Combine Day 1: Kyler Murray... Drama?

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Speaker 1: Be around the NFL. Podcast would be called the NFL in Germany, Oh Topical from the Indianapolis Convention Center. It's around the NFL, um Dan Hansas on a riser filled with Saphiros, Greg Rosendal, Mark Sessler. Yes, boys, here we are in the beautiful Midwest for another year. Mike McCarthy said it, well, it rarely does, but in this case he did on the riser, calling the combine the starting line of his year, and in a lot of ways it's the same for us. He also said he can't say enough of what Indianapolis has meant to the NFL over the years, because who knows. We don't know if this combine is going to be the last one here for a little while. Um, we've been coming here since two thousand and twelve as a group on on some level. Uh, you know, good, good time to see Mike McCarthy taking some Trenchant company man pointers from Greg so that Greg alone doesn't have to do all that. Yeah, if this is the last year in Indianapolis, that would be uh, that would be said. I am a creature of comfort. I like to do the same thing over and over again. That's why I spearheaded yet another trip to Elmo sat Almo Steakhouse tomorrow. I'm all about like just having traditions. But I guess, after what twenty some odd years, it seems like it's going in another direction. And I will miss India if if if it exits the mix. That's good to get to know you a little bit better. You painted out you know some of your characterizations famously why you never want to leave the country. That's it's sort of in that same ballpark. Well, other things are involved there too. That's that's a false characterization. I used to say that what you used to say, well, what do I need to see the rest of the world? That was a big thing. That was you putting words in my mouth. And I don't and I resent you for it. I look, I'm I am heading out of the country from my tenure anniversary. You are red, white, and blue centric. I wouldn't. I do love my country. I I know that's something not a lot of people like to say. But I am a fan of being an American. How about freedom? How about that? How about you know, look around the world down freedom as a concept. It's fine. I think I think it's okay to to go visit other places. It's that disloyal, It's not like it's not again in my mouth. At no point that I say it was disloyal to leave this country. Well you applied that somehow not when we start the show, you we definitely cannot. Yes, here we are in the center of all the action, all the we're in a new spot this year. We've been at the Lucas Oil Stadium in a suite for the past few years, but this year we're in the convention center around where all the press conferences are going down. Very cool to be kind of in the center of it all. And by the way, speaking about Mike McCarthy, and we're gonna get to all the coaches and GM's news that came out of today. We have a great guess um, including Bill's general manager Brandon Bean. We have Steelers GM Kevin Colbert on the eve of his retirement. Um. But there was a great moment when it's hard to get you know, real nugs, real news to come out of these press conferences. So when Mike McCarthy off handedly says, yeah, Dak, you know, Dak Prescott a little clean up on his shoulder, He's like Hamma Hammeda. And actually so you could tell as I'm in the scrum, uh, you see people be like, oh, Dak Prescott had surgery. And then I hear behind me and I turned around and there's Greg with a an audible m from the Mike McCarthy Dak revelation and that and that is the combine. I mean, that's it takes a lot for Mike McCarthy to get that, And that's the highest thing you can get as a person in the NFL. How about the second hand anxiety of being in those scrums and when someone's trying to get a question in that There was a guy next to me during um who was it? Joe Shane? I think the giants gems Joe, And then the PR guy eventually goes two more, two more for Joe, and you see like the temperature rising in that poor individual space and when he doesn't get it off, inevitably, not only have you failed in your core job as a journal to get that question out, everyone knows you failed. Oh it's it's performative. Yeah, it's I mean we've all been there where you try to shout and get that earliest word in where you get the eye contact of the person up on the podium, and when it doesn't happen, you're deflowered, you're emasculated. I got out of the game officially this year. I retired from it, just the spectator, but I know Greg you you want to be involved still in that capacity. And it's more just like when when you get through like seven questions where Mike McCarthy's trying to run out the clock by like answering philosophy. If we don't want turnovers and penalties. It's like, can we hear about Amari Cooper that you're not gonna keep your best rip wide receiver potentially instead of just wasting all this time? Tough sitch, though you weren't able to get that question. It didn't get it in, didn't. It does take reps, the true the beat people, they've been doing it forever. They have that ability to either be in the right spot to say it a certain way anyway. That is the combine. There's there's all sorts of little subplots, and it does feel like the city and especially just like the football Cognis and everyone's so happy to see each other because there has been a two year break. It does feel like things are loosening up in the mask uh department, and in general people are going up to each other and hugging each other and very there's a lot of excitement. Loosening up is a is a conservative way to describe where the mask situation is here in Indianapolis. I haven't seen a mask. Well that's an overstatement. They are out, but for the most part, people are enjoying themselves and it's an exciting time anyway. So let's get to before we get to our interviews today. And we got another show coming up on Wednesday and another show on Friday that Greg Rosenthal Free Agent one oh one, unveiled on the Around the NFL podcast. Mark, have we decided whether we want to have a rival one oh one countdown this year? I think that bit probably played itself out in the in the past. I mean it would be are we would you and I like to get together tonight and instead of going out to dinner and doing the fun stuff, sit down brass tacks and come up with a list. Absolutely not. I find the one way to do it is go position by position first. By the way, you haven't, That's what I'm barrow it down. Maybe start with your interior offensive lineman guards centers, you know you might. You gotta get at least ten to fifteen per position to be safe. Try to pull me in change my mind where we are from where we are right now, I have zero interest in doing that on my own. I've gotten a lot of he actually from my Ben Jones versus Bradley Bozeman ranking. So yeah, that's probably something you could Mark. Mark and I have traded some texts about that, so yes, that maybe it is. We can't get it, We can't seem to agree, and a lot of stuff because we're so dugging on our points exactly. It's one of those situations. All right, let us start by hitting the news. But it is a business and you have to be able to separate the business and the personal side of it, which I think is important. All right, let us start with it. You know it was this is uh first day of the combine where there wasn't like a runaway winner. What's the big story of day one from Indie. But let's continue to attract this Kyler Murray situation because a lot is kind of transpired around Super Bowl week and we haven't really had a chance to talk about it when there is a sources coming out and saying that Kyler Murray is not a very good teammate that he points fingers the report that he did he refused to go back into the playoff loss of the Rams after it become a blowout. Kyler, though, then releases a statement saying, anybody that's for play with me knows that I'm a baller, and I'm a great teammate, and you know I'm a great player. Then the latest now to the stories, Kyler Murray's agent comes out and releases what reminded me of the Jerry McGuire mission statement, a long, rambling novel all in caps, which seems totally unnecessary. Well if it if it wasn't you know, much better written. That was by like a great Hollywood screenwriter and delivered beautifully. This thing was like you could have taken half of that out and it would have been fine. It's not well written. It's a bad it's a bad, bad job, hideous Russian novel of sorts and overly long and getting crushed on Twitter the minute it was released. But how about we ease up on the caps too? Yeah, we need to. I don't again test group this with someone you like did two bold like you know, bullets at the beginning of what really matters, and then you did another couple like hundred words after that. It's very I don't know it, honestly, if I was a player and my agents sent that out, like your job is to communicate effectively a message that that was like a playoff game. For Eric Burkhard, the agent, and he had Kyler Murray's performance in a playoff game, perhaps it's fitting in the UH statement, he said that Murray is committed to remaining with the Cardinal's long term, and he desperately wants to win a Super Bowl, even if he wasn't desperate to get back into that playoff game which leads to the Super Bowl. UM. And then today we had Steve Kim, the general manager, who said, despite the consternation about Kyler's contract status, he is entering his fourth season, which makes him eligible for an extension. UH. And you have this strange statement there is no concerns about a potential holdout of the star quarterback. Do you buy that, Greg Rostal No, that I mean, I thought that was a nothing burger of a statement. I don't buy anything that the Cardinals are saying about Kyler Murray or just publicly. First of all, Steve Kime is a good GM. He had. They've been willfully misleading a lot of times over the years when it comes to quarterbacks, when it comes to a lot of things publicly at the combine, how would he not be worried about a hold doubt? That statement to me was, if you don't give me a contract, I will be holding out. And he's in the only after three years of his deal. Not that many quarterbacks have gotten the three years. Certainly not many have held out to start the off season. They don't know that he said he's been talking to Kyler Murray. But I think that statement was very clear, like if I don't get what I want, I'm gonna be trouble and I'm willing to see where it goes. But it's like we're in a world where Lamar Jackson isn't out there verbally complaining about the fact that he doesn't have a massive extension. Kyler Murray could not have ended this past campaign in a more troubling fashion. The whole season, the whole team, the whole offense fell off a cliff. And I mean, I if I'm kind like, yeah, I'm with you, Greg, like this hold out is a concern, a trade demand is a concern, and Kyler Murray is the centerpiece of their team. But this seems to me like one of the more awkward fringe of madness campaigns by a player in a while. And it's just the wrong time to be talking about a contract extension, you know, I think it's I think it's different than say Baker last year, where who said nothing though said nothing, and there was a should we extend him? Should we not extend him? They didn't extend him. That turned out to be a smart decision. Kyler would make sense at the card, even though I thought he faded down the stretch obviously and did not play well in the playoffs. There there, we've seen much enough body of work to say, yes, of course you want to do a long term deal, but there seems to be some damage here between team and player, and I just I hold out hope as someone who you know, I like, I want some chaos and drama and this this particular happening. If he is that domino, it changes everything. There's so many things, so many teams that we're gonna have Kevin Colbert of the Steelers on later. There's so many teams that would sell out, I think to get into business with Kyler Murray, even if there are some disparaging reports about him as a teammate, I think this is just starting. I think this is gonna be the a to me in April. I can't imagine that the Cardinals are going to be interested whatsoever in trading and I just think there's gonna be uh a lot of drama. Going back to that that report you meant mentioned Dan. It was on ESPN from Chris Mortenson and then Mike Garafolo on our air had it too late and super Bowl Week about that he was uh immature, not a great leader, finger pointer you know, talked about his focus. There was like video game addiction and stuff being thrown out there. I missed that. Whoa and he is somebody's got it out for Kyler Murray. It's like that's coming from somewhere, that's coming from the team that is such a self interested finger pointing. Um not good leadership quotes or things to be putting out there. And to me, those are the types of things that you put out there if there's a power struggle between the coaching staff or personnel and the player and ownership is in the middle, and Bidwell has kind of come out publicly and said, like, Kyler's my guy, and I think I think it's messy, and I think that Kime knows it's messy and that it could be a problem. I think you're missing something else, not you. I mean the Cardinals in the middle of this soup is that strong head coach figure who unquestionably leads the team. And you're wondering, is it the coach is at the quarterback because I think that you've got issues with Cliff Kingsbury. I mean, we've seen it two years in a row, the way this team fades. I don't like where he talked to uh, Kyler and everything's fine. They share a name, I know, but if you don't believe anything else, you know that. I don't believe that at all. They share an agent too. That's very strange. Cliff Kingsbury and Kyler Murray share an agent. It's all at the risk of parsing the owner's words. He did say he loves Kyler Murray and a statement last week, but he also said he knows he's going to get better, which I think there's there's just some simmering tension obviously within that organization. And yes, if if Kyler wird hit the nuclear red button there and turn this into um I need out of here, there is going to be a bidding war for his service. If the Cardinals ever played Sten was close enough, especially coming after a couple of days of oh, actually we do want Kylier, we like them. And then they released that statement to me that was just like the first little this little action speak much louder than words in this volatile business. That was this the whole Eric Burkhardt, well, I don't know. I mean, did he write, sit down and red pen the whole thing himself? Someone pended and it was it was wanting from a reading angle Burkhard he's you know, he's an appointment on it. In other news, I mean, how can you represent Cliff Kingsbury and Kyler. It doesn't well that that will be changing soon potentially um the Tampa Bay Buccaneers. Obviously, another big story in the NFL is Tom Brady's quote unquote retirement and everything speaking of some like simmering tension underneath the surface. I I continue to sense even Bruce Arians doing all his media today that he's kinda he's got all set with the Tom Brady thing at this point, like he would love obviously that Tom Brady still be his quarterbackist. That would make his job easier. But also I don't know if Bruce is all about this drama outpost quote unquote retirement. Jason light, the general manager of the bucks uh said today on the Riser that yeah, they planned to leave the light on for the legendary goat if he does come back. I think with the with the Tom Brady, you never I personally never want to completely close the door. Now. I don't have any information that suggests that he is going to come back. I mean, I'm very good friends with him. We talk, we don't we haven't talked about that. I don't want to applay any pressure in that regard right now. And then Bruce sarah and said, right, I'm staring right where it happened because I watched it. He was with a gaggle of local reporters. Just this is how it works. Everybody. They do the riser combo with the big scrummer reporters. Then the beat guys get the coach or the GM privately to asked some more questions and there was more digging about Tom Brady, and Arians said like, oh yeah, when I talked to Tom, he slammed the door on me. So to Bruce Arians saying, there's no chance that Tom Brady is coming back at least this year. And then he was asked, why do you think this is a story? Said, well, you know a lot of these guys like Tom Brady, and not just Tom but other big time players. They like their name out there, they do. And he was asked, you know, if if Tom Brady wanted to come back and continue his career with another team outside of Tampa Bay, would Arians allomidate that? And he just said nope, bad business. And then it was like what would it take to wrestle Tom Brady away from Tampa Bay? Five number one? And this is why Arians is a breadtha fash chair in the middle that no, well, I don't think I don't. He does not like that report about the you know they will not be getting along as well. Um. The most telling thing I I believe that he said today was that he did not think veteran quarterbacks are gonna be traded. He he offered that up a couple of times. Jason Light kinda indicated that too. That's like, you can talk all you want about getting these big names and and maybe they're just soft playing it, but it's easier said than done. He did mention how he's known to Shaun Watson a long time and he's very surprised he's in that situation. And then if ever something would happen on that front, I would have to get clearance from the top of the organization. Uh So he seemed to leave that door open. But I think the Bucks are one of those teams that have checked around in the last month and it's like, yeah, Russell Wilson and Aaron Rodgers, no one's calling about them. Literally. Brian Goodkun said no one called about Aaron Rodgers either, Like no one has even picked up the phone about it. Everyone kind of assumes Russell Wilson and Aaron Rodgers staying put. He also said that Jamis Winston that would not be the best thing to bring him back, Like I am, I think that he is basically telling us what's happening behind the scenes. We can project and witch cast all these massive, tumultuous quarterback moves from A to B to C and we'll probably get one tops. Maybe Kyler Murray is all we get in the end. I would sign up for that. But but even that, to me, I think ultimately we'll probably settle itself out in some fashion. I we'll see I just mark Jimmy G. You know, we get the Jimmy G. That's low octane to me. We'll get to Jimmy G in the second. Speaking of the Bucks, Pro Bowl left guard Alan mar Pett is retiring stunner. He announced it on Instagram just twenty eight years old, finished his first Pro Bowl season in one of the top um guards in the league, certainly one of the best UH players on the Bucks. So in addition to Tom Brady being on and all the other questions around that team, UH, Mark pet exits the picture, leaving a huge gaping hole on offensive line. A source told ESPN that mar Pett made decision due to concerns for his overall health. Good for him, hope he made his money and UH also the subject of multiple connor Or features over the years. One NFL dot Com was early on the mar Pet train, and I know he wrote one about at Sports Illustrated to they're in trouble like he he was their best guard. Alex Cappa is one of the better guards in free agency, who's also the buck starting guard. And their center Ryan Jensen is also a free agent, so they were known for their offensive line. All three of those guys UH are up for grabs. One is retired to free agents. You've got a ton of free agents uh throughout the roster. Chris Godwin and Dominican Sue Jordan's whitehead, you know, Pierre Paul. It's just like goes on and on and on. The best cornerback, Carlton Davis. It's just the have a lot going on. The quarterback might be blaming Gabbert. So even if all those things weren't happening, you'd still be in a world it'll be It'll be Kyle Trask over Blaine Gabbert. I think I actually think Kyle Trask has a better chance to start. Maybe, but he has a better chance to start than maybe. Arians has a Blaine Gabbert fascination, and he has had these fascinations throughout. He's also not on the roster. They don't see that interested in Kyle Trask. He but Bruce Arians just twenty feet away. Mark with Andrew Siciliana. They said, what's door number one, door number two this this year? Air, I'm not blaying a word of it, And he said, door number one is Kyle Trask and door number two would be a trade. So he for whatever reason left out free agency. But he said door number one is Kyle Trast, door number two traders. Thing. All right, you mentioned it, Jimmy G. ESPNZ Adam Schefter reports that Jimmy G is going to undergo sir shoulder surgery. That's a tough one to say, shoulder surgery. You did well right there. Yeah, but even then it was just a little bit shaky their surgery on his shoulder. Uh. But according to ESPN, is still likely to be traded this month. Now here's the thing, because Jimmy G is another one of these guys. There's so many guys that are like in the middle of the pack with quarter. What's up. Sorry, I've just seen this great quote for we were just talking Bruce Arians on Tom Brady and I feel like I just gotta read it word for word. Unbelievable ride. This is Bruce arians unbelievable ride these last two years. I gotta say Tom got all the credit a lot of other guys had a hand in the pile. It wasn't all just Tom Brady. This is exactly what I'm talking about, is like he loved the two years, but he is he is not really about this post mortem that's gonna carry on throughout this week and all through the draft until they find someone else. But like Jimmy G is like a quarterback. Like you could say, oh, what about Jimmy G to the Bucks? I don't think the Bucks were super Bowl caliber team, but for Tom Brady, I don't think they're after Tom Brady gonna be super bo caliber. So what do you do with that roster? I feel like maybe you think about tearing it down and start building up again. You got the ring anyway. But Jimmy G has surgery. That's his throwing shoulder too, so um obviously they believe he'll be ready for the start of next season, but it could his rehab could take him into the summer, but he has to Ben still believes the trade is coming with Trey Lance waiting in the wings. That comes a week after that report that the Fortnite's might be willing to hang on to Jimmy G. For a variety of reasons well, and that felt like messaging from another place. I think they want to move him, and you could maybe look at potentially the Steelers. You could look at potentially a team like Washington that is heat seeking a veteran quarterback or someone out there. If not in the draft, we'll see, all right. He's had significant interest though, I believe that, But I don't think it's gonna be a high price. I mean, how is Jimmy g coming off a shoulder surgery now with this contract you know, quite quite a lot um. How is he getting more than like a fourth round pick for twenty three million dollars coming up a soldier. So I'm just staying out of this. Shoulder surgery. Shoulder surgery, shoulder surgery. You got it. There's a little hesitation, but I understand the only guy I didn't sense any hesitation. Patriots only got a second round pick for him when he had all the talent in the world and no injuries and all the all the upside. So there's no way. I think it's fair to say there may be a number of people calling though, because there is a dearth of available quarterbacks. We'll give you a late pick and you give us your Jimmy g alright, everybody hold that thought. We're gonna take a break and be right back. And other quarterback uncertainty news, Well, there's no uncertainty about the Colts getting out from their current quarterback, Carson Wentz. That's happening. It's been reported. We had Zach kieferan last week. Everybody's reporting it that the cults are moving on. Chris Ballad, the general general manager, had Wentz in his office today for a one hour face to face meeting. But that was pleasant, uh, And he said of the meeting, will be interesting to see how he goes from this, and I think he will. So it's it's it's now the code. He's coming out and saying this is over this relationship. But Ballard made sure to tell reporters today that he is not going to panic in this situation. They will find someone that they feel comfortable with. And he believes in himself. It's not in my nature. You know, I'm usually pretty objective and sitting back and not making like just not making a panic move. And we won't like, we will not just make a panic move. To make a panic move. Y'all can kick me in the in the face, and I promise you I am who I am, I mean like and I have a lot of confidence in myself. I don't know if you'll have gotten out, but I do. And I have a lot of confidence in the people around me, in Frank, in our coaching staff, my face, I mean kicking him in the face a thousand hundred times. That's not going to help the cults. It's five years now more greg that we watched Ballard on the podium right here in this room for the first time and thought to ourselves, this is an interesting dude. He is an interesting guy. He's a a lover of Broadway plays. I've heard, he's multifaceted, and he's put a good roster together. He's in an unwinnable situation answering questions about Carson Wentz right now. We were listening to Frank, Greig Mark and I and he was just saying, you know, trying not to answer it, and just hey, whoever is there whatever hand uh that you're dealt with, you just try to do the best job with it. And I'm thinking, like, well, you can deal yourself the Carson Wentz hand, you like, that's a choice. You guys actually gave him a two year contract and it's financially very difficult to get rid of him. So like it's not just like, oh, well, see what hand I'm dealt. Well, you can deal yourself the quarterbacks the poker analogy, there's yeah, they pushed their chips to the center of the table on Carson Wentz. They gave up draft assets, they took on that contract and took on a guy that seemed to have some scars on him, and it turned out it didn't work out. So now they are yes in that crunch of so many other teams where the roster seems ready to win now, but without that quarterback, you're kind of stuck in purgatory. I wouldn't call what they did last offseason hubris because I think that there was genuine faith that the pairing of Frankrson Wentz I didnied. I think I think that half the people that cover football did not, and have to. There was this offseason debate about always suddenly Carson Wentz in this great situation and a great fit. And look at his season was not terrible, and he had some serious meltdown moments, but seven interceptions all year. It wasn't like a turnover. Pron put together an amazing sizzle reel of our podcast through the season where we alternate killing him and saying, wow, they nailed this, Like there is they flipped let's say they let's say you flipped out? That's you? You can you get on that, Carson wentz good or not? Sizzle real? Yeah, starting take it through January, just comb through every show. Maybe said it maybe one and a half speeds. Make sure you don't miss I was actually just on the what Greg just said about and yeah, I'll get on that right away. Justin Randy, you guys hear that. Yeah, Um, I was looking at my tweets from the last time we were here two years ago, and there's a there's a photo of me and I like did a face mask in my hotel room. Well, you guys all went to dinner because I had to edit the show, and I was like remember that, and you guys had like the greatest dinner and I couldn't go. You were sifting through tweets from two years ago for photos of yourself? No, you know, I was sifting through tweets because I remember I used to do that bit with everyone because they're always wearing their colors, like they're all they're dressed from head to toe bills and or like you know Cardinals, And he used to ask them like, hey, who are you here with? And I was trying to find those videos, but there they were too long ago. Like I check like that. You've got to just bring it back every retweeting it every every every year talking about all these quarterback possible changes are. Ron Rivera spoke just as we were talking, that's how you know a real journals right behind and I just I think his answer to the question of could you pay too much in a quarterback trade or how much is too much? And he just said, does anybody care what they paid for Matthew Stafford last year? No? Uh? And they were one of the teams that were trying to get Matthew Stafford. And I just think more than any team out there, if I had to choose a team that would give up four first round picks for someone Kyler Murray or whatever it is, and veterans Chase you know, Chase Young, we've heard could even be available, like Washington is the team? Uh. And he was asked also if big name quarterbacks might be chade he said, that's what we're trying to find out. I just feel like they are the team that would be the most aggressive. But I I just don't see the trade partner. There's no there's very little heat that anyone's allowing them to pick up the phone and be plied into a trade. Yes, we'll give you Aaron Rodgers. Like Washington fans, they want to hear. But Russell Wilson's that it doesn't want to I like it. Well, Russell Wilson shot down the idea of it today that like we got a little cranky Cessla right now. I like when there's a little crimudgeon that this was because you know what, because it's a lot Actually it's there is There is some news, but there's a lot of non news. It's our job to dig through the right and I find a lot of it. I find a lot of it to be fluff. Well, we're No'm okay, No, this is the search for the nugs right out. We've got the interviews coming. It's we've we've been here, you know, for we're doing at the end of the day here on this riser. So I think you get a little that's also I was, you know, in the Atlanta airport and offered a thousand dollars to fly but flew here to do this. I'm enjoying myself. But what about the fact that that the NFL, Yeah, they bought that ticket, so you know the thousand dollars because you know, because I would be the person who would be enduring an extra day in a hotel that the airline paid for before flying here. Well, I think you should split it with him. I know he makes a lot of money, but he would be happy. There's there's a lot of ethical gray area in the NFL. I would be allowed to contribute some of that myself. In other quarterback purgatory news, General George Peyton of the Denver Broncos he knows there are another team. This is kind of an annoying event for the Broncos because everyone is saying the same thing. Guys, get a quarterback. Jesus fine, do it. And so that's what all the questioning is all about. Uh So here's what Peyton had to say, uh making it very clear that yes, the Broncos will come out of this offseason with someone new and shiny under the tree. We just want the best guy. We don't care if it's free. Agency. We don't care if it's a raft, we don't care if it's a trade. You know, we're just gonna we're gonna exhaust all options to try to get the best guy for the Broncos. But more importantly, and that everybody knows it. They they are looking for better play at the position and hopefully they find it, whether it's a draft, free agency, or a trade. But more importantly here Greg, and this, I think this will cheer you up. Mark seeing Nathaniel Hackett on a riser, There is there there, here's breaking news. You want to get through the fluff and get the nug. Mark Sessler as a new man crush at head coach and it's Nathaniel Hackett. Take us through watching that man, a fascinating human being who doesn't necessarily speak the way that most coaches we've come to know speak. He has at some point in his life he had to make a decision whether to be I think it was a neuroscientist and go to med school, um, become a coach, or become a hip hop dancer, um operating in various hip hop environments. And that feels like a joke, the last one. And he's like, you know what our friend Connor Or was here. I was standing next to Connor while we were listening. Connor ruled up to me and said, this is our new guy, and I was like, bingo, yes it is. He was. He was a hip hop dance instructor at U c L, a apparent absolutely and a career path though you better. Honor did a long form on him and Doug into all this and actually said that it was a couple of months ago. He flew out and like spent just days walking around with Nathaniel Hackett, who is truly an interesting speaker the way he presents himself. We need more of those in the NFL, and he's one of them. I hesitate to say this, Mark because I know you like that, you like it when it's your guy. But I was watching I felt the same thing too. I found myself falling for I can't have anything. I cannot have anything to myself. Yeah, you still got rule. We're actually too to the day of when you first really fell for Matt Roue. I got the full backstory of it. I don't I don't think I had known that. Just you know that he he was a fan of your work and that was really, what did it? That is a false best story, that's entirely a compliment was paid at a darkened corner of the tavern. It does not take much to win myself over. So yeah, you're welcome to ride this this this with just take normally you take the slow, slow a role on this guy. I like this enthusiasm because I was I slowed my role also on Brandon Staley because that was your crush last year. And I feel like pretty okay about that right now he wins. The press certainly gives good was a little tingle for Hack, all right. I like that tingles good alright in other news, I mean hip hop dancer just because he doesn't just you're going somewhere strange with that. Now where I'm going is he was gonna be a neuroscientist or uh, follow in his father's footsteps as like one of the you know, most famous offensive coaches West Coast offense originators Paul Haggett or hip hop dancer. I failed to believe that that was ever a realistic The other two, you know, Greg, you're two cynical. It's you're just it's very much a possibility that he has an artistic dance side to him. It's a good bio nugget at the very least. Um. Finally, Oh, Giants general manager Joe Shane on se Kwon Barkley and the idea of a trade We're open to anything clock that track that that and uh finally the trade partner finally in the news. See I think if he was in the right spot as long as his bodies I'm just being annoying. I keep thinking the partner like, find a trade comma partner. I'm trying to find something that will light mark up with optimism. It's it's been tough. Uh. Finally the news. It's time for news and notes presented by up work, where you can build the team that will build your business. Learn more at upwork dot com. Oh yes, you know this is near and dear to us. The International Series for two was announced and we go in a Germany, Baby Deutschland, Baby Deutsche. Now are we going? I don't know. We're gonna talk to Vice President of International Henry Hodgson. Heavy campaign too. We would love to go. But five NFL teams will play international games in three countries, highlighted by the Packers first international trip and the Tampa Bay Buccaneers playing the first ever regular season game in Germany, the league announces a Monday, the Cardinals will play in the NFL's first game in Mexico since two thousand nineteen. While the Packers will be joined by the Jagson Saints and playing games in the UK are adopted homeland, the Bucks will debut in Germany. How about this, Greg, I know you have roots in the Deutsche Land. I know this must really hit. I do want to go. I do want to go. My dad was born in Germany. My brother is bizarrely a citizen, even though he's ever really ever been there. But because you could get that with what's the word for it. But I'm struggling eternal something, yeah, born to born? Was he born there? Reparation reparation that it was like a multi year process for what payoff. I probably wasn't gonna live there, But I want to go visit and watch this game. And I know the Deutsch LAMB listeners out there, they'll huck us up and support the sendates. Let me play the role you want me to play. But I only lack America. I don't want to go there. I wish you could see what Dan is doing this body right now that Dan's like, and then Mark's like, Hey, I was in Germany with Rob Roll and I connected with him on it. I'll drop another little nugget on you. Back in the day, when you know Sessler is a German last name, it means chairmaker, and Wesleyan is German, and we and I, he and I both looked up the origins of Cessler, which was Cecilberg and Wesselberg, I believe, which were about eighteen miles away from each other back in the day. That means thousands of years ago, ancient West and ancient Me probably walked eighteen miles and drank beers together in a German beer hall. I thought I was part German for the first like twenty years of my life, and then I found out that I was Austrian, which is close, right, So we're very close stones throw, I mean not a maybe you're on the border stones. My brother did a lot of research into it, and they were there for two hundred years because it was like they had their roots in Germany. This time his citizenship. Then, I don't invalidate it. It just seems we spotted it down. It seems rand maybe he should be here before you take down. It seems random. Wait can I throw out just a couple of quiets before? Before that? Greg? That was news and no, it's presented by upwork, the world's work marketplace. Learned more at upwark dot com. Close this out, Greg, before we get trying to be fast fast about it. Uh. Stephen Jones was not um committed to Marie Cooper being on the Cowboys this year. I think that's the notable the number one actual star slash superstar that could actually be traded or cut. I think there would be a great trade market for him. But them throwing that out there publicly is something, and I thought it was interesting. You boy. Andrew Berry not surprisingly vague about Jarvis Landry's future mark, but also said it's too early to say whether ad competition for Baker Mayfield, which to me strikes me as they're gonna have a like soft competition. I think they've always been very open to a like if the world were a little different, maybe go get the Russell Wilson out there, which sounds like probably not happening, but competition, yes. I think that they also look at the landscape and say Baker Mayfield healthy, the rest of it. We're gonna roll with it. They should go get a Marie Cooper. I just you know, putting that together, they got all the cap space, they got all the need and the worst wide receiver room in the league. That makes sense. Did you have a Ron Rivera thing you wanted to mention? We we got that in but a few minutes ago. I think his mind is on other things. I think his mind is on the woman that is not in his bed, as usually is the case, now that they lived together in not Ron Rivera. We're discussing, right, And also we shouldn't be dessessing any of this because it is it has been barred from conversation, and it should be noted that I means summer of the Superstar Club. Very bold decision to take Amari Cooper out of the Superstar Club, and now he might be out of Dallas's plans going forward. Connect the dots if you must. All right, I think we got everything. That's what's happening in the news. Let's take a break and then get to the general manager of the Pittsburgh Steelers, Kevin cold All right, We're very fortunate to be joined now by a man that let's be honest, a towering figure in terms of building one of the top teams in the a f C this for two decades. Kevin Colbert joins the Around the NFL podcast, general manager of the Steelers at least for a couple more months. How are you, Kevin? Doing great? Guys? How about yourselves doing well? Yeah? We were talking how it's like feeling a little back to normal here at the Combine. Like you were, you just looking to check off, like one more box in your career checklist by joining me Around the NFL podcast Before you that was your last thing. It had to be that to check off list, the bucket list, whatever it is. But as you mentioned, Greg, it's great to be back in Indianapolis and at the Combine and almost normal conditions. Uh. It's great for our game, uh to take this this big part of the process, to take that step again. And I just that's exciting to be back here and and hopefully moving toward more normalcy. So Ben Roethlisberger retires after the conclusion season. A day later, it's announced that you will be stepping down and retiring, uh with the Steelers as well. I thought it was kind of interesting, Big Ben. Obviously two thousand four first round pick, and then you got to enjoy what I guess every GM longsport is like not having to worry about the quarterback position. So this last draft you have here is different, isn't it? Because obviously all the talk or a lot of the talk around Pittsburgh is what do we do now post Big Ben? Yeah, and it's not, Um, it's not ignored by us that you know, the one year there was three Hall of Fame quarterbacks available. You know, fortunately we were thank you for putting Philip Rivers in. By the way, that means a lot to me personally, and now I mean, in our opinion, that's an easy three Hall of famers. And that was the one losing season we had, and there was fortunate there was three available we were able to get one. Ben was with us for eighteen years. He obviously helped us be successful. So as we move forward, how can we do that again? I think what we can't do is try to misidentify potential replacements and say their franchise quarterbacks. Um, nobody knows if you're a franchise quarterback until you get in and improve it. So we'll try to make the best decisions at that position, and if they turn into franchise quarterbacks, it's more on them and not the people who selected them. I do feel like we've heard Mike Tomlin in the towards the end of the season talk about the concept of a mobile quarterback. He seemed attracted to that. You've talked about Mason Rudolph stepping in potentially as the week one started seeing how the cards fall. I mean, I think with like just you know, certain Steelers fans are bumping a little bit on the idea of Mason Rudolph being more than maybe a bridge quarterback. Are would you maybe look at the draft or someone like Kenny Pickett and say, we might make a bold move that people aren't expecting at this point to go get the guy that we really fall in love with. Whenever we identify any position, there's an ideal mold that we all look for, Um, a six five tackle with thirty five inch arms and so on and so for quarterback mobile, Sure, if that's a big part of them, but all of them have a different characteristic that there that is their strength and this this group is no different. So we won't lock ourselves in. Sure, you may have an ideal picture of what that quarterback might be, but you can't lock the door on any given one because you don't know who will be available to you. It's a little different in free agency if you can allocate those cap dollars. Same thing with it, as you mentioned maybe trading up in a draft. What we try to always do is not only say well, it's the first and third round pick, or if it's a it's a third and the six. Well, that third and six might be Emmanuel Sanders and Antonio Brown, we don't know. We try to put actual names from the projected class into the and into those discussions and try to say this, this group might be the best, and just try to make each individual decision. Yeah, history says you probably aren't. Trading really hasn't happened a lot under under you as the GM. You did make that trade for Minko it Patrick. I heard you on the podium say there are starting quarterbacks in this draft, though, that you're confident in that whether they'll be around you know when you pick or not. We'll see. Do you feel any any heat because you know your rival in Baltimore, Ozzy Newsom, on his way out his last draft, he did get a quarterback. He wasn't even his first pick in that draft. He took Kate to Hurst and then Lamar Jackson. You feel that the heat from Bozzy that you gotta match him by finding the quarterback of the future on your way out. We're very well aware of the quarterbacks in the in the a f C North. You know, Coach Thomon always talks about we have right three Heisman winning quarterbacks to compete against in the a f C North. It's but again, we can't just say this has to be a franchise guy. We just we just picked as who who we are, or pick who they are and hope that they turn into that. But we won't lock ourselves in. I mean, those guys are great quarterbacks and they're young, and that's that's the unfortunate part. That's great for those organizations. But now we have to continue to compete. UM, and we're excited to see what Mason can do on a sixteen games format if he's the guy Dwayne Haskins, Um, Dwayne can come in and compete and maybe maybe he's that guy. But they have to prove themselves over sixteen games. All right, So alright, I'm gonna be real with you, Kevin, because and you're retiring anyway, so you don't care, right, you can say whatever you want at this point when we talked about on our podcast, because with the reports that came out that you had said that, you know, right where we stand here, Mason Rudolph makes sense as a quarterback. I'm paraphrasing, you have no plans to sell out to replace Ben Roethlisberger. But in terms of the Mason Rudolph question, again, like sometimes we call it a trope alert when you hear a front office officials say, oh, yeah, where we are right now, we're perfectly happy with Mason Rudolph. That's the trop alert. But then what we translate that is to try hard to upgrade off that position and get somebody new in there. So like I feel almost certain personally, there will be a new quarterback of the Steelers. That's what's gonna happen. Right. Well, again, if if we started today, Mason's our starter, and we're comfortable with Mason being our starter. Um, again, I referenced five four and one over his first nine starts. If you look back over the quarterbacks in history and look at their first eight, nine, ten games, that record compares pretty favorably. Um Ben was the one outlier because he's still you know, when Tommy Maddox got hurt and he was forced into the line up, he goes fifteen and one, So that was unusual. Most of the starting quarterbacks early in their careers, they don't have winning records, and that's that's something that over time again Mason will have to prove it. Does that mean we're not going to look at options. No, And he knows that we've talked about that on his exit interviews. He understands that he's going to not be given anything and there could be competition either from within or from outside. Right. I think there's quietly a lot of free agent quarterbacks that are pretty solid, that have started a lot of games that could that could be uh competition, Like, you don't need to start the season right now, you don't need to settle the questions. There's free agency and then there's a draft. Sometimes you guys, you pick up guys right before the season, like Joe Hayden, our our friend here, Mark is a Browns fan and one of the things that like you've done so much damage, right, yeah, you know, thank you for the past twenty years. We we have been next to him in the newsroom during you know, Sundays, and it's tough. It's tough on us, it's tough on Mark. But his biggest fear, I feel like, more than anything on the Brown fan is when a player leaves and then as a success elsewhere. And so when you signed Joe Hayden and he turned into one of the best free agent signings in Steelers history, I mean that that was sort of hitting the bulls I right there for Brown's fan pain, like do you about that, Kevin? And but that that can happen as you reference, and we we always have to be open, you know, our personnel department has to know. We know what the what the unrestricted free agent classes as of today, A lot of those players will sign prior to the start of free agency. A lot of them will be franchise or transition, so that will change. And then when people sign or people draft, they may be cutting players and it's our job to make sure that we're ready to add a player like a Joe Hayden if he's available. So I I really don't know everybody that will be available, and it's our job to keep up with it. I mean, speaking of Ohio, is it annoying that the Bengals are good again? Hey? Give them their give them their due. They put together a ary you know Duke too, and put together very good team, a Super Bowl UM participant. I know they would have obviously love to have won it. But to get where they are, Um, everybody's looking up from the a f C. So good for them. Uh, it's our challenge to try to get back up there with them. It's any how do how does the okay? So, how does the transfer of power work with this? Like? Is there a remember like when let's use well, I'll use for some reason, Ronald Reagan and George H. W. Bush when you had the eight years, then the vice president gets elected? A smooth process? Uh, you can mention ozzyk Newsom, Eric da Costa. Um, how does it work when there's a general manager that's overseeing the draft process, free agency and then steps away? How do you ensure this continuity for the next guy who takes over whoever that is? Yeah, that's something that honestly we discussed myself, Art Roney and coach Tomlin. I would be involved, but I may not be with that team that we put together and I think there's a great trust that we're all going to make the right decisions collectively, and that's what we've done throughout our history and we will we will do that for this and hopefully we put that team together and it'll be a team we can all look at and be proud of. This is your last you know, free agent period, your last combine, your last drap. Yeah, I noticed, yet you have more salary cap space than I can ever remember the Steelers haven't. Do you just want to like go out wild, just like spend a lot of money. Steelers are really known for doing that, but just like throw your money on the table and like get wild. I mean, it is it's an unusual, um. And again we don't know an exact amount, but we know we're confident we'll have more room than we've ever had and I don't know how many years, and we'll try to make those best decisions, not only with unrestricted free agents, with maybe our own people that we want to keep, So we'll try to put that all together. It is unusual, Um, it's a it's the it was to be expected. Coming out of last year. We had a big free agent class of pretty significant players, and we knew we were going to be up against that cap. And then when the cap went down because of the pandemic, we were up against it even tougher. So this year, um, it could be tempting, but we'll try to make the best, most sound decisions before we say goodbye. Is this a real retirement. Well, we've left the door. We've left it open. Uh. And I again, I don't want to be whoever the next person is. If I can help and not hinder, great, but we're gonna leave it open um and or it will make that final decision and and he's open, coaches open, I'm open. But again, we want to be fair to not only that person but to the organization. If it makes sense to help great, if it's it's best if I'm not here to help great too, because we'll make that decision collectively for them. Would you jump over to Cleveland's front office and a sort of lateral type us a lot of information. They're good. Other people are tracking Tom Brady, Willie or won't he I'm Kevin Colbert, Colbert, Kevin, thank you so much, and congratulations on a great career. Than all right, there he goes Kevin Colbert you know, you try to. I thought there might be a sliver of opportunity as he headed into retirement. Although it sounds like a Bruce arians leaves the Steelers retirement, but he's also heavily involved in hiring the successor, who may or may not be from the Steelers. So that's an interesting like is he actually going fishing? I don't know the way he didn't if I was an nfl um decision maker like himself. I try to work for the Rooneys. Who's better than to work for the Rooneyes. He's been there for years. Tomlin has been there for fifteen years. And consultant money, right, you get you hang around after where it's like it's just like a family. You just you get like a high six figure salary. That's literally not it's a family only you get paid to be in the family. Rights. He's earned it. He's ranked very high on my GM rankings, which is coming out, I believe in a couple of weeks year after year. One year, I remember he was number one overall. I mean he was, like we said, maybe it was a little strong in the intro calling him a tower ring figure of the millennium, but uh, I will say he's very successful. The Steelers have been for twenty straight years basically more or less um so that's deserving that he's high in the ranks. But Greg, your ability not to tell him that it felt like I missed opportunity this show that you are someone that gets it. It's gonna haunt me if you were to tell him. It does bother me when you think of the things and now it was. It was one of the things I was gonna say. But you see how the conversations flowing, you only have time for so much. But it maybe it would have made him feel awkward, like, hey, I like I think you're a great guy in my little list, and you've number one. Do you like me? I don't a very warm smile sitting next to him right here. If he made him laugh a lot, I wish he didn't didn't change his an. I do wish he wasn't a liar. He didn't need because I tell you what they are going. He's no plans to sell out. I look at this roster. T J. Watt ragining Defensive Player of the Year. Make if it's Patrick cam Hayward, a running back on a rookie deal, good wide receiver corps. This is to me a wind now roster that doesn't need to go into QB purgatory. You have a window. Why not give up the farm and try to get that Matthew Stafford type guy. Maybe, but it's the same issue that the cults up. It's like, you can want to find a better quarterback. The Freegan have a first round pick. That makes it much that much Steelers down. I mean, in theory, wouldn't it be poetic if they took Kenny Pickett out of pit to become their starter. But they have to love that guy another U twenty. I mean, of course Mason Rudolphs their starter right now, but that's of course he is, like you know, and of course he's gonna face competition. I think that goes without saying. It might be a veteran Anna rookie and what a sellout mean, there's about ten free agent quarterbacks that have started a decent amount of games in the NFL, and one of those guys is gonna be on the Steelers. Now. It could be like an upside of a Winston or a downside of someone way below that like Tyrode. But one of those guys is gonna be on the Steelers and you might not have to sell up for anyone. I get it, But what are the other options? They're not they're not, Hey, here's Russell Wilson. Yes, our next two first round picks, and make it Fitzpatrick or three first round picks. Go get find a way to get Kyler or Russell Wilson, hell Kirk Cousins. Not gonna cost that much. But bring in someone that's actually a solution. Not in this there's a very this underbelly quarterbacks where there's just so many okay to maybe good guys, like if that's who they get, that's not going to get them over the over the top in the a f C. I start to think, though, we're coming out of this week finding out that Aaron Rodgers is going nowhere, Russell Wilson's going nowhere, Tom Brady is not coming back. The Bucks aren't trading for someone to come and be Tom Brady. Two point that they'll be lack of movement, not all these stunning trades which you just never know. Mark, I'm not saying we're gonna draft someone I would, I would. I'm putting a sandwich on it right now. The Steelers are drafting a quarterback to you know, to make because that's a bit of a cop out. I'll say in the first three rounds, I mean that's safe. I feel like that's that's almost too safe. I'll say to the drafting a quarterback, I mean they will draft one. It's just Twayne Haskins. I think, like our friend Damn a check and others are would be. He says, they're starting quarterbacks in this class. Of course, there are like a lot of these classes where they look great, they end up in terrible, and a lot of classes I guess you know, where it's supposed to look bad, you end up finding some quarterback. I guess my take on it is that there's perhaps with this organization where they are now, there should be more urgency than taking a swing on a quarterback and a not a great quarterback class. As we're being told over and over again, have you heard about how small pickets hands are. We're gonna get Lands air Line on the show, uh tomorrow to help us out, you know where the babes in the woods. Uh. We're learning about the draft class and Lance is kind of like he always helps us out, gets our feet wet as we start to figure out who potentially could be a quarterback that would make sense for the Pittsburgh Steelers. Getting our feet wet I like that, get traded. Well, let's good to get his feet wet um. On the flight here, he thought he had downloaded the whole Scouting Combine research packeties he was going to read every single page. And then when he got on the plane, he said he realized it didn't work out. I had failed to download it to my to my iPhone. So we did make it feel better that you actually would have only read the first twelve pages and then got bored. That would be rich. I think I wouldn't go up up six or seven. Alright, Uh, we're not done yet. We have another excellent guest coming up, another general manager of an a f C superpower. Hell, you could argue general manager of the best team in football, Joe Douglass. You could do it. You can do it after this break. All right, here we go Brandon being general manager of the Bills. This is a good one. This is ago. We're very happy to have Brandon on. This is a team Brandon, that has their stuff together. I feel like the Bills are a model that other teams now seek to follow. Which if you if you're you know, twenty five years old, thirty years old, and you grew up with the Bills not being a functioning unit, that's all gone. The GM of the coach come together in two thousands seventeen, they draft and develop a quarterback. They smartly built the free agency and the draft, and now you have a superpower that just needs to take one more step. So congratulations that there's question. I appreciate. It doesn't feel like congratulations till we can hold that trophy up. So we got work to do. Are you are you over? You know the thing I'm not. I was just talking to some of the other guys. I still haven't watched the film. I mean I've watched a few of the end plays, just seeing where guys were aligned and kind of walking through that and what the calls were on, you know, whether it's you know, special teams or defense. But you know, you have to give Kansas City credit. They made some some really nice plays as well. And you know, we played well, we just didn't finish it and we gotta It's hard you got because you don't get a start up here. And that's what I've told the guys last year when we went to the NFC Championship game. Everybody's back to zero and zero and it's an important offseason for us, don't you just why don't watch Josh Allen though? It's like two games, Like he was awesome that game tremendous. We watched it again. Yeah, you know what, I wish I could enjoy it, like I could watch the game before. You know how well he played against New England and and listen, it's uh Josh is is is great at quarterback. He he's a great human, great leader and he fits Buffalo so well. And it was we were very fortunate to be able to trade up and get a guy like him where we got him. And um, you know, I think Josh is going to continue to working to ascend. He's he's not lost that chip on his shoulder that he's always had. You know, we all know he's been doubted through various steps. I mean Realley Junior College, but I mean I I was so wrong about it. Our friend Chris Wesley and who's not here, UM believed in him from the get go, Like did you think he could be that? Because you're saying he's got to ascend. I don't know if it's possible he was out of his body for those two games. I can't remember a quarterback playing as well for two playoff games in a row as Josh Allen did. Right then, when you took him, did you think it could be like that level from you know, you don't want to sit here and say this is exactly what I see. You're you're you're projecting, but I'll say this, Um, his smarts, his processing, We knew the physical talents. Um if you just watched his his film, if you broke down his games and truly said, all right, what would um, you know, what would Aaron Rodgers have done on this play while he's at Wyoming? Like what would like there's nothing there? Or you know what he just got out of Yeah, he threw the ball away. He's oh oh for one on this play, but he just avoided an eight yard sack to to throw the ball away, or he hit the receiver and literally you know one there was a play I remember they're playing in Iowa and he's back. He dodges a couple of guys like you saw him in the Kansas City game, steps up on the run. It's like a forty five yard post pattern. The guy's wide open and bounces off his chest. What he gets no for one, zero for one. There if you truly watched everything he did Um, instead of just stats, I think a lot of people got lost in the stat world and in so, you know, I apologize. I mean I apologize to Josh you know, formally, but now I'm gonna apologize to you. I'm the whole team. Now you're you know what. Uh, that's that's what makes this business. Somebody asked me over there earlier when I was doing the media thing, was you know, what's the you know, the pick the position that you know in you know, in any year that gets talked about or discussed the most, like his offensive line. I'm like, no, it's quarterback like it's and I'm out talk about in the media. I'm talking about I can go back to that year. If you'd had five different teams, they probably would have taken five different quarterbacks that you know what I mean. It's just everybody's got the guy they want, the type they want. And we just felt that Josh Um obviously we play in the elements. Um. He's very smart. We just felt he was chip on his shoulder. We know Western New York, everyone up there has a chip on their shoulder. Everything just meshed and uh, and he's been a great fit for Uce. I mean, one thing that he had from you know, day one was Brian Dable. You had that consistency. And we're in the era, in the age of the discontented quarterback Hyler Murray's going off. Everyone's upset about left, right, left or right. I mean, this situation is so good with him, But losing Brian Dable, what do you lose in terms of the in game play calling at that He did a great job at justin and tailoring, you know, into inside games to Josh's talents. Ken Dorsey's there. Tell us a little bit about Ken Dorsey in that transition. If you think that it can be as smooth as Bills fans would hope. Yeah, I mean it's a really good question. Um, you know, you always hate to lose good talent, but uh, you know you're happy for Brian and his opportunity to New York. The one thing is Dorsey. So Davil was here for four years, Dorsey's been here for three and uh, this was a new system for for Ken. This was not the same system we ran in Carolina with with Cam Newton and you know, Mike Schula and so h. But Dorsey has taken on, learned this system. He'll have his own, you know, little nuances that that he does. But he and Josh, you know, he was in the room coaching Josh. They formed a great relationship and Josh just raves about Ken. Um, even a year ago, Dorsey was I mean, Davil was believed to, you know, have a chance a year ago and Josh was already lobbying. You know, I really think Ken can do this. And again, Sean and I have been around you know, Dorsey since two thousand eleven back in Carolina. He's a hard worker. Uh, he played the position obviously had success, you know, major success at the college level. So you know, until he actually calls plays, it's like me, until you're sit in the gmcat. You have to prove yourself and there will be some bumps along the way. But Josh, it starts with Josh believing in Ken and Kim believing in Josh, and I think from there, um, you know, we're confident that it will work. It's it's crazy going back to the incredible efficiency and the outrageous level of offensive play in in the postseason for the Bills, Like as a GM, as a team builder along with Seawan, how tempting is it to say offense is set for the most part, let's put our focus elsewhere. But that's really not how it works ultimately right now. I mean, you want to keep your fastball and and uh, we know this team is built around Josh Allen, and so we want to we want to protect him, okay first and foremost, and then we want to give him weapons. But yeah, we we also want to get the other teams, you know, quarterbacks down Mahomes, Joe Burrow, you know all those guys, uh that we're gonna face. You know, the guys in our division. You know, we've got three teams that are trying to build around some some young guys now as well. And I'm sure they've got their aisle on us. So, uh, we got our work cut out for us to try. And you know, we got a lot of free agents that you know, we'll see which ones we can get back, and then we're gonna have to make the right moves. Um. Not only you know with the guys here, you know, in the draft, but but finding some pieces to feel, you know, some of the spots that we lose. You mean you mentioned the other you know, teams in the division. I I told my son last night. I was like, Oh, we're gonna interview the Bills general manager tomorrow. Like what what should I ask him? He's seven years old? And he was like, I tell him, I don't like him. Um So I just want to know, like that if you take pride he's a Patriots fan, that you now take pride that like Key thinks of the Bills, he's young enough that the Bills are the big bad bullies of the division. Like what kind of feeling that gives you as a as a Bill's GM? Well, I love it. It's better that than than him feeling empathetic for me. Those guys don't know what they're doing or anything like that. So now it's uh, you have to give New England a lot of credit. They were the the team that in my interview, I felt like we talked about a lot. You know, how do you how do you take them down? And you know what what was wrong here in Buffalo and it was really you know the a f C East, you know, the Jets were constantly turning over. The Dolphins were constantly turned over, and the Bills, and you know, I think every team was doing Bill Belichick and Tom Brady a favor and we've got to stop that, and we've got to have a chance to build it the right way. And when we've got to find a quarterback. And um, fortunately, you know, we landed Josh when we had Sean McDermott on our show a number of owners meetings ago, before all this happened, before the Bills became what they are. Um, we were just impressed kind of, I think with his personality and the way that he just he to me, it seemed like a new age type of coach, and you're a new age type of GM. I know. He was, um a wrestler too. I mentioned to him that I when I was in middle school, I lost to a girl in wrestling in uh seventh grade. I think it was a bit uh humiliating. Well, let's say you and you and Sean mc dermott were in like a sort of a clash. If his gonna clash, he's winning that. I mean, you're both very fit men. Uh, Shawn, he's more fit than me. He eats better than me. Uh, you know, we're both super competitive. What I would know to do is like he's gonna beat me in a wrestling all day long. I would know where to hide some weapons illegally to take it like the brass knuckles guy like Dino Bravo, or so I'm pulling something out of my shoe. Um. Sorry, every interview we ever do, Mark ends up asking about men grappling. It's just I don't know what it is. Um. One last question I have is you said on the riser that the Bills correct me if I'm wrong, are going to submit a rule proposal, Uh, to change over time. I don't know why the Bills would want to do that. I can't. I can't piece that together the wilderness, But UM, could you share You probably can't share what the proposal is, but could you tell us how does the process work behind the scenes for a team building out a proposal that you then submit. Yeah, I mean we definitely talked to some of our peers around the league, UH, coaches, gms and listen. I talked to another gym that Senior Bowl and he said, I think there's gonna be about thirty to thirty two different proposals everybody wants it to change, and um, ultimately I think something will change to where both teams do get the ball. You know, our proposal, you know, I feel strongly that we should consider, you know, a time limit and play it out. You know, you know other leagues you get five minutes on the clock or you know major League Baseball. You know the way team gets to bat, then the home team gets too bad again, if you're still tied, you do it again. So, UM, I just don't I don't feel like at that, and I'm talking about postseason. I don't feel like in the postseason. You know, you've played seventeen games. It's a long season that we should end on some some flute thing or a coin toss. You know, we want to see Josh Allen or Pat Mahomes or Aaron Rodgers, whoever is out there we want. So our proposal is gonna be play you know a certain time limit. Okay, you know in postseason. I like that. That's football, Like football is with the time limit, you try to outsgo him in a certain amount of time. But before you go, do you think Jerry use Um has a good chance of being back? I kind of can't imagine Jerry Hughes playing anywhere else and just like where you kind of look at your your pass fresh right now with Mario Addison also a free agent. Yeah, I talked to Jerry and Mario this past week, called them both major respect for those guys and just, uh, we're gonna stay in touch through the process. And they are too. Um. I think both of them are kind of like, let's let's see what free agency is, let's get our value, and uh, they're both great players. They both will continue to play, I feel sure for one to three more years. Uh, and they both can play. So um, you know, we'd love to definitely work something out, but we'll we'll just kind of see how it goes. I still got some moves to make to get our cap in order before then, so kind of first things first, all right, Brandon being thank you for joining us, And just last thing, one to seven trillion. How annoying was it when the Chiefs at halftime of the a C title game disappeared and were plays by other guys in uniforms that had never played football? You know, I didn't. I couldn't watch the game. I hear that, so I didn't know until it was over. Okay, okay, don't watch because it's even more fresh, right, I know what happened, all right, Brandon be in best of luck and beyond thanks. Thanks, all right, there he goes, Brandon Bean seems like a good dude, you know, easy to root for the Bills to get over that hub. But I totally get it. I totally get it not being able to watch that game, not being able to revisit the loss because you go through all this process from the combine to the draft, through summer camp to the season, and then you do everything right, it seems, and you still can't find a way to close it out. And everybody knows it's fleeting these opportunities. So the frustration, you understand that why watch on repeat like the worst forty five minutes of your entire life basically professionally. But coaches don't have the choice. The GM, the GM can society doesn't want to watch it. Coaches have to suffer through that. Yeah, Like I feel like there could have been five or six different teams that won the title if they redid the playoffs ten times. But the Bills to me were the team him that remember that series and that the missing rings on NFL and that one. All right, I will go to my grave believing that that team was winning the Super Bowl, that Josh Allen was playing, that they should have won the Super Bowl. Their defense didn't didn't do it. And the only thing is is like and I mentioned at the end of that conversation, like the Chiefs where every bit they're equal at the end of that game and stole the game away from Buffalo, and then that same version of the offense went through two quarters against Cincinnati dominant and then disappeared. You could just never can't predict this stuff, I guess, is what I'm saying, Mark, did you notice you got hit with the That's a really good question. I know you live for that, so I tend to think that that maybe is not a good question when they're saying that sometimes WHOA take me through that process, just like it's sort of a psychological trip trick. He was trying to play on me potentially, and he and it's like it was his way of being like, Okay, dumb ask I'm gonna It's like I've already probably like I this. You just threw me a little softball right down the middle, and I'm just gonna get an opposite day. I'm saying it's possible when they're yeah, when they're the fault to say, wow, I did a great kind of like a nice pat on the head, like, hey, I'm happy to answer this one. Thanks for softball. Yeah right, you gave me a little, gave me a little. The first thing he said was that was easy. So maybe that's not the first thing you want to hear. Is not true Capital J jar. That's fair because he could have said, like, man, you guys are tough, but fair, like that's what we're looking for. That was easy, peasy? Are we that really good at what we're looking for? One of these guys connection. I think they probably take Greg seriously, Why would they don't know? Because we always get that answer from professionals, Greg, I respect I feel confident in that brand, not to know who the three of us are or what the difference is. Like that whipper snapper in the middle was a real sharpie. Now, Colbert, what I want psychologically with you that you you want to get that answer so that you could like have that hanging over you in a way. Well, I want to know the truth. All right, Let's let's stick a pin and there's so much to get to this week. We'll have another show tomorrow, more guests, coaches, general managers, all the watest news from the risers here, anything wild that goes on on the night that the what do they call that? The nightlife? He's called nightlife and some do you mean when you go out and do things with other people? Yes, at nightlife. Nailed it. And just so everybody knows, because I know you've been wondering, Uh, there will be no Flashpoint focus this one where it's on a brief hiatus, but we'll return next week full power. But I was thinking, and I don't know if you heard Greg or maybe you tune me out, but it did hit me when I was man splaining what flashpoint meant to Ricky because she had suggested mac Jones is a flashpoint Focus was just terrible suggestion. Just she's not not getting the exercise. And while his man's planning with flashpoint was I said, well, maybe it should just be flashpoint Colon Baker Mayfield. I like that, get the focus out of there. We continue to trim to drive by there, but I just had to set up Yeah, you can't. She doesn't have a microphone that's an apology from media right here. You know what st Elmo is on me, and by me, I mean the Roger Goodell sanctioned Well, it has been like a little distract. I'm not saying like our podcast is that popular or whatever, but I did feel different this time in Indianapolis of like everyone stopping me in the hallways and on the street asking like who's next on Flashpoint Focus. There's a lot In some ways you would say it's faulty to launch a series and immediately go into a hiatus, but I think fathers in this case. I think it's just builds the momentum toward what happens next week. So everybody just know that it will return. It's into flashpoint. Colin Baker may flashpoint flash point? Ricky, do you have the can you the dictionary um definition of flash point? I mean, she's ready to stab you in the face right now. I apologize. It's not our fault. Wait it's over, Ricky, I'm sorry, she's gonna kill me. All right, just forget it anyway. All right, there you go, Day one from the Combine. Good stuff. Thank you everybody for listening. Like we said, we'll be back tomorrow. I have another special show on Friday. Uh so a lot more content coming your way until then. Dan Hanson signing off work wide Storm, the Old Boss, the wonderful Ricky Hollywood. Sincere apologies, you can keep trying. Brave digger behind this to tomorrow, head the car