Become the “It Bag” creator of Nigeria with Zashadu’s Zainab Ashadu

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<v Emily Blumenthal>Hi and welcome to the Handbag Designer 101 podcast with your host, emily Blumenthal, handbag designer expert and handbag fairy godmother, where we cover everything about handbags from making, marketing, designing and talking to handbag designers and industry experts about what it takes to make a successful handbag.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>Welcome to yet another episode, a fabulous episode of Handbag Designer 101, the podcast.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>I'm here with one of my most favorite people from Nigeria.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>I mean, I do have other people in Nigeria, but I'd say I'll put you at the top just quietly Zeynep Ashadu of Zashadu.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>I'm so excited to have you.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>I take pride in being a personal celebrity in Nigeria although I haven't been, but it's purely by association, of knowing you.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>So thank you for being here.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>Thank you for coming on, and what time is it for you right now?

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<v Emily Blumenthal>And what time is it for you right now?

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<v Emily Blumenthal>It is 3, 30, 3 something, 3, 40.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>Maybe.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>Yeah, right, okay, fabulous, all right.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>So we have a micro time distance difference here.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>Yeah, so we've known each other more than 10 years.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>We've just established, because you were a finalist in the handbag awards in 2014, it's 2024.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>It's been a minute like that is a very long time, especially in this day and age, to still be doing this.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>There have been platforms who have tried to amplify designers from africa.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>A lot of them have come and gone, a lot of them have had some issues, but yet you are still here.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>So let's get into that.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>Why are you still around doing this?

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<v Emily Blumenthal>Is this because this is who you are at this point?

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<v Emily Blumenthal>This is your brand, this is your life Like?

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<v Emily Blumenthal>Is there any time where you're like I don't know why I'm still doing this, especially where I am in Africa, especially in Nigeria?

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<v Zainab Ashadu>Talk to me.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>Oh, thank you, emily.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>What an expansive question.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>No pressure.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>Why am I still doing this?

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<v Zainab Ashadu>I mean, it has been a journey and there have been times on the journey where I've had to ask myself questions and ask myself is this the right thing for me to still be doing?

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<v Zainab Ashadu>Am I just being obtuse and just kind of like you know, forging ahead and blah, blah, blah?

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<v Zainab Ashadu>And each time I ask myself that question, I think just having the luxury to have to ask the question and take time to answer it, like I have choices in life, you know we all and just being being with myself, in way, I kept finding that there was still more for me to do.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>There was more for me to do in terms of continue adding to the design landscape, for example, on the continent, in my country.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>There's more for me to do in terms of, like, raising standards and investing in artisanry.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>There's more for me to do in teaching.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>There's more for me to do in teaching.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>There's more for me to do in inspiring the young people that are coming behind me.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>There's more for me to do in building industry.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>So there's more for me to do.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>And it's almost like of whom much is expected, much is given.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>I seem to have an incredible amount of strength.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>I have a lot of support.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>I'm blessed in that way.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>So I felt like, okay, what do I need to do to make sure that I can do this and still have a good life, be happy, be smiley, have time for family, have time for friends?

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<v Zainab Ashadu>And I managed to find that.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>And I just keep kind of trudging along and here we are, 10 years later and I'm still here.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>So that's kind of the behind the scenes of that.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>So were you always a designer?

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<v Emily Blumenthal>Was this something you stumbled onto?

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<v Emily Blumenthal>Were you one of the little girls who could sew, or sewed with your grandma?

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<v Emily Blumenthal>Like, what's the story that brought you to this point?

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<v Emily Blumenthal>Have you always lived in Nigeria?

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<v Emily Blumenthal>Like, how?

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<v Emily Blumenthal>Because you know, I've spoken to enough designers over the years and there are, you know, there's ongoing parallels, like it was something someone taught them, it's been a passion, or they found something missing in the market, couldn't find it.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>And then it's so interesting because to start a brand, start a business, let alone in handbags, it almost seems like you are like not even risk averse, it's just organic.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>Like OK, this is what I'm going to do, and it sounds crazy if you explain it to anybody else.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>But no, I'm starting a handbag brand.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>Do you have experience?

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<v Emily Blumenthal>No, no, I'm just going to do it.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>So and then you realize, like, looking back, like Jesus Christ, what was that Like?

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<v Emily Blumenthal>If I would have heard someone say that to me when I went through it, I would have been like how dumb are you?

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<v Emily Blumenthal>Like, I mean, why look at us now?

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<v Zainab Ashadu>Well, the story is okay.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>So I grew up in between Lagos and London.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>So I my time.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>Now I've spent more time in Lagos, but when I started zashandu I had just come fresh from london, like on a whim, completely on a whim.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>My entire family still lived in the uk for the time.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>I was in the uk for 15 years, I had only come to lagos once, wow, and so it was just like on a family vacation, on a family trip.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>Like on a family vacation.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>Most Nigerians come back every year, like you know.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>So I hadn't done that, but it was a calling.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>I didn't know then that that's what it was, but it was just this sort of like strong pull to come and create here.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>So as a young girl I was very like in my own world.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>I love to read, I love to just do my thing.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>I never knew what I wanted to be, but I just knew that I wanted to do things that made me happy.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>That's the one thing you couldn't like.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>My logic is for like, I don't know emergencies or something.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>I cannot talk myself into doing something that I don't feel.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>So university I did English and drama, what I like to do and then I bumped into a friend.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>I bumped into a friend who I had spent like a boyfriend an ex-boyfriend's cousin, who would spend a whole entire summer together, and a couple of years later I was walking in the streets of London and I bumped into her and she said to me, oh, how's the fashion going?

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<v Zainab Ashadu>And I was like, what fashion, like, were you talking about?

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<v Zainab Ashadu>Because then I think I was working.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>I don't remember where I was working.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>You went to university in London.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>I went to university in London, yeah, and then I finished and then I was working.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>I think I was working in an architect's studio doing some admin, right, and she said what you know, what about the fashion?

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<v Zainab Ashadu>And I was like what fashion?

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<v Zainab Ashadu>Right?

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<v Zainab Ashadu>She said I thought you studied fashion.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>I said, no, I didn't.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>And then she said so, all of the clothes that you always used to put together and you always used to make.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>It was just like something you did.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>And I was like, yeah, and she gave me this look like either this girl is a genius or she's a dumbo.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>And I went home and I thought to myself you used to make your clothes yourself.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>I used to just like, cut things up and, you know, pin them together and just whatever.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>I just used to write on them, draw them, whatever.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>And I thought to myself, maybe I should focus on this bag thing.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>That's been bogging me down for a while, because by this point I had collected maybe 200 bags, vintage bags that I just I mean, looking back, it's so obvious, but I just really love.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>And one day I realized I'm like, oh, I know what's missing in my collection it's my own handbag that's missing.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>Wow, that's enough, you know.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>From there I decided to go back to school.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>So I went to London College of Fashion.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>I did a long course.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>I did a night night course.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>I was working in the daytime.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>I just wanted to make sure that I kind of knew what I was doing.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>And then, after that, I had this calling.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>I went to visit Lagos.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>And when I got to Lagos it was like come back.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>This was the second time.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>Second time exactly, and I was like one I have to come back here.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>So I went back home in 2009.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>I told my parents I said mom, dad, my late dad, may he rest in peace.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>I said I'm going to move to Lagos and they were like um, okay, okay, I need to interrupt you.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>Are you a middle child?

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<v Emily Blumenthal>No, I'm a first child.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>You're the oldest.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>I'm the oldest.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>Of how many?

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<v Emily Blumenthal>Of three, wow, so okay, so you're not only immigrant offspring, you're Nigerian immigrant offspring, and that is very off brand for a firstborn who does the right thing.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>Colors in the lines goes to uni studies, what they're supposed to.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>They probably lost it.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>Yeah, I think they were really worried because I don't think, even though I had, I had a lot of passions and I don't think the handbag one really stood Like you couldn't really tell I was passionate about whatever I was passionate about, so you can really distinguish one from the other wasn't like, oh okay, yeah, it was just like, oh, my god, is this?

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<v Zainab Ashadu>And I just left in two weeks.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>I left in two weeks with two weeks.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>I took a suitcase, I went, I stayed with a friend and my dad.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>Before I left, my dad said to me look, I don't have anything to give you.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>Like I can't help you in any way.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>You know, I don't know what you're gonna go and do, but the only thing I can do for you, which is what my father did for me, is I can pray for you.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>And so he asked me to kneel down and he put his hands over my head and prayed for me and did you cry?

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<v Zainab Ashadu>Did you cry?

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<v Zainab Ashadu>I feel like crying now, but then I didn't necessarily kind of know the significance, because Because your mind was like yeah, because my dad wasn't very expressive as a man and he just prayed and he just opened my path and blessed my path and said that everything I touched would be you know all of that.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>And I was like okay, and I took my hand and I went.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>So that's the story of the beginnings of Zashadu.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>Were you living?

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<v Emily Blumenthal>at home, at this time.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>So it's not like you had a flat to worry about it's like you were just taking your, so it's not like the barriers were low because you had nothing to lose Exactly.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>Yeah.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>Wow.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>So you're going to Nigeria right Now.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>This is your third time going yes, and you're like.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>You show up at the airport.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>What did you do?

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<v Emily Blumenthal>Because I think when people tell these origin stories, they neglect the details.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>Like you get there and you land and you're like what if I just died.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>I knew I was coming.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>So I had a boyfriend who was Nigerian he's also late, may he still rest in peace and he was in the UK with me.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>So I said to him listen, I'm going to, I'm going to Lagos.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>And he was like what?

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<v Zainab Ashadu>So he hooked me up with some friends, like okay, listen, I have this friend, you don't have any friends in Lagos.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>And then I had one old school friend, so I let her know I was coming.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>I had some family in Lagos, but they weren't like.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>They were found by blood, it wasn't tier one exactly and I just didn't feel, you know that.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>So I went, I came to Lagos, someone picked me up from the airport, I went to a friend's house, I stayed with her for a couple of weeks and then I met another friend and then I stayed with her for a couple of weeks and I just just like that, I got a job quite quickly when I came, and then I was able to get accommodation with the job and then it just kind of like everything sort of just fell into place, you know, very really serendipitously, like just it was the right thing for me to do.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>So it just kind of, you know, the plan just unfolded and I just put another foot in and put another foot in front of each other can I ask you a stupid question?

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<v Emily Blumenthal>do you have two passports?

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<v Emily Blumenthal>Did you always grow up?

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<v Zainab Ashadu>you do so you are.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>So you, you showed up with, like I'm a Nigerian resident, so it's not like you had to deal with any issues, because even people going back to their native country, it really doesn't matter A lot of people you know as first generation.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>You know it's not like sometimes the parents didn't go through with getting everything.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>You know.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>So, yeah, yeah, so I was lucky that I had that.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>Yeah, wow, so that's wild.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>So you showed up and now you have a day job in Nigeria, which is something you're like were you seeing this as a means to an end so you can start this hair dye thing?

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<v Zainab Ashadu>Yes, I mean, I didn't even at that.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>Yes, okay, at that point I definitely needed the job I needed to be able to fend for myself, and it was.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>I got a job in art and so being around artists and seeing them believing in themselves and just continuing in like you know, not the richest people I just felt like man, if they can do it, I have no excuse, like I even.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>You know, I have a day job and I can save money and I can whatever.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>So I just was inspired by them, I was inspired by the artist mentality and I allow that to yeah, to inspire me.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>So you know, nigeria is not really a hub of handbags.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>Right, it's not what people think.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>I know a lot of people have gone to Nigeria and other countries in Africa for other kinds of resources, but handbags are never at the top of that list.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>But we do know that obviously there are artisans, there are a lotans, there are a lot.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>There's a strong native culture.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>Did you have to do the grassroots?

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<v Emily Blumenthal>Let me find some women who sew, or let me see if there is a factory, because you know, I know how these countries well, I don't want to say I know everything, but I know how these countries work like there's always a small factory and then there's women who sew, and then you kind of have to piece them all together and go from there.

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<v Emily Blumenthal>Yeah, yeah.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>So when I hit the ground, I knew already before I came to Lagos that Nigeria had a history in leather.

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<v Zainab Ashadu>I don't know if you, I saw something recently that's kind of making the rounds on social media about how Italian leather is actually Nigerian leather and this whole legal thing, whatever.

00:14:28.868 --> 00:14:37.052
<v Zainab Ashadu>So I already knew the history of nigerian leather and so I knew that there was leather and if there is the wrong material, there has to also be the artisan.

00:14:37.052 --> 00:14:38.966
<v Zainab Ashadu>Right, that logic.

00:14:38.966 --> 00:14:42.018
<v Zainab Ashadu>So I got there and I thought, right, I need to start asking questions.

00:14:42.018 --> 00:14:45.784
<v Zainab Ashadu>So I went to the local market where leather is sold and I started asking questions.

00:14:45.784 --> 00:14:54.764
<v Zainab Ashadu>Right, and I I actually this is a really amazing story because I bumped it into a guy's cousin- it's always a cousin.

00:14:55.485 --> 00:14:57.750
<v Emily Blumenthal>It's always a cousin, it's always a cousin.

00:14:57.750 --> 00:14:59.922
<v Emily Blumenthal>Can I tell you how many street stories I have?

00:14:59.922 --> 00:15:03.934
<v Emily Blumenthal>I'm like, oh, you're the cousin, okay, wow, yeah, it's always a cousin.

00:15:03.934 --> 00:15:09.424
<v Emily Blumenthal>If you ever wanted to start a handbag brand and you didn't know where to start, this is for you.

00:15:09.424 --> 00:15:15.289
<v Emily Blumenthal>If you had dreams of becoming a handbag designer but aren't trained in design, this is for you.

00:15:15.289 --> 00:15:19.923
<v Emily Blumenthal>If you have a handbag brand and need strategy and direction, this is for you.

00:15:20.666 --> 00:15:28.543
<v Emily Blumenthal>I'm Emily Blumenthal, handbag designer expert and handbag fairy godmother, and this is the handbag designer 101 masterclass.

00:15:28.543 --> 00:15:35.644
<v Emily Blumenthal>Over the next 10 classes, I will break down everything you need to know to make, manufacture and market a handbag brand.

00:15:35.644 --> 00:15:45.062
<v Emily Blumenthal>Broken down to ensure that you will not only skip steps in the handbag building process, but also to save money to avoid the learning curve of costly mistakes.

00:15:45.062 --> 00:15:56.230
<v Emily Blumenthal>For the past 20 years, I've been teaching at the top fashion universities in New York City, wrote the Handbag Designer Bible, founded the Handbag Awards and created the only Handbag Designer Podcast.

00:15:56.230 --> 00:16:02.773
<v Emily Blumenthal>I'm going to show you like I have countless brands to create in this in-depth course, from sketch to sample to sale.

00:16:03.240 --> 00:16:09.389
<v Emily Blumenthal>Whether you're just starting out and don't even know where to start or begin, or if you had a brand and need some strategic direction.

00:16:09.389 --> 00:16:12.914
<v Emily Blumenthal>The Handbag Designer 101 Masterclass is just for you.

00:16:12.914 --> 00:16:16.768
<v Emily Blumenthal>So let's get started and you'll be the creator of the next it bag.

00:16:16.768 --> 00:16:21.128
<v Emily Blumenthal>Join me, emily Blumenthal, in the Handbag Designer 101 Masterclass.

00:16:21.128 --> 00:16:33.192
<v Emily Blumenthal>So be sure to sign up at emilyblumenthalcom slash masterclass and type in the code PINECAST to get 10% off your masterclass today.

00:16:37.240 --> 00:16:38.384
<v Zainab Ashadu>Guy that I met.

00:16:38.384 --> 00:16:42.413
<v Zainab Ashadu>When I told him, oh, I, I, you know to sign handbags, he's like, oh, my cousin does that.

00:16:42.413 --> 00:16:44.106
<v Zainab Ashadu>And he said I'm going to introduce you.

00:16:44.106 --> 00:16:47.486
<v Zainab Ashadu>And I thought okay, Cause I didn't think that that would you know.

00:16:47.808 --> 00:16:56.655
<v Zainab Ashadu>But it turned out like she introduced me to this amazing woman, nene, and she had a brand called delune and she was so warm and welcoming to me.

00:16:56.655 --> 00:17:03.198
<v Zainab Ashadu>She took me in like she showed me everything, she showed me the suppliers, she showed me everything.

00:17:03.198 --> 00:17:05.763
<v Zainab Ashadu>She showed me where I could buy all the best skins, blah, blah, blah.

00:17:05.763 --> 00:17:09.811
<v Zainab Ashadu>And then also she had a little artisan who was working not a little.

00:17:09.811 --> 00:17:19.082
<v Zainab Ashadu>She had a little shop at the back of her store where an artisan was creating bags, and so she said look, I can create your bags for you.

00:17:19.722 --> 00:17:30.326
<v Zainab Ashadu>I was like, okay, so she started the production of the initials, of shardu pieces and it literally was like the path was just sort of laid out for me and I just had to trust and follow.

00:17:30.326 --> 00:17:38.164
<v Zainab Ashadu>And so after that, a couple of I don't know, you know, the first couple of bags you make, you're working with somebody.

00:17:38.164 --> 00:17:51.190
<v Zainab Ashadu>Sometimes she was infusing her own design, because my design aesthetic was very strong, very kind of austere in a way as well, not very Nigerian or very flamboyant, and I think she thought, oh, she doesn't really know what she's doing.

00:17:51.190 --> 00:17:53.223
<v Zainab Ashadu>Let me add another bow here, for her.

00:17:53.564 --> 00:17:54.445
<v Emily Blumenthal>Did that?

00:17:54.445 --> 00:17:56.832
<v Emily Blumenthal>How did that work with your relationship with her?

00:17:56.832 --> 00:17:58.522
<v Emily Blumenthal>That's not easy at all.

00:17:58.623 --> 00:18:03.373
<v Zainab Ashadu>Yeah, you know what I was like okay, I need to find my own artisan, so I need to.

00:18:03.373 --> 00:18:05.006
<v Zainab Ashadu>This has to be under my control.

00:18:05.006 --> 00:18:12.287
<v Zainab Ashadu>And so that was when I started looking for artisans and scouring the whole of Lagos, like looking.

00:18:12.287 --> 00:18:21.900
<v Zainab Ashadu>And then, as God will have it, my mom had a property in Lagos and it was a little bit far away from the sort of from this, from the something.

00:18:21.900 --> 00:18:26.066
<v Zainab Ashadu>It's not far at all, it's kind of near the airport, but far away from where I was living.

00:18:26.066 --> 00:18:34.665
<v Zainab Ashadu>Right, I thought, well, if I can maybe my mom, I can convince her to allow me to have access to that property and then I can have my artisans there.

00:18:34.665 --> 00:18:45.321
<v Zainab Ashadu>And so I asked her and she said yes, and I was like yes, and so I was like, damn, okay, fine so you didn't think to even live in that property when you came there but it was.

00:18:45.843 --> 00:19:04.782
<v Zainab Ashadu>It was far away from the hub of the city center, where everything happened and where I sort of needed to be, and far away as well means because traffic is monstrous here, so it didn't make any sense, but I could have that there and I started.

00:19:04.782 --> 00:19:13.150
<v Zainab Ashadu>That's how it led me to having my own mini factory, and we have that to this day and it's like kitted out and bigger and everything.

00:19:13.150 --> 00:19:16.529
<v Zainab Ashadu>Is it in your mom's space or you moved on from that?

00:19:16.529 --> 00:19:20.388
<v Zainab Ashadu>It's in my mom's space, it's in my mom's land.

00:19:20.388 --> 00:19:26.105
<v Zainab Ashadu>We built like more spaces on it and yeah, and it's wild.

00:19:29.779 --> 00:19:39.269
<v Emily Blumenthal>So, yeah, I mean, and it's so interesting that you went through this there, because, as you know well, maybe you don't because you didn't have to go through it but how expensive the sampling process is.

00:19:39.269 --> 00:19:41.434
<v Emily Blumenthal>Yeah, right, it is absolutely insane.

00:19:42.381 --> 00:19:49.786
<v Emily Blumenthal>And you know, I know at least here in New York City there's only a handful of people left that do it and you will get charged.

00:19:49.786 --> 00:19:54.521
<v Emily Blumenthal>A minimum of seven is 7000, right off the bat, and that is with.

00:19:54.521 --> 00:20:07.825
<v Emily Blumenthal>I know that's with no redos, no comments, and honestly I don't blame the sample makers, because most people who are coming in don't have the experience, don't know what they're doing, don't have orders against it.

00:20:07.825 --> 00:20:11.784
<v Emily Blumenthal>So it's the time value of money they have to put in right the learning curve.

00:20:11.784 --> 00:20:21.211
<v Emily Blumenthal>It's interesting that you had someone who was willing to put the time but wanted to put their opinions and point of view and aesthetic on yours.

00:20:21.211 --> 00:20:26.791
<v Emily Blumenthal>That must have been very difficult, especially with someone who was being so generous with you.

00:20:26.791 --> 00:20:29.769
<v Emily Blumenthal>How did you handle that situation?

00:20:29.769 --> 00:20:35.760
<v Emily Blumenthal>Because you know it's like, don't bite the hand that feeds you, but it's like, honestly, I don't know if I need her to feed me, like.

00:20:35.760 --> 00:20:37.386
<v Emily Blumenthal>So how did you handle that?

00:20:38.019 --> 00:20:46.309
<v Zainab Ashadu>I think one of my gifts is that I quite I have high emotional intelligence, so I can decide what's going on.

00:20:46.309 --> 00:20:57.990
<v Zainab Ashadu>I understood that it came from a good place and also, in a way, I mean this woman had opened the doors for me, you know, and that was really unexpected, yeah, and I sort of like I just forgave it.

00:20:57.990 --> 00:21:07.559
<v Zainab Ashadu>I understood where it was coming from because I looked at her designs and I understood that she felt like, man, these girls bags aren't gonna sell because they right, there's nothing to do them.

00:21:07.559 --> 00:21:10.787
<v Zainab Ashadu>It's just like, really plain, let me help her out, you know.

00:21:10.787 --> 00:21:20.380
<v Zainab Ashadu>So I got that and I also, yes, I have my very strong ideas, but I'm also quite a fluid person and I also don't mind trying things out.

00:21:20.380 --> 00:21:26.412
<v Zainab Ashadu>Like I'm like, okay, you know I can, but I knew then, I knew that it would become a power struggle.

00:21:26.412 --> 00:21:29.964
<v Zainab Ashadu>I knew that it like I had outgrown the grace.

00:21:29.964 --> 00:21:35.201
<v Zainab Ashadu>It's like, yeah, say now, you've got a lot out here, now be a big girl and move on.

00:21:35.702 --> 00:21:36.865
<v Zainab Ashadu>How did you break up with her?

00:21:36.865 --> 00:21:40.011
<v Zainab Ashadu>Well, I just I don't remember what I said.

00:21:40.011 --> 00:21:44.635
<v Zainab Ashadu>I think I just stopped taking, or maybe I said to her that I wanted to get my own artisan.

00:21:44.635 --> 00:21:46.965
<v Zainab Ashadu>I think I said that I wanted to get my own.

00:21:46.965 --> 00:21:47.627
<v Zainab Ashadu>She was completely fine.

00:21:47.627 --> 00:21:48.632
<v Zainab Ashadu>Think I said that I wanted to get my own.

00:21:48.632 --> 00:22:01.311
<v Zainab Ashadu>She was completely fine, because I mean, we're all big girls, you know Well, and everybody is, but yeah, Well, maybe not, let's be honest, she was a business woman and she was focused and I guess she saw me as a client.

00:22:01.633 --> 00:22:07.613
<v Zainab Ashadu>You know she was like, okay, I want my client to still be happy, and maybe she thought, well, if she doesn't find somebody, she'll come back to me.

00:22:07.613 --> 00:22:09.384
<v Zainab Ashadu>So let me just you know.

00:22:09.384 --> 00:22:14.288
<v Zainab Ashadu>So it wasn't too much of a problem and we're still friends to this day, that's good.

00:22:14.900 --> 00:22:26.853
<v Emily Blumenthal>So I want to ask you, because when you started out and this is not a you thing, this is an everybody thing when every designer starts out, the retail price of their bags is extraordinary.

00:22:26.853 --> 00:22:41.935
<v Emily Blumenthal>It's really, really, really high and, especially being in Nigeria, there's not like you can create a fluid shipping cost reduced.

00:22:41.935 --> 00:22:54.709
<v Emily Blumenthal>It's not like you're going to find someone like here in the US, there's 100 different people contacting, constantly saying look, if you work with us, we can get you a flat rate so you can offer free shipping to your customers.

00:22:54.709 --> 00:22:57.351
<v Emily Blumenthal>So how did you work on your strategy?

00:22:57.351 --> 00:23:00.553
<v Emily Blumenthal>Because this is 100% learning curve, right?

00:23:00.553 --> 00:23:03.055
<v Emily Blumenthal>You can't know this until you deal with it yourself.

00:23:03.115 --> 00:23:10.227
<v Emily Blumenthal>Yeah, like you can't offer free shipping, but if you do, that would be something you'd have to eat and that's a big thing to swallow.

00:23:10.227 --> 00:23:23.303
<v Emily Blumenthal>And you can't make your bags too expensive because then you know, even as beautiful as they are, even if they're made in Africa, even if they're made in Nigeria, it will become cost prohibitive for someone to want to invest.

00:23:23.303 --> 00:23:24.244
<v Emily Blumenthal>So how?

00:23:24.244 --> 00:23:26.489
<v Emily Blumenthal>Because it's been 10 plus years at this point.

00:23:26.489 --> 00:23:28.353
<v Emily Blumenthal>How did you work around that?

00:23:28.353 --> 00:23:43.404
<v Emily Blumenthal>Because we have a lot of listeners who are not in the US and do a lot of local production and so forth, and this is always something they grapple with Like, okay, the production might be less but I'm still paying for everything, everything and everything.

00:23:44.127 --> 00:23:46.980
<v Zainab Ashadu>Yeah, so I guess your question is how did I navigate?

00:23:50.126 --> 00:24:03.113
<v Emily Blumenthal>how did you sure, whatever, however, you want to receive it how did you navigate the evolution of costing and shipping to make your brand sustain itself for this amount of time?

00:24:03.113 --> 00:24:07.000
<v Emily Blumenthal>Because you know most designers, when they start out, don't pay themselves.

00:24:07.000 --> 00:24:12.893
<v Emily Blumenthal>And if they do, I'm always saying like maybe you shouldn't because you got to make sure the brand will live before.

00:24:13.119 --> 00:24:19.285
<v Zainab Ashadu>Thank you for saying that, Because I mean you hear that a lot in business Make sure you pay yourself, and it's like, yeah, I mean of course.

00:24:19.786 --> 00:24:21.770
<v Emily Blumenthal>But sometimes your expenses are paid for.

00:24:21.770 --> 00:24:30.145
<v Emily Blumenthal>Yeah, you know you're like no, you have to make sure everybody else gets paid.

00:24:30.145 --> 00:24:32.032
<v Emily Blumenthal>Exactly you know like I hear I've met designers saying well, I need my salary.

00:24:32.032 --> 00:24:33.799
<v Emily Blumenthal>I'm like honey bunny, from what with what?

00:24:33.799 --> 00:24:35.585
<v Emily Blumenthal>Yeah, are you paying your people?

00:24:35.585 --> 00:24:42.480
<v Emily Blumenthal>They need to get paid before you need to get paid, or else you're not gonna have anybody paying making your bags and you have a vision of where you're trying to get to.

00:24:42.540 --> 00:24:52.288
<v Zainab Ashadu>You have to like there's something to just have to buy, okay, I so, yes, the higgledy-pickledy of shipping and costing.

00:24:52.288 --> 00:24:53.490
<v Zainab Ashadu>So I had to.

00:24:53.490 --> 00:24:54.933
<v Zainab Ashadu>So this is what happened.

00:24:54.933 --> 00:25:00.451
<v Zainab Ashadu>So I had a blog, because I was working in art and I was working in pr as well.

00:25:00.451 --> 00:25:05.689
<v Zainab Ashadu>So I had three, essentially three jobs and I was like man, I don't have time to.

00:25:05.689 --> 00:25:09.366
<v Zainab Ashadu>People are always asking me are you that girl that makes vans and also does this art stuff?

00:25:09.366 --> 00:25:10.170
<v Zainab Ashadu>I was like yes, I am.

00:25:10.170 --> 00:25:15.226
<v Zainab Ashadu>So I decided to have a blog so I could write everything there and then put pictures of the bags.

00:25:15.226 --> 00:25:16.509
<v Zainab Ashadu>And so I did.

00:25:16.509 --> 00:25:20.329
<v Zainab Ashadu>And I didn't forget that a blog is worldwide, isn't it?

00:25:20.329 --> 00:25:29.708
<v Zainab Ashadu>And so in a very short time, people started contacting me from Paris, from Russia, from America, and asking can I buy this bag?

00:25:29.708 --> 00:25:32.330
<v Zainab Ashadu>And I'm like yes, okay, how do I pay?

00:25:32.330 --> 00:25:35.192
<v Zainab Ashadu>You can pay into my UK account.

00:25:35.192 --> 00:25:38.455
<v Zainab Ashadu>And they were like okay, but it's coming from Nigeria.

00:25:38.455 --> 00:25:52.530
<v Zainab Ashadu>And they were like okay, and I thought to myself damn, zeyna, you have to like respect this, streamline this, make it easy for people, people, to they're willing to pay you in Nigeria, which is already sounding the way it sounds into your UK account.

00:25:53.732 --> 00:26:03.343
<v Zainab Ashadu>So from there I had to start thinking about shipping internationally, and at that time the biggest shipping company was so extortionately priced.

00:26:03.343 --> 00:26:03.784
<v Zainab Ashadu>Yeah.

00:26:03.784 --> 00:26:08.594
<v Zainab Ashadu>So I thought to myself you myself, you know what I have to if I want Nigeria to be better.

00:26:08.594 --> 00:26:11.509
<v Zainab Ashadu>I can't be part of the chorus that says it's bad.

00:26:11.509 --> 00:26:14.489
<v Zainab Ashadu>I have to be a delusional person and say it's amazing.

00:26:14.980 --> 00:26:21.448
<v Zainab Ashadu>And so I was like I wonder what the local post service is, I wonder if it's working.

00:26:21.448 --> 00:26:25.924
<v Zainab Ashadu>And I told people, and people laughed at me like oh my God, no one's ever going to get your bag.

00:26:25.924 --> 00:26:28.010
<v Zainab Ashadu>And I told people, and people laughed at me like oh my God, no one's ever going to get your bag.

00:26:28.010 --> 00:26:29.114
<v Zainab Ashadu>But I was like I have to believe in it.

00:26:29.114 --> 00:26:31.500
<v Zainab Ashadu>So I went there, met a lady, spoke to her and I said blah, blah, blah.

00:26:32.180 --> 00:26:39.711
<v Zainab Ashadu>So we got talking and then I started using the local post thingy Nigerian Post to ship items outside of the country.

00:26:39.711 --> 00:26:48.140
<v Zainab Ashadu>It was very, very well priced, like you know, an eighth of like any other price, right, and with that I had to befriend customs officers.

00:26:48.140 --> 00:26:54.835
<v Zainab Ashadu>Yeah, I had to befriend airline staff, because that's how the, the package travels.

00:26:54.835 --> 00:27:04.008
<v Zainab Ashadu>Oh yeah, oh yeah, and that's the way I could then, you know, track the item and see where it was and then call someone up and then call the class.

00:27:04.008 --> 00:27:11.634
<v Zainab Ashadu>So that's what I did for a good I would say good almost three years it's like, oh wait, which pilots on that plane?

00:27:11.756 --> 00:27:14.384
<v Emily Blumenthal>okay, let me just check, let me check in with his cousin.

00:27:14.665 --> 00:27:24.352
<v Zainab Ashadu>Make sure he's getting there or it's like oh, by the way, we're striking so your package is going to be held up for a little while, so so I'm like, okay, thank you, I can tell the customer.

00:27:24.352 --> 00:27:29.133
<v Zainab Ashadu>And I always offered the customer the option of it being shipped at a higher rate.

00:27:29.133 --> 00:27:31.531
<v Zainab Ashadu>You know, like you can have this shipping as well.

00:27:31.531 --> 00:27:31.993
<v Zainab Ashadu>Blah, blah, blah.

00:27:31.993 --> 00:27:33.972
<v Zainab Ashadu>So they could make their choice.

00:27:34.545 --> 00:27:46.272
<v Zainab Ashadu>And then by that time, a couple of years into the game, one of the biggest shippers started having a I one of the biggest shippers started having a I don't know like a smaller sort of.

00:27:46.272 --> 00:27:48.358
<v Zainab Ashadu>If it's within a certain amount, then it's cheaper, like a very little bulk rate, thank you.

00:27:48.358 --> 00:27:51.089
<v Zainab Ashadu>And so they came to us and they started working with us.

00:27:51.089 --> 00:28:02.303
<v Zainab Ashadu>But then, funny enough, it's kind of come back again full circle, because now the current, there's political or it's not even political economic stuff happening.

00:28:02.303 --> 00:28:11.989
<v Zainab Ashadu>I mean, it's worldwide, so it's really affected the rate, the rate of the naira, and so the prices for shipping again have just like tripled.

00:28:11.989 --> 00:28:16.778
<v Zainab Ashadu>And so it's now a thing where we're thinking, oh, what are we gonna do?

00:28:16.778 --> 00:28:18.145
<v Zainab Ashadu>How do we navigate this?

00:28:18.145 --> 00:28:29.915
<v Zainab Ashadu>So it's an ever-evolving thing to be in, but going to night posts and finding ways to work with them was what saved us and allowed us to offer reasonable shipping.

00:28:30.625 --> 00:28:35.571
<v Emily Blumenthal>Do you know what you need to do, since you know, I know the country's big, but you're already on the inside?

00:28:35.571 --> 00:28:39.528
<v Emily Blumenthal>Is that you need to offer some sort of that you're a brand ambassador for them?

00:28:39.528 --> 00:28:44.096
<v Emily Blumenthal>Hmm, Okay, yeah, hmm, okay, yeah, I like that.

00:28:44.659 --> 00:29:11.749
<v Emily Blumenthal>Yeah, I mean honestly, and I've spoken to people about this, but you know, in other countries that are, I mean, look, nigeria is a big country, but you are somebody who, at this point, is well known enough that it's in their best interest to use you as a vehicle of a promotion and have you say what and talk about the journey and talk about why it's so good and why other brands and businesses and try to come up with a.

00:29:11.749 --> 00:29:18.528
<v Emily Blumenthal>You know, I like back and forth because this way it's in your best interest and it's in their best interest.

00:29:18.528 --> 00:29:23.317
<v Emily Blumenthal>And then this, this way, if there's a strike, you're going on strike with them.

00:29:23.317 --> 00:29:24.358
<v Emily Blumenthal>We're all striking together.

00:29:24.358 --> 00:29:30.471
<v Emily Blumenthal>We're all striking, but I'm going to make sure I know that pilot's cousin is going to take my bags because I have people who want them.

00:29:31.325 --> 00:29:51.766
<v Emily Blumenthal>Yeah, no, I think, honestly, when you are, especially because you're British, a British citizen, and especially since you have two places you call home, I feel, since you're, you know, you have two places you call home I feel like you're crazy not to, because then you become the national handbag, essentially of the country.

00:29:51.766 --> 00:30:06.748
<v Emily Blumenthal>Yeah, you know, it's interesting opportunities that present themselves that I think, as business owners and especially as a handbag designer, it's not anything we would even consider, and not for nothing.

00:30:06.748 --> 00:30:24.094
<v Emily Blumenthal>It's so important and I tell people that to continue to network, to continue to talk to people and, even though you know you've been doing this for 10 years, there are new people coming up and much like that woman you know you're the kind of person, as I know, that would pay it forward.

00:30:24.094 --> 00:30:34.576
<v Emily Blumenthal>Let me see what I can do, because the more people, the more talent that comes from Nigeria, the better it is and the more people it raises a profile that's mutually beneficial for everybody.

00:30:35.037 --> 00:30:36.097
<v Zainab Ashadu>Yes, exactly.

00:30:36.958 --> 00:30:39.959
<v Emily Blumenthal>Has it ever dawned on you to move back?

00:30:39.959 --> 00:30:41.980
<v Emily Blumenthal>You know it must be hard.

00:30:41.980 --> 00:30:49.682
<v Emily Blumenthal>You know you said your father passed and you're all the way over there and this is a country they left for you to have a better life and meanwhile you went back.

00:30:49.682 --> 00:30:52.723
<v Emily Blumenthal>That must have been tricky at some times.

00:30:55.125 --> 00:30:55.705
<v Zainab Ashadu>Well, not really.

00:30:55.705 --> 00:31:12.006
<v Zainab Ashadu>I mean, I feel like Nigeria gives me just the right amount of I mean I can't even believe I'm saying this but just the right amount of rubbish and, you know, trash to deal with to keep me sharp and engaged.

00:31:12.006 --> 00:31:22.184
<v Zainab Ashadu>I think I really do feel like this is my calling, and the calling, of course, it is to design, but it's also I recently heard something which I've been calling myself.

00:31:22.184 --> 00:31:24.009
<v Zainab Ashadu>It's a creative industrialist.

00:31:24.009 --> 00:31:34.738
<v Zainab Ashadu>I am actually here to build industry, and that doesn't exist in this part of the, the what's the word in this part of the of the industry, I guess.

00:31:34.738 --> 00:31:36.647
<v Zainab Ashadu>So this sector, it doesn't exist.

00:31:36.647 --> 00:31:37.711
<v Zainab Ashadu>It needs to.

00:31:37.711 --> 00:31:39.596
<v Zainab Ashadu>It needs to, it opens up a lot.

00:31:39.596 --> 00:31:44.607
<v Zainab Ashadu>It can educate so many, it can alleviate so much poverty, you can train and teach and all of that.

00:31:44.929 --> 00:31:54.954
<v Zainab Ashadu>So I needed something that was an irritant, to make me face it, and I think if I were in the UK that I just wouldn't have that.

00:31:54.954 --> 00:31:57.367
<v Zainab Ashadu>Every problem is sort of solved in that way.

00:31:57.367 --> 00:32:00.336
<v Zainab Ashadu>You know, and I also, maybe because I'm an immigrant.

00:32:00.336 --> 00:32:06.092
<v Zainab Ashadu>I also, as maybe you've heard a number of times, I didn't know I was black until I went to the UK.

00:32:06.092 --> 00:32:07.674
<v Zainab Ashadu>You know it's not the same.

00:32:07.674 --> 00:32:13.536
<v Zainab Ashadu>So it's, I didn't have that struggle, which could have been an easy struggle to sink your teeth into.

00:32:13.536 --> 00:32:26.752
<v Zainab Ashadu>So I feel like I mean, of course there are times when you're in Nigeria and you miss home, you miss the uk, but I went quite often and I go quite often and I like the life that I live here I do, yeah.

00:32:26.752 --> 00:32:44.417
<v Zainab Ashadu>So I think maybe my parents were actually a bit proud, like, oh okay, she's gone back to try and you know, she's taking her education and her what she's seen and what she's been exposed to and she's taking it back to try and get more people to see that.

00:32:44.417 --> 00:32:46.752
<v Zainab Ashadu>So I feel like they felt proud of that.

00:32:47.464 --> 00:32:48.912
<v Emily Blumenthal>This has been so enlightening.

00:32:48.912 --> 00:32:51.814
<v Emily Blumenthal>I just think this has been really, really wonderful.

00:32:51.814 --> 00:32:57.616
<v Emily Blumenthal>How can people find, follow, purchase, share all that good stuff?

00:32:58.506 --> 00:33:03.134
<v Zainab Ashadu>You can find us on Instagram at the Shardu.

00:33:03.134 --> 00:33:10.897
<v Zainab Ashadu>We also have a website, of course, zasharducom, and I have an Instagram account at Zainab Ashardu, so you can find me there too.

00:33:11.585 --> 00:33:19.507
<v Emily Blumenthal>I know because I've been writing you on every platform, zainab, it has been an absolute delight.

00:33:19.507 --> 00:33:35.701
<v Emily Blumenthal>I want to make sure we keep up with you and have you back on just to talk about what you're doing in the country and the culture and your handbags, because you are such a pivotal person within the Nigerian handbag sector and I think the country is very, very lucky to have you.

00:33:35.701 --> 00:33:37.902
<v Emily Blumenthal>So thank you so much for being part of this.

00:33:38.664 --> 00:33:39.385
<v Zainab Ashadu>Thank, you, Emily.

00:33:39.385 --> 00:33:42.593
<v Zainab Ashadu>Thank you so much for being part of my story and for all that you do.

00:33:43.756 --> 00:33:44.577
<v Emily Blumenthal>Thanks for listening.

00:33:44.577 --> 00:33:49.931
<v Emily Blumenthal>Don't forget to rate and review, and follow us on every single platform at Handbag Designer.

00:33:49.931 --> 00:33:50.833
<v Emily Blumenthal>Thanks so much.

00:33:50.833 --> 00:33:51.816
<v Emily Blumenthal>See you next time.