The Wow! signal: did a telescope in Ohio receive an extraterrestrial communication in 1977?

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Hello, and welcome to the Physics World Weekly

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Podcast. I'm Hamish Johnston.

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In this episode, we revisit the wow signal.

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A curious astronomical

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observation

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made nearly 50 years ago that has been

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described

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as one of the most compelling

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potential instances

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of extraterrestrial

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communication.

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But first, Physics World is brought to you

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Back in 1977,

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the Big Ear

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radio telescope in the US

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was scanning the skies

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in search for signs of extraterrestrial

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intelligent life.

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On 15th

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August, it detected

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a strong

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narrow bandwidth

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signal

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that vanished

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24 hours later when Big Ear

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again looked at the same patch of sky.

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This was exactly the sort of techno signature

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that astronomers

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were looking for.

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Indeed,

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one scientist wrote the word wow

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next to the signal on a printout of

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Big Ear data.

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Ever since, the origins of the wow signal

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have been debated,

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and now a trio of astronomers

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believe they have the answer.

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Here is Physics World's

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Margaret Harris

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in conversation

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with one of those scientists.

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My guest in the virtual studio today is

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Abel Mendez, a planetary astrobiologist

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and director of the planetary habitability laboratory at

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the University of Puerto Rico at Arecibo.

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Hello, and welcome to the podcast.

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Oh, nice to be here. Thank you for

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invitation.

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Now, Abel, you and your colleagues have been

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doing some research recently

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on something called the Wow signal.

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What is this wow signal, and how did

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it get its strange name?

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That's a

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amazing story.

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A story that I heard from,

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from my early childhood,

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that famous wow signal, but,

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always was not into details. And I never

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thought that I was going,

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do doing some work with this,

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signal.

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Well, in 1977,

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a Big Air,

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Telescope, that's a telescope for the University of

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Ohio,

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they were doing

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a risk radio astronomy research,

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exploring

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different sources. It's in the early days of

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the radio astronomy.

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It's a it's a telescope that was contemporary

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with the receiver observatory,

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which was that started in the both started

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in 1963.

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So they

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have been doing this radio astronomy,

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research.

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And in that particular year,

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they detected an interest in signal. That was

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at a

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particular project

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in what we know today as SETI or

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TENOT signatures.

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So they were actually,

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doing in with that observatory

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a search

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for extraterrestrial intelligence on purpose.

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And,

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and they they just got what they were

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looking for.

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This telescope was scanning the skies, so it

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was not targeted at any particular direction. It

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was using the movement of Earth

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and the rotation of Earth through through through

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the stars just to see what's there.

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And, for a moment, they got, for actually

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72 seconds,

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they got a signal that was increased and

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decreased,

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which was something that we're expecting for a

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stationary signal

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that they just happened to drift and pass

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by.

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So we have to make clear that, that

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signal was, constant at least during the time

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that they were drifting, even that it would

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they saw that it changed in intensity because

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they were drifting

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and moving. So the signal was narrowband,

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so it was very particular, and that was

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it was

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makes interesting the signal. It was a narrowband

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frequency.

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Usually,

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astronomical

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events when they,

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supernova

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or some flares, they emit

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radiation

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in all frequencies

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on all the spectrum. Could be visible or

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x rays, gamma rays,

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optical, and then radio. So

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and they are easy to recognize. And that

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was something that they were doing and detecting

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for the first time

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with the with this, telescope.

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But this was just one particular frequency,

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and that's the amazing part. Only things that,

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transmit in one particular physic frequency

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are spectral lines from different molecules. We know

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that they,

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do that.

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But also technology

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because,

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our technology is much easier to transmit

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at one particular

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frequency because otherwise you will spreading

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spreading your energy,

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and it would be a waste of of

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communications.

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So,

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but then why not a a astronomical

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spectral line or something like that? Well,

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the signal just,

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when they came back

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through the all their Earth rotation 24 hours

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later

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and saw and checked it up and checked

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the the data,

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they

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it was not there.

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Spectral lines are constant.

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They are there, and they stay there.

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And, and there are some events like,

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masers that produce, so this is the the

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same thing as lasers, but but in your

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in the video frequencies

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that they can emit the signal. But, usually,

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they are pretty constant.

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So the signal just

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lasts

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for a a for those second observation

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is not there the other day,

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and

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that was amazing. That was like,

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instead of a a

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astronomical maser.

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It was, more like an artificial maser.

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So that was it. That that that was,

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the

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the the story, and they,

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had at that time,

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they don't have the computer capacity to save

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the data in disk

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or tapes

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that were that

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were available. That was too much

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for that time, and they just printed the

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information.

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Information was printed. That's it. That's all the

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data that we had in those in those

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days.

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And, one of the scientists

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of the project just highlight

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this strong signal with, wow.

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It could be something else. He could write,

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wow, or

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or what is this? But, wow, as simple

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as that.

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So do you think that the astronomers working

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at the the Big Ear telescope actually thought

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that they'd heard something from an alien civilization,

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a a technologically advanced alien civilization?

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Yes. They they they thought that because that

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was exactly what they were looking for, a

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very strong signal,

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One particular here in the sky with very

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strong signal.

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And,

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and,

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it just lasted at least less than 24

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hours.

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So that they were very intrigued,

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and they looked through all the data because

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in those days, you save the data and

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printer, and it was later after

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that you saw the the data. And you

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look through the printed and then continue

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scanning

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that just to see if there's any repetition

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and that, and they were actually discussing that.

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That's a

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a a strong possibility that they detected because

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there was no other explanation

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for

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and there are multiple

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people have been proposed on multiples,

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at least qualitatively,

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multiple explanation,

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but they fail at something.

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Even the,

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saying that this was a a terrestrial communication,

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let's say, satellite, we are we're talking in

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the seventies.

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There were not much, and those frequencies were

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already protected.

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So for use of astronomy. So it was

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not supposed that any radio communications will be

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performed and in in those frequencies.

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And this was a a target thing. It

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was one particular region of the sky

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that was otherwise

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probably

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some radio frequency interference

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will be shorter in time and will be

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something that could be repeated.

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And it's it's very hard to it was

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very hard to come, and that's probably what

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is was so famous

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that,

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astronomical

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or

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terrestrial explanations

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or even instrumental

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defects,

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they were very

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something

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very hard to come by to for us

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as as planet.

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But over the intervening years since the late

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19 seventies, people have gradually come to the

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view that this this wasn't, in fact, a

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communication from the alien signal. How has that

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consensus come about?

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Well, I think

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so we tend to everything that we cannot

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explain otherwise is evidence.

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I see. I think that's that's that's the

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general,

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public perception

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that,

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no. It's something well,

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we can learn from this, that anything that

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we cannot explain is something that need to

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be explained. That's it.

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And, and, because no astronomical explanation was easy,

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then one easy explanation

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is assuming,

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00:10:59,465 --> 00:11:01,965
okay, there are aliens there, and they were,

292
00:11:03,225 --> 00:11:04,445
trying to communicate.

293
00:11:05,065 --> 00:11:07,245
And just to be noticed, they've

294
00:11:07,625 --> 00:11:08,125
constructed

295
00:11:08,504 --> 00:11:10,285
a some maser,

296
00:11:11,600 --> 00:11:13,679
like we we do on Earth. We have

297
00:11:13,679 --> 00:11:16,100
masers in in this particular frequency.

298
00:11:16,879 --> 00:11:19,360
And, and then because it's the easy ways

299
00:11:19,360 --> 00:11:21,679
to to narrow your signal to all your

300
00:11:21,679 --> 00:11:22,179
energy

301
00:11:22,720 --> 00:11:24,959
to be concentrated in something that can be

302
00:11:24,959 --> 00:11:26,365
detected, and then,

303
00:11:26,745 --> 00:11:27,245
you

304
00:11:27,625 --> 00:11:28,924
just shine that

305
00:11:29,544 --> 00:11:32,264
maser everywhere, and it happens that they were

306
00:11:32,264 --> 00:11:33,004
at the right

307
00:11:33,464 --> 00:11:35,485
time observing that location.

308
00:11:36,264 --> 00:11:39,704
But they turn off it is is energy

309
00:11:39,704 --> 00:11:40,204
consuming

310
00:11:40,910 --> 00:11:43,330
for having so much energy in one direction.

311
00:11:43,389 --> 00:11:45,309
So they turn off or they or the

312
00:11:45,309 --> 00:11:48,429
planet is rotating also. So they they they

313
00:11:48,429 --> 00:11:48,929
are,

314
00:11:49,230 --> 00:11:50,450
chiming other targets.

315
00:11:51,389 --> 00:11:53,970
So so so there could be many

316
00:11:54,404 --> 00:11:57,125
possible explanation why it's short lived even easy.

317
00:11:57,125 --> 00:12:00,318
You consider this as as as as an

318
00:12:00,324 --> 00:12:01,225
alien communication.

319
00:12:02,884 --> 00:12:04,884
But let's turn now to your new work,

320
00:12:04,884 --> 00:12:07,144
which I understand you've carried out at Arecibo

321
00:12:07,445 --> 00:12:09,299
even though, as some of our listeners may

322
00:12:09,299 --> 00:12:13,059
remember, the famous 305 meter diameter radio telescope

323
00:12:13,059 --> 00:12:16,100
there suffered a serious structural failure and collapsed

324
00:12:16,100 --> 00:12:17,000
back in 2020.

325
00:12:17,699 --> 00:12:19,779
Is the work you've done all based on

326
00:12:19,779 --> 00:12:21,399
old data from before then?

327
00:12:23,664 --> 00:12:24,164
No.

328
00:12:24,945 --> 00:12:27,044
I I started using the the the observatory

329
00:12:27,424 --> 00:12:28,404
in 2017.

330
00:12:30,304 --> 00:12:31,445
Our objective

331
00:12:31,825 --> 00:12:35,024
was to look at particular stars that we

332
00:12:35,024 --> 00:12:37,445
know that have potentially habitable planets.

333
00:12:38,070 --> 00:12:40,550
It's not it was not to search for

334
00:12:40,550 --> 00:12:41,690
life on those planet,

335
00:12:41,990 --> 00:12:44,730
but for habitable condition for those planets.

336
00:12:45,350 --> 00:12:47,029
Because we were looking on the stars, those

337
00:12:47,029 --> 00:12:50,389
stars emit, flares, and that flares can produce,

338
00:12:50,629 --> 00:12:53,254
can damage the atmospheres of these planets on

339
00:12:53,254 --> 00:12:54,074
the long run.

340
00:12:54,855 --> 00:12:57,254
So we were trying to get the sense

341
00:12:57,254 --> 00:12:58,394
of the space weather

342
00:12:59,014 --> 00:13:00,794
that was affecting those

343
00:13:01,254 --> 00:13:01,754
planets.

344
00:13:02,134 --> 00:13:04,475
But when you have a radio telescope,

345
00:13:05,199 --> 00:13:07,279
it has a a a field view, what

346
00:13:07,279 --> 00:13:08,659
we call a beam size.

347
00:13:09,199 --> 00:13:12,480
So that beam size is is large, and

348
00:13:12,480 --> 00:13:15,360
you will have signals not only from the

349
00:13:15,360 --> 00:13:15,860
stars

350
00:13:16,240 --> 00:13:18,259
but also from the other planets

351
00:13:18,559 --> 00:13:20,100
and some background stars.

352
00:13:20,875 --> 00:13:23,674
So so it so we're getting all the

353
00:13:23,674 --> 00:13:26,634
radio information from that region in particular. So

354
00:13:26,634 --> 00:13:28,714
it's not only the star. So I got

355
00:13:28,714 --> 00:13:30,414
always in my mind, well,

356
00:13:31,034 --> 00:13:32,014
if I'm looking

357
00:13:32,889 --> 00:13:35,529
targets of particular interest for for the search

358
00:13:35,529 --> 00:13:37,070
for actually search for life,

359
00:13:37,690 --> 00:13:40,570
but I'm not doing that. And, maybe sometime

360
00:13:40,570 --> 00:13:42,889
in the future, I look through the data

361
00:13:42,889 --> 00:13:44,625
and and and

362
00:13:45,184 --> 00:13:48,065
so that was my impression. So we have

363
00:13:48,065 --> 00:13:48,565
observations

364
00:13:49,504 --> 00:13:50,004
until,

365
00:13:51,105 --> 00:13:51,605
August

366
00:13:51,985 --> 00:13:52,485
2020

367
00:13:53,264 --> 00:13:55,605
because in August 2020 was the

368
00:13:57,024 --> 00:13:59,365
time that the first cable broke

369
00:13:59,740 --> 00:14:00,559
at the observatory,

370
00:14:00,940 --> 00:14:03,200
and, so they stopped working.

371
00:14:03,660 --> 00:14:06,160
And then by December, they equalized.

372
00:14:06,700 --> 00:14:08,480
So it was a slow process.

373
00:14:09,899 --> 00:14:10,639
And then,

374
00:14:11,580 --> 00:14:14,975
so I looked through our data, and

375
00:14:15,434 --> 00:14:17,674
and this project, what is amazing for me

376
00:14:17,674 --> 00:14:20,174
that I started doing this May.

377
00:14:21,595 --> 00:14:24,714
Okay. Let's so finally, I decided just to

378
00:14:24,714 --> 00:14:25,694
look for 10 signatures.

379
00:14:26,074 --> 00:14:27,754
So that's a big shift. This is a

380
00:14:27,754 --> 00:14:28,574
side project,

381
00:14:29,115 --> 00:14:31,419
and and and I was motivated by the

382
00:14:31,419 --> 00:14:32,879
video of on the

383
00:14:34,220 --> 00:14:37,259
on the WAV signal because probably, like, in

384
00:14:37,259 --> 00:14:38,080
most astronomers,

385
00:14:38,860 --> 00:14:40,940
I dismiss the WAV signal. Even that I

386
00:14:40,940 --> 00:14:42,559
know from my childhood,

387
00:14:44,384 --> 00:14:44,884
I

388
00:14:45,904 --> 00:14:47,825
I never thought the wipe signal as something

389
00:14:47,825 --> 00:14:48,325
real

390
00:14:48,945 --> 00:14:50,865
or something. I thought maybe it was a

391
00:14:50,865 --> 00:14:51,365
glitch.

392
00:14:51,904 --> 00:14:54,725
I I didn't put much attention to that.

393
00:14:56,320 --> 00:14:59,460
Something fun probably, but, and and

394
00:15:00,160 --> 00:15:02,899
the association with aliens, it doesn't help. So

395
00:15:04,160 --> 00:15:06,559
so that's probably but when I saw this

396
00:15:06,559 --> 00:15:09,764
video and, and it tried to dig into

397
00:15:09,904 --> 00:15:11,445
what was the signal about,

398
00:15:12,384 --> 00:15:14,465
this the strain, that's something that I may

399
00:15:14,465 --> 00:15:16,304
see. It was a strong signal for for

400
00:15:16,304 --> 00:15:19,504
for that duration. That's I that's in my

401
00:15:19,504 --> 00:15:21,445
experience, that's very hard

402
00:15:22,070 --> 00:15:24,070
to do as in in astronomy. I've never

403
00:15:24,070 --> 00:15:26,009
seen something like that in in my data.

404
00:15:27,269 --> 00:15:30,409
So, that motivated me to go deeper into

405
00:15:30,470 --> 00:15:32,230
that and expecting that,

406
00:15:33,190 --> 00:15:36,070
in this project, let's search for wow signal.

407
00:15:36,070 --> 00:15:39,045
So I for me, the must fun part

408
00:15:39,424 --> 00:15:42,304
was to get into the history of the

409
00:15:42,304 --> 00:15:43,605
Big Air serve observatory,

410
00:15:44,225 --> 00:15:45,764
compare with a receiver,

411
00:15:46,225 --> 00:15:48,004
know how they did the observation,

412
00:15:48,945 --> 00:15:52,225
try to imitate the exact analysis that they

413
00:15:52,225 --> 00:15:52,679
did,

414
00:15:53,399 --> 00:15:54,139
even going

415
00:15:54,600 --> 00:15:55,339
that retro

416
00:15:55,720 --> 00:15:57,179
to also our,

417
00:15:59,080 --> 00:15:59,580
analysis

418
00:16:00,519 --> 00:16:02,460
converted to to numbers

419
00:16:03,320 --> 00:16:05,339
to text and numbers like they did

420
00:16:05,879 --> 00:16:07,879
at that time just for the fun of

421
00:16:07,879 --> 00:16:08,379
it

422
00:16:08,735 --> 00:16:10,894
because I love it, this this this, part

423
00:16:10,894 --> 00:16:11,555
of history.

424
00:16:12,175 --> 00:16:12,415
And,

425
00:16:13,375 --> 00:16:15,615
and I was expecting that, I was not

426
00:16:15,615 --> 00:16:18,254
expecting to get any signal at all, something

427
00:16:18,254 --> 00:16:18,754
interesting,

428
00:16:19,855 --> 00:16:21,394
but we have to search anyway.

429
00:16:22,340 --> 00:16:24,500
Maybe I write a paper in 1, 2

430
00:16:24,500 --> 00:16:26,040
years that we look at this region,

431
00:16:26,500 --> 00:16:26,980
and they

432
00:16:27,940 --> 00:16:29,800
that we are is is is,

433
00:16:30,180 --> 00:16:32,519
we don't detect anything with this,

434
00:16:32,980 --> 00:16:35,300
sensitivity, and and that and that no result

435
00:16:35,300 --> 00:16:37,834
is important to be published because that's something

436
00:16:37,975 --> 00:16:38,475
that,

437
00:16:39,014 --> 00:16:41,034
other scientists will look and say, okay.

438
00:16:41,735 --> 00:16:44,294
These people did this, and if you want

439
00:16:44,294 --> 00:16:46,154
to look further on that,

440
00:16:46,615 --> 00:16:49,254
then we not increase the sensitivity or your

441
00:16:49,254 --> 00:16:51,254
time or your frequency because it was an

442
00:16:51,254 --> 00:16:53,340
observed before in that. So we we we

443
00:16:53,340 --> 00:16:55,580
build up. So that's one important these node

444
00:16:55,580 --> 00:16:57,259
results. So that was my idea that in

445
00:16:57,259 --> 00:16:59,340
1 or 2 years, I will be talking

446
00:16:59,340 --> 00:17:00,080
about this,

447
00:17:00,700 --> 00:17:03,340
about my node results on that. But it

448
00:17:03,340 --> 00:17:05,119
was amazing that, just

449
00:17:06,204 --> 00:17:07,585
something interesting happened.

450
00:17:08,684 --> 00:17:09,345
Too early.

451
00:17:09,884 --> 00:17:11,484
So what was that interesting thing? Do you

452
00:17:11,484 --> 00:17:14,365
basically see a few sort of miniature versions

453
00:17:14,365 --> 00:17:16,365
of something like the wow signal in the

454
00:17:16,365 --> 00:17:16,865
data?

455
00:17:17,325 --> 00:17:20,070
Yes. Definitely. That was a miniature version. That's

456
00:17:20,070 --> 00:17:21,750
that's the one way to call it. That's

457
00:17:21,990 --> 00:17:23,210
so it was exactly,

458
00:17:24,150 --> 00:17:25,130
the frequencies

459
00:17:25,430 --> 00:17:26,410
that were expected.

460
00:17:27,590 --> 00:17:28,570
We narrowband

461
00:17:29,190 --> 00:17:31,369
a very particular narrowband frequency,

462
00:17:33,974 --> 00:17:36,234
which looks like a a space meter.

463
00:17:36,934 --> 00:17:37,414
And,

464
00:17:37,815 --> 00:17:40,214
but the only difference within that and the

465
00:17:40,214 --> 00:17:41,835
whole signal was the intensity.

466
00:17:42,934 --> 00:17:46,054
That was it. These signals were in the

467
00:17:46,054 --> 00:17:47,194
limit of detection

468
00:17:48,079 --> 00:17:49,140
of the big ear.

469
00:17:49,839 --> 00:17:51,140
So they were not,

470
00:17:52,000 --> 00:17:54,420
in general be able to detect the signal.

471
00:17:55,039 --> 00:17:57,539
So only if they get brighter, much brighter,

472
00:17:57,920 --> 00:17:59,619
they will be detectable.

473
00:18:00,394 --> 00:18:02,234
And they have to be brighter for,

474
00:18:02,794 --> 00:18:05,194
also for a short time. And short time,

475
00:18:05,194 --> 00:18:07,134
if I mean, I mean, minutes, hours.

476
00:18:08,554 --> 00:18:09,054
So

477
00:18:09,434 --> 00:18:11,994
so I I so I start this project

478
00:18:11,994 --> 00:18:13,615
May, and we I analyze

479
00:18:14,039 --> 00:18:17,019
the data using their their procedures, some

480
00:18:17,559 --> 00:18:18,779
some much better procedures.

481
00:18:19,400 --> 00:18:20,860
I immediately saw

482
00:18:21,400 --> 00:18:21,900
these

483
00:18:22,360 --> 00:18:23,740
lines, the signals.

484
00:18:24,440 --> 00:18:26,759
And I look through the signals, and I

485
00:18:26,759 --> 00:18:29,345
say, wow. That well, yeah, wow. No point

486
00:18:29,345 --> 00:18:29,845
intended.

487
00:18:30,224 --> 00:18:32,804
That look exactly like like the wall signal.

488
00:18:33,984 --> 00:18:34,484
And,

489
00:18:35,585 --> 00:18:37,044
they just have to be brighter.

490
00:18:38,304 --> 00:18:40,704
And that got me thinking how we can

491
00:18:40,704 --> 00:18:43,125
make those signal brighter for a moment,

492
00:18:44,529 --> 00:18:46,930
Because they are natural emission for the for

493
00:18:46,930 --> 00:18:49,830
the hydrogen atoms, they are very well known.

494
00:18:50,289 --> 00:18:51,809
So those those signals

495
00:18:52,369 --> 00:18:53,590
I I knew there were clouds

496
00:18:54,210 --> 00:18:56,930
of hydrogen that they are very cold, and

497
00:18:56,930 --> 00:18:59,174
because they are they are very cold, they

498
00:18:59,174 --> 00:19:00,474
emit in narrow band.

499
00:19:00,855 --> 00:19:02,075
But, usually, hydrogen

500
00:19:02,375 --> 00:19:04,774
is a is a is a is a

501
00:19:04,774 --> 00:19:07,115
atom at different speeds everywhere

502
00:19:07,494 --> 00:19:08,634
moving through the galaxy.

503
00:19:09,014 --> 00:19:11,674
So the general when we say the

504
00:19:12,320 --> 00:19:15,200
hydrogen line is in astronomy is actually when

505
00:19:15,200 --> 00:19:16,500
you see it is a profile.

506
00:19:17,119 --> 00:19:19,440
It's a big signal. It's a broad signal.

507
00:19:19,440 --> 00:19:21,359
So that's why one of the reason that

508
00:19:21,359 --> 00:19:22,099
it never

509
00:19:22,640 --> 00:19:24,720
occurred before that it could be a hydrogen

510
00:19:24,720 --> 00:19:26,099
line is a broad line.

511
00:19:26,400 --> 00:19:27,539
But there are pockets

512
00:19:28,154 --> 00:19:28,715
of these,

513
00:19:29,195 --> 00:19:30,095
small clouds

514
00:19:31,275 --> 00:19:33,055
that are are cold enough

515
00:19:33,994 --> 00:19:36,235
for that narrow signal to be and and

516
00:19:36,235 --> 00:19:38,735
bright enough to narrow signal to be detected

517
00:19:38,795 --> 00:19:40,174
if you have the right telescope.

518
00:19:41,380 --> 00:19:43,779
And that's why I saw that that signals,

519
00:19:43,779 --> 00:19:45,700
and I got thinking maybe for a week

520
00:19:45,700 --> 00:19:47,319
or so for different,

521
00:19:48,740 --> 00:19:51,619
methods because I knew that, for example, a

522
00:19:51,619 --> 00:19:54,740
supernova explosion will excitate that gas, and it

523
00:19:54,740 --> 00:19:57,615
will highlight the the the hydrogen line. It

524
00:19:57,615 --> 00:19:58,355
will stimulate

525
00:19:58,815 --> 00:20:01,855
the emission. But also it will move and

526
00:20:01,855 --> 00:20:03,955
compress the the atoms there,

527
00:20:04,414 --> 00:20:07,075
and they will have different speeds and

528
00:20:07,535 --> 00:20:08,755
by the Doppler effect,

529
00:20:09,329 --> 00:20:12,529
that signal will be broadband. It will spread

530
00:20:12,529 --> 00:20:15,089
in the spectrum, and you will recognize, okay,

531
00:20:15,089 --> 00:20:16,390
we have seen this before.

532
00:20:17,089 --> 00:20:18,309
So all the mechanisms

533
00:20:18,609 --> 00:20:21,890
that made those brighter were also make the

534
00:20:21,890 --> 00:20:23,750
signal broad and not narrowband.

535
00:20:24,554 --> 00:20:26,954
So the point was and the only thing

536
00:20:26,954 --> 00:20:29,835
that makes sense was a some kind of

537
00:20:29,835 --> 00:20:30,894
maser effect,

538
00:20:31,595 --> 00:20:34,075
which won't increase the temperature of the system,

539
00:20:34,075 --> 00:20:35,375
but it will stimulate.

540
00:20:35,755 --> 00:20:37,534
And for that, you will need

541
00:20:37,835 --> 00:20:39,454
a background source

542
00:20:40,369 --> 00:20:42,150
of high energy radiation

543
00:20:42,610 --> 00:20:44,529
that could be in any parts of the

544
00:20:44,529 --> 00:20:45,029
spectrum,

545
00:20:45,730 --> 00:20:47,990
but it will include the radio spectrum.

546
00:20:48,450 --> 00:20:50,690
And if if the sign is the

547
00:20:51,570 --> 00:20:54,150
including the frequency of the of the hydrogen

548
00:20:54,210 --> 00:20:55,830
emission, and that will stimulate

549
00:20:56,984 --> 00:20:58,365
for a moment because

550
00:20:59,224 --> 00:21:01,384
that's the big issue here. We know of

551
00:21:01,384 --> 00:21:02,924
many astrophysical measures

552
00:21:03,545 --> 00:21:05,325
by different molecules.

553
00:21:06,184 --> 00:21:08,205
And even for hydrogen,

554
00:21:09,144 --> 00:21:10,045
atomic hydrogen,

555
00:21:10,859 --> 00:21:13,099
it was discovered in is it rare for

556
00:21:13,099 --> 00:21:15,500
the for atomic hydrogen, but it was at

557
00:21:15,500 --> 00:21:16,480
other frequencies.

558
00:21:17,980 --> 00:21:18,480
Never

559
00:21:18,940 --> 00:21:20,720
in this particular frequency

560
00:21:21,420 --> 00:21:22,799
of the 21 centimeters.

561
00:21:23,464 --> 00:21:25,305
Never. And it was thought that it was,

562
00:21:25,545 --> 00:21:27,005
very difficult to impossible

563
00:21:27,945 --> 00:21:30,205
to and that was my perception too.

564
00:21:30,825 --> 00:21:32,125
So so

565
00:21:32,984 --> 00:21:35,785
but this also made sense that this could

566
00:21:35,785 --> 00:21:38,470
be a rare event and you need then

567
00:21:38,470 --> 00:21:41,690
a strong radiation source, and the main effect

568
00:21:41,750 --> 00:21:43,929
won't be able to be sustained anyway.

569
00:21:44,630 --> 00:21:46,789
So it will be a very transient effect.

570
00:21:46,789 --> 00:21:48,950
So that's one that that's one of the

571
00:21:48,950 --> 00:21:49,450
explanations

572
00:21:50,390 --> 00:21:52,329
that makes it makes sense.

573
00:21:52,634 --> 00:21:55,195
There are other options in that line, but

574
00:21:55,195 --> 00:21:56,255
all require

575
00:21:56,875 --> 00:21:59,615
that you have a strong background source

576
00:22:00,315 --> 00:22:01,455
that will stimulate

577
00:22:01,835 --> 00:22:04,494
and that that source are not necessarily visible.

578
00:22:06,240 --> 00:22:08,080
Right. So, I mean, some of our listeners

579
00:22:08,080 --> 00:22:10,480
may hear the words hydrogen maser and think

580
00:22:10,480 --> 00:22:12,559
of, as you said, a laboratory device. We

581
00:22:12,559 --> 00:22:15,039
may people people make mazers, and they use

582
00:22:15,039 --> 00:22:16,880
them for atomic clocks and this sort of

583
00:22:16,880 --> 00:22:17,380
thing.

584
00:22:18,400 --> 00:22:20,654
How does the natural world sort of

585
00:22:21,134 --> 00:22:23,234
duplicate that sort of physical system

586
00:22:23,855 --> 00:22:24,355
out

587
00:22:24,734 --> 00:22:26,595
somewhere light years away from Earth?

588
00:22:28,015 --> 00:22:30,434
Well, I I get an impression

589
00:22:30,894 --> 00:22:31,394
that

590
00:22:31,855 --> 00:22:32,355
that

591
00:22:33,134 --> 00:22:35,634
everything we do in our lab,

592
00:22:37,590 --> 00:22:38,970
nature does it better

593
00:22:39,670 --> 00:22:40,970
and more magnificent,

594
00:22:42,230 --> 00:22:42,730
bigger.

595
00:22:43,590 --> 00:22:45,130
So we can do a high

596
00:22:46,470 --> 00:22:49,190
foot function of fission in the lab on

597
00:22:49,190 --> 00:22:52,695
nature. We do with stars, fission, marginally. So

598
00:22:52,695 --> 00:22:53,355
I think

599
00:22:53,734 --> 00:22:56,055
so for this, we can do masers in

600
00:22:56,055 --> 00:22:58,775
the lab. So I think the the well,

601
00:22:58,775 --> 00:23:02,214
as as astronomy is doing, masers. So this

602
00:23:02,214 --> 00:23:03,414
kind of masers that we do in the

603
00:23:03,414 --> 00:23:04,955
lab and we haven't seen before,

604
00:23:05,380 --> 00:23:08,259
I think that that's what's happening here. Nature

605
00:23:08,259 --> 00:23:08,919
is doing

606
00:23:09,299 --> 00:23:12,259
that measure of it. But, anyway, it will

607
00:23:12,259 --> 00:23:12,759
be

608
00:23:13,380 --> 00:23:15,619
a rare event because many thing has to

609
00:23:15,619 --> 00:23:16,679
be right also.

610
00:23:17,565 --> 00:23:19,744
Because the you have to have the

611
00:23:20,365 --> 00:23:21,964
strong emission from this,

612
00:23:22,365 --> 00:23:25,585
within the the only things that could be

613
00:23:26,524 --> 00:23:28,924
that a strong emission enough for producing and

614
00:23:28,924 --> 00:23:31,825
stimulate this emission in this cloud are magnetars,

615
00:23:32,720 --> 00:23:33,700
which is a kind of natural

616
00:23:34,320 --> 00:23:36,559
neutral star with a high magnetic field, and

617
00:23:36,559 --> 00:23:40,000
they emit the strongest flare ever compared to

618
00:23:40,000 --> 00:23:41,619
any flare star or so.

619
00:23:42,000 --> 00:23:42,500
So

620
00:23:43,039 --> 00:23:45,279
we think so that has to happen. And

621
00:23:45,279 --> 00:23:47,785
those we know not that many, and we

622
00:23:47,785 --> 00:23:48,365
have detected

623
00:23:48,984 --> 00:23:51,325
the magnetile flares, and they are rare because

624
00:23:51,384 --> 00:23:53,244
it it will hours be directional

625
00:23:53,625 --> 00:23:54,125
also.

626
00:23:54,585 --> 00:23:56,605
So they could be flaring in other direction,

627
00:23:56,664 --> 00:23:58,204
and you will never detect it.

628
00:23:59,224 --> 00:23:59,724
And

629
00:24:00,184 --> 00:24:02,365
that flare has to be in the background

630
00:24:03,240 --> 00:24:04,460
of of one of these clouds

631
00:24:05,079 --> 00:24:07,660
because, these cold clouds will highlight

632
00:24:08,680 --> 00:24:09,420
the and increase,

633
00:24:10,200 --> 00:24:10,700
the

634
00:24:11,079 --> 00:24:12,059
the the signal.

635
00:24:13,320 --> 00:24:14,700
And it it will be a

636
00:24:16,119 --> 00:24:17,339
a a a a a process of

637
00:24:17,984 --> 00:24:19,444
chance and good luck.

638
00:24:19,825 --> 00:24:20,805
And it's amazing,

639
00:24:21,345 --> 00:24:21,845
but,

640
00:24:22,305 --> 00:24:22,805
that,

641
00:24:23,265 --> 00:24:24,085
even the

642
00:24:24,625 --> 00:24:25,684
the air had the

643
00:24:26,305 --> 00:24:28,065
the chance to detect something,

644
00:24:28,464 --> 00:24:29,204
like this.

645
00:24:30,809 --> 00:24:32,649
And the fact that you've now detected more

646
00:24:32,649 --> 00:24:34,649
of them, albeit at a much lower intensity,

647
00:24:34,649 --> 00:24:35,710
what are the implications

648
00:24:36,089 --> 00:24:38,970
of that for future research in this this

649
00:24:38,970 --> 00:24:39,470
area?

650
00:24:40,329 --> 00:24:41,789
Okay. So we detected

651
00:24:43,134 --> 00:24:45,214
a different signal. I have to make clear,

652
00:24:45,214 --> 00:24:46,674
these these signals

653
00:24:46,974 --> 00:24:47,954
are known

654
00:24:48,494 --> 00:24:50,674
because these clouds are are ubiquitous,

655
00:24:50,974 --> 00:24:51,634
are everywhere.

656
00:24:52,335 --> 00:24:52,835
They're

657
00:24:55,500 --> 00:24:57,259
in in in in I mean, in the

658
00:24:57,259 --> 00:24:58,000
whole sky.

659
00:24:58,380 --> 00:25:00,559
And I if you but you need

660
00:25:01,019 --> 00:25:04,080
to recognize those signals a a big telescope.

661
00:25:05,259 --> 00:25:05,580
And,

662
00:25:06,059 --> 00:25:08,779
you need also to analyze the data in

663
00:25:08,779 --> 00:25:09,680
the same way

664
00:25:10,474 --> 00:25:11,434
that they were,

665
00:25:12,154 --> 00:25:14,795
exploring the signal, looking at the exchanges in

666
00:25:14,795 --> 00:25:15,455
the background.

667
00:25:15,914 --> 00:25:18,974
And you need also to have the the

668
00:25:19,115 --> 00:25:20,654
bandwidth that they were using,

669
00:25:21,515 --> 00:25:23,850
which is with everybody call it as a

670
00:25:23,850 --> 00:25:26,430
narrowband. They were looking narrowband saying that, well,

671
00:25:26,570 --> 00:25:29,130
we're looking for SETI right now in much

672
00:25:29,130 --> 00:25:31,630
narrower bands because you usually, for communications,

673
00:25:32,330 --> 00:25:32,830
transmit

674
00:25:33,529 --> 00:25:35,150
in much narrower bands.

675
00:25:35,850 --> 00:25:36,990
But that was narrowband

676
00:25:37,705 --> 00:25:38,445
back then

677
00:25:39,305 --> 00:25:41,884
back then. And for just by coincidence,

678
00:25:42,345 --> 00:25:43,244
our observations

679
00:25:44,025 --> 00:25:45,485
were in that narrowband

680
00:25:46,105 --> 00:25:48,765
because we were not looking at spectral lines.

681
00:25:49,305 --> 00:25:52,179
We were not going for 30. If if

682
00:25:52,179 --> 00:25:54,599
I were looking for spectral lines,

683
00:25:55,700 --> 00:25:58,279
I will be using a much narrower band,

684
00:25:58,659 --> 00:26:00,440
and I will be seeing this.

685
00:26:01,619 --> 00:26:03,720
So so you have to have

686
00:26:05,474 --> 00:26:07,095
looking at the right

687
00:26:07,474 --> 00:26:09,894
sky at the right region of the sky

688
00:26:10,355 --> 00:26:12,454
with this, sensitive telescope

689
00:26:12,835 --> 00:26:15,714
in a and do this type of particular

690
00:26:15,714 --> 00:26:17,815
type of analysis looking for narrowband

691
00:26:18,194 --> 00:26:21,119
that that side just to to to recognize

692
00:26:21,339 --> 00:26:21,919
the signal.

693
00:26:22,700 --> 00:26:23,200
So

694
00:26:24,059 --> 00:26:26,319
we will continue to do so,

695
00:26:27,500 --> 00:26:30,220
observing because now we there's an intriguing possibility.

696
00:26:30,220 --> 00:26:30,619
Okay?

697
00:26:32,619 --> 00:26:34,640
Now that we know that the

698
00:26:35,099 --> 00:26:35,599
corporate,

699
00:26:36,025 --> 00:26:36,765
we believe,

700
00:26:37,224 --> 00:26:38,684
is, one of these clouds,

701
00:26:39,224 --> 00:26:41,944
so these clouds should be in the area

702
00:26:41,944 --> 00:26:43,464
of the web signal. That will be the

703
00:26:43,464 --> 00:26:46,444
first thing to to other people or us

704
00:26:46,744 --> 00:26:47,724
to search for.

705
00:26:48,279 --> 00:26:51,180
And why we haven't seen those clouds in

706
00:26:51,240 --> 00:26:53,180
search? Well, there is not a a

707
00:26:53,880 --> 00:26:55,500
so far, a a

708
00:26:55,880 --> 00:26:58,519
telescope with enough sensitivity had looked at that

709
00:26:58,519 --> 00:26:59,019
region.

710
00:26:59,799 --> 00:27:02,054
A resevo was not able to look at

711
00:27:02,054 --> 00:27:04,054
any way to that region in particular, so

712
00:27:04,054 --> 00:27:05,514
to the region of the WAP signal

713
00:27:05,815 --> 00:27:07,674
because it was outside of the declination.

714
00:27:08,774 --> 00:27:11,815
And all the telescope that were able are

715
00:27:11,815 --> 00:27:12,714
smaller ones.

716
00:27:13,575 --> 00:27:14,075
The

717
00:27:14,774 --> 00:27:16,474
the next that's in the

718
00:27:17,690 --> 00:27:20,509
green bank, for example, a 100 meters, unless

719
00:27:20,650 --> 00:27:22,109
you are using FASS

720
00:27:22,410 --> 00:27:23,150
from China

721
00:27:24,890 --> 00:27:25,869
or the BLA.

722
00:27:26,170 --> 00:27:27,390
BLA is,

723
00:27:28,490 --> 00:27:30,269
it has a a a

724
00:27:31,404 --> 00:27:32,144
a nice

725
00:27:32,845 --> 00:27:33,744
space resolution

726
00:27:34,204 --> 00:27:34,865
to see

727
00:27:35,244 --> 00:27:37,184
in that. It's not that sensitive,

728
00:27:37,805 --> 00:27:41,085
but but but, it compensates that because it

729
00:27:41,085 --> 00:27:41,585
has

730
00:27:42,605 --> 00:27:44,045
a nice space of resolution. So that's the

731
00:27:44,045 --> 00:27:45,964
only one that could could look through the

732
00:27:45,964 --> 00:27:46,464
area

733
00:27:46,789 --> 00:27:47,450
and spot

734
00:27:47,750 --> 00:27:49,210
these small clouds.

735
00:27:49,909 --> 00:27:52,230
And if somebody do that, and we're planning

736
00:27:52,230 --> 00:27:53,049
to do that,

737
00:27:53,669 --> 00:27:54,169
but

738
00:27:54,869 --> 00:27:56,650
now the paper is out, somebody

739
00:27:57,509 --> 00:27:59,849
might might search, probably diagnose.

740
00:28:00,549 --> 00:28:01,049
So

741
00:28:01,664 --> 00:28:03,684
is the good thing is that

742
00:28:04,705 --> 00:28:07,365
we should start trying to falsify this hypothesis,

743
00:28:07,825 --> 00:28:09,664
is to look for these clouds in the

744
00:28:09,664 --> 00:28:11,825
region, which I'm sure you will find those

745
00:28:11,825 --> 00:28:13,445
clouds there because they are everywhere.

746
00:28:15,220 --> 00:28:17,639
And for the first time, you will have

747
00:28:17,700 --> 00:28:19,639
a a a

748
00:28:20,899 --> 00:28:21,639
this idea.

749
00:28:22,579 --> 00:28:25,460
So where the actual if this is true,

750
00:28:25,460 --> 00:28:27,779
where the signal came from. Because we know

751
00:28:27,779 --> 00:28:30,404
the general region, the beam size, as I

752
00:28:30,484 --> 00:28:33,045
told you before, for radio telescope is big,

753
00:28:33,045 --> 00:28:34,904
so it encompass many objects.

754
00:28:35,684 --> 00:28:37,765
And that was true for the big ears

755
00:28:37,765 --> 00:28:39,144
since it was not that big.

756
00:28:39,605 --> 00:28:41,845
So there are 1,000 stars in the in

757
00:28:41,845 --> 00:28:44,670
this field. So we don't know actually which

758
00:28:44,670 --> 00:28:47,009
one was. So the clouds

759
00:28:47,309 --> 00:28:48,130
will discriminate.

760
00:28:49,150 --> 00:28:50,910
So you will see these clouds, and maybe

761
00:28:50,910 --> 00:28:53,470
I expect that there being that that field

762
00:28:53,470 --> 00:28:54,609
file or 6.

763
00:28:55,264 --> 00:28:57,284
That will be, reduction

764
00:28:57,984 --> 00:28:59,125
where to search for.

765
00:28:59,744 --> 00:28:59,984
And,

766
00:29:00,944 --> 00:29:02,644
and once you find that,

767
00:29:03,264 --> 00:29:03,764
so

768
00:29:04,144 --> 00:29:04,884
the responsible

769
00:29:05,184 --> 00:29:07,505
to excite that cloud will be in the

770
00:29:07,505 --> 00:29:10,210
background of those clouds. So these clouds are

771
00:29:10,210 --> 00:29:12,789
transparent. They are visible in their radio spectrum.

772
00:29:12,849 --> 00:29:13,349
So

773
00:29:13,730 --> 00:29:15,750
only you see them in the radio spectrum.

774
00:29:16,210 --> 00:29:18,289
But in any optical telescope, you will you

775
00:29:18,289 --> 00:29:19,909
won't see those. You won't,

776
00:29:20,690 --> 00:29:22,710
you will see the background stars.

777
00:29:23,434 --> 00:29:26,075
And one of the background stars or objects

778
00:29:26,075 --> 00:29:27,994
there will be, we don't know of any

779
00:29:27,994 --> 00:29:29,375
magnetar in that video.

780
00:29:29,914 --> 00:29:32,554
We haven't discovered that. But magnetars have been

781
00:29:32,554 --> 00:29:33,775
randomly been detected

782
00:29:35,035 --> 00:29:35,934
in the sky

783
00:29:36,500 --> 00:29:37,000
because

784
00:29:37,619 --> 00:29:38,200
of luck.

785
00:29:38,740 --> 00:29:40,759
Or maybe we see one of the stars

786
00:29:40,820 --> 00:29:42,380
in in that field, and we see that

787
00:29:42,500 --> 00:29:44,900
and we know already that's it's orbiting something

788
00:29:44,900 --> 00:29:47,299
that we don't see because a magnet are

789
00:29:47,299 --> 00:29:49,619
usually you only see when they they emit

790
00:29:49,619 --> 00:29:50,119
these

791
00:29:50,660 --> 00:29:51,160
flares.

792
00:29:52,514 --> 00:29:54,514
Then and you calculate the mass and they

793
00:29:54,514 --> 00:29:56,034
may it makes sense that this is an

794
00:29:56,034 --> 00:29:57,575
outer star that is orbiting

795
00:29:58,115 --> 00:30:00,375
the object because you see the star moving

796
00:30:00,434 --> 00:30:02,274
or within something that is and that will

797
00:30:02,274 --> 00:30:04,355
keep me a delta that, okay, maybe this

798
00:30:04,355 --> 00:30:06,534
is the the corporate one. But

799
00:30:07,119 --> 00:30:09,279
I know it will also motivate other people

800
00:30:09,279 --> 00:30:11,440
to look in that particular region, now more

801
00:30:11,440 --> 00:30:13,119
sensitive to Telugu for a long time. I

802
00:30:13,119 --> 00:30:14,659
think that would be a long time

803
00:30:15,599 --> 00:30:18,240
just to just to try to to to

804
00:30:18,399 --> 00:30:20,240
even that you know if the the no

805
00:30:20,240 --> 00:30:21,674
magnetars, even that

806
00:30:22,475 --> 00:30:23,855
wait for that to happen,

807
00:30:24,555 --> 00:30:26,795
that will be something you you have to

808
00:30:26,795 --> 00:30:27,295
wait.

809
00:30:27,914 --> 00:30:29,775
We know a few that has been

810
00:30:30,634 --> 00:30:33,595
active and repeat for some time, and they

811
00:30:33,595 --> 00:30:34,414
just stop.

812
00:30:35,500 --> 00:30:38,160
We for weaker signals on only flares.

813
00:30:39,500 --> 00:30:40,960
And, but that,

814
00:30:41,339 --> 00:30:42,319
that will be

815
00:30:42,859 --> 00:30:45,099
something to do anyway. So I I hope

816
00:30:45,099 --> 00:30:46,000
this motivates

817
00:30:46,619 --> 00:30:49,019
people first to look at the wild signal

818
00:30:49,019 --> 00:30:49,519
differently,

819
00:30:50,115 --> 00:30:50,615
more

820
00:30:50,955 --> 00:30:51,455
astronomical

821
00:30:51,795 --> 00:30:54,694
thing. So something interesting, something to test about,

822
00:30:55,474 --> 00:30:56,755
to look for and,

823
00:30:57,315 --> 00:30:57,815
explore.

824
00:30:58,194 --> 00:31:00,855
And, definitely, we will look through our data.

825
00:31:02,115 --> 00:31:03,299
Maybe we have

826
00:31:03,779 --> 00:31:04,440
our data

827
00:31:04,980 --> 00:31:07,080
a similar event recorded somewhere.

828
00:31:07,700 --> 00:31:08,200
Only

829
00:31:09,140 --> 00:31:12,019
I will net it through our analysis to

830
00:31:12,019 --> 00:31:12,519
study

831
00:31:13,619 --> 00:31:14,519
stellar flares.

832
00:31:14,980 --> 00:31:16,039
I will never

833
00:31:16,734 --> 00:31:18,595
will be able to detect to

834
00:31:19,134 --> 00:31:21,394
see this unless I did the right analysis.

835
00:31:22,174 --> 00:31:24,174
So having the the data is not enough.

836
00:31:24,174 --> 00:31:25,694
You have to have the right analysis. Now

837
00:31:25,694 --> 00:31:26,914
we're doing that analysis,

838
00:31:28,095 --> 00:31:30,494
and then we will explore our data. Maybe

839
00:31:30,494 --> 00:31:31,474
we see it,

840
00:31:31,849 --> 00:31:33,789
a random event that looks like that,

841
00:31:34,970 --> 00:31:37,049
and then we will move to the archive

842
00:31:37,049 --> 00:31:38,670
data of the RSC observatory.

843
00:31:39,049 --> 00:31:40,109
So going back,

844
00:31:40,809 --> 00:31:42,269
that the data is

845
00:31:42,650 --> 00:31:44,830
saved from the even from the sixties.

846
00:31:45,845 --> 00:31:47,924
So the data is there, and we we

847
00:31:47,924 --> 00:31:49,384
will have a long project

848
00:31:49,765 --> 00:31:52,424
scanning through all that data for this particular

849
00:31:52,725 --> 00:31:54,505
type of of phenomena.

850
00:31:55,525 --> 00:31:57,045
I guess you can't find what you haven't

851
00:31:57,045 --> 00:31:58,744
been looking for. Yes.

852
00:31:59,205 --> 00:31:59,705
Yes.

853
00:32:01,339 --> 00:32:03,740
Does this discovery that that, in this new

854
00:32:03,740 --> 00:32:06,480
hypothesis, I should say, of, a magnetar

855
00:32:07,339 --> 00:32:10,080
creating a hydrogen maser because of this intervening

856
00:32:10,220 --> 00:32:11,680
cloud of gas and then happening

857
00:32:12,140 --> 00:32:13,660
to be pointed at Earth when it does

858
00:32:13,660 --> 00:32:16,059
it and when some telescope is listening for

859
00:32:16,059 --> 00:32:18,615
it, does Does this tell us anything about

860
00:32:18,755 --> 00:32:21,154
the the search for extraterrestrial intelligence in terms

861
00:32:21,154 --> 00:32:22,835
of what types of signals we need to

862
00:32:22,835 --> 00:32:24,615
rule out and what things we

863
00:32:24,994 --> 00:32:26,755
we need to say in the future? Wow.

864
00:32:26,755 --> 00:32:28,775
That's interesting, but it's definitely not aliens.

865
00:32:29,690 --> 00:32:31,470
Well, now you have an example

866
00:32:32,009 --> 00:32:33,470
of a false positive.

867
00:32:34,250 --> 00:32:36,910
Something that you can tell immediately

868
00:32:37,450 --> 00:32:39,769
now that you know if this is some,

869
00:32:40,089 --> 00:32:40,990
real phenomena.

870
00:32:41,855 --> 00:32:45,154
But we have to be also cautious because

871
00:32:45,535 --> 00:32:45,855
these,

872
00:32:47,695 --> 00:32:49,315
emissions are still

873
00:32:49,775 --> 00:32:50,275
broadband

874
00:32:51,055 --> 00:32:54,355
by the SETI standards or techno signals research.

875
00:32:54,414 --> 00:32:56,994
They're actually searching a much narrow bands.

876
00:32:58,019 --> 00:32:58,519
So

877
00:32:58,980 --> 00:33:01,779
if you are searching a a a a

878
00:33:01,779 --> 00:33:04,440
much narrow bands, which makes sense for more

879
00:33:05,620 --> 00:33:06,840
technological signals,

880
00:33:07,460 --> 00:33:09,400
then you will easily differentiate.

881
00:33:09,904 --> 00:33:10,964
It will still be

882
00:33:11,585 --> 00:33:12,404
a a much narrower,

883
00:33:13,024 --> 00:33:15,744
broader band that than the you are searching

884
00:33:15,744 --> 00:33:16,244
for.

885
00:33:16,625 --> 00:33:19,764
So depending on on on on on the

886
00:33:20,065 --> 00:33:21,125
how you're searching,

887
00:33:21,744 --> 00:33:24,085
you now that you know this, it could

888
00:33:25,799 --> 00:33:26,299
probably,

889
00:33:28,120 --> 00:33:30,279
may you realize that zone events that you're

890
00:33:30,279 --> 00:33:30,779
detecting

891
00:33:31,160 --> 00:33:33,180
be more cautious and say, okay.

892
00:33:33,720 --> 00:33:34,940
Let's rule out

893
00:33:35,240 --> 00:33:37,500
the this astrophysical measure.

894
00:33:38,394 --> 00:33:38,954
And then

895
00:33:39,355 --> 00:33:39,714
but,

896
00:33:40,315 --> 00:33:42,714
tunnel signature also is not searching only in

897
00:33:42,714 --> 00:33:45,075
this, close to the hydrogen line. They're searching

898
00:33:45,075 --> 00:33:47,355
in in other, frequencies, so you don't have

899
00:33:47,355 --> 00:33:48,095
that problem,

900
00:33:49,115 --> 00:33:49,855
other frequencies.

901
00:33:50,920 --> 00:33:52,359
So all sorts of things have moved on

902
00:33:52,359 --> 00:33:54,519
since 19 seventies. What was broad what was

903
00:33:54,519 --> 00:33:57,240
narrowband then is not narrowband anymore for SETI

904
00:33:57,240 --> 00:33:59,320
and the technology and that sort of thing.

905
00:33:59,320 --> 00:34:01,160
It must be quite interesting to sort of

906
00:34:01,160 --> 00:34:02,220
revisit this

907
00:34:02,519 --> 00:34:04,680
this these old observations. Does that happen very

908
00:34:04,680 --> 00:34:06,625
often in astronomy, or is it does everybody

909
00:34:06,625 --> 00:34:07,904
just sort of move on to look at

910
00:34:07,904 --> 00:34:09,985
the new next new thing? Is it is

911
00:34:09,985 --> 00:34:12,164
it common in astronomy to look back at

912
00:34:12,385 --> 00:34:15,525
old data and revisit it and reanalyze it?

913
00:34:15,905 --> 00:34:17,925
Yes. Yes. And that's important.

914
00:34:18,260 --> 00:34:19,000
We can,

915
00:34:19,780 --> 00:34:22,980
for example, the fast radio burst. Fast radio

916
00:34:22,980 --> 00:34:23,960
bursts were detected

917
00:34:24,659 --> 00:34:25,159
in

918
00:34:25,539 --> 00:34:27,940
in house in a telescope in Australia in,

919
00:34:27,940 --> 00:34:29,319
I think, it was 2,007.

920
00:34:30,099 --> 00:34:30,839
And these

921
00:34:31,859 --> 00:34:32,359
these

922
00:34:34,514 --> 00:34:35,255
first signals

923
00:34:35,714 --> 00:34:38,375
that are short duration, very intense,

924
00:34:38,914 --> 00:34:40,054
never seen before

925
00:34:40,434 --> 00:34:41,574
by other telescopes.

926
00:34:42,514 --> 00:34:45,394
So and this telescope detect those signals, and

927
00:34:45,394 --> 00:34:48,675
everybody an astronomer was cautioned. That's probably some,

928
00:34:48,675 --> 00:34:50,570
you know, fluke in the data. Like the

929
00:34:50,570 --> 00:34:51,309
world's Sydney.

930
00:34:51,769 --> 00:34:53,630
There was some fluke in in Sydney.

931
00:34:54,730 --> 00:34:56,190
But scientists decided

932
00:34:56,969 --> 00:34:59,210
that motivates others to look for forward, to

933
00:34:59,210 --> 00:35:00,110
take it seriously,

934
00:35:00,650 --> 00:35:02,329
and they looked through the archive data of

935
00:35:02,329 --> 00:35:03,469
the receiver observatory,

936
00:35:04,255 --> 00:35:05,635
and they found it.

937
00:35:06,175 --> 00:35:08,175
So because they found it in the receiver

938
00:35:08,175 --> 00:35:11,375
observatory, this and publish that, okay, we found

939
00:35:11,375 --> 00:35:12,594
the what now

940
00:35:12,894 --> 00:35:15,855
it make for everybody real. Oh, this is

941
00:35:15,855 --> 00:35:16,355
real.

942
00:35:16,655 --> 00:35:18,889
We have to look for this signal.

943
00:35:19,349 --> 00:35:21,510
So for detecting the signal, you have to

944
00:35:21,510 --> 00:35:22,250
have observations

945
00:35:23,670 --> 00:35:25,130
and and and running

946
00:35:25,429 --> 00:35:26,969
with a time step.

947
00:35:27,510 --> 00:35:28,250
Very small.

948
00:35:29,269 --> 00:35:31,349
So that's that's one of the reason, and

949
00:35:31,349 --> 00:35:32,650
they are random everywhere.

950
00:35:33,224 --> 00:35:35,144
It was something hard to detect and never

951
00:35:35,144 --> 00:35:37,244
realized. And it's amazing that,

952
00:35:38,105 --> 00:35:40,265
because our archive data, we were able to

953
00:35:40,265 --> 00:35:40,765
confirm

954
00:35:41,065 --> 00:35:41,644
and then

955
00:35:42,505 --> 00:35:44,585
and and then, other people. And now it's

956
00:35:44,585 --> 00:35:46,345
it's a hot it's a hot topic of

957
00:35:46,345 --> 00:35:46,845
exploration.

958
00:35:47,829 --> 00:35:49,670
What are the what was the source? And,

959
00:35:49,670 --> 00:35:50,170
actually,

960
00:35:51,349 --> 00:35:53,670
sure after that, people thought, well, maybe this

961
00:35:53,670 --> 00:35:55,510
is aliens again because we don't know what

962
00:35:55,989 --> 00:35:58,469
this emitting from random places in the in

963
00:35:58,469 --> 00:35:59,210
the the customers,

964
00:36:00,164 --> 00:36:01,385
these strong signals.

965
00:36:02,244 --> 00:36:02,905
They're broadband,

966
00:36:03,445 --> 00:36:04,664
but they are very strong

967
00:36:05,045 --> 00:36:06,805
and for a short time, and we don't

968
00:36:06,805 --> 00:36:08,644
know any phenomena that could do that. So

969
00:36:08,644 --> 00:36:10,985
people were thinking about aliens again.

970
00:36:11,844 --> 00:36:12,344
And

971
00:36:13,364 --> 00:36:13,864
but,

972
00:36:14,565 --> 00:36:15,065
eventually,

973
00:36:16,800 --> 00:36:19,300
astronomers pinpoint those signals to galaxies.

974
00:36:20,559 --> 00:36:22,880
Oh, so the earth is coming from far

975
00:36:22,880 --> 00:36:23,380
away

976
00:36:23,680 --> 00:36:25,700
from this galaxy and this galaxy,

977
00:36:26,239 --> 00:36:28,820
but still what phenomena is is doing that?

978
00:36:29,144 --> 00:36:29,644
And

979
00:36:30,025 --> 00:36:31,644
then what happened was

980
00:36:32,025 --> 00:36:34,364
the, in our own galaxy why

981
00:36:34,664 --> 00:36:35,965
not in our own galaxy?

982
00:36:36,664 --> 00:36:37,965
There is a magnetar,

983
00:36:38,744 --> 00:36:41,465
and that magnet we detect the fast radio

984
00:36:41,465 --> 00:36:42,525
bursts from that magnetar.

985
00:36:43,250 --> 00:36:45,030
And, now we think,

986
00:36:46,769 --> 00:36:49,569
so, probably, this is our magnetors are the

987
00:36:49,569 --> 00:36:51,889
ones that are emitting these 5 effect of

988
00:36:52,130 --> 00:36:53,909
and that's now a stronger

989
00:36:54,449 --> 00:36:55,670
hypothesis that

990
00:36:56,285 --> 00:36:59,184
fast radio inverters are due to magnetars and

991
00:36:59,965 --> 00:37:02,065
among many other explanation. So

992
00:37:02,445 --> 00:37:03,184
and that's

993
00:37:03,805 --> 00:37:05,885
quite recently in the few years that we

994
00:37:05,885 --> 00:37:06,385
are

995
00:37:06,844 --> 00:37:08,385
starting to realize this.

996
00:37:08,940 --> 00:37:09,739
And, that's

997
00:37:10,460 --> 00:37:13,500
so so there are many other examples of

998
00:37:13,500 --> 00:37:14,000
of

999
00:37:14,300 --> 00:37:15,920
looking through archive data

1000
00:37:16,219 --> 00:37:18,300
because you have to analyze the data in

1001
00:37:18,300 --> 00:37:19,280
different ways.

1002
00:37:19,739 --> 00:37:20,239
Look.

1003
00:37:20,940 --> 00:37:23,179
As you said, if you're not looking you're

1004
00:37:23,179 --> 00:37:24,239
looking for something,

1005
00:37:24,755 --> 00:37:26,675
you don't not looking for something you won't

1006
00:37:26,675 --> 00:37:27,414
fight in.

1007
00:37:28,114 --> 00:37:29,635
Well, Abel Mendez, thank you very much for

1008
00:37:29,635 --> 00:37:30,994
the coming in the podcast. I hope you

1009
00:37:30,994 --> 00:37:32,835
find more interesting things as you look through

1010
00:37:32,835 --> 00:37:34,454
the data. Yes. Thank you.

1011
00:37:35,074 --> 00:37:36,630
I appreciate that. Bye.

1012
00:37:43,429 --> 00:37:47,190
That was Abel Mendez in conversation with Margaret

1013
00:37:47,190 --> 00:37:47,690
Harris.

1014
00:37:48,230 --> 00:37:51,029
You can find a preprint of Abel and

1015
00:37:51,029 --> 00:37:54,085
colleagues' paper on the archive server.

1016
00:37:54,784 --> 00:37:56,085
Just look for the title,

1017
00:37:56,704 --> 00:37:57,204
Arecibo

1018
00:37:57,824 --> 00:37:58,964
Wow 1,

1019
00:37:59,505 --> 00:38:00,405
an astrophysical

1020
00:38:01,025 --> 00:38:01,525
explanation

1021
00:38:01,984 --> 00:38:03,444
for the Wow signal.

1022
00:38:04,800 --> 00:38:08,019
CERN is one of Europe's premier research facilities.

1023
00:38:08,559 --> 00:38:10,420
And this year, the lab is celebrating

1024
00:38:10,800 --> 00:38:11,780
its 70th

1025
00:38:12,079 --> 00:38:12,579
anniversary.

1026
00:38:13,680 --> 00:38:16,559
In the August episode of the Physics World

1027
00:38:16,559 --> 00:38:17,780
Stories podcast,

1028
00:38:18,565 --> 00:38:19,224
2 former

1029
00:38:19,525 --> 00:38:20,585
public relations

1030
00:38:20,965 --> 00:38:22,265
gurus at CERN,

1031
00:38:22,644 --> 00:38:25,144
James Gillies and Achinche Rao,

1032
00:38:25,605 --> 00:38:28,005
look back on some of the highlights of

1033
00:38:28,005 --> 00:38:28,744
their careers.

1034
00:38:29,445 --> 00:38:33,144
These include welcoming Hollywood royalty to the lab

1035
00:38:33,285 --> 00:38:36,139
for the launch of the film Angels and

1036
00:38:36,139 --> 00:38:36,639
Demons

1037
00:38:37,339 --> 00:38:39,279
and the announcement of the discovery

1038
00:38:39,659 --> 00:38:41,119
of the Higgs boson

1039
00:38:41,500 --> 00:38:42,400
at the lab.

1040
00:38:43,179 --> 00:38:46,859
That episode is hosted by Andrew Glester, and

1041
00:38:46,859 --> 00:38:47,599
it's called

1042
00:38:47,900 --> 00:38:49,199
CERN at 70.

1043
00:38:49,635 --> 00:38:53,014
How the Higgs Hunt Elevated Particle Physics

1044
00:38:53,394 --> 00:38:54,855
to Hollywood Status.

1045
00:38:55,474 --> 00:38:57,474
You can find it on the Physics World

1046
00:38:57,474 --> 00:39:01,255
website or at your favorite podcast provider.

1047
00:39:02,400 --> 00:39:03,699
And the CERN celebrations

1048
00:39:04,079 --> 00:39:06,420
continue here at Physics World.

1049
00:39:07,039 --> 00:39:08,579
On Thursday, 26th

1050
00:39:08,960 --> 00:39:09,460
September,

1051
00:39:09,839 --> 00:39:10,579
we present

1052
00:39:11,039 --> 00:39:13,299
the future of particle physics,

1053
00:39:13,760 --> 00:39:16,099
a Physics World live event

1054
00:39:16,474 --> 00:39:20,074
produced in partnership with the journal Reports on

1055
00:39:20,074 --> 00:39:21,295
Progress in Physics.

1056
00:39:22,155 --> 00:39:24,335
The live panel discussion will feature

1057
00:39:24,715 --> 00:39:25,614
Tara Shears

1058
00:39:25,914 --> 00:39:27,614
of the University of Liverpool,

1059
00:39:28,155 --> 00:39:30,974
Phil Burrows at the University of Oxford,

1060
00:39:31,539 --> 00:39:35,000
and Talika Bowes of the University of Wisconsin

1061
00:39:35,139 --> 00:39:35,639
Madison.

1062
00:39:36,579 --> 00:39:39,539
They will explore what the future holds for

1063
00:39:39,539 --> 00:39:40,839
high energy physics

1064
00:39:41,139 --> 00:39:43,400
and where the next particle collider

1065
00:39:43,940 --> 00:39:44,920
should be built.

1066
00:39:45,644 --> 00:39:48,224
You can register now for this free event

1067
00:39:48,364 --> 00:39:49,985
on the Physics World website.

1068
00:39:50,765 --> 00:39:53,985
Just click on the Physics World live tab

1069
00:39:54,285 --> 00:39:56,385
at the top right of the homepage.

1070
00:39:57,860 --> 00:39:59,619
I'm afraid that's all the time we have

1071
00:39:59,619 --> 00:40:00,840
for this week's podcast.

1072
00:40:01,140 --> 00:40:04,660
Thanks to Abel Mendez and Margaret Harris for

1073
00:40:04,660 --> 00:40:06,199
a fascinating discussion

1074
00:40:06,500 --> 00:40:07,960
about the Wow signal.

1075
00:40:08,420 --> 00:40:11,140
And a special thanks to our producer, Fred

1076
00:40:11,140 --> 00:40:11,640
Ailes.

1077
00:40:12,255 --> 00:40:14,894
We'll be back again next week. See you

1078
00:40:14,894 --> 00:40:15,394
then.