Bangkok: Where the Nightlife Heals (ft. Pangina Heals)

Some travel journeys are all about solitude and reflection. Why
at beaches, long walks, slow mornings with a cup of
coffee and others they're about sound, spectacle, adventure, and the
thrill of discovering new parts of ourselves by way of
the people and spaces around us. This is Wayfinder, life
changing travel. This podcast goes beyond the guide books into
the heart and soul of real life travelers as they
journey around the world. I'm your host, Daniel Scheffler, and
I have seen firsthand how our stories connect us and
inspire us. In today's episode, I got to sit down
in person with my dear friend Pangina Heels to talk
about her hometown, Bangkok, Thailand. You may know Pangina as
the iconic drag superstar or a contestant on RuPaul's Drag Race,
but what you may not know is the roles she's
played in shaping Bangkok's queer nightlife and cultural landscape. We
recorded this conversation the morning after a night out together
where I experienced firsthand all the glitz and glamour that
Bangkok has to offer. This time, I'm not just your host,
I'm the traveler. Okay, good, morning, Good morning, Panngina heels
here we sit at the Aman Bangkok together. Yes we
are Hello, Hi darling. Thanks for last night. It was good.
Oh wow, and you didn't even have to pay me, uh,
just a freebie. Yeah. I loved seeing you work a
little magic. The way people looked at you was so sweet.
People were like, wow, there's the star. There's that person
who offers us a glimmer of hope. That's sweet of you.
I think it's just drunk.
But it was a fun time letting you see me
in my element and just seeing both of the nightclubs
that are the popular ones. I mean, most of them
are popular, but these two are the ones that people
really go to to see drag and the other one
is just to see some boys.
Yeah yeah, how long have you been in Bangkok? All
my life?
I was born in Sabakan, which is like the suburb
of Thailand. It's like an hour away to a Taiwanese
mother and a Thai father.
So I'm the two taies right. What was your suburbs?
Like poor Taye people.
We lived close by the fields like rice paddi fields,
and you see parents every day just like different birds.
And my parents had like a factory, so we would
be there and the highlight of every week is to
go to KFC once a week because that was like
our I was splurred wow.
Vanjina was raised by the suburbs, but it was in
the city of Bangkok where she eventually found her belonging.
I think I was around fifteen. I would sneak into
these clubs. I don't recommend it, but because I wanted
to be around people who understood me, who I did
not need to explain certain things because at the time,
a lot of my friends were not gay until I
went out to this gay club. It's called DJ Station.
I'm sure you've been. There is a rule now that
you can't dance on the speaker, and I believe it's
because of me.
Ah.
I wanted to have friends who understood what it's like
to go through this journey called life. And so for me,
having been in that space, I found lifelong friends.
I found people who I could rely on.
I found my current business partner, Like fifteen years ago.
For a young performer like Pandina, Bankok was both a
beacon and a one way ticket to a more authentic future.
What are some of your favorite parts about living in
this great city. It's so freeing.
You feel kind of like liberated to be able to
you walk and wear anything you want. No one's going
to tell you otherwise. People are very tolerant. So like
me being a drag queen, I would just dress up
as a woman and go out at night and I
would never feel unsafe. There's an alley in Thailand called
Sealumsoy four where I would get dressed up and walk
the streets, and then one day this bar owner was like,
you're kind of crazy.
Do you want to perform here? And that's how it started. Wow.
There is a sense of like rush when you go
out at night and you're doing something that society necessarily
say you can't do.
It just makes you feel alive.
Yeah, Bangkop, I think anywhere you go most of the time,
you feel like you can just be who you want
to be.
Wow. Yeah, don't you wish that for the whole world?
I would love that. I have been coming to Thailand
since I was a kid, right Like I came for
the first time when I was seventeen to come party
in Bangkok. Where did you go? I can't remember. I
just went out on the town like I went to
gay Bars. It was like two thousand. It was like
the millennia. O R. It was that era. I'm just
a little older than you, and I remember thinking it's
open and free and it's not what I expected. Right.
Do you think that Thailand is like that because it's
kind of its own thing. It's the country in Asia
that's never been colonized. I mean, there's no prouder nation
than the Ties, right. Yeah. We love our country. It's
ingrained to now our TNA. Yeah. Yeah, So a part
of that to me seems like, well, we love Ties
and we love all type people, so why would we
hate on anybody that's part of our society because it's
such a multifaceted grouping of people.
Yes, we're like very prideful. But also on top of
that level is a fact of tourism. One of our
main income is tourism. So I think that's why we're
called the Land of smeus is because that's part of
our culture is to welcome people from all over the
world and.
In general, which is very friendly people. I think sometimes
your fault. You're very friendly to a certain extent.
Yes, just don't get on my bad side because I'm scurry.
I think Bangkok is so associated with nightlife. Yes, right,
It's such an iconic nightlife city. And I came here
as a seventeen year old boy because I was like, oh,
I can be free there. I had no desire to
escape my life, but it offered me an insight into
myself because it offered me a place where I was
free and expressing in a way that I was never
allowed to in my life. Tell me your version of that.
I think it's about learning who you are and who
you want to be, meeting the people that will eventually
become your tribe. And I think it's great to be
able to your rate your own life based on what
you do on the night out.
There's this idea that nightlife is entertainment, and you're of
course an entertainment, but there's also this idea that it's
a place for freedom and a place for expression. And you,
by opening these bars and these clubs, you're offering people
that lifeline. You're offering them this place of expression, You're
offering this place of existence, community and a place of community.
Yeah. I think as gay travelers, we are always trying
to find our community or our haven, right, I would say,
And no matter which city you go, there's a certain
degree of having to find that. And I think with
Bangkok it's so readily available that sense of safety and
sense of being able to explore who you are and
then finding out more about yourself that it's unlike other cities.
And so because Bangkok is such an open space, it's
not just one bar, it's an alley, it's an area,
So that way you can prouce, you can sachet down
the street and find what you like in different pockets
of this magic that we call Bangkok.
Much thanks to Panjina, Bangkok's drag scene isn't just a
means for entertainment. It's become a cultural institution. And it
all began at her first club, the House of Heels.
So tell me, like, what is the drag scene like here?
Why did you think that there was a space for
you to open House of Heels and all the other
niche bars as you told me that you've opened in
the city.
In terms of the House of Heels, I've worked in
straight clubs all my life. Sorry for you, I know
every since that boring, right, I mean, no offense, but
all offense. It's like a lot of the straight clubs,
they play the same top forties, and when I perform
at the straight clubs, I don't feel safe, like people
would pull my wigs out when they're drunk. And so
one day I wanted to create a space that was
safe for the performers and for everyone else. I have
had the experience of seeing what nightclubs could be and
what Thailand or Bangkok was not offering. So I was
a little inspired by something from New York. So I
was a little inspired with something from San Diego, something
from Singapore, and so I wanted to create something that
we didn't have and something I wanted. The experience of
opening the first nightclub is like having a child.
You're worrying about everything.
I felt like I slept at the nightclub itself because
with all the construction, with the things coming together, then
on top of that, you will wonder if anyone will
show up. So it's such a mix of emotions and
I remember never ever stop worrying about it, and after
having the opening, you felt like such a relief.
After it goes well, it was received.
Phenomenally, like people had to wait in line because the
space was small, but it was intimate and all the
celebrities came.
It had the.
Magic that Bangkok has never seen before because it had
drag queen performers, we had live singers, and people just
love the vibe of it. You know, you can't explain
the magic of a certain space.
A lot of people when.
They go there, they were like, this feels like going
to your gay best friend's house and just partying there.
Like we would wake up one day and we see
like paces on the wall. It was wild. The stories
you would hear, Oh my god.
Then we've had a lot of stars came through. We've
had Duaalipa here, We've had Lisa from Black Pink here,
We've had cl from Townyjuan Lupita Nyongo, and so lots
of celebrities do feel safe to come here because you know,
it's in the Renaissance Hotel as well, so that offers
a certain amount of security. And so that's how it
all began. And we've been going on five years strong,
and I've basically curated the best of the best queens
to perform at Heels. So if you're performing at Heels,
you've got to have your shit together because.
You're no longer baby queens.
You're working with the top in the industry, and so
it's kind of nice to have that pressure on each
of us as well, so that we can't stay complacent.
Speaking of Heels, the way you spell your Pandrina heels
h e a l s opposed to h e e
l s. Let's talk about that, Yes we can.
I do think that when the world used to be one,
the super continent Pangaea. That's half of what my name
came from. So I think the world is so divided,
especially right now. I think that wouldn't it be nice
we were just all one continent without all this clashing.
And I think what drag does for me is heals
other people, and it healed me. And so I think
that through this journey of this art form, I've seen
so many people lit up, and I think that's one
of the greatest gift to myself is looking around the
nightclub and seeing people laugh yeah, no matter who they are.
And I feel like that's what I'm born onto this
earth to do, is to give people happiness.
Oh you're doing it. I saw you last night. People
were like, got gang, thank you. And the House of
Heels wasn't the only club Pandolna opened.
My goal is to open niche places. And I use
this term very loosely, but like Beef for example, is
a place where all the bears come together.
But then my other club is Silver Sand, which is
more like.
A dive bar or anyone who loved like baby queens,
So that's like the place you foster new talent.
And then there's Horn which is.
For DM lovers, you know techno. And there is DT,
which is a shower show bar.
Oh will you be in the showers? Oh? Hell no.
I don't want people to leave, you know.
I was so inspired by like being in Vegas. They
just make dance such an art form. I just love
stark disilay, so I kind of want to bring that
element back.
Into Bangkok a little bit.
I don't want people going out at night to just
have the same thing. They should have an experience, and
that's what most of my venues does. The scent when
you walk in, the decoration, the music, all of it
must blend in a beautiful orgy. You always remember that night.
I do delling, and I think it's nice to do
something that you haven't done before and you're a little
afraid because that's when you feel most alive, and so
that's always been my motto in life. If it makes
you a little afraid, you should do it.
Yeah.
So I think having those nightclubs and always constantly using
fear as fuel, I was able to do most of
the things I did in life.
Like all the places we've explored, the city of Bangkok
reveals itself through its flavors. So here A'pendinna's tips for
finding delicious food in the city.
One of the restaurants that you have to go to
in Thailand, in my opinion, is Hi Some Thumb Convent,
which is in Si Convent that's hard to pronounce Darling
Haiha High Convent. Oh my god. The food is so
good and so cheap. It's Northern food, so it has.
Like sausage and all the types of soup.
But also like for any people coming to Thailand who
wants like a safe intro to Tay food, you can
go to like Nara.
It's always going to be good.
Oh good. I love Eat Me Restaurant. It's a restaurant
that has a pun in its name because where you
want to go eat me? So you're like, really, is
that the first thing you say? The cocktails are great,
there's always artwork, the food is decadent.
I do enjoy that place.
There's also a Michelin Star restaurant that I recommend, which
is called.
Royal O Chap.
So if you want to have the experience of Thai
food but like habits so bougied up with the presentation,
you'll enjoy it. And one of my favorite things is
looking at what local office workers go to. You sit
out and like you poach, and you like, okay, where
are they all walking on? Because that's what they have
to eat every day, so you know that it's got
to be good. So that's one of my favorite things
to do. Even if I go overseas as well, it's
like what.
Are they eating? What are the locals? You're smart, thank you.
But also a trick in Thailand if the restaurant you
eat looked like there was a murder scene happened there,
possibly it's usually good.
Yeah, you're right, you know what I mean, you're totally right. Yeah.
The nightlife of Bangkok that we know today didn't appear
out of nowhere. It sits on decades of queer history,
cabaret houses and live performers who shaped Thailand's global identity
long before the rest of the world paid attention. There's
a history of drag shows here, right, there's a history
of lady boys, which I don't know we still to
create say that word out loud. I don't know, are
we still saying that? What are we saying now? I
think just trends women's show or cabaret show or showgirls lost.
But at the time eighties, nineties, early two thousands, it
was thy ladyboys for sure. Yeah, and then that evolved
into cabaret stars show girls.
We can call them show girls. I think that's what
politically correct a waere woke people use it. But the
word lady boy is so attached to who we are,
so most Thai people would just like call it's the
lady boy show.
Still even still wow, how is that different from a
drag queen? Well, that's a really good question.
So traditionally Thailand has a culture of cabaret shows, and
it's very specific to Thailand because nowhere else in the
world would have a big cabaret show where the main
performers are all trans women. Other places more rouge, they're
biological women. But here in Thailand that's been the history
ingrained into the context of our culture. So that along
with something called Miss Tiffany pageant where they have I
think once a year, trans women compete and it's seen
all over the world. So that causes the society to
accept transwomen and they call it women Type two South
a hit song. So that's why we were so opened
to trans women and trans people in general. But the
main difference is that most showgirls would live their life
as a woman versus some drag queens in Thailand, like me,
would live my life as a boy. That doesn't mean
because a lot of people are going to clock me
on that. It doesn't mean drag queens in general have
to live as a boy, right, But in Thailand, stereotypically
that is the case.
Right. Well, it's just free. You can do whatever. Yeah,
it doesn't can do it a role, there's no role.
When I started coming here, I was very aware that
the country was different to anywhere else I've been, and
I couldn't quite understand why. I was like, oh, I
need to really get under the skin here, make thy friends,
dip into the culture, the ancient culture and the kind
of contemporary culture where there's a sort of I love
the mix of old kind of wisdomy wonderful zenness, and
then that sort of blade run of futurism, right that
exists in Bangkok in a way that doesn't really exist anywhere.
New York feels very of the moment. Bangkok feels in
many ways of the future.
Yes, there's a very much sense of the future, but
also a place trapped in time.
You can find pockets of stuff like that for sure. Yeah, yeah,
we were talking about this last night. That ancient Thaie
wisdom comes from seeing things two sides of a corner,
making a hand movement of like a fish flopping over
back and forth. Isn't that very time? It's so time?
We love the Can I say oxymoronic qualities? The dichotomy
of everything, Like you would see the most five star
hotel in the next block over, it's like the shanty town.
That's Thailand for you. The cleanest, the dirtiest, the grungiest,
the best, the worst, choose you an adventure.
How did you infuse that into your drag.
So back in the day, I was very unpolished, very crazy,
I would say whatever. And then having been on drag race,
I fell in love with fashion and I fell in
love with the polishness of everything and just the idea
that no one can say anything about you from the
head to toe. For me, that is such a diss
and I love it so For me, I love that
my mouth is itself, the gritty, the dirty, the grungy
weapon that I have, and my dragon itself is I
love looking perfect.
You always look perfect. Well wait, I'll fanboy for one second.
I mean you were incredible on drag Race. Thank you. Yeah,
my husband and I were both like, oh my god,
you arrived that polish.
Oh.
I did a lot of preparation that I was serious. Yeah,
you was serious.
I was really serious. I took eleven types of classes
in those preparations. Wow, people didn't know like I relearned
how to sew, learn how to make hair, We learned
how to make up, fashion, history, meditation, acting.
It was eleven types of classes. I hate it when
the queens arrived, like, I've never saw what the fuck
is that? Right? Wait, you're coming on.
Drag Race, you know, you know, you know there's gonna
be that. God, drag is art and with that art
can teach you lessons in life, but also it could
really heal you. I think drag is a teacher, drag
is a doctor, and I think drag is someone's best friend.
That's what's at the heart of Bangkok. Its contrast ancient
and futuristic, quiet temples and loud nightclubs, grunge and glamour
often on the same street, and these elements come together.
And Panjoina's work is a drag queen and nightclub owner.
But let's take a pause and share a few of
her favorite spots and things to do in Bangkok.
I do love the drag shows at Stranger Bar, so
a lot of my sisters do perform there. It's filled
with backpackers and people from all walks of life, fashion people,
so it's cool because you never know who's going to
wander into there. There's so many rooftop bars in Bangkoks.
I'm not gonna recommend one. But also I love getting
a good massage. The best passage plays in a Bangkok
that I recommend that is safe is prime massage. You
should always book one day in advance. But the skill,
the level that they do, they would transport you into Nirvana.
They're so well trained that the massage is out of
this world.
You know. One of my favorite things in Thailand to
do is exactly what happened last night. You were like,
I'm out and you paid some man seventy bady and
I hopped onto the back of a motorcycle, no helmet,
just holding on. You know that my driver or the
man who was operating such motorbike, he was like ninety
five years old. He would look like Gondolph. Yeah. Yeah,
and off I went and it was raining, went through
the pools of water, just into the night. Yeah, that
is one of my favorite things to do. I love it.
For a dollars. Yeah, you can just go out in
the world. And the man was so sweet and he
wanted to drop me right at the dawn, right and
to be like, wait, we've got to make sure that
you're safely tucked into bed, like tye. People are friendly, man.
There's a part of the culture here that I deeply, deeply,
deeply love, and it's that it's that people want to
be hospitable. In Bangkok, you dive headfirst into the city,
quickly becoming a part of everyday flow, the hospitality, the history.
So picture this. You're on a motorcycle driving through a
major intersection and you come upon a giant golden statue
surrounded by yellow flowers. This for locals and visitors alike,
is a very spiritual stop along their journey, all right.
So in English, the shriness called the Four Faced Buddha
Point Tai Paphom in the corner of one of the
busiest central business district of Bangkok, and the shrine is
so revered for the ability to grant wishes to people
that people fly back from all over the world and
you'll see this daily of people.
Repaying their debts.
So what you do is you go and you ask
for what you want, and then if it comes true,
you have to pay for the tribute of dancers.
So you can choose two dancers for six, eight.
Or twelve, and you have to pay if your wishes
are when your wishes come true. And for me, I've
asked for two things and it happened within a month.
And so try your luck and you have anything you
want to come true, go and ask.
Speaking of traveling and speaking of tourism, what are some
of the things you hope that a traveler would experience
while visiting Bangkok.
Well, I want travelers who come to Thailand to feel
like this is paradise. And because honestly unpopular opinion. I
do think Thai food is one of the best food
in the world for a reason, and I want them
to come to Thailand and be like, Oh, this don't
taste like what it tastes back home, right. I want
them to experience Bangkok the way they want to experience it,
because everyone has their own thing. Sometimes it's families, sometimes
it's wild single side, and we have that to offer,
So choose your own adventure.
Basically, by the time the sun rises in Bangkok, you
understand something. This is a city that doesn't just invite
you in. It invites you to become more of yourself.
Whether you come for the food, the temples, or the drag,
what you leave with is more permission. And maybe that's
what makes travel meaningful, not the places we visit, but
the parts of ourselves we discover along the way. For
Panjaina Heels that permission gave her the courage and determination
to express herself unapologetically, and in return, Bangkok grew to
new spaces, new stages, and a new cultural identity.
My message to future travelers to Bangkok is always be
conscious of allowing new experiences to drop in your lap.
You never know what kind of night you're going to have.
And always explore and be open minded because Thailand, not
just even Bangkok, but like Thailand in general, you will
have experiences that you'll never have again.
Ever. Wherever your road takes you next, may you find
more freedom with every turn. Way Find a life Changing
Travel is a production of Iheart's Ruby Studio. I'm your
host Daniel Scheffler. Our show's executive producer is Sierra Kaiser,
with supervising producer Meredith Barnes. Our story producer is Ryan Amador,
with post production by James Foster and editing by Sierra Sprain.
Don't forget to subscribe to Wayfinder and please rate and
review the show wherever you get your podcasts. Thanks for listening.