Chicken Brooding Tips with Jeff Mattocks

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<v Carey>Hi, and welcome to the Poultry Nerds Podcast.

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<v Carey>I'm Carey Blackmon, and I'm here with my co host for the show, Jennifer Bryant.

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<v Carey>And we're here to help you figure out how to raise the healthiest, happiest and highest quality birds possible.

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Mhm.

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<v Carey>So in your book, the, I've got the fifth edition in the very beginning of it, you talk about air quality.

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<v Carey>Yes, sir.

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<v Carey>Can you elaborate on that?

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<v Carey>Like how does somebody check it?

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<v Carey>What are they looking for?

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<v Carey>What levels?

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<v Carey>of what should they be searching for in the air quality for their chickens?

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<v Carey>So the

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<v Jeff Mattocks>simple answer is if it stinks, it's bad.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>So what are you checking for?

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<v Jeff Mattocks>Look, if you walk into your chicken coop and you can't stand to be in there for more than 10 minutes to do your chores and leave, your chickens don't want to be in there either.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>They're not enjoying their life.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>So, statistically what we know is that the human nose cannot detect ammonia smell until you hit 25 parts per million, right?

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<v Jeff Mattocks>And we know through years and years of research and study and observation, That a chicken's respiratory tract starts to deteriorate, have scar tissue and not function efficiently at anything above 10 parts per minute.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>So the bottom line is by the time a human nose can detect this, we're already at two and a half times the tolerance level of a chicken.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>And if people sit back and think about what is the most important thing to sustaining life, it's.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>oxygen or air quality.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>You actually have to have air before you have to worry about food and water.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>So, I always, in, in every presentation I ever give or in any situation, when somebody lets me say it.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>The three key factors to any creature are air, water, and then feed.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>And it's always in that order, right?

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<v Jeff Mattocks>So if the air quality is bad, they're not going to drink enough.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>If they don't drink enough, they're not going to eat enough.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>So air is everything.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>In my opinion.

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<v Carey>All right.

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<v Carey>And we're going to talk about food and water in a little bit.

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<v Carey>Cause what I'm going to do is.

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<v Carey>As I read the book for, I think the third time I read it, I started taking notes on things that questions that I had and things that had I ever got the chance to sit down with you, I wanted to talk about.

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<v Carey>So we're going to go through it.

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<v Carey>Pretty much in order.

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<v Carey>The first part of the book, also you talk about brooder bedding and that your favorite was peat moss and you've done some comparisons I've heard you talk about before with peat moss and shavings.

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<v Carey>And other different things.

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<v Carey>Can you talk about that a little bit?

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<v Jeff Mattocks>By accident, actually, if you want the background story on peat moss, I had a bale here when we had chickens in our backyard.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>And every day, when, it was chore time, you go out and you're looking around, and there was this one black bantam hen.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>Who was missing and I was like, I couldn't find any feathers.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>I couldn't find any dead bodies.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>There was no nothing, right?

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<v Jeff Mattocks>So it was really puzzling me.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>And I'd look around, but every day she would be missing from somewhere around lunchtime till chore time in the evening, four or five o'clock.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>So sitting beside the chicken coop outside where she wasn't supposed to be was a bale of peat moss.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>And it had a small enough opening to reach in there with a scoop and get some out.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>And one day I looked in there because this bale of peat moss that was 80 percent full when we put it there was now only 30 percent full.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>Looked down inside the bag and there she was she had found and discovered the bale of peat moss and She was buried all the way to her waddles in peat moss So I learned two things one the chicken really liked the peat moss and that began that adventure So then we experimented with using peat moss as brooder bedding, right?

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<v Jeff Mattocks>And we found the same thing the chicks loved it, right?

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<v Jeff Mattocks>They way preferred peat moss over anything else Just in that, and we compared it to pine shavings, large flake, small flake, medium flake, whatever.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>But, we Cornish cross chickens, which are stupid, were already expressing chicken ness by dust bathing in it, in that peat moss, where they're not doing that in pine shavings, right?

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<v Jeff Mattocks>They're not doing that in any other kind of bedding.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>They're not, digging in, fluffing themselves, having a good time, doing their dust bath.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>What we also noticed was we didn't have to add anywhere close to the same amount to control that ammonia smell or to control the smell period, right?

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<v Jeff Mattocks>It always smelled like peat moss, you know.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>And we were able to go all the way through brooding 50 chicks.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>for a field trial on one bale of peat moss, one 3.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>4 cubic foot, whatever they sell at the local, hardware store.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>So then curiosity got us because everybody was, complaining about peat moss and dusty and cost and everything else.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>So we did a side by side field trial, brooding trial, and we did two groups of birds, exact same size coop, exact same room, exact same Everything, so that hundred chickens showed up and we split them evenly 50 50 on day one.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>One side was pine shavings, the other side was peat moss.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>Yeah, we brooded the entire four week period on peat moss.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>And the same bale.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>The same bale.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>Okay.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>Alright.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>Now this was an 8 foot by 8 foot brooder.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>Okay, just to give you a space, 60 square foot.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>We used one bale of peat moss.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>And on the other side, exactly the same, 8 foot by 8 foot.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>For the other chicks, we went through five and a half bales of pine shavings to manage the odor control.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>Alright, they're in the exact same room, they're side by side, split brooder.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>Okay, exact same size, exact same height, exact same brooder, heating lamp.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>Everything was exactly the same.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>I couldn't have duplicated it any better if I tried.

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<v Carey>For me, in Alabama, peat moss is about$25 a bale.

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<v Carey>And it has gone up a lot in the last few years.

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<v Carey>A bundle of pine shavings At my local box store is like$7.50 ish, a bale, but if you compare one$25 bale to the six bales that you're going to need to get the five and a half, just round it down

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<v Jeff Mattocks>and

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<v Carey>call it five.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>Even at that you're at$37.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>50.

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<v Carey>Yeah.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>So, when you're done brooding.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>When you clean the brewer out, if you are using pine shavings, you need to take it to the compost pile and let it finish.

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<v Carey>Yeah, you're gonna have to

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<v Jeff Mattocks>throw it away or let it finish composting or something.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>When you finish with peat mos, you can go right to the garden, right to the flower bed, wherever you want to use it.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>You can spread it on your yard and it disappears, and it's more beneficial to whatever is next.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>I don't care if you bag it up, box it up, and sell it to your neighbors, right?

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<v Jeff Mattocks>But you have something of much higher value for the next, after, for the after, for the next step on, on that video.

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<v Carey>Essentially, using peat moss, which is better for controlling bacteria and a whole lot of other stuff, and it gets chickens to doing chicken stuff faster.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>We didn't even talk about this.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>The peat moss is naturally, right out of the, right out of the peat bogs, is somewhere around 4, 4 and a half percent, 4, 4 to 4.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>5 pH.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>And, what's really mind boggling, considering where it comes from, It is sterile.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>So further research as I continued down this pathway with the peat moss and, I stumbled upon some other information.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>Peat moss is actually, if you're in the woods, you have a major gash or a wound, peat moss is a natural bandage, right?

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<v Jeff Mattocks>You can rinse off the wound, pack it, wrap it with peat moss.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>And you've got a sterile bandage at this point.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>It's highly absorbent.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>Right.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>So with shavings you got a place to grow bacteria, right?

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<v Jeff Mattocks>You know the coccidiosis the bacteria and all that other stuff does not want to grow in that peat moss because it's naturally sterile It wants to go back to that low pH just because of its decaying organic matter It wants to hold it'll continue to do that, you know You do not have to go in and stir it and rake it and fiddle with it nearly as much as you do with pine shavings or other types of bedding, right?

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<v Jeff Mattocks>It stays loose and friable for the most part.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>Unless you really screw up peat moss, because the chickens are constantly digging in it and they're always dust bathing in it.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>They're stirring it up for you.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>Yeah, the only.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>Complaint that I really get is from the chicken owners is all the dust, right?

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<v Jeff Mattocks>And people have heard it before.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>Jennifer Bryant said the same thing.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>I had dust everywhere, right?

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<v Jeff Mattocks>The cobwebs were black, the everything was black.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>And that is a truthful statement.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>It is, right?

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<v Jeff Mattocks>And people worry about it.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>Is it going to be a respiratory hazard or a respiratory irritant or whatever?

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<v Jeff Mattocks>I have never, ever seen that be.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>So for science,

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<v Carey>for science, I recently made the dive.

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<v Carey>I ordered a hundred, a hundred corners cross.

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<v Carey>And instead of, getting the shavings habit, I went for peat moss.

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<v Carey>And I think I put about three inches worth in my brooder, which is probably too much, way too much.

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<v Carey>I probably could have gotten away with two inches, inch and a half inch and a half is usually enough.

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<v Carey>So, I overkill, but I packed this brooder full of chicks and in one of them, I have a automatic watering cups in my brooder and one of the cups busted and about two gallons of water leaked out inside of it.

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<v Carey>The only way I knew it is because I saw water dripping out the bottom of the brooder, because when I opened it to look in there, the dirt's dry, which tells me it's doing its job.

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<v Carey>Fixed the problem and no longer had that issue.

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<v Carey>And I was able to not have any issues with my chicks had I been using pine shavings and two gallons of water escape as young as those chicks were, that'd probably be dead and that'd probably got too cold.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>And it wouldn't have worked out for him, so Pine shavings do not have the same absorbency quality.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>If you want to prove it to yourself, get yourself a cup, or a pint jar, or whatever you want, of pine shavings and peat moss.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>And start adding measured amounts of water.

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<v Jeff Mattocks>And you'll quickly see which one can, has a higher holding capacity for moisture, pine shavings or peat moss.

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<v Carey>Yeah.

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<v Carey>And so with these Cornish, I had them in the brooder for three weeks.

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<v Carey>And normally when I'm brooding a hundred chickens inside my barn, even with my 20 inch fan pulling air out, it gets rough quick.

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<v Carey>Because you take a hundred chicks.

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<v Carey>Couple hundred quail that live in the barn, whatever chickens that I've got, that's not quite old enough in my grow out over here to go outside because I raise chickens year round.

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<v Carey>I had probably a couple hundred quail, 20 chickens that were four to six weeks old, but I was still seeing 20 degrees outside.

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<v Carey>So it wasn't time to put them out.

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<v Carey>I needed them to get a couple more weeks.

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<v Carey>I brought these hundred broilers in there.

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<v Carey>It didn't stink.

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<v Carey>The ammonia never hit, obviously it never hit the 25 parts per million because I didn't smell it.

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<v Carey>You shouldn't.

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<v Carey>And the couple times that I did go in there and smell the manure, I kick my fan on, and in about a minute it was back to smelling just peachy.

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<v Carey>There's definitely a lot of truth in that.

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<v Carey>I'm, I've been learning a lot over the past year, and I'm seeing that everybody talks about the money, I'm.

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<v Carey>The peat moss costs 25 bucks, shavings cost 7.

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<v Carey>50, same way with feed.

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<v Carey>Oh, I can get feed for$15 a bag.

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<v Carey>You can, but by the time you feed them twice the amount of feed, cause that's what they're going to eat at least.

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<v Carey>And by the time you add stuff to it to get it to the nutrition level, you could have spent$35 on a bag of food.

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<v Carey>Thank you for joining us this week.

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<v Carey>Before you go, be sure to subscribe to our podcast so you can receive new episodes right when they are released.

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<v Carey>And they're released every week.

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<v Carey>Feel free to email us at poultrynerds at gmail.

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<v Carey>com to share your thoughts about the show.

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<v Carey>Until next time, poultry pals, keep clucking, keep learning, and keep it egg citing.

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<v Carey>This is Carey signing off from Poultry Nerds.

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<v Carey>Feathers up, everyone.

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Mhm.