2025 NFL Week 4 AFC Preview

00:00:04
Speaker 1: Welcome to NFL Daily, where we can't believe the Chiefs or the Ravens are going to be one in three after this week.

00:00:10
Speaker 2: I'm Greg Rosenthal.

00:00:11
Speaker 1: I'm here in the Chris Wesleyan podcast studio. It is a full house today, my friends, Patrick Claybond, Jordan Rodrigue and returning the King Steve Wife.

00:00:23
Speaker 2: Yes, welcome to NFL Daily. You're back.

00:00:26
Speaker 3: I'm back.

00:00:26
Speaker 4: I'm fired up. Went through a whole weekend of games. You know, did the Commanders Raiders? Did the Ravens getting it? Get handed a little bit by the Lion. So I'm in the spirit.

00:00:35
Speaker 1: I like when you're giving us the good stuff before the show start. I just want those elbows to stay as sharp as they are, or the mics turned on, you.

00:00:43
Speaker 3: Know, always always.

00:00:45
Speaker 2: How are we feeling, guys, good?

00:00:46
Speaker 5: How are you feeling? I'm ready for your trip?

00:00:48
Speaker 1: I am.

00:00:48
Speaker 2: We're going tonight. I'm going tonight. But uh, you know, we got to have so much fun.

00:00:53
Speaker 1: I am looking forward to it. We got a couple of shows right right when we land in Dublin. But we got a couple shows now, including that Ravens Chiefs banger.

00:01:03
Speaker 3: Yeah, let's get into it.

00:01:03
Speaker 6: The Baltimore Ravens favored by two and a half because the planet hates me.

00:01:07
Speaker 3: Against the Kansas City Chiefs.

00:01:09
Speaker 6: Over under forty eight and a half, we get Jim, Tony and Tracy on the call.

00:01:14
Speaker 3: The defense kind of got a little bit exposed.

00:01:16
Speaker 6: Derek Henry fumbled for the third time in the fourth quarter this season. The Ravens stonewalled at the goal line.

00:01:23
Speaker 3: Jordan. Other than that, miss Lincoln, how was he played?

00:01:29
Speaker 7: It does not feel right to me that Derrick Henry is having fumbling issues. It just does not feel congruous with the universe to me that our King Derrick Henry is having fumbling issues. And I don't like to see him in mental turmoil and emotional turmoil on the sideline, throwing his helmet and being so upset with himself and costing these games, swinging these games in these massive moments. Patrick, I'm sort of channeling you as I speak as well. It's just it doesn't feel like that is right with the universe. But also the Chiefs being you know, to or one and two also does not feel necessarily right with you. This is a weird game.

00:02:04
Speaker 1: Why are you mad that the chief the Ravens are favored in this game.

00:02:09
Speaker 2: You think that's going to give you some bad.

00:02:10
Speaker 3: No, I actually don't think it matters.

00:02:12
Speaker 6: Just lamenting the circumstances has I got almost every single pick that I could possibly get wrong last week, and of course the team losing, and I really think with the Henry fumbles too, of those were great defensive plays.

00:02:28
Speaker 2: On the head.

00:02:28
Speaker 5: I just don't like seeing him be upset. That's all.

00:02:30
Speaker 1: But the run game The bigger issue to me, then the thumblane is just the run game stinks like for two games. Obviously it was incredible week one, but they haven't had consistent running the last two weeks and they haven't stopped the run.

00:02:43
Speaker 2: That's like, not the Ravens. We know well, I tell you since I was at the game.

00:02:46
Speaker 4: The run game stink a large part because the receivers can get open. It was a weird thing sitting up in the box watching this offense. Lamar couldn't. There was nobody could open other than Mark Andrews, typically as the last option, not as the first priority. They Flowers, they doubled him and said, beat us with your other guys.

00:03:04
Speaker 3: This is the Lions.

00:03:05
Speaker 4: Now, They're not known necessary to have a great now they're their dbs are fast.

00:03:08
Speaker 3: Ryan Brandt is really good player, doesn't get talked about enough.

00:03:12
Speaker 4: But with knowing that they could they could stop the receivers with four Yeah, they just stacked up for the run game. And they spied Lamar. Yeah, and Alex Angeloni just didn't miss. I mean anytime Lamar had a run lane, they were so disciplined with the run lanes. Detroit just had a great game plan. I think they're a little bit more dialed in. I don't think it was so much the Ravens slipping as it was the Lions having a great game plan and it was still in one possession game.

00:03:37
Speaker 7: And I want to say, too, you can run against this Chiefs team. They're twenty ninth in Russia. That's staggering defensive rushing success rate. They are not. I mean, this is that's what's stunning to me. Like the Ravens took a while last year defensively to turn into their full form, the Chiefs being this susceptible to the run is stunning to me.

00:04:00
Speaker 1: And it feels like of the two teams, I would have more confidence in the Ravens to take advantage of a poor opposing run defense, but it is all weird.

00:04:08
Speaker 2: You're right.

00:04:09
Speaker 1: Like the Lions who are known for playing so much man, they were in zone all night. It did, it did mix them up a little bit. I thought Lamar, like Lamar, was the least of their problems. He was excellent ultimately, but him having to be that good is a problem. So Patrick Mahomes talked this week and the Chiefs defense, even though they have been bad against the run, they have been better overall the last two weeks. And Eric, our producer, insists, this is some dynamite sound. Let's listen.

00:04:38
Speaker 8: Yeah, I think for us, we got to start faster. I think every game we've we've kind of said that we haven't really got to do that. And we were moving the ball early in the game last week, but we weren't were settling with field goals. And when you play teams that are that are really good have dynamic quarterbacks like the Ravens do, you got to get to turn those into touchdowns and that that will not only put pressure on them, but it unleashes Spags will be able to do what he wants to do. And you always see when we it leads is like he's great, he's a great finisher. He's a great closure of being able to give you different looks and stuff like that. And so we got to take pressure off our defense and put pressure onto them by starting faster, and we can be better at that this week.

00:05:12
Speaker 7: Hey, look at that, you guys. It's the Kansas City Chiefs leading rusher about thirty yards right now. Isaiah Pacheco has not cracked one hundred rushing yards yet. Patrick Mahomes got him beat by about thirty rushing yards right now.

00:05:24
Speaker 1: He is the best scrambler according to next Gen Stats in terms of efficiency in the NFL this year most yards like, not Lamar, not Josh Allen, It's Patrick Mahomes.

00:05:33
Speaker 4: He's it. I mean, the receivers can't get open. Jordan and I were texting about this a little while ago. Right tackle, left guard issues on the offensive line. So it's Mahomes. I mean, he's got got to run for his life.

00:05:46
Speaker 2: And glad he brought that up about the offensive line.

00:05:48
Speaker 5: I mean, Steve, we're texting me too.

00:05:50
Speaker 1: That is disappointed to me. I am a little jealous also, jealous of that jacket there. Like their offensive line has probably been the biggest disappointment.

00:06:01
Speaker 2: I think on the team.

00:06:01
Speaker 1: Josh Simmons we got so excited about in the preseason. I don't think he's a problem, but he's not standing out. He struggled with I'm still excited.

00:06:08
Speaker 3: He's not their issue.

00:06:09
Speaker 1: He isn't, but overall the group is an issue. And he's a rookie. You're hoping a rookie to just fit in and be average, but that's not good enough because the rest of the group outside of Creed Humphrey struggling to the Ravens though Patrick have the pass rush to actually like take advantage. It's crazy how much negative things we can talk about with the two teams right now. But they really aren't playing well. It's not that they're unlucky. I think to be one and two, they look like one in two teams.

00:06:36
Speaker 6: Well, I think the pressures and again Steve pointed it out, and that's the Ultimately, the Lions had a great game plane defensively, especially with Kelvin Sheppard, but offensively as well. Where if Madibike is in the game right and they do get quicker pressures on Jared Golf, they still weren't ever a couple. I'm on raw and that's to the benefit of the Ravens. I'm on Rossain Brown is a play in case, so barely have half of Juju Smith Schuster.

00:07:00
Speaker 1: You got Taekwon Thort. Taekwon Thoron is kind of the key to the Chiefs offense.

00:07:05
Speaker 3: Which is a crazy thing to say.

00:07:07
Speaker 2: It's it's pretty depressing. And Mahomes mentioned the blitz and how they need to help out Spags. It's interesting.

00:07:14
Speaker 1: I think that actually does show up in the numbers a little bit because he's wrong about the blitz this year, Like they're blitzing like crazy and they're not really getting pressure. I know overall they've done a good job the last couple of weeks, but their pressure numbers are like they're blitzing through the roof.

00:07:27
Speaker 2: They actually have less pressure when they're blitzing.

00:07:30
Speaker 1: So I do think, man, a team that doesn't rush the passer well against Lamar Jackson is a tough recipe.

00:07:36
Speaker 3: It's it's gonna be tough. Thinks missing justin read a little bit, Yeah, a lot, a lot. You can put somebody in his number out there.

00:07:44
Speaker 1: It's and yeah, if I was a Ravens fan like you, I don't feel comfortable.

00:07:49
Speaker 2: I mean, I'm I'm.

00:07:50
Speaker 3: Gonna an these two teams play each other to.

00:07:52
Speaker 1: The Chiefs have beaten the Ravens, by the way in the Lamar Patrick Mahomes era five out of six times, including four in a row. And so it's another one of those big games. And you know, people talk about Lamar getting a little tight in big games. How about John Harbaugh? Like where are you at with I'm a little like I'm not as high as John Harbaugh right now, as I feel like he gets a little tight in big games. You got you got Dan Campbell and Mike Rable and all these guys going for fourth downs in big spots. And he's got to read his team and understand his defense is not it right now? And let Lamar Jackson, for instance, last week go for a fourth and nine, he's, oh, he's playing it very tight.

00:08:29
Speaker 6: Well, yeah, in my personal bias on the fourth and goal to sprint out. If I'm not mistaken, it was the same doomed and failed sprint out that they didn't even run correctly against the Pittsburgh a couple of years ago. It didn't work that time. Get rid of it. Why don't we keep one of the most dynamic pocket passers in the history of the NFL with the best passer rating in the history of the NFL in a position where he has a two way go and not limit his options on the goal line.

00:08:53
Speaker 3: So that that was frustrating.

00:08:54
Speaker 6: But yeah, when it's compared with Dan Campbell and the Lions, who again had a great plan, who had a clear idea of what they wanted to do on fourth down, versus like, well, I guess we have to on the one fourth down decision, and then another where it's like, yeah, this defense that's not necessarily doing anything.

00:09:10
Speaker 4: It was a beautiful play though, if you go back and watch the film, I'm gonna try to describe this. They motion him on rot inside the tight end right, and then he goes out in a route and uses a tight end as a rub to catch Marlon humph.

00:09:23
Speaker 3: There was it was.

00:09:24
Speaker 4: It was one of the most beautifully schemed up stings. So Ben Johnson, you're Chicago now, the guy who took your place. Unless you designed that left of the playbook, it was a beautiful play.

00:09:32
Speaker 3: I mean, there's there's no way anybody could have stop. It was a beautiful play.

00:09:35
Speaker 2: That that is absolutely fair.

00:09:37
Speaker 1: I'm just saying, you know, yeah, if your team gets known for blowing big leads and at some point you gotta look at the coach a little bit in the situational football. All right, that's the game of the week, even though they both have losing records. But I cannot wait to watch this Vikings Steelers game over in Dublin.

00:09:55
Speaker 6: Yeah, looking forward to Minnesota, A two and a half point favorite the Pittsburgh Steelers and Aaron Rodgers, who, if he can have thirty touchdown passes, will pass Peyton Manning on the all time list to become number three with over under a forty one and a half. It's on NFL Network, The Great Community, the great and free people in Ireland celebrating just their their commitment to freedom and anti imperialism. Joe Joe Davis, Greg Olsen, Pam Oliver, and Jamie Erdahl on the call to be there with Greg Rosenthal doing everything Landing doing two.

00:10:29
Speaker 3: Podcasts, Sky Sports Podcasts. Get getting set for it, Greg.

00:10:34
Speaker 6: Aaron Rodgers is going to get a win in Dublin, the first ever game in Ireland.

00:10:38
Speaker 2: It would be so typical and I am on the call.

00:10:40
Speaker 1: You're right for tok Sport, go check it out halftime with Sky sports. If you're over there and interested at all, this is a game where if all you got to do, if you're Mike tom and you want to like motivational speech is say like.

00:10:57
Speaker 2: Art Rooney, Dan Rooney.

00:10:58
Speaker 1: It rather was the ambassador, like we are the Ireland team. We're going over there. They have so many Steelers fans. I did a podcast today and yeah, they have more fans than any other team over there, the Steelers. They're both two and one. The Vikings are starting Carson Wentz, and the Steelers are underdogs in this game.

00:11:20
Speaker 2: Like, that's disrespect.

00:11:22
Speaker 5: I have maybe a better motivational line for you.

00:11:24
Speaker 7: If you're Mike Tomlin talking to his quarterback who's looked very spotty over the last three games, three opening games of the season, you could say, hey, hey, Aaron, another Rogers scored just as many freaking touchdowns as you did last week.

00:11:38
Speaker 5: What do you gotta do about it?

00:11:39
Speaker 7: Isaiah Rodgers scored two touchdowns by himself for the Minnesota Vikings.

00:11:43
Speaker 5: That's a corner.

00:11:44
Speaker 3: Yeah, don't give him another one.

00:11:46
Speaker 1: I am worried if I'm Aaron Rodgers going up against this Vikings defense, because they will test the offensive line protection schemes, and it's a young group, and I have not been impressed with their young offensive line. I think the route to them being good this year is this young group. Two first round picks on the outside, Flatanu and Proderick Jones and some and young players in the middle too, growing up together and being an asset.

00:12:13
Speaker 2: Instead, they have really.

00:12:15
Speaker 1: Struggled blocking uh in terms of the running game, and Rogers doesn't hold the ball too often, but when he does, he tends.

00:12:22
Speaker 2: To get hit. And this is not the right defense to go up against.

00:12:26
Speaker 3: Andrew Van on one side, Jonathan Gernard on the other side.

00:12:29
Speaker 4: I mean, it's not like they don't have players I'van pace in the middle. But I gotta tell you what Pittsburgh's defense, what's going on there? I mean, they have not been nearly as consistent as you thought it would be. They'll make plays from here and there, but you know, TJ. Watt is off to a tough start. Alex high Smith hurt again on the edge, is pretty good good last week, and he's a good player.

00:12:52
Speaker 3: I mean, he's a good player.

00:12:53
Speaker 4: Jordan Natis is coming back from Minnesota, so I I mean I like the Vikings. I mean I see why they're favorite here and I like them going over there and soiling it for those Dealers fans.

00:13:03
Speaker 7: Vikings are also probably going to get Ryan Kelly and Justin School back to this week, and however, Donovan Jackson's going to be out per Kevin O'Connell earlier this week, so a little bit more continued offensive line shuffling. Remember Carson Wentz has not played with Ryan Kelly or just In.

00:13:18
Speaker 1: School well School I think at this point is on the bench, which is which is good for them because Derek ll.

00:13:22
Speaker 2: You might be back is a may it's huge.

00:13:26
Speaker 7: But coming back, I mean coming back, and then you know, you just never know if you're going to need him. I mean he was a backup, but you just never know if you're going to need him to slide and elsewhere because they're still dealing with injuries along the line. You know, you guys mentioned the Vikings front, and I did want to take some time to give a shout out to like some of the young guys that they found on the interior and some of the different additions that they found in revamping that interior defensive line. The outside guys, we know that they're good. They've been proving it. This is a team that has a number two in pressure rate in the NFL forty nine percent pressure rate, and there blitzing thirty five percent of the time because Brian Flores.

00:14:02
Speaker 3: That's what he does.

00:14:03
Speaker 2: But slow for him, right.

00:14:05
Speaker 7: Because those interior guys are getting pushed. Jalen Redmond is playing rotational snaps and he's tied best in the league with Jeffrey Simmons among interior defensive linemen in past rush win rate and pressure rate. And Levi Drake Rodriguez another young guy, great last name who they're trying. They're rotating in as well. These are they can They Haveja Williams Goo, They have a ton of guys and they can rotate them and they're getting pushed. And when you brought up that Steelers front and being worried about the inside guys, this is exactly the matchup I'm watching here.

00:14:35
Speaker 1: Yeah, like half their offense and almost all their big plays the last couple of games are just dump offs to Jalen Warren or it's you know, early script plays.

00:14:44
Speaker 2: I thought both weeks.

00:14:45
Speaker 1: Last week Arthur Smith was like Delan in the first quarter, him and Rodgers. They had a good plan and then that was it for the game and they basically didn't do anything else the rest of the game. I do worry though, as someone who's, you know, kind of an anti Rodgers guy, I'm a little bit of a hater.

00:15:02
Speaker 5: Wait clarify which Rogers, Aaron.

00:15:04
Speaker 2: Rodgers, Isaiah Isaiah Rodgers.

00:15:08
Speaker 1: Honestly, like Howie has taken a little bit of heat in Philadelphia. He did this offseason actually take a little bit of heat for letting Isaiah Rodgers leave. He's kind of that mid tier free agent, but he played really well for them last year and they were like, man, we're kind of scrambling at our outside cornerback and he was good. Why didn't you just pay him? And Brian Flores recognize him. I think we're putting way too much confidence in Carson Wentz coming off of last week. I watched that game back expecting, like, Okay, this is gonna be a good quiet you know Carson Wentz performance, and he warmed up a little. But like if that first read wasn't open, he was holding on to it and he was sacked. And the reason his time to throw was so low is because like he either got sacked or he had a first read, and there were some wild there were some wild running around and a couple just big misses. And if those plays work out different, like you can see those as interceptions or fumbles. And I can just imagine the Steelers defense showing up because they are talented and this being like a massive turnover game for the Vikings or for both teams, where it's like three turnover three turnovers on each side.

00:16:14
Speaker 6: If we script it that way, though, I think we need the number one passing efficiency defense against Aaron Rodgers to have like this categorical failure that they haven't shown us all season. Meanwhile, everybody that's played Pittsburgh that didn't turn the ball over five times has scored thirty points.

00:16:30
Speaker 3: Where it's just like does Carson Wentz need to do that?

00:16:34
Speaker 1: Yeah, But there's magic in them their hills, you know, it's like the it's like the shamrock under the parquet at the Boston Garden. Let's actually listen to Mike Tomlin talking about the special connection with Ireland Man.

00:16:48
Speaker 9: I think a lot about the late Ambassador Rooney Man and how fired up he would be about this trip and how important the development of this trip was for him and so I've been thinking a lot about it. I'm sure I'll be thinking a lot about it this week and I certainly will be thinking a lot about him when we're there. Man, you talk about a guy that certainly had a lot of passion for Ireland and obviously the Steelers, and you know, serving as ambassador to Ireland. I'm sure he's gonna be smiling down at us this weekend.

00:17:22
Speaker 2: One of the great owners in the history.

00:17:25
Speaker 1: When when Dan Rooney and some of the other owners, but he was really among the leaders, were making decisions for the betterment of the NFL instead of just thinking about themselves. It's hard to imagine that happening, maybe like right now. And so shout out, shout out to Daniel.

00:17:42
Speaker 3: Yeah, and he was open minded guy too.

00:17:43
Speaker 4: I mean not just like Okay, let's do it this way, because I'm this type of owner. I want this agenda, like let's hear it what everyone else to say, and then let's come to it.

00:17:51
Speaker 1: That's why I'm gonna have a hard time picking this game. It's not about the magic. It's more I keep saying, there's nothing worse than a moral victory in the NFL where you get the l I feel like the Steelers are of the reverse. There's nothing better than getting these wins where you don't play very well because they will play better, like they will have better games, their defense will be better, and just wouldn't surprise.

00:18:09
Speaker 2: Me if it was this week.

00:18:10
Speaker 7: Okay, if I give you a statistic, I'm not expecting to change your mind because I do know you after all, but this might help you, just sway you just a little bit, because I know you're worried about Carson Wentze or my colleague Mike Sando at the Athletic Kevin O'Connell and Brian Flores have won twenty three games together. In those games, the Vikings defense has totaled almost twenty times more EPA than the offense, per True Media. So this defense, whatever happens with Carson Wentz, this defense has got it.

00:18:39
Speaker 1: They are the one group in this game that I completely trust and that's why I will be picking them to win ultimately because that's why.

00:18:44
Speaker 2: I did it. But I don't really way, I'm not confident.

00:18:49
Speaker 3: Brother.

00:18:51
Speaker 2: Yeah, I can't wait, can't wait.

00:18:53
Speaker 6: Yeah, I'm excited for it, and yeah, maybe the safe wins is the version we get all seasons.

00:19:00
Speaker 5: As we all know I didn't really go ahead and start to take commands.

00:19:03
Speaker 6: Thank you Carson Love that the Chicago Bears one and a half point favorites after Caleb Williams those four touchdowns and two hundred and ninety eight yards against the Dallas Cowl on the road against the Las Vegas Raiders coming off a loss to the Commanders, the over under his forty seven and a half spuaddas Adam Rchella and Adide King Kawala on the call, Steve and the Raiders bounce back and in the hot Bear streak.

00:19:29
Speaker 3: I mean, I think they can't.

00:19:33
Speaker 4: It's you know, I saw Las Vegas last week and I wasn't surprised. They had a short week because a Monday night game. Second time going back to the East coast. Remember they opened at New England, had to go back to Washington. Uh, didn't play well. I thought they were pretty uninspired in fact against the Commander.

00:19:48
Speaker 3: So I think being at home, they know they'll be tested. You know, it's just weird. You know.

00:19:53
Speaker 4: Offensively, we thought they were gonna be better with gent and everything. Their offensive line got handed to them by the Commanders. Chicago's got a defensive front that can that can kind of get into him a little bit.

00:20:06
Speaker 2: What did you say with Genty?

00:20:08
Speaker 4: Yeah, with Genty, is is weird because he had a physical run earlier a couple times, and then I didn't see that physicality much anymo very And we've seen in a couple of games where he started off piling a dB or somebody. And he's a very talented player, but he still Washington. They just we're looking at clips here where they're into him before he gets going. Yeah, and so you really don't know necessarily what to make of him because you look on the surface, like man, he's not as physical necessarily as his build, right, But then he doesn't get a chance to get going either at that second level where he can make a guy miss and and put some of that musculature on him. So I'm interested to see this overall Vegas's offensive game plan because I do think they're passing, they can throw the ball.

00:20:51
Speaker 1: Their offensive line is killing them. He look, Genty's eighth in the league and mistackles forced, but he's getting hit behind the line of scrimmage. They are dead last than run block win rate. Gino Smith is among the five or six most pressured quarterbacks in the league. So I don't think the Bears are an overly tough matchup. But they made the Washington Commanders look like, you know, like your old Vikings from the seventies.

00:21:16
Speaker 4: But the stat well, they showed that Genti has his gross yardage of like yards after contact is greater than his overall net yard.

00:21:25
Speaker 3: Right, he's taken so many.

00:21:26
Speaker 7: Negative plays, yeah, and his his yards before contact. So the blocking quote unquote that has opened is sort of a oxymoron here because there's not any yards, there's negative yards.

00:21:37
Speaker 5: Being open for him.

00:21:38
Speaker 7: It's the last in the league is yards before contact, So the offensive line is not blocking open for him. We always say this, it's the age old trope, adage lesson whatever. A good, really good running back cannot fix a bad offensive line.

00:21:51
Speaker 5: But you really need.

00:21:53
Speaker 7: To me when I watch him and I watch him in person two a couple of weeks ago, Steve and I came away with some similar conclusions as you is. I think he's pressing to make a play because he knows he has to make a lot out of nothing.

00:22:02
Speaker 5: Right.

00:22:03
Speaker 7: I think that there's a lot of things that a rookie running back has to learn very quickly.

00:22:09
Speaker 5: That are difficult a and pass pro be.

00:22:11
Speaker 7: I mean there was even a handoff mistake that might have been on the quarterback in terms of communication, and might have been on the center in terms of communication. We just don't know. He was on the wrong side. There are hits behind the line of scrimmage. He's a player to me who is having to make so much out of nothing helping him and also pressing internally mentally to try to make more happen, and he feels like a player who's putting a lot of pressure on himself mentally to me.

00:22:37
Speaker 3: Well, I think the.

00:22:37
Speaker 6: Play stall plays into that as well. He's a home run hitter. We talked about a running back earlier in the show and Derek Henry, who's a home run hitter. Guys who look to make big plays and sometimes we need a detriment to that. You can say that about some of the best running backs to ever play the game. You go back to Barry Sanders. I think the conversation goes back to the play caller who the last time was in the NFL was calling plays for the thirty second ranked offense in the league. And now we're in a situation where we have a young running back and an offensive line that's having some trouble. You can put your guys in situations to be successful, and it can't. Of course, the blank can be script spread equitably, right, But because ashion GENTI does have like negative twenty five rush yards over expectation and negative twenty rush yards over expectation in the last two weeks. But I think it takes a village, and the person who is coordinating the village is the person that I would put the total.

00:23:30
Speaker 2: They haven't been competitive the last two weeks.

00:23:32
Speaker 5: No play callers help their players regardless of what they have.

00:23:35
Speaker 1: Right, we gassed up Pete Carroll culture change, optimism throughout the offseason, and now he's going up against another higher from this cycle the prize. Ben Johnson, You're home against the Bears. Like this is after two pretty dispiriting games. This is a game where like that culture shows up, Like the Bears should be a beatable team, but the defense of got steamrolled last week too. They didn't have a ton of fight. Washington came out and just bullied them around. Meanwhile, like this is the dream schedule you want to get Caleb Williams's season going. Let's play the Cowboys and the Raiders back to back. I'm not that convinced talent wise that the Raiders defense is really it. And like that was the first week I think in the Caleb Williams era that you know, there was only one quarterback hit on him.

00:24:25
Speaker 2: There was no sacks, no turnovers.

00:24:27
Speaker 1: That's only happened like a few times in the last fifteen years for the Bears. And they played well up front because Caleb will do the the wow stuff. Like we'll see if he can be consistent doing the other stuff, but he'll do the wow stuff. If you give him some time against the r it's gonna get better.

00:24:42
Speaker 4: Man, with him and Ben Johnson, this is not an easy offense to run. It is going to get better. He's gonna have his moments where it's not great, but I'll tell you this, Patrick Graham, the Raiders DC is going to scheme some stuff up. He actually had some stuff schemed up well against the Commanders to some of their guys, including Marcus mariotivates some plays, so we'll see how well they execute. I mean, Crosby is insane, k Malcolm Koons is good, but the rest of the defensive front did not play like it did the first two weeks, and that hurt him.

00:25:12
Speaker 3: So we'll see.

00:25:13
Speaker 4: Their linebackers got you know, got put in to some bad situations. I mean they got schemed up by Cliff a little bit who needed to have a bounce.

00:25:20
Speaker 2: They really did.

00:25:21
Speaker 1: So Look, these are like two coaches Chip and Ben Johnson and Pete care like they I feel like they're a confident that they think well of themselves. One of these two teams is going to be two and two. Like, one of these teams is going to come out of this game with a lot of winners in your sale, Raiders, Raiders are coming back.

00:25:40
Speaker 7: I don't have a hot take such a clean like I saw such a clean cohesive. Yes it was against the Cowboys defense and battled as they are, but like they just the receivers look to be on the same pages. The quarterback looked to be on the same page, as the offensive line looked to be the same pages as all the blocking structure looked to be the same page as you know. That's that's what we are looking for. That's what that's actually what we didn't really see in these first two games. Take out the Caleb Williams factor of it. All the whole operation was sloppy the first couple of weeks. This was this was different to me. This is people starting to speak the same language in that locker room.

00:26:15
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a it's a great early test for two new programs. And like I said, yeah, the Bears could be feeling good about themselves after this game road favorites. Let's take a quick break and we'll come back. We're going to talk about two teams playing on Monday Night that desperately back on NFL Daily. I cannot wait to listen to the double header recap on Monday Night Football host it for the first time ever by Nick Schook with Jordan rod Reeg and one of the games they'll get to it's between two teams with no wins, and yet I'm weirdly excited for it. I don't care what you say.

00:27:03
Speaker 6: Yeah, somebody's got to win. Monday Night Football. The New York Jets traveling to Miami to take on the Dolphins, who were favored by three over under is forty five and a half. Chris Vawlor, Dan Orlowski, Lewis Riddet, Peter Scheger, and Katie George will be there on the call.

00:27:17
Speaker 3: Jordan.

00:27:18
Speaker 6: As this Finns team has been close, they've been better. Do they win against the Jets.

00:27:26
Speaker 7: I think the Jets. It's time for the Jets to start putting it together. I think Tyrod Taylor showed some stuff. They lost obviously. I think that that Will McDonald plague gives this group overall some splash juice. Aaron Glenn's reaction also was amazing, and he just is this is a Jets team that feels like it's being put together in real time as we sort of expected it to, especially sounds justin fields. But I like what they're doing. I like how they're building this team out. I still have hope for the Jets, even though I know the outside narrative is like, oh.

00:28:01
Speaker 5: Same old Jets.

00:28:02
Speaker 7: Miami, on the other hand, this is another primetime game that will be probably filled with as the last broadcast was, questions about the head coach's job status, questions about the GM's job status, questions, and real scrutiny on whether the team is playing hard. Last week, Miami played their butts off for Mike McDaniel and for each other, which I think is important to note as well for their teammates, and they showed that they were not wanting to scrap this season and go down without a fight.

00:28:30
Speaker 3: Yeah. I mean it was week three, it's week four.

00:28:32
Speaker 7: Now.

00:28:32
Speaker 4: If they lose this one, then we'll see what happens. I like the way Miami played. It's we that the amount of giveaways. Man, they are not taking care of the football. That's something that really hasn't been the issue with Tua and the rest of this offense.

00:28:47
Speaker 3: But their offensive line is still.

00:28:51
Speaker 4: I mean they knew going into the draft and to the season, and the offensive line is an issue. It's still an issue. I mean, it's not going to get going no matter how quick and stuff you t I run this offense. We keep talking about offensive lines so far on the show. It's still an issue. Yeah, and we know the Jets can make it a more confounding issue, which is why I like the Jets of this game, because Miami's been turned the ball over and the Jets defense is a team now that I think is really going to start the rolling.

00:29:16
Speaker 2: The vibes are so bad with Miami.

00:29:18
Speaker 1: The aftermath of that game I thought was not promising for how that building is working. It felt like people were starting to protect some turf I noticed our colleague Tom Pelasero on Rich Eisen Show really kind of calling out that that interception is to a tongue of I lois fault and that there's so many limitations with what Hutua is as a player, and because of his concussion history as well, that like making an offense around him is really difficult. And I'm reading between the lines here, and then there's some weird Frank Smith Darren Waller stuff going on, like Mike McDaniel almost sounded like he tried to get him off the team. I listened to this podcast three Yards per Carry, who's kind of parsing all this stuff, and people inside the building like claiming territory.

00:30:08
Speaker 2: I agree that Tua tongue of.

00:30:11
Speaker 1: Ailoa is not playing well right now, but it does feel like there's camps and well when you why is up going chet?

00:30:18
Speaker 4: When and when you when you hear that stuff, it's not Tom Pella Show on people like that making That's what I mean. Yeah, it's it's when when the league starts springing like this, there there are issues in the building.

00:30:29
Speaker 1: And McDaniel, even on the podium more or less said like, yeah, there were some parts with the operation and the decision making of our quarterback and like they kept asking about that interception. He was like, he's got to throw it to the flat there, and Kurt Warner is being like, no, that's an offensive scheme. Problem that it teaches you to throw it there. So all of that is really ugly, and I just.

00:30:48
Speaker 7: Want to but I want to say something really quick that when he when Mike mec daniel took over that job, and the entire not just media world minus Steve White, but all so like the analyst world, the main popular thing to scream about on TV was TUA and what takes can we have and like all of these things, and then there was the floras of it all before you know, he went to Minnesota and to really mentally going through some stuff and everybody out there in the world had an opinion on it. And Mike McDaniel went up to the podium and the lecture in every single day and had his quarterbacks back. And so I don't want to forget that part of it just because butts are tied over there right now too.

00:31:29
Speaker 4: Well, that was three four years ago. To defenses have adjusted. Yeah, they've seen.

00:31:33
Speaker 2: Where's the run game?

00:31:36
Speaker 1: He's supposed to be mister run game, and like that is his thing, and I think that's maybe becoming a problem for him because he's not missed the pass game. But if you're going to be mister run game, they need to have a more consistent running game.

00:31:48
Speaker 2: They need to run the ball.

00:31:49
Speaker 3: A line is boot boo.

00:31:51
Speaker 7: Yeah, But my thing is this Miami team. It's like I can't help but thinking it's too little, too late, because they I do think they found a dude in Ollie Gordon. I think they found a guy. I wish they had him two years ago, or this type of player or this type of plan for this player two years.

00:32:07
Speaker 5: Ago in the winter against Buffalo.

00:32:09
Speaker 7: Like this just feels like it's like, oh, we're learning our lessons too late as a franchise, as an organization collectively, not just one person or another person.

00:32:17
Speaker 6: Yeah, I think learning the lessons too late is a collective thing. And you mentioned the Flora's circumstances. A lot of the mitigating factors from the Flora's circumstance are still part of the buildings, yes in Miami, and so like as people cordon off and they have this leak and that leak to protect, like their personal image. Like the things that we can see on the field. The quarterback is facing more pressure than he's ever faced in his entire career. The offense is not operating. He's got as low as passer rating. So either he's just fallen off the map or it is a once again a village that has facilitated the failure of the Miami Dolphins.

00:32:54
Speaker 3: And so like, yeah, I.

00:32:56
Speaker 1: Tend to think it's both yes, and to be fair, like the offense has been fine, the defense is one of the worst in the NFL, and that's where the money is. Like, the offense has been fine. Last week they made big, big mistakes, but Jalen Phillips and Bradley Chubb coming off big injuries with big salaries not really performing. Zack Steelers weirdly been a negative this year for them.

00:33:17
Speaker 2: Is usually a great.

00:33:17
Speaker 5: Place and miss Kalais Campbell right.

00:33:20
Speaker 1: Chop Robinson, they're not even sure how and where to play him. And then on the flip side, just to give the Jets a little because we got to move on, they acquired a starting cornerback this week that was very quiet. I was one of the strangest trades I can remember. Jarvis Browne, who has started basically since he entered the league as an unknown rookie for the Titans, got traded to the Jets. Uh, just a couple of days ago. And I do think I don't know what was going on there. He was inactive for week three after starting there. I don't know what was going on there in Tennessee, but they gave up on them, went on.

00:33:51
Speaker 3: Something went on. Tennessee has not made a ton of great personel.

00:33:54
Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't know what happened there, but they need some help because Brandon Stevens has been struggling and uh look sas Gardner kind of struggled last week, like they are not tackling well. So if you can get you get those Dolphins players out on the perimeter like you might spring some long ones.

00:34:08
Speaker 6: You want to talk about a defense that has improved, What about a zero AFRO squad in Carolina? The Panthers coming off a trouncing of the division. Ronald Falconona going up against the New England Patriots, who are favored by five and a half against the eighty five Bears. It seems the over under is forty three and a half. Chris Myers, Mark Slairath and Chenhill on the call, Greg, do they do it again?

00:34:33
Speaker 1: This is an insane line I now feel about that Ravens one. And maybe they're maybe it's a Boston thing. Everyone just gets so over their skis on the Patriots and they'll just go for it, and maybe they're trying to sucker people, and they really think the Patriots, I mean, the Panthers stink because the Patriots are so sloppy, like their defense gives up so many plays. They're all over the place, they have different mistakes, and as good as I've thought that Drake May has played like, he still had two killer turnovers in that game. One was a little bit of a bad luck decision. But they're putting so much on his plate that I think it is a little fair to wonder if he can stay consistent, even as a fan, like I'm a little nervous with him having that much on his plate without a ton of help. So I don't know, you know, I'm I think Rico Daddle and Cuba Hoverard they need.

00:35:27
Speaker 2: Like those two.

00:35:27
Speaker 1: Guys, they are like the workmen you know they need. They're just like no nonsense, no frills running backs, and they're pretty good.

00:35:33
Speaker 7: Yeah, you know what, that was a fun game to watch. It was it was interesting. There's a lot of crossover connections between those two coaching staffs. It's like sometimes it's fun game the previously Carolina Atlanta and uh, you know, sometimes it's fun to be mean to your friends, you know. So that's that's in a giro Evro defense. That that stood up really for the first time. What I liked watching. And I think Atlanta made plenty of mistakes and I know we're going to get to that later in the show, but our next show. But like Carolina made plays on the ball. Yes, it's almost like they're playing a little freer. There's nothing. What do they have to lose. They were historically bad last year. They have to develop some younger players behind the Derek Browns, behind the j C Horns. They have to make plays on behind the Nick Scotts, Like, you've got to make plays on the ball, and you got to play you got to play aggressive, you got to jump routes, you've got to do these things that we know this defense when it has the personnel that it could have attacks and knows how to do so why just why not.

00:36:28
Speaker 2: Just go for we got to see it.

00:36:29
Speaker 1: But yes, Trevon Morrigg for instance, who was a big free agent signy, had a nice game.

00:36:33
Speaker 4: He's Look, everything I see from Carolina is they're going to continue to grow and get better. They're not a dynamic team, but I don't think this is a team like, oh, it's just a Panthers and they know and they just blanked the Falcons.

00:36:45
Speaker 3: That's what they do.

00:36:45
Speaker 4: They beat the Falcons, right, and then when the Falcons lose in forms like this, it puts their head coach a little bit of a blow tours happened about previous head coach.

00:36:55
Speaker 3: But I just think Bryce is getting better. We love Tteroa.

00:36:59
Speaker 2: McMillan didn't practice Wednesday, which yeah.

00:37:03
Speaker 7: He's got what no an ankle ankle injury, calf injury, That's what I meant to say.

00:37:09
Speaker 1: So that would be a killer injury if it was serious. But he did finish out last week's game, which generally is a good indeviey.

00:37:14
Speaker 3: Yeah, but I'm with you on the Patriots, man.

00:37:16
Speaker 4: I thought they would be turning a little bit more of a corner than they are on both sides of the ball, and for them to be five and a half point favorite.

00:37:23
Speaker 3: I am absolutely surprised by this one. Yeah.

00:37:26
Speaker 6: I mean, you guys get tired of me saying it, but the lines would re spur action. Yeah, and it'd be half to inspire people to behave in a certain way. Because I feel like it's difficult to look at anything the New England Patriots have done in twenty twenty five and say it's more impressive than what the Carolina Paths right last week against an Atlanta team that the Vikings were powerless against it. And to look at this game where you have to think, after the fumbles from Gibson and Remandre, that this is going to be the Trey Hendrickson.

00:37:55
Speaker 7: Oppertun I mean finally just finally get here.

00:38:00
Speaker 1: Yeah, like maybe like he is playing a decent to be more excited about the idea.

00:38:05
Speaker 2: No, I would, I would love it. He's playing, He's playing more than.

00:38:08
Speaker 5: People us Patrick.

00:38:09
Speaker 7: He's trying to not play into what he knows we're looking for, which is his fandom here.

00:38:14
Speaker 1: I think Remandre is a really good player and is ultimately gonna be an asset for them. He the fumbos the last couple of years now have just killed them. Like there's there's nothing more. You can talk about it, but I get it that Trevon Henderson just had like one nightmare game in pass protection, like where he literally had three pass protection snaps and he made a catastrophic mistake in all three, and so early in your career, then that'll get you bench.

00:38:41
Speaker 2: But even then, he played twenty five snapslast week. So I'm with you.

00:38:44
Speaker 1: Because they have no explosive element to their offense. Digs is slow, to Mario Douglas is not playing as well as I would have expected. Kishon Booty is clearly their one, plays way more than anyone else. But you're you're running a passing game, and where Kishon Boody and Hunter Henry are clearly options one and two, that's it's difficult. I'm actually impressed that they've had as good an offense as they've had.

00:39:05
Speaker 7: I think I actually when I look at the Patriots, if I take away the turnovers, I think they're coming along. Like I don't think that it's as dire. Drake May's playing really well. I think they're super limited. They have to replace two basically two terrible drafts. More than that, because Belichick was awful at drafting near the end, there and last year's draft not good. So if Rabel comes in, he starts picking his own guys and signing big money free agents, which is a sign of a bad team that needs to fill the gap somewhere right older at signing those older players minus Milton Williams, who's played well, yeah, very well. But it's like this is and getting Christian Gonzales back this week sounds like they're going to have him.

00:39:48
Speaker 5: He says he's excited. He told reporters he's excited to get out there.

00:39:53
Speaker 1: Sad as massive, especially if its place that's like a perfect matchup for him.

00:39:58
Speaker 7: This is a huge defining element to this game in my opinion. But these two teams, to me are both teams that are really coming along in my opinion watching it. Yeah, the turnovers are bad, you can't do that, But infrastructurally with what they've had to build out and replace, like, I don't know, this is kind of a yeah, okay.

00:40:15
Speaker 1: Yeah, one of these teams, it's it's kind of like the Raiders game. One of these teams will be two and two and feel good enough. The expectations in New England, I think we're we're too high go into the air. But I do think at some point I would like to see a team coach by Mike Rable, you know, have a good defense.

00:40:31
Speaker 3: They they will be better.

00:40:32
Speaker 2: It's like nine years he's had like two, he's had like two.

00:40:36
Speaker 7: He literally last time he's plugging in linebackers that are reminded of himself.

00:40:39
Speaker 1: Yes, Robert Splaine, Blaine had a good game.

00:40:46
Speaker 5: After he heard you, Soda Keenan.

00:40:50
Speaker 6: So uh, never forget perhaps a bounce back for them, somebody who's going to bounce back in Houston on Sunday, we think the Tennessee Titan reef looking for win number one at the Houston Texans, who are favored by seven. The over under is thirty eight and a half. Beth Mowens, Ross Tucker and Amanda Balleonis are dear friend and friend of the show on the call, Steve, did the Texans get a win here in twenty twenty five?

00:41:13
Speaker 3: I think so?

00:41:14
Speaker 4: It's look already we've got the head coach, former play caller turning over play calling duties in Tennessee.

00:41:21
Speaker 3: What you brought there?

00:41:23
Speaker 4: You just draft a quarterback to get him going, like, Hey, I have nothing wrong with my play call and I'm just turning it over right.

00:41:28
Speaker 7: Now, I'm delegating the leader and that's not an excuse expression.

00:41:33
Speaker 3: I'll put a two finger pow pow to the.

00:41:35
Speaker 4: Head organization in terms of making the head coach make a move.

00:41:40
Speaker 3: It's not that type of organization.

00:41:42
Speaker 2: What is that? What is that? You so you think he did that on his own?

00:41:44
Speaker 4: Yeah, seth type of organized with that owner that there's nobody in front of it.

00:41:48
Speaker 1: I mean, it's gonna be all they haven't been afraid of firing people well that they'd rather do that.

00:41:52
Speaker 4: Okay, then say like, okay, you know you need to step out. You know, he's like, let me try something because soon the firing.

00:41:58
Speaker 1: Is because I think the game management stuff, and we did go over this a little bit. I do think it's just been so bad that he needs to show he actually does need to take a step out of it because he's losing the plot of the game.

00:42:10
Speaker 2: He can't do both. He can't do.

00:42:13
Speaker 4: Both, and I'll give him credit for that, But I want to go over to Houston. I mean, look them getting rid of CJ. Gardner Johnson, which is a value whould move. They're trying to clear the locker room again. That's why they change out a lot of their offensive linemen, like, we're not having certain types of players in this organization.

00:42:29
Speaker 3: Well, it ain't working.

00:42:30
Speaker 4: Whatever's going on in Houston because their offensive line play has not been good.

00:42:34
Speaker 3: Remember they hired Nick Kayley.

00:42:36
Speaker 4: They put him with his boy who he coached offense with in New England, and it is not looking good. They CJ Shroud looks, hey, they're trying to get me off the island. They're trying to make sure I'm not on quarterback Island.

00:42:49
Speaker 7: With the way they're dangerous for him on quarterback Island. I think.

00:42:54
Speaker 1: I think he's bought his his ticket and he's enjoying his remaining time there.

00:42:59
Speaker 2: Maybe maybe it's less pressured again.

00:43:00
Speaker 4: But I mean just no weapons. It's it's just offensively, they are a mess. I think they win this game, but they may needed to get some momentum going and feel good about themselves because right now, you know, they're scratching their heads.

00:43:13
Speaker 1: I think they have the Ravens next week too, so that you really don't want to be zero to four going into the Ravens. I you know, we uh crashed out of our Survivor picks last week and then last year when that happened early I think it was the same week, week three.

00:43:27
Speaker 2: We decided to make decisions.

00:43:29
Speaker 3: Okay, so we got a team we're rolling with.

00:43:31
Speaker 2: As a group. Well, no, I'm just throwing out the possibility.

00:43:35
Speaker 5: Yeah, which usually means he's already made the decision.

00:43:37
Speaker 1: No, No, we do to work out this one, is all. It's a group decision. I would put forward the Texans, who are still seven point favorites. Yeah, getting right and defensively dominating enough to just win this game comfortably.

00:43:53
Speaker 6: A game in the division after another loss on the road of in the division, in a season where the schedule and the since have struggled. The schedule has not been very nice. No, for the Houston Texans to start the season. I you know, I'll present a case here in a loak.

00:44:08
Speaker 1: Okay, that's just it's just presented to the group. By the way, Yeah, the Titans were on the other side of that Jarvis Brownly trade, because yeah, they're full of great not that he's great, but young talent just loaded right.

00:44:19
Speaker 7: Since new play collar in Tennessee, here's a suggestion to fix things immediately. Stopped throwing to Calvin Ridley like eight catches twenty one targets, many of them drops, cam Ward, throw to your young guys, you know, throw to the guys who are who.

00:44:35
Speaker 2: They have options. No, they kind of need him. I'm with you.

00:44:38
Speaker 1: He's killed them the last couple weeks with drops and they've had to defend him, both cam Ward and Callahan. But he's also the best receiver on the roster by a decent amount. And who are those others not playing?

00:44:49
Speaker 2: Like it?

00:44:50
Speaker 5: He's paid the highest but he's not playing.

00:44:52
Speaker 2: But he can he can move, he can separate, he can produce. Elk Io Manor is basically a starter now. And they found someone as a fourth round pick. Good pick, but it's not like they have any other options they have.

00:45:04
Speaker 3: Maybe they'll trade them to someone if.

00:45:06
Speaker 1: They have Timiri dk is there as like a return guy at Tyler Lockett's maybe wasting some snaps. Maybe that's so, I hear you, Jordan. I just don't know, Like the roster is not built for it. They need Calvin Ridley or at least for they are show case before the trade bit.

00:45:23
Speaker 4: Yeah, I agree, because they are a year away from being a year away. I just look at this ross, like, what is the plan? He got a quarterback, but what is the plan?

00:45:31
Speaker 2: M Seth Pain.

00:45:35
Speaker 1: We're big fans, we're Seth heads. He said he he wanted to apologize because he felt like he bought bought all the lines about their offensive line, that they would be greater than the some of their parts and you could just you know, get a bunch of average guys together and coach them up. And he says he felt like he was like he went to Jonestown. He was drinking the kula, and he apologized. They they are.

00:45:56
Speaker 5: Here, his voice in my head saying that too.

00:45:58
Speaker 1: They are last in point this season. They do not have a red zone touchdown. That's hard to do through three weeks. They you know, they hit that open play against Nego Collins last week. That's like kind of how they scored big plays, blast in third down conversions. One positive, they ran it pretty well last week. It was a lot of cover too by the Jaguars trying to take away the big play, which didn't totally work, but they ran it pretty well, so that there's something for you.

00:46:24
Speaker 7: I the only thing I would do to to hedge for them a little bit. The offensive line is bad. Where there's no excuses about that.

00:46:31
Speaker 5: They are bad.

00:46:32
Speaker 7: They are affecting the quarterback for the negative once again, even the plays where c. J.

00:46:39
Speaker 5: Stroud like, he looks.

00:46:40
Speaker 7: Still uncomfortable, even when he has a modicum of blocking available to him. I think though, that some of this is difficult to just to write at the start of the season when you're suddenly playing two rookie receivers and you have to play the two Iowa State guys early because you got injuries, and then Joe Mixon, you know that situation. So it's like, Okay, You're now you're doing an entirely different run game for a different type of you know, for.

00:47:06
Speaker 5: Different running back.

00:47:07
Speaker 7: Nick Chubb looked great in Week one, but you just there's just a lot of like late adjustments when if you're already dealing with an offensive line that is not good. This is a ripple effect that affects every skill player, every person on the offensive side.

00:47:21
Speaker 1: Yeah, I've wondered if they would go back to Cam Robinson, Dearente Ersiri, who got a lot of pop in the preseason. They really thought they found something. He's been struggling. But you know, it could fix just be a little bit of a slumpbuster. It is Tennessee type.

00:47:34
Speaker 3: There's always one.

00:47:35
Speaker 1: Maybe the worst is always one. Maybe the worst edge rushing group in the league. They applied no pressure from the edge, so that is maybe a perfect match up. Okay, just a consideration for our survivor.

00:47:46
Speaker 5: I do that.

00:47:46
Speaker 1: We'll have another one coming up. Let's take a break and we'll be back here to wrap up the AFC. Back on NFL Daily. That Jets Dolphins not the only Monday night game this week? Can you remember? And I'm gonna test Steve Weiss here, the dean of NFL Network, any memorable Bengals Broncos games in the history of the NFL.

00:48:19
Speaker 2: This is really putting you.

00:48:21
Speaker 5: On the spot.

00:48:21
Speaker 3: Oh man, there's gotta be you know.

00:48:23
Speaker 1: I feel like there had to be some good Boomer Assias in John Elway games, maybe like a Trevor Sime and Andy Dalton game at some point that was spicy.

00:48:33
Speaker 3: Jake Plumber.

00:48:35
Speaker 2: Uh, I was just fishing in a barrel. I know nothing in mind and nothing nothing in mine.

00:48:39
Speaker 3: But it's gotta be like good like Jake Plumber, cards and Palmer.

00:48:43
Speaker 2: You're maybe not.

00:48:44
Speaker 1: This is I find it interesting. This is getting the Joe Buck. Yes, though I like I like that. They made the right choice, the best choice.

00:48:52
Speaker 6: And I am pander to my personal bias here because up until two thousand and five, Monday Night football was on ABC's back, when we used to get TVs that had ATSC tuners installed in them, and football was provided to the people of America free over the air.

00:49:09
Speaker 3: And it's back.

00:49:09
Speaker 6: Tonight the Cincinnati Bengals and Jake Browning, who was apparently the greatest quarterback of all time before that. Later at the Denver Broncos, who are seven and a half point favorites, appropriately the overhyder there it's forty four and a half. The afore mentioned Joe, Troy, Lisa, and Laura Rutledge on the call as Jordan it was bo Nick's having a little bit of a rough one against the Chargers defense. What better opportunity to bounce back than the Cincinnati Bengals.

00:49:34
Speaker 5: Yeah, Al Golden kind of a.

00:49:36
Speaker 3: Tough start for the pullet in a rough situation.

00:49:39
Speaker 5: Lou had a Rumo replacement there after.

00:49:41
Speaker 3: How does that work out the.

00:49:45
Speaker 7: Fall for the entire organization over there? I don't know that it gets any better. For Greg's boy, Jake Browning. I would see my boy you were so excited him last night. But I think he's a good example.

00:49:57
Speaker 5: Excited about him.

00:49:58
Speaker 2: I think he's a good example.

00:49:59
Speaker 1: And I don't even think this is a hot take, like he played better than Carson Wentz in that game. I think people that are killing him didn't go watch that game. He had one bad throw and it was in the fourth quarter when it was forty five to three. He didn't do anything, Neither quarterback did anything. But he had the same thing happened to him as the Patriots did, where they're just fumbling the ball away. And that first interception he had that Rogers took back is like a diving deflection at the last second by Harrison Smith, where you're happen to like stuff happens in their offensive linstink. Their running game is the worst in the NFL, and the defense is bad, like him and Carson Wentz were at think, I would say, for no more.

00:50:34
Speaker 7: Reason why he shouldn't have been riding the Jake Browning train. It's a system around a backup quarterback. It's at quarterback.

00:50:41
Speaker 3: It's a lot one of the better backups in the NFL.

00:50:44
Speaker 7: Those yours, Yes, and it is a low bar Cincinnati, Yes, you are right, Greg, historically bad run game two point four yards per carry. It's the worst in the league, and Chase brown is only above Ashton Janty and averaging negative yards before contact on every single rush. This is not good. If you have a backup in the game, you have to run the ball. You have to run the ball better. I don't think you do it necessarily against this Broncos team. No, Denver can't really run the ball either, but they might not have to worry about.

00:51:15
Speaker 5: Too much against the Cincinnati defense right now.

00:51:17
Speaker 2: I try to run it though. You should.

00:51:19
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, it's.

00:51:22
Speaker 7: China one hundred percent you should. And then you know, I also don't think that for Jake Browning in terms of what he's going to be seeing and the types of pressure he's going to be facing. I don't think this gets any easier for him. Not only do you not have a run game if you're Cincinnati, you also can't really protect the court at the backup quarterback here in this case, No, I mean they're going to.

00:51:41
Speaker 4: Get all over them. Uh, either got Patz or Tan out there. You got some guys in that secondary.

00:51:46
Speaker 5: Benito's like third the in the NFL, and pressures right now.

00:51:49
Speaker 4: Incredible last week. I mean it is two or three years in a row for Nick, that's where they paid him. I mean, he's just that good. Vance Joseph could scheme up. He'll find one or two guys and scheme up that the world for him. And then all of a sudden they get the and they're great, and he's got one on a defront and he's got one with Benito. So yeah, I mean Cincinnati, Yeah, you got the extra day to prepare for this, but they're just so limited in so many ways, and the fact that their defense put them in a situation where Jake Browning is probably going to have to be throwing the ball forty times. Now, what you want to have when you're going on the road, you know, to den for on Monday night and.

00:52:24
Speaker 6: A chance in prime time for Bo Nick, who has been a little streaky, which is fair to say, just in a second year playing in the NFL, and we've seen Bo hit those three passes that he missed that probably could have turned the game around, and so far on Sunday, especially late last season when he got hot man, he was dropping everything into the bucket, and to have him start like this is a little bit of of a reminder that sometimes these things do get a little up and down, but the you know, the fourth down, aggressive calls from Sean Payton, like all those things are going to be there. The opportunity to run the ball is going to be there. Where it's just and not to like because I just celebrated the fact that that a national audience gets to see this over the air.

00:53:06
Speaker 3: You know, while while.

00:53:07
Speaker 1: It's competitive, I would take the Bengals just because I never liked giving that. I don't like making anyone that big of favor that hasn't been playing good football.

00:53:15
Speaker 2: And the Broncos haven't been.

00:53:17
Speaker 1: They've been like very sloppy, and their defense has been good. It hasn't been like it was a year ago. I mean, they basically got you know, run up on by the Colts and they gave up big time drives against the Charges. Chargers are a good team, but it's not like they've beens.

00:53:34
Speaker 7: That are playing offensively some of the best football in the NFL.

00:53:38
Speaker 1: No question that they've had a hard schedule in terms of their defense. And sometimes you look at this Bengals team and like they're they're not built to lose. Joe Burrow because they signed and paid a lot of money and used draft picks to have a good pass protecting offensive line. And so then you you, and you're they're out of shotgun and it's not on center, and then now they're suddenly under center and they're trying to run it, and it's just like a bad team build. He's been hit before the line of scrimmage, uh Chase bound by the way seventy six percent of the time, which would of course be the all time record history.

00:54:16
Speaker 2: Of the NFL. We know, like, we know he's a good player.

00:54:20
Speaker 5: He's been talking about it.

00:54:21
Speaker 1: Yeah, we know he's a good player. So that that probably doesn't turn around.

00:54:25
Speaker 3: Seventy but but I don't know it could on history.

00:54:31
Speaker 5: That's historically.

00:54:32
Speaker 3: What did he make that? That's a whole series. You go out, you get the ball. He talked back to the sidelines.

00:54:40
Speaker 1: Bow Knicks, by the way, almost made QB Island was almost away, gonna make it.

00:54:46
Speaker 3: Oh, we got a bunch of guys who are dropping off. There might space rally.

00:54:51
Speaker 2: I don't think he's gonna make it.

00:54:52
Speaker 1: Yeah, you mentioned Sertan, who's getting targeted more the last couple of weeks than than he has pretty much in his whole career, so that that's something interesting in this.

00:55:00
Speaker 7: I don't know.

00:55:00
Speaker 2: I think they'll be frisky.

00:55:01
Speaker 1: Our crack producer, by the way, brought up a fun Bengals Broncos game before we move on.

00:55:08
Speaker 2: The brock Osweiler game brought no.

00:55:11
Speaker 5: Yes, oh do you guys know my brock Oswiler.

00:55:14
Speaker 1: Needing a win for uh, we'll hear it in a second, needing a win to get a buye and playing without Andy dallon A. J. Mccherrn goes into Denver, gets a big time lead trying to get that buy for the Bengals, and who comes in but brock Osweiler.

00:55:30
Speaker 2: They benched Peyton freaking man They benched Peyton Manning and brockas Sweiler comes in there and leads a big comeback victory. It honestly was kind of the game that felt like kick started their Super Bowl Championship season.

00:55:46
Speaker 5: Get him paid?

00:55:47
Speaker 2: Didn't I get help to.

00:55:48
Speaker 3: Get him paid? Yeah?

00:55:50
Speaker 1: Peyton was injured, by the way, Uh never paid. He did not get benched in that game. He got he got injured. There was there was a game later where yeah, they tried to bring in Brock and Peyton famously was like you stay on the sidelines because.

00:56:04
Speaker 6: He was he was up and he was gonna he was gonna useur Peyton Mannick at that point because Brock Alice Swaller was the future.

00:56:10
Speaker 3: He was.

00:56:11
Speaker 5: They were going off of how tall someone was. Yeah, he was very tall. It was a yeah, super nice guy.

00:56:18
Speaker 7: In college. I went to Arizona State. He also played football at air Zona State. Go Devil's and he do you guys remember the movie Signs Like the one shot.

00:56:29
Speaker 1: That one of the most disappointing experiences I've ever had at the movie theater the once.

00:56:33
Speaker 7: The one shot that freaked everybody out across the universe was when the alien walks in like long walks in front of the camera shot all of a sudden, it turns to the side. There's a lot of construction at airs on a State. When I went there and I was driving my car pretty fast around a corner.

00:56:47
Speaker 5: He was coming out of the training room. There's a big barricade.

00:56:50
Speaker 7: I swerve, I basically drift to avoid this like long gangly thing walking across. This scared me the same as that alien walking. That's the freaking TV screen. Sorry, Brock, if you're listening. I don't know why I pointed to the sky.

00:57:05
Speaker 6: He is still method, still with this and Night Shyamalan still making movies.

00:57:10
Speaker 3: Unfortunately for a lot of people.

00:57:13
Speaker 6: Uh New Orleans at Buffalo the final game of our AFC preview with the Buffalo Bills on this cheet of paper, this, this is this is wiggling right now? Sixteen point five that that number is subject to some alteration right now?

00:57:26
Speaker 5: Is real? Is that for real?

00:57:29
Speaker 6: This time goes on over unders forty eight and a half Andrew cattle On, Charles Davis, Jason mccordy, and A. J.

00:57:35
Speaker 3: Ross, Greg Roseenvelt. I submit this as a potential.

00:57:38
Speaker 2: Well, I guess we're avor game. Yeah, I guess we're starting from scratch. I don't know if.

00:57:42
Speaker 5: We use I picked this bill, I picked this one.

00:57:46
Speaker 1: I guess if we want to just be safe about it, I just felt good. You know we're not gonna want the Texans any other time of the year.

00:57:54
Speaker 3: There's there's also the game we just discussed with the Denver Broncos.

00:57:57
Speaker 2: No, I would not take that one. I would not trust this on Coos team that much. I would trust the tech.

00:58:02
Speaker 3: Do you trust the Texans more? Yes?

00:58:03
Speaker 2: I would are the point because of their opponent.

00:58:05
Speaker 1: Because of their opponent, this is the biggest spread for the Saints in in thirty years. They they're struggling their defense. Man, this is going to be a difficult one two for them. I would submit, though, because people are asking for Tyler shuck that Spencer Rattler is the best part of this team. People in New Orleans a little bit people in nationally. If you look at like their their DVA rankings, for instance, on defense, like it's bad against the run, it's bad against the pass, pretty bad. Their running game has been stuck in neutral. Their passing game is like eighteenth through nineteenth. Do you watch this team and like they're great at hitting nine yard throws and having long field goal drives. That is not a path to go win. But Spencer Ratler is doing okay despite it all. Yeah, a little bit of positivity.

00:58:54
Speaker 4: I mean Tyler in this game fair because Spencer Rattlers He's gonna have, you know, forty forty five attempts.

00:59:01
Speaker 1: This might be the easiest defense they've faced. For what it's worth, I'm not really buying the Bill's defense.

00:59:06
Speaker 7: I've been worried about the Bill's defense from the jump. I just I a they are shaky on all three levels, especially after at Oliver was dealing with the injury. That they are shaky on all three levels, and they have been since the since that Jets game. I know, the Jets never looked quite the same again, but I think that tells you a lot about the Bills defense.

00:59:26
Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean at the corner, at safety, exit a linebacker, they're They're not complete. But the Saints right now, I mean, if they can say competitive for a half, you know, I.

00:59:38
Speaker 3: Think they I think you know, I don't.

00:59:39
Speaker 4: I think they cover, but I just they just seem you talked you toltal to talk about their defense is terrible.

00:59:47
Speaker 3: I mean, we knew this was coming. We saw this coming.

00:59:49
Speaker 4: We knew this was going to be this type of season for the Saints, you know, especially once Derek.

00:59:52
Speaker 1: And they were right there in the first two weeks. Really, they had chances to win both of those games.

00:59:56
Speaker 7: To be fair, yeah, better than I expected on both sides. Against the Cardinals. Honestly, like the Cardinals played with their food, almost let them back into that game. I mean, I just have no expectations for the Saints. I have high expectations for the Bills this season. I can't understand why they're at sixty one and a half percent third down conversion rate for.

01:00:15
Speaker 5: Their opposts of allowing, yeah, allowing it.

01:00:17
Speaker 6: For the posing offense, Alvin Kamaras run into more light boxes than almost anybody in the league right now. The Saints are kind of one handed with in terms of how teams are approaching them, and the Buffalo Bills are one of the you know, in terms of running light boxes six or fewer defenders in the bottom half of the league. And that's so I'm wondering how McDermott's going to deploy this unit against this group where it's pretty much we have to spread you out and pass the ball because we can't do anything else.

01:00:47
Speaker 2: But they've put so many research.

01:00:49
Speaker 1: There's a lot of reasons why I think Mickey Loomis has passed his expiration date. But number one is all they've done is invested in the offensive line over and over and over again. It's still a major weakness. Like Caesar Ruiz.

01:01:03
Speaker 7: Is that Caesar Ruiz numbers in terms of past black win rate and run black win rate, and I was like, excuse me.

01:01:11
Speaker 1: What he's one of the worst starters in the league, but the high picks at tackle. You know, Kelvin Banks looks like he'll be fine.

01:01:17
Speaker 3: But what does that tell you about the individual player.

01:01:20
Speaker 2: No, that's arching organization changing plans.

01:01:23
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I mean that's a lot of that.

01:01:25
Speaker 4: When you see good players or talented guys or upstarts not develop or come up with real disparaging numbers like that, that's just overall functionality of the coaching staff or whatever working hand in hand with one another.

01:01:37
Speaker 1: Or it's like the front office having too much say of like, wait, we got to make this Caesar Ruiz, you know, pick that everyone's been dogging us for look good after he has a halfway decent season, and overpay him and then make him stay in the lineup.

01:01:50
Speaker 4: That office that dictates personnel Sean Sean remember Sean Payton ran building.

01:01:56
Speaker 2: For a lot.

01:01:57
Speaker 1: I'm yeah, I'm definitely talking to Dennis Allen uh and now the Kellen more Dayes and Kellen Moore. There's just been a couple of game management things.

01:02:04
Speaker 3: It's it's early get there. Yeah, He's gonna be fun.

01:02:06
Speaker 2: For some reason.

01:02:07
Speaker 1: When I hear like the fact that he made them all go on a big boat ride. They went out to Seattle early to get some like team bonding. For some reason, that makes me dislike Kellen Moore.

01:02:17
Speaker 5: It's appropriate, the threat of a social activities. It's just like a lot of the threat.

01:02:25
Speaker 1: Of I've just heard a lot about team bonding here with the with the Saints. Can we get some like tactical advantages, that's all I mean.

01:02:33
Speaker 3: It works.

01:02:33
Speaker 4: You've got like dudes who are thirteen years into their careers.

01:02:38
Speaker 3: Greg Greg loves the father before.

01:02:42
Speaker 1: Shout out to speaking of shout out to Tulane grad Dorian Williams, who I think has played very well for the Buffalo Bills at linebacker the last couple of weeks.

01:02:50
Speaker 2: And you mentioned like how will they attack it?

01:02:52
Speaker 1: They have played way heavier defenses this year than previous years. With Sean McDermott, it's not all nicol and I'm like usual. So he's just he's trying to figure things out. And you can do that when you have the best quarterback or the second best quarterback in the league.

01:03:09
Speaker 3: Defense, because you're gonna score thirty five quarter bail you out.

01:03:13
Speaker 2: It's fine, it'll be fine.

01:03:14
Speaker 1: He I do give Josh Allen all the credit in the world that I think like, you don't know which version of him you're going to see in a different week, because he can beat you in like any different kind of I think he's smarter than he.

01:03:25
Speaker 4: Is, so easy now, like him and Lamar just looks too easy than to play.

01:03:30
Speaker 2: It looks easy for you.

01:03:31
Speaker 1: Wish no one, no one does a better job here and just make it look seamless. You're not joining us for the NFC. You you famously hate the NFC, So we're gonna stay goodbye now. Steve has a lot of things going on in the building. We will take good bye to him, and we will be right back in preview all those NFC games.