Where We Were Wrong, Potential Cousins Trades and Marc's Big Day

00:00:00
Speaker 1: The Around the NFL podcast Daddy Needs his titos. Welcome to another edition of Around the NFL. My name is Dan Hansis. I come to you from a virtual room filled with some heroes, Greg Rosenthal and the man who truly deserves the titos on this special really milestone in his life, Mark Sessler. What's up, heroes? Marcus turned fifty years old today? Wow?

00:00:39
Speaker 2: Yeah, I thought I was kind of monitoring self, monitoring self scouting.

00:00:45
Speaker 1: Do I feel different? I don't feel that different. Feel good? No titos yet. It's very early in the morning and coming up later. Sessler looks back what I've learned in my half century on Earth. I'm really excited about that. It's got to be a full week here. You know.

00:01:04
Speaker 3: I'm sure you didn't expect that you would be spending your fiftieth birthday on a bird with Dan and I. And then we'll have, you know, we'll get to celebrate with Sky. I'm sure Neil Reynolds won't say anything awkward about it during the week on television and then show this is It, and then at dinner like it's all us it's never ending.

00:01:26
Speaker 2: Mark, you I you know it's because these London trips have come up, you know, in a similar time, multiple in multiple years. I think it's maybe the fourth birthday that I've celebrated en Route two or in England, so you know, and I don't really celebrate most of my birthdays that heavily or closely with anyone. So it's most of my most of my passage of time has been with the two of you, and uh, I could wish for nothing more.

00:01:55
Speaker 1: Well, we're happy to be with you. And if you're just tuning in coming up a little later Market fifty a retrospective now right, the back end of the show is just gonna be loaded with memories of Mark Sessler. Yes it is. It's a lot of us. It's always a lot of us together this time of year. But you know, it's nice that we're gonna be together for your birthday and we'll definitely carve out some time Sestag when we're in England this week and then through the weekend for the close of the London Games Ravens Titans. It's gonna be a good one.

00:02:27
Speaker 3: It's one of those birthdays that I remember when we were doing the show like six seven years ago, and we would always joke about how you and Wes were the old guys, you know, because there's about about a five year difference between like the two of you and Dan and I.

00:02:42
Speaker 1: Roughly we're all a little apart. So I do.

00:02:44
Speaker 3: Remember thinking, like, by the way seven, I'm only one ahead of you. I do remember thinking like back in twenty fifteen, twenty sixteen and thinking like, wow, this show is going great. I hope it always is continuing, like it'll be crazy someday when and you know, Mark celebrates his fiftieth birthday on the pod and now here we are and you look better the day has arrived.

00:03:08
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's totally surreal, I you know, And I like, we miss West for manifold reasons every minute. And it's funny because, like I was looking at some photos that Nick, his brother sent of Wes growing up through the years, and let's it just brought back so many memories.

00:03:22
Speaker 1: And there's one of him.

00:03:23
Speaker 2: Like as a youth baseball player and it's like it's the most West photo ever and he's got a big head of hair. But like I do, one thing I do miss is that, you know, the the agism attacks that come on the show occasionally, not today today is very nice, but uh, you know, when I'm dashed for being like one hundred and six years old compared to you guys who are like five years younger than me or whatever, it's like h seven.

00:03:44
Speaker 1: I missed the West.

00:03:44
Speaker 2: But you know, Wes would step in there and be like, listen to you, you children, like we're gonna we're gonna throw it right back at you. But like, uh, I'm I've been for myself now in my fifth or six decade whatever it is.

00:03:56
Speaker 1: Yes, this is yeah. Wes would have turned fifty this year as well, right, yep.

00:04:02
Speaker 3: Little I think what in February. It would have been at the very very end of the season on my birthday. We share as well. But yeah, I always think about him a little extra on these weeks, special weeks like like London.

00:04:15
Speaker 1: So we'll we'll have to throw one back.

00:04:17
Speaker 3: I'll have to actually drink a pint in honor of you and.

00:04:21
Speaker 1: West, and I think you will. All right, let's get into it all right, now, what do we have today? We're gonna do some news and there is some there is some news out there and we're gonnaet caught up there. We're gonna do some previews we're a little were day earlier than usual for a good reason. We're getting on a bird tonight, as we said, and we're going to England. So that's coming up. But first I thought a good way on the special day with Mark Sessler. Take a look back at you know, as we head towards week six. I always find it funny that what we do for a living, it's really tricky in the summer, especially because you you know, once free agency occurs and then the draft, you kind of these teams are a little bit locked in carbon Star Wars reference Mark for your birthday, And I know I believe Luke Skywalker was trapped in there. Now it's I'm not gonna I think you know what you're doing here, but it was not going to get out. He was in the concrete job of the hut had locked him in there. Anyway, nailed it. We have these takes throughout the summer, and then there's nothing too much that moves. Of course, the training camp comes and that that sharpened certain takes, and then pre season, which which lies comes and that sharpens takes or dulls takes. But let's circle back, and this is what separates us. Greggie from the other shows, all these other talking head shows and even the Smart Guy podcast. They they tend to just dig in on points and then when when the ones at work come around, the ones that they get right, they won't shut up about it, but the ones they get wrong they quietly sweep under the rug. We're not going to do that. So what do we get wrong as we enter week six? What are we feeling like we totally botched? And maybe at the end we'll throw in something we got right so far. Let's start with you, Greg.

00:06:21
Speaker 3: Well, it's honestly hard to look past just the last two weeks. I know that's not the exercise, but I've literally done one rain maker all year, and it was on a Patriots team that lost thirty eight to three, and then I stupidly picked them again to win the following week on game debut where I make my picks and they lost thirty four to nothing. So that is sticking in my crow right off the top. But going back to the summer, the Miami Dolphins are the team that I did the thing that I have tried to learn through twelve years of doing this to not do and then I do it anyways, which is to overrate the preseason and to totally give up on a team that like early in the offseason. I think a lot of us and I was included, but I certainly wasn't alone was thinking, Wow, this is one of those teams. If you're kind of looking for a sneaky team to go ahead and make the Super Bowl, the Miami Dolphins are a great choice. I just love this roster. They could be the next Super Bowl superpower. By the time we got to September, I didn't even have them in the playoffs. I thought they had the worst month of August period. Practically no one ad them in the playoffs. But like I went from thinking they're gonna be my Super Bowl pick to replacing them with the Chargers. And I feel like a total moron for both parts of that, but especially the Miami Dolphins part of it.

00:07:38
Speaker 2: I do think like almost everyone slept on the nature, like the insane nature of their offense. Like we knew it would be creative. We knew that under Mike McDaniel you had explosive wide receiver play and we were like, Tuoa was a real TBD. But then the balance with the run game and what they're doing on a weekly basis. Really outside of that Bills game, I didn't expect that. I think I maybe tag them as a wild card team just because I mean, they made the playoffs last year and I didn't think they got worse. But I did not expect them to be as devastating a product as they are.

00:08:13
Speaker 1: They're a little bit tricky because a lot of people, including I think all of us, got the preseason playoff prediction wrong here that we know they're going to the playoffs, but obviously they're a power player in the AFC, and some of that's a little bit you got to keep in mind. People are getting behind the Jets when the Jets had Aaron Rodgers and it kind of came down to a choice between the Jets and Dolphins for a lot of people in terms of like kind of pumping up a team, and a lot of people, including myself, made the wrong choice. The Dolphins are the team. I have it on my list here, Greg, but this one is one of the ones that's like, yeah, I'm pretty sure I got it wrong my off season take and summer take that I know this offense is fun and exciting and explosive, but are they going to be unstoppable like they were for stretches last year, and we know they I won't bring it up, Greg, but yes, they have the record now for the most total yards in the first five games of a season. Mischoon accomplished and that attack was Their attack has been unstoppable against the Chargers, Broncos, and Giants, even if they were a bit sloppy on Sunday, they were generally contained and wins over the Pats and a loss to the Bills. And I think they'll have another massive day of this upcoming weekend against the Panthers, you know, hide the women and children of Charlotte. But I guess I want to see what happens when the competition rams back up. Week seven is a big one at Philly. They have two matchups against a tough Jets defense, including a Week twelve Black Friday game. Crazy. They have Baltimore in Baltimore on the schedule, Tennessee's on the schedule, and then they have a Week eighteen Bills rematch. So I'm excited just to see how they look when this competition stiffens again, because when it has it hasn't been quite the joy or so maybe they're just lingering just a tiny sliver of doubt that they this is an attack that will play in January, for instance, but overall definitely wrong because they were so dominant in the first five weeks for the most part.

00:10:13
Speaker 3: What's also because I replaced them with the Chargers, like and I know the Chargers are two and two, and that's the thing we're making these evaluations that after week five, we're probably got to be wrong about these too, because it's hard to know what's coming forward.

00:10:25
Speaker 1: But I don't feel good about that.

00:10:26
Speaker 3: I know they're two and two and Herbert's played well individually, but I feel like this team hasn't changed. It isn't changing right now, and it hasn't given me any reason to change. And so between those two teams, I did the cardinal sin, which I let the off season like go too long, and I totally flipped it. And I wouldn't be surprised if the Chargers don't miss the playoffs at all, much less win the division, which I had them doing over the Chiefs.

00:10:48
Speaker 1: So I think that was a bad pick. I had the NFC North all wrong. I thought the Packers would be better than they have been got sucked in by the Jordan love hype and this idea that the baton would simply be passed. I saw them as a playoff team potentially. I thought the Vikings were being overly dismissed for last year's deceiving win loss record, which obviously is proven to be the wrong take on it. Because they're one and four. I thought the Bears could be ready to make noise and accepting what we saw on Thursday night, that hasn't really been the case and then, and I mentioned this a couple of days ago, but I think a lot of it was just like my connection to a downtrodden historical franchise. I was less high on the Lions, and I just kinda I saw them being heavily pumped up as the favorite and the NFC North, and I wasn't totally believing that that's what was going to happen. But that's exactly where we are here in the middle of October. They are head and shoulders above the rest of that division and seemingly playing at a level that's begging the question whether they should be talked about with the San Francisco's and Philadelphias of the league. So definitely slept on how good the Lions and them continuing to level up. I got that one wrong, how about you, Mark?

00:12:05
Speaker 2: Yeah, I join you on that because I I thought Justin fields make a big jump, and I thought the Lions would be frisky, but not not the way I see them right now, which is just the tier beyond the Niners and the Eagles. I mean, they were kind of alone in the next tier for me in the NFC, So I didn't predict that for me. I mean, I think I look at my predictions in general, and it's like I could be in the ballpark more often on some of these if they weren't so hyper specific. Like I don't know why when I talked about the Pittsburgh Steelers saying I think they're a wild card team. I think they're gonna surprise the people and win more games than people. I say, twelve are gonna win twelve games? And I'm banging the table all off season on the specific number they're three and two. But that's I mean, everything we see about them does not look three and two. And I think that one thing I really fell for, And you know, Dan were you were from the very beginning of this preseason saying I'm not gonna watch it.

00:12:59
Speaker 1: I don't care about I'm not gonna pull takes from it.

00:13:02
Speaker 2: There was no team that was sung them out more poetically than Pittsburgh and their offense and Kenny Pickett and sort of the idea that they were going to grow together and become this explosive maybe way better than the people expected attack because of pristine August games.

00:13:18
Speaker 1: I fell for it. I trust the coaching.

00:13:20
Speaker 2: I always feel like Tomlin's gonna give you an extra win or two then you'd get in a different situation.

00:13:25
Speaker 1: Yes, yes, yes, so we will do that.

00:13:27
Speaker 2: But like I was kind of looking at their schedule to get to twelve games, and I'll go through this quick. I think you've got the Rams, like they could win that game, Jaguars, tough, Titans, maybe Packers. Yes, I'd say they probably could sweep the Browns potentially, but you lose that one, you'd maybe split with the Bengals if you're lucky. You could beat the Cards, you beat a bad Pats team, the Colts way better than I thought they'd be. The Seahawks are tough, and you got the Ravens. So the path to twelve games is very tight and very tricky. Even though they sit at three and two. I could see them getting too ten or eleven, but that would also be a bit of a mirage. I think their offense is a disaster. They are ripe for a mid season coordinator firing, although Tomlin seems loyal to Matt Canada, overly loyal. I just I got this wrong because the team that I was talking about isn't the team we're watching.

00:14:19
Speaker 1: On offense, defense sure isn't so much of it, Like, yeah, the Canada thing has really ramped up in heat, but a lot of people were much higher on picket because the way last year ended, and then of course all the summer hype. But the fact that he has not continued to develop this year has really hurt that. I don't think they're gonna sniff eleven wins, at least based on what we've seen, forget about twelve. They kind of have the look of a eight to nine, nine to eight team to me right now. But there's still time, I guess, for them to figure some things out. I just don't I haven't seen any evidence greg that this offense, even in the wins that they've had, there's a lot to get excited about, so far.

00:14:58
Speaker 3: No, they're the worst three and two team in the league. They're one of the worst offense in the league. The only case for them is that teams do evolve and change, and sometimes teams do get better, and the fact that they've gotten to three and two while they stunk. If they can just get their offense to average, maybe they'll do the Tommon thing.

00:15:15
Speaker 1: And they're not getting to twelve though. All right, anybody else want to share anything? I think we all gave ourselves the lashings we deserve. I won't take a jet sell on it because that was unfair. That was corol and the world is a mean place. But maybe I should have known it was coming when I predicted them to win the Super Bowl. But I like a lot of mine.

00:15:37
Speaker 3: But Commanders, as the seventh wildcard team, is not feeling too good right now.

00:15:41
Speaker 2: That always felt a tad suspicious, although I thought it was you know, daring.

00:15:46
Speaker 1: Bold, bold, bold and again. Coming up a little bit later, as we celebrate the big day for Mark Sessler counting down Mark's fifty craziest moments on his fiftieth right day.

00:16:01
Speaker 2: I don't know, I know, like this Gregg's child listens to this podcast. I think other children listen to it. I'm not sure I could cover all fifty we could get. We get a solid ten or twelve in there.

00:16:12
Speaker 1: Though. You think he got more wildness inside you in the in the in the back fifty Mark, Oh, you think it's gonna be it's a toned down version of Mark.

00:16:24
Speaker 2: No. I think the trajectory is heading in one very specific direction. So yes, I think there's more to come.

00:16:30
Speaker 1: Very good. All right, let's do some news. I mean, I'm twice your age plus a few years. That's concerning, right, you guys are on the way out. There's old friend Caveon Thibodeaux, I guess young friend Caveon Thibodeau, who just relentlessly disrespected Mark and I last June. And but the good news is he's he's starting to accumulate a lot of empty, meaningless sacks and a totally lost season for the New York Giants. So good for him, whoa well done. Let's get to the news. I still think Greg quietly is on cave On's side with that, But that's it seems.

00:17:09
Speaker 3: No, But I do enjoy that when I was removed in Japan hearing about this, that I was not involved whatsoever.

00:17:19
Speaker 1: All Right, We talked about it on the Monday Night Show. Justin Jefferson. There was some signs pointing to the superstar wide receiver of the Vikings missing time with his hamstring injury he sustained in Week five, and sure enough, the Vikings plan to put Jefferson on injured reserve. According to the Pell Raiser, that means he's going to miss the next four games against the Bears, Niners, Packers, and Falcons earliest. The earliest he could return November twelfth against the Saints. So Greg, but Jefferson is the NFL's reigning offensive Player of the Year. He is obviously the driver of all things Minnesota related. And now you take him out of the picture, the team is one and four. What does it mean for Jefferson? What does it mean for the Vikings from a big picture sense?

00:18:10
Speaker 3: I think they are going to start thinking about who they can trade if they don't pile up some wins. So to provide a little context on injured reserve, Kevin Seaffort on ESPN and some others have reported similarly they think it's going to be longer than four weeks, that it's a very serious hamstring strange, and it's no guarantee he would be back after four weeks. In fact, they would probably expect it to be longer. Then you start raising questions about where they are in the season, his contract status. He was looking for a contract extension, didn't make a big thing of it, but he's eligible for one and they haven't given into him one. So they're not going to rush him back at seventy eighty percent. They're going to try to save him from himself and keep him happy and not put him in an awkward situation. And if they they don't win games, and their schedules quite easy other than that forty nine Ers game, so you never know. But if they don't win games, I think you got to think about if Kirk Cousins is on this team in November, if Daniel Hunter is on this team, there's a couple of people that would make sense to possibly move.

00:19:15
Speaker 2: Yeah, Because I mean they they are very clearly in a rebuilding project of some sort. I mean you look what they did with their cap. They let people go on defense outside of Daniel Hunter this offseason. I think it was widely presumed. I just have always felt like even if they don't trade cousins. This is the final go around with them and they move on from that point. So your centerpiece is justin Jefferson. So the idea of getting into one of these things where the player comes out of a bad campaign saying, you know, I got rushed back into the lineup, like, yeah, there's no reason to do it. They've got the Bears, then they got the Niners. But I think there's a really realistic roadmap where they're you know, two and five or you know, two and six, get to the eighth game mark, and it's like you start shutting things down and looking at taking a realistic look at your assets and what you can trade them for.

00:20:04
Speaker 1: And then well you also have to look at like where, let's say the Vikings did decide to go down this road, Like what teams would make sense. I mean, obviously you connect them to the Jets because of the Rogers situation, but I don't know if the Jets are looking to take on a lot of money and give up draft assets and who knows where they'll be by Halloween, if they're even in contention. What other teams even jump out to you that would say, let's welcome in this guy and pay him a lot of money and give up a draft pick to play for half a season, like what's his market? Right?

00:20:36
Speaker 3: That is the tricky part. I don't think necessarily. You know, the money to me is a positive because you just have to play his base salary and it's not that high.

00:20:45
Speaker 1: As long as you can fit him in, that's fine.

00:20:47
Speaker 3: As long as he's okay, he's not looking for a long term contract extension right away. There aren't a lot of superlogical teams. I mean, the Jets are the most logical. If Rogers was okay with it, if they can be competitive, don't think that's crazy at all to give up a mid round pick for half a year of Kirk Cousins with the with the Vikings. Do it just for like a third or a third that turns into a second? Maybe the other one that you know came to mind, and it's a little crazy, But it's this old coach from Minnesota and Cleveland, and is that is that a trade that could make sense for both sides? And Deshaun Watson actually gets involved in that trade, Like, crazier things have happened.

00:21:27
Speaker 1: Maybe I'm turning it.

00:21:28
Speaker 3: I'm turning into the NBA pods I listened to all NBA pods are are speculating about future trades and then they eventually sometimes happened, but usually they don't happen.

00:21:38
Speaker 1: You're telling me, Greg, that the Cleveland Browns would take a reputation dirt nap, wait all this time to finally get this guy in the field, and then they would quit on them after eight weeks and send him out of town. That that would show like a complete like Jesus take the wheel situation there. They would also get out of that point.

00:21:56
Speaker 3: They would also get out of that guaranteed money, and they would get a orderback that they think is probably as good or maybe their head coach thinks is as good a fit in their offense, are better than the guy that they have. I think that contract is a bit of an albatross, and there's concerns.

00:22:12
Speaker 1: Wait, it would be soon, Greg, I know you don't like talking about this player in any positive but you're acting like it's already a he's a bust.

00:22:20
Speaker 3: I mean, I just think it's I just think it's possible. I think in two weeks it would be.

00:22:23
Speaker 1: Pro football is completely different than the best.

00:22:25
Speaker 2: Wait, why but why would the Vikings, and I think their front office is pretty forward thinking and there's hope there. Why why would the Vikings take on like the Watson contract starting next year. I know you can read do the money and stuff, but is insane and we haven't seen evidence that he can play and a trade needs to happen pretty soon. You know, there's a trade deadline for this to happen. It's like, why on earth would the Vikings take on Cleveland's ostensibly biggest problem.

00:22:56
Speaker 1: Wow, Because there's a lot of people that think he's a top flight quarterback just what he does on the field, And that's why the Browns sold their soul to the devil on it because they were looking for a quarterback for thirty years. And that's why I don't think they would get out at this point, because then they're right back into that QB wilderness with a thirty five year old Cousins on a rental deal where they guess they start over, go ahead. It's it's crazy.

00:23:22
Speaker 3: I'm just throwing out there, partly because there weren't logical teams and the way I always start these are who are these players with previously? And Cousins and Stefanski, you know, had that time, and the forty nine ers don't really make sense. But just from about the Valerie Cousins is only making ten million dollars actually in terms of his base salary, So you'd be like paying nothing to get Kirk Cousins for eight games or whatever ten games.

00:23:48
Speaker 4: How about the Falcons and a wide open Yes, that was only like a logical team that I could think of. That's about the only thing is like I feel like Arthur Smith keeps getting in the way of these concepts that we have because you know, we talked Ryan Tannehill for six months and Arthur Smith all he does is turn around and back Desmond Ritter against sometimes like our wishes, and it's like, I don't there's not a big link between Arthur Smith and Kirk Cousins at all.

00:24:12
Speaker 1: But you think Tennessee you could talk itself into it.

00:24:15
Speaker 2: I don't know, probably not if they were they were like stay competitive and they're hanging around and Ritter has another like really bad game or two, like maybe ownership would get on board with that.

00:24:23
Speaker 1: I mean, you give them hope.

00:24:26
Speaker 3: The only trick is Arthur Smith is like the system. Everything is about the system. Yes, we can draft these top ten wide receivers and tight ends. But my system, you know, dictates they only get the ball twice a game. And his system is like, I want a running quarterback to run this system, to uh, someone with mobility, and so I do wonder about the fit with with Cousins.

00:24:48
Speaker 1: All right, interesting, very interesting intrigue in Minnesota in a transition period for the team. Let's move on to other injury news. Unfortunate news here that the Dolphins will be without Devon Yeah, his name just gives me trouble. The first and the last name. You got, Devon Chan, not Devin Chan. Devon Chan. He is headed toward injured reserve, it appears, and he is likely to miss accorded tod Adam Schefter multiple weeks with a knee injury. Mike McDaniel, we played it on the Monday Night Show, is cryptic about what exactly was going on with the knee, and we still don't have a clear picture as of recording today what exactly is up with the knee unless I miss something. But he steps out of the picture after an electrifying last few weeks, and Raheem Moster moves back to the front of the line in that incredible offense.

00:25:50
Speaker 3: Everyone always goes right to well, see he's one hundred and eighty three pounds. That's why he fell to the third round. Okay, let's see. I mean, it's true, it didn't take long and they weren't going to over load him, so that that's a concern. I don't think he's gonna go on injured reserve Dan. It sounded from a rap sheet that it would be like week to week, and you that might end up happening anyways, but for now it sounded like they were hoping maybe it would be closer to two to three weeks versus more.

00:26:16
Speaker 1: Like.

00:26:16
Speaker 2: My concern is because I like Raheem Moster a lot, and they've essentially, you know, adopted with Jeff Wilson, they've adopted the Niners backfield from years of old. But it was like most was another player that you'd get two great weeks out.

00:26:29
Speaker 1: Of him, then he'd get injured. Like he's.

00:26:31
Speaker 2: His durability has been a big problem and it's been such a huge plus for their offense.

00:26:36
Speaker 1: I mean, h chan his season.

00:26:37
Speaker 2: We just did that NFL plus thing yesterday where you know, we didn't know what was gonna happen with him, but now he's out of the picture. But twelve point one yards per care there isn't really a comp for what he's accomplished over the first five weeks of the season because he really didn't. He didn't play in week one and had five yards in week two and then utterly exploded. And he has like fifty something sixty less carries than Christian McCaffrey and yet has the second most yards in the in the league. So it's a huge loss, and I mean, you hope he's back sooner than later.

00:27:06
Speaker 1: Finally, in the news, the rams Man score another one for the culture because it was decided that Van Jefferson did not fit into their plans. Pukaakua has risen up, Cooper Cup is back to to Atwell's doing some things in this offense. So Los Angeles makes a move and they, I mean, they do Van Jefferson dirty. They must have really, he must have really done something behind the scenes to get them met because they send him to Falcons for a sixth and seventh round pick. Get line, buddy, if you didn't like your role in the offense with the Rams under Sean McVeigh enjoy the Arthur Smith system.

00:27:48
Speaker 3: Was it wasn't working though he wants he wants to play, and he wasn't gonna play anymore in Los Angeles unless they were injuries.

00:27:55
Speaker 1: So like, can you send me to the CFL? Is there another option here in Atlanta?

00:28:02
Speaker 3: You know, he's the number two or three receiver behind Drake London. Mac Collins is there too. At least I'll get to play In theory. Van Jefferson was always a little more of an in theory guy for the Rams. I mean, I know he played a lot on the on a Super Bowl winning team, but it just I don't know, I never I never got into it.

00:28:20
Speaker 2: I like the thing you're so right about the Falcons where it's like Drake London, like it's he's sort of stuck and hijacked in this offense. And same with Kyle Pitts. But they have like for being this system where you think they want to run the ball and do nothing else, like Rivers had these games where he's throwing the ball forty something times, like it keeps happening, and like, I mean that doesn't mean that he's completing great passes downfield, but like it's not as if Van Jefferson goes to a complete and total wilderness because there's not much around him. Like, what's the competition outside of Drake London?

00:28:50
Speaker 1: Great food, great strip clubs? You know, well he could those box He's he might be a good Christian man, Uh, Greg, he might be upset that those type of established and litter the landscape of a town. Look at that.

00:29:03
Speaker 3: I suppose there's plenty in Los Angeles too, So I don't know what my point is.

00:29:10
Speaker 1: Yeah, many a time I've driven by Seventh Veil here in Los Angeles and it's just Greg by him smell self smoking a cigarette. It's disturbing, all right. That makes me think of by the way, in that old Tom Selleck vehicle, mister Baseball from I think ninety one or ninety two, and he learns he's been traded and he goes anywhere but Detroit and they actually got sent to Japan. Like do you think Van Jefferson would rather be sent to Japan right now to live with like your wife's family, Greg.

00:29:42
Speaker 3: M maybe you could hang out with our old our old boss, James John Marvel's son James Marvel pitching over in the Japanese League.

00:29:49
Speaker 1: Oh good for him? Checking well too, Grady ra oh, beautiful, beautiful, Yes, shout out to James Marvel, big right hander with plus stuff. All right, before we take a break, a little teas here on this special day. Coming up on the other side of this break, fifty and fabulous Sessler, Shed's black jacket and everything else.

00:30:13
Speaker 2: I mean, if I do two of the things you're telling me I'm gonna be doing on this show, it's going to be a new territory.

00:30:19
Speaker 1: Now that's a tease, a strip tease. I'll be here all week. We'll be right back, all right, welcome back, Mark. That was quite the show. I agree it was the right move to do it off camera, but really enjoyed it.

00:30:48
Speaker 2: I have to say, yeah, I wanted to see if you guys, if you guys approved, then I could bring it to a larger audience, take my act, you know, to a higher larger venue.

00:30:56
Speaker 3: Yeah that Manny Pachiao gym member ship or whatever you got, it's paying off.

00:31:03
Speaker 1: And we got the I don't belong to the gym. We got the big live show at the sold out shot theater coming up in a couple of days. I mean, that's you know, that might be that might be the spot, that might be the spot for us. All right, let's get to the Island game previews before we say goodbye, Starting with Thursday Night Football. It is a matchup of a one in four team against a four and one team. However, you know, based on what's going on with the Chiefs, I can't sell it. The Denver Broncos are going to Arrowhead on a short week after melting down in the second half against the Jets against a I imagine ticked off Patrick Home, Mahomes and company who are still trying to find their stride. Greg, you're good at this. Sell this as a game that America in the world needs to check out. Okay, well, number one, Patrick Mahomes is involved. It's he's in it.

00:32:01
Speaker 3: I guess I lean more towards Tony Romo than I know Mark does. I always enjoy watching Mahomes number two. Hey, last year, when who is Jerry who is their interim head coach Jerry Rosberg or something?

00:32:16
Speaker 1: I don't know, something. Remember they almost beat the Chiefs.

00:32:20
Speaker 3: How do you remember that in like week sixteen, Week seventeen that you know, so it was like down to the last second in that game. But more importantly, this is not the same Chiefs defense, the Chiefs offense, and so I am curious how this thing is evolving. Marcus Valdez, Scantling and sky Moore are just not happening, like it ain't happening. And so you saw Justin Ross get a few more snaps, really more targets he barely played, and Rashid Rice has been solid, and Justin Watson and Tony maybe at his best game of season, Like, are those the guys? They're gonna have to start figuring out who their guys are because they thought mvs and more were going to be their guys and they're not their guys. And Kelsey is supposed to play in this game. He did practice Tuesday, but his yards per target, his yard per catch, Mahomes' is yards per attempt, and yards per game. They're not just all down like they're all down a lot, and I think they want to put it on this team. That's one of the worst defenses that we've ever seen, the worst defense through five weeks in DVOA history. So if there are anything like the old Chiefs, this is like that Bears game where they put a forty.

00:33:20
Speaker 2: Captain captain degrees. But I mean, I Greg, you did a you did your best there.

00:33:28
Speaker 1: I am.

00:33:28
Speaker 2: I'm looking at a team where I think, like, on a short a short week Thursday night, what can you lean on? And like, I think the Chiefs can can run the ball, and if the Denver run defense is a dark void. Your best performance was the one hundred and twenty two yards you give up to Washington, three hundred and fifty to the Dolphins, one hundred and seventy one to Chicago. The Jets got right with two hundred and thirty four yards this past weekend, and you mentioned the DVOA. It's funny because, like our friend Aaron Shatz talked to the Athletic and he said that you're right, it's the worst ever measured going back to like nineteen eighty one, and that the gap between Denver's DVOA at number thirty two and Chicago's at number thirty one is the same gap as Chicago's at number thirty one and the Titans at twenty.

00:34:17
Speaker 1: They are historically putrid. And I just think, like, yeah, the Chiefs.

00:34:21
Speaker 2: Have to work themselves a little bit out of their funk. They just won two road games and they didn't do it in massively impressive fashion. But I would be stunned if there's any result of this game other than Denver, who aren't that special on offense in any way either, and we're handled a week ago, can do anything against this Chiefs team. It's like it would be an Andy Reid unusual Andy Reid meltdown to not go completely punch Denver out.

00:34:45
Speaker 1: Well, Cadarius, excuse me, Travis Kelcey not being physically right is obviously a major detriment to this offense. So if he's kind of gutting through another game and instead of you know, picking up twenty five yards just galloping through the second level of defenses, is he just doing those nine yard you know, a little turnarounds and it's you know, maybe a shovel pass near the goal line that makes such a big difference. Because obviously, you know, I was watching this morning the Giants Dolphins game. I was like, one you just got to knock out, And you know, we saw Tyreek Hill catch a wide receiver screen and then run diagonal across the defensive line through the linebacker corps and then into the opposite side of the field for like a fifty yard gain. And it was the first time I thought to myself, I wish Patrick Moms had you know a dude like this again, because you didn't really talk about it last year because he was he just kept motoring last year because Kelsey was so great. They need the idea of this summer storyline, which I don't think any of us like totally bought into to our credit in this case, that Kadarius Tony was going to be their number one. It's just not gonna happen. But can he give them more? And we maybe got a little bit this past week. Can he become a guy in this off that's what they need and until we get somebody else that steps up in this offense, and maybe they'll be active at the trade deadline. I think some of these games that we see as like total blowouts and one side of affairs are going to be surprisingly less exciting, less fireworks, less scoring. So maybe the Broncos hang around. But I could also see as I I think Pachenko could have a huge game here because that Denver run defense is horrific. That could be the storyline coming out of the Chiefs offense on Friday morning that they ran for two hundred and fifty yards in a blowout win.

00:36:34
Speaker 3: Well, plus the Chiefs defense is just making life difficult for other quarterbacks. Lagerious Need is really playing well. Trent McDuffie might be a Pro bowler this year in his second year, really one of the best slot corners in the league. And I saw that quote from Mike Greenberg the only time I ever see quotes from Mike Greenberg, So this is a little unfair. Is like when he says something stupid and then it's tweeted around. So I don't know, maybe he says other things, but he was saying, like, this is the worst Russell Wilson we've ever seen. Is because he hasn't watched them all year until that Jets game. And he's not worse, he's a little better. This offense is okay, he's better than he was a year ago, but he'll be tested versus Spagnola, who now can really do a lot of things in terms of the blitzes that he sends because he has such a good back end. It's a top ten defense, like Chiefs fans are getting ahead of their skis. It's like tenth, ninth or tenth. But it's a good defense, and that's that's enough.

00:37:27
Speaker 1: That was a total lot of Ravio Magnefiico from Greenberg. Gotta be careful with that stuff, and I know the accountability is at a different level with those morning shows, and you got a lot of time to fill. But anybody that's even half watching the Broncos knows that Wilson is far better and more productive. I mean, going into week five like he I know it's deceiving a little bit and he's not having a big year, but he was like a top ten producer and a lot of stat lines that was he couldn't complete anything. He couldn't get anything going last year at this time. But whatever. I'm glad you called it out because that annoyed me too. The second primetime game. We're hurting a little bit of here, guys, because what could be more lopsided than Denver case. How about Giants at Buffalo? My god, my god, And we have a rematch of Super Bowl twenty five. But there ain't no LT and there ain't no Otis Anderson and Jef Hosteller ain't gonna hold on to that ball when Bruce Smith smokes him in the end zone. Geez, this this Mark, it's your turn explain to me how this game is something that people will be wanting to watch after halftime.

00:38:41
Speaker 2: The only way that I really could is there is some optimism that Daniel Jones will play. From his own words, we'll see, although Daniel Jones hasn't really been a reason for optimism. Uh, there is a chance, I mean, there is a chance that you get Saquon back. It sounds like Andrew Thomas according to Brian Dable, your left tackle has a better shot than Saquon. But if you get these people back in the lineup, and you get healthy, and you catch a Bill's defense, you know, maybe on a couple big plays, a Bill's defense that is missing Matt Milano, missing Tredevia Swhite, missing Dai Kwon Jones.

00:39:21
Speaker 1: That's a big thing.

00:39:22
Speaker 2: The Jaguars were able to move the ball on Buffalo for portions of that game. The Bills had nineteen missed tackles against Jacksonville. I really like guys like Terrell Bernard and aj Epanessa and at Oliver this season, so they're getting they have depth. But I guess if you got a weird Josh Allen game, which is outside of the Jets performance that hasn't really been the case, and your Giants team does one of these things where you show up for a couple of quarters and maybe you get into They had three turnovers against the Dolphins. I know they still give up five hundred plus yards, but they had the one hundred and two yard pick six and two other turnovers. If all that stuff came together, maybe the Giants keep it interesting. But we've watched the Giants like forty two times on primetime and they've not fulfilled that promise.

00:40:05
Speaker 1: So I am suspicious.

00:40:07
Speaker 3: It is four out of six weeks and this is the last time I think, so congratulations.

00:40:12
Speaker 1: I mean the fact that the Giants got a pick six, as Mark said, another interception when the Dolphins were going in for a score, and a fumble recovery that set them up with good field position and they still lost thirty one sixteen. It's like, it's so telling. I think the Daniel Jones situation is it's noteworthy. You know, he had the neck injury and he's had neck issues before, and if they choose to play him in this game, I just, you know, I think what you might be seeing here with Jones, and I don't think he's being buried in criticism right now, but you know, he got paid mostly because of a strong close to last season. I know he was in general better than he had been previously before Dable got arrived, even in the first half of the year, but it was really that closing month or so where he was starting to like really shred d defenses, but also the in retrospect and even in the moment it was like, the schedule's pretty soft right now as he's doing this damage. He lit up the Vikings twice, for instance, including in that playoff win before reality hit against Philly. I just wonder if Jones is not a bad quarterback or even a quote unquote problem, but if he is in that rather a large middle class where if you set him up really well, you're gonna be okay, but if you put him with a bad corps, he's gonna not help you and sometimes look even worse because he tries to force things. So like, as you try to like diagnose what has happened with the Giants surrounding this kind of quarterback with a very bad corps around him, maybe it shouldn't be a surprising because I'm trying. I'm still trying to wrap my head around how they could nose dive the way they did the way they do, and I think the quarterback not being able to raise a team plays some part well.

00:41:55
Speaker 3: I think we put too much faith into most coaches and Deebo did a great but the offensive line miscommunications are just so bad. They're just so bad. And that isn't on Daniel Jones, and it's like it's high school football stuff or you know, even before that, where just guys are just coming free. Like let it's so often in a Giants game where defensive end is just coming free. But it's not even they're they're not even doing anything crazy upfront where it's like, oh, they're sending seven guys. It's like no, they're just rushing for and there's some crazy miscommunication and he gets killed. So that's on coaching. I hope Sakuon comes back. Waller looked okay last week. That's a positive. And U for the Bills that we're going DVO heavy, DVOA heavy today. They are the best three and two team in the history of tv OA. And I believe in like rebound effects for good teams, like when you're picking games, like if a good team loses the week before in a way, they weren't happy with like they usually show up ready to play, and Von Miller maybe he plays a little more. He only played twenty snaps week and didn't do much, but they got Dorian Williams from Two Lane University stepping in for Milano and he looked pretty good last week at lineback.

00:43:07
Speaker 1: Did you just did you just throw out something that's a record? Through Week five? There, I didn't say a record.

00:43:15
Speaker 3: I'm fine saying it as a stack, but we're not saying break the record. You can use it for context, but it's like he has broken the record.

00:43:23
Speaker 1: It's just the wording of records. What did you say? I don't know that. Maybe I messed it up. I'm just saying, like, what's honestly the difference. It's not like there's some museum where that's my point. Yeah, but I'm saying, like, what's the difference between what you just did and people bringing up the Dolphins.

00:43:41
Speaker 3: When they're making like a huge deal of like the moment that they reach it or whatever, like, Hey, you just brough it's you literally the words broke the record.

00:43:48
Speaker 1: That's it. Hey you just got the record? Did I say that? Well, you know, I don't know if you said record, Mark I don't know were you listening or close. I mean, you're in the words business.

00:43:58
Speaker 2: You made quite a no rotation out of a five game stretch for a team.

00:44:04
Speaker 1: Uh you know, you said they're the best. You said they're the best three and two team ever.

00:44:10
Speaker 3: In Yeah, in Dvoa they're the best you know, three and two team. That's a that's providing context. I'm all about stats providing context. Even the yards for the Dolphins is a good thing to mention. I think you're misunderstanding my point. It's not a record, that's it.

00:44:24
Speaker 1: We're we're in the words business. Words matter. Thank you, Thank you again, Greg for clearing things up for me. Okay, mission accomplished, So I get it. I'm with you.

00:44:34
Speaker 2: But one quick thing on Daniel Jones where it's like I like, I'm with you, Like I think like last year was was probably the aberration campaign and he stayed healthy and so did a lot of other people. Like when Tyrod Taylor came in this game, Like you know, when Tyrod Taylor can move around and he's not he's a solid backup, like he was getting killed. I mean it's like, yeah, they allow eleven sacks on Monday Night seven and Week five, the PFF hasn't ast the worst not only the worst pass protecting unit, but the worst run blocking. It's like, it's kind of hard to evaluate what's happening in this offense. When I think Daniel Jones at this point, it's like you kind of worry about the fact that he's probably just seeing ghosts and like concerned about his own safety. I mean, it's like these Get Giants games, it's like the Monday night game, Like, get Daniel Jones out of there, but then you have to put another human in there. I'd be worried about that person's safety too. This is a disaster, and I don't know how you get your way out of this because offensive line coaching matters. There's obviously a problem there, and you don't have the people to make this thing work.

00:45:31
Speaker 1: You know what else could be a disaster. A segment we have coming up right after these previews here in a very special day in the history of Mark Sessler coming up in just a little bit. Sessler at fifty, Well, you don't know, may surprise you. That's one that I'm tuning in for.

00:45:53
Speaker 2: I think, like the thing about the you know, the trajectory of the next fifty years in the in the other fifty things you didn't know about, Like I could I think I could pack a punch here. You know, there are some things I think I could do well, and this would be one of them in terms of divulging information that would surprise some people.

00:46:11
Speaker 1: All Right, finally, okay, this one. This one feels competitive and perhaps even fun. The Dallas Cowboys deeply humbled once again by the San Francisco forty nine Ers, now three and two, they head to Sofi Stadium for a matchup with the Chargers, who are coming off a bye week, who are chemically dependent on creating drama within games and making sure, no matter what the circumstances are, the game will come down to the final minutes. So on one hand, Greg, this feels like and I, you know, I like the Chargers enough to think that they're not just some pushover that the better team comes in and gets right against them. So I'm not saying that. But if the Cowboys have a little chip on their shoulder after being embarrassed, this is not a great time to catch the Cowboys for me. So I think that the Chargers are gonna have a very angry Dallas team that is going to have a lot to play for after being humbled the way they are. What do you think?

00:47:16
Speaker 3: I agree with that, and that's why I'll probably pick the Cowboys to win. But I expect this to be one of my favorite games of the week, one of my favorite matchups of the season so far, just because it's like drama.

00:47:30
Speaker 1: You just know they're gonna bring it. Justin.

00:47:32
Speaker 3: Herbert will do some crazy stuff, Mike McCarthy will make some crazy decisions so well, Brandon Staley, it'll go late, Troy and Joe will be having fun. I just can't imagine this game occurring without a crazy ending. What two teams have been more reliably like drama merchants than these two over the last five years.

00:47:50
Speaker 1: So I'm into it. I'm with you.

00:47:53
Speaker 2: It's a I think Dallas is gonna do things like this all season where they're gonna disappoint maybe places you didn't expect as you did. But then they're a bounce back team. They got a lot of talent, and I just think this this Chargers defense is an opportunity they right now. They have allowed explosive passes on about sixteen percent of opposing dropbacks, and we just talked about Denver. Only the Denver Broncos and Pittsburgh Steelers have allowed those plays at a higher rate.

00:48:22
Speaker 1: So I think that fits well with like a bounce.

00:48:25
Speaker 3: Maybe Brandon Staley went into the lab mark in the bye week and Brandon Staley figured.

00:48:30
Speaker 2: Sure, Maybe he went to Toronto and took a week off. I mean, we don't know what he did. Like, I mean, I feel like he's been in the lab for two plus years with a lot with a lot of additions last offseason too, and parts that fit his defense, and we didn't see it. I mean, I think like one thing that's kind of like to trade J. C. Jackson away is sort of like, you know, a bit of a tell that like you you get these guys, you're you're spending this money and they're not working. It's like this defense just is not a difference maker. But I do have hope in like what Herbert's done so far this season, I think you're gonna get the best version of Herbert all year long. And so it's like, you know, these charts we talk We talked to Daniel Jeremiah on Sunday night in the viewing room and we were just like, that's a great game you got coming up. He's like, yeah, it's be like every single game, Like the Chargers could play your high school and it.

00:49:15
Speaker 1: Would still come down to the final drive.

00:49:16
Speaker 2: So I just expect to, you know, be there in the with about fifty seconds to go, someone knocking on the door.

00:49:22
Speaker 1: Good news for the Bolts. It appears they're gonna finally get Austin Eckler back. He said last week that there is a quote long time between now and Monday Night football versus the Cowboys, so expecting to be back by then, for sure. He's been out three weeks with an ankle injury, and you know, he is such a huge addition for that Chargers team, especially I've always found in the red zone where he is just so gifted at and has such a nose for the goal line. So there is greg for the Chargers dreamers out there, of which you are one of them. There is certainly, even post Mike Williams injury, this world where Herbert continues to play at an MVP level and then you bring in this dynamic all purpose running back and they go up a level on offense, and then they start to kind of really build something here and they become a truly frisky contender in the AFC. This is a nice way to announce yourself. Is that way against Dallas in primetime? It would be fun to see it. Let's see if they can do it right.

00:50:28
Speaker 3: I'm with all that, But they've had a pretty favorable schedule in terms of opposing defenses, and this is a step up in class.

00:50:34
Speaker 1: I thought their offensive line was going to be great this year.

00:50:37
Speaker 3: It's been good, but it kind of struggled in that Raiders game, which was conserving. Herbert also hurt his finger in that game and it was definitely the worst game of herbert season in terms of his accuracy and decision making. I don't know if it was the finger or not. I don't know if he's going to be able to take snaps from center. We never really heard, like I think he broke the you know, he broke the finger, right, but it was on the offhand, and so that.

00:51:01
Speaker 1: That could be a factor. And I just I do worry.

00:51:03
Speaker 3: Do they have the horses to go deep because Keenan Allen has been making plays down the field. But it's Allen, it's Josh Palmer, Quinton Johnson, you know, make a tough catch Quinton Johnson, Like I can kind of see why they're not giving him a ton of snaps. They're kind of giving their return guy some more snaps. Like I do worry whether he has enough against a good Cowboys defense, but maybe it's not as good of a Cowboys defense as we thought, certainly in the back end without tre vending well, I.

00:51:27
Speaker 2: Mean they I mean, you know that Arizona game, Like I get that it was a weird contest, but it was this first moment where it's like, wait a minute, what are you doing giving up two hundred and twenty two yards rushing? And then they got gashed against the Niners. They've given up four hundred plus and two of their last three games. So I think there's like this matters for them to come up and show up. And I it is this week where it's like you just kind of presume that Dallas will bounce back and win, but like, imagine the NFL landscape if they don't.

00:51:53
Speaker 1: If they go in. I don't assume that. I don't assume that.

00:51:56
Speaker 3: I mean, I, like I said, I'm picking the Cowboys probably this game. They got a lot of questions.

00:52:01
Speaker 1: I got, I got a great game. I have Dak thrown a huge interception late that allows the Chargers to steal one with another Herbert big throw as he really takes hold. In the MVP conversation, thirty five thirty one bolts. I like that. I will.

00:52:20
Speaker 2: I also think that in their home stadium, with probably about a seventy five percent Cowboys crowd, the Charger you're going to say, we don't care about that. You're going to get one of these great Herbert games that shuts up the remaining.

00:52:33
Speaker 1: Herbert doubters for a while.

00:52:35
Speaker 2: And I think they take it twenty eight to twenty four final seconds.

00:52:42
Speaker 3: I'm a spooked. I hope you guys are right. I'm going to take the Cowboys. You know, they did finally get their offensive line. Let's go thirty four to thirty three. This thing's just wild. They did finally get the offensive line back that they intended to have when they drafted Tyler Smith with everyone helped healthy Biadis at you know, at center and Tyron Smith at left tech. It literally had never played together until last week. But you know, so that's a year plus four games until last week, and they weren't amazing against San Francisco.

00:53:14
Speaker 1: But maybe they'll get better.

00:53:15
Speaker 3: I think it's a big game for your boy McCarthy because he got rid of Kellen Moore and now he's going against Kellen Moore. And the old Texas Coast offense has limited Dak's interceptions relatively until last week. But even then, his interceptions have gone down, but every other offensive stat has gone down this year for Dallas yards yards per attempt. They can't get Brandon Cooks involved whatsoever. Now comes a Chargers defense that's pretty soft, and you should be able to take advantage of it.

00:53:45
Speaker 1: Let's let's show me something, you know, what's really jumped out. The Dax ceed lamp thing hasn't happened really this year, right, and Tony Pollard hasn't in general. Yeah, you're right. The offense is not necessarily humming right now. And uh, you know yeah, Mike McCarthy's gonna have to face some criticism if they don't show up in this game. But I think they will. I think we're gonna get points. I don't know. I think maybe for me. I gotta say it. For me, I've always I've been on the fence a little bit the last year or two on DAK. It's almost like Sunday night was a tipping point for me. I just I'm kind of out on Dak, so he's got to win. He's got to win me back get hot. I think it's totally fair.

00:54:27
Speaker 2: I mean, he's I'm waiting for the string of games that announced him and the Cowboys as something different than I already thought they were.

00:54:36
Speaker 3: It's been a while since he had a special game, even as a Dak.

00:54:41
Speaker 1: The wild card game against the Bucks, he was awesome, but like in general, it's it's been, you know, since the god I mean, if you really want to dig in a little bit, which let's not because we got to catch a bird, but really since the leg injury, has Dak been top ten quarterback? I would say no, But let's take and then let's see what he does on Monday Night. Anything else?

00:55:06
Speaker 3: Well, yeah, we got we got those banger Mark segments, right, Oh we have?

00:55:11
Speaker 1: Oh yes, I got developing news here. By the way, I'm Palm Roja out of Los Angeles. Stussler at fifty New Docs cast doubt over podcasters actual age. Let's see the birth certificate, Sessler. We're we've gotten to this place.

00:55:33
Speaker 2: I mean, so am I actually pretending that I'm older than I am.

00:55:36
Speaker 1: Is that right? But there's a you're actually like a sixty eight year old, leather faced old man that's been using a filter for years decade on the show. That would be incredible if that were true. No, in fact, if there was doubt. I mean the Manny Pacquiao workouts, the Hector Macho Camacho workouts. You're looking great, buddy at fifty, and we're very lucky to have you with us. How about we have a couple of two tree drinks at the airport bar to celebrate this momentous day.

00:56:08
Speaker 2: That is in that's only in a few hours from now. I genuinely am excited to go to London with you guys on this day. And well that is exactly what we'll do when we meet at lax which in outside of the airport bar is a disaster of a place, but we're gonna mine our way through that airport scenario.

00:56:28
Speaker 1: Well, why am I still talking? I don't. It's okay, this is your day, all right, and that's it for us here from America for a week. Well, next time you hear from us, yes, we will be overseas in London, so make sure you check in with all our content out there. Until then, Happy birthday, Mark and E the car