Jon Hamm on the art of rebooting an iconic character, breaking out of Don Draper, and finding himself in therapy

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Speaker 1: Hello over one. I'm John Hammond. Welcome to next question. Hey that's my line. I'm Katie Kuric, and yes, welcome to next question. We might as well just dive right into my conversation with the star of the new comedy Confessed Fletch, the one and only John Hamm. Hello. John, I'm so happy to see you, so nice to see you. It's been a minute. I know it has been a minute, and you have been everywhere you've been, h you've been hawking the ship out of this movie. Yeah, you know, it's we we it's a it's a labor of love. We we we put a lot of time and sweat equity into making it and we're very, very proud of it. And it's you know, it's the little engine that could, you know, it's it's it's in theaters and on streaming as as we speak, and people are really enjoying it. Those tomatoes are are all fresh and uh and the audience whatever, you know, good. So you know, we're very pleased because obviously know when you when you take on a character or a franchise or a film, that's sort of holds its place in the pantheon of especially for people my age, you know, as a as A as A one of their favorite movies. You know, you don't want what you don't want to do. There's two things you don't want to do when you don't want to ruin it, but too you also don't want to do some sort of pale limitation of it. So I never really wanted to do a Chevy Chase impersonation in this film. And we knew. Greg Mottola and myself really kind of worked hard to try to figure out what's what's our version of this, And all we really did was take it back to the books, and we just decided, like, why don't we just make a pretty faithful adaptation of of the novels because they're really excellent kind of mystery novels. And I feel like the mystery is having a moment at this at this time, with with the success of things like Knives Out and Only Murders in the Building, Death on the Nile, and what have you, It's like there's there's I think people are find that those kinds of stories are tremendously satisfying. Were you a big fan of the original, Because I have to be honest, I I love Chevy Chase. But somehow you missed it. I did, okay, John, I missed it. It was, it was. It was a huge presence in my life. The first film. Yes, everything about it so quotable. Chevy is so funny and so particular and so um Chevy. It's unimpeachably good. I think, Oh, it's Dr Rosen Phoenis. I'm just here to check out fanwicks file, Dr Rosen Rosen. I'm here to get home running again. I get Dr Rosen, I I want to check out verserens. Dr Rosen. We also didn't want to get into a nostalgia you know, situation where you know, Chevy's in it and I play a son or some thing. You know. We just decided to kind of truly reboot it and and take it in a different direction. See this is my theory. I think the victim interrupted an art theft, the thief got spooked, balked her over the head, and then ran. No amate, just a little thing, please listen. I used to be an investigative reporter of some repute. I could be very helpful in this whole matter. I used to play the trumpet in high school. I never offered advice to Miles Davis shut up. It's a very confusing combination of commands. So you went back to the books, which how many are there. There's something like ten or eleven Fletch books. And then there's a spinoff character called Flynn who who is actually in the book confessed Fletch, but for rights reasons, we were not allowed to use that character or that name, so we kind of spun him off into the character played by Roy Wood. I know Ryan Reynolds tried to do this, Stave Chappelle tried to do it. I mean, this has been something that people have tried to do for a long time. So why why you know? I think I think part of it is what I was saying. It's really hard to tackle something that exists so prevalent in the minds of people for my generation. Really uh and and and we were just fortunate enough or dumb enough to to kind of land on this idea of like, what we don't have to do the slapstick joke a minute, wigs and teeth and funny names and funny voices version of this. We can actually just take it, take it back to the original stories. And we got the blessings of Gregory McDonald and his estate. Uh, it was not easy. And they you know, they're they're rightfully so very protective of Gregory's work. And I got you know, I got a lovely note from his son after he saw the film and he just said, you know, my dad would have been so proud. It was. It was really great and you really captured the spirit of the book. Well, it was a lot of fun to watch. And I guess greg Matola is that night Matola Matola. Um. I don't know much about him, but I could envision a lot of behind the scenes laughs and camaraderie. So what was it like to make it with with First of all, I love you, well, John is his own case, so you know, we we have a history that's that people can recognize obviously, but Gregor I actually have his My third project I've done with greg I worked on a movie with Larry David and he called Clear History, and then we did Keeping Up with the Joneses with Dolphin Akis and Galgado and uh, and this is the third one. And you know, this is the third time I've shot in Boston as well. So it was a tremendous amount of fun to make the movie. That's always a plus when you're making a comedy if you're actually having fun doing it, which also for me and Greg as as producers on it as well. There's a ton of other things you have to worry about. But once we got shooting and once we got a rolling, it was it was fun and um, and that's, uh, that's what you're kind of going for, is is that shorthand of of having having a good time. And Greg had worked with Marcia Gay before, and I'd obviously worked as Slatter before, and I think both of us knew com McLaughlan and and uh, and then we were lucky enough to get people like Eugene Merman and Roy Wood and Aiden my Arie, people that are just fun and funny on their own. And I had I imagined you all had a hard time kind of at times, especially is at Roy keeping a straight face during some of these scenes. Roy, it was always funny, too fun for me to make Roy break because he's so serious and he's a wildly funny man, but in this character he was so serious and believably so. He plays the detective that's out to try to solve the case, and it looks like the character I play fletch Is is guilty, so that's the fun of that. And I think his sidekick is so funny. Mary plays his sidekick, who's sort of the young trainee or something, and she's very funny. We were we were lucky to get her. But yeah, we had Annie Mamolo, who I worked with on Bride'smaids, came along and does a very funny small part. So we just we had We were really lucky to get the people we got, and we had a blast making it. I think of you and your quote unquote body of work. Let's see how James Liptony I can get. But you know, obviously, Madman, I mean, we'll we'll talk about that in a second. But you are a very talented comedic actor and you love comedy. I thought you were so funny and thirty rock. But tell me about sort of your preference to enjoy doing funny better. Well, I'll say this about that. You know, I'm I'm lucky enough to have credibility on both sides of the aisle, so to speak. So I have, you know, been been given the incredible good fortune to to have done work with some really talented people on the dramatic side, as well as the comedic side. And part of that was getting famous doing such a serious, um, you know, sort of brooding, kind of dramatic work as Don Draper, that I could then pivot off of that, and instead of choosing the things that were offered to me off of that, which we're basically versions of the same thing, to actually be able to pivot and say, you know, and actually like maybe do something a little goofier and funnier. And and then once people were able to see me and that world too, then I could I could really kind of ping pong back between both sides. Did you worry And this is such a cliche question, but I do wonder, And I have asked other actors who have really established such an iconic presence in a role that that it would be hard to break out of of the Don Draper mold after that show was over. You know, I think I I think I recognized that kind of possibility and actively sought to play things against that that stereotype. Honestly. That's why, you know, if if I would have done, you know, another role where I played kind of super serious and period or what have you, I think I would have been lost any credibility in in in the comedic world, which is you, as you rightfully point out, as I'm a fan of it, and most of my friends are in that way, and you would love it. I like doing it, So it was definitely a conscious decision to make sure that I wasn't locked into doing that. You know, I think the fact that you really struggled, I mean this, the Struggling Artists moniker actually really fit for you because it took you a long time to get noticed and to start having things click for you. You went to the University of Missouri right then you started out. You went back to your old high school and taught, which to me is like a series in and of itself John Ham teaches. What what did you teach? I taught acting, in public speaking and improv So I taught the entire eighth grade and then ninth through eleventh grade. We're elective. Did you have fun doing that? I had a blast, And I mostly I went back because I recognized that that school had done so much for me and served in in in keeping me engaged and keeping me on an achievement oriented path, and and it kept me, you know, saying basically in a in a time when my my life could have very easily gone in several different directions, and and provided me with the artistic input in the in the in the spark that I uh. In many places, whether it was athletics or or the theater or academics, it was all. It was all you were encouraged to succeed and to achieve at all of those things. And I just found that to be a really healthy and wonderful place to be. So I really wanted to kind of have that experience for another generation and I was fortunate enough to to really be able to do it. Ellie Kemper being the most visible of of my former students, but but I have quite a few of them that I'm that I'm tremendously proud of. And So you went from teaching at your alma mater and then you you took off for Hollywood, and um, it was it was a slog right, John, Yeah, you know, it's it's it's a very strange. Uh. You know, it's a very strange transition to be to be, you know, to drive west from St. Louis, Missouri and then find yourself in Los Angeles and really realized that not only are you a very small fish in a very big pond, but that pond is a small part of a larger ocean. And uh and you don't really have any kind of survival skills whatsoever. So it was it was a real tricky, uh and challenging transition to realize that, you know, okay, this is this is not gonna this might not happen overnight. Um, did you take acting classes once you got there there? I enrolled in a class or two and uh, method not quite, but I I did, you know, I was in class with a lot of working actors and a lot of people that I recognized from TV and uh and and you know, it was it wasn't inexpensive. So I had two or three jobs, you know. It was just it was hustling and it was surviving, you know. And then and I knew a little bit about that. That's what's kind of my go to, you know, ethos for a long time. So uh. Fortunately I had a really good group of friends that kind of were all in the same boat, like Paul. Well, Paul was in a very different boat. It was very nice, nicely appointed luxury liner at that point. But uh, but but Paul was there too, and Paul was proved. You know, it was sort of the proof of concept, like, look, and you all knew each other from St. Louis or new because you were both from St. Louis. You connects from Kansas City. I'm from St. Louisa. I knew Paul because his roommate at the University of Kansas was the older brother of a friend of mine from high school. So he would come back for holidays and weekends. What have you? Um and uh and yeah. So Paul was sort of like there as the example of like, oh, well, maybe it could happen. You know, it doesn't you don't have to be the son of somebody famous or I guess you kind of do now it seems like but uh, nepotism wasn't quite what it is now. Back then, you had this idea that if I'm if I'm not in it or if I'm not making it by the time I'm thirty, I'm gonna pack my bags and figure out something. I gave myself five years and at that point that would have been I was twenty when I moved to l A. Would have been a you know, sixth of my life. When I have you seventeen percent of my life. And uh, that's enough time. I thought to like establish some kind of plan, put it into action, see if it works. And and it was. I've I turned thirty on the set of my first movie. I was paying my bills being an actor. I had paid off my student loans. I wasn't working in a restaurant and bar, attending for the first time in a decade, and uh, and I was like, Okay, I'm um, this this seems to be working. You know. In the first three years that I was in l A, I auditioned for tons of things, but it didn't. Nothing hit And did you do small roles or no? I mean nothing. I was an extra. I was an extra in the pilot of the Practice, you know. I had a featured extra role in Ally mcbeil where I didn't any lines. I was just the guy at the bar. Nothing substantial and nothing that was able to pay my bills for years and finally I got, you know, a part, and I had to talk and then I a little more and a little more. But what was your first The first thing that I had that was that was of any consequence was a role on a TV show. It was on NBC on Friday nights called Providence and it was remember that kind of curitas. Yes, that was the first thing I learned is how to pronounce the stars very important, beautiful, lovely, lovely lady. And I know you remember me, bartender, what are you doing here? Fireman by day? Bartender by night. I had a one time guest spot on that that probably paid me more money than I had made the entire year. And they asked me to come back for thirteen episodes. Uh. And then they asked me to come back for seven more episodes. And I was like, this is this is the gift that keeps on giving. This is just great. Uh. And then I got another part and smaller things here and there, And then I got a series regular on a lifetime television show called The Division, starring Bonnie Badelia and Taji Hanson and and Nancy McKee and Lisa Vadal, Tracy need him, uh, Amy, Joe Johnson. We had a great cast. No, I did not do group but buy my own tickets chance of winning. Remember that woman that bought those tickets last Yeah, she's supposed to collect to the whole office and buy the tickets, and then she said she bought one more that was supposedly the one that won all the money. Yeah, I'm not even going there a lot of a lot. And it just got a little bit easier to put push the rock up the hill every day. And so that led to you know, more and more opportunities and movies and things and pieces and parts and whatever, until I was finally in the running for a show called matt Men, And that was in two thousand five. That was ten years after I moved to uh to l A. And it only took ten years to be an overnight success. When we come back, John shares the funny story of how he found out that he had landed that gig. Was it hard to secure that part as Don Draper where other people considered because to me, sitting across from you and just knowing you a bit, I mean, I feel like you were born to play them. Yeah. You know, there's I've heard rumors of who was being you know, looked at any everyone from Thomas Jane to I don't know who else, But you know, there was no I had auditioned seven or eight times. I think you know that nobody wanted me as I was not a known quantity. I wasn't a name. I wasn't a star. I wasn't a you know, a TV proven thing whatever, even though I had worked for the past five years or so consistently. But you know, sometimes it takes time. And uh, And I remember I got the part in an elevator in um Tribeca at the Gaswort Hotel after my final audition, and we had I had drinks with the on the roof of the Gangs of Wort with all the ecutives, and I was kind of like this, No, no one's told me I have this yet. I don't know what's going on here, but I'm I'm being treated like I have it, but I could I'm not. I haven't seen a contract. What's what's happening. And so finally we're on the on the elevator going down after these the string session and the and the executive terms to me and says, you know you got the part right, and I said, no, I didn't thank you for telling me. No one explicitly told me this, So it was it was it was that that was the day, and I happened to be riding in the elevator with a very famous German soccer star named Franz Beckenbauer and the elevator. She just told me this. I had no idea he was on the elevator or who he was. But the doors open and they were all these people like like waiting and cheering and everything. I was like, Wow, they really did a number here. This is really cool. Of course they were waiting for the superstar football man. That's funny and what I mean, I just still love watching that man. Such an incredible show, incredible cast, so stylish and um, do you think that Madman could get made today? Because you know it, I don't think it's you know, it's not like a superhero. It's just very it's a funny thing. I don't think mad Men could have been made five years before it got made, and I don't think it probably could have been made five years after. I think it just happened to come along right at the right time. It didn't look like anything else, It didn't act. The show wasn't about cops or fireman or lawyers or doctors, so it didn't have or gangsters or what have you. It was The stakes in the in the in the world that we were playing were not the life and death stakes that most television deals in right. So it wasn't Tony Soprano or Walter White or this or or you know e er or what have you, NYPD blue, you know, it just it was. It was real life, and it was portrayed so as you say stylish lee and um and beautifully that. I think that's how it That's how those steaks were brought and there. And there were things that people could recognize, you know, things like your your your marriage dissolving, or your career not going the way you wanted to, or or you're getting everything you want, what does that mean? How does that work? Or struggling with you know, whatever is going on in your life. And they were. It was and it was played in a in a real way and not in a corny or schmalty way either. So I think it was. I think it came along right at the right time. You know. I don't know if it would be if it maybe if it was made today, people wouldn't pay attention. And I don't know, I don't know. It's just such a iconic show. And I think for me, I liked watching it because of the gender politics in the office. Is somebody who had to kind of muscle my way into a male dominated industry. You know, of course I love Peggy and Joan and um, seeing sort of all those dynamics and I think, you know, it made me really appreciate how far we've come, you know, so there was an element of that that that was really appealing to me. Um, do you keep in touch with all those folks? Obviously you and John are good friends. Yeah, you know, we well, well, well there's a text thread that gets hit up every now and again, or you know, if one of us goes through a life moment, you know, there'll be of congratulations or what have you. But but yeah, we're well I wouldn't say we're super close, but but we're as close as you you probably imagine. And uh, it was a pleasure to get to have John come on, come on our film and play my former boss that which was sort of a nod and a wink obviously to to our past. But it was great to be in a scene with him again. You know. It says he's a wonderful actor and he's a great guy. And Elizabeth Moss is kind of on fires, is killing it. She's she's become a cottage industry and right she's doing her thing, and you know it's it's it's really great. You know, it's Christina. Christina has had a really nice run with with good girls, and you know, everybody's kind of doing their thing. And listen, I always see people from Madman popping up in different shows and I'm like, wait, there's what's his name? That man? You know, it's nice, you know, it's it's it's nice. We root for each other for sure, and uh, and that's a great you know, it's a great to have that kind of history. Honestly, it's for better for worse. It was a decade out of our lives, you know, and that we spent kind of constantly together, whether we were either shooting the show or promoting the show or on the awards circuit or what have you. So it's it's a it's a really worthwhile thing to have in your life, and it's not something you want to let go that easily, you know. Obviously, John, I've interviewed you before and read a lot about you and and and preparing for the interview today, I forgot about your mom and then I remembered um that you're only ten when you lost your mom, And then I think twenty when you lost your dad, and um, you know, it's lately I've been reading and thinking a lot about generational trauma and how how that term has expanded, and not just sort of slavery in the Holocaust, which of course is the ultimate sort of generational trauma, but just the idea of of enduring a significant loss or having something traumatic happened to you as a child, and the impact that had on you then and how much it it colors your adult relationships. And I know that. I think it's so cool that you have been really exploring that. It's amazing to me that that we weren't thinking about that even a few years ago, about the incredible impact your childhood does have on your adult life. Yeah, I mean, it's a it's the foundation. You know, you're you're a different literally, a different human being. You're made differently at that age than you are as an adult. You're not really cooked in many ways, and and you know, your neural pathways are wide open when you're younger, and it's it's all of these things are still working themselves out, so to have that kind of traumatic experience, and and you're right, it doesn't have to be abuse or anything like yeah, like you said, you know, but but but the other kinds of that are are very real as well. And you know, my mom died of essentially of colon cancer, and obviously I know that that's a big part of of of your existence. It's very much part of mine. I tell everybody in my world that's get a colonoscopy yesterday, because it's it's all of that is easily preventable and your most pretty and obviously that wasn't you know, it wasn't anywhere near time for her to be screened or anything like that. It's just a very much an outlier, you know, like cancer is. Sometimes it just happens and it's a bummer, um, but you know, it's it's something that that does, as you say, leave a mark, you know, and it and it I think that the reason recently it's been a little more forward in people's minds is because we kind of all had a major trauma over the last couple of years with the pandemic, and we all went through this kind of global weirdness that I think we're all still it's just now, you know, walking in the city and you're just now kind of like, oh, everyone kind of feels a little bit back to me. But there's something in the air that's still doesn't feel quite normal, right. I feel like it's it's it's it is. It's a combination of the very strange Trump era, but that that amp amplified by the the very strange pandemic. And uh, there's no you know, comparison to either of those things. Really, they're both incredible outliers. And so I think that that's everyone's kind of thinking about how all of that is not only affecting them, aut affecting their kids. And I've had plenty of friends of mine's kids that their senior year or their freshman year in college or whatever was remote and they don't get to see their friends, they don't have to get to have a graduation, and I'm just like, gosh, that's sucks. You know, that just sucks because because of this weird thing that we had no control over. I mean, it's like like an asteroid hit the planet or something. It's just all of a sudden, it's we can't go out for a year. That was weird and processing that is is it going to take a minute? You hope it teaches kids resilience and sort of how to adjust and sacrifice. But you're right, I think it's it was really really difficult and heartbreaking for a lot of kids, and a lot of adults, and a lot of elderly people who declined so rapidly because they didn't have social interaction, social the social part of our day to day existence. Having having that completely removed or or or completely replaced, I should say, with with some semblance of if you're lucky enough to have a computer or WiFi or whatever, you could zoom, or you could FaceTime or things like that. But I remember early on in the pandemic calling all of my friends and FaceTime and all my friends, like I've talked to you more than the last like six months that I have in the last six years, because there isn't it's a replacement for what was just normal life seeing people. I know, I can't call my friend seeing him, how's he doing? You know? What time is? It mustragon like you know. So I think you're right. Maybe that has sort of spurred more interest in how events in one's lives, you know, have an impact, yeah, and re emerge often, and how you interact with people. And I'm just curious John, and if you don't feel comfortable talking about it. We don't have to. But do you do you remember much about your mom and your mom's illness, because obviously, you know, when my husband got sick and died nine months later. I mean, like, I remember almost every detail of that. I remember a lot of it, you know, I remember. I just remember how sudden it was, you know, I remember her it being my mom one day and then not my mom one day. You know, just how rapidly the illness spread. And you know, being spending so much time in a hospital at that young age was very strange to me. And my only experience with hospitals was old people at that point, not certainly not my mom, who was thirty five years old. I's not old, although when you're nine that's any but you know, it was like, the hospitals are for old people. That's what hospitals are for. And so it was a very strange, you know, kind of disconnect and jarring. Uh. And then by the end, my mother had the cancer really spread throughout her whole abdomen and all of her major organs, and you know, she was a shell of herself and and there wasn't any support network in the early eighties, mental health was what they called crazy people like that was you know, if you needed some mental health work, that meant you were going in the rubber room. Um, and it was just you and your dad. It was me and my dad. And I had two half sisters who both lost their mother very young as well, and you know, aunts and uncles and and and whatnot. But I understanded family, but it was the vocabulary certainly wasn't there, and people didn't know how to talk about that. I was given a book that said what to do with it when a parent dies, written by some psychologist I guess or social worker, which I read. But you know, that's not really what you need. You need to talk and have people explain and understand and really you know, and from way, that's a that's your first, uh introduction in many ways to permanence, you know, as death and most people it's their dog or there or their grandma or what have you. And and to have it be this close and have have it really settled. It was my part that I don't remember so much as the aftermath. The next couple of years are very aggy for me. And then once I got once I started at the school that I eventually went back to teach that got me back into a pattern room. Was like, Okay, now I'm starting to feel like I'm coming out of that fog. Ten is a tough h to a ten year old boy. And energy, you know, you've got a lot of, but also you're very you know, my girl, my girls were two and six, and you know, Ellie was obviously aware and her dad walked her to school every day and made her breakfast and did her hair and all that not very well by the way, but you know, um, I think, yeah, I think ten, you know, you're kind of in the world, and and I remember thinking and those those are very like that pre adolescent adolescent stage is so tender and fragile, and so that that must have been tough. Was your debt was did you feel like you're I mean, your dad probably had a hard time dealing with that, as you said, people how to do he he was his first wife passed away very suddenly as well, so you know, he was dealing with a lot of stuff that again, no vocabulary, no infrastructure to help, no mental health checks. No, it was not only talk about death, John, but really to talk about cancer, cancer, depression, feelings. You know, a lot of that was you know, we're still in the post war. You know, my grandfather fought in World War Two, and I remember going through I was probably in my late teens or even early twenties, some of his photo albums from back then, Handsome Guy and the Navy and you know, outfit and the thing, and I was like, oh, man, where were you as we're in the Philippines. I was like, Philippines went to World War Two and you're like, oh, yeah, that was a brutal part of World War Two, Like the Pacific Islands were not. It wasn't sun tans and surfing. It was a lot of like death and destruction. And he just wouldn't talk about it. He just would say a lot of bad things happen there. And that was your dad died at when you were twenty, and so you were sort of an orphan. That sort of you were an orphan. Yeah, you were an orphan when your dad died when you were just twenty, and that must have left you feeling pretty unmoored for sure. It was you were in college. It was in college, and it was sort of like I was, I was. My my grandmother had passed away about eight months before hand, and that's where I was living, and so I was sort of moved out of my house while I was in college and came back and all my stuff was in my sister's basement. That's where I lived. And then my dad died, so I was very much That's when I really leaned on my community. And that was when my my friend's parents and they all sort of adopted you pretty much. Yeah, that's when I really realized that, Okay, not only do I need help. My sister was like, you need to see a professional, You need to talk to somebody, and you need to know somehow get back on your feet. And part of that was getting a job, you know, recommitting to school and and really kind of understanding in some way what was going on, you know, what was what was not only what was happening now and what had happened, but what what do you want? What do you want your life to look like? Because because start working on it, because it'll go buy fast if you don't. And and that's when I really that was you know, in a lot of ways was like okay, it was a gut check. You know a lot of people don't get that until way later in life. But mine came in and it was and it was time to kind of get back on the horse and really get going. We'll be right back. I feel like you have really started in a in a very significant way, delving into the impact of your your mom's death and later your dad's death. And you know, if there's a guy named Terry Real who I've interviewed who talks about the adaptive child versus the wise adult, and some of the impulses you have that harkened back to when you were much younger, and I'm just curious, you know, what are you learning about yourself, John through your work through therapy that is helped you in forging your relationships today. Part of that is, you know when you lose parents at a young age, that the fact the loss of them is is processed like an abandonment, uh, even though it's obviously it's of no, not their choice, the choices made by the universe. But you adaptive child brain doesn't think of it that way. It feels abandoned. And so you you experience this loss this lot. It's almost like a cutout shape, right, and you just don't have it anymore. But you can't quite process why, and that that stays with you. And so as you say, it reflects itself in your relationships and your ability to you know, be in a in a loving relationship or let yourself be vulnerable or let yourself be loved or taking care of anything, and and and that's a that's a tough pattern to break, and it takes. It really just takes. I'm not going to try to make this sound like it's easy, but it really takes the awareness to identify what it is and to identify how you are actually processing that. And then don't you have to almost you have to kind of rewire your brains, but you have to identify it first. You have to stop yourself in your tracks at time and say, why am I? Why am I pushing this away? Or why am I reacting this way? Why am I? Or why am I looking for this other thing? Why? Why? You know? Why? Why is a big When you can come up with with the reason why, then you can actively or effectively counteract it if it's something that's not healthy. And so that's yeah, that's been a big part of my kind of unpacking of a lot of all that stuff is understanding that Okay, some of that stuff is a survival mechanism, right. And you talk about adaptive children, Well, the kids are very famously can you know, find their way through any situation. But it doesn't necessarily mean that that's always good for them. You know, if you talk to survivors of atrocities or things and their kids, they you know, they they're holding onto that stuff even though they survived it, and they they adapted to their surroundings or abuse or you know whatever. But you have to really understand that that surviving something is not coming it and and and learning from it. Well, so you how are you feeling on like the healthy and whole spectrum these days? Mentally? You know, I'm I'm for me. The pandemic was actually, you know, I hate to say this. It's always like you say, I had a pretty nice pandemic. Um, but I got to I worked a lot, which was good. Um, you know, I I basically strengthened a relationship with my girlfriend Anna throughout that. It was sort of like a tribe by fire. A lot of people's went the other way, but the but the pandemic was an amplifier I think for for good and bad and for for our case, it was it was good. And um, you know, I'm looking forward to the whatever the next phases. You know, it's it's I'm very I'm very present in in that and and understanding that you know, none of that stuff comes without real awareness and work on it and and and paying attention. That's a big part of it. You can get distracted so easily in the business that we're in. There's so many shiny things, right there's a party to go to, an award show, and at this and at that, and the next job and the next challenge, and and you can get so distracted that it it's helpful to to center and and remind yourself that you know, everything you have is really nice, and maybe don't worry about what you don't have. Amen. Amen, brother, So do you think you'll ever have kids? I'm just curious. I mean, I mean, is that when you looked ahead at your life plan? Was that something that was in the picture or was it? I mean, it's my life. I've never had a life plan. You know. That's you said, you said by thirty if this isn't true, but but but that's a that's a that's an if. Then I guess, Um, I never really had a roadmap because I never I don't know, I never. Everything was always so unstable and now that things have stabilized and I'm comfortable in my career and I'm comfortable in my life, yeah, you know I would. I would love to have kids. I think it would be great. You know, I'd be a good I just I just saw George Clooney, he was on Drew Barrymore right before me, and I was like, oh, yeah, like he's he's a good old dad. Like there's good old dad's. He would be a good I'd be a good old dad. Well, I think you'd have a lot of fun because I think you're fun and funny, and it would be you know, there's nothing like kids in terms of you know, you talk about shiny objects. Boy, they set your priorities pretty quickly. And yeah, in the best way I think too. Care of something is is is great? You know, is a great reason to get up in the morning. For sure? Are you speaking of shiny objects? Do have something you're doing next professionally or I'm currently working on the show? Wait wait, wait, we have to we have to talk about that for a set the morning. I'm sure it's very near and dear to your heart. I mean, so, have you shot some episodes? Let me guess you're an Angerman? I'm not, actually, strazily enough, No, I don't. I don't play an anchor. Man. I can't really get into who I play. But really, but can you give us a little hint? I wish I could. No, I don't want to spoil anything, but I suffice to say, I get to I get to work with jan Anniston and Reese and Billy crude up and the whole gang over there, all of whom are really wonderful actors. And it's a real treat to get to to be in scenes with with pros, you know, And and at this point in my career, it's like a nice it's nice to be invited to to play with the A team. And um, yeah, we're here in New York City. We're gonna shoot some exteriors for the show. And and are you shooting some scenes also in New York? So I'm not I'm not sure. I think if whatever we do will be outdoors and beautiful in it. She's wonderful. She's a longtime friend of mine as well. I love her. Um, so yeah, you know, it's it's uh doing that. When I wrapped that in a couple in a month or so, I'll go up to Canada to do season five, a far ago. Um, so you know, wait, were you in earlier season? Because I was like, I don't remember. That's kind of what I look for when I look at TV. Stuff is sort of things I can get into and get out of. You know, it's one season here, one season here, the you don't want sort of a the long the decade long job is holds less of a thrill for me than it once did. But and then hopefully we'll get to make some more fletches down the line. There's there's nine, nine or ten more books. I'd love to I'd love to get to the one where he goes to Rio. I hope, I hope we get to do that. That would be awesome. But there's plenty more stories, and it's they're all really fun and funny and and intriguing, and they're satisfying. You know, they're they're they're who done. It's and when you when you tell one of those stories, as I said that, they're having a moment right now. So I think people are are finding that the mysteries. When they're solved, they're satisfied. And also escapism, and it's also also a little bit of a change from like when you see a story that where the where actions have consequences and things make sense at the end, and then that's talk about wish fulfillment, Like I just wish that the real world would work like that every now and again, where people would have to actually own up to what they did and pay for it. Who could you be talking about. I can't imagine who I might be thinking of. Well, it's really fun to see you. I'm so glad things are going so well. Always been a big fan. Thank you for your help with Stand Up to Cancer. Thank you for spreading the word about colonoscopies and other forms of screening. I did a Colon Guard commercial because you know, colonoscopies are great if a you do them, yes, and there's a there's a rough days, well you know, as as it once was. Yeah, And I also say it's much better than being diagnosed with colon cancer. But you know, my attitude is the best test is the that gets done. So for whatever reason, if you can't miss work and you want something to even be and you know, between colon oscar by Art is a big option. By the way, this wasn't a commercial, but I just wanted to explain why I was happy to support what they did. Stuff is so is so important and it's so you know. Again, I talked about my mom. You know, in the seventies, it just didn't exist, and the the idea of preventative medicine in any kind of way. It was like kind of a hippie dippie thing. I remember my neighbor eight yogurt and I thought that was super weird. Give me a break, hippie, right, and really health food. It was like what health food? Who wants to be healthy? It's you know, and in the Midwest it was it was kind of amplithizing, right, What do they have those Drew's Drews? I had a Ted Drews. You turn it upside down. It doesn't concrete. Yeah, they're good. They're good and probably not good for you though, John everything in moderation. They are delicious. But it's not only you know, not only are understanding of prevention, but just some of the things they have in terms of diagnostic tools and treatments. I mean cancer care. My dad had diabetes when he was thirty years old. My grandmother had diabetes, like my my mom's side of the family has cancer all over it. I just why not if you're going to find it, find it early. It's better find it late. Diabetes is the same thing, you know, it's it's one of those things that you there's markers and there's things that they know are precursors, and if you just pay attention to them. Part of that is what I was saying to you know, if you just pay attention to what your life is telling you, you can actually it's a lot less stressful. It's true. It's true. What is it an ounce of preventing ance of preventions or the pound of cure is and that's so true. Yeah, well, Seohn, thank you for doing this. And it's nice because it doesn't sound like you're tired of talking about this stuff, which is really nice. No, because you've been, you've been. You know, it's it's always a pleasure to see you. It's you put a smile on my face every time I see you. But it's nice to have a conversation with, you know, with regular people. Good, all right, thanks John, My pleasure confess fletches out now, and if you want to know where to watch it, do what I do. Google it. Next Question with Katie Kurik is a production of My Heart Media and Katie Kuric Media. The executive producers Army, Katie Curic, and Courtney Litz. The supervising producer is Lauren Hansen. Associate producers Derek Clements and Adrianna Fasio. The show is edited and mixed by Derrick Clements. For more information about today's episode, or to sign up for my morning newsletter, wake Up Call, go to Katie Currek dot com. You can also find me at Katie Curic on Instagram and all my social media of channels. For more podcasts from I Heart Radio, visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. H