Episode 5 - The Fifth Episode

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<v Charlie Incarica>Before we kick off today's episode, I should let you know one of our sponsors has withdrawn its ads from our podcast due to what they deemed unflattering coverage of their restaurant.

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<v Charlie Incarica>But my primary responsibility isn't to any company.

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<v Charlie Incarica>It's to you, the listeners, and of course, to the victims of this unspeakable tragedy that I speak to you about every week.

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<v Charlie Incarica>Upholding their dignity in the interest of pursuing justice will always be the guiding principle here on the Murderer Killings.

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<v Charlie Incarica>That's why we urge you to visit themurdererkillings.com to check out our merch, where we have t-shirts, hoodies, aprons, and very large kitchen magnets, with the phrase The Murderer Killings, a podcast upholding the dignity of the Shady Grove murder victims while pursuing justice for them, as well as coasters, coffee mugs, and water bottles that, due to size restrictions, simply have a graphic of a cup of pudding with a knife sticking up through it.

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<v Charlie Incarica>And now, on with episode 5.

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<v Charlie Incarica>In April 2020, the world was facing an unprecedented pandemic and had all but shut down.

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<v Charlie Incarica>But for Shady Grove, there was extra cause for fear and confusion.

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<v Charlie Incarica>The four murders that had happened there in the last month.

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<v Charlie Incarica>And because of the lockdown, the residents believed the killer or killers could very well still be in their area or areas.

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<v Charlie Incarica>One of those residents was Taylor Branigan.

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<v Charlie Incarica>Although Tommy Ebner's name was still stenciled on the chief of police's door, he was also one of the murder victims, which at minimum presented a clear conflict of interest.

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<v Charlie Incarica>So Taylor Branigan now had to take over.

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<v Charlie Incarica>The city council had called an emergency session two days after Ebner's death to officially appoint her.

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<v Charlie Incarica>But a bitter debate quickly ensued about whether she should be appointed as acting chief or interim chief.

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<v Charlie Incarica>After weeks of tense negotiations, Mayor Carl Lyons crafted a compromise, and in the end, they agreed to appoint her acting interim chief.

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<v Charlie Incarica>To her credit, Branigan didn't allow the political quagmire to distract her.

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<v Taylor Branigan>What was worse was that the town was shut down, and everyone started working virtually, and based on that, the police force lobbied to work remotely too.

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<v Taylor Branigan>Mayor Lyons, because he needed their support in the upcoming mayoral election, approved it.

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<v Charlie Incarica>So you really had a lot working against you.

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<v Taylor Branigan>Yes, and no.

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<v Taylor Branigan>In some ways, it was more freeing.

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<v Taylor Branigan>And this was a police force entirely trained by Tommy Hebner, so I don't think it was necessarily a crippling blow.

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<v Charlie Incarica>Right, but were you being given enough resources to handle the case?

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<v Taylor Branigan>That was a little bit more complicated.

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<v Mayor Lyons>As I'm sure you can imagine, it was a particularly challenging time.

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<v Mayor Lyons>This is Carl Lyons, Shady Grove's mayor.

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<v Mayor Lyons>The effects of the COVID virus were horrifying.

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<v Mayor Lyons>The paperwork was just overwhelming.

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<v Mayor Lyons>We had to requisition for all sorts of crap.

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<v Mayor Lyons>APE for everyone.

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<v Mayor Lyons>And that stuff completely exploded our small town's budget for, you know, health and public safety and shit.

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<v Mayor Lyons>About the budget.

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<v Charlie Incarica>Um there's been a lot of speculation that the town didn't spend nearly enough on resources to help with the murders.

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<v Mayor Lyons>I think you'll find the people who may be saying that are not on the inside and so are just speculating.

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<v Charlie Incarica>Taylor Branigan's the person who's most frequently leveled those charges.

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<v Mayor Lyons>Exactly.

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<v Mayor Lyons>And when I say people without inside knowledge, I mean inside knowledge of a budget meeting.

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<v Mayor Lyons>But it's another thing entirely to be inside the room hashing out the budget, trying to see how the sausage gets made.

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<v Mayor Lyons>And believe me, this was a total sausage party.

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<v Mayor Lyons>I mean, there were good people on both sides.

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<v Charlie Incarica>But for someone citing a tight budget as the reason he didn't give the police many resources, it's hard to understand the council's first major decision after the lockdown demolishing the town hall and constructing a massive new building to replace it.

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<v Mayor Lyons>Yeah, but what most people don't understand is building the new town hall was a direct result of the pandemic restrictions.

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<v Charlie Incarica>How so?

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<v Mayor Lyons>Well, the government demanded there be always six feet between everyone.

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<v Mayor Lyons>Our old town hall simply lacked a size to accommodate that.

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<v Mayor Lyons>We needed this new building to stay in compliance.

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<v Charlie Incarica>Yeah, that seems a little hard to believe, frankly, especially with the fact so many of the staff were now working from home.

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<v Mayor Lyons>Well, there was so much confusion in those early days about what regulations were going to stay in place for how long and such a situation was it was very fluid at that time.

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<v Charlie Incarica>Wouldn't that argue against committing so much money to build a completely new structure?

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<v Mayor Lyons>Oh, well, now you're getting into numbers.

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<v Mayor Lyons>And I'm not a numbers guy, but the numbers don't lie.

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<v Charlie Incarica>The plan for a new town hall also made Branagan's job harder.

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<v Taylor Branigan>Yeah.

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<v Taylor Branigan>I had to waste two days cordoning off the town hall for its demolition.

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<v Taylor Branigan>Maryland's wanted the building implosion to be a big event.

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<v Taylor Branigan>He somehow tried to make it also a tribute to the murder victims.

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<v Taylor Branigan>He urged the town to come out, stand six feet apart, and hold a candlelight vigil, even though the demolition was at 10 30 in the morning.

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<v Taylor Branigan>And because most of the police were working from home, I had to set up iPads on music stands around the perimeter about every ten feet or so.

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<v Taylor Branigan>So an officer could tell the crowd to stand back via Zoom.

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<v Charlie Incarica>Sounds incredibly time consuming.

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<v Taylor Branigan>And stupid.

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<v Charlie Incarica>It was undeniably both.

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<v Charlie Incarica>As a result of the demolition, the clerks working there had to scramble to store documents anywhere and everywhere they could.

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<v Charlie Incarica>The police station, trunks of council members' cars, the dugouts at the Town Hall Little League field.

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<v Estelle Hayes>It was a logistical shit show.

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<v Estelle Hayes>They asked me if they could use a library van, but I told them it was a fucking van filled with books.

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<v Estelle Hayes>I offered them a room in my house with the documents via Airbnb, but at the last minute they complained about the shower pressure and bail.

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<v Charlie Incarica>In the interest of fairness, Estelle's shower pressure is often problematic.

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<v Charlie Incarica>But they were able to bail in part because Teddy Putnam offered to store the town's documents and computers in its newly vacant pudding applications lab.

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<v Charlie Incarica>It was a building the size of an airplane hangar, where Amanda had hired teams of scientists, social workers, and eminent members of the clergy to find other uses for pudding besides eating.

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<v Charlie Incarica>Teddy had closed the program within minutes of Amanda's death, largely because he said he was a quote, proud science skeptic.

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<v Estelle Hayes>It's actually a very clever move.

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<v Estelle Hayes>Now the whole town's records were literally controlled by the buttons.

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<v Charlie Incarica>Meanwhile, after weeks of politely being given the brush off, Taylor decided to visit Teddy on April 28th, not finding him at home or at his gym.

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<v Charlie Incarica>In desperation, she tried his office, where shockingly he was.

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<v Charlie Incarica>The following is from Taylor Branigan's police camera when she arrived at Teddy's office.

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<v Taylor Branigan>Mr.

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<v Teddy Putnam>Putnam?

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<v Teddy Putnam>Depends on who's asking.

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<v Taylor Branigan>I'm acting interim chief Brannigan of the Shady Grove Police Department.

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<v Teddy Putnam>Ah, I've certainly heard of your name.

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<v Taylor Branigan>You've also known me since about the age of ten.

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<v Taylor Branigan>We grew up together.

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<v Taylor Branigan>You took me to prom.

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<v Teddy Putnam>Ah, well, that explains it.

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<v Teddy Putnam>I have a terrible memory for dates.

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<v Teddy Putnam>This uh little irregular deputy interim chief actor showing up and flashing your badge in front of my employees.

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<v Teddy Putnam>You trying to get me to crack, hoping I'll be humiliated in front of my office?

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<v Teddy Putnam>I didn't flash a badge, and there's no one else here.

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<v Teddy Putnam>I noticed that too.

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<v Teddy Putnam>Is it a holiday or something?

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<v Taylor Branigan>The country's in a lockdown.

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<v Teddy Putnam>Of course.

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<v Teddy Putnam>That makes sense now.

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<v Teddy Putnam>Amanda meant so much to people.

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<v Taylor Branigan>No, I mean we're in a nationwide lockdown over the pandemic.

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<v Teddy Putnam>Oh, of course.

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<v Teddy Putnam>That makes even more sense.

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<v Teddy Putnam>Well, what can I get you to drink?

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<v Teddy Putnam>I had a fully stocked bar installed in my office after I watched Mad Men, which really made the days fly by.

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<v Taylor Branigan>No, thanks.

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<v Taylor Branigan>I'm on duty.

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<v Taylor Branigan>I just have a few questions about your late sister.

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<v Teddy Putnam>Ah, Amanda.

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<v Teddy Putnam>I'm still quite broken up about it.

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<v Taylor Branigan>With all due respect, Mr.

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<v Taylor Branigan>Putnam, you're saying you're broken up about it at the same time you're starting a game of Miss Pac-Man.

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<v Teddy Putnam>The thing is, Miss Pac-Man was our game.

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<v Teddy Putnam>Our father left it to us, and it synthesized our strengths beautifully.

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<v Teddy Putnam>Between Amanda's voracious appetite for hunting and destroying all who stood in her way, and my lifelong terror of ghosts, it complemented the two of us beautifully.

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<v Teddy Putnam>We fit together like hand in knife.

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<v Taylor Branigan>You mean hand and glove?

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<v Teddy Putnam>What did I say?

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<v Taylor Branigan>You said hand and knife.

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<v Teddy Putnam>What an odd thing for me to have said.

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<v Taylor Branigan>I just want to ask you a few simple questions.

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<v Teddy Putnam>Should I have my lawyer here?

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<v Taylor Branigan>That's certainly you're right.

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<v Teddy Putnam>I think it'll be okay.

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<v Teddy Putnam>These are just questions to rule me out of suspicion, right?

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<v Taylor Branigan>A few minutes ago you said I was hoping to make you crack.

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<v Taylor Branigan>What do you think you might crack over?

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<v Teddy Putnam>I'd like my lawyer.

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<v Charlie Incarica>The next time they met, Teddy's attorney Ellen Newberry was sitting next to him.

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<v Charlie Incarica>It's worth noting Ellen Newberry is a junior partner in the well-known international law firm Handley, Kelsey, Markowitz, and Jones.

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<v Charlie Incarica>And if the name Jones sounds familiar, it should.

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<v Charlie Incarica>And not simply because it's one of the most common surnames in the English language.

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<v Charlie Incarica>It's the last name of Margaret Mandragara Jones.

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<v Charlie Incarica>And that firm's senior partner, Tom Jones, is another name you might find familiar, as it's also the name of beloved Welsh-born singer Sir Tom Jones, whose hits include such pop classics as What's New Pussycat?

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<v Charlie Incarica>and It's Not Unusual.

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<v Charlie Incarica>But it's not that Tom Jones.

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<v Charlie Incarica>To be clear, this wasn't another Erica Hobbs situation, in that Erica Hobbes turned out to be Erica Hobbes' mother or Erica Hobbes' daughter, depending on which Erica Hobbes you're using as a starting point.

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<v Charlie Incarica>These Tom Joneses are of no relation to one another.

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<v Charlie Incarica>But Tom Jones is related to Margaret Mandragara Jones, the lawyer Tom Jones, not the Grammy-winning singing star.

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<v Charlie Incarica>Perhaps more importantly, however, he is Margaret's father.

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<v Charlie Incarica>And that, to borrow from the other, more musically successful Tom Jones songbook, caused acting interim chief Branigan to think it's not, not unusual.

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<v Charlie Incarica>In other words, she became suspicious.

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<v Taylor Branigan>Not only was it obvious that Margaret and Teddy struck up some kind of relationship, but it seemed possible they were in cahoots.

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<v Charlie Incarica>What did you think they were in cahoots about?

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<v Taylor Branigan>I wasn't sure at that point, but certainly it seemed cahooty.

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<v DA Theresa Nolo>A key stumbling block in all of this is that in the United States, the legal standard for establishing any level of cahootsing is exceptionally high.

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<v Charlie Incarica>This is Teresa Nolo, the district attorney for Upshaw County, whose jurisdiction includes Shady Grove, and who is among the last major characters to be introduced in this podcast.

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<v DA Theresa Nolo>The thing that struck me and my team is that the Jones family had to know the relationship between Margaret and her father would come to light.

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<v DA Theresa Nolo>So why were the Joneses so eager to free Teddy Putnam from suspicion?

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<v Charlie Incarica>I asked Margaret directly about this.

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<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>Well, firstly, I reject the premise of your question.

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<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>Why would we think the Shady Grove police would be able to make any connection between anything?

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<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>This is a town that invested nearly $50,000 in Lederhosen because they continually confused Australia with Austria.

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<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>It's a police force that met me at the airport with a motorcade, yet still managed to arrive late for my meeting at Town Hall because they had not once, but twice pulled over to let each other pass.

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<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>Having said that, I don't think there's anything wrong with providing an acquaintance with a path to excellent legal counsel.

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<v Charlie Incarica>Had Teddy done you any favors during your stay in Shady Grove?

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<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>Well, we became friendly during the lockdown.

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<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>I didn't find his conversation especially engaging, but he did have a very large supply of absinthe, so I figured he was worth knowing on some level.

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<v Charlie Incarica>Teddy's new lawyer immediately called for a change of venue.

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<v Charlie Incarica>When Branigan and Nolo pointed out Teddy wasn't on trial, so there was no court venue to change, Newberry clarified she was calling for a change of venue for the interrogation room, claiming the color scheme of the walls in the room was a clear Eighth Amendment violation against cruel and unusual punishment.

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<v DA Theresa Nolo>This was clearly a power play, a naked delaying tactic.

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<v DA Theresa Nolo>However, the actual color of the paint is called gulag green.

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<v DA Theresa Nolo>And even though we'd hung a few cat-themed inspirational posters, cheered up a bit, it was still pretty grim.

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<v DA Theresa Nolo>So her complaint wasn't without merit.

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<v DA Theresa Nolo>We eventually settled on the back office of a funeral parlor.

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<v Charlie Incarica>The following is from the interview of Teddy Putnam.

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<v Taylor Branigan>Teddy, you were born on December 9th, 1972, correct?

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<v Taylor Branigan>On the advice of my counsel, I plead the fifth.

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<v Taylor Branigan>Sorry, quick word with my client.

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<v Taylor Branigan>Of course.

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<v Teddy Putnam>Oh, I thought I thought you said that's what I'm saying.

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<v Teddy Putnam>Oh, great.

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<v Taylor Branigan>And is it also true that you share your birthday with your sister, the late Amanda?

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<v Teddy Putnam>On the advice of counsel, I plead My counsel advises me I was born on the same day as my twin sister.

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<v Teddy Putnam>And would you say the two of you were close?

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<v Teddy Putnam>Very much so.

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<v Taylor Branigan>That's a little odd, Teddy.

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<v Taylor Branigan>Because you told the first officer on the scene, Sergeant Joseph Rino, you two always saw the world in totally opposite ways.

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<v Teddy Putnam>I'm sorry, I thought you meant physically close.

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<v Teddy Putnam>We were very physically close for a while, especially in utero.

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<v Teddy Putnam>I see.

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<v Taylor Branigan>In what year did your sister start taking an active part in running the company?

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<v Teddy Putnam>Oh, gosh, like ten, fifteen or so years ago at this point.

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<v Taylor Branigan>2008?

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<v Teddy Putnam>2008, 2010, something like that.

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<v Teddy Putnam>I do remember it was an even numbered year because in even numbered years our company Foosball Fantasy Leagues would hold a pure auction draft, whereas in odd-numbered years we did what's known as a snake draft.

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<v Taylor Branigan>Okay.

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<v Taylor Branigan>Within 45 minutes you officially identifying the body of your sister, you made four phone calls.

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<v Taylor Branigan>For the record, I am sharing with Mr.

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<v Taylor Branigan>Putnam and his attorney a log of his calls that morning.

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<v Taylor Branigan>The first was to the foosball wholesaler, who took the foosball tables out of your offices when Amanda stepped in.

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<v Taylor Branigan>The second was to another foosball table distributor when you discovered the first foosball table company had gone out of business.

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<v Taylor Branigan>The third to Margaret Mandragara Jones, and the fourth was to the head of your company's Pudding Research Division, informing them their department was immediately liquidated.

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<v Teddy Putnam>Right.

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<v Teddy Putnam>Well, I'd sent an email to security ordering them to throw the researchers off company property, so I felt I owed it to the team to let them know why they were being, in many cases, physically thrown off our grounds.

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<v Teddy Putnam>Why were you so quick to shut that program down?

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<v Teddy Putnam>You'd known your sister was dead less than an hour.

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<v Teddy Putnam>Amanda always valued efficiency.

00:15:33.600 --> 00:15:36.080
<v Teddy Putnam>In a way, it was a tribute to her.

00:15:36.480 --> 00:15:40.399
<v Taylor Branigan>What did you talk to Miss Mandragara Jones about during your phone call that morning?

00:15:41.440 --> 00:15:46.080
<v Teddy Putnam>Well, I knew what an admirer she was of my sister and her liquor collection.

00:15:46.080 --> 00:15:48.080
<v Teddy Putnam>I thought it best she'd hear it from me.

00:15:48.080 --> 00:15:49.679
<v Teddy Putnam>Did you call her regularly?

00:15:49.679 --> 00:15:51.200
<v Teddy Putnam>Define regularly.

00:15:51.200 --> 00:15:53.759
<v Teddy Putnam>Did you speak to her on a regular basis?

00:15:53.759 --> 00:15:56.879
<v Teddy Putnam>If that's what you mean by regularly, then yes.

00:15:57.200 --> 00:15:58.159
<v Taylor Branigan>What did you talk about?

00:15:58.559 --> 00:16:01.600
<v Teddy Putnam>Oh gosh, I mean I couldn't tell you exactly.

00:16:01.600 --> 00:16:03.279
<v Teddy Putnam>Just, you know, life stuff.

00:16:03.279 --> 00:16:11.840
<v Teddy Putnam>And sometimes I'd pick out words and ask her to say them in her accent, usually ones with lots of vowels like aluminum or hello.

00:16:11.840 --> 00:16:13.840
<v Teddy Putnam>Did you discuss business?

00:16:13.840 --> 00:16:15.440
<v Teddy Putnam>Well, in a sense.

00:16:15.440 --> 00:16:16.639
<v Teddy Putnam>What sense?

00:16:16.639 --> 00:16:25.679
<v Teddy Putnam>We discussed the business of being alive, of being thinking feeling organisms on this fragile blue marble most called Earth.

00:16:25.679 --> 00:16:26.320
<v Teddy Putnam>Okay.

00:16:26.320 --> 00:16:28.879
<v Teddy Putnam>Oh, and shady grove pudding.

00:16:28.879 --> 00:16:29.600
<v Teddy Putnam>I almost forgot.

00:16:29.600 --> 00:16:30.879
<v Teddy Putnam>We talked tons about that.

00:16:30.879 --> 00:16:32.720
<v Teddy Putnam>Went into real detail.

00:16:32.720 --> 00:16:35.360
<v Teddy Putnam>She had endless questions about my company.

00:16:35.679 --> 00:16:39.200
<v Charlie Incarica>Newberry immediately called an abrupt halt to the interview.

00:16:39.600 --> 00:16:43.360
<v Taylor Branigan>So, armed with this information, I brought Margaret back in for questioning.

00:16:43.600 --> 00:16:44.879
<v Charlie Incarica>At the funeral parlor?

00:16:45.279 --> 00:16:45.600
<v Taylor Branigan>No.

00:16:45.600 --> 00:16:50.559
<v Taylor Branigan>I asked one of the few officers working at the station to get some paint and take care of it.

00:16:50.559 --> 00:16:54.799
<v Taylor Branigan>Unfortunately, Mayor Lyons caught wind of it and denied the expense.

00:16:54.799 --> 00:16:59.679
<v Taylor Branigan>So, then I had the officer check Craigslist for anything being given away we could use.

00:16:59.679 --> 00:17:03.120
<v Taylor Branigan>I should have been more hands-on, as it turns out.

00:17:03.440 --> 00:17:07.359
<v Charlie Incarica>The police interview room had wallpapered over its unsightly paint.

00:17:07.359 --> 00:17:12.160
<v Charlie Incarica>But to Branigan's dismay, it was wallpaper for a small child's room.

00:17:12.400 --> 00:17:16.319
<v Taylor Branigan>Less than ideal, but the important thing was to get Margaret in again.

00:17:16.319 --> 00:17:17.039
<v Taylor Branigan>Okay.

00:17:17.039 --> 00:17:19.519
<v Taylor Branigan>Margaret Mandrager Jones.

00:17:19.519 --> 00:17:22.000
<v Taylor Branigan>Second interview on May 3rd, 2020.

00:17:22.000 --> 00:17:27.039
<v Taylor Branigan>Present with her is her attorney, Ellen Newberry, and myself, acting interim chief Taylor Branigan.

00:17:27.039 --> 00:17:29.519
<v Taylor Branigan>And assorted Muppets in Napies.

00:17:29.519 --> 00:17:33.519
<v Taylor Branigan>The interviewee is referring to the temporary wallpaper in the room.

00:17:33.519 --> 00:17:34.880
<v Taylor Branigan>Indeed, I am.

00:17:35.200 --> 00:17:40.640
<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>Remind me, who are the characters on the wall of this interview room in your actual police station?

00:17:40.640 --> 00:17:42.559
<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>They're Muppet Babies, but I don't think so.

00:17:42.559 --> 00:17:43.440
<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>No, agreed.

00:17:43.440 --> 00:17:45.200
<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>Acting Interim Chief Branigan.

00:17:45.200 --> 00:17:47.440
<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>I just wanted to hear you say it for the record.

00:17:47.440 --> 00:17:49.279
<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>Well, I'd worry less about the wallpaper.

00:17:49.279 --> 00:17:57.519
<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>You mean the Muppet Babies wallpaper that you, in one of your first command decisions as acting interim chief, ordered hung in your police interrogation room?

00:17:58.000 --> 00:17:58.480
<v Taylor Branigan>Yes.

00:17:58.799 --> 00:18:00.160
<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>Sorry, just clarifying.

00:18:00.160 --> 00:18:04.559
<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>So you want me to worry less about the pictures of Kermit the Frog than what?

00:18:04.559 --> 00:18:10.480
<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>The Paw Patrol decals, which no doubt festoon the inevitably unlocked room in which you store your firearms?

00:18:10.720 --> 00:18:17.440
<v Taylor Branigan>I'd worry more that you claimed your former assistant told you about the murders of March 9th, when Teddy Putnam claims he was the one who told you.

00:18:17.680 --> 00:18:20.400
<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>Well, you can't be taking anything he says seriously.

00:18:20.400 --> 00:18:24.559
<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>Teddy Putnam's about as reliable as a watch built by a squirrel.

00:18:24.559 --> 00:18:28.880
<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>I think on balance the infant Muppets are more troubling to me with all due respect.

00:18:28.880 --> 00:18:32.000
<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>Well, if you have no further questions from my client, I'm Actually, I do.

00:18:32.240 --> 00:18:44.640
<v Taylor Branigan>For the record, I am handing Miss Mandragora Jones and her attorney a phone record registering a phone call between Teddy Putnam and Miss Mandragara Jones that took place between 1048 and 1122 on the morning of March 9th, 2020.

00:18:44.640 --> 00:18:48.960
<v Taylor Branigan>You mean to tell me you and Teddy didn't discuss his sister's murder?

00:18:49.279 --> 00:18:55.200
<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>I'm sure it must have come up at some point, but we tended to focus our conversations on another topic.

00:18:55.200 --> 00:18:58.799
<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>Which was Well, it's not strictly relevant to the murder inquiry.

00:18:59.119 --> 00:19:00.720
<v Taylor Branigan>Why don't we make that my call?

00:19:01.279 --> 00:19:09.920
<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>Most of our conversations, AIC Rannigan, centered around his asking me a series of sexually explicit knock-knock jokes.

00:19:10.480 --> 00:19:12.319
<v Taylor Branigan>Um what?

00:19:12.880 --> 00:19:13.440
<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>Indeed.

00:19:13.440 --> 00:19:15.599
<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>I feel that's the only appropriate reaction.

00:19:15.599 --> 00:19:21.119
<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>However, his X-rated knock-knock jokes are the closest thing to the performing arts in this perforated ulcer of a community.

00:19:21.119 --> 00:19:24.079
<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>And fair play to him, some of them weren't half bad.

00:19:24.079 --> 00:19:29.680
<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>Of course, I'd been drinking far more absinthe than is medically prudent, which may have made me less than strictly objective on that front.

00:19:29.680 --> 00:19:31.519
<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>Were you and Teddy sexually involved?

00:19:31.519 --> 00:19:33.119
<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>My client doesn't have to answer that.

00:19:33.119 --> 00:19:35.519
<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>I'm actually gonna side with my lawyer on this one.

00:19:35.519 --> 00:19:46.640
<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>Unless you can prove to me the relevance of such a question to solving these horrible murders, which still seem to me aggressively unsolved, I don't feel I have the need to comment on my personal life any further.

00:19:46.640 --> 00:19:50.480
<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>Besides, think of the cartoon Babies on Your Wall.

00:19:50.480 --> 00:19:53.440
<v Margaret Mandragora-Jones>We don't want them growing up too fast now, do we?

00:19:54.799 --> 00:19:58.880
<v Charlie Incarica>Margaret's reaction suggested Taylor Branigan had struck a nerve.

00:19:58.880 --> 00:20:01.039
<v Charlie Incarica>Here's DA Theresa Nolo.

00:20:01.440 --> 00:20:11.119
<v DA Theresa Nolo>And though, as I said, the legal standard for proving cahootsing with malice aforethought is notoriously hard, we all felt confident we were onto something.

00:20:11.359 --> 00:20:24.160
<v Charlie Incarica>I requested a warrant to wiretap their phones, but then Teresa Nolo was going to share with you the surprising twist on that story, but I thought it was such a good twist that I wanted to do it.

00:20:24.160 --> 00:20:30.799
<v Charlie Incarica>An hour after the judge allowed the police to tap the phones of Teddy and Margaret, the warrant was revoked.

00:20:30.799 --> 00:20:34.480
<v Charlie Incarica>And it came all the way from the governor's mansion.

00:20:34.480 --> 00:20:41.119
<v Charlie Incarica>Why would Alice Hart hinder an investigation into the murder of her daughter-in-law?

00:20:41.359 --> 00:20:43.279
<v Estelle Hayes>I've got some theories.

00:20:43.680 --> 00:20:45.359
<v Charlie Incarica>Indeed, Estelle does.

00:20:45.359 --> 00:20:47.599
<v Charlie Incarica>And we'll hear about them next time.

00:20:47.599 --> 00:20:51.119
<v Charlie Incarica>I'm Charles and Karika, and this continues to be.