Episode 100 - Cypher

[SPEAKER_02]: Welcome to the Forty K-Lorecast.
[SPEAKER_02]: Welcome to Forty-K-Lorecast with me, John Barsadian, Bradshaw.
[SPEAKER_02]: On today's cast, we're going to be covering the most famous, the Dark Angels.
[SPEAKER_02]: Sorry, Samuel.
[SPEAKER_02]: Cypher?
[SPEAKER_02]: We're going to start off with a little bit of coverage of the fallen and the origins of them, and then we're going to dive pretty heavily into Cypher, who he is, how he functions the galaxy, and whether or not he belongs in the chaos code.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I am so proud of you that only took us like eighteen takes to get eight seconds into the cast.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, that's pretty much the norm.
[SPEAKER_02]: Welcome.
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's usually, for this time, it wasn't me.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yay.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: Also, welcome to the hundredth cast, everybody.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's how much we've learned.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yes, there is nothing.
[SPEAKER_02]: I've learned nothing.
[SPEAKER_02]: I refuse to learn.
[SPEAKER_02]: No.
[SPEAKER_02]: All right.
[SPEAKER_02]: For those who don't know the Forty K. Lord Cast, the weekly show in the Laura Fort Hammer Forty K. Universe, releasing every Monday at seven p.m.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And we're actually, I found out, recently, the top zero point one percent of podcasts, which is more of a knock on all the other podcasts than the benefit on us, but being honest.
[SPEAKER_02]: Let it go.
[SPEAKER_02]: What are you?
[SPEAKER_02]: What are you all doing wrong?
[SPEAKER_02]: That worth doing this well.
[SPEAKER_02]: Anyway, if you do like the cast, we hear more up Brad and I click the link to our YouTube page, the Forty K. Lord cast, there you'll find old versions of the show converted with imagery, our live Q&A sessions, our other shows, the history of Forty K with Brad and myself and two old men of their handler with Brad and what Brad's one of the two old men.
[SPEAKER_02]: And then there's a hand.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm so old.
[SPEAKER_00]: And a man.
[SPEAKER_00]: So yes, it's accurate.
[SPEAKER_02]: You are old.
[SPEAKER_02]: Let's do a game.
[SPEAKER_02]: How many colonoscopies is Brad had in his life?
[SPEAKER_00]: I wish it was less than the Molly Tasman.
[SPEAKER_02]: There it is.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: I can release count them on one hand.
[SPEAKER_00]: How about that?
[SPEAKER_02]: That's true.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm just pointing out.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's how old men check each other.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's not a matter of you have gray hair.
[SPEAKER_02]: That was implied.
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[SPEAKER_02]: because good God, you people do meet well, and those who don't know Uruguay has more cows than people by a ratio of four to one, and every one of those cows is oh, so delicious.
[SPEAKER_02]: Unless you're a vegan, in which case ignore everything, I just said, and you probably aren't living in Uruguay.
[SPEAKER_02]: Or if you are.
[SPEAKER_00]: I was saying, we don't have a huge listener based in Uruguay, but there's not that many people in Uruguay.
[SPEAKER_02]: There's no, if we got thirty listeners in Uruguay, more than half of them would, could likely be cows.
[SPEAKER_02]: That is their population.
[SPEAKER_00]: I like to think to myself that we could send them some Forty-Key-Lorecast merch and put it on the cows.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, I'm going to make that happen.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, so basically, what we're discovering here is that if we do have a listener in Uruguay and you really want to just have a blow up, Brad and I'll do a lot of these things.
[SPEAKER_02]: Just fun for us.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, Brad also kind of speak Spanish.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's, that is awesome.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's a good description.
[SPEAKER_02]: You speak Spanish, but not enough to, enough to get you out of trouble, but not enough to do something of wrong series.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I got your bookie.
[SPEAKER_02]: Lastly, yeah, exactly.
[SPEAKER_02]: Lastly, we have a link in our show as to our Discord page for those who really would like the show.
[SPEAKER_02]: I want to just get more interaction, more for EK, join a Discord.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's completely free because all Discord should be.
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[SPEAKER_02]: It's a wonderful community we've built in there.
[SPEAKER_02]: I couldn't be more proud of it.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm in there a lot, Brad's in there a lot.
[SPEAKER_02]: Great place to ask us questions.
[SPEAKER_02]: But with that, onto the Dark Angels.
[SPEAKER_02]: So,
[SPEAKER_02]: But before we dive to heavily into Cypher, we need to do a quick recap on the origins of the dark angels with more of a focus on Calaban.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm also going to bitch about Luther again.
[SPEAKER_00]: Because there are traditions.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not letting go.
[SPEAKER_00]: As soon as we said, we were going to talk a little about Calaban.
[SPEAKER_00]: I said, you know, we're not going to do.
[SPEAKER_00]: We're going to talk a little bit about Calaban.
[SPEAKER_00]: And we're going to talk a lot about how much John hates Luther.
[SPEAKER_02]: I hate Luther.
[SPEAKER_02]: Not the way you hate the lords of terror.
[SPEAKER_02]: I hate Luther because there's makes no sense.
[SPEAKER_02]: And we'll get there in a minute, everybody.
[SPEAKER_02]: If you didn't listen to this cast, hold on.
[SPEAKER_02]: I got a big buzz.
[SPEAKER_00]: But you hate Luther as much as I hate Luther as a terror.
[SPEAKER_00]: If Luther was inside a crisis soon.
[SPEAKER_00]: It doesn't matter.
[SPEAKER_02]: My issue with Luther was when Luther and my, no, we'll get there.
[SPEAKER_02]: We'll get there.
[SPEAKER_02]: So let's start off with real quick.
[SPEAKER_02]: The dark angels like every legion were made it up entirely of Terran born space marines.
[SPEAKER_02]: At this point, they were known as the first legion, but they were infused with the gene seed of the primarclinal Johnson, whose superpower was basically being stoic grumpy and honory.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, Lions got some pretty badass superpowers.
[SPEAKER_00]: We'll hit them later because he's gotten a glow up in his primar powers.
[SPEAKER_00]: They've added on extensively forest walk is legit.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm trying to figure out who had less Medula on Blangada.
[SPEAKER_02]: Was it Lion?
[SPEAKER_02]: Was it?
[SPEAKER_02]: I was a reference for it.
[SPEAKER_02]: Mama said.
[SPEAKER_02]: Mama said.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's good they got on them teeth.
[SPEAKER_02]: They can't brush them.
[SPEAKER_02]: And movies still really good by the way.
[SPEAKER_02]: But the reason for this cast is nothing to do with the original Legion.
[SPEAKER_02]: But the fact that Lion was found on a planet called Caliban.
[SPEAKER_02]: And as we talked before, the chaos gods took all of the primarks when they were in the gestation tubes and sent them all around the galaxy and attempt to tempt them to chaos.
[SPEAKER_02]: And Lion landed on what's called a death world, which was cowardly.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, it's look both back then, I'm just a sminch on that.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know we see death worlds, but this is like,
[SPEAKER_00]: the best of the death world.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is a forest.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, it's end-door, but with monster.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's end-door.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's good.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's not the best.
[SPEAKER_02]: You think the best of the death world?
[SPEAKER_02]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_02]: I stand by what I just said.
[SPEAKER_02]: Fine.
[SPEAKER_02]: We're doing a bonus cast.
[SPEAKER_02]: We'll rank death worlds.
[SPEAKER_00]: A bunch of the death worlds.
[SPEAKER_00]: You can't even breathe.
[SPEAKER_00]: They're death worlds.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is a death world that's beautiful.
[SPEAKER_00]: It just happens to have some monsters.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, when I say some monsters, I mean, cast beats that would kill you.
[SPEAKER_02]: you have played entirely too much Final Fantasy, because you're like, oh yeah, fighting in the forest is fun.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's the only time you want to fight monsters in the forest is Final Fantasy, because you get more experience in the thousands of years.
[SPEAKER_00]: You also get bonus.
[SPEAKER_00]: You get mogulista.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: Exactly.
[SPEAKER_02]: So back to this, the people on Calaban led the really brutal existence.
[SPEAKER_02]: So they lived in these settlements that dotted the forest at landscape.
[SPEAKER_02]: And all their cities were walled to protect them, but like any feudal castle, food and supplies had to be gathered outside of the walls and brought in.
[SPEAKER_02]: And even like clearing the forest, this wasn't we talked about the forest being full of monsters.
[SPEAKER_02]: It wasn't like the some of sci-fi monsters where they live in the shadows.
[SPEAKER_00]: No, these things came out of the forest and came and slaughtered all of the peasants that are attending to the land and doing stuff.
[SPEAKER_00]: think that they probably should have taught them to fight just a little bit better because in everything that they talk about calabanans, hey, we protect the peasants.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're like, yeah, after a bunch of them get killed, then you do a, and you track into the forest and kill a token monster and come back.
[SPEAKER_02]: Let me help you out.
[SPEAKER_02]: They don't protect the peasants.
[SPEAKER_02]: They avenge them.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's it.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's not the only more.
[SPEAKER_02]: There is no crime prevention occurring here.
[SPEAKER_02]: It just crimes solving.
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: Those hundred peasants all got slaughtered.
[SPEAKER_02]: Cool.
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, don't worry, guys.
[SPEAKER_02]: I wrote my horse into the forest and killed a thing that did it.
[SPEAKER_02]: Or yeah, but they're all still.
[SPEAKER_00]: Or at least something that looks like the thing they killed you.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, exactly.
[SPEAKER_02]: This is useless.
[SPEAKER_02]: Calaband develops into kind of a feudal type set up, not as I complained about the nightcast, not the real feudal set up, but the one of a King Arthur.
[SPEAKER_02]: And the noble houses aren't that different in Calaband from the Imperial Knights.
[SPEAKER_02]: We covered in episodes, eighty one, eighty two.
[SPEAKER_02]: These guys will be with Joe Biden.
[SPEAKER_02]: They took it up upon themselves to protect the citizenry and it honestly is closest to what the orc Gretchen had where the orcs are the powerhouse and the Gretchen that you will always say for the orcs Gretchen run orc society.
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's be honest.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, Carl marks what he grew with me here.
[SPEAKER_02]: The peasants.
[SPEAKER_02]: Nobles weren't making food.
[SPEAKER_02]: Throw that one out there for you, man.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's cool.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, you've got a horse and power arm.
[SPEAKER_02]: You go to the fox.
[SPEAKER_02]: Stop when you're hungry.
[SPEAKER_00]: Stop rooting romanticized versions of history and lore.
[SPEAKER_00]: And let's talk about the order.
[SPEAKER_00]: Great, yeah, noble.
[SPEAKER_00]: Protect yourself is the populace.
[SPEAKER_02]: No, and I'm gonna crap talk to Dark Angels because this is fun now.
[SPEAKER_02]: The whole purpose, no, the whole purpose of this, it's a feudal society where the nobles protect the citizenry and they get together and they rise up.
[SPEAKER_02]: Cool, who are the best protectors of the citizenry?
[SPEAKER_02]: This group called the order that are not made up of nobles.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's made up of random volunteers.
[SPEAKER_02]: The order are awesome, by the way, guys.
[SPEAKER_02]: The order is awesome.
[SPEAKER_02]: The order is it's made up entirely of volunteers.
[SPEAKER_02]: You can volunteer from any socioeconomic class and join all you have to do to become part of the order is have a desire to slay the work beasts that are praying on the people of Caliban.
[SPEAKER_02]: It is awesome.
[SPEAKER_02]: My issue is a totally undermined the entire purpose of having nobles.
[SPEAKER_02]: But they do nothing for these guys, at least in the night world.
[SPEAKER_00]: Stop, they actually try to protect things before they happen because they stay outside of the walls.
[SPEAKER_02]: Because my whole point is in the nighthouses we talked about before in the imperial nighthouses, they actually did.
[SPEAKER_02]: The nobles would protect the citizen.
[SPEAKER_02]: They would run out there and they would keep them safe.
[SPEAKER_02]: And they were the best at it.
[SPEAKER_02]: In the case of Caliban, I guess they were doing it technically, but it felt a little bit more like some nepotism where I was dying a horse got to kill something that was already dead.
[SPEAKER_02]: Where is the order of the ones who are out there?
[SPEAKER_02]: Now we're going to go we're going to go to section of forest and kill everything in it.
[SPEAKER_02]: The order awesome.
[SPEAKER_02]: And over time, I become correct.
[SPEAKER_02]: The order basically take over Calabin.
[SPEAKER_02]: They build a city called.
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, I'll direct.
[SPEAKER_02]: We're going with Alderc, where they basically govern Calibut.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's pseudo-government because of the fact that they don't have official authority over anything.
[SPEAKER_00]: However, they're so popular with the peasants who are the majority of the people that live on Calibut, that they have sway.
[SPEAKER_00]: So if you don't do, or say more so, if you do something, that they disapprove of, it's not going to go so well for it.
[SPEAKER_02]: Exactly.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so this is the group that ends up finding Lyon, the Lyon when he lands on part of that.
[SPEAKER_02]: And they bring him in there.
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's talk about the fact.
[SPEAKER_00]: Lyon doesn't get found instantaneously.
[SPEAKER_00]: Settle down.
[SPEAKER_00]: God.
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's talk about a primar that whips him butt from day one.
[SPEAKER_00]: So the Lyons in the woods for what?
[SPEAKER_00]: I think it's ten years.
[SPEAKER_00]: And in that tiny killed beast innumerable.
[SPEAKER_02]: He gets the woman's turn for this bread.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's called Tarzan.
[SPEAKER_02]: They stole this from the Tarzan novel.
[SPEAKER_00]: He was awesome.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, they found it.
[SPEAKER_02]: He also had a big swing of the trees.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that's that point.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yes, they swing of the tree where Tarzan was holding the rope with a stick apparently because he was healthy.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, that's who they found.
[SPEAKER_00]: So anyway, let's give Lion, we're props for Lion as props.
[SPEAKER_00]: He was like murdering Wartbees from Day Zero.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yes, by the way, we're sharp with sticky sharpened.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, exactly.
[SPEAKER_02]: So anyway, we're trying to go fast if or but the order finds him, they bring him back in and the leader of the order is this guy named Luther and Luther decides
[SPEAKER_02]: He is just a dude.
[SPEAKER_02]: Sorry, this is going to happen to everybody.
[SPEAKER_02]: So Luther looks at the lion and goes this person's amazing because again, they're killing beasts in the forest solo and they decide to go on a buddy quest together to remove all of the beasts on Calabin.
[SPEAKER_02]: One of these two buddies is three meters tall and five hundred kilograms and a pseudo god.
[SPEAKER_02]: The other buddy is a dude named Luther.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I just, I hate this story so much, because Luther tries to claim that he did half the work here.
[SPEAKER_02]: And it is the last episode, if you want to listen to the sixteenth, seventeen, eighteen, I went into this hard.
[SPEAKER_02]: But basically, if you've never seen the movie Twins with Arnold Schwarzenegger and Danny DeVito, that is the size difference between Luther and the lion.
[SPEAKER_02]: When I think of Luther and the lion going out into the forest of fight, I think of it like when my six year old helps me do work around the house.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yes, he's got a tool belt on and he's using words and holding a light that he's mostly nowhere near where I'm working.
[SPEAKER_02]: and he's cute and I love him, but he's not really helping.
[SPEAKER_02]: And the best part of this is I think Luther knew the same thing because Luther really was the big fan of the lion once we got a bit further into the story.
[SPEAKER_00]: I love the end of this though, because at the end, they go through their cleansing, they're crushing the planet, they're killing everything.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a depressed with a holy grail, completely awesome.
[SPEAKER_00]: They come back and
[SPEAKER_00]: The lion is elected and I love it our notes.
[SPEAKER_00]: We have air quotes because they don't really elect the lion.
[SPEAKER_00]: The lion just goes, hey, I'm in charge.
[SPEAKER_00]: And doesn't actually, I don't even know if he announces it.
[SPEAKER_00]: He just is because also, he man, it's a primar.
[SPEAKER_00]: Of course he's in charge.
[SPEAKER_02]: They just killed like three million beasts and of that three million two hundred nine hundred nine nine thousand nine hundred ninety six were killed by the line and for the Luther League.
[SPEAKER_02]: I got this one.
[SPEAKER_02]: What's the guy from scaring movie the doofy officer doofy up to thank you very much.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm going so hard on the third day, but that's what we end up with.
[SPEAKER_02]: So they all come back and one of the planets like, so the God, we're going with the God lead us, right?
[SPEAKER_02]: Everyone's like, yeah, we're going with the God lead us.
[SPEAKER_02]: And then the Emperor shows up.
[SPEAKER_02]: After the Emperor shows up,
[SPEAKER_02]: Lyon says, hey, all my buddies get to be dark angels now, too, or first legion, including Luther.
[SPEAKER_02]: And Luther gets the up conversion.
[SPEAKER_02]: So the term I think we use a lot for, where we took at someone who's way too old to be a space marine.
[SPEAKER_02]: They made them a space marine anyway.
[SPEAKER_02]: And correct me, guys, and discord in the notes.
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't know of a single person who was converted to space marine when they were in quotes too old to become a space marine and did not fall to chaos.
[SPEAKER_00]: I have to look at this one now.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now I'm going to have to think about it.
[SPEAKER_02]: Because it's like core fair on, yeah, Luther, because it's all trader leagions.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's over and over again, trader leagions, where this dude exists.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think everybody's just one of them too, actually, for some random reason, not sure on their list though, but.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, anyway, Luther is super jealous of the line.
[SPEAKER_02]: And at one point, he actually, it's hard, it got red condibate.
[SPEAKER_02]: He either tried to get the lion killed, or would just super excited seeing lion about to get killed, but either way, the lion wasn't happy about it.
[SPEAKER_02]: And the lion did exactly what you do when someone betrays you.
[SPEAKER_02]: He took him and sent him back to his home world to run his entire world.
[SPEAKER_00]: No, no.
[SPEAKER_00]: The basis of where you get all your new Marines.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, genius.
[SPEAKER_02]: No.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I'm going to go out there and say, the lion might not be.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's a good thing, Gilman came back to leave the galaxy.
[SPEAKER_02]: He's what I'm getting.
[SPEAKER_02]: Because your Gilman wouldn't have done that.
[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, you're not wrong.
[SPEAKER_00]: However, if you need somebody's butt kit, the lion is
[SPEAKER_02]: The lion is brutal.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you're going somewhere to fight some guys, I'm probably going to call him first.
[SPEAKER_02]: What happens with blue through though is fairly interesting and very important for what about to get to.
[SPEAKER_02]: So Luther just hates the line at this point.
[SPEAKER_02]: And he ends up converting Calaband to the side of the traders and the Horace Heresy, not the side of chaos though, the side of the traders.
[SPEAKER_02]: This is a big difference.
[SPEAKER_02]: There are no chaos cults that I'm aware of.
[SPEAKER_02]: There's no chaos icon, but I cannot hear it.
[SPEAKER_00]: But remember that Luther is super juiced up, I can't see this point then.
[SPEAKER_00]: He is when Lord doesn't convert them.
[SPEAKER_00]: And also, he, well, he doesn't convert the fan.
[SPEAKER_00]: And also a bunch of the planet will get, we'll talk about this in a moment with the fallen, a bunch of the Dark Angels have absolutely no idea that there are no longer loyal to Lion.
[SPEAKER_02]: They are.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: They know that they're part of a rebellion or they're at least against the imperial, but they don't, there's no knowledge of chaos anywhere within them, which is very unique.
[SPEAKER_00]: But also, they were told the lion chose this also for most of them.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: They are on the side of the dark.
[SPEAKER_00]: The dark ages are fighting the good fight as far as they know.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's it.
[SPEAKER_02]: Right about this time, though, Calaband gets consumed by a warp storm and cut off from the galaxy.
[SPEAKER_02]: Remember, Calaband is right outside the eye of terror.
[SPEAKER_02]: So like, it not surprised they get eaten by a warp storm.
[SPEAKER_02]: Horace Heresy concludes in the warp storm and Calaband subsides.
[SPEAKER_02]: At this point, the lion is Legion rushed there to check on their people.
[SPEAKER_02]: Because again, this is their home planet, as soon as they arrive in orbit, they get fired upon.
[SPEAKER_02]: And lion takes that really well.
[SPEAKER_02]: And by taking it really well, he bombards the planet so heavily from orbit that he actually breaks the planet into pieces.
[SPEAKER_02]: And then as it breaks a piece into pieces, he teleports down there to go in single handedly deal with the traders.
[SPEAKER_02]: And ends up taking a ten thousand year nap.
[SPEAKER_02]: He got soft for a little bit.
[SPEAKER_02]: He did.
[SPEAKER_02]: The planet breaks apart and then the dark angels save a small piece of it, shove them on it there.
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel that you say they saw, they save a small piece of it.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a pretty big piece and they know it's not rockets to it.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_02]: Warp engines.
[SPEAKER_02]: Number one, number two.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's compared to a planet.
[SPEAKER_02]: If the Earth broke apart and you save New Zealand,
[SPEAKER_02]: All right, it's New Zealand big.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, but not compared to Earth.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, if I'm driving around with a piece of the planet, it deserves to be called a big piece, damn it.
[SPEAKER_02]: They call it the rock.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, because it's awesome.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, and but neither you nor I, there's no way you or I read that for the first time without a Scottish accent.
[SPEAKER_02]: Of course.
[SPEAKER_02]: I know our age.
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't know why I can wear this.
[SPEAKER_02]: But an important piece here is as the planet was breaking apart and all of the dark angels who were on the side of Luther disappeared.
[SPEAKER_02]: and they disappeared because the chaos gods worked them all away and the same method that they'd done the primarks scattering them all around the house.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's be a hundred percent accurate though.
[SPEAKER_00]: It wasn't just chaos.
[SPEAKER_00]: They scattered all of the fall in.
[SPEAKER_00]: the people that were, a lot of them were not worshiping or an even knowledge of cans at this very good point.
[SPEAKER_02]: These are not hit members of chaos.
[SPEAKER_02]: They just took anyone who was on this on the Dark Angels team Luther.
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, it's is a twilight where they had those team Jacob.
[SPEAKER_00]: But they also get sent to wildly different places in the galaxy.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think the people that were already falling to chaos gets drawn in the war and a lot of the others get sent all over the place because one of the things the cascads didn't want to do is they didn't want to have the dark angels getting back together and being a forced stop horse.
[SPEAKER_02]: And this leads the formation of what's called the inner circle.
[SPEAKER_02]: The dark angels have a huge problem.
[SPEAKER_02]: They are now a loyalist and a traitor, Legion, which in the eyes of the Imperium is a traitor.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're like, but we're half in half.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, you're just straight.
[SPEAKER_02]: The Imperium rounds up into traitor.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like I said, that's how their math works.
[SPEAKER_02]: The good news for the dark angels is that no one knows what happened on Calaban except the dark angels that were there and the traitors who escaped.
[SPEAKER_02]: now known forever forward as the fallen and the dark angels by the way, become the unforgiving.
[SPEAKER_02]: These are two terms that they use internally.
[SPEAKER_02]: Now luckily, the dark angels can keep a secret better than really anybody.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, a thousand percent.
[SPEAKER_00]: They've already been and so back up though, they have been doing it because they were the ones and they got the jobs that no one was allowed to know about.
[SPEAKER_00]: So they're in turnally in the Legion doing this already.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's just what they do.
[SPEAKER_02]: Exactly.
[SPEAKER_02]: But they decide that no one else is going to know of the heresy within their Legion.
[SPEAKER_02]: So first thing that Dark Angels do is they create what's called the inner circle.
[SPEAKER_02]: And it's what it says in the tent.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's an inner circle of Dark Angels who are privy to all the details of what happened on Calaban.
[SPEAKER_00]: And this is important because this is actually, there are minority, well, there are minority of the dark angels, but are they not anymore, though, there's the inner circle and the inner slightly bigger circle and the concentric circle and the weird circle and the years and a lot of circles.
[SPEAKER_02]: In the earlier code axis, it was like all the inner circle was like six Dugos.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, and now you're like, it's half the Legion.
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, and members of the inner circle serve in the death watch and come back.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's one of those ones where you're like, all right.
[SPEAKER_02]: This isn't that inner guys.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's it again, fifty percent.
[SPEAKER_02]: The inner circle realized that as long as they're former brothers, the fallen are alive, there's a chance their secret will be discovered.
[SPEAKER_02]: So they decide, we're going to do what all dark angels are doing in the situation.
[SPEAKER_02]: Kill things.
[SPEAKER_02]: So they just go out into the galaxy to hunt down and kill anyone who is at best to put down.
[SPEAKER_00]: I have a question for you, John, in Forty K, as anyone caused more collateral damage than dark angels hunting down the fallen.
[SPEAKER_02]: But the pens, if you care about collateral damage, otherwise, the world leaders have caused more collateral, which is what I'm getting.
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel that when you're not supposed to say world leaders, we're doing damage, because that's what they're doing.
[SPEAKER_02]: Ooh, I'll give you a better question.
[SPEAKER_02]: Who's done more collateral damage?
[SPEAKER_02]: The dark angels are the granites.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's also, granites also, granites also paint with a big big brush.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it's like, there's a demon here.
[SPEAKER_02]: You just blow up a planet in a different system.
[SPEAKER_02]: There was a demon over here though.
[SPEAKER_02]: So, you know, oops.
[SPEAKER_02]: Anyway, the dark angels start rushing around the galaxy, pointing down any dark angels.
[SPEAKER_02]: And the concern that they have to be careful of though is that if the inquisition sees them do this,
[SPEAKER_02]: They'll pick up one hay something's going on.
[SPEAKER_02]: So they devise a pretty clever strategy.
[SPEAKER_02]: The dark angels carry on as that nothing happened and they just keep it volunteering to always go wherever the lords of terror are saying, hey, we have an issue here.
[SPEAKER_02]: And they do this because what they do is when they deploy to an area, they then run scans in the wider area.
[SPEAKER_02]: Because apparently the dark angels' librarians can sense just a hint of dark angel gene seed.
[SPEAKER_02]: And this allows them, and this guy cool, to while doing one mission actually do their mission on the side.
[SPEAKER_02]: But then when they're spread around the galaxy, no one's heard.
[SPEAKER_00]: I love this stuff because this was really big in
[SPEAKER_00]: early Laura for decay and it also was part of the game because it's reasons that you had these small a lot of times you they had almost kill teams going down.
[SPEAKER_00]: So there's a big battle and then all of a sudden Tim, Teddy, Ronnie Bobby, Ricky, Mike all went somewhere else and you're like, what's going on there?
[SPEAKER_00]: You're like, don't worry about it.
[SPEAKER_00]: They'll be doing a thing and they used to do a lot more of this in the game.
[SPEAKER_00]: I actually used to really like this.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, Dark Angels have any better.
[SPEAKER_02]: I've had more fun in prior editions.
[SPEAKER_02]: I also put out they also murder anyone who tries to visit Calaban, which makes me laugh because I'm convinced there's some merchant who gets every few years, someone gets the take these goods to Calaban, RIT, and it but no one's ever survived this.
[SPEAKER_02]: Maybe you will, and they get murdered by the Dark Angels.
[SPEAKER_02]: Basically, what I view when you try to get to Calaban, you just, your ship gets boarded, you all get slaughtered, and they take all the goods and they wait for the next one to come that way.
[SPEAKER_00]: Thanks for the free stuff, you?
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: All right, but let's get into Cypher now.
[SPEAKER_02]: So, five, eighty of m-thirty one.
[SPEAKER_02]: This is thirty four years after the end of the war of the beast.
[SPEAKER_02]: There is a dark angel fleet hunting down Remnant Works, because as we said in the War of the Beast cast, the Beast is dead, but there's still quite billions of orcs throughout the sectors, and given enough time and of violence, anyone of the war bosses leading these could become another beast.
[SPEAKER_02]: So Imperial forces are just actively pruning orcs everywhere they can find them.
[SPEAKER_02]: Once in the system, the dark angels are merely scanning for events, the fallen, and they get notified of something that's perfect for them.
[SPEAKER_02]: You've got a planetary rebellion on a nearby planet.
[SPEAKER_02]: But it's different than a normal one.
[SPEAKER_02]: The rebellion is over mining rights who gives a crap.
[SPEAKER_02]: But even though the planet is in rebellion, the imperial tides are beating met.
[SPEAKER_02]: And Brad, what happens when you meet your imperial tides?
[SPEAKER_00]: Nobody messes with you.
[SPEAKER_00]: Nobody cares.
[SPEAKER_02]: Exactly.
[SPEAKER_02]: So you've got a full revolt
[SPEAKER_02]: but ties with being met.
[SPEAKER_02]: So the impairment of the conflict, which brings up the radar of Dark and A. This is something's off here.
[SPEAKER_00]: Something's really off.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's some warring factions down there.
[SPEAKER_00]: However, what are the factions?
[SPEAKER_00]: Is doing a lot better in hand to hand combat?
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, one of them has a superhero.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, one of them's got a full bunch of, and so they immediately detected it.
[SPEAKER_02]: Now, they do get two readouts when they scan this system.
[SPEAKER_02]: The first is a firm confirmation of fallen Gency.
[SPEAKER_02]: There's a fallen there.
[SPEAKER_02]: The second one is described, it's like a flicker.
[SPEAKER_02]: And it appears similar to one of Librarian scans and area as a bit of a warp storm, like a static feedback.
[SPEAKER_02]: They ignore this.
[SPEAKER_02]: This becomes very important later.
[SPEAKER_02]: In fact, because in these searches, they were kind of like, oh, yeah, there's every now and then we get an odd reading.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, that's one's actually really important.
[SPEAKER_02]: But what mattered is to them is that there's a fallen.
[SPEAKER_02]: His name is the maller, and he is just doing exactly that.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like I said before, the Dark Angels decide, hey, what do we do?
[SPEAKER_00]: Inner circle terminators are going to teleport us all down, murder this person and move on to life.
[SPEAKER_02]: What?
[SPEAKER_02]: Capture this person, murder anyone near the person.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: And then move on to life.
[SPEAKER_00]: How about it's more of a dead or alive warrant there.
[SPEAKER_00]: So what?
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: What happens though, interestingly is they teleport down and a bunch of the terminators take a bunch of
[SPEAKER_02]: fire from a with a pair of pistols, who shoots his way out and disappears.
[SPEAKER_02]: The Terminator's grab the maller and leave.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's not until they're basically out of the system that someone says, hey, how many first company Terminator's went down and how many came back up?
[SPEAKER_02]: And it was, yeah, why?
[SPEAKER_02]: Did a dude with two pistols just kill like six Terminators?
[SPEAKER_02]: That feels like a lot.
[SPEAKER_02]: And they began looking back and they go and check the tape.
[SPEAKER_02]: And yeah, these are a bunch of turns that killed by a guy with two pistols wearing a cloak, who moved that almost lightning speed.
[SPEAKER_02]: At which point the Dark Angels come to the realization that, oh, crap, we may have missed something.
[SPEAKER_02]: Oopsies, but they get back to the rock and they take the mall are there and they interrogate him.
[SPEAKER_02]: Not in a happy way.
[SPEAKER_02]: This is not, this is not law and order interrogation for those of you not in the US.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's a mediocre show that a lot of us watch too much of.
[SPEAKER_02]: Which lot of the eighteen of them there is?
[SPEAKER_02]: Are they original?
[SPEAKER_02]: We're not watching John Mulaney ruined as you.
[SPEAKER_02]: I was kidding.
[SPEAKER_02]: I was kidding.
[SPEAKER_02]: So you're telling me anyway, but as they're basically torturing Mueller to death, so they by the way, they torture him until he confesses all his sins and then they execute him.
[SPEAKER_02]: Mueller reveals the location of a number of other fallen throughout the sector.
[SPEAKER_02]: All that we're about to cover here is covered in one, it's a PDF.
[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, it was a book, but now it's a PDF.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's called Data Slate, Cypher, Lord of the Fallen, was released in two thousand thirteen.
[SPEAKER_02]: We don't reference the books enough, but a lot of what we're gonna do here comes out of that one document.
[SPEAKER_02]: So, go nuts, guys.
[SPEAKER_00]: Pretty good, read down.
[SPEAKER_02]: The dark, yeah, it's a very well written, actually, is Gaffthorp.
[SPEAKER_02]: So it is one of the, he's one of the better writers they've had.
[SPEAKER_02]: He did believe you job.
[SPEAKER_02]: Dark angels start pursuing these leads, and as they move through the system, each fallen that they find leads them to another one, and then to another one.
[SPEAKER_02]: And they discover over time that these fallen are not acting alone, but with the Alpha Legion.
[SPEAKER_02]: And they also start to learn about this mysterious figure known as Cypher.
[SPEAKER_02]: At first, they thought the guy who escaped was just a random dude.
[SPEAKER_02]: We'll go get him later.
[SPEAKER_02]: No, he might be the leader of the fallen.
[SPEAKER_02]: And that's just in this sector.
[SPEAKER_02]: All of the fallen.
[SPEAKER_00]: This was about a hundred percent true in the early days, though.
[SPEAKER_00]: Cypher was the leader.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_00]: Was leading air quotes certain amounts of the fallen.
[SPEAKER_02]: We're going to close this whole show at this episode out guys with Brad and I discussing where we who we think site for is what we think site for us and at some time on site for do the additions, but yeah, and the early additions, Cypher was chaos.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, because he would show up with Fallen.
[SPEAKER_00]: You can only take him with Fallen.
[SPEAKER_00]: He came with a squad of Fallen.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, now the issue with the dark angels is they can be a little OCD when it comes to a purpose.
[SPEAKER_02]: So yeah, they decide all in the wrong that Cypher has to die now, by the way, because they're actually quite afraid of them at this point, because if someone else gets them, then they'll see where we revealed.
[SPEAKER_02]: So the dark angels though, what's funny is this is all going on.
[SPEAKER_02]: Remember, they were supposed to be hunting down orcs.
[SPEAKER_02]: This is all occurring while under the guise of us hunting down works.
[SPEAKER_00]: They've been doing a terrible job of right now by the way.
[SPEAKER_02]: The opposite, they've done a great job of hunting down the orcs.
[SPEAKER_02]: The problem is the orcs are all gone now.
[SPEAKER_02]: This is the problem of the dark angels.
[SPEAKER_02]: The dark angels do a great job because they are trying to cover their tracks.
[SPEAKER_02]: But the lords of terrorists are to ask him like, hey,
[SPEAKER_02]: Didn't you kill out of the ocean?
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't have to say they didn't have any orcs and they didn't go kill the other orcs.
[SPEAKER_00]: Hence the reason they said they were doing a terrible job of killing orcs.
[SPEAKER_02]: Fair enough.
[SPEAKER_00]: They were supposed to be continuing on.
[SPEAKER_00]: The orcs were like, hey man, is that orcs right ahead of us?
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, we'll get to those other orcs soon.
[SPEAKER_02]: This hunt for cipher has gone on for a couple decades.
[SPEAKER_02]: And the lords of terrorism asking questions about, hey, you're active in systems that have no orcs in them.
[SPEAKER_02]: These are not where we assigned you, what's going on?
[SPEAKER_02]: And then, of course, what they say is, because the learns of terror don't think the dark canals are up in no good.
[SPEAKER_02]: They actually say, hey, do you need some assistance?
[SPEAKER_02]: You've been stuck there for a while.
[SPEAKER_02]: Do you want us to send some more support?
[SPEAKER_00]: Or just assume it's the Han Solo scene?
[SPEAKER_00]: Do you?
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, should be there.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, exactly.
[SPEAKER_02]: You're breaking up.
[SPEAKER_02]: I came in a crackle crackle hang up.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: And the dark angels can't risk the imperial forces, being sent out to an area that they know are the fallen.
[SPEAKER_02]: So they have to now really intensify their hunt for a cipher.
[SPEAKER_02]: And they come to a planet called brigia.
[SPEAKER_02]: And brigia is just classic scenario for them.
[SPEAKER_02]: planetary defense for us is run, but with a dark angle's realizes a fallen, safe results are there.
[SPEAKER_02]: So, brugia is not actually in revolt against the imperial.
[SPEAKER_02]: It would have done better for them if they had.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, because the dark angels decide to end Britia.
[SPEAKER_02]: They deploy everything.
[SPEAKER_02]: First company, second company, third, fourth, me, everyone deploys.
[SPEAKER_02]: And the battle is just raging.
[SPEAKER_02]: And this is, it's a cool part of the book, by the way, as they're circling in on cipher.
[SPEAKER_02]: all of us on the Alpha Legion up here at attack.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is where it gets to what is safer.
[SPEAKER_00]: Who is he for?
[SPEAKER_00]: What is going on?
[SPEAKER_00]: Because the Alpha Legion's there, they're not setting a trap for the Dark Angels.
[SPEAKER_00]: They're move along.
[SPEAKER_00]: These aren't the droids you're looking for.
[SPEAKER_00]: They're scheming and plotting to take over.
[SPEAKER_00]: They want to take over the sector actually.
[SPEAKER_00]: They want to bring down this entire place.
[SPEAKER_00]: And
[SPEAKER_00]: Cypher coming here, leading him, ends up being this huge brawl where the Dark Angels actually stopped what the Alpha Legion was doing and saved the sector from Alpha Legion and Chaos.
[SPEAKER_02]: And this is a sort of thing called a lot with Cypher, because the Alpha Legion had to attack the Dark Angels there, not because how high you fell into our trap, but a oh shit, you just, if you guys don't know Alpha Legion, we'll do a cast them.
[SPEAKER_02]: Basically, you shot someone who is Alpha Legion, and we're about to discover, oh crap, that's an Alpha Legion, and this whole thing blows up.
[SPEAKER_02]: And yeah, the Dark Angels in hunting down Cypher, who by the way escapes here, completely escapes.
[SPEAKER_02]: Because of Alpha Legion terminators,
[SPEAKER_02]: behind outside for they then save the sector.
[SPEAKER_02]: So this leads us to what becomes more of and some of this is more of a recent rep kind of as long as this is two thousand thirteen book up until then cipher.
[SPEAKER_02]: They'll sign up here, guys.
[SPEAKER_02]: Up until about twenty thirteen or so, Cypher appeared in Dark Angels Code X's.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's where he primed.
[SPEAKER_00]: No, he was in both.
[SPEAKER_00]: He was in chaos.
[SPEAKER_00]: The chaos booked and the Dark Angels.
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, yeah, you're right.
[SPEAKER_02]: He was.
[SPEAKER_02]: And the question was always, what is Cypher was this?
[SPEAKER_02]: And then in thirteen, we got this, it's not really a redcon, but it's more of a shift.
[SPEAKER_02]: So that's what his story is coming into.
[SPEAKER_02]: And the question that you end up asking yourself is Cypher good or is Cypher bad?
[SPEAKER_02]: He's not, you know, he's not on the side of the Imperium.
[SPEAKER_02]: But is he good or bad?
[SPEAKER_02]: And so we'll go through a little backstory on the name Cypher.
[SPEAKER_02]: We'll be right back after a quick break.
[SPEAKER_02]: On Calaban, we talked about the order.
[SPEAKER_02]: The term Cypher comes from that.
[SPEAKER_02]: The line was in this.
[SPEAKER_02]: One person of the order is elected to be what's called Lord Cypher.
[SPEAKER_02]: This individual went elected.
[SPEAKER_02]: They forsake their name, rank, and everything, and they were actually where it cloke.
[SPEAKER_02]: And to conceal the identity, and if you saw him, you're supposed to pretend you didn't know who he was.
[SPEAKER_02]: And if you've never seen the Serenet Live sketch of the Rock as Superman, go watch that because it doesn't work.
[SPEAKER_00]: God, that's fantastic.
[SPEAKER_00]: We're all like, yeah, that's just fun.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, hello, Clark, if he takes one of those superdubs that that don't really kill him.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, he's been using the cypher that when they give him that, he's supposed to be in charge of raining grongs.
[SPEAKER_02]: Perfect.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, he's in charge.
[SPEAKER_02]: The idea is that Cypher is more my opinion.
[SPEAKER_02]: Cypher in the Lord Cypher in the order is supposed to be the ultimate arbiter of rules and laws.
[SPEAKER_02]: His job is to uphold all the traditions and hold them to it.
[SPEAKER_02]: The idea is to prevent someone from bastardizing them.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's why I give it the right in the wrong.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's why I felt about it because he's in, he's supposed to be outside of everything.
[SPEAKER_00]: So he's never swayed by personal bias or relationship.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, he's supposed to be a Puritan is what he's supposed to be a Puritan of the order and the beacon for the rest of the order to work off of.
[SPEAKER_02]: I say that because this is why I think he's called Cypher, and we'll get into that second.
[SPEAKER_02]: So after the events of Ejia, the Dark Angels follow the trail of Cypher and he goes into the eye of terror.
[SPEAKER_02]: And the Dark Angels had in doing so, by the way, review all the records, and they realize that Cypher basically is cloaking himself against their searches.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like a blank, but whereas a blank doesn't appear invisible to all Cypher's,
[SPEAKER_02]: Cypher is hiding himself from dark angels librarian.
[SPEAKER_02]: And then they're able to follow that.
[SPEAKER_00]: But this is another one where you ask yourself, is Cypher good or bad?
[SPEAKER_00]: How much is he done good for the dark angels?
[SPEAKER_00]: Because he just lets himself be seen multiple times after this.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, for I think for a reason.
[SPEAKER_02]: So the next piece that goes into this is he goes into the eye of terror.
[SPEAKER_02]: And the dark angels go to pursue.
[SPEAKER_02]: As soon as the dark angels start going into the eye of terror,
[SPEAKER_02]: this massive warped storm begins.
[SPEAKER_02]: While it as it begins, Cypher starts sending transmissions to the Dark Angels saying, this is a trap.
[SPEAKER_02]: Get out of here.
[SPEAKER_02]: Do not pursue me.
[SPEAKER_02]: This is a trap.
[SPEAKER_02]: And eventually, the Dark Angels realize how bad the storm is getting, that they're about to get stuck in the warp.
[SPEAKER_02]: So the chapter master orders everyone out, not all them leave.
[SPEAKER_02]: He stays because one of the sub-chapters whose name I'm feeling, because the silver lions, I'm a soft-top man, I'm trying to recognize.
[SPEAKER_02]: They decide to say, so he goes down with them to go hunt down Cypher.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, but things don't go well, even with this retreat, because, yeah, warm.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, all the darkers who leave come out.
[SPEAKER_02]: They've been in the warp for about a year or so.
[SPEAKER_02]: They come out of the warp, discover it's been a thousand years.
[SPEAKER_02]: And in that thousand years of dark needles, remember, their chapter masters in there.
[SPEAKER_02]: In the last thousand years, Dark Angels have tried to enter the warp and have been unable to.
[SPEAKER_02]: So they come out and it's just, yeah, they tell a story.
[SPEAKER_02]: He went off on his own, we don't know where he is, blah, blah, blah, blah.
[SPEAKER_02]: Over times the warp sort of subside and the Dark Angels are in for a system.
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, they go, we should probably find our chapter master and the guys that went with them.
[SPEAKER_00]: And they go, we're gonna do a really great search on the planet that is no longer there.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's gone.
[SPEAKER_00]: is completely gone.
[SPEAKER_00]: Don't not just destroy anything.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's just gone and immediate.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, just not there.
[SPEAKER_00]: And immediately after that, though, Cypher's detected.
[SPEAKER_00]: I say detected.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think Cypher just lets himself be seen.
[SPEAKER_02]: He's he's chasing issues off of.
[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, let's call it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I'm just saying that
[SPEAKER_00]: The ciphers doing the Jason board where he looks into the camera.
[SPEAKER_02]: Stairs that.
[SPEAKER_02]: Exactly.
[SPEAKER_02]: But what's cool about this is he's on this planet.
[SPEAKER_02]: They, of course, be lying over there.
[SPEAKER_02]: And when they get there, the place they detected ciphers, he's standing in an old cathedral.
[SPEAKER_02]: And when they get into the cathedral, they discover that the sort of secrets and the lions help.
[SPEAKER_02]: The two most important relics of the dark angels that are worn by the chapter master are just sitting in this chapel.
[SPEAKER_00]: Those are the, the capital, everything relics of the Dark Angels.
[SPEAKER_00]: And they're just sitting on a table like, here you go.
[SPEAKER_00]: Thanks.
[SPEAKER_00]: Or from Amazon next day delivery.
[SPEAKER_00]: Go.
[SPEAKER_02]: Cypher then disappears for a few hundred years.
[SPEAKER_02]: no contact, whatever.
[SPEAKER_02]: The next big thing happens is an orc wall.
[SPEAKER_02]: And the darkings are fighting against the orcs against the wall, this mineral rich, partially galaxy.
[SPEAKER_02]: The war boss is named Zagax Dugrate, because orcs are awesome.
[SPEAKER_02]: Dogax liked the shiny helmet that was on the chapter master.
[SPEAKER_02]: And Killing.
[SPEAKER_00]: Hold, please, because this is an awesome thing, because again, you like to say freight going out like that.
[SPEAKER_00]: So,
[SPEAKER_00]: Zagax leans down to pick them up and someone takes great offense to that that someone being safer and shoots him about, I don't know, two to three million times and saves because he was riddled with all of them.
[SPEAKER_02]: He blasted him through the face of the Plaza Pistol a bunch of times and kills him.
[SPEAKER_02]: Cypher, then this by the way, this is a full conflict.
[SPEAKER_02]: The Dark Angels and the Orcs are fighting all of a sudden.
[SPEAKER_02]: Cypher then grabs the body of the fallen chapter master, drags it out.
[SPEAKER_02]: Make sure they see it.
[SPEAKER_02]: A loved Brad's comment of the Jason Bourne looking the camera.
[SPEAKER_02]: Looks the Dark Angels.
[SPEAKER_02]: They all be lying at him and he figuratively and literally smokey boats and just a bigger smoke bomb.
[SPEAKER_00]: Smoke bomb.
[SPEAKER_02]: And he disappears, but again, preserving the relics.
[SPEAKER_02]: We move again.
[SPEAKER_02]: Cypher is gone.
[SPEAKER_02]: And this time, even longer.
[SPEAKER_02]: This is about a hundred and seventy-five years past this time.
[SPEAKER_02]: And the dark angels discover a very weird problem.
[SPEAKER_02]: One of their recruiting worlds has fallen to rebellion.
[SPEAKER_02]: Never a good thing.
[SPEAKER_02]: By the way, but the rebellion is primarily in the noble class, like she almost exclusively in the noble classes who are taking some issue with imperial tides.
[SPEAKER_02]: Cypher has been there, they discover.
[SPEAKER_02]: But Cypher has been in the, the, the, the, the, the part of the world where the peasants live.
[SPEAKER_02]: And he's been training the peasants not to be rebels, but to make sure that when the Dark Angels do the recruitment, that more of the peasants are selected for Dark Angels recruitment.
[SPEAKER_00]: He actually keeps the Dark Angels gene seed pure by having actual Dark Angels that are going to be outerbound to Dark Angels become the Dark Angel.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then again, poof gone.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so this rebellion happens, the dark angels, because the truth is, when you're, if you have a recruiting where they go to a rebellion, a lot of them, you need to purge your legion of them because they're tends to be corruption there.
[SPEAKER_02]: Cypher by acting in this way prevented that corruption from affecting the dark angels legion.
[SPEAKER_02]: These are quick hitters.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's easier to do it this way.
[SPEAKER_02]: The next big chunk, two hundred and fifty.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, more years go by.
[SPEAKER_02]: And now we're in segmentum positions.
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, that was just the sound.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is on the other side of the galaxy.
[SPEAKER_02]: Another rebellion were a successionist or declaring an independence from the lords of terror.
[SPEAKER_02]: the dark angels are sent out there and they see telltale signals of fallen and cipher.
[SPEAKER_02]: And they chase him.
[SPEAKER_02]: They begin chasing cipher through the system.
[SPEAKER_02]: But as they chase him, each planet they get to, they discover the rebellion was being led by a member of the fallen.
[SPEAKER_02]: And they have to stop chasing cipher, kill this fallen off, and then they begin chasing him again.
[SPEAKER_00]: I haven't got a biggest thing yet.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm doing one.
[SPEAKER_00]: The biggest thing about this is each one of those fallen has taken a key position of power.
[SPEAKER_00]: So they have to stop and get rid of them because it's not just a fallen.
[SPEAKER_00]: And obviously they want to capture or kill.
[SPEAKER_00]: But this is also somebody that is a key members of parliament have been in front of.
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, in these guys, these fallen are often tough.
[SPEAKER_02]: They're not necessarily planetary governors, but they're going to be like key members.
[SPEAKER_02]: They're going to lead the planetary defense force or close to top the planetary defense force, all of this thing and they're influencing and that dark needles are just trying to kill site for they're going to plan it by planet.
[SPEAKER_02]: I connect to the dots and just keep killing all the fallen at the end of it.
[SPEAKER_02]: Cypher again disappears.
[SPEAKER_02]: but the rebellions also stopped because all of the people who are formatting the rebellion have now been killed.
[SPEAKER_02]: Again, the dark angels save us.
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's a huge deal on this because of the fact that this was a key logistics part and it would have actually possibly crippled the sector.
[SPEAKER_02]: Exactly.
[SPEAKER_02]: Now, about forty years after that though, Cypher takes a turn that's a bit more heretical.
[SPEAKER_02]: And the next one is what's called the red heresy in two ninety of m thirty six.
[SPEAKER_02]: So I want to point out, Cypher was on Caliban when it was destroyed in m thirty or m thirty one one of those two.
[SPEAKER_02]: So we're five thousand years still live.
[SPEAKER_02]: Or is he?
[SPEAKER_02]: We'll get there.
[SPEAKER_02]: In two ninety of M. thirty-six, this rebellion overtakes hundreds of worlds.
[SPEAKER_02]: Billions of workers declare the corpse emperor of false god and they declare a worship for the old gods.
[SPEAKER_02]: This leads to a twenty-year rebellion where the locals kill every member of the minister autumn, the ecclesiarchy, anyone else there.
[SPEAKER_02]: The silver skulls are deployed who are a ultramarine successor are deployed to deal with it.
[SPEAKER_02]: And as soon as they get there, get their butts up, just get right.
[SPEAKER_02]: They arrive just to wreck that.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, and they call back for support and the dark angels come in.
[SPEAKER_02]: The dark angels arrive.
[SPEAKER_02]: I will note a little bit oddly quickly.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like they call for support.
[SPEAKER_02]: They're like, oh, yeah, we're here.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's like, didn't you have to come through the warp?
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, we took a shortcut.
[SPEAKER_00]: Also, they're less than helpful.
[SPEAKER_00]: Kind of.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it's kind of fun.
[SPEAKER_02]: The dark needles arrive.
[SPEAKER_02]: This is where the stories hilarious.
[SPEAKER_02]: They arrive, save the silver skulls.
[SPEAKER_02]: So push the front line of the optician back.
[SPEAKER_02]: Silver cells got a beach head.
[SPEAKER_02]: And then just start like heading all over.
[SPEAKER_02]: Just wander away.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, just wander away.
[SPEAKER_02]: The silver skulls are still fighting over.
[SPEAKER_02]: And they're going to be like, hey, yeah, we'll be there.
[SPEAKER_02]: You go slow.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: As far as getting a good yelp review, the silver skulls are not giving one to the dark ages on this because they took
[SPEAKER_02]: wild casualties because they went you guys ready to charge and then they went guys guys guys yeah the dark angels they realized later the dark angels took a right turn and just chased one dude who they note was in power armor across the planet while the silver skulls got just they had a winning forgetting wrecked
[SPEAKER_02]: And the important part of this story is the silver skulls file a like a complaint against the dark angels with the lords of terror because that's also a thing.
[SPEAKER_02]: There is a complaint done with within the imperial HR and if you think I'm not going to record that, you're out of your mind.
[SPEAKER_02]: So next Cypher again escapes there as he always does, eight hundred years go by.
[SPEAKER_02]: And the next one's kind of funny.
[SPEAKER_02]: The dark candles actually don't discover sight for this time.
[SPEAKER_02]: They discover the actions of sight.
[SPEAKER_02]: There is a pirate smuggler fleet that gets big enough.
[SPEAKER_02]: The dark candles have to go destroy it.
[SPEAKER_02]: They do their usual thing of capturing all the leaders and then heavy air quotes here interrogating them.
[SPEAKER_02]: And while in Terry and they tell this story, and the story that they say is that, you know, we didn't really want to be doing this stuff we are caught doing, but this random dude showed up and called for parlay.
[SPEAKER_02]: We had to give him parlay.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not about the fact that there wasn't a lot of parlay.
[SPEAKER_00]: He said there was going to be so totally, and he was like, well, what actually I'm going to do is I'm going to challenge your leaders for control of the fleet and proceeded to individually duel them to death and said, yeah, I'm the captain now.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, and he takes over this entire pirate smuggler fleet takes him out to an area called the black gulfs and they raid all the mines there, steal a bunch of materials, and then he pieces out and leaves these guys to the dark angels.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like he said he basically knows that eventually the dark angels are going to get there.
[SPEAKER_00]: It just goes, what, by the way, they never say what the hell they were mining the stuff for because he just leaves.
[SPEAKER_00]: Hey, hope it works out for you with the dark angels.
[SPEAKER_00]: They're very considerate.
[SPEAKER_02]: One of my favorite ones though is next.
[SPEAKER_02]: So, fifteen hundred years past now.
[SPEAKER_02]: So we get to six, sixty, five of m, thirty, eight.
[SPEAKER_02]: Cypher pseudo appears again.
[SPEAKER_02]: He appears, but dark angels don't catch him.
[SPEAKER_02]: He senses somehow the inquisitions on his trail.
[SPEAKER_02]: So, Cypher, huts down.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is one of my favorites on this because he's being chased by the inquisition.
[SPEAKER_00]: He finds the guy that's trailing him, kills him, takes his place and then proceeds.
[SPEAKER_00]: He needs to scour the database of all of the information that they had collected on him
[SPEAKER_00]: As this guy, it's fantastic.
[SPEAKER_02]: And it gets better, because then he uses this guy's inquisitorial power to collapse a high world, concept this seven, which was actually part of an alpha-leagion plot to take over an entire sector.
[SPEAKER_02]: By the way, the alpha-leagion, not huge fans.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, there's not a lot of pro-safer guys on that.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's getting very few votes.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, and this is where a Cypher becomes a bit more interesting because he starts to appear more and more with the forces of chaos initially giving the outward appearance of being more alive because he is a fallen.
[SPEAKER_02]: But in truth, his allegiance doesn't seem to be the chaos.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's much more chaotic to say the least.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like for example, he leads a raid on a high-world named Voss Prime and Voss is one of the top
[SPEAKER_02]: Hi, world producers of high-end military goods in the galaxy.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is such a good.
[SPEAKER_00]: So he's basically leading the bank robbery with the Joker.
[SPEAKER_00]: So they go down with black Legion terminators.
[SPEAKER_00]: They break into the fall.
[SPEAKER_00]: They get the STCs, which were the entire reason they're there.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then the STCs don't actually get back to the black Legion.
[SPEAKER_00]: And you don't know where the STCs went because the terminators didn't get back to the black Legion.
[SPEAKER_00]: He was, he jumps into the bus and drives away.
[SPEAKER_00]: He said, yeah, yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: Cypher is seen throughout this whole era, like, converting with Trader Legions.
[SPEAKER_02]: But primarily, he's interacting with Fallen and building up his forces there.
[SPEAKER_02]: And this is a line's mark, you know, maybe six edition, fifth, six edition Dark Angels, where to Brad's point, he would lead the Fallen.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so he's built this massive section of the Fallen.
[SPEAKER_02]: But I want to do a bit more time on him hissing off Alpha Legion.
[SPEAKER_02]: Because it is really fun.
[SPEAKER_00]: The best part about this is we had to narrow this down because every time Alpha Legion shows up and it's safe for us anything to do with it, he's just giving a quick screw you to him.
[SPEAKER_00]: Which makes me shit is epic.
[SPEAKER_02]: It is epic.
[SPEAKER_02]: So, five, eight, ten of M, thirty-nine.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's a hundred worlds in the edge of the veiled region going to rebellion.
[SPEAKER_02]: This was an alpha legion plan that was planned over.
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, say, this is the law.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is the long con coming to fruition.
[SPEAKER_00]: Everything's going right for the alpha legion and safer may or may not decide to screw it up.
[SPEAKER_02]: Cypher just shows up on each of the hundred worlds in sequence to bring the dark angel every single one.
[SPEAKER_02]: So fantastic.
[SPEAKER_02]: And the Dark Angels keep arriving just as the chaos cultists are trying to get to the end of their ceremony.
[SPEAKER_02]: And the Dark Angels while looking for a cipher and look down and see the cultists go, oh yeah, blow them up.
[SPEAKER_02]: Blow them up and we can move on to the next world.
[SPEAKER_02]: The entire thing, the thousand year plan by Alpha Legion just goes up because off with a fizzle.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's like a firework you buy at like a grocery store.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's just I love that he's he goes to each planet and basically spray paints.
[SPEAKER_00]: Cypher is here and waits for them to get there and it goes to the next point.
[SPEAKER_02]: As we've gotten into what we call modern Forty K though, Cypher has become much more a hero, I think.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's like ancillary hero for the Imperium.
[SPEAKER_02]: And the first example I'll use is this plant's quote, I am a desk.
[SPEAKER_02]: So this is nine, seventy, six of M, forty one.
[SPEAKER_02]: This is effectively just about modern Forty K.
[SPEAKER_02]: The Dark Angels arrive, and this planet I'm a dance was under attack by chaos, and the Dark Angels are sent to save it.
[SPEAKER_02]: The Dark Angels arrive, there is one person left in the defense force who is held out against chaos.
[SPEAKER_02]: everyone else has died.
[SPEAKER_02]: So, Cypher was there with him and Cypher told him, he helps it, don't tell anyone I was here.
[SPEAKER_02]: So the dude says, okay, he has a promoted a bunch of times.
[SPEAKER_02]: And where this comes to fruition is hilarious.
[SPEAKER_02]: He's at what's described in the book as a social function with a dark angels company master.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I just want, what kind of social action is that?
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, there is nothing less enjoyable than spending with a dark angel.
[SPEAKER_02]: There's no party.
[SPEAKER_02]: I genuinely believe, yes, you don't want the world leaders at your party, but they might be fun.
[SPEAKER_02]: If I'm being honest, there is a zero percent chance of the dark angels being fun.
[SPEAKER_02]: The old shimmeryens I could see be like a countenance who get too drunk, it's kind of a wild party.
[SPEAKER_02]: The dark angels would just be boring in the corner, brooding.
[SPEAKER_02]: At this social function, this guy decides to tell people.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I love everything about setting this up because one, he wasn't there by himself.
[SPEAKER_00]: Where was he, who was he with?
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, the guy they've been trying to track out forever.
[SPEAKER_00]: He doesn't know this, but also, why would you tell the grimist, most textured guy that looks like he would the best part about this party would be killing someone, which ends up being him, because for some unknown reason, he tells them all about what Safer did and how he is fighting next to him the whole time.
[SPEAKER_00]: And the company master just decides that the kernels are heretic and shoots him in the face.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it was executed, right there.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, at the party, which you can why you don't invite dark angels to the party.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's the kind of that they're not fun fast forward a little bit and let's get on to to modern forty K nine nine five of them four once effectively just shy of modern forty K K D has not fallen yet, but we're that close to this.
[SPEAKER_02]: Mysterious Voice starts broadcasting all over the place, and is saying to the downtrodden workers and the laborers of the Imperium, to throw off their shackles and resist, key piece because this is not what the Emperor wanted for them.
[SPEAKER_02]: He's, instead, he's calling himself the voice of the Emperor.
[SPEAKER_02]: hundreds of worlds fault of rebellion, namely against him in a storm.
[SPEAKER_02]: The first thing that the loads of terror do about this is weirdly send to the assassins.
[SPEAKER_02]: And the official assassin, or go out after him, all of them die.
[SPEAKER_02]: One of them gets a little bit close and is able to report back that the voice of the emperor is a robed hooded figure in power armor with two pistols in a phase sword.
[SPEAKER_02]: The next group who encounter him with a black Templar, we cover this in our black Templar cast.
[SPEAKER_02]: Actually, sorry, not the black cut.
[SPEAKER_02]: We cover this in our crusade cast, where the black Templars were hunting down the voice of the emperor.
[SPEAKER_02]: And when they got to a planet that they were he was broadcasting from, they found the dark angels were also there.
[SPEAKER_02]: They also found a bunch of plants that had been exterminated from space, but side note.
[SPEAKER_02]: In the process of trying to grab that voice, the emperor, they did capture him and bring him back to their ship at which point the dark angels informed them that they would like the prisoners sent over to them and they informed them while powering up the weapons of their ship.
[SPEAKER_00]: They made a very courteous ask and while they were pointing huge volcano answers at them.
[SPEAKER_02]: What happens next is import, they do transfer the president over.
[SPEAKER_02]: It is cipher.
[SPEAKER_02]: That only to cipher escape, but both ships disappear.
[SPEAKER_02]: All of the black Templar ships disappear and the Dark Needle ships don't reappear.
[SPEAKER_02]: If I'm reading the novel correctly.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah, yeah, no, continue on with it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Just he gets away high-style.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, the cyberships.
[SPEAKER_02]: And the black templar, by the way, file another claim.
[SPEAKER_02]: So we have the silver skulls, the black templar, telling the Imperium, hey, there's so many of the dark angels.
[SPEAKER_02]: Now, let's get to the last piece of the cypher lore.
[SPEAKER_02]: This is the most recent bit of cypher lore, and I want to get to this so we can cover our last, the last part of our cast.
[SPEAKER_02]: Everything we said there was through about two thousand thirteen.
[SPEAKER_02]: In two thousand seventeen, we get the first big storyline progression that is you.
[SPEAKER_02]: This is almost twenty.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is gigantic.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's the first time they've actually pushed the storyline forward.
[SPEAKER_00]: in GW books because of the fact you were allowed to write anything before this time you could change things you could actually read count things but you weren't allowed to write anything beyond this point in time and this is when they started pushing the story forward it's also when the game started getting cool again because this is the beginning of eighth edition
[SPEAKER_02]: Yep, this is a very big move in the part of GW, a very good with part of GW.
[SPEAKER_02]: So Gilman is resurrected.
[SPEAKER_02]: He stabilizes McCregn and he decides he's going to have a chat with the emperor and he goes back to the end towards terror.
[SPEAKER_02]: While doing this, he gets stuck in his journey.
[SPEAKER_02]: He is, ooh, we're going with this word again, retinue, retinue.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, retinue.
[SPEAKER_00]: We're so close.
[SPEAKER_02]: I have no idea which one of this is his retinue.
[SPEAKER_02]: He and his retinue are trapped in the work by Cairo's fake lever.
[SPEAKER_02]: And they actually are captured by the red corsairs and placed in prison at the blackstone fortress.
[SPEAKER_02]: We're going to cover this in a future cast, guys.
[SPEAKER_02]: But anyway, what they're there, cipher some fallen angels and a shadow sear appear.
[SPEAKER_02]: And cipher makes an offer to kill him.
[SPEAKER_02]: And he says, I will free you and your friends on one condition.
[SPEAKER_02]: You take me back.
[SPEAKER_02]: to terror with you, and I get to speak to the Emperor.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think this is a giant turning point in how you look at Cypher, because when Cypher gives this option to Gilliman, Gilliman doesn't just, oh no, this is our only option.
[SPEAKER_00]: He actually eyes Cypher up and decides
[SPEAKER_00]: He should be able to, if the Emperor sees fit.
[SPEAKER_02]: Let's get to what happens then.
[SPEAKER_02]: But I'm going to debate this.
[SPEAKER_02]: So, Cypher helps Gilman escape.
[SPEAKER_02]: Cypher actually fights next to Gilman when they get to Luna and they're under attack by Magnus.
[SPEAKER_02]: They get all the way to Terra, at which point Gilman has Cypher arrested by the... You're not wrong, but the whole point in the book, he says he judges him when he sees him and stuff.
[SPEAKER_02]: But the part I want to get to is what happens next for Cypher, which is cool.
[SPEAKER_02]: So Cypher is now imprisoned in the Imperial Palace.
[SPEAKER_02]: And you know who finds out about this?
[SPEAKER_02]: The Dark Angels.
[SPEAKER_02]: And decide this is basically worst case scenario.
[SPEAKER_02]: Our secret is now like seven floors below the boards of terror.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, and they do this kind of, this is actually, I did like this book.
[SPEAKER_02]: I like the writing here.
[SPEAKER_02]: It sounds like crap on it.
[SPEAKER_02]: I like this writing.
[SPEAKER_02]: So the Dark Eagles have to sneak in there to go kill Cypher.
[SPEAKER_02]: And what they do is they have to just, they go in and they disable.
[SPEAKER_00]: They get the Cypher.
[SPEAKER_00]: They have to disable the cells, but in disabling the cells.
[SPEAKER_00]: Cypher steps.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, so that, yeah, they disabled the dark selling what they was called.
[SPEAKER_02]: That was holding Cypher.
[SPEAKER_02]: Cypher senses this with the, and then use it to, to escape.
[SPEAKER_00]: Also, you know, who's not super awesome with the fact that they just shut down a bunch of cells, the custodians.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, and so that's why I love it.
[SPEAKER_02]: So Cypher escapes and he's got two problems now.
[SPEAKER_02]: Problem one, the Dark Intel still one and dead.
[SPEAKER_02]: Problem two, now the custodes are also trying to cover for them because so Cypher is now a mistake for the Dark Angels.
[SPEAKER_02]: No one can know about the fallen and the custodes who is no one can ever escape from us.
[SPEAKER_00]: You forgot the third one.
[SPEAKER_00]: The Inquisition, who's not super excited that he acted like he was a member of the Inquisition.
[SPEAKER_02]: other stuff that went to you.
[SPEAKER_02]: Cypher Cypher and modern era, I think is the most wanted member of the galaxy who's not an official leader of.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm like a hundred percent.
[SPEAKER_02]: Or maybe it's.
[SPEAKER_02]: And that right there is where I actually want to jump into Cypher, more of Brad and I discussing a Cypher.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so where this is interesting to me is
[SPEAKER_02]: Cypher, the question that I've recently put is Cypher Chaos.
[SPEAKER_02]: We'll start that because he was for a long time.
[SPEAKER_02]: He had a Chaos data sheet and Ted edition, he still has a Chaos data sheet.
[SPEAKER_00]: But yes, it's always had a Dark Angel's data sheet.
[SPEAKER_00]: Also, he gets to talk to the Emperor.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's true.
[SPEAKER_02]: But the question is Cypher, a actual member of Chaos, or is Cypher something else?
[SPEAKER_02]: I think he's something else.
[SPEAKER_02]: Let me ask you a few questions here.
[SPEAKER_02]: Question number one.
[SPEAKER_02]: Is there more, is there one cipher or more than one cipher?
[SPEAKER_00]: That one, I don't know, I've heard this a lot and I'm debate on it quite a bit.
[SPEAKER_00]: My, the thing is, I think that cipher might be a weird type of perpetual or he continues on the work of because he actually acts like a nicely republic.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's, he's Reven.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I would say this kind of, I think there's three ways this goes.
[SPEAKER_02]: Way number one is cipher has been alive for eleven thousand years.
[SPEAKER_02]: way number two, cipher is dread pirate Roberts where there's been numerous ciphers and each of these ciphers.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's why probably guys in the Catholic explained the gaps between them and how much time there was.
[SPEAKER_02]: It was the point out that perhaps somebody we've had numerous ciphers popping through and they're very different fallen steps.
[SPEAKER_00]: Somebody takes up the mantle of the dread pirate Roberts or is it would be the mantle of cipher which also would explain his very erratic behavior.
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, the other one too is he is a warp being.
[SPEAKER_02]: Because the first one is he's, yeah, he's been alive this long, but the third one is he's actually, is a being of the warp that was formulated much like the watchers that are, I think the watchers of the dark are good nerdlings.
[SPEAKER_02]: He also in my mind could be at, this is what I probably lean mostly into.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think Cypher might actually be a warp entity.
[SPEAKER_02]: That has been manifested as a result of the fall of Calaban.
[SPEAKER_02]: You have all the emotion and then the order because that's the order were pretty closely aligned with the, all right, if we're at the, what are the good nerdlings called out for other than watching us in the dark.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, with with the watchers of the dark.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think it's possible that Cypher actually is that because he smoke bombs.
[SPEAKER_02]: He's Cypher just disappeared.
[SPEAKER_00]: He a hundred percent is a powerful Cycher, but it's one of the, is it?
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, that's what I'm saying.
[SPEAKER_00]: I want to set this up a little bit.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think he's a powerful Cycher in the fact that he's innately using powers of the warp like a warp entity.
[SPEAKER_00]: So it makes more sense.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's not an actual Cycher.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's just innately using the warp.
[SPEAKER_02]: Exactly.
[SPEAKER_02]: And that's where to me.
[SPEAKER_02]: And again, this is pure John Ferry, but that's where I see Cypher.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think of Cypher as being this actual being that is not a human, that is not even a space marine, but it manifests as one.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like we learn with the primarks.
[SPEAKER_02]: The primarks aren't actually heat their warp entities in case, and like a sausage, basically of humanity.
[SPEAKER_00]: You meant to say like a terminator, a T-way hundred.
[SPEAKER_00]: with a flesh covering.
[SPEAKER_00]: No.
[SPEAKER_02]: No.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's so much cooler than I get that way.
[SPEAKER_02]: I like sausage.
[SPEAKER_02]: I like warp sausage.
[SPEAKER_02]: All the primarcs are warp sausage.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's what they really are.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think they're more of an inside of it and then add a case.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know if you're warp entity thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know if how they feel about that.
[SPEAKER_00]: Because of the fact that for so long in the additions, third, fourth, fifth, he was this enigmatic
[SPEAKER_00]: is he good, is he bad, but he also has a data sheet in both codices?
[SPEAKER_00]: What is he doing?
[SPEAKER_00]: I always thought that he was leading the Imperium not to fall.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think that he wasn't for the Imperium, but he also wants the Imperium to be right.
[SPEAKER_02]: We love our D&D references.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think is he chaotic good?
[SPEAKER_00]: who who gets because he's associated with the fallen gets labeled as chaotic neutral probably and he won that's what I think he doesn't I think here I'll give you my full mode of what I think about side I think that safer actually believed in the fact that there was problems in how everything was going with the crusade I think is that you know how everything turned out
[SPEAKER_00]: And Buddy still believes in humanity, you know what I mean?
[SPEAKER_00]: That the fact that he wants the Imperium is humanity.
[SPEAKER_00]: So he wasn't want that to fall, but he doesn't believe that they're doing it right.
[SPEAKER_00]: So he's not want doesn't want to be part of the machine, but he also doesn't want the machine to fail because then humanity fails.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's too many threats against humanity.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, because when I was doing the research for the show, I used up those of these Lexicanum guys, no mystery there.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's a very great way for me to figure out, oh, yeah, what do I have to go reread?
[SPEAKER_02]: And in Lexicanum, they describe the cipher way I like a lot, where they say everywhere cipher goes destruction follows, but it's almost never by cipher.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's usually the dark angels showing up and doing it.
[SPEAKER_02]: And this is my point where I think he's chaotic good.
[SPEAKER_02]: He seems to be trying to either, that both help the Dark Angels and help the Imperium, not the Lords of Terra Imperium, but the Imperium itself quite frequently.
[SPEAKER_00]: The things that he does aren't really pro-imperium, they're anti-tons of humans getting killed.
[SPEAKER_00]: Every time he goes somewhere, he stops her billions.
[SPEAKER_00]: He stops the forces of chaos.
[SPEAKER_00]: He stops, I mean, he stops all kinds of all the folks.
[SPEAKER_02]: Unfortunately, the dark angels get involved, though.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's true.
[SPEAKER_02]: The collaterals brutal, but it seems like it almost feels like, or another young guy, but it's maybe he's kind of the guardian angel and a messed up way of the dark angels, where he's drawing them all around the galaxy to do good for the galaxy.
[SPEAKER_02]: Whether they want to or not.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I like, oh, they do not.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I like that quite a bit.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's forcing them in chasing him to do acts of good.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: I like that quite a bit.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's close on that one.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think we've reached consensus on Cypher.
[SPEAKER_02]: So next week we're going to, we've done now a bunch.
[SPEAKER_02]: We've done some Imperium.
[SPEAKER_02]: We've done some Trader.
[SPEAKER_02]: We've done Loyalist.
[SPEAKER_02]: We owes you know something.
[SPEAKER_02]: And again, I'm going back to some early casts where people said, tell us more about something.
[SPEAKER_02]: I said, I'm totally going to do that.
[SPEAKER_02]: And then a year and a half went by.
[SPEAKER_02]: So next week, we're going to go back to the Necrons.
[SPEAKER_02]: And we're going to focus on the silent king.
[SPEAKER_02]: His return to the galaxy, what that's done in changing the necrons, what's that done in changing the galaxy itself, some of the stories about him.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I'm going to find a way guys.
[SPEAKER_02]: I promise to wedge Trasian into this one.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're welcome, everyone.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, but this was Brad's idea.
[SPEAKER_02]: He was dead.
[SPEAKER_02]: He was dead right when he said it.
[SPEAKER_02]: He got in my head and I said to figure out how to do it.
[SPEAKER_02]: So yeah, so next week silent king could be one episode could be two.
[SPEAKER_02]: I haven't written a single word of it yet.
[SPEAKER_02]: So we're going to find out.
[SPEAKER_02]: I once at the end.
[SPEAKER_02]: But until then, this has been John Bar Saudi and Brad.
[SPEAKER_02]: See you guys next week.