Superintendent Series: Justin DePippo of Bel-Air Country Club

00:00:01
Speaker 1: The Friday Egg Superintendent series is brought to you by Toro. Among the countless reasons why we go to the course, communing with Mother Nature, sits near the top of mosless and the company most trusted to responsibly maintain our golf environments, Toro continues to lead the way. Its line of all electric and hybrid mowers and vehicles do their jobs as well as ever better. Actually, because while their precision, power, reliability and comfort remain the same, this new breed reduces engine exhaust emissions, noise pollution, and increases efficiency and ease of maintenance. If only our golf swings were that productive and sustainable. Follow add Toro Golf on Twitter and reach out to your local Toro distributor to schedule a demo. I miss a green, for example, I'm already upset when I find my ball in the bunker, I'm really upset.

00:00:52
Speaker 2: And when I find my.

00:00:53
Speaker 3: Ball in a bright egg Frida Egg the dread and Frida Egg, Frida Egg, Frida Egg Egg, Frida Egg bride Egg.

00:00:59
Speaker 1: Lie ready to run off of the hup? All right, Welcome back to another edition of the Frida Egg podcast in our Superintendent series. Today's episode is with the director of agronomy from the bel Air Country Club. I'm not sure if there's a the there, it might be. It sounds right. I feel like it could be a the Ohio state situation. Justin de Pitpo. Justin is a phenomenal superintendent, having played bel Air just recently, it is probably one of the best conditioned courses I've ever been to, rock hard, really firm and fast, fairways, firm greens, and he's done a marvelous job with the restoration there and the continued projects that they have. They have some USGA events coming up. He is a bright young star in the superintendent industry and uh a really good guy. So, without further ado, here is Justin to pip up. What's the uh, what's the oddest request that you've gotten from an adjacent homeowner that you can.

00:02:25
Speaker 2: Tell honest request?

00:02:29
Speaker 3: Nothing really jumps out as odd, but more of a some extreme request to you know, completely alter some portion of the golf course just to drastically improve their their view.

00:02:42
Speaker 1: Is it all about the view? Uh?

00:02:45
Speaker 3: Yes, I mean the way we sit the golf course is below a lot of these homes, so you know, when they walk out to their backyard or back porch or kitchen window and look out. Majority of their panoramic view is the golf course.

00:03:00
Speaker 1: So it's with you sitting below. Naturally you know what's going on up top because everything comes down to you, right Usually.

00:03:12
Speaker 3: No, naturally, I don't know. I find out when it's a little too late, because by then it's coming down the hill and ending.

00:03:19
Speaker 2: Up on the golf course.

00:03:20
Speaker 3: Whether it's sewage or water pipe or.

00:03:27
Speaker 1: Pools.

00:03:27
Speaker 3: You know, some pool guy left the hose on and the pool's now overflowing. So it usually one of the three.

00:03:35
Speaker 1: So you manage, uh, you manage the golf course, the grounds, and you've got your membership that you you deal with, but you also have you're you're almost like the property manager of the homeowners association too.

00:03:47
Speaker 3: In a way the way you know this golf course winds its way through the hills here. Uh, I know majority of the neighbors just as well as I do the members.

00:03:55
Speaker 2: So yes, in a way.

00:03:59
Speaker 1: Uh tell you know, obviously this is bel Air's one of the most unique properties in all of golf. Like you know, when it was built, it was a marvel that it was even constructed, you know, George Thomas for those that aren't aware is it's it's a it's effectively three canyons and the you know, there's a central canyon that you te off on one, but then you wind back into back canyon on the front nine, and then there's a back canyon that most of the back nine sits in. And what present what challenges does this do these canyons present? I imagine, just like I noticed it from like having shot the place with a drone, how hard it is to get around? How do you get equipment around?

00:04:47
Speaker 3: I mean the logistical challenges of our operation here and just basically doing anything, you know, we deal with some sort of challenge, whether it's equipment or noise or I mean, I'm sure you could tell just pulling in this morning. You came through a private all girls high school just to come to the shop. So you know, there's challenges just getting anybody inside the gates, which it could be any one of our you know, eighteen to twenty gates, and equipment wise, you know, we have a couple service gates that we have to use, and you have to backtrack the same way you went in to come back out, and so there's a lot of time and you know, logistical thought that's put into just how we go about our morning.

00:05:36
Speaker 1: Uh.

00:05:37
Speaker 2: You know we've too you.

00:05:40
Speaker 3: Know, California labor laws, we only have you know, four and five hours to work in the morning. So yeah, you take your meeting, you take your break. Outside of that, you're left with four hours.

00:05:48
Speaker 2: And thirty minutes.

00:05:49
Speaker 3: I mean, we've you could almost put every task down to the minute as to this is where you're going, this is exactly how you're driving in and out, just to get the most of you know, there's four hours and thirty minutes. And it's all really due to just the challenges of you know, having four tunnels that certain carts can fit one way but not the other. You know, everything we buy, we go measure the width of it and see if it'll fit.

00:06:16
Speaker 1: So the manufacturer spects are super important.

00:06:19
Speaker 3: Yes, yes, we actually had a challenge. We demoed some vehicles and they were great, fit through, no problem, and ordered them with roofs. And then when they all showed up with roofs, none of them fit through fit through three of the tunnels, but the fourth one on the back did not. So we had to make a quick adjustment and have custom roofs installed. On all of our carts just to make it through the tunnel.

00:06:46
Speaker 1: So you took over, and everybody on your crew, I imagine a lot of them sticked over, stayed over from the previous superintendent. And were there things that you just talked about, like having to be dialed down to the minute? Were there things that you figured out. Do you have like an example of an operational efficiency that you tweak something? Maybe it's even like a route to a hole where you you picked up time like it. Tell me about that, and how do you how you went about the process of like figuring out how to make things more efficient.

00:07:23
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean we definitely went through a lot of that. There was a learning curve there. Uh, and it was actually fairly difficult in the sense that, you know, I mean I relied heavily on the veteran staff and everybody who had been here because by the time I started, the course was already shut down, so we were about a month into the project, and you know, so I didn't really get to go through a normal day of operating. And then uh, you know, there was you know, the lay the hole by whole layout didn't change, but all the features did, and there was a handful of bunkers removed and redone and you know true, you know this doesn't that were opened up, so you had to be a little more cautious of where he went. And but no, we changed a lot of the routing everything that was a lot of the tasks that we're done here before were more section based. You know, you would kind of go to your three whole section and you did every task in.

00:08:16
Speaker 2: That section, and.

00:08:19
Speaker 3: That kind of slowed down the overall. You know, somebody could still be working on three, four, five, and yet six and seven and ten and eleven are already done, right, So I tried to get us in more of a sequence order of routing to get every part of the process done ahead of the ahead of play.

00:08:40
Speaker 1: And how was it with the construction When you guys did the restoration with like the heavy machinery.

00:08:45
Speaker 3: We'd have to bring in a large semi and pick a piece of equipment up and driving around and bring it in another gate. So we would, you know, on a Saturday, if we knew, hey, we're going to go to another section of the golf course on Monday, we'd bring a semi in load up to x ecavator or dozer and you know, leave the gate on fifteen in the back canyon and then come to our gate over here off sunset bring in unload.

00:09:07
Speaker 1: So yeah, how did it compare it to like La when you guys did work at LA and and and.

00:09:13
Speaker 3: You know at LA you could come in really well, like the south course of the project we did right at the end there before I left. You know, we started at the far corner there on kind of five six area and worked our way back to the shop. You kind of worked your way out where you come in from here. We basically did that four times, so you know we had four separate locations of bringing material in sand and gravel and hauling from and equipment and yeah, it was just all part of the challenge. You know, it's it uh add some speed bumps, but you know we got through it. But no, it's it's you showed me that video earlier and it was like bringing everything back. It was hard to believe that we did it that way out through it.

00:10:01
Speaker 1: With that with the canyons too. Everybody in San Francisco loves to talk about micro climates, and you effectually have a property that's got like four different climates. Do you get like do you have to maintain different areas differently because of things? Do you do you have to wait to do?

00:10:20
Speaker 2: Like how does that definitely?

00:10:22
Speaker 3: You know, are you know, our two toughest canyons over here three four, five and kind of.

00:10:27
Speaker 2: Six seven there.

00:10:28
Speaker 3: Those are the two or the lower lying canyons that tend to be pretty heavily shaded through the winter. So a majority of the growing season, you know, spring through fall, we're good, you know, bank grass permuta grass does pretty well here, but those winter months to December, January, February can be pretty tough in those areas just with the limited sunlight. So, uh, those areas we you know, we pull back on our mowing, you know, heavily focused on just rolling or you know, just moving traffic around any way we can to you know, spread the wear and tear and just help with the recovery. That's that's another challenge of our you know, the way we just kind of nestled in here nice and tight and what.

00:11:15
Speaker 1: Are the advantages are there any I mean, we've talked about all the challenges. Do you do you is there anything that's the quirkiness of this place that you actually end up being like, you know, it's pretty nice for here.

00:11:27
Speaker 3: I mean, just that statement right there, it's pretty nice for here, you know, I mean you being able. I mean every morning, you know, if you get to drive up to the first tea here and look out, and you know, I get to start my day with a cup of coffee right there and walk out.

00:11:40
Speaker 2: I mean, it's.

00:11:40
Speaker 3: Just I mean, probably the best view in LA one of the best views. I mean. And then I mean you get halfway into your you know, the the routing here, and you turn back on ten and you're looking at downtown and it's almost like an.

00:11:53
Speaker 2: Even better view in another direction.

00:11:55
Speaker 3: So just the vistas and views here that this property offers, and it's routing of just the way it flows through it is just, I mean, it's really something special.

00:12:06
Speaker 1: It's funny. It's uh. I'm out here with Will who works for us, and he has, uh, he's never been to l A, really spent like it's considerable time, and he was asking me on the drive over here, like where where's downtown. I was like, oh, just wait, just wait a few minutes and then I'll be able to point you exactly where it is. And we we got up to the first tea and I'm like, that's downtown. He's like, WHOA. Like you know, it's like, you know, I've spread out. It is an incredible place. It's in terms of the in terms of the views and everything, and uh, you know you you you mentioned a couple of times you how often do you walk the golf course.

00:12:45
Speaker 3: At least two three days a week? And you know, sometimes I'll get maybe four days in I'll be nine to nine or three, you know, as much as I can. Really it's it's I think, really important to try to see the golf course from the golfer's point of view. You know, if I'm just running around in my cart, then I'm blown by stuff or the majority of our car paths are off to the side, if we even do have a car path. So if I'm just you know, I usually try to keep my cart on the path as much as I can. So if I'm if I'm just cruising around, I could be missing a lot.

00:13:18
Speaker 1: So what what type of stuff have you picked up? Like on where you is there an example you can think of where you saw something walking that changed the perspective of how you guys maintained stuff.

00:13:34
Speaker 3: Uh, you know, one recently did was our bunker rake placement.

00:13:37
Speaker 2: You know, it's.

00:13:39
Speaker 1: I'm always interested in bunker rake place.

00:13:41
Speaker 2: But small change.

00:13:43
Speaker 1: You know.

00:13:43
Speaker 3: I had always wanted to keep them in the rough off to the side. You know, they were like less visible, and you know, I didn't want to interfere with, you know, while rolling into a bunker, uh, being in that line of play. And I also originally wasn't a fan of it. Sitting out in the bunker. I just felt like it made up stand down a little more. We recently just went to just resting the handle on the side.

00:14:05
Speaker 1: And I'm a big half in, half out guy.

00:14:08
Speaker 3: Well that's what we're doing now, so it's more convenient. And really, you know, most of our plays caddy play, and if the caddi's you know, rushing to get the putter handed to the guy just hit a shot out and then he's got to rush back and break the bunker. And the guy wants his club cleaned and the ball cleaned because he just hit it out of the bunker. Caddy's trying to run three different directions all at once. You know, they get a half assed job a rake and chuck the rake, you know, or and the other thing is we have a lot of the you know, the fairway line just runs right along the edge of the bunker, so if it's always in the rough, it might be ten to fifteen yards behind you, which is inconvenient. You know, it should kind of be where a majority of the people are stepping in and out of the bunker, so we kind of try to distribute them in the right locations and just more efficient.

00:14:54
Speaker 1: You know, totally. So you've worked a few places you were at around the Mink before you came to LA and I'm curious that was before they did a restoration. How's how does your approach maintaining a course that hasn't yet you know, was restored you know, years ago, but older you know, it's an older course. Is there anything you're doing differently than when you, you know, effectively had a brand new course here where you've got new turf, new new greens. Is there different maintenance practices that go into like, you know, how you're how you're approaching, uh, maintaining your greens and grass.

00:15:34
Speaker 3: Oh definitely, I mean when you have a course that hasn't matured yet, there's definitely a lot more inputs involved in there. You know, if you've got new greens that especially if you do sandbase that there's no organic in there. You're watering a little more frequently, you're fertilizing a little more frequently. Yeah, similar to fairways. If you have new fairway grass, you're gonna have to alder your you know, herbicide or pre emergence. I mean at every year, you know, the plant's going to mature and I'm gonna be able to handle a little more. We're gonna be able push things a little harder, you know, and you figure out too every year what works and what doesn't work. Maybe there's a better timing in the year to do certain applications, or you know, just maybe you got to get a little more aggressive late fall going into winter to you know, put things to bed or you know, it just depends that. I mean, that's something that you do back east, but you wouldn't do out here. You know, out here, it's you're kind of trying to go into the winter as strong as you can because the golf doesn't stop. You know, it's just the days are a little shorter, but it's still just as busy.

00:16:37
Speaker 1: Yeah, when do you try and like breathe when you're going when you're a year around.

00:16:43
Speaker 3: I like to say, you know, it's it's a little more steady out here because it's just three sixty five. It's you know, we you know, maybe don't ever operate. Yeah, I guess I could say one hundred percent. It's more staying at that ninety percent, you know, or you know, DC, Philly anywhere. But you know, you might be at like one hundred and ten some weeks, you know, you're just nineties and humid and thunderstorms are coming through, you know, and you're just pulling your hair out. I don't think I'm ever pulling my hair out, but you know, it's just it's it's steady here. There is no off season. It just uh things slowed down a little bit, but golf doesn't.

00:17:20
Speaker 1: So it's, uh, yeah, I imagine you know you're having winner is nice. You probably have to approach your staff a little bit differently too, and how you manage, right.

00:17:31
Speaker 3: One hundred percent, we're definitely a little more schedule oriented out here. You could say, you know, everybody's your entire staff is mostly full time. You know, we don't we don't shut down in the winter, right, You're not no golf and you have seasonal labor. It's it's more full time, so you definitely got to manage their their time and days off and just be a little more schedule oriented because you're you know, it's it's it's it's a marathon on a race out here. You know, it's it's doesn't end, and you got to make it till the end. And the second it does end December thirty, first January one, it starts back up again.

00:18:09
Speaker 2: So my mindset definitely changed their coming out here.

00:18:14
Speaker 1: Does anybody do like I know cal Club does like two week maintenance like maintenance like course shutdown. Do you do you guys? Is that a common practice in California?

00:18:24
Speaker 3: Yes, we do eight days in July, you know, being mostly bermuda grass, that's you know, July, August, September. You know, it's probably the best bermuda weather we have out here, so rate at the beginning there we just that's when we'll get aggressive with our fairways, tease rough all the bermuda grass, and then we'll time it with our greens as well. Try to the good thing there is you try to inconvenience the membership as little as possible. So if we can be super aggressive one week a year and try to get as much done as we can, and you know, any of our surface management practices do whatever we can that week that'll allow for better conditioning throughout the year.

00:19:03
Speaker 1: So those eight days harding to break at all for you. It seems like those were probably the hardest things.

00:19:08
Speaker 3: Everybody else at the club schedules, you know, like a nice week vacation and everybody's time off, you know, a couple of people coming up top.

00:19:15
Speaker 2: That's about it. And we're, you know, twelve fifteen hour days, and you know.

00:19:20
Speaker 3: We've had so many big projects going on. It seems like every year we're trying to you know, not only do the golf course, but time it was something else, and you know, it's it. It's like there's still not enough time in the day. Even with eight days, I'd sit here and say, oh, du it'd be great two weeks.

00:19:38
Speaker 2: Sorry.

00:19:38
Speaker 1: I mean, so you're in the midst of a huge clubhouse renovation. I mean when you took the job, and it was what twenty seventeen.

00:19:46
Speaker 3: Twenty eighteen, twenty.

00:19:48
Speaker 1: Seventeen, I've tried to remember back exactly, but twenty seventeen, you're you're doing a full course restoration in between that, then you had COVID. It's it's like there's never been you almost in a way, I have never had just normalcy.

00:20:03
Speaker 3: No, No, it's the talk about it with our general manager. We haven't had just like a normal operating year and so long. You know, seventh part of the project was in twenty seventeen, majority of it was twenty eighteen. You know, the first year the course was open twenty nineteen. Obviously we're really busy. I mean the court restoration work was really well received.

00:20:26
Speaker 2: Rounds were up.

00:20:26
Speaker 3: So so you had the challenges of it just being a year one golf course and you know, having you know, new challenges and new property for myself figuring things out and what works what doesn't. And then you had an increased volume of play. And then before you know, at March of twenty twenties, COVID we rolled into a fifty three day full closure. I mean it was just a couple of us coming in working so and then the project that you mentioned. So yeah, it's been one thing after another.

00:20:57
Speaker 1: When you look back at COVID, he's so you shut your your the whole club shut down for fifty three days. You're doing barebones maintenance with bare bones people and then you come out of it and it's you know, I imagine was very stressful to manage people during that time and be like one of the businesses operating. Did you does anything? You know, obviously golf as a whole has come out of COVID really a big winner. But from a maintenance side, did that time where you guys were kind of bare bones change the way you maintained the facility out of COVID? Was there like anything that you learned from that?

00:21:40
Speaker 3: You know, we we went through it of you know, we started with, okay, how how much can we pull back? You know, obviously the golf course is you know, the biggest asset to the club and the membership, and we would never want to do any sort of long term you know, pull back there. But we tried to get through those. You know, the beginning of that, that sixty day stretch, we didn't know what was going to happen, right, so it was pulled back full force. Okay, once the dust settled a little bit, we you know kind of said, okay, what's our priorities here? You know, what do we need to do to maintain and keep everything in good shape, and you know, I kind of went through and said, look, we can you know, get things kicking again shortly after once we do open up, and uh tried to just pull back as a way to help as much as we could, you know. I mean it's uh we were uh we we didn't you know, let any staff go or furlough or anything. We you know, kept everybody on through those two months there. So anything we could do with not really knowing what the end result was going to be was the mindset going into it.

00:22:49
Speaker 1: Now for a quick word from our sponsor, Toro. For more than a century, with cutting edge turf equipment and the irrigation solutions, Toro has had your front nine covered and your back nine too. In fact, Toro's always had your back period. Toro is is committed to your long term success as tour pros are committed to their shot. That's down to top notch customer support from Toro and it's dedicated local distributors. Both of them are passionate about delivering turf equipment and irrigation solutions that solve real world problems. Follow at Toro Golf on Twitter and reach out to your local Toro distributor today what was it like coming into a job. You're taking a job and then in that you're you're like in the midst of a project, like it's it's full force, Like did that what was that experience?

00:23:38
Speaker 3: Like? You know, I really credit uh, you know, working at La Country Club for five years or so, you know, we did a lot in my stretch there. I mean we did, Uh, there was a big driving range project we had done early on. We had the Walker Cup, we did the clubhouse, we did the whole entire South course, a lot of prep work for the open the same time. Since the gil was out and construction company was already there, so it was easy to get through some of the stuff. You know, I almost had lived the life of one thing after another for a while, so I was coming off that project over there, so it was pretty easy to just kind of jump in the seat here and get going.

00:24:23
Speaker 1: You know.

00:24:23
Speaker 2: It was exciting.

00:24:24
Speaker 3: I mean, you know, not too many guys on the side of the business get to just instead of getting off on the wheelshre eggs that you get off on the sunsets in the morning.

00:24:31
Speaker 1: So yeah, it's just a short, short, short job over here. I was looking at it was funny to look at La on Google Earth and I the other night last night, I was looking at like Airbnb directions here and you know, directions from our airbnb to here, and I just was like, God, I forgot how close they are together.

00:24:53
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean it's two minutes up the road, three minutes, you know. I mean so it's Uh, that was really cool to be able to do. And you know, I'm fortunate enough to the timing worked out that way, and uh, come over here, and it was great to be part of the project.

00:25:08
Speaker 2: Uh was it was.

00:25:09
Speaker 1: The most satisfying thing. What's the what's the aspect of of We'll say both here in La see see the South Course project. What when you look back, is there something that you think about, like the most about about those projects where a memory that you have that is particular that sticks with you.

00:25:30
Speaker 2: You know.

00:25:34
Speaker 3: The big thing was just the probably the amount of work we accomplished. And uh, you know, the people you work alongside with when you go through those projects, it's like a relationship you build and uh, you know, from the contractors and architects to you know, your own staff.

00:25:50
Speaker 1: It's just.

00:25:52
Speaker 3: It to people who don't understand maybe all of it, it might not be as like, seemed like so much that you took on and you were able to accomplish. But when you look back and what you did, and you know, when you get to see the end result and it comes out and things are so well received and the golf world gets to you know, really appreciate it, and membership appreciates it and loves it, and you know, it's rewarding. I mean, it's uh, you know, it's why we do what we do.

00:26:17
Speaker 1: And it's funny. I spend a considerable time checking in on something on a project this winter, and it's amazing how if you go every day, it feels like nothing's really happening. But then if you if you don't go for like ten days and you come back, you're like, WHOA, so much has happened. You know, it's like a it's when you when you have like a little space from it, it's you're like, wow, this is really cooking. But when you're in it on a daily basis, there's so much that goes into reconstructing like a singular feature, let alone in an entire golf course.

00:26:59
Speaker 3: You know, there's so much little steps, you know, and you can have you know, however, many contractors in helping, from irrigation to just a general construction company to your own staff to you know, tree company, and you know, maybe.

00:27:16
Speaker 2: Landscape companies helping.

00:27:17
Speaker 3: And you know, if you if you look at every little piece of the puzzle, and you know, you just look at one golf hole and you know it's really just a big train, right that goes through the whole thing. And if yeah, I mean, if you're out there every day looking at every step, you're you know, you're always excited about the next thing, the next thing. You know, I can't wait to listen to I know, I can't wait to listen to I know, I can't wait.

00:27:34
Speaker 2: Till this is done.

00:27:35
Speaker 3: But when you take a step back and you look at it every two weeks or so, you'd be like, oh wow, look it's really coming together that look at that whole now. Two weeks ago there was nothing there, you know.

00:27:45
Speaker 1: So is the most satisfying thing when when the grass is down and you know you're you're moving on to something else.

00:27:51
Speaker 3: Uh, you know, at the end of those projects, I think the most satisfying thing is when everybody leaves and then it's just you know, the growing of you and your staff, and it's like, wow, those other fifty seventy people that were on site, you know, architects and contracts and you know, and you finally just get to you know, come in and work with your team and you know, you get to detail and dial everything in. You know that that's a reaching that point feels like a huge relief and like, Okay, we're getting there.

00:28:21
Speaker 2: We almost there.

00:28:22
Speaker 1: Yeah. And I think that's the thing is that most people think like and even think like opening day then it's everything's done. But you know, having been here a few times, you know, during construction to now, like you guys are continuing to evolve the course never it really never stops.

00:28:43
Speaker 3: Right, No, I mean it's always evolving, you know naturally. You know, a big thing that we've continued working on is kind of like our perimeter landscape plan. There was still you know, we took out a lot of you know, non native material here and you know, we really focused on the golf hole and the golf side of things, and we did not in that nine month stretch put a whole lot of time or effort into you know, some of these hillsides and just how things tie in and flow together and that's something we've been working on year after year. And you know, I mean, you wouldn't keep a golf course closed to continue working on hillsides, right, you know, like the golf hole's done, like give it back, you know, let them enjoy it. So and you know, trees are going to grow, plants are going to grow, things are going to evolve, and you know it's something that you can work on through, you know, for the years to come, and we will be for a while.

00:29:40
Speaker 1: So do you. I mean, And this is something I think about a lot with like new golf courses. Right, It's like everybody rushes to go see new courses and like make a judgment about them. But like, you know, this place, the way it plays now versus the way it played three years ago, it's just a world different. I mean. And this is with every new course too. I say this to people all the time. It's like, you know, as much as as the resorts want you to come play the new course the first year, it's you know, I would mostly say don't go the first year, like a couple of years in because agronomically, you just everything gets so much better a couple of years.

00:30:23
Speaker 3: In, right, Yeah, of course. You know, like we touched on earlier. As you know, as things mature, they're going to be able to handle more you and be able to push them more. I mean, we weren't maintaining the course like we are today right out the gate, you.

00:30:34
Speaker 2: Know, but you know, you want to get open. You want people to enjoy it.

00:30:38
Speaker 3: I mean, you know you're not going to stay closed an extra three months just you know, just.

00:30:43
Speaker 1: For the Is there a feature that like you've changed the way you've maintained it because you saw, Hey, we thought we would do it this way and it just didn't necessarily work that way. So we're doing it a little bit differently. Uh.

00:30:55
Speaker 3: You know, a big thing is art the drywashes.

00:30:58
Speaker 2: You know, that was a.

00:31:00
Speaker 3: We weren't even really sure exactly how we were going to grass those, you know, how we were going to do it, what type of grass it was going to be. It really evolved as we went through the project, and that actually how those came to is it's kind of a cool story. We I was back and forth with the Dope guys and Renaissance guys on you know what we're going to do there and talking different grasses and you know, we knew the look we wanted, We knew we roughly how we wanted it to play, and we didn't want to market them as a hazard and be able to play through them. And so then we kind of started to get you know, how do we get there?

00:31:33
Speaker 2: And is it?

00:31:34
Speaker 3: Is it a native grassier grass or plant? You know, but they're really small. They get hit with overhead irrigation from the fairwayes and rough the way they just kind of wind through there. They don't have a separate irrigation. So we were sodding the fairways in February, so everything was coming in pretty dormant, so we were originally going to sprig that way. It came in kind of ratty and rustic and just you know, gave it a nice natural look rather than just sodding the flush or something. Right, we're seating perfectly or so we decided, uh, so we're gonna sprig. Well, February it was either you either get sold or sprigs get one or the other. You know, you know, we're trying to take whatever bermuda is available, and you know, we're pushing to try to get everything down as quickly as you can, you know, trying to make that opening date. So a couple of rolls came in in pretty rough shape that were.

00:32:23
Speaker 1: Just so you're essentially you're spoilage.

00:32:26
Speaker 2: Yes.

00:32:27
Speaker 3: So we had these like rolls massive, you know, big roll side that was sitting off to the side and we can't use it. And I'm sitting there and I'm like, what you know, Bermuda grows everywhere. I mean you'll see it growing in like a middle of the street and a crack. I mean, I mean you can spray around up on it and it'll come back two weeks later, you know. So I was like, hey, let's just let's just throw these in the in the washes, and uh, it looked like a bunch of little beef patties, you know. And our driving ange was still open and members were driving by and I would just see them stop and stare like what, like what is this?

00:32:59
Speaker 2: What was going on here?

00:33:00
Speaker 3: Is this?

00:33:01
Speaker 2: Is this the idea? Was this a plan?

00:33:02
Speaker 3: And you know, I just kind of told about be patient and now, I mean, they they came in phenomenal, They're great. We've actually never string trimmed or mode or fly mode or anything. We've never mowed them. Really, we manage them just with growth regulator, and we don't fertilize them.

00:33:17
Speaker 2: We try not to water them. We just basically would.

00:33:20
Speaker 3: Ant you know what it would be, yes, and you know it just let it grow naturally, you know, I mean maybe not fully since we do limit it with some growth regulator. But we don't want them to get unplayable, right, We don't want to be too thick and you know, not somebody not be able to find a ball. But you know they're still challenging to hit out of. But from a maintenance standpoint of being as low maintenance as can be, it's you know what a native area should be.

00:33:44
Speaker 1: Well, I think that's like one of the biggest challenges, especially in the Midwest that people have or even the East Coast. It's like I talked to so many supers that are like, you know, our native areas. We spend the most time working on native and it's like that that doesn't seem like a logical thing. But then they get out of hands so quick.

00:34:03
Speaker 3: No, I hear a handful of guys that you know, that's a challenge. You know, you put in these massive acreages and reduce rough and you know, bring some grass lines in and you know it ends up being more work in the long run trying to keep them clean and you know, have that perfect look, you could say. But now, the way these came out has been phenomenal. And you know, going into it, I thought we were going to be spots dring trimming here and there, you know, or whatever we had to do to maintain it. But they've been phenomenal. I mean, it's probably something I'm most happy with with, you know, not knowing how it was really going to turn out, but they came out great.

00:34:38
Speaker 1: So you got the women's say, I'm next year. The clubhouse will be done by then.

00:34:42
Speaker 3: Right, the first phase two phase projects, so yes, most of it will be done.

00:34:49
Speaker 1: So I think you'll just jump into a national championship right from that.

00:34:53
Speaker 2: That's the plan.

00:34:54
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know this our whole plan has been changed a little bit with COVID and you know, delays there and permitting and just getting things going. So but now we're we're moving along. Things are things are looking good. I mean, you it saw a good bit of it this morning, so it's it's coming along.

00:35:11
Speaker 1: With the What are the unique challenges that a tournament a championship present that you know, compared to doing these big projects with whether there are clubhouse projects or because or or restoration projects. In your past experience with LA and in the Walker Cup.

00:35:33
Speaker 3: You know, the big challenge with tournaments is just you're limited on time. You know, you're going off one in ten at seven thirty or seven am, so you know, instead of going off one at seven thirty or eat whatever your d time is. You know, all of a sudden, you got to get everything done within three and a half hours, three hours, So it's you know, you really.

00:35:55
Speaker 2: Got to think about how efficient.

00:35:57
Speaker 3: You can be, what you can do in the morning, what you can do in the evening. And that's why you see these huge volunteer groups that tournaments and you know, we all try to help each other out.

00:36:06
Speaker 1: And it's a big year for LA next year.

00:36:10
Speaker 2: Yes, Yeah, a lot going on.

00:36:11
Speaker 3: You know, Uh, you get the Open l A and we've got the Women's Am here and uh you get the riff Tournament and LA Open.

00:36:21
Speaker 2: So it's uh, I think I think this is the first US Open ever right in Los Angeles. Yeah, is it?

00:36:28
Speaker 1: Do you sense that, you know, having been around the area, uh for a long time, is there a lot of kind of like camaraderie amongst all your peers about everything going on, because obviously these championships they happen and they run so smoothly a lot of times because of volunteers that help with the gronomy. Like you know, your staff is going to be significantly larger the week of the of the Women's am and and l ACC is going to have people from all over helping out.

00:36:59
Speaker 3: Since the match play gets a little benefit there, it gets easier as the week goes on, So you know you're kind of heavy upfront that Saturday through Wednesday there, and then Thursday through the weekend just gets easier. I mean the final day, right, you got two people.

00:37:12
Speaker 1: Going off, so as you know, I haven't played some amateur events. I think one of the coolest things for a competitor is how the atmosphere of the tournament as you get further and further in a match play tournament changes and you know, it's just like when you walk out to the range in the morning, there's like when there's only four people left. Yeah, I've never gotten to where there's two, But when you when you go out and just the number of dwindles from that first morning of full field to it, it's a really cool and I imagine the same thing happens with with the with the turf staff. Like the you know, you're you're doing all the same work effectively, but for so few people.

00:37:51
Speaker 3: You know, yep, you know that you do get a little bit of a break as you know the tee times later and you know, you know you don't need the first that final tea time on Sunday isn't at seven thirty in the morning.

00:38:01
Speaker 1: So you're still a very young, uh superintendent, but you were a very young superintendent when you got your first head job. How how have you do you think your management has changed over the last you know, five years?

00:38:17
Speaker 3: You know, I think, uh, the most has probably just been this piss two years, you know really since COVID and just learning how to you know, manage the new workforce coming in and you know, labor is an issue everywhere and uh every part of the country right now, and you know, trying to attract new labor and retain people. There's definitely a a side of this that I definitely wouldn't have realized early on or thought about in my early twenties, that I need to learn how to you know, lead people in the sense of teaching them, engaging them, and you know, trying to get them on a on a bigger vision rather than you know, I think early on I probably would have just thought it's you know, you're going around, you give everybody their job assign in the morning, and it's you know, you go do your job, I go do mine, and there we go.

00:39:09
Speaker 2: But it's not that simple.

00:39:12
Speaker 1: With the with the labor. Have you how have you been going about procuring you know, people like it's obviously a huge challenge in the in the industry.

00:39:23
Speaker 2: Uh big.

00:39:24
Speaker 3: This best thing has worked for me is word of mouth, you know, trying to find people through you know, your current staff and you know, it's just it's such a unique job and uh you know, look it's early mornings and there's definitely a challenges to driving in Los Angeles and now I you know, I think the best thing that's worked for me is just word of mouth and you know, looking to hire people that have a connection with the people that are here and you know, whether it's a distant relative or neighbor, friend or something them.

00:40:00
Speaker 1: Yeah, you find probably a lot of people that can grow in the industry here right Like you can you can take a job as a mower and you could, you know, eventually become a superintendent. I mean that's one of the neat things I think about the job one hundred percent.

00:40:16
Speaker 2: I mean a lot of what you learn is on the job.

00:40:18
Speaker 3: And you know, there's no handful of people in the industry that you know of either it was a second career, right they got into it late with another degree, or maybe didn't go to college, picked up a certificate along the way, and we're still able to, you know, build a pretty bright future for themselves. And you know, it is a rewarding job. I mean you get to you get to see your hard work, you.

00:40:41
Speaker 2: Know, payoff.

00:40:42
Speaker 3: I mean you can go out there at the end of a project, at the end of an evening and you know, yeah, you may have just worked at ten twelve hour day, lay inside or something, look back and you look at your you know, your new.

00:40:51
Speaker 1: Tea or and then even like three weeks later, you can be like, look at how that looks now versus one it was.

00:40:58
Speaker 3: I can't even tell you how many times I've stood on the team, you know, uh and looked at the past few weeks.

00:41:03
Speaker 1: So, yeah, how'd you get into the turf?

00:41:08
Speaker 3: Started as a summer job in high school working at a called Heartfield National in Kent Square outside Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. Uh, my stepfather works for the USGA, and he kind of introduced me to the business, and uh was good friends with the superintendent at Heartfeld at the time. And just you know, I wanted a summer job, wanted to make some money, and uh, to be honest, never knew you could you could do this.

00:41:35
Speaker 1: And uh did you play golf before you or just.

00:41:40
Speaker 3: Like a little bit, you know, with you know, family friends here and there. You know, I wasn't a huge golfer by any means, but you know, I enjoyed being outside and just enjoyed working with my hands, and just I just kind of fell in love with the work. Really, I you know, I loved it. I couldn't rarely took days off and just just stuck with it. And yeah, went I went to penn State for turf grass management, and career just kind of went from there.

00:42:11
Speaker 1: Then you then you found yourself out in l A.

00:42:14
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, that was pretty big jump in between there.

00:42:16
Speaker 1: But yeah, do you miss the do you miss the transition zone and all?

00:42:19
Speaker 3: Uh, you know, there's if I go back in the fall or you know, it's def yeah, basically fall. You go back and you get like a nice cool morning and the leaves are changing and it's just like, oh wow, this.

00:42:30
Speaker 2: Is nice, you know.

00:42:31
Speaker 3: But then I'll go back in January or February and snow on the ground and it's freezing, and.

00:42:37
Speaker 1: Or you go back in July and it's like one hundred in human and you're like, yeah, you.

00:42:41
Speaker 3: Know, you step outside for ten minutes, you're sweating and yeah no, So, uh, you can easily be reminded how how good it is out here, and you know why I first came out and enjoy it.

00:42:53
Speaker 1: So all right, well maybe we'll talk when we get closer to the women's dam. But uh, I appreciate the time, and.

00:43:01
Speaker 2: I was good sneing. Glad you came down for the day.

00:43:03
Speaker 1: Doing doing a phenomenal job. The place is like flying, so you appreciate it. Yeah, and uh, people can find you. You're on you're on Twitter. You're not super active, but.

00:43:15
Speaker 2: A little here and there, I jump on it, you know. Yeah, I don't go crazy with it, but you.

00:43:21
Speaker 1: Got what you got one of the most popular turf dogs.

00:43:23
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, she kind of She takes the trophy there, so I'll let her have the you know, be number one in that in that side of things. So it's a little a little celerity celebrity dog.

00:43:34
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, all right, Well, thank you and uh, I mean I don't even keep up the good work.

00:43:41
Speaker 3: I appreciate it.