Sharna Burgess Meets Twirl'd

00:00:15
Speaker 1: Welcome to pod meets Twirled, the Dancing with the Stars recap hosted by two guys who can't dance, don't want to dance, and have now seen eight episodes of Dancing with the Stars. But since our best friend Danielle joined the cast for season thirty four, we're going all in. We are Wilfred, Ellen, Ryder Strong aka the two dudes standing next to Topanga aka daniel Fishal's backup aka the Daniyettes. How you doing well?

00:00:42
Speaker 2: I'm sad, Daniyet Ryder, how are you pretty? Said too, Yeah, I guess we'll get more into that on our official recap regular recap, But I'm it was a blue day. It was a melancholy day. He has very little pleas in my day to day, is what.

00:00:57
Speaker 1: I would say. Yeah, normally there's a lot of pleas.

00:01:02
Speaker 2: There's a jive, there's an occasional foxtrot, and today was a life without dance. It's like a life without color.

00:01:09
Speaker 1: Well, today we're gonna be interviewing Sharna Burgess. Sharna Burgess is an Australian ballroom dancer who is best known for being a pro on Dancing with the Stars. She is the winner of season twenty seven with her celebrity partner Bobby Bones. She has also been a judge on the Australian version of the show since twenty nineteen. She has been on fourteen seasons of Dancing with the Stars, but has only won once. Some of her previous partners included Nick Carter, Antonio Brown, and her now fiance who she met on the show, Brian Austin Green. Sharna has her own mini series on the Danielle with Feed Sharna Burgess in the Fourth Chair, where she breaks down every dance after each week's show. You can listen every Thursday at six am Pacific Standard time. Please welcome to Podmates Tworld. Sharna Burgess.

00:01:54
Speaker 2: Hi, Hi, you don't look like Yeah, it's not Brian Green.

00:02:00
Speaker 1: Your name says Brian Green. We expected Brian. I don't know what's going on here.

00:02:05
Speaker 3: It's currently fixing our Christmas tree.

00:02:07
Speaker 4: Nice.

00:02:08
Speaker 1: Well, we're so glad to have you. You are, for me, the first pro that I've spoken to.

00:02:15
Speaker 3: Yeah, Field, privileged, amazing.

00:02:18
Speaker 1: We began Dancing with the Stars journey having no clue what the show was, how it worked, and we still don't really know. We're just kind of figuring it out as we go along.

00:02:28
Speaker 3: So what do you feel you've learned waiting when do they.

00:02:33
Speaker 2: Hand out the roses? Yeah, okay, yeah, we've learned a lot. I mean one of the things I've learned is that the judging seems to be completely and totally arbitrary. That it's just week zero's in week one actually mean five. In week two it means six, in week three it means seven. So if you get an eight now it's like you might as well have gotten So, yeah, we're learning as we go.

00:03:03
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's sort of listen, you kind of get that every season. You know, there's no real rubric for it. It's the judges have their opinions. It is subjective to their opinion what they're watching on the night. As a judge and someone that does it in Australia, there have been times when I've judged and thought I've seen everything and the judge next to me will say something.

00:03:23
Speaker 3: I'm like, holy crap, how did I miss that?

00:03:25
Speaker 5: Because as a judge, you're trying to watch everything all at once, the technique, the footwork, did they miss anything up?

00:03:30
Speaker 3: But did they misshand connections?

00:03:32
Speaker 5: The styling, the personality, like all of it and sometimes your eyeballs can't be in all.

00:03:36
Speaker 3: The places at the one time, and so sometimes you just miss stuff. Man, it happens human error.

00:03:42
Speaker 2: Well, I mean you said you said you're human, which is obviously we all are. But as a judge, do you have your favorites? I mean, do you try not to be like, Wow, I love this person, I'm not going to judge them as harshly as I am this other person who.

00:03:55
Speaker 1: Maybe I just don't like, Like, say, if someone becomes your fiance to judge, I think that might.

00:04:02
Speaker 3: Be a conflict of interest.

00:04:03
Speaker 5: But you know, as a judge, look, we all start on even playing field right at the start of the season, so you're kind of removed from it. You've done your research on who's on the show, but unless you actually have a personal connection with them, everyone.

00:04:16
Speaker 3: Is the same.

00:04:17
Speaker 5: But then, yeah, you know, it's not that you get biased, but you start to get to know people, and then you start to understand their story or where they're coming from, and it's a lot harder to be so objective sometimes because you're like, oh, I know you're a car accident, or I see how hard you're working, or you're sick, this cleek you start to know the personal details that can sometimes work their way into how you feel, and you have to step back and go, Okay, it's not my job to judge on how I feel. That's the audience. That's why there is an audience vote. It is my job to purely judge the dancing. Now, that does mean performance and how it made me feel, because that's dance, but it very much also means the technical aspect of it and what we're looking at.

00:05:00
Speaker 3: But again, they're all human.

00:05:02
Speaker 5: You have to pull yourself back sometime and be Okay, I loved the story, but I can't give Andy a ten. I love Andy, but I can't give Andy a ten.

00:05:09
Speaker 3: You know, does all the.

00:05:11
Speaker 5: Flavor flavor felt every time?

00:05:17
Speaker 2: Every single time? Yeah? So, I mean how much interaction do the judges have with the contestants during the week or do they just see them at the show?

00:05:27
Speaker 5: Just see them at the show. Judges don't have an interaction. I like to as I've never experienced it here. You might sometimes catch them for thirty seconds at the end of the show, which I know we heard Elaine talk about how she feeled Derek in on her injuries because we just won't seeing those things in the packages unfortunately, but they don't have interaction when I judge in Australia, because I've known the pro dancers for such a long time, sometimes I'll come down at the end of the show and have a chat with them and say, you know, any questions you know, or like, hey, I really loved it, but I didn't get to dive into this because you know, that's what I try and do with the fourth chair, right is give more airtime to what they're saying because they have very limited time, so I think it would be nice for them to have a little interaction. But then maybe they're trying to keep that separation so they don't get biased, you know what I mean.

00:06:14
Speaker 3: You don't want to.

00:06:15
Speaker 5: Go in and start chatting with a couple about something or working with them on it, and then have to judge that at the end of the week because you might feel biased to the fact that they improved on it, you know. So I understand them feeling more removed from the actual contestants and create and having space.

00:06:30
Speaker 1: Well, so you started as a prow What season did you start on?

00:06:36
Speaker 5: Ah, it was twenty eleven. It was season thirteen.

00:06:42
Speaker 2: My god, this show has truly been on forever. It's been on forever.

00:06:46
Speaker 1: So I'm curious, how did you come into being a pro?

00:06:48
Speaker 4: Like?

00:06:49
Speaker 1: How was it? Did you know what you were getting into? What was how was the job pitched to you?

00:06:54
Speaker 3: Like?

00:06:54
Speaker 5: The show had been around for a while, and so I knew about it. And at the time, I was touring with a dance show called Burn the Floor, so I was I had already shifted from being a competitive ballroom dancer and found my love in theater and performance.

00:07:11
Speaker 3: And I loved this show.

00:07:13
Speaker 5: I absolutely loved what it was doing for ballroom dancing, and so when they offered it to me, I was still under contract for a year with Burn the Floor doing a tour through Europe. We were finishing Broadway and then I was contracted to go to the UK, to the West End, and so I finished that out and in twenty eleven I was able to join. I had no idea what I was getting myself into. I had not television. I got told to get social media accounts, which I didn't have, and at the time I think it was Twitter and Instagram, but like, it was a whole other ball game, and I, thankfully at the time had a couple seasons on the Troupe where I really got to learn the ropes of how to.

00:07:49
Speaker 3: Be a pro.

00:07:49
Speaker 5: I would be in there assisting and helping the pros then choreograph their routines and get to see how they work, or standing in when people were injured, and so I got to learn the ropes a little bit before I had my very first season, and my very first season was Andy Dick and I did not know what I was in for.

00:08:06
Speaker 2: That was like that I did a show with Andy. You never know what you're in for. That was a wild ride and it absolutely is.

00:08:13
Speaker 5: It was, and it was also beautiful at the same time because he's an addictive personality.

00:08:17
Speaker 3: He'd switched out substance for.

00:08:19
Speaker 5: Dance, so he was all in, obsessively all in, and I had his full attention at all times, and he gave it everything. I had a beautiful experience with him, chaotic but beautiful. But I think I also learned a lot at the time too of how to be a pro, what it takes.

00:08:34
Speaker 3: I had that.

00:08:35
Speaker 5: Ground the groundwork with being on the Troope, and then when I started as a pro, I made it my absolute business to watch the best of the best on the floor, and at the time that was really Mark and Derek that were doing some of my favorite things I'd ever seen, and I made sure that I studied them and learned everything that they did and so to try and be the best pro that I could.

00:08:55
Speaker 2: Was there a reputation in the dance community. I mean, was it like did you have dancers come up to you being you're going to do dancing with the stars? Or is it like, oh my god, you get to do dancing with the stars. I mean, how is it thought about?

00:09:06
Speaker 3: So both ways?

00:09:08
Speaker 5: To be honest, there are the purists, the competitive purists that are like, ugh, dancing with the stars, you know, because it's not pure ballroom dancing, and the technique will never be as spectacular as it is on a ballroom dancing glory.

00:09:20
Speaker 3: It cannot be, you know.

00:09:21
Speaker 5: We dedicate our entire lives to just a simple rumble walk, which is how to walk Like there's no possible way we can do that in ten weeks with the person. So yeah, there's two ways of thinking. There are those that say that they don't like it andugh, but I honestly think that's driven by a lot of jealousy because it's the best dance job in the world that you can possibly have, highest paying, greatest everything that comes with it in a platform. And then there are those that are just hungry to be on it, which is you know, I think you see a lot of that now, and it's now not just ballroom dances that are hungry to be on it.

00:09:54
Speaker 3: It is dances across the board of every.

00:09:57
Speaker 5: Single style that are now getting in there and learning much like what we see our troop dances are now they're like hybrids of everything. They can tumble and flip like a gymnast, and do a rumble walk like a ballroom dancer, and everything in between.

00:10:10
Speaker 3: That's spectacular.

00:10:11
Speaker 5: I am a ballroom purist and then I got into contemporary jazz later. But this new generation everyone wants to be on Dancing with the Stars, so everyone is doing ballroom dancing in their training.

00:10:22
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, I mean reality TV writer and I are very new to reality TV, but it obviously if you know, if it's a show where you take a bunch of and you throw them in a room and you play them with alcohol and you film it, that's one kind of reality show. But really reality has done at so much for dance with so you think you can dance and dancing with the stars. It really has kind of helped to shape an entire new generation of dancers, hasn't it. Oh well, yes, and why.

00:10:52
Speaker 5: I remember when I was a kid, my thing was ballroom dancing, but I didn't tell people that because ballroom dancing was what your grandparents did, Like it was not the cool style to do. You wanted to do hip hop, maybe ballet, you know, But I was like, oh, I'm a dancer.

00:11:06
Speaker 3: I just wouldn't be specific about it. But now it's the cool thing to do.

00:11:10
Speaker 5: Dancing with the stars or strictly come dancing the mothership of it in England. Worldwide, it has put dancing now opening the door for all other forms of dance now, so you're thinking you dance and other shows to be in people's living rooms, to find fitness through it, to find mental health help through it.

00:11:27
Speaker 3: Like it's really help people understand how amazing this can be. That it's cathartic. You don't have to compete, you don't even have to be good, but.

00:11:35
Speaker 5: It is something that everyone can enjoy and everyone can give a fair crack.

00:11:40
Speaker 3: And I think that's what's so amazing about dancing. With the Stars and that's why people love.

00:11:43
Speaker 5: Watching it for twenty years because not only do we have the people that come on with dance talent, and this season is very, very stacked, but look at how well Andy's doing. He is the one that people relate to. He's the one that people see themselves in though I could never possibly try it, but he's doing it.

00:12:01
Speaker 3: You know.

00:12:01
Speaker 5: That speaks to everyone sitting at home that has whatever insecurity about trying something new. It is this, but this Dancing with the Star's concept is magical in itself and I don't think they've ever recreated it in any other reality TV platform. Maybe singing, but you're taking people that can actually sing right, you know, but this is every day people. Okay, they're celebrities, but they're not dancers. They're stepping outside their comfort zone in front of America. And it's that's why it's lasted so long, because there is a magic in that vulnerability.

00:12:32
Speaker 2: It.

00:12:33
Speaker 1: Being a pro in this context seems like the hardest and most thankless job because you you you have to put so much work into it, clearly creative work, physical work. But then even if you do incredibly well, the star takes all the Thumber like they get awesome and the other person sending it right. But then on the other side too, I'm also curious about there must be times when you get in there and you have ideas and the person just can't do it, They just can't rise to there, and then you have to adjust and sort of lower your own standards or what you expected to be able to do that that week. So do you have, maybe without naming names, like, have you ever had an experience where you literally just had to completely throw out what you would plan to do because somebody wasn't capable of rising to what you wanted.

00:13:24
Speaker 2: Name names, name names, name names.

00:13:27
Speaker 3: Honestly most seasons.

00:13:29
Speaker 5: So because that's the process, right you you prep we have three weeks in the beginning of the season to try everything out on our celebrity to see what's good now what I used to do as a pro is within that time, I'm trying to find out what their strengths and weaknesses are.

00:13:44
Speaker 3: How do they learn? Are they visual?

00:13:46
Speaker 5: Do they need to hear me say it right down to do I look in their eyeballs when I say it? Or do we need an activity when I'm doing it? Everybody listens differently. You are studying human behavior.

00:13:56
Speaker 3: On how to be a coach.

00:13:58
Speaker 5: Now, what that comes with is putting your checking your ego at the door and knowing it has absolutely nothing to do with your amazing ideas or how cool your choreography is or how awesome your ideas were this week. It had everything to do with the human being standing in front of you and that you are trying to get them, teach them how to dance and how to last in this competition.

00:14:18
Speaker 3: That is both the.

00:14:19
Speaker 5: Physical aspect, the emotional aspect, the connection with the audience.

00:14:23
Speaker 3: It is everything.

00:14:24
Speaker 5: So if you go into it selfish about your creative ideas, you're never going to go anywhere as a pro because A your celebs won't enjoy it.

00:14:32
Speaker 3: B you'll only be good with people that.

00:14:33
Speaker 5: Are actually talented and see people won't connect with you because you're solely going to be selfish about your own ideas. It is the most selfless job because it has to be about the person that's in front of you. Every person I taught, I was a different coach when I had football players.

00:14:48
Speaker 3: I was a football coach. I was a drill sergeant.

00:14:50
Speaker 5: I had absolutely no mercy when I had actors or an Andy Dick. I was much more sympathetic, much more empathetic, much more understanding.

00:14:58
Speaker 2: Right, those your actors are like that that we need to be held with kid gloves. It's so true, Like we're a little biggest babies.

00:15:04
Speaker 3: Lie so well, you're doing so well.

00:15:07
Speaker 1: I have such a big ego, but it's so weak.

00:15:13
Speaker 2: Oh, that's absolutely true. Now. One of the things that we've been told because again and we've done this specifically, we have not gone back and watched any of the old Dancing with the Stars, this is we have done eight episodes of Dancing with the Stars and eight episodes of Dancing with the Stars. Only we have been told that the show has evolved quite a bit. So what my my other co host of another podcast I do is Sabrina Bryan, who was on The Cheetah Girls, who was on the show. She's one of my favorite people in the world. But she has told me, without being specific, that the show has evolved even from when she was on it. So we know that. But my question is, we do a segment on our show called Will's History of Dance, where I have an encyclopedic knowledge of everything dance. I am not googling it at all. It's not on Wikipedia, it's all up here. But it's seems like every dance was kind of created anywhere from the eighteen forties to the nineteen twenties. So while the show has evolved, have the dances evolved. I mean, if we watch a Viennese waltz from season one and it's really great, is that going to look the same as it does from this season?

00:16:19
Speaker 3: Completely different? Completely different.

00:16:22
Speaker 5: Everything has absolutely evolved, just like it's evolved in the competition world too. By the way, you know, those peurists that are doing ballroom dancing, a lot of them have ballet training, a lot of the content doing. Yes, they stick to the syllabus that you need to in the competition world, but they're adding flourishers left, right and center. If you watch Dancing with the Stars twenty years ago, you were seeing straight up ballroom dancing. We did not have jazz, we did not have contemporary, we didn't have any of those things. It was the ten ballroom dancers, chuch our, samba, rumba, passaba, jive, waltz, fox trot, quick step, vinie, waltzon, tango. Now we've added an Argentine tango, Lindy hop, jazz, contemporary, and not only that, were we're also incorporating those different flavors within the dance.

00:17:03
Speaker 3: Like Mark Ballas's choreography.

00:17:06
Speaker 5: While true to the style that he is doing, he puts a different flare on it every single time. You would never have seen that, even probably maybe you did see it with Mark back in Sabrina's time, who was his partner, but you definitely saw.

00:17:19
Speaker 3: A much more traditional version of it.

00:17:21
Speaker 5: Everything has to evolve because people, First of all, everything just naturally does.

00:17:26
Speaker 3: It's the way of the world.

00:17:26
Speaker 5: But people are going to get bored if it's the same thing all the time. So the show felt it needed to evolve. Then we had so thinking and dance come into the picture and we're like, oh man, everyone's doing contemporary and jazz and hip hop.

00:17:38
Speaker 3: But we tried hip hop one time. Not so great.

00:17:40
Speaker 5: We shall not you, no, no, it didn't really work out well for us on the few times we did hip hop.

00:17:45
Speaker 2: Oh God, please tell me that was Andy Dick's season that.

00:17:49
Speaker 3: We did jazz though.

00:17:50
Speaker 5: And if you do watch one, we did a Queen of Hearts and the Mad had a jazz routine and it was so twisted and fun. It was amazing, but yes, to answer your question, it would not look the same. And another layer on that is since we lost our amazing Len Goodman, who was really the traditionalist, who was really the stickler.

00:18:09
Speaker 3: For the rules, we've sort of lost the rules a little bit too.

00:18:12
Speaker 5: And some of the discrepancies that you're seeing even this season is that people.

00:18:16
Speaker 3: Are like, well, who's supposed to break hold? And when are you supposed to break and why are you're not?

00:18:21
Speaker 5: The rules are blurry now because things are evolving, and I think we haven't found what that really means yet, Like what are our new sets of rules? Let's all know them and all have them, like carry Ann will forever not want lifts, right, That's always been her thing. But unless it's a jazz or a contemporary, right, But in the specific dance, it's no lifts.

00:18:40
Speaker 3: And Len was the one that always said.

00:18:42
Speaker 5: You're not supposed to break hold in tango. You know, you're not supposed to break hold in quickstep, and he would take a point off for it. But now we have some judges doing it and some judges not, or some weeks a couple gets called out and other weeks a couple doesn't, and that's making people be like, well, what.

00:18:56
Speaker 3: The heck is going on? What are the rules? And this seems unfair.

00:19:00
Speaker 1: That's mostly how I feel. But yeah, but you know, but that's just because I came in as a complete newbie. So when I'm watching it and I'm like, oh, I don't understand what they're judging, I kind of want right to like learn, and I've and I feel like the first five weeks I was kind of figuring it out. I was like, Oh, this is supposed to be that way, and now I've lost all track. I'm like, but wait a minute.

00:19:20
Speaker 3: Now you're like, yeah, so do you feel I mean, do you you?

00:19:22
Speaker 1: It sounds like you you kind of crave a little bit more structure too. Do you feel like it's evolved a little too far into the like wishy washy or whatever whatever goes category?

00:19:34
Speaker 5: I say that as now a judge, right, I say I want rules, But believe me, when I was a pro, I bended and broke.

00:19:41
Speaker 3: I bent and all of those rules like it was.

00:19:44
Speaker 5: I loved breaking them and taking risks because I always loved that style and that kind of energy, and I would value the crowd pleasing public vote over that one point that I was going to lose from the judge. It was strategic whether I thought we could take that risk or not, you know. And then I also didn't want to look like I was taking the piss out of the rules, so I would again choose when to take the risks or not. But as a judge, what makes it easier for me to judge and to be fair and to be consistent is rules. And it's only fair to consist to contestants that they have the same rules and they can then choose.

00:20:16
Speaker 3: To break them right.

00:20:18
Speaker 2: Well, that's one of the things that Cheryl mentioned when she was the guest judge, Cheryl Burke because this is the first time rider or night, because we talked about it on our show that we'd ever heard what you just said, breaking the hold, Yeah, and we were wondering does that mean ever because they started side by side, so are they already breaking the hold? Then if they're dancing side by side or is it the second you then touch each other, you're not allowed to then break away.

00:20:41
Speaker 5: The second basically, so if you have there are some dances that we've taken on the American Smooth Rules, which is where you can open hold and do all different sorts of frames. And then there are a couple dances, be it tango and quick step where we have the traditional international rules where one to take up frame you are in frame, so you can generally on Dancing with the stars, get away with it was around a fifteen to twenty second intro of some sort of flourished to get into it, and then you have yourself an ending of whatever five to ten seconds, however long it goes for. But once you are in frame, you are supposed to stay in frame, and that means both sides being.

00:21:20
Speaker 3: Connected, not letting go of one and doing a little twelve.

00:21:23
Speaker 5: That's like both sides being connected, and so we are not necessarily seeing that anymore.

00:21:29
Speaker 3: And so it's interesting. Maybe it's evolved, And I was.

00:21:32
Speaker 2: Just gonna say, is that evolution or is that breaking the rules?

00:21:35
Speaker 1: But yeah, evolution.

00:21:36
Speaker 2: Yeah, they don't know what the rules are going in I guess, I guess if the rules don't up. Bliss is again where I find the judging to be very arbitrary, where it's like if the rules don't apply to anybody, it's fine, But if the rules apply to some people and not to others that's not okay totally. So then I guess that's where it becomes a question of it's like, Okay, what are we doing here because this person did this, this person did that, one of them is an eight and one of them is a ten. How are we as people watching this show supposed to know what the hell just happened? And then it's what you said too, where it's like, then the judges and this is this is you know, a detriment to them where they're not really given any opportunity to explain themselves. So it's like you got twenty five seconds to say, I love you, you're great, here's an eight, and then you can't explain why you really gave that score, so you're kind of just thrown to the they're thrown to the wolves as well. Yeah, and we've been guilty of it as well. We called out Carrie in for what it seemed like was something we even said it's probably not personal. It seemed like it was because you get a snippet of something that happens and then you're on to the next So yeah, I mean, I guess that's how do you how do you then, with the evolution of the dance. How do you then formalize the rules so that they are followed by everyone? Is that even a possibility anymore?

00:22:55
Speaker 3: I think it's a.

00:22:56
Speaker 5: Good question, and maybe it's something that the show will look at and refresh, because I certainly think fans are calling for it. People and we have new viewers like yourselves that are like, wait a second.

00:23:05
Speaker 3: What does all this mean?

00:23:07
Speaker 5: But then we have the old school viewers that are like, well, these were the rules, but it's kind of a bit weird now, and I'm not so sure, but they have a bit more of an understanding of it. I think we just need to go back to clarify, you know, like where do we sit. Are we wiping the don't break hold thing? Because cool, but let's just put it across the board and be super clear. But I think what you're also seeing too is while this is evolving and changing and people are taking risks. Some people like there was one week it was Gleb and Ilaria and they broke hold and they did a quick step and you're not supposed to and that Derek said something about not enough in hold and whatnot.

00:23:41
Speaker 3: To be fair, he didn't say that you broke hold.

00:23:42
Speaker 5: He just said there wasn't enough of it, and then someone else did a dance where there was a lot of broken hold but didn't get pulled up.

00:23:48
Speaker 3: I think it was the way Gleb's dance was structured.

00:23:50
Speaker 5: It was so obvious that there was so little of the content in frame that it really stuck out so much that Derek felt called to talk on it. But the other one maybe a little bit more on went in and out. I think while it's blurry, it just it was a moment where it really stuck out for Derek and he's like, oh wait, that doesn't feel like enough in hold.

00:24:09
Speaker 3: I didn't get what I needed. But again, it doesn't make it right. It's still blurry. It's not clear for everyone, and.

00:24:14
Speaker 5: I would love moving forward for them to like hash it out a little, like, what are our new rules?

00:24:19
Speaker 3: Cool, let's have new rules.

00:24:20
Speaker 5: Let's let it evolve, but let's have new rules so we know what it is for everybody. Or throw them all out the window, say no rules and just go for how much you love it and was there technique in it?

00:24:30
Speaker 4: You know? Yeah?

00:24:31
Speaker 2: See that's cool.

00:24:37
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00:24:45
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00:24:53
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00:25:21
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00:25:27
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00:25:42
Speaker 1: You mentioned uh having a strategy, which seems like so essential to this. You know, it's something that when we our first answer with the Stars, we were actually there for the first episode of the season and got to see it live and you know, Robert Irwin came out and just like blew the house out and brushed it. Afterwards, we started talking to people and they were like, well, strategy wise, you might have might have come out too hot, you know, And we were like, what what is That's a thing? So do you have like an overall when you like, in general, do you go into a season being like, we gotta we gotta show that we can do traditional dances for the first couple of weeks and then break the Do you have like an overall strategy or is it just based on who you're dancing.

00:26:20
Speaker 5: With, Based on who you're dancing with, knowing their strengths and weaknesses, planning out which dances you want to save because they'll be better at them and you want to save them for later down the line.

00:26:30
Speaker 3: That's definitely in the strategy. Back in my back in my day. Wow, when I was competing, that felt weird to say.

00:26:40
Speaker 2: It wasn't even contemporary at the time. Yeah, yeah, there was none.

00:26:43
Speaker 1: We never did it.

00:26:44
Speaker 5: We did I was in that time, but we would have we would be able to really tailor their journeys a little bit more. Sometimes with all the theme weeks, you're not so sure, how to like I think plan that out, but we would have most memorable year and you know, like dedication, So you would want to get to know your celebrity, know those stories and know how to bring those things out just to give the audience a little bit more every week that they wanted to come back for, right, And so there's a strategy. But yes, it's different for everyone, but in those persons, that person's response to Robert, I don't know, man, his natural arc that he's now had because he came out so strong and everyone was like, holy, he's so good, and then he had a moment where it fell right and it lulled and everyone's like, oh no, But remember he's not really a dancer. He's never done this before. He wrestles crocodiles for a living. And now he's blowing it out of the water again. Like that arc and that momentum that Kerry and just commented on is actually phenomenal to shoot him all the way to the mirror ball, especially because like Joey won last season, right, and it was the same similar thing with him.

00:27:51
Speaker 3: He's not a dancer.

00:27:52
Speaker 5: He's good enough that he can fool you that he's a dancer, but he has enough awkwardness and imperfection to remind you that he's not that every week. He's this from the ground up, unlike someone who's a Whitney, which people tend to have lots of thoughts and opinions on the.

00:28:05
Speaker 3: Fact that she is a trying to dance.

00:28:07
Speaker 2: She's a professional. It's two professionals that are dancing together.

00:28:11
Speaker 3: Sure, but it doesn't mean she's gonna win.

00:28:13
Speaker 2: No, But I think that's it that's gonna end up being a detriment frankly, because I think people that's why Andy's still there is because I look at her. I'm sure she's a lovely human being. I obviously have nothing against her personally, but I was show I don't neither do I. But at the same time, you know, I was watching with my parents, and I've seen two episodes with my parents, and both times my parents are like, so, wait, which one is the pro? Like they literally they don't they can't tell the difference. They don't know which one is the pro. And that's why I think shows like so you think he can dance and a stuff? Again, nobody wants to watch American Idol. Well, I take that back. People obviously like watching her and they're voting for her. But I'll say for myself, I don't want to watch American Idol and see the person who's getting there really far has already had a record contractact kind of does it beats the purpose of the show for me? Yeah, But this brings me to an interesting kind of series of questions about your celebrity that you get when you first find out who's coming on the show. Do you get a whole list of people that are coming on the show and you yet don't know who you're partnered with, and you're kind of like, Ooh, I wish I was this person, or I wish I was it, and then they hand you someone and you're like, or or is it kind of like you don't know the other people coming on the show and they just go, you're with Andy Dick this year, And then you go, because I know Andy, But it's a whole different thing.

00:29:38
Speaker 5: Ye different, It's different, right, No one gets a list, right, You don't get to say, we're all checking the media releases and seeing what's been leaked, just the same as anyone else. There were a few key moments where I was brought in and they said, Hey, this is who I have for you, and one of those was Andy Dick. For two reasons, it was my first season being promoted to PRO and also of a do you.

00:30:01
Speaker 3: Know who Andy is? Do you know his history?

00:30:03
Speaker 5: Like, we want to make sure you're okay going into this kind of a situation because who knows what my life has been like up to that point, right, So that sensitivity is really appreciated. But no, no PRO really gets the full disclosure. You walk into that room and you meet your celebrity for the first time, and me being Australian by the way, nine times out of ten, I was like, oh, no.

00:30:22
Speaker 4: They are ye, no idea they are.

00:30:26
Speaker 3: The only one I knew.

00:30:27
Speaker 5: That I fangirled over was Nick Carter because I had no idea. They flew me back from Australia early. They would not tell me because they were so excited. And I went to this sound stage to meet my partner. I was like, what's going on here?

00:30:39
Speaker 3: I had no idea, no idea who it could be.

00:30:42
Speaker 5: And I see the cameras are on me and I see Nick Carter walking down the hallway and I was like, Oh, Nick Carter is here.

00:30:47
Speaker 3: That's so cool. I had no idea. He was walking directly towards me old and.

00:30:51
Speaker 5: The more he got to me, the more I blushed, the more I turned into the ten year old that had like his posters on.

00:30:56
Speaker 3: My bedroom walls. And I was like, I fanned. I've never fann.

00:31:00
Speaker 2: God.

00:31:00
Speaker 3: I was like my partner like I couldn't even get my words out.

00:31:04
Speaker 4: Wow.

00:31:05
Speaker 5: And then I told him about the posters that were on my bedroom wall. So that was really embarrassing. But like, you don't ever actually know who's going to be in the room, and unless there is a very specific reason, they've had to check in with you about it.

00:31:17
Speaker 2: And are you jealous of other pros and some of their celebrities? Are you looking over going like oh man, what I could have done with that guy?

00:31:28
Speaker 4: Sure?

00:31:28
Speaker 3: I mean, listen, let's be real.

00:31:30
Speaker 5: We're all competitors, we all love each other, we're absolutely family, but everyone wants to win. We literally came from a competitive life that we dedicated ourselves to. I was going to be a world champion.

00:31:40
Speaker 3: That was my dream.

00:31:41
Speaker 5: I left Australia at eighteen years old to move to London to be a world champion. I am a competitor by nature, so it's impossible for me to get into a season and not be like, Damn, I wish I had that guy.

00:31:53
Speaker 3: That would be fun.

00:31:54
Speaker 5: But I've also had some of my most unbelievable seasons with people that weren't the dancers, that weren't the ringers.

00:32:00
Speaker 3: You get to learn.

00:32:01
Speaker 5: After a time of being on the show, it's not actually about how good they are.

00:32:05
Speaker 3: You're going to be in a fake marriage.

00:32:06
Speaker 5: With this person for three months, so it's a simulated marriage. Basically, you're going to go through everything, ups and downs. You'll be each other's shoulder to cry on, therapist's best friend, everything, and you want a person that you can actually get through that with. And sometimes it's not about it being the greatest, but you can also go all the way to the end. Again example, Andy, I won with Bobby Bones. You know, I had a double amputee one time that I danced with and I walked in, But I didn't.

00:32:34
Speaker 3: Walk in going oh my god.

00:32:36
Speaker 5: No, I walked in so excited for the opportunity to give him dance because I understood the game at that point. I understood it wasn't about me, it was about that person. And Wow, what a gift that season was for me to be able to I remember him walking, he would walk more confidently and better on his prosthetic than he had ever and he'd been a double amputee for years, And that kind of stuff makes me emotional, like what dance can bring to a person. And so yeah, I think some people maybe still get those things because they really want to win. But I think I loved it for the journey and the storytelling. I was always a storyteller. That was always my favorite part of it. Anyway, So yeah, I guess, of course I'm a competitor, but if you understand the gig, then you don't really get those issues.

00:33:25
Speaker 1: And so you's the one with Bobby Bones. I know nothing about any of this, but I've been told that he was basically that he was basically the Andy Richter of his Yes season. So did you ever think you would win that year? Were there moments are like how did what was that process?

00:33:44
Speaker 5: Like?

00:33:45
Speaker 1: When did you realize like, oh, we got a shot?

00:33:47
Speaker 4: Dude?

00:33:48
Speaker 5: Never they carded us a mirrorble and I still didn't think we had a shot.

00:33:51
Speaker 3: I was like, what do you mean?

00:33:53
Speaker 2: Wow?

00:33:54
Speaker 5: We joked we were like we were going to get a mirror ble tattoo if we won, because we never thought I ended up having. I got the word mirrorble tatt because I was like, well he said it to all of his fan base. I you know, every week when we went through, we were shook that it was happening, and we were exhausted by the way. Because Bobby worked his butt off and he did all the overtime. It was also exhausting for both of us traveling Nashville to LA. He was putting in the hours and the work and he loved every single moment of it. But it was I honestly hadn't prepped the following week because I was like, this is the week we're gonna go home.

00:34:29
Speaker 3: It's been so nice, you know, we're friends for life. And then they were like safe, Bobby and Shana.

00:34:33
Speaker 5: I was like, what do you mean, I've got to do a passidopeay, Like it was just it was a thing we've gone to the finale.

00:34:41
Speaker 3: I had no freestyle prepared.

00:34:43
Speaker 5: I was like, I don't know, you haven't seen a freestyle yet. It is the big moment where the couple gets to do whatever they want.

00:34:50
Speaker 3: They throw a budget at it. You get to do all the things and I was like.

00:34:53
Speaker 5: I, and you're usually prepping that for weeks because you know you've got a shot.

00:34:57
Speaker 3: I had no things, guys. I don't have a song. I didn't have no idea what I was going to do.

00:35:02
Speaker 1: It probably made it better because you were just rolling with it and just in the moment.

00:35:06
Speaker 3: Oh, it ended up being for not he did three steps and the whole thing.

00:35:08
Speaker 5: But if you ever go back and watch it, Bobby Bones, we did the Greatest Showman.

00:35:12
Speaker 3: And it was a show piece.

00:35:13
Speaker 5: You know, I had him narrate the first part of it, like it was phenomenal. It was fun, but it was shocking. I never ever had a clue, and it was really the first time with someone like that one. You know, we'd had those people in the finals before even getting second.

00:35:28
Speaker 3: There was a baseball player David.

00:35:30
Speaker 5: Ross, who was wonderful and lovable, but and he got second and I think someone that could really dance one. It was the first win of its kind and it really ruffled a lot of feathers too.

00:35:41
Speaker 3: But the truth is, it's what the show is about.

00:35:44
Speaker 2: That's what I was going to ask is because I did not know who he was either. But obviously we've done a bit of research and it seemed like there was some ruffled feathers. So the question is, as the pro are you more proud of taking somebody like that to the finals or are you more proud of taking somebody who has some dance talent and going to the finals.

00:36:06
Speaker 3: That's a really interesting question. That's an angle I've never been asked, you know.

00:36:09
Speaker 5: I think the Bobby specific situation came with a lot of complicated stuff For me.

00:36:15
Speaker 3: I was incredibly proud at.

00:36:16
Speaker 5: The time, and then when I saw all the hate that I was getting and that we broke the show and there was a lot of stuff involved with that, that was a bit yucky to process for a while, but now incredibly proud. I just did we did our job, We did it to the absolute best of our ability, and we got there and we did what the show is about.

00:36:35
Speaker 3: So absolute.

00:36:37
Speaker 5: As much pride as I have in the Nick Carter season and that any other great season that I have, I created some amazing work with Bobby for what he was capable of, and super proud of it. But certainly there's nothing quite like when you have someone that can really do some stuff and you get to look back at that work and be like wow, because also in those seasons I get to dance even to my fullestability. With someone like Bobby, my technique is out the window.

00:37:04
Speaker 3: I am dance. I'm making sure he is getting what he needs.

00:37:07
Speaker 5: Don't look at me that. When I've got someone like a James Hinchcliff or a Nick Carter, I can dance my own off.

00:37:13
Speaker 3: So yeah, I can. I can go back and watch those performances.

00:37:16
Speaker 5: I did a fully blindfolded Argentine tango with one of my partners because and he was an indie car driver, a race car driver that just freakishly was amazing at dance. And he was one that learned by the way through the at the physics of dance because of his background in race cars.

00:37:34
Speaker 3: And driving and momentum.

00:37:35
Speaker 5: We would be talking about percentages of weight and centrifugal force and all sorts of things that he needs.

00:37:41
Speaker 3: Crazy right, wow, But anyway I can be.

00:37:44
Speaker 5: I look back at some of that work in that season and it's I think some of the stuff I'm the most proud of him and Nick Carter as far as creativity. But then I look at Bobby Bones, I'm like, I worked myself, so did he?

00:37:55
Speaker 3: We created some amazing stuff.

00:37:57
Speaker 2: Did you now One of the things we're seeing that with Emma, we notice that there's during the dance, she's essentially talking to Andy the whole time. Oh yeah, So is that.

00:38:06
Speaker 3: What it's like?

00:38:06
Speaker 2: I mean, are you literally like and don't forget move your feet and hands out this way? And is it I mean, are you kind of walking them through the dance as well?

00:38:15
Speaker 3: All of it?

00:38:16
Speaker 5: Yes, all of the above. Not everyone you have to do that with. But she is reciting.

00:38:20
Speaker 3: And so what you learn throughout your rehearsal of the week is you have your own dance language.

00:38:25
Speaker 5: You have little keywords that you've come up with that resonated with them.

00:38:28
Speaker 3: That makes sense.

00:38:29
Speaker 2: You know.

00:38:29
Speaker 5: One of my things in a frame was palm tree. It was a visual It was a thing that made sense to people in the shaping.

00:38:34
Speaker 3: They were supposed to make.

00:38:35
Speaker 5: You're counting them in five, six, seven, eight, you'll see a lot of the time. I think for some reason, it feels like it's more the female because the female pros that.

00:38:45
Speaker 3: Are doing it.

00:38:45
Speaker 5: The males are always in the dominant leading position, so they can physically the dance is built for them to physically put the girl where they're meant to be right unless they're doing a side by side section, But we are in the passive position, so sometimes it's hard to back and you are yelling these things to them and telling them.

00:39:02
Speaker 3: Left right or fine or halms out or whatever it is.

00:39:06
Speaker 5: Hell leads, you are like trying to a smile, trying to like say the things to them that they need to hear and remember.

00:39:15
Speaker 2: Well, that was another question that we had, was exactly what you were saying, because we both had different points of view, and both of them I think were right. Strangely enough, But do you believe it's harder to be a female pro because you have to teach the man how to lead? Or is it harder to be the male pro because you still get to have the dominant position? Which one's more difficult?

00:39:38
Speaker 5: I mean, I personally think it's harder being the female pro because of what we have to teach and teaching them to lead and teaching them to be a man. They are the ones that are lifting us, you know, they are the ones. There's a lot that goes into it. It's also the job that we have is harder for dancing with this specifically because room dancing is designed to show off the woman, right, so we have all the flourishes and the extra things and the it's not that we have more complicated footwork, but it's designed to show us off. So then as the female pro you have to work really hard for people to not say, oh, she was dancing around him, when sometimes that is just just naturally what the choreography is. Right, So we have to work really hard to make sure the choreography makes them shine and specifically put the feature on them in ways that you don't necessarily always do it in ballroom dancing because it's much more focused on watching the female.

00:40:33
Speaker 3: But it is hard.

00:40:33
Speaker 5: It's hard both ways. Look, and it really is a case by case basis.

00:40:38
Speaker 3: There are some.

00:40:40
Speaker 5: Types of female celebrities that have been really hard to teach. You know, it depends if they have it's all related to athleticism and body strength and core strength, determination, focus, they can they handle it.

00:40:52
Speaker 3: You know what I mean?

00:40:53
Speaker 5: Sometimes the men can handle the tough love a little bit more than the women can, so then the men have to sow from their style of teaching. We all have things that we have to deal with going in, whether it's for male or female celebrities, but I think in a physical sense of what we have to teach.

00:41:09
Speaker 3: And how to get the as much juice out of the squeeze? Is that the road saying I think the females is something juice out of the I don't know.

00:41:18
Speaker 2: Yeah, anyways, is the juice worth the squeeze?

00:41:21
Speaker 3: As I think I got the wrong analogy or the wrong sec It's perfect.

00:41:25
Speaker 2: It worked, It worked, you evolved the analogy like the dance itself evolved, so you all back around.

00:41:32
Speaker 3: It's now a thing.

00:41:34
Speaker 5: But if I had to pick, I would say the female pros have it harder. But I'm a female pro, so I'm sure any of the male pros would be like, what.

00:41:41
Speaker 4: A All right?

00:41:56
Speaker 1: So I'm sure you've talked about this a lot on your your own podcast, but I'm really curious if you have, if you can present some overall feelings about this season in comparison to seasons past, or what makes this season unique or interesting in your opinion.

00:42:11
Speaker 5: It's funny, I think every season is unique, you know, because you just simply have different personalities. We have a very stacked season, and it's not always this stacked, you know, very few times it's this stacked. Funnily enough, the season I won with Bobby, it was this stacked.

00:42:30
Speaker 2: It's one of the reasons why you won.

00:42:33
Speaker 5: I think that in a season full of stacked dancing, where maybe the votes for amazing dancing are split between and whatever is going on, Bobby was able to come in with the people that vote for the People's Champion and took the whole thing home because it was wild standing there with four other couples that could legitimately.

00:42:53
Speaker 3: Dance right, and then we won.

00:42:56
Speaker 5: And I think you're looking at something similar this season, where Andy is, as the judges have said, the heart of the show, the People's Champion, reminding people with this experience is about. While everyone else is fighting over who's got dance experience and the difference of a point between Alex and Whitney and who whatever. Those votes are now split, but there is that core chunk of people that love Dancing with the Stars for the experience and the person that is the underdog or whatever, and they're all voting for Andy. Especially now that we sadly lost Danielle. They are definitely all voting for Andy.

00:43:29
Speaker 2: So were there seasons where Danielle would have made the finals or maybe even one.

00:43:34
Speaker 3: She's wonderful and talented. She was doing such a great job.

00:43:38
Speaker 5: She was just caught up in the middle of a season where you have it Andy, which is also a rare personality and character and energy right the way he captivates that's rare.

00:43:48
Speaker 3: But then you have it stacked on.

00:43:50
Speaker 5: The front end with gymnasts and dances and all sorts of things, and she sadly was left in the middle, not because she's not talented, not because she wasn't captivating on the flare doing a great job, but there was just such extremes on either side of her, right, and it just made it really really hard for her to go all the way. But her Impasha did a phenomenal job, you know, and she is also what this experience is about, yeah, very much so, and watching her do that, and I love that she got to do her last contemporary that was an emotional piece for her and she felt how cathartic dance can be and she was talking about the things that it brought up for her. It's beautiful in that way, and Dancing with the Stars is about that too, So I love that she got to have that experience before she left.

00:44:34
Speaker 3: But it was really sad.

00:44:35
Speaker 5: It's gone so fast, you know where We've got three weeks to go.

00:44:40
Speaker 3: And so it feels too soon to leave her. But I get it.

00:44:43
Speaker 5: We've got three weeks and a stacked cast and it's going to go very fast.

00:44:47
Speaker 3: Yeah.

00:44:48
Speaker 2: Can I ask you a couple of quick, rapid fire questions. You can choose not to answer any of these questions, but you have to answer every single one. Okay, which pro has the biggest ego.

00:45:00
Speaker 3: The biggest ego all of us?

00:45:03
Speaker 2: All of us really, so it's not just instantly Val?

00:45:06
Speaker 5: No, actually no, So if you knew that Val is also incredibly humble. At the same time, if you've got any personal time with him, he definitely has that New Yorker like thing about him that is just all up there and you feel that it's one hundred per ego, but he's not. He's also he's got to get a lot of humility to himself as well.

00:45:29
Speaker 2: Okay, how much does the amazing amount of social media that has been surrounding this show lately affect the judging?

00:45:38
Speaker 5: Oh, the judging is very interesting and it's hard to answer that because this unbelievable amount of social media is very new in the last couple of years. I think everyone is adjusting. I think you can see Derek being affected by it and some of the things he's said relating to we need more positivity, like I know personally some of the dances that I've spoken to in just sharing some advice with them on how to like post and ghosts and don't look. I think it's affecting everyone across the board because it is vicious out there and unnecessarily so.

00:46:11
Speaker 3: And I never had really that in my time. It was Tumblr. I remember seeing blogs of people that hated me, but it.

00:46:18
Speaker 5: Wasn't like this and so, and I do believe they have someone that is on set to always be there for them for them to check in, like some aid. Whether that is a counselor I don't know what we call that person, but it is. There are resources there for people to reach.

00:46:33
Speaker 2: Out to, mental health professional, maybe something along yet.

00:46:36
Speaker 5: Because it is wild this season, and I imagine that it's affecting everybody.

00:46:41
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's interesting to hear the booze when like carry Anne was judging last night and I was like, what is it coming into the room in a way that it didn't before, Like.

00:46:50
Speaker 5: Well, yeah, what's interesting about that is not that booz are choreographed or or indicated to happen, but the hype, man is very much.

00:47:01
Speaker 3: Like if you love something, love it. If you hate it, do it. Because it's a live audience, we want sound, you know what I mean.

00:47:07
Speaker 5: We want movement where we want things, and so you need that in there.

00:47:11
Speaker 3: But it was never received.

00:47:12
Speaker 5: It almost used to be comical in a way, like Len used to get booed all the time. But now that booing is crossing over into social media and I think we're all getting a little bit more sensitive with.

00:47:22
Speaker 3: It now and like, how are you booing.

00:47:24
Speaker 5: When sometimes Carrie in was the only one on the panel at some point trying to say a critique and then she's getting booed, But then online.

00:47:30
Speaker 3: People are like, but the judges aren't saying anything and they're giving it a day, Like you can't have it both ways.

00:47:36
Speaker 6: Man.

00:47:36
Speaker 5: It's just getting really intense all around. But I think personally, I think we need the booze. It's just they've felt a little bit more intentional as than playful lately.

00:47:47
Speaker 2: It's just there's there's a mean aspect to but it's social media, so that's the way it is, well, it feels like there's a.

00:47:52
Speaker 1: History behind it, you know, like that That's the thing for me is I was like, I feel like they're responding to what happened last week because they've all whipped each other up into a frenzy. And I'm Charlene hasn't actually said anything yet and they're already booing her. I'm like, well, hold on, like, let's let's hear her out.

00:48:05
Speaker 2: She literally just says but the exactly, they're just like, at least say something.

00:48:13
Speaker 1: She's been so judgmental as a judge, I like a judge.

00:48:18
Speaker 2: Another quick question, is it true in Australia all the spins go in the opposite direction?

00:48:22
Speaker 3: Absolutely? Yes, yes, I'm great.

00:48:26
Speaker 2: And then for me, final quick fire, who's gonna win.

00:48:33
Speaker 3: My money right now? If I was a betting woman, would be on Robert?

00:48:37
Speaker 4: Really?

00:48:38
Speaker 2: Yeah, So you don't you don't think you think you think the people will take Andy so far and then they will at the end of the day still vote for somebody who can dance.

00:48:48
Speaker 5: So the the difference here is that Robert, there is just something about the Irwin family right and there is just something spectacular about that legacy.

00:48:57
Speaker 3: He is so lovable. It's and he's very good, and.

00:49:01
Speaker 5: The fact that he is like Steve all Day and in the Skyboxer and then he dances and he puts on this whole other persona.

00:49:08
Speaker 3: It's it's wild to watch and it's captivating.

00:49:11
Speaker 5: And I think the fact that he is not a dancer, that he's dancing.

00:49:14
Speaker 3: Very well, and all the other things around it. My money's on Robert. But I reckon we might say Andy in the final, well, he's gonna have to prepare themselves.

00:49:23
Speaker 2: I was gonna say, they're gonna have to do something. But you, I mean, you obviously live here now. But are you getting vibes from back in Australia what it's like watching him go this far on the show?

00:49:33
Speaker 3: Oh no, I yeah, I live here now, so oh no, I know.

00:49:35
Speaker 2: But I'm just wondering if you're hearing from back home like how amaze? Like oh my god, he's Australia's champion.

00:49:40
Speaker 5: Oh well, they don't actually get it in Australia. It doesn't air in Australia. Australia is the Australia one. Yeah.

00:49:48
Speaker 2: Oh man, So it's not like Love Island where there's thirty seven different versions you could watch. Oh okay, amazing, wow.

00:49:54
Speaker 5: Yeah, our Australian Dancing with the Stars is in like one hundred and something territories, and so Dancing with the Stars in Australia only as Dancing with the Stars of Australia, the UK only as the UK one. So but I do have people over there, of course that would try and like get their VPNs and what to watch it, especially when I was on it, and I would say that Australia is youtubing the heck out of it because of Robert and very very excited.

00:50:19
Speaker 3: He's on all the local news channels.

00:50:21
Speaker 5: They are all very very excited about Robert potentially winning it, just like his sister Bindi did. So yeah, they're tuning in, but it doesn't actually air over there.

00:50:29
Speaker 1: Crazy wow man. Well, Charna, thank you so much for answering all of our questions. Welcome showing us a little bit more about Dancing with the Stars. This is this has been quite a journey and even though Danielle's off, we're not finished yet. We're gonna keep We're gonna keep.

00:50:44
Speaker 3: Going, all right. I love that. We'll enjoy you guys, and maybe we'll do this again.

00:50:49
Speaker 5: Sometimes sez, thank you so much by everyone.

00:50:54
Speaker 2: Man, it's incredible. Yes, there's so much, so many questions we had she was able to answer. First of all, though I do have to say the accent both. She's from the Jersey total crap but knowledgeable, which is nice.

00:51:07
Speaker 1: Man. I would never want to be a pro. I would love to be a judge, Like I feel like being a judge is actually pretty fun. But the idea of like putting all of that effort creatively physically and then really just kind of being the unsung hero. No thanks, no thanks.

00:51:25
Speaker 2: It's not just that, but it's exactly what she said. She's right. They all come from such competitive backgrounds that, right, there are times they I'm sure, walk in and see their pro and are like ah man, But then I have to imagine they also know the show well enough to go like, Okay, the story's there, right, we could go far with this and they will progress as Dan. I mean, say what you want about Andy, and there's plenty of people saying plenty of things, but he has gotten better from the first week to now. Yeah, And if that's what the show is about, then he's what the show is about.

00:51:55
Speaker 1: I mean, it's I know, but like you said it best, I think a couple episodes ago where you were like, is it hair when you have people who are really you know, who are learning how to dance and doing something so much more than he is, frankly capable of getting eliminated, you know. And I felt it with Danielle last night.

00:52:11
Speaker 2: Yeah, he's he's still there and our best friend is gone and she's worked her off and I'm not saying he hasn't. No, it was a different level. It's just a different level. And it's one of those things where, yeah, it's such a weird thing, but it's it's almost the flip side of the popularity contests you grew up with in high school, where the football player who wasn't qualified in any way, shape or form to actually be president of the class was voting in president overwhelmingly to be president of the class. It feels a little bit like that.

00:52:45
Speaker 4: Well.

00:52:45
Speaker 1: I think Sharna put it best when she said that this season and like it sounds like the Bobby Bone season for her, was that it was too extreme in both directions, do you know what I mean? It's sort of like the show should be either or the show should either be anybody can learn to dance, Let's root for people based on their progress, or the show is a real dancing competition, let's, you know, vote them based on quality of actual dancing. And I think, unfortunately this season is sort of split between those two and people like Danielle who are really progressing and kind of be able to do both right, have a personal story, be somebody who never danced before. I mean, she's just losing out and that's.

00:53:24
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's too bad. Strangely enough, having only seen the eight episodes, I do think this show from a production standpoint needs a retool. It does it needs to What is this show right now? Is it a professional kind of dance thing where you're trying to find the next great professional dancer. Or is it let's take people who can't dance and teach them how to dance.

00:53:46
Speaker 1: You know what it would you know what it would take. I think that the answer is either a complete judge reset, like completely new panel of judges, or ask the judges episode one to explain their criterion.

00:53:59
Speaker 4: Do you know what I mean?

00:54:00
Speaker 1: Each of them said, here's what I'm judging on for this entire season, and I'm not going to change my opinion as we go, because just letting it be their personalities without them presenting like here's the things I think the show is, Here's what I'm going to be judging based on. We're just sort of like left to assume those things. But if they clearly stated this is my thesis statement coming in, I'm a judge who is going to care about X, then we could be like, okay, and they could be different, right, they could have different but as but right now we're just sort of left to be like and that's you know, on the show's producers. I think maybe to make that a little clearer from the outset of the season, like Derek is this type of judge, Carryon's coming with this, Bruno's going to be the fun you know, whatever it is. They just come with, like I'm going to be judging based on this, and you know, because like what was Flavor Flav doing?

00:54:44
Speaker 2: You know, like it's just because he was rock and roll Hall of Fame, but he had.

00:54:47
Speaker 1: But that's also that could be reflected in all the judges for a certain extent. You're just like, oh, okay, I guess we're just going to listen to this person, right, So it'd be nice to have a little clarity on that front.

00:54:57
Speaker 2: I think I think that's a great idea, even levels I don't if you, I mean, how do you say that it's but it's weird? Then you throw in somebody like Andy or I guess Bobby Bones, who again neither of us know anything about, but and he they throw a wrench into the system where when you say, but, come on, this person is a professional dancer basically, and they're like, yeah, but these people are winning or they're being voted through every week. So isn't that kind of showing what the show can do. It's such it's infuriating at times, it really is infuriating, And then you're right, I see Andy, who you like and who his story is great, and you're really I'm watching enjoying watching him, and he's lovable and likable. And my best friend who worked off, who was clearly the better dancer, is no longer there, and so it's kind of like, yeah, I don't know, it's it's infuriating, but we're here for the journey.

00:55:42
Speaker 1: All right. That's it for this episode of Pod Meets Twirled. Join us next episode as we continue watching season thirty four of Dancing with the Stars. We may not know a chat chaw from a chimney chonga, but we know what we learned way back in Poene's class. Daniel Fischel was the star of the show. Podmeats World is an iHeart podcast producer hosted by Danielle Fischel, Wilfridell and Ryder Strong executive producers Jensen Karp and Amy Sugarman Executive in charge of production, Danielle Romo, producer and editor, Tara Subasch producer, Mattie Moore engineer and Boy Meets World superman Easton Allen. Our theme song is by Kyle Morton of Typhoon. Follow us on Instagram at Podmets World Show or email us at Podmeats World Show at gmail dot com.