:14:18.280 --> 0:14:20.000 insights on this group. He's been following it for a 0:14:20.040 --> 0:14:23.600 long time. Bloomberg News contributor out There in Toronto shares 0:14:23.640 --> 0:14:25.520 a Meta down almost thirteen percent.