Episode 167: Controlling Pests using Boron Instead of Insecticide with Jay Watts

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Hi friends, this is John.

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Welcome to the Region of

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Agriculture podcast where we

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have all kinds of fun

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conversations. Today, I'm joined

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by Jay Watt, who is a friend of

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mine.

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I had the privilege of hosting

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him here at my home some time

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ago on

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a day where we also had lots of

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interesting conversations.

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Jay, thank you for being here.

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I've really been looking forward

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to this discussion.

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And, you know,

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we all have different

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perspectives,

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different experiences.

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And one of the things that I've

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always been intrigued by is the

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experiences and the perspectives

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of people who are actually

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producing and growing seed or

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producing and growing a

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diversity of different crops

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because there is something about

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growing a diversity of different

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crops or taking things to the

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kind of the ultimate level of

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quality that really sharpens

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your perspective and hones your

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senses.

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So thank you for being here.

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Tell us a bit about your context

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and your operation and the scope

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of the things that you're

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working with.

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Thank you.

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I'm actually a fourth generation

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farmer in the Imperial Valley,

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which is the southernmost point

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in California. We're a seed

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production

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family operation.

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I make

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two different kinds.

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My main thing is Bermuda seed

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that is sold. You see it in

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Lowe's, Home Depot.

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It's your

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filler grass for a lot of the

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lawn and garden companies.

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And then I also grow alfalfa

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seed

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that we use locally.

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I sell it to

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back to local farmers,

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and I also have a couple

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brokerages that I work with that

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sell it wholesale,

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but our seed's a little bit

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different because we have zero

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dormancy rating on our alfalfa

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seeds, so it only can go to

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more

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southern areas, more warm

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climates,

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and some of the other,

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they'll use them sometimes if

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you use it like a clover as just

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an annual in quarantine.

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but it won't survive the

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winters.

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Is there anything else going on

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besides the seed production?

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Yes.

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I do about seven acres of

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agave that I have been doing for

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three years.

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where that's gonna go, we'll see

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what the market does.

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As of right now, it's probably

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gonna be into a spirit,

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hopefully,

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but it's wide open for what it

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could be.

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There's inulin production, which

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is a prebiotic for a

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fiber,

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like fiber, your fiber pills and

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things like that.

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There's also a feed,

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like animal feed possibility in

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that.

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And then there's,

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Biofuel is one of the things

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that there's a big study out

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right now, whether it's going to

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be a viable crop for

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biodiesel or biofuel.

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And then my pet project right

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now is my wife and I are

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starting a small market garden

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to have a

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CSA that we can

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have locally shipped,

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or not shipped out locally, but

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that we can have delivered

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locally to all of our friends

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and neighbors to give them

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a healthier source of produce

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that is a little bit more

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diverse than just the lettuce,

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squash, things like that on the

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shelf at the grocery store.

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In the context of your seed

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production operation,

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what are some of the historical

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challenges that you've had to

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deal with in your growing

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environment, in your growing

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context?

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How is producing seed for those

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crops different than from

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producing a forage crop?

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Well, the water scheduling is a

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little bit more difficult.

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And when you're producing a

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forage crop, you're watering it

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every two weeks, and you want it

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to grow as much leaf matter and

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forage as possible.

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With seed production,

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we kind of want to, for lack of

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a better term, mistreat it so

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that it thinks it's going to

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die, and it wants to put off

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seed to help itself reproduce.

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So we will stress it a little

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bit.

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From past experience, I have

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learned that you can overstress

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a lot of the Bermuda and things

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like that to where it'll just,

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it makes blank seeds that are

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just,

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they're a husk with no

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seed inside.

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They

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will

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go through the

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cycle of producing seed three or

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four times throughout the

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growing season.

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So you'll have different flushes

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come through and you kind of

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have to time it because you're

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trying to maintain the

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the plant and keep it growing

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and you're also trying to

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help it

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be stressed out and

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want to produce seed.

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So we

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usually will

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change our water schedule as we

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go through the

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season. In the beginning when

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it's cooler we'll probably water

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every

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30 to 40 days.

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And then once it starts to warm

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up, we start to taper that back

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until we get to about 20 to 14

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days. There at the last one, our

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last two waters are probably 14

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days apart.

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When you, if you have multiple

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seed flushes or head flushes

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coming through in a year, are

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you on the, in the case of the

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Bermuda grass, are you

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harvesting seed multiple times

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per year or just one harvest per

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year?

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Just one harvest.

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Bermuda doesn't shatter like

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other seeds.

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It, uh,

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we do also do a winter harvest.

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seed that we've

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started doing rather than

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cutting for hay, because it's

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just more economically viable.

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The hay,

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you have to put a lot of inputs

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into it, and then you also have

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to cut it, and you

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don't have the capability to

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make as much.

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So

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it can sit there in the field,

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either windrowed or just upright

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before you cut it, and it will

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hold for,

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I mean, we've held it for two

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months.

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just sitting in the field before

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we could get a combine to it and

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the yield didn't change.

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So you have the benefit of being

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a fourth generation farmer and

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having

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observed lots of changes

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in the way farming is done and

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ecosystem management and so

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forth. What have been some of

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the

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challenges that you've observed

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over the last couple of decades

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and how is your farming

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operation evolving?

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Changing crops is one of the

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main ones.

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My dad was

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pretty large cotton grower in

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the area when we would grow

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cotton here.

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And up until probably two years

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ago, we had no acres of cotton.

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And this year we have a couple

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hundred acres when we used to

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have 85 ,000 acres of cotton in

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the area.

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And as the crops change,

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the methods of farming have to

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change. Our

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bed sizes will change.

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Our methods of cultivation will

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change.

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The fertilizer companies will

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have to adapt and move their

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products into a

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more like

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Bermuda or alfalfa or produce

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centric model and they'll

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have to focus their attention

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other

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areas rather than what we have

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here. just lost the sugar beet

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plant that we had here for,

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I think it was,

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I'm probably getting this number

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wrong, but upwards of 75 years.

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It's been here since the

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forties, I think.

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And

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they,

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the company, it just wasn't

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economically viable for them.

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And they are from Minnesota.

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They

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decided to shut this plant,

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take their sugar allotment and

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move it to Minnesota.

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and,

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or no, yeah, Minnesota.

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And now we've got 25 acres of,

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or 25 ,000 acres of

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sugar beet production that isn't

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going to happen this year,

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that's going to have to move

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into a new crop.

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And that's going to affect

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everybody from the beet

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harvesters all the way up to the

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like city managers and things

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that are having to figure out,

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they actually declared a state

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of emergency for it.

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I'm not sure what it's going to

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do, but

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besides maybe help with tax

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revenue and things like that.

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But that's been one of the main

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things that we have experienced

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that has

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forced us to adapt.

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My dad started farming Bermuda

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seed when I was probably 11

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years old.

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And before that, nobody farmed

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it.

295
00:09:05,019 --> 00:09:08,069
And it was a pretty unknown crop

296
00:09:08,069 --> 00:09:09,909
at the time. And now it's one of

297
00:09:09,909 --> 00:09:11,389
the main crops in the Imperial

298
00:09:11,389 --> 00:09:12,669
Valley besides alfalfa.

299
00:09:16,850 --> 00:09:17,970
When I think about crop

300
00:09:17,970 --> 00:09:18,909
production in the Imperial

301
00:09:18,909 --> 00:09:20,590
Valley, from the perspective of,

302
00:09:21,279 --> 00:09:22,299
there are many of our listeners

303
00:09:22,299 --> 00:09:24,250
who don't

304
00:09:24,779 --> 00:09:25,579
particularly have

305
00:09:26,210 --> 00:09:27,509
perspective on the Imperial

306
00:09:27,509 --> 00:09:28,430
Valley. Tell us a little bit

307
00:09:28,430 --> 00:09:29,230
about the

308
00:09:29,569 --> 00:09:31,230
growing climate, the growing

309
00:09:31,230 --> 00:09:33,230
conditions, and what irrigation

310
00:09:33,230 --> 00:09:34,029
water

311
00:09:34,240 --> 00:09:36,680
management looks like and

312
00:09:36,680 --> 00:09:38,180
availability and future supply

313
00:09:38,180 --> 00:09:39,299
and how you are thinking about

314
00:09:39,299 --> 00:09:40,099
that.

315
00:09:41,299 --> 00:09:43,299
In the Imperial Valley, we are a

316
00:09:43,299 --> 00:09:45,200
400 ,000 acre

317
00:09:45,580 --> 00:09:47,799
valley in the southernmost

318
00:09:47,799 --> 00:09:48,659
portion of California.

319
00:09:49,039 --> 00:09:50,480
We get our water from the

320
00:09:50,480 --> 00:09:52,720
Colorado River and it's all

321
00:09:52,720 --> 00:09:53,519
gravity fed.

322
00:09:53,720 --> 00:09:54,519
Oh, dear.

323
00:09:54,200 --> 00:09:55,799
Yeah, we'll get to that.

324
00:09:56,259 --> 00:09:57,940
That's a whole nother hot button

325
00:09:57,940 --> 00:09:58,740
issue.

326
00:09:58,960 --> 00:09:59,759
It's

327
00:10:00,740 --> 00:10:02,440
all gravity fed for us.

328
00:10:02,500 --> 00:10:03,580
There's no pumping stations.

329
00:10:03,940 --> 00:10:05,620
There's just there's dams that

330
00:10:05,620 --> 00:10:07,379
have that produce hydroelectric

331
00:10:07,919 --> 00:10:08,719
power.

332
00:10:09,000 --> 00:10:09,799
And

333
00:10:10,110 --> 00:10:11,029
then

334
00:10:11,789 --> 00:10:12,809
we have canals that

335
00:10:13,149 --> 00:10:15,110
get smaller and smaller and feed

336
00:10:15,110 --> 00:10:15,909
into our fields.

337
00:10:15,990 --> 00:10:17,570
We have laterals that take a

338
00:10:17,570 --> 00:10:18,649
large portion of the water down

339
00:10:18,649 --> 00:10:20,509
and then move it into our actual

340
00:10:20,509 --> 00:10:21,309
field

341
00:10:21,340 --> 00:10:22,139
irrigation.

342
00:10:23,179 --> 00:10:23,979
And

343
00:10:24,200 --> 00:10:25,340
I

344
00:10:25,970 --> 00:10:27,289
don't know the actual

345
00:10:27,289 --> 00:10:28,610
percentage, but I would say we

346
00:10:28,610 --> 00:10:30,169
are probably upwards of 80 %

347
00:10:30,169 --> 00:10:30,969
flood irrigation.

348
00:10:31,230 --> 00:10:33,179
And my sister, who's on the

349
00:10:33,179 --> 00:10:34,399
IVH2O,

350
00:10:36,720 --> 00:10:37,899
board, or well, she's the

351
00:10:37,899 --> 00:10:39,279
executive director of it, is

352
00:10:39,279 --> 00:10:40,299
probably going to kick me for

353
00:10:40,299 --> 00:10:41,559
saying wrong numbers.

354
00:10:41,620 --> 00:10:42,720
So I'll just say we have a lot

355
00:10:42,720 --> 00:10:43,519
of flood irrigation.

356
00:10:43,659 --> 00:10:44,759
There is some sprinkler and some

357
00:10:44,759 --> 00:10:45,559
drip,

358
00:10:45,600 --> 00:10:46,399
but

359
00:10:46,490 --> 00:10:47,289
we

360
00:10:48,730 --> 00:10:50,629
have a bit of a different

361
00:10:50,629 --> 00:10:51,930
situation than most areas

362
00:10:51,930 --> 00:10:52,730
because

363
00:10:52,879 --> 00:10:55,200
we have a lot, have a high salt

364
00:10:55,200 --> 00:10:57,299
content in our impurova, or in

365
00:10:57,299 --> 00:11:00,379
our ground. We have a high pH.

366
00:11:00,379 --> 00:11:02,759
We're upwards of 8 .1

367
00:11:03,069 --> 00:11:05,990
to 8 .4 in most areas.

368
00:11:06,129 --> 00:11:06,929
Our water

369
00:11:07,049 --> 00:11:09,669
coming in is 8 .4 pH also.

370
00:11:10,590 --> 00:11:13,149
So even if you were to bring the

371
00:11:13,149 --> 00:11:14,730
pH down on your soil,

372
00:11:15,700 --> 00:11:16,500
your water,

373
00:11:16,600 --> 00:11:17,919
the next irrigation is going to

374
00:11:17,919 --> 00:11:19,480
bring it right back up and it

375
00:11:19,480 --> 00:11:20,879
just, it won't hold down.

376
00:11:21,039 --> 00:11:22,539
So we have to adapt.

377
00:11:22,759 --> 00:11:25,259
And most of our crops are geared

378
00:11:25,259 --> 00:11:26,919
for the more alkaline salty

379
00:11:26,919 --> 00:11:27,799
areas.

380
00:11:28,139 --> 00:11:30,019
And we are

381
00:11:30,840 --> 00:11:32,940
a desert area. We get upwards of

382
00:11:32,940 --> 00:11:34,980
120 degrees in the summertime.

383
00:11:36,909 --> 00:11:37,709
And

384
00:11:38,889 --> 00:11:41,230
we have a great winter growing

385
00:11:41,230 --> 00:11:42,029
season.

386
00:11:41,990 --> 00:11:43,830
Starting right now, we're

387
00:11:43,830 --> 00:11:45,009
planting lettuce

388
00:11:45,480 --> 00:11:48,159
for the winter and fall.

389
00:11:49,379 --> 00:11:52,460
We grow a lot of cauliflower and

390
00:11:52,929 --> 00:11:54,029
broccoli,

391
00:11:54,960 --> 00:11:56,120
corn, carrots.

392
00:11:56,879 --> 00:11:57,679
Between

393
00:11:57,990 --> 00:11:59,509
us and Yuma, I think we supply

394
00:11:59,509 --> 00:12:01,309
most of the

395
00:12:01,879 --> 00:12:03,799
United States with winter

396
00:12:03,799 --> 00:12:04,599
produce.

397
00:12:04,799 --> 00:12:06,340
So it's a very

398
00:12:07,399 --> 00:12:08,620
interesting growing region.

399
00:12:09,399 --> 00:12:10,199
I

400
00:12:10,799 --> 00:12:13,039
have to pay attention when I'm

401
00:12:13,039 --> 00:12:13,919
looking at

402
00:12:14,230 --> 00:12:16,149
growing new crops and things

403
00:12:16,149 --> 00:12:17,450
like that to check

404
00:12:18,139 --> 00:12:19,899
what their temperatures are that

405
00:12:19,899 --> 00:12:21,620
they're growing in because

406
00:12:22,000 --> 00:12:22,820
the

407
00:12:24,029 --> 00:12:25,970
opposite season for us here.

408
00:12:26,269 --> 00:12:27,069
We're just

409
00:12:26,879 --> 00:12:27,679
very

410
00:12:28,080 --> 00:12:29,039
kind

411
00:12:29,730 --> 00:12:30,529
of niche.

412
00:12:32,360 --> 00:12:33,580
Are you adding any irrigation

413
00:12:33,580 --> 00:12:34,539
water to,

414
00:12:35,580 --> 00:12:37,340
in the case of the vegetable

415
00:12:37,340 --> 00:12:38,840
crops, are you adding irrigation

416
00:12:38,840 --> 00:12:40,299
water at all to

417
00:12:41,779 --> 00:12:43,120
compensate for temperature

418
00:12:43,120 --> 00:12:44,639
stress and to help cool crops

419
00:12:44,639 --> 00:12:45,439
down?

420
00:12:45,100 --> 00:12:46,000
Is that something that happens

421
00:12:46,000 --> 00:12:46,899
during the winter months at all

422
00:12:46,899 --> 00:12:47,699
or not really?

423
00:12:48,720 --> 00:12:49,759
During the winter months, I

424
00:12:49,759 --> 00:12:52,960
doubt it because I'm not a

425
00:12:52,960 --> 00:12:53,980
vegetable grower, so I

426
00:12:54,289 --> 00:12:55,809
can't really speak for them.

427
00:12:56,480 --> 00:12:58,259
But I don't think that they do.

428
00:12:58,319 --> 00:12:59,119
I've never heard of that

429
00:12:59,100 --> 00:13:01,580
management practice because

430
00:13:02,149 --> 00:13:05,029
the varieties that we use are

431
00:13:05,029 --> 00:13:07,669
geared for a winter crop,

432
00:13:08,220 --> 00:13:09,200
not a summer crop.

433
00:13:09,539 --> 00:13:11,259
Like our onions that we grow

434
00:13:11,259 --> 00:13:13,419
here are short day onions.

435
00:13:13,889 --> 00:13:15,129
instead of long day onions,

436
00:13:15,190 --> 00:13:16,710
which means we need a shorter

437
00:13:16,710 --> 00:13:17,909
day for them to

438
00:13:18,319 --> 00:13:21,120
make bulbs and grow.

439
00:13:21,340 --> 00:13:22,860
So we have different varieties

440
00:13:22,860 --> 00:13:25,039
that are catered to our area.

441
00:13:25,200 --> 00:13:27,059
Texas is very similar to us in

442
00:13:27,059 --> 00:13:28,680
their growing season and some of

443
00:13:28,680 --> 00:13:30,279
the southern tips of Texas.

444
00:13:35,090 --> 00:13:35,889
Historically,

445
00:13:36,210 --> 00:13:38,090
the perspective has been that

446
00:13:38,429 --> 00:13:39,929
the Imperial Valley, Central

447
00:13:39,929 --> 00:13:42,190
Valley, these desert areas of

448
00:13:42,190 --> 00:13:44,149
the West have had a significant

449
00:13:44,149 --> 00:13:45,590
competitive advantage from a

450
00:13:45,590 --> 00:13:47,110
climate perspective and from a

451
00:13:47,110 --> 00:13:47,909
disease

452
00:13:47,970 --> 00:13:49,350
susceptibility perspective

453
00:13:49,350 --> 00:13:50,549
because of an ideal growing

454
00:13:50,549 --> 00:13:51,349
climate.

455
00:13:55,419 --> 00:13:57,259
What is interesting is if you

456
00:13:57,259 --> 00:13:58,700
look at the historical use

457
00:13:58,700 --> 00:14:00,440
patterns of fungicides and

458
00:14:00,440 --> 00:14:01,240
insecticides,

459
00:14:01,500 --> 00:14:02,320
but in this case particularly

460
00:14:02,320 --> 00:14:03,120
fungicides,

461
00:14:04,159 --> 00:14:05,139
there is

462
00:14:05,679 --> 00:14:08,940
increasing use of fungicides

463
00:14:08,940 --> 00:14:10,159
in these production regions

464
00:14:10,159 --> 00:14:11,720
quite rapidly if you're looking

465
00:14:11,720 --> 00:14:13,019
at over a 20 to 30 year time

466
00:14:13,019 --> 00:14:14,700
horizon and even longer.

467
00:14:16,250 --> 00:14:17,250
So how,

468
00:14:18,639 --> 00:14:20,299
in this environment, how are you

469
00:14:20,299 --> 00:14:22,320
observing disease pressure and

470
00:14:22,320 --> 00:14:23,700
insect pressure shifting and

471
00:14:23,700 --> 00:14:24,500
changing? You've been,

472
00:14:24,799 --> 00:14:25,740
your father was one of the

473
00:14:25,740 --> 00:14:26,820
pioneering growers of

474
00:14:27,679 --> 00:14:28,479
Bermudagrass, you've been

475
00:14:28,419 --> 00:14:29,740
growing Bermudagrass seed in the

476
00:14:29,740 --> 00:14:30,919
same location for quite a long

477
00:14:30,919 --> 00:14:31,719
time.

478
00:14:31,990 --> 00:14:32,970
How have you seen that shift

479
00:14:32,970 --> 00:14:33,769
over time?

480
00:14:35,180 --> 00:14:36,319
In the Bermudagrass seed, we're

481
00:14:36,319 --> 00:14:37,799
just starting to see a shift.

482
00:14:38,769 --> 00:14:39,990
It's a

483
00:14:40,690 --> 00:14:41,490
little bit behind.

484
00:14:41,409 --> 00:14:42,230
I don't think because

485
00:14:42,930 --> 00:14:45,110
we rotate it a little bit more.

486
00:14:45,549 --> 00:14:47,250
Also, it's a perennial, so it

487
00:14:47,250 --> 00:14:49,680
stays in, but we're not just

488
00:14:50,700 --> 00:14:52,080
Bermuda after Bermuda after

489
00:14:52,080 --> 00:14:53,319
Bermuda. We'll rotate some

490
00:14:53,319 --> 00:14:54,559
alfalfa and some wheat,

491
00:14:55,220 --> 00:14:56,180
maybe some Sedan.

492
00:14:57,019 --> 00:14:57,960
So ours hasn't

493
00:14:58,720 --> 00:15:01,879
been that bad, but for the

494
00:15:01,879 --> 00:15:03,299
fungus problem,

495
00:15:03,639 --> 00:15:05,559
we have a rust issue here,

496
00:15:06,460 --> 00:15:07,960
and we can solve it with

497
00:15:08,649 --> 00:15:09,950
a little bit of...

498
00:15:09,950 --> 00:15:11,769
Most guys use like Tebistar or

499
00:15:11,769 --> 00:15:12,569
something like that.

500
00:15:12,930 --> 00:15:14,690
Other guys will use sulfur.

501
00:15:15,029 --> 00:15:16,470
Sulfur doesn't exactly work on

502
00:15:16,470 --> 00:15:17,269
rust.

503
00:15:18,049 --> 00:15:19,909
It's long been a

504
00:15:20,830 --> 00:15:21,830
prescribed treatment

505
00:15:22,519 --> 00:15:24,299
for rust, but it doesn't quite

506
00:15:24,840 --> 00:15:25,700
manage it.

507
00:15:27,370 --> 00:15:29,549
But the main problem for Bermuda

508
00:15:29,549 --> 00:15:32,210
has been in the recent years, we

509
00:15:32,210 --> 00:15:33,509
have started to get a lot more

510
00:15:33,509 --> 00:15:34,309
pests.

511
00:15:34,590 --> 00:15:35,389
Bermuda

512
00:15:36,360 --> 00:15:38,139
historically didn't have any

513
00:15:38,320 --> 00:15:39,440
pests that you had to worry

514
00:15:39,440 --> 00:15:40,820
about besides maybe some flea

515
00:15:40,820 --> 00:15:42,659
beetle coming in when it was

516
00:15:42,659 --> 00:15:43,459
germinating,

517
00:15:43,500 --> 00:15:45,279
and they would just clip off the

518
00:15:45,679 --> 00:15:46,479
growing

519
00:15:47,200 --> 00:15:49,200
small plants, but once it grew,

520
00:15:49,299 --> 00:15:50,500
it grows so fast and so

521
00:15:50,500 --> 00:15:52,879
vigorously that even if you had

522
00:15:52,879 --> 00:15:54,279
worms come in, it wouldn't eat

523
00:15:54,279 --> 00:15:55,279
it down. But we,

524
00:15:55,799 --> 00:15:57,820
this year had an army worm

525
00:15:57,820 --> 00:15:58,620
problem,

526
00:15:59,440 --> 00:16:02,539
which was unheard of in growing

527
00:16:02,539 --> 00:16:03,919
Bermuda, not in germinating

528
00:16:03,919 --> 00:16:04,719
Bermuda.

529
00:16:04,769 --> 00:16:06,870
We have a leaf stem maggot that

530
00:16:06,870 --> 00:16:08,909
comes in and will

531
00:16:09,539 --> 00:16:10,799
lay its egg.

532
00:16:11,240 --> 00:16:12,659
The fly will come in and lay its

533
00:16:12,659 --> 00:16:14,139
egg in the stem of the Bermuda

534
00:16:14,139 --> 00:16:17,009
stalk and kill that entire stalk

535
00:16:17,009 --> 00:16:18,649
up and it won't produce seed.

536
00:16:19,230 --> 00:16:20,029
And

537
00:16:20,080 --> 00:16:22,240
there's also a mite issue, but

538
00:16:22,240 --> 00:16:23,080
that's always been there.

539
00:16:23,179 --> 00:16:24,559
And that was very easy to solve.

540
00:16:24,639 --> 00:16:25,519
If you just put on

541
00:16:25,960 --> 00:16:28,259
one application of sulfur, it

542
00:16:28,259 --> 00:16:29,559
basically broke the life cycle

543
00:16:29,559 --> 00:16:30,919
of the mites and you didn't have

544
00:16:30,919 --> 00:16:31,779
to worry about them anymore.

545
00:16:32,590 --> 00:16:33,830
But we're definitely seeing

546
00:16:34,240 --> 00:16:36,379
new and emerging pests coming

547
00:16:36,379 --> 00:16:37,180
into the Bermuda.

548
00:16:37,620 --> 00:16:39,879
And then I can't quite speak for

549
00:16:39,879 --> 00:16:41,319
the produce guys because I'm not

550
00:16:41,319 --> 00:16:42,779
a produce grower, but I am a

551
00:16:42,779 --> 00:16:44,180
pest control advisor, which is

552
00:16:46,039 --> 00:16:48,639
PCA, I prescribe the chemicals

553
00:16:48,639 --> 00:16:51,100
for farmers and I go to a lot of

554
00:16:51,100 --> 00:16:51,899
meetings.

555
00:16:51,799 --> 00:16:53,440
And a couple of years back,

556
00:16:53,740 --> 00:16:56,980
Sclerotinia was rampant in the

557
00:16:56,980 --> 00:16:58,519
Yuma area and the Imperial

558
00:16:58,519 --> 00:17:01,680
Valley. It's slowly becoming

559
00:17:01,860 --> 00:17:04,990
more managed, I think through

560
00:17:04,990 --> 00:17:06,750
more fungicide uses and

561
00:17:08,220 --> 00:17:10,819
practices like that.

562
00:17:11,400 --> 00:17:13,029
But there's also

563
00:17:13,569 --> 00:17:14,410
new

564
00:17:15,069 --> 00:17:16,589
bugs that are coming in from,

565
00:17:17,009 --> 00:17:18,369
we had the brugada bug that was

566
00:17:18,369 --> 00:17:19,650
a big problem in broccoli for a

567
00:17:19,650 --> 00:17:20,450
while. It's

568
00:17:21,069 --> 00:17:23,789
a true bug that comes in and

569
00:17:23,789 --> 00:17:24,829
stings the growing point of the

570
00:17:24,829 --> 00:17:26,009
broccoli and the broccoli makes

571
00:17:26,009 --> 00:17:28,509
a triple head or a double head

572
00:17:28,509 --> 00:17:29,829
that's non -marketable.

573
00:17:30,529 --> 00:17:33,500
And then you have the newest one

574
00:17:33,500 --> 00:17:35,809
that's coming in is a virus

575
00:17:35,809 --> 00:17:38,029
carried by thrips and it

576
00:17:39,539 --> 00:17:41,079
you can see it it's it's like a

577
00:17:41,079 --> 00:17:42,799
almost a mosaic pattern going

578
00:17:42,799 --> 00:17:44,619
through the field of where the

579
00:17:44,619 --> 00:17:47,119
thrip lands and feeds it infests

580
00:17:47,119 --> 00:17:49,059
the the lettuce plant

581
00:17:49,369 --> 00:17:50,250
and it

582
00:17:50,559 --> 00:17:51,920
just died i think it's called

583
00:17:52,359 --> 00:17:54,720
insv is what i don't know what

584
00:17:54,720 --> 00:17:56,819
it stands for but um it's uh

585
00:17:56,819 --> 00:17:58,579
it's a big product problem in

586
00:17:58,579 --> 00:18:00,720
salinas right now not so much

587
00:18:00,720 --> 00:18:02,859
here but it'll get here most

588
00:18:02,859 --> 00:18:04,720
things in salinas come

589
00:18:05,390 --> 00:18:07,390
down to us because we're just we

590
00:18:07,799 --> 00:18:09,619
don't have as much produce year

591
00:18:09,619 --> 00:18:10,759
-round they're able to grow

592
00:18:11,509 --> 00:18:12,650
pretty much year -round because

593
00:18:12,650 --> 00:18:15,859
their climate and we were

594
00:18:16,009 --> 00:18:17,210
only half the year.

595
00:18:17,509 --> 00:18:19,130
So they have a little bit faster

596
00:18:19,130 --> 00:18:20,930
development of these pests and

597
00:18:20,930 --> 00:18:21,730
diseases.

598
00:18:23,549 --> 00:18:24,549
I'm curious. I'd like to

599
00:18:25,019 --> 00:18:26,779
understand your perspective and

600
00:18:26,779 --> 00:18:27,619
your thought process.

601
00:18:27,799 --> 00:18:30,319
As a PCA, you get to see what's

602
00:18:30,319 --> 00:18:31,579
happening and what's going on.

603
00:18:31,640 --> 00:18:33,200
You have the benefit of some of

604
00:18:33,200 --> 00:18:34,279
a historical perspective.

605
00:18:35,710 --> 00:18:36,809
What's your take on the

606
00:18:36,809 --> 00:18:40,089
increasing pressure and what the

607
00:18:40,089 --> 00:18:41,750
long -term solutions for some of

608
00:18:41,750 --> 00:18:42,730
those challenges might be?

609
00:18:43,599 --> 00:18:45,279
The increasing pressure, I

610
00:18:45,279 --> 00:18:47,299
think, is just because we

611
00:18:47,700 --> 00:18:48,940
do the same thing year after

612
00:18:48,940 --> 00:18:49,740
year after year.

613
00:18:50,660 --> 00:18:52,039
And it's almost a

614
00:18:52,410 --> 00:18:54,789
foregone conclusion that you're

615
00:18:54,789 --> 00:18:56,049
going to get something to come

616
00:18:56,049 --> 00:18:56,849
in.

617
00:18:57,000 --> 00:18:58,380
I mean, avocados are a good

618
00:18:58,380 --> 00:18:59,440
example. When they first started

619
00:18:59,440 --> 00:19:00,980
planting avocados in California,

620
00:19:01,380 --> 00:19:02,519
there were no pests.

621
00:19:02,920 --> 00:19:03,740
They planted them on this.

622
00:19:03,779 --> 00:19:04,779
You can see them still if you

623
00:19:04,779 --> 00:19:05,579
drive to San Diego.

624
00:19:05,599 --> 00:19:06,500
They're planted on the side of

625
00:19:06,500 --> 00:19:08,660
hills where you could harvest

626
00:19:08,660 --> 00:19:10,099
them, but you can't drive a

627
00:19:10,099 --> 00:19:10,899
tractor around there.

628
00:19:10,759 --> 00:19:11,559
You can walk.

629
00:19:12,339 --> 00:19:14,619
And they've just abandoned those

630
00:19:14,619 --> 00:19:16,599
because now we have pests that

631
00:19:16,599 --> 00:19:18,319
have come into the avocados and

632
00:19:18,319 --> 00:19:19,119
they can't spray them.

633
00:19:19,740 --> 00:19:20,980
They can't do anything to manage

634
00:19:20,980 --> 00:19:21,779
it.

635
00:19:22,089 --> 00:19:24,390
With ours, what I have seen is

636
00:19:24,390 --> 00:19:25,190
just

637
00:19:26,329 --> 00:19:27,809
a lack of

638
00:19:29,279 --> 00:19:30,640
diversity in our management

639
00:19:30,640 --> 00:19:31,440
practices.

640
00:19:31,519 --> 00:19:32,319
We just,

641
00:19:32,539 --> 00:19:34,539
if it's a bug, we spray it with

642
00:19:34,539 --> 00:19:35,339
an insecticide.

643
00:19:35,339 --> 00:19:36,440
If it's a weed, we spray it with

644
00:19:36,440 --> 00:19:38,339
a herbicide. We don't look at

645
00:19:38,339 --> 00:19:39,139
any other

646
00:19:39,500 --> 00:19:40,960
processes, which is kind of what

647
00:19:40,960 --> 00:19:43,099
I'm trying to do with my farm

648
00:19:43,099 --> 00:19:43,899
right now.

649
00:19:44,119 --> 00:19:46,099
The main thing that I'm doing is

650
00:19:46,099 --> 00:19:47,660
a boron regiment.

651
00:19:48,180 --> 00:19:48,980
I put

652
00:19:49,109 --> 00:19:50,549
boron through...

653
00:19:50,549 --> 00:19:51,589
Oh, this is going to be a fun

654
00:19:51,589 --> 00:19:52,389
conversation.

655
00:19:53,670 --> 00:19:55,410
You just hit one of my hot

656
00:19:55,410 --> 00:19:56,210
buttons.

657
00:19:57,150 --> 00:19:59,269
I'm using Solubor to put boron

658
00:19:59,269 --> 00:20:01,009
through the, into the roots,

659
00:20:01,250 --> 00:20:02,049
through the water.

660
00:20:02,150 --> 00:20:03,710
And then I also come in with a

661
00:20:03,710 --> 00:20:05,210
foliar application of

662
00:20:06,420 --> 00:20:08,180
boron throughout the year.

663
00:20:08,380 --> 00:20:10,460
I try and get twice a year and

664
00:20:11,079 --> 00:20:12,519
I have actually seen

665
00:20:13,019 --> 00:20:16,380
a decrease in ligase pressure

666
00:20:16,380 --> 00:20:19,059
in my alfalfa seed compared to a

667
00:20:19,059 --> 00:20:20,720
neighbor who sprayed.

668
00:20:20,900 --> 00:20:23,309
I was getting upwards of,

669
00:20:24,740 --> 00:20:27,140
I think it was at least half the

670
00:20:27,140 --> 00:20:28,200
ligase pressure that he got.

671
00:20:28,240 --> 00:20:29,039
I've got my notes here.

672
00:20:28,960 --> 00:20:29,819
I'm trying to look at them and

673
00:20:29,819 --> 00:20:30,619
see.

674
00:20:30,140 --> 00:20:31,240
It was at least half, but

675
00:20:31,240 --> 00:20:33,710
sometimes it was three or four

676
00:20:33,710 --> 00:20:35,609
times more in the

677
00:20:35,980 --> 00:20:37,519
conventionally managed field

678
00:20:37,519 --> 00:20:40,380
compared to mine that had a

679
00:20:40,529 --> 00:20:41,950
boron treatment and

680
00:20:42,519 --> 00:20:44,220
inoculations just

681
00:20:45,440 --> 00:20:47,140
in my opinion, a healthier,

682
00:20:47,279 --> 00:20:49,500
happier plant that was able to,

683
00:20:50,410 --> 00:20:51,450
if for nothing else,

684
00:20:52,680 --> 00:20:54,660
not let the ligus get

685
00:20:54,660 --> 00:20:56,920
established and reproduce like

686
00:20:56,920 --> 00:20:58,140
the other fields were able to.

687
00:20:59,319 --> 00:21:00,119
All right.

688
00:21:00,190 --> 00:21:01,869
As I said, you hit on one of my

689
00:21:01,869 --> 00:21:02,890
buttons, so we're going to dig

690
00:21:02,890 --> 00:21:04,710
into this one because I

691
00:21:05,240 --> 00:21:06,619
don't know that if I've made

692
00:21:06,619 --> 00:21:08,099
this comment on the podcast, but

693
00:21:08,099 --> 00:21:08,960
I certainly haven't in many

694
00:21:08,960 --> 00:21:10,099
presentations, but I'm of the

695
00:21:10,150 --> 00:21:11,430
persuasion that

696
00:21:12,029 --> 00:21:14,210
if crops generally had adequate

697
00:21:14,210 --> 00:21:16,339
levels of boron or even on the

698
00:21:16,339 --> 00:21:18,529
generous side of adequate levels

699
00:21:18,529 --> 00:21:19,329
of boron,

700
00:21:20,460 --> 00:21:21,740
insecticide use would probably

701
00:21:21,740 --> 00:21:23,440
drop by in the neighborhood of

702
00:21:23,440 --> 00:21:26,380
plus 80%, upwards of 80 % across

703
00:21:26,380 --> 00:21:27,240
the entire industry.

704
00:21:27,599 --> 00:21:28,399
So

705
00:21:28,240 --> 00:21:29,519
this is something that I'm

706
00:21:30,309 --> 00:21:31,869
quite interested in digging

707
00:21:31,869 --> 00:21:32,669
into.

708
00:21:33,029 --> 00:21:34,230
In your your ligus bug

709
00:21:34,230 --> 00:21:35,769
experience, just to understand

710
00:21:35,769 --> 00:21:37,150
the context, when you talk about

711
00:21:37,150 --> 00:21:38,349
conventional treatment versus

712
00:21:38,349 --> 00:21:40,250
your boron treatment with

713
00:21:40,750 --> 00:21:42,390
the fields that you applied the

714
00:21:42,390 --> 00:21:44,250
boron on, did those also have an

715
00:21:44,250 --> 00:21:45,269
insecticide treatment or was

716
00:21:45,269 --> 00:21:46,349
that without any insecticide?

717
00:21:46,490 --> 00:21:47,390
No, no insecticides.

718
00:21:48,220 --> 00:21:49,900
I haven't sprayed an insecticide

719
00:21:49,900 --> 00:21:51,599
on my ranch in,

720
00:21:53,579 --> 00:21:54,500
that was probably three or four

721
00:21:54,500 --> 00:21:55,960
months ago. I said I did

722
00:21:56,309 --> 00:21:57,410
the math and it was about 18

723
00:21:57,410 --> 00:21:58,589
months. So we're going up,

724
00:21:58,890 --> 00:22:00,390
we're coming up on almost two

725
00:22:00,390 --> 00:22:02,349
years with no insecticides

726
00:22:02,349 --> 00:22:04,329
whatsoever on my ranch.

727
00:22:06,660 --> 00:22:09,380
Most conventional practices for

728
00:22:09,380 --> 00:22:11,240
alfalfa and alfalfa seed

729
00:22:11,240 --> 00:22:13,759
treatment are usually about one

730
00:22:13,759 --> 00:22:16,109
spray per cutting and probably

731
00:22:16,109 --> 00:22:17,569
two to three sprays

732
00:22:18,299 --> 00:22:20,759
on the conservative side for

733
00:22:20,759 --> 00:22:21,559
seed production.

734
00:22:21,660 --> 00:22:22,579
Some of the

735
00:22:22,960 --> 00:22:24,940
farmers that are on the nicer

736
00:22:24,940 --> 00:22:26,700
ground that are able to produce

737
00:22:27,359 --> 00:22:28,579
large yields,

738
00:22:29,039 --> 00:22:32,000
they will get probably five to

739
00:22:32,000 --> 00:22:33,839
six sprays per

740
00:22:34,220 --> 00:22:35,019
cutting. When you say five to

741
00:22:34,920 --> 00:22:35,839
six sprays or two to three

742
00:22:35,839 --> 00:22:37,099
sprays per cutting, are each of

743
00:22:37,099 --> 00:22:38,119
those sprays an insecticide

744
00:22:38,119 --> 00:22:38,919
spray?

745
00:22:38,480 --> 00:22:39,279
Is that what you're describing?

746
00:22:39,640 --> 00:22:40,440
An insecticide spray.

747
00:22:41,690 --> 00:22:43,349
It's heavy, heavy insecticide.

748
00:22:43,569 --> 00:22:45,390
I'm going to get crucified for

749
00:22:45,390 --> 00:22:47,809
bringing this up on a on a

750
00:22:47,809 --> 00:22:49,470
podcast, but I don't care.

751
00:22:50,789 --> 00:22:51,609
It's the truth.

752
00:22:51,769 --> 00:22:54,490
I just I found that I don't need

753
00:22:56,559 --> 00:22:57,420
insecticides.

754
00:22:58,309 --> 00:22:59,630
My goodness, going from that

755
00:22:59,630 --> 00:23:00,670
type of regime,

756
00:23:01,009 --> 00:23:02,829
spray regime, to to no

757
00:23:02,829 --> 00:23:05,009
insecticides in 18 months or 20

758
00:23:05,009 --> 00:23:05,809
months.

759
00:23:05,740 --> 00:23:06,539
that's

760
00:23:06,759 --> 00:23:08,079
quite a shift.

761
00:23:09,349 --> 00:23:10,549
There was definitely some

762
00:23:10,549 --> 00:23:11,990
growing pains. It was a

763
00:23:11,990 --> 00:23:13,250
conscious decision I made.

764
00:23:15,099 --> 00:23:16,779
I don't know why, but this agave

765
00:23:16,779 --> 00:23:18,680
has been kind of a gateway for

766
00:23:18,680 --> 00:23:21,140
me to get into the regenerative

767
00:23:21,140 --> 00:23:21,940
movement,

768
00:23:24,410 --> 00:23:25,710
I won't say organic, because I

769
00:23:25,710 --> 00:23:27,069
look at organic as more of a

770
00:23:27,069 --> 00:23:28,230
marketing scheme than anything

771
00:23:28,230 --> 00:23:30,390
anymore. It used to be something

772
00:23:30,390 --> 00:23:31,910
that actually meant something,

773
00:23:31,990 --> 00:23:33,210
but anymore it just means that

774
00:23:33,210 --> 00:23:34,529
you spray a lot more of a

775
00:23:34,529 --> 00:23:36,630
lighter material, in my opinion.

776
00:23:37,069 --> 00:23:37,869
And

777
00:23:38,880 --> 00:23:40,220
that's not a popular opinion,

778
00:23:40,380 --> 00:23:42,119
but it's in my

779
00:23:42,589 --> 00:23:43,389
view.

780
00:23:43,210 --> 00:23:45,200
Well, I think you have kind of a

781
00:23:45,200 --> 00:23:46,940
front row seat as a PCA to know

782
00:23:46,940 --> 00:23:47,900
what's actually happening and

783
00:23:47,900 --> 00:23:48,900
what's going on in the fields of

784
00:23:48,900 --> 00:23:50,319
California, that your opinion

785
00:23:50,319 --> 00:23:51,119
has some merit.

786
00:23:51,509 --> 00:23:53,230
It just seems like with the

787
00:23:53,230 --> 00:23:54,029
organic,

788
00:23:54,869 --> 00:23:56,730
They use, it's softer

789
00:23:56,730 --> 00:23:57,529
chemistries,

790
00:23:57,869 --> 00:23:59,029
things that are

791
00:23:59,440 --> 00:24:00,859
derived from plants,

792
00:24:01,710 --> 00:24:03,009
but they're sprayed,

793
00:24:03,640 --> 00:24:04,980
you know, in an organic spinach,

794
00:24:05,079 --> 00:24:06,299
you might spray every two or

795
00:24:06,299 --> 00:24:07,799
three days, something like that.

796
00:24:07,859 --> 00:24:09,519
Or, I mean, corn, it's just,

797
00:24:09,559 --> 00:24:10,359
it's just a ton.

798
00:24:11,099 --> 00:24:12,940
And again, they're lighter,

799
00:24:13,299 --> 00:24:14,940
they're derived from plants most

800
00:24:14,940 --> 00:24:16,259
of the time, but

801
00:24:16,950 --> 00:24:17,789
there are,

802
00:24:18,670 --> 00:24:19,950
you know, there's still plants

803
00:24:19,950 --> 00:24:21,450
that are detrimental to humans

804
00:24:21,450 --> 00:24:23,089
out there. So I don't.

805
00:24:23,670 --> 00:24:25,250
I don't know about the whole

806
00:24:25,250 --> 00:24:26,049
organic movement.

807
00:24:26,150 --> 00:24:27,410
I know there are some very, very

808
00:24:27,410 --> 00:24:29,329
good organic crops out there,

809
00:24:29,349 --> 00:24:30,170
and there's some very good

810
00:24:30,170 --> 00:24:30,970
organic growers.

811
00:24:31,309 --> 00:24:32,109
And

812
00:24:31,859 --> 00:24:34,180
I've tried to support those over

813
00:24:34,180 --> 00:24:35,259
the years by purchasing their

814
00:24:35,259 --> 00:24:36,819
products. But I just

815
00:24:37,259 --> 00:24:38,680
see that it's a

816
00:24:39,569 --> 00:24:40,450
little bit of a

817
00:24:42,619 --> 00:24:43,480
marketing thing.

818
00:24:43,660 --> 00:24:45,299
But back to the agave, it was

819
00:24:45,299 --> 00:24:46,359
kind of a gateway to get into

820
00:24:46,359 --> 00:24:47,159
this.

821
00:24:47,039 --> 00:24:47,900
And I

822
00:24:48,369 --> 00:24:50,730
first put in my agave on a

823
00:24:51,069 --> 00:24:51,869
field,

824
00:24:51,910 --> 00:24:54,150
and I sprayed everything over

825
00:24:54,150 --> 00:24:56,289
the top of it, from Roundup to

826
00:24:56,289 --> 00:24:57,490
Prowl to

827
00:24:57,910 --> 00:24:59,230
I mean, just anything I could,

828
00:24:59,269 --> 00:25:00,069
because I was trying to see.

829
00:25:00,039 --> 00:25:01,059
if it would survive.

830
00:25:01,380 --> 00:25:02,599
And it does because it's got a

831
00:25:02,599 --> 00:25:05,420
waxy cuticle, it stomata are

832
00:25:05,420 --> 00:25:06,220
open at night.

833
00:25:06,440 --> 00:25:07,799
It's just, it's a pretty

834
00:25:07,799 --> 00:25:09,000
resilient, awesome plant.

835
00:25:09,140 --> 00:25:10,980
And then most of the chemistry

836
00:25:10,980 --> 00:25:12,619
that I was using ties up in the

837
00:25:12,619 --> 00:25:14,299
soil so that the roots don't

838
00:25:14,299 --> 00:25:15,099
uptake it.

839
00:25:15,630 --> 00:25:18,319
And then I moved to a different

840
00:25:20,519 --> 00:25:21,880
plot of land that I started

841
00:25:21,880 --> 00:25:23,339
planting the agave and

842
00:25:23,859 --> 00:25:25,140
for whatever reason, started

843
00:25:25,140 --> 00:25:26,940
looking into regenerative

844
00:25:26,940 --> 00:25:30,240
practices on agave

845
00:25:31,599 --> 00:25:33,319
and just in general.

846
00:25:33,700 --> 00:25:36,180
And I stopped spraying my agave,

847
00:25:36,279 --> 00:25:37,079
didn't spray it.

848
00:25:37,160 --> 00:25:38,440
I put, the one thing I did do

849
00:25:38,440 --> 00:25:39,599
was I put some diatomaceous

850
00:25:39,599 --> 00:25:40,980
earth because we had a cricket

851
00:25:40,980 --> 00:25:42,480
infestation that actually ate

852
00:25:42,480 --> 00:25:43,299
them down to the ground.

853
00:25:44,839 --> 00:25:45,639
Yeah, it was,

854
00:25:45,869 --> 00:25:47,390
I've never seen crickets eat

855
00:25:47,390 --> 00:25:48,690
something like that, but I mean,

856
00:25:48,690 --> 00:25:49,490
they,

857
00:25:49,740 --> 00:25:52,980
pretty much foot tall to foot

858
00:25:52,980 --> 00:25:54,119
and a half tall agave down to

859
00:25:54,119 --> 00:25:54,919
the ground. They've all come

860
00:25:54,900 --> 00:25:56,599
back because they're just tough

861
00:25:56,599 --> 00:25:57,399
plants. But

862
00:25:57,819 --> 00:25:59,440
that

863
00:26:00,109 --> 00:26:02,710
got me into not spraying on

864
00:26:02,990 --> 00:26:05,210
my Bermuda and I stopped putting

865
00:26:05,460 --> 00:26:06,640
TR10,

866
00:26:07,160 --> 00:26:08,839
the pre -emergent herbicide,

867
00:26:09,940 --> 00:26:11,019
the granular herbicide that we

868
00:26:11,019 --> 00:26:11,819
would all put down.

869
00:26:11,759 --> 00:26:12,920
I stopped. I didn't

870
00:26:13,299 --> 00:26:15,339
do it. And then I would walk my

871
00:26:15,339 --> 00:26:16,799
fields and I would walk the

872
00:26:16,799 --> 00:26:18,019
other fields that I managed that

873
00:26:18,019 --> 00:26:19,839
were conventional and

874
00:26:20,789 --> 00:26:22,130
I didn't see a lot of difference

875
00:26:22,130 --> 00:26:22,930
in the Bermuda.

876
00:26:22,769 --> 00:26:24,769
Yeah, I had a few broadleaves

877
00:26:24,769 --> 00:26:25,569
here and there,

878
00:26:26,460 --> 00:26:27,259
but when

879
00:26:28,089 --> 00:26:29,309
I started looking at them and

880
00:26:29,309 --> 00:26:30,410
figuring out what they all were,

881
00:26:30,490 --> 00:26:31,289
they're all forbs.

882
00:26:31,410 --> 00:26:32,250
So I

883
00:26:32,730 --> 00:26:33,970
don't mind having them out there

884
00:26:33,970 --> 00:26:35,769
and they all die off before the

885
00:26:35,769 --> 00:26:37,230
Bermuda gets harvested and I

886
00:26:37,230 --> 00:26:38,349
don't have to worry about them

887
00:26:39,039 --> 00:26:40,559
gumming up any of the combines.

888
00:26:41,970 --> 00:26:45,029
That led into my alfalfa

889
00:26:45,029 --> 00:26:46,630
production, which I just stopped

890
00:26:46,869 --> 00:26:48,529
doing any

891
00:26:49,259 --> 00:26:50,420
pesticides. I kept with the

892
00:26:50,420 --> 00:26:51,519
herbicides for

893
00:26:51,960 --> 00:26:54,279
a while because I wanted a

894
00:26:54,279 --> 00:26:55,079
clean, pretty field.

895
00:26:55,420 --> 00:26:56,220
but

896
00:26:56,279 --> 00:26:57,740
the insecticides I stopped

897
00:26:57,740 --> 00:26:59,809
because they didn't make any

898
00:26:59,809 --> 00:27:00,609
sense to me

899
00:27:00,960 --> 00:27:04,230
in the economics because I could

900
00:27:04,230 --> 00:27:05,650
look and see it was, you know,

901
00:27:05,750 --> 00:27:06,730
maybe it would eat,

902
00:27:07,990 --> 00:27:09,690
the insects would eat

903
00:27:10,549 --> 00:27:12,329
a quarter ton of hay.

904
00:27:12,819 --> 00:27:15,660
I make another ton and a half of

905
00:27:15,660 --> 00:27:16,759
hay, ton and a quarter,

906
00:27:18,009 --> 00:27:20,339
but I have to spray a pretty

907
00:27:20,339 --> 00:27:21,180
expensive spray.

908
00:27:21,299 --> 00:27:23,799
Most of them, even the low end

909
00:27:23,799 --> 00:27:25,180
generics are,

910
00:27:25,730 --> 00:27:27,690
$20 or $30 to the acre.

911
00:27:27,890 --> 00:27:28,910
And then I've got a tractor that

912
00:27:28,910 --> 00:27:30,029
has to go through a field, a guy

913
00:27:30,029 --> 00:27:31,109
that has to sit in the tractor

914
00:27:31,109 --> 00:27:32,109
and the economics just didn't

915
00:27:32,109 --> 00:27:32,909
work out for me.

916
00:27:33,480 --> 00:27:35,359
So I stopped. And

917
00:27:35,680 --> 00:27:37,779
for probably the last five

918
00:27:37,779 --> 00:27:38,880
years, I haven't sprayed my

919
00:27:38,880 --> 00:27:41,240
alfalfa seed with an insecticide

920
00:27:41,240 --> 00:27:42,039
throughout the year.

921
00:27:42,059 --> 00:27:43,559
I would spray what we call the

922
00:27:43,559 --> 00:27:44,700
cleanup spray in the beginning,

923
00:27:44,799 --> 00:27:46,180
which was a heavy dose of

924
00:27:46,180 --> 00:27:48,640
herbicides, insecticides, pre

925
00:27:48,640 --> 00:27:49,440
-emergent,

926
00:27:49,500 --> 00:27:50,299
a

927
00:27:51,210 --> 00:27:52,390
little bit of fungicide, a

928
00:27:52,390 --> 00:27:53,190
little bit of miticide.

929
00:27:53,269 --> 00:27:54,069
I mean, it was,

930
00:27:54,769 --> 00:27:57,130
it was a huge cocktail and.

931
00:27:58,150 --> 00:28:00,230
It was $100 an acre to put that

932
00:28:00,230 --> 00:28:01,349
on, if not 120.

933
00:28:02,269 --> 00:28:03,910
And I don't

934
00:28:04,609 --> 00:28:05,470
produce enough seed.

935
00:28:05,690 --> 00:28:06,490
I'm

936
00:28:06,450 --> 00:28:07,730
on tougher ground.

937
00:28:08,349 --> 00:28:09,809
I'm not a seed grower in the

938
00:28:09,809 --> 00:28:10,650
alfalfa sense.

939
00:28:11,170 --> 00:28:12,349
I grow it for hay.

940
00:28:12,470 --> 00:28:14,009
I'm learning now how to grow it

941
00:28:14,009 --> 00:28:15,589
better for seed, but that's only

942
00:28:15,589 --> 00:28:16,910
been in the last five, six years

943
00:28:16,910 --> 00:28:18,130
that we've grown alfalfa for

944
00:28:18,130 --> 00:28:19,390
seed on a regular basis.

945
00:28:20,450 --> 00:28:22,869
And I just, I couldn't make the

946
00:28:22,869 --> 00:28:23,750
production that some of these

947
00:28:23,750 --> 00:28:24,930
other guys could on their

948
00:28:24,930 --> 00:28:27,049
ground. So I didn't see the

949
00:28:27,049 --> 00:28:28,890
point in putting $120 worth of

950
00:28:28,890 --> 00:28:29,690
expense

951
00:28:30,089 --> 00:28:31,769
for something that even with

952
00:28:32,049 --> 00:28:33,049
that, I would make

953
00:28:33,750 --> 00:28:35,289
marginal yields.

954
00:28:35,869 --> 00:28:37,309
And when on the fields that I

955
00:28:37,309 --> 00:28:38,210
didn't spray,

956
00:28:38,640 --> 00:28:39,900
I made the same yields.

957
00:28:40,240 --> 00:28:42,980
So I haven't lost anything, in

958
00:28:42,980 --> 00:28:44,700
my opinion. And people look at

959
00:28:44,700 --> 00:28:45,640
my fields, and they'll tell me

960
00:28:45,640 --> 00:28:46,599
if I had done it, I'd have made

961
00:28:46,599 --> 00:28:47,579
200 extra pounds.

962
00:28:47,779 --> 00:28:48,579
But

963
00:28:48,599 --> 00:28:49,399
I

964
00:28:49,440 --> 00:28:50,779
don't really agree.

965
00:28:51,480 --> 00:28:52,680
I think that it would have been

966
00:28:52,680 --> 00:28:53,480
the same

967
00:28:53,529 --> 00:28:55,109
whether I sprayed or whether I

968
00:28:55,109 --> 00:28:55,909
had left it alone.

969
00:28:56,619 --> 00:28:57,839
When you consider that cocktail

970
00:28:57,839 --> 00:28:58,839
that you're describing, you had

971
00:28:58,839 --> 00:28:59,839
a pretty heavy dose of

972
00:28:59,839 --> 00:29:00,639
herbicides there.

973
00:29:00,960 --> 00:29:04,000
Has not putting on those

974
00:29:04,000 --> 00:29:05,500
herbicides affected your seed

975
00:29:05,500 --> 00:29:07,779
purity in the alfalfa in any

976
00:29:07,779 --> 00:29:08,579
way?

977
00:29:07,839 --> 00:29:08,920
My germination rate has gone

978
00:29:08,920 --> 00:29:09,720
through the roof.

979
00:29:11,240 --> 00:29:12,039
Okay, that's,

980
00:29:12,839 --> 00:29:13,639
wow.

981
00:29:13,859 --> 00:29:14,659
How

982
00:29:14,859 --> 00:29:15,960
has your germination rate

983
00:29:15,960 --> 00:29:17,799
changed from historically to

984
00:29:17,799 --> 00:29:18,599
present?

985
00:29:20,480 --> 00:29:21,279
It's relative.

986
00:29:21,460 --> 00:29:23,039
Through the roof, to me, means I

987
00:29:23,039 --> 00:29:24,420
have another half of a percent

988
00:29:24,420 --> 00:29:25,299
germination rate.

989
00:29:25,440 --> 00:29:26,240
In alfalfa,

990
00:29:26,599 --> 00:29:30,069
99 % germination rate is the

991
00:29:31,400 --> 00:29:32,980
bare minimum that you want.

992
00:29:33,509 --> 00:29:34,769
And I would have stuff in the

993
00:29:34,769 --> 00:29:36,410
98s, 97s.

994
00:29:37,569 --> 00:29:40,470
Now my germination rate is

995
00:29:40,470 --> 00:29:43,349
upwards of 99 .8, 99

996
00:29:43,349 --> 00:29:44,149
.7.

997
00:29:44,529 --> 00:29:46,450
One of the seed wholesalers that

998
00:29:46,450 --> 00:29:47,250
I work through

999
00:29:47,839 --> 00:29:49,480
their number one grade and

1000
00:29:49,480 --> 00:29:51,420
number two grade differs by one

1001
00:29:51,420 --> 00:29:52,220
-tenth of a percent.

1002
00:29:52,299 --> 00:29:54,660
If I'm 99 .5, I'm number one.

1003
00:29:55,059 --> 00:29:57,539
If I'm 99 .4, I'm number two.

1004
00:29:57,960 --> 00:29:59,460
And you lose about 10 cents,

1005
00:30:00,089 --> 00:30:02,529
if not a little bit more per

1006
00:30:02,809 --> 00:30:04,130
pound.

1007
00:30:05,269 --> 00:30:08,250
So it's gone from in the 97s and

1008
00:30:08,250 --> 00:30:10,410
98s, some of it was 96s,

1009
00:30:10,950 --> 00:30:12,589
all the way up to the last

1010
00:30:12,589 --> 00:30:14,150
germination test I got was 99

1011
00:30:14,150 --> 00:30:14,950
.7.

1012
00:30:16,420 --> 00:30:17,940
Actually, I think there was a 99

1013
00:30:17,940 --> 00:30:19,119
.8 in there also.

1014
00:30:20,990 --> 00:30:21,869
Okay, this is a slightly

1015
00:30:21,869 --> 00:30:23,509
different question or response

1016
00:30:23,509 --> 00:30:24,509
than the question I was asking.

1017
00:30:24,630 --> 00:30:25,869
I was actually asking about if

1018
00:30:25,869 --> 00:30:27,089
you have any contamination with

1019
00:30:27,089 --> 00:30:27,930
other weed seeds or anything

1020
00:30:27,930 --> 00:30:28,730
like that.

1021
00:30:29,569 --> 00:30:32,910
So you're ascribing the

1022
00:30:32,910 --> 00:30:35,029
improvement in germination rate

1023
00:30:35,029 --> 00:30:36,509
to a lack of herbicides

1024
00:30:36,509 --> 00:30:37,309
primarily?

1025
00:30:39,470 --> 00:30:40,829
Prescribing it to my entire

1026
00:30:40,829 --> 00:30:42,990
practice of no herbicides,

1027
00:30:43,769 --> 00:30:45,009
no sprays,

1028
00:30:46,529 --> 00:30:47,829
soil inoculations,

1029
00:30:48,529 --> 00:30:49,329
a different

1030
00:30:49,589 --> 00:30:52,150
minor nutrient regimen,

1031
00:30:53,190 --> 00:30:55,299
and a lot of just

1032
00:30:55,680 --> 00:30:57,720
management practices that have

1033
00:30:57,720 --> 00:30:59,240
changed. Maybe I'm a better seed

1034
00:30:59,240 --> 00:31:00,180
grower. Maybe it's been five

1035
00:31:00,180 --> 00:31:01,440
years. I'm learning the ropes.

1036
00:31:01,539 --> 00:31:04,279
I don't know. But I don't think

1037
00:31:04,279 --> 00:31:05,079
that's the case.

1038
00:31:05,079 --> 00:31:06,980
I think that maybe I am a better

1039
00:31:06,980 --> 00:31:08,480
seed grower, but I don't think

1040
00:31:08,480 --> 00:31:10,599
that that's increasing my

1041
00:31:11,160 --> 00:31:12,559
germination. But the purity,

1042
00:31:12,799 --> 00:31:14,059
that's never been a problem.

1043
00:31:15,619 --> 00:31:18,279
With most of the weed seeds that

1044
00:31:18,279 --> 00:31:19,500
we have here, they're

1045
00:31:20,259 --> 00:31:21,059
of a

1046
00:31:21,400 --> 00:31:23,180
very different size than our

1047
00:31:23,180 --> 00:31:24,640
alfalfa seeds, so they're easy

1048
00:31:24,640 --> 00:31:27,619
to mill out or to

1049
00:31:27,619 --> 00:31:28,419
get

1050
00:31:29,430 --> 00:31:30,230
out in the combine.

1051
00:31:30,289 --> 00:31:31,470
The combines are able to take

1052
00:31:31,470 --> 00:31:32,269
them out pretty easily.

1053
00:31:32,470 --> 00:31:33,589
The only ones we have a problem

1054
00:31:33,589 --> 00:31:35,769
with are Dotter and Curly Dock,

1055
00:31:36,069 --> 00:31:37,990
and Curly Dock's pretty easy to

1056
00:31:37,990 --> 00:31:39,710
spot. It's bright red out in the

1057
00:31:39,710 --> 00:31:40,509
middle of the field.

1058
00:31:40,269 --> 00:31:41,170
You can go pluck it out

1059
00:31:41,869 --> 00:31:42,869
if you have any.

1060
00:31:43,549 --> 00:31:44,509
And Dotter,

1061
00:31:45,039 --> 00:31:46,200
little harder to spot.

1062
00:31:46,519 --> 00:31:47,740
I did have a bit of

1063
00:31:47,740 --> 00:31:49,039
contamination with daughter this

1064
00:31:49,039 --> 00:31:49,839
year,

1065
00:31:49,980 --> 00:31:51,319
but between me and the seed

1066
00:31:51,319 --> 00:31:52,519
miller aren't sure whether it

1067
00:31:52,519 --> 00:31:53,319
came from

1068
00:31:53,539 --> 00:31:56,039
my field or whether it came from

1069
00:31:56,480 --> 00:31:58,710
either a contaminated combine.

1070
00:31:59,029 --> 00:32:01,109
And it was there was literally

1071
00:32:01,109 --> 00:32:02,950
one daughter in a pound of

1072
00:32:02,950 --> 00:32:04,829
alfalfa seed, which is enough to

1073
00:32:04,829 --> 00:32:05,629
to

1074
00:32:05,680 --> 00:32:06,859
bring down the purity to

1075
00:32:07,069 --> 00:32:08,309
critical levels.

1076
00:32:08,349 --> 00:32:09,250
They have to run it through

1077
00:32:09,250 --> 00:32:11,490
another machine to clean the

1078
00:32:11,490 --> 00:32:12,289
daughter out.

1079
00:32:12,109 --> 00:32:13,890
But daughter has a rough texture

1080
00:32:13,890 --> 00:32:15,430
on the outside and

1081
00:32:16,150 --> 00:32:18,029
alfalfa seeds are smooth so they

1082
00:32:18,029 --> 00:32:18,829
run it over

1083
00:32:19,180 --> 00:32:21,329
essentially velcro and the

1084
00:32:21,329 --> 00:32:23,009
daughter stick to the velcro and

1085
00:32:23,009 --> 00:32:25,650
the alfalfa seed keep sliding so

1086
00:32:25,650 --> 00:32:27,809
it'll be cleaned out no problem

1087
00:32:27,809 --> 00:32:30,680
and I'll be back into 99 %

1088
00:32:30,680 --> 00:32:31,480
purity.

1089
00:32:31,930 --> 00:32:32,730
Yeah

1090
00:32:33,410 --> 00:32:34,569
all right so

1091
00:32:35,170 --> 00:32:37,349
you mentioned you're

1092
00:32:37,660 --> 00:32:39,819
giving credit to that the

1093
00:32:39,819 --> 00:32:40,950
compost of all the various

1094
00:32:40,950 --> 00:32:41,750
things that you're doing.

1095
00:32:41,809 --> 00:32:42,950
And so far, we've talked

1096
00:32:42,950 --> 00:32:43,910
primarily about the

1097
00:32:44,319 --> 00:32:45,880
reductions in pesticide

1098
00:32:45,880 --> 00:32:47,059
applications. And I still have

1099
00:32:47,059 --> 00:32:48,000
this thing in the back of my

1100
00:32:48,000 --> 00:32:48,980
mind that I'm going to come back

1101
00:32:48,980 --> 00:32:50,240
and talk more about this boron

1102
00:32:50,240 --> 00:32:52,519
issue as well. But let's talk a

1103
00:32:52,519 --> 00:32:54,099
bit about what are some of the

1104
00:32:54,099 --> 00:32:55,160
other changes that you've been

1105
00:32:55,160 --> 00:32:55,960
making?

1106
00:32:55,599 --> 00:32:56,640
You mentioned the inoculation

1107
00:32:56,640 --> 00:32:57,440
and the trace mineral

1108
00:32:57,400 --> 00:32:58,460
applications and things that

1109
00:32:58,460 --> 00:32:59,259
you've been working on.

1110
00:33:00,049 --> 00:33:01,690
Yeah, I inoculated for the first

1111
00:33:01,690 --> 00:33:02,549
time last year.

1112
00:33:03,910 --> 00:33:05,970
My alfalfa seed

1113
00:33:08,039 --> 00:33:09,500
is also one of the changes that

1114
00:33:09,500 --> 00:33:11,500
I made. I only use my own seed

1115
00:33:11,500 --> 00:33:14,440
now, because I make enough that

1116
00:33:14,440 --> 00:33:15,380
I can sell it,

1117
00:33:16,279 --> 00:33:18,710
sell probably 90 % of it and use

1118
00:33:18,710 --> 00:33:20,910
10 % for myself, if not less

1119
00:33:20,910 --> 00:33:22,109
than 10%. You

1120
00:33:22,420 --> 00:33:23,220
don't,

1121
00:33:23,339 --> 00:33:24,579
for the seed that you plant, you

1122
00:33:24,579 --> 00:33:25,880
get a lot more than that off of

1123
00:33:25,880 --> 00:33:26,680
it.

1124
00:33:27,150 --> 00:33:30,119
So I haven't had to buy seed.

1125
00:33:30,789 --> 00:33:32,170
And so I know it's coming off of

1126
00:33:32,170 --> 00:33:32,970
my field,

1127
00:33:33,430 --> 00:33:34,230
my regiment,

1128
00:33:35,390 --> 00:33:36,190
my

1129
00:33:36,190 --> 00:33:38,349
soil microbiome, all the things

1130
00:33:38,349 --> 00:33:40,809
that are conducive to me having

1131
00:33:41,359 --> 00:33:42,339
a better

1132
00:33:43,099 --> 00:33:44,940
beginning and a better final

1133
00:33:44,940 --> 00:33:45,740
product.

1134
00:33:46,180 --> 00:33:49,079
The micronutrients here in the

1135
00:33:49,079 --> 00:33:49,879
Imperial Valley,

1136
00:33:50,000 --> 00:33:51,619
we would do some soil sampling.

1137
00:33:51,779 --> 00:33:52,759
My dad and I never

1138
00:33:53,069 --> 00:33:55,769
did any petiole samples or

1139
00:33:55,769 --> 00:33:57,049
anything of the sort, but I

1140
00:33:57,049 --> 00:33:58,549
started doing some sap samples

1141
00:33:58,549 --> 00:34:01,710
and working with you guys to get

1142
00:34:01,710 --> 00:34:02,509
a

1143
00:34:03,009 --> 00:34:05,630
better grasp on the

1144
00:34:06,009 --> 00:34:08,730
soil micronutrients

1145
00:34:08,730 --> 00:34:10,210
and the

1146
00:34:11,159 --> 00:34:13,320
mining of the soil nutrients

1147
00:34:13,320 --> 00:34:14,500
that are in there to help

1148
00:34:15,079 --> 00:34:16,659
get the plant onto a more

1149
00:34:16,659 --> 00:34:18,260
balanced footing and a better,

1150
00:34:20,559 --> 00:34:21,579
just a better base.

1151
00:34:23,039 --> 00:34:25,239
You have some interesting soil

1152
00:34:25,239 --> 00:34:26,460
challenges to deal with, with

1153
00:34:26,460 --> 00:34:27,760
the salinity and the alkalinity

1154
00:34:27,760 --> 00:34:29,360
and the challenges that you have

1155
00:34:29,360 --> 00:34:30,160
there.

1156
00:34:29,659 --> 00:34:31,019
So how have you been addressing

1157
00:34:31,019 --> 00:34:32,320
some of those trace mineral

1158
00:34:32,320 --> 00:34:33,440
imbalances that you've been

1159
00:34:33,440 --> 00:34:34,240
uncovering?

1160
00:34:35,210 --> 00:34:36,409
The main

1161
00:34:36,789 --> 00:34:37,590
one before,

1162
00:34:37,809 --> 00:34:39,849
what we would do is to

1163
00:34:39,849 --> 00:34:40,969
counteract the salts,

1164
00:34:41,329 --> 00:34:42,130
we would put

1165
00:34:42,239 --> 00:34:44,340
a, we have a liquid

1166
00:34:45,360 --> 00:34:47,300
calcium product that we would

1167
00:34:47,300 --> 00:34:49,900
put on and it would help leach

1168
00:34:49,900 --> 00:34:51,440
out the salts, bind the calcium

1169
00:34:51,440 --> 00:34:52,880
to the sodium, help leach it out

1170
00:34:52,880 --> 00:34:53,680
in the tile lines.

1171
00:34:54,949 --> 00:34:56,769
It also increased the, or helped

1172
00:34:56,769 --> 00:34:57,750
with the soil structure.

1173
00:34:59,090 --> 00:35:00,230
So we would do that.

1174
00:35:00,329 --> 00:35:02,519
And then the other thing that we

1175
00:35:02,519 --> 00:35:03,320
would do, because we're on a

1176
00:35:03,300 --> 00:35:04,100
clay soil,

1177
00:35:04,880 --> 00:35:05,680
we would put

1178
00:35:06,300 --> 00:35:07,639
a lot of nitrogen.

1179
00:35:08,570 --> 00:35:09,530
We upped

1180
00:35:09,909 --> 00:35:12,190
our nitrogen depending on what

1181
00:35:12,190 --> 00:35:14,869
we had by up to 20 % on some

1182
00:35:15,179 --> 00:35:17,820
fields, some crops to

1183
00:35:18,389 --> 00:35:19,949
help with. We also have high

1184
00:35:19,949 --> 00:35:21,250
calcium soils, which doesn't

1185
00:35:21,250 --> 00:35:22,369
make any sense that I would put

1186
00:35:22,369 --> 00:35:23,269
calcium on, but,

1187
00:35:23,599 --> 00:35:24,980
you know, the forms of calcium

1188
00:35:24,980 --> 00:35:26,199
are different than

1189
00:35:26,539 --> 00:35:28,340
in that it's a plant available

1190
00:35:28,340 --> 00:35:29,140
calcium.

1191
00:35:30,079 --> 00:35:32,349
So we would do that to manage

1192
00:35:32,349 --> 00:35:33,150
the

1193
00:35:33,610 --> 00:35:36,289
salt and the sodium, I mean, the

1194
00:35:36,289 --> 00:35:38,090
calcium tying everything up.

1195
00:35:39,460 --> 00:35:41,460
Now I'm working to

1196
00:35:42,699 --> 00:35:44,920
use sap samples, look at what's

1197
00:35:44,920 --> 00:35:46,260
going on in the plant, rather

1198
00:35:46,260 --> 00:35:47,340
than just kind of guessing.

1199
00:35:47,820 --> 00:35:49,019
Before we did NPK,

1200
00:35:49,320 --> 00:35:50,920
and we didn't really do a lot of

1201
00:35:50,920 --> 00:35:51,720
K.

1202
00:35:51,619 --> 00:35:53,480
It was mostly nitrogen

1203
00:35:54,530 --> 00:35:55,330
and potassium.

1204
00:35:56,909 --> 00:35:58,050
And then we would do nitrogen

1205
00:35:58,050 --> 00:35:59,250
and phosphorus.

1206
00:35:59,630 --> 00:36:00,430
Yeah, sorry.

1207
00:36:00,570 --> 00:36:02,010
And then we would do a little

1208
00:36:02,010 --> 00:36:03,409
bit of potassium for

1209
00:36:03,750 --> 00:36:05,769
root development here and there.

1210
00:36:06,030 --> 00:36:08,429
And most farmers around here

1211
00:36:08,940 --> 00:36:09,780
don't

1212
00:36:10,380 --> 00:36:11,480
even think about it.

1213
00:36:12,869 --> 00:36:14,250
The only other thing we would do

1214
00:36:14,250 --> 00:36:15,289
that was a little bit

1215
00:36:15,760 --> 00:36:17,340
outside of the norms, we would

1216
00:36:17,340 --> 00:36:18,380
put a

1217
00:36:18,849 --> 00:36:20,150
sulfur solution

1218
00:36:20,530 --> 00:36:23,090
on to help with the nitrogen

1219
00:36:23,090 --> 00:36:23,890
uptake.

1220
00:36:24,130 --> 00:36:26,349
But now I've started working

1221
00:36:26,349 --> 00:36:27,690
with a lot of different

1222
00:36:27,690 --> 00:36:29,150
chemicals that I never even, or

1223
00:36:29,150 --> 00:36:30,050
not chemicals, but

1224
00:36:30,400 --> 00:36:31,760
that I never even thought of,

1225
00:36:32,519 --> 00:36:35,340
like molybdenum and copper.

1226
00:36:36,690 --> 00:36:37,490
The

1227
00:36:37,420 --> 00:36:38,739
only time I ever thought about

1228
00:36:38,739 --> 00:36:39,940
copper before was for a

1229
00:36:39,940 --> 00:36:41,820
fungicide. Now I'm using it for

1230
00:36:41,820 --> 00:36:45,110
increased pollen vitality, for

1231
00:36:45,110 --> 00:36:47,130
just plant vigor.

1232
00:36:47,889 --> 00:36:51,239
And then the molybdenum, I have

1233
00:36:51,679 --> 00:36:53,159
really seen a difference in

1234
00:36:53,159 --> 00:36:55,309
using molybdenum and my

1235
00:36:55,309 --> 00:36:56,110
nitrogen.

1236
00:36:56,420 --> 00:36:57,980
I've cut my nitrogen back by

1237
00:36:57,980 --> 00:36:59,599
about 20 % hopefully gonna cut

1238
00:36:59,599 --> 00:37:00,539
it back a little bit more

1239
00:37:00,909 --> 00:37:02,670
I don't want to cut too much

1240
00:37:02,670 --> 00:37:03,989
back as I've

1241
00:37:05,039 --> 00:37:06,019
heard people say the grounds

1242
00:37:06,019 --> 00:37:08,099
kind of like a drug addict It's

1243
00:37:08,099 --> 00:37:10,619
hooked on all the conventional

1244
00:37:10,619 --> 00:37:11,840
products. You can't just pull it

1245
00:37:11,840 --> 00:37:13,780
off and not give it anything

1246
00:37:13,960 --> 00:37:16,699
It'll it'll kind of seize up and

1247
00:37:16,699 --> 00:37:18,519
well your plant won't be ready

1248
00:37:18,519 --> 00:37:19,320
for it.

1249
00:37:19,179 --> 00:37:20,739
So it'll go through withdrawal

1250
00:37:20,739 --> 00:37:22,920
symptoms So

1251
00:37:23,239 --> 00:37:25,039
that's that's been the main

1252
00:37:25,039 --> 00:37:27,219
changes that I've made has been

1253
00:37:28,409 --> 00:37:29,969
to balance the

1254
00:37:30,380 --> 00:37:32,679
miners so that the

1255
00:37:33,059 --> 00:37:35,159
macro nutrients are more

1256
00:37:35,469 --> 00:37:38,570
plant available and the ones

1257
00:37:38,909 --> 00:37:40,090
that are in the plant are used

1258
00:37:40,090 --> 00:37:42,329
to the highest benefit of the

1259
00:37:42,329 --> 00:37:43,130
plant.

1260
00:37:43,300 --> 00:37:44,239
In those alkaline soil

1261
00:37:44,239 --> 00:37:45,780
conditions, how are you

1262
00:37:45,780 --> 00:37:47,440
addressing those trace minerals?

1263
00:37:47,539 --> 00:37:48,780
Are you adding them in your

1264
00:37:48,780 --> 00:37:49,699
irrigation solution?

1265
00:37:49,920 --> 00:37:51,059
You're adding them to the soil.

1266
00:37:51,219 --> 00:37:52,639
How are you ensuring they get

1267
00:37:52,639 --> 00:37:53,440
into the plant?

1268
00:37:53,699 --> 00:37:55,260
The only trace mineral that I

1269
00:37:55,260 --> 00:37:58,460
apply to the soil is solubor or

1270
00:37:58,460 --> 00:38:01,119
boron through the irrigation

1271
00:38:01,119 --> 00:38:01,920
water.

1272
00:38:02,579 --> 00:38:04,320
And I also put a calcium

1273
00:38:04,320 --> 00:38:05,900
solution in with it when I do

1274
00:38:05,900 --> 00:38:07,739
that. But everything else, any

1275
00:38:07,739 --> 00:38:09,099
of the minors are foliar.

1276
00:38:09,780 --> 00:38:10,580
I

1277
00:38:10,280 --> 00:38:11,320
don't

1278
00:38:11,760 --> 00:38:13,980
think in our soil that with the

1279
00:38:13,980 --> 00:38:15,219
small amounts that we use,

1280
00:38:15,849 --> 00:38:17,269
it would even make it to the

1281
00:38:17,269 --> 00:38:18,309
plant. I think it would have

1282
00:38:18,309 --> 00:38:21,239
tied up before it even had a

1283
00:38:21,239 --> 00:38:22,360
chance to get into the plant.

1284
00:38:22,440 --> 00:38:23,619
So I've been doing everything

1285
00:38:23,619 --> 00:38:24,420
foliarly.

1286
00:38:25,769 --> 00:38:26,630
Yeah, I think in your soil

1287
00:38:26,630 --> 00:38:27,909
conditions, that's probably

1288
00:38:27,909 --> 00:38:28,710
true.

1289
00:38:28,849 --> 00:38:30,369
And molybdenum actually is quite

1290
00:38:30,369 --> 00:38:31,409
available in alkaline soil

1291
00:38:31,409 --> 00:38:33,690
conditions, but that's an

1292
00:38:33,690 --> 00:38:34,490
exception.

1293
00:38:36,329 --> 00:38:38,210
So you mentioned boron again.

1294
00:38:40,039 --> 00:38:42,019
Remind me, I think you said that

1295
00:38:42,019 --> 00:38:44,079
you applied a pound of boron in

1296
00:38:44,079 --> 00:38:45,599
the irrigation system, and then

1297
00:38:45,599 --> 00:38:46,960
you did some foliar as well in

1298
00:38:46,960 --> 00:38:47,980
your alfalfa seed production?

1299
00:38:48,599 --> 00:38:49,400
So,

1300
00:38:49,699 --> 00:38:51,659
almost everything I put boron

1301
00:38:51,659 --> 00:38:54,360
when I went through foliarly,

1302
00:38:54,750 --> 00:38:56,489
I would put boron.

1303
00:38:56,710 --> 00:38:59,349
And now, everything that I do

1304
00:38:59,349 --> 00:39:01,010
with an irrigation, I put at

1305
00:39:01,010 --> 00:39:02,710
least one boron application,

1306
00:39:03,469 --> 00:39:04,570
and it is

1307
00:39:04,909 --> 00:39:07,489
five pounds to the acre

1308
00:39:07,829 --> 00:39:09,210
of soluble borer.

1309
00:39:09,739 --> 00:39:10,760
One pound per acre of actual

1310
00:39:10,760 --> 00:39:11,560
boron.

1311
00:39:11,760 --> 00:39:12,560
Oh,

1312
00:39:12,920 --> 00:39:13,720
yes.

1313
00:39:13,119 --> 00:39:13,920
Yeah.

1314
00:39:13,340 --> 00:39:14,320
Sorry, because it's a 20 %

1315
00:39:14,320 --> 00:39:15,120
solution. Yes.

1316
00:39:16,510 --> 00:39:18,730
What does your total boron

1317
00:39:18,730 --> 00:39:20,070
application look like over the

1318
00:39:20,070 --> 00:39:21,130
course of an entire 12 -month

1319
00:39:21,130 --> 00:39:21,930
season?

1320
00:39:23,210 --> 00:39:25,980
It's probably about,

1321
00:39:27,420 --> 00:39:30,460
I would say, between 6 and 7

1322
00:39:30,460 --> 00:39:32,400
pounds of boron depending

1323
00:39:33,090 --> 00:39:35,989
on however many waters I get and

1324
00:39:35,989 --> 00:39:36,789
cuttings.

1325
00:39:36,949 --> 00:39:38,289
Because every cutting I try and

1326
00:39:38,289 --> 00:39:39,090
put

1327
00:39:39,119 --> 00:39:41,340
an application of boron since

1328
00:39:41,340 --> 00:39:44,019
I've taken, if I do cut for

1329
00:39:45,719 --> 00:39:47,519
hay, I will put another

1330
00:39:47,519 --> 00:39:49,000
application of boron because I

1331
00:39:49,000 --> 00:39:50,659
just, you know, you're bailing

1332
00:39:50,659 --> 00:39:51,460
it off.

1333
00:39:51,059 --> 00:39:51,940
You're taking all the nutrients

1334
00:39:51,940 --> 00:39:52,740
out of the field.

1335
00:39:52,820 --> 00:39:54,639
But if I sheep it off, I won't,

1336
00:39:54,760 --> 00:39:56,000
I will probably do, I'll

1337
00:39:56,000 --> 00:39:57,219
probably skip that one and put

1338
00:39:57,219 --> 00:39:58,019
it on the next one.

1339
00:39:58,880 --> 00:39:59,699
So again,

1340
00:40:00,130 --> 00:40:01,289
just for clarification, when you

1341
00:40:01,289 --> 00:40:02,730
say six or seven pounds over the

1342
00:40:02,730 --> 00:40:03,650
course of the season, you're

1343
00:40:03,650 --> 00:40:05,010
referring to pounds of actual

1344
00:40:05,010 --> 00:40:05,810
boron.

1345
00:40:06,190 --> 00:40:06,990
Yes.

1346
00:40:07,099 --> 00:40:09,139
So I do, I do five pounds per

1347
00:40:09,139 --> 00:40:11,460
cutting of

1348
00:40:11,679 --> 00:40:14,139
alfalfa. So it ends up being

1349
00:40:14,139 --> 00:40:15,360
between five and six.

1350
00:40:15,829 --> 00:40:16,630
Yeah.

1351
00:40:17,630 --> 00:40:18,430
Yeah, so.

1352
00:40:21,059 --> 00:40:22,760
have it sounds what you're

1353
00:40:22,760 --> 00:40:24,820
describing is all is this

1354
00:40:24,820 --> 00:40:25,860
magical combination.

1355
00:40:26,119 --> 00:40:27,699
I've observed it in a number of

1356
00:40:27,699 --> 00:40:28,820
areas around the country where

1357
00:40:29,260 --> 00:40:30,119
you have

1358
00:40:30,780 --> 00:40:32,099
high calcium soils,

1359
00:40:32,550 --> 00:40:33,570
you have a strong calcium

1360
00:40:33,570 --> 00:40:35,050
foundation to work from.

1361
00:40:35,110 --> 00:40:35,910
And then, of course, you're

1362
00:40:35,789 --> 00:40:37,510
adding further calcium that is

1363
00:40:37,510 --> 00:40:38,449
actually plant available.

1364
00:40:39,690 --> 00:40:40,490
And

1365
00:40:40,469 --> 00:40:41,690
against

1366
00:40:42,030 --> 00:40:42,830
that

1367
00:40:42,739 --> 00:40:44,760
foundation of calcium, you are

1368
00:40:44,760 --> 00:40:45,860
leveraging boron.

1369
00:40:46,000 --> 00:40:47,960
And it seems every time I see

1370
00:40:47,960 --> 00:40:48,760
that

1371
00:40:48,780 --> 00:40:49,900
that

1372
00:40:50,469 --> 00:40:51,309
that combination,

1373
00:40:52,429 --> 00:40:54,210
Not only are there very strong

1374
00:40:54,210 --> 00:40:55,190
quality responses,

1375
00:40:55,550 --> 00:40:56,949
but there are also consistently

1376
00:40:56,949 --> 00:40:58,650
just simply exceptional yield

1377
00:40:58,650 --> 00:40:59,769
responses where we get very

1378
00:40:59,769 --> 00:41:00,570
strong yields.

1379
00:41:00,670 --> 00:41:02,289
So since you've been, how long

1380
00:41:02,289 --> 00:41:03,150
have you been doing the boron

1381
00:41:03,150 --> 00:41:03,950
and what,

1382
00:41:04,250 --> 00:41:05,909
aside, we spoke about the ligus

1383
00:41:05,909 --> 00:41:06,710
beetle,

1384
00:41:06,550 --> 00:41:07,610
the change in ligus beetle

1385
00:41:07,610 --> 00:41:08,550
pressure and insect pressure,

1386
00:41:08,690 --> 00:41:09,490
but

1387
00:41:09,119 --> 00:41:10,980
what changes have you observed

1388
00:41:10,980 --> 00:41:12,719
in crop yield and performance

1389
00:41:12,719 --> 00:41:13,739
and quality since you started

1390
00:41:13,739 --> 00:41:14,539
doing that?

1391
00:41:16,190 --> 00:41:17,550
The crop yield hasn't changed

1392
00:41:17,550 --> 00:41:18,350
just yet.

1393
00:41:19,570 --> 00:41:20,550
Our soils are very,

1394
00:41:20,929 --> 00:41:23,550
where I am, are extremely high

1395
00:41:23,550 --> 00:41:24,350
clay.

1396
00:41:24,690 --> 00:41:25,730
So most

1397
00:41:26,070 --> 00:41:27,949
things change very slowly in

1398
00:41:27,949 --> 00:41:28,750
there.

1399
00:41:28,510 --> 00:41:31,050
When you start adding minor

1400
00:41:31,199 --> 00:41:32,480
nutrients, they get tied up

1401
00:41:32,480 --> 00:41:34,159
pretty fast. They don't

1402
00:41:34,639 --> 00:41:36,000
show up in the plant for at

1403
00:41:36,000 --> 00:41:38,000
least a couple of years if you

1404
00:41:38,000 --> 00:41:39,280
do a

1405
00:41:40,639 --> 00:41:41,559
long -term treatment.

1406
00:41:42,400 --> 00:41:44,599
But the quality of the plants

1407
00:41:44,599 --> 00:41:46,099
has changed drastically.

1408
00:41:47,219 --> 00:41:48,019
The

1409
00:41:48,789 --> 00:41:50,769
Bermuda we watered back after

1410
00:41:50,769 --> 00:41:51,969
our seed harvest,

1411
00:41:53,110 --> 00:41:54,349
Because it's so hot here, we

1412
00:41:54,349 --> 00:41:55,909
have to keep it alive.

1413
00:41:56,010 --> 00:41:56,869
If we don't water it,

1414
00:41:57,309 --> 00:41:59,409
it'll die. You'll lose half

1415
00:41:59,409 --> 00:42:02,440
the established crop.

1416
00:42:03,119 --> 00:42:05,340
So I watered it back,

1417
00:42:05,719 --> 00:42:06,519
and

1418
00:42:06,489 --> 00:42:08,449
no fertilizer whatsoever, just

1419
00:42:08,730 --> 00:42:09,530
put

1420
00:42:09,599 --> 00:42:11,000
irrigation water on it.

1421
00:42:11,260 --> 00:42:12,519
And I had people calling me

1422
00:42:12,519 --> 00:42:13,820
asking me how much fertilizer I

1423
00:42:13,820 --> 00:42:14,820
put, how many pounds of

1424
00:42:14,820 --> 00:42:16,460
nitrogen. did I have on because

1425
00:42:16,460 --> 00:42:17,260
it looked

1426
00:42:17,260 --> 00:42:18,219
better than

1427
00:42:18,570 --> 00:42:20,070
any other fields around the

1428
00:42:20,070 --> 00:42:20,870
area.

1429
00:42:21,300 --> 00:42:22,100
And I had not put,

1430
00:42:22,340 --> 00:42:23,679
granted, there's probably some

1431
00:42:23,679 --> 00:42:25,460
residual from the

1432
00:42:26,570 --> 00:42:28,010
Bermuda crop before,

1433
00:42:28,349 --> 00:42:30,809
but not that much to

1434
00:42:31,119 --> 00:42:32,219
where it would look this

1435
00:42:32,440 --> 00:42:33,719
vigorous and

1436
00:42:35,630 --> 00:42:36,430
healthy.

1437
00:42:37,059 --> 00:42:38,900
So that's one of the things that

1438
00:42:38,900 --> 00:42:40,380
I've noticed is the plant

1439
00:42:40,920 --> 00:42:42,019
bounces back.

1440
00:42:42,340 --> 00:42:43,159
a lot better.

1441
00:42:43,900 --> 00:42:45,400
I've got two alfalfa fields that

1442
00:42:45,400 --> 00:42:46,219
are side by side.

1443
00:42:46,719 --> 00:42:48,500
One was inoculated and treated

1444
00:42:48,500 --> 00:42:50,590
with the boron all year long.

1445
00:42:51,400 --> 00:42:54,219
One wasn't inoculated and got a

1446
00:42:54,219 --> 00:42:55,800
boron treatment during its seed

1447
00:42:55,800 --> 00:42:56,600
production,

1448
00:42:57,360 --> 00:42:59,210
and I'm going to have to replant

1449
00:42:59,210 --> 00:43:00,130
that entire field.

1450
00:43:00,739 --> 00:43:02,539
The one that was inoculated and

1451
00:43:02,539 --> 00:43:03,340
got the boron,

1452
00:43:03,949 --> 00:43:04,989
I don't know if I'm going to

1453
00:43:04,989 --> 00:43:05,829
have to replant it all.

1454
00:43:06,170 --> 00:43:08,739
It came back from the summer and

1455
00:43:08,739 --> 00:43:09,639
is looking

1456
00:43:10,440 --> 00:43:11,480
It's ragged right now.

1457
00:43:11,619 --> 00:43:13,159
It needs to be sheathed off and

1458
00:43:13,159 --> 00:43:13,960
cleaned up.

1459
00:43:14,639 --> 00:43:15,440
But

1460
00:43:15,300 --> 00:43:17,119
none of it died.

1461
00:43:17,519 --> 00:43:19,599
Usually here, we have such a hot

1462
00:43:19,599 --> 00:43:20,400
summer,

1463
00:43:20,239 --> 00:43:21,880
and our soils are so tight

1464
00:43:22,860 --> 00:43:24,840
that the water sits on it for

1465
00:43:24,840 --> 00:43:26,000
too long, and it will scald out

1466
00:43:26,000 --> 00:43:27,880
the alfalfa. In some

1467
00:43:28,360 --> 00:43:29,300
fields, you'll lose the entire

1468
00:43:29,300 --> 00:43:30,100
field.

1469
00:43:30,179 --> 00:43:31,420
Other fields, you'll lose

1470
00:43:31,789 --> 00:43:32,869
50%.

1471
00:43:32,869 --> 00:43:34,329
And then on the sandier soils,

1472
00:43:34,449 --> 00:43:36,010
you don't lose any, because it

1473
00:43:36,010 --> 00:43:37,469
doesn't sit. It's on and off so

1474
00:43:37,469 --> 00:43:38,269
fast.

1475
00:43:38,150 --> 00:43:40,690
But all the boron fields have

1476
00:43:40,690 --> 00:43:41,490
come back.

1477
00:43:42,510 --> 00:43:44,190
a lot faster and a lot healthier

1478
00:43:44,190 --> 00:43:45,309
than the fields that didn't have

1479
00:43:45,309 --> 00:43:46,110
it.

1480
00:43:46,329 --> 00:43:47,590
You mentioned the inoculation as

1481
00:43:47,590 --> 00:43:48,390
well.

1482
00:43:47,909 --> 00:43:48,710
Was it inoculated with

1483
00:43:48,630 --> 00:43:49,430
mycorrhizal fungi?

1484
00:43:49,530 --> 00:43:50,349
What was the inoculation?

1485
00:43:51,800 --> 00:43:53,590
With your product,

1486
00:43:54,050 --> 00:43:55,909
the PBS.

1487
00:43:56,539 --> 00:43:57,340
The BioCoat Gold?

1488
00:43:57,539 --> 00:43:59,099
No, well, BioCoat Gold was in

1489
00:43:59,099 --> 00:44:00,960
the seed, but I inoculated the

1490
00:44:00,960 --> 00:44:01,840
soil with...

1491
00:44:02,440 --> 00:44:03,780
I'm drawing a blank on the name,

1492
00:44:03,880 --> 00:44:04,680
but it's... Spectrum.

1493
00:44:05,639 --> 00:44:07,780
Yeah, Spectrum PBS, the...

1494
00:44:07,780 --> 00:44:08,580
Yep,

1495
00:44:09,340 --> 00:44:10,140
Phosphorus Soluble.

1496
00:44:10,110 --> 00:44:10,910
bacteria.

1497
00:44:11,380 --> 00:44:13,360
So that was because I had a lot

1498
00:44:13,360 --> 00:44:14,160
of

1499
00:44:15,070 --> 00:44:16,070
tied up phosphorus,

1500
00:44:16,389 --> 00:44:17,849
we decided that that would be

1501
00:44:17,849 --> 00:44:18,650
the way to go.

1502
00:44:18,530 --> 00:44:20,320
I think this year we're going to

1503
00:44:20,320 --> 00:44:22,619
switch to the DS because of all

1504
00:44:22,619 --> 00:44:25,559
the salinity and because it's a

1505
00:44:25,559 --> 00:44:26,639
lot of drought stress in the

1506
00:44:26,639 --> 00:44:27,440
summertime.

1507
00:44:27,670 --> 00:44:30,320
But the phosphorus solubilizing

1508
00:44:30,320 --> 00:44:31,120
bacteria,

1509
00:44:31,059 --> 00:44:32,440
I think it did a great job

1510
00:44:32,440 --> 00:44:34,440
because I never ran low on

1511
00:44:34,440 --> 00:44:35,619
phosphorus and I never applied

1512
00:44:35,619 --> 00:44:36,420
any.

1513
00:44:37,239 --> 00:44:39,679
So I have a follow -up question

1514
00:44:39,679 --> 00:44:41,920
on the boron with the boron soil

1515
00:44:41,920 --> 00:44:42,720
applications.

1516
00:44:44,320 --> 00:44:46,219
You mentioned your high clay

1517
00:44:46,219 --> 00:44:47,480
content soils and you sometimes

1518
00:44:47,480 --> 00:44:49,480
have difficulty getting applied

1519
00:44:49,480 --> 00:44:51,400
trace minerals and minor

1520
00:44:51,400 --> 00:44:52,599
elements into the plant.

1521
00:44:53,409 --> 00:44:54,969
How have you seen boron move

1522
00:44:54,969 --> 00:44:56,230
from that soil application in

1523
00:44:56,230 --> 00:44:57,030
the SAP analysis?

1524
00:44:59,059 --> 00:45:00,139
I've seen it

1525
00:45:00,519 --> 00:45:02,239
in the SAP analysis.

1526
00:45:02,699 --> 00:45:04,179
It showed up not nearly as

1527
00:45:04,179 --> 00:45:06,099
strong as for the application

1528
00:45:06,099 --> 00:45:07,539
because it's

1529
00:45:09,090 --> 00:45:09,989
It's just not getting in the

1530
00:45:09,989 --> 00:45:11,730
plant. Where it really showed up

1531
00:45:11,730 --> 00:45:13,250
and you could see it moving was

1532
00:45:13,250 --> 00:45:15,210
the foliar application of the

1533
00:45:15,210 --> 00:45:16,010
boron.

1534
00:45:15,860 --> 00:45:18,559
But it's just so easy to put the

1535
00:45:18,559 --> 00:45:19,820
soluble in the water.

1536
00:45:20,219 --> 00:45:21,019
And it's cheap.

1537
00:45:21,320 --> 00:45:22,120
Exactly.

1538
00:45:22,219 --> 00:45:23,599
That I do that.

1539
00:45:23,760 --> 00:45:24,860
But I'll

1540
00:45:25,360 --> 00:45:27,320
never depend on that anymore now

1541
00:45:27,320 --> 00:45:29,400
that I've seen an entire year of

1542
00:45:29,400 --> 00:45:30,320
foliar applications,

1543
00:45:30,719 --> 00:45:33,400
which was never a thing on our

1544
00:45:33,400 --> 00:45:34,280
ranch that we did.

1545
00:45:34,340 --> 00:45:35,140
We ran everything.

1546
00:45:35,179 --> 00:45:38,309
Either we dry spread urea and 11

1547
00:45:38,309 --> 00:45:39,110
-52.

1548
00:45:39,389 --> 00:45:41,389
or we water ran all of our

1549
00:45:41,800 --> 00:45:43,559
other fertilizer, our liquid

1550
00:45:43,559 --> 00:45:45,980
UN32s and AN20s and things like

1551
00:45:45,980 --> 00:45:46,780
that.

1552
00:45:48,030 --> 00:45:49,110
I will

1553
00:45:49,769 --> 00:45:51,630
never not do a foliar spray

1554
00:45:51,630 --> 00:45:53,469
going forward because I just

1555
00:45:53,469 --> 00:45:54,269
have seen

1556
00:45:54,380 --> 00:45:55,180
the

1557
00:45:55,420 --> 00:45:58,039
value of it in how fast it gets

1558
00:45:58,039 --> 00:45:59,840
into the plant and the

1559
00:46:00,539 --> 00:46:02,619
small amounts that I can get

1560
00:46:03,190 --> 00:46:04,969
a large boost

1561
00:46:05,010 --> 00:46:06,889
in the plant using,

1562
00:46:08,289 --> 00:46:09,710
I mean, if I were to run it in

1563
00:46:09,710 --> 00:46:10,969
the water, it would get so lost

1564
00:46:10,969 --> 00:46:13,429
in my water that it wouldn't.

1565
00:46:13,639 --> 00:46:14,440
Yeah, you don't even see

1566
00:46:14,440 --> 00:46:15,240
anything.

1567
00:46:15,139 --> 00:46:15,940
Yeah.

1568
00:46:15,829 --> 00:46:17,070
So but if you put it on, I put

1569
00:46:17,070 --> 00:46:17,870
it on foliarly,

1570
00:46:18,440 --> 00:46:20,500
I have a big spray boom, I go

1571
00:46:20,500 --> 00:46:21,960
through there, I can knock out a

1572
00:46:21,960 --> 00:46:23,699
field in a day,

1573
00:46:24,019 --> 00:46:25,679
and then we water right

1574
00:46:25,679 --> 00:46:27,360
afterwards. And it's, it's

1575
00:46:27,360 --> 00:46:28,160
great.

1576
00:46:29,059 --> 00:46:30,239
Out of curiosity, what form of

1577
00:46:30,239 --> 00:46:31,159
boron were you using in your

1578
00:46:31,159 --> 00:46:31,960
foliar?

1579
00:46:32,340 --> 00:46:33,140
Rebound.

1580
00:46:33,369 --> 00:46:34,170
Rebound boron.

1581
00:46:34,739 --> 00:46:35,699
It's an important point, and

1582
00:46:35,699 --> 00:46:38,059
I've posted a couple of clips on

1583
00:46:38,059 --> 00:46:39,440
this, but it's worth

1584
00:46:39,440 --> 00:46:40,659
reiterating, reminding people,

1585
00:46:40,739 --> 00:46:41,900
because we get these awesome

1586
00:46:41,900 --> 00:46:43,480
results from boron.

1587
00:46:45,019 --> 00:46:46,679
There's a handful of crops that

1588
00:46:46,679 --> 00:46:48,840
can thrive and can transport

1589
00:46:49,380 --> 00:46:50,960
solubor if it's applied as a

1590
00:46:50,960 --> 00:46:51,960
foliar, but for the most part,

1591
00:46:52,059 --> 00:46:52,900
you have to have the chelated

1592
00:46:52,900 --> 00:46:54,260
boron. Otherwise, it's phloem

1593
00:46:54,260 --> 00:46:55,719
immobile. You apply solubor, and

1594
00:46:55,719 --> 00:46:56,599
you don't

1595
00:46:57,159 --> 00:46:59,179
get the types of responses that

1596
00:46:59,179 --> 00:47:00,539
you're describing that you

1597
00:47:00,539 --> 00:47:02,139
experienced, and then people are

1598
00:47:02,139 --> 00:47:03,219
puzzled about why that is the

1599
00:47:03,219 --> 00:47:04,019
case.

1600
00:47:04,409 --> 00:47:05,789
That's what I found with almost

1601
00:47:05,789 --> 00:47:06,889
any of the fertilizers.

1602
00:47:07,369 --> 00:47:09,010
The company that I also work

1603
00:47:09,010 --> 00:47:11,469
for, we have a chelated sulfur,

1604
00:47:11,969 --> 00:47:12,769
potassium,

1605
00:47:13,159 --> 00:47:14,980
and phosphorus that

1606
00:47:15,969 --> 00:47:19,210
is 95 % available,

1607
00:47:19,289 --> 00:47:20,989
as opposed to the opposite in

1608
00:47:20,989 --> 00:47:23,469
1152, that's 95 % tied up.

1609
00:47:23,710 --> 00:47:24,510
And

1610
00:47:24,369 --> 00:47:26,590
it gets into the plant, it

1611
00:47:26,590 --> 00:47:27,390
moves,

1612
00:47:27,510 --> 00:47:28,310
it's,

1613
00:47:28,170 --> 00:47:29,230
you can, I mean, they've,

1614
00:47:29,829 --> 00:47:30,630
the

1615
00:47:31,449 --> 00:47:33,869
company that started it has a,

1616
00:47:35,349 --> 00:47:36,570
where they did the radioactive

1617
00:47:36,570 --> 00:47:37,670
dyeing, you can see it moving

1618
00:47:37,670 --> 00:47:38,470
through the plant.

1619
00:47:38,449 --> 00:47:40,230
You can see how fast it gets in

1620
00:47:40,230 --> 00:47:41,250
as compared to

1621
00:47:41,849 --> 00:47:42,809
standard

1622
00:47:43,190 --> 00:47:46,480
1034s, 1152s that just

1623
00:47:46,480 --> 00:47:48,610
get tied up in the soil and

1624
00:47:48,610 --> 00:47:50,260
don't make it into the plant.

1625
00:47:51,059 --> 00:47:51,860
But

1626
00:47:51,610 --> 00:47:52,989
the foliar with

1627
00:47:55,900 --> 00:47:58,059
any of the foliar applications,

1628
00:47:58,159 --> 00:48:00,179
I've just seen 10 times more

1629
00:48:00,349 --> 00:48:02,130
activity and availability, even

1630
00:48:02,130 --> 00:48:03,650
then the chelated stuff running

1631
00:48:03,650 --> 00:48:05,659
in the water at, you know, we'll

1632
00:48:05,659 --> 00:48:07,519
run 25 gallons of

1633
00:48:09,400 --> 00:48:11,280
phosphate in the water,

1634
00:48:11,679 --> 00:48:12,480
which is,

1635
00:48:12,679 --> 00:48:13,960
it sounds like a lot, but it's,

1636
00:48:13,960 --> 00:48:15,139
it's really not because it's,

1637
00:48:15,239 --> 00:48:16,840
it's like a 1 % solution

1638
00:48:17,340 --> 00:48:18,140
of,

1639
00:48:18,440 --> 00:48:19,280
or I guess it's

1640
00:48:19,659 --> 00:48:21,920
6 % solution, but it's,

1641
00:48:22,849 --> 00:48:24,650
it's all available to the plant,

1642
00:48:24,650 --> 00:48:25,450
but

1643
00:48:25,480 --> 00:48:27,239
doing a foliar application,

1644
00:48:27,980 --> 00:48:29,820
it's night and day, even to

1645
00:48:29,820 --> 00:48:30,620
water running,

1646
00:48:30,980 --> 00:48:32,559
high quality products like I

1647
00:48:32,559 --> 00:48:33,360
use.

1648
00:48:33,460 --> 00:48:35,400
The foliar just is, it outshines

1649
00:48:35,400 --> 00:48:36,200
it

1650
00:48:35,909 --> 00:48:36,710
10 times.

1651
00:48:38,880 --> 00:48:40,059
On a couple of occasions, you've

1652
00:48:40,059 --> 00:48:42,260
mentioned sheeping off the

1653
00:48:42,260 --> 00:48:44,320
alfalfa and perhaps the Bermudas

1654
00:48:44,320 --> 00:48:46,099
as well. And one of the things

1655
00:48:46,099 --> 00:48:46,900
that

1656
00:48:47,019 --> 00:48:49,300
I've observed is that anytime

1657
00:48:49,300 --> 00:48:50,100
you add,

1658
00:48:50,300 --> 00:48:51,100
when you have these generous

1659
00:48:51,079 --> 00:48:52,760
levels of boron, I think if

1660
00:48:53,269 --> 00:48:55,920
there is any one mineral

1661
00:48:56,500 --> 00:48:58,320
or any one nutrient that I would

1662
00:48:58,320 --> 00:49:00,099
associate with a high Brix

1663
00:49:00,099 --> 00:49:01,539
content, higher sugar content,

1664
00:49:01,679 --> 00:49:02,539
it's probably boron.

1665
00:49:03,360 --> 00:49:05,199
It has almost the most direct

1666
00:49:05,199 --> 00:49:06,039
analog, obviously,

1667
00:49:06,519 --> 00:49:07,820
elevated sugar production is

1668
00:49:07,820 --> 00:49:09,579
involved. There's a suite of

1669
00:49:09,579 --> 00:49:10,380
nutrients that are involved in

1670
00:49:10,380 --> 00:49:11,719
that process, not just one, but

1671
00:49:11,719 --> 00:49:13,179
boron has perhaps the most

1672
00:49:13,179 --> 00:49:14,900
direct analog effect.

1673
00:49:16,389 --> 00:49:17,190
And so,

1674
00:49:17,920 --> 00:49:19,239
quite commonly, I see

1675
00:49:19,579 --> 00:49:21,579
improved palatability and

1676
00:49:21,579 --> 00:49:23,000
desirability on forages from

1677
00:49:23,000 --> 00:49:24,039
higher boron applications.

1678
00:49:25,480 --> 00:49:27,840
Do you have any indicators from

1679
00:49:27,840 --> 00:49:29,460
the sheep or any livestock of

1680
00:49:29,460 --> 00:49:30,860
changes in perception and

1681
00:49:30,860 --> 00:49:31,660
quality?

1682
00:49:32,530 --> 00:49:33,330
Yeah.

1683
00:49:33,090 --> 00:49:36,139
So on the sheep production or on

1684
00:49:36,139 --> 00:49:38,179
the sheeping off the field,

1685
00:49:40,000 --> 00:49:40,980
two fields I was talking about

1686
00:49:40,980 --> 00:49:42,920
that had the late season born

1687
00:49:42,920 --> 00:49:44,460
application and then the born

1688
00:49:44,460 --> 00:49:47,199
application and inoculation all

1689
00:49:47,199 --> 00:49:48,000
year long,

1690
00:49:48,760 --> 00:49:51,420
the sheep fed for about seven

1691
00:49:51,420 --> 00:49:54,199
days per block on the

1692
00:49:54,199 --> 00:49:55,400
standard field.

1693
00:49:55,519 --> 00:49:57,000
And then on the inoculated field

1694
00:49:57,000 --> 00:49:58,639
treated with the boron, they got

1695
00:49:58,639 --> 00:50:01,400
at least one more day per block.

1696
00:50:01,849 --> 00:50:04,329
Some of them were two days per

1697
00:50:04,329 --> 00:50:05,130
block.

1698
00:50:05,429 --> 00:50:06,889
And the

1699
00:50:08,119 --> 00:50:10,460
fields, when we would bale them

1700
00:50:10,460 --> 00:50:11,260
off,

1701
00:50:11,199 --> 00:50:13,920
are almost identical in yield.

1702
00:50:14,900 --> 00:50:15,700
They're

1703
00:50:15,389 --> 00:50:16,650
very similar

1704
00:50:17,090 --> 00:50:20,469
size, very similar ground

1705
00:50:21,489 --> 00:50:22,289
type.

1706
00:50:23,849 --> 00:50:25,130
they would always, actually the

1707
00:50:25,130 --> 00:50:26,369
one that was untreated would

1708
00:50:26,369 --> 00:50:28,590
usually beat the other field by

1709
00:50:28,590 --> 00:50:29,390
a little bit,

1710
00:50:30,170 --> 00:50:30,970
maybe two

1711
00:50:31,639 --> 00:50:32,440
or three

1712
00:50:32,690 --> 00:50:34,309
hundred males, something like

1713
00:50:34,309 --> 00:50:35,110
that,

1714
00:50:34,949 --> 00:50:35,750
not a lot.

1715
00:50:36,340 --> 00:50:37,140
But

1716
00:50:37,349 --> 00:50:39,639
in this case, the sheep were in

1717
00:50:39,639 --> 00:50:40,619
there and they ate on it.

1718
00:50:40,719 --> 00:50:42,400
And I took seven acres of that

1719
00:50:42,400 --> 00:50:44,179
field out and put in agave.

1720
00:50:44,400 --> 00:50:47,179
So the field was even seven

1721
00:50:47,179 --> 00:50:48,500
acres smaller than the other

1722
00:50:48,500 --> 00:50:49,300
field.

1723
00:50:49,579 --> 00:50:51,579
They're 140 acre fields apiece.

1724
00:50:51,739 --> 00:50:53,079
So we were looking at 130

1725
00:50:53,079 --> 00:50:54,599
compared to 140.

1726
00:50:55,300 --> 00:50:57,639
And they fed for a total of

1727
00:50:57,639 --> 00:50:59,940
about five and a half days more

1728
00:51:00,380 --> 00:51:01,180
on

1729
00:51:01,429 --> 00:51:03,500
the treated field.

1730
00:51:04,329 --> 00:51:06,250
So if I'm following your train

1731
00:51:06,250 --> 00:51:07,050
of thought here, you're

1732
00:51:06,989 --> 00:51:07,849
describing that

1733
00:51:08,360 --> 00:51:09,579
there were

1734
00:51:10,369 --> 00:51:12,409
there were smaller yields in

1735
00:51:12,409 --> 00:51:14,349
terms of biomass per acre, but

1736
00:51:14,349 --> 00:51:16,730
larger yields in terms of animal

1737
00:51:16,730 --> 00:51:17,750
feed days per acre.

1738
00:51:17,849 --> 00:51:18,849
In other words, the animals were

1739
00:51:18,849 --> 00:51:20,070
getting more out of the forage.

1740
00:51:20,170 --> 00:51:21,130
They were more satiated with

1741
00:51:21,130 --> 00:51:21,930
what they were feeding.

1742
00:51:21,909 --> 00:51:22,789
Is that is that what you're

1743
00:51:22,789 --> 00:51:23,590
describing?

1744
00:51:23,670 --> 00:51:24,690
Yeah. Sorry, I kind of rambled

1745
00:51:24,690 --> 00:51:25,710
around a little bit right there.

1746
00:51:25,829 --> 00:51:26,949
I had a bunch of thoughts

1747
00:51:26,949 --> 00:51:27,849
bouncing around in my head.

1748
00:51:28,030 --> 00:51:30,449
But so, yes, the animals fed

1749
00:51:30,449 --> 00:51:31,250
longer

1750
00:51:31,500 --> 00:51:33,760
on the field that was treated

1751
00:51:33,760 --> 00:51:35,079
compared to the field that

1752
00:51:35,079 --> 00:51:35,880
wasn't.

1753
00:51:36,320 --> 00:51:38,099
But when we would cut them,

1754
00:51:38,570 --> 00:51:39,889
Historically,

1755
00:51:40,369 --> 00:51:41,849
those fields yielded almost

1756
00:51:41,849 --> 00:51:42,650
identical.

1757
00:51:44,190 --> 00:51:46,530
And then I also have taken

1758
00:51:46,530 --> 00:51:48,630
acreage out of the treated field

1759
00:51:48,630 --> 00:51:50,059
for agave.

1760
00:51:50,920 --> 00:51:53,019
So there's even less acreage on

1761
00:51:53,019 --> 00:51:55,510
that field and the sheep fed for

1762
00:51:55,510 --> 00:51:57,590
five to six days more

1763
00:51:57,969 --> 00:51:59,250
on the treated field.

1764
00:52:00,269 --> 00:52:02,030
Yeah, got it. So when we think

1765
00:52:02,030 --> 00:52:03,860
about observations around

1766
00:52:03,860 --> 00:52:05,380
quality, we spoke a little bit

1767
00:52:05,380 --> 00:52:06,360
about alfalfa seed.

1768
00:52:06,460 --> 00:52:07,380
We spoke about the livestock

1769
00:52:07,380 --> 00:52:08,460
indicators. We haven't really

1770
00:52:08,460 --> 00:52:09,579
talked about the Bermuda grass.

1771
00:52:09,679 --> 00:52:11,199
Have there been any observations

1772
00:52:11,199 --> 00:52:12,360
of improved quality with the

1773
00:52:12,360 --> 00:52:13,780
Bermuda grass seed production?

1774
00:52:14,719 --> 00:52:15,519
This

1775
00:52:15,420 --> 00:52:17,400
was a bad year to

1776
00:52:17,920 --> 00:52:19,199
try to evaluate that.

1777
00:52:19,280 --> 00:52:20,559
We've got a water program here

1778
00:52:20,559 --> 00:52:22,780
where we were

1779
00:52:23,289 --> 00:52:24,889
able to shut off our water,

1780
00:52:25,300 --> 00:52:26,100
able,

1781
00:52:26,099 --> 00:52:28,739
we were compensated for shutting

1782
00:52:28,739 --> 00:52:31,059
off our water for two months in

1783
00:52:31,059 --> 00:52:33,650
the summer, and I

1784
00:52:34,469 --> 00:52:35,949
didn't see the writing on the

1785
00:52:35,949 --> 00:52:37,949
wall. It was too late when they

1786
00:52:37,949 --> 00:52:39,230
had us do it. We did it August

1787
00:52:39,230 --> 00:52:40,030
and October,

1788
00:52:40,369 --> 00:52:41,570
which this was one of our

1789
00:52:41,570 --> 00:52:43,090
hottest October, last October,

1790
00:52:43,550 --> 00:52:45,150
was one of our hottest Octobers.

1791
00:52:45,599 --> 00:52:47,659
I think on record, we broke at

1792
00:52:47,659 --> 00:52:50,199
least two records during the

1793
00:52:50,199 --> 00:52:51,599
year for high temperatures.

1794
00:52:52,900 --> 00:52:55,139
I saw 118 in the middle of

1795
00:52:55,139 --> 00:52:55,940
October.

1796
00:52:58,320 --> 00:53:00,659
And it dried out the fields so

1797
00:53:00,659 --> 00:53:03,159
much that I think it killed at

1798
00:53:03,159 --> 00:53:03,980
least half

1799
00:53:04,519 --> 00:53:06,300
of the established Bermuda that

1800
00:53:06,300 --> 00:53:07,100
was out there.

1801
00:53:07,789 --> 00:53:10,199
So the seed yield this year was

1802
00:53:10,199 --> 00:53:11,420
terrible.

1803
00:53:13,119 --> 00:53:15,460
Luckily this year the the same

1804
00:53:15,460 --> 00:53:17,579
program is going on, but we were

1805
00:53:17,579 --> 00:53:18,900
able to choose a different date.

1806
00:53:19,039 --> 00:53:20,239
I did mine earlier I'm already

1807
00:53:20,239 --> 00:53:22,260
out of the program and watering

1808
00:53:22,260 --> 00:53:24,840
again in our hottest months So

1809
00:53:24,840 --> 00:53:25,640
it

1810
00:53:26,019 --> 00:53:27,980
hasn't seen nearly the effect

1811
00:53:27,980 --> 00:53:30,000
that it did last time so

1812
00:53:30,000 --> 00:53:30,800
hopefully next year.

1813
00:53:30,880 --> 00:53:32,519
I'll be able to see some

1814
00:53:32,519 --> 00:53:33,719
improvements,

1815
00:53:34,840 --> 00:53:37,940
but this this year the field

1816
00:53:37,940 --> 00:53:38,740
that

1817
00:53:40,679 --> 00:53:42,119
was completely treated with

1818
00:53:42,119 --> 00:53:44,340
inoculation boron all of it is

1819
00:53:45,210 --> 00:53:46,010
And I

1820
00:53:46,650 --> 00:53:49,789
didn't listen to my

1821
00:53:49,789 --> 00:53:51,170
AEA advisor.

1822
00:53:51,550 --> 00:53:53,610
And he told me to only take the

1823
00:53:53,610 --> 00:53:54,989
nitrogen down by 20%.

1824
00:53:54,989 --> 00:53:57,880
I have a bad habit of if 20 % is

1825
00:53:57,880 --> 00:53:59,380
good, then 50 % is better.

1826
00:53:59,519 --> 00:54:01,360
So I took my nitrogen down way,

1827
00:54:01,360 --> 00:54:02,599
way lower than you're supposed

1828
00:54:02,599 --> 00:54:03,960
to, which is why I know now that

1829
00:54:03,960 --> 00:54:05,219
plants go into withdrawals.

1830
00:54:06,599 --> 00:54:07,400
But

1831
00:54:07,599 --> 00:54:09,320
it produced the same as the

1832
00:54:09,320 --> 00:54:10,440
field next door that had the

1833
00:54:10,440 --> 00:54:11,340
full standard

1834
00:54:12,349 --> 00:54:13,269
regimen on it.

1835
00:54:13,849 --> 00:54:15,409
So I definitely think the minor

1836
00:54:15,409 --> 00:54:16,710
nutrients attributed to that,

1837
00:54:16,809 --> 00:54:18,150
and I would, I kind of regret,

1838
00:54:18,670 --> 00:54:20,849
not kind of, I 100 % regret not

1839
00:54:20,849 --> 00:54:22,469
putting the full

1840
00:54:22,940 --> 00:54:25,019
nitrogen package on there,

1841
00:54:25,559 --> 00:54:27,179
plus the minors to see what it

1842
00:54:27,179 --> 00:54:27,980
would have done.

1843
00:54:27,760 --> 00:54:30,360
But it was the same yield on the

1844
00:54:30,360 --> 00:54:31,559
two fields that

1845
00:54:32,230 --> 00:54:33,530
had the same treatment,

1846
00:54:33,969 --> 00:54:35,289
or had the different treatments.

1847
00:54:35,570 --> 00:54:37,429
And I had about 50 % less

1848
00:54:37,429 --> 00:54:38,909
nitrogen on the

1849
00:54:39,320 --> 00:54:40,120
treated field.

1850
00:54:41,019 --> 00:54:42,440
So Jay, I've got to ask the

1851
00:54:42,440 --> 00:54:44,079
question. You're a PCA, you make

1852
00:54:44,079 --> 00:54:44,900
lots of pesticide

1853
00:54:44,900 --> 00:54:45,700
recommendations.

1854
00:54:46,719 --> 00:54:48,099
How are these experiences that

1855
00:54:48,099 --> 00:54:49,360
you're having on your own farm

1856
00:54:49,360 --> 00:54:50,599
influencing the recommendations

1857
00:54:50,599 --> 00:54:51,619
you're making for other people?

1858
00:54:53,039 --> 00:54:56,300
I definitely try and I've

1859
00:54:56,300 --> 00:54:58,659
always been the guy that trained

1860
00:54:58,659 --> 00:54:59,460
me.

1861
00:55:01,510 --> 00:55:04,170
was very frugal with the way he

1862
00:55:04,170 --> 00:55:05,349
managed his fields for his farm.

1863
00:55:05,409 --> 00:55:07,650
It had nothing to do with plant

1864
00:55:07,650 --> 00:55:09,349
health. He just wanted to do the

1865
00:55:09,349 --> 00:55:10,909
best job monetarily that he

1866
00:55:10,909 --> 00:55:12,170
could for his growers.

1867
00:55:12,909 --> 00:55:14,809
And he passed that along to me

1868
00:55:14,809 --> 00:55:15,829
in the way that we manage

1869
00:55:15,829 --> 00:55:16,630
fields.

1870
00:55:16,449 --> 00:55:17,550
You have

1871
00:55:18,280 --> 00:55:19,080
to

1872
00:55:18,949 --> 00:55:20,570
tailor it to your grower.

1873
00:55:21,389 --> 00:55:23,269
Some growers want no bugs

1874
00:55:23,269 --> 00:55:24,469
whatsoever. If they see a gnat

1875
00:55:24,469 --> 00:55:25,449
flying around that doesn't even

1876
00:55:25,449 --> 00:55:27,550
have mouthparts, they want those

1877
00:55:27,550 --> 00:55:28,350
sprayed.

1878
00:55:29,809 --> 00:55:31,230
On other farmers that are

1879
00:55:31,230 --> 00:55:33,469
willing to take a little bit of

1880
00:55:33,469 --> 00:55:34,269
damage,

1881
00:55:34,989 --> 00:55:36,170
but not

1882
00:55:36,639 --> 00:55:38,260
have the cost of the spray.

1883
00:55:39,309 --> 00:55:40,190
Those are the ones you can

1884
00:55:40,190 --> 00:55:42,309
really dig in and start working

1885
00:55:42,309 --> 00:55:43,110
with.

1886
00:55:42,570 --> 00:55:44,090
And maybe you can skip a spray

1887
00:55:44,090 --> 00:55:45,130
on one of the

1888
00:55:45,960 --> 00:55:47,679
cuttings, but it's definitely,

1889
00:55:48,320 --> 00:55:50,239
that was already part of my DNA.

1890
00:55:51,300 --> 00:55:53,699
And now that I'm seeing this,

1891
00:55:54,000 --> 00:55:56,409
I can use my experiences on my

1892
00:55:56,409 --> 00:55:57,210
fields.

1893
00:55:56,670 --> 00:55:57,929
And I'm always the canary in the

1894
00:55:57,929 --> 00:55:59,289
coal mine that

1895
00:55:59,630 --> 00:56:03,050
does stuff first with any,

1896
00:56:04,949 --> 00:56:07,309
new treatments or new products

1897
00:56:07,309 --> 00:56:09,269
that we have because I farm and

1898
00:56:09,269 --> 00:56:12,170
I work for a fertilizer slash

1899
00:56:12,170 --> 00:56:12,970
chemical company.

1900
00:56:13,130 --> 00:56:14,690
How does how does this work that

1901
00:56:14,690 --> 00:56:15,630
you work for a fertilizer

1902
00:56:15,630 --> 00:56:16,909
company and you're using AEA

1903
00:56:16,909 --> 00:56:17,710
products?

1904
00:56:18,179 --> 00:56:19,039
And hopefully they don't hear

1905
00:56:19,039 --> 00:56:19,840
this.

1906
00:56:21,750 --> 00:56:24,829
He understands my I have a great

1907
00:56:24,829 --> 00:56:27,250
boss and he understands that I

1908
00:56:27,250 --> 00:56:28,050
am

1909
00:56:28,519 --> 00:56:30,199
able to I'm able to go out and

1910
00:56:30,199 --> 00:56:31,000
use other products.

1911
00:56:31,000 --> 00:56:31,980
They don't carry these products.

1912
00:56:32,139 --> 00:56:34,260
We have some, but they're

1913
00:56:35,539 --> 00:56:37,139
Most of our stuff is very

1914
00:56:37,139 --> 00:56:37,960
conventional.

1915
00:56:38,880 --> 00:56:41,500
To be clear, Jay, you are one of

1916
00:56:41,500 --> 00:56:42,300
many.

1917
00:56:42,179 --> 00:56:43,300
You're just the first one that's

1918
00:56:43,300 --> 00:56:44,420
in that particular spot that

1919
00:56:44,420 --> 00:56:45,360
I've happened to have on the

1920
00:56:45,360 --> 00:56:46,160
show and interview.

1921
00:56:47,219 --> 00:56:49,739
You know, my boss understands

1922
00:56:49,739 --> 00:56:51,679
that there's other products out

1923
00:56:51,679 --> 00:56:52,679
there. We're not the only game

1924
00:56:52,679 --> 00:56:53,480
in town.

1925
00:56:53,679 --> 00:56:56,139
I don't go recommending other

1926
00:56:56,139 --> 00:56:56,940
products.

1927
00:56:57,019 --> 00:56:59,340
I will tell people what I put on

1928
00:56:59,340 --> 00:57:00,140
mine.

1929
00:57:00,559 --> 00:57:02,809
It was on my Instagram and I had

1930
00:57:02,809 --> 00:57:04,289
a friend of mine

1931
00:57:04,820 --> 00:57:05,820
that kind of laughed, but he's

1932
00:57:05,820 --> 00:57:06,980
like, so are you just

1933
00:57:07,480 --> 00:57:09,079
kind of putting this out there

1934
00:57:09,079 --> 00:57:10,059
hoping that your boss doesn't

1935
00:57:10,059 --> 00:57:10,860
see it? I said, yeah, that's

1936
00:57:10,760 --> 00:57:11,560
exactly what I'm hoping.

1937
00:57:12,699 --> 00:57:14,940
But if they work, they work.

1938
00:57:15,199 --> 00:57:18,150
And that's just the nuts and

1939
00:57:18,150 --> 00:57:19,849
bolts of it. If a product works,

1940
00:57:19,869 --> 00:57:22,090
it works. And I'm not ever going

1941
00:57:22,090 --> 00:57:22,890
to

1942
00:57:22,960 --> 00:57:24,280
say one of our products is

1943
00:57:24,280 --> 00:57:25,300
better than another when it

1944
00:57:25,300 --> 00:57:26,599
isn't. If there's another

1945
00:57:26,599 --> 00:57:28,340
product that another company has

1946
00:57:28,340 --> 00:57:29,380
that is better,

1947
00:57:29,940 --> 00:57:31,519
I'll recommend that they go use

1948
00:57:31,519 --> 00:57:32,320
that product.

1949
00:57:33,030 --> 00:57:35,110
But if we have one that works,

1950
00:57:35,449 --> 00:57:38,110
I will always recommend mine or

1951
00:57:38,300 --> 00:57:39,100
my company's

1952
00:57:40,170 --> 00:57:41,829
before I recommend another, but

1953
00:57:41,829 --> 00:57:43,230
when they, the products work,

1954
00:57:43,289 --> 00:57:44,090
they work.

1955
00:57:44,210 --> 00:57:45,869
And so I

1956
00:57:46,210 --> 00:57:48,110
have definitely moved my

1957
00:57:48,110 --> 00:57:49,809
management practices more to

1958
00:57:49,809 --> 00:57:52,059
nutrients than to

1959
00:57:52,440 --> 00:57:55,019
chemistry, depending on,

1960
00:57:55,170 --> 00:57:56,050
um,

1961
00:57:57,159 --> 00:57:58,340
just coming in and doing a

1962
00:57:58,340 --> 00:57:59,140
rescue spray.

1963
00:57:59,719 --> 00:58:01,400
My wife laughs because my wife

1964
00:58:01,400 --> 00:58:04,219
is like maha movement to the

1965
00:58:04,219 --> 00:58:06,559
max. She loves all of the

1966
00:58:06,559 --> 00:58:08,900
natural foods. And I don't even

1967
00:58:08,900 --> 00:58:09,820
think we have Florida in our

1968
00:58:09,820 --> 00:58:10,620
toothpaste anymore.

1969
00:58:10,940 --> 00:58:12,300
So she

1970
00:58:12,949 --> 00:58:15,510
always asks me about things.

1971
00:58:15,610 --> 00:58:18,809
And my stance is that I

1972
00:58:18,809 --> 00:58:20,489
believe pesticides and

1973
00:58:20,489 --> 00:58:21,630
herbicides and fungicides

1974
00:58:22,190 --> 00:58:23,530
are a

1975
00:58:24,010 --> 00:58:26,090
necessary evil to for lack of a

1976
00:58:26,090 --> 00:58:27,449
better term, that they're a

1977
00:58:27,449 --> 00:58:28,889
they're a tool that

1978
00:58:30,059 --> 00:58:31,119
should be used

1979
00:58:31,940 --> 00:58:33,780
like you would any other tool.

1980
00:58:34,300 --> 00:58:35,100
They're not

1981
00:58:35,840 --> 00:58:37,579
everything that you should be

1982
00:58:37,579 --> 00:58:38,760
using. You should look at all

1983
00:58:38,760 --> 00:58:40,019
aspects of it. You can't use a

1984
00:58:40,019 --> 00:58:41,139
hammer to take out a screw.

1985
00:58:41,619 --> 00:58:42,900
You have to use a screwdriver.

1986
00:58:43,239 --> 00:58:45,690
So that's the way I look at

1987
00:58:45,880 --> 00:58:48,019
pesticides and herbicides is

1988
00:58:49,219 --> 00:58:52,099
if they work in this situation,

1989
00:58:52,099 --> 00:58:52,900
and

1990
00:58:53,159 --> 00:58:54,679
that's all that you can use, say

1991
00:58:54,679 --> 00:58:56,980
you're getting eaten up by worms

1992
00:58:56,980 --> 00:58:58,480
or weevil or something along

1993
00:58:58,480 --> 00:58:59,280
those lines,

1994
00:58:59,719 --> 00:59:01,699
and you don't have time to

1995
00:59:01,699 --> 00:59:02,880
manage the nutrients,

1996
00:59:03,429 --> 00:59:04,250
Yeah, absolutely.

1997
00:59:04,329 --> 00:59:05,349
Go in and spray because it's a

1998
00:59:05,349 --> 00:59:07,489
lot better getting a yield and

1999
00:59:07,489 --> 00:59:10,010
having to spray than getting

2000
00:59:10,010 --> 00:59:10,909
eaten up and not getting

2001
00:59:10,909 --> 00:59:11,710
anything.

2002
00:59:11,739 --> 00:59:12,880
But now next year, learn from

2003
00:59:12,880 --> 00:59:13,680
that

2004
00:59:13,449 --> 00:59:14,250
and

2005
00:59:14,320 --> 00:59:16,300
manage your nutrition like

2006
00:59:17,400 --> 00:59:19,300
you should and pay

2007
00:59:19,619 --> 00:59:20,519
attention to those things.

2008
00:59:20,599 --> 00:59:22,039
And eventually you can get to

2009
00:59:22,039 --> 00:59:23,199
the point where you're not using

2010
00:59:23,199 --> 00:59:24,000
them,

2011
00:59:24,039 --> 00:59:25,659
but for emergencies.

2012
00:59:26,769 --> 00:59:27,969
Where you just went with this

2013
00:59:27,969 --> 00:59:29,190
conversation, Jay, is so

2014
00:59:29,190 --> 00:59:30,010
important. And it was

2015
00:59:58,329 --> 00:59:59,650
I think it's this that

2016
00:59:59,650 --> 01:00:03,090
foundation of integrity that has

2017
01:00:03,239 --> 01:00:04,039
really

2018
01:00:04,480 --> 01:00:06,079
allowed us to have the impact

2019
01:00:06,079 --> 01:00:07,079
that we have as a company

2020
01:00:07,079 --> 01:00:07,880
because

2021
01:00:08,000 --> 01:00:10,789
we only we don't we don't have a

2022
01:00:10,789 --> 01:00:12,170
universal product lineup and we

2023
01:00:12,170 --> 01:00:14,389
recommend many products that are

2024
01:00:14,389 --> 01:00:15,510
not a part of our lineup.

2025
01:00:15,650 --> 01:00:16,630
And I think it's to

2026
01:00:17,389 --> 01:00:18,710
me, that's that's that is a mark

2027
01:00:18,710 --> 01:00:20,210
of integrity in agronomic

2028
01:00:20,210 --> 01:00:21,369
recommendations when you're

2029
01:00:21,369 --> 01:00:22,949
willing to take and to truly

2030
01:00:22,949 --> 01:00:24,429
advise and recommend what is

2031
01:00:24,429 --> 01:00:25,849
what is the best and produces

2032
01:00:25,849 --> 01:00:26,809
the best response.

2033
01:00:28,090 --> 01:00:28,890
And it

2034
01:00:29,420 --> 01:00:31,019
occurs to me that in what you

2035
01:00:31,019 --> 01:00:31,840
were just describing,

2036
01:00:33,739 --> 01:00:35,579
about pesticides, from a

2037
01:00:35,579 --> 01:00:36,699
pesticide use perspective, being

2038
01:00:36,699 --> 01:00:37,659
a necessary evil.

2039
01:00:38,730 --> 01:00:39,530
The

2040
01:00:40,219 --> 01:00:41,280
challenge or

2041
01:00:42,110 --> 01:00:44,079
the conundrum is that

2042
01:00:44,610 --> 01:00:46,610
the knowledge and the

2043
01:00:46,610 --> 01:00:47,869
information to,

2044
01:00:49,639 --> 01:00:51,280
as well as the incentives for

2045
01:00:51,280 --> 01:00:52,639
integrity of recommendations

2046
01:00:52,639 --> 01:00:55,079
related to pest management, the

2047
01:00:55,079 --> 01:00:56,199
conversation we were just having

2048
01:00:56,199 --> 01:00:57,440
around boron, for example,

2049
01:00:57,940 --> 01:00:59,559
and the responses that you saw

2050
01:00:59,559 --> 01:01:00,360
with

2051
01:01:00,260 --> 01:01:03,280
ligus bug pressure on alfalfa,

2052
01:01:03,380 --> 01:01:04,860
like there are...

2053
01:01:05,420 --> 01:01:07,539
That is... This knowledge of how

2054
01:01:07,539 --> 01:01:09,219
to use nutrition management for

2055
01:01:09,219 --> 01:01:10,280
disease control and insect

2056
01:01:10,280 --> 01:01:11,159
control is knowledge

2057
01:01:11,570 --> 01:01:14,190
that I would desire, and many

2058
01:01:14,190 --> 01:01:15,369
other people I'm sure would also

2059
01:01:15,369 --> 01:01:16,949
desire, to be much more widely

2060
01:01:16,949 --> 01:01:18,250
known and understood in

2061
01:01:18,250 --> 01:01:19,710
agronomy. And so there are

2062
01:01:20,210 --> 01:01:22,750
many people who have integrity,

2063
01:01:23,760 --> 01:01:24,980
but who perhaps lack that

2064
01:01:24,980 --> 01:01:26,460
integrity. knowledge to truly

2065
01:01:26,460 --> 01:01:28,679
make the best recommendations

2066
01:01:28,679 --> 01:01:29,500
from

2067
01:01:29,909 --> 01:01:32,150
this nutrition versus pesticide

2068
01:01:32,150 --> 01:01:32,950
dimension.

2069
01:01:33,880 --> 01:01:35,960
And that's an interesting place

2070
01:01:35,960 --> 01:01:36,920
to find ourselves in.

2071
01:01:38,289 --> 01:01:39,429
I completely agree with you.

2072
01:01:39,650 --> 01:01:41,710
It's one of the things that

2073
01:01:41,710 --> 01:01:42,690
has...

2074
01:01:43,199 --> 01:01:44,699
I like the products for one, but

2075
01:01:44,699 --> 01:01:45,500
I

2076
01:01:45,300 --> 01:01:46,699
just...

2077
01:01:47,349 --> 01:01:48,710
put him out there and let him

2078
01:01:48,710 --> 01:01:49,769
know how much I appreciate it.

2079
01:01:49,829 --> 01:01:51,730
Pedro has been fantastic.

2080
01:01:52,789 --> 01:01:54,510
There are very few times that

2081
01:01:54,510 --> 01:01:55,310
I've seen

2082
01:01:55,519 --> 01:01:57,460
someone that's selling something

2083
01:01:57,960 --> 01:02:00,199
look at a

2084
01:02:01,380 --> 01:02:03,500
soil sample or even just a field

2085
01:02:03,500 --> 01:02:05,199
and say,

2086
01:02:05,659 --> 01:02:06,460
yeah,

2087
01:02:06,110 --> 01:02:06,929
everything's good.

2088
01:02:07,030 --> 01:02:07,830
I think we're good.

2089
01:02:07,650 --> 01:02:08,450
I don't think we need to do

2090
01:02:08,429 --> 01:02:09,849
anything. And at

2091
01:02:10,420 --> 01:02:12,960
least a couple of times he don't

2092
01:02:12,960 --> 01:02:13,760
get him in trouble for this.

2093
01:02:13,840 --> 01:02:15,179
He has said,

2094
01:02:15,550 --> 01:02:16,350
no, you're good.

2095
01:02:16,389 --> 01:02:17,230
Everything looks fine.

2096
01:02:17,250 --> 01:02:18,170
I don't think we need to apply

2097
01:02:18,170 --> 01:02:19,250
anything. And

2098
01:02:19,659 --> 01:02:20,460
that

2099
01:02:21,400 --> 01:02:23,119
solidified my relationship with

2100
01:02:23,119 --> 01:02:26,579
him as a customer because I

2101
01:02:26,739 --> 01:02:27,900
knew he was taking the same

2102
01:02:27,900 --> 01:02:28,780
approach that I do.

2103
01:02:29,559 --> 01:02:31,960
That I have talked farmers out

2104
01:02:31,960 --> 01:02:32,760
of

2105
01:02:33,090 --> 01:02:34,570
chemicals

2106
01:02:35,230 --> 01:02:37,949
or putting extra nitrogen or

2107
01:02:37,949 --> 01:02:39,690
something like that on because I

2108
01:02:39,690 --> 01:02:41,010
didn't think they would need it

2109
01:02:41,010 --> 01:02:43,050
as opposed to just being a

2110
01:02:43,050 --> 01:02:44,329
salesman and pushing the sale

2111
01:02:44,329 --> 01:02:46,420
and making more recommendations.

2112
01:02:46,980 --> 01:02:48,320
I had a conversation with a co

2113
01:02:48,320 --> 01:02:49,120
-worker of mine

2114
01:02:49,500 --> 01:02:51,000
And he was asking me what

2115
01:02:51,000 --> 01:02:53,099
because I he has a very good

2116
01:02:53,099 --> 01:02:56,019
grasp of the basic

2117
01:02:56,019 --> 01:02:59,380
NPK and some of our calcium.

2118
01:02:59,599 --> 01:03:01,079
And we have another amino acid

2119
01:03:01,079 --> 01:03:02,760
product that we that our company

2120
01:03:02,760 --> 01:03:03,560
makes.

2121
01:03:03,579 --> 01:03:04,380
And

2122
01:03:04,059 --> 01:03:06,559
he is instrumental in a couple

2123
01:03:06,559 --> 01:03:07,780
of getting those off the ground

2124
01:03:07,780 --> 01:03:09,239
and getting them into farmers

2125
01:03:09,239 --> 01:03:10,380
hands and showing them how to

2126
01:03:10,380 --> 01:03:11,180
use them.

2127
01:03:11,670 --> 01:03:13,969
And I pick his brain constantly

2128
01:03:13,969 --> 01:03:16,010
because he's been in the in the

2129
01:03:16,010 --> 01:03:17,010
industry about 10 years longer

2130
01:03:17,010 --> 01:03:17,810
than I have.

2131
01:03:18,230 --> 01:03:19,150
And he

2132
01:03:19,519 --> 01:03:20,320
started asking me questions.

2133
01:03:20,389 --> 01:03:21,369
why are you asking me that?

2134
01:03:21,469 --> 01:03:23,190
What's going on with this

2135
01:03:23,190 --> 01:03:24,369
direction of questions?

2136
01:03:24,690 --> 01:03:26,449
Because he knows I'm a PCA.

2137
01:03:26,909 --> 01:03:29,050
And I told him, I said, I'm

2138
01:03:29,050 --> 01:03:30,449
trying to find the best way to

2139
01:03:30,449 --> 01:03:31,250
manage things

2140
01:03:31,480 --> 01:03:33,940
for the grower, for myself,

2141
01:03:34,219 --> 01:03:36,239
because in the long run,

2142
01:03:37,539 --> 01:03:39,380
I made a joke that if I do my

2143
01:03:39,380 --> 01:03:41,239
job or if I do everything right

2144
01:03:41,239 --> 01:03:42,739
that I'm trying to do, I'll be

2145
01:03:42,739 --> 01:03:44,059
out of a job in 10 years.

2146
01:03:44,159 --> 01:03:45,179
But that's not the case.

2147
01:03:45,239 --> 01:03:46,420
I don't want to be out of a job.

2148
01:03:46,929 --> 01:03:48,150
I want to make

2149
01:03:48,650 --> 01:03:49,809
my job.

2150
01:03:50,429 --> 01:03:52,869
Well, yes, essentially, I want

2151
01:03:52,869 --> 01:03:54,670
and I told him I want me to be

2152
01:03:54,670 --> 01:03:57,460
the most valuable aspect for a

2153
01:03:57,460 --> 01:03:59,320
grower, my knowledge base, my

2154
01:03:59,539 --> 01:04:02,400
experience, to be

2155
01:04:03,039 --> 01:04:05,219
what I know to be the value as

2156
01:04:05,219 --> 01:04:07,480
opposed to the fact that I can

2157
01:04:07,480 --> 01:04:09,179
sell you a $1 ,200 a gallon

2158
01:04:09,460 --> 01:04:10,519
fungicide

2159
01:04:10,900 --> 01:04:11,700
that

2160
01:04:12,079 --> 01:04:13,420
is a, you know, miracle cure.

2161
01:04:13,559 --> 01:04:14,440
And that's all, that's all I

2162
01:04:14,440 --> 01:04:16,400
have to know is, you know, in

2163
01:04:16,400 --> 01:04:18,659
March, I put this fungicide on

2164
01:04:18,659 --> 01:04:20,260
and everything's golden.

2165
01:04:21,130 --> 01:04:22,969
But I would rather it be,

2166
01:04:24,139 --> 01:04:25,960
if we need to, I know how to use

2167
01:04:25,960 --> 01:04:27,679
that. But if I don't

2168
01:04:27,989 --> 01:04:29,730
need to use it, I know other

2169
01:04:29,730 --> 01:04:31,329
aspects, other avenues that we

2170
01:04:31,329 --> 01:04:32,210
can take that maybe,

2171
01:04:33,150 --> 01:04:35,309
maybe my bonus isn't as big, but

2172
01:04:35,460 --> 01:04:36,739
my conscience is better.

2173
01:04:37,019 --> 01:04:38,480
And that's kind of where I've

2174
01:04:38,480 --> 01:04:39,659
gone with most of the things

2175
01:04:39,659 --> 01:04:42,019
that I've done in, in everything

2176
01:04:42,019 --> 01:04:42,820
is

2177
01:04:43,309 --> 01:04:44,289
I have to make a living,

2178
01:04:44,590 --> 01:04:46,570
uh, even in farming, like my,

2179
01:04:47,869 --> 01:04:49,530
uh, uh, my market garden that I

2180
01:04:49,530 --> 01:04:50,789
want to do, it has to make money

2181
01:04:50,940 --> 01:04:51,740
to be

2182
01:04:52,639 --> 01:04:54,039
reasonable. I'm not going to go

2183
01:04:54,039 --> 01:04:54,900
lose money on it,

2184
01:04:55,260 --> 01:04:58,309
but it was more of a calling

2185
01:04:58,309 --> 01:05:01,650
to do something good for the

2186
01:05:01,650 --> 01:05:03,130
community and people around me

2187
01:05:03,130 --> 01:05:04,789
to give them something healthy

2188
01:05:04,789 --> 01:05:06,190
and, um,

2189
01:05:06,730 --> 01:05:07,750
beneficial to them

2190
01:05:09,690 --> 01:05:11,730
than it was to find another

2191
01:05:11,730 --> 01:05:12,530
revenue stream.

2192
01:05:12,530 --> 01:05:13,550
Obviously I

2193
01:05:13,960 --> 01:05:15,199
would love for it to be.

2194
01:05:15,260 --> 01:05:17,179
off and have 140 acres of market

2195
01:05:17,179 --> 01:05:18,519
garden that I'm selling at

2196
01:05:18,519 --> 01:05:21,440
grocery store prices and retire

2197
01:05:21,440 --> 01:05:22,780
by 50, but

2198
01:05:23,119 --> 01:05:24,460
that's not the goal.

2199
01:05:25,019 --> 01:05:26,920
The goal is to do something that

2200
01:05:26,920 --> 01:05:27,720
makes

2201
01:05:27,769 --> 01:05:30,610
my conscience, my soul, my

2202
01:05:30,610 --> 01:05:31,949
whatever you want to call it,

2203
01:05:32,820 --> 01:05:33,620
content.

2204
01:05:33,480 --> 01:05:35,139
And that's the way I try to

2205
01:05:35,139 --> 01:05:38,239
approach all of my dealings with

2206
01:05:38,239 --> 01:05:39,139
the fertilizer industry.

2207
01:05:39,360 --> 01:05:41,460
If you need me to prescribe,

2208
01:05:42,059 --> 01:05:44,050
a pesticide or herbicide,

2209
01:05:44,489 --> 01:05:45,309
that's no problem.

2210
01:05:45,469 --> 01:05:47,269
I'm not one of those people that

2211
01:05:47,269 --> 01:05:50,190
gets the icks trying to

2212
01:05:50,190 --> 01:05:52,250
use a pesticide or even,

2213
01:05:52,619 --> 01:05:53,500
God forbid,

2214
01:05:53,940 --> 01:05:55,159
going in there and disking up a

2215
01:05:55,159 --> 01:05:56,119
field if you have to.

2216
01:05:56,460 --> 01:05:58,239
I've learned that there are uses

2217
01:05:58,239 --> 01:05:59,099
for everything.

2218
01:05:59,880 --> 01:06:01,900
There are also alternatives to

2219
01:06:01,900 --> 01:06:02,700
everything.

2220
01:06:03,420 --> 01:06:04,920
And I try and do the best thing

2221
01:06:04,920 --> 01:06:06,460
for my customers,

2222
01:06:06,800 --> 01:06:07,600
my field.

2223
01:06:07,800 --> 01:06:08,619
And one

2224
01:06:09,860 --> 01:06:11,179
of the main things that drove

2225
01:06:11,179 --> 01:06:13,340
this is I have three kids.

2226
01:06:14,179 --> 01:06:16,679
My oldest daughter is six years

2227
01:06:16,679 --> 01:06:18,219
old. She's decided she wants to

2228
01:06:18,219 --> 01:06:20,820
be a flower grower and seller.

2229
01:06:21,179 --> 01:06:23,400
So I'm learning how to grow

2230
01:06:23,400 --> 01:06:24,200
flowers.

2231
01:06:24,539 --> 01:06:27,550
My middle son is four

2232
01:06:28,309 --> 01:06:30,269
and loves everything about the

2233
01:06:30,269 --> 01:06:31,070
farm.

2234
01:06:30,980 --> 01:06:31,940
So I

2235
01:06:32,250 --> 01:06:34,989
want to give him something that

2236
01:06:36,230 --> 01:06:37,030
he can

2237
01:06:37,250 --> 01:06:40,070
look at and be proud of, not,

2238
01:06:40,690 --> 01:06:41,769
you know, say, oh, well, you

2239
01:06:41,769 --> 01:06:43,349
know, the farm costs me a

2240
01:06:43,349 --> 01:06:44,349
million and a half dollars a

2241
01:06:44,349 --> 01:06:45,210
year and I make,

2242
01:06:45,690 --> 01:06:46,490
you know,

2243
01:06:46,639 --> 01:06:47,820
million six profits.

2244
01:06:48,039 --> 01:06:49,840
I got $100 ,000 to live off of.

2245
01:06:49,920 --> 01:06:50,720
That's pretty nice.

2246
01:06:51,719 --> 01:06:52,900
I want him to know,

2247
01:06:53,719 --> 01:06:54,519
yeah,

2248
01:06:54,340 --> 01:06:55,340
dad worked on this.

2249
01:06:55,460 --> 01:06:56,539
He built up this soil.

2250
01:06:56,940 --> 01:06:58,079
There's a reason that

2251
01:06:58,460 --> 01:06:59,800
we don't have all the issues

2252
01:06:59,800 --> 01:07:01,000
that the people around us do

2253
01:07:01,000 --> 01:07:01,800
have some pride.

2254
01:07:01,900 --> 01:07:02,920
Maybe we lose some acres.

2255
01:07:03,079 --> 01:07:05,420
Maybe we cut back and we focus

2256
01:07:05,420 --> 01:07:07,019
more on smaller acreage.

2257
01:07:08,280 --> 01:07:09,639
But we can

2258
01:07:10,550 --> 01:07:11,510
we're there doing

2259
01:07:12,530 --> 01:07:13,590
what's best for the ground.

2260
01:07:13,750 --> 01:07:15,130
And I'm making sure that he has

2261
01:07:15,130 --> 01:07:15,969
something, if he,

2262
01:07:16,630 --> 01:07:17,929
maybe he doesn't want to be a

2263
01:07:17,929 --> 01:07:19,670
farmer, maybe he wants to, you

2264
01:07:19,670 --> 01:07:20,470
know,

2265
01:07:20,150 --> 01:07:21,570
use his head and be a doctor or

2266
01:07:21,570 --> 01:07:22,370
something like that.

2267
01:07:22,429 --> 01:07:24,909
But I, I want this to be

2268
01:07:24,909 --> 01:07:26,289
something that - For the record,

2269
01:07:26,469 --> 01:07:27,670
I don't think doctors use their

2270
01:07:27,670 --> 01:07:28,610
heads any more than farmers do.

2271
01:07:28,610 --> 01:07:29,809
I don't think they use Chad GPT

2272
01:07:29,809 --> 01:07:30,610
anymore.

2273
01:07:33,320 --> 01:07:34,120
Yeah.

2274
01:07:34,179 --> 01:07:36,079
Thank you for that monologue

2275
01:07:36,079 --> 01:07:37,119
there at the end, Jay.

2276
01:07:37,440 --> 01:07:40,659
The legacy of farming and I

2277
01:07:40,659 --> 01:07:41,460
think what

2278
01:07:42,360 --> 01:07:43,380
you described is

2279
01:07:44,230 --> 01:07:47,309
this fulfillment aspect that all

2280
01:07:47,309 --> 01:07:49,829
of us want to find our work

2281
01:07:49,829 --> 01:07:51,030
fulfilling. And fortunately,

2282
01:07:51,250 --> 01:07:52,829
most of us as farmers and

2283
01:07:52,829 --> 01:07:54,210
growers get the opportunity to

2284
01:07:54,210 --> 01:07:55,010
do that.

2285
01:07:55,980 --> 01:07:58,079
And particularly if we are able

2286
01:07:58,079 --> 01:07:59,039
to take this

2287
01:07:59,550 --> 01:08:00,929
approach and this mindfulness

2288
01:08:00,929 --> 01:08:02,889
perspective into our operations.

2289
01:08:04,190 --> 01:08:05,869
We've had a very wide -ranging

2290
01:08:05,869 --> 01:08:07,429
conversation, which I've greatly

2291
01:08:07,429 --> 01:08:09,769
enjoyed. What important topics

2292
01:08:09,769 --> 01:08:11,230
have we missed talking about?

2293
01:08:12,900 --> 01:08:15,019
The only one that is kind of

2294
01:08:15,019 --> 01:08:17,420
interesting, and it goes to

2295
01:08:17,630 --> 01:08:20,050
multi -species cover crops and

2296
01:08:20,050 --> 01:08:21,789
the plant interactions.

2297
01:08:23,270 --> 01:08:25,050
This is just my little pet

2298
01:08:25,050 --> 01:08:27,090
project that I keep noticing and

2299
01:08:27,090 --> 01:08:28,970
wanting to dig deeper into,

2300
01:08:30,510 --> 01:08:31,569
but the

2301
01:08:31,970 --> 01:08:34,270
Alfalfa that you know this the

2302
01:08:34,270 --> 01:08:36,149
stray seeds that made it into

2303
01:08:36,149 --> 01:08:38,189
the agave area and grew

2304
01:08:38,720 --> 01:08:39,520
have

2305
01:08:39,970 --> 01:08:41,609
Unfortunately, I can't harvest

2306
01:08:41,609 --> 01:08:42,529
them. They're right next to the

2307
01:08:42,529 --> 01:08:45,430
agave, but they're triple the

2308
01:08:45,430 --> 01:08:46,890
the seed production the

2309
01:08:47,359 --> 01:08:48,560
ones that are growing right next

2310
01:08:48,560 --> 01:08:51,449
to the agave are much healthier

2311
01:08:51,449 --> 01:08:53,590
and much happier

2312
01:08:53,590 --> 01:08:56,630
There's also I've had three

2313
01:08:56,630 --> 01:08:58,369
cover crops in there from a

2314
01:08:58,369 --> 01:09:00,130
brassica heavy cover crop to

2315
01:09:00,130 --> 01:09:01,250
some

2316
01:09:01,890 --> 01:09:05,229
pollinator mixes and a lot of

2317
01:09:05,229 --> 01:09:06,869
other things. that I've had

2318
01:09:07,920 --> 01:09:09,439
specially blended up for that

2319
01:09:09,439 --> 01:09:10,239
exact area.

2320
01:09:10,890 --> 01:09:11,690
And the

2321
01:09:12,260 --> 01:09:14,840
alfalfa keeps coming back in

2322
01:09:14,840 --> 01:09:16,779
there and it looks so much

2323
01:09:16,779 --> 01:09:17,579
better.

2324
01:09:17,199 --> 01:09:18,880
So I just, I think that there is

2325
01:09:18,880 --> 01:09:19,840
something plant

2326
01:09:21,979 --> 01:09:24,079
interaction that unfortunately

2327
01:09:25,060 --> 01:09:27,260
I can't do it in my broad acres,

2328
01:09:27,560 --> 01:09:30,140
but in the agave and

2329
01:09:30,140 --> 01:09:33,640
for trees and vineyards and

2330
01:09:33,640 --> 01:09:34,600
things like that, I definitely

2331
01:09:34,600 --> 01:09:35,400
think there's,

2332
01:09:35,960 --> 01:09:37,840
something to be explored with

2333
01:09:38,050 --> 01:09:39,289
putting other

2334
01:09:39,930 --> 01:09:40,730
crops around.

2335
01:09:40,609 --> 01:09:41,489
I think they just,

2336
01:09:42,010 --> 01:09:43,529
they're meant to grow together

2337
01:09:43,529 --> 01:09:45,890
instead of separately in a

2338
01:09:46,300 --> 01:09:47,279
big wide open field.

2339
01:09:47,500 --> 01:09:48,520
I wish I could figure out how to

2340
01:09:48,520 --> 01:09:50,159
do it in my broad acres,

2341
01:09:50,579 --> 01:09:52,420
but I just, especially for seed,

2342
01:09:52,520 --> 01:09:53,320
it doesn't work.

2343
01:09:53,970 --> 01:09:55,529
But that's one of the things,

2344
01:09:55,609 --> 01:09:56,890
the plant interaction has been

2345
01:09:57,430 --> 01:09:59,550
fantastic in the

2346
01:10:00,210 --> 01:10:02,510
agave because of all

2347
01:10:03,850 --> 01:10:04,689
the different crops.

2348
01:10:06,140 --> 01:10:08,119
It's quite an intriguing

2349
01:10:08,119 --> 01:10:09,420
observation and I'm wondering

2350
01:10:09,420 --> 01:10:10,859
is, okay, does the agave,

2351
01:10:11,220 --> 01:10:12,800
and obviously it's a desert

2352
01:10:13,270 --> 01:10:15,829
adapted plant with different

2353
01:10:15,829 --> 01:10:17,170
photosynthetic pathways and all

2354
01:10:17,170 --> 01:10:18,250
the various pieces that that

2355
01:10:18,250 --> 01:10:19,630
means and the implications from

2356
01:10:19,630 --> 01:10:20,989
a soil microbiome perspective.

2357
01:10:22,380 --> 01:10:23,979
So there's a few thoughts that

2358
01:10:23,979 --> 01:10:25,680
went through my mind and one of

2359
01:10:25,680 --> 01:10:27,859
those is, did the benefits from

2360
01:10:27,859 --> 01:10:29,760
whatever that microbiome

2361
01:10:29,760 --> 01:10:31,100
association or root association

2362
01:10:31,100 --> 01:10:31,900
is,

2363
01:10:31,960 --> 01:10:33,779
to what degree do those transfer

2364
01:10:33,779 --> 01:10:35,380
to the following generation, to

2365
01:10:35,380 --> 01:10:36,640
those seed? You might want to

2366
01:10:36,640 --> 01:10:37,880
start collecting seed there for

2367
01:10:37,880 --> 01:10:38,680
your next generation.

2368
01:10:38,500 --> 01:10:39,640
I need to get a little pouch and

2369
01:10:39,640 --> 01:10:40,440
go through there.

2370
01:10:40,750 --> 01:10:41,550
Yeah.

2371
01:10:42,189 --> 01:10:43,250
If they're producing triple the

2372
01:10:43,250 --> 01:10:44,329
yields, it'd be interesting to

2373
01:10:44,329 --> 01:10:45,210
see how that transfers.

2374
01:10:45,760 --> 01:10:47,600
It's just, it's one of the small

2375
01:10:47,600 --> 01:10:48,960
observations that I've made.

2376
01:10:51,140 --> 01:10:52,060
My wife laughs at me.

2377
01:10:52,100 --> 01:10:53,600
I spend probably 90 % of my time

2378
01:10:53,600 --> 01:10:54,920
walking up and down those agave

2379
01:10:54,920 --> 01:10:57,039
and 10 % of my time driving

2380
01:10:57,039 --> 01:10:58,180
around the other fields because

2381
01:10:58,180 --> 01:10:59,939
they're so broad and so big.

2382
01:11:00,420 --> 01:11:01,220
that,

2383
01:11:01,430 --> 01:11:02,829
but I can walk the entire agave

2384
01:11:02,829 --> 01:11:04,449
field in one, you know, one

2385
01:11:04,449 --> 01:11:05,250
hour.

2386
01:11:04,829 --> 01:11:06,090
I can walk up and back and look

2387
01:11:06,090 --> 01:11:06,970
at the whole thing and I'll

2388
01:11:06,970 --> 01:11:07,770
just,

2389
01:11:07,489 --> 01:11:08,890
you know, I name all my plants.

2390
01:11:10,210 --> 01:11:13,060
But it's interesting to see,

2391
01:11:13,260 --> 01:11:14,060
it's a

2392
01:11:14,979 --> 01:11:18,079
very nice little snapshot of

2393
01:11:18,079 --> 01:11:19,060
everything, what everything

2394
01:11:19,060 --> 01:11:22,039
could be if you were able to put

2395
01:11:22,609 --> 01:11:23,989
everything out there and just

2396
01:11:23,989 --> 01:11:25,529
not have to worry about

2397
01:11:27,180 --> 01:11:29,300
what it's going to produce

2398
01:11:29,300 --> 01:11:30,220
because it's just

2399
01:11:30,890 --> 01:11:32,090
almost a test plot.

2400
01:11:32,430 --> 01:11:33,390
And I'm

2401
01:11:33,890 --> 01:11:35,369
very interested to see what all

2402
01:11:35,369 --> 01:11:36,329
the interactions do.

2403
01:11:38,010 --> 01:11:39,210
There's so much left for us to

2404
01:11:39,210 --> 01:11:40,810
explore and so much to be

2405
01:11:40,810 --> 01:11:41,610
observed.

2406
01:11:42,439 --> 01:11:43,239
Well,

2407
01:11:43,100 --> 01:11:44,020
Jay, thank you.

2408
01:11:44,079 --> 01:11:45,500
Thank you for being here, for

2409
01:11:45,500 --> 01:11:46,460
the work that you're doing, for

2410
01:11:46,460 --> 01:11:47,920
sharing your experiences and

2411
01:11:47,920 --> 01:11:48,720
your observations.

2412
01:11:49,020 --> 01:11:50,880
And I look forward to coming to

2413
01:11:50,880 --> 01:11:51,979
visit at some point and having

2414
01:11:51,979 --> 01:11:53,180
more conversations like this

2415
01:11:53,180 --> 01:11:53,980
one.

2416
01:11:53,930 --> 01:11:54,730
Absolutely.

2417
01:11:54,670 --> 01:11:55,869
I look forward to it.

2418
01:11:56,029 --> 01:11:57,149
I think Pedro is coming out

2419
01:11:57,149 --> 01:11:58,750
sometime this year.

2420
01:11:59,090 --> 01:12:01,329
He was pretty curious as to how

2421
01:12:01,329 --> 01:12:02,130
everything works here because

2422
01:12:02,090 --> 01:12:03,250
it's a whole different world,

2423
01:12:03,369 --> 01:12:04,850
the way we irrigate, the way we

2424
01:12:04,850 --> 01:12:05,650
have to farm.

2425
01:12:06,250 --> 01:12:08,590
So I think he's coming out.

2426
01:12:09,960 --> 01:12:10,859
All right. Thank you, Jay.

2427
01:12:11,180 --> 01:12:12,020
Thank you very much.