Current State of WWE: Royal Rumble Thoughts & CM Punk's Massive Injury

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Whiskey Morning Coffee. This is WWE Superstar Drew McIntyre. If you're listening to
the WWE podcast, stop that show, the one that everybody wants me Gods
good for the sixteenths. I just gripped your ass is my eyron, You're
gonna acknowledge me. Welcome to the current state of WWE. It is Monday,
January twenty ninth, twenty twenty four. Hope everyone's doing well, and
we have Anthony DeMarco with us as we are about to break down a little
bit of the Rumble. You guys have already heard my full review, but
this is going to be a lot more focused on the devastating news about CM
Punk and his injury and him being out four to six months and what this
means to WWE, what this means to Punk. So Anthony, how you
doing? Man and crazy crazy forty eight hours here A long has changed since
the last time we spoke last Monday between Vince pick men and what that's meant
for the company on the business side and even the creative side because of brock
Lesner's potential involvement, given the accusations and now the injury. To see them
Punk, what happened at the Royal Rumble, and it feels that that the
direction creatively of this company is almost completely different than where we thought it was
going to be when last time we spoke. It does I mean, there
is just chaos right now and Triple H is doing the best he can to
navigate those waters. But my god, is there's so much so quote unquote
off the field stuff right now that they're trying to play damage control, no
pun intended, and they are really trying to just focus on the product and
the good things. But even the product right now, it's not a bad
product. I think they've got a stacked roster, but it's just injury now
after injury, major injuries. These aren't you know, mid card stars with
Charlotte and Seth Rollins who's on the shelf for a month, and now Punk
who is seemingly out for four to six months, missing WrestleMania. What happens
with the world title that now affects you know what, who's gonna face Seth
Rollins? And like you said, the brock Lesner effect who is named in
the lawsuits, so he didn't show up at the rumble, which means Gunther
and brock Letzer is not happening. And it's just it's it's insanity right now.
But before we get into all of the extra curricular stuff, I do
want to ask you about the Rumble and kind of give your thoughts on the
winners and overall feeling about the pl e. Well, look, I believe
it's a well documented as point that it was a very predictable pl e.
I mean I got almost all of my predictions wrong. I think I was
two well, no, I went two for four. I predicted the two
Rumble winners, but I think everyone and their mother predicted Bailey and Cody Rhoads
to win. I know you did as well. And those two matches,
I think, and the winners and outcomes specifically very predictable, but not necessarily
the wrong pick. I hate Cody Rhodes with every being of my body,
but objectively speaking, he probably was the right pick. The US title match.
I mean, I thought Kevin Owens is going to walk out with the
championship, just because SmackDown needs a consistent championship for the men, something they
have not had since October at this point, with no tag title and Roman
Reigns holding his title hostage and Logan Paul defending his US Championship for the first
time since he won it almost three months ago. And then but that's not
the end of the world. I do really like Logan Paul as champion when
he's there for me. It's just I really like had it up to my
last straw with absentee champions and then the the undisputed Championship match, and I
believe you described it as formulaic. That's the perfect way to describe it.
And the placement of it very bizarre. It buried the lead. You know
which way it was going, and not only did you know the outcome,
but you knew exactly what was going to happen, that Solo was going to
get involved, there'd be some shenanigans for Roman to win the belt, and
then he rolls out as the champion again. So look in a vacuum.
The pay per view was satisfactory. I mean, I'll give it like a
CC plus, not terrible, but I was just expected a lot more.
I really thought that this was going to be a monumental pay per view,
a major shift in the direction. Maybe Triple H putting his stamp on the
product, but I thought that he just went with a bunch of safe picks,
and some of them were the right choices and the rumble winners. But
the fact that Roman holds under the championship again and we're getting Cody Rhoads and
Roman reigns again and again, it's going to be very predictable. The outcome,
I don't think anyone is envisioning Cody Rhoads losing him back to back years
in the main event wrestling to Roman Reigns. It's just maybe it's just my
disdain for Cody Roads combined with the ex just the absolute like distaste I have
with everything to do with Roman rains as championship run right now. But I
came away from the Rumble being very unexcited about wrestling a season and going into
the pay per view. I was so excited. So maybe it's that that's
kind of wearing on me right now. It's a pay per view, a
pl I mean, we still call it pay per views, but it is
a pl that I came away as well feeling I thought that the picks overall
were good. I mean, I went four for four, but that's not
saying much a lot of people did to given there's only four matches. It's
not exactly a flex I mean, but that said, it was an event
that I came out I was like, Okay, I don't disagree with really
any of the outcomes, but like you said, it felt like there was
that intangible missing, that massive return. There was no Rock. I mean,
I think that would have helped things if the Rock had come out and
at least come face to face with Roman or laid out solo or whatever.
No Rock, no big returns. Obviously no brock Lesnar hurt. Yeah,
I mean we did get the other returns of Andrade, okay, cool,
we got Naomi On the women's side, we got the debut of Jade Cargill,
which was a massive moment on the women's side of things. But yeah,
it felt it did feel formulaic and safe, and it's I know what
WW would say is like, Okay, you want us to pick these people,
we pick them to win, and yet you're still complaining that it was
safe and not unexpected. But you can play it safe but also have shocking
moments. The outcome doesn't have to be the shocking moment, right, Like,
you can still have the right booking decision, but without throughout the match
or after the match, you can do things that are edgier and create more
chatter. But yeah, there was no there wasn't that spark, that massive,
like kind of goosebump moment that you expect to happen at the Royal Rumbles.
So yeah, I was I was a bit. I came away,
like you said, satisfied, but not not excited like I feel like I
should be. Yeah, it's because it's like they went with the very safe
option and look on the women's side, let me say I thought the first
half of the match there were so many botches. I believe that you mentioned
it, like Maxine Dupre god lover, but like she tried to do like
that tilt to world not her. It was at head scissors with Bailey,
and at first they like they messed it up and then they had to redo
it again and you could see that it was pretty much all Bailey doing it.
I think the wordest and maybe it was kind of just like the image
of how big the two women were. When Naya Jack was supposed to scoop
slam Piper Nivin onto Chelsea Green and she got her like our quarter of the
way up and then just put her down and shoved her. Yeah, like
every went toppling over her. I think Ivy Nile actually had a few rough
ones. I think there was just a few that she didn't get off the
map properly. But I think as a whole you come away saying like,
men, you're gonna have Becky Lynch versus Rhea a baby face Bailey versus Eo,
which is kind of trending towards like an evolution s storyline of Bautista versus
a triple age, and then you're probably gonna maybe have the first ever women's
match at WrestleMania that's non titled but feels like a main event in Bianca bell
Air versus Jane Cargill. So my takeaway from the women's side of things is
very positive, and that's a good thing and a fair thing to point out.
And even though Bailey was the predictable winner, absolutely the right choice for
the men, it's like, well, now we're just going to Cody and
Roman, and we were all expecting the Rock in somewhat former fashion, and
a lot of us have just been over the Roman Championship run and the title
being held hostage. And look, I know Cody was the odds on favorite
to win. I predicted him, You predicted it, Vegas was predicting him,
Everyone was predicting it. But still seeing him win just upset me to
the like to the deepest part of my body, because remember we all we
were saying this time last year that everything will be sacrificed at the altar of
Roman Reigns. It feels like now like everything is being sacrificed at the altar
of Cody Rhoads. And that, to me is what's starting to piss me
off a bit. Is where I'm saying, are we just going to go
from a Roman Reigns three and a half title reign to just like the Cody
Rhods era where it's all about him all the time. Well, it already
is, right. I mean, you look at him, his stupid smiling
faces. On the cover of the two K video game he's being shown getting
out of his vehicle in his suit. I mean, like I said,
I really feel like he wears his suit, probably while he's taking a shower.
I don't know if he ever takes it off. It's obnoxious how often
he wears a suit. I love how Drew pointed that out a couple weeks
ago, how he always smiles. It's almost like he took the criticisms from
this show and put it into his promo talking about how he looks like a
politician. I mean it was a very I loved everything Drew said a couple
weeks ago. But now I mean shifting gears because this is going to be
the bulk of our conversation. We get an injury that occurred, presumably,
and you can go watch this. Everyone has probably seen it at this point,
the moment when Cmpunk went down, and we didn't know he went down
until the reports came out earlier today that Cmpunk has injured. He's torn his
triceps off of his arm basically, which is going to require surgery. It's
going to take four to six months of rehability pitation for him to come back,
which means at the earliest he's coming back in like June. So obviously
there goes WrestleMania. Maybe in time for Summer Slam. He'll be back right
in time for Charlotte to return. So that's a huge blow to the company.
I know that they have a deep roster right now, but everyone was
expecting and waiting for Seth Rollins and Cmpunk. It was a matchup that was
made for WrestleMania. It had a great build, a great foundation. And
now, yes, you could put Gunther in that position, you could put
jay Uso in that position, and maybe the stars are aligning for that because
Gunther's opponent is also gone. So I mean those two now and have no
opponents, and they seemingly would be a good fit. But what was your
reaction? I mean, when you heard the news that cmpunk was injured,
that he's going to be out for four to six months and here comes WrestleMania,
what was what are your thoughts? It's weird, Like for obviously disappointed
on some level because of his return, and I felt like his return had
already lost a lot of steam because he hadn't sunk his teeth right into a
promo yet or not a promo program yet, and he had yet to have
a one on one televised match. So the Rumble was the first time that,
unless you were at the Madison Square Garden House show, that you saw
him in ring since he returned to the company two months ago. So I
already felt like a lot of wind had been taken out of his sales.
But then when you add in the injury thing, the first thing I thought
about was like, man, was this just like a one night thing where
everyone lost their collective minds and that's it for Cmpunk, Like before I get
into the impacts they'll have about WrestleMania and the subsequent match that might well replace
it, What do you think that there's any validity to the thought that maybe
this was just like a one night wonder upon on his return at Survivor series.
You mean, was it a one night wonder in terms of it being
like fan interest? Oh, I don't. I think you're right that it
got to the point where we were. We were at that tipping point.
Even the most ardent CM Punk fans were like, Okay, dude, you
know you're being advertised for this raw, that raw whatever, but we know
it's just going to be a promo. The promos were delivered very well.
I mean, that's what Punk is known for more than his matches are his
promos. I mean, that's how he essentially has made his living. It's
how he has made his career is with his voice, really and not his
in ring. His in ring is good, really good, but it's it's
his voice. So I think even the most fans were saying, hey,
man, can we just get into a program. I think that's kind of
where we started to land. And really, even when you heard the reaction
at the Rumble when the fans had to make a decision between Cody and Punk,
the fans were leaning towards Cody. I mean, you could hear the
difference in the reactions and when the fans were forced to choose, it wasn't
overwhelming, but there was a clear delineation that they wanted Cody Rhodes over Punk
in that moment. So do I think it's a one off? Do I
think it's kind of a lightning in a bottle one night? I don't think
so. CM Punk, though, has started to lose some steam, but
that happens with every single return, no matter how big they are, from
Austin to Rock to whoever. Every time they come back, if they're on
a short run, the subsequent reactions are going to become a little less and
then eventually level off at a certain point. So that's kind of a normal
thing. The biggest reaction is always the first return, and then it levels
off and people kind of get used to you being back. So I think
though, that you're right though, that it is a It did start to
descend and get frustrating where it's like, okay, can you show up and
get into a program of someone. We understand you're good at promos. But
I think it did get from so now that you take him out for four
to six months, it's going to open up a massive opportunity for someone at
WrestleMania, and I guess we're all assuming that Cody's going to go up against
Roman Reigns based on his point the following the match, And to be honest,
as much as I hate Cody Rose, that was kind of like a
nice change of pace, like the Skybox thing. And Roman Reigns, for
as much as he's never there and I hate his rain no pun intended,
his facials are still one of the best in the business, if not the
best in the business, and it makes you realize and remember why he was
pushed so hard, because he has this talent when he's present. So assuming
that's the case, in Ceth Wrongs is good to go to WrestleMania. It
opens the door for someone who was maybe going to get buried down the card.
And the first guy that jumped into my mind was La Knight. I
know we all expecting him to challenge Logan Paul for the United States Championship,
but with Dunter being I get well, you could also make the keys for
Gunther. But with set, with cmpunk being injured and his spot being freed
up, I can't think of a better guy to challenge Seth Rawlins based on
the steam he has behind him, Like you can make the case for Drew,
but it's been there, done that with Drew and Seth At this point,
they've already had two matches. I doubt they go back to the well
at WrestleMania, And if Cody is gonna challenge Roman, He's presumably gonna shift
to SmackDown full time. Wouldn't it be best for La Knight to avoid being
further buried on SmackDown and shift to Monday Night rass So for me, the
way I guess I'm kind of looking at is that as much as it sucks
that CM Punk won't be around to challenge Seth Rowns for the world title and
we finally get that match that is seemingly years in the making between the two,
it opens up a spot for a guy that wouldn't have had that prominent
position. And to me, the first guy I thought of was La Knight.
I have no issues with. I mean, I think every fan that's
listening that is an La Knight fan would agree. And I think that there's
easily a way to get that done. Like you said, I mean,
it's not like WWE cares about their own brand rules. I'm sure you know
there's even if they did and they respected them, you easily, as you
mentioned, could just do a swap. You could do a trade, I
mean whatever. It's very easy to get La and Night over to Raw and
keep them there if they want to have him challenge Seth. The only concern
I have with that is that La Knight's a big baby face and unless you're
planning on turning Seth Rollin's heel, that match will turn Seth rollins heel because
La Knight is a beloved character. Right now, He's not as hot as
he was, but he's still pretty damn warm. And I think the fans
are ready for a change with the World Tide or the World Heavyweight Championship,
and they would back La Knight over Seth Rollins just because La Knight is has
never held a major championship in WWE. The fans were ready for it many
months ago when he faced Roman Reigns, and even before that they were ready
to embrace him as a champion. He's not a young guy either, so
he's you know, he's not this immature twenty two year old that doesn't know
who he is. El Aa Night knows exactly who he is. He's a
polished performer. Is he the greatest of all time? No, but he
could absolutely be a candidate to take the belt off of Seth Rollins. It's
just the concern of if your plan isn't to turn Seth Rollins heel, that
will become the plan by force if you put them together at the stage of
WrestleMania. Yeah, that's a good point. But could that have not been
the case with Sam Punk as well? Oh? Absolutely that I mean,
and I think it really would have been interesting though, because you could have
turned Punk heel with La and I you can't turn him heel. I think
Sam Punk has shown how good of a heel he is, and the fans
were starting to cool off on him a little little bit anyway, And so
with that, you could have actually had Punk be the guy to take out
Rollins from behind and instantly, I mean, people would have bought into it.
I think you could have made a better case to turning Punk heel than
you could have with La Knight. But unless maybe that wasn't the case and
they were just gonna let the fans decide, And if the fans decided,
sure, they probably would have chosen Punk over Rollins when it came to when
when it came to the actual match itself in Philadelphia. Yeah, it's a
good point. It's just I guess if it's not because now Gunther's freed up
as well, right, because we doesn't seem like that doesn't seem like brock
Lester is going to be part of the creative plans anytime soon because of the
pending lawsuit against WWE and his name being involved in that. So do you
think Gunter finds a way into the world title picture and drops the Intercontinent Championship
before WrestleMania. Yeah, that's that's the thing. So here's what I My
best guess is this, assuming Broc isn't some magician that's able to clear his
name completely from this lawsuit, which is very unlikely, and it's a damn
shame, you know, It's a damn shame obviously from a human perspective.
Obviously the actual acts are horrific all that stuff, if they're true, But
it's also a damn shame from a wrestling fan perspective of we are now cheated
out of Gunther and brock Lesnar. We're cheated out of a brock Lesnar entry
into the Rumble and just having him be around during WrestleMania season. It just
sucks. It sucks, so from obviously a less important perspective, it does
suck from a fan a fan's perspective. But here, what I would guess
is gonna happen is that Gunther drops the belt at Elimination Chamber or he's in
the Chamber and he the Intercontinental Championship is dropped after like a Monday Night Raw
sometime between Chamber and WrestleMania, because you don't want Gunther going into WrestleMania as
Intercontinental Champion and also competing for the World title. To me, then then
at that point, you're what are you doing? You're sacrificing the Intercontinental Championship
and leaving it off the show for what reason? It wouldn't do anybody any
good when you have a lot of contenders that could have an awesome match for
that for that championship that Gunther has made infinitely more important, arguably in some
ways more important than the World title. So I think that that's probably what
happens, is that Gunther wins now is going to be the favorite to win
this presumable presumable elimination chamber match of guys. Again, we haven't seen money
at RAW, so I always like to say that because I have not seen
a lick of money at RAW. A lot of this may be addressed already,
but from not seeing Raw yet, I think Gunther wins, the Chamber
drops the Intercontinental Championship between Chamber and Mania, and then Gunther challenges Rollins one
on one of WrestleMania. So this is my thing is that that would make
a ton of sense. But what are the Gunther going up against a brown
Breaker for the Intercontinental Championship? Or do you think that Gunther has too much
to lose by putting over a guy like bron Breaker at wrestle May like his
Gunther still in the stage where he should be getting the big wins at Wrestleman
because with bron Breaker pretty much taking on the brock Lesnar role at the Rumble,
I wonder like, is that a match that they could go forward with
but keep the Intercontinent Championship involved with Gunther versus bron Breaker, because as far
as mid card championships goes, that would be one of the bigger ones of
the last few years. Although the Icy title match that was a triple threat
last year almost arguably stole the show as well. Yeah, that's right,
with Seamus and Drew and Gunther, that was a yeah. I mean you
could do that. And you know what, you could just keep the Daan
Belt on him and have him compete in two matches. I guess that's possible
too. But bron Breaker, with his performance at the Royal Rumble has really
I mean again, this is where we just talked about it. Brock's loss
of an opportunity allows somebody else to step up and shine, and Broun Breaker,
who was obviously supposed to be not supposed to be in the Rumble and
took brock Lesner's spot, did have a nice showing. He's getting that mainstream,
that main roster exposure now to fans that are like, who is this
guy? Ah, that's right, he's some NXT guy. He's you know,
he had a pretty good showing, and then they start to recognize him
and it becomes a main stay in their minds and it becomes more and more
of a threat to the Intercontinental Championship. So I think, yeah, you
could do that. You could have bron Breaker versus Gunther, but I I
mean, honestly, you could. You could even keep him as champion.
I mean, what about Gunther as a double champion. They did that with
Seth Rollins. What like back in twenty sixteen, they had Seth Rollins as
an intercontinental was it the inter Continental and the Universal Champion or Intercontinental and w
Champion at one point, So it's been done before. Yeah, I think
he had the WWE Championship and the US title when he defeated John Cena for
it. And the last time that they did an icy title versus a world
title that was probably what Hogan versus Warrior Whistlemania six. But all this to
say is like you have a lot of talent to go with to replace cmpunk.
And that's not to say that and I'm not trying to dump all over
cm punk here, but what they've said in past show is like WWE's in
a very good spot talent wise, arguably better than they've been in twelve over
a decade. So I mean you could gun there's a good choice. You
could have him even drop it inside the elimination chamber, like, well,
if you have two chamber matches, you have one, Well, I guess
they usually do one for the women and one for the men, and the
men will almost surely be for the undisputed the number one contendership for the world
title. So I guess, like could gun Th drop it to jay Uso
at the elimination chamber and then like, but then he would have to compete
twice in one match. It's weird how they could get gun through there unless
he drops the icy title on Because do you think they would actually do a
double title match you mean Intercontinental versus World the World. Yeah, I mean,
anything's possible at this point. There's a lot of ways to go,
and honestly, I don't know if any of them are really bad. I
mean really few bad decisions I think out there, because, like you said,
the talent depth right now is so deep, and they have in such
a good position, and really, this injury to Punk I think exposes a
larger problem of the past and somewhat of the current. When you rely on
older stars who have obviously older bodies and more mileage, they're more susceptible to
injury. I mean that injury that happened, it was kind of a freak
thing. He landed fine. I mean, even with Seth Rollins. He
has a ton of mileage on his body too, and nothing, No one
did anything wrong, nobody botched anything. It's just one of those freak things
that happens. I think when you have and you're more susceptible to it,
when you have older stars doing these maneuvers that it's just physics. It's just
not a science, right, So, I mean it's one of those things
that they have a lot of good options, and I don't think they have
a whole lot of terrible ones. I mean they have, they had,
like you said, they could do Intercontinental versus World. I don't have a
problem with that. The only downside of that is you're putting all your eggs
in one basket and you're not separating them out and allowing guys to have that
match by themselves, maybe a fatal four way of sorts for then Intercontinental Championship
at WrestleMania and then have Gunther have his own one on one with Seth Rollins.
That's the only drawback is that I think you're maybe taking some guys out
of the equation that would otherwise have a title match when you put both titles
in one match. Yeah, and because you could put the title on Jay
and have him defended against a breaker, and I think both of us are
kind of in lockstep that Jay Usso would be probably the best guy to go
into WrestleMania as the intercontinal champion or leave WrestleMania as the inter continental champion.
And something that I think you speculated on before we heard the news about Punk,
but I guess shifting gears to the SmackDown side of things, and with
the Rock seemingly on the outside looking in, like, what's your opinion on
where this all leads to with Roman Reigns and Cody Rhodes and the Rock,
what happens here? Well, one thing I want to finish up on before
I talk about the Rock, Just one point I want to make is what
if they just have Gunther vacate the belt? What if he just remains undefeated
for that championship? Would you just my last question to you on this side
and then we'll move to the Rock, is would you be opposed to Gunther
just saying you know, I'm vacating the championship because I have bigger goals or
something like that. I mean, we've seen it, We've seen it before.
I remember back in ninety seven when Austin gave the belt to the Rock,
the Intercontinental Championship to the Rock because he said he wanted to move on
and you know he had bigger fish to fry or whatever he said at the
time. So would you hate that? Would you? Would you oppose that
that Gunther decides to relinquish the championship. I will just because I think you
have some guys who could really benefit from winning that title, but primarily Jay
Usa, and I think even Sammy's ain like Sammy Zin hasn't really gotten his
due since we both agree, got shafted in Montreal last year at the elimination
Chamber. So I think those two guys defeating Gunther for the Interconinal Championship would
do them bosom good. And maybe you do it in a in a fatal
fod like I heard you mention it like Drew, Sammy, Jay and Gunther
so he doesn't have to take the pin like there are ways to keep Gunther
looking strong with and get him get him away from the Interconnal Championship. I
just think that based on the guys you have at your disposal who could really
do good things with a victory like that, I would avoid the vacation or
vacating it rather. Yeah, the vacation, I mean, yeah, the
vacation. Don't say that word in front of Roman. He'll say vaca.
I'm in so yeah, I mean so as far as the Rock goes,
here's really at this point the only thing I can think of of what happens
if they still want to do Rock Roman, It's not going to happen at
elimination Chamber. I think everyone can kind of get that out of their minds.
It's been reported that Roman Reigns, surprise to everyone, is not going
to be even competing at the elimination Chamber. We haven't confirmed that, but
a lot of sources, all the big websites, you know who they are,
have been saying that, and I'll take it at face value. So
what I think the only option you have really the only option you have because
they're doing Cody Roman. They're doing that. The only option you have is
having Roman work both nights. You have the Rock versus Roman Reigns non title
in night one, and you have Cody versus Roman for the championship in nine
two. I just don't see another way to do this. I don't know
how else you if you want to do it again at Wrestleman eighty forty,
there's really no other option other than throwing the Rock into the main event,
which I mean, I honestly wouldn't want a triple threat. To me,
you can't do this mega match with a third party. If you're doing Rock
Roman, which is a match, it's a dream match. You can't add
a third party to this, at least in the first go around. If
they want to do it, and if there's a second or third match,
fine, but you can't have the first iteration of this be with Cody and
Rock and Roman. I think that you would probably do two nights with the
Rock on night one. What do you think? I don't like I wouldn't
like that, Like, I really just wanted Roman Rock, and then we
spoke about this Randy and Cody. Like at this point, it's just a
cake punt on Roman Rock do it, SummerSlam, do it, Saudi Arabia,
do it Wrestling next year. It's just I want all the focus to
be on Roman and Rock, and look, they clearly want to do Cody
Roman. I mean, like I said earlier in the show, it is
all the bill pushing Cody Roads to the absolute top of the wrestling world.
We know that's where it's going. So I'd rather than just go balls deep
in Cody Roads, get it over with, just get me to the bane
of my existence by seeing him win the championship to close WrestleMania. Honestly,
I can't even talk about because how upset I am that they're doing this again
and they're going to take attention away from Rock Versus Roman. This is the
Rock said it. I think he's talked about with Stephen A. Smith last
week, that has the potential to be one of the biggest wrestling matches of
all time, one of the biggest builds of all time, Rock versus Roman.
And he's right, He's not being conceited. That's literally correct. This
has been arguably four years in the making, if not even longer to your
point, nine years in the making since the Rumble twenty fifteen, and now
it's going to have to share the spotlight and arguably get overshadowed by Cody Rhodes
and his story. I want nothing of that. If they're so hell bent
on doing this with Cody Roads, just do it and kick the kick the
can down the road or don't do it at all. I would rather them
not do it at all than do it night one and be overshadowed by Cody
Roads. Yeah, I'm I have my reservations about the plan I laid out,
but it's the Again, if they want this to happen at Buy WrestleMania
forty or at WrestleMania forty, that's the only option other than throwing the Rock
into it, making it a triple threat. Again, I'm really opposed to
that because Cody has already laid out what his plans are. I mean,
it's it's a lock. It is an absolute lock. It's Cody and Rollman.
It is happening, which means either Roman does double duty or like you
said, you kick the can to another time in another place. But I
can't think of another time and another place other than WrestleMania. That is the
only place that this at least the first one. If they want to do
multiple fine, but the first one has to be at WrestleMania. There is
money to be made, and a lot of it to be made off of
Rock and Roman. I don't want to hear from the Cody fans that it's
a better match. It'll be a better wrestling match. Cody needs to take
the belt off of Roman. It's his story all, that's all. That's
really fun and gooey and makes you feel good with your belly. But I'm
telling you, if you don't understand how and why Rock Roman is a bigger
match than Cody Roman, I mean, you're just you're just not paying attention
or you don't want to be so. I have absolutely no reservations about focusing
on Rock Roman. But how I don't know how they do that anymore?
I again, can you formulate a scenario where this year not Summer Slam,
not WrestleMania forty one, in which it's Rock Roman one on one for the
belt or not whatever? How is that even? Is it not even in
the realm of possibility anymore? Is it doable? It is? Because because
what do you know? There's a spot open up on Monday Night Raw.
And although we think Cody Rhodes picked Roman reigns, has he done it officially?
For all we know, he could pivot and challenge seth Rawlins and finishing
the story makes a lot more sense against seth Rawlins, given how he returned
two years ago than it does against Roman. Rains I don't know why his
story has to finish with Roman Reigns. I've never really understood it. Unless
it's only about the championship, that specific title. It has to be that
title. It can't be another world title. I don't get it. Like
I think that Cody Rhodes versus Seth Rawlins will be a much better story to
tell because we've already been down that road with Roman Reigns. I mean,
it was even more about Paul Hayman and Cody Rhodes, like Okay, yeah,
the dusty thing, which I just I don't give a damn about anymore.
But like that's the easy way. It's actually quite simple with cmpunk out
of the way, there's an easy path to having Rock versus Roman for the
title and Cody versus Seth for the world title. But I just don't think
that they'll do it. But with cmpunk out of the way, it's a
very simple solution. That's actually true. I mean, I keep forgetting how
big of a hole that Sampunk's absence leaves. We're assuming it's Gunther or you
know who else we were talking about, but it could be absolutely could be
Cody Rhodes, even though Cody was pointing directly at Roman Reigns at the Rumble,
and Roman, you know, was doing his great acting and acting kind
of depressed or acting kind of very very anxious, very concerned. It very
well could be Cody versus Seth Rollins at WrestleMania, and you know how good
they work together. They have a storied history. They have three matches prior
of which Cody has won all of them. By the way, they were
going to do a fourth, and the injury was derailed the whole thing,
and so sure they could do that if they want Rock Roman. I think
what they're the reason they want Roman is you know, Cody got screwed out
of that championship opportunity last year with Solo Socoa, along with a million other
people before him. But also I think Rowan Rains has looked at as kind
of the end boss. He's kind of like the mafia, the head of
the mafia, right Like he is that end boss. And as much as
Seth Rollins wants to pretend that his title means more and all that, it
just doesn't. It Just that's kind of the way it is. I mean,
the lineage of the WWE Championship, the universal championship. It's a little
muddy, but I know that Seth, or rather Cody, was chasing that
particular championship that his dad never won. I don't believe his dad ever won
the title that Seth Rollins holds, but I think he was chasing specifically that
championship and the lineage of the WWE Championship, not universal. Universal was made
up out of thin air, just like what eight years nine years ago.
So that's I think the reason. Yeah, it does make sense when you
lay it out like that. I for me, it's just more like it's
kind of like what I said at the beginning of the show, you are
wasting every possible opportunity at the altar of Cody Roads. So because he's chasing
the lineage of the WWE title and because Roman reigns is like the final boss,
that means that we're not going to get Rock versus Roman. Like,
I just like, how important is this guy? And you know what I
say that, But I'm pretty sure Triple H said that he's the future of
this business. And to me when I heard them, just like, oh,
we're bleeped. That's it. We have bleeped for as long as Cody
Roads is around. It is going to be Cody Roads all the time,
and people like I cannot wait for anyone to keep cheering about Cody Roads because
it's just like you guys all boomina justifiably so to a certain extent, for
years, years and years and years, you booed John Cena out of the
building. You wished them away, You want nothing to do with him.
And Cody Rhodes is a hundred times worse than John Cena ever was in my
opinion. I know that you were never a huge John Cena fan, but
who is worse between peak John Cena and this version of Cody Rhods. It's
crazy. It's a no contest for me, Cody Rhoads. It's like the
worst attributes of John Cena on steroids. I mean, no pun intended like
that. That's that's what it was. Take all the things that were super
annoying about the bite babyface John Cena and then maximize them or magnify them by
about the factor of ten, and you have Cody Rhoads. Yeah, I
mean so yes, So we're now going to get this and you know that
he's gonna be no triple h and he likes his long world title reigns,
He's probably gonna hold that championship for over a year, like I would guess,
like, do not see if Cody Rhods wins the WWE title at Wrestleman,
could you not see him going into next year's WrestleMania's WWE champion. I
think it's a foregone conclusion. I could see no less than a one year
reign from Cody. And here's the other thing, what would do you think
WWE would dare have Cody Rhodes lose a second year in a row? No?
Only four? The fact that I think we're still not understanding how maybe
committed they are to having Roman beat Hulk Hogan's record when they are they're about,
you know what six months away at this point when you get to WrestleMania,
about six months away from having Roman get that championship that next level he's
now in the top three. Or do you think they just say we can't
do it two years in a row, guy, we just can't do it.
Is there any chance in your mind that they actually don't give Cody the
belt for a second time? No, there's no chance, because then they
would be turning Cody into a parody of them himself with the finishing the story
thing. Everyone thought it was a foregone conclusion last year, but now you
know, he went through turmoil, he lost to their own rains. He
had the thing with Brock and he treaded water in the spring. He had
the short lived feud with Shinske. But now two years to the pay per
view that he's returned, he finishes his stupid story if you make Roman win.
Now you've already seen some memes and like, you know, spoofs of
him finishing the story or him cutting a pipe bomb promo, like because he
when the rumors came out that he wasn't supposed to face Roman or for any
world title at WrestleMania, So I mean he has to. And you see
how Triple H and Creative are positioning him. He's being put presented to us
as the face of the company, which to me is very disrespectful to seth
Rawlins. Like it's like they're passing the baton from Roman reigns to Seth and
they're just stepping right over seth Rawlins or other guys for that matter, like
La Knight or even a Drew McIntyre, Like I don't know why Cody Rhodes
has just been dubbed the chosen One, and like I don't get it.
Like I understand that he's over. I could concede that he's a main event
player, but like the fact that he has just been kind of anointed as
like the face of the company, I do not get. And like I
said, they are sacrificing so many things at the altar of Cody Rhods just
to make him be the first back to back champion in twenty six years or
whatever it is, or win the world title away from Roman Reigns, the
guy to break the three and a half year long rain, Like everything has
to go with Cody Roads. And remember when you used to say all roads
lead to Roman Reigns, Well, now all roads lead to Cody Rhads pun
intended. I mean they do exactly they do. I mean everything you see,
every big move that has happened, somehow Cody is responsible for it.
He's now the face of two K, He's in ad campaigns. He I
mean, like you said, though, how the hell did this happen?
He left WWE for how many years, made a mockery of Triple H in
ae W and then he comes back with his bleach blonde hair, and all
of a sudden, he's just the face of the company. How did this
happen? I just I feel like I need to do a case study on
this, Like what did he do? I mean, then he gets injured
and goes away again for another five months? What happened underneath our noses?
All of a sudden, Like you said, a lot of guys passed over
who have been here consistently throughout the years, champions like seth Rawlins, who
have just killed themselves to stay at the top, to get to the top,
and all of a sudden, Cody comes in with his suit and his
hair and his stupid smile, and we're all supposed to just just accept these
the face of the company. I mean, the fans are reacting, no
doubt about it, But like, what what happened? What happened right underneath
our noses here? I honestly don't understand. And it's funny because, like
if you ask casual fans, like my girlfriend is like the most casual wrestling
fan, no pun intended. We love the actual casual wrestling fan, but
she is one of She is a complete casual fan. She'll pop in from
major pay per views, major storylines around Rumble season, and what she said
when she said that he won is just like, what the bleep did this
guy do to win everything? She doesn't understand why he's winning everything because she
had no idea who Cody Rose was before he showed the cup two years ago.
If you started watching wrestling in twoenty and twenty one and Cody Rose just
showed up and you only watched WWE and you did watch AW like, you
would have no idea who the bleep this guy is. And the reason behind
that is because he was gone for what five years and before that, even
if you did watch it before that, like me, he was stardust or
he was a like a perennial tag team champion, or he had a couple
of coffeees like the Intercontinental champion. Like I mean, he was nothing ever
more than like a lower mid carter tag team guy. And what just because
like he had modern success in AEW, which I didn't even really watch it.
Even in AEW, he wasn't the main guy, was he just like
the TNT champion, Like he never held their world title. It's not like
you're bringing over over MJF like it wasn't like you got their biggest star and
brought him over, like that's why like you left it. When you're writing
for wrestling shows, especially WWE, and how like mainstream they are, you
have to go with the assumption, in my opinion, that not every fan
knows the full on backstory and internet discourse of every wrestler. And I feel
with Cody Rhodes, the reason why they bring up Dusty so much is to
try and convince fans like my girlfriend, why he's so important. But in
reality, all it is is annoying and he can't stand on his own two
feet, so it's just it's so bizarre. But at the same time,
we're in the minority. The vast majority of people love this guy, so
maybe we're the fed up ones and all this. I don't care if I
am, I'll accept that title because I'm not changing my feeling on his persona.
I mean, we could totally change our two and the funny thing is
you and I may totally flip the script if he decides to turn heel at
some point, because I think he could be brilliant as a heel. He's
got he's got everything built right in with the suits and everything else, and
how he looks, and he could easily talk down to us. He's good.
He's a really good promo. There's I mean, it's all right there
if the slip switch ever wanted to get flipped. But they have invested themselves
in this babyface character for years to come. I don't think we're gonna see
it for like plural years because of all the marketing materials he's on, the
merch he's selling you, all the ads, he's in all the ad campaigns
and everything else. You're not going to have a top heel do that kind
of stuff usually. So he's built in, I think, for the next
at least two years as a babyface, unless the fans organically turn on them,
which I hope happens. But you're right in ae W. He was
just he was he was moderately successful, but the fans turned on him,
and then he was just like, I don't get it, guys, why
do you hate me? And you know it's self. The lack of self
awareness I think is really lost on him sometimes. It's his character is like
he's trying to be so much like the common man and be so relatable that
he's actually super unrelatable, Like you could tell he's trying to just be a
fan and trying to be just just normal guy, and I know what he's
doing. Instead of feeling like he's out of touch, he actually feels like
he's out of touch because he's trying not to be if that makes sense.
I mean I could do a whole psycho analyzing podcast on why Cody Roads's babyface
character just sucks, like I mean, it's just it's But I won't so
I'll stop there. And I don't know if you have any anything else on
the Cody Road situation heading into WrestleMania and ultimately do you think though, that
they would even dare go that road of Cody versus Seth? Do you think
they do? You think they do that? I don't think so. Like
I said, I think that they're prepared to sacrifice everything at the altar of
Cody Roads and finishing his dumb story. So although that would be the logical
choice, because if you all sat down and said, Okay, what's actually
best for business here, that would be the best thing Tody Versus Seth.
You could even do that on night too, Tody Versus Seth Night two Rock
versus Roman on Night one. Yep, like it's right there. It's right
there for the taking. Seampunk's gone, and then you could have gun Through
versus bron Bar Aaker for the Ericonnell Championship. You could still have La Knight
versus Logan Paul for the US Championship. You could have Drew doing whatever he's
going to be doing. Like that would probably be the best outcome for everyone.
But if you're hell bent on Cody versus Roman, then you're not getting
Rock versus Roman. You're gonna force Gunther or La Night into the main event
scene on Monday Night Raw, which will then open up another spot for a
mid card championship, and everything gets shuffled around, as opposed to if you
just go Cody Seth, you still have Rock Roman and then the two mid
card championships, or at least what we're thinking or speculating on stay the same.
For me, it's simple, but I know for them everything will be
sacrificed at his altar. So I'm not holding my breath probably, I mean,
unfortunately, I think we're probably talking into the wind here that it's not
gonna happen. But the only evidence I can see of Cody and Seth being
actually a realistic option is if you remember over the summer and into the fall,
every time that each of them would finish a program and they would confront
each other, they could never get a promo with each other because someone would
interrupt. That happened like two or three times where the WWE was teasing them
once again getting back together to have a program, and the fans seem pretty
excited about it because they hadn't cross paths since his return from injury, and
he finally crossed paths with them, and then someone would interrupt. Someone would
interrupt, someone would interrupt. So they teased it and laid the groundwork for
a future program with them again. But I mean, they haven't done that
in a while, and that's the only thing I can think of of them
using that as a platform of, you know, coming back to Cody and
Seth and again. It would make so much sense and make everything so much
easier when it comes to the WrestleMania card if you just went that way,
because you could have the Mega match with Roman and Rock, which is the
money match. I don't think that we really understand the magnitude of how big
that match is. Or some people don't of how big and how much publicity
and how much hype that that match would get, how many more viewers,
how many more subscriptions to to Peacock that that would get, how many YouTube
views, which creates ad revenue and the Rocks reach in Hollywood. He's the
biggest star literally on the planet. There is just to me, Like you
said, if you're looking at this from dollars and cents, it makes a
whole lot of dollars and cents pun intended for Rock Roman to be the main
event of I don't care if it is Night one and you have Cody and
Seth Night two and Cody becomes champion, you can kill two birds with one
stone. But people are hell bent on it being Roman reigns that Cody defeats.
So yeah, I just don't see the point of even speculating on anything
else, Like they will alter everything before they change Cody Roads's path unfortunately,
And yeah, it sucks. And if I hear one more time finishing the
story, this thing is a this whole thing. I mean they made a
whole slogan out of it for two K twenty four. Yeah, I mean
it's it's and even other wrestlers are using it in their promos. It's just
like built into the fabric of w WE somehow. Now, uh, oh,
finish the story. I want to finish my story. I when to
finish my story. It's just it's just like, I mean, I don't
I don't need to hear any more bedtime stories. I don't need to hear
about I mean, honestly, it's not even finishing your story, because you
want to start your story when you win the belt. So that's what we'll
hear when he wins it. I mean as well, you know, I
thought it was finishing it, but really I'm starting a news story. It's
like I can see a stupid promo already. But hey, if Roman drops
the belt, I will sack. I will sit in stomach that promo for
the sacrifice or as a sacrifice for Roman losing. That's another good point,
that's you know, honestly, So there is that because Cody does have the
best chance to beat Roman more than the Rock, So that that is one
positive if we get Roman Roman, Cody over Rock and Roman, so that
is one positive. But all right, I guess we'll end it there.
I know that you you have a after Dark show that you did this past
week that focused on the Royal Rumble and guys, it's exclusive to Patreon and
to Apple podcasts, so I don't know if you have the wrap up thoughts
or comments. It was essentially just my preview and prediction show. Putched a
bit on Vincent, how tragic of an ending it is and how you know
he shamefully retired, forced his way back in after six months and now had
to shamefully and maybe criminally be shown the door finally. And I don't think
he's gonna be shoehorning his way back in anytime soon, especially given the fact
that Eron Emanuel is the guy who the buck stops with now. So aside
from the previeum prediction show, I just had maybe my five to six minute
thoughts on Vince McMahon, And obviously I'm not going to touch on the criminal
stuff too much, just because we don't know just accusations at this point,
and I'm not a lawyer. I don't want to say anything out of turn,
but more so just how unfortunate and ending his story punintended came to be.
Yeah, I mean really, yeah, it really is. It is.
It's really just kind of it is tragic. But also if those allegations
are true, I mean it's you know, then screw disgusting. Yes I
don't, I mean, screw him. Right. So, but we'll let
things I'm a big believer in letting things play out, letting the evidence speak
for itself, letting the courts and everything else. Let's see the proof,
let's let's go through the motions. It's not looking good. I'm not saying
he's innocent at all, but I'm a big believer in let's let the evidence
play itself out. People have already jumped to conclusions without even looking at a
single word in the document of the of the lawsuit. Again, he's probably
guilty, but I want to at least let things play out before I jump
to any conclusions. But it's it's really crazy. We look at this now
in twenty twenty four, we don't have a single McMahon in the company.
It's it's it's mind blowing. Really, if you had told anybody that just
two years ago that not a single McMahon will ever will be employed by the
WWE, you wouldn't have believed it. So, all right, I think
we'll end it there. But yeah, certainly that this has just been a
wild week of news and tragedies and injuries, but also some really good booking,
so we'll have even more updates and I'm sure much clearer picture for Elimination
Chamber in seven days. So thanks so much, buddy, and we'll talk
soon. Looking forward to next week, man, take care you too.
Thanks for listening to the WWE podcast. Don't forget to subscribe on your favorite
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