Ump stats in CS, Final games w/o ABS challenges, Divish on M's Game 7 decisions & 2026 spending plans

00:00:02
Speaker 1: Hey, Ryan Divish is here and you can follow him hat Ryan Divish and he writes for the Seattle Times. And it is tough times in Seattle right now. So Ryan, good to see you. I'm glad to see you outside touching grass. But tell me how Mariners fans are doing right now and how the city of Seattle is handling what just happened.

00:00:24
Speaker 2: You know, it's not quite like it was after the game where it was Lord of the Flies and you know, people were freaking out. It's I think they're starting to kind of accept the idea what had happened, the outcome. I think the problem is is a lot of people, a lot of the fans are digging into some of the numbers, are going back through and reading some of the coverage and hearing what people said and everything else. And I think that's what is still incensing. A lot of fans is kind of going back and looking at it. You know, you have the time to react. I always say that people on Twitter, it's like they shoot first and aim later, and they react first and then they think about it later. But I don't know that going back and rereading or rethinking or even kind of looking at all the details that went into that crazy seventh inning is gonna make them feel any better.

00:01:17
Speaker 3: Well, let's do. Let's let's dig right in. Since you know you're in Montana. You got out of town before you know, things got nasty there in Seattle. But would you have brought in Andres Munhoz. I know that Bizardo had a high strand rate of runners, and people are throwing that at me on Twitter, saying like, well, look at his strand rate.

00:01:34
Speaker 4: It's top ten in baseball.

00:01:36
Speaker 3: True, but at the same time, it wasn't the series on the line, the season on the line, and you have one of the best closers in baseball that hadn't pitched at all in this series.

00:01:47
Speaker 5: Really.

00:01:48
Speaker 2: Yeah, I haven't gotten back to God's Country yet, Agent, I'm still in a I'm in Washington. It's just as beautiful here as Montana, just a little different.

00:01:57
Speaker 4: No, So here's my thinking on this.

00:02:00
Speaker 2: And you know the other guys that we were with, you know, Adam Jude and Tim Booth, my other guys that cover. When they brought in Bizarto, I was kind of stunned. I wasn't watching the bullpen. I knew they were gonna go there and to me, the Mariner's pitching philosophy. A lot of times Pete Woodworth always says it is like, if you're gonna get beat by a hit or get beat by your best pitch, Well, if you're gonna get beat in a leverage situation, don't you want your best leverage reliever? And to me, everything about that situation he needed a strikeout. Who is better at getting a strikeout on the Mariner's bullpen than Andris Munno's. I mean, like, this is a guy that didn't allow a hit during the postseason, hadn't allowed a run. You're looking for a swing and miss. George Springer hadn't seen him since July of twenty twenty four. He'd seen Edward Bizardo three times already in the series, including the day before when Bizarro oddly pitched two innings in a game they were down four runs. So I just thought, like, to me, if you're going to go in that situation and you have the leverage point in that situation, you go with your best guy.

00:03:06
Speaker 4: You can figure out the ninth.

00:03:07
Speaker 2: I think they plan for Munos to go to innings in that game, but you know you have you can't save him for a lead in a ninth inning, you don't have You can't allow yourself.

00:03:19
Speaker 4: You you got up, you had a lead.

00:03:21
Speaker 2: Everything's like trending towards you clinching, and you have to go with your best in the most difficult situation.

00:03:29
Speaker 3: Okay, can we also can we also put something else to bed? You weren't walking George Springer right there to get to Lucas. Okay, let's let's all the Mariner fans are like, oh, they should have walked him. No, because then you're bringing Vlad into play, right, Well, who's there do they old series are trying to avoid in these situations? Goes? Okay, let's say Lucas goes up there and punches out on three pitches. Well, then Vlad comes up with the basis load and you got to get him out with Bizarreto, a guy he's seen a bunch of times too. So let's also can we please div can you please put that to bed for me, that they should not have walked him.

00:04:00
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's not even a ru You know, that's not a good idea at any level. You can't assume you're going to get a double play ball. I mean, you know when they official score you can't assume that you're going to get a double play on a play if they make a mistake. Can't assume that you're going to get a double play ball.

00:04:14
Speaker 4: And so no, you don't.

00:04:16
Speaker 2: So like if you do it properly, if let's say Munos gets the strikeout or gets Kurby, even if he gives up a run like on a sackfly, then he strikes out Lucas, then you have Muno's coming back for the next inning and Vlad's leading off with nobody on base. And if you get through that without massive damage, all of a sudden, it's the back end of the Toronto order in the ninth and Vlad is seven hitters away from coming to the plate. All you had to do was find a way to minimize the damage in the seventh, and then you you have set yourself up because like I said, if you if you get the first you get, if you get Springer out and Lucas out, then you have Lad leading off the eighth, so he's coming to play with nobody on base. Then you can get creative if you want to walk in him or do whatever. But like I just think, to me, the worst possible scenario in that situation was or George Springer hitting a home run. Do we really think that if Andris Munoz comes in, he's giving up the homer.

00:05:13
Speaker 4: He might give up a hit.

00:05:14
Speaker 2: He gave up some hits in the in the next inning, but you know that doesn't lose you the game. The worst possible scenario is Springer hitting a bomb and you lose the lead. It's not tired or whatever, and then you have to play differently in the final, in your final six out. So I just think, you know, to me, it wasn't that critical. I mean, the one thing I thought, maybe is if you're looking to trying to you know, plan out your game. George Kirby was actually throwing better in the third and the fourth, and he wasn't the first. In the second, his velocity was ticking up even more. The movement on his pitches was better than the third and the fourth. Maybe if you wanted to start him in the fifth and let him face because I think it would have been Barger or I can't remember who it was. It was the bottom of the order coming to Springer. If you wanted to go that way, you know, start him in the fifth. But they were so cognizant about not starting Brian Wu in the middle of an inning, but even then you have all your leverage levers available. So if you start Kirby in the fifth, maybe he gives up a base runner, then you go to Bizardo, or then you go to Matt Brash and kind of clean it up, because I also have Bryce Miller still sitting in the dugout ready to pitch one inning and throw it as hard as he could, and he was probably the best pitcher for the Mariners in the entire series.

00:06:21
Speaker 4: So I just I thought, like I think they had it planned out.

00:06:25
Speaker 2: I think they're hoping three from Kirby, three or four from Kirby, two from Wu, two from Munyos and figure out the other one inning. But I just think that, like you know, you can't like designate that you want Munos to pitch the last two innings when there's a higher leverage situation.

00:06:41
Speaker 4: That's just screaming at you.

00:06:42
Speaker 2: Put your best guy in here, figure out a way to get him out.

00:06:47
Speaker 6: For all your parents out there like me with teenagers trying to already keep a million things under control, cash app is here to help us make sure your team's money and they're spending isn't adding up to craziness.

00:06:59
Speaker 1: With the cash App available to teens thirteen to seventeen with sponsorship by an eligible parent or guardian, every transaction triggers a real time notification for you to see, empowering your team to practice independence while giving you peace of mind by keeping track of their spending. You can also manage everything directly from your own cash app account without having to switch between the two. With the cash App card, you and your team's balances receive twenty four to seven fraud monitoring, and if something ever feels off, you have the ability to lock their card right from your phone in just one tap. If you're ready to give your team more independence while staying in the loop, start by downloading cash App and setting up their account today. For a limited time, new cash App customers can earn ten dollars if they use code family ten in their profile at sign up and send five dollars to a friend within fourteen days. Terms apply. Cash app is a financial services platform, not a bank. Banking services provided by cash apps bank partners, prepaid debit cards issued by Sutton Bank member FDIC, direct deposit and promotions provided by cash App a block ink brand. Visit cash app, Dot app Slash Legal Slash podcast for full disclosures.

00:07:59
Speaker 5: That's exactly a perfect transfer to me where I can only relate to it on our twenty sixteen Cleveland run where we had Andrew Miller at the time and Cody Allen at the back of the bullpen. We don't go on our run unless Tito handles that bullpen the way he did, and where if exact same situation seventh inning we might have second and third, you need to strike out. Why wait for the eighth inning for Andrew Miller or something like that. We just brought him in rate then get that strikeout, get through to it, and then you can kind of flip flop or miss or manage your way from there. But it also happened again another thing where I think we threw Andrew Miller in like Game four or five when we shouldn't have our two winnings, and then brought him back the next day. So stuff was, he's probably a little tired. Guys had just seen him, so even another reason to maybe not use him. There Bizardo there, So it really does it coincides. We don't get as far as we did without Tito pulling the right triggers and the right strings. But there's one that I can be questioned. I think the manager Dan Wilson is going to be facing questions about that because you just said it's the highest leverage situation right there, give me your highest leverage pitcher. So I think it just lines up there. What I want to transfer over to though, is kind of where do they go from here with their their roster. Then you've got two big free agents looming ahead. You got a Suarez Naylor who'll become free agents again. What do you see happening with the two of them? Do you see them both going bull staying or maybe keeping one or what do you see Seattle's moves this offseason?

00:09:27
Speaker 2: Well, they'll have three actually too, because I think Polonco has a player option and it's only like six million, so he'll opt out of that and want to get paid for his season. And I think, you know, there's three guys there. I think they're hopeful. You know, the priority is probably Naylor because he's such a good fit. I think their best chance is to bring back Polonco because he likes how Seattle feels, you know, as a guy that only had one, you know, only played in one organization before being traded to Seattle and didn't want to, you know, try something different this past offseason and came back to Seattle.

00:10:04
Speaker 4: Not exactly a place where you go to rebuild your numbers. But he's very comfortable.

00:10:08
Speaker 2: They're comfortable with Julio Rodriguez and Edgar Martinez is one of the hitting coaches, and Kevin Seitzer. So I think, you know, they have a chance to get Polanco back if they give him market value. Naylor will be the interesting one, you know. I think with Suarez they'll look at it, but they're not gonna, you know, give him fifteen million or something like that. They're just not going to They they you know, the priorities are probably Naylor and Polanco in that order.

00:10:35
Speaker 3: Okay, div what are they gonna do about their pitching because I know they're not going to keep the payroll going up. We've learned that about the Mariners. That's one thing they're not gonna do. And if they have Naylor, they have Polonco, they have Suarez as free agency. But at some point this pitching staff is gonna start getting expensive. So are they gonna try and sign any of these guys to a long term deal. Are they gonna try and maybe think about trading one of them to get some money off the books? How are they going to handle this? Because Munos is getting close to arbitration. Logan Gilbert, Brian Wu, George Kirby Castillo is already locked up to obviously to a team friend the deal. But how do they make this all work because their strength as they're.

00:11:12
Speaker 2: Pitching, Yeah, I haven't you know, they offered Logan Gilbert an extension kind of before he was even in the big leagues, kind of the I don't know. It wasn't like an Ebon White extension, but what you see from teams and they offer a guy that hasn't really debuted yet. It wasn't for a lot of money. Kirby, I don't know that they've had any of the discussions. I don't know that they believe that those guys are that interested in signing extensions. Of the group, maybe Bryce Miller is the most likely to sign an extension because he wants his ranch in Texas. But that's something they're gonna run into, and I think, you know, for them, probably what they're thinking is is like run it back for next year if possible, with most of the same guys, with your core guys, and then make the harder decisions a year from now. But Logan Gilbert is going to get a lot more expensive, you know, even with a year where he wasn't you know, didn't get the thirty starts that he normally does. His arbitration number is still going to go up. Kirby's arbitration number is still going to go up. It's all going to add their incremental you know, it's like inflation. It's all going up. And so their payroll is going to go up without even signing these other guys, I think, you know, they certainly can't claim poor. You make it to the alcs, all the all the benefits of a postseason run. Not to mention they with the last week of the season, they went over their attendance figures from last year. So they have money, Like they don't like to add a ton of payroll, but it's not because they can't.

00:12:37
Speaker 4: That's the difference.

00:12:38
Speaker 2: They can, you know, And I think if you don't capitalize on this moment, like everybody says, oh, this is a beginning, not the end. That's fine, It's only a beginning. If you continue to invest and make the team better. There are obvious holes you're looking at. You know, first and third are undecided, you know, whether you you know, they have to make a decision on whether they want to bring Randy a rose Aorana back at eighteen million dollars a year or if they want to move him in his final year and try and you know, supplement somehow.

00:13:05
Speaker 4: Get more big league pieces.

00:13:06
Speaker 2: But they have pieces that they need to add, and the pitching is part of it, Like they don't they need to add another middle reliever. So their their payroll is going to have to increase, and it can't just increase by you know, everybody getting a little bit more in salary arbitration and everything costing a little bit more. No, it's you have to capitalize on this opportunity. And it's something they failed to do in twenty twenty two where they they make the postseason, you know, upset the Blue Jays in the first round, and then you know, lose the Astros, but everybody's excited, and then they have two straight years where they don't really do a whole lot in the off season. I just think you've got to capitalize on it now. You know, and and like, to be honest, they didn't do a lot this past offseason. They went and got all their pieces really at the deadline. Or hey, Polanco was their major free agent signing, and it was more of a you know, a high or low risk, high reward.

00:13:57
Speaker 4: They weren't.

00:13:58
Speaker 2: I think they offered it where they pay seven points of five million with a vesting option. I mean, that's that's not a huge investment, and it paid off. But I don't know that you can try and run that same game plan back again where you don't do a lot and then try and supplement at the deadline. It's just a tough way to live.

00:14:14
Speaker 3: Dev I don't know if you know this, but the wind is blowing like from this my coffee this side.

00:14:22
Speaker 4: It's that coffee.

00:14:25
Speaker 2: No, it's forty five degrees here in ording So I'm like hanging out in Washington.

00:14:30
Speaker 4: Now we can put some beautiful weather forty five degrees.

00:14:33
Speaker 3: We can put some you know, a sweatshirt or something on.

00:14:35
Speaker 4: You know. Oh, this is perfect.

00:14:37
Speaker 2: After the after sitting in the press box in Detroit and in Toronto where there's no air moving, this is this is beautiful fresh air.

00:14:46
Speaker 3: Okay, all right, well, you brought it up, and I want to know the answer this. Did the did the ownership learn anything from this year? Right? Meaning after twenty two they didn't really do anything. Fans were pissed. Cal Rawley had to come out and say what he said, I remember in twenty three and then oh no, I didn't really say that, just kidding, right, And then this year they go out and they make the trade for Suarez, they make the trade for Nailor, they do some things and they get I mean as close as you can get to the World Series without making it. Did the ownership of the Maritors learn anything that, hey, if we just spend a little bit on this team, we might actually make history.

00:15:20
Speaker 2: I would think so, But again, you never know, how Like, they make a lot of business decisions when it comes to baseball, so you would think that they would look at it and say, you know, you have to invest in a product to get maximum output in terms of your revenues that you want to generate. I think honestly, them moving away from from their regional sports network and not in just going straight to MLB and dealing with that, I think that provides a little clarity.

00:15:50
Speaker 4: But yeah, they again they have money.

00:15:53
Speaker 2: This isn't a situation where they're really not. Every team has money. It's whether or not you're on comfortable to add a little bit more than maybe your your numbers, or your algorithms or your budgets that you've used traditionally.

00:16:08
Speaker 4: To add.

00:16:09
Speaker 2: Just you know, go against it, get uncomfortable. What do they always say about players that want to get better? You have to, you know, you have to be willing to get uncomfortable to learn to get better. I think for these guys, for the ownership, Hey, you know what, get uncomfortable a little bit, go in some territory where you've never been before, add some money that you wouldn't normally do.

00:16:29
Speaker 4: Because it's right there. The core is right there. You know.

00:16:32
Speaker 2: We talked to JP Crawford about Josh Naylor and what it would mean to come back, and he was just adamant, like we got to find a way to bring him back because they know what the fit is. Okay, they've never really done a four year, eighty million dollar contract for somebody.

00:16:47
Speaker 4: I think you got it. I mean I think you gotta.

00:16:49
Speaker 2: You have to get You have to look at what you need and value that more than what you're willing to pay.

00:16:57
Speaker 4: And I think that's the big thing.

00:16:58
Speaker 2: At times they've been I think they've been resistant to taking risks, risk averse. But to get to where you want to go and to get to the World Series, you have to take risks. I mean, yeah, you might lose on a guy, or you might have a bad signing, but you know, I think you don't really care at this point.

00:17:17
Speaker 4: You have to get back.

00:17:18
Speaker 2: I mean, you cannot let what happened this year and what this team did and what the fans were like in that Game five against Detroit or Game five against the Blue Jays. You can't let that go by. You can't let it slip out of your hands. You have to capitalize on the momentum you've built and come back and show fans that, hey, we really believe in this group, and then move forward. And I mean, if you want to resign other guys, if you want to attract free agents, then you have to show that you're ready to commit to winning on a consistent basis beyond just draft, develop and sign.

00:17:53
Speaker 4: You want to be you know, you wanted to move to a higher level.

00:17:57
Speaker 1: This episode of Foul Territory is brought to you by Fox one. Fox one is now live stream all of your Fox favorites together in one place, from MLB postseason games to the NFL on Fox to Big Noon Saturdays. With Fox one, you get it all live. Start your seven day free trial today. Offers are subject to change. Go to Fox one for complete terms and conditions. We have the website in the description of this episode. It's Fox one. It's streaming now for the baseball fans here on FT and we know you love baseball. If you're listening to the show, you get LCS games right and the entire World Series every year is on Fox. So if you don't have normal cable or you can't get the channel, Fox one is the solution for you. Now, the app that solves it all again. Go to Fox one and start a seven day free trial to see for yourself how money it is.

00:19:01
Speaker 3: Bryan, what's your favorite college team?

00:19:05
Speaker 4: Montana Grizzlies.

00:19:06
Speaker 3: Right here, it sounds like it's South Carolina with all those cocks crowing behind you. I'm just saying it's crazy, a little late.

00:19:12
Speaker 4: I would like to kill those roosters and make them.

00:19:18
Speaker 3: Okay, they're a little late. It's ten ten thirty out there. Tell them they're a little late frat boy rooster. Yes, all right. So now what was your favorite team baseball team growing up?

00:19:30
Speaker 4: Was it the Mariners?

00:19:32
Speaker 2: No, Being in Montana, you're equidistant between the Mariners and the Twins. And my family had family in Minneapolis. So the first I think fifteen big league games I saw, we're all in the Metrodome. Love Kirby Pucket more than anything else.

00:19:46
Speaker 3: Okay, So if if you were a fan of Kirby Pucket and you saw him standing in an airport, would you recognize him? I know he's passed away and I love Kirby, but would you recognize him? By the way, the correct answer was me. But other than that, go ahead.

00:19:58
Speaker 2: I saw you play when I I was in college. Actually it was in Minnesota. I saw a few games there. I would recognize him, Yeah, I think. I mean he was kind of unique looking because he was built like a fire hydrant, you know, so it was like, you know, you could, you would recognize him.

00:20:17
Speaker 3: Okay. The reason I asked is I told this story After Game five in Seattle. I was flying back to Orlando, where I live, and Ken Griffy Junr Was standing next to me and we chatted for thirty to forty five minutes, and all these Seattle people had Griffy jerseys on and Seattle Mariners this, and he stood there. Not one Seattle person came up to him. It is that, Am I the only one that's like, I cannot believe that nobody recognized Ken Griffy Junior standing in the Seattle airport for like forty five minutes.

00:20:46
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's pretty amazing.

00:20:48
Speaker 2: I mean I would think maybe it's just the awe of seeing him, or maybe they were just terrified that you were his bodyguard and they didn't want to get near him.

00:20:54
Speaker 4: I'm stunned by that.

00:20:57
Speaker 2: Then again, you know what it's like, there are more people recognize the dumpier guy in the T shirt than they do probably James Paxton standing in an airport too, So I it's I'm always kind of stunned by that. I I always want I was planning on doing a story on cal Rawley going to Costco because he went to Costco one day to try and get some snacks and you get a hot dog, and it didn't go well for him, Like he got recognized right away and he never did get the hot dog.

00:21:25
Speaker 4: He was pretty disappointed.

00:21:26
Speaker 2: So I wanted to go do a story on that, like it's and I don't think and you know, like you look at Callan, you don't think, oh, he's a big league player. You look at him and think, oh, probably a policeman or you know, construction guy.

00:21:37
Speaker 4: But he gets recognized.

00:21:38
Speaker 2: So I can't believe I'm going to text Junior and make fun of him about that too.

00:21:42
Speaker 1: Though, please please do that sounds like a sequel article. Yeah, I would like to follow up.

00:21:47
Speaker 3: Caw was just pissed because you can't get that one fifty dollars fifty hot dog at Costco whatever it is.

00:21:51
Speaker 4: He wanted the hot dog.

00:21:53
Speaker 2: He wanted the pretzels, the pretzel bites with the peanut butter inside him.

00:21:56
Speaker 4: He loves those things.

00:21:58
Speaker 1: I think he's popular enough now that he can tell the klubby chef and he can whip that up for him. But he's got the off season to work on his menu for next year that he can request. He'll be there for a long time. Ryan, good stuff man, great coverage, and thanks for hopping on.

00:22:13
Speaker 3: Don't freeze the death of montane okay?

00:22:15
Speaker 4: Hell and I'll.

00:22:16
Speaker 2: I'll you know if you if I send out a picture of meat and fried chicken.

00:22:20
Speaker 4: You'll know it's the roosters from next door.

00:22:22
Speaker 1: And next time we have you on. If we don't hear that, we know what happened.

00:22:26
Speaker 4: Appreciate you man, talk soon, Thank you, snee.

00:22:30
Speaker 1: Right, all right, so we've got the recap on umpires in the league championship series. What's up? Oh, one hundred and twenty one hundred and twelve calls missed?

00:22:47
Speaker 3: Okay, and how many games? Six of the eleven.

00:22:50
Speaker 1: Games had below league average correct call rates.

00:22:56
Speaker 3: That's not good.

00:22:57
Speaker 7: That's not good.

00:22:59
Speaker 3: Can we get the score cards?

00:23:02
Speaker 7: Yeah?

00:23:03
Speaker 1: Well, I'm a specific at bat that I want to look at with you guys.

00:23:07
Speaker 5: I think they do it, but this should be the best of the best, or whoever's had the highest scores should be the ones doing it. It's like the way you earn your way into that. But I don't think they do so.

00:23:16
Speaker 3: The guy, the guy a couple of years ago, I had the highest scores for the year, got suspec got kicked out for gambling. So that's true.

00:23:22
Speaker 4: I don't know.

00:23:22
Speaker 1: But the thing is, their scoring system, KIP is not just tied to how they do calling balls and strikes, right, It's even like how they handle player relations right and all of that. So I just think that there should be a who's the top ten on the home plate rank? And we've done this before, we talked about this, so I want to I want to focus on a specific situation, Geno Suarez against Chris Bassett. Bassett throws that seventy two mile an hour curve called strike three to get Gino in a big spot in Game seven. Let's run what Gino said first, and then we'll show you why he was pissed. So he said that was the same pitch you called.

00:24:11
Speaker 3: Ball, and then you didn't say that.

00:24:14
Speaker 1: What did he say a little.

00:24:16
Speaker 4: More than a little more.

00:24:18
Speaker 1: Let's show the pitches. Here's the thing, he's actually wrong. Both of them were strikes, Kip, I mean the ABS system next year, if he challenges that, he loses.

00:24:30
Speaker 5: Yeah, but I'm saying he was even further inside of the last one. But that's the problem when if number two, because he's compared it to his number two pitch, if that number two pitch was called a ball, I would be even more irate if I was Suarez on that one, but the first one was called a strike and it was full count. You should be kind of swinging at that pitch anyways, But I remember doing that a bunch where ball is on the on the black or right on the outside of the zone, and I'm just like, hey, is that as far as it goes? And then it will be uh. He's like, yep, it'll be like literally half the ball out from that and it'll be called the ball. It's like you're a man of your words, so you have these kind of conversations throughout the bat with it, but you're just guys know their zones.

00:25:10
Speaker 7: This is what we do. We like we put the.

00:25:12
Speaker 5: Baseball from our t drills into the cages to every at bat, we learn what the zone is. So we're usually up on that and we allow a little gray area, but we just want a consistent great area. If you're going to give the inside all night, that's fine, but just be on your your p's and q's on the on the outside.

00:25:29
Speaker 7: We won't want that to remain the name. So we just want consistency.

00:25:32
Speaker 3: I think, Okay, here here's a different side of this. Maybe Kirk framed it better. Second one. Also, maybe the umpire said to Johannio earlier, hey man, I missed that one. We don't know. We only saw the end. Maybe said, oh man, I missed that one. I need to get that next time. But next one is three too, We don't know that.

00:25:51
Speaker 1: Yeah, two different pitches too, so they get perceived differently.

00:25:55
Speaker 3: Yes, and they both were strikes technically, yeah, they were both strikes. Strikes. Yeah, I don't know. There's a million ways to look at this. Some bars generally do a good job. Am I looking forward to abs, absolutely, because I can't wait to see who gets to tap their head and who doesn't.

00:26:11
Speaker 1: But in this case, he doesn't have an argument.

00:26:14
Speaker 3: Wait, it doesn't because they were both strikes. If he goes back and he looks at it now. Also, I will say this, I don't know who does the little dots on the little screen, because there's probably some college kid that's like you were in college, eat a bunch of gummy nerds and how it's from stack cast. Yeah, but there's someone's got to be pressing the button.

00:26:31
Speaker 1: No, no, no, it's that cast.

00:26:33
Speaker 3: Because we used to have back back before stack cast, we used to have a inside edge or whatever it's called. There were literally we'd watched the thing and they chow us where the dot was and We're like, damn, what was this kid doing sitting up at three am in his dorm room pressing the wrong spot and you're like, that's not where it was.

00:26:49
Speaker 1: That's different. Okay, it's auto now. But here's the thing. Let's paint this picture next year, same exact spot. Okay. Gino's up and that pitch is called the ball, the second pitch of the Abu sweeper. Let's say the team doesn't challenge it. Chris Bassett and company, they don't challenge it. Okay, fast forward later in that IB called strike three, he's pissed. The consistency doesn't go away, or the inconsistency doesn't go away, because it's not judging every pitch. So if Gino's like, what the hell challenge boom, you're wrong. That's a strike. That's what it was. So it's not. If you want that kind of consistency, you need abs on every pitch. We're not getting that. Players didn't want that.

00:27:26
Speaker 3: I don't want that either, Okay, So.

00:27:30
Speaker 5: There and I was I was I misspoke earlier. So he did call it a ball first. So that's why as far as it's even more mad because it was even more inside. And then that's why so I said, he called it a strike earlier, but three to two. Uh, it's a tough one.

00:27:44
Speaker 7: I don't know.

00:27:44
Speaker 5: It's a tough one to he's taken it because it literally was just called the ball earlier in that I bet so.

00:27:49
Speaker 7: The inconsistency is what got to him.

00:27:50
Speaker 5: The ABS is to remove the inconsistency and just to get the call right. I think that's all we want to really, all we care about is getting the call right.

00:27:58
Speaker 1: Does Gino really know the exact spot where that's landing when he's taking that the.

00:28:03
Speaker 3: Same pitch he was, It was not the same pitch the Empire was right though.

00:28:06
Speaker 1: It was a sweeper and then a curve, but.

00:28:08
Speaker 3: It wasn't the same spot either. They didn't even touch each other.

00:28:11
Speaker 1: Yeah they're close, but no, not.

00:28:13
Speaker 3: That's a spot. That's like saying I'm close to Canada right now? How close that? I'm not that close, but I'm close.

00:28:19
Speaker 1: I mean, you're closer than Asia is true. How tough is that pitch? Specifically during that ab when he unleashes that very rare epic curveball, I.

00:28:31
Speaker 3: Mean, it's you just you have a hard hope he throws it for a ball.

00:28:36
Speaker 5: Right, that ninety four looks like ninety nine then because you just got to get your weight back on both or you just got to get your hands ready for the fastball.

00:28:45
Speaker 7: So it really does add it to the other pitches too.

00:28:47
Speaker 1: But I mean he went sweeper, sinker, sinker, cutter, sinker, and those were all obviously. Actually the sweeper was was seventy three ish and then curveball. Good sequencing.

00:29:04
Speaker 5: Yeah's different sweeper and a slider technically nothing horizontal.

00:29:11
Speaker 1: Okay, more horizontal break slur.

00:29:15
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's a slur. They just invented some guys. Listen, you know this. Some guys had more horizontal on their slider. Some guy has more more vertical. But they just wanted to come up with a different name so they could categorize it. And by the way, I said this when I did my broadcast, can we stop calling a high two seamer a sinker? It's not. It's just a two seamer. He's just trying to get run across the zone at the top because as you know, kip high sinkers, they don't sink. They only sink over the fence usually, so you're not trying to they're not trying to make the ball start at your chest and go to your thighs. They're just trying to start at your chest and run it across the zone. So can we stop calling that a sinker. It's not a sinker. It's a two seemer.

00:29:51
Speaker 4: I'm with you.

00:29:51
Speaker 5: They're just trying to start it at the barrel and go to the end of the bet exactly.

00:29:55
Speaker 1: Wait, so then, do you want stat cast to change.

00:30:01
Speaker 3: Whoever calls whoever calls this pitch right here a sinker when it's really George Kirby was doing it at ninety eight and he was just throwing two seamers that would start here and end up over here instead of the four seamer, which stays truer. Right, that's not a sinker, because a sinker, you're really you're literally trying to get the ball to go down, right, He's not trying to get the ball to go down down, He's trying to get the ball to go from here to here. So that's not a sinker. That's a two seamer.

00:30:25
Speaker 1: So should we label all of them two seamers or do we still have sinkers if they're.

00:30:29
Speaker 3: Yes, some guys, but some guys throw one seams sinkers right, So I mean, you know this, kip. Some guys throw the one seamer that just goes straight down right. Some guys thow two seamers that has more horizontal and down. And then some guys were never able to get the ball to go down, so they just throw a ball that goes this way.

00:30:46
Speaker 7: I like those guys usually, Yeah.

00:30:47
Speaker 3: Those are usually the ones. If it's a righty on the lefty, those are usually the ones you could get that you could go from here and just go fuck.

00:30:53
Speaker 7: Yep, lefties look forward to those guys.

00:30:58
Speaker 1: Yes, well this this this will be the last four to seven games in Major League history that don't have a challenge system or abs involvement. In the future, we might have autoballs and strikes for everything, but this will be the last time that machinery is not involved with this, kip.

00:31:18
Speaker 5: So kidding, question for you, is there a deal with it where it's like we're going to give this a five year, ten year run or is this just like implemented and this is the rule now, or is it just like is there any kind of trial period.

00:31:29
Speaker 1: Deal implemented. Here's the deal. They feel like they tested enough everywhere and that this is the next step in terms of calling balls and strikes. I think there's still a chance that in the future all of this is called be a machinery, but I think we're far away from that. I think this is going to be a roaring success and people are going to like it, and baseball's a business, and they're going to like the fact that the challenge system creates a lot more in interesting content for everyone, for umps, for teams, for fans. Right, everyone can get involved on that. So I actually think that it's going to be so successful that if anything, maybe we because what did we say, we have two and most of us were pissed that we want three, So maybe, if anything, they added three or four whatever it is. But you just give teams more of the ability to challenge versus going on every pitch.

00:32:23
Speaker 7: Yeah, if you win, right, you wouldn't.

00:32:29
Speaker 4: You keep it?

00:32:31
Speaker 1: Yeah? But but no like oh, we're going to try this for a few years or anything. They just kind of go with everything where this is the new rule. But yeah, if it somehow was a disaster and like the machine was wrong or something like that, then the next season they could take it away or do something different. No commitments, no commitment