How to Understand Everyday Mental Health Challenges, Environmental Factors, & Significant Events w/ Ross Szabo | The Big Success Podcast

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<v Speaker 1>Sometimes what makes a really successful entrepreneur is not taking in all the emotions and everything else that can upset you.

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<v Speaker 1>It's having a characteristic that allows you to just keep moving forward.

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<v Speaker 1>So that's why a lot of people with ADHD and autism end up in the entrepreneurial space.

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<v Speaker 2>Success today.

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<v Speaker 2>A big part of it is how you think, how you approach things, and that's why Ross's teaching is going to blow your mind about how you and me can make sure we stay on the positive.

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<v Speaker 1>We've become so uncomfortable with people just being uncomfortable that we have taken typical emotions like sadness, like nervousness, and called them depression and anxiety.

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<v Speaker 2>Ross Zabo and I are going to have a fun conversation here today and help you understand how mental health helps you be successful.

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<v Speaker 2>So, ross, I want to start with a big thank you for giving us some words to use to describe mental health.

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<v Speaker 2>What made you think that people needed to understand how to describe mental health?

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<v Speaker 1>I had the opportunity at a really young age to travel the entire country and talk to over a million people about mental health, and the thing that just kept coming up was, when you say the words physical health, everyone knew what it meant.

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<v Speaker 1>But when I said the word mental health, people would think everything from oh, someone's homeless to going to a spa and like getting facials and massages, and I was like, oh, we don't actually have a definition for this and until we do, I think, unfortunately, people are talking about very different things.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, like if a physical injury is easy to describe, a mental injury is not something we have.

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<v Speaker 2>So can we start, then, with your five scales of mental health and that five layers, starting with the everyday challenges?

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<v Speaker 2>And I think a lot of us and I know me personally I've sometimes scaled everyday challenges a little further than they needed to be.

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<v Speaker 1>Definitely so.

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<v Speaker 1>What you're talking about is we need to be able to sort mental health, like challenges, experiences, into different categories, like, for example, you know the difference between a sprained ankle and a broken leg or the difference between having a cold or flu, because we had that language from a young age.

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<v Speaker 1>So the first category I always talk about is everyday challenges.

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<v Speaker 1>These are things like stress, sleep, body image, self-compassion.

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<v Speaker 1>These are things that can be healthy or unhealthy, good or bad, depending on your experience with them, but they are everyday things that all of us experience.

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<v Speaker 2>So hang on.

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<v Speaker 2>Why do I?

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<v Speaker 2>I don't speak for me, I won't speak for my listeners.

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<v Speaker 2>Why do I have a tendency, then, to sometimes scale my everyday challenges into well, let's not say disorders, but sometimes I scale them up.

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<v Speaker 2>That rung a little bit.

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<v Speaker 1>I think part of it is we want to really understand the severity of our experiences.

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<v Speaker 1>So part of it is we do want to say like oh, this is really hard for me, and I think because we don't have a uniform language out there, what we tend to do is compare, or we get our information online and we see like all these other people are saying this, so I should be saying this as part of my language too.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I've noticed a labeling ability since I was a kid.

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<v Speaker 2>When I was a boy at school, not focusing was called well, he's just a boy.

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<v Speaker 2>Today it's got 17 different labels.

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<v Speaker 2>Does that make it harder or easier?

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<v Speaker 2>How does that work for people?

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<v Speaker 1>Well, what I'm seeing is we're kind of a self-diagnosed nation, where now people get all of their information online and once you do, you believe it.

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<v Speaker 1>So I do think that, in the case where someone actually has a learning disability, having variants is really helpful.

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<v Speaker 1>In the case where someone is diagnosing themselves, it's actually problematic One, because what a lot of evidence based data shows is, once you diagnose yourself, you believe it.

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<v Speaker 1>So you'll go through the rest of your work life being like, yeah, I'm a little ADHD, and you're like okay, do you have a diagnosis?

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<v Speaker 1>No, I just know that, like I struggle to pay attention.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, that's not the same thing.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>So second layer for you.

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<v Speaker 2>Then you talked about environmental factors.

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<v Speaker 2>How does that fit in?

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<v Speaker 1>The difference between an everyday challenge or an influence and your environment is that your environment tends to be more systemic.

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<v Speaker 1>So, like the home you grew up, in, the school you went to, the way you were raised, your relationships, your actual work environment can affect your mental health significantly, and it needs to be separate from everyday challenges because the way you would approach that or change that is differently, like much like when we think about physical health separations.

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<v Speaker 1>If you sprain your ankle, the treatment for that is different than if you tear your ACL.

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<v Speaker 1>So an everyday challenge might just need more positive coping mechanisms, things like that, whereas your environment is going to need more systemic change If you're in an unhealthy relationship or I don't know about you, but I grew up in a home where no one talked about mental health or emotions, and so you know I always joke with people that part of being an adult is either undoing adolescence or reliving adolescence, depending on your level of self-awareness, and so that comes from your environment.

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<v Speaker 1>Like who you are in the workplace, who you are as an entrepreneur, who you are in a business setting whether it's a positive or negative comes from those first languages you had or didn't have with mental health.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>So there's two things that come to mind with that.

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<v Speaker 2>One is you know, we can't raise our kids the same way our parents raised us, because that world doesn't exist anymore.

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<v Speaker 2>So you know, I do talk about mental health with my kids but, yeah, it never happened.

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<v Speaker 2>My parents never discussed it with me and I'm open with the fact that I have a coach, counselor, therapist, and have done that for many, many years, and I think a lot of people is.

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<v Speaker 2>There still a stigma to it, buddy, Do you see it?

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<v Speaker 2>You're in it every day.

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<v Speaker 1>I do.

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<v Speaker 1>I still see a lot of shame and embarrassment.

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<v Speaker 1>I think there's there's more openness now and I think there are more people willing to talk about it, but we don't necessarily know what to do, especially like, let's be honest as guys.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm fine having a conversation with my friends on the golf course or calling someone when I'm, like you know, angry or upset, but those conversations don't last that long.

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<v Speaker 1>I don't know what your experience is with with other guys.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, look, I mean, I see songs like uh, dan Dax right now out there are talking about being a man and how different it is to be a man in this world, and the pressures and you know the the ability to actually discuss those situations.

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<v Speaker 2>And I do notice, though, with my friends, the desire to talk about it now is much stronger than it was probably even five years ago.

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<v Speaker 1>Definitely, definitely.

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<v Speaker 1>And there's not judgment or there's not a lot of, at least in my circles.

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<v Speaker 1>There's not as much fear around it.

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<v Speaker 1>I think there's not a lot of, at least in my circles.

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<v Speaker 1>There's not as much like fear around it.

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<v Speaker 1>I think there's more openness to it, for sure, but I do think there's still some level of shame, embarrassment, and I do think there's still a level for everyone.

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<v Speaker 1>It doesn't matter what gender you are of feeling like you should be able to suck it up or get through it on your own.

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, I know as a business coach.

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<v Speaker 2>There's even shame for people like, oh, I don't need a coach to survive in business, I can do it all on my own.

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<v Speaker 2>Speaking of business, when we talk environmental factors, is there something that you've noticed about those that do run their own business, different levels or different ways they have built themselves for mental health?

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<v Speaker 1>I think there's like, unfortunately, the spectrum for that is so fascinating right Like on one hand, you have the like super overachiever go-getter who, when they are in that entrepreneur space, they're almost so creative and in the zone that they are successful in seeking everything out, and the double-edged sword of that is that you can hit the edge where you just burn out right.

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<v Speaker 1>And then you have the people on the other side who are, you know, as someone who's been, who started my own business, my own mental health curriculum business before I started school.

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<v Speaker 1>There's always that anxiety of if I don't have a next paycheck, if I don't have a next thing coming in, how am I going to do this?

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<v Speaker 1>And in that frenetic pace?

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<v Speaker 1>Because if you're an entrepreneur and you're not having much success, you can be in a state of depression or fear in a lot of ways, and so I think mental health plays a part in both of those, whether you're overactive and burning out or you're in that place of fear because things aren't coming together for you.

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<v Speaker 2>Anything that we can do for ourselves, or anything we can do, or any tips or tricks to help us get better at coping with that stuff or get better at moving through it all.

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<v Speaker 1>I think the most important thing to keep in mind is that our brains are actually really simplistic.

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<v Speaker 1>They're not these complex things that we think, and we are more likely to repeat the same patterns and habits in business, in relationships, in family, in parenting, in everything.

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<v Speaker 1>And we'd really love to believe that we won't.

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<v Speaker 1>We'd really love to believe that, like oh yeah, I know this about myself, but I'm going to change it.

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<v Speaker 1>There's that statistic out there that 95% of thoughts we have every day are thoughts we've had before and that in some ways, we're just reliving the same stuff over and over again.

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<v Speaker 1>So, when it comes to coping, I think the most important step is really understanding your patterns and habits, so that you're not just repeating the same cycle of I'm not going to burn out, I'm going to go to the gym, I'm going to do all these things, and then you're right back in burnout mode or I'm not going to get into this fear mode, it's it's.

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<v Speaker 1>First step is like what are your patterns?

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<v Speaker 2>Got it.

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<v Speaker 2>So let's dive to.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, actually, on that, how do I identify my patterns?

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<v Speaker 2>Because I'm the worst at seeing, like everyone else can see, my patterns.

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<v Speaker 2>But I'm looking in the mirror going I don't have any patterns.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm just, you know, a normal person.

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<v Speaker 1>So the first step is to listen.

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<v Speaker 1>Listen to other people and if you are finding yourself in the same dynamic, whether it's in your relationship, whether it's in your business.

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<v Speaker 2>No, that never happens to me.

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<v Speaker 2>I've never done that twice, you know.

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<v Speaker 2>Ask my wife, I'm never doing that.

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<v Speaker 1>So the first step is to listen and hear, like, okay, what do I see?

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<v Speaker 1>The unfortunate reality is, if you don't have that self-awareness, it's tough to build it.

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<v Speaker 1>The second step would be to talk to.

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<v Speaker 1>If you really are stuck and you can't see your patterns, talk to a therapist and see what you can do.

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<v Speaker 1>The other thing you can do and this is a fun experiment that I challenge everyone to do is write down a lot of the thoughts you have every day and do it for a week, and what you'll see is you end up and do it separately, don't do it in the same document.

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<v Speaker 1>When you go back through the week, you'll see that you had those same thoughts every single day, and every day you woke up you thought it was new.

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<v Speaker 1>You thought this dreaming of this new deal or this new idea or concept was like brand new that day.

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<v Speaker 1>But it wasn't.

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<v Speaker 1>The flip side of that is, if you do it in a relationship, you'll quickly see that you are having the same fight over and over again, thinking you're having an epiphany one day, but repeating the same behavior.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>I remember journaling for 90 days and when I went back and reread the journal I thought that person is crazy.

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<v Speaker 2>That know, that's a crazy person.

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<v Speaker 2>Hey, I want to jump to level three, the significant events.

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<v Speaker 2>Tell me more about that and how that plays out.

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<v Speaker 1>So what's really important about significant events is that their experiences with loss, change and rejection that don't happen on an everyday basis and aren't necessarily a part of your environment.

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<v Speaker 1>So if you think about both positive experiences that can affect us that don't happen frequently, like starting a relationship, ending a relationship, death, major illness, moving, changing a career, having something happen, a wedding you know any of these things.

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<v Speaker 1>They are not as persistent as everyday challenges or as your environment, but they do require us to cope and address them in different ways.

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<v Speaker 1>I think the hardest thing in my entire mental health life that I've ever gone through is when my dad passed away.

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<v Speaker 1>It was sudden, it was not something anyone saw coming, and the grief of losing my dad man.

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<v Speaker 1>It was like four to five months where it just didn't matter if I was in therapy, if I was doing anything else.

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<v Speaker 1>I couldn't process it and it didn't mean I wasn't functioning.

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<v Speaker 1>I still went to my school, I was in a graduate program, I was running my company.

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<v Speaker 1>But that's a significant event.

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<v Speaker 1>That is not an everyday challenge.

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<v Speaker 1>That is not your environment that can really affect your mental health differently.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, you know it's funny because with five kids and nine companies, I feel like I have a significant event every day, so it's like my everyday challenge is also significant events type thing.

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<v Speaker 2>It's crazy that way.

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<v Speaker 2>My wife and I once sat down and listed out all the significant events and we realized that at least once a quarter we had a massive shift in things, and so it was like how do we reduce our stress load for ourselves?

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<v Speaker 2>How do we actually slow it down?

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<v Speaker 2>Level four is where you get into the disorders type thing.

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<v Speaker 2>Give me the definition there so that people can understand the distinction between level one, two, three and four.

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<v Speaker 1>A mental health disorder is any disorder that's diagnosed by a mental health professional, and the reason it's an important separate category is that, unfortunately, in today's world we've become so uncomfortable with people just being uncomfortable that we have taken typical emotions like sadness, like nervousness, and called them just depression and anxiety.

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<v Speaker 1>We don't even use the word nervous anymore.

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<v Speaker 1>Everyone has anxiety.

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<v Speaker 1>If somebody's sad, everyone has depression, and it's causing a lot of harm in two ways.

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<v Speaker 1>One, if you are a person who has an anxiety disorder or clinical depression, if you are a person who has an anxiety disorder or clinical depression, telling those people to just calm down or get happy is actually dismissing the severity of their disorder.

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<v Speaker 1>And, on the flip side, what it's doing is it's taking everyday emotions like nervousness or sadness and inflating them to be disorders that they're not so like.

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<v Speaker 1>If you're nervous, if you are scared about something or you have butterflies in your stomach, that is a very common feeling.

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<v Speaker 1>It lasts a short amount of time.

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<v Speaker 1>It goes away.

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<v Speaker 1>You can tell someone who's nervous to be calm.

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<v Speaker 1>When someone has an anxiety disorder, the opposite of that's not being calm, it's being able to see reality, and it's a similar thing with being sad or upset or depressed Like that typically has an identifiable cause and you can tell someone to be happy.

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<v Speaker 1>But the opposite of clinical depression isn't happiness, it's vitality, it's being able to get out of bed and do things, and so that's why we need a separate category for disorders is because people are making that leap and they're confused.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I know, when I first, after Route 91, when my wife and I were in that mass shooting, and when I started seeing a therapist and they kept wanting to give me the definition of depression, I'm like, dude, I'm not depressed, I'm just dealing with the fact that.

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<v Speaker 2>And then when I found a PTSD specialist, he's like, oh, you're nowhere near depression, dude, you just got PTSD and it'll take you a few months and we'll get through that sort of thing.

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<v Speaker 2>And that's what it did.

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<v Speaker 2>And I think having a professional guide me through that was actually a thing.

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<v Speaker 2>But selecting the professional actually, if I can get some of your advice on that, how would someone go about selecting a professional for themselves?

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<v Speaker 1>And this is a huge challenge.

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<v Speaker 1>No matter where you are, we will never have enough mental health professionals to manage the mental health crisis, which is why we need to start with clear language and concepts when we compare mental health to physical health.

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<v Speaker 1>The most important thing is that you find someone that you can trust and be honest with.

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<v Speaker 1>This is a big difference between physical health and mental health.

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<v Speaker 1>If you went to multiple doctors with a broken leg, they'd all diagnose you with a broken leg.

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<v Speaker 1>Now, some of them might have different approaches that made you feel more trustworthy or comfortable, but in mental health, you could explain.

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<v Speaker 1>You know an issue you're having with your family or symptoms you're having and like you experienced.

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<v Speaker 1>One person might say it's depression, another person might say it's PTSD.

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<v Speaker 1>So you do need to go through a vetting process to see like do I trust this person?

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<v Speaker 1>Am I comfortable with them?

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<v Speaker 1>Do we have a good vibe?

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<v Speaker 1>Because you're going to be really vulnerable and it's not that you're not vulnerable with physical health issues.

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<v Speaker 1>You are like, especially as we've gotten to our age and need the prostate checks and the colonoscopies and things like that You're vulnerable.

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<v Speaker 1>That's a vulnerable moment.

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<v Speaker 2>Thanks for bringing that up again.

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<v Speaker 2>You know, appreciate, uh, your openness there.

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<v Speaker 2>You know, actually you said something there that I think is really important.

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<v Speaker 2>I've found the best coaches, counselors, therapists for me are people that I actually could really be honest with.

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<v Speaker 2>If I wanted to hide stuff from them, it never worked.

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<v Speaker 2>Um yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>It doesn't and that can take some time, unfortunately, because typically the best therapists or coaches are booked and they may not have availability and that's hard, and I think what at least what I see in Los Angeles is what the best people are doing is now hiring teams so that they are available, so that they're not just like, okay, you can get in in five months.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, la, every single person's got a counselor or a therapist.

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<v Speaker 2>We know that about LA.

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<v Speaker 2>Here in Vegas, I think they just go gamble it all away.

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<v Speaker 2>Hey, I want to hit level five, just so we complete on that before we move on Developmental disabilities, your definition there, so people can understand the distinctions.

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<v Speaker 1>And this isn't my definition.

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<v Speaker 1>It's from the National Institute of Mental Health, but it's basically a disability that manifests before the age of 22 that cause impairments in someone's ability to learn or in their ability to do things that are cognitive.

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<v Speaker 1>So this is where ADHD fits, this is where autism spectrum disorder fits, this is where intellectual disabilities and learning disabilities fit, and, as both of us know, some of the strongest entrepreneurs out there have ADHD, like legitimate ADHD, or they are on the autism spectrum or have autism spectrum disorder, and what's fascinating about that is sometimes what makes a really successful entrepreneur is not taking in all of the emotions and everything else that can upset you.

00:19:21.726 --> 00:19:33.034
<v Speaker 1>It's having a characteristic that allows you to just keep moving forward, and so that's why a lot of people with ADHD and autism end up in the entrepreneurial space.

00:19:33.420 --> 00:19:36.529
<v Speaker 2>I want to flip it over, because mental health isn't just negatives.

00:19:36.529 --> 00:19:38.508
<v Speaker 2>Mental health is also positives.

00:19:38.508 --> 00:19:41.568
<v Speaker 2>There's a very strong.

00:19:41.568 --> 00:19:47.848
<v Speaker 2>I had John Asraff on with me recently who does inner size and teaches people mental health, how to build your mental health.

00:19:47.848 --> 00:19:51.361
<v Speaker 2>You talk about bad stress and good stress.

00:19:51.361 --> 00:19:55.531
<v Speaker 2>Take me through that part, because I think that's a really important distinction.

00:19:57.122 --> 00:20:12.586
<v Speaker 1>It's such an important distinction, especially because what we've learned in longitudinal studies is people who frame stress as being bad throughout their life on average have higher physical and mental health issues, but also die five years before a life expectancy.

00:20:12.586 --> 00:20:15.071
<v Speaker 1>So like, let's talk about this because-.

00:20:15.140 --> 00:20:16.063
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, let's be real.

00:20:16.063 --> 00:20:17.146
<v Speaker 2>You're going to die if you-.

00:20:19.765 --> 00:20:29.490
<v Speaker 1>So the way I always explain this is you know, a lot of times in our adult lives we're having competitions to see who's busier or more stressed out, right?

00:20:29.490 --> 00:20:34.904
<v Speaker 1>So it's common, especially if you go to a business conference and you see someone you haven't seen in a while, and they're like how are you doing?

00:20:34.904 --> 00:20:39.023
<v Speaker 1>You're like, oh, I'm busy and I got a family and I got all this other stuff and blah, blah, blah.

00:20:39.023 --> 00:20:44.252
<v Speaker 1>And the only response to that for someone is to be like I am also busy, I'm busy.

00:20:44.252 --> 00:20:49.297
<v Speaker 1>And then you try to out busy each other and it's a competition.

00:20:49.297 --> 00:20:49.916
<v Speaker 1>Nobody wins.

00:20:49.916 --> 00:20:50.938
<v Speaker 1>You don't win a car.

00:20:50.938 --> 00:20:53.907
<v Speaker 1>At the end of it, you don't like win anything.

00:20:54.960 --> 00:20:58.810
<v Speaker 1>And so what I think is really important is there's stress.

00:20:59.901 --> 00:21:08.470
<v Speaker 1>You stress or good stress that motivates you, it activates your fight or flight mechanism for a short time and it actually gets you through things and helps you get things done.

00:21:09.039 --> 00:21:22.301
<v Speaker 1>Most people wake up with some good stress and they use it throughout the day, and then, obviously, on the bad side of that is bad stress or chronic stress, and that is the stress that most people think of when they think of the word stress.

00:21:22.301 --> 00:21:28.202
<v Speaker 1>It's debilitating, it's headaches, it's body aches, it's insomnia, it's all those other things.

00:21:28.202 --> 00:21:33.363
<v Speaker 1>The reality is we all have different ways of processing stress.

00:21:33.363 --> 00:21:47.311
<v Speaker 1>I would make an argument that most entrepreneurs function from a place of good stress, that they see, you know, you see your five kids and your nine businesses and everything else as a source of motivation, as a challenge that you're going to overcome.

00:21:47.311 --> 00:22:06.902
<v Speaker 1>But there are a lot of people who don't make that distinction and when they don't make that distinction, they are stuck in that space where they're using their fight or flight mechanism for like a really long amount of time and then their body's filled with cortisol and now they're shutting down and it's just not a healthy pattern to continue.

00:22:07.383 --> 00:22:13.844
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean I like looking at most things as I mean, if I don't want to do it, I see it as stressful.

00:22:13.844 --> 00:22:18.123
<v Speaker 2>If it's something I've chosen to do, I see it as my passion sort of thing.

00:22:18.123 --> 00:22:22.712
<v Speaker 2>But the biggest stress of being an adult, I know, is what are we having for dinner tonight?

00:22:22.712 --> 00:22:26.306
<v Speaker 2>Like you know, you've got to make that decision every single day of your life.

00:22:26.306 --> 00:22:29.090
<v Speaker 2>It's a crazy thing In marriage.

00:22:29.090 --> 00:22:36.002
<v Speaker 2>I've found Ross's two things how did you sleep and what are we having?

00:22:36.022 --> 00:22:36.364
<v Speaker 1>for dinner.

00:22:36.364 --> 00:22:37.727
<v Speaker 1>I mean, they're the two most common questions.

00:22:37.727 --> 00:22:39.471
<v Speaker 1>There's only time for those conversations.

00:22:39.471 --> 00:22:40.553
<v Speaker 1>Is there time for other?

00:22:40.553 --> 00:22:41.082
<v Speaker 1>I don't know.

00:22:41.082 --> 00:22:42.828
<v Speaker 1>What else do you have time for?

00:22:43.049 --> 00:22:45.179
<v Speaker 2>Hey, we touched on it a little bit.

00:22:45.179 --> 00:22:57.132
<v Speaker 2>Another discussion that you have a lot is about the difference between feeling sad and depression, and I do notice, as you said, a lot of people leaping to that word depression.

00:22:57.132 --> 00:23:00.851
<v Speaker 2>How do we make sure we understand the distinction?

00:23:01.880 --> 00:23:11.181
<v Speaker 1>So I think every not every, but some of the biggest emotions in our society have a spectrum and I think it's really important to talk about that spectrum.

00:23:11.181 --> 00:23:21.029
<v Speaker 1>And this is true of depression, of suicide, of anxiety, of body image, of, you know, whether you want to get to the nuances of like-.

00:23:22.201 --> 00:23:23.726
<v Speaker 2>And all the happy ones as well.

00:23:23.726 --> 00:23:24.888
<v Speaker 2>Excited happy.

00:23:24.888 --> 00:23:26.452
<v Speaker 2>They all have spectrums too.

00:23:27.839 --> 00:23:35.354
<v Speaker 1>Well, yeah, but I think those things can also fall on a spectrum of just emotion, right?

00:23:35.354 --> 00:23:40.501
<v Speaker 1>So let's focus on sadness to depression first, the spectrum.

00:23:40.501 --> 00:23:46.101
<v Speaker 1>For that would start with you having some level of sadness, some level of upset.

00:23:46.101 --> 00:23:57.643
<v Speaker 1>Maybe a significant event happened to you, maybe your environment is doing something, but the difference between sadness and clinical depression is that sadness typically has an identifiable cause.

00:23:57.643 --> 00:24:02.093
<v Speaker 1>So you went through something, you had an argument, a disagreement.

00:24:02.093 --> 00:24:04.746
<v Speaker 1>You didn't get the business deal you were hoping for.

00:24:04.746 --> 00:24:13.163
<v Speaker 1>The difference is you know what that cause is and you can feel upset and you can work through it, and the opposite of that, again, is being happy.

00:24:13.804 --> 00:24:19.788
<v Speaker 1>When you have clinical depression, there typically isn't an to really find a way to manage it or work on it.

00:24:19.788 --> 00:24:43.042
<v Speaker 1>And that's the biggest difference is sadness typically has a cause and it can suck and it can last for a long time, like I just talked about grief with my dad before.

00:24:43.042 --> 00:24:55.566
<v Speaker 1>But clinical depression typically doesn't have a cause and it needs a much different level of treatment and attention, In case someone listening is at that phase.

00:24:55.625 --> 00:25:00.355
<v Speaker 2>how would they recognize that they are at that point of needing help for depression?

00:25:01.381 --> 00:25:25.792
<v Speaker 1>Some of the bigger signs are that you just don't find enjoyment in the things that you used to, that you stop doing the things you really found enjoyable, that you do feel a higher sense of loneliness or isolation, like you feel kind of cut off from everybody in your life, that you don't have the energy that you used to have, that you in some ways stop taking care of yourself too.

00:25:25.900 --> 00:25:32.407
<v Speaker 1>You don't care about showering as much, you don't care about hitting the gym, you don't care about showering as much, you don't care about hitting the gym, you don't care about these other aspects.

00:25:32.407 --> 00:25:34.593
<v Speaker 1>And it's okay to go through that in phases.

00:25:34.593 --> 00:25:39.612
<v Speaker 1>Look, I am a founding faculty member of a middle school, high school, and I run a company.

00:25:39.612 --> 00:25:46.602
<v Speaker 1>So there are times where I just have to be like I can't do it, I'm just shutting down, I'm not doing anything right now.

00:25:46.602 --> 00:25:54.555
<v Speaker 1>But it's when it's persistent enough, where people are checking in to be like, hey, what's happening to you?

00:25:54.555 --> 00:25:56.566
<v Speaker 1>Those are the bigger signs.

00:25:56.566 --> 00:26:04.809
<v Speaker 1>And then, obviously, another sign would be if you're having uncontrollable thoughts about suicide, taking your own life or death.

00:26:04.809 --> 00:26:13.185
<v Speaker 1>I think a lot of times people think, yeah, it's normal to think about death, and it is, but it is not normal to obsess over ways to take your own life.

00:26:14.166 --> 00:26:15.407
<v Speaker 2>When you're a young man.

00:26:15.407 --> 00:26:20.832
<v Speaker 2>You did that courageous move of talking about bipolar disorder with your school.

00:26:20.832 --> 00:26:23.094
<v Speaker 2>How did it happen?

00:26:23.094 --> 00:26:24.674
<v Speaker 2>What happened Like?

00:26:24.674 --> 00:26:27.837
<v Speaker 2>How did you even come up with that as a young teenager?

00:26:27.837 --> 00:26:33.828
<v Speaker 2>Like I don't think I would have had anywhere near the gumption to discuss that stuff when I was a teenage boy.

00:26:34.509 --> 00:26:35.613
<v Speaker 1>I appreciate that.

00:26:35.613 --> 00:26:37.105
<v Speaker 1>I think it was a combination of things.

00:26:37.105 --> 00:26:49.227
<v Speaker 1>Number one you know, when I got out of the psychiatric ward after I attempted to take my own life in my senior year, I went from being the cool guy, the guy that everyone partied with, everyone liked, everyone knew.

00:26:49.227 --> 00:27:06.951
<v Speaker 1>So all of a sudden, people were just calling me a psycho and a crazy kid, and it was frustrating because I was still at parties, people were as dysfunctional as I was, but what I was going through just had a label, and the label was what, like, made people treat me that way.

00:27:06.951 --> 00:27:14.567
<v Speaker 1>And then the second thing was you know, I had a teacher at my school who did care and he saw that I was being treated this way.

00:27:14.567 --> 00:27:22.492
<v Speaker 1>So he thought he would help and he brought a psychologist into my school, in one of my classrooms, to talk about the patients he treated.

00:27:22.492 --> 00:27:36.692
<v Speaker 1>And when that psychologist did that, he chose the most extreme stories possible, like stories that aren't even remotely common, and so all the students started laughing and I was just tired of being laughed at.

00:27:36.692 --> 00:27:41.152
<v Speaker 1>And so, you know, I took my teacher in the hallway and I was like, hey, this isn't funny.

00:27:41.152 --> 00:27:45.886
<v Speaker 1>And I, I know that you were trying to help, but like this is really infuriating.

00:27:45.886 --> 00:27:47.771
<v Speaker 1>And so he looked at me.

00:27:47.900 --> 00:27:53.542
<v Speaker 1>I grew up in in very rural Pennsylvania and I was actually born in Bethlehem and raised in Nazareth.

00:27:53.542 --> 00:27:56.469
<v Speaker 1>If anyone is, it's very, very important.

00:27:56.469 --> 00:28:02.549
<v Speaker 1>And so in Nazareth, pennsylvania, my teacher looked at me and he was like, well, what do you want to do about it?

00:28:02.549 --> 00:28:04.040
<v Speaker 1>And I was like let me speak.

00:28:04.040 --> 00:28:09.406
<v Speaker 1>If they're not going to understand this from anyone else, then let me tell them what it's like to go through it.

00:28:09.406 --> 00:28:28.616
<v Speaker 1>And so two weeks later I stood up in that classroom and I shared all of it the diagnosis, my family history with severe mental illness and substance abuse and addiction, and then kind of what it was like to go through clinical depression as a senior in high school.

00:28:28.636 --> 00:28:35.662
<v Speaker 1>And what I saw at that age was, if you share your story, it opens other people to sharing their stories.

00:28:35.662 --> 00:28:41.702
<v Speaker 1>Like when you're vulnerable, it opens other people to being vulnerable and nobody left.

00:28:41.702 --> 00:28:47.778
<v Speaker 1>And a lot of the students came up and shared that they have family members with mental health disorders and all this other stuff.

00:28:47.778 --> 00:28:51.661
<v Speaker 1>So I had the opportunity to learn at a young age like, oh, there's something here.

00:28:51.661 --> 00:28:56.500
<v Speaker 1>If you open up this way, it can educate people in a different way.

00:28:56.500 --> 00:29:08.603
<v Speaker 1>And then, like five years later, that's when the entrepreneurial spirit kicked in for me, where I was like, okay, there are no large scale presentations about mental health in this country.

00:29:08.603 --> 00:29:18.942
<v Speaker 1>It was 2002 when I did this, so I am now going to create the first large scale mental health presentations because I had the experience of seeing like this resonates.

00:29:19.490 --> 00:29:20.650
<v Speaker 2>Well, hey there and thanks for listening.

00:29:20.650 --> 00:29:25.863
<v Speaker 2>I've noticed that 78% of you are brand new, which means you haven't hit the subscribe button yet.

00:29:25.863 --> 00:29:33.144
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00:29:33.144 --> 00:29:35.258
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00:29:35.258 --> 00:29:36.434
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00:29:36.434 --> 00:29:37.952
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00:29:37.952 --> 00:29:43.996
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00:29:43.996 --> 00:29:56.897
<v Speaker 2>One other area I want to touch on is you talk about the difference between being nervous and anxiety, and I think that you touched on earlier, but I want to establish that a bit more, because nervousness is normal.

00:29:56.897 --> 00:30:00.085
<v Speaker 2>Anxiety is where you start pushing yourself into a realm.

00:30:00.085 --> 00:30:04.435
<v Speaker 2>Tell us how that definition is and what we can do about that.

00:30:05.076 --> 00:30:08.432
<v Speaker 1>And again, this is a another spectrum that I think is really important.

00:30:08.432 --> 00:30:14.438
<v Speaker 1>So nervousness is just the butterflies you get in your stomach before you're about to do something that you're not comfortable with.

00:30:14.438 --> 00:30:28.676
<v Speaker 1>Nervousness is a very, very common emotion that we all have and again, nervousness typically has an identifiable cause and it lasts for a short amount of time and it goes away.

00:30:28.676 --> 00:30:31.932
<v Speaker 1>And when somebody is nervous, you can tell them to calm down.

00:30:31.932 --> 00:30:51.102
<v Speaker 1>What I see happening right now is a combination of a couple of things One in schools and even businesses like I have a lot of managers from huge companies always asking me like well, you know, I have this employee who says they have anxiety and they can't do this job.

00:30:51.102 --> 00:30:57.022
<v Speaker 1>But I don't think it's anxiety and you know, and in schools you see it all the time.

00:30:57.022 --> 00:31:06.419
<v Speaker 1>When you take devices away from kids, there's almost that like kind of addiction withdrawal where they're like I can't do anything.

00:31:06.419 --> 00:31:17.298
<v Speaker 1>So, yeah, so it is really important to make sure that we are identifying nervousness lasts a short amount of time, because that's what a majority of people are experiencing.

00:31:17.699 --> 00:31:19.566
<v Speaker 1>There are people with anxiety disorders.

00:31:20.048 --> 00:31:22.634
<v Speaker 1>Anxiety disorders are the most common mental health disorder.

00:31:23.096 --> 00:31:49.313
<v Speaker 1>The difference is for an anxiety disorder to happen it's either like an amount of anxiety, whether low or high, that is persistent all day, that you need some kind of treatment for because it is preventing you from doing the things you need to do, or it is a kind of extravagant or large reaction to a thing that that contributes to an anxiety disorder.

00:31:49.373 --> 00:32:05.536
<v Speaker 1>So some people you know are afraid to be in crowds, or some people are afraid of like social anxiety, or some people are afraid of like social anxiety, or some people are afraid of specific things, and then the reaction from those triggers is is more than than nervousness.

00:32:05.536 --> 00:32:13.960
<v Speaker 1>It is a panic attack where you feel like your heart is going to beat out of your chest, you're going to die, or the walls are caving in or things like that.

00:32:13.960 --> 00:32:20.853
<v Speaker 1>And when somebody has an anxiety disorder, the opposite of that for them really isn't being calm, it's being able to see reality.

00:32:20.853 --> 00:32:25.874
<v Speaker 1>It's being able to see like, okay, this is what's happening, this is what's going on, this is what I need to do.

00:32:25.874 --> 00:32:36.303
<v Speaker 1>And when we don't explain that spectrum, then we have everyone ending up on the anxiety side, which for me, right now at least, is not working.

00:32:37.310 --> 00:32:49.442
<v Speaker 2>Ross, I want to finish out on this area, mental health being the positive or the mental fitness type thing, because it's not just let's wait till there's a problem and fix it type thing.

00:32:49.442 --> 00:32:57.893
<v Speaker 2>Like you know, with physical health today, people aren't waiting till they get sick to deal with it, they're staying fit, staying healthy, eating better.

00:32:57.893 --> 00:33:05.215
<v Speaker 2>How can we make sure that our mental fitness and our mental health stays as much in that positive realm as possible?

00:33:06.799 --> 00:33:13.750
<v Speaker 1>And this is a really great question, and I think the way to look at it is when you think about your physical health it's not that you're always perfect.

00:33:13.750 --> 00:33:21.244
<v Speaker 1>When you think about your physical health, it's that you know what to do when a situation arises and you try to maintain some baseline of health.

00:33:21.244 --> 00:33:32.160
<v Speaker 1>You know, we know that we shouldn't eat sugar and sweets and candy every day, but a lot of us still do it and then we justify it by like yeah, but I went to the gym, like, so I can do it.

00:33:32.160 --> 00:33:33.652
<v Speaker 1>I went for a run, so I can do it.

00:33:33.652 --> 00:33:39.883
<v Speaker 1>Also, if you think about your physical health in a lot of ways, you don't pay attention to it until something pops up.

00:33:39.883 --> 00:33:46.772
<v Speaker 1>So if you have a cold, you're like, okay, I'm going to take some cold medicine.

00:33:46.772 --> 00:33:47.776
<v Speaker 1>If you have the flu, you know that you're out.

00:33:47.796 --> 00:33:50.930
<v Speaker 1>And I really wish people would switch their approach to mental health to be the same thing.

00:33:50.930 --> 00:33:53.974
<v Speaker 1>You want to maintain a baseline of mental health.

00:33:53.974 --> 00:34:06.890
<v Speaker 1>So that is, you know, communicating with people and making sure that you have friends and people you can check in, and you don't need a ton of friends, but just certain people you trust, whether it's a relationship, friendship, some kind of communication that's healthy.

00:34:06.890 --> 00:34:18.753
<v Speaker 1>The next thing you want as a baseline are coping mechanisms that give you an outlet, that give you joy, that give you a release, that give you an outlet, that give you joy, that give you a release.

00:34:18.753 --> 00:34:24.811
<v Speaker 1>I think it's really important to have a coping mechanism that's either music or exercise, whatever it is that gives you that outlet.

00:34:24.811 --> 00:34:29.603
<v Speaker 1>It is extremely important in your baseline of mental health to know your family history.

00:34:29.603 --> 00:34:38.143
<v Speaker 1>If I was growing up and somebody was like hey, three of your grandparents are alcoholics, your mom has bipolar disorder.

00:34:38.143 --> 00:34:38.945
<v Speaker 1>You probably.

00:34:38.945 --> 00:34:39.806
<v Speaker 1>Three of your grandparents are alcoholics.

00:34:39.806 --> 00:34:40.568
<v Speaker 1>Your mom has bipolar disorder.

00:34:40.588 --> 00:34:41.730
<v Speaker 2>You probably shouldn't start drinking at age 12.

00:34:41.730 --> 00:34:42.931
<v Speaker 2>This is a bad move?

00:34:42.931 --> 00:34:45.773
<v Speaker 2>Possibly not, unless you're Australian.

00:34:45.773 --> 00:34:47.315
<v Speaker 2>It's different.

00:34:48.217 --> 00:34:50.679
<v Speaker 1>This isn't going to end well for you.

00:34:51.179 --> 00:34:57.266
<v Speaker 1>But part of that baseline is knowing your family history, and then the next part of it is is putting it into action.

00:34:57.688 --> 00:35:04.523
<v Speaker 1>So there are many days, as somebody who has been diagnosed with disorders and gone through trauma and everything else, that my baseline is okay.

00:35:04.990 --> 00:35:14.938
<v Speaker 1>But then there are days where things pop up where I am reaching a level of depression or I am reaching a level of anxiety and now I need to know how to respond to it.

00:35:14.938 --> 00:35:23.750
<v Speaker 1>And that is very similar to us having a baseline of physical health and now we see that, like, okay, we're gaining weight, so we might need to change something.

00:35:23.750 --> 00:35:43.215
<v Speaker 1>Or you get, you know, you go to the doctor and they're like hey, you actually have some different type of physical challenge, whether it's cancer, whether it is something else, now you know, like, whether it is something else, now you know like, okay, I need to do this, this and this to respond.

00:35:43.215 --> 00:35:58.934
<v Speaker 1>I really wish people would get to a place where when they say mental health is like physical health, they don't make it about being perfect, they make it in a similar capacity of like okay, I understand the four things I need for my baseline and then, if something happens, I need to ramp it up in some area to take care of it.

00:35:59.295 --> 00:35:59.597
<v Speaker 2>Love it.

00:35:59.597 --> 00:36:00.038
<v Speaker 2>I love it.

00:36:00.038 --> 00:36:01.021
<v Speaker 2>You know, I know for me.

00:36:01.021 --> 00:36:09.253
<v Speaker 2>You know simple things walking the dog, reading books, listening to music, doing those sorts of things, hanging with the kids.

00:36:09.253 --> 00:36:19.876
<v Speaker 2>They're all things that improve my mental health, and if I don't do enough of it, I don't stay in that space, especially with the stress of running companies and leading people.

00:36:19.876 --> 00:36:22.570
<v Speaker 2>Ross Zabler, thank you so much for your time today.

00:36:22.570 --> 00:36:23.813
<v Speaker 2>I appreciate everything you do.

00:36:23.813 --> 00:36:25.878
<v Speaker 2>You're on the Big Success Podcast.

00:36:25.878 --> 00:36:31.619
<v Speaker 2>Follow, like, listen, subscribe, check out everything at Ross's that you can Keep learning.

00:36:31.619 --> 00:36:34.012
<v Speaker 2>Mental health is not an issue.

00:36:34.012 --> 00:36:38.677
<v Speaker 2>It's something that we need to keep and keep working on, for ourselves and for others.

00:36:38.677 --> 00:36:40.041
<v Speaker 2>We'll see you next week.

00:36:41.505 --> 00:36:47.159
<v Speaker 3>You've been listening to the Big Success Podcast with the number one business coach in the world, Brad Sugars.

00:36:47.159 --> 00:36:56.679
<v Speaker 3>To learn more about how to achieve business and personal success, as well as how to level up or listen to past episodes, visit wwwbradsugarscom.