Episode 82 - Cryptid Chat with Jon Cook

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<v Speaker 1>[inaudible]

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<v Speaker 2>And welcome back to another episode of the lunatics radio.

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<v Speaker 2>Our podcast today, I am not here with Alan COO, Dan, I think for the first time I am here though with John Cook of the[inaudible] podcast and we are super, super excited to have John talk to us today.

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<v Speaker 2>John is among many things, a local to, uh, the out John.

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<v Speaker 2>I dunno, you tell me how local you are, but a somewhat local to the point pleasant, uh, area that we covered extensively in the moth man episode.

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<v Speaker 2>And John's had some cool experiences and we just thought it would be great to have somebody on, you know, I felt, I felt like I was, we, we talked so much about point pleasant and I wanted to make sure we had somebody on who could represent that as somebody who's actually been there.

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<v Speaker 2>Right.

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<v Speaker 2>And has some experiences there.

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<v Speaker 2>So, John, welcome.

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<v Speaker 3>Thank you.

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<v Speaker 3>It's good to be here.

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<v Speaker 3>Thanks for having me on.

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<v Speaker 3>And like, and while I can't say that I'm a point pleasant native, um, I'm certainly adjacent to the culture and yeah, I've, I've been up there, um, the, the moth man and cryptid scene as a whole around here as a whole thing.

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<v Speaker 3>And, um, and so, yeah, I'm happy to be here.

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<v Speaker 3>I hope that I can provide some sort of additional perspective and depth to the whole thing, but yeah, it'll be,

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, it's always fun to have a conversation with you.

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<v Speaker 2>Anyway, John has been on the podcast before we did a big, deep dive into the history of fairytales.

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<v Speaker 2>Um, John's podcast, Frodo covers, folklore and fairytales, and it was a really natural pairing for us.

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<v Speaker 2>So a check out our episodes that, that overlap, but also go and check out Fidel, if you haven't already.

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<v Speaker 3>Thank you.

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<v Speaker 3>And we just, I'm happy to say, just wrapped up season two and a on like a three or four week hiatus here before I kicked back into it.

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<v Speaker 3>But yeah, it's, uh, it's been a lot of fun.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>How does it feel to have season two?

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<v Speaker 3>It's crazy.

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<v Speaker 3>Like when I started, I didn't expect it was going to be, um, I didn't really know, honestly, I wasn't like expecting anything, but now I, here I am and it's, um, been a year and a half and I've got 72 episodes total and yeah, it's been a lot of fun.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>That's awesome.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay.

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<v Speaker 2>So before we get into your personal experiences and you don't need to reveal too much personal information, but tell us a little bit about where you're from about your relationship with that part of the world.

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<v Speaker 2>That part of the world being point pleasant, Western

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<v Speaker 3>Point pleasant West Virginia.

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<v Speaker 3>Okay.

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<v Speaker 3>So, um, I am, I think I am an hour and a half or so away from point pleasant, which sounds like a long way if you're used to being able to go from point a to point B without much intrusion.

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<v Speaker 3>And, uh, but I, I say it a lot when we invented the phrase, you can't get there from here, down here and it doesn't really make, if you're, if you're from like a well-planned city, you know, you can go from here to there just about any way you want to.

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<v Speaker 3>But, uh, from here point pleasant is about an hour and a half, maybe hour and 45 minutes, but it is a straight up the Ohio river on old roads and, and things like that or over the Hills.

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<v Speaker 3>And so I I've been there a couple of times, uh, in my life as well as, uh, the neighboring West Virginia cities.

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<v Speaker 3>And, um, yeah, so I think the first time I ever went to point pleasant was, uh, back in the early two thousands, the, uh, the geocashing craze that, that caught on.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 3>And so a lot of people have heard of that now at the time it was fairly new, but, uh, we found, uh, we, we went geocashing up at point pleasant at the, uh, site of the old tea factory, uh, where some of the moth man sightings occurred.

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<v Speaker 3>And so we, uh, we, we probably were a bit, uh, rash in our cars.

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<v Speaker 3>We went at night, um, and it was difficult to navigate, but we, we didn't know at the time that there were still huge pits you could fall in and things of that nature.

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<v Speaker 3>But, uh, yeah, that's, that was my first time.

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<v Speaker 3>And I've been to the moth man museum.

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<v Speaker 3>I've never actually attended the festival, but there is an annual moth man festival that, uh, kind of embraces that whole thing.

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<v Speaker 2>You just piqued my interest.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm like a thousand things you just said.

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<v Speaker 2>So I w we talk a lot about the TNT area and about that factory building in the episode.

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<v Speaker 2>And so I definitely want to hear about what that was like to be there.

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<v Speaker 2>Um, and, and, but maybe we'll save kind of the spooky stuff for a little bit, but what is the museum like?

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<v Speaker 2>What is the vibe in point pleasant now around the moth man?

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<v Speaker 3>I think so in the, what I get from it is, and maybe it's just, you know, the people that I know in the circles that I, I run in, I don't think anyone truly would expect the moth man to show up in their backyard or anything like that.

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<v Speaker 3>But I think a lot of what the moth man is, is a sort of a cultural, sort of a touchstone it's kind of, um, it's kind of our pet cryptid like down, down in this area, it's, it's sort of the pet crypted.

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<v Speaker 3>There's, there's a lot of, and if you get into West Virginia cryptids, uh, to any degree, uh, you'll, you'll find that there are quite a few different things that have happened or allegedly happened, right.

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<v Speaker 3>Moth man being probably the most famous, but yeah, for me, like, I think folks use it as more of a mascot, uh, than anything else.

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<v Speaker 3>Um, but I I'm certain that there are people who would, who would tell you that, you know, there's, there's some truth to what occurred, whether or not it's actually a moth shaped man that, that, you know, but there were, there are people that, that know a lot more about it than I do that I think would say something.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, absolutely.

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, I think it's hard to like, look at just the sheer number and the gravity of the number of sightings, and to think that just everybody went crazy or everybody was making it up, you know, like there's definitely something going on.

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<v Speaker 3>My, my general take on unexplainable phenomenon in whatever occurrence in whatever form, whether or not it's an alien or whether or not it's a monster we've never seen in the woods.

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<v Speaker 3>There's some, it's something unexplainable until it's explained it's unexplainable.

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<v Speaker 3>And so whatever it was, it is something that we don't know.

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<v Speaker 3>And it's yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>Something Alan, I talked a little bit about in the episode, which I think is like perfectly aligned with what you're saying now and what your kind of take on it is.

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<v Speaker 2>And it actually comes up in the movie, the moth man prophecies as well, which I'm not sure if you've, if you've seen, but the there's a moment where one of the characters who's like an expert or like someone who's gone through what Richard Gere is going through, uh, says to him like Richard, Gere's like, why can't we just understand, like, why can't they just tell us what they are?

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<v Speaker 2>And he's like, well, have you ever explained to who you are to a cockroach?

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<v Speaker 2>And I think that's like, that idea, I think is kind of what, what got Allen on board a little bit, which is like, we, we have to acknowledge that probably something happened and we don't know what that is.

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<v Speaker 2>And we probably, maybe even can't comprehend it.

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<v Speaker 2>Right.

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<v Speaker 2>Like I can't explain the internet to my cat.

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<v Speaker 2>So like, you know, there's a way we can't, there might be something going on in this town, like experienced it for whatever reason, like the veil, so to speak of, of this dimension was whatever.

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<v Speaker 2>But there's no way for us, probably with our human brains to like, fully understand that thing.

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<v Speaker 3>I, I can, I can get on board with that.

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<v Speaker 3>I think, um, uh, you can go down a whole trail of dimensional talk like there's and there are, it's not, it's not quack science.

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<v Speaker 3>It's, it's, you know, there are theorists and very well decorated, you know, people speculating about the possibilities of that kind of thing.

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<v Speaker 3>But, um, yeah, explaining, explaining, I don't know how many times my friends and I, uh, and my wife and I, we we've gotten into, uh, discussions about the fourth dimension and the fifth dimension and things like that.

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<v Speaker 3>That dimensional talk is easy, an easy way to blow someone's mind, you know, if you, if you just jump into it, but it makes sense if you, if you really start with the second and third and you really sort of lay it out, it's, it's interesting.

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<v Speaker 3>And there's the, uh, the movie interstellar really delves into that a bit.

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<v Speaker 3>Like it's really cool, but yeah, I'm with I'm with you.

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<v Speaker 3>If we, if we try to measure something with the wrong tool, we get the wrong data and, and we can't go, assuming we have made all the tools necessary to measure nature.

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<v Speaker 3>And so it's, it's like trying to measure temperature with a scale.

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<v Speaker 3>We don't like, we don't, you can't get on a scale and say, there's, it's, there's just the wrong tool for the job.

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<v Speaker 3>And so I feel like maybe we just don't have the right tools to measure whatever, all of these things.

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<v Speaker 3>Yes.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>The way Alan described that was that if you have like a, a game boy that has Mario the game, Mario, right.

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<v Speaker 2>In a two D setting and all of a sudden a 3d snake goes through the game, you and I could visualize what a 3d snake looks like in Mario, but Mario can't to Mario, he's going to see pixels and fragments of that.

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<v Speaker 2>It's not going to make sense.

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<v Speaker 2>And I think that's like, uh, that was, that was very helpful.

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<v Speaker 2>I think, for me to understand too, because the dementia stuff is, is certainly outside of my wheelhouse, but fascinating.

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<v Speaker 2>Do you have, um, like any recommendations or for like pop culture, things like that.

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<v Speaker 2>If people are into kind of like learning more about pop culturally

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<v Speaker 3>Speaking.

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<v Speaker 3>So there's a, there's a novels written in the 18 hundreds called flat world, which is take, it takes place in a two dimensional world, uh, where you and the characters are all like in the 18 hundreds, it's one of the earliest kind of fantasy books.

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<v Speaker 3>Um, but it's out there, but yeah, flat world is something to check out.

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<v Speaker 3>There are also, uh, what, which which-which TV suit was a, probably a star Trek.

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<v Speaker 3>Um, I think it might've been either next generation anyway, Alan May know actually, uh, but there, there have been episodes that explored it might've been Voyager anyway, there, there were, there was an episode that explored moving through an area of two dimensional space.

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<v Speaker 3>You know, it sort of did the same thing.

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<v Speaker 3>It's like the idea that if, if, um, a, a three-dimensional being moves through a two-dimensional space, that two dimensional beings only see a single slice of that being right.

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<v Speaker 3>They can't see the full of it, you know?

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<v Speaker 3>And, but it's like when we, we look at a piece of, it's not a perfect, because it actually has a thickness, but we look at a piece of paper with a line on it, you know, and, and assume that that is a two dimensional thing.

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<v Speaker 3>And it has height that the two dimensional beings can see one plane of it, but we can see all around it.

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<v Speaker 3>And it extends out dimensionally after that.

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<v Speaker 3>And I'm not F I'm not a physicist.

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<v Speaker 3>Uh, but this is, this is just as I've come to understand it, being able to see those other dimensions, if they exist, we can't see them.

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<v Speaker 3>We can't perceive them as three dimensional beings.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>Right.

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<v Speaker 2>That's super interesting.

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<v Speaker 2>And yeah, it's, I don't know.

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<v Speaker 2>It makes it easier.

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<v Speaker 2>I think too, it's people want so badly to understand sometimes these like paranormal things that happened to them.

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<v Speaker 2>And there's a podcast that I really, really love called radio rental.

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<v Speaker 2>It's like a Lindsey pain podcast.

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<v Speaker 2>Lindsey pain is really like a true crime kind of guy.

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<v Speaker 2>He's got like lots of true crime podcasts, but he and Rainn Wilson actually from the office made this podcast called radio rental.

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<v Speaker 2>And it's, it's got lots of stories of like true crime things like narrow misses with serial killers, but there's a few kind of glitch in the matrix stories.

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<v Speaker 2>And they're like told by people that experienced them.

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<v Speaker 2>Those are the ones that really like get under my skin.

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<v Speaker 2>And I think that's why the moth man had such a heavy impact on me too, because it doesn't feel like your typical paranormal story or cryptid story.

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<v Speaker 2>There's something different and bigger going on.

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<v Speaker 2>And there's no way for us to understand, especially like however many years later, this happened in the 1960s, right?

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<v Speaker 2>Like there's no way we can ever go back and understand what it was, but it still it's like one of those big unsolved mysteries that our humanity wants us mentally to be able to solve.

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<v Speaker 2>But we just can't.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 3>What that made me think of is I occasionally go down the rabbit hole, one of my favorite stories, and many of them are super, this is all just, and it could just be stories.

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<v Speaker 3>Right.

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<v Speaker 3>But, but that's okay too.

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<v Speaker 3>But like the, I love time slip stories is so much fun.

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<v Speaker 3>Like the idea of like some guy's walking in France and suddenly he's in the 16 hundreds and there's like men in uniforms talking and yeah, there's, there's dozens of those time slip stories that I just get a kick out of and true or not.

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<v Speaker 3>They're just cool stories.

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<v Speaker 3>And who knows.

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<v Speaker 3>It's just, it's, it's kind of amazing though.

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<v Speaker 2>They're kind of fun.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>If you, uh, one of my favorite subreddits is glitch in the matrix.

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<v Speaker 2>And if you soar on the most popular, you get kind of, I think Reddit also is just a great place for good stories.

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<v Speaker 2>And a lot of cases like the creepy pastas are really good, but if you store on like best of all time, you get some really unsettling, like time, time slip stories, or the one from radio rental specifically was this guy went through this crazy breakup out of nowhere.

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<v Speaker 2>And then like a second later after his girlfriend left and stormed out, she was there and it was fine.

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<v Speaker 2>And she had no memory of it.

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<v Speaker 2>But the thing that's wild to me is that there's like security camera footage of it.

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<v Speaker 2>And so it's kind of those things.

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<v Speaker 2>And he's like, I was with her for five years.

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<v Speaker 2>I knew that this was my girlfriend and, but there's, and there's security camera footage.

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<v Speaker 2>And the woman who came in who was, you know, broke up with him, like had the key, had all the things.

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<v Speaker 2>And then a second later she was there a different clothes.

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<v Speaker 2>And so it's just like, you're like, whoa, like, how do I wrap my head around it?

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<v Speaker 2>You

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<v Speaker 3>Know, at time and dimension and like dimension and, you know, the, the infinite worlds and things like that.

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<v Speaker 3>Uh, speaking of pop culture, we've been, we've been watching through.

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<v Speaker 3>Um, have you ever seen sliders?

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<v Speaker 3>No.

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<v Speaker 3>Okay.

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<v Speaker 3>So sliders is a TV show that was on.

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<v Speaker 3>And, uh, I believe it was, I want to say 95 to 2000 or 2000 to 2005, anyway, a period of five years in that era, very dated, pretty, pretty hokey, pretty hokey, but, uh, it explores the infinite worlds thing.

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<v Speaker 3>Like, you know, they, they find a way to cross dimensions and they end up in these worlds that are the same place in the same time, but in a slightly different reality.

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<v Speaker 3>And it's, it's a load of fun to explore those things.

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<v Speaker 3>And like, you know, it, like I said, it's pretty hokey, but, but it's a lot, it's a load of fun.

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<v Speaker 3>It's like an it's entertaining anyway.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, for sure.

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<v Speaker 2>So also in this is, this is more time travel, but this show kind of stuck with me a lot growing up.

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<v Speaker 2>Um, did you ever watch quantities?

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<v Speaker 3>I watched every single episode of quantum leap as it aired when it was on the air first show they ever did that with love that

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<v Speaker 2>Show.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>I haven't, I would love to actually rewatch it now and I think Alan would like it, but yeah, I just, I loved it.

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<v Speaker 2>I loved quantum.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>Scott

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<v Speaker 3>Macula is one of the most underrated actors.

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<v Speaker 3>If you watch quantum leap, like he w he was everyone in every episode of that show is just so good.

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<v Speaker 2>Really great time.

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<v Speaker 2>Absolutely.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay.

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<v Speaker 2>So I'm glad we're super aligned here on the, the, uh, the, our take on moth man and, uh, dimensionality that being said, I want to definitely talk a little bit more about, uh, your proximity to it.

00:15:28.801 --> 00:15:40.490
<v Speaker 2>So tell us, what is the museum like, like when you go through, is it sort of like a, you know, hokey like small town thing, or is it are people that are still kind of invested in it in some way?

00:15:41.320 --> 00:15:41.320
<v Speaker 2>Uh,

00:15:41.379 --> 00:15:50.769
<v Speaker 3>To be honest, I don't have a huge, I don't have my finger on the pulse of it real close, but like when I went through it's, it is, there's a lot of information just about the facts and about the speculation.

00:15:51.370 --> 00:15:56.860
<v Speaker 3>It is, it is very much a small town kind of a chintzy museum, but it's among the best of those.

00:15:56.860 --> 00:15:57.370
<v Speaker 3>You know what I mean?

00:15:57.370 --> 00:16:06.789
<v Speaker 3>Like you can drive across America and find those, those little places everywhere, but no, the moth man thing is, you know, there's merchandise, there's lots of little facts and things.

00:16:07.029 --> 00:16:11.379
<v Speaker 3>Uh, the, the big draw is the statue, which is right outside the museum.

00:16:11.409 --> 00:16:15.009
<v Speaker 3>And, and it's just a big stainless steel moth man statue.

00:16:15.159 --> 00:16:19.059
<v Speaker 3>If you Google moth man statue, you'll find dozens and dozens of pictures.

00:16:19.690 --> 00:16:20.799
<v Speaker 3>And I have a picture with him.

00:16:21.190 --> 00:16:22.779
<v Speaker 3>Uh, everybody, it's kind of a thing.

00:16:22.779 --> 00:16:23.320
<v Speaker 3>You gotta do it.

00:16:23.321 --> 00:16:24.789
<v Speaker 3>You gotta, you gotta get a picture with them off, man.

00:16:25.899 --> 00:16:41.379
<v Speaker 3>But no, I, I think it's, I'm trying, I guess if I had to say, I don't know, it's there to commemorate and to kind of memorialize the truth of what happened that we really know, and then it does, it does move on to speculate, you know, things.

00:16:41.380 --> 00:16:48.610
<v Speaker 3>But, uh, gosh, it's been a while since I've been, I w I'm not sure if I can pin down exactly what the, what the neighborhood feels about it.

00:16:48.940 --> 00:16:55.450
<v Speaker 3>Uh, but it's, it's there as a, it's there as a Memorial and it's there, I mean, as much to the people that died in the silver bridge thing as it is to anything.

00:16:55.539 --> 00:16:55.870
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

00:16:55.870 --> 00:17:10.509
<v Speaker 2>I was going to ask like, is it because to me, it seems like very connected and obviously the movie and a lot of the stuff connects it, but when you think about silver bridge, the collapse as, as someone from the area, D is, does moth man come to mind or do they feel like two sort of isolated incidents?

00:17:10.990 --> 00:17:11.200
<v Speaker 2>Uh, for

00:17:11.200 --> 00:17:20.710
<v Speaker 3>Me, like when I hear silver bridge, I think moth man, a lot of times they get mentioned together, but I think for the most part, like, I don't think people like to associate it too much.

00:17:21.250 --> 00:17:22.329
<v Speaker 3>And this is just opinion.

00:17:22.330 --> 00:17:22.839
<v Speaker 3>I don't know.

00:17:22.869 --> 00:17:30.130
<v Speaker 3>I couldn't tell you what the average person on the street thinks, but like, I think people hesitate to, uh, to align it too much with moth man.

00:17:30.131 --> 00:17:44.319
<v Speaker 3>I think, you know, most, most folks will talk about structural failures and they'll talk about, you know, engineering and how it could have been stopped, but, but they don't immediately go off that moth man did it, you know, it's and I think probably that's more, more of a thing just to kind of cause people died.

00:17:44.320 --> 00:17:46.960
<v Speaker 3>I think that's, that's where, you know, yeah.

00:17:46.990 --> 00:17:51.880
<v Speaker 3>People died in the accident and people don't want to be dismissive of it and, and, and all that.

00:17:51.881 --> 00:18:06.160
<v Speaker 3>So I think that prevents it from becoming too connected, but people do talk about, oh, it's interesting that this sort of citing revolves around that calamity there they are associated, but I don't think they're legitimately like cemented together.

00:18:06.161 --> 00:18:06.490
<v Speaker 3>Yeah,

00:18:07.000 --> 00:18:07.390
<v Speaker 2>For sure.

00:18:08.109 --> 00:18:08.440
<v Speaker 2>Okay.

00:18:08.441 --> 00:18:20.799
<v Speaker 2>So you also, so you've had a rich history, I would say, uh, compared to other people potentially that have of paranormal or unexplained or potentially UFO sightings.

00:18:21.160 --> 00:18:28.619
<v Speaker 2>And we've talked about it a little on the podcast before, but I would love to kind of dive into that as they, to the area.

00:18:28.621 --> 00:18:28.859
<v Speaker 2>Right?

00:18:28.861 --> 00:18:40.799
<v Speaker 2>Because again, something that we saw when we dug into the research of moth man is how, how a, how many crypted sightings, how many UFO sightings come up around the Ba'ath man stuff.

00:18:40.800 --> 00:18:46.650
<v Speaker 2>But also before and after that right point pleasant generally, and this kind of, part of the world seems to be a hotspot.

00:18:46.670 --> 00:18:55.079
<v Speaker 2>And again, if you're into, if you're into euphology, I think that tracks in a way like New Hampshire is as well, like there's certain geographies that sort of make sense.

00:18:55.440 --> 00:18:58.079
<v Speaker 2>And there's also like a lot of crypted folklore from that area.

00:18:58.080 --> 00:18:58.289
<v Speaker 2>Right.

00:18:58.290 --> 00:19:00.390
<v Speaker 2>There's Bigfoot and there's, there's other things as well.

00:19:00.391 --> 00:19:13.740
<v Speaker 2>So I would love to kind of hear about your experiences and also like the TNT area, that kind of stuff is super cool, but just in general to kind of like take us through some of the things you've experienced in your life to kind of just give us some local color.

00:19:14.119 --> 00:19:14.509
<v Speaker 2>Okay.

00:19:14.539 --> 00:19:14.930
<v Speaker 3>Sure.

00:19:14.960 --> 00:19:19.519
<v Speaker 3>So to begin with, uh, I grew up outside of a town called Ironton Ohio.

00:19:19.579 --> 00:19:29.690
<v Speaker 3>It is well-named because it is a, basically a BoomTown from the industrial revolution when they started making steel and iron iron at the end at a junction in the Ohio river.

00:19:30.319 --> 00:19:33.529
<v Speaker 3>Uh it's trimodal there's river, rail and road, all right there.

00:19:33.530 --> 00:19:35.210
<v Speaker 3>And so it became this sort of BoomTown.

00:19:35.211 --> 00:19:43.759
<v Speaker 3>And in fact, if you, if you look it up, the, uh, the, some of the iron that was used, uh, in the civil war ironclads was used, was made in Ironton.

00:19:44.150 --> 00:19:46.279
<v Speaker 3>So it's, it's, it's that, it's that old.

00:19:46.549 --> 00:19:46.730
<v Speaker 3>Right.

00:19:47.029 --> 00:19:51.619
<v Speaker 3>Um, and I grew up 10 miles outside of Ironton and a much smaller community.

00:19:51.621 --> 00:20:04.430
<v Speaker 3>I was outside of an even smaller community, um, out in the woods, you know, a bit of, uh, and the, uh, the classic Appalachians, uh, stereotypes of self-sufficiency and, you know, kind of isolation and things.

00:20:04.609 --> 00:20:09.920
<v Speaker 3>They hold true to some extent we were out there and that's, you know, we, we sort of dealt with whatever we had to deal with.

00:20:10.430 --> 00:20:20.029
<v Speaker 3>My, probably my first brush with anything, uh, that was remotely unexplainable, uh, was, uh, I was, uh, a young boy, uh, growing up was just me and my dad.

00:20:20.030 --> 00:20:27.230
<v Speaker 3>And, um, you know, one morning after a big snow, it would have been, you know, mid winter, I want to say it was, uh, February or March.

00:20:27.319 --> 00:20:31.430
<v Speaker 3>I went outside to probably carry wood in or something like that.

00:20:31.431 --> 00:20:37.220
<v Speaker 3>But like I, I found, uh, around the house, there were, there was a set of footprints and you probably know where I'm going with this.

00:20:37.250 --> 00:20:43.160
<v Speaker 3>The, uh, but the, they were, they looked like regular big human footprints.

00:20:43.220 --> 00:20:46.099
<v Speaker 3>And I was like, these, I think Bigfoot's been in my front yard.

00:20:46.400 --> 00:20:51.980
<v Speaker 3>And I was like, you know, a young kid, I didn't, I didn't, I was just like, kind of surprised.

00:20:52.250 --> 00:20:52.970
<v Speaker 3>I showed my dad.

00:20:52.971 --> 00:20:55.160
<v Speaker 3>He was like, no, that's clearly the dog's been running.

00:20:55.161 --> 00:20:59.960
<v Speaker 3>And he slid in the snow and made these big long, but I stared at them and stared at them.

00:21:00.259 --> 00:21:05.240
<v Speaker 3>And I went so far as to go to the library because there wasn't internet in those days.

00:21:05.539 --> 00:21:09.589
<v Speaker 3>And I researched footprints, like animal prints and things like that.

00:21:09.590 --> 00:21:16.250
<v Speaker 3>And I was like, gosh, this surely this has gotta be something, but, but, uh, and I took a Polaroid at the time and I was too young to think about scale.

00:21:16.250 --> 00:21:18.619
<v Speaker 3>So I didn't put like a yard stick out or anything.

00:21:18.950 --> 00:21:32.019
<v Speaker 3>So it was just a picture of a footprint in the snow and it could have been just anybody, but, um, but yeah, my first earliest experience with anything was that was a big foot, like footprint in my front yard after it was early morning, uh, after a big snow,

00:21:32.190 --> 00:21:37.799
<v Speaker 2>You even as like a young guy had an awareness of Bigfoot, right.

00:21:37.800 --> 00:21:46.440
<v Speaker 2>So that must have been like somewhat the, not the talk of the town, but like, like that must have been kind of th th that oral tradition of telling that story, right.

00:21:46.441 --> 00:21:48.420
<v Speaker 2>If big foot must've been part of your upbringing.

00:21:48.569 --> 00:21:48.839
<v Speaker 2>Yeah,

00:21:48.869 --> 00:21:49.349
<v Speaker 3>Absolutely.

00:21:49.650 --> 00:21:55.980
<v Speaker 3>There's and, and as a kid, you hear about Bigfoot and, uh, uh, the skunk ape and all of the different names that he has.

00:21:55.980 --> 00:21:56.220
<v Speaker 3>Right.

00:21:56.519 --> 00:22:00.720
<v Speaker 3>And I think that's a slightly different creature if we're getting technical, but anyway, yeah.

00:22:00.721 --> 00:22:08.220
<v Speaker 3>So th there, there are, you know, you asked folks around here, there are definite people who have had, you know, experiences that they thought might be Bigfoot there.

00:22:08.221 --> 00:22:12.119
<v Speaker 3>And there are other creatures around here that get that get talked about.

00:22:12.420 --> 00:22:14.339
<v Speaker 3>But, uh, but yeah, that was, that was, yeah.

00:22:14.369 --> 00:22:14.849
<v Speaker 3>Early on.

00:22:14.851 --> 00:22:15.900
<v Speaker 3>That was my first experience.

00:22:16.089 --> 00:22:18.240
<v Speaker 3>And, and it was, uh, a strange one to be sure.

00:22:18.269 --> 00:22:23.549
<v Speaker 3>And it just sort of faded into the background and it was, you know, I never had any other big foot sort of experiences.

00:22:24.119 --> 00:22:25.259
<v Speaker 3>A lot of, a lot of folks will.

00:22:25.289 --> 00:22:31.859
<v Speaker 3>So I think what happens around here, and if we're playing devil's advocate around here, there are coyotes and coyotes.

00:22:31.859 --> 00:22:33.450
<v Speaker 3>I don't know if you've ever heard of coyote in the woods.

00:22:34.259 --> 00:22:34.650
<v Speaker 3>Okay.

00:22:34.740 --> 00:22:41.730
<v Speaker 3>So they are up to one of the scariest sounds like, especially when there's like a bunch of them, it's terrifying, it's terrifying.

00:22:41.970 --> 00:22:44.700
<v Speaker 3>There are lots of animals that make lots of strange noises in the woods.

00:22:44.970 --> 00:22:51.960
<v Speaker 3>And so if, you know, I bet a lot of those experiences are related to strange animal noises in the woods.

00:22:52.109 --> 00:22:52.109
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

00:22:52.440 --> 00:22:58.109
<v Speaker 3>But I, you know, mine was, you know, great, big human looking footprints, five toes, the whole, the whole nine yards.

00:22:58.200 --> 00:23:02.460
<v Speaker 3>And, uh, they would have been, I don't know, they were longer than a 12 inch ruler.

00:23:03.089 --> 00:23:03.539
<v Speaker 2>You know what I mean?

00:23:03.660 --> 00:23:07.500
<v Speaker 2>And like, even if that, like, I don't know anything about, well, I guess I know that that's not a bear.

00:23:07.950 --> 00:23:08.519
<v Speaker 3>That's not a bear.

00:23:08.520 --> 00:23:09.029
<v Speaker 3>I believe me.

00:23:09.030 --> 00:23:09.869
<v Speaker 3>I was like this their way.

00:23:09.871 --> 00:23:10.440
<v Speaker 3>This can be a bear.

00:23:10.680 --> 00:23:10.680
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

00:23:10.690 --> 00:23:11.670
<v Speaker 3>But like either

00:23:11.700 --> 00:23:17.009
<v Speaker 2>No matter what, that's so large, that just the scale of it is terrifying.

00:23:17.039 --> 00:23:24.539
<v Speaker 2>Like, no matter if it is like a normal animal who knows, but like bigger than a ruler is like unnerving.

00:23:24.720 --> 00:23:25.440
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

00:23:25.650 --> 00:23:26.130
<v Speaker 3>It is.

00:23:26.131 --> 00:23:27.839
<v Speaker 3>It was, it was a large print.

00:23:27.840 --> 00:23:29.130
<v Speaker 3>And there was, I mean, it was more than one.

00:23:29.131 --> 00:23:36.329
<v Speaker 3>They went around the, the front where the snow had drifted and then sort of, we had a gravel driveway where they disappeared and it was, it was weird.

00:23:36.450 --> 00:23:37.019
<v Speaker 3>It was really weird.

00:23:38.309 --> 00:23:38.670
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

00:23:38.730 --> 00:23:39.930
<v Speaker 3>So that's, that's the first big one.

00:23:40.470 --> 00:23:43.049
<v Speaker 3>Um, that's the scene, that's the, yeah.

00:23:43.380 --> 00:23:48.740
<v Speaker 3>And the, uh, I can tell you a bit, I mean, I think this was the thing that we talked about on the show that I, I sent in.

00:23:48.750 --> 00:23:49.680
<v Speaker 3>I actually sent in the story.

00:23:49.681 --> 00:23:51.869
<v Speaker 3>I think Alan read it quite well quite well.

00:23:52.799 --> 00:23:53.519
<v Speaker 3>Um, thank you, Alan.

00:23:53.520 --> 00:23:57.779
<v Speaker 3>That was well-delivered the T I was in college and this was, I was living in Ironton.

00:23:57.780 --> 00:24:07.259
<v Speaker 3>Then I had moved into the great big metropolis of Ironton, Ohio, and I was, uh, prone to staying out pretty late playing magic, the gathering with my friends in college.

00:24:07.259 --> 00:24:10.769
<v Speaker 3>And I was coming home late one night and, uh, happened to having to look up.

00:24:10.890 --> 00:24:14.009
<v Speaker 3>And there were, there were two, two lights in the sky.

00:24:14.279 --> 00:24:23.190
<v Speaker 3>I think I said it in the story, but I think if they had been moving together or whatever, not moving at all, I wouldn't have noticed, but they were kind of, uh, figuring and moving in strange ways.

00:24:23.569 --> 00:24:24.769
<v Speaker 3>There weren't any noise.

00:24:24.770 --> 00:24:30.349
<v Speaker 3>Like the only thing you could hear is normal street noise of, uh, you know, three 30 or four 30 in the morning, whatever.

00:24:30.619 --> 00:24:30.619
<v Speaker 3>Right.

00:24:31.039 --> 00:24:33.049
<v Speaker 3>And they moved awfully strangely.

00:24:33.079 --> 00:24:40.490
<v Speaker 3>I went to look for a camera in my bag, and by the time I looked back up, they were gone and I couldn't see him on the horizon anywhere as much as I could see.

00:24:40.490 --> 00:24:43.069
<v Speaker 3>And that again is an unexplainable thing.

00:24:43.070 --> 00:24:49.160
<v Speaker 3>And I, I never heard of any story around here quite like that it was a white light and an orange light.

00:24:49.190 --> 00:24:50.930
<v Speaker 3>And they moved in these figure eights around each other.

00:24:51.099 --> 00:24:54.460
<v Speaker 2>How large were they compared to stars and how close did they look?

00:24:54.789 --> 00:24:58.630
<v Speaker 3>They, they seemed so they were moving fast enough that they seemed close.

00:24:58.660 --> 00:24:59.319
<v Speaker 3>I don't know.

00:24:59.349 --> 00:25:07.539
<v Speaker 3>Maybe, maybe they were moving much faster, further away, but like, they seemed to be moving like far enough away that they were well into the sky, but they were moving fairly quickly.

00:25:08.019 --> 00:25:24.619
<v Speaker 3>You know, how slow a plane looks from way of, you know, but th the size, I would say they were bigger than any, they were bigger than anything in the sky than other than the moon, you know, by quite a lot, much smaller than the moon, but much larger than the biggest star or planet that you would see.

00:25:25.019 --> 00:25:26.230
<v Speaker 3>Uh, yeah.

00:25:26.230 --> 00:25:32.559
<v Speaker 3>So big enough that, that, uh, they definitely stood out and I I've never claimed that that was a UFO.

00:25:32.560 --> 00:25:34.900
<v Speaker 3>Well, it was a UFO I've never claimed it was aliens.

00:25:35.440 --> 00:25:36.910
<v Speaker 3>I've just have no idea what it was.

00:25:36.910 --> 00:25:38.170
<v Speaker 3>And it's always kind of fascinated me.

00:25:38.680 --> 00:25:50.410
<v Speaker 3>Um, and again, like the closest place, like, um, and I think one of, a lot of the sightings we get, like we're 150 miles or so from a Wright Patterson air force base, which is obliquely related to Roswell.

00:25:50.411 --> 00:26:04.420
<v Speaker 3>If you look into that, you may go there a lot on the X-Files they do, they do, but Wright Patterson, air force base has probably some stuff that gets in and out of there, that's weird, but I mean, I'm 150 miles to the Southeast of Wright Patterson.

00:26:04.450 --> 00:26:08.410
<v Speaker 3>And I, you know, it would have to be fairly out of the way I would imagine.

00:26:08.529 --> 00:26:11.740
<v Speaker 3>I don't know, but yeah, not much ever flies over in Ironton anymore.

00:26:11.980 --> 00:26:11.980
<v Speaker 3>Right.

00:26:12.160 --> 00:26:15.039
<v Speaker 3>And it was less, we don't get much of that.

00:26:15.040 --> 00:26:16.380
<v Speaker 3>So it was, it was an interesting

00:26:16.779 --> 00:26:17.170
<v Speaker 2>For sure.

00:26:17.171 --> 00:26:19.359
<v Speaker 2>It's one of those things, I feel like that sticks with you.

00:26:19.361 --> 00:26:26.829
<v Speaker 2>It's just like just the fact that there's lights in the sky that are moving in figure eights, and they're different colors that they're not naturally occurring things.

00:26:27.019 --> 00:26:29.710
<v Speaker 2>It's, it's not like, oh, that could have been a plane.

00:26:29.711 --> 00:26:31.119
<v Speaker 2>It's like, no, there's no solution.

00:26:31.539 --> 00:26:32.829
<v Speaker 3>This is 1999.

00:26:32.830 --> 00:26:35.470
<v Speaker 3>This isn't like, like this isn't like your neighbor's drone.

00:26:35.500 --> 00:26:39.430
<v Speaker 3>This is like, well before that and, and, uh, yeah, so I don't know.

00:26:39.431 --> 00:26:40.539
<v Speaker 3>I, I don't know what it was.

00:26:40.660 --> 00:26:40.960
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

00:26:40.990 --> 00:26:43.119
<v Speaker 2>My dad was stationed in Panama.

00:26:43.150 --> 00:26:44.740
<v Speaker 2>I believe in the seventies.

00:26:44.799 --> 00:26:51.759
<v Speaker 2>He, we talked about it on the podcast very early on, but he had a somewhat similar experience.

00:26:51.760 --> 00:26:56.650
<v Speaker 2>And he was like in, you know, he was in the military, so he was in the Navy, but in the military.

00:26:56.651 --> 00:26:58.240
<v Speaker 2>So there's something to be said around.

00:26:58.240 --> 00:27:01.269
<v Speaker 2>Maybe there was things going on, like experiments or whatever, but

00:27:01.599 --> 00:27:02.380
<v Speaker 3>Navy stories.

00:27:02.440 --> 00:27:02.769
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

00:27:03.099 --> 00:27:03.460
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

00:27:03.849 --> 00:27:12.220
<v Speaker 2>And he, he come, he came out of like this facility that he was working in that was sort of like a top secret facility and to get like some air for a break.

00:27:12.609 --> 00:27:23.190
<v Speaker 2>And he just would, and it happened more than once where he would see that kind of thing where it that's what it reminds me of when, when you, when, when you're saying it again now, uh, it was like lights moving.

00:27:23.191 --> 00:27:30.630
<v Speaker 2>And I think he said something like there was lights in the sky, like moving in patterns that I couldn't explain with like the technology that I know.

00:27:30.631 --> 00:27:35.250
<v Speaker 2>So, you know, especially like back in the seventies or the nineties, or even right before drones.

00:27:35.250 --> 00:27:36.150
<v Speaker 2>So yeah.

00:27:36.180 --> 00:27:45.630
<v Speaker 2>It's one of those things and there's, there is like, to some extent, something that beyond like the pilot siting, we have like a big influx of UFO stuff going on right now, but like the basic human.

00:27:46.079 --> 00:27:49.799
<v Speaker 2>Now, if I went out and saw that, I would probably say, oh, it's drones or it's whatever.

00:27:49.800 --> 00:27:52.799
<v Speaker 2>Or Allen would, I would think it's aliens and Al would say, Abby, that's drones.

00:27:53.369 --> 00:28:02.279
<v Speaker 2>But like, because of the technology advancements, it sort of takes away the ability sometimes to maybe even like process some of these things that might be happening around us.

00:28:02.339 --> 00:28:02.490
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

00:28:02.630 --> 00:28:11.119
<v Speaker 3>I, I would have, I would have dismissed it if the lights had moved any other way, like together, I would have thought, oh, it's just a weird light on a plane or whatever.

00:28:11.121 --> 00:28:13.490
<v Speaker 3>But yeah, they, they were strange.

00:28:13.519 --> 00:28:14.509
<v Speaker 3>They were very strange.

00:28:15.049 --> 00:28:19.640
<v Speaker 3>The, those are the two big ones that I've ever had, but like, I, you know, there's, I've talked to plenty of people who have said, oh yeah, I saw something.

00:28:19.819 --> 00:28:27.619
<v Speaker 3>My, my dad will, he, he saw something driving between Tennessee and Ohio once, uh, a light in the sky that he didn't couldn't explain again.

00:28:27.621 --> 00:28:29.390
<v Speaker 3>He didn't say, oh, I saw aliens.

00:28:29.400 --> 00:28:30.470
<v Speaker 3>He just saw something.

00:28:30.471 --> 00:28:31.190
<v Speaker 3>He didn't know what it was.

00:28:31.819 --> 00:28:46.640
<v Speaker 3>I think, uh, probably the, the biggest disappointment, uh, in terms of like this sort of thing in my life is that, um, my, uh, my wife and I in 2006, did a, a road trip where we went, we followed partially routes, route 66, we were on 40.

00:28:46.640 --> 00:28:54.680
<v Speaker 3>We went, we drove all the way to Roswell, spent the night in Roswell, which basically is just like Ironton, Ohio, except with alien alien eyes on their streetlights.

00:28:54.710 --> 00:28:55.789
<v Speaker 3>It's pretty much the same town.

00:28:55.880 --> 00:28:58.069
<v Speaker 3>And we, uh, we stayed there.

00:28:58.099 --> 00:28:59.630
<v Speaker 3>We went to the meteor crater.

00:28:59.631 --> 00:29:02.450
<v Speaker 3>We did, uh, we, I called it the X-Files tour of the Southwest.

00:29:02.809 --> 00:29:04.819
<v Speaker 3>And we went to all the cool places.

00:29:04.820 --> 00:29:10.279
<v Speaker 3>And we went and stayed a night in Rachael, Nevada, which is next door to area 51.

00:29:10.280 --> 00:29:15.079
<v Speaker 3>We had a rented Skyblue, uh, Plymouth, PT cruiser.

00:29:15.109 --> 00:29:16.910
<v Speaker 3>That's it, the Plymouth PT cruiser, we all Skype.

00:29:16.940 --> 00:29:28.670
<v Speaker 3>And we popped the hood up, uh, pop the hatch up on the back and lay down, laid out in the desert and watched for several hours or through for, I don't know how long, uh, so nothing, didn't see a thing we're out there air right in the middle saw nothing.

00:29:28.670 --> 00:29:29.390
<v Speaker 3>But yeah, I did.

00:29:29.720 --> 00:29:32.630
<v Speaker 3>I did see some lights in Ironton, Ohio way out of the way I was.

00:29:32.631 --> 00:29:32.809
<v Speaker 3>Okay.

00:29:32.810 --> 00:29:34.220
<v Speaker 3>You want to talk about alien culture?

00:29:34.490 --> 00:29:34.490
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

00:29:34.940 --> 00:29:36.559
<v Speaker 3>Rachel Nevada has embraced it.

00:29:36.740 --> 00:29:40.640
<v Speaker 3>Let me tell you, it's you go out there sometime stay at the little alien.

00:29:41.210 --> 00:29:42.740
<v Speaker 3>Um, yeah.

00:29:42.740 --> 00:29:43.700
<v Speaker 3>It's, it's really great.

00:29:43.759 --> 00:29:44.509
<v Speaker 3>It was there.

00:29:44.630 --> 00:29:49.400
<v Speaker 3>We met 80% of the town's population in the, in the restaurant.

00:29:49.430 --> 00:29:49.670
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

00:29:49.671 --> 00:29:50.420
<v Speaker 3>There's pretty great.

00:29:50.421 --> 00:29:50.869
<v Speaker 3>It's fun.

00:29:51.140 --> 00:29:52.160
<v Speaker 3>It's like, okay.

00:29:52.161 --> 00:29:52.880
<v Speaker 3>Have you seen tremors?

00:29:52.910 --> 00:29:53.930
<v Speaker 3>No, actually I haven't.

00:29:54.470 --> 00:29:55.130
<v Speaker 3>Oh my gosh.

00:29:55.160 --> 00:29:55.910
<v Speaker 3>Watch tremors.

00:29:56.519 --> 00:30:03.950
<v Speaker 3>And it's like a caricatured version of, of the town of Rachel, because these folks tremors could happen out there and they would, they would deal with it.

00:30:03.951 --> 00:30:09.529
<v Speaker 3>They would handle it, uh, much like Kevin bacon, but, but no, this is a great little place.

00:30:09.559 --> 00:30:09.769
<v Speaker 3>Really

00:30:09.769 --> 00:30:10.009
<v Speaker 2>Great.

00:30:10.250 --> 00:30:10.910
<v Speaker 2>I love that.

00:30:10.911 --> 00:30:13.670
<v Speaker 2>And I don't know, there's something to me that's just like fun.

00:30:13.859 --> 00:30:24.940
<v Speaker 2>And, and I like what you've said this whole time, which is that you've seen like unexplained things, but not necessarily, you're not saying I saw a big foot foot or I saw, you know, aliens, you're saying these are, this is just what I saw.

00:30:24.970 --> 00:30:27.640
<v Speaker 2>And I think a lot of people I've had those experiences.

00:30:27.970 --> 00:30:28.599
<v Speaker 2>Allen's had those experience.

00:30:28.601 --> 00:30:30.250
<v Speaker 2>Like a lot of people have had those experiences.

00:30:30.460 --> 00:30:30.759
<v Speaker 2>I dunno.

00:30:30.990 --> 00:30:41.140
<v Speaker 2>It's, it's more maybe even like relatable to put it that way versus to say like, I've had an experience with an alien or I've had a normal, like, it's easier to digest by just saying, oh, it was just true though.

00:30:41.141 --> 00:30:43.210
<v Speaker 2>Like, I don't know what it was, but this is what it was.

00:30:43.559 --> 00:30:43.839
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

00:30:44.069 --> 00:30:45.359
<v Speaker 3>That that's the way I tend to look at it.

00:30:45.420 --> 00:30:46.619
<v Speaker 3>Like it's, I don't know what it was.

00:30:46.621 --> 00:30:51.539
<v Speaker 3>I had an experience outside my normal natural perception of the world.

00:30:51.569 --> 00:30:51.900
<v Speaker 3>Yes,

00:30:51.900 --> 00:30:52.529
<v Speaker 2>Exactly.

00:30:53.099 --> 00:30:59.700
<v Speaker 2>And then I also want to talk about the TNT area because the D and D area is like a huge, huge focus of, of the moth man staff.

00:30:59.701 --> 00:31:03.119
<v Speaker 2>And so you have been there and that to me is, uh, very fun.

00:31:03.509 --> 00:31:03.509
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

00:31:03.990 --> 00:31:06.359
<v Speaker 3>Uh, and, and bear in mind, I've been there at night.

00:31:06.390 --> 00:31:14.039
<v Speaker 3>It was quite late, but yeah, I, when it was spooky, I mean, you know, I think geocashing, at that time, got me over my fear, apprehension.

00:31:14.190 --> 00:31:18.029
<v Speaker 3>I have like cemeteries and dark, weird places and things like that.

00:31:18.030 --> 00:31:24.779
<v Speaker 3>We crawled in and out of a lot of places, uh, that were, uh, probably not a hundred percent safe, but, you know, we had it in our mind.

00:31:24.780 --> 00:31:30.869
<v Speaker 3>We were going to go cashing at night, but yeah, the T and T area like it's, um, kind of a ruin, you know, there's not much there.

00:31:31.119 --> 00:31:36.900
<v Speaker 3>Uh, and I think they may have even gotten rid of some of the other dangerous things, like hazards, buildings and so forth.

00:31:36.930 --> 00:31:46.500
<v Speaker 3>I haven't been in a long time, but yeah, it's like this, I'm just kind of this lonely country road that drives past this area where there's old hoppers and buildings and pits.

00:31:46.529 --> 00:31:48.029
<v Speaker 3>And, um, yeah.

00:31:48.180 --> 00:31:49.829
<v Speaker 3>Were the original sightings I guess, happened.

00:31:50.670 --> 00:32:01.650
<v Speaker 3>The thing that I remember most of all is, uh, we were, we didn't know as much about moth man as we, we, we, we went because it was a moth man cash, but we, we just, we didn't know much about it.

00:32:02.009 --> 00:32:08.160
<v Speaker 3>The, one of the biggest things about the moth man that, that always has mentioned, one of the details is the red glowing eyes.

00:32:08.161 --> 00:32:08.430
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

00:32:08.970 --> 00:32:19.950
<v Speaker 3>And so when I'm standing out there in the middle of this T and T field, and I'm looking and off to the, up into the sky, off in the distance a bit are these are the blinking radio tower lights and the blinking red lights.

00:32:20.309 --> 00:32:21.869
<v Speaker 3>And, you know, my brain made that connection.

00:32:21.871 --> 00:32:22.920
<v Speaker 3>I was like, I don't know.

00:32:22.950 --> 00:32:27.900
<v Speaker 3>I mean, that seems far-fetched that someone would mistake that for some red eyed monster chasing their car.

00:32:28.259 --> 00:32:37.170
<v Speaker 3>But, um, I remember when I was a kid, you know, and, and I believed in Santa Claus, I used to think that the radio tower near my house was Rudolph's nose, but only that one time a year.

00:32:37.289 --> 00:32:37.500
<v Speaker 3>Right.

00:32:37.500 --> 00:32:38.549
<v Speaker 3>Like it's there all year.

00:32:38.640 --> 00:32:38.849
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

00:32:38.851 --> 00:32:39.720
<v Speaker 3>It was a neat experience.

00:32:39.721 --> 00:32:45.089
<v Speaker 3>It's kind of dark and, and there's not much out there, but definitely has a mood.

00:32:45.150 --> 00:32:45.539
<v Speaker 3>Definitely.

00:32:45.779 --> 00:32:46.200
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

00:32:46.440 --> 00:33:00.869
<v Speaker 2>And I want to talk more about the factory building in a second, but I really liked what you said about the radio tower lights, because something that I do think the film, the moth man prophecies does really well is, uh, plays with the motif of the two red, glowing lights.

00:33:00.871 --> 00:33:14.549
<v Speaker 2>And so in almost every transition in the film, like they, they find like natural ways where there's reg, whether it's traffic lights or, you know, stop sign reflections, or, um, just like Christmas light, like different ways.

00:33:14.550 --> 00:33:27.920
<v Speaker 2>But throughout the whole thing, there's like this dual glowing light, it wouldn't, you see it in the film, like it has a haunting effect, but it also sort of like demonstrates that once you have that in your mind, uh, you know, you kind of can see it everywhere.

00:33:27.921 --> 00:33:28.190
<v Speaker 2>Right.

00:33:28.191 --> 00:33:29.779
<v Speaker 2>And so like, it's the chicken or the egg thing.

00:33:29.780 --> 00:33:45.380
<v Speaker 2>And again, I'm not discounting what happened or people's exciting or experiences, but I do think there is something to that in a way where two red glow, glowing eyes, or two red, glowing lights, aren't, uh, so hard to find, you know, just around you every day, once you start looking for them.

00:33:45.559 --> 00:33:45.740
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

00:33:46.089 --> 00:34:04.450
<v Speaker 3>And, and I, that's kind of why I mentioned it, but like, like I was struck by that red blinking radio tower and I, I'm not sure how you can get from there to, there is a giant moth shaped man chasing my car, you know, but, but, uh, but it, you know, that's what maybe, I don't know, but yeah, the, the, the bunkers and things are really neat.

00:34:04.451 --> 00:34:06.250
<v Speaker 3>And we were, like I said, we were there late.

00:34:06.250 --> 00:34:11.920
<v Speaker 3>And so you would sort of walk in this sort of, uh, I don't know, knee high grass.

00:34:11.920 --> 00:34:12.159
<v Speaker 3>Right.

00:34:12.161 --> 00:34:29.619
<v Speaker 3>And then out of the, out of the Merck of, out of the depths of the darkness would come this like strange looking door, like some kind of, uh, well, it it's a, it's a perfectly modern place, but having overgrown and things like that, it, it gains a certain amount of mystique.

00:34:30.789 --> 00:34:33.730
<v Speaker 2>It's like, of course it happened there, you know, like yeah, of course.

00:34:34.099 --> 00:34:34.320
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

00:34:34.360 --> 00:34:36.489
<v Speaker 3>Like how, how could it happen anywhere else?

00:34:36.519 --> 00:34:41.019
<v Speaker 3>I, I grew up, uh, as I mentioned in that iron industry area.

00:34:41.021 --> 00:34:48.639
<v Speaker 3>And so there's a lot of, um, I don't know, dozen or more in the vicinity of, uh, the old iron furnaces, the blast furnaces.

00:34:49.059 --> 00:35:00.639
<v Speaker 3>And, um, all this left of them is kind of the, uh, the great big stone pyramids that was like, uh, like the Coke they was, where they would like stoke the fires and things.

00:35:00.641 --> 00:35:02.380
<v Speaker 3>It was just these big, big furnaces.

00:35:02.650 --> 00:35:10.809
<v Speaker 3>And so all this left of these great big, uh, hulking things, and they, they remind you of a ruin that you would come in and come up on in a jungle.

00:35:11.019 --> 00:35:13.239
<v Speaker 3>And, and I grew up with those two.

00:35:13.240 --> 00:35:19.480
<v Speaker 3>So I, I guess I had a bit of Indiana Jones on the brain when I started experiencing things too.

00:35:19.481 --> 00:35:20.409
<v Speaker 3>But, um, yeah.

00:35:20.411 --> 00:35:22.510
<v Speaker 3>Sometime check those blast furnaces out there, mate.

00:35:22.570 --> 00:35:23.440
<v Speaker 2>I would love to, yeah.

00:35:23.530 --> 00:35:32.230
<v Speaker 2>I think something that's come up for me, especially as being part of this, like podcasting collaborative, that we're part of is that there's people from all over the country in it.

00:35:32.231 --> 00:35:41.110
<v Speaker 2>And so you grew up with blast furnaces and I grew up with like abandoned factories and mills from new England and Bob and Michael have their own.

00:35:41.110 --> 00:35:52.900
<v Speaker 2>And so it's just like, it shapes, uh, stuff that, you know, we all know from therapy, but like stuff that happens when you're growing up, like really does shape your understanding of the world, especially with these like kind of creepy cryptic things.

00:35:52.900 --> 00:35:53.170
<v Speaker 2>Right.

00:35:53.170 --> 00:35:54.760
<v Speaker 2>And you said coyotes earlier.

00:35:54.760 --> 00:35:59.139
<v Speaker 2>And I was like, yeah, I've been surrounded in the woods by Fisher cats, which sound like women's screaming.

00:35:59.141 --> 00:36:12.820
<v Speaker 2>And it's those kinds of experiences, even though you can explain them still, I think, helped to create your like, vibe and away for when it comes to the, the spooky or, or things at night, abandoned buildings, all of that sort of like becomes part of your makeup and your local DNA.

00:36:13.900 --> 00:36:13.900
<v Speaker 3>Yup.

00:36:13.960 --> 00:36:25.380
<v Speaker 3>I, uh, I, the, the owls, the ALS there, you get us a screech owl in the woods somewhere, and it sounds, sounds like a murder and it's just

00:36:25.889 --> 00:36:27.389
<v Speaker 2>Our Al's big in the area.

00:36:28.019 --> 00:36:29.070
<v Speaker 3>Uh, depends on the owl.

00:36:29.489 --> 00:36:32.250
<v Speaker 3>Uh, like yeah, the barn Alice can get pretty big and things like that.

00:36:32.251 --> 00:36:34.980
<v Speaker 3>Like we ended up with some, yeah, there's some pretty big ones around here.

00:36:34.981 --> 00:36:35.519
<v Speaker 3>You mean big?

00:36:35.521 --> 00:36:37.679
<v Speaker 3>Like, are there a lot of them are big artists?

00:36:38.199 --> 00:36:38.199
<v Speaker 3>Well,

00:36:38.239 --> 00:36:49.730
<v Speaker 2>I'm asking because when we were doing the Mosman episode, the one creature that Alan could find online, he spent some time trying to investigate, like, what could the mock ban be if it was a bird?

00:36:49.731 --> 00:36:49.880
<v Speaker 2>Right.

00:36:50.030 --> 00:36:52.250
<v Speaker 2>Cause a lot of the initial theories were that were birds.

00:36:52.429 --> 00:37:00.380
<v Speaker 2>And I think none of us think that it was a bird, but, uh, what he found was that the one creature that has cause he was like, what has reflective eyes?

00:37:00.599 --> 00:37:02.690
<v Speaker 2>And, and it was owls have reflective eyes.

00:37:02.690 --> 00:37:10.579
<v Speaker 2>And so we were like, okay, like, yeah, again, we don't think it was necessarily owls, but it is, you know, they do kind of maybe a few of those could have been right.

00:37:10.610 --> 00:37:14.900
<v Speaker 2>Maybe people who are kind of afraid of what was going on on owl and freaked out

00:37:15.289 --> 00:37:22.699
<v Speaker 3>Once the seed of the moth man has been placed, then it's, you're free to interpret an owl in such a way.

00:37:22.701 --> 00:37:23.150
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

00:37:23.210 --> 00:37:27.019
<v Speaker 3>The mind does tend to, uh, look for those things.

00:37:27.079 --> 00:37:38.179
<v Speaker 3>So, but yeah, we have, I don't think we have any owls big enough to make, you know, to, to make people think, oh, it's clearly a, a dude, look that looks like a moth, but um, we have some big ones, but not that

00:37:38.179 --> 00:37:38.449
<v Speaker 2>Big.

00:37:38.840 --> 00:38:02.780
<v Speaker 2>So John just sent me, uh, in our zoom chat, one of the furnaces that's local to him, which looks just like, I don't know, uh, crazy, but it reminds me there's this YouTube channel, which of course, I'll never remember the name of in this moment, but there's this YouTube channel that it's this guy and he must be local to your area because he goes through these sorts of like furnaces or old factories, like things in the woods.

00:38:02.780 --> 00:38:05.389
<v Speaker 2>And it's kind of like rural things and makes YouTube videos.

00:38:05.391 --> 00:38:10.010
<v Speaker 2>But in one there's this crazy moment where I can find it and send it to you, John.

00:38:10.010 --> 00:38:41.289
<v Speaker 2>But there's this one moment where this guy is just filming and he's been filming for 10 minutes or something.

00:38:41.291 --> 00:38:43.210
<v Speaker 2>And so it's not like a cut or anything.

00:38:43.210 --> 00:38:52.000
<v Speaker 2>And he's just walking through this old building and out of nowhere, the brick is thrown at him and this empty room and Alan of course is like that.

00:38:52.001 --> 00:39:01.030
<v Speaker 2>So we talk about this a lot, I think in the end field Poltergeist episode, because I have like, this is crazy now it's like, there's a thousand ways that could have been, you know, faked and right.

00:39:02.019 --> 00:39:02.679
<v Speaker 2>Absolutely.

00:39:02.949 --> 00:39:06.369
<v Speaker 2>But I was like, so obsessed with this guy's YouTube channel for so long.

00:39:06.371 --> 00:39:09.820
<v Speaker 2>And so it's reminding that these furnaces and these things that, that, yeah.

00:39:10.030 --> 00:39:12.309
<v Speaker 2>So how big is the scale of this, the

00:39:12.309 --> 00:39:12.789
<v Speaker 3>Furnace?

00:39:13.119 --> 00:39:15.159
<v Speaker 3>Um, so if they vary in size a

00:39:15.159 --> 00:39:15.489
<v Speaker 2>Little bit.

00:39:16.059 --> 00:39:16.449
<v Speaker 2>Gotcha.

00:39:16.480 --> 00:39:16.659
<v Speaker 2>Okay.

00:39:16.661 --> 00:39:19.929
<v Speaker 2>So you just sent me a picture, so they're pretty big compared to a human.

00:39:19.931 --> 00:39:20.110
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

00:39:21.019 --> 00:39:21.369
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

00:39:21.460 --> 00:39:29.590
<v Speaker 2>And they look like, they're like relatively, just like in the middle of woods, they're kind of overgrown and they seem to stand just totally by themselves.

00:39:30.219 --> 00:39:33.489
<v Speaker 2>How did they come to be, you know, like, so, so decimal.

00:39:33.940 --> 00:39:34.179
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

00:39:34.181 --> 00:39:39.300
<v Speaker 3>So, uh, the iron furnaces were built in places where there was iron ore.

00:39:39.659 --> 00:39:39.659
<v Speaker 3>Right.

00:39:39.809 --> 00:39:49.440
<v Speaker 3>And, uh, so, uh, this, this thing would build, they would build the furnace and consequently, uh, the furnaces needed coal in order to run.

00:39:50.250 --> 00:39:57.090
<v Speaker 3>Uh, and so they would build the furnace bill and then they would begin to mind coal out of the Hills, which, uh, we have a lot of.

00:39:57.989 --> 00:40:03.510
<v Speaker 3>And uh, so the, you would have your furnace and your coal mines going and a lot of workers.

00:40:03.510 --> 00:40:09.300
<v Speaker 3>And so generally what would happen is they would build the, the office buildings and the work buildings around the furnace and around the mines.

00:40:09.300 --> 00:40:15.570
<v Speaker 3>And then like some housing, you would end up with some houses and really just little towns that would spring up all over the place.

00:40:15.780 --> 00:40:23.190
<v Speaker 3>And, and this is in Southern Ohio, but mostly, uh, in, you know, you get it in, you get it in Kentucky and you get it in West Virginia as well.

00:40:23.190 --> 00:40:26.429
<v Speaker 3>This, this whole tri-state area was kind of the heart of it.

00:40:26.639 --> 00:40:29.550
<v Speaker 3>And so a lot of towns sprung up and a lot of went away, a lot, went away.

00:40:29.789 --> 00:40:39.869
<v Speaker 3>There's actually, um, an old town called, um, dun Glen, uh, it's out in West Virginia, which is, it was built on the side of a mountain could only be reached by tram.

00:40:40.019 --> 00:40:44.670
<v Speaker 3>And I have gone searching for it once and didn't find it, uh, but people know where it is.

00:40:44.670 --> 00:40:51.929
<v Speaker 3>We just, we just couldn't find it, but it's yeah, these towns would spring up and then exhaust the resources and then they would just go away and fade back into the woods.

00:40:51.960 --> 00:40:52.739
<v Speaker 3>And so that's what you see

00:40:52.739 --> 00:40:53.190
<v Speaker 2>Is what's left.

00:40:53.630 --> 00:40:53.630
<v Speaker 2>Gotcha.

00:40:53.650 --> 00:41:00.590
<v Speaker 2>That's exactly like a Dudley town, which is one of Connecticut's sort of like big ghost abandoned ghost towns.

00:41:00.590 --> 00:41:10.070
<v Speaker 2>And it's the same idea where this case, they, they planned very poorly and built this like settlement, like very early settlement in a place where there was like not enough resources to support a settlement.

00:41:10.670 --> 00:41:16.460
<v Speaker 2>Um, and so everybody eventually got super sick or moved out west and then it just sort of leaves it totally abandoned.

00:41:16.460 --> 00:41:21.679
<v Speaker 2>Like, and there's like one solitary road that goes into the middle of the woods to this, this group of foundations.

00:41:22.000 --> 00:41:27.530
<v Speaker 2>It's also interesting that like all of this land is, is just like still undeveloped.

00:41:27.530 --> 00:41:38.659
<v Speaker 2>And I think it makes sense in, in the case of, you know, uh, steel processing where like, this is, uh, this is where the resources are, but in some cases too, it's just sort of like, well now it's just woods, I guess.

00:41:38.661 --> 00:41:40.760
<v Speaker 2>And, and no one has any use to develop it.

00:41:41.239 --> 00:41:41.480
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

00:41:41.480 --> 00:41:46.010
<v Speaker 3>And the w the woods reclaimed it fairly quickly in, in the whole historical scheme of things.

00:41:46.010 --> 00:41:46.250
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

00:41:46.400 --> 00:41:47.630
<v Speaker 3>The, the woods just reclaimed it.

00:41:48.289 --> 00:41:50.719
<v Speaker 3>Um, it makes me, it makes me think of Centralia, Pennsylvania.

00:41:51.030 --> 00:41:52.429
<v Speaker 3>Uh, are you familiar with Centralia?

00:41:52.670 --> 00:41:57.530
<v Speaker 3>It's the one, it's the mining town that sprung up and then they caught the mine on fire and everybody left and now it's still burning.

00:41:59.210 --> 00:42:07.610
<v Speaker 3>Oh, I'll check into that sometime, because it's not so much a cryptid thing, but it is a, it is a mining town in the middle of Pennsylvania somewhere.

00:42:07.610 --> 00:42:08.570
<v Speaker 3>I couldn't tell you for sure.

00:42:08.570 --> 00:42:09.710
<v Speaker 3>But, uh, yeah.

00:42:09.710 --> 00:42:11.840
<v Speaker 3>It's uh, that it was a mining boom town.

00:42:12.469 --> 00:42:21.409
<v Speaker 3>Um, I think, I can't remember if it was coal, uh, or if it was like silver, I don't, I don't remember, but it was a mining town and they got the mind caught on fire.

00:42:21.411 --> 00:42:23.809
<v Speaker 3>And so they abandoned the mine and the mine is still burning.

00:42:23.811 --> 00:42:25.400
<v Speaker 3>I think it's cold because it's still burning.

00:42:25.400 --> 00:42:31.400
<v Speaker 3>It's like, uh, but there's this basically the mind is on fire and smoking and steaming, they declared the place a hazard.

00:42:31.400 --> 00:42:34.130
<v Speaker 3>Everyone had to move away and it's still on fire.

00:42:34.420 --> 00:42:35.360
<v Speaker 3>It's still burning.

00:42:35.989 --> 00:42:35.989
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

00:42:36.019 --> 00:42:37.090
<v Speaker 3>And it was in the sixties.

00:42:37.090 --> 00:42:37.630
<v Speaker 3>It was again in

00:42:37.719 --> 00:42:38.289
<v Speaker 2>The six towel.

00:42:38.349 --> 00:42:39.340
<v Speaker 2>That's really mind blowing.

00:42:39.369 --> 00:42:54.280
<v Speaker 2>I, what I, what I think I'll do is I'll put up like a, an article on lunatics, project.com like posts by me that, that has links in and kind of goes into all this, because I think what we're talking about is so fascinating that listeners are probably gonna want some like supplemental material.

00:42:54.280 --> 00:42:54.940
<v Speaker 2>So yeah.

00:42:55.170 --> 00:42:56.820
<v Speaker 3>It's rabbit trailing quite a bit as well.

00:42:56.820 --> 00:42:59.469
<v Speaker 3>So we love so yeah, no, I can do this.

00:43:00.269 --> 00:43:04.170
<v Speaker 2>So, uh, listeners definitely head to the lunatics project.com.

00:43:04.170 --> 00:43:10.619
<v Speaker 2>If you want some more info and I'll share all the links that John is sending to me via zoom right now, so that you guys can look as well.

00:43:10.860 --> 00:43:17.190
<v Speaker 2>One thing I want to talk about while John is here, because this became a point of contention the other day for Alan and myself.

00:43:17.190 --> 00:43:28.590
<v Speaker 2>So John has, before I met John and or Michael, I've always said Appalachian, because in Connecticut and new England people, that's how it is pronounced is the Appalachian trail.

00:43:28.590 --> 00:43:28.889
<v Speaker 2>Right.

00:43:29.219 --> 00:43:34.800
<v Speaker 2>But John pointed out to us and, and Michael, that no, it is called Appalachian.

00:43:34.800 --> 00:43:36.239
<v Speaker 2>And that is what it is called.

00:43:36.240 --> 00:43:44.849
<v Speaker 2>And so the other day when we were recording the moth man, Alan, and I kind of got into it a bit and I said, no, listen, I have to say Appalachian or Chan will be really upset when he listens to this.

00:43:44.851 --> 00:43:53.070
<v Speaker 2>So I just wanted to put it on the record for everybody that the whole world should be pronouncing it Appalachia, Appalachian.

00:43:53.280 --> 00:44:03.389
<v Speaker 3>And it's, um, you know, I think if you look it up and you go down that trail, you'll probably find people debating and debating and debating the locals.

00:44:03.900 --> 00:44:08.460
<v Speaker 3>The locals pretty much universally are Appalachia.

00:44:08.820 --> 00:44:16.559
<v Speaker 3>And I think it has to do the Appalachian folks can make, make a case with like linguistics and things like that.

00:44:16.829 --> 00:44:16.829
<v Speaker 3>Right?

00:44:16.889 --> 00:44:17.130
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

00:44:17.130 --> 00:44:28.289
<v Speaker 3>So the, the, uh, the tribe, uh, that, that word comes from the original name of the Apalachee, uh, Muskegon people of Northwestern, Florida.

00:44:28.769 --> 00:44:37.019
<v Speaker 3>And so Apalachee is, uh, I think, uh, this is coming from Wikipedia, by the way, the word, the word Apalachee is other side of the river gotcha.

00:44:37.650 --> 00:44:38.550
<v Speaker 3>Is, is where that comes from.

00:44:39.329 --> 00:44:43.320
<v Speaker 3>Um, but this, yeah, that comes from, comes from Florida, but so it's now spelled the way it is.

00:44:43.320 --> 00:44:50.010
<v Speaker 3>And, um, but yeah, so Appalachia is closer, I think, to the, the origin of it.

00:44:50.400 --> 00:44:56.579
<v Speaker 3>And you can probably make a case for Appalachia, but, um, but, um, yeah, everyone I know says Appalachia.

00:44:56.969 --> 00:45:02.400
<v Speaker 3>So now we're fond of saying, if you say apple, if you say Appalachian, instead of Appalachia, I'll throw in Appalachia.

00:45:02.519 --> 00:45:03.210
<v Speaker 3>That's right.

00:45:03.300 --> 00:45:03.869
<v Speaker 2>Fair enough.

00:45:03.900 --> 00:45:04.079
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

00:45:04.081 --> 00:45:07.079
<v Speaker 2>And listen, I'll, I'll always listen to what the local say.

00:45:07.081 --> 00:45:09.900
<v Speaker 2>You know, you guys, you guys determined, so now we know.

00:45:10.230 --> 00:45:10.679
<v Speaker 2>Awesome.

00:45:10.681 --> 00:45:12.480
<v Speaker 2>Well, John, thank you so much.

00:45:12.481 --> 00:45:16.409
<v Speaker 2>I can't tell you how, you know, it's so good to always just talk to you.

00:45:16.411 --> 00:45:21.599
<v Speaker 2>It's been a while since we've connected, but this I think was a perfect companion episode.

00:45:21.630 --> 00:45:28.469
<v Speaker 2>You know, the milkman press was really dense and heavy in a way, and very sad with the conclusion with the silver bridge.

00:45:28.471 --> 00:45:42.920
<v Speaker 2>And we felt like a lot of the research was rooted in, uh, in the town itself and in this part of the, and so it was just fun to kind of have, you know, this information around experiences you've had, but also the color that you provided around, around where you're from.

00:45:42.920 --> 00:45:44.690
<v Speaker 2>So thank you so, so much for being here.

00:45:44.949 --> 00:45:45.219
<v Speaker 2>Sure.

00:45:45.250 --> 00:45:46.059
<v Speaker 3>Thanks for having me.

00:45:46.119 --> 00:45:47.139
<v Speaker 3>And, uh, let's see.

00:45:47.469 --> 00:45:53.530
<v Speaker 3>Oh, you know what I would recommend if you want to get, uh, somewhat, I would say, I would say caricatured yet.

00:45:53.530 --> 00:46:00.280
<v Speaker 3>Very stylishly, well done version of the, uh, of, of the world that I come from.

00:46:00.940 --> 00:46:07.510
<v Speaker 3>Uh, there's a podcast called old gods of Appalachia and, and you'll hear them say old gods of Appalachia by the way.

00:46:08.079 --> 00:46:14.349
<v Speaker 3>Um, uh, but, uh, they, they have, and some people, some people will say, oh, it's a bit heavy.

00:46:14.351 --> 00:46:14.860
<v Speaker 3>It's a bit heavy.

00:46:15.130 --> 00:46:30.130
<v Speaker 3>But I think, um, in terms of growing up here and listening to them speak and the, the problems and the, the good things about this area, um, they have kind of nailed it in a way that really resonates with me having come from here.

00:46:30.429 --> 00:46:32.800
<v Speaker 3>They, they, uh, and it's horror.

00:46:32.829 --> 00:46:34.610
<v Speaker 3>It's pretty scary and gruesome.

00:46:34.630 --> 00:46:44.110
<v Speaker 3>I would recommend, uh, caution if you are squeamish or if you are, you know, but, but they have a really fantastic podcast.

00:46:44.349 --> 00:46:50.320
<v Speaker 3>Their, their flavor is, like I said, it may be a bit caricatured it's and in order to be dramatic.

00:46:50.349 --> 00:46:50.530
<v Speaker 3>Right.

00:46:50.769 --> 00:46:53.199
<v Speaker 3>But it's a, that's a great one.

00:46:53.269 --> 00:47:00.699
<v Speaker 3>I would recommend for all the lore and the coal mines and the, you know, the, the witches and the haints and all of the things that come out of the woods here.

00:47:01.269 --> 00:47:02.889
<v Speaker 3>So definitely check that out.

00:47:03.010 --> 00:47:05.590
<v Speaker 3>Kind of a sideways shout out to those guys.

00:47:05.590 --> 00:47:06.309
<v Speaker 3>They're doing a great job.

00:47:06.460 --> 00:47:06.460
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

00:47:06.489 --> 00:47:07.329
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, absolutely.

00:47:07.331 --> 00:47:20.530
<v Speaker 2>And also, are there any cryptids or, or folklore, just things in general that you were like, this is, you know, besides the moth man and the stuff we've talked about, like, this is like, you like to understand, uh, you know, point pleasant.

00:47:20.530 --> 00:47:21.909
<v Speaker 2>You also have to understand this.

00:47:21.911 --> 00:47:25.969
<v Speaker 2>Is there anything like, you know, around the area that we should, we should research?

00:47:27.460 --> 00:47:28.599
<v Speaker 3>Oh, that's a good question.

00:47:28.630 --> 00:47:30.010
<v Speaker 3>I don't know if I have anything.

00:47:30.760 --> 00:47:39.639
<v Speaker 3>Um, yeah, we, we may not have, I I'd have to think about that, but, uh, yeah, the hotdogs definitely the whole time, you know, what's funny is how like, hot dogs are big around here.

00:47:39.730 --> 00:47:40.389
<v Speaker 3>It's weird.

00:47:40.500 --> 00:47:43.750
<v Speaker 3>Do you know how big, like the Chicago style with relish and all this stuff?

00:47:43.960 --> 00:47:47.469
<v Speaker 3>As much as they are with their like Chicago hot dogs?

00:47:47.860 --> 00:47:48.730
<v Speaker 3>What, like we're down here.

00:47:48.731 --> 00:47:49.000
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

00:47:49.030 --> 00:47:54.670
<v Speaker 3>There's, there's at least three hot dog chains competing for top dog, but,

00:47:55.659 --> 00:47:56.260
<v Speaker 2>Um, yeah.

00:47:56.440 --> 00:47:56.650
<v Speaker 2>Hot dogs.

00:47:57.760 --> 00:47:58.300
<v Speaker 2>Well,

00:47:58.329 --> 00:48:01.900
<v Speaker 3>So I worked, I managed at a Stewart's original hot dogs for a year and a half.

00:48:02.530 --> 00:48:10.210
<v Speaker 3>Um, back back in college, I was a manager at stewards, so I'm a little biased, so, but, but Stuart's is kind of one of the, one of the big ones.

00:48:10.690 --> 00:48:17.320
<v Speaker 3>Um, and it's sort of a fight between Stuarts and Sam's hotdogs and then crisps, dairy has good hot dogs as well.

00:48:17.320 --> 00:48:17.679
<v Speaker 3>Anyway,

00:48:18.070 --> 00:48:19.030
<v Speaker 2>So there's lots of options.

00:48:19.030 --> 00:48:22.780
<v Speaker 2>So we'll have to come and do like a cryptid hotdog tour of the area, a cryptid

00:48:23.170 --> 00:48:23.590
<v Speaker 3>Hotdog tour.

00:48:23.650 --> 00:48:24.130
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

00:48:24.159 --> 00:48:32.889
<v Speaker 3>So yeah, you guys, you guys, if you ended up coming through the area, we'll have to make sure we meet in point pleasant, come down route two and a stop at hillbilly hot dogs.

00:48:33.300 --> 00:48:33.719
<v Speaker 3>That'd be great.

00:48:33.750 --> 00:48:34.170
<v Speaker 3>Perfect.

00:48:34.199 --> 00:48:37.559
<v Speaker 3>Hillbilly hotdogs is, like I said, it's like the outlaw rock and roll hot dogs.

00:48:37.739 --> 00:48:38.909
<v Speaker 3>They're not in the competition.

00:48:38.911 --> 00:48:39.809
<v Speaker 3>They're their own thing.

00:48:40.650 --> 00:48:41.760
<v Speaker 3>Totally separate genre.

00:48:42.360 --> 00:48:42.780
<v Speaker 3>Oh yeah.

00:48:42.780 --> 00:48:45.960
<v Speaker 3>They're they're yeah, they're making there, they're doing it different.

00:48:45.960 --> 00:48:46.679
<v Speaker 3>They're doing it their way.

00:48:46.739 --> 00:48:47.699
<v Speaker 3>So anyway,

00:48:47.989 --> 00:48:48.440
<v Speaker 2>Beautiful.

00:48:48.469 --> 00:48:48.769
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

00:48:49.190 --> 00:48:49.610
<v Speaker 2>Got it.

00:48:49.699 --> 00:48:50.150
<v Speaker 2>Awesome.

00:48:50.150 --> 00:49:04.400
<v Speaker 2>So you have until September 12th to catch up on seasons one and two of[inaudible] and, and then you'll have infinity ahead of you to explore season three together with John as he broadens, uh, the fantasy piece to fiction.

00:49:04.400 --> 00:49:08.780
<v Speaker 2>And so he will have a never ending supply of inspiration, infinite

00:49:08.780 --> 00:49:11.210
<v Speaker 3>Stories, infinite dimensions, infinite.

00:49:11.929 --> 00:49:12.650
<v Speaker 2>Exactly.

00:49:12.710 --> 00:49:13.190
<v Speaker 2>Oh, John.

00:49:13.190 --> 00:49:13.460
<v Speaker 2>Okay.

00:49:13.489 --> 00:49:14.599
<v Speaker 2>Thank you so much.

00:49:14.630 --> 00:49:18.710
<v Speaker 2>It's always a pleasure to talk to you and, uh, this has been amazing.

00:49:18.710 --> 00:49:22.460
<v Speaker 2>So everyone go check out for dough and we'll talk to you soon.

00:49:22.730 --> 00:49:23.750
<v Speaker 3>Thanks so much for having me.

00:49:23.780 --> 00:49:25.969
<v Speaker 3>And I will talk to you once upon a next time.

00:49:30.199 --> 00:49:30.199
<v Speaker 1>Ah,