TGI-Dad Episode 102 (“On the Fence”)

00:00:21
Speaker 1: Steve having what did that start? That was? So that was why am I blaking? In our second stage managers it was Michael Michael Michael Shay was our second stage man or second a d That would have been fifth season, I think or sixth season. And then Steve hey Ford went off to because his kid was being born, and uh, yeah, Mike Michael Shay, who I didn't realize his dad was like a legendary director. Legendary. Yeah, so he's like television royalty. He's like big in the d g A and like, yeah, and I totally didn't know that, of course, because all grown ups were just the same experience, and he yeah, he was really stressed out taking over Steve's job. And I remember him, you know, just in order to keep us going and be like, help us out. Steve's having come on, guy, Steve's having a baby. That was just to keep us and so that we repeated for the next three years, ending video everywhere we said, Steve's having a baby everything all the time. By the way, I will put a picture of because I have a great picture of me and d D to Stephano, Michael Shay and Steve Hayfer. I'll put that on the Pod Meets World show Instagram. Nice and Michael Shane and I didn't always get along. I think a lot of people had that experience. He with me, Michael, he a lot of people didn't get along with you. Yeah, well you're hard to get along with, Michael. I remember Michael did the AIDS ride. Do you guys remember that? He remembered the you know they still do it? Right? You didn't. Rusty's like, Hello, that's right, that's right. That was Wow. It's a long ride. That's a long time. I'm sore from a workout I did yesterday, so I know what you mean. Yes, I'm sore from Danielle's workout. Let's get into the episode. Welcome to Pod Meets World. I'm daniel fish and Strong, and we have with us here William, Rusty Russ. We just know him as Rusty. You know him as Allen Matthews. Oh everybody, Yeah, so this was a great episode to have you on the pod because this was a great Alan Matthews episode. There are there are a few, have a few great Dad episodes, but this one in particular, I loved. I thought you are I mean, you're always wonderful, but boy, this episode for me. Really, I truthfully, I cried. I'm not gonna lie. I had a little to watch with Indie. I'm sitting there like, oh, I couldn't believe how stupid I felt. I'm tearing up, and it came out of nowhere. I was like, Oh, this is why Boymate's World was so good. It totally got me. I mean, as the only one of the three of us, with four of us sitting here smart enough not to have children, I did not cry at all. Oh my gosh, I didn't see it coming. I did neither the Superman when he looks out the window. Okay, you know, I do think that this is probably the episode that defined Alan Matthews because in the pilot you had you had a nice exchange with Ben where he finally realizes that he abandoned you at one point, you know, like that's the storyline, but you kind of downplay it and and it doesn't. It doesn't land the way that this, you know. And also I feel like this is probably where we learned that Alan what he does for a living. Yes, they defined his job in this episode, because later one in the season we get Lenny Spinelli, the great Late Willie Garson, who came on a couple episodes. But yeah, so we this is really I think where the show discovered who all is what Alan does, which is it's so lovely. It's such a lovely episode. Now, before we get into it, you obviously watched this episode. Before watching this episode, when was the last time you saw an episode of Boy Meets World? My goodness, Um, I don't know. I can't even remember. Once in a while, yeah, you know, but once in a while watch and somebody asked me something. I don't remember that. Let me see. Did you watch them when they were on in the nineties? No, actually I didn't, wow, because I was yeah, because they were on Friday nights. You had an active, very busy life at Friday nights, and you know, it wasn't we're streaming in those days outside the covered Wagon. You know, I had to feed the oxen. Did you have the episodes on vhs? Because I remember at the end of every season we would have the Opera Trinity to buy. Do you guys remember that it was so expensive It was like three hundred dollars and then we got to buy them four episodes per VHS and every Disney would offer that to us. It's like, you know, like basically to have it as a memorabilia of like and and my parents I think did it every year. So six VHS tapes, Yeah, we have stacks. I don't know if my parents still have them. But we had every episode before D before the DVD box set came out. We convert. We paid more money to convert them to dd D. You could buy them on Amazon for like, and I was like, what did we do this for? There's a lot of used ones that those are my favorite ones, Like I'm selling my used season three of boy Meat's World, Like, oh, okay, interesting, So so you didn't have you didn't so if you missed it on Friday Night, Rusty, that was it. It's just well I could always see it. I could always ask to see it. But you know, I have to say, just in general, I would never watch things that I did, Okay, and I I first of all, as an actor, I was afraid to make you self conscious. Remember my famous old acting teachers Sandy Misers that you never watch yourself, you know, because then you become self conscious. And literally, I mean my family was always upset with me or I didn't know you're on TV or I didn't know you did this movie or I didn't know you know. It was just my personal thing for better for work, you know, I don't. I do it for the work. And it's hard to watch it. I mean, I've gotten better as I got old, looking, I just don't care. Is there any show you were on that you watched anything that you were like, I watched Wise Guy quite a bit, or any any show. No. Never, I've been surprised by actors who watched the monitor watch playback now, you know, which is something that didn't exist until really the nineties, and now it's a standard thing to have playback on a set. And he's very helpful. Well, it's what looks what's crazy to me, is I hear uh an act I hear like somebody Jeff Bridges Apparently it's a huge playback watcher, which doesn't make when you watch his performances, they're effortless, right they It almost seems like he's is like the least self conscious. Uh. And yet he apparently is one of those actors who watches him, watches his playback just performance based on seeing the playback. That would drive me insane, Like I like Robert Redford apparently has never seen anything he's ever been in, right, I mean that I'm with you, Rusty, like I couldn't. I just tried to watch the show, and that's one of the reasons I didn't, because I, well, I just got insecure. But I also didn't want to be aware of my body or my face in a way that would, for me, seemed like an impediment act and make you less spontaneous. The great gift you have as a good actors, as you all are, is that you can be spontaneous in front of the camera presently the moment, at least for me, once I start watching myself, it's not so much anymore that I don't really take it that seriously mine, but sometimes actorly the look at just to see if there's a feather standing over their head. And you know, I also it wasn't like I was in any position to go, oh, we have to do that again. But I mean we were just talking, uh in the break here about how you know you were on Sopranos, which then led me to you were also on West Wing. I mean, you've been on some of the greatest television shows ever, literally dead Wood. I mean, you name it. You've been on Briscoe County. I mean you were on some of the career. I mean we didn't even touch on some of your movie. The film American History Acts Cruising, as I mentioned, which by the way, it was a showing at the New Beverley American History. American History. Your performance in that movie, so it's so amazing and the way that you you humanize the awfulness, it's so smart, you know, to cast you because you you you're so likable and you're so reasonable and rationable, and then you're just spouting this hate so casually and you could just see how how like, oh yeah, that that's how the spreads is that there's there's a dad at the table, not being an evil villain, like he's like, you're a good guy. You know, you were easically playing like my dad a firefighter, you know, like and oh my god, I remember when that that that movie came out. It blew me away. There's a big boy the contingent in that in that an incredible film. Yeah that was. And then so you you know, go from American History X two on the Fence, which is how did you feel watching this episode? This episode? You know, it was I watched it, and it's just I was very interested. I hadn't seen it, and um, and I was actually kind of moved by it to uh, you know, and and being the dad, I kind of went, oh, this is what makes Michael Jacobs so great. All of a sudden, you get to a point in the story and its story is really about letting a kid be a kid, you know, and and and and it's about understanding and love. And yeah, it was I was quite thrilled to watch it. And but that's also the genius of it is because when you watch it as somebody as a kid watching t G I f it's about finding out that your parents, or your or a specific parent at the time is so what they do in their life and they are more than than what you see. And while you're always working, always doing this, you still have time for me. You still have time. And then when you watch as adults, you're crying because it's about letting a kid be a kid. So there it is. Really you get different things the different ages you are when you watch the show, which is still holds up to the writing. I mean, at the end of the day, that's what it's about. Is it's like you get one thing when you watch it as adult, you get something completely different when you watch it as a kid. That's rare to have that. That's not a bad segue for a few minutes with Indie. Actually, UH, if you love to play it back, because I watched it as I has become the new tradition. I watched this episode with my seven year old son and UH recorded a conversation with him. It starts off because I, you know, I started recording. He was like, what are we doing this for. I was like, well, we're putting it on the podcast. So his first question is, is it's gonna make me famous? Nice? Hey, Bachelor fans Ben Higgins and Ashley I from the Almost Famous podcast. The new season of The Bachelorette returns to TV July eleven, with not one, but two bachelorettes as Rachel and Gabby will both be competing for love. And since we've all been waiting so long for this, or bring you NonStop exclusive content, interviews and behind the scenes secrets, all the Bachelor Nation juice you can handle. We're talking roses, tears, hookups, more tears. We've got all the insider info for the new season of the Bachelorette. But there's only one place to get that, and that's by listening to the Almost Same as podcasts. Trust us, you won't want to miss a thing, So subscribe and start listening because we're starting the pre party now and then we'll continue with coverage and breakdowns literally and figure actively throughout the entire season. But Almost Famous podcast, we're like your own personal fantasy suite for all things bachelor in Bachelorette. Wait, could I be famous if this happened? Um? I guess so. At least your voice could be famous. My voice. Nobody even knows who I look like? You want, don't you describe yourself? Short hair, little shaggy right now? Actually bushy hair, long bangs. You have freckles all the way across your nose and your cheeks. What color eyes blue? What color hair blue? It is blue right now. But it's fading that we died it. How long ago did we die it? Like to only two weeks ago? All right, but it's it's got it's gone gray as all right, We're gonna sit down and watch another episode of my show. Do you remember what it's called? The Boy? Yeah? All right, Square guns painting the fence. What do you think? And do still too much shirts? What? Actually you commented on the vest, Yeah, a lot of vests in the beginning, and the must and the mustache. Dude, game back, Mr Feenie. Yeah yeah. Do you think Corey learned anything this episode already? Really? No, I was too focused on you still me. I was barely in it again. Actually had a bigger part this time. What did you think of the square guns? Yours was cool? The Nerds was dumb. It had a rubber band in the middle kind of weird. Wait you called him a nerd? What what? What's a nerd? Math nerd, science nerd? What does that mean? We like? I don't know, but you just knew that he was a nerd character. Yeah. Why he's always like so protective and he is like and he loves math, and he just like tries to be safe and stuff. I do not like order kids with his buck teeth. Dude, you heard missing one of your front teeth. I don't think you're one to talk right now? Oh okay, alright, So did you like him though as a character? I thought he was really funny. Yeah, when he wasn't a banana suit? What what about when Corey got all wet in the beginning. You seem to like that. Yeah, I thought that seeney dude was talking sense where he said the water fountain wasn't a toy? Very true. What about the little sister man she killed me? I thought she was so funny. She's the best. Oh, yes, she should have called nine on one. I feel like she should. I would have done that if they were having a water gun fight and they shot the neighbor, yes, I'd go nine one one. I don't think that would be the appropriate thing to do. But all right, what about the whole the whole thing? Did you notice that in the beginning of the episode, he says, Corey, they're talking about which superhero you'd want to be your dad, and then he has that moment when he's watching his dad paint offence and he says, it's like, my dad's Superman. What do you think of that? That's kind of cool? Yeah, man, I got kind of emotional because it was like earlier in the beginning of the episode he kind of was, I don't know, like not thinking about his dad's feelings and how much how hard his dad was working, what super he would you want your dad to be excellent question. Let's get into the real thing. My I mean, it's really hard to to to not think Superman. I mean, you'd want the most powerful superheroever, wonder Woman. I guess what about you? Say, my mom? Maybe that girl? Dad, that's a spider Man. Yeah, even though I hate superheroes since when I don't like superhero still weird? What's weird about them? They're just like we do save the page. It sounds to me like you're talking. It sounds to me like you're talking about the movies, like you don't really like the superhero movies, the horrible and the shows they're like, oh no, I got'ta say, Lord learn I was square headed on Superman. So is it safe to say that you like Boy Meets World better than superhero shows? Yes? Yeah, all right, I think that's a good that's a that's a compliment. Anything else you want to add? How did the sister get the phone? She was always on the counter? Great question, unbelievable and with a really good question. Is a good question. But to your point, will I, it was like we watched two different shows exactly. He like, if you notice he knows he identifies with literally like he's basically like the sisters the best, and he's more concerned I would have called nine one one and then the score guns and the nerds, you know, as I'm sitting there trying to be like, did you know this the dead and like he's absorbing that too, but it's not nearly as important as like who would you want as your superhero? You know, And that balance the way that the show is a family show in the true sense that a family can watch it together, enjoy it, but have completely different interpretations or different experiences of that show. It also leads to which we got into further episodes when when Lily wasn't on the show anymore, where it's like why would they bring We don't need the Little Sister? Whey would they bring her back? And it's like, well, look at that audience. If there's a whole an audience connected to every one of the characters on the show, that they bring a different audience with them, which again I didn't know any you know, I don't know anything about that. So at the time it was like, we don't need the Little Sister, and then it's like, oh, no, you do. There's a whole group of people out there that will identify with that character's I'm obsessed with. By the way, that segment we are calling too much Shirts. It's my favorite segments so far to do on the podcast. It's just too much Shirts with Indie is just amazing, the absolute best. So let's jump into the recap. Let me give you a synopsis of the episode. When Corey's parents don't give him the money to buy a water gun for the classes water fight, he strikes a deal with Mr Feenie to paint his shutters and Phoene will give him the money for the gun. Corey rushes through the job and an accident occurs. So this episode was directed by David Trainer, who we have already mentioned. His name has already come up like three times on the podcast. The writers were Michael Jacobs, April Kelly and Jeff Sherman. And um, it's you know they have starring here and we all know who's starring starring's amazing people. Um not yet but alright, sure not me and guest starring. I think the guest star is important because I think the only time we saw him, isn't it? Yes, the one guy is His character name is Ellis. Do we does anybody say his name Ellis on the show? Because I had the same thought. I was like, wait, what was characters? And then we never mentioned it. But he's great, he's so funny. How do you get to be award? Um? Yeah, well, this is the introduction of the death chair. Unfortunately, let's recap the death chair. So the death chair is the chair that Dewan is sitting in. Um, which, yeah, it was in the cafeteria. We go through these first episodes and this was not the first episode we shot after the pilot. This they aired out of order, so this was probably episode three or four of actual shooting, and so by this time we had probably already Dewan was probably not the first one to sit in that chair in the cafeteria. So we'll see in the other episodes that we end up. Um, I believe Marty York sits in that chair. John Party was in the averaging the pilot. But yeah, so we started making the joke that this is the death chair because the kid, because whoever said yeah, whoever sat in this chair seat usually did one episode and then did not come back. If they were lucky enough to do one episode. There were times we're halfway through a rehearsal the person be gone and he's like, oh there, that's it, You're gone. So it was it was tough to be the To be Corey's third friend was not a not an easy thing to do in town, all right. So in in the cold open, Corey and Sean and and Dewan are talking about which superhero they would want to be their dad, uh, which is all Michael Jacobs, by the way, because Michael Jacobs is such a it was known for a vast comic book collection, and so there would be many a comic book or superhero reference that would happen during Boy he was any time he hears anything superhero, it's all Michael. Yeah, okay. And so the Sean and the friend pull out their water gun and they spray Minkus. They just completely dows him in water mingus. Then I know it's also we should mention this is the first time we see Yeah, this is the first time we meet Mincus. So we we see his name Leon Norris in the opening credits in the pilot episode. He just didn't appear in the pilot episode. This is so this is the first time we see this character, and um Mincus then pulls out his water guy and it's actually way bigger than everybody else's puts everybody else's water guns to shame him struggling, I'm sorry him taking up the giant like cello case or whatever. It was really funny because Lee was a very small kid and they had this giant shut and you see him have to like muscle that thing up on the table to pop it open. Old school, Yeah it was. It was cold. Yeah, it was really cute. I thought it was cute that even to have the case like that, where you think it's going to be a violin or a cello or something and then it's And this was the era of the super soaker. This was very very nineties timely. Like I remember in real life, these things were so cool and we couldn't call I mean, supersoakers were the brand. I believe that's sort of like ushered in this era. Now it's sort of taken for granted, but like there was the whole idea that you could make like really cool big score guns was a new idea and they all looked like they do on the show. But I remember it was so fun to do this episode. I actually have memories of this episode, I can imagine that pointing out the guns and like doing the whole thing. And then you know, of course Ben getting soaked in that opening scene was just so much that that's like one of those moments where it's like, uh, you know, kids love watching that kind of stuff, Like my son that he was just dying, and that when we watched this scene. It was also really fun to do when we did like food fight stuff or like this is that was the marriage of like being a kid actor and still being a kid and having so much fun with this stuff and so rusty. Since you didn't watch the show when it aired in the nineties and you weren't in obviously the cafeteria set, did you watch like did you get to watch it during run through? Did you watch it during the taping? Like? What was what was your What was going on for you while we were doing this like kid friendly stuff? Oh? I was. I was enjoying watching you guys, you know. I mean I love the tapings because I would see scenes that maybe I hadn't been around, but I was, you know, in the first couple of years, I was there a lot you know, as you guys got older and there were different storylines, you know. But as as I love watching you guys, I like what you would come up with, and and also how brave you were to get wet. Why you're fearless as a kid actor, You're just like, yeah, throw me in the table over your fearless as an actor. I get older, I kind of how cold is that? Yeah? Exactly? Do I really have to get wet? But I don't know if I want to do this. What do you remember about Lee Norris? I just remember he was so sweet, so smart and just could you know, just got everything immediately. Yeah, you know you kind of you know, he was there from the table read just ready had this character. He was really funny. He was funny. He's a pro, and I guess he had a lot of experience, more of the experience than any of us on sitcom at that point, because he had already done Almost Home and wasn't even I think Michael, I think, Okay, So Michael Jacobs basically created the role of Minkus for him because he was so good, such a pro, and you know it's so funny because yeah, like I just remember him and his mom when where were they? They had a slight accent. You could hear his accent in there. Oh, he's just such a cute kid. Michael would do that. Though Michael would if he liked an actor would create it. I mean Jason Marsden. The Jason Marsden character was created for Jason Marsden because I mean it was that's just Michael. So Corey realized he gets soaked with the water gun, and then he realizes he's the only person in the school who doesn't have a water gun. I have one question. Can we go back to the cold open a little bit? I have one question. Okay, good, we're still here. So, if memory serves, we were not allowed to say things like oh my god. So he stops himself. You hear he says. And I even wrote that because you you know, halfway through he was like, oh wait, we're not allowed to say. And so you set you that that thing shuts down in your brain. It's like swearing on TV. So it was him going, if you watch again, he was, oh my god, and he stops himself from saying it TV with a chiron and with like with subtitles and and it says, oh my god. That probably wasn't scripted. That was probably just be and knowing that he couldn't, he stopped himself halfway through. You could see him and he saw the mind going wait, I can't say, Oh my god, I wonder how my only takes we did I don't remember, because I mean something like that you have to change. Yeah, well was the shot from his from behind his back though, because maybe they could have just taken it out on his face and he has a kind of over his He has a single of him and then and then um Bill comes in and joins his shot their exchange. This also started the pants pole. I don't know about these are things before I came on the show, So tell me what is the patented ben pants poll. You will notice Corey always will walk into a scene and for some reason, and it's usually just his right hand, it's not both. He will reach down and he like goes to pull up his pants And did you know this at the time. I remember this at the time to the point where when I saw it the first time I was rewatching this, I was like, Okay, I'm gonna keep a running tally of how how many time said he does this? We were at ten by the end of the episode. By the way, check me if I'm wrong, Um, but you do you see him just it was a kind of thing he did where he would always go for his pants. What were your ticks? Do you have you remember? Oh, I'm sure I had. I mean, my my first tick was just it was it's just bad acting. It was one of my first time. I feel like you went through a pointing stage. I pointed that. I also did a lot like a facial thing like like where you and Michael like pulled me aside one time and told me to do this where like you would say a line like actors when you're trying to get a laugh when there isn't one and you don't really know how to find the laugh yet you would make a face after the line, like you can't believe even you said that line. So it was like, whatever you mean, Corey, Like I can't said that's well, but it is. I can't believe I got away with that exactly. So it was I remember Michael like during a note session, I think it was our six of a note session was like, oh, and will don't make faces like okay, thanks? Um. So yeah, we always got into that stuff. But I'm the only person who was bumped even with water guns. Just hearing the word gun and seas in a schools were talking not it did not occur to me. But I'm watching it with Indie, and I think he was having so much fun with the idea of square guns that I just saw them as square guns. But yes, now that you guys men, but it is incredibly disturbing. But let me point out something also about your son. What did he say? He said, you call nine one one in their heads. It's even your son's young head shooting the neighbor wasn't At that time, it wasn't interesting. It's a pre Columbine nobody was thinking anything like that. But you know what's interesting, Writer, is that I'm surprised it didn't occur to you because I got something from you. I've gotten many things from you, parenting wise, which is funny because we've only our kids have not even well, your son came to my son's birthday party, but whatever. I've taken so many things parenting wise from Writer, but one of them was that you said, very early on, Uh, there's no you cannot avoid it. Whether you shield or protect your kid from any any vision of guns in your house, they will still somehow gravitate towards finger guns. Finger guns exactly. And you said blasters, We call them blasters, and so we Jensen and I have taken in our home, we don't say the word gun at all. Everything is a blaster. Oh look at that water blaster? Is that? Oh that's a laser. Everything's a blaster or a laser. Um And so I think even just hearing kids talking talking about it wasn't just that one of the lines. He one of the lines that I might have been due on a kid. It might have been Lee. He says, it's so powerful, this thing will blow your head off. And it was like, wow, I mean, it's just the times are different. Times different. It's just something didn't bump any of us back then. And and you know, it was very very strange. Yeah, to hear it was, it was, Yeah, it was. It was interesting, all right. So we leave the cafeteria, Corey goes home and he comes downstairs. He starts complimenting her, Wow, you sure do look nice today, and she knows what this means because probably yeah or something. So this was interesting. Corey was more conniving than I remember, like, you know, as as as the show went on, you know, Corey obviously grew up and Ben added his own thing and it changed completely. I forgot that there's like this real Dennis the Menace, like you know, a wise guy, smart aleck Corey. That's what I forgot that between between Corey and Bill Daniels, that Coy and Mr Feeney, that was absolutely Dennis. That like that evaporated in Corey by you know, season I don't know when, but by the time, you know, season seven, like there was no I mean, he would never be like a manipulative, smart alecky character like that. So it's so interesting that the show clearly started from this place and and it works, you know, it's but he's also there all a little meaner to each other. And I remember, like there's also like classic trope, yeah, you know the young you know, adult acting kid, Yes, the con Man totally. You know, it's a great story icon too, and and Ben was very good at it, and it's it's a very fun and it's also very you know, it's it's someone to watch. Yeah, you know that you want to go, Okay, what are they really going to do? Well, that's the thing, I mean say. One of the things that strikes me as I'm rewatching these episodes. Is A, Ben was in every single scene, every sing and B. He can carry the show. Absolutely, really can carry the show. You watch him the whole time. He's like a little stand up comedian and he really can carry the weight twelve year old actor. That's pretty amazing that he was. He was able to do that because he was in every single scene so far for the two episodes that we've watched, which is nuts, that's that's and then going to school and doing everything out. I mean, that's a lot of weight on your shoulder. And I thought halfway through this episode, I was just like, man, Ben's actually really good, Like he's really good at that. And I think we all took that for granted. I think we all thought of ourselves. I mean even though we know the show was built around him, and it was like, well, we're all working, we're all doing that. Like no, in these early years, it was all bad, Like there was so much pressure on him to carry the show. Like you're saying, he nails it and like and that the effortlessness with which Corey is like empathetic and then sort of becomes also a smart alec and he's like, what do you mean, you know, like give me the you know what does he say, Well, we'll get into Yeah, but he's he's really good. Yeah, yeah, it was. I was. I was amazing because I haven't seen it in so long. That's one of the things I really took away from the first two episodes was like, man, Ben's good at this. Yeah. So he tells his mom he wants a water gun. He shows or a brochure and it's fifty dollars and then Dad Rusty down the stairs grabs him in a in a bear hug from behind, which is just so cute. And uh he looks at the water gun and he says, hmm, that seems pretty steep, pretty expensive. You can't get it now, but maybe we could get it for you for Christmas. Rusty, what's it like to have like, what's it like to have a TV wife, a TV family? What? What is that? How do you create that chemistry? Because like I'm watching you and Ben, and right from the beginning, I just buy and believe that you guys have a father son relationship. You just feel it. Oh well, thank you. Well, I think I think hopefully that's what actors bring. I mean, as an actor, I part of me believes more and make believe than real life, because there I can be anything I want. And Ben was a sweet kid. You all were, and I was, you know, getting to know you guys. But again, part of it is just jumping in and going for it. And thank goodness, Ben was there too, as you all were. Really, as far as I'm concerned, um, I don't know, you know, I don't know. He was a wonderful actor and a great kid, and I just you know, you have to be brave. I just said, Okay, this is what I do with my kids. You know, this is what I do. You know, with my son or my daughter. You know, in the family of five. You know, my dad was you know, great dad, you know, and he wan hugg us and you know that's what you want. What do you want from my father? I thought, this is immediate time to say, oh, this is where we are, this is my kid. I do remember as a kid actor getting jobs where you'd be somebody's kid, and um, the good actors would physically spend time with you, because you need to be comfortable, you need to be like I remember, I did a movie called Benefit of the Doubt with Amy Irvine and like, that's a that's a whole story, and never let me forget that I was in that movie because I'm so bad in it, and he would just imitate me every morning. He saw it on TV one day and then he was like, writer, what is this movie? Amy Irving? Uh? You know, like in my my screen test, she just she was like, we do the scene and then she's like, hey, writer, can you just come sit in my lap? Like in retrospect it's kind of weird, but at the time it was like, that's what and we just and then she just hugged me and held me and it was like we needed the physical and it's it seems weird, but it's true. As a kid to have a parent kid relationship, the actors need to have a dynamic that it's believable, that's lived in and it's it's it's super Yeah. And you guys had that instantly. Yeah, you know, and you develop that. I mean, who knows we developed at the craft service ta kid Ben or I would kid you or Danielle or you know, Will It's like, what are you doing? What kind of shoes are those? What are you yea last night? Where did you go? You know? You kind of like any kind of but and actors can hopefully most people can do it kind of instantly. I mean, you think about it, you go to work, you have to create some sort of life between the other actors, and hopefully that's a gift that you have or not. You know. Fortunately Ben was great, and yeah, I just kind of showed up baby and trying not to run into the furniture. There's there's a question that I we should have asked last episode, but I want to ask now because we we've heard about this from some of the other actors that were on the show that we will get to eventually. But was there ever a time, especially at the beginning, where you thought to yourself, this isn't gonna work, this isn't for me, and I might not want to be here. No good, Okay, No, I don't think so. No. I there are many times I went, oh, I don't get there. A lot of things, a lot of things I don't know that I don't know right right. I would do something and David Trainer kindly would point out, oh, I need you to look over here or do this, or you can't walk in the back like that. You look crazy. You know. There were just things in the format that I went, Oh, I was so used to doing, you know, single camera and things, and the dynamics and the set and the you know, we're all kind of different dimensions, and it took me a while to adjust certain things because there were certain things I would do that I wasn't sure the camera was getting or not. Though I never really worry about that, Okay, I'm just curious. No, no, I always you know, once I committed to it, and as I said, you guys were so great and I love the writers, and man I was I was really glad to be there. Cool. So then we're in Korean Eric's room. Eric is trying to put a girl's number in his watch. I definitely remember being so excited about having a Cassio digital watch that could do that. Was a calculator watch that was so advanced in whenever I had it. Um So it's but now it just seems so dated, and I believe it's the Eric says the same name, it's still Heather from the pilot. So, and then I believe Nicky Cox plays Heather. So he's been dating the same girl for two or three episodes, which the thing I like about that is that it kind of ties back into the previous episode where Corey told you to call her, which means it didn't work work and she stuck around and you guys were able to continue your relationship. Um. And so Corey's like, hey, how did you get your parents to buy that watch for you? And you explained that you actually bought it with your own money because you have a job, and what I did. Eric, Eric had a job. What he didn't ever have were scenes with the parents, So it was always like the parents would be downstairs and then Eric's upstairs in his room, so it was still like it was just it's normal, but it was it's very strange. You'd always be talking about stuff, but it was never like I wasn't working. You actually come down for a brief second in the next scene. One quick, one quick, little out again. But it was we were all kept very insular at the time. It was like, this is your set, like, okay, rider, you know at the time, Sean, you're in school, the this is your set. Yeah, the bedroom was your kitchen was Alan and Amy exactly. And then Ben got to run between the worlds and it was Foenie backyard, Poenie classroom was Poenie, but not as much yet. We haven't really established that yet, so it was it was It's very interesting they set up all these different worlds and then the through line is been running from world to world world and we and and nobody's been really meshed yet, right, which is which is an interesting, interesting look at the whole thing. And you know, it's kind of inevitable, right, it has to happen, and they set it up. They always set it up with with the opening static shot start of either the house or the school, and then you know where the camera pans in, like, oh, they're going upstairs to the bedroom, it's going to be an eric scene, They're going downstairs to the front door, it's going to be a kid and scene. Like by that, you knew where you were going to be in the house and and by extension, what actors you were going to see the exterior of the house, did you do? You guys know that that house is in Studio City on Colfax, right across from the studio, right across from where we shot. And just yesterday I passed the exterior for the school, which is on the name of the school, but it's a Beautiful High School and Lovesteless one of the few brick schools in Los Angeles. Why it was the exterior because it looks like an East Coast it does. But I drove by with India yesterday after we watched the episode. I was like, there it is and he was like what really? Well, I remember when they sold the house, they sold it as The Boy. I mean that was like it was first sale as the Boy means world house. Yeah, speaking of all the different worlds that is. It actually is very much how a child's life feels. You do feel like you're like I have so many things. I have my home life, and I have my friend life, and I have my school life, and everything feels nothing feels like a it goes well together. It just fluid. It's not fluid at all. It's very interesting. Yeah. Okay, So then we're in the kitchen. Are you at all handy rusty? Because I noticed in this episode you're you're fixing the toilet, you're fixing the sink. Are you handy in that way? Are you like, can you fix stuff? I'm an actor. I let other people fix stuff. Yeah, I'm terrible. I'm relatively like if it's a toilet, a sink, something like that. Then I fix it around the house. Really learned years. Yeah, my dad figured it. Yeah, I live by myself since I was sixteen. It's like, am I going to call a plumber because the sink is making? No, you should go outside, you shut off the water. You fix the sink. I wouldn't even know how to shut off the water. You're gonna need to learn how to do that because if there's a flood or something, you're gonna need how to learn how to shut off the water in your house. That's important. There's usually one valve coming in from the street or two. If you've got to want to know where that is your water valve. You're gonna want to know where those are. Those are two important things. All right, I'm gonna learn it later today. But no, I'm not doing a leg. I'm not like, you know, rewiring anything but basic stuff. Hey, the toilet's running, I can do that, you know, I'll call you the joy of being able. I do appreciate though, how establishing you know the parents in this scene they get a real life blue callar. You know, there's a sense of like money is kind of you shoot, it's not just like because some sitcoms, that's not that's removed. My money is just removed. Other sitcoms like Rosanne was like money was obviously between you know, it's like, oh, you own this grocery store. I'm assuming you know, like the manager manager. Okay, great, so yeah, but you know there there there's also that sarcastic line like that you deliver to Betsy is like remember when we were before, before we knew each other, when we were happy, and you know that is like classic sitcom banter. But it also does establish the sort of level that this that this family lives at, you know, which I like. I think it's it's it's a good because we're in Philadelphia, but we're kind of in the suburbs. It definitely feels like the suburbs of are quite explain where, you know. But I also like though that they're also establishing that the parents have a real work ethic. So it's like if you want to buy something, get a job and go and buy something, And that's I think something that's that's lost a little bit on certain generations. So I like that that was still written into the show where it's like, hey, you got that watch where'd you get it? Well, I earned the money. And there's even the line where Eric says, Dad said to me, it's my money. I get to spend it the way I want to. And it's I like that. It's like, that's your money. You've earned it. Now you can go do with it what you want. And you don't see that a lot on sitcoms either, So that was that was cool. Yeah, so go make some money and give it me exactly. Okay, So this is the first time where Alan specifically mentions because Corey says he wants a job. He comes down, he's like, hey, my brother has a job. He gets to spend his money, then why can't I get a job? And this is the first time where you get to deliver the moral of the story from the adult perspective, really is No, your job is to be a kid, and and that is just as important of a job as any other job that we all have. And once it's gone, you cannot get it back, unlike a real job, where once one job goes you could always go get another job. Being a kid is such a temporary and very fleeting thing, although when you are a kid it feels like it's never gonna be over my my like, this is today while we're recording, this is my son's last day of first grade. Gosh, and he could not come sooner. He thought this is was the longest year ever, Like, oh my god, you know how this is flown by? I believe you're done with first grade? Stop? Slow down? It does it happened? I mean, I remember my whole life. I wanted to be thirty, and now thirty is eleven years behind me. And I do still love aging. I don't have a problem with aging. I do. I think life gets better as you get older, assuming you're willing to, you know, assuming you're actually growing and evolving and learning and becoming a different person. Life has just continues to get better the more you know. Um, but boy, I just felt like, you know, I remember at the beginning of a school year and being like, well, yeah, we'll do that next summer, being like the next summer never going to be here forever? Is there is there some sort of irony about a show about how you have to be a kid and stay a kid as long as you can. That's starring a kid actor who's got the entire way to the world on his shoulders. But that's what I mean, just talk about how he runs everything, and the whole episode is about you gotta keep being a kid. And it's like, except you, Ben, because you gotta make money. Yeah exactly. Now go to school and now come back and keep the four hundred people on the cast crew and everything employed. Ben, So be a kid. There's something disturb menywhere it's like, you know that was the moral is everybody you need to keep your childhood except for you Ben. You gotta get back to you. Yeah, Rusty, did you ever talk to the writers about your character, your storylines, lines you wrote? What was your relationship with them? Like is it related to every week's episode? I have to say I had a great uh rapport with the writers. They were terrific writers, and you know, I loved you know, I knew that they were always trying to find the funny, you know, but they're also going for a heart of the matter. And that's what I was always trying to go, well, what is this scene really about besides this joke? And there and Michael I have to say, I mean, to his his his credit, he always was saying, well, it's about this, about this, and then if we can lay a joke on it, or we find it in a funny way that we like, then we'll do it. So I had, you know, I loved the writers and I loved, as I say, the tapings and watching you kids all the time. And once in a while is something to come up and I kind of tork my ears and though it doesn't really quite sound writer doesn't quite work, and hopefully I would talk to you guys and say, you know, let's try this. What's this about? That not working? Yell, let's try it another way, you know. I mean, that was what the rehearsal was about, was want to discovery what is this about? You know, That's definitely something I learned literally, like my very first week and then continue to learn every week thereafter. Was like truly breaking down a script from every character's perspective, What is this about for you? What is this about for you? What is this about for you? Because from every character's perspective, it's a little bit different. And obviously the you know, as we're seeing with Indie, Indie is seeing it through the Corey eyes. He truly is the Corey character. Um. But like I breaking down a script and for the actor to know I am responding and reacting this way in this scene because for me, what this is about right now is this, and that's because of what just happened before. And I don't know what's going to happen in the future, but in the future, this is going to happen because of what's happening right now, and good writing accommodates that bad doesn't. And I feel like one of the things that separated Boy's World from a lot of other sitcoms was that Michael Jacobs wanted answers. He didn't mind every character having their perspective and an arc, whereas I could see on other shows they'd just be like, because it's funny. Yeah, there is not a wasted moment. The Superman banter in the beginning, which seems like the most casual I didn't write it down when I went because I didn't think it was important to the show is easy banter, and then it made me cry. Exactly this scene that we're still talking about because we're only on scene three, him fixing the sink comes back when Amy grabs it as her score kind of the in the it's like unbelievable. There's not a wasted line there's not a wasted physical move, and this is like, this show is tight, but this is what it's about. This is about going back and watching it as adults and finding being able to appreciate actually that everything went into this little show that we were like, well, but now I'm sneezing the lottery numbers. But there's a but it is and that's what makes actually great movies, great books, great any of you as I get older, as you get older, I mean, you see why this works. And then the use that you use the very important term there's nothing wasted. Everything is there for a moment. There's nothing you know, superfluous to what's going on. I mean, and you can look at Lawrence of Arabia movie most like that, and you'll see every moment leads to the next and continues as a story, as does Boy Meets World or a good writing which is which is pretty incredible actually, and it's it's one of those things where I was constantly amazed. So we'll talk about nothing wasted. There's one moment which I'm not sure we've gotten back to, because obviously there's several through lines that go through here. Mr Feenie always throws one in In this case, Alan Threw went in about being a kid um. But one of the things that I was surprised they kind of mixed literary references because he talks about the Raven and so I was like, oh, how's the raven gonna come back? And it never did. And then they jumped to Tom Sawyer. And that's why I was like, okay, so waiting, how well that okay, so something I'm thinking, No, I'm not going to make the connection. I'm I do. It's it's interesting to me watching the pilot and this how much Phoenie is sort of a caricature of culture, you know what I mean, He's such this refined cultural guy and so those, yeah, those references I think are kind of hokey. Actually, Like that's one of my least favorite parts because there's the Tom Sawyer one is great because you could see but you know, I just think it's interested like Phoenie is just you know, it's like the Western cannon. It's just like every time he opens his mouth, he's going to make a reference like Emily Dickinson Black. It's like every exactly. Let's keep tracking because I think it's so funny. But you know, it is how in eleven year old sees right these cultures, you know. But yeah, I I find it funny that it's like he can't open his mouth with a name dropping some awesome that's the new thing. It is there. It was very but I was waiting for that to come back, like, Okay, he specifically mentions the Raven. That's not just gonna be dangling. They're going to bring them. Oh no, they didn't. That just was just the thing, like I don't know, So it was that I found interesting. But then of course they worked in Tom Sawyer and then you also get the great Lee line, which will get but they is like, am I the only one who read the Summer Zyllabus? You know, because we always would get them and you never read them everything. Probably read them, every single one. That's the point of the mention of the Raven and Tom Sawyer. Yeah, no one read them. That's why. Exactly. So we're in the backyard. We see Phoene he's he's trimed his roses. Uh. Corey offers to help. Uh. Phoeny says, no, stay away from the roses. But Corey asks for fifty dollars in advance to shovel snow in the winter, and Phoenie says no, but he does need his shutters painted. And then we get a little math joke. He was willing to pay him. It was so funny. He's willing to pay him eighty bucks, but he tells him he's willing to pay him five dollars. Five dollars. Five dollars was five times two times eight times eight and there were eight shutters or something, and he was willing whatever, and it was gonna be eighty bucks. But you see Corey go through the math and he comes up with fifty eight bucks, and Phoeny says, deal, fifty eight bucks. I'll pay a fifty eight bucks for it, which is fine with Corey because all he needs is fifty to buy his water gun. Um. So that's a great joke though, how even even the teacher is like, if you're not going to do the math, you're not going to correct you to pay you more. Well, it's actually it leads to a really funny joke where he says, you earned every cent of that s plus I gave you in math, which is really great. Um. The quintessential like line for me that um that surprised me get a pulse, so like a kind of obnoxious kid, but it comes back. That's what I mean. That is that I wrote down. It's like, what is this? I forgot this aspect of our show. Get We're still in the backyard. Corey paints all the shutters and Phoeney pays him the money. The shutters look great. Everybody's impressed. But once they move the shutters happened. Alan notices that Corey has painted the shutters against the fence and their side of the fence. Now, the Matthew side of the fence is now zebra print basically with green paint, and Corey cannot go to the water War because he has to fix the fence. By the way Indie's restaurants, it looks better that way. It's like the zebra thing is cool, the stripes are great. Why don't they just leave it? I was like, it seems you're kind of right, dude. Yeah, so um uh. Corey's obviously bummed. He's like, what the sucks? I really wanted to go to the water War. He has to stay. Um and we're back in the kitchen. This is where Lily Uh is tying your apron because we see you going to work, going Eric going to work and doing the little boat tip. So this is as I was watching this, this reminded me of again what Michael was clearly trying to do. He was trying to find the pairs and the teams that were going to work. So for for a good six or seven episodes, they were trying to make Eric and uh Morgan a thing. Um. They were trying to make you know, Corey and Corey was there for everybody, but were trying to pair people up where it was going to be like, let's see what teams work which. Again, by the end, you know, middle midway through season one or two, it was all of a sudden it was Eric and Peeney like. So they were trying to see what season one is. When you guys, nail, it's when we started. We started to get there. But you could tell they were trying to see which teams have the chemist. And one of the coolest things I ever heard about this was was Family Guy Seth MacFarland talks about this where he's like, the idea when we started the show that the show was going to end up being Stewie and Brian is ridiculous. There's like, there's no way the dog and the baby are going to run the show. He's like, and then you start to let the actors go, and all of a sudden, the characters, the characters they matched the way they're supposed to match. So this is the start of them going like, all right, here's the Eric Morgan scene, because this is gonna be a thing. And um, you know this is essentially why the death chair was there, right, It is because they were trying to find that character that would pop and you know that chemistry they're just trying to find. Yeah, and I mean it was great. I think until Tapanga shows up the whole thing. Japanga showing up changes the whole thing. Um. But yeah, So it was working with with Lily was wonderful. She was a ton of fun to work with a little kid, and she she would love to, you know, make jokes and and always had a big smile on her face. Jumping ahead, Rusty while we have you here. Eventually Lily gets swapped out. We replaced Lily nix A with Lindsay Ridgeway. What is what was your what's your memory of that time? Because you know, I think we all have different perspective perspectives of it based on how much we were working or what we saw at the time. What was your perspective of what was going on around that time? Well, I think there was um some issues that had to do with growing up, and it's possible Lily didn't necessarily want to be a child actor. Yeah, I think I'm not sure. She was very happy at the time, and Michael Jacobs, to his credit, could see that. He and they decided what was best personally, Yeah, for for her was to let her go, was to you know, let her try something else, you know, somewhere else. And I think that's really what it was about. Yeah, how many seasons did we go without? I was gonna say she wasn't really replaced at first. It was just they got rid of the character. They just knowledge one day Lily was gone, and then Lindsay was there. It's like Lily was gone and started I know, but but it just wasn't mentioned and then and then and then they to bring the character back because what we were talking about where it was a whole another dynamic of the show and a whole another audience of the show. So it's like they need to bring her back. And then they made a joke about it, and then Lindsey walks down. It was in my room for a really long time, very long time out. Yeah, you know, this is coming back from what they're feeling from audiences. Yeah, you know. I mean, nothing's done in a vacuum, and then you find what a lot of funds you don't know do you do it? It's like everything, you try it and see what's working or not. And that's the that's the the the interesting thing about doing a TV show every week, as opposed to a movie where you just do it and put it out there and see what's happening. Then you can edit with it. But every week you have this living, growing thing that you're taking information from from the audience, from the writers, seeing how it moves. Yeah, she's so, she's so naturally funny. She was, and she's just cute as a button. I know. We talked about it in the first episode. Just didn't want to be there. Yeah, I mean we and I don't think at first, not at this point, not at this point, at this point, but but later she was she was like six again when we were talking about the pressure, you really have to want it because it is it's a lot, it's a lot on your shoulders. And she was six years old, six and yeah, I think I think eventually she just got to a point where she was like, this isn't as fun as you guys all think you always had fun, and hopefully that's why you're still here because it's fun. Yeah, exactly. Okay. So Corey then comes into the kitchen. He grabs ice cream bars for his friends who are outside because he's tried to sucker them into painting the fence. Yeah he's suckering. Yeah, but he suckered you into it with with money he's paying you. Um, and I love this he hands uh, I love Lee, saying he really prefers a heath bar crunch. I think that's very funny, and dipping it in the dirt, putting a handful of dirt on it. Here, chew on that. Okay. So then the friends leave, writer or did you have any have a lawyer called my mom? I didn't remember that. I was like, all right, Sean, stuff, I think this scene too. I wanted to the blocking in this show. I find so much more interesting than what we do in today's day and age. As a director of kids TV, now I am We're often limited by everybody wants to see two eyeballs at all times, and nobody wants anything in front of anybody's face. You're all the way upstage, practically behind a tree when you deliver the line have your lawyer called my mom. And I love it your body. I also know that you get to see our feet all the time. I was freaking out about how the sneakers. I was like, these are cool. I remember those wearing cool monarchs. In the scene where he's fixing under the sink, by the ways under the sink, I could barely even see one eye. And I love it. It feels like I'm watching it's a real family. Multicam used to be more stage like, and it's gotten back then was better, Yes, yeah, I mean watch Cheers. Cheers was shot on film and it's beautiful and it feels like it feels like a filmed play and you get to watch actors use their body their hands. Nowadays, multy cam ye, but nowadays MALTI a beautiful set when some of them. But nowadays multi cam is emulating single cameras so often, and that we've we've we've come to expect. I think too much of it or certain, And I don't think audiences care. I don't think to care. I think executive scared exactly. I don't think kids are like I didn't think that was funny because I could only see one of their eye most In fact, they I think being able to see actors a little distanced and a little it is. Actually it's it's more involving the fourth wall on so many shows that people are talking right to the camera, like literally directly to the camera that now just seeing half of their face doesn't do it anymore, and it's like come on, So yeah, very strange. Yeah, I noticed that, especially in that scene. I was like, man to be able to play with the whole set. Yeah, that's that back space was not wasted. We're on a sitcom set now, would be like, well, we can't do is that? That's an interesting question, Rusty. Was there a set that you preferred shooting in over another set, because I remember, like the living room set when we would shoot there, it seemed like we had a lot more to play with than they when they would throw us in, say the bedroom set. So was there a set where it was like, yeah, this is there's this is more freeing to me to think if I liked anything, I like the outside, the backyard. Yeah, like that. What else you have to take? You account that a lot of people are saying, well, you're not gonna see this when you're watching it on your phone. Right. The screens are in one sense bigger, right, and then on the other sense they're smaller. You know, people looking on their gigantic screen at home from Costco, and then they're also looking at the phone on the subway. I never understood people that had big screens. We'll talk about Okay, So Corey is alone. His friends have left, they've gone to the water war. He's Corey still has more coats to do on the fence. Uh. Alan comes back from work. He's had a long day. Your tie is undone, that's how we know you've had a long day. And uh Phoene comes out and says that when he was a kid, he was worked from sun up to sundown and that's the way Alan should be handling things with Corey. And he goes inside. This was an interesting dynamic. Yeah, the difference between Phoenie as authority and Dada's authority. I really appreciate yea because I I in my mind it was like Phoenie's never wrong. But here's episode one, basically episode two, like the show went, I Phenie wasn't exactly right, Like that's cool, Like he he gave advice that was not horrible advice, but like here here Alan's going to take in a different direction. I really appreciated that. Yeah, adults who disagree politely different totally and you and you're you just your your heart just goes right to Rusty. And I like the I like the idea that, like the subtext for Rusty is really like you get him all day at school. He's on my side of the fence now and I get and I'm going to handle it my way, which was, you know, pick Corey up from laying on the floor and telling him that he should stay eleven years old for as long as he possibly can. And he didn't want him to be like Phenie didn't want to work him. Son up to sundown, go play, and you send him off to go to the water war and you take over painting the fence for Corey. And if we're totally honest after watching the episode, there's barely any left to paint and multiple clote they have to do. I mean, it's it's like, there's fifteen minutes worth of work. Hey, dude, have you spent a day managing a grocery? You know, yes, I know, but I mean it's you know I'm saying for for Corey, It's like, there's you've got fifteen minutes worth of work left there. Twenty minutes. Oh my god, dude. I mean having a seven year old and I know it's not going to be any better when I'm like asking him to pick up his shoes as a twenty minute battle. So, you know, like getting a kid to paint a fense at eleven. It was also talk about why not just put a thing behind the thing and use the actual paint sprayer before he had a sprayer of the first time. Now all of a sudden he decides to go go with one brush. Come on, this is a terrible show. Let's be honest. They have to put the tarp between it and the roses. And as you saw, based on how Mr Fini's protected, he wouldn't. He wouldn't let that happen, so they wouldn't. That's the real reason why they couldn't. Back then, he had to do it by hand. Look at look at Rusty Allen's got the tie on day. How we know he's had a long day. Days over just amazing. Welling about the dynamic between Phoenie and Alan. Also is that Phoenie has no children. Yeah, he's not a parent. You're right, he's a teacher. Yeah, And there's always the thing to the writer's credit, there's this certain kind of app but what it really comes to children. Yeah, that's where Alan comes in. That's interesting, that's really interesting. Has two sort of sources of authority that are he's very different, different He's taught kids his whole life, but he's never raised And there is nothing like raising a child. There's there's there you could you could couldn't explain it to somebody, sure if you tried. And so there is the things the way the parent I was before I had children is a totally different parent than I was after I had children, because I was in my mind I was a well when I have children, and well, well if I was that child's parents and now are yeah, you do. And you see talk about you know, finding out your laws and and them just being a mirror to the things you still have left to work on. It is it is one of those things. So yeah, they're definitely phoene pick such a good call. And being a good parent is so different than being a good teacher. You can be great at one and awful at the other, and being a parent of one child it's a lot different than being a parent of a lot of ways better. Yeah, otherwise, quadrupled to work. I'm going to have five of my own way any time? Will anytime? No, thank you? Yes, this is where spill on Aisle seven. That was seven. I don't know I thought I wrote down, but I do remember. This was one of those lines we used to say all at the time. Yeah, it was. It was, and it was just like Eric's like I had to box things today. It was half a half a ship shift. Yeah it was. It was crazy that this we haven't We hadn't really found the Eric Matthew's character yet. So none of them, myself, the writers, we didn't. Yeah, exactly exactly insert teen well teen at work here, you know, teen lying on bed tired kind of thing. Also, if you think about it, like teen has been at school, team teen is still I guess maybe it's summer were you're not in school? Do they really well know? It must have been because yeah, so you had gone to school. You had also you were also working. I'm assuming the water war was a weekend, but still like working half a shift when you're fifteen or sixteen years it is kind of from your perspective, you do feel like, I'm exast. Nobody's ever worked this hard, and there man, my feet are killing me. But it was also that was at this point other than a line here there Eric was the bedroom. Yes, I mean that was it. It was like my room. Yes, that's it. That was the blocking. It was like I didn't like that sunthing. I like that sty It was an uncomfortable set. It was an uncomfortable set. It was also logistically, and I know this sounds ridiculous, it was all the way down at the end of the stage. It was not in front of the audience. It was and there's two beds. It was. And it wasn't until later that we actually started to utilize the entire set, like using the bathroom, like entering and exiting out of the bathroom, rolling in and out of the window, using the entire the entire set um. It was usually just that was like, okay, Eric, put Eric in the bedroom. Eric, bedroom set so it was, and then I'd come down and have one line like, oh, that's right, you play my dad, and then I'd walk out and that way, and then they'd have a scene. So it was everybody's still finding themselves. Still the world's fun. We get another through the window shot. Well, in the last episode it was from the treehouse to Phoene's, but now we get from the bedroom window down into the backyard where we see Alan is still painting its sundown. The water wars over and he's still painting Superdad. And that conversation that I didn't even write down because I didn't think it was important to the episode from the cold open about what kind of super which, which superhero would you want your dad to be? Comes back? Just killed me too. I actually teered. Yeah, I teered up too. They didn't dropped, Okay, so we should keep track. Yeah, I'm sure did not fall. My eyes curled up, and I found myself kind of embarrassed, and I didn't know if I wanted Indie to see. But yeah, so that didn't drop down the cheek yet. I'm just sure that will happen. But let's we'll keep trash. I thought I was just like the biggest. I'm welling up thinking about it now. One well up. We got one well up, one up, one one well up. No, no tear drop, but one well up. If you're keeping keeping tally out there, we're gonna get to ugly cry by season seven, Yeah, exactly. The episode was just so sweet honey coming in and but yeah, it was just so it was just so touching. Again talking about the blocking, I think that's just I love that we utilized the different you know, from the window into the backyard, from the treehouse into Phoene's yard. Uh, that was early and that was good. Well, I know, I think it was better. We'll have to see. We could be wrong. We could be like, oh my gother in every episode, how do we not remember this? And then we get into the last scene of the show, which is just again another time. The welling up continued for me into this scene where you get to see little twelve year old Corey be so thoughtful. He has turned in his big water gun that he wanted so badly. He has turned it in for two smaller water guns because he saw earlier in the episode that his dad thought the water gun was cool and he wants them to play together with it, and he's got it under he's got it under the table. And I loved Rusty your performance, especially in this scene because I was thinking it was going to be a very oh wow water gun and now they're just for it. In my head as a mom, who is um you know hey, now now that's definitely the kind of parent I am. I that was your reaction. You didn't find out right away that there was a water gun and and think, oh, sure, this is all fun. Look look for TV. We're just gonna have a water fight. No house, You're like, no, we don't do this here, and Corey has he has to really make an argument about yeah, and visiting childhood again, that idea that you don't ever get to go back to it to live, but you can come and visit it over. You can visit childhood again. Um, what do you remember about this water fight scene? Was it? Did you guys practice during rehearsal? Did you did you actually do it for run through? Use real water guns? Think we used real guns during I don't think water wasn't like a big technical thing, right, I mean you have four cameras, they're going to see everything you're doing. Yeah, No, I think it was we're excited about. I mean, to me, that's the fun. Yeah, you know, let's do the unthinkable or maybe the different, you know, and I'm let's just do it. And a lot of times stuff like that behavior comes out of the actual you know, you're actually doing it, shooting getting wet um. That was always a fun for me, and the show was actually doing half the stuff we did. Yeah, you know, the actual doing of it. So I'm always ready to do that as long as wardrobes ready. Yeah they are ready. Yeah, it was fun. I I just I love the scene and then I love the joke too that he's like, well, mom, why don't you look under your scene? And she's like there's nothing there. He goes, what do you think I made of money? Money? Yeah, that's cracked me up. You should have mentioned from the scene before I wrote it down. I think they tried to make it a thing. Ben always going you do that, tried to be that's right. He did that for like one or two episodes, and I think I went, you're not going to be wait what he says that back back with the in the bedroom with you, right? Is it in the bedroom somewhere? Yes? Yeah, it's um, I do remember they were always trying to like find catch phrases. There was there's a couple of times in the next few episodes where he puts his hands on his shoulder or splits his hands on his hips and says, I'm such they tried to make you do a thing you do I do, like, remember you think you think that we were one of the first people to do you think? And then they're like, no, we tried catchphrases, and then the yeah what you knew? That was another one, and then the catchphrases that actually lasted. We didn't even know where catchphrases, which is the way it works, which is how it was. But yeah, it's interesting, Like in retrospect, I would never just show shows Michael Jacob's experience that like if we can get a catchphrase, would be good because it gives you a touch stand before branding exactly. Yeah, okay, So then it turns into a whole family water fight and the hose comes back. It was it wasn't it was weak water. But since Alan fixed exactly and full circle, the parents relax and we let the water fights start in the house and then it runs out into the backyard, and uh, we have a tag. I love a good tag. This was a greatfect. She was really really good in this tag. I thought she is absolutely adorable, the way she crosses her legs. She has the phone, so thanks to Indie from our segment to the phone. Did she get the phone? Good question? Unless it's on the counter. I don't think it's on the counter. How did she get on the counter? Did we see somebody put her on the counter. And somebody puts her on the counter and then they run outside, and so she's stuck there. That's why she calls one, right, right, But Indie was right, how did she get the phone? Yeah? How did she get the phone? And it was in her pocket already? Yeah, yeah, that huge, enormous phone, the giant Yeah, and then she got the neighbor. Was just hysterical, I thought, yeah, this was Indie was dying during this saying she was great, She was great. Yeah, they just shot the neighbor is a classic one. That and the you deserve every inch of that c plus I gave you in math or two of my two of my favorite lines from from that episode. Well, Rusty, you're a gem. Thank you for joining us. You have any final thoughts. Do you have any final thoughts on the episode or just about the experience in general. I'm eternally grateful to work with you guys and the writers and being a part of it. It's been as thrilling and as wonderful and experience as I couldn't not possibly imagine I was going to say when it started. I mean, you were like, oh, what is the sitcom? Thanks all. I always say, you know, you never know. You have to try things Dorby sometimes, but that that line is still resonating with me. From the last episode. Russy said you can bang your head all day long against door ay, and if Dorby opens and you don't go into it, then you're an idiot. And yeah, absolutely true. That it's stuck with me since he said it. You have to sometimes it's about taking Doorby. Sometimes it's about taking Doorby. And we all benefited from your Doorby that. Thank oh man, thank God, and my privilege, my privilege. Well you made it a lot easier on a lot of us young actors out there. Taught us how to. That's one of the things I've constantly told people is that you and Bill and Betsy Um really taught us how to help to teach us how to be professionals, help to teach us how to have still have fun. And it was it would often the lessons you were teaching as Alan often mirrored in the lessons that you taught us on the set. So I love you and I'm just so glad that you were there for all of this. Bill. Bill is our next podcast guest. He is going to be joining us for episode number one oh three, Father Knows Less Us it sounds like another Yeah, So Bill and Bonnie will be joining us for episode one oh three Father Knows Less. Also a special thank you to Kyle from Typhoon, who is responsible for our wonderful Pod meets World theme song. Yeah. Kyle Morton of the band Typhoon, who I've been friends with for ten years at this point. He played at your wedding where I met him. It's a long story, but yeah, he's incredible. He's a musical genius and directed a music video. I directed a music video for them last year, very insane, and his writing is just next level both lyrically insane, but I also musically he's incredible and has written stuff for me before, and I was like, Hey, could you possibly come up with something for our podcast, and he did it in like two days. When we started talking about what we wanted for a theme, song writer immediately had a great just a bunch of ideas and he was like, I think we could do this and it could be kind of weird and reminiscent in Nostalgic and Dalla La. He was like, I'm I'm gonna see if Kyle wants to do it, and then uh, he turned that around for us in less than twenty four hours. It was also like right, or what that's a very jumblie What could you possibly could all those things? How would somebody put that in a song? And then and then like two days there was like, oh, that's exactly what. Right. It's funny because I played it for you know, a couple of people and I was like, what do you what does this make you think of? Like not telling them what the context what I said. Some of the answers I got were makes me think of the nineties, which I was like really, And then another person was like, it has this like early two thousand's sort of filtered sound, like something that is coming. I was like, that's it, that's what. Yeah. Because I Basically I told Kyle was like, could it sound like we're listening to the past coming into the present, like a theme song from the past coming into the present, and he really Thank you to Kyle Morton of Film for our theme song. Be sure to join us on Instagram Pod Meets World Show and also send us your emails, send us your questions, your thoughts, feedback on the show. What you want to hear more of, what you want to hear less of? All right, final, shut up. It's ad meets World Show at gmail dot com. And yeah, next week Bill Daniels episode number one oh three, father knows less. We'll see you there. Um oh, I get to say this time, don't night It's your turn one more Thanks to Rusty, We love you all, pod dismissed. Pod Meets World is an I heeart podcast produced and hosted by Daniel Fisher, wilfredel and writer Strong Executive producers Jensen Carp and Amy Sugarman, Executive in charge of production, Danielle Romo, producer and editor, Tara Sudbach, producer The Rain Verruez engineer and Boy Meets World super fan Easton Allen. Our theme song is by Kyle Morton of Typhoon. Follow us on Instagram at Pod meets World Show, or email us at Pod Meets World Show at gmail dot com.